So so indebted to u for posting those lovely illustrations from Cyrano <333 & even more so for yr tags!! I'm completely in love w yr analysis, please feel free to ramble as long as u wish! Browsing through yr Cyrano de Bergerac tag has given me glimpses of so many adaptations & translations I'd never heard of before! I'll be watching the Solès version next, which I have only discovered today through u ^_^ As for translations, have u read many/all of them? I've only encountered the Renauld & Burgess translations in the wild, & I was curious to hear yr translation thoughts that they might guide my decision on which one I buy first (not necessarily Renauld or Burgess ofc). Have a splendid day & sorry for the likespam! 💙
Sorry for the delay. Don't mind the likespam, I'm glad you enjoyed my tags about Cyrano, and that they could contribute a bit to a further appreciation of the play. I loved it a lot, I got obsessed with it for months. It's always nice to know other people deeply love too that which is loved haha I hope you enjoy the Solès version, it may well be my favourite one!
About translations, I'm touched you're asking me, but I don't really know whether mine is the best opinion to ask. I have read... four or five English translations iirc, the ones I could find online, and I do (and especially did, back when I was reading them) have a lot of opinions about them. However, nor English nor French are my first languages (they are third and fourth respectively, so not even close). I just read and compare translations because that's one of my favourite things to do.
The fact is that no translation is perfect, of course. I barely remember Renauld's, but I think it was quite literal; that's good for understanding the basics of the text, concepts and characters, but form is subject, and there's always something that escapes too literal translations. Thomas and Guillemard's if I recall correctly is similar to Hooker's in cadence. It had some beautiful fragments, some I preferred over Hooker's, but overall I think to recall I liked Hooker's more. If memory serves, Hooker's was the most traditionally poetic and beautiful in my opinion. Burgess' is a whole different thing, with its perks and drawbacks.
Something noticeable in the other translations is that they are too... "epic". They do well the poetic, sorrowful, grief stricken, crushed by regrets aspects of Cyrano and the play in general, but they fall quite short in the funny and even pathetic aspects, and that too is key in Cyrano, both character and play. Given the characteristics of both languages, following the cadence of the French too literally, with those long verses, makes an English version sound far too solemn at times when the French text isn't. Thus Burgess changes the very cadence of the text, adapting it more to the English language. This translation is the one that best sets the different moods in the play, and as I said before form is subject, and that too is key: after all, the poetic aspect of Cyrano is as much true as his angry facet and his goofy one. If Cyrano isn't funny he isn't Cyrano, just as he wouldn't be Cyrano without his devotion to Roxane or his insecurities; Cyrano is who he is precisely because he has all these facets, because one side covers the other, because one trait is born from another, because one facet is used as weapon to protect the others, like a game of mirrors and smoke. We see them at different points through the play, often converging. Burgess' enhances that. He plays with the language itself in form and musicality, with words and absences, with truths masking other truths, with things stated but untold, much like Cyrano does. And the stage directions, poetic and with literary value in their own right in a way that reminded me of Valle Inclán and Oscar Wilde, interact with the text at times in an almost metatextual dimension that enhances that bond Cyrano has with words, giving them a sort of liminal air and strengthening that constant in the play: that words both conceal and unveil Cyrano, that in words he hides and words give him away.
But not all is good, at all. Unlike Hooker, Burgess reads to me as not entirely understanding every facet of the characters, and as if he didn't even like the play all that much, as if he had a bit of a disdainful attitude towards it, and found it too mushy. Which I can understand, but then why do you translate it? In my opinion the Burgess' translation does well bending English to transmit the different moods the French text does, and does pretty well understanding the more solemn, cool, funny, angry, poetic aspects of Cyrano, but less so his devotion, vulnerability, insecurities and his pathetism. It doesn't seem to get Roxane at all, how similar she is to Cyrano, nor why she has so many admirers. It does a very poor job at understanding Christian and his value, and writes him off as stupid imo. While I enjoyed the language aspect of the Burgess translation, I remember being quite angry at certain points reading it because of what it did to the characters and some changes he introduces. I think he did something very questionable with Le Bret and Castel-Jaloux, and I remember being incensed because of Roxane at times (for instance, she doesn't go to Arras in his version, which is a key scene to show just how much fire Roxane has, and that establishes several parallels with Cyrano, in attitude and words, but even in act since she does a bit what Cyrano later does with the nuns in the last act), and being very angry at several choices about Christian too. While not explicitly stated, I think the McAvoy production and the musical both follow this translation, because they too introduce these changes, and they make Christian as a character, and to an extent the entire play, not make sense.
For instance, once such change is that Christian is afraid that Roxane will be cultured (McAvoy's version has that infamous "shit"/"fuck" that I detest), when in the original French it's literally the opposite. He is not afraid she will be cultured, he is afraid she won't, because he does love and appreciate and admires those aspects of her, as he appreciates and admires them in Cyrano. That's key! Just as Cyrano longs to have what Christian has, Christian wants the same! That words escape him doesn't mean he doesn't understand or appreciate them. The dynamics make no sense without this aspect, and Burgess (and the productions that directly or indirectly follow him) constantly erases this core trait of Christian.
Another key moment of Christian Burgess butchers is the scene in Arras in which Christian discovers the truth. Burgess writes their discussion masterfully in form, it's both funny and poignant, but it falls short in concept: when Cyrano tells him the whole discussion about who does Roxane love and what will happen, what they'll do, is academic because they're both going to die, Christian states that dying is his role now. This destroys entirely the thing with Christian wanting Roxane to have the right to know, and the freedom to choose, or to refuse them both. As much as Cyrano proclaims his love for truth and not mincing words even in the face of authority, Cyrano is constantly drunk on lies and mirages, masks and metaphors. It's Christian who wants it all to end, the one who wants real things, the one who wants to risk his own happiness for the chance of his friend's, as well as for the woman he loves to stop living in a lie. That is a very interesting aspect of Christian, and another aspect in which he is written as both paralleling and contrasting Cyrano. It's interesting from a moral perspective and how that works with the characters, but it's also interesting from a conceptual point of view, both in text and metatextually: what they hold most dear, what they most want, what most fulfills them, what they most fear, their different approaches to life, but also metatextually another instance of that tears/blood motif and its ramifications constant through the whole text. Erasing that climatic decision and making him just simply suicidal erases those aspects of Christian and his place in the Christian/Cyrano/Roxane dynamic, all for plain superficial angst, that perhaps hits more in the moment, but holds less meaning.
Being more literal, and more solemn, Hooker's translation (or any of the others, but Hooker's seems to love the characters and understand them) doesn't make these conceptual mistakes. Now, would I not recommend reading Burgess' translation? I can't also say that. I had a lot of fun reading it, despite the occasional anger and indignation haha Would I recommend buying it? I recommend you give an eye to it first, if you're tempted and can initially only buy one.
You can read Burgess' translation entirely in archive.com. You can also find online the complete translations of Renauld, Hooker and Thomas and Guillemard. I also found a fifth one, iirc, but I can't recall it right now (I could give a look). You could read them before choosing, or read your favourite scenes and fragments in the different translations, and choose the one in which you like them better. That's often what I do.
Edit: I've checked to make sure and Roxane does appear in Arras in the translation. It's in the introduction in which it is stated that she doesn't appear in the production for which the translation was made. The conceptualisation of Roxane I criticise and that in my opinion is constant through the text does stay, though.
9 notes
·
View notes
@dire-kumori (this is, uh. This is gonna be a long one 😬)
It's completely fine if you're not up to date on the fnaf books, especially considering I haven't read any of them myself, lmao. I only know the things that the silly fnaf youtubers tell me is important in their theory videos, so. I don't know very much, and what I do know is probably very biased through their theory-crafting lenses.
But I enjoy me a good Evan and Gregory story, so I'd love to rant a little but more about them. I like the idea that Evan is hiding away somewhere in the Night Terrors recreation of his room, too terrified to leave it. He hides away somewhere that only a little kid would think to go/be able to reach, which is exactly why Gregory (who isn't THAT afraid while playing the game, but is a little menace who likes breaking the game's boundaries and trying to see where he can and can't go rather than playing the game normally) is able to find him.
Maybe Evan is terrified of Gregory at first-- after all, the details are hazy, but he clearly remembers how much the Stranger hurt him for so long, and who says this stranger will be any better? But Evan is terrified and alone and he just wants comfort. He thinks about the weird pictures on the wall of the family with blurry faces, how happy and safe they all look, and after a while of Evan being scared and Gregory trying to calm him, Evan can't help but notice that Gregory looks a LOT like one of the small blurry figures he sees in the family photos (ig technically Gregory should be nothing more than a pair of transparent floating arms if they're in a VR game, but I'll do what I want with no regard to the cruel constraints of logic). And Evan wants the happiness and safety he sees in those photos, so wouldn't it make sense to go with Gregory? (though, Gregory insists the kid in those photos isn't him)
Evan is so broken at this point that he doesn't remember his personality or his name. He can't answer any of the questions Gregory asks him about what things he likes or what he does for fun (though, the difference in technology thanks to them being born so far apart may play into that, too). Gregory has to help give Evan a name (Evan shudders for reasons he can't remember when Gregory suggests the name Freddy).
The last thing I'll say about the Gregory ending (such an original name, ik) is I'd like to think the two of them get out of the game eventually. Despite Gregory’s kindness, Evan still thinks he's too broken and the world is too big and scary for him to continue existing... and then the sun rises. At this point, Evan has spent what accounts to years/billions of nights desperate to survive long enough to see the sunrise but always being brutally murdered before he can. And then! Then Evan feels the light and warmth ghosting against his skin for the first time in god knows how long, he sees the brilliant pinks and oranges and reds of the rising sun, and he falls onto his knees with tears in his eyes. "I made it," he whispers. "I finally, really made it."
The happiness is almost enough to make his soul move on right then and there. But... it also fills him with hope that maybe this world and the people in it are worth surviving for after all.
Okay, moving on!
~
~
Oh gosh,, the idea of "Michael" trying to take control of the game in order to turn it into a safe haven for Evan!! It's such a painfully sweet idea... except, I can't help but wonder if Michael would even know what a 'safe haven' for Evan would look like-- let alone if the Fragment would know, since the Fragment has lost everything that makes Michael, Michael and is just the remnant of an instinct to keep Evan safe. I feel like the "safe haven" that the Fragment would make for Evan would end up being empty and hollow, devoid of any real meaning or happiness. It's nothing but an empty paradise filled with false promises of what the Fragment thinks a little kid SHOULD want but is devoid of the love and affection that Evan NEEDS. I'm having trouble coming up with any examples, though. Maybe it's like the Other World in Coraline, but instead of a greedy, hungry monster being in control of an empty world of lies, it's a monster that WANTS to help Evan but doesn't understand how.
~
~
And the idea of Glitchtrap using Evan against the Fragment is positively delicious :3
I'm going to make William and Mike a bit more sentient than you originally intended for a sec, though. I like the idea of a manipulative, silver-tongued William turning Evan against his brother. Maybe William even takes advantage of the fact that Evan (and probably Mike) never found out or knew why he got trapped in the Nightmare in the first place; maybe William frames the whole thing as Michael coming up with another way to torture Ev for fun. I wonder how Evan would respond. Would he listen to his father (whether or not Evan even recognizes this person as his father) telling him Mikey deserves this, take out his frustration on Mikey and hope that he can rest once Mike is gone? Or does Evan break, because as much as Mikey has hurt him, he doesn't want his brother dead?
And wouldn't it be interesting to see how Mike/the Fragment responds to Evan attacking him/it? The Fragment wants nothing more than Evan to be happy, so it must glitch the hell out of it when Evan tries destroying the Fragment. It's just like what you wrote about Mike being torn when Ev begs Mike to stop trying to save him in the Nightmare; the Fragment's entire existence is to keep Evan safe and happy, and it needs to be present so it can do that, but if Evan wants it gone... how is it meant to fulfill both objectives at once?
Though, I'm also curious about how this au could tie back into Security Breach. Maybe the Fragment does end up winning control of the game from Glitchtrap, so Glitchtrap runs to the only place he can: Vanessa. And maybe he drags Evan with him, or perhaps Evan goes *willingly* if it means escaping from the Fragment/Stranger that tortured him for so long. Security Breach still happens, but this time, Glitchtrap has Vanessa AND Evan under his control. Maybe he even uses Evan’s ghost to try tricking and manipulating Gregory as well. And all the while, Michael has to try to figure out how to get out of the VR game and back to protecting the ghost spirit whose name he no longer recalls.
~
~
AND THE FRAGMENT BEING A YOUNGER MIKE IS SO COOL! Maybe it could be the reverse of what I described with Evan and Gregory, where Evan sees another lost and scared kid his age hiding away, just like him, and decides "i am not leaving you to face your horrors alone." Neither Evan nor Mike have any memory of who either of them are, but they're both lost and alone and terrified and cling to each other. They're the only thing that either of them has, and vow to get through this together, sort of the antithesis to how isolated they were in the Nightmare. Very depressing that it takes both of them completely losing all of their memories and will to live for them to trust and rely on each other without constantly hurting each other, but...
Maybe the two of them spend eternity forever without their memories. Or maybe like you said, they slowly find each other's memories in the game's coding, and they have to reconcile the horrible truths they learn about themselves and their pasts with the fact that they're *friends* now and don't want to lose each other
24 notes
·
View notes