#team deancas positivity

[sinnabonka]

Spn positive party

Boy, what a ride this week has been, huh? Gathered some spn endgame positive things together, click on the links to read them.

1. Cas is definitely coming back, because Love Always Wins, Quotes and Music from the set confirm, The dead are rising in the Dodge City, Misha is back on IMDb

2. Dean is going to say it back, because He dances with a lamp, There’s a need for him to speak, All other reasons, Dean needs his closure

3. We are getting our happy ending, because Fandom defeated the author, Hope is Logical, This one owns my heart, it’s not Chuck’s ending, but Fix Fic from Showrunners

Edited: how 19x15 proves we are getting The Ultimate Happy End.

💙💚 Destiel is canon.

[weebeestie]

Listen to me, literal showrunner Andrew Dabb did not boop into the middle of the final season to write 15x10 The Heroes’ Journey featuring

Dean fantasizing about tap dancing in the Bunker with a lamp

The most obvious and casually dropped Sam Knows of the entire show (“This Cas keeps looking at me weird”--“So kind of like the real Cas”)

Dean wistfully gazing at Garth and Bess dancing together in sweet domestic bliss and saying "I could be a good dancer if I wanted to be”

just for Dean Winchester to not reciprocate the feelings of the dude he’s been pining over for more than a decade.

[sinnabonka]

That’s been on my mind since I watched the episode. Some things need time to breathe, to rip, and the pause between Cas’ confession and Dean’s truth being told is the most powerful weapon the writers could have possibly used.

As Castiel weaponized his deal with Empty, showrunners weaponized the question hanging in the air for the whole damn week.

The whole world had to talk about Supernatural ending, about the confession. Black PR is still PR, after all.

I mean, the episode eventually resulted in the 11/05/2020 apocalypse. Mission accomplished!

When they went for “bury your gays”, they were prepared for the wave of memes, jokes and hatred, because that was the whole point!

They had a radio silence planned in advance, they have the video of Misha saying goodbye trending, they have a full campaign “To love”, the whole cast talking about the gay angel and Destiel, which is (quoting Mark S) forever.

I -

I mean, this is art. I might be pissed for them for making it harder then it is for the fans, but as a storyteller myself I tip my hat at them. They are going for the ending which is...

Hi, I've followed you for a long time and I really have been appreciating & identifying with your response to the internet explosion about Cas & Dean, so I thought maybe you could help me? I'm also autistic and I'm REALLY confused why everyone has been saying "Destiel is canon" when Dean hasn't responded yet & all we have so far is Cas' confession? I know I can be literal, but that's not mutual yet? I don't understand. No worries if you can't reply, thanks for your time either way. 💜

hello, dear! i get how that’s confusing, but the key thing here is it openly, tacitly acknowledges the concept of romance between dean and cas. 

for years, it’s been implied if not outright said that we, destiel shippers, are delusional for seeing dean and cas’s relationship as romantic. we’ve been shamed and mocked and told that we’re stupid for ~making it gay~ when they’re just good friends. all this time, we’ve been ridiculed for seeing what “isn’t there”.

then cas looked dean in the eye and said “i love you” in a way that not even the straightest straight can misconstrue as platonic. therefore, after a decade of hints and implications and snide remarks (like mockingly calling cas dean’s “boyfriend”, “the one in the dirty trenchcoat who’s in love with you”), it is no longer subtext. it is canonically textual that there is romance in this relationship.

yes, okay, dean hasn’t reciprocated yet, but it’s there, hanging between them, said out loud. no longer lingering looks or ambiguous statements like “i need you” or “i love you, i love all of you.” cas is in love with dean. 

it is spoken, acknowledged, and in fact blessed by the narrative, because being in love with dean is what granted cas true happiness. with two episodes left, the peak of castiel’s character arc is not only accepting that he’s in love with dean, it’s in being unashamed of it, happy with it. after 11 years of cas visibly struggling with depression and emptiness and feeling directionless, he finds his meaning, his happiness, in confessing his love to dean.

and all of that means that we were right. when we said that invisibly watching a man raking leaves isn’t a bromance, when cas broke free of mind control, when dean asked “what broke the connection?” and cas said “i don’t know” and we screamed at the tv “YOU!!! YOU BROKE THE CONNECTION, BECAUSE I LOVE YOU!” we were fucking right.

all of this wasn’t just good friends, we weren’t making it up, we weren’t ~making it gay~, because NEWSFLASH ASSHOLE, IT WAS GAY THE ENTIRE FUCKING TIME. 

now, one might say, aren’t we technically only half right, since dean loving cas hasn’t been textually confirmed? 

sure, maybe. but with “i love you” dropped like a bomb between dean and cas, it reframes everything that’s ever happened between them. we look back at all of cas’s actions to and for dean, everything he’s ever said to dean, every time he’s looked at dean, and realized that he was in love all along. then, what we automatically do next, is look at dean, all his actions and words and looks, and ask ourselves… wait, was he in love with cas the whole time too?

that’s the question that the audience automatically asks, to fill the empty space left by dean not having the time to react or say anything in response. without dean’s answer, we look for an answer ourselves. the audience asks this question, and therefore the show will have to give an answer. desperately we want to know, does dean love cas back??? 

and what can be the answer? with every extraordinary thing they’ve ever done for each other, with half those extraordinary things textually confirmed as romantic, with dean sitting on the floor crying his eyes out, there is no other possible answer but yes. and furthermore, we want the answer to be yes. we naturally yearn for dean to find cas, save cas, and tell him “i love you too,” when we might not have been lead into that yearning for reciprocity if he had said it back immediately. 

an audience that hasn’t shipped destiel all along might have balked at both of them saying i love you “out of nowhere”, but this play of events can cause even a casual viewer who never before interpreted dean and cas as romantic to shout at their tv “of course dean loves cas back!! he has to find cas and tell him!!” suddenly, even a casual viewer wants canon destiel.

so what does that mean? that means the longtime destiel shipper sits back and says,

[clairenatural]

Supernatural 30 Day Challenge Day 3: Favorite Season | Season gr8 Eight

[naruhearts]

That being said, I’ve calmed down a bit (jk NOT REALLY!!!!!!!). 15x18 will be absolutely pivotal and story-changing in terms of realizations, regrets, character arcs waxing and waning and waxing to like, their biggest ultimatums ever...I have so many words that I don’t have time to fit in one post.

We’ve adored the Found Family Sam and Dean have grown to cherish: a non-nuclear found family that mirrors positive change, self-actualization, and interpersonal vigor in each other. Love and...love. 

Love, in all its forms, truly will conquer all. 

Next week’s episode is gonna hurt us, folks. We’re in the actual, literal, raw, unadulterated endgame now. Next week may change everything we thought we knew about the characters and relationships we love, or better yet, magnify our appreciation for them tenfold. I have to say, my stomach is a bottomless pit of anticipation, COMPLETE TERROR, and excitement, mish-mashed together. 

Most of all, I have to say this: Dean and Cas are meant for each other, in every world, in every place, in every year, in every lifetime. The angel afraid of falling and the man afraid of flying caught each other, intertwined unpredictably, to throw cosmic authorities and hierarchies off course. 

Free will is love. Love is free will. Love isn’t bound by anything, isn’t trapped nor suppressed by universal rules. It doesn’t exist in a singular vacuum. It controls and frees itself. Love ebbs and flows and transcends even “the veil of death and saves the day.”

I thought this specific passage from ReKnew (a Christian website) was fitting (and one doesn’t need to subscribe to Christian beliefs to read this. It’s really relevant): “Love can only be genuine if it’s freely chosen. Which means, unless a personal agent has the capacity to choose against love, they don’t really have the capacity to choose for it...[i]n a world that is centered on love, even God can’t be guaranteed to always get what he wants.” 

It’s now up to the writers to see them through appropriately. We’ll finally know if Team Free Will get a good, more-than-palatable, positive ending (especially one we never expected) full of life and love in the next urgent final weeks of SPN on air, and holy fuck, do I love you all for being in this with me. <3

- Mon

[hermywolf]

okay so

dean said they had to move on for cas’s sacrifice to mean something and then died the next day and people are making memes about it but honestly

he accepted his own death so. goddamn. easily.

he IMMEDIATELY accepted it and the first thing he did was try to get sam to accept it, too.

I think this is pretty telling. dean believed he had to move on for cas’s sacrifice - and jack’s, and all the others’s - to mean something, but he COULDN’T. of course he couldn’t, this is dean winchester we’re talking about, and he knew he couldn’t. so when he died, he accepted it.

plus, the finale tells us jack got cas out of the empty. I just chose to interpret that as “cas is in heaven, too.”

so dean tried to move on from cas’s death, couldn’t, died himself, and got to heaven where cas is waiting for him.

which means destiel can be canon in heaven, after all. 

at least, that’s how I chose to see it.

[sinnabonka]

In my head bringing Cas back after the big win is the only option, actually.

This way we’ll have:

The Big Loss - The Big Win - The Big Reflect Patry - The Ultimate Happy End.

And if they keep this dynamic, I’m gonna sob like a little clowning bitch I am.

can i just say that waiting until after the big showdown with Chuck to bring back Cas is a brilliant move because it does away with the whole Need mentality (ie. needing Cas back because of What he can do) and in its place we get the Want mentality (ie. wanting Cas back because of Who he is) i mean Dean won’t be rescuing Cas from The Empty in order to “use” him because there is no Need because the battle is already won which means Dean will be rescuing Cas simply because he Wants Cas back - and not as a brother in arms or even a best friend but as something much more and theres no world-ending threat to rush things along in a fit of desperation just a man following his heart because Cas deserves to be saved because Dean wants him alive because its personal and for the first time theres no other excuse or distraction to hide behind just a man standing in front of his Profound Bond-mate telling him he loves him (too). 

[abushelandablog]

Fandom : Sam, Dean and Cas in heaven pls

Spn: here’s Sam, Dean and Cas in heaven

*cue crickets chirping*

[sortasirius]

What the Fuck Happened to the SPN Finale?

Okay so here it is, my Charlie Kelly style manifesto.

Before I get into it, I recognize that I will look like this to many of you, and that’s okay, I understand:

Secondly, your personal Takes about the writers don’t interest me, I don’t need to hear them. This, as I’ll explain, is going to remain a writer positive blog, and that’s the end of it.

Third, and most importantly: some of what I’m going to talk about is fact, and some is highly educated speculation. I will notate what is speculation, just so there’s no confusion or hot takes in my inbox that I’m a conspiracy theorist or stirring shit up for no reason.

A list of what I’ll be discussing

The episode in regards to the rest of the season

The episode issues: length, editing

Scene placement and speculation of scenes cut

The scrubbing of Jack, Cas, Eileen

Network involvement and general timeline of when things were cut

Misha: theories on where he was, official company line, why we can’t expect to hear anything directly

The silence of the cast post episode (in Misha’s case, mid episode) and what this might mean

Jensen speaking with Kripke about the ending: why it doesn’t mean what you might think (also why kripke remained positive on the ending)

Walker, and why this episode had a major shift

Why the network would do this or get involved

Why the writers of the show simply aren’t the bad guys here, and what I “want” out of this post, since I know it’ll get asked

This is very long and under a cut, but I hope you’ll give it a read.

The Episode In Regards to the Rest of the Season

So, I’ve discussed this already here, but it’s the most obvious thing to me, and that’s the way this episode simply doesn’t fit with the rest of the season.

These people in this room have, truly, been nothing but consistent when it comes to their arcs, especially this season, and the marked dropoff in quality for the finale episode is just too sus to discount to me.  Dabb’s whole focus has been character-based.  In his seasons, we’ve moved far away from MOTW and bro-codependency, the found family taking it’s place.  Does it really sit right to anyone that that was all thrown away in literally the last episode of the entire show?

This is speculation on my part, but as a writer myself, there is no way I would be happy or willing to stamp my name on something that I didn’t think would, at the very least, wrap up the season+ character arcs that I and my team had been crafting.

And before anyone comes in here saying, “well GOT did that!”  Bruh.  The writing was on the wall for GOT long before the final episode.  You could tell that the showrunners just wanted to be done (not only from the plot, but from the fact that they lobbied for a shorter season).  Miss me with that, it doesn’t apply here.  Andrew has, besides Singer and J2, been with the show longer than anyone.  He cares, he is meticulous and detailed, and this ending feels worse than anything Bucklemming has ever written, let alone Dabb.

Additionally, I’ve seen a lot of people say that Dabb was never behind Destiel, that it was all Bobo and Meredith and no one else.  That is reductive to the point of insult of the work Dabb has done to get this greenlit.  This man did not write the s13 Dean grief arc to be slandered like this.  That being said, YES, Bobo and Meredith were the leads on the DeanCas arc this season, but ANDREW IS THE SHOWRUNNER, TO GET EVEN THE CONFESSION APPROVED BY THE NETWORK HE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE THEIR BACKS.  AND HE DID.

Finale Issues

So, now that we’ve gotten the fact that this episode doesn’t hit on any of the major themes the show was barrelling towards all season, let’s discuss the fact that the episode is just...weird.

Not only is it shorter than any other episode (I think with the intro and the credits/crew thing at the end, it was around 38 mins), but it was also...idk, 90% filler?

One of the lovely humans in the POLOL server did the legwork here, and broke it down:

This is weird, y’all.  Most series finales are LONGER than normal (Lost, SOA, Longmire are the ones I can think of off the top of my head), and for the final episode to be this?  I saw more than one person point out that we only really needed 19 episodes, what was the point of 20?  AND THAT’S EXACTLY IT?  WHAT WAS THE POINT OF THIS FINAL EPISODE IF THIS WAS ALL WE WERE SUPPOSED TO GET?

It simply doesn’t make any sense, the first half of the episode was rushed, a final monster hunt gone wrong, but in the second half?  Nothing really happened?  Sam lived his entire life and Dean just drove around.  It doesn’t make sense to have all the emotional arcs left unaddressed in an episode that definitely needed some kind of spark.

Here’s the speculation I have: the episode seemingly went through a lot of changes between the initial inception of the final season and when we actually got it, but I think it would have been passable (as in, we wouldn’t be sitting here asking each other why each arc feels incomplete) until the editing room got ahold of it.  The only think that makes this episode make sense is network fuckery.  Truly, that is the only thing.  It explains the weird, cuts, the rushed pacing of the first half followed by nothing in the second half, the double montages of “Wayward Son” back to back, and Dean just...driving around for the last half of the episode.

Scene Placement and Speculation of Scenes Cut

Before I get into this section, the info of the shots in the episode I have come from a source that @occamshipper​ got a week or so before the finale.  She’s talked about this here.

So here’s what Min was given:

1-5: 1 INT MEN OF LETTERS – DEAN’S ROOM Dean is greeted by Miracle

6-10: 6 INT MEN OF LETTERS – HALLWAY/SAM’S ROOM Sam has his routine

D1 1 11-15: 15 EXT FARM HOUSE Establishing

N1 1/8 16-20: 19 Dad’s journal, marker, drawing of masked man in journal.

21-25: 23 INT IMPALA – PMP Driver picks the music

N2 1 3/8 1,2 26-30: 28pt2 INT BARN: A face from the past

28pt3 Sam and Dean say goodbye

28pt4 Shot early for technical reasons, presumably the overhead shot

N2 31-45: 41 INT MEN OF LETTERS – SAM’S ROOM Sam’s alarm goes off D4 1/8 1 46-60: 56 INT N7glasses for Sam, laptop.

So...it all fits right?  It all tracks with the actual episode, where it lands, etc.  The issue is between shots 29-40 which were apparently “too big to spoil.”  Uh.  Where are they?  And where’s 28 pt4?

After Dean dies, the next scene is Sam burning him, then shot 31, the shot of his alarm going off.

So.  Where are those 11ish shots?

PLUS we have the boards, which are scenes we KNOW were actually shot:

As well as scenes for 20 that were shot in 19.

It’s just...weird, it’s weird and again hits on the fact that the episode is so short and like 80% montage.

The Scrubbing of Jack, Cas, and Eileen

So now we have to reckon with the fact that Eileen was last mentioned by Sam after she got snapped by Chuck, Jack’s last mention is that he’s off being God somewhere, and Cas’ last mention is a ~knowing look~ between Dean and Bobby.

I’m sorry, make it make sense:

????????  That’s the end if it?  They don’t need to be discussed after this???  It’s just simply not something a writer would do, they would not introduce these characters, these arcs, without thinking there’s going to be some kind of follow through here.

So not only were three major characters (including two leads and both of the original characters’ love interests) completely wiped from the finale episode, it was as though Sam and Dean never even needed them, which just...ain’t it.

So why Eileen and Jack too?  Why not just take Cas out of it if they were afraid of the gay?  Because, ultimately, the episode went back to Kripke’s original story: just the bros, they only need each other and no one else.  They don’t want anyone else, they don’t need anyone else.  Easier to go back to something they knew was successful than trust the writers and their audience and take a big leap.

Alex even said he shot for 20 with “some of the guys” here.  What happened to that footage?

The complete 180 of it all still shocks me, I still cannot believe that we were essentially at the finish line, and the network just stopped short, and decided to go run another race, at the expense of the arc of this fifteen year legacy show.

Network Involvement and When Things Were Cut

Okay, now into the juicy stuff.

So I’ve pretty well established that network fuckery is clear, but how much did they get involved, what was the original intent?

Well again, we may never actually know what Andrew’s original script was, but I think, at the least, it would involve Dean speaking his truth to Cas and Sam living a life with Eileen.

Now, it seems today, that Misha said that Jimmy Novak was supposed to be in the finale in one iteration of the script, and while initially my brain was like “that truly makes no sense and he’s either straight up lying or telling a half truth,” I think what may be happening is Misha talking about as much as he can right now.

So Jimmy right.  Weird as fuck.  Why would he been in the Roadhouse and not Cas?  My current thought (this is about as reachy as I’ll get) is that Jimmy had no lines, could he have been in the Roadhouse as a red herring, like it said ���Jimmy” in the script but it was just Cas in human clothes, a way to get around the network saying Cas couldn’t be in the final scene.  Also, you’ll notice that Misha didn’t say that Cas wasn’t supposed to be in the ep at all, just Jimmy in the last scene.

All this to say, there have clearly been multiple versions of the script, getting lighter and lighter with Cas and Eileen as the network pulled further and further back.  Remember, Dabb has to get things approved before they get shot, and if the network kept asking and asking and asking to cut Cas and Eileen, he had to find a way to work around it.  Granted, I still think that if we had been able to get a Dabb script that wasn’t torn to shreds in editing, it wouldn’t be so bad.  It may not be what a lot of us wanted (Dean speaking his truth to Cas and a reciprocation), but doing everything he could to give it to us in subtext or visual clues.

Plus, in all honesty, my man can’t keep his story straight anyway.  He said twice in his panel that the Empty and offscreen Heaven ending weren’t his original ending either.

In addition, remember that Jensen did ADR post episode 18, AND said in a meet and greet last weekend that Dean’s reaction to Cas’ confession was “cut down.” (Source here).  Many of us clowns got excited when we first heard about ADR, because we thought it would be upping the ante on Dean’s reaction, but I remember being a little sus when it was just crying.  My speculation on that is that they cut out Dean actually SAYING something, @winchestersingerautorepair​ spoke about that here.

The biggest sins were, in my opinion, committed during editing, where the network got too gun shy and sliced the episode until it was nothing but a heartless bro-fest of a finale, not mentioning anything about the other major characters that we all love, and letting the boys just suffer in separation until Sam died and finally joined Dean in Heaven.  The editing came by cutting all the major emotional beats between anyone other than Dean and Sam, leaving the skeleton of the story intact, just shorter and less...poignant than it was ever supposed to be.

Misha

We know Misha was in Vancouver, we know he quarantined, but we also know he wasn’t in the final scene, when he spoke about being in the last moment of the show months ago.  We were not crazy, he was there, he quarantined, and, in all likelihood (speculation but fitting with the timeline), he actually may have shot something (not much, but something).

I have sources here, here, here, and here showing where Misha was at that time.

Remember, the man was completely open about coming back until they finished shooting (look at this thread).  The switch happened, just like everything else, halfway through them shooting.

Please also remember Jake Abel posting his “Where’s Misha” video here.  Jake isn’t malicious, he isn’t being nasty here.  Misha was there, and everyone that’s trying to convince people he’s wasn’t just...isn’t telling the truth about it.

This is one of the things that makes me really mad, because they’re literally attempting to gaslight people into thinking, “oh we were totally wrong he was never supposed to be there” WHEN HE WAS THERE, WE KNOW HE WAS THERE.

So we’ve already heard from several people (Meghan Fitzmartin, Jay, a PA on the set of 19 (WHO WAS NOT WORKING FOR 20), Misha himself) that this was all down to Covid restrictions.  Ultimately, as this post says, we’ve heard FIVE versions of where Misha was.  None of it makes sense, but the Covid protocol seems to be the company line that others are repeating.

You may ask: why?  Why lie to all of us when we have questions?  Why, in Jay’s case, say that we’re all spreading false lies to stir up trouble, when we just have questions and things that do not make sense.  Simply?  Warner Brothers is absolutely massive.  These people have their careers to protect and are likely all under NDAs.  They want to work for WB again and don’t want to burn bridges, including Misha.  It sucks, but that’s why it’s unlikely that we’ll hear someone come out and say, “yeah we’re lying to you.”

Silence of the Cast Post Episode

So this is...probably the worst part of all this, at least in my opinion.

The guys had all been pretty excited about the end of the show (especially Jared, but Jensen’s panel last week was Jensen as happy and jokey and positive as I’ve ever seen him.  He was so excited about episode 18, about what it meant for Dean and for Cas, and I just cannot buy that he would have been that excited unless he thought there was something more in the episode.

Misha live-tweeted the episode, and was watching it with his kids.  It’s well known that Misha and the kids don’t watch the show because it’s too scary, and let’s ask ourselves, why would he have them watch an episode that he’s barely even mentioned in?

He also stopped live-tweeting at a very specific point in the episode (Dean’s death) and has not mentioned Supernatural since then. 

None of them, not Jared, Jensen, Misha, or even Alex, said anything about the episode for nearly 36 hours, when Jensen posted a salty photo on instagram.  It’s just...not what you’d expect for the end of a 15 year show, when the cast and crew are so close to the fans, so close to each other. 

My theory?  They didn’t know.  They thought Misha was, at least, going to be in the episode in some way, and when he wasn’t, they decided not to say anything.

You really think that Jensen “Heller” Ackles would have been so excited about the end of the show last week if he thought Cas wasn’t going to be in it at all?  Nah son, doesn’t make any sense.

Even today, in Jared and Misha’s panels, they seemed sad and...more than a little careful, both saying that there were things they couldn’t say, both talking around things that we all have questions on.

Jensen Speaking with Kripke

So this is where a lot of people are getting fodder to take shots at the writers, saying that Jensen hated it from the beginning, but I don’t think so.  I actually think I know what Jensen went to him about, and it wasn’t the lack of Cas or the weird pacing or the montages (which I don’t think were there when Jensen got the script); I think it was the manner of Dean’s death.

I know a lot of people were upset about that, upset with how...normal it was, coming off an episode where they literally beat God.  I actually didn’t mind it, I thought it was an interesting thematic take to be like: you can be a hero all your life, but sometimes shit happens, and you just die.

But imagine how hard that was for Jensen to read.  He would run to Kripke for that, because for him, Dean dying by being impaled by a piece of rebar had to be tough to swallow.

So, why didn’t Kripke say that?  Why didn’t he say, “oh well he had a problem with Dean’s death, none of that other stuff was in the script.”

Guys.  Why would he get involved?  He’s not going to burn bridges any more than anyone else is.  He said the ending was good because it’s the easy thing to do, it’s simple, will cause him no problems in his career, and he can just ignore the people trying to engage with him on it.

Walker

Something else to talk about is the major shift this episode had from the rest of the season: the shift from Dean to Sam.  I am NOT saying that Sam isn’t important, he definitely, absolutely is, but it was DEAN who really needed to wrap up his arc, Sam just needed to move on, get married to Eileen, become the leader he was always meant to.  So what changed?  What was with the shirtless scene, the Austin number and random case there, most of the episode being heavily Sam focused, going through his entire life in a montage?

Anyone else notice the 375 Walker promos, or Jared’s little spiel about Walker and how he hoped SPN fans would “come along for the ride.”

It’s...kinda obvious?  CW wanted to appeal to who they think the key demographic of SPN and Walker is: rural areas in the South.  It would explain a lot, why so much editing, why so Sam focused, the Austin number, the number of Walker promos, all of it.

I’m not saying this is fact, I don’t know that it is, but it is a little suspicious that even in Jared’s panel today, he talked A LOT about Walker and how he hopes SPN fans will watch it.

Why Would the Network Get Involved?

Simply put: $$$

If they think Walker can be the new SPN, and that those crazy SPN fans liked it originally, it’s a lot safer to go with the “original intent” of the show than do something risky (like making one of your two original leads queer).

And?  They don’t care.  They don’t care that the episode didn’t make sense, they don’t care that all the emotional arcs were left hanging, they don’t care by (potentially) smashing together two of Dean’s monologues (one to Sam, one to Cas) that it came of as...gross. ( @curioussubjects​ wrote a beautiful post showing how part of that death speech was likely meant for Dean here).  They don’t care, they never have, they just want to make their money and move on from the too-loud fandom that fought for representation too hard for too long.

It can’t help but feel insidious, which, honestly, it might be, but it really all comes down to the next cash cow, which, they think, is Walker, even at the cost of the fifteen year legacy show.

The Writers and What I Want

So here it is, all this weird, sus shit laid out on the line.  And you know what?  To me, there is no way to blame the writers, because they didn’t want this.

I don’t think Dabb and Bobo would have gone ahead with the confession in 18 without thinking that there would be some closure to that arc, they wouldn’t have done that not only to the fans, but for the sake of their own story as well: no writer wants to start something that they can’t finish. (And this applies to both Cas and Eileen).

Here’s a basic rundown of what I think happened: they had a clear arc from 18-20, ending in reciprocation at some level from Dean, Sam marrying Eileen, Hunter Sam as the new Bobby, Dean in heaven with Cas and big roadhouse reunion at the end. Covid prevented a good amount of that. Network had to stare at big gay 18 for six months, got cold feet. Thought about Walker, target audience and alienation of the rural areas if it went full gay. Misha quarantined and likely shot something (not much), he was then cut by execs and went home. They likely added in lines referencing Eileen and Cas to make it clear but more subtextual. They wrap, editing gets it and hacks it to pieces, so we get a shorter episode that’s mostly montages and jarringly bro-centric with nothing else. Arcs are left hanging. Dabb gets episode but it’s too late, there’s nothing he can do. Actors aren’t told so they can continue to do positive PR for the ending, they all found out at the same time we did: hence almost complete silence about the finale.

And you know what?  They warned us.  I talked about it here, but they’ve been telling us all season that Chuck wasn’t the writer, he’s the network.  I don’t think, still, that they thought it would be cut up like this, into something so unsalvageable that it’s been panned by almost everyone, even people who didn’t care much about Dean and Cas.

Finally, a masterpiece can be ruined by editing, and while I’m not sure even the script they ended up shooting on was a masterpiece (due to the network meddling already), but to me it’s blatantly obvious that it’s no one but the network that caused this, that took away closure for Dean, Cas, and even Sam.

So what do I want?  Nothing really, there’s nothing we can do, but I wrote this mostly to show people that the writers are not your enemy.   In fact, to the people trashing them?  You’re doing exactly what the CW wants you to: blame the obvious targets, blame Misha, blame Jensen and Jared, blame Dabb.  Scream and yell at them on Twitter and about how the show is ruined because of them.  The network keeps their engagement levels high, they don’t get as targeted for their behavior, and just keep moving along.

Just, please, think about who did this,  Mourn the show, be angry, but not at the people who fought tooth and nail for this for literal years, not the people who wanted it more than we did, not the people who cannot say anything because of their careers and the NDAs they’re bound by.

Someone is going to spill eventually, but until then, we just have to wait, and continue to be loud.

[sinnabonka]

Spn Final Positivity Party

It’s the final countdown, my wayward sons and daughters, and everyone needs a little boost of positivity, something to hold on to, something to fuel all the hope vibes. Lucky you, I’m happy to deliver this crazy mixture of some good meta, specs and funny stuff to go through not to lose a smile these days! 

For the part 1 of the post click here, all of those are still relevant. 

Okay, let’s roll. Starting with the big ones!

Breaking down the montage by @friedchickenangelwings

Speculations on the probable endings by @ me 

The last long post about Supernatural by @mishasminions

Taming the General Audience by @lovelyladlelumps

What was the meaning of 15x19 for the ending by @ me

10 reasons why by @feralgosto

Cas is not human by @norahastuff

Full cycle by @rambleoncas

Hints from the real world:

The way Jensen talks about the confession scene & Tweets

What did Dabb said @dotthings

Misha was in Vancouver 

Connecting the dots

All the smaller things: 

They never wanted a life like this  by @folkloredean

Why Jack didn’t bring Cas back | Why there’s no Cas in 15x19 

The best eggs in her life by @winchester-reload, kinda

Why lamp, of course 

Some asks which can be helpful

Jack’s foreshadowing | Small comfort | Why they do what they do | If you are anxious about the rumors | Killing off Cas | What about the barn?

If you have something nice of your own, please do share! We need every single spec and meta for this positivity party to go on!

[dotthings]

Jensen Ackles:

Walked into the S15 writers room with a list of people he wanted back

Back when everyone thought the series finale was going to include a lot of beloved familiar faces, he said in the New York Daily News, “I’m excited about it...I think it pays credit to a lot of things that have gotten us to where we are today.” (We know now his issue right along has to do with Dean’s fate)

Has been mister “get the band back together” more than once

Has, unprompted, said Destiel positive remarks on panels

Has, unprompted, talked about Misha, praises Misha, calls Misha “a dear friend”

Spoke a whole eloquent paragraph on the value of the different characters and relationships on the show

Was the one who urged Bobo Berens to complete the Kaia arc

Showed open enthusiasm for Wayward Sisters and said “I want to help tell that story”

Is not going to be the least bit annoyed about fans who say Misha is a 3rd lead

Showed his happiness and joy and relief when Misha was brought back onto the show in S7

Has frequently spoken warmly about the Dean and Cas bond and Cas’s emotional impact on Dean

High-fived Misha over “brokebacknatural”

Talked about filming a “western slash rom-com” with Misha

Was visibly excited about 15.18, openly supported Misha and that story, he and Misha showed each other fan reaction videos to the confession, Jensen said of the hand-print “that’s going to make someone scream in their apartment” and knows and appreciates how much Destiel and that bond between Dean and Cas means to fans

Has always been vocal about his love for his cast-mates and how he likes having those characters around, praises them as actors and their characters

Appreciates and supports found family and expanded cast

Jensen Ackles is the bro bond team free will found family cas fan wayward sisters supporter deancas king, and he is mostly the biggest Dean fan. My receipts are Jensen Ackles himself. His highest priority is Dean, he’s not about ship wars and he’s not against anyone. He cares about the whole show and has demonstrated that over and over.

[laora-inn]

Supernatural - 15x17. On Chuck, Cas, and love. Chuck’s true weakness

As all my SPN metas, it’s Destiel positive and happy end positive, don’t like - don’t read.

15x17 gave us a lot about Chuck and Amara relationship. Now I should tell, that inside the story they are not mirrors for some other SPN characters. SPN characters are supposed to be mirrors for them.

Or that’s how it was planned by Chuck.

From the start Chuck wasn’t whole. That’s where his disappointment in angels and humans comes from. That’s why, though he needs fans, the same time he despises them and can’t see the truth, which is obvious for them (i. e. for Becky).  Chuck doesn’t kill his fans. He just sends them away, ‘cause they are "annoying” and have their own demands. He prefers to ignore that. Just like channel execs preferred to ignore us when it came to Cas and DeanCas. 

Chuck sends his angelic fans away the same he did with Becky in 15x04, with the same words actually. “I didn’t kill him (Becky’s husband). He’s just far away”. Chuck ruins their lives with ignoring them - but also he ruins lives of those who he is interested in. Lucifer was his most beloved son - and Chuck gave him the Mark of Cain, which corrupted him... though Chuck’s main purpose there was to seal Amara, of course. 

That’s how his disappointment began. He sealed the part of himself and became BROKEN. Broke himself, actually.  In 15x17 Chuck says he was obsessed by fractals, repetitions of one form on different levels, and that’s true: in Sam and Dean’s story he just tries to repeat his and Amara’s one - maybe, to understand something. To fix himself. Not to be haunted of his own failures. That’s his self-therapy - but it didn’t work even a little for ages... until he saw something true. Until the story of Team Free Will began and his puppets suddenly weren’t puppets anymore. 

Why? I think we all Destihellers had known, but in 15x17 we got a serious confirmation.  These Sam and Dean are so special because of this Cas, because of his total and absolute disobedience. According to Chuck, that’s the only real difference between their story and the others’ ones. 

The reason of that is obvious - love. Cas’s perfect angelic devotion, but not to God. Here I wrote about Adam and Seraphina and the sacred oath reason - in connection to Cas.  Chuck doesn’t understand Cas’s (and love - the synonyms here) importance for his story. For him Cas “is something that always goes wrong” (Dean’s words from 15x03, fascinating *sarcasm*). Here in the end there are some thoughts about Cas’s being the greatest trickster of the show.

There are lots of Sams, Deans, Cases. But there is one Amara. In 15x17 she said her return because of the Winchesters was a part of Chuck’s plan - except her feelings for Dean, as Chuck confirmed. I suppose we can believe him - he chose these Sam and Dean to return Amara, to deal with her. Thanks to them he finally found the will to face her - not to make it looks like one sibling’s death/sealing is the logical reason for another one to live long and happy life (like for Dean in 5x22, after Sam’s sacrifice). Chuck used the story to heal his trauma - but he ignored Lucifer’s trauma, his desperate want to be loved, and the Winchesters’ story continued. Now I think that it was a part of Chuck’s plan - he liked these boytoys so much. And with considering them boytoys, his trauma wasn’t healed.  ‘Cause it wasn’t Amara who caused it. It was always Chuck himself.  In 15x04 he said that he hates himself. I have no doubts about it, but all he’s doing was making it even worse. Hurting others means deepening your wounds. To find the way you should stop. Just stop. And enjoy the moment, maybe - like Amara in 15x17 advised. 

But Chuck didn’t listen to her. Enjoyment means love, and he can’t love. Only manipulate. 

Unlike Chuck, Amara found her harmony. I assume that’s because she found love in herself, not outside. The love outside can’t be appreciated if your heart is closed, like Chuck’s. Well, Amara’s heart is open, and that makes her vulnerable I guess.  In the beginning of 15x17 Amara was reading “Norwegian wood”. I’ve also read this book and think that the main message here is: the real is always better than some dreams about. Just like Amara said to Dean about Mary in 15x15... though Dean seemed not to understand her.  Betraying Amara for Dean means betraying himself and letting Chuck, the vengeful father, who is ready to sacrifice his children in a heartbeat, win. Betraying her means Dean becomes Chuck’s mirror. He gives up his family not for his own freedom, but for Chuck’s.  ALL THIS STORY WAS CREATED BECAUSE CHUCK WANTED TO HAVE HIS FREE WILL. And he can’t. 

I assume somewhere in 15x04 he thought Amara’s consumption was the only way to become whole, to find free will, to feel joy, not disappointment. To be happy. 

In 6x20 we saw Cas’s praying to Chuck while sitting on a bench, with some flowers near. We know that was the moment when Chuck could stop Cas, prevent all this Leviathan story... unless he WANTED it. In 15x04 he said that he loved monsters, Leviathans especially. And by that time he certainly wanted Cas dead (as well as the channel execs, I suppose). 

In 15x17 we see Amara praying to Chuck while sitting on a bench, with a flower in her hands. She wants a balance with him. He wants her dead - not literally though. 

Did Chuck know that in 15x17 Amara would trap him? I think yes. He wanted that specifically.

Did he know that Sam would be alive by the end of 15x17? I think no. He was disappointed again, he WASN’T HAPPY even after Amara’s disappearance.  

Why wasn’t he? The Empty gave us a clue while making a deal with Cas: to be happy you must let yourself be happy. And that’s impossible without love, understanding, and TRANSFORMATION.

Yet Chuck didn’t understand that AGAIN. He said “kill each other, don’t kill each other - I don’t care” to boys only because he succeeded in killing Amara as a personality finally. So he didn’t need Sam and Dean as “mirrors” of his own toxic relationship with his sibling anymore.

But we - now we understand. Chuck revealed the secret himself when told about this Cas’s uniqueness.

To be whole doesn’t mean to manipulate and to devour, in fact these are the opposites. Maybe Sam, Dean and Cas ARE broken, but not as much as Chuck himself. Maybe they are broken only because of him and his trauma, his awful relationship with Amara. Maybe, unlike him, they found the real way to healing.  

Maybe their “cracks” are not like his. Maybe these “cracks” are the free will itself, the things that can change the convo, and they are also something Chuck doesn’t know about -  ‘cause he doesn’t understand them. 

He doesn’t truly understand love. 

The way Cas supports Sam while looking the way to save Jack. The things he says during Sam and Dean’s fight - small things, not important at first sight. They weren’t scripted by Chuck I think: Dean, don’t. Sam, why not? All these looks - from Sam to Cas before confronting Dean. From Cas to Sam and Dean. From Dean to Cas - Dean was looking at Cas several times while listening to Sam, for support or confirmation.

Cas couldn’t fight Dean there, he was so unsure. He didn’t even agree to buy Sam some time if Dean comes back earlier than Sam. But he supported Sam in his fight, said to him not to surrender, said, that Sam’s internal compass was functioning perfectly. That’s moral support only, but it could change things.

Dean also saw support in Cas, but Cas had doubts, he ASKED Sam, why not, and Dean just HAD TO listen. 

As a result they confirmed themselves as Team Free Will. All the three of them - they could escape the next Chuck’s trap.    Still I assume the crucial party in that belongs to Cas. He is something that always isn’t in the plan, something unpredictable.  Notice - when Sam, Jack and Dean deal with Amara, there is no Cas with them. But in the end of 15x17 it’s Cas who asks Chuck about Amara, and that wasn’t the part of his plan. I suppose this question was the reason of Chuck’s getting angry so much that he revealed the secret about this Cas as a kind of offence. Like it’s bad - to be unpredictable. To be a trickster.  To be real.

Chuck’s words about this Cas’s uniqueness influence Cas for sure. After them he looked at Dean TWICE (what for?!), and I think that’s possible that his latter question “What do you mean?” refers to these Chuck’s words especially. Cas was just lost in his thoughts when he heard them. Only when Chuck told about Jack’s death, Cas was brought back to reality. Coincidence? Hell no. 

Now Cas understood something thanks to Chuck, and that will play in 15x18 for sure. 

Also, in 15x17 we didn’t see any Cas+Empty interaction. Only Sam+Empty - but THIS IS CAS’S HELP TO SAM THAT MADE IT POSSIBLE.

So maybe Chuck knew about Sam coming to Death library. But did he know about Sam’s getting God Death book? We’ll wait and see. To conclude: Chuck can’t control love ‘cause he doesn’t understand it, doesn’t feel it. And that's the true weakness that will end him.  Chuck’s true weakness is revealed: he isn’t in love. With anything. 

[naruhearts]

PR is not showrunning but—

Dean/Cas framing.

With three leads and two sad words.

(Twitter: fishh3088)

[surlybobbies]

For the Love of the Game [deancas, 1.5k, T]

Summary:

“A tense moment on the field between good friends. Novak has taken Dean Winchester’s legs out from under him - did he get the ball? What do you think, Joe? Yellow card?”

“Looks like he just about got the ball to me. Fair challenge. Though judging by his reaction, it looks like Winchester doesn’t agree."

(Dean and Cas over the course of three years as players of opposing soccer teams.)

Author’s notes: written in the 90 minutes it took to watch a soccer game at 1am.  I’m a sucker for athlete Dean and Cas.

Read on ao3 or

“Of course, Winchester and Novak have known each other since they were kids.  Best friends, these two, off the pitch.  On the pitch, however, as I’m sure we’ll see today, is a different story.”

The loss is a difficult one to take; it means that Cas and his team are now on the bottom half of the league table, a position they haven’t been in for well over a decade.  

After the final whistle, Dean jogs to Cas, whose hands are clutching at his hair in disbelief.  Dean puts his hands around Cas’s face, forcing Cas to look at him.  “You okay?”

Cas closes his eyes and grits his teeth.  He’s probably thinking about the goal Dean had scored just 10 minutes before the final whistle, and how he’d been unable to prevent it.  “I will be.”

Dean sighs and pulls Cas in for a rough hug.  “I’ll tell mom you’re coming over this weekend.”

“How long is she in town?” 

“Just a week,” Dean says.  “She’ll want to see you.”

Cas shoves him away and scrubs his face with both hands.  “Just let me know.”

++

“Apparently they stay at each other’s bachelor pads over holidays.”

It’s been coming for years, but when Cas pulls Dean in for a kiss on Christmas, it’s still a surprise.  Dean takes a few moments to fully register what’s happening, that Cas is really finally kissing him, but once it sinks in, he is definitely on board with the developments, and he pushes Cas against the wall and starts to thoroughly enjoy himself.

A century later, Cas pulls away.  “This is unwise,” he says breathlessly.

Dean’s dizzy with Cas’s touch.  He touches Cas’s face because he can’t stand not touching him.  “You started it,” he says, all he can think of to say.

Cas frowns a little bit, but his nostrils flare with how hard he’s breathing.  “How I got here, kissing an absolute idiot, I have no idea.”

“You’ve also got a hand up my shirt,” Dean supplies unhelpfully, “if you wanted to get around to removing that.”

Cas arches an eyebrow, and Dean likes it.  “Do you want me to remove it?” Cas asks, leaning in again, dragging his hand down to Dean’s waistband at an agonizingly slow pace.

Dean’s hopeless - absolutely done for.  “Definitely not.”

“Good,” Cas growls, and Dean likes that a lot.

++

“Their rivalry seems to fuel their friendship - or is it the other way around?”

“Just to be clear, this doesn’t mean I’m going to take it easy on you this Saturday,”

Dean’s lounging, one hand behind his head, watching the progress of Cas’s lips down his chest with lidded eyes.  “Wouldn’t love you if you did.”

There’s a long pause.  Cas lifts his eyes to watch Dean’s expression, but it doesn’t waver.  The only sign of nerves is in the way his throat moves.  Cas acknowledges the word with a small smile and a lingering kiss to the center of Dean’s chest.  Later, he’ll murmur the word over and over and over into Dean’s hair, his hands on Dean’s ass, encouraging him, and Dean will swell and break with it.

++

“A tense moment between good friends.  Novak has taken Dean Winchester’s legs out from under him - did he get the ball?  What do you think, Joe?  Yellow card?”

“Looks like he just about got the ball to me.  Fair challenge.  Though it looks like Winchester doesn’t seem to agree.”

“Could have broken my leg, Cas,” Dean spits.

Cas is adjusting his shin pads.  He looks up at Dean.  “Hardly - it was a fair challenge.”

Dean gets up right in his face when Cas straightens.  Cas has seen this face in the throes of pleasure and he knows he’ll see it again; he lifts his chin and smirks, knowing how much Dean will hate it.  

“Also, ref begs to differ,” Cas says, winking.  “No foul.”

“Jesus, you’re a cocky bastard.”

“And you’re a shit striker.”

“You shouldn’t even be on the field with a challenge like that.”

Cas is getting back into position, walking backwards so he can throw one last remark at Dean: “You shouldn’t even be on the field with skills like that.”

Dean’s face turns red.  “What’d you just say?”

In the end the ref has to separate them; no cards are shown, but neither of them talk to the other for two weeks.

It goes without saying that the eventual make-up sex is fantastic.

++

“It’s Novak’s last game for the Angels - he’ll be officially retired at the end of these 90 minutes, aged 35.  Fitting that his greatest rival and friend should be on the pitch with him, albeit playing for the opposition.”

Cas is subbed at 87 minutes for his last ovation from the home crowd.  They adore him as he adores them, and Dean knows this last walk off the field has got to be an emotionally harrowing moment for Cas.

Dean hopes his fans won’t give him too much shit for what he does next: he pulls Cas in for a rough hug as Cas walks to the touchline to be subbed.  He doesn’t look Cas in the eye, and shoves him away before either of them do something stupid like cry.

++

“Back for the second half of the first game of the season, and Dean Winchester’s 37th minute goal is the only thing separating the two sides.

As most know, Winchester announced over the break that he and his best friend and former Angels player Cas Novak have been dating.  There’s been quite a bit of backlash, mostly from fans who think their relationship has swayed their performances over the years, but both Winchester’s manager and Novak’s former manager have laughed off that particular suggestion.  What do you think, Greg?”

“No, they’ve both been consummate professionals, haven’t they, over the years?  Obviously good friends - well, we know why now - but it never stopped either of them from giving it their all on the pitch.”

“They both loved the game too much to let anything affect it.”

It’s not fun, being the only player in the league out of the closet.  His teammates don’t treat him any differently, but Dean sometimes feels like he’s slowly being frozen out.

“It’s because you didn’t say anything to us.”

“What the hell was I supposed to say, Benny?  ‘I’m fucking a guy, and it’s Cas Novak’?”

Benny sighs.  “I don’t know, Dean.  They just want to know their captain’s being honest with them.  Sleeping with the opposition is pretty shady, alright?”

Dean hangs his head.  He understands.  He’s still pissed, still frustrated, but he makes up his mind.  He slams his locker to get everyone’s attention.  “Just figured you all would want to know,” he says loudly, a little angrily, “I’m asking Cas to marry me tonight.”

Stunned silence.  Dean stares them all down, daring any of them to say anything.  If he has to knock someone out for talking shit about Cas, he swears he’ll do it and damn the consequences.

But nothing happens.  Ash grins, scratching his neck.  “We’re invited to the wedding, right?”

The laughter that follows breaks the ice.  Dean tries and fails to stop himself from crying when they all come forward to congratulate him.

++

“Dean Winchester made history by marrying Cas Novak over the break.  It’s a great moment in sport, but he’s opened up in a recent interview regarding the homophobic abuse he and his husband have received.”

“A shame that.  The sport needs to do more to support their LGBTQ+ players.”

“Agreed.  But despite all that, Winchester says he’s proud to lead the way for others to come out in his wake.  Plus, his husband is here to watch his first game of the season, so that must make up for it somewhat.”

“He’s probably not happy to see Novak in Angel colors, though!”

“The rivalry lives on!”

“Who wants to bet that it’ll be a tense atmosphere in the Novak-Winchester home tonight?”

Cas is solemn as he greets Dean at the door of their home, but Dean scowls at him anyway.  “Don’t think I didn’t see you cheering when they scored.”

Cas looks a little abashed.  “They’re my friends, Dean.”

“I’m your husband.”

Cas hides his smile in Dean’s neck.  “And I love you.”  He wraps his arms around Dean so he can’t wriggle away.  “But I also love my team.  My fans would have rioted if I’d shown up in your jersey.”

Dean doesn’t bother arguing.  He played for the full 90, and the emotional toll of the loss is just now sinking in.  “I’m ready to go to bed,” he says, his voice raw.

“Alright,” Cas says, kissing Dean on the cheek.  “I’ll be there soon.”

Dean is half asleep when Cas walks in wearing Dean’s jersey and a pair of sweatpants - then Dean’s suddenly wide-awake and half-hard.

Cas gets under the covers and leans over Dean, smelling like shampoo and toothpaste.  “Good night,” he says cheerfully.

Dean stares at his husband, marveling at the audacity.  Finally, he says, “You’re such a jackass,” but diminishes the effect by pulling Cas in roughly by the front of the shirt and kissing him, much to Cas’s delight.

_____________ tag list:

@super-powerful-queen-slayyna @lifeisingrey @fangirlingtodeath513 @levicastho @dontlosethemoon @dmsilvisart @hello-vague-stuff @bold-sartorial-statement @snarkysnartes @massivefaceperson @dontlosethemoon @livebloggingmydescentintomadness @yourspecialeyes @misha-moose-dean-burger-lover​ @profoundnet

(if you’ve asked me to put you on the tag list and i haven’t I’M SO SORRY i was bombarded with a bunch of notifs and may have missed it… send me an ask - replies sometimes get buried esp if you don’t reply on the original post - and i’ll update the list!)

[nicollekidman]

abby can you talk on how deancas and tenrose are the same?

okay so i need to preface this with the usual…. cannot believe i am enlightened enough to be seriously discussing this in the year 2020, but i’m happy for my teen self. also there is about to be a lot of unhinged earnestness to follow, so if you’re easily succebtable to cringe… don’t read on. ALSO RIP I WROTE 1800 WORDS about just the most general and nonspecific concepts…… brb k wording myself 

first off i think it’s so funny that i just went back and looked and i typed cas/ten as a one and dean/rose as a six completely independently so… that’s where my head is at. 

i think the meat of the issue is the way that tenrose and deancas function both in relation to the overall narrative and each other. there are many differences of course, but at the end of the day, both relationships are positioned as the ultimate working example of what their shows are trying to be About. 

i could write an entirely separate essay on the intersections between cas and the doctor, but essentially…… these are figures introduced to the audience as Beyond Human Understanding. they exist as celestial beings unconstrained by the rules of space and time, more closely connected to god than humanity. we meet the doctor farther along in his journey than castiel, but both of their character arcs are rooted in a Godlike Creature observing humanity and becoming enamored with it/driven to protect and care for it. by the time the doctor meets rose, it is well established that he has a soft spot for humanity, she’s not the one who teaches him that. but she is the one he reaches out to and leans on for support and healing post-time war, and she is the one who influences ten’s regeneration so deeply that he is made in her image/for her. castiel rebuilds dean atom by atom is hell, and upon rescuing him from the pit, finds himself similarly irrevocably altered. it is revealed to us that castiel also has had a long affection for humanity, but nothing swayed him from his ultimate duty before he met dean. and just as the doctor finds himself with a family for the first time after gallifrey with rose and her mother on the estate, castiel finds himself cut off from his family/realm, but with a new family, team free will. they lose everything, their attachment to the heavens, and find a new family and a new reason to continue, in these humans. 

dean and rose also are the ultimate Human Credentials. we all know this term to be indicative of someone who confers humanity onto the other, someone who, by mere accompaniment, allows their beloved to more safely/easily navigate life. and it’s true in this sense. rose is constantly reminding ten how to Be Human (”am i being rude?”) in both big and small ways, just as dean more or less badgers castiel in the same way ( “dude. we talked about this”). neither cas nor ten would be as intimately connected with their “human sides” with their partners. but dean and rose are also Human Credentials in a broader sense, in that….. they act as character references for the rest of humanity, and by virtue of their own selves/their partner’s attachment to them, guarantee investment in the rest of the human race. castiel is more-or-less content to watch from heaven and take orders until he rescues dean and becomes involved with his life (”the moment castiel laid a hand on you in hell he was lost”). his love and affection for dean and his willingness to bend everything to keep him safe means that castiel learns to defy heaven for the good of humanity. ten has always loved humans, but he loves rose a little differently. The Doctor Needs Someone, and we see rose’s power as his human credential most strongly when she’s gone. Without rose, ten is more willing to put himself/others in danger, to make choices that will result in death, to be callous and reckless and thoughtless. rose’s presence is a constant reminder that humanity is Worth the Trouble, that he’s never met anyone who wasn’t important. 

for rose and dean…. these are two, completely Normal, Average People. or so they think anyways. the burdens they carry and their inner lives are very different, but in very simple ways, they both would’ve continued their lives believing there was nothing special about them, getting up to Do Their Duty, never asking for anything special. both view themselves are caretakers, although this manifests differently bc rose is a bratty 19 year old and dean never got the opportunity to be a teenager. but both Feel Deeply in ways/levels that others don’t. each has an extremely open heart and a need to protect/provide for the little people. what ten and cas give them is an entirely new perspective, whereupon it starts to be possible to believe that even the smallest person can affect the world for better, and that they, specifically Deserve More. 

THEN we have the ideas of religion/free will/fate that intertwine both shows. rtd’s doctor who was explicitly and obviously written with the intent to show an atheist universe where the human spirit and mind are enough on their own to be holy, to determine right and wrong, and to decide the events of the universe. obviously ten is often situated in christ-like positions, but he learns from humanity as much as they teach him. supernatural is a little more complicated, with an alternate vision of accepted figures of christianity, but both shows heavily emphasize the power of human kindness, passion, empathy, and individual choice. ten may not live within the confines of space and time, but apocalypses in doctor who often hinge on one small person doing The Next Right Thing, just as supernatural’s base credo is We’re Writing a New Chapter. castiel bursts onto the scene and is literally taught the importance of free will by dean, and perhaps even the importance of his own desires/needs by dean. both core relationships exemplify what it means to make choices outside the realm of fate (even whilst allowing for the existence of soulmates). yes, castiel was ordered to raise dean from perdition, but their human connection is what allows the winchesters to subvert God and move outside the printed narrative - love for a human is what makes an angel CHOOSE to fall from heaven. and ten…. well ten knows that rose is going to die. ten understands from the moment he allows himself to care for her above all others, that he is dooming himself to pain and regret and loss. but he decides to do it anyways, because isn’t the best thing an otherwordly being in love with humanity can do is to eperience love and loss on a human level? both cas and ten understand that there is no love without pain, that they will be the ones to watch their beloveds leave them, but that the Choice to love out of free will is worth it. 

there’s also the element of Expression/Repression. here is where the underlying emotion remains similar but the freedom of how exactly to illustrate these feelings could not be more different. tenrose is a heterosexual relationship at the end of the day, and their storylines require them to be alone in each other’s presence nearly 100% of the time. thus, we get LOTS of familiar touching, lots of body language and casual intimacy and teasing. dean and cas…. lol. not so much. instead of physicality, we get looks, both because of dean’s own upbringing/sexuality and because they exist on the show that they do. deancas deals in the unspoken - the acts of service, the grace healings, the tense moments of battle, the lack of personal space. the expression is different, but the emotion is the same. ten and dean hold themselves back from the more Obvious open-book partners, for their own personal reasons. the end effect being that everyone on screen understands/insinuates what’s happening, and their relationship is so thick with subtext its a wonder no one suffocates. Words are seen as the ultimate step, once which cannot be overcome in normal life. both pairs use death/separation as the final step towards full transparency, but even then we are never granted the ultimate catharsis of an I Love You. castiel couches his confessions in generalizations towards groups, and dean swallows his truth even in prayer. rose says the words through a veil of uncrossable distance, but she doesn’t get to hear them back. they can Know, and we can Understand, but we cannot hear it. 

lastly (for now)…. and perhaps as an ultimate summation…….. death and parallel universes and fate cannot stop them, those who are drawn to each other through heaven and hell, through time and realities. it is to be understood that will all four individuals fight to ensure that each human being is safe, protected, and able to make their own choices they are soulmates. they are soulmates who are bound to each other to be sure, but they’re not Fated in a way that takes away their free will. they’re fated by the series of choices they make, over and over again, to prioritize each other, to traverse time and space and dimension and hell to get back to one another. god cannot see castiel in his plans for the world, and yet castiel has evaded death again and again, to give dean a win. nothing could tear rose away from her doctor, and even while trapped in another dimmension, she hears his voice, she runs to him, and she finds a way to get back to him. each and every choice they make brings them back to one another, regardless of the ultimate ending. we don’t know yet if we will ever hear castiel and dean get their doomsday moment, but we do know that in order for castiel to leave dean’s side, an entirely new dimmension (the empty) will have to be in play to keep them apart. 

ultimately, castiel and ten are both celestial beings with self-worth issues but a burning and true desire to see humanity thrive, directly and indirectly because of their attachment to dean and rose. dean and rose make castiel and ten more human, all while exemplifying why human is a good thing to be. dean and rose become more themselves under cas and ten’s influence, both are given more opportunity to bloom into who they are meant to be. all four become More in the presence of each other, and save the world while doing it. ultimately there is a heavy dose of tragedy in both - whether or not dean and cas get their moment is yet to be seen, but these are still Soulmates with differing relationships to mortality. but is there anything sweeter than defying god’s and fate and our own doubts to grab love with both hands, even when we know there will be pain? 

[orionsangel86]

I can't take you seriously as a meta writer or so who wants to see representation on SPN. If your main concern is whether a character tops or bottoms, I can't help thinking you just ship DeanCas to satisfy a fetish. You almost exclusively post about bottom Dean, cause top Cas is true to character. Truth is: there ain't no top/bottom character traits in gay/bi dynamics. Almost all top Cas fics are OOC and make him cruel and Dean a whiny "bottom s*ut. When in canon Cas acts submissive towards Dean

This is fucking hilarious. You are clearly a bottom!Cas stan who is upset by an old post of mine where I quite clearly stated that I was pro switch/vers but on the rare occassions where I do read smut I prefer top!cas fics because I find A LOT of bottom!Cas tagged fics write him OOC. You have taken this statement, and used it to send me a rant which is both contradictory and hypocritical. Did you even read this message back before you sent it?

“There ain’t no top/bottom character traits in gay/by dynamics” but “in canon Cas acts submissive towards Dean”.

Um excuse me? Why are you comparing submission to bottoming? Those are two separate things and comparing the two traits is actually extremely problematic especially in fanfic. Not all submissives bottom and not all tops are doms. This is classic heteronormative misogynistic behaviour and we have had ENTIRE DISCUSSIONS on this topic proving how harmful it is to assume that the bottom in a relationship is also the small, weak, submissive party. (Because the bottom is the “girl” in the relationship right?)

It is you who shouldn’t be taken seriously. My issues with bottom Cas stans are simple. They (you) write him as a small, thin, pale, short tiny feminised version of Cas. I consumed plenty of smutty Destiel fics in my first few years of shipping them where I had ZERO preference on top/bottom dynamics because WHY WOULD I HAVE A PREFERENCE IT MEANS NOTHING TO THE RELATIONSHIP. But because of the way bottom Cas writers treat Cas I started blacklisting “bottom!Cas”. I have asked people to recommend me Bottom!Cas fics where he is portrayed accurately COUNTLESS times in the past and will read anything that guarantees an accurate character portrayal.

Before you start snapping that Bottom!Dean fics do the same thing.They don’t. Not the ones I have read. Yes, this DOES happen but it is RARE compared to the constant terrible portrayal of Cas as blatantly being described as “the girl” of the relationship. I don’t even really read Dean in panties fics because I’m not into it and don’t like EITHER character being feminised. I simply ask for both characters to be portrayed as masculine manly men and the standard dumbasses they are in canon. But at the same time I NEED them to be described as per their actors. Here is a list of things I NEED in fic for BOTH characters in case I haven’t made it clear. Otherwise, I tap out of the fic:

CASTIEL

Is only ONE INCH shorter than Dean.

Is built like a brick shit house

Has meaty thighs that can crush watermelons.

Flexible. Meaty but flexible. Could totally twist into weird sex positions to Deans horror and delight.

Has big broad shoulders

Is TAN AS FUCK

has deep blue beautiful eyes

has full plush lips which are dry but NOT chapped

has a head of stylish messy dark BROWN hair (not black)

CANONICALLY CAN LIFT VERY HEAVY SHIT INCLUDING DEAN

DEAN

Is only ONE INCH taller than Cas

Is built like a brick shit house

Is a dorito shape (like Chris Evans) broad shoulders, slim waist.

is much slimmer on his bottom half. Doesn’t have watermelon crushing thighs but is still STRONG AF. (But not strong enough to hoist an angel of the lord up in the air I don’t think - maybe against a wall with the wall as leverage)

Is not exactly flexible (canon) so can’t be bent in half like those bottoms in gay porn.

Has fanfiction green eyes

plush full lips

styled neat light BROWN hair (NOT BLOND)

Freckles. Everywhere. 

Paler than Cas.

IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUE WITH THE ABOVE DESCRIPTIONS YOU ARE NOT DESCRIBING DEAN AND CAS IN YOUR FIC AND THEREFORE I WILL CONSIDER YOUR FIC OOC. SORRY BUT THIS IS MY OPINION. DON’T AGREE? FINE. BUT DO NOT COME INTO MY ASKS TO YELL AT ME ABOUT IT YOU HYPOCRITES.

Honestly you people on your high horses thinking it’s okay to yell at me and discredit me as a meta writer because I have an issue with Bottom!Cas fandom for bad portrayals. I am team switch/vers. I have ALWAYS been team switch/vers. I would happily read/write bottom!Cas who is still IN CHARACTER my issue is the many MANY people who DON’T.

HOW DARE you accuse me of using Destiel to satisfy a fetish when you can’t even distinguish between Top/Bottom and Dom/Sub. Who’s really got the fetish here hmm? Half the time I don’t even READ the smut stuff! I am ALL ABOUT THE LOVE STORY. THE CANON LOVE STORY. The smut is merely an afterthought! Hardly a fucking fetish.

Also the moment you basically treated Top/Bottom and Dom/Sub as the same thing your opinion becomes utter trash and anything you say to me is disregarded as such. So bugger off please and reconsider your life choices.

Happy Fucking New Year.