#someone other than jason

[echo-stimmingrose]

Jason and Piper = A lesbian and a gay man in a relationship for no reason

[ghost-bxrd]

@shiny-snek here’s the size comparison you asked for! I had to rescale Nightwing and the little dragon a bit because I realized they didn’t match the pictures and what I had in mind. So, thanks for requesting the comparison! Definitely made me aware of some flaws hehehe 💚💚💚

[anxi04]

steph and babs don’t need personas, as far as anyone is concerned they’re just family friends.

bruce has his “brucie wayne” persona, very clumsy, playboy, kinda air headed but still very smart and wants to do good for gotham. which of course makes him seem naive cause good?? for gotham??

dick has “richie grayson-wayne” who’s dabbled in modeling before becoming a gymnastics teacher. also very vocal about his “adorable little siblings”

jason never really had a “nickname” after all he was from crime alley and he had to look GOOD for them or else they’d go back to “he’s just like the rest of them”. his persona was very empathetic and kind though, which worked great for him since that’s how he was like. he always talked about doing several non profit charities. the elites switched their opinions of him on a dime, although the rest of gotham adored him.

damian refuses to go by a nickname. his persona is based around animals, mostly about abandoned animals. it’s very clear his goal for the future is to make good animal shelters and help every animal he can. it’s the only persona he could stomach and there were SEVERAL other ideas

cass is “cass wayne” very quiet, polite, generally just there in the background. normally hanging around one of her siblings, most often tim. although her being around him unnerves some of them, she’ll get a look in her face and then her and tim both know they were lying. they fully get why she hangs around tim

duke is regularly seen as the normal one. pleasant to be around, kind, but generally also just there. very normal student, not really sure what he’s gonna do. the elites don’t particularly for him, though the rest of gotham love him.

tim’s persona differs from the rest pretty heavily. he can’t get away with being like bruce, the elites vividly remember janet and see her in him very often, which vaguely scares them if they’ll be honest. he’ll act like “Tim Drake-Wayne” to unsettle them, after all he’s a Drake why is he acting clumsy? they’ve seen him when he was younger and he was the spitting image of perfect. it makes more sense to them when he trips and lands right where he can tell them something no one else can hear. “Timothy Drake” is what scares them though. the tim that casually whispers secrets no one else knows, who points out someone they’re supposed to have a “private meeting with” in a week. who has nearly cause several of them to go broke with such simple actions, and the only reason they didn’t was cause he let them stay rich. there was one elite who insulted damian near tim and suddenly said elite had to get an apartment in crime alley, pay his now ex-wife, a kid he had with some random person, and several debts

the fact that lex luther and tim are some kind of friends also doesn’t make them feel super great but that’s another issue

[ekat-fandom-blog]

Jack decides he needs a bit of time away from family to mourn the loss of his one sided friendship with Vlad and Vlad's death. So he takes a trip to Gotham. On this trip, he runs into Damian and Tim, who are convinced he's Captain Marvel in disguise.

Meanwhile, Jason's also run into Jack as he's coming into his ghost powers. Jason starts freaking out because someone just saw him when his new powers started glitching. Panicking only worsens the situation as now he can't figure out how to get his foot un-caught in the cement.

Jack, despite not knowing if this kid is a halfa or not, decides to give him advice based on how Danny told him his powers work. It works.

Now, Jason has a sort-of mentor that he didn't ask for but definitely needs, and Jack has something to do while he sorts out his feelings on the whole Vlad-was-never-his-friend thing.

Eventually, Damian and Tim catch them while Jack is trying to explain how Jason might have a second form. While Jack explains, Jason just transforms. His ghost form isn't what either expected. Jack was expecting something similar to Danny's or Vlad's. Not a winged little kid with a mask.

To be honest, this just solidifies that this guy is Captain Marvel for Damian and Tim. Obviously he decided to teach Jason magic.

[thenonbinarydetective]

Things batfam stans need to leave behind in 2023:

Jason's Lazarus pit rage

Thinking Tim's parents were horribly abusive and hated him

Only caring about Stephanie in terms of her relationship to another person (ex: Tim's bestie/ex/gf or Cass' gf/bestie)

Treating Jason or Stephanie like they're stupid

Feral Demon Child Damian

Permanent sunshine boy Dick Grayson

Any "[blank] was the real violent Robin" discourse

Really just any reducing or sectioning of certain traits to certain batfam members and not allowing other characters to exhibit those same traits (ex: see sunshine Dick Grayson)

But also stealing traits from other characters and projecting them onto someone else (ex: Jason getting Dick's personality in fics. He is not the same type of big brother Dick is canonically)

Purposefully mischaracterizing characters for angst (ex: Dick sent Tim to Arkham, my beloathed. also again see Tim's parents)

Trying really hard to nuclearize the family. They are an unconventional family for many reasons, and that's why they're interesting.

"Alfred solos the batfam"

Making Duke "the normal one" and completely forgetting to give him an actual personality.

Cass using sign language because she can read body language (note: does not apply to YJ Cass who has damaged vocal chords)

Cass being used as a prop for her brothers

Tim being weak, woobified baby

Feel free to add on ~~

Don't send hate over these things because idgaf, they are harmful mischaracterizations, and many are built on total ignorance and often racism, classism, ableism, and sexism.

[quadrantadvisor]

Alright new Jason Todd headcanons in a dpxdc setting:

Danny is a "liminal" ghost, rather than a "half" ghost. He's alive and dead at the same time. (He's like Jesus Christ (in the church denomination I grew up in), fully ghost and fully human.) Danny, in human form, can go through a ghost shield, because he IS a living human.

Jason, however, is a reanimated corpse. He isn't a ghost, wouldn't have a ghost core, etc, he has a normal human system that runs ON ectoplasm. Jason CANNOT go through a ghost shield, because he is always an ectoplasmic entity. Danny can go through the Fenton Ghost Catcher and be split into a ghost and a human; if Jason went through the ghost catcher, he would straight up die.

(For my purposes I'm gonna say that Jason became an ectoplasmic entity upon his resurrection, but wasn't very stable. Dunking in the Lazarus pit stabilized his system but also poisoned his ectoplasm.)

I do think that Jason could learn certain ghost abilities if he learned to harness his ectoplasm, especially if they detoxed him off the Lazarus waters. He's probably already enhancing his stealth and strength in ways he hasn't really noticed. I think he's held back by the amount of physical matter he's lugging around, so maybe he couldn't fly, but I'm imagining temporary invisibility, or intagibility of like, a limb at a time. Maybe he can't walk through walls, but in a fight he can dodge by instinctively making the targeted part of his body intangible.

[garfalsettos]

sorry for the continued act 1 marvin slander. it will happen again

[aingeal98]

Thinking of Cass and Damian got me thinking of the New 52 and how the dynamic between Batgirl and Robin there is even more proof of the travesty that was Babsgirl. She's been the longest running Batgirl to Damian's Robin, has witnessed most of the events of his life as Robin and yet their dynamic is just... A nothing burger. She's there in batfamily group reactions in the New 52 as the most heinous use of the Smurfette Principle I've seen in a long while. Tim isn't Tim, Dick isn't fully treated as Bruce's son, Jason exists mostly to say funny one liners, and yet despite the shallow characterisation there are still moments and events you can point to and say look. This happened. They interacted with Damian and it meant something. With Babsgirl? Nothing. How can there be anything when they're shoving a grown woman into a role she's outgrown for years now and forcing her to be the Batgirl of a preteen Robin? Her original Robin gets his own mantle, gets to be an adult with a legacy. She's shoved back into this role she doesn't fit in and because they know damn well she doesn't fit in it and they're just doing it for misogyny, they don't even try to make Batgirl and Robin a thing. Any interaction they had during the new 52 was so unremarkable and flavourless, devoid of character and heart, that I've never seen a single panel of the two of them in my 16 years as a DC fan.

Steph had a 24 issue batgirl run where she interacted with Damian a few times. Cass got even less than that with a six issue miniseries to bond with him. And yet the characterisation, writing and dynamic created in those stories was interesting, entertaining and impactful enough to last in the fandom for YEARS when Cass and Steph got erased. When you think of Damian's big sister you think of Steph, Cass, Maya etc long before you think of Babsgirl.

It's just infuriating to me. All those years of potential Batgirl and Robin stories wasted on a duo with as much cultural impact on the Batgirl and Robin team up as the James Cameron Avatar movies had on the word Avatar. All so they could erase the women of the batfam and reduce the sole one remaining down to The Girl Bat. Yeah whatever she was there in Damian's life when Steph and Cass weren't why am I supposed to care when her standing there gave me nothing to work with emotionally compared to a single conversation Steph or Cass had with Damian back in 2011. Compared with them or even Oracle Babs, I care about Babsgirl and Damian's dynamic and bond as much as DC and it's writers do. Which is to say, not at all.

[aalghul]

in the top 10 worst things about being a jason fan has to be that 99% of his fanon and canon content with friends is some variation of a rhato lineup

[tisajest]

Reverse Robins AU but the adoption order stays the same

Bruce had been Batman for around 2 decades when he witnessed the Graysons fall. He takes in little 8-year-old Dick Grayson and they become Batman & Robin a couple of months later.

Jason still tried to steal the Batmobile’s tires, but this time Dick is there with Bruce. And Dick immediately goes: friend?! Because who’s cooler than an older boy who has the audacity to steal your dad’s crime-fighting tires? Bruce doesn’t immediately take him in but he does adopt him soon after nonetheless. A year later, Batman gains a new sidekick partner.

Tim still puts together the Bats’ IDs by recognizing Robin’s quadruple somersault. He keeps this info to himself but his father’s death breaks something in him and he becomes reckless and directionless. He’s saved by one of the Bats, maybe little 11 year old Robin, and he just blurts out his name. He tells him how he was at the Graysons’ last show, how he and his parents were such huge fans. Bruce shows up but it’s too late, Dick’s already attached to his new big brother.

This teenager is obviously a threat, he knows their secret identities, but Bruce can see a bit of himself in the lost young man in front of him. He’s around the same age he was when he made the choice that changed his life forever. And having two young boys in his life, two young heroes, he can’t help but want to help Tim. It doesn’t hurt that the kid’s obviously smart and in good shape. A year later, Batman gains another partner.

Damian was never sent to Bruce, he stayed with the League. Eventually, he and Talia killed Ra’s. He becomes Talia’s right-hand but he doesn’t want it. He’s so disinterested in his own life and Talia, for all her flaws, loves her son. She tells him to leave, to “find himself or whatever it is young people do” and so Damian does. He leaves Nanda Parbat at ~18 and travels.

Damian has many skills, but he feels he’s best at killing people, so it doesn’t take long for him to take up contracts. Traveling’s fun and all but he grew restless. He does this for years, he makes a name for himself outside of being an Al’Ghul. And he’s visited Gotham, of course he has, but he doesn’t long for Bruce’s approval. He isn’t a child, he isn’t good person, and he isn’t a Wayne. Bruce means nothing to him, not really he doesn’t think Bruce would ever want him.

So, he keeps an ear out for news regarding the Bats. He visits Gotham every time he learns of a new child but he never allows himself to be noticed. One day, he hears whispers of the Wayne children being in Ethiopia of all places and he can’t help but seek them out. He gets there in time to put the Joker down permanently and prevent any lasting damage to any of them. They’re all taken by this mysterious savior to varying degrees (Tim’s the most cautious), but Dick is especially enthusiastic.

They manage to distract Damian long time enough for Bruce to get there. The long await meeting occurs and Damian decides fuck it, might as well let his father know about him. Bruce has more than enough children to fuss over and he’s an adult with his own life completely separate from Bruce, no need to make a big deal out of it. It is a big deal and Bruce is in shock and infuriated and heartbroken about his very much adult son being kept from him all this time.

As much as Bruce begs, Damian doesn’t go back to Gotham with them. Regardless, he keeps up his occasional visits and stays out of sight. Surprisingly, or maybe not, Dick is the first to find him out. And Dick, amazing human bean that he is, grows on Damian with time and interactions. He’s impressed by this child his father took in and he can’t help but want to teach him a few moves. Bruce wasn’t as oblivious to these meetings as he made himself seem, but he knows Damian isn’t interested in Bruce being his father. He’s hoping he can bridge this gap between them with Dick.

It works.

[cephalog0d]

Okay, but like. There's the whole joke about Bruce recruiting children to be his sidekicks, but honestly there's only really one that fits that.

And it's Jason. And the whole story there is, frankly, unhinged. Aaaaand then he died.

(I'm specifically talking about "first post-crisis origin stories" here because Jason and Dick, in particular, have both had multiple major retcons and revisions over the years, and some of them dramatically change how things happened.)

Like okay. Going backwards, you've got Duke who joined/led a whole Robin-based gang at a time when Bruce wasn't even Batman. You've got Damian and Cass, who were both literally born into the world of masks and capes and heroes and villains, so they weren't ever really not going to be part of it. Steph might have taken inspiration from previous heroes but she made her own identity and repeatedly refused to stop involving herself in the vigilante lifestyle. Tim, obviously, basically strong-armed Batman into letting him be Robin, despite Batman's protests.

Dick's a little more complicated just because there's so many versions, because that's what 80 years of comics and multiple universe reboots will do, and there's kind of a general trend that earlier pre-crisis versions were more of Batman being like "hello, child, would you like to be my sidekick" and later versions have leaned harder and harder into the idea that Dick was absolutely going to do this anyway, regardless of what Batman had to say about it. But even in the first post-crisis version, the flashback in Batman Year 3, Dick says he wants to find a way to keep people like that from hurting others again. When Alfred questions Bruce's offer to train him, Bruce says that Dick should learn to do things the right way if he's going to do it. It's not hard to extrapolate that, much like later versions of the origin story, Dick was going to get himself into this one way or another. (Batman (1940) #437)

And then there's Jason. Whose backstory has also had a lot of (sometimes major) revisions over the years (remember when his adoption was, like, some kind of Joker-originated long con? Fucken Nu52, man). But the original post-crisis version is pretty straightforward. Steals Batman's tires, gets caught and sent to Ma Gunn's Secret Criminal School, intervenes when Batman goes to investigate, immediately gets offered the chance to be Robin based entirely on that.

Which is itself kind of unhinged. That Bruce saw this kid who was living on his own stealing tires and went "Hey you would make a good Robin" as his very first instinct.

But if you've never read Jason's post-crisis origin, or it's been a while, it's honestly even more unhinged than that because that arc starts with Dick getting "fired" as Robin specifically for the reason that he got shot by Joker and Bruce freaked out about how the Robin identity has too many enemies and therefore Dick, a legal adult with approximately a decade of training and experience, should not use the identity anymore.

(And it's specifically about the Robin identity, in this version, because when Dick says he's not going to stop the crime fighting thing Bruce's response is basically "I know and I didn't expect you to". Honestly I could also say a lot about this version of the Robin/Nightwing transition vs. later ones and how this one definitely feels like the Heavy Hand of DC Editorial in the fact that they had no contact for so long afterwards, because the interaction really doesn't feel like it warrants that in this case compared to some later versions, but that's a whole other too-long ramble.) (Batman (1940) #408)

And then a few weeks later Bruce turns around and picks up a random kid, a literal child, and goes "Hey you would make a good Robin!"

And I think a lot about how fucking wild that is. And it's not like the people writing just didn't notice. Dick's big argument with Bruce when he finally comes back to Gotham and meets Jason isn't about the fact that Bruce took in another kid, or even necessarily about Dick feeling proprietary over the Robin identity, the thing he's angry about is that Bruce said it was too dangerous for him, an adult, someone who has trained with Batman for a decade and was already highly physically trained before that for his whole life, to be Robin, and now Bruce has turned around and painted that target onto some random new kid. He pushes, repeatedly, trying to get Bruce to justify himself and this absolutely irresponsible decision, and Bruce gives a lot of answers about how Jason was on a bad path and needed this outlet and eventually just admits that he missed having a partner. (Batman (1940) #416)

And like. Dick's right, is the thing. He is 1000% in the right in this argument. If he can't be Robin anymore because of the danger, how in the hell is it anything like a good idea to hand it over to someone way younger, way less trained, way less experienced, and expect that that wouldn't end in tragedy?

And then it did.

And yeah, Bruce, it is kinda a lot of your fault.

[m-for-now]

Something that I feel like I should emphasize again about my type of shipping is that I care so much more for the dynamic and depth of a relationship than wether it's romantic or platonic or queer-platonic or some other kind of connection.

Give me the actual interactions and parallels and dynamic and i'm in

[donnatroyyyy]

Dick and Jason fighting:

Dick: you’re nothing but a scummy, worthless piece of shit! I hope you die again! You should’ve never come back in the first place!

Jason: oh yeah?! Well you’re nothing than a big fake who doesn’t deserve to be here with the family or with superheroes in general! There’s a reason why you’re the one Bruce took the longest to adopt! It’s because you’re not worth it! You’re worthless and nobody loves you!

Dick: well at least I can get my own juice box from the grocery shop! But oh no I’m Jason Todd, the favorite child because I fucking died and I need to do everything criminally because I’m rebelling! Get over yourself you ass no one thinks you’re cool!

Jason: and people think you’re cool?! With your fucking mullet phase and need to over sexualize yourself?! Yeah fucking sure, stop blowing this out of proportion it’s a fucking juicebox!

Dick: and you’re just a fucking failure but oh look at that— Bruce still loves you for some reason!

Jason: what you’re sad cuz he doesn’t love you?!

Dick: and you’re sad because you never had a real mother?

*five minutes later*

Dick, in Jason’s doorway, has done this a million times before with all his siblings: I’m going to bat burger

Jason, was contemplating burning down Dick’s apartment, and also wanted to go ask Dick his opinion on some cargos but didn’t want to be the first to cave: I’m coming with

[kittykatninja321]

Brothers in Blood but instead of framing Dick for murder Jason's doing full on Hannibal Lecter shit like meticulously set up traps and situations and fucked up trolley problems and psychological manipulation trying to coerce Dick into organically murdering someone himself. Why? They were doing anything with Jason's character in this era, why not. Lets get psychological with it

[dceasesd]

i’ve been on a dick&jason kick lately their dynamic is truly unmatched like no one else compares

[jasontoddenthusiastt]

It is not classist that Jason, a vigilante in a *family of vigilantes*, is violent like the rest | just | because he comes from a poor family

What's (more likely) classist is writers thinking he needs to be taught right vs wrong from Bruce and co and that he consequently makes snap judgments out of some childish grudge-fueled rebellion which makes him dangerous the way a toddler holding a knife is dangerous