#ship and let ship! That’s what it means to proship!

[mellosdrawings]

noooo not the n2 ship 😭 omg people can be so weird sob sob you have more drawings of them as adults and frankly why does it even matter?!? it's not even an illegal ship sob (eg. incest or smth else that normally turns heads in fandoms) if you don't like it, don't read it???? (i personally like it tons!)

-🥬

(About this post)

Well, you know, it's the usual Leojami age difference discourse. I just delete those comments anyway, but I'm glad you like the N2 squad :3

I won't develop too much since I don't want this blog to be about discourse (I'm giving my opinions plenty on my sideblog) but here's what I think about these topics:

-I'm vehemently anti-censorship. I don't think something shouldn't ever exist and I will never push for something to be censored, even if it's stuff that makes me uncomfortable. I think warnings about particular contents are great, but in the end it's my responsibility to curate my experience with banning # and blocking people, etc etc. Even illegal stuff should be portrayed. If people can draw/write about murderers and conmen without a fuss, then they can also do that about taboo/illegal sexual topics. Depiction is not endorsement.

-I believe the reader/viewer is the one who injects meaning to art/stories. I'm an artist and all the things I do mean something, but that meaning doesn't prevail over the meaning my viewers inject in my art. I regularly see people "misreading" my comics in the tags, but it doesn't matter. Their interpretation is just as valid as mine, and if they wanna see ships where I didn't mean to draw ships, or if they interpret a scene as negative when I meant for it to be positive, then it's either my role as the content creator to be more explicit/obvious with what I meant, or to simply let my viewers have fun however they want with my stuff. I don't believe in the "there's only one valid interpretation and everybody who thinks otherwise is wrong".

(That's also why I don't really believe in DNI. People you disagree with will interact with your stuff anyway, caring about those things will just anger and tire you for nothing. I try to avoid interacting with people who have DNI that probably include me? But considering "proship" means anything and nothing it's hard to tell whether N2/LeoJami is considered a proship or not.)

Tldr: I'm anti-censorship and I think everybody should make and enjoy the content they want, even if it's topics that are usually frowned upon. Imagination is the one place one should be able to go hogwild without fearing retribution.

[flowery-xoxo13]

I'm sorry but what the actual fuck is this.

My honest reaction to that:

Why are people shipping valangel? What the actual fuck. did we forget that this is a disgusting ship? This is a proship, guys, c'mon. What do you mean "please let your husband have your attention"?? 😰 I am disgusted in the hazbin hotel fandom right now.

[deathdetermineslife]

So you recognize the difference between proship and Darkship and still say “proship DNI”? So you know that that’s LITERALLY just saying “DNI if you don’t support harassment”? So you know that you’re just saying “I support harassment"? gross

here is every instance i can find of a proshipper directly interacting with me (you included!) blatantly ignoring my dni, as well as a post that was flat out made about me on proship tumblr that was sent to me. unsure of whos doing the harassing here... hmm... i support harassment though, got it. you all don't seem very anti-harassment to me. but what do I know, right? this isn't even including the asks I get that I don't post because I'm far too uncomfortable posting them on my blog, or any of the extra hate messages that got sent to me after I got sent the mile-long hate message.

again, something i said... literally a few days ago. does ship and let ship not mean that you're just cool with darkships that include pedophilia, zoophilia, and various other forms of abuse? why on earth would I want someone who doesn't see a problem with that interacting with me. seriously explain this.

why would i condone harassment when all yall fucking do is harass me. never fucking leave me be. its all the time, dude. can you think critically for a MOMENT and leave the people who don't want you interacting alone?

[im-not-buying-it-ether]

Gotta love the old man yaoi and it’s problematic circa 2014-era rebound relationship

[pro-sipper]

"- 'proshippers' or whatever the fuck you people are calling yourselves now -"

It's. It's still just "proshippers". It's you guys (antis) and the fence-straddlers trying to have their cake and eat it too that keep creating random new phrases to "other" and distance themselves from us. We're here, unchanging, same as ever, in our corner with our silly little stories. We aren't the ones interested in coming up with 500 new labels for people who know that fiction isn't reality.

[kiwisandpearls]

*gently takes your hand*

if you truly want fandom to start feeling fun again and not like stepping into a field of a bunch of hidden explosive mines, your going to have to accept that fandom is going to be full of fanart, fanfiction, ships, and people that you fucking hate.

you cannot say that people should allowed to make whatever fanart or fanfiction or like whatever ships they want to and then exclude certain ships or fanfiction or fanart. Because that’s how we got to the point of people not liking fandoms because of people’s strict definitions on fanart, fanfiction, and ships that are ok and those that are not.

i’m not saying you should just simply stop being uncomfortable with ships/fanfiction/fanart that does make you feel squicked out or uncomfortable. There’s a lot of fanfiction/fanart/ships out there that squick me out. But that’s where it’s important to remember the saying “don’t like; don’t read”. You found the fanfiction you hate; don’t read it. You found this fanart that squicks you out; don’t look at. You found this ship you hate; block/don’t look at the ship’s tag.

Running fanartists, fanwriters, and shippers out of fandoms for making fanworks you deem as “immoral” or “literally illegal” will not help. Simply put, you’re just making fandom seem restrictive.

[zakubabbles]

Went to someone's social media profile and it said "Proshippers DNI."

I then scrolled through their art gallery and it was nothing but ship fanart with their OC.

[s0fter-sin]

being on twitter and seeing 18yr olds with “minors dni” in their bios is the weirdest thing ever

[thwipsthrown]

'proshippers dni' tell me you havent learned media literacy without telling me

[chuuyasdog]

In the last few months Ive seen so many tiktoks, comments, posts, ect. where people are harassing, sending death threats, sending suibait, sending rape threats, sending doxxing threats and more just because of fictional ships, and it just blows my mind honestly, like what happened to ship and let ship, and dont like dont read?

I personally dont ship anything people like that would consider "problematic", and i despise pedophilic ships, and other stuff makes me very uncomfortable too, but i dont harass the people who ship it, i just say to myself "ew that makes me uncomfortable", block them or the ship, and move on, LIKE A NORMAL PERSON.

It is FICTION, there has been studies proving that fiction does not affect real life, and if you are harassing REAL PEOPLE over a FICTIONAL CHARACTER, quite frankly, you are the bad guy here.

https://comship.carrd.co/#c10 This has a load of links to various sources and info, and i didnt want to have to copy everything when i can just link this, i didnt make it, just found it when looking up comship meaning.

Dont harass people for what they ship, if it makes you uncomfortable just dont look at it, thats what tags and blocking are for.

[scentedluminarysoul]

I'm a proshipper because I can tell fiction and reality apart, and that's it

Also, antishippers are vile, man. And their bullying has real life consequences even aside from the bullying. There was this post about kids literally being groomed by them, into thinking their parents' small (<5) age gape is ~problematic~, and to distance themselves from their parents and only talk to the "good and moral" people online

So no, it's not just "silly fandom discourse".

I don't think bullying and grooming are silly

"ugh proshippers and antishippers are both sooo immature like shipping discourse is sooo stupid like i'm neitherrrr like why would you even want to engage with that"

I've seen antishippers unironically say and agree with eachother on the following opinions: being a proshipper means people should be allowed to bully you. proshippers make them believe in eugenics. proshippers all belong in jail. being a proshipper means people can send you death and rape threats because "you deserve it". being a proshipper should be basis for taking away someone's human rights or at least put them on a watchlist.

I'm not a proshipper because i care too much about fictional ships, I'm a proshipper because antishippers sent my friends threats for liking certain ships. I'm a proshipper because i believe i shouldn't have my human rights taken away or be bullied or in jail just for liking a fucking ship. If you believe ship discourse is stupid and immature, then you probably believe people shouldn't be thrown in jail for it.

[asses-to-ashes]

The proship label says nothing about what content a person consumes.

Proship means you have a "ship and let ship" mentality. The "pro" in proship doesn't stand for "problematic."

"Proship means you ship adult x minor." No it doesn't. Proship means you won't harass or belittle someone who does. Proshippers don't assume the moral values of another person based on fanfiction.

There are Proshippers who are uncomfortable with age gap ships, there are Proshippers who are uncomfortable with shipcest, etc. There isn't a human being on the planet who isn't squicked out by some topics and Proshippers aren't a monolith.

[pro-sipper]

Even the nicest, most polite and genuinely curious anons that come into my inbox asking about proship things all have a common misconception about what it means to be a proshipper.

The thing I see most frequently is someone saying that they personally aren't comfortable with a lot of content under the proship umbrella and does that make them an anti or not?

When in reality the whole idea of a "proship umbrella" of content isn't really a thing. The whole concept of a proshipper is just a "ship and let ship" mentality.

I know sometimes it seems like all proshipping means is shipping rape, abuse, incest, etc but that's because those are some very extreme examples of ship dynamics. They're the ones that get brought up the most. "Well I'm not comfortable with _____" or from antis, "You're disgusting if you ship _____".

It's not a requirement of the community to personally ship all those things. It's just that "ship and let ship" includes every type of ship, including the extremely toxic ones.

I'll reiterate that I'm proship through and through, but the majority of my personal ships are very tame. Lots of best friends to lovers, high school sweethearts, etc. That's just what I personally prefer.

But I also know that someone's ships aren't the be all end all tell of a person's character, and certainly not an indication of what they think is good, healthy, or what should be normal in real life.

At the end of the day, proshipping just means ship and let ship. Don't like? Don't read. And do NOT harass real people over fictional characters. If you agree with all that, regardless of what you personally ship, then welcome to the proship community!

[greenapplebling]

It's incredible the amount of antis I've seen lately that actually have a very proship mindset but they classify themselves as antishipper bc they think proshipper = pedophile

Idk how to tell them that a lot of proshippers like me are also repulsed by adult x child ships or ships that include incest, etc... but we don't go witch-hunting for it

We block and/or filters the tags out so we don't have to see it. No harassment needed

Uh- are you aware of the meaning of proship?

Proship has never meant anything except a combination of three ideas:

Ship and let ship (your ships don't harm me and vice-versa) and YKINMK (your kink is not my kink, and that's okay; my kink stories don't harm you and vice-versa)

Harassment over fiction is not acceptable

Censorship of fiction is not acceptable either

Any other definitions are made by antis, not proshippers, and are an attempt at revisionism to justify harassment based on false claims.

[clearancecreedwatersurvival]

Is anyone gonna explain to people that ‘proship’ does not actually mean ‘problematic shipping’ or ‘problematic ship’ or are we just going to let this misinformation spread some more?

It means pro-shipping. The prefix pro, meaning ‘supporting.’ In favor of shipping.

It only became a defined position after anti-shippers who initially identified themselves as anti-a specific ship started harassing creators they didn’t like, doxxing them, and trying to get them fired from their irl jobs for shipping reasons around 2014-2016.

So people who had been in fandom for long enough to know where that kind of rhetoric leads (ffnet purges, LJ strikethru, as well as the direct harms caused by doxxing) observed this increasing trend of harassment and rallied to say ‘oh you lot are anti-shipping, as in opposed to certain ships? Well in that case, we are pro-shipping, because we follow the adage of ship and let ship.’

Before that point, it was just basic fandom etiquette to not bother people who ship stuff you don’t like, and to understand that if something squicks you out, it’s not the fault of the people who made it.

If someone says they are pro-ship, it means fuck all about what they actually enjoy in fiction.

It just means they’re opposed to harassing creators for making content that doesn’t cause tangible harm to real people. A better way to understand the ideological position is being anti-harassment and anti-censorship.

I have a lot of ships I find disgusting blacklisted so I don’t have to see them. But I am not interested in forcing people to comply with what I think is gross. That’s what it means.

Curate your online experience, and understand that your disgust response is not a defensible moral indicator or a justification to harass, deplatform, and dox fan writers.

[kayakoto-enterprises]

This is for the self shippers whose self ship story doesn't start out all lovey dovey. This is for flawed f/os, grieving, ugly, angry, and mean ones. The ones who step on your feet, the ones who talk over you, the ones that boss you around, the cold hearted ones. This one is for the hurt feelings, the sadness or the forced docility. This one is for those whose f/os took a while to get around.

For whatever circumstance, they do. They do look you in the eyes and they apologize. Of course words won't fix all wounds. But they mellow out, they try mending wounds they themselves caused, they own up or grieve those words. Every time you cry internalizing what they said previously they do everything to fix or to mold into something positive. They want you to associate their words now with apology. With love. With admiration. With care.

They lay awake with you thinking of new days and memories to fold over the hurtful ones. The days where they were so callous but now they're dedicated to changing and improving. Their hugs feel protective and whole, to shield you from even themselves.

The hurt can't be erased but your f/o is trying, trying so so so hard to let you know they're getting better and that they'll love you better.

🍓🍓 PROSHIP DNI 🍓🍓

THIS POST IS NOT ABOUT ROMANTICIZING ABUSE. THIS IS ABOUT TRYING TO HEAL PAST HURT, BUT ALSO LIVING WITH THE CONSEQUENCES OF PAST HURT.