#she-hulk critical

[kathrahender]

Female Characters in Media and how they should write them better (and their relationship with other characters too)

One of the things that upsets me is how women are depicted in media. Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike some female characters for being female (like someone could think), I'm not a misogynist person. I dislike them for not being good characters. For being poorly written (in my opinion). If you want to keep reading, prepare yourself, because this would be long (?

First, the "girl with a crush" type of female character.

Some of the female characters are always following their crush wherever he goes, sometimes saying his name a lot of times in the show, and her life is almost centered in living for her crush and nothing else. Like they have no purpose except being around her crush. They (the female characters) care about her crush more than they care about anyone else (even their own family). Sometimes they care about their crush more than her own future. They care more about having (or not having) a future with her crush than they care about having a degree/a job.

And I hate those kind of female characters, because a woman's life shouldn't be determined by a man. They should be independent people centered in being successful in life, not being centered in having or not having a future with the man they like. And if the man they like doesn't feel the same/doesn't pay attention to them, then leave him alone (after all, he's not the only man in the world, is he?) or don't force the situation, just let it flow. If the man is meant to love them back, then he would do it. If he isn't meant to love them, they shouldn't waste time thinking about how their relationship could work. And if they are dating another person, they definitely shouldn't try to separate them (or actually separate them) because then their "love" towards the man they like wouldn't be "love" but obsession or the "if I can't have you, no one can" type of love.

Secondly, the "girl who is just the love interest" type of female character.

This is the type of character who is weak, dependent, and everytime they need saving. They add nothing to the plot except being the love interest. You could remove them and the only thing that would happen is that the hero wouldn't have a love interest. That's all. They are the type of character who do nothing important in the plot. They are in the show just to fullfill the "male character ending with a female character before the show ends" trope. They aren't strong, they aren't "useful", their existence is basically based in having to be saved, crying, or making stupid things to make the audience "laugh" or feel sympathy for her.

And I also hate this type of character. A female character shouldn't be in a show just to make the audience laugh. They shouldn't be in a show just to be the love interest. What you're implying with those type of characters is that a female character can't be nothing else than a non-important sub-plot. They can't be strong, they can't save the day, and they can't be fighters because "Oh my god, they're women, how could they be an important part of the war? 😡😡". And that's bullshit. Women can be strong and should be strong in media. Women should be and deserve to be important in the main plot. Women should save the day and they deserve it. Women deserve to be more than a "always crying" character.

Thirdly, the "female warrior who is more powerful than everyone else" type of female character.

This female character is strong, tough, resilient, brave, and more things. It's basically the reverse of the "girl who is just the love interest" character. She doesn't need saving, she doesn't cry (or at least she has just a few "weakness" moments) and she is important to the plot because without her there wouldn't be a storyline (whether she is the main character, one of the main characters, or the love interest of another character).

Sometimes this trope is handled well. This type of character can be well-written and be an awesome powerful female character, but there are some cases where the writers/showrunners/producers don't do it well (in my opinion). The thing is that in some shows/movies, to make the female character strong, brave, and intelligent, they make the male characters more weak, more "coward", and more dumb. And that's what I hate about the writing of this type of character. Women can be strong, brave and intelligent without making the male characters the opposite. A woman and a man can be the same, and you don't need to make one look bad to make the other look better. They both should be strong. They both should be powerful. They both should be though. They both should be intelligent.

And fourthly, the "female tough character who doesn't show a lot of emotions" type of character

This type of character is similar to the previous one, except that she isn't considered the "most powerful" character in the book/show/movie. She's strong, tough, resilient, brave (probably more things) and she doesn't need saving (most of the times), but she's not the most powerful character of the show. Yes, she is one of the strongest characters, but she isn't the strongest.

The problem I have with this type of character is that sometimes they appear with another trope. The malewife/girlboss trope. And two of those malewife/girlboss pairings seriously upset me because they're seen as "beautiful" "wholesome" and "awesome" when they aren't. The fans of that ship act like it's "healthy", but I have news for you. It's not healthy. It's not healthy to call your partner with mean nicknames. It's not healthy to hit your partner "as a joke". If it was the reverse, if the man was calling the woman with mean nicknames and he was hitting her "as a joke", everyone would throw hands. If "X" male character treated the "Y" female character like that, there would be no one in this world who wouldn't get angry at him.

But if it's the reverse? "Oh, she's not really hurting him" "Oh, she's so funny" "Oh, she's so silly" "Oh, she's so cute". And that's what I hate about this trope. That the female-on-male bullying is not treated seriously. And you can like these ships, okay. But at least don't pretend they are something they aren't. It's kind of toxic/abusive, and you can still like it, as well as you can like... I don't know, Buffy x Spike (?, but don't act like those ships are healthy because they aren't (this is me talking about the canon because some writers can write those ships as healthy).

Now, after all of this. I'm gonna mention some female characters that I think are well-written, as well as some straight ships that are good (again, in my opinion).

First, the female characters.

Pacifica Northwest from Gravity Falls. Lila Rossi from Miraculous Ladybug. Valerie Gray from Danny Phantom. Karai, April O'Neil from TMNT (any version). Katara, Toph, Korra, Asami Sato from Avatar: The Last Airbender/Legend of Korra. Sabine Wren, Ahsoka Tano, Hera Syndulla from Star Wars Rebels. Nancy Wheeler, Robin Buckley, Eleven/Jane Hopper, Max Mayfield from Stranger Things. Chloe Decker, Ella Lopez, Maze, Linda Martin from Lucifer TV. Allison Argent, Lydia Martin, Malia Hale, Kira Yukimura from Teen Wolf. Alina Starkov, Nina Zenik from Shadow and Bone. Shado, Felicity Smoak, Laurel Lance, Dinah Drake, Sara Lance, Thea Queen, Caitlin Snow, Kara Danvers, Alex Danvers, Lena Luthor, Samantha Arias, Ava Sharpe, Zari Tomaz, Nora Darhk from Arrowverse (The CW). Regina Mills, Emma Swan, Snow White, Ruby, Mulan, Aurora, Ashley Boyd from Once Upon a Time. And more. I don't know what makes these characters so likeable, but I can't help but love them. Compare them with the characters I criticized, and see what I mean with the good/bad female character writing.

Secondly, the straight canon ships (I'm just gonna say my opinion about a few of them and mention the others because if I explained why I accept all of those straights ships and not others, the post would be very very long and I don't want that)

Gray Ghost from Danny Phantom. They had better development and better chemistry than Amethyst Ocean for me, and although Amethyst Ocean is not a bad ship, the way they ended up together at the end of Phantom Planet felt so rushed. With more development? Amethyst Ocean could have been a ship I would have liked.

Kataang from Avatar: The Last Airbender. I will always prefer Zutara/Zukka over this ship, but you can't deny they objectively had development and chemistry. The ship didn't feel rushed or forced, you could actually see they loved each other. And the two of them are powerful, the writers/showrunners didn't make one look bad to make the other look better (in my opinion).

Makorra from Legend of Korra. Their relationship at the beginning of the show was honestly beautiful, and although I like Korrasami, I wouldn't have minded Makorra being the Endgame ship in the show. For me they had good development, chemistry, their romance didn't feel forced or rushed, and their hurt/comfort scenes were so wholesome and heartwarming. And that without saying they also didn't make one of them more weak or more dumb than the other because yes-

Casapril from TMNT 2007. Although in this movie we couldn't see how Casey and April ended up together, what we saw was enough to make me think they were a good ship. I don't know if it was because their relationship seemed healthy or because it seemed like they loved each other so much, but I loved them.

Scallison from Teen Wolf. Okay, Scott McCall had a crush in Allison Argent at the beginning of the show, and some of you could say "Oh, so you accept a character having a crush as long as it's not a girl having it 😡". No. That's not true. Scott McCall had a crush on Allison, yes, but unlike Hinata and Marinette, he didn't stalk Allison, and he talked to her. And unlike Naruto and Adrien, Allison liked Scott almost since the beginning. Then, no, it's not the same situation. Scallison is very different from Naruhina and Adrienette. Scallison actually had development and chemistry, and you could see they both were down for each other since the start of the show.

Gweter from The Amazing Spider-Man. Their relationship is beautiful. The way Gwen got into Flash-Peter's fight and defended Peter, the way they slowly fell for each other, the way the connected so well... Everything between them was wholesome. And again, you could see the chemistry, you could see both characters were well-written without making one look worse than the other. They both were strong (in different ways, but they were), they both were intelligent, and they both were so in love with each other. Their romance wasn't rushed, or forced neither.

Snowing from Once Upon a Time. They're the couple of Once Upon a Time. Their relationship in the Enchanted Forest was beautiful, and although they had to work in their relationship in Earth, you can't deny they're soulmates. Their love is pure, even connecting them across realities, and if there's true love out there, they surely have it. You can ship other ships in this show, sure, but the chemistry between these two is undeniable. As well as their development.

Other straight canon ships I think they're well-written are Stricklake (Trollhunters), Entrapdak (She-Ra and the Princesses of Power), Aelita x Jeremy, Ulrich x Yumi (Code Lyoko), Hank x Shay, Lotura (Voltron Legendary Defender), Obitine (Star Wars), Jancy, Lumax, Mileven, Jopper (Stranger Things), Deckerstar (Lucifer TV), Scalia, Scira, Chelissa (Teen Wolf), Darklina, Helnik (Grishaverse), Petermj (MCU), Olicity, Barricity, Westhawne, Snowstorm, Quickwest, Captain Canary (Arrowverse), Danali, Damiko (Karate Kid), Samguel, MoHawk (Cobra Kai). As you can see (and if I'm not blind lmao) none of these ships are based in the tropes I previously said I hate. There are some of these ships that I don't like for personal reasons, but they are good ships and objectively well-written ships. So... yeah.

To end this post, I want to thank you for reading this, and if you support one of the characters/ships I criticized, please, keep it to yourself and block me or block the "Anti Naruhina/Percabeth/Adrienette/Hiccstrid" and "Anti Marinette/Hinata/Astrid/Annabeth" tags. I didn't make this post just to get hate comments.

If you think the same as me about this, thank you for your time! I'm glad you made it to the end of the post ;)

[isagrimorie]

One detail I really love about episode 47 is the moment Marisha predicted how Fearne could bring down the Malleus Keys in five seconds.

AND THEN SHE DID.

Druids, man.

Also, Fearne Calloway, ladies, and gents!

[age-of-moonknight]

“What If Venom Bonded to Moon Knight?” What If…? Venom (Vol. 1/2024), #5.

Writer: Jeremy Holt; Pencilers and Inkers: Jesús Hervás and Geraldo Borges; Colorist: Ceci de la Cruz; Letterer: Ariana Maher

[thetimelordbatgirl]

How many more reshoots are they going to do for Captain America: Brave New World before they realize the problems are that a, they've made a Hulk film this point rather then a Captain America film and b, that they have a zionist character played by a zionist actress-

[inkoutsidethelines]

If I was making an MCU show that involved Daredevil, a character famously known for being blind, and Charlie Cox had to tell me that Daredevil was blind, and that he couldn't do what I had scripted for him to do? Which is basic, well known information about his character?

I would take that to my grave. I wouldn't admit it under torture. If someone else told on me, I would lie. I wouldn't in a million years talk about it in front of a camera as if it was a funny joke instead of something revealing my incompetence.

[alastorhazbin]

Bro my school library is lit

[neonshrike]

Thoughts on Bruce Banner in She-Hulk

Thank you @themarysuep for inspiring me to write this out!

I’ve had a few discussions about this, since he’s one of my favorite characters of all time, but I decided to write out my thoughts on how Bruce is written in She-Hulk. My overall thoughts are: not very well. 

I’ll start with the things I like, starting with the first episode. It was nice seeing a glimpse of his life in the five years after the Snap, seeing his lab and home. The fact that he lives on an island by himself makes a lot of sense to me, both Bruce and Hulk are the type of people to enjoy quiet and solitude. It seems like they’re trying to undo some of the things in Endgame, like the idea that Bruce became this celebrity/public figure, which never made sense to me.

Getting this out of the way: I personally like Professor/Smart Hulk, I just wish we had more time with it and that it didn’t happen off-screen. He’s happy, he deserves to be.

Bruce talking about his integration, and the fact that Tony gave him this place, helped with the process, and was a friend for all those years (the Scott Lang book mentions that Tony is the only person who visited him on the island) was great to see. I think they really show that Bruce is now a combination of himself and the Hulk better than Endgame.

Something that really interested me was the use of one of his character strengths as a flaw: his empathy. Bruce legitimately wanted to help Jen with her new situation, and didn’t want her to feel alone like he did. However, it was through his own trauma of being feared that caused him to start projecting his wants onto her.

I think it’s really cool Bruce has a spaceship now, that seems like a pretty fun direction for him to go in, having adventures in the cosmos and the excitement of learning more about the universe.

And now for the bad…

A few scenes definitely rubbed me the wrong way. I don’t personally like the idea of Bruce drinking, considering his father in the comics was an alcoholic and that would put him at a very high risk of becoming one himself. It’s seen as a good thing that he and Jen can drink copious amounts of alcohol. With that note, the MCU continued to erase his childhood which is integral to the Hulk.

(However, I do recognize that this is Jen's show!)

I definitely didn’t like when he flat-out told Jen that she had an obligation to be a superhero now that she has powers. That is the very last thing he wanted, to be an Avenger and for his abilities to be exploited by organizations in power. It would have been better if he just warned her not to use her new powers selfishly or irresponsibly.

I don’t really mind Bruce having a sense of humor, but I don’t like the type of humor they gave him from Ragnarok on, where he acts very clueless and it definitely shows here too. In Avengers and Age of Ultron, he was pretty sardonic and deadpan, and cut people down with words alone; It really fit his character. Here, he’s still the same as well as a goofy prankster for some reason, something he never really did. 

You could argue he’s like this since he’s around family, but they barely give us any indication whether Bruce and Jen are even that close. They’re 20+ years apart in age, they weren’t really raised together, and it’s not really mentioned what his relationship with the rest of the family is like other than seemingly positive. He’s been gone for years either on the run, as an Avenger, in space, or trying to improve himself.

And finally, the finale, where Bruce reveals that he had a son while he was on Sakaar. That came out of nowhere and makes absolutely no sense. In Ragnarok, Hulk was just the Grandmaster’s champion, he lived alone, his only real friend there was Valkyrie. Also, his only focus was on fighting, avoiding calming situations so that Bruce wouldn’t be able to come back.

(Forgive me for oversimplifying things or getting details wrong about the comics, I'm trying to summarize to the best of my ability.)

In the Planet Hulk comics, the Hulk alter isn’t Savage Hulk like in the MCU (who is more or less mentally a child), he’s a different one called Green Scar and his time on Sakaar is dramatically different. He does become a gladiator, but forms a group called the Warbound and basically overthrows the leader of Sakaar. There’s a developed story between him and Caiera the Oldstrong, his wife and the mother of Skaar.

But none of that exists, and the reveal in the show just seems like a throwaway reference. I would have been happy with a more simple, mundane explanation of why he was gone the whole series, even no explanation would have been fine (another story for another time?)

An overwhelming amount of fans want World War Hulk to be adapted, but I think with the way that they adapted Planet Hulk (which WWH is a sequel to) it would be nearly impossible. He has a reason to go all Worldbreaker in the comic. Basically, the ship that Hulk was sent to Sakaar with blew up the entire planet, destroyed his home, and killed his pregnant wife.

In the MCU, Bruce is definitely going through hardships (losing two of closest friends and being apart from another, figuring out his place in the world besides being an Avenger, navigating the post-Blip world), but he seems to be pretty well-adjusted. He’s accepted after years of people being afraid of him, he has a loving, supportive extended family, he does have a few friends left out there and is making some new connections.

I’m not exactly sure what they’re planning for Bruce next or what exactly I would want to see next, but I’m not completely happy with this current direction they’re going in.

[gay-jewish-bucky]

don't want to bother op but this is literally "steve's" ending, the genders were swapped, and yet the majority of people support it despite it being all kinds of fucked up

[tgirldarkholme]

One good thing about the finale of Secret Invasion seguing into The Marvels is that this mean there is a slight possibility that Brie Larson's Carol Danvers might have to conflict with the US military on the silver screen (something which her comics counterpart did in the very first dialogue line she ever uttered, in her two solo series as Ms. Marvel, in Uncanny X-Men, in her two stints on the Avengers as Ms. Marvel, in her stint on the Avengers as Warbird, in the House of M timeline...). But, then, again, they have yet to mention the giant dude in the ocean except for a throwaway blink-and-you-miss-it gag in She-Hulk.

[theredqueenandthebloodwyrm]

I didn't like She-Hulk, but I wanted to

Obviously this is just my opinion so you're free to disagree and all that.

When I went into watching She-Hulk it was sometime after hearing about how bad it is "worst show ever" "she sucks" but I had chalked up most of it to bandwagon hate / sexism / the anti-woke crowd (which to be fair does and has review bombed stuff before). So I went into this thinking "alright, I'm not getting on any hate bandwagons, I want to give this show a fair take, I'm sure it's not that bad / not bad / let's judge it based off its contents". It just felt like wasted potential when I finished watching it.

(read more because this post is getting long)

Needless to say, I was disappointed...so much disappoint. Like did they want to fail? tf happened in the writer's room? Look, I'm not a lawyer nor do I study law nor do I have any idea of how it works so I'm not gonna criticize the lawyer stuff, just the characters + plot stuff.

The fact that the dude she went on a few dates with and sleep with, who then later ghosted her, turned out to belong to some evil villain hate group? It was stupid, I didn't like it, I feel like it would have worked better if he was just a regular guy who ghosted her (and it still tells a lesson about Jen Walters and what she has to deal with as a woman dating). It felt cheap and cliché that he was some baddie rather than some regular douche? I dunno, maybe someone else can provide a different take or explain it some to me. But that's just a personal nitpicky thing, not like "worst thing ever" yknow.

Daredevil was...something. His introduction during the Leap Frog episode was...fine? not entirely out of character but some of lines didn't fit his voice? and look I like happy Matt Murdock too, and I don't want just some dreary sad Daredevil, like he can be happy. It just felt that the writers didn't necessarily have a handle on his voice? Also that weird walk of shame was unnecessary and weirdly demeaning lmao now that I'm thinking about it.

I didn't mind Jen besting the Hulk, I thought it was funny and had that classic sibling rivalry vibes (well, cousin vibes in this case but you know). Her having a better handle on her rage due to sexism she experienced as a woman was dope and made sense to me.

The fourth wall breaking was...a...choice. It was a choice that was fine at first though there reached a point where there was too much wall breaking, especially in the episodes leading up to the Finale. Like, it had funny 4th wall moments but then the next episode it would start to be a bit too much 4th wall breaking at once? not sure if that makes sense.

The finale made me want to hit my head against a wall because just why? It's this weird mess of 4th wall breaking that doesn't work?

Also the episode starts at afternoon/night and then it skips to morning when Jen rewrites the story? The writers' room / Kevin Fiege Bot was like the best example of what not to do? does it count as lampshading? If it counts as lampshading then it's what not to do when lampshading. Like She-Hulk isn't Gwenpool or Deadpool, she shouldn't be breaking reality and rewriting her own story like that.

Also I didn't like the mustard ketchup suit Daredevil had? I get that it was an OG Comics reference but the colors clashed? and not in a good way. taste is subjective and all that, and red + yellow can look good but meh.

Look, there's fun moments and characters beat. It's not the worst thing ever but I just can't get behind the ending, it sours the whole thing a bit for me.

It had fun moments like with the rogue magician summoning demons, Leap Frog, and whatnot. Like I'd throw She-Hulk scenes on a funny marvel comp video, but it felt flat in terms of character building?

[stanley-ballz]

Viel zu denken

[starlight-bread-blog]

As bad as MCU humor can get, at least they don't do lame meta.

God damn it!

[breckstonevailskier]

Daredevil's Charlie Cox defends viral 'Walk of Shame' scene in She-Hulk

To these people, I'd say the big issue is that this Matt felt more like a caricature of who he is in Daredevil. And I also take issue with Jen using her control of reality to write Matt into a relationship with her because if how reminiscent that is of Kilgrave controlling women.

[atjsgf]

when people try to criticize MCU post infinity saga and they list she-hulk as one of the bad ones i immediately discard everything they have to say tbh

[thetimelordbatgirl]

You wanna know the biggest red flag that the MCU doesn't seen the Young Avengers as their own team and just sees them as copies of the Avengers??? Miss America whose literally her own hero in the comics, no mentors or anything and is a unique character in terms of powers and such...is literally not only nerfed in her debut film in the MCU just so they can make her like some of the other young heroes in MCU in need of rescue by the older heroes, but is also literally turned into a sorcerer in training at the end and even compared to Doctor Strange when he started training. Like. They basically took a unique and non-connected to the Avengers character like Miss America and made her basically a copy of Doctor Strange. Because the MCU does not get the Young Avengers at all and just thinks they must be either relatives or copies of certain Avengers.

[lpsgirl109]

Yall remember when She Hulk episode 3 dropped and people started saying if you didn't like the post credits scene you were a misogynist and "oh well when WOMEN dance in media it's the worst thing ever but when MEN do it it's fine" and the shit they'd bring up in comparison was. The Bully Maguire dance. That one scene in TFATWS where Zemo does a little dance. The literal fucking intro to GOTG. Im being so honest to god someone said if you like Quill's dance at the beginning of GOTG, you cant be mad at the She Hulk scene. As if anyone at all was mad at the mere fact that she was dancing and not the fact that that scene had no other purpose than to sexualize the character. As if scene where character is singing and dancing while on an important mission to establish who he is as a person and how he's a bit of a carefree idiot is comparable to scene where character shakes her ass directly at the screen, which had no contribution to the plot or her character at all, it was only there to make her appear more sexy.

Cause I remember all that