#saw a similar thing for dany on reddit and just had to

[owlsinathens]

Like twins

[esther-dot]

Okay, earlier anon who was recced your asks like Tumblr sometimes tends to do 🙃. Thing is that a large part of your fandom has certain opinions about authorial intent that other people don't agree with, because (and as was clear by your answer to my first ask) it seems that there are double standards with how you guys are approaching characters, so alright. I'm not here to debate about that, your opinion is as valid as other people's, but tbh it's kind of why people tend not to take a lot of you seriously. Again, obviously I recognize that that's not something you are even aiming for, but it feeds into fandom perception of stans always whitewashing their faves and situations that the faves are in, or are connected to. This is something stans of all these characters, Dany, Sansa and Arya are complicit in idk I'm not making a point, but this is what I observed. Also, about the KL theory, it was made popular by a person who twisted the text, literally changed wording, to provide support to his theory and afaik Dany fans do not accept that theory at all, which is why recently there has been a schism between them and BNFs, because the latter are still standing by that essay. No one really thinks burning KL and coming out of it will have any space for redemption (except some BNFs still), and seems like you guys have only a one way understanding of what that part of the fandom thinks, just as they have very limited opinions of Sansa fans. I'm literally a Theon fan so all these characters have my empathy, which is why both sides, to me, look like they are always exaggerating. And as to why you don't think Dany hasn't received immense flak over the years, it's probably because you see her as a villain and would rather have fandom perception shift to that view. But as it stands, BNFs who proclaimed themselves fans for years have peddled theories that not even antis have thought up, so it's not like the Dany fandom had as large a voice to push back because she is an immensely polarizing character. Shipping fights are different because they tend to blow up in any fandom. I have seen similar pushback by Sansa stans in the last few years toward BNFs so it seems like both parts of the fandom are moving in the same direction. Thank you for answering my earlier ask so patiently and sorry for this very long ask. I understand if it's getting irritating.

(Continuation of this convo)

You seem like a very nice person, anon, and I appreciate you trying to point out that we may all have more in common than we think, but I simply can’t agree with you. Everything you’re saying is contrary to my experience. For instance, the idea that the Dany fandom doesn’t have a large voice, that simply isn’t true. I understand that they may feel like underdogs now, but Dany was the most popular character on GoT for years. She had the largest fanbase. And even with people trying to separate/distinguish book v show fans, the fandoms were merged and still overlap, so I just don’t think that claim is true.

As a Sansa fan, I didn’t know anyone in real life who liked her. Tumblr was the only site that had a real Sansa fandom when I was looking around in 2018. Back then, Reddit adored Dany, westeros.org seemed much more interested in the male characters, and on Quora there were people who liked Sansa, but they were outnumbered. The Sansa hate was everywhere, on every positive Sansa post I saw and on any youtube video I watched...it was unrelenting. She had nowhere near the fanbase. Here on tumblr, there was a large enough group that you felt free to really enjoy her. I mean, people still got anon hate/threats, but there were enough people that you could have fun. That wasn’t true in other places.

And, the people who were being nasty were typically Dany or Ary@ stans.  I observed it, then I lived it. We are still living it. I’m not sure a week goes by that one of us doesn’t get angry anons. I sometimes get them within minutes of posting because they hate read our blogs/follow our tags for the purpose of harassing us. Kelsey Hayes, the most popular GoT/ASOIAF writer on Quora (for like, a decade running), talked about how horrible the Dany fandom was. Obviously, every fandom has their bad eggs, but she experienced an unrelenting stream of abuse over the course of several years. She had tons of followers and was really popular and respected, but after the show ended she wrote about how awful the Dany stans were. Now, imagine what the average Sansa fan felt during that time. They didn’t have the respect or followers or the platform, but they still got the abuse. Obviously it’s awkward to say you’re a Dany stan now (with the show ending in mind), but the life of a Sansa fan was always hell.

The Sansa fandom has remained active here even while much of the rest of the fandom has quieted down, so we’re more noticeable now, and several of us are Dark Dany enthusiasts which I am sure contributes to Dany stans feeling victimized. So, I can accept that people are upset, but I don’t accept their version of events.

As for not being taken seriously by the fandom, I think they got confused somewhere along the way and thought that the author writing about certain things meant he condoned them, and instead of being willing to think about that possibility, they shut those people out because the alternative is a totally different understanding of the characters and their roles in the story. We will likely never get the last book and be proven right or wrong, so I just stay in my own little corner of the fandom, answer my asks, write my fics, and enjoy myself.

I filter and block liberally, and I encourage everyone to do the same!

[rainhadaenerys]

Here's what I've seen so far about James Hibberd's book, Fire Cannot Kill a Dragon (fuck you for choosing this title).

GRRM talked about what everyone is assuming are the three "holy shit" moments that D&D had talked about:

(talking about the 2013 meeting with D&D) It wasn’t easy for me. I didn’t want to give away my books. It’s not easy to talk about the end of my books. Every character has a different end. I told them who would be on the Iron Throne, and I told them some big twists like Hodor and “hold the door,” and Stannis’s decision to burn his daughter. We didn’t get to everybody by any means. Especially the minor characters, who may have very different endings.

So there's no mention of "Mad Queen Dany" or "Dany burning King's Landing". Sure, one could argue that GRRM is just mentioning a few examples and not saying everything, that Mad Queen Dany could still be one of the twists. But I find it unlikely that he would list all major twists (who sits on the Iron Throne, that Stannis burns Shireen, and what happens to Hodor) and NOT list Mad Queen Dany or Dany burning King's Landing, both being supposed major twists. GRRM even goes on to explain how the circumstances of Stannis burning Shireen and the Hodor twist will be different in the books (click in the link for details). If Dany burning King's Landing was a book plot point, be it on purpose or burning King's Landing accidentally, I would expect GRRM to say something similar, like "I told them that King's Landing would be burned by Dany, but it will be different, it will be an accident, blah, blah". I might be wrong here, maybe GRRM didn't mention this just because he didn't want to mention, but let me have my hope.

Also, he says he told D&D who would sit on the Iron Throne, but he doesn't explain if D&D actually were faithful to what he told them. Again, this is probably wishful thinking on my part, but maybe this could mean that it's not Bran (I sure hope it's not, because it makes no damned sense for Bran to sit on the Iron Throne).

I also don't understand what GRRM means with "It’s not easy to talk about the end of my books. Every character has a different end". Does he mean that in the books, no character will have the same ending that the others have? I mean, that's pretty obvious, every character in every book usually has different endings from each other. Or does he mean that every character in the show has a different ending from the ending that they have in the books? I saw one post on reddit that suggested this second interpretation, and they added this quote from Benioff to show that this could be the case:

DAVID BENIOFF: We don't get bonus points for being strictly faithful to the books. It doesn't give us anything extra. For every decision there is a fork in the road and the fork to the left is adhering strictly to the books and to the right is what's better for the series, we're always going to take that path to the right.

Maybe D&D did change a ton of stuff, if this is what Benioff is saying. So with GRRM's and Benioff's comments I'm going to keep hoping that Dany survives.

About Dany's ending specifically, apparently GRRM didn't directly say anything. What I found on reddit about Dany's "dark road" was this:

After lists Dany watched Viserys die, killed slavers, threated Qarth, and burnt Tarly, the book says:

Over the years, producers sometimes gave Clarke notes about how to play a moment, nudging the character toward her tyrannical destiny.EMILIA CLARKE: There was a number of times I was like, “Why are you giving me that note?” While I am quite consistently a “How can I help?” kind of person, there were a few moments where I was like, “Don’t tell me what to do with my girl. I know what to do!” It’s like Daenerys’s calling card became cold expressionlessness. I always wanted to infuse that with some humanity because no one’s consistently that. I would sometimes fight back a little: “I get that she has to be steely and unforgiving and a powerful force. But in this moment she’s also a goddamn human being. So I’m going to give you that and I really pray that you take that in the edit.”

Remember when Emilia said that she was given notes on how to play Dany and that she thought these notes must have been the ones building up to Dany's "turn"? Well, here she clarifies that said notes were simply to play Dany as "stoic" and "ice queen". So it doesn't seem to me that these notes were to build up "dark Dany", it seems simply that these notes just show how D&D never understood Dany's character (because anyone who has read the books know that Dany is warm and playful), and that they wanted Emilia to follow the "Ice Queen" stereotype. It had nothing to do with "setting up dark Dany" in my opinion.

The other thing I've seen about Dany was just this really dumb comment by Cogman:

BRYAN COGMAN (co-executive producer): In our minds, we thought the Randyll Tarly scene was disturbing. The I watched it with a crowd of people at a freind's house and they were cheering. Weirdly, the audience didn't care. They loved Dany.

So they really expected us to accept Dany's turn just because "Dany watched Viserys die, killed slavers, threatened Qarth, and burnt the Tarlys". This is what the book mentions as "setting up" Dany's turn. Not reacting when her abuser that just threatened to kill her and her baby is killed. Killing slavers to free slaves. Making an empty threat in a desperate attempt to save her people from starvation. Killing two traitors, something that everyone does in this medieval world. This was their justification.

So this is what I've seen so far about the book. Apparently, James Hibberd will do an AMA on r/asoiaf tomorrow, so maybe we'll find out more things. Also, if anyone knows something else I didn't include, please let me know!

[nutellaninja0001]

honest question, why does the Jonsa fandom stand behind Sophie Turner? She herself is clearly a Jonsa anti, and according to her this is a very good ending for Sansa. Then she reiterated that she doesn't see herself marrying someone else because of all she has suffered, clearly very ignorant of the fact of how sexual healing works, and projecting her vision of a strong independent female ending on a character that didn't want any of that. Yall talk about EC not understanding the character, but..

Hello!

Well, I cannot speak for the entirety of the Jonsa community on why or even if they are a fan of Sophie Turner but I know there are a lot who were Sansa fans before they shipped Jonsa and as both a Jonsa shipper and a Sansa fan, I always liked Sophie Turner for her outward personality. She seems like a genuinely fun person. It was also easy to get behind her when she shared similar opinions on Sansa and I related to her defending Sansa from the backlash she got since season 1 onward and the shit she had to deal with as a teen because of fans who took a show too far and decided to bully an actor because of their opinion of an imaginary character she played.

Whether or not she shipped Jonsa or disagreed with the ship made no matter to me because it was her opinion and I could understand why she might not feel this way as an actor over that of a fan. She has a good friendship with Kit that comes off a little bit like siblings so if she did have that kinda relationship with him off camera, I get why she would be weirded out or against the ship at face value.

I can’t speak for Sophie on her feelings for Sansa but I won’t blame her for being content with Sansa’s ending. Sansa ended the series as a queen who’s people respect and trust. She’s taken control of her identity as a Stark that was stripped from Sansa throughout the series and she reigns as the queen who fought for her peoples independence and withheld against threats that posed to take it all away. Something Sansa had been fighting for since season 5. For those reasons alone I too would be happy seeing Sansa gain that independence and end the series on a better note than the 2 other queens in the last 2 episodes. Even if she did not get the romantic love Sansa deserved I get Sophie’s satisfaction even if Sansa’s ending didn’t end with marriage etc.

It’s also especially satisfying considering year after year from fans and critics alike constantly theorizing how Sansa was going to betray her family and what was the point of her character when she couldn’t physically fight and soooo many death predictions. Seriously, spend 1 minute on Reddit and hear the bullshit that Sansa is a Bolton and doesn’t deserve to be a Stark and you’d be happy too knowing she ended up as Queen in the North.

I had read the interview where Sophie remarks that she doesn’t think Sansa will get married or have children and she will rule peacefully till she’s old and grey. However in that particular article she made no mention of it being the cause of Sansa’s traumas. We do have another article though where Sophie remarks that she doesn’t see Sansa worrying about a relationship around the time of season 6 airing but she continued that if her character fell in love, she she fell in love. She even seemed to ship Sansa and Margaery. Hell, even Arya! Although that seemed more of a joke than anything but at that point her character had been stripped of any genuine relationship of any kind I think she just wanted Sansa to have some positive relationships regardless of the type of love.

In all honesty I really don’t think it’s comparable to Sophie defending an independent Sansa to Emilia justifying the behavior and actions of a character who was not meant to be justified. Sophie has gone on record a lot talking about Sansa’s desire for family and home even when they kept spouting the bull that she was going to side with Littlefinger. She also talked post finale that Sansa did not care about the Iron Throne because that was never her real goal which is more inline with Sansa’s character.

Emilia never saw Dark Dany coming because she never saw Daenerys in any other light than a badass feminist. She went as far as to making changes so Daenerys could be seen in a more sympathetic and girlish light after mass genocide because she didn’t want Daenerys looking like the bad guy despite the fact that Daenerys has only been the hero in her own story. It’s one thing to be unhappy with your characters direction in the show but if Emilia saw only a hero in Daenerys it does pose the question what had she interpreted the many scenes of Daenerys cruelty rearing its ugly head and the lack of understanding she might have had about Daenerys as a morally grey character.

[nightqueendany]

Leak Connections:

So I was just reading @adecila’s recent POST on her re-watch of the Friki leaks regarding Tyrion’s trial. I had just finished reading that post when I was made aware of the UPDATE to the FreeFolk 8x05 leaks page about Cleganebowl photos being “confirmation” of Mad!Dany.

And there are some things with both that I want to talk about that I noticed. These are in no particular order, under the cut.

1) Bran’s flashback. According to the old Friki leaks, Bran has a flashback (or maybe he just says the line) of Tyrion telling Catelyn back in his first ever trial from Season 1 (AGOT), “I never bet against my family.” Implying that Tyrion has been playing the long game and has been Team Cersei this entire time. Perhaps that’s not entirely what’s happened, but Friki claims this line will be used against Tyrion. Apparently GRRM’s book editor and the person who writes the comics also somehow support this information and that this line specifically was added to the comics of Book1 because it foreshadowed Tyrion’s end. So regardless of the “how”, Tyrion does betray everyone for his family.

2) Friki also claims that for sure we will get a scene (likely during the battle of King’s Landing) of people in front of a gate saying, “Open the gates.” Now, the “open the gates” lines and Tyrion’s betryal are not directly connected, as far as I can tell. It’s just speculation on Friki’s part. However, Friki says there is a scene with Jon, Davos, and Tyrion walking through the wreckage of King’s Landing at some point where Tyrion says the line, “What have I done?” So it could be possible Tyrion keeps gates closed in King’s Landing, or not. Still not sure what the connection here is but Tyrion apparently feels responsible for some of the destruction of the capital.

3) It appears two endings for Tyrion are possible however. Some leaks saying ‘Jon will kill Dany’ say Tyrion is still on trial and that Sansa has promised Tyrion they will rule together, only to betray him in the end to seize power for herself. Others just mention Tyrion’s trial with no details. Some have Tyrion freeing Jaime from Dany, Dany arresting him, and Tyrion somehow still being on trial with the Starks/Davos at the end. One has Tyrion listening for the surrender bells (that apparently set Dany off) but it’s not mentioned where Tyrion is, if he is with Jon and co or Dany or elsewhere. Also not said why bells signal surrender of Cersei’s armies). And others claim it’s not a trial at all, but a “Great Council” and Tyrion becomes one of Bran’s advisors because Bran becomes King.

All of these above “leakers” have some amount of credibility to the FreeFolk community but clearly, they can’t all be right. Someone has to be wrong or have partially incorrect information because much of that is contradictory.

So the Tyrion-Trial plot point in and of itself proves that there is false information floating around somewhere.

4) Arya during 8x05: Friki said that Arya is in King’s Landing when it goes up in flames and it’s possible the audience will think she’s dead by the end of 8x05 with all the destruction and what not. But, Friki also says that Arya is at Tyrion’s trial so in 8x06 we would see Arya escape. In the “Cleganebowl photo” “leaks”, something similar is mentioned. Arya is caught up in the destruction of the city and it looks like she’s dead. But then she gets up and leaves the city on a horse and this is possibly the end of 8x05, not somewhere in 8x06. So this seems likely. I’m guessing the leaks that say Arya is “useless” are referring to this because she doesn’t get to kill Cersei.

5) Highgarden. As we saw in last episode, Tyrion promises Bronn Highgarden. Friki says we see aerial shots of Highgarden. So this is perhaps why, because it now belongs to Bronn.

6) The 4Plebs leaks. I’ve noticed these circulating around the Jonerys fandom and investigated them myself. You can find the threads HERE. So the OP in this link gave us these spoilers:

“Tyrion fucking dies, because he betrays Jon and Dany. That is the "bitter" part of the ending. The Sweet part is Dany and Jon survive and rule together, riding off into the sunset on a dragon. No joke. That fucking Spanish bitch got it all right. I Hate myself for reading the spoilers even though I thought they were fanfics. Also, White Walkers are killed by episode 4 and main focus is Cersei.”

This was posted on 4/14, the day of the season premiere. Now, anon here says these leaks come from Friki but I don’t believe Friki has ever said Jon and Dany fly off on a dragon together. I feel like I have seen this leak elsewhere about Jon and Dany flying off on a dragon but I can’t remember where. Further down in this thread we see these posts:

They essentially make the same points about the latter half of the season: White Walkers are finished by 8x04 which is more or less correct, rest of the season is dedicated to defeating Cersei, Tyrion betrays Jon/Dany, with a few additional details in each - Jaime kills Cersei, Jon/Dany ride off into the sunset.

As far as I know, the first pic is the only one that outlines the ENTIRE season. All other leaks I have seen have only given details on one or two episodes at a time, aside from these two 1, 2, which both say Jon kills Dany. But even then, they include no details about the early episodes, just from 3/4 on. The pic above has every single episode, aside from Ep 1 which had just aired so that’s why it’s not included, and even then, the second link gets Dany and Cersei mixed up at first, initially saying Jon kills Cersei, not Dany.

7) Unsullied vs Lannisters. According to the Friki leaks mentioned on the Reddit master post, Friki said 7 months ago that there was, “Fake action scene between Unsullied and Lannister soldiers in the dragon pit as misdirection. Meant to deceive us and the action scene was never filmed.”

Many of the “Jon kills Dany” leaks mention the Unsullied fighting Lannister forces - the Lannisters start to surrender at the sound of “bells” but Grey Worm, either of his own volition or because he sees Dany continuing to burn the city, spears a Lannister who had surrendered and the fighting continues.

Now, I’ve pointed out before that this scenario already seemed odd for the simple reason that all these leaks keep saying “Lannister” and not “Golden Company” when the majority of Cersei’s forces should be the Golden Company. They’re the most featured in all the previews (and a Golden Company vs Unsullied fight has been pretty hyped).

There are shots in the 8x05 preview of men not in Golden Company uniform...but they’re not in Lannister uniform either:

These are the typical Lannister uniforms:

Everything about these guys outfits from 8x05 are different to the point where I don’t know who or what they are. They’re not Euron’s men. They’re not Golden Company men. And they’re not Lannisters, based on their outfits. But as they’re operating the scorpions in different locations of King’s Landing that have the Lannister lion on them (Euron’s scorpions look like a kraken), I guess they’re Lannisters? But regardless, they’re not ground troops. The Golden Company are the ground troops. The “Lannisters” seem to be either a) operating the scorpions or b) are archers on the castle walls as we saw in 8x04.

However, if Friki says the Unsullied vs Lannister stuff from the Dragonpit is fake, then perhaps this gives explanation to why many leaks mention it? If Friki is claiming HBO put out information to “misdirect” the audience - scenes that were never filmed - the Unsullied-attack-surrendering-Lannisters leaks could definitely be part of that.

8) One more thing I would like to point out is, aside from Friki’s leaks about 8x01, NO ONE has leaked details in their entirety. We keep getting small details: “Arya kills Night King”, “Jon kills Dany in throne room” “Tyrion betrays everyone”, etc. None of the information from the leaks seems to be connected in any way. We just have snippets of things.

And again, as I’ve pointed out twice above, it definitely appears that there are differing versions of things and HBO has put out false information at least potentially once. But if they’ve done it once, then what’s to say they haven’t done it more than that?

One source might have “Cleganebowl” pics, but if they haven’t seen the actual scene of Dany “going mad” or “Jon killing Dany” then it’s still in question as to whether those things actually happen. *Edit: FreeFolk also claims these leaks do not fit their particular standards for reliable leaks so take the Cleganebowl leaks with a grain of salt!:

Also, why would extras be present in a scene where Jon kills Dany? Why would anyone superfluous be present for shooting such a scene? Only key people would likely be there for this because it would be SUCH a huge spoiler.

Anyway, you guys can take all this with a grain of salt. I unfortunately don’t work for HBO so I have no sources and have yet to see the episodes. But these are just dots I’ve connected. Let me know what you think.

[thebuckybarnessoldier]

Thoughts on 8x05

I never thought my first Tumblr post in like 200 years would be about Game of Thrones of all shows, but here I am. I just have so many thoughts about this episode that I have been marinading in over the last day and I need to express them ughhh.

1. I saw this suggestion on Reddit and tbh I 100% agree with it - Davos should have been the one running through King’s Landing instead of Arya. At the very least, if they so badly wanted to set up Arya to kill Daenerys, have Davos encounter her, then get split up again and then focus on her. It creates more suspense to have Ser “I’ve never been much of a fighter” Davos in there, rather than Arya, who - let’s face it - has pretty much been guaranteed to survive, if ever there was such a thing in this show. And Davos was from Flea Bottom, can you imagine the emotional impact? (Also Liam Cunningham would have some good material to show his acting chops for the first time in seasons)

2. Speaking of emotional impact...Daenerys has never ever expressed any kind of emotional connection to the Red Keep? I’m not gonna discuss whether or not she should have become mad at all, because honestly it seems like their minds were completely set on it. But even so it could’ve and should’ve been done better. The way it was done was so RANDOM. If I recall, Daenerys has never held any sentiment towards the Red Keep or the fact that it was built by her ancestors. Why would seeing it be her trigger? (PS...D&D...if you had to tell us that reasoning in the aftershow...you didn’t do ya damn job. Show don’t tell????? Aka the first lesson of Writing 101?????) It would’ve made far more sense for Rhaegal to have been just injured at Dragonstone, then died at KL. Then Daenerys could have snapped at the sight of her child’s body, rather than the Red Keep.

3. Or even better, flesh out her entire “descent” a bit more. When she’s locked in her room after Missandei dies, show that. There’s a great still going around of her in that no makeup, dark circles and totally haggard state. I think the photo is brilliant, Emilia really gets across that this is a very shattered Dany, but how much time did it get in the show? A few seconds? Emilia did such a great job in the scene while the bells were ringing, they should’ve given her a similar scene alone in her room, and let Emilia do what she does and portray that Dany might actually cross some serious lines.

Maybe don’t have her burn all of King’s Landing the day of the battle. Maybe she just goes for the Red Keep - killing Cersei and all her human shields. Maybe even a little spillover into the streets. Something that was, technically, planned for, but dark enough to kickstart their Mad Queen thing and cause turmoil for Jon, Tyrion et al. Then, in the aftermath, amongst her remaining advisors or even walking through the city streets, show Dany’s increasing paranoia like in the dining hall scene of 8x04. Have her grow increasingly suspicious of rebellions. Then she still enacts the writers’ whole Mad Queen burning down KL plot, but so much less random and rushed. And yes, it WAS rushed. Being ruthless towards her enemies and acknowledging she acknowledging she could have to take cities with fire and blood during war, IS NOT the same as violating a surrender and killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people who wouldn’t be able to do a thing against her. It’s like she went from being a bit fond of tequila, to getting meth-ed up on the daily, within the space of 1 week.

4. “It’s supposed to be random and rushed!” they cry. “That’s the point! There’s no logic to her madness, that’s what makes it mad!” NAH. Big nope. I can’t remember if it was discussed in the show, but my understanding was that not even the Mad King just woke up and snapped one day. He started out as a decent enough king, but grew increasingly paranoid and fearful. And since everyone is justifying Dany’s madness by saying “her father was mad too! It’s in her genes!” then I think at least do a similar arc. In fact Dany’s madness would still be pretty rushed compared to Aerys, who was commonly known as mad for years but was still kinda tolerated until burning-the-Starks-alive happened.

5. Jaime. Fricking. Lannister. What a mess. What a mess. Back when I first started watching GoT, one of the first interviews I watched had of one of the show runners or writers or someone (it was years ago okay I’m sorry I can’t remember) was asked why they thought people liked the show so much. Their answer went along the lines of: “Westeros is a world undergoing huge changes and upheaval, a bit like our own world, and I think people l really relate to that.” Ok, so the place Westeros isn’t the same as the characters living in it, but come on - you’re really gonna undercut your own self-professed basis of the show by having a hugely redeemed character suddenly regress to what he was in the beginning? You really did that? For what? Shock value? To be edgy edgelords? Jamie just spent 8x04 talking down Bronn from killing him on Cersei’s orders. He’s really gonna have no problem with that? I get that they want their show to be “not like other shows”. But at the end of the day, it IS a show, they are telling a story. And Jaime’s choice did not fit in narratively.

[crowfoodsdaughter-blog]

Shade of the Evening Tree... I would bet money it does this.

The Shade of the Evening Tree... it’s the Essosi version of the Weirwood except inversed in a dark and creepy kind of way. Our writer loves to use symbolism and literary devices to drop clues from time to time...something he does well and does often. There have been many inversions and parallels drawn between the Essosi Shade of the Evening tree and the Westerosi Weirwood noted by readers throughout the fandom.  Today we are going to discuss a possible connection between these two trees and speculate on the enigmatic oily black stones peppered throughout the ASOIAF mythos and worldbuilding.  Before we get started I need to disclose that spoilers from the Forsaken and Arianne chapters will be discussed.  Now let’s get started.

Blackwood / Weirwood

You don’t have to look hard to see the what our writer is doing with these two magical trees.  One only has to look at how the two are described.  We have white trees with red leaves and black trees with blue leaves; this seems ostensibly contradicting and opposing at first glance from a sheer aesthetic point of view.  There are however some striking similarities as both trees are magical and have the potential to both extend life and provide visions.

What has especially captured the attention of the fandom is how our author has chosen to describe the tasting experience of the two trees vision inducing byproducts. There is an eerie similarity that cannot be denied.  For example, here we have Danny ingesting Shade of the Evening:

“The first sip tasted like ink and spoiled meat, foul, but when she swallowed it seemed to come to life within her. She could feel tendrils spreading through her chest, like fingers of fire coiling around her heart, and on her tongue was a taste like honey and anise and cream, like mother’s milk and Drogo’s seed, like red meat and hot blood and molten gold. It was all the tastes she had ever known, and none of them””

And now Bran with weirwood paste:

“The first spoonful was the hardest to get down.  He almost retched it right back up. The second tasted better. The third was almost sweet. The rest he spooned up eagerly. Why had he thought that it was bitter? It tasted of honey, of new-fallen snow, of pepper and cinnamon and the last kiss his mother ever gave him.”

Interestingly, in addition to there being vision inducing trees located in Essos, there was also once a race of small, shy forest folk called woods walkers or Ifequevron who once inhabited the Essosi mainland. 

Immediately south of Ib itself, a densely wooded region that had formerly been the home of a small, shy forest folk. Some say that the Ibbenese extinguished this gentle race, whilst others believe they went into hiding in the deeper woods or fled to other lands. The Dothraki still call the great forest along the northern coast the Kingdom of the Ifequevron, the name by which they knew the vanished forest-dwellers. The fabled Sea Snake, Corlys Velaryon, Lord of the Tides, was the first Westerosi to visit these woods. After his return from the Thousand Islands, he wrote of carved trees, haunted grottoes, and strange silences.  A later traveler, the merchant-adventurer Bryan of Oldtown, captain of the cog Spearshaker, provided an account of his own journey across the Shivering Sea. He reported that the Dothraki name for the lost people meant “those who walk in the woods.”  

TWOIAF further goes on to hint that the Dothraki horselords shunned the forests either from reverence for vanished wood walkers, or because they feared their powers and Corlys Velaryon even reported finding ‘carved trees’ in their forests. Another hint we have of a forgotten CotF-type presence can be found in the secretive peoples of the great and holy Isle of Leng. A people who are known for their large golden eyes, keen eyesight/night vision and their subterranean gods known as the ‘old ones’ lurking beneath the earth. This bit of information we have of the people of Leng has caused speculation of a possible mixture of bloodlines between the natives and the CotF in the ancient past.  Knowing there was a CotF-type presence in Essos, it is quite possible the black barked relative of the weirwood was a part of that magic from years gone by.

 “It will have turned to stone”

So we can see a possibility that the white barked trees of Westeros and the black barked trees of Essos could be lighter and darker versions of one another so to speak.  Now this is where it gets interesting: We know the weirwood petrifies when it dies, pretty simple to comprehend, the trees don't rot they just turn to stone...

 “For a thousand years it has not shown a leaf. In another thousand it will have turned to stone, the maesters say. Weirwoods never rot.”

That was some Tytos Blackwood wisdom for you there. Yes, a guy named Blackwood gave us that little nugget.  Knowing the weirwood turns to stone, if the trees are somehow relatives of each other the same logic could likely apply to the darker version of this tree. Basically, if the white stuff petrifies then the black stuff does too.  So, imagine for a moment what black wood actually becomes when it is petrified…it becomes black stone.

Let’s continue this train of thought and ponder the most mentioned relic of black stone we have in the series, the Seastone chair.  As I mentioned in the beginning, our writer likes to use some symbolism every now and then to drop clues…

Then she saw it: an uprooted tree, huge and dark, coming straight at them. A tangle of roots and limbs poked up out of the water as it came, like the reaching arms of a great kraken.

  “No.” Aeron Damphair did not weigh his words. “Only a godly man may sit the Seastone Chair. The Crow’s Eye worships naught but his own pride.”

Let’s look at the very first time we see someone drink Shade of the evening:

Dany raised the glass to her lips. The first sip tasted like ink and spoiled meat, foul, but when she swallowed it seemed to come to life within her. She could feel tendrils spreading through her chest, like fingers of fire coiling around her heart"

Our writer decided to hide two little hints in our first view of this sorcerous drink, but before Dany actually partakes in the wine of the Warlocks, we are introduced to the grove of shade trees Dany sees outside the HotU.

Long and low, without towers or windows, it coiled like a stone serpent through a grove of black-barked trees whose inky blue leaves made the stuff of the sorcerous drink the Qartheen called shade of the evening. No other buildings stood near. Black tiles covered the palace roof, many fallen or broken; the mortar between the stones was dry and crumbling. She understood now why Xaro Xhoan Daxos called it the Palace of Dust. Even Drogon seemed disquieted by the sight of it. The black dragon hissed, smoke seeping out between his sharp teeth. “Blood of my blood,” Jhogo said in Dothraki, “this is an evil place, a haunt of ghosts and maegi. See how it drinks the morning sun? Let us go before it drinks us as well.” Ser Jorah Mormont came up beside them. “What power can they have if they live in that?” “Heed the wisdom of those who love you best,” said Xaro Xhoan Daxos, lounging inside the palanquin. “Warlocks are bitter creatures who eat dust and drink of shadows.

The wording here is interesting, if you have noticed, the Qartheen warns Dany that the warlocks ‘drink shadows’ and the Dothraki are disquieted by the way the place ‘drinks the morning sun’.  If these words seem familiar, you will notice it is echoed in TWOIAF when Asshai in the shadowlands is described.

“Some say as well that the stone of Asshai has a greasy, unpleasant feel to it, that it seems to drink the light, dimming tapers and torches and hearth fires alike.

Asshai is a haunt of sorcerers known for a ridiculous amount of black oily stone. The city is supposedly made entirely of the stuff and is said to be the size of Volantis, Qarth, King’s Landing, and Oldtown put together.  For some reason Asshai is still much a mystery to maesters and readers alike.  The sheer mass of the materials required tends to rule out most opinions and theories.  What you may find interesting however, is there is a high possibility Asshai was once a very fertile and forested area much like Yeng and Yi Ti.  If you take a glance at a map, you will see that in the past Asshai would have been a part of a forest/jungle fertile that would have stretched from Sothoryos and the Basilisk Isles all the way to Ulthos.

Another thing that I do want to draw your attention to is Ulthos, a land mass just as close to Asshai as any settlement found in Essos. This nearby land mass is a heavily jungled area that is a noticeably distinct color than any of the other forested areas on the map of the known world.  Recently /u/Werthead on Reddit published a tremendous undertaking of his Atlas of Ice and Fire which piqued my interest because the atlas mentions that the jungles of Ulthos are specifically purple-black in coloring on the map.  When I asked for his reference he pointed me to the actual mapmaker Jonathan Roberts who, on his fantastic maps website, mentions that the jungles of Ulthos are in fact meant to be depicted as purple-black in coloring.  I think it is highly possible this was not artistic license and was part of the guidance provided by our writer who commissioned his maps, but who knows, maybe the artist decided it would be good to have a purple-black colored jungle.  The purple part is somewhat confusing, but the black coloring of this tree depot next to Asshai, it has my attention.

Despite Ulthos being extremely close in proximity to Asshai, the possibility exists they were once even closer.  As we have noticed, there are some hints the sea level was lower at some point in the ancient past.  The Thousand Isles, the Neck and the Arm of Dorne are just a few examples.  One detail I would also point to is the artwork for Asshai in TWOIAF.  In the worldbook, it appears Asshai is a half-drowned city.  Again, I’m not sure if the artist just decided that Asshai should be half-drowned in appearance without any guidance, but there is definitely something there.  So not only is it quite possible Asshai was part of a forested and fertile crescent, but there is also the possibility this massive “purple-black” jungle was located closer to Asshai in the ancient past than we realize.

The years pass in their hundreds and their thousands, and what does any man see of life but a few summers, a few winters? We look at mountains and call them eternal, and so they seem … but in the course of time, mountains rise and fall, rivers change their courses, stars fall from the sky, and great cities sink beneath the sea. Even gods die, we think. Everything changes. -Maester Luwin to Bran

I know what you are thinking, if a shade tree were to truly petrify what are the mechanics that would cause it to be oily? If this is the same stuff, it has to be oily or become oily in some form or fashion. Well as it turns out, Shade of the Evening is also described as OILY.

The Crow’s Eye filled two cups with a strange black wine that flowed as thick as honey. “Drink with me, brother. Have a taste of this.” He offered one of the cups to Victarion. The captain took the cup Euron had not offered, sniffed at its contents suspiciously. Seen up close, it looked more blue than black. It was thick and oily, with a smell like rotted flesh. He tried a small swallow, and spit it out at once. “Foul stuff. Do you mean to poison me?”  

Current storyline significance

From here we now have pondered the possibility of what could be the origins for the black oily stone.  Now let’s look at another quote and see what we make of it:

Though Aeron clamped his mouth shut, twisting his head from side to side he fought as best he could, but in the end he had to choke or swallow. The dreams were even worse the second time. He saw the longships of the Ironborn adrift and burning on a boiling blood-red sea. He saw his brother on the Iron Throne again, but Euron was no longer human. He seemed more squid than man, a monster fathered by a kraken of the deep, his face a mass of writhing tentacles.

This last quote is somewhat confusing to some readers as this plainly looks like some straight up Lovecraft monster reference, but remember that Euron is kind of a Shade of the Evening junkie so to speak and Shade of the Evening is basically a brother from another mother to Weirwood paste... and what does weirwood paste do? It weds you to the tree, the writhing tentacles is a greenseer/tree man symbol in Aeron’s dream. See for yourself: 

Your blood makes you a greenseer,” said Lord Brynden. “This will help awaken your gifts and wed you to the trees.” Bran did not want to be married to a tree … but who else would wed a broken boy like him? A thousand eyes, a hundred skins, wisdom deep as the roots of ancient trees. A greenseer. 

  The sight of him still frightened Bran— the weirwood roots snaking in and out of his withered flesh, the mushrooms sprouting from his cheeks, the white wooden worm that grew from the socket where one eye had been. He liked it better when the torches were put out.

So, the Shade of the Evening vision basically showed Aeron what his brother actually is... a terrible man with wisdom as deep as the roots of ancient trees… but we are not done yet.

Let's talk about some hairy men for a minute.  The hairy men were kind of everywhere when you look at the text of TWOIAF at least in central and western Essos.  I noticed that there was once a forest inhabited by these CotF-type woods walkers who came into direct contact with the hairy men and not in the diplomatic kind of way. More in the, I am going to commit genocide, take your land and bleed your resources type of way:  

 The God-Kings of Ib, before their fall, did succeed in conquering and colonizing a huge swathe of northern Essos immediately south of Ib itself, a densely wooded region that had formerly been the home of a small, shy forest folk. Some say that the Ibbenese extinguished this gentle race, whilst others believe they went into hiding in the deeper woods or fled to other lands.

  At its greatest extent, the Ibbenese foothold on Essos was as large as Ib itself and far richer. More and more of the hairy men crossed over from the islands to make their fortunes there, cutting down the trees to put the land under the plow, damming the rivers and streams, mining the hills

It is safe to say the Ibbenese didn't get along well with this forest folk that worshipped the black wood trees.  In fact, it seems like the Ibbenese kind of persecuted them in a sense and cut down a bunch of their trees and the maesters even theorize the Ibbenese caused the woods-walkers extinction.  That’s bad right?

What made my eyes completely bug out of their sockets was this line:

The eunuch drew a parchment from his sleeve. “A kraken has been seen off the Fingers.”  He giggled. “Not a Greyjoy, mind you, a true kraken. It attacked an Ibbenese whaler and pulled it under.

So, a "kraken" has pulled under an Ibbenese whaler...makes sense now doesn't it?  Tree roots can look like the reaching arms of a kraken as our writer has pointed out.  This has caused me to speculate that there indeed might be something under the sea.  I think there might be a good chance there is a network of huge roots, which could be why there is the Greensee/Green sea pun that ravenous reader has pointed out in the Westeros.org forums and explains why Patchface came back from the depths with the gift of prophetic vision.  And here is why… detailed in one of Aeron's Shade of the Evening trips:

“Urri!” he cried. There is no hinge here, no door, no Urri. His brother Urrigon was long dead, yet there he stood. One arm was black and swollen, stinking with maggots, but he was still Urri, still a boy, no older than the day he died.  “You know what waits below the sea, brother?”  “The Drowned God,” Aeron said, “the watery halls.”  Urri shook his head. “Worms... worms await you, Aeron.”

In Aeron's dream, Urri is telling him there is no Drowned God, no watery halls, just worms, worms await him.  From what we have seen in the House of the Undying, shade visions are supposed to be cryptic and somewhat prophetic in nature right?  So, what if there is actually something that looks similar to worms or the reaching arms of a kraken under the sea?  Let’s take a peek:

The way the shadows shifted made it seem as if the walls were moving too. Bran saw great white snakes slithering in and out of the earth around him, and his heart thumped in fear. He wondered if they had blundered into a nest of milk snakes or giant grave worms, soft and pale and squishy.  

  The sight of him still frightened Bran— the weirwood roots snaking in and out of his withered flesh, the mushrooms sprouting from his cheeks, the white wooden worm that grew from the socket where one eye had been.

I guess this means we may actually get to see this play out in the chapters due to whatever Euron is doing at the moment.  According to the Arianne I sample chapter there are ‘krakens’ stirring around the Arm of Dorne being drawn to blood of the current hostilities and our Shade of the Evening drinking Euron has something planned in his upcoming battle with the Redwyne and Hightower fleet.  So yeah maybe there will be an Eldrich Apocalypse of sorts, just not the kind most were expecting.  

Before moving on, we are going to take this idea and look at two cultures in Essos who both fear the sea: The Thousand Isles and the Dothraki.  As we have read, the maesters suggest the Thousand Isles is something of a drowned kingdom that has been reduced to hundreds of scattered islands. Before the Thousand Isles were drowned, it was most likely connected to the dark forests of Mossovy ”.   A place whispered to be the haunt of shapechangers.  Additionally, the Dothraki whom the maesters hint could fear the Ifequevron also have a very real fear the sea and will not even plow the earth. 

Ebony and Weirwood

So, let’s back up for a moment and take a look at ebony. There have been many in the forums who have drawn attention to hints of the relationship between the two sets of trees through the writer’s use of ‘ebony’ and weirwood.  These hints are casually floated in front of our faces in the shape of weirwood and ebony doors seen in both the House of Black and White and the House of the Undying.

In the real-world ebony is a black wood of a few species that is so dense and heavy that it sinks or ‘drowns’ in water. Each time our characters encounter ebony, I’m not sure if they can distinguish one type of black wood from another when it comes certain items. It is kind of a tinge of the unreliable narrator that our writer uses from time to time; just like when Bran sees Jaime and Cersei wrestling naked. He is familiar with wrestling, so they are wrestling.  You see, characters might easily have difficulty categorizing a wood that they have never seen before and are unfamiliar with.  The shade of the evening tree is not seen in Westeros or the Free Cities that we have seen, so far, so what makes us so certain our characters can identify it when they happen across seeing it? Basically, they think they see ebony and so ebony is how it is described. 

“At the top she found a set of carved wooden doors twelve feet high. The left-hand door was made of weirwood pale as bone, the right of gleaming ebony. In their center was a carved moon face; ebony on the weirwood side, weirwood on the ebony. The look of it reminded her somehow of the heart tree in the godswood at Winterfell. The doors are watching me, she thought.”

Here we have ebony and weirwood superimposed and contrasting one another with a carved face that does an excellent job reminding Arya (and the reader) of the heart tree in Winterfell.  Pretty simple symbolism, basically black tree/white tree=heart tree. 

In addition to Arya, Dany experienced a similar door in the House of the Undying: 

To her right, a set of wide wooden doors had been thrown open. They were fashioned of ebony and weirwood, the black and white grains swirling and twisting in strange interwoven patterns. They were very beautiful, yet somehow frightening. The blood of the dragon must not be afraid. 

It seems the writer is trying to describe these doors as an allusion to being made of one wood.  Notice how the wording makes it seem as if they were not mechanically pieced together from two different types of wood with descriptions such as the grains twisting and swirling?  The description itself makes it seem almost as if it is made from the same slab of wood.  This imagery makes a great deal of logic knowing there is a black barked tree with similar qualities to weirwood and were possibly one species at one time before they split in their evolution.  Later, shade drinking Dany is fittingly given further symbolism in Mereen as she is sitting equivalent of an Essosi weirwood throne, an ebony bench.  Also, TWOIAF mentions that the people of Asshai ride around in palanquins made of ebony…hmm... must be an abundance of that stuff somewhere nearby. 

There is also another set of doors that should be mentioned although not as enigmatic. We also have ebony and weirwood doors all the way back in Game of Thrones at the forge of Tobho Mott, our friendly neighborhood Qohorik.  This one is a little trickier, but it gets cleared up in TWOIAF. 

Qohor stands on the river Qhoyne on the western edge of the vast, dark, primordial forest to which she gives her name, the greatest wood in all of Essos.

  The Forest of Qohor also yields up furs and pelts of all kinds, many rare and fine and highly prized, as well as silver, tin, and amber. The vast forest has never been fully explored, according to the maps and scrolls at the Citadel, and it likely conceals many mysteries and wonders at its heart.

  The artisans of Qohor are far famed. Qohorik tapestries, woven primarily by the women and children of the city, are just as fine as those woven in Myr, though less costly. Exquisite (if somewhat disturbing) wood carvings can be bought in Qohor’s market, and the city’s forges have no peer.

We also learn of the God of Qohor, the Black Goat.  A deity that requires daily blood sacrifice, and is frequently mentioned when the Lion of Night is mentioned.

“And many names,” the kindly man had said. “In Qohor he is the Black Goat, in Yi Ti the Lion of Night, in Westeros the Stranger.

  “Warlocks, wizards, alchemists, moonsingers, red priests, black alchemists, necromancers, aeromancers, pyromancers, bloodmages, torturers, inquisitors, poisoners, godswives, night-walkers, shapechangers, worshippers of the Black Goat and the Pale Child and the Lion of Night, all find welcome in Asshai-by-the-Shadow, where nothing is forbidden.”

  Beyond her was a man with a lion’s head seated on a throne, carved of ebony. On the other side of the doors, a huge horse of bronze and iron reared up on two great legs. Farther on she could make out a great stone face, a pale infant with a sword, a shaggy black goat the size of an aurochs, a hooded man leaning on a staff.

Basically, Qohor is known for its special wood being the largest forest in Essos and which is described as not fully explored and primordial.  Additionally, what I am seeing with the Black Goat is a deity that is worshipped in the most heavily forested area in Essos, is a fan of blood sacrifice (like a heart tree) and is often associated with another deity that is depicted in the House of Black and White as carved out of ebony…oh yes, and their worshippers can find refuge in Asshai, go figure.

Also, in Lovecraft mythos, Shub-Niggurath is known as the Black Goat of the Woods.  But wait!! What about all of the Lovecraft references? Isn’t C’thulhu coming for the Redwynes? No, but the trees are.

Lovecraft and the Old Gods

The Lovecraft references peppered throughout the story do seem to focus on some watery stuff going on, but there are other Lovecraft nods that cannot be explained with a watery hall.  These places include Ib, Qohor with its Black Goat, N'Gai with its underground city, and the Sarnori are a few examples.  I believe the Lovecraft references could be, at least in part, referring to Old Gods presence surrounding the Long Night narrative. As you can see…  

Ib:

Ib is mentioned quite a few times in this post pertaining to Huzhor Amai and the destruction of the Ifequevron. Ib is also mentioned in "The Doom that Came to Sarnath", Ib was an ancient civilization destroyed by Sarnath. Interestingly, the Sarnori and the Ibbenese also fought in the ancient past.  

Leng:

As previously mentioned, Leng is also has some possible links to the Old Gods with their golden cat eyes, night vision, subterranean gods and blood sacrifice. Leng is possibly inspired by the Plateau of Leng mentioned in various Lovecraft stories.

The Black Goat:

The Black Goat is of course mentioned above in Lovecraft terms is known as “The Black Goat of the Woods with a Thousand Young", "The Black Goat of the Woods", and "The Lord of the Wood".

Sarnor/Sarnath:

TWOIAF mentions that the Sarnori got into more than a few skirmishes with the Ibbenese and their Long Night hero, Huzor Amai, “wore the pelt of the king of the hairy men" so he may have been in conflict with them or even descended from them. Awhile back, I also read an excellent thread that provided a very reasonable argument that the Lengii may possibly descend from the tall men or proto-tall men also known as the peoples of Sarnor.

N’Gai:

N'Gai's capital Nefer is an underground city located next to the Mossovy forest which is said to be full of shapechangers. Coincidentally, the N’Gai also have a Long Night hero of their own Neferion. In Lovecraft legend, N'Kai is an underground dominion where Tsathoggua is said to sleep.

The Iron Islands:

The Iron Islands are another drowned area with Lovecraft nods and with their own Azor Ahai like figure and black oily stone. The Grey King literally has weirwood in his legend as he slew the pale demonic flesh eating tree Ygg. The Iron islands of course also have various references such as characters named Dagon, and religious mantras such as “what is dead may never die”.

Stygai:

Stygai is a part of the Shadowlands right next door to Asshai which has black oily stone and a Long Night Hero of its own and was most likely fertile and forested in the ancient past. This is possibly inspired by Stygia from the Conan stories (influenced by Lovecraft) It is a city where magic is strong with promises of sorcery and witchcraft for scholars and dabbling warlocks. It is said a dark shadow has been cast along this land for centuries.

The Church of Starry Wisdom:

This church was founded by the Bloodstone Emperor, possibly another version of a Long Night hero such as Azor Ahai. In Lovecraft’s world, the Cult of Starry Wisdom is from "The Haunter of the Dark".  

The Isle Of Toads:

This is a site of a black greasy stone statue, similar to various Lovecraft stories where there are statues of black or greenish stone with aquatic like aspects. The Isle of Toads is located in the same forested/jungled fertile crescent that contains Sothoryos, Yi Ti, Leng and Ulthos.

 In essence, Lovecraft wasn’t just about C’thulhu, he had a whole slew of different Gods with various aspects. The thing that Lovecraft did with many of these deities is refer to them as the "old ones" and the "elder gods". What our author is doing is GRRM is at various Lovecraft lore and carefully throwing these Easter eggs out there because he has his own version of old ones/elder gods… these are the Old Gods… and in his world they are the trees.

GRRM has done everything possible to make the Shade tree an Essosi Weirwood, so if the white stuff petrifies, the black stuff probably does too.

If I had money to bet...I'd place it on the warlock tree taking a note from its Westerosi cousin.

[dmcrossroads-blog]

Night 05! Rise of the Vampires!

Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome back to DMCrossroads! Before I get into today’s post, I feel like I need to warn you; this is going to be the most hyped post I’ll have written here so far. It may be the most hyped thing I’ve written in a long time, if not simply EVER! There’s going to be a lot of ALL CAPS WRITING and exclamation points to properly convey, in text, just how excited I am!

You see… Today is day 3 of the Commander 2017 spoiler week. And today…

They spoiled some Vampires.

If you don’t understand why that makes me hyped, then I’m going to quickly explain: I love Vampires. I. LOVE. VAMPIRES! There are very few Vampire products or sagas or universes that I don’t enjoy. Maybe a total of three or so, now that I think about it. In all the Vampire-related things that have ever been created, there MAY be three instances I was unhappy about.

And this Commander 2017 deck is NOT one of those things. I. Love. This. Deck.

And I can’t wait to talk to you about it. But before we do, I feel the need to do some house-keeping. Yesterday’s post came out before I saw two of the spoilers from the 8th of August. For the sake of being organized, I want to quickly talk about those two cards before we get started on today. Let’s go!

Mirror of the Forebears

Mirror of the Forebears strongly resembles a Tribal-dedicated Mirage Mirror. If you haven’t been following the Commander VS episodes over at the StarCityGames YouTube channel, then you may not realize this, but the Magic Mirror (as Jeremy Noell and Stephen Green have nicknamed it) is an amazing piece that can find a home in nearly any and every deck. Mirror of the Forebears does something similar, albeit it limited to working within Tribal decks. Still, I can’t imagine what kind of deck I wouldn’t want to run this card in because if ONE awesome thing is awesome, TWO awesome things is TWICE AS AWESOME!

Qasali Slingers

Qasali Slingers is an awesome card in the fact that it is basically a creature version of Aura Shards. And honestly, Green and White is really good at getting rid of pesky Artifacts and Enchantments, so the fact that this provides even more removal for those types of cards and aligns with Cat tribal is such a win! And the fact that it triggers off the Cat entering the battlefield and not on cast is very important because Flicker effects and token creators just became even more awesome!

Okay, so those two cards were awesome additions! I don’t want to downplay them in the slightest. BUT! … Let’s talk about some Vampires. And like the past couple of posts, I want to start with the big shebang RIGHT UP FRONT!

Edgar Markov 

…

Hold on a second, I’m still trying to collect my thoughts and excitement for this. Don’t judge me, you don’t understand the over-hype that I’m currently over-hyping right now!

Let’s start with the simple stuff, like his name. You may or may not have noticed, but Legendary Creatures tend to come with a “,” somewhere in their name, followed by a title. They could have called this card “Edgar Markov, Father of Vampires” or “Edgar Markov, Lord of Innistrad” or even “Edgar Markov, Ruler of the Night”. But they didn’t. And I think I know why. Edgar Markov doesn’t need a title. Think about it. This IS the Father of Vampires on Innistrad. And seeing that Vampires were SUCH A THREAT to humanity that Sorin Markov felt they needed to be policed and created Avacyn to do so, I would wager that calling him the Lord of Innistrad or Ruler of the Night is EXTREMELY appropriate. But that’s all just fluff. Because THIS is Edgar Markov. No fluff needed.

Then we look at his art. We got to see it last week when the Commander 2017 page on Wizards.com had his art as splash art, but he wasn’t centered on the page. He was aligned to the right just a bit so they could fit the title of the page and some description wording without overlapping his face or armor. I agree 100% with how they handled the situation, but now seeing the art on the card, it’s amazing. Lord Markov (let’s be real, we’re not worthy to call him by his name!) is centered, surrounded by tending fledgling Vampires, a look of nobility and strength. His golden, black eyes are looking right at the player (or any poor fool of an opponent who picks him up to read his text) and staring into your soul. This is some prime art. THIS is the art… of Lord Edgar Markov!

Finally, let’s look at what he does. And wow, does he do it all or what? Sure, he costs 6, but he’s also a 4/4 with First Strike and Haste. That means he’s going to enter the battlefield SWINGING! But that’s not all he does. Let’s say you play him turn 6, but you were able to set up with two or three other Vampires in prior turns. That means you’ve gotten two or three Vampire tokens because of his Eminence ability. I want to draw very SPECIAL ATTENTION to this ability. Not only do we get tokens while casting Vampires and Lord Markov is in the Command Zone. We STILL get them while he is on the battlefield! We’re going to bring an ARMY of Vampires to fight! And Lord Markov empowers his forces, making them gain strength with just his command to attack! Unlike Drana, Liberator of Malakir, you can prevent Lord Markov’s damage, block him, but you cannot stop the benefit he is giving to his warriors. Honestly, the only complaint I have about this card is that he’s a Vampire Knight. Let’s be honest. Lord Edgar Markov is the Vampire King!

I could go on and on about this card and how I plan to make this deck. Because, trust me! I am going to be running Lord Edgar Markov at some point in the VERY near future! But there’s a ton of other cards and I don’t want to take up your entire evening. After all, there are Vampires about! You may want to ready your defenses before nightfall…

Licia, Sanguine Tribune 

I will openly admit that I was not nearly as excited about Licia, Sanguine Tribune as I was for Lord Edgar Markov (no, Lord is not leaving his name for most likely… Ever. Expect me to always refer to him as Lord from here on out!) despite the fact that I think they’re an interesting Legendary Creature. Why, you may ask? Well, for starters, the CMC on this one is REALLY high. I see that the cost is reduced by gaining life, but I have this stereotype of Vampires for Magic: the Gathering in my head that makes me think more of the “growing in strength via combat” by them gaining +1/+1 counters instead of thinking of a lifegain deck. Now, with that being said, if I stop thinking of Licia as a Vampire Commander and more of a Lifegain Commander, I start getting more excited. I once ran Karlov of the Ghost Council as a WB Lifegain Zombie Tribal deck, so utilizing lifegain to gain counters is not new to me. Then, I also notice that you can activate Licia’s +1/+1 counter ability once EACH TURN! Not each of YOUR TURNS, EACH TURN! So in a four-person game where I’m gaining tons of life, I could pay 20 into this Commander and get a 16/16 after a single round? Um. Yes. Yes, please. I think Karlov will be a great part of the 99 for a deck like this and I’m excited to see what Licia can really do!

I’ll also note that Reddit got super hyped over Licia because their armor appears to be Roman-esque in nature. Some people theorized that they may be from Theros and we’ll see a Greece vs. Roman style conflict in a return to Theros while others are hoping and praying for a Roman-based plane in the future that has Vampires incorporated into the government. Honestly, if it has Vampires in it, I don’t truly care where we go!

Mathas, Fiend Seeker 

Wizards, STOP WITH THE AMAZING ART! This guy looks EXTREMELY badass, and I can only imagine that the branding tool in his hand is either about to be used or just was used on some poor fool. Then I look at the stats on the card and I can’t help but get excited. A 3/3 body with Menace for three mana is awesome. And then I read the Bounty counter ability and it SCREAMS politics! “Hmm, see this creature we all don’t really like? I’m going to put a Bounty on it. Now if we get rid of it, we all benefit!” Definitely something I would play. And this isn’t the first time we’ve seen Bounty counters, so there’s some pre-existing synergy to build with in a deck led by Mathas.

That’s it for the Legendary Vampires that have been spoiled thus far. Someone on Reddit noticed that there are five Legendary Creatures spoiled for the Dragon deck, four for the Cat deck and only three for the Vampires, so there’s some theorizing that there will be another new Legendary Vampire at some point. I’d like to also provide the possibility that perhaps there will be more reprints in the decks that have fewer new Legendary Creatures. Vampires have tons of Legendary Creatures they could bring back, including two Drana’s, two Olivia’s, two Kalitas’ and more! So who knows what we’ll see once the decklists are revealed? For now, let’s talk about the non-Legendary Vampires we saw today.

Bloodsworn Steward 

Commander 2016 had a very unique card in one of the decks called Bastion Protector. My wife, Dani, fell in love with this card because it was another Aegis Angel for her Kaalia of the Vast deck. It looks like Vampires are bringing the “buff Commander cards” idea back and instead of giving Indestructible, the red-colored card is giving Haste. I’m excited to see the mechanic return and Haste is fine, but I almost wonder if Trample wouldn’t have been better. Haste is super important ONCE each time you play your Commander. Trample matters every attack phase it’s on the battlefield and we’ve seen Red start to share Trample with Green over the past couple of years. Remember the Red Archetype of Aggression from Theros? Still, this is a four mana 4/4 with flying that buffs your Commander and gives haste. All in all, an extremely efficient card!

Crimson Honor Guard 

I like everything about this card. The stats are spot on with a five mana 4/5 body with Trample. But the fact that it encourages people (or punishes them!) for not having their Commander on the battlefield seems hilarious! I mean, part of the reason we all love and play Commander is because you get to build this awesome deck around this awesome Legendary Creature! (Most of the time… I acknowledge some people build cards around COLORS instead of the Creature itself, but I will stand by the statement that normally, decks are built with what the Commander provides in mind). The only issue I could have with this card is if your own Commander is hard to cast, it may be a dud. Still, if you’re in a group that runs a lot of big stompy Commanders that you know won’t be out until turn seven or you plan on regularly sending back to the Command Zone… This might give you the upper hand with some nice damage!

Patron of the Vein 

Any time I see graveyard disruption on a card, I instantly want to buy as many as I can fit into decks with those colors. As a graveyard player (Hail the Golgari!) I know too well how crazy decks that rely on putting their own cards in the graveyard can get. A healthy amount of graveyard hate has a place in ANY DECK and I would say it’s as necessary as having ramp and draw. Not only does this card provide graveyard hate, it’s still very tribal by boosting EACH VAMPIRE YOU CONTROL when something gets exiled for dying. Sounds like a win/win for me!

New Blood 

So this spell obviously isn’t a Vampire itself, but as you read it, you can tell while I’m classifying it with the rest of the Vampire cards. I love taking people’s stuff. The first Vampire Tribal deck I ran was Commandered by Olivia Voldaren (as, I believe, most Vampire Tribal decks tend to be led by) and nothing was more fun than taunting my opponents by pinging their creatures and turning them into Vampires and then taking them. This card goes a step further and REPLACES TEXT ON THE TAKEN CARD so that whatever creature type it previously referenced now references Vampire instead. This doesn’t just turn the taken creature into Vampire, it can take an Elf Lord and make it a Vampire Lord. As a Krenko, Mob Boss player, I giggled with glee when I thought of taking Krenko from someone and making Goblins now say Vampires. Imagine making 1/1 Vampire tokens for each Vampire you control?! Please, Wizards, stop TOYING WITH MY EMOTIONS!

That was all the Vampire and Vampire-esque cards that were spoiled today! But we’re not done. Actually, we’re only about halfway… Because some AWESOME other cards were also spoiled! The first ones I want to talk about was the cycle of Curses!

Curse of Vitality 

Curse of Verbosity 

Curse of Disturbance 

Curse of Opulence 

Curse of Bounty 

I’m not going to go over each and every ability because you can read them for yourself and figure out which of your decks they will do the most work in. I do, however, want to mention that I am in love with Curses and have been since they first came out. I’ve been talking about wanting to run a Curse Commander deck and am constantly upset that there isn’t a Grixis colored Legendary Creature that I can work with. I’ve resigned myself to work with Nekusar the Mindrazer, since he’s the right colors, helps you draw cards and I don’t have to worry about losing my Curses like I would if I ran the deck under Jeleva, Nephalia’s Scourge. With that in mind, I noticed something VERY important about these Curses, since they’re new and improved! Remember that any time an opponent triggers one of these new Curses by attacking the cursed player, they’re not the only one getting the benefit. THESE Curses pay the attacker AND the owner of the curse! THAT IS SO COOL! It’s the ultimate political play. Sure, you want to attack this person because who doesn’t want 2 life, to draw a card, a 2/2 Zombie token, a Gold token or to untap their nonland permanents? Just know that anything you get, I get. You have to pay taxes on that benefit! Fantastic!

Finally, there was three other cards spoiled today and nearly all three were instantly gobbled up by the people as being awesome. Let’s talk about them before we wrap this SUPER LONG post up!

Disrupt Decorum 

Teferi’s Protection 

Kindred Charge 

For starters, seeing Kindred Charge after Kindred Discovery yesterday leads us to believe there will be five cards in a Kindred Cycle, just like the five Curse cards. This means there’s a White, Black and Green Kindred card that we haven’t seen yet. For today, though, Kindred Charge was instantly seen and loved by Krenko players. You mean I get MORE while I keep getting MORE from Krenko?! I’ll definitely be adding the card to my own Krenko deck!

Disrupt Decorum tickled the fancies of another set of Goblin players; Grenzo, Havoc Raiser already loves forcing chaos by making people attack each other with Goad. This spell can basically hit everyone at once and may put you in a position to sweep in for a win, or to just keep the chaos going by constantly hitting people with JUST ENOUGH creatures to keep the War of Goading going! I saved Teferi’s Protection for last because I think it made the biggest splash in the community. For starters, it’s an amazing card. It basically says you get a turn off from being touched, which is awesome on its own. Then you read the card and realize that Wizards printed a NEW card with Phasing on it. We haven’t seen this mechanic for YEARS, so the fact that they’re printing it now may be a hint that we should expect to see it in the future. While I’m loving the card, I’ll be the first person to admit that I don’t fully understand the rules behind Phasing and I’m not super excited to see the mechanic return en masse. However, if this is the only printing of it, I could definitely deal with that!

Wow. Again, this was a really long post and I hope you readers at least enjoyed it! I would love to hear from you on what you think about the new cards, what you think will come of the Wizards tomorrow, what decks you’re planning on putting what cards into, etc.! You can write to me here or find me on Twitter @DM_Cross! Or you can email me at seth.dm.cross@gmail.com! Don’t also forget that you can follow along with the Praetor Magic YouTube channel and follow the channel’s Twitter handle @PraetorMagic! We’re STILL working on our first giveaway, so head over to the channel and SUBSCRIBE and then Tweet out your favorite Magic Online Commander League episode with #MOCL! That’ll give you a chance to win a Blessed vs. Cursed Duel Deck when we hit 50 subscribers, or the second one when we hit 100!

Thanks for reading through everything! I really appreciate the attention I’ve gotten so far. I’m loving these posts and seeing what people think, so definitely reach out to me!

Until next time, folks, that’s all I got for you! Peace, love ya’ll!