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ann-atar · 4 days ago

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Thinking about the subtle presence of the powers that be and/or the Valar in Rings of Power, and having thoughts about what part they might play in the adaptation, specifically what we’ve seen so far, and going over how those powers that be might view Sauron and his actions, and every time I think about him in that context I feel somewhat sympathetic .

However, not too sympathetic, given his repeated offenses, to qualify him for redemption or some kind of blanket amnesty, at least not before many, many ages of serious contrition, and given that Sauron is Sauron, well. Is that likely?

There are a few different threads I’ve seen that try to make a case for TROP being all about ultimate forgiveness for Sauron, while condemning the choices and actions of Galadriel, Adar, Celebrimbor, Mirdania, or anyone who gets in his way because those individuals were short-sighted or needy, or were motivated by ego or weakness, and that the Valar were handwaving Sauron’s actions or even using Sauron as some kind of tool for divine justice(!).

Do we really think the Valar are indifferent to the suffering of elves and dwarves and men, to the point that they would condemn them to be tortured to death based on a bad choice, or a personal weakness, or a common character flaw? I don't think they are quite that severe in their judgement, but I do think, being something akin to gods, their seeming lack of presence could be interpreted as indifference, and more than that I think their actions happen on a much different time scale, so any action they take might take most of an age to show any results. And of course there would be a lot of unfortunate collateral damage in the meanwhile.

But do we seriously think this means that they would allow all of the violence and destruction we’ve seen so far just to give Sauron a second (third, fourth, fifth) chance to choose a better path before he’s subdued, just because he's a Maia and that somehow makes him their special boy?

No, and I think the show has shown us that this is not the case.

I think Sauron blew it when we were shown what happened in the season two flashback, when we saw his first days as “Halbrand”. Because it feels like that was his chance, and everything he's done and will continue to do in upcoming seasons will show him going deeper into whatever passes for insanity in demi-gods, with little or no understanding of the fact that his vision of order for Middle-earth is just as much an abomination as Melkor's path of destruction.

And that’s the compelling tragedy of Sauron.

Sadly that will mean more and worse consequences for the peoples of Middle-earth in the short term. But the Valar are not indifferent to this, and based on what we've seen they know Sauron needs to be dealt with. But what proof is there of that?

Well, they sent the Stranger/Gandalf, an Istari, and he has been explicitly put on a path to confront Sauron.

Think about the timing of him falling to earth: Sauron was on the raft with Galadriel, not long after Diarmid(!) was trying to get through to Sauron in the hold of that ship (and its subsequent destruction with Sauron on board was anything but a coincidence).

Of course Gandalf has free will too, and might make some mistakes. But he is a powerful force, who also has a different perspective and can play by different rules if he chooses, but he isn’t indifferent to the suffering of the Harfoots, and won't be indifferent to any pain Sauron causes the other peoples of Middle-earth.

So we're watching the consequences of Sauron blowing his latest chance play out, and ultimately I think we know we’ll see the realization of the Valar's condemnation of Sauron's choices and actions via Gandalf, the emissary they sent to counter him and muster forces to help subdue him. And I think the rings, all of them, will come into play during that struggle.

There’s a lot of underlying stuff about free will and the fact that power corrupts running through TROP and Tolkien in general. Celebrimbor made the Three with good intentions despite the fact that wanting to make them was also about ego and his legacy, but we can’t deny that the Three did the job he made them for, and we’ve seen them used to do good things. But Celebrimbor and Galdariel and Gil-galad and anyone else who comes in contact with the Three still have free will, and any attendant flaws that come with free will, and ultimately any powerful tool can be used for good or ill, and will inspire different things in characters according to their individual strengths and weaknesses.

But I do think the Three are more benevolent tools than any of the other Rings, with the One that Sauron will forge out of desperation being the ultimate corrupted tool that could influence the others. So Elrond or Galadriel or even Gandalf might have a better chance of using one of the Three for good, for protection and preservation for some length of time, whereas contact with someone like Sauron would change them based on his intentions, and his intentions are about gaining enough power to subjugate, well, everyone. In his hands, for instance, Nenya’s tendency toward protection would quickly decay into more overt stagnation, and just like men were drawn into the shadow realm by the Nine and the One, someone like Sauron with ill intent or a long history of general malevolence would gradually feed that into any one of the Three and reap the consequences.

In other words it’s not all about the sword, but who wields it.

I do wonder if we’ll see the Three become somewhat tied to the One in TROP, and if so how that will play out. Going back to the books, eventually the Three do lose their powers but there’s no indication that they were corrupted to the degree that the potential of any of the rings of power could corrupt or be corrupted.

The Three are powerful, and they are sought after, but they are not the Silmarils.

But would one of the Three heal or help Sauron? No, and getting back to the first part of this post, there are no shortcuts on the path to healing and redemption, and Sauron can't see that path at this point, and more than that he doesn't even know he's lost in the woods.

Quick aside because I just got a rude anon ask on the subject: Yes, I’ve read Silm and the other books and a bunch of other stuff, but I don’t treat the Legendarium as if I’m a supplicant who only accepts a literal interpretation of something Tolkien said in a lecture or a letter as something akin to religious doctrine, and I think he would laugh himself into a fit to see fans trying to contradict each other that way, especially given how he felt about the so-called dominion of the author. And given that TROP is going at Silm etc. buffet-style I don’t think we can talk about the show and expect it to adhere too strictly to every line the poor man ever wrote. This doesn't mean I didn't understand Silm, but I am coming at the adaptation mostly as it's own "thing." I hope that makes sense.

#rings of power #the rings of power #sauron #sauron in rings of power #gandalf #galadriel #celebrimbor #the valar #the valar rings of power #tolkien-meta

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k3yreviewer25 · 1 year ago

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One of my favorite hobbies is thinking about the fucked up implications of this fantasy world map my parents got me for christmas

[Image ID: photo of a map. On the left side of the map is Middle Earth, with the Shire and Mordor labeled. To the direct right of Mordor is Whoville.]

#like realistically what would this world look like?#is sauron just evil because like the grinch he too had to put up with the who's annoying noises?#could a who be corrupted by the ring's power?#it's so much

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galaxyspeaking · 2 months ago

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