#retcon is not a negative term

[werewolf-cuddles]

Okay, so, unlike with Shiver, non-binary Dedf1sh does appear to actually be canon.

They're never referred to as such, but the DLC exclusively refers to them with they/them pronouns. I was unsure if this would actually be the case, given that they were referred to with she/her in earlier lore posts, and Shiver had previously been referred to with they/them in pre-release materials before using she/her in the final game.

Even in the Japanese script, they use the personal pronoun boku, which is typically considered masculine, but is also used for tomboys and people who are non-gender conforming.

So I think we can safely consider this to be a retcon.

[dimension20stuff]

Bitching and moaning under the cut

I really loved a lot of what happened in that episode. Putting aside my complaints about some beloved headcanons becoming canon contradictory (I know that's not really a big deal), Baron now canonically using he/they is just. So disappointing to me.

When Cassandra was she/her in ep one I was bummed, but then they switched to she/they and i was like oh, ok, maybe it's a plot point about reflecting Kristen and Kristen's arc with herself, ok yeah that's cool.

But now Baron, another canonically they/them character is now he/they. And I would LOVE if new characters were introed with multiple pronoun sets, or if established NPCs like Zayn or Tracker or whatever started using he/they or she/they. I would love if we were ADDING rep for neutral & gendered pronoun users, but this just feels like TAKING rep from characters that previously only used gender neutral pronouns....

And I KNOW they aren't major characters and only appeared for a bit but it just feels shitty to me. Like if Garthy's card suddenly had he/they I feel like people would be upset?

And people have mentioned that Baron was called by a number of pronouns in SY but i think that was a product of not stating the pronouns to the players in game. When the players in The Seven he/him'ed Baron Brennan corrected them. Garthy had a similar problem where players slipped up often but no one ever questions their pronouns or says "Garthy uses he and they".

And maybe I just missed it, but has ANYONE used gender neutral language for Cassandra since like the beginning of ep 1? It feels like the gendered pronouns were added just to make things easier, rather than because of actual change in the character.

I'm a multi pronoun user myself, like normally I would like the rep. But the fact that we are taking away characters that use they/them and not adding ANY new ones as far as I can tell (barring like the Thistlesprings but I don't think that's a very good faith argument) just stings. I'd rather the players accidentally use the wrong pronouns every once and a while than try to make it so if they do slip up it's ok because that's an acceptable pronoun for the character now.

[xbomboi]

i wonder if people actually realize that darling and dexter being twins was a retcon

if it were up to me, they’d have always been presented as twins from the start, because that’s just way better imo, but i’m not CEO of Mattel so it’s NOT up to me and we have this weird inconsistency.

i mean, first of all, the start of the tv series already includes that weird period of time where darling just straight up Does Not Exist because at the end of the day this is just an extended toy commercial and there wasn’t any toy to advertise yet.

when darling WAS, however, introduced into the show, she strangely interacts with DARING more than she ever does dexter, despite her closeness to the latter that’s established as early on as her doll’s diary. my personal guess as to why that is has to do from the show capitalizing heavily on darling’s princess charming gimmick of being a girl who’s a knight, and as a result, benefited from portraying the fact that she and daring are, in a way, foils to each other.

anyway, when darling’s doll released, her bio listed her birthday as November 16th. dexter’s birthday had already been established as the 11th of February, so at this time, darling was not intended to be his twin.

and we can see this further shown by the word choice in darling’s diary. she refers to daring as her “oldest brother” and then goes on to refer to dexter as her “older brother”. which, sure, a twin can be older than the other, but in her doll diary, she’s gonna call him her twin if they want us to know that they’re twins.

i’m not sure exactly when the earliest instance of any official media referring to darling and dexter as twins was, but if my memory serves me correctly, i believe it was a post from the official Facebook that had stated they were twins. again, don’t quote me on that.

this discrepancy is important to me as someone who has to constantly fact check lore and timeline of events, because it very much so impacted Ever After High media released prior to the twin retcon’s ability to hold up. as far as I can remember, a good amount of the books were written under the initial status of darling’s birthday falling on 11/16 rather than 2/11 with dexter, the Susanne Selfors books coming to mind in particular. but i could be wrong, because i’m not going to reread all of those books just for this post.

the updated birthday for darling ended up being the one they stuck with. a brief scroll on the official Ever After High Instagram page will show as much, with birthday posts for dexter & darling on the same day. there is the tidbit of information that dexter is still older by a few seconds (not sure if this was ever officially stated, i’m only going off of the wiki for this one detail), but i honestly think that’s only included as a way to try and rectify the past instances of darling or possibly anyone else referring to dexter as her older brother.

as of today, it seems like everyone understands darling and dexter to be twins, and if they are familiar with the past retcon, they prefer the twin change and are glad it was made. i’ve never witnessed anyone say anything like “ugh, i really wish they wouldn’t have made darling dexter’s twin and kept her younger!!”.

still, it’s interesting that it happened. i call it what it is: a retcon. and most people hear that term and associate it with negativity. which, to be fair, in terms of writing, it more often than not absolutely is. but in this isolated case, despite it making some of the supplementary pieces of media for the series confusing (though the show and books/diaries take place in a different continuity anyway), i see this as a good thing. right off the bat, it makes less sense to me that the Charmings would intentionally go on to have not just one but two other children individually after daring with him being the successful golden child they wanted. it makes more sense that they decided to have one other child just for the hell of it and happened to end up with two.

also, and i don’t have the source for this so i’m just going based off of memory, apparently the grade-level cut off isn’t in the fall in the Ever After High universe, because daring, dexter, and darling are all intended to be in the same grade according to what i believe was one of the writers or producers or something of the sort for the tv show. and i make that conclusion about the cutoff not being in the fall because daring’s birthday is April 2nd, and since he’s older than dexter & darling, they’d have been born in February of the following year, meaning in order for them to be in the same grade together, the grade level cut off couldn’t fall anywhere within the roughly nine months gap between April to the next February. which, if you’ve done the math, you’ll have realized must mean that either the cut off for the next grade either falls sometime late February anywhere after the 11th, is on the 1st of April, or is any day in the month of March.

darling being in the same grade as daring and not a grade (or two) below also makes daring and rosabella work considering that, being her roommate, rosabella would be in whatever grade darling is in, and were she to be anymore than a grade below daring, there’d be a questionable age gap. not to mention with darling herself and apple. jesus. so it’s definitely a positive that’s not the case. and to anyone who may have been confused before, this is also why dexter can room with a character like hunter, because he too is in the same grade.

or maybe this is a show for babies and nothing matters.

[spiderpussinc]

are the 2099 comics THAT bad in terms of racism plus other weird writing choices??? i'm starved for miguel content and would like to read the original comic run but i keep seeing the debate of the original comics being problematic and/or downright just BAD bad (not to mention miguel is supposed to have mexican heritage but he's straight up a white redhead lol)

Some people may disagree but speaking as a latinx writer; it's bad because it is racist, yes! On multiple fronts!! And beyond that, it's also bad as a complete failure of comics structure and compelling narrative.

Longpost, on readmore;

I say this as a long-time capeshit reader, as politely as possible: Miguel's comics are a *paycheck* book. As in; a series a writer does monthly to be paid for it, but with middling aspirations and downright negative characterization depending on where their mood is.

The first few issues of his 1992 run are relatively complete and well-balanced, may even trick you into thinking this story is going somewhere; but that's only because they're the /character pitch./ Ill skip to the end and tell you upfront. That 1992 series ends with the implosion of the whole "2099" line of comics (an universe that included other books, like ghost rider, doom, etc, by other writers) due to dwindling public interest and mass cancellations. The end of that run is basically meaningless, since the whole thing got retconned - and even before that a guest writer had came in and made mistaken character reveals pdavid wasnt happy with and wanted to erase before the finale. The event book that wrapped up that universe was unironically, literally called -- "2099: Manifest Destiny."

Now, I don't like Peter David's writing. I think he's obsessed with the idea of building harems out of his female characters (when he's not fridging them, or making them act ~crazy~ to further alienate them from the protagonist) and it is the kind of grueling, joyless reading experience I can only describe as making you feel Oily Inside. This goes as far as multiple stalking plotlines, the inclusion of a guest appearance from AU s/x slaver Hulk in later years, Miguel's mother being strongly implied to have been forced into conceiving him by his real dad who's the evil CEO of alchemax, general torture painporn. His broader supporting cast is so interchangeable and disposable that they were literally disposed of.

In terms of the racism; I have mentioned how he uses cultures as tokens and does 0 research whatsoever. The way it feels and the way it is deployed is through a lens of Exoticism - tourism. Miguels suit is allegedly "a dia de los muertos costume" b/c pdavid seems to think that holiday is mexican halloween. In the orig book, you'll see plenty of broken japanese and stereotypical orientalist caricatures - after killing his first love interest, pdavid introduces a japanese girl who is unironically, literally named "Xina" (that pretends to be chinese on occasion) to fill in the vacant role. Miguel himself falls right into all the usual latino stereotypes — short tempered, drug addict, sex magnet "latin lover" (this last one also applied to his brother Gabriel, who for the longest time is characterized by just Going Through A Lot Of Girlfriends). And it's kind of insane bc he's still being drawn as a deeply deeply white man, but not even that takes off the burden of the racial microagressions!!! They're the only times pdavid seems to remember that heritage! Then there's the commemorative hanging page. Since you mention the redheadedness; thats another insane thing to me. He has 0% of irish in him. His dad is Blond. Who is this man?

Most of the info in the 2099 run is either revealed to be a lie midway thru (miguel is not mr o'hara's son, nor addicted to rapture) or completely retconned away to be rewritten in new runs. Different writers have tried to come in and do miguel in other team/event books but frankly nothing stands out and most of them get marked as alternate-miguels. Unfortunately, every time marvel decided to give another shot at spider-man 2099 they also brought pdavid back. The newer books were never a success, and theyre just as filled w/ the garbage i mentioned earlier (wow! Steampunk spider-woman is given to pdavid for *ONE* issue and instantly tonguekisses gabriel before leaving, so novel. More fridging ensues. Stalking. Etc.) 2099 as an *universe* has been retconned so many times Nothing is consistent and Nothing is set on stone and frankly i think they should make it an AU separate from main canon and build a whole new world already.

The art in the 2015 + runs consists mostly of tracing, and more of that oily weird feeling applied to fem chars. Perhaps you have noticed in this entire hate review have never once spoken about Miguel's heroic plots and memorable villains --- he has none. At least nothing I can remember or distinguish. (Interchangeable, disposable, etc) There is a vague inkling of "this is an anti-stabilishment spiderman, he fights against The Public Eye, the Corporation Cops!" at the start but much like his cultural illiteracy pdavid has no real insightful politics commentary, so that dissolves into the background in time. Its all buzzwords. All of his plotlines are solved in circuitous or soap operaish extradrama ways; and while some of this is present in other superhero comics, what stands out to me MOST is how utterly fucking joyless Miguel's comics are. It's like going through a slog on obligation. They genuinely gave me a headache every time.

ATSV does a great job of reinventing Miguel and rebuilding the parts of him that showed real promise. Being a different tone-swapped spiderman, futuristic, being more on the tech-science side of crime fighting. Him being a single dad with a daughter is also new. (And he is single! There is no singular mention of marriage or a wife anywhere, he's a geneticist, multiple spider-men we see in this movie were literal clones made in tubes - i am fond of the idea he's a transmasc dad but even if you think he's cis he could have made that baby himself. Adoption is also always there.) I think its very clear ATSV didn't want to bring any of pdavids major weird shit w fem chars to the big screen on the hopes that miguel gets rebooted eventually. I think he's gay. Nobody can prove me wrong.

On that note, Steve Orlando (queer writer, also wrote for DC's midnighter/apollo) did some of the latest 2022/2023 Miguel miniseries. Another reboot! Those were "2099: Exodus" and "Spider-man 2099: Dark Genesis" - i think its campier/trying to tackle superhero plots more head on and trying to do something wide wacky cast focused at Marvel's personal request, but Miguel's future is very up in the air rn. I do really hope they reboot him into something closer to ATSV with latines at the center soon.

What I always reccomend for people curious abt miguel: read his first 3ish 1992 issues, get a general feel and close the book as soon as you feel annoyed. It won't get better. Remember none of it is canon nor has been relevant in over two decades. If you want to know the wider context of his messy chronology, check out some of the 2099 "all comics" type of youtube videos, theres some pretty easy to digest summarizations if u dont wanna waste ur time reading stuff that just got retconned again lol. Most writers now are operating on vibes and that is a freedom you should also allow yourself in your own fanwork.

Putting his panels out of context can be very funny though. (For further curiosity or tangents, there's always my meta tag)

[the-violet-galaxy]

~Sigh~

I tried to hold off on talking about a negative opinion, but today's episode was kinda a straw that broke the camel's back for me, and I gotta say something.

I hate that the Show is legitimately making New Moon inferior to Old Moon. This isn't even an opinion anymore, it's basically canon -- the way they've written it, Old Moon is genuinely better than New Moon in every single way, from brains to morality.

Old Moon is much smarter, more intelligent and cunning, his technological skills are SO much better than Nexus's. Moon looks at everything Nexus has ever built and LAUGHS at it and mocks him and calls him a bad builder -- there isn't a single thing he's impressed by, or even one kind of technology that New Moon is matched with him in skills at or slightly better at. (And the other characters tacitly agree, especially Sun.) He's also more cunning because in one swoop he snagged Ruin's signature to find his spaceship, and is schooling Ruin in terms of making a deal with him -- something New Moon was not capable of doing.

This is especially egregious because of the episode "A Talk With Past Moon." (This episode has noticeable bad retcons. In recent episodes, Old Moon says he received none of New Moon's memories or information. But during "A Talk With Past Moon" he knew EVERYTHING that had happened during New Moon's life, and referenced a lot of it. In recent episodes they go too hard with the gag of Old Moon not knowing anything that had happened in the past year, which is annoying because in A Talk With Past Moon he KNEW everything that had happened.) So during A Talk With Past Moon, Old Moon knew everything about New Moon's life, and thus knew about the things New Moon had built, his technological capabilities, and how smart New Moon was when dealing with enemies. And in that video, Old Moon says to New Moon: "Oh by the way! You've never been Inferior, you've been holding yourself back out of fear." Old Moon meant that when he said it. Therefor, this shows that Old Moon viewed New Moon is smart -- he considered him as smart as himself, or smarter in his own ways....

...But in recent episodes he's literally using the word "inferior", calling him stupid, a bad builder -- treating New Moon like a limp noodly punching bag.

New Moon isn't stupid. But the Show is now written so that it's canon he was stupid.

AND THEN, all the projects that New Moon was involved in, Old Moon sweeps in and is solving them instantly. New Moon isn't even allowed to keep the wins he DID achieve. OLD MOON is fixing Dazzle's broken body after one glance where New Moon couldn't do it in weeks. He's throwing everything New Moon built into the trash or calling it all badly designed.

They couldn't even let New Moon have an easy win/throw him a bone: When Old Moon looked at New Moon's garage lab, he sees the slot machines and starts mocks them; Sun suggests "maybe he converted them to look inconspicuous, so it'd be hidden...?" and Moon replies "No, I can tell they're just slot machines." Really......??? Why couldn't they have given New Moon this ONE win? Old Moon could have looked around and been like "Ah! All this stuff looks like it's just a normal garage, but there's a TON of hidden tech in here. Not bad, not bad." New Moon couldn't just have that?? It has to be another moment for Old Moon to go "incompetent, incompetent, an incompetent version of me......"

The straw was in today's episode where Moon talked to Nexus. Moon spends the whole time laughing at Nexus. There isn't a single moment where he feels attentive or like he's on alert from a threat. And later when Moon talks to Sun, he's dismissive of Nexus and says "ehhhh I think he's trying to match wits with me. Didn't turn out well for him." My guys, if Nexus IS GOING to be a villain (godIhatethisplot), then why can't Nexus, like... actually HAVE something?? Like why can't Old Moon sound just a little bit concerned with the idea that they have a new threat?? Cuz if no one is intimidated by him, why should we the audience worry about him? (Especially since the Show has made Old Moon the infinitely superior Moon. Since we're shown New Moon was SOOOOOO incompetent, then who is even worried? We know Old Moon is gonna spank Nexus like a toddler when they meet.)

What I'm getting at is I hate that New Moon is written to be stupid. Because he's not stupid. It's like they retconned his brains, his own skills, and his own accomplishments away. It isn't fair that they've written him to be stupid and dumb and laughable in the face of Old Moon's impeccable unbeatable genius.

New Moon shouldn't be put down so much just to prop Old Moon up.

(One idea that scares me is they might do something with this and New Moon's arc of "you DON'T have a legacy and don't need to live up to Old Moon!" and by the end Nexus will use this all as a learning experience where he'll be okay not being as smart as his past self. Now to be clear, New Moon DOESN'T need to compare himself to Old Moon, and he never needed to prove himself, this is true. However, when the arc is set up this way to where New Moon is written to be SO LAUGHABLY WORSE than Old Moon, and Old Moon is laughing in his face, then I have a problem with the idea New Moon could just have to lay down and say "yep that's correct, you're factully smarter than I ever could be! And I'm fine with that" after Old Moon insulted everything about him.)

This arc exhausts me, guys. I tried to find things to keep positive about with this arc but I can't. I'm not even a person who thinks Nexus was treated overly bad by his family (he made choices, he gets consequences, at the same time he was manipulated so if he put in the work he could come back), but the WRITING that paints him as canonically stupid almost feels like reading a hatefic at this point. I genuinely did not want Old Moon to come back, period. I love New Moon more than Old Moon and I don't want New Moon to be permanently lost in his Nexus identity. (I'll cut up a part 2 to explain why Old Moon coming back messed up New Moon's arc.)

[umalvie]

what iroh should have been, and how it would've impacted zuko and azula's arcs

in terms of canon atla, aside from my criticisms of the orientalism woven into the show's fabric, its pattern of telling not showing, the tumor-like presence of filler episodes that don't do enough as character studies or dynamic studies (mostly in book 3; in book 1 i'm more forgiving of these since atla was still finding its groove), and my issues with zuko's redemption arc not challenging his political beliefs in a meaningful way, the thing that i would consider its biggest failure writing-wise is the fact that iroh is not intentionally portrayed as a morally gray character.

the thing about iroh is that he is a longtime war criminal. they try to soft retcon some of that in book 3 by making his nickname "the dragon of the west" about him pretending to have hunted the dragons into extinction and by making him a part of the white lotus, but this to me is not only grievously boring but also a waste of his character.

i understand why the idea of iroh as little more than zuko's loving, wise, and kooky uncle makes people happy. it means zuko gets to have a father figure who loves him unconditionally and makes him feel safe. that's a lovely concept! but not a very interesting one in terms of the narrative, nor is it one congruent with iroh's initial characterization.

think of the absolute contempt and terror he struck into those earthbenders who tried to arrest him in book 1. think of the fact that he besieged ba sing se for 600 days straight well into his adulthood (his age is unclear, but i'd presume he's somewhere in his mid to late 50s throughout atla, so he would at youngest in his 40s when he lead the siege of ba sing se). think of the fact that iroh only changed his mind about his very active part in the war as a grown man once his son was killed. think of the fact that iroh spent 3 years with zuko in exile without ever once actively making a real effort to help zuko unlearn the fire nation propaganda he was indoctrinated with from birth or to truly help him understand that ozai abused him. think of the fact that the white lotus didn't really do much of anything throughout the war to end it.

what picture do these facts paint? is it really that of a reformed war criminal? no, not really.

iroh loves zuko unconditionally. he is patient and kind and loving with zuko. i don't think there's much, if any, room to argue with that. i am not denying that to zuko, iroh is a loving, wise, and kooky uncle.

however, i am saying that iroh is multifaceted. he is zuko's loving, wise, and kooky uncle, and he is also a war criminal who, despite the show telling us has reformed his ways, is not shown to have done so in any meaningful way. he does not do much to help zuko to unlearn imperialist propaganda, does not do much to discourage zuko from trying to capture the avatar, and does not do much at all to end the war.

this makes for an incredibly interesting and dynamic character! this is a character who believes that his personal kindness absolves him of his heinous political misdeeds. that is why he does not do anything meaningful to challenge imperialism where he sees it. that is why he is also a kind, loving man. he's hugely flawed, but he also has virtues that make you want him to overcome his flaws! there is so much room for him to develop whether it's negatively or positively, and there is so much that can be done with the relationships he has, especially his relationship with zuko! furthermore, this is the summation of what the canon material overall most strongly presents us with.

but it's not how the narrative wants us to view iroh, so it's not how the narrative treats him.

instead, we are told that iroh is a reformed war criminal (and later even the notion that he was in the wrong for his military service to the fire nation is soft retconned) who is now nothing but a loving and supportive uncle to zuko. he's unfailingly kind to both zuko and the gaang, ty lee lets slip that she actually rather likes him despite azula's contempt of him to show us that ty lee is an antivillain who will be redeemed (despite her political beliefs never being actually challenged in a meaningful way), and really the only people iroh is unkind to or who dislike him are azula and ozai to highlight to the audience that they are villains.

this makes for an incredibly static character who essentially only exists to love zuko and act as his moral tether despite the fact that iroh never actually challenges zuko's political beliefs. iroh does not need to grow or develop within the narrative atla tells us exists. he has already done his self-reflection and repented for his behavior. he is a figure of moral authority. while this makes him feel safe and good to viewers who accept what atla tells them without question, in addition to not aligning with what's actually shown, it also makes him insanely bland from a narrative perspective.

but what if atla intentionally portrayed him as morally gray? what if they leaned into his shortcomings?

here's the thing about if iroh is intentionally portrayed as morally gray: zuko's redemption arc improves drastically, and azula's is given a much better opportunity to begin.

hear me out. if iroh is morally gray, then he is not solely there to show zuko what real, unconditional love looks like so that zuko can replace his abusive father with a loving father figure, giving him the strength to do the right thing and join the gaang. i'm not saying iroh no longer serves this function in the narrative; i'm saying that now that iroh does this, and his failure to meaningfully repent for his war crimes and to challenge imperialism creates conflict with zuko. you see, if iroh is morally gray, then his failure to challenge zuko's political beliefs (i.e. imperialism is good) is something that zuko is forced to reckon with throughout his redemption arc.

this would mean that zuko is finally actually challenged in his political beliefs as opposed to simply accepting that people are afraid of him because he is a destructive firebender/the prince and thus representative of the harm they have endured throughout the war. furthermore, it means that zuko has to go against a father figure who has treated him well, so his redemption is no longer a matter rooted in kindness but in moral conviction. zuko doesn't have to lose his love for iroh to do this; in fact, that would be a very boring way to portray this. it is far more interesting if zuko has the internal conflict of both loving his uncle and condemning him politically as he struggles to do the right thing in spite of that love.

the idea of zuko managing to grow beyond iroh and do the right thing even though it is hard, even though it means not only going against ozai's malice but also iroh's complicty, is one that would round zuko's arc out better.

it's also one that would open up the gates for an azula redemption arc a lot more than what canon does (although canon azula is still redeemable).

if zuko outgrows iroh enough to challenge his inaction, then he has outgrown iroh enough to start to really see his flaws.

one of zuko's main flaws in canon is that he has a very black and white way of thinking. this is a hugely defining flaw for him. it's why he struggled to accept that ozai abused him, why he struggled to see that his pursuit of the avatar and thus the war as a whole was wrong, why he got physically ill when he was confronted with the fact that he was harming people, etc.

but if zuko starts to see that iroh's inaction as a flaw despite the fact that iroh loves him so sincerely and is so kind to most everyone, then he can start to break this black and white thinking. like ozai, iroh is no longer on a pedestal in zuko's mind. this would lead to the unearthing of more of iroh's flaws.

in conjunction with the fact that zuko has now seen proof of azula's pain (her psychotic break in the last agni kai), this means that zuko can start to place blame where it's due with people over her pain.

i am under no delusions about the state of zuko's relationship with azula in canon. i've expanded on my thoughts about the love between them here if you'd like to see them, but i can sum it up as so: while azula cares about zuko in her own deeply screwed up way, zuko doesn't really care about azula because he is shortsighted and struggles to empathize with her or even see a need to.

however, seeing proof that azula has been harmed too means that zuko would finally see a reason she is worthy of his empathy. the first, most obvious, and easiest to identify (for zuko) perpetrator is, of course, ozai. like with the war, ozai is clearly malicious. now that zuko has admitted and accepted that his father was abusive to him, it is much easier for him to admit that their father is responsible for azula's pain too. this much i believe is likely in canon as well.

the next person for zuko to look to, which can only happen if zuko has opened his eyes, is iroh. like with the war post 600 day siege, iroh was not malicious in his treatment of azula, but he was still complicit. iroh may not have abused azula, but he did neglect her entirely. he did not give her a chance to ever be anything but what ozai told her she should be. he did not show her love and compassion the way he did zuko. furthermore, he not only failed to encourage zuko to ever try doing so, he actively discouraged him from attempting to.

to be clear: i don't think zuko should be a mentor figure to azula during her redemption. like azula, he's just a kid. he's still growing and learning himself. he also doesn't really understand her at all, even if he has realized that she was hurt too. he doesn't understand how she was, and he's going to have to spend a lot of time reconciling the way their father's abuse colored his perception of her with how she actually is. furthermore, their relationship is complicated and full of pain for them both, so relying too heavily on it to help azula recover and redeem herself would end badly if we're being realistic.

but zuko seeing that azula was abused by their father and seeing that their uncle's failure to ever give her a chance to understand real love is crucial to him realizing that the asylum is not somewhere that gives her a real shot at recovery and redemption.

whether or not azula takes that shot when it's given to her is a more complicated story that would involve both zuko and azula having to reflect more wholly and honestly on ursa than i think either of them ever have before as well as some likely very painful conversations challenging the way she, like all other fire nation citizens, was indoctrinated, but do you see how interesting treating iroh as the morally gray character he is could be?

even if you don't want to see a redeemed azula (i personally do, but the possibility of her rejecting the idea of redemption is also quite fascinating and tragic in this context), zuko's arc and the commentary made about redemption and second chances overall are made so much more interesting and nuanced by this simple choice.

[shihalyfie]

There's something bugging me since I saw a statement from Producer Shimomura in a Spanish interview being linked to Rui's page (and consequently, the Chosen Child's page) on a wiki about a question which was "Rui is way younger than Maki and Daigo who're the first Chosen. How so?" My assumption of that question was like "the interviewer was assuming things (thanks to the fact now everyone who sees the mentioned Five Previous Chosen from Adv'99 as Maki and Daigo's team thanks to ▽) and is not well aware of the math lore",

But then... Shimomura's answer was like "Oh this is new for me too. Anyway Rui is not exactly a Chosen Child and is more likely a special and unique case" which is basically contradicted by everything 02TB-related as well -- interviews, promotional stuff, etc.

(also the interviewer misquote Rui's statements in-movie, since Rui was not even aware of that term and the ones to claim he was indeed the first there were the 02 kids.)

I've been talking with a friend about this quite recently and i'm confused now... What does that whole question even MEAN what's up with that answer!?

(I hope this is not ▽ negative tho, because i do love Maki-Daigo and i want them to coexist with Rui, i'm trying to make them WORK with the lore... Even by soft-retconning a few details of them orz)

Yeah, so about that...I apologize for the language, but this is one of those rare occasions where you just have to flat-out discard an official statement as bullshit. Shimomura's answer doesn't make sense by any kind of logic whatsoever:

In Adventure continuity, being a "Chosen Child" has an extremely loose definition (which is even acknowledged in Two-and-a-Half Year Break). The only consistent definition of a Chosen, and the one thing that distinguishes cases like Oikawa, Hiroki, and Hikari and Taichi in 1995 from kids who can actually be called Chosen, is that Chosen Children have Digivices (i.e. them being "chosen" is not for anything specific, but being formalized with a Digivice means they now have a responsibility). So by definition, as a kid who was sent a Digimon and a Digivice by some entity, Rui is a Chosen. There's no good argument for him to not be a Chosen.

And of course, even if in the movie they didn't claim that Rui was the first Chosen with that exact wording, basically every bit of promotional and advertising material and member of staff has referred to him as the first Chosen. Like this isn't a "Menoa says that Digimon disappear because they became adults" situation where the advertising would have this "they learn from Menoa that..." indirect tone about it; everyone else has been completely unambiguous about the fact Rui is meant to be taken as the first Chosen. Otherwise, why would they make such a big deal about picking that specific year for Rui to meet Ukkomon, or, hell, what's the point of naming the movie "The Beginning"? That would arguably make advertising the movie as being about the first Chosen into advertising fraud or something.

This is a response to a question asking how Himekawa and Nishijima would be Chosen if Rui was the first Chosen Child, because the contradiction makes this not make sense. But even if you take Shimomura's idea of Rui being the "first one to form a partner relationship with a Digimon", that still doesn't explain anything nor does it resolve the contradiction because Himekawa and Nishijima also clearly had partner relationships with their Digimon in their childhoods too. Like again, it's practically advertising fraud if Rui isn't the first something.

As for why Shimomura would say something like this, the whole "this is new to me too" already hints at the idea she wasn't very well-informed about this issue or series Deepest Lore (in particular, it's pretty likely she didn't know much about tri., given she was two producers ahead of it, and her article series on Digimon Partners suggests she's pretty new to Digimon production as a whole). So I doubt this answer was very well-thought through, especially since everyone else involved in the movie has been pretty clear about being timeline-precise.

The other likely reason is that, when you think about it, this question is inherently an unsolvable trap for a producer like her. If you know the actual Digimon Adventure series production timeline, tri. was unilaterally the one that went off-kilter here; Adventure lore alone dictates that you can't have Chosen before 1995, so there is a correct answer here, and it's simply that tri. messed up and that going back to original Adventure canon for Kizuna and 02TB required throwing a lot of it out. This has generally been the implicit stance that's been taken since even back during Kizuna; most glaringly, tri. was just flat-out omitted in an official timeline, which has to carry some meaning because one does not just accidentally omit a series that was advertised as an Adventure sequel and was basically the core of the franchise for five real-life years.

I don't get the impression it's "tri. isn't canon anymore" as much as it's "we have to ignore so many substantial details of tri. that it may not be correct to call it the same thing anymore," which is consistent with the way "canon" has been loosely treated in the franchise in general. But the thing is, the reason why they're being implicit about it instead of saying it all-out is that, yeah, if they say it in explicit words, that's going to piss off everyone who's going to see that as five years being tossed down the drain, let alone tri. fans who will basically see their favorite being spit on in public. (If you ask me, I don't see "messing up lore points" as having inherent ties to writing quality, and I don't think the creators do either, but lore can be Serious Business to Japanese fans, so officially saying that something violates lore can easily be taken as public shaming; even the few times they've brought up lore contradictions have gotten people mad in some way.)

So while I definitely wish she'd have given an answer that was less obviously bullshit, Shimomura did kind of have to give a bullshit answer in order to not piss someone off, since her job as a producer is less about the creative writing and more about juggling the interests of the movie as a whole. This also wouldn't be our first instance of this kind of situation; it's generally been hinted by staff members that Seki's claim of every version of Akiyama Ryou being the same character was also something she was forced to say in order to not have to say something like "yeah the WonderSwan games aren't canon actually" (which would piss off their fans and Bandai).

[oacest]

I never got why at some points they'd say they Never Really got along nor did stuff with each other, when there are also multiple stories abt them hanging out and having fun together like the anecdotes with the Maroon 5 and Depeche Mode dudes, hell I remember an old Morrissey documentary where there's a clip of them backstage after a Moz concert, they obviously used to see each other for more than just business and tour purposes up 'til like 2007 so the constant retconning abt it is so ??? to me

yeah, this is an incredibly eyeroll-worthy tendency of theirs, and I think there are a myriad of reasons for it, even if you set aside the They Are Compulsive Liars With Deep-Fried Brains aspect of it all

for one, they are sensitive and easily wounded creatures that have always cemented the Bad times into their long-term memories and disregarded the good times like they never happened. think about how, for example, one negative comment holds the power of a hundred positive ones — it’s like that. for them, it would’ve taken an insane amount of good times to negate the damage done by one nasty fight

on top of that, they have this batshit way of committing to particular narratives including both how things “are” and how they think things should be. their various ~traumas gave them a misguided idea of what a happy and functional family dynamic should be and so, besieged by typical sibling rivalry, they baked “we don’t get along” into the core of the way they define their relationship whether it’s true or not. it meant that the good times were never enough and didn’t Count, and the bad times added up to a mountain of proof that they don’t get along and never have

finally, they are allergic to and terrified of vulnerability which means they can neither admit when they like each others’ company (too exposing! too revealing! too much opportunity for disappointment!) nor admit that the bad times result in painful longstanding wounds (they’re not hurt, you see, because that’s just How They Are and they both know that! all good nothing to see here!)

throw in liam being a bottomless well for love and validation and noel being the most stubborn man who has ever lived, and that’s a recipe for two people who are going to insist they don’t get along for the rest of their days

anyway hope they have fun on tour! lmao

[mimble-sparklepudding]

Little OC Creation Ask List

I am trying to help a friend with their creative block around creating a FFXIV OC. So I thought I might try putting together a quick Ask List on the topic and maybe they would find people's responses helpful. Also it might be interesting to learn about how people approach the creative process!

How did you decide on the sex and/or gender of your OC? Was it important that it was the same as yours? Or the same as what you personally find attractive? Or did it not make much difference either way?

To what degree is your OC a self-insert? Are they in any way an aspirational version of yourself? Or perhaps a way to explore feelings and behaviours you suppress in yourself?

Is it important to you that you "like" your OC (as in consider them likeable)? Or is it more important to create a distinctive character, even if they are unpleasant or evil?

Do what degree did you intend your OC to be canon-compliant? Did you end up sticking to this or did you veer off into unforeseen territory over time?

How important is it to you that your OC is attractive? Does that mean attractive to you personally (sexually or just for purposes of playing dress-up!)? Or do you aim to make an OC over which others will inevitably thirst?

To what degree do you use the OC creation process as a way of exploring your own strengths and flaws?

Is your OC based upon another character or person? Or aspects of several? Is this just in terms of their appearance? Or also their personality?

Do you create the OC first and then the backstory? Or do you have a backstory lined up and then create an OC that will fit this?

Have you ever retconned your OC's story or situation? What inspired this? Did you just fancy a change? Or were you bored with them as they were? Or did you regret your decisions on first creating them?

To what extent does your OC function as a mouthpiece for your own views when it comes to describing their opinions or reactions? Do you quite like exploring how someone with very different values to your own might respond to a situation?

What is your main focus when creating an OC - making a character for yourself and your own enjoyment? Or do you try to create a character that will be popular with others or attract a lot of attention?

How much importance do you attach to humour when creating a character? Are there inevitably comic elements? Or are you more focused upon angst or drama?

Does your OC need to be believable (within the context of the fictional world in which you place them)? Or are you more interested in pushing the boundaries of what you can invent?

How do you want other people to view or react to your OC?

Is there anything you regret about how you designed your OC or their backstory?

Do you have the same OC (broadly speaking) across multiple fandoms or settings?

Did you design your OC with a specific aspect of RP in mind? Such as shipping, NSFW things, attending in-game social events, hosting events or entertaining others?

Has anyone ever reacted badly to your OC? Why was this?

Do you want other people to become invested in your OC? What would this look like ideally?

Is it important to ensure your OC has flaws or negative traits? Or do you try to make an idealised character as far as possible?

Do you want or enjoy your OC having in-game interactions with other people's characters? Or do you prefer to keep things more distant (like Ask Games on Tumblr!)? Or is your OC private and just for you?

How do you feel about others making art of your OC or writing about them? Do you feel like you need to vet their creative process? Or does anything go?

Was there a location in-game that inspired your OC (like Ishgard or Hingashi etc.)?

Was there something in the MSQ or even a side-questline, that inspired you to create them? Perhaps meeting the Sylphs or the Namazu? Or visiting the Unsundered World? Or even something to do with crafting or gathering?

To what extent does their appearance in game match your vision of them creatively? Are there things you wish you could change about them in this regard? Or possibly do, if you knew of a way to do so...

Do you have a voice claim for your OC? Did you have this before you did anything else? Or did you decide on it later?

Which OCs that are not yours do you most admire? What is it about that character that you find impressive or engaging?

To what extent have other people's OC influenced your own? Perhaps in the sense of inspiring your ideas? Or giving you "permission" to create a character you might not otherwise have done? Perhaps a lore-breaking one, or an overtly sexy one, or a self-insert, or a villainous one etc?

What do you try to avoid when creating an OC? Are these things you dislike in other people's OCs? Or purely your own personal preference?

What is your favourite thing about your OC or OCs? Is there something about them of which you are particularly proud?

To what extent does it matter that you are being "original" when you create an OC? Or is it OK to base them on an existing character or celebrity, so long as you enjoy it?

If you're stuck for ideas when creating an OC, what do you do to inspire yourself? (if you never have this problem, then what would you advise to someone that did!)

Is there an OC you would love to create in-game, but currently you are unable to do so, perhaps because that race is not playable or that sex is unavailable (hello female Hrothgar)?

How many OCs do you currently have? If you have multiple OCs then how different are they from each other? How often do you create new ones?

What things do you most want to see in someone's OC? Or what do you always find the most interesting? Or stimulating, if you're in that sort of mood?

[aotopmha]

Being too exhausted to play has made me think about the Dawntrail story again.

I wanted to take a break, but it occupies my brain too much, turns out and I engaged with takes on the internet again.

(Some of it is really dumb and a negativity void with zero substance, which is, in fact, unfun and exhausting, as it is designed to be, so it probably is better to not engage with, but I also do very much enjoy discussing what I love and it offers fantastic springboards for that.)

Spoilers for the Dawntrail story!

You know the complaint that it's "not as good as Shadowbringers or Endwalker"?

Well, I think a lot of people have actually echoed this, but I really like that Dawntrail is not trying to one-up them.

It's really good that it's not only pulling back the scale, but also lightening up the tone.

In particular, there was a complaint I saw that said HW, ShB and EW were these "deep and dark" stories and had issues with DT not being that kind of narrative and I think a story being Endwalker all of the time would become boring in its own right.

If all you see is positivity, eventually it means nothing, but this is also true in the opposite sense.

If all you see is misery all of the time, at one point, it doesn't mean anything anymore.

Eventhough I myself mostly enjoyed it, I can see the argument that it went too far in the other direction and handled some ideas too simplistically, but I think the general idea to do this is a really good, refreshing move.

It's similar thematically (which is actually my biggest issue), but I really like that it mostly focused on new stories with new characters.

I also like that the Scions are taking a backseat.

I saw an opinion that "you can't have your cake and eat it, too" in regards of the Scions being minor roles and you should either write them out completely or entirely focus the story on them, but personally I don't see any issue with this.

They were set up to be support and behaved as such. I don't understand the take that they were "teased" too much when the setup was that it was not their story to begin with.

Now, I do think the friendly rivalry aspect was underutilised. I feel like getting to fight Thancred and Urianger in good fun would've been great, for example.

I love the vibe of adventure we haven't really had for such a long time, and I really think the mystery of the City of Gold might be one of the best ones in the entire narrative because many of the mysteries so far at least have some aspect of retconning to them.

The gate and everything with it is entirely new and didn't need any retconning to fit within the current concepts of the story, whereas you could always tell they had to slightly tweak everything with the Ascians once in a while.

I think the fact that most of the characters that people do like from this expansion are entirely new or characters we knew fairly little about before Dawntrail says it all.

People actually do want new stuff. I think the mostly positive response towards the actual gameplay content says this, too.

So I hope they don't give up on what they've built here despite some of the really loud negative voices.

Don't start trying to do Endwalker or Shadowbringers again before building a new bigger picture.

We've talked about legacy and memory and loss a bunch of times already; evolve from this and do something *entirely* new with new characters and ALSO entirely new theming.

Don't give up on making content just a little more engaging.

That's my worry in light of these very loud complaints.

And the thing is, during the Endwalker patch cycle and even before, these are things so many people wanted.

People wanted a break from the Scions. People wanted the story to reset and relax after Endwalker because it had been within that dark tone for so long.

People wanted us to go back to being an adventurer.

People were tired of the increasingly same-y encounter design (and lack of stuff to do during patch downtime, which you can also see improved in terms of certain rewards; thing is what I've seen is people loving the new content so much they just like playing it and I feel the same way, so it isn't always even more grinds or rewards people actually want).

And that's exactly what they gave us.

Again, I don't know the overlap between audience groups here, but in terms of sentiment, that's the craziest part to me.

They kind of gave us exactly what we asked for.

And I really hope they stick to their guns and get braver from here because new is fun and even if it doesn't always succeed, you can look at what people like and don't like and go from there in a more nuanced way, rather than leaning on overcorrective decisions as they have in terms of certain aspects of the game. It just stops the game from stagnating and getting boring in all aspects.

[rei-ismyname]

Iceman Cometh - Bobby Drake Levels Up

As the youngest of the original five X-Men, Iceman was the class clown and the least powerful. Snowboy might have been a better name for him, though that would be a little mean. He definitely experienced growth and came into his own with his powers, but Bobby Drake was closeted for many years in more ways than one.

Snowboy and Iceman, side by side.

All-New X-Men is a great example of an additive retcon for Bobby, revealing that he is gay. His outing is not a model for how to treat queer people, but Marvel sucks at that so it's kinda to be expected. It was nonetheless a quite profound turning point for him and he grew as an X-Man and as a person. 2019's House of X revealed that he was an Omega Mutant of Temperature Manipulation (negative) while also finally defining the term - 'a mutant whose dominant power is deemed to register or reach an undefinable upper limit...' Basically Gods or elemental incarnations for their specific gift, and Iceman was no different.

Iceman terraforming Mars with the other Omegas in Planet-Size X-Men, described as 'creating ice sheets miles wide' - all the ice on Planet Arakko was created by Iceman - the very environment.

Bobby was having a blast in Marauders, taking names and kicking ass on the high seas. In issue 21 most of the Marauders + Emma Frost were flushed into space by a scoundrel trying to rob and kill them. He would have succeeded if not for Iceman's quick thinking, creating a small planetary body to shelter in after being airlocked. Iceman himself could survive space but this feat unlocked confidence we hadn't seen before from him, and something else...

Bobby Drake was truly becoming Iceman and internalising what Omega means. Not having to fear death played a part too but he was considering 'undefinable upper limit' when opportunity struck.

One fine afternoon FIN FANG FOOM smelt their aged Krakoan whiskey and acted as gigantic dragons that win galactic combat tournaments often do. The whole crew was terrified and made haste to GTFO. Sure, customers were waiting on their product, but generally dragons do as they please.

Bobby Drake would have been one of them but Iceman just saw a challenge. 'This isn't even my final form' - probably.

Freezing his gums and his initial attack didn't work, with the dragon smashing Bobby into shards. Fortunately that's barely an inconvenience and Iceman was not giving up. Yeah, get iced, idiot!

Still, Ice Pokémon are weak to Fire. Melting him was as effective as smashing him to pieces, so Bobby finally got serious. 'Get big and beat them down' beats even the hottest flame.

Sure, buddy. After a walloping, Triple F fired off some face-saving utterances and turned tail. The rest of the Marauders were gobsmacked and kinda scared, except for Christian Frost who said 'that's my boy.' He still wasn't feeling challenged though, so he went on a little trip...

... to Niffleheim to bare knuckle box Ice Giants. I feel a little sorry for them bc they were just kicking it in their home when this lunatic showed up and kicked all their asses. 'SEND THE ONES THAT FIGHT THOR!'

'WE ARE THE ONES WHO FIGHT THOR.' Yeah he beat the shit out of all the Ice Monsters in the Ice Realm easily. The ones that give Thor and Odin grief. They've invaded Asgard and Earth multiple times, though they might give the latter a miss in future. Tbh he found it unchallenging, but at least they know who's the king of Ice. ICEMAN, THAT'S WHO.

'What did you do today?'

'Pounded Fin Fang Foom til he fled then beat up the entirety of Niffleheim. Kinda slow, wbu?'

[acotarfrustrations]

After taking 10d6 psychic damage from the absolute shit show that was acomaf, idk if I'm going to take a break before reading acowar or read a palette cleanser before hand (if I do it will be Baby Teeth by Zoje Stage so lmk how good it is) but I just wanted to talk about something after reading the other negative reviews for acomaf on Goodreads.

I honestly feel bad for Rhysand's character and his fans. For both obvious reasons and personal reasons that I won't get into on a tumblr blog, characters who do SA are a hard no for me. An immediate dislike. But I read reviews from a lot of people who like ACOTAR and picked him up as a favorite character purely because they thought he was interesting and liked how evil he was and they felt disappointed by his retcon into the Virgin Mary during acomaf.

And honestly, that's a perspective I'd never considered.

Rhys' retconning did him such a disservice. He could have been such a nuanced character. Not a love interest, but just a really nuanced side character. Balancing his sexual trauma and victim hood of being held hostage by aramantha while still coming to terms with his status as a sexual assaulter and a murderer who had to do the things he did for survival would have been SUCH a compelling arc.

It would have done to much to explore the impracticality of the perfect victim myth (so would a proper writing of tamlin's character but that's another post).

But instead SJM just takes away all his hard edges and turns him into this whiny sad boi with a sob story at the ready for every bad thing he ever does.

It's such a waste of a perfectly good character.

[charlotte-family-apologist]

I feel like a lot of the hate Sonya gets is a lot more rooted in misogyny than people like to admit. Like yes she was a bad mom but how did yall not see how much she cared for her daughter.

Also she’s like a ladybird character to me and I can’t explain why

It’s definitely rooted in misogyny. Compared to some male characters, she has a lot more personality. I feel as if people boil her down to her negative traits and fail to see her positive ones.

In the OG timeline, it wasn’t Kuai Liang (or any Lin Kuei member for that matter) who helped restore Cyrax’s humanity- it was Sonya and Jax! They show genuine sympathy and worry for him and his cyberization, Sonya even asking if he’s sure he wants to go through with the process of restoring his mind since it could kill him if it went wrong.

As someone who has a bad mother and was raised in an overall unhealthy environment, Sonya as a mother was objectively bad, but I feel as if it was her own problems that kept her from being good. She clearly has some form of attachment issues with the way she distanced herself from others. In the OG comic she blatantly disregards Jax’s worry and attempts to stop her from following Kano, preferring to go alone. In the 1995 movie her character was about learning to accept other’s help.

This was kind of retconed in the ALT timeline with her going to the tournament to find Jax, but I think that was more of her clinging on to what she has.

With Johnny, it’s never stated who divorced who. All we know is Sonya started to obsess over her work and distance herself from her family, driving a wedge between them.

Her mkx bio says it quite bluntly: “Her commitment to her career and difficulty opening up emotionally led to their split five years ago.” Sonya is emotionally unavailable and dedicates herself to her work to an unhealthy degree. She displays these tendencies even before the events during and post tournament, so it’s likely something she picked up in childhood.

I do agree she is somewhat of a ladybird. She seems to get terrible tunnel vision and not think of the long term consequences of her actions.

[noecoded]

Thoughts on your (our) wife in nightbringer so far? Im having normal thoughts about him :)

Asmo literally not giving a fuck that u and levi are abt to be excecuted is too much im going to get this guy. but ermm overall i think its interesting how they chose to expand on asmos character! i think people kindof forego seeing him as like an adult demon (from a non sex appeal standpoint, just in terms of maturity lvl) that can be like startlingly mature and emotionally differentiated at times, & really passionate and patient...i focus on a lot of his perceived "negative" qualities but i think he has a lot of very positive ones that nb highlights nicely between the horribly written dialogue and cringe characterization and ridiculous retconning

[taylortruther]

This is probably my post unpopular opinion and also cynical take on Taylor’s music. I don’t like to use the word “retconning” exactly like you and your anons, but I feel like Taylor does that (I’m only using this word because I can’t think of another one in this moment). I remember how in one of your posts you said that Taylor has been writing about what-ifs so much in her discography for many different guys and how that makes it more difficult to distinguish the muse in retrospect and this is one of the reasons that makes me say that she adjusts the “lore” accordingly to what she wants to tell in her songs. Another reason is the one you pointed out, about her having a more private life: if people don’t know that something happened could they tell her that she’s lying?

These are not negative things imho, they’re just proofs to me of how she’s a great storyteller and a testament to her talent

yeah but the reason i hate the term retconning is because it implies that we knew, for a fact, exactly who and what she was writing about, and that now she's telling us something else aka lying. consider: what if we were wrong about what she was writing about initially?

so if you don't want to do that, i think the term you are looking for is not, "she adjusts the lore," but, "her feelings are complex and it is impossible to capture the full complexity in a song."

i agree she is a wonderful storyteller, and i agree that she can rededicate her own songs, and she has recurring themes in her work/how she thinks of the world, and so her entire discography gets swirly. but i just refuse to suggest she's "retconning" when emotions aren't black and white, and a song could be about multiple situations. unless she explicitly tells us, we are just making assumptions.

[thebibliomancer]

Essential Avengers: Avengers West Coast #61: The IMMORTUS IMPERATIVE

August, 1990

AVENGERS West Coast vs IMMORTUS and the LEGION of the UNLIVING!

Well! A Legion of the Unliving! And an Immortus. Vs the Avengers. We've been here before. But not with this specific Legion of the Unliving. Is that Iron Man 2020? He's not even unliving yet! Way to think outside the current year, Immortus.

Anyway.

Last times on Avengers West Coast: John Byrne was building up to something with Scarlet Witch and Immortus. But he had beef with editorial so he took his ball and went home and now Roy and Dann Thomas are going to pick up the plot threads and tie them together as best as they can.

But in plot terms: Scarlet Witch has been having the worst several weeks of her life. Her husband was disassembled and rebuilt except without emotions so he fucked off to the other Avengers team. Wanda went catatonic except when she woke up to be capital E evil and then she went catatonic again.

While she was Evil, she joined up with Magneto for his vague plans and kept suggesting he murder people. But then she went catatonic while he had to fight the Avengers by himself. So he fucked off.

Immortus has been shown spying on the Avengers for Reasons and deleting divergent timelines for Reasons and after Magneto fucks off, Immortus shows up to claim everything has transpired according to his plans. Also, he's going to marry Wanda or something.

Sir. If Wanda takes up polygamy, you are not high on her list.

Honestly.

This era of Avengers has way too much Kang and Kang accessories in it.

Quicksilver (and Lockjaw via growls) tell Immortus to get his creepy self away from Wanda but Hank Pym is like dammit, let the villain monologue!

He says it's for Wanda's sake but I think he just knows we'll never know what the plot is if we don't let Immortus villainsplain at them.

Wasp: "Spoken like a true leader and founding father, Hank!"

God. Get off his dick, Wasp.

I'd hoped that her characterization being reduced to being Hank's cheerleader would go away with Byrne but forecast looks bad.

Hawkeye ignores Hank (because the Avengers West Coast don't have an official leader so Hawkeye thinks it should be him and therefore he can do what he wants) and shoots an arrow at Immortus.

Which bonks off thin air.

Wonder Man: "You know force fields are standard issue with supervillains, Hawk!"

Yeah, Clint. Are you a veteran or not?

Immortus takes issue with being called a villain and asks "do you apply such negative labels to everything you cannot understand?"

Which would hit harder if it were not Immortus and not a situation where he's mind-controlling a woman.

Hawkeye points out that Immortus has been causing trouble for the Avengers since issue #10. I mean, he's right. But how does he know that? Issue #10 got retconned.

And Wonder Man says that his own introduction in issue #9 happened a few weeks after the Immortus fight that didn't happen at all because it was retconned and as Simon describes it the issues would be in the wrong order even if it did happen and...

This way lies madness.

Despite his injured leg, Quicksilver isn't going to stand by letting Immortus talk even if Dr Pym, Wasp, and Iron Man say he should.

He tries to rush Immortus but Immortus has Time Powers.

Immortus: "You would use so pitiful a power as speed -- against one who controls time, without which speed is an inconceivable concept? I could take this single step backward -- or walk to Earth's Moon and return -- while you were merely careening into this other fool who thought to sneak up on his superior!"

So Immortus just steps out of the way of Quicksilver's charge and lets him collide with US Agent. But he describes it as TIME POWERS.

Immortus doesn't actually want to Explain It All and says he's protecting all timelines, source: trust me, bro.

But the Avengers don't trust him, bro.

Wasp tries to get Lockjaw to teleport Wanda away. But she's still in that time-space stasis field thing and that's immune to teleportation. And also, Immortus has Dog Sleepy Powers which he uses to make Lockjaw to sleep.

Supposedly.

Lockjaw continues standing around with his eyes open. So maybe Immortus doesn't know how to get the Dog Sleepy Powers to work.

The Avengers all rush Immortus, since he won't exposition at them.

Immortus sighs and decides okay fine, I'll just take you with me then. And teleports them all to Limbo.

Leaving behind a weird after image of himself in the Avengers' base.

Immortus' throne room has been redecorated to look more... organic, apparently. Immortus says that's because Limbo reflects his moods and he's been in an organic mood lately.

Sure, okay.

I'm not sure what he means because the background just looks like. Rock. Like a rocky cave that someone put a metal floor in and a throne.

Wonder Man thinks it's very impressive and says a set like this would cost the budget for three of the movies he's worked on.

Hawkeye: "Right about now, Simon, your movie career's the last thing I'm worried about!"

Hey, c'mon, Clint.

He's just describing it through his lived life experience. And reminding people that he's an actor who acts in movies.

Remember when Hawkeye showed new maturity by getting married and leading a team of his own? Remember when he and Wonder Man came to an understanding in the sauna that even though he was an actor, being a superhero was still Wonder Man's number one priority?

I can't believe I'm saying it but characterization has gone downhill since Englehart.

Whether on Earth or in Limbo, the Avengers are still ready to kick Immortus' ass. And apparently his TIME POWERS only work on Earth. Because Limbo is timeless. Except for all the passage of time that the people in it experience because duh.

But if there's anything consistent about Immortus from the non-occurring events of Avengers #10 onward it's that Immortus doesn't fight his own battles.

Immortus: "Still, I am disappointed you think me stupid enough -- to face all you overly muscular specimens alone."

And boom. As the cover promised, a new Legion of the Unliving.

Getting a bit ahead of myself but that's Toro, not the Human Torch. The villainous Black Knight. Ugh, Grim Reaper. The Swordsman. Left-Winger and Right-Winger. Iron Man 2020, who I guess is unliving in the sense that he's not even been born. Unless you count sliding timescale because the timescale slid so hard that Arno is now contemporaneous to Tony. And Oort, the Living Comet.

Despite Oort asking if they remember him, this is his first appearance.

Like Arno, Oort is implied to come from the future. Although a more recent future.

Honestly, that's a fun thing to do with Immortus. It's HARD to do, unless you have established some characters from the future like the Iron Man 2020 series. 2099 characters would be a good choice but we're a couple years from that being possible. Or you can just make up a future character like Oort, the Living Comet, and have him mention a personal history that hasn't happened yet.

My point being: despite how stupid this story is looking, I like Immortus getting creative with his Legion of the Unliving choices.

Most everyone dies at some point and Immortus has every point at his disposal so he could throw any given character into his Legion.

Actually, I'm a little sad that the MCU just has Immortus as One of the Kangs and that maybe the Kang plot will get dropped or deemphasized due to so many reasons. Because an MCU Immortus dropping a Legion of the Unliving on someone. Imagine the characters you could bring back for it.

There are so many dead characters in the MCU. So many.

The only limit is imagination and how much Disneymarvel would be willing to pay to get actors to come back and reprise.

Anyway.

Wasp tells the Avengers not to hold back just because these are dead people that they might know. As far as she's concerned, these aren't the real dudes, they're simulcra that Immortus pulled out of time and if the Avengers get too in their head about fighting dead people they might know, they'll wind up dead instead.

She's actually right.

Because Immortus kept using dead characters that actually turned out to be alive - including Wonder Man once - it's had to be retconned that sometimes Legion of the Unliving members are just Space Phantoms.

So many Space Phantoms in Immortus retcons. So many.

Anyway, this Legion of the Unliving seems to have been chosen for personal connections with the heroes. Mostly.

Wonder Man obviously squares up against Grim Reaper, his supervillain brother that keeps harassing him and trying to put him and Vision in a blender.

Iron Man 2020 fights Iron Man because he's always wanted to prove he's better than the original Iron Man, Tony Stark, his great-uncle. Despite Iron Man's protests that he's definitely not the handsome, brilliant Tony Stark.

Hawkeye fights his old mentor and frenemy Swordsman.

Swordsman claims that he taught Hawkeye everything he knows which is why he's totally going to win this fight. Kind of ignoring the fact that he's been dead for years and Hawkeye didn't just stop learning shit. It's just a dumb boast, is all.

Black Knight faces Dr Pym, his old nemesis. Hank is no longer Giant-Man but he unshrinks Rover, the airship with the brain of an ant who loves Hank, so he can have an aerial duel with his old foe.

Right-Winger and Left-Winger fight US Agent. They're dudes he fought during his time as Captain America. He kinda blew them up in to a coma. Because they were involved in his parents' deaths.

Wasp is fighting Toro (who everyone is mistaking for the robot Human Torch). ... Okay, this is the odd one out. Wasp has no connection with this dude.

You couldn't think of a dead villain that has a personal connection to Wasp? I hate to say it but... I mean. She did tell Hank to crush Vibro to paste three issues ago. Maybe she should fight Vibro.

It would kind of make that fill-in issue where the Avengers West Coast take a break from the Wanda is Evil and Crazy arc more relevant to the arc. Wasp sentenced a dude to die because he wouldn't stop earthquaking Los Angeles. And then he pops up again in the Legion of the Unliving.

Feels like it writes itself but it didn't.

Anyway. The most interesting match-up here is actually Quicksilver vs Oort, the Living Comet.

Because Oort knows Quicksilver. And Quicksilver has no idea who Oort is.

Oort: "We never did find out which of us is faster, did we, mutant?" Quicksilver: "What are you talking about, Oort -- or whatever your name is? I never even heard of you befo-- NO! Those comet bursts --- fired at Wanda -- !" Oort: "You haven't changed a bit since we met in the 50th Century, Quicksilver. Even there, you were overly protective of your sister... though she couldn't care less whether you live or die!"

It sucks nobody ever ran with this.

This story is Oort's only appearance. We may never know what the hell Pietro and apparently Wanda were doing in the 50th Century. Or why they started beefing with this Oort dude.

The Thomases introduced Oort in this story as a future foe of Quicksilver because Quicksilver doesn't have a rogues gallery to draw on and everyone (but Wasp) was getting personalized fights.

So they made a whole new guy up to give Quicksilver a personalized fight and they gave Wasp Toro.

Double standard, boo.

Meanwhile, in the Hawkeye vs Swordsman fight, Swordsman does his usual Swordsman thing. You know, slicing or batting Hawkeye's arrows out of the air.

Really showing off his visual acuity and reflexes, the jerk.

He even mocks Hawkeye's gimmick arrows as relying on a "technological care package from Tony Stark" as if Hawkeye didn't invent anti-gravity by himself and then never use it for anything.

Swordsman: "Whether it's the strength of my arm -- or the sharpness of my blade -- I shall always be the teacher, and you merely the pupil!"

Basically Swordsman talks a good game up until the point Hawkeye tricks him into trying to block a 21k volt electro-arrow with his very conductive metal sword.

Props to the story, for a dude that Hawkeye has personal history with, he comes off like he has personal history with Swordsman.

After he... yeah, he basically kills Swordsman. Twenty-one thousand volts will do that. And this is Avengers Don't Kill Hawkeye, having to re-kill his dead mentor because if Hawkeye lost, Swordsman would move onto killing the next Avenger.

Hawkeye: "You -- shouldn't have made that crack -- about what you were gonna do to the others. I knew you best, so that meant I had to be the one to stop you, at any cost. Do me a f-favor, okay? D-don't let Immortus bring you back to life again. I really don't think... I could take that...!"

It's a low bar to clear but nobody in West Coast Avengers but Wanda has had appropriate emotions for the entire Byrne run. So I'll give credit where due that Hawkeye is emotionally impacted by having to kill a dude he has conflicted feelings about.

I'm realizing that I'm liking a lot of the bits in this story. The overall story is still kinda dumb. But it's cleaning up someone else's mess so maybe this bodes well for the Thomases run on this book.

Anyway. Remember how Immortus left behind an after-image when he teleported everyone to Limbo?

Yeah, Agatha Harkness did that.

She "half-sensed" Immortus' hand behind all the shit that's been happening to Wanda and her growing powers and her hard swing into mutant superiority and also the fake made-up children who definitely didn't exist.

Agatha didn't tell anyone though because fuck you nobody tells anyone their suspicions about anything in this book until it's too late to matter. Remember all the times recently that Hank Pym suddenly claimed he knew something all along?

But since Agatha Harkness kept a low-profile, Immortus didn't think to take countermeasures against her and she was able to cast a spell that left behind an after-image of himself.

Why? Eh. Apparently she can do magic on the after-image to learn what he's up to.

Agatha Harkness: "For, as you know full well, Earth's very timelines are in danger of unraveling, like threads in a fallen skein... but I, for one, am far from certain that you are the one to knit them up again!"

That's fair. He retgonned the timeline where Lincoln kicked John Wilkes Booth's ass. What a jerk thing to do, to get rid of that.

Anyway, Agatha does a magic that will make the image of Immortus share all the hot goss about Immortus' schemes. Magic can do that. Why wouldn't it?

In the grand aerial duel of Dr Pym vs the Black Knight, Black Knight's flying horse outmaneuvers Hank Pym's technology. He uses his laser lance to blast Rover but Hank just unshrinks a hover-pack and jumps out at Black Knight.

Who panics and falls off his horse to his re-death.

Hank saves himself with his hover-pack. He realizes that Black Knight must have remembered the last time he fell to his death, while fighting Iron Man, and that's why he panicked and, ironically, caused history to repeat.

Having put this together, Hank feels lousy about helping history to repeat on Black Knight.

He supposedly repented his evil right before he died the first time and then Immortus drags his ghost out of time, or whatever, and throws him into superhero fighting again. Black Knights just got no luck.

... Huh, did Thor ever get Dane out of that time warp he left him in?

Meanwhile, US Agent gets double-teamed by Right-Winger and Left-Winger.

Then US Agent throws his less-mighty-than-Cap's shield and makes Left-Winger trip so both brothers accidentally stab each other with stalagmites.

US Agent: "Welcome back to the dead zone, boys."

It's his favorite DBZ movie.

But, wow, he sure is proud of himself for deading those two guys.

Elsewhere in this big Limbo, Iron Man vs Iron Man. Future technology vs modern technology. A dude who just bought his armor vs the dude that built it.

And Iron Man 2020 is kicking Tony's ass. There's several decades of advancements in Arno's favor, even if Tony is the better engineer.

Iron Man 2020: "Face facts, unc... You're like some primitive stealth bomber up against a star raker from my day!" Also Iron Man 2020: "Whoever you are in there, you're last century's model!"

And then Tony wins via sucker punch.

I guess decades of improvements don't mean a lot if you can't take a punch.

Shrug.

(Feels like there was a more thematically satisfying conclusion to this fight somewhere but this is a team vs team fight issue and each character can only get so much time.)

Over with Wonder Man vs Grim Reaper for the umpteenth time.

Grim Reaper is in full bigger brother bully mode, reminding Simon of when they were kids and Eric would threaten him with a stolen pocketknife.

Grim Reaper cuts Wonder Man up with his scythe (which he lampshades he wasn't able to do when he was alive) but Wonder Man grabs him by the throat and demands he stands down.

Bigger brother bully refuses and shocks Wonder Man with his scythe, Wonder Man determinedly keeps his grip on Grim Reaper's neck and-

KRAK!

Wonder Man: "My grip -- so strong -- I killed him -- broke his neck! Immortus's control over him was so strong -- he wouldn't quit fighting till he was dead again! You're going to pay for this, Immortus! So help me -- you're going to pay!"

Damn. That's dark.

Which seems to be the theme with the fights where the Avengers win their fights.

Hawkeye had to go against his Avengers Do Not Kill principle and re-kill his mentor. Hank Pym (accidentally) put the fear of death in Black Knight so hard he died of it. And Wonder Man squeezes his brother's neck so hard it breaks -- and doesn't even realize he's doing it.

Oh, and US Agent made two brothers kill each other. But he doesn't seem too broken up over it. I guess he's the combo breaker.

And the afterthought fight: Wasp vs Toro.

Who she confuses as Human Torch until he informs her otherwise.

I sincerely believe this fight happens - and Wasp gets screwed out of a personalized fight - to clear up some continuity.

When Toro reveals he's Toro, Wasp realizes that the previous time the Avengers saw the robot Human Torch in a Legion of the Unliving (under Kang) it couldn't have been Jim Hammond because androids can't die because they're not real people!

Oof.

Toro: "Kang the Conqueror once thought I was the Torch, too -- when he gathered the first Legion of the Unliving! I was a man -- so I could -- and the Mad Thinker murdered me! -- Just like Immortus is going to make me kill you -- RIGHT NOW!"

Glad we cleared that up.

And, yeah, Wasp loses her fight because she's too distracted by the Not-Human Torch thing.

This issue kept cutting back and forth between Agatha interrogating Afterimage Immortus and the Avengers vs Legion fights. I just moved most of the fight stuff together in this recap for clarity.

Because we're about to do some big retcons, Agatha Harkness asks Immortus to RECAP HIS ENTIRE BACKSTORY.

Granted, how long has it been since we learned Immortus' complicated deal?

He was born in the 30th Century in a world of peace and plenty and he hated it because it was so boring. His only solace was watching old video tapes of superheroes punching people.

Especially the Fantastic Four. He loved their exploits best because he had learned that he and Reed Richards both traced their ancestry back to Nathaniel Richards.

Little Kid Future Nathaniel Richards (Ie Immortus) found a shrine Reed's dad Nathaniel Richards left behind with a time machine. Young Immortus rebuilt the time machine to look like a Sphinx and time traveled back to Egypt to take over as White Pharaoh Rama-Tut.

Then the Fantastic Four showed up and kicked his ass and he fled Back to the Future.

He went too far, wound up in post-apocalyptic year 4000 and became Kang the Conqueror.

Later, he became ashamed of all the stupid shit he did as Kang and became Rama-Tut again and took over Egypt again (but benevolently?). Then he became Immortus and moved to Limbo.

Afterimage Immortus: "As Immortus, I was a more contemplative type than my Kang counterparts, who were dedicated only to the conquest of historical eras. Sequestering myself in the ageless dimension known as Limbo, I dedicated myself to the study of that ultimate enigma -- time itself."

Then, the Time Keepers came to Immortus in Limbo and taught him all about time and appointed him the custodian of the time stream for the period which he had lived as Kang -- 3000 BC to 4000 AD.

So Immortus became responsible for monitoring time travel during that period. Which mostly meant monitoring himselves.

And if he fulfills his vow to the Time Keepers' purpose, they'll give him total mastery over those seventy centuries.

Kind of seems a downgrade from when Immortus was Master of Time.

Agatha Harkness asks Immortus what the Time Keepers' purpose is and what the heck it has to do with Wanda or with all those divergent timelines Immortus deleted in Byrne's run.

Afterimage Immortus: "You already know the truth, old woman! The Scarlet Witch is a nexus being -- one who belongs equally to all possible timelines -- all realities and divergences -- so that, through her, all futures can be totally safeguarded -- inexorably controlled -- by Immortus, Master of Time!"

Okay. Does that mean anything for Wanda herself or does that just make her a plot device to win?

Remember when Sentinels kidnapped Wanda because they needed to her power to sterilize Earth? And not her hex power, just the fact that she was A Woman?

This shit keeps happening to Wanda.

I'm surprised she didn't go evil and crazy sooner.

Speeeeaking of whiiiiich.

This is where (Afterimage) Immortus explains how he's been behind everything.

EVERY. THING.

Going back to his first appearance in Avengers #10 which was retconned and didn't happen so I don't know what he's talking about.

But, hypothetically, his evil plan in that story that didn't happen was to break up the Avengers so Scarlet Witch could never join them. Without the Avengers as a support network, Immortus could have manipulated Wanda so much more easily.

And why did Immortus show Vision an origin where he was built from the body of the original robot Human Torch? TWAS A RUSE! He wanted Vision and Wanda to marry and only knowing his origins would make Vision comfortable enough in his life to marry!

(The retconned origin that Vision was made out of extra Human Torch parts is close enough that one wonders why Immortus didn't just show him that? This is stupid. God I hate sweeping retcons like this.)

Why did Immortus want Wanda and Vision to marry? Is he just a big ol' shipper actually?

NO!

WANDA MARRYING VISION WAS ACTUALLY A SLOW BURN PLAN TO MANIPULATE WANDA! IMMORTUS PLANNED IT ALLLL!

Immortus knew that Wanda would want children and that she would specifically use her mutant magic to magic them up instead of adoption or surrogacy! He knew it all along!

And having created fake, not-real children, he knew that one day, she would learn they weren't real!

Afterimage Immortus: "Over time, Agatha Harkness, I slyly seduced the Vision into attempting to dominate the Earth by taking over its computers. After he tried that, it was easy to subliminally influence a multi-national security alliance to take him apart-- in such a way that, although his android body could later be more or less reassembled -- the Vision's particular mind and memory -- and thus his love for the Scarlet Witch -- became part of a dead and unrecapturable past! Soon afterward, even while I was subtly increasing her hex power, I made certain she was one of seven brides-to-be of Set, to further undermine her confidence -- by making her fear she was doomed, always, to be a victim of circumstances beyond her control. Perhaps she was, at that. Witness her quite coincidental capture later by the human servants of the micro-organism known as 'That Which Endures'... Although Master Pandemonium, whose kidnapping of her 'twins' caused her pain and terror, was unknowingly obeying my secret suggestions. And when her 'offspring' finally vanished forever -- you, dear lady, did me the service of explaining to her how they never truly existed! This was the final straw that turned her into a hard-hearted human-hater -- and thus perfect for my purposes. Magneto's blundering along just then was an annoying, but quite temporary, nuisance -- one which scarcely delayed the implementation of my plan!"

God this is so much. I hate it also so much.

Saying someone secretly conspired to organize so many events is a hard sell. And roping in Master Pandemonium seems unlikely since Immortus couldn't see into the netherworld where he took Wanda.

Saying Immortus nudged Vision into his takeover the world plan diminishes the original story.

And the writer drawing the line at Immortus being responsible for the That Which Endures story is just kind of funny. It's brought up solely so Immortus can say "that wasn't me" even though it seems like the racism goo turning Wanda into a mutant supremacist would only serve his plan.

There's so much to like about this issue and then there's the big reveals, which are unfathomably stupid.

Sheesh.

With all this exposition, Agatha Harkness has finally pieced together what Immortus' plan for Scarlet Witch is.

Although, she doesn't share it with the class. No doubt wanting to keep up the tension for next issue.

(Also, Immortus sends the Legion of the Unliving back into the void, sparing Quicksilver and Wasp from being finished off by their opponents.)

Next week, switching back over to Avengers East Coast for more airport paperback political thriller action in the Crossing Line arc. And in two weeks, the Immortus slash Wanda is Evil and Crazy arc wraps so the Thomases can start their own plots.

I will not be sad to see Byrne's lingering plot threads go.

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