#remus sanders analysis

[let-roman-bite-someone]

i briefly mentioned this in a previous post but i really want to talk about how patton’s growth and how he is trying his best to accept remus as part of the sides, because

he went from reacting like this to remus’s contributions, screaming or looking visibly horrified or telling remus to stop

to just casually replying to remus when he suggested that janus might have gifted him a dead animal.

keep in mind, patton is very fond of animals and these are the kind of thoughts that freak him out, but he showed no sign of distress here nor did he reprimand remus for suggesting such a thought. i’m so proud of him, he’s keeping his promise to thomas.

[part-time-zombie]

You know how remus physically reacted to logan downplaying his impact, like he was weakened by his rationale?

I thought it looked familiar... but it took another rewatch to see it.

Virgil had a similar reaction to the breathing technique.

And in both cases, the method was the same.

By acknowledging and accepting the fact that Anxiety and Intrusive Thoughts are strengthened by fear, he took that power away and it had a clear reaction from both Virgil and Remus.

They both made a stronger impact when thomas feared them, and they were both "defeated" by his recognition of that power.

[tentacle-therapissed]

IMO the fanon interpretation of the Dark Sides’ dynamic ignores the fascinating canon implications that they’re more like forced family than anything resembling found family. These are three characters who genuinely do not seem to get along— at the very least, Virgil has made it clear that his function as a Side does not mesh well with either Janus or Remus’s functions, and the moment he saw an opportunity to be accepted by the others he ditched them with absolutely no remorse or lingering attachment. Meanwhile the dubiously canon interactions Janus has with Remus come off as him putting up with Remus’s antics simply because what else is he going to do? The most friendly the two of them ever get is when they’re collaborating to screw with c!Thomas— it’s like they’re coworkers who have nothing else in common besides their overlapping goals. The three currently introduced ‘Dark Side’ characters are united only in the fact that they were all outcasts. ‘The Dark Sides’ isn’t even a meaningful phrase, it’s something Roman came up with on the spot to lump together all the Sides that were too complicated and ambiguous to be part of the OG triad. Virgil doesn’t even use the phrase ‘Dark Sides’, he specifically made the point to call Remus and Janus ‘the others’ instead. He knows he used to be part of That group but it wasn’t because he actually identified with them, it’s because everyone else grouped him with them and until AA—maybe even until Fitting In— he thought his only option was to double down on being an antagonist and collaborate with the other ‘antagonist’ Sides no matter how uneasy they made him.

The Dark Sides are those roommates with no prior history who weren’t able to change their contract in time. They’re the students who got put in a group project together and have wildly different ideas on how to approach the material. They’re the only remaining members of a dying club trying desperately to find some reason to keep hanging out together so the club doesn’t die. They’re the kids who all got detention on the same day and figured talking to each other was better than complete solitude. They’re the inhabitants of that one abandoned lunch table in the back of the cafeteria because no other table will take them.

[sandersontheside]

A thought while I'm thinking about the religious guilt angle. Roman doesn't just represent creativity, but also hopes and dreams and romance. But do you think there was a time, before C!Thomas accepted his sexuality, where Remus was in charge of some of those fantasies? Where imagining being romantic with another boy, no matter how tame, was put in the same category as violent intrusive thoughts? A time where Virgil whispered in his ear that he would go to Hell for being gay?

[ashbeanss]

okay so i was reading through this and the main big thing i feel that’s being left out here is his role in regards to roman. creativity is an all-consuming force, especially for artists your creativity is always active and coming up with ideas and bothering you in one way or another. we know roman, who is a light side, who has been present since the very beginning of the series, already feels dejected because his ideas don’t seem as valuable to thomas as he wants. how does this relate to remus and his purpose and motivations you ask? i’ll explain.

as someone who got a surprising amount of talks on mental health in school, something that we were told about a lot was the effects of treatment at home. different things can make people act in different ways, namely negligence or abuse. what we see with roman and remus is two different kinds of negligence and their effects.

roman isn’t being given enough praise, which is devastating for his role as both creativity and ego. if you aren’t letting yourself feel good about your creations and ideas, you’re not going to feel like creating. you’re going to feel like everything you make is bad, isn’t up to scratch. this is a separate issue that needs addressed at some point.

remus on the other hand is getting barely attention at all. there’s a certain saying that comes with that, being ‘any attention is good attention’. that is where why remus acts like he does comes in. this has been confirmed by thomas to be in remus’ line of behaviour, in a now inaccesible livestream that took place right after dwit released, thomas spoke about remus (obviously) but said two things that stuck out to me so much i wrote them down a few years ago when i watched that stream. those two being “he’s like the neglected younger brother that just screams for attention” and, “it really is a ‘look at me, look at me’ kind of deal”.

that’s why remus acts the way he does. he is the metaphorical class clown. he is being as insufferable, as disturbing, as irritating as he can so thomas will pay attention to him. will acknowledge his existence for even a moment. while roman is devastatingly insecure, remus doesn’t get looked at enough to even think about feeling shame. that is where remus’ arc is going. he hides how deeply and upsettingly lonely he is, how unfulfilled he is, behind his constant and perfected mask of deranged indifference.

that’s why the only time he is genuinely threatening in any way is towards logan in dwit, when he’s getting through to thomas about ignoring remus. this is remus’ shot, his opportunity to get through, and it’s being ripped away from him. he’s perfectly fine coming out of the episode with the negative view thomas has on him, because thomas has an opinion of him at all. it is important in these moments to recognise remus is not intrusive thoughts, and is not representative of them, and that intrusive thoughts are his method. the best way for him to get to thomas is to forcefully plant himself in his mind and make himself as hard to ignore as possible. this isn’t the only thing he’s made for, he’s creativity for crying out loud, of course he wants to do more, but it’s the only thing that works.

sorry that was long i have a lot of thoughts about remus. anyways all my opinion feel free to say i’m entirely wrong in every way

What is Remus' contribution?

Let's discuss

So as we know all of the sides' sole purpose in life is to help make sure c!Thomas is safe, successful and happy in life:

Logan is responsible for his learning, vocabulary, reasoning, logic and curiosity;

Virgil is responsible for his safety, vigilance, attention to his relationships, caution and basic life preservation instincts;

Roman is responsible for creativity, ego, self esteem, adventurousness and romantic pursuits;

Patton is responsible for his morality, sense of wonder, joy, memories and nostalgia

Janus is his self preservation instinct and represents his more selfish impulses and adds some nuance to the group's discussions.

Remus...?

As we know, there are no "bad" or "evil" sides, and that presumably includes Remus and the orange side soon to be revealed.

However, as hard as I may try I can't seem to come up with what might be Remus' role. All of the sides take on multiple crucial roles in c!Thomas' life and sure, it could be argued that Remus' disturbing suggestions and mental images he conjures serve as moral tests in which by consistently picking the safe, healthy option over the dangerous or unethical option c!T can be sure of where he stands morally. But how many times can a man's morals be tested before it just becomes exhausting? What else does Remus do? Surely he doesn't only represent intrusive thoughts, when the other sides represent so much beyond what they're best known for?

I would like to hear your thoughts, headcanons and theories about Remus, cause I'm afraid I really don't get his character. At least not so far. I would like to get to know him better as a character in the next episodes.

[loganslowdown4]

Today I was thinking about how the dark sides are represented as ‘villains’ because c!Thomas thinks that that side of himself is reprehensible. Like he sees completely in black and white. And because of this, any thought or action that comes from that side is immediately villainized, to the point where they act and even look like cartoon villains.

His point of reference for ‘bad guys’ has always been from his experience with the media he consumes, like cartoons or video games. It’s actually an immature way of looking at himself.

I get the wanting to separate good from bad, and this works for the big moral yes or no questions. But there gets to be a point where we grow up and realize that most instances in our lives have shades of grey answers, which is actually why Janus and Remus are there. We eventually just accept those sides of ourselves as part of us.

And eventually, they become more mellow and we realize they’re just there for self preservation. It’s not selfish to look after yourself if you have to lie about something. We’re not bad because we have intrusive thoughts. Being bothered by them literally shows us what NOT to do. In their way, they are a form of moral compass.

Neither sides are there to make him comfortable, but being comfortable leaves you vulnerable when you need protection. So Janus and Remus aren’t great sides but they aren’t ‘villains’ either, as Thomas sees them. They deserve acceptance just as much as Virgil does, because, like Virgil, they’re working to protect Thomas just as much.

Just some food for thought today! 😁 Also check out the colours in Thomas’ tie whoa 👀🤍🖤

[orbmanson7]

And here's the last part of the analysis of the "The Sides Need a Nice Day" video, this time, let's talk about Janus and Remus.

(If you want to read the first part about Patton and Logan, go here.

If you want to read the second part about Virgil and Roman, go here.)

Right away, we have Janus letting us know he's about to one-up Patton and Virgil's attempts at cheering another side up, for whatever reason he feels compelled to do so (because acceptance isn't a competition or anything, right?), and says he will be giving Remus a nice day.

Specifically, he says that "freaks deserve nice days too" which is a funny but wonderful sentiment, because it shows that Janus sees Remus for what he is but also doesn't want him to change anything about that. Remus deserves to be who he is and enjoy himself, as they all do, which is kind of the whole point behind this video, even though it hasn't really been obvious up to this point, probably because Janus is being far more direct about it than the others were.

To explain, if you look back at Patton and Logan's part, you'll see that Patton wasn't trying to change anything about Logan and came up with things he would enjoy doing, but he wanted to do them far too quickly for Logan's liking.

And with Virgil and Roman, the suggestions all turned out to be things Virgil thought Roman would like but he changed those things to be something they might both enjoy instead, which wasn't really giving Roman anything he expected.

But Janus knows Remus very well, recognizes the purpose behind the trend is to simply give someone something they want and let them enjoy it, and he's prepared to properly do what the others had failed at, to give another side a nice day without flaw.

Also, Janus not knowing where the pens would be is likely meant as a little hint that Janus is still very unfamiliar with the light sides' area and where they'd keep things. Not sure how he knew where to find the note cards, though...

Janus goes looking for Remus in a dark closet, expecting him to be there but is still startled when it turns out he is.

He quickly gets to the point and simply tells Remus what to do and what the result will be. No constant questions back and forth, no push for an explanation, Janus just tells Remus what to expect immediately. See how easy that is?

Remus doesn't seem too pleased before picking the card, but is delighted after he sees the result. This may imply Janus has offered to do things in the past that have not been enjoyable for Remus, but that could be a stretch. We don't know these two well enough yet to really be sure.

Janus, though with little emotion, tells Remus to 'have at it' and that he's convinced Thomas to 'lean into his intrusive thoughts' for the day. It's very likely that this means Thomas is merely thinking out these scenarios, not actually participating in them, which would still be enjoyable for Remus as someone who delves in the imagination just as much as Roman. It also would keep Thomas out of any real-life repercussions for these actions and keep down his stress and anxiety, as well.

Considering DwIT showed that just the thought alone would often put Thomas on edge, it makes sense that these actions are thoughts being leaned into and imagined rather than legitimately happening (and would also explain some of the unused options on the cards). Thomas has learned by now that thinking about something doesn't make you a bad person, and who better to convince him to have a little fun with that than Janus?

Remus excitedly grabs for the next option, instantly delighted by what it turns out to be. This really does show that Janus understands Remus rather well, he knows what Remus enjoys and doesn't have to change anything to make him happy. This comes from knowing each other, likely for a long time, and Janus not just knowing his interests but also understanding why Remus likes something.

However, on the next round of options, Janus remarks that he can't believe he's doing this. He's either in disbelief that he's doing these nice things for Remus all to show up Patton and Virgil, or he is regretting how much effort he's put into this with how easily Remus is entertained by it.

Janus doesn't seem bored, but he's definitely doing this for Remus and not enjoying the activities alongside him.

As I mentioned in the last post about Virgil and Roman, this is likely in relation to love languages that have been on display throughout the whole video.

At this part with Janus and Remus, though, Janus is using his knowledge of Remus' interests to give him something he'll enjoy, making this the love language of 'gift-giving'. However, he's also acknowledging that these are activities others would be weirded-out by and then saying nothing negative about it. Janus is encouraging Remus to do these activities, regardless of what anyone will think, making this the love language of 'words of affirmation' in its own unique way, by validating what Remus enjoys.

While you could argue the others also did this, it means a lot more for Remus in particular, as someone whose entire presence is seen as a bad thing, that any ideas he may have are hazardous and awful, and he's shut down and ignored as much as possible at every turn. Something as simple as saying that it's actually fine if he wants to dangle a phone off the side of a bridge is incredibly kind to do for him.

But this also shows us that he's very used to being ignored and suppressed, because he was absolutely enamoured at the thought of getting to do any of these activities. From his reactions throughout this entire part, we know he would be equally as excited to eat paper as he would to summon Bloody Mary, which just proves that point. It's not just the extreme ideas of his that get pushed away, it's all of them. Remus finally getting the chance to act things out that he thinks up and enjoys must mean a hell of a lot to him.

Remus then thanks Janus in the end, a great big smile on his face, and Janus sighs and says "you're welcome. Don't say I never did anything for you."

It's possible this is just a little joke, but if it did mean something, it could be implying that Janus and Remus are not quite on equal ground in the current timeline of the plot. This would make sense, as Janus has just been accepted by Thomas, but only just. This still puts him leagues above where Remus is, even though Thomas does seem at least more used to him being around, at least.

This could cause a rift between Janus and Remus if it's not addressed soon, but Janus will still be working to earn his place amongst the others, so we'll have to see how that pans out.

It's also possible that Janus' line is more in reference to his overall purpose in the show. He operates more as Self-Preservation, but that doesn't have to be exclusive to Thomas, as many of the other sides can affect one another, as well. If he's attempting to restore some balance to Thomas' mental health by getting some of the other sides to understand their own biases (as he's been doing so far), this could still put Remus at a disadvantage until Remus is more accepted as Dark Creativity rather than Intrusive Thoughts. This may explain Janus' line if he's already been accused or expects to soon be accused of not paying enough attention to Remus, because Janus' priority will still have to be Thomas' well-being and that could put Remus at the bottom of his priorities.

He may not want Remus to change, but it's going to take a lot of work before the others can be ready to handle Remus without any changes, and he may know that a little too well, considering how long it's taken just for Janus to be accepted.

But, in the end, Janus did manage to prove his point in this part of the video, that he absolutely knows how to give another side a nice day, far better than Patton and Virgil, that's for sure.

He can be proud of that fact, for knowing Remus so well, but hopefully that isn't something he has to toss aside for Thomas' sake any time soon...

[intrulogical]

remus isn't dumb; a sanders sides essay

i've been struggling to make a cohesive post about this because i feel like most of what i want to say boils down to the same underlying message which is: remus isn't dumb.

i feel like a good chunk of this fandom understands what i mean, at least to a surface level point. but even then, i think too much of the fandom still misinterprets remus' character in a way that, they seem to understand different traits of his, but the way they execute it is still way off from what we see in canon.

(rest of the essay under the cut!)

for example, the biggest thing i see people get wrong would be the way they write remus "lol random" personality. it's true that remus tends to say whatever he wants at any given moment. but, the problem here is that people tend to think remus as random in function. i have no better way to describe this succinctly, so to expound: while remus tends to make left-field jokes a lot, he is shown to be incredibly deliberate, cunning, committed, and intelligent in very subtle ways.

truth is, remus is very goal-oriented, and when he has a goal, oh he strives for that goal. so far, i'm writing this with the last 5 years episode being the most recent substantial episode, so i can't really 100% say all my assumptions of remus are true. actually, i think the upcoming season finale will be the missing link when it comes to providing us with the whole picture of who remus is.

as for now, i just have to stick with my theory of; remus, as a side of thomas' heavily connected to insecurities and mental health issues, intends to shed light on the "darker" sides of thomas because he believes them to be beneficial. throughout dwit, we see remus continuously bolster the idea that his contributions are useful for thomas. this continues in wtit, but with the extra layer of remus wanting logan as well to be in touch with the darker parts of himself to get thomas in line.

it is also heavily implied that remus is well in on whatever janus' plan is to get thomas to be a.) more aware of his mental health issues, and b.) to get thomas to break out of his catholic black and white thinking. in forbidden fruit, it's janus who’s seen permitting remus to present himself to thomas. bigger evidence though, as i've mentioned in the previous paragraph, is the way remus seems to deliberately want logan to manifest his anger against thomas.

of course, we can always say that remus taunted logan "just for fun", but i feel like too much of what happened in wtit seem to point to remus having deeper reasons. for example, wtit exhibits how bad thomas' mental health is to the point that he gets irrationally angry at nico for not replying to his texts. this proves how thomas has been neglecting his mental health, and with the way patton, virgil, and roman held onto toxic selfless ideologies for the longest time, thomas would still, naturally, be lost on what to do. he would even seem to deny how bad things have gotten, especially with the way he acts like nothing bad is happening when he goes to his date with nico.

why am i emphasizing this? well, it's because something i find interesting about remus' character is how deeply cognizant he is of thomas' problems. what i mean by this is, no other side can call out thomas' issues more than remus can. i wrote an essay about this before if you want to check this out, but tldr: remus, as intrusive thoughts, is the most perceptive out of all the sides when it comes to calling out insecurities or problems. we see this come to fruition in wtit when all of the traps he laid out for thomas involved nico in some capacity.

while you can interpret his character as evil for preying on others’ insecurities, i think it's important to acknowledge that, in a sea of people who tend to refuse to talk about their issues, remus is the main guy who constantly brings them to the table. whether remus' intentions are good or not, there's no denying that remus' importance as a side lies in the fact that he serves as a mental health alarm clock for thomas. with the way none of the sides want to communicate with each other, we need someone like remus to cut the bullshit and say things as it is. 

again, we don't really know if he wants to help thomas. but i would like to emphasize that, yes, remus is not dumb. he does not merely make lewd jokes and calls it a day. he has the long-term goal of making everyone talk about more "taboo" topics with each other, and this includes talking about personal grievances the sides tend to suppress or refuse to talk about. lewd jokes are just part of the process.

i think this goal of his is also incredibly visible with the way remus treated logan in wtit. wtit is my favorite sanders sides episode because there's just so much to analyze between remus and logan, but you can check my other essays in regards to that. the main thing i wanted to point out is that what remus says to logan in the end, "woowee logan, now you're speaking my language. but who do you really want to scream that at?", proves he is more deliberate and cunning than he seems.

a lovely bit of analysis my friend orb (@orbmanson7) provided is that remus didn't just pop up in wtit to intervene with thomas' plans. he was there to intervene with logan's. if you've seen my other essays, i've talked about how logan as a side has been dwindling in terms of self-confidence and assertion. this has left a big problem of thomas being more reliant on his emotions, making him ignore the suggestions given by logan that may help with thomas' mental health in the long run. this is not to villainize thomas' mental health crisis, btw. all i want to say is that, remus recognizes how logan's self-restriction is doing no good and deliberately wants to push logan to become more assertive and angry.

that is why he says logan is speaking his language. he wants logan to recognize the merit in the way remus grabs thomas' attention. he wants logan to be like him and cause more havoc. again, we never know how much remus genuinely wants to help thomas, but we know that remus wants everyone to be more exposed to "taboo" things, and this includes logan being more in touch with his angrier side.

besides that, i'd like to mention how, in general, remus tends to be very committed to his goals more than how the fandom typically portrays him? in dwit, remus' main goal was to disturb thomas and the other sides. it's kind of just an introduction to his character. we're not sure if it's part of a bigger plan he and janus devised to get thomas to take care of himself better, but it is a possibility. the only time he gets too random is when logan begins picking apart his arguments. there we see remus only results to super left-field, continuous off-tangent jokes when he's desperate or placed in a lose-lose situation.

another, in wtit, we see how remus understands how to make very long, complicated traps. i think it's a perfect encapsulation of his personality, actually! throughout the episode, we see him make these multilayered traps with a ton of props and preparation just so he can bother thomas with it. it shows that remus is actually less impulsive-oriented as he seems. he even created a schedule he showed to logan detailing everything he wanted to do that day. again, deliberate! he is deliberate and very smart!

other thing i'd like to harken back to is the idea that he's in cahoots with the other dark sides to execute some Big Plan to break thomas out of his black and white thinking. while we don't know how orange acts like yet, we're Very familiar with janus by this point and we can see how long-drawn janus' plan of acceptance is. he's, again, sorry to use the word so many times, very deliberate. i don't even think his plan ends with svs.r, because it does seem like remus is well in on this plan too. in the 5 years video, he also seems to know more than thomas on what else is to come for the future of sanders sides, which implies he has some plans up his sleeve that no one else knows about. like i said, janus has the goal to break thomas out of his black and white thinking. and so far from what we've seen from remus, he also wants the same!

an important factor of remus' character besides his deliberateness is his general need to subvert what "goodness" means. "good and bad are all made up nonsense," he sings in forbidden fruit. throughout dwit he continuously criticizes everything thomas thinks is good or acceptable. in the 5 years video, he argues about how there's no "correct way of sitting". i think this also proves how remus is important as a side because, while not every single one of his beliefs are morally acceptable, he is still able to pick morality apart in a way the other sides are unable to. also, i just think this proves his character as just. generally smart? he's able to pick apart the status quo and moral philosophies, of course he's smart.

just to pick up on a previous point, remus is scarily perceptive. i mentioned this earlier with how remus is able to pick logan apart, but i'd like to add onto it more since i think a lot of people underestimate how crazily perceptive he is. for one, despite not being too close with a bunch of the other sides, he seems to be able to read their insecurities and play them against them really well. we see it in the way he uses virgil's insecurities of being an ex-dark side against him. we see it in the way he picks on patton and thomas' morality crisis against them. we see it in the way roman describes remus as someone being able to show him things he doesn't like about himself. and most importantly, we see it in the way remus constantly reaps the fact that logan isn't listened to to the point that logan snaps. as intrusive thoughts, remus' job is to see what deepest darkest secrets thomas and the sides suppress and use it against them.

at the moment, we don't really know if remus has any weaknesses, although wtit sort of implies that he himself is also quite irritated by the fact that thomas doesn't listen to him. he does a good way of hiding, though, how much of that problem is genuinely affecting him. it makes me think he's also smart in the way he's able to hide his vulnerabilities and true intentions from the other side. he's silly and goofy and lewd and because of that, everyone thinks he's harmless. the sides think he's unserious, and so does the fandom. but deep down, remus really isn't that stupid. 

and LASTLY, when beta reading this essay, orb also mentioned to me about how remus possesses cognitive flexibility in a way roman doesn’t. this isn’t meant to discredit roman of course, but i think it’s important to mention that remus is the side with the least amount of restrictions when it comes to creative liberties. orb mentioned to me how remus is able to connect concepts easily in a way roman doesn’t because remus doesn’t operate under the same self-restrictive mindset. while this obviously would help thomas become more innovative as a creative, i think it’s also important to recognize how much thomas kind of needs it in general. much of the latter half of the series shows thomas dealing with restrictions, especially when it comes to doing good. it would be great benefit for thomas to be able to listen to a side who generally wants to Have a Good Time, and doesn’t abide by rules imposed onto them.

and yes that is my essay on remus 100/10 best character and is not dumb at all. very excited to see him in the finale and i hope y’all’s get your characterizations straight because i need me some good fics 

[moss-sprout]

im about to autism all over you guys about sanders sides so listen up

we all talk about Roman and how his thing is with his creative ideas and how he is more withdrawn now and tries to make himself more agreeable by just immediately dropping his suggestion if its met with rejection and start agreeing with someone else (usually Patton). But I was just thinking about how this affects c!Thomas.

Roman being Thomas' creative string and ego, he must be really insecure about his ideas and must not think that they are worth sharing because he is afraid -- but of what? Being selfish. We can see that Janus is a suppressed part of his mind (hence being a dark side), and we continuously see that Roman likes to favor the more selfish decision but he hides it because its not what the others agree with. Where did this come from though? Surely someone must have taught Thomas that this behavior was shameful, right? I mean, you don't just start feeling shame over being selfish out of nowhere.

That's where Remus comes in. Remus does represent intrusive thoughts, sure, but I do notice a lot of religious themes that come with his character; as Logan once asked Thomas: "Thomas, you are a religious man, correct?" implying that he probably had an upbringing was more christian or catholic. Religious guilt is a very real thing that is taught to people from a very young age; that's its shameful, sinful really, to have such selfish desires (or even "disturbing" thoughts, if Remus' existence is anything to go by)

If Thomas were to actually accept Remus and not think of him as some anomaly in his brain that shouldn't be there, and realize Remus is just as important as a side as the rest of them, then he can steps towards healing that religious guilt and accepting himself, which in turn can actually boost Roman's confidence!! Accepting Remus as a side will literally help Roman's character development and could help him feel less shame and insecurity about his ideas since Thomas would be able to unlearn his shame by embracing his dark sides.

Anyways, this post was most likely already made by someone else but I couldn't stop thinking about it and I *needed* to put my thoughts somewhere because the autism was going crazyyyyy

Tell me your thoughts in the comments!! I'd love to read them!! :3

[clinically-obssessed]

Remus' Purpose

So far in Sanders Sides, we have seen that two of "dark sides" - Virgil and Janus - are just as essential to Thomas as the "light sides." Without Virgil, Thomas has no motivation, and Janus introduces an element of self-preservation that would otherwise be absent. But what about Remus? So far, all we know is that he represents intrusive thougts, but we have not yet seen in what way he helps Thomas. And it's not immediately obvious that he does at all: the two episodes in which he appears as a major character portray him as pathological, focusing on strategies to help Thomas cope with and avoid intrusive thoughts. But I think, given the show's increasing attention to Patton's overly strict ethical rules, Remus will play a key role in helping Thomas accept himself and change his attitude toward morality

In his introductory song, Remus sings a number of lines that relate to morality. He begins with a Biblical allusion, drawing a parallel between Adam and Eve eating the forbidden fruit and Thomas learning about Remus. He says, "Adam and Eve bought knowledge for the small price of a little sin," framing Thomas' own pursuit of self-knowledge as a transaction that requires him to break his moral rules. Later in the song, he states that "Good and bad are all made up nonsense" and that "everybody cheats, everybody lies, so why deny yourself knowledge?" which attempts to justify Thomas' descent into sin. This is further reinforced by Remus' assertion that "these kinds of things are only thought in the mind of a man whose soul is truly rotten," which is intended to dispel Thomas' self-image as morally righteous. In Remus' view, what is holding Thomas back from understanding himself and reaching his full creative potential is that he is too caught up in false notions of morality, and it is only by dropping these pretenses that he can truly achieve his goals.

At this point, you should be screaming, "Whoa! That sounds exactly like the philosophy of Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche (1844-1900)!" That is precisely because I've described it in a way that is intentionally similar to the philosophy of Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche (1844-1900). I think that drawing this parallel will allow us to understand the character's direction. Nietzsche was a highly influential philosopher because of his rejection of most things everyone else - even philosophers - took for granted. His writing is complex and difficult to interpret - likely intentionally so - but one of his most famous ideas is that morality is subjective. He criticized Christian morality as "slave morality", claiming that it celebrates weakness and keeps people from achieving their true potential. Additionally, he believed that the metaphysical claims of Christianity were becoming less and less believable in the face of advancements in science and philosophy, so Christian ethics no longer had any grounding either. Instead, he says, it is up to every individual person to give their life meaning. To him, there is no objective truth, only each person's will to power. In this new world that can no longer find answers in God, everyone must strive toward an ideal known as the ubermensch, or "overman," a person who is able to overcome their own weaknesses, create new things, and affirm all aspects of life.

The similarities between Nietzsche and Remus are clear. Both embrace self-understanding, value creativity, and reject moral systems as barriers to achieving one's goals. Furthermore, they share a particular orientation toward controversy. Nietzsche's work is filled with contradictions, and his style is exaggerated and extreme, suggesting that his writings do not form a logically coherent philosophical system or even necessarily reflect his own beliefs but are rather intended to challenge societal norms and promote critical thinking. In the same way, Remus intentionally gives Thomas uncomfortable and disgusting thoughts which he knows will contradict Thomas' morality in order to force him to question his values and assumptions about himself.

With this in mind, it seems likely that Remus will play a major role in the finale. The arc of the show has been focused heavily on the idea of morality, and as "Putting Others First" revealed, Patton's standards are only hurting Thomas' mental health. Janus made the case for the importance of self-care using psychology, but his argument is not fully convincing. As Roman pointed out, it is necessary to find a balance between selfishness and selflessness, and Janus does not answer his question of "When is it enough?" Therefore, it may be necessary for Remus to come in and force Thomas to confront the fact that Patton's morality is not only hurting him but it is based on false premises to begin with. By bringing ugly realities to the surface, Remus will challenge Thomas to stop passively accepting the moral codes that have been handed down to him by society and to create his own meaning and values that serve him.

[amazable01]

God, I've been thinking about Remus and Patton in canon, but I haven't known what to say, but now with the finale being worked on, I feel like this is a good time to talk about this. Cause if you go back with a fresh mind (blocking out fanon concepts and just watching the actual material), Remus and Patton don't hate each other at all. In fact, in a platonic/foil kind of way, I think they complete each other, and work well together like Roman and Logan.

Remus never once in canon has insulted Patton. He has offered up uncomfortable ideas, but if anything, Remus has encouraged Patton. He gives him a creative blessing for sanitizing, and seems genuinely confused and surprised when Logan brings up Patton being an issue. Remus and Patton also bounce off one another, what with the creative thing in DWIT, but also in the asides with the "kill-joyman" bit and their interactions in the incorrect quotes (and who can forget the air fryer and Remus being genuinely excited and curious about it). Remus never intentionally goes after Patton, and when you would expect him to lash out at Morality, it's said to the group instead of him directly.

And if you look at Remus' few appearances in canon, Patton's presence actually seems to temper him slightly. DWIT, WMPG (Christmas 2023), incorrect quotes, and the asides are VERY light compared to WTIT. While you could call it a change in approach, it's really not. Remus always behaves this way toward Logan specifically, and in WTIT he is intentionally pushing the other far beyond his comfort. Patton not being brought up to help the issue intentionally makes Logan's problem with Remus worse. Which implies Remus does change his behavior slightly around Patton.

But, if Sanders Sides has shown anything across its run, it's to not underestimate the intelligence of any approach or person, regardless of how smart they appear on the surface.

So if Remus was trying to stoke what he imagines is important, he's not going to intentionally kill Thomas' drive by driving him to the brink. I think a lot of people forget that Patton is passion, not Roman. Roman is romantic and creative, but Patton is the actual feeling of passion and motivation for a project. And without that, Roman (and likely Remus) are just thoughts that get lost. And so it makes perfect sense for Remus to not actually hate Patton. Because Patton has never done anything to him, and is the only way that Remus can actually have his thoughts voiced out.*

*Remember that the Split is not canonical or confirmed. There's nothing saying that something like that happened, as Logan said it was "Like an ovum" which would imply this was how they were born. On top of this, if Remus was mad at anyone for separating out the sides like the Split implies, it would be Janus because he decided what was allowed and safe to be known. Patton probably was a contributing factor, but knowing how Patton reacts to changes in environment and nostalgia, I doubt Patton would've actively chosen to change something so drastically. I could make a whole post about this and why the Split isn't really corroborated in canon, but that's another discussion for another time.

[let-roman-bite-someone]

this is something i’ve been ruminating on ever since WTIT came out.

i’ve been thinking about this connection for a while. Virgil’s anxiety can lead to cognitive distortions if taken too far (a.k.a if Thomas beats himself up over something) and these cognitive distortions are Remus’s creations. this is interesting, it’s interesting to see how Virgil’s and Remus’s roles overlap and almost compliment each other, but in an unhealthy way.

but this just makes it all the more confusing as to why Virgil wasn’t present in WTIT, and why he seemed so unbothered in the endcard. i once aired this confusion on here and most people said that it was like Logan in Moving On, Virgil was still present within Thomas, he just didn’t take a physical form.

this doesn’t make sense to me because when Logan sunk out, Thomas had trouble thinking logically at first. he gets around to it eventually, but it’s clear that while Logan wasn’t completely gone, his disappearance made a significant impact on the group. Virgil was having a panic attack, Roman was urging Thomas to act on impulse, Patton was confused and lost.

it’s clear this is not the case in WTIT. in an episode that is so heavily centered around anxiety and - dare i say - paranoia, it’s baffling that Virgil was almost completely unaffected. especially since, again, he seemed fine in the end card. he was a little bitter towards Patton, but that’s all.

i’m just curious as to whether there was a canonical reason for this. for why Virgil wasn’t involved in an episode where Thomas was constantly panicking over dangers that might take place.

especially since,

1. Thomas is worried about something Virgil has mentioned before, being alone/losing his loved ones.

2. Thomas did something that Virgil has canonically been shown to care about in the past - not following up on his plans to be productive.

3. fake!Nico says WORD FOR WORD what Virgil suggested during the debate - AND both scenarios were about a potential love interest not replying to Thomas’s text.

of course, Virgil has greatly improved since the negative thinking episode, but he is still anxiety. and Thomas is still an anxious person. and Thomas was visibly freaking out throughout WTIT so it’s really really unlikely that Virgil was just in the backseat for that episode.

Logan temporarily “leaving” (but still being present) in Moving On makes sense because it was an emotional episode, and Thomas needed to sort things out with his emotional sides a.k.a Patton, Roman and Virgil (mainly Patton). there was logic involved but it wasn’t a logic-centric episode.

WTIT was 100% an anxiety-centric episode.

i doubt that this was accidental. there are so many direct parallels and callbacks, it had to be intentional. there’s no way Thomas and crew just forgot that Virgil played a crucial role in creating cognitive distortions. i think there’s something deeper here, there must be a reason why Virgil wasn’t present for this episode and how he seemed so nonchalant when he did appear. there’s absolutely no way Virgil was just “present within Thomas” and didn’t feel the need to show up in person.

[part-time-zombie]

I really like this little thing right here, give me a second.

Remus clearly loves the nickname thomas gave him, especially since it was used to show similarity to roman.

Even better, it's an obvious reference to romans own nickname "princey". Thomas is confirming to remus that he and roman are still alike (even if only by a little) and will be treated similarly.

Remus is no idiot. He knows the nickname wasn't intended kindly towards him, but it's still a nickname like the others have, it almost makes him an official part of the group now.

When it's brought up again, he wants to include himself even more by giving roman a new nickname too. Now, just like "dukey", roman can be called "pissy" as a crude take on his own title in the same manner as remus. Roman clearly wasn't pleased by this, but I don't think it was intended on being mean by remus.

I think he just wanted to be his brothers other half again, he wanted to find another thing they can have in common.

[tentacle-therapissed]

Thinking a lot about the significance of Patton representing both c!Thomas’s feelings and his morality. Because it’s been made very clear that c!Thomas’s way of dividing the facets of himself cannot be universally applied to everyone, and the thing is that one’s morality being based on their emotions is very much not the case for everyone. There’s a reason ethos and pathos are two separate appeals in the rhetorical triangle, yet in Sanders Sides the pathos guy also represent c!Thomas’s ethics.

Think about it; every Side has their own unique moral code based on what they represent. The fact that they all have different viewpoints on what they believe is the best thing to do is the reason they have arguments like SvS in the first place. But despite this, Patton is the only side who actually represents Thomas’s morality. Roman and Logan both personally believe it is best for Thomas to go to the callback but encourage him to go to the wedding anyway because that’s what Patton believes is the right thing to do, and therefore that’s also what c!Thomas believes is the right thing to do. One’s ethics could just as feasibly be based in logical reasoning (what is the best course of action based on facts, statistics, and probability?) or self-preservation (what is the best course of action to fulfill my needs and desires?) or even idealism. But Thomas’s are based on his feelings. See a cute dog? Adopt it, the poor thing needs a home. Friends need help with something? Oh, you love your friends, they’re so wonderful! They deserve everything you could possibly offer them. Homelessness is sad, volunteer at your local soup kitchen. Violence is disturbing, shut it down!! It doesn’t matter if what you’re doing isn’t logically sound, or if it’s creatively unfulfilling, or if it serves to your own personal detriment; You should do what feels right. And considering natural law is the basis of Catholic moral theology, it makes perfect sense for him to associate his morals with an intrinsic part of him like his emotions rather than a conscious thought process. Plenty of us do not subscribe to natural law theory, however, and if I were making my own Sides I very much would not have my morality Side and emotions Side be one and the same.

But it’s not just Patton, is it? Roman represents Thomas’s hopes, dreams, and passions because most of Thomas's passions, career, and hobbies are creatively focused. But every Side also has their own motivations. Their own passions. Their own reasoning skills. Their own fears. Their own anger. Yet not all of them represent Thomas’s passions. Thomas’s reasoning. Thomas’s fears. Thomas’s anger. What would happen if Thomas’s passions were more aligned with Logan’s role? If his ethics were more aligned with Janus’s role?  If his punctuality was more aligned with Virgil’s role?

And what would it look like if c!Thomas’s anger was somehow most aligned with Logan’s role?

[sagesparrow394]

So I heard it’s Mother’s Day in the US, so in honour of that, here’s a very late and mildly unhinged analysis of what roles in the family the Sides claim in the 5th Anniversary video

Patton - “I’m the dad”

In the ‘traditional nuclear family’ (ew) the father is typically seen as the head of the household, the breadwinner, the one with authority. This reflects how Patton has always had a position of authority among the core sides, with Thomas often putting his say first and relying very heavily on his opinion. However, much like how the idea of the father being the head of the household is outdated and problematic, so is the position of authority Patton is put in, which we’ve already begun to see. It’s time Thomas puts less pressure on Patton. Maybe even go to the ‘other half’ of the couple…

Logan - “Why am I the mom? What gender roles are we pushing here?”

Most notably, he is the only one who does not choose his role in the family. Patton is the one to assign Logan the role of mom, while Logan’s own feelings and thoughts on the matter are ignored. This reflects the issues he’s been dealing with throughout recent episodes, being ignored and overlooked. The fact he is in the mom role furthers this, with again, in the ‘traditional nuclear family’ (ew) the mother’s work and suffering often being overlooked, because she is simply doing ‘what is expected’ of her.

Roman - “I’m the son, the hotshot, who’s only dream… is to be a star”

Being “the son” of among the ‘Light’ sides potentially links to Roman’s feelings of inferiority, believing he has less power in Thomas’ life compared to Patton and Logan - not surprising after POF. And his sad tone when talking about his dreams links to his feelings of being failure, both with the whole callback debacle and Thomas literally becoming a star, and just generally in his desire to be seen as Thomas’ hero.

Virgil - “I know you think I’m the son, but I’m not. I’ll be the gay emo cousin.”

Virgil immediately starts by separating himself from the rest of the core four, placing himself outside of the immediate family. This links to both his current strain against Patton, but also his insecurities after revealing himself as having once been a ‘Dark Side’. He no longer feels like he belongs with the ‘Light’ Sides, as was affirmed in the first episode of season 2. Rather, he puts himself in the immediate family of the other ‘Dark Sides’.

Remus - “I feel like I’m a fresh out of jail uncle.”

“Fresh out jail” equals new to the group. No one knows much about him or what exactly his deal is, since he hasn’t been around long. However, what they do know is he’s come from “jail” - aka, was repressed for being bad creativity. Therefore, they instantly have a negative bias against him and assume the worst.

Janus - “And I’m the sassy aunt. Who talks shit about everyone…”

Despite being ‘accepted’ by Thomas and opening up about his name at the end of POF, he still positions himself with the ‘Dark Sides’ and not the ‘Light’ ones. This could mean two things:

1) He has still not fully been accepted by Thomas,

Or 2) He doesn’t personally see himself as ‘with them’. Whether because he knows full well the ‘Light and Dark’ dichotomy is meaningless, or because he doesn’t trust them back, or because not all of the ‘Light’ sides accept him yet, we don’t know.

Him “talking shit about everyone” is also notable. He is the one who can see the problems among the core four, viewing them from the outside. He knows their weaknesses, struggles and issues - and he is going to make them apparent, so that they and Thomas can finally deal with them.

Thank you for coming to my TEDTalk.

[clydesavage-thefox147]

[Part 2 to Big Long Awaited Theories. This one is a bit..Roman slandering so be warned, be civil and hear me out here please, sorry if it's a bit jumbled heh] (Part 1 here)

Unpopular opinion/theory here but:

I think Roman sided against the callback because if he picked it, he would be supporting Janus who was seen as a villain at the time by everyone else, so he wanted to avoid any more affiliation. His need to be the hero and feed his broken ego was bigger than achieving a life-long dream.

Don't believe me? Then what does this line mean?

Furthering this belief, there's a notable pattern throughout season 2, particularly to start with Fitting in. When Roman was assigned the role of Slytherin in the group, he was rather taken back. He refused to believe it because he pushed the understanding that Slytherins were evil. This then followed with him saying "I'm not evil!" then Virgil(in a pretty Janus sounding tone) saying "Says who?". (Also coincidence how the snake affiliated house gets called evil here).

Then cut to the episode CLBG. I find it quite funny that Roman felt like Janus used him during this episode even though Roman himself was the one who stated FIRST that acting was like lying AND started the idea of disguising as Joan to help Thomas practice. Janus only nudged him to do it on a stage. Then later into the episode, Roman states about Janus "I hate this guy and his creepy snake face, however he is very kind". First off, making fun of Janus for his snake traits that he has little to no control over having. And two, blatantly admitting that he believed Janus' flattery. He left the window wide open for what happened later in SvS.

Speaking of, in SvS, it was clear that Roman wanted the callback desperately and so did Thomas. Roman is part of Thomas' personal dreams and goals. Janus knows this. Roman was willing to give Janus the benefit of the doubt and let him explain his side of the situation which Virgil obviously wasn't too happy with. Throughout the court case, Janus' flattery was his way of keeping Roman on his side, the best overall decision that was the callback while simultaneously pointing out the denials of all the other sides and Thomas. He eventually got so fed up of them beating around the bush that he made Thomas finally admit that he wanted to pick the callback instead. Like I said before, Janus knew this beforehand so he did low-key rigged the case in favor of the callback choice. This is a positive form of manipulation called a "Contrivance". Something meticulously planned piece by piece in favor of a desired outcome. Virgil I guess was right about it being rigged. But, when all was said and done and Janus was so close to winning the case, Roman pulled out last minute, making Janus reasonably angry. Roman stated "It is my sworn duty to help Thomas achieve his hopes and dreams, but Thomas wouldn't dream of attaining his hopes through deceitful means" following with Janus pleading that that wasn't true. But, Roman's line proves that he picked the wedding to avoid committing what was believed to be a selfish act. You can see how desperate Janus was for the others to see his perspective, even benching Logan in the process to have his lesson heard instead(then did it again in POF). Janus wanted the others to see that they were blowing this simple problem out of proportion but no one cared. He knew the answer was obvious but everyone refused to agree.

Then cut to DWIT, the following episode where Remus was debuted for the first time. Many believed that Remus was sent out, out of pettiness on Janus' part which could be possible. If Roman wanted to be a good person, Janus was going to show him(and Thomas) that it wasn't so easy. Remus made Roman realize and admit that he doesn't want to end up like him. Furthering why I think he made the decision he did.

Then cut to Healthy Distractions, where I find it funny is that here's Roman trying to avoid villainy...but commits petty theft and voter fraud. Roman literally said "I was gonna rig the vote anyway". So much for trying to avoid what he literally talked about an episode prior. Sure, he could've stolen the hat out of a joke but it still is petty(both be petty bitches).

Then..cut to POF: SvS Redux. This is where a lot of this come into play. One noticable thing is within the song. Not only was the line I previously stated there but the lines leading up to it paint a different picture.

Ro: "And no one wanted you to go more than the that slimy snake"

Th: "Who pushed to do the egocentric thing auditioning" (Ro: "Yep that's Deceit!")

Now, correct me if I'm wrong..but don't you have to audition before you get a callback? And isn't Roman the physical representation of Thomas' Ego? And didn't Janus point out Egoism in SvS? AND didn't Thomas called Roman " a bit of an egoist" in the 2017 behind the scene vid? Yes. All yes. So, this can only mean that Janus, in the few months that he and Roman were on decent terms with one another, must've influenced him to get Thomas to audition(or influence Thomas to get Roman involved) since Janus is a part of the 'selfish desires'. In this case, Janus is within his right to be mad at Roman. He spent time setting up the perfect end-goal for Thomas here as a show of good faith and intentions, but Roman shoved it aside because the other sides believed Janus' was still no good.

Then after the song, when Patton was struggling with his rhetoric of morality, some moments seemed to correspond with the court case. Two of these moments Roman himself brought up in conversation. Roman stated the view of how it shouldn't matter why the prince saved the kingdom as long as the citizens are safe(in this case the prince did it for a reward). However, Patton didn't like that conclusion, claiming that that doesn't make the prince a good person. Which then prompted Roman to respond with somber expression "Yeah probably not". Roman wants to avoid any villainous affiliations. But, he also wants the praise of being a hero for his own external validation which he's desperate for(no wonder Janus' flattery almost worked). His reward was that praise and he got that for a short time.

But, according to Patton, this is a selfish act. Roman has stated that he is "a proponent of following one's heart" It would make sense to appease the heart and morality to remain on his good side. However, Roman said shortly after "if it's not helping to fulfilling one's longing, then what is the point?" Patton wasn't fulfilling Thomas' goal of finally being a star. Roman didn't really like that. But, to avoid upsetting Patton, he followed along with him. Hell, Patton was the one who gave Thomas the inspiration to even start video creation. Another incentive for Roman to follow along with him. Double Hell, Roman initially didn't like Patton's idea of using puppets back in LNTAO but then immediately flipped script which Virgil pointed out. Patton definitely contributed to Roman's final decision on the wedding. Roman thought that he was the problem for making Thomas want a 'selfish desire' over friendship, even though this desire wasn't really a big issue at all(and he sent Thomas to wedding as punishment for wanting said desire). Which prompted Patton to beg for Roman to stay on his support team. No wonder when Patton started to view Janus in a different light, Roman got immediately defensive, trying to push that Janus was evil and he wasn't. He didn't want to feel like his decision was for nothing but it ultimately was. Janus states "it served no one" after giving Roman some credit for his sacrifice. But, if that sacrifice was for the praise and glory of the others for his heroism...that's just as selfish as going to the callback. No wonder Roman was upset when Patton thought it was bad. So, why is Roman mad at Janus when he should direct some of his anger at Patton for contributing to his final decision and the moral confusion. Is he afraid of hurting his feelings? Also tagging on, the same episode he said he followed the heart, Roman said that Patton should only stick to knowing the difference between right and wrong and leaving the rest to them...well, look where that took them. Lead Patton to guilt Roman into making him feel bad for pushing Thomas to be dishonest and dishonorable which just made him more confused.

The second thing being that Roman stated the Trolly Problem. The situation of deciding to save the larger group of people or the one person. Roman did this exact same thing the court room. He had to pick between siding with the others (the larger group) on the wedding..or side with the one person(Janus on the callback). He picked the former and let Janus get hit metaphorically.

It all collimated in the final scene between him and Janus. Janus being vulnerable with revealing his name as an attempt to gain trust..all to get laughed at and made fun of. Janus retaliated with the now infamous line "Thank God you don't have a moustache, otherwise between you and Remus, I wouldn't know who the evil twin is". Roman couldn't take it. He can dish out all these insults but the second it's him who's insulted he shuts down or gets pissy right back. However, maybe Janus was right with his statement. I mean, there's been only two confirmed times Roman was ever influenced by Remus. One was the "Naked Aunt Patty" line from the 12 Days of Christmas vid and the bubbagump shrimp line in the carol itself. But, there's been moments where it seems that Roman had no influence from him and it was all his wording. Like how he responded to Janus' pinata metaphor with "I believe he's saying that you beat someone up and rob their unconscious body". Or how in one scene in CLBG, as Joan, he stated "-like your weird habit of gluing your butt cheeks together". Or how in Moving On pt 2, he was all about that butt dial lie and wouldn't stop. And finally, remembering way back to the QnA, when they were asked if they all had YouTube channels, Roman said quote "Epic fail compilations of all the horrible deaths my enemies incur after I impale them". Roman...wanted to film himself..killing people..to post on YouTube. For what? To laugh? To gloat? Does this not sound creepy to any of you? And just adding his petty theft and vote rigging and all his bullying insults up to now...yeah Janus' retort holds a lot of weight.

Another note is that Roman has been getting pretty close with Virgil lately. What's noticable here is that Roman's might be playing favorites. Notice how when both Virgil and Janus revealed their names, they were both equally vulnerable. Virgil revealed his name because he had already gained trust with the others but Janus did it to gain trust with them. Roman gave Virgil congrats for his admittance and bravery and only laughed at the Virgin joke Patton said. But, Roman laughed and insulted Janus? Even though both Janus and Virgil are of dark side origin? What makes Virgil more special? Especially when Roman hated Virgil to begin with and now they're best buddies...then he supported Janus at first and now flat out hates him. He pulled an Ono reverse card on them. Roman mainly chilling with Virgil now because they both hate Janus is definitely 'the enemy of my enemy is my friend'. Hell, in FWSA, Roman and Virgil were calling Thomas a liar constantly after he accepted Janus. Meanwhile if Roman continued to do so, he would be in the same boat. Mind you, only Patton has accepted Janus completely. Thomas and Logan are 50/50, and Roman and Virgil are against it entirely.

Janus is aware of the others' denials, lies and desires. He's aware that Roman is in denial. Roman wants to believe he made the right decision but he knows he didn't. He keeps moping and whining over how he wants to be happy and achieve his dreams but he lost that opportunity because he made a stupid sacrifice. If he was confident in his choice, he wouldn't be acting this way. Janus knew Roman would be hurt if they missed the callback. And him behaving this way long after just proves it. Janus said right to his face in the court room "You want that callback so back and it will CRUSH you if we miss it". This was true. And if Roman were to say that he did make a good decision he'd basically be lying and stooping to Janus' level. So both ways he's screwed and played. Roman is also very fraudulent when it comes to his facade. He likes to act like he's this brave prince who isn't insecure and can handle his problems alone when that is clearly a lie. Janus wants Roman to be honest with both himself and the others, the others know by now that Roman is very insecure so what else is there left to hide? Janus would know about facades..and he sees right through Roman's and so does everyone else. Tagging in here, Janus' 'wroammin' spelling meant 'remorse' signifying that Roman was giving Janus sympathy while also showing Roman's imposter syndrome(alongside other times he corrected people on his name). This wasn't Janus insulting his name first, this was him proving a point.

To add on, Roman turned to Janus after he said "I thought I was your hero" and Thomas replying "You are". Roman trusted Janus' confirmation. Janus' nod was confirming that Thomas is telling the truth but Roman only believing Janus was lying, he took it as Janus confirming Thomas was lying. Or, Janus was sadly confirming that Thomas was in fact lying. But I think the former is most likely. Roman now believes he lost his "hero" title..which honestly might be a good thing, maybe he'll try to earn it back in a very honorable way without letting the power go to his head. His bullying and grandiose behavior was his way of making himself feel important when he deeply felt like he wasn't good enough. Roman is so desperate for external validation because he can't love himself without it and Janus is trying to tell him that. Quit acting like you love yourself and actually..do so.

In conclusion, I believe Janus was more in the right here but if we must compromise, they both must reach an understanding and an apology. My theory stands that Roman sided against Janus to avoid any further association for the reward of heroic praise.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk. Feel free to correct me or change my mind if you so please but remain civil.

Part 3 soon.. maybe.