#queer ships in general if you look at media really

[anerol152]

If anyone is wondering, thinking about these two has taken over my full attention today (past few days really) so any quality posting on this or my Dracula acc is postponed until tomorrow at the earliest

[musical-chick-13]

ANYWAY. "I don't like m/f relationships being explored in fiction because they aren't queer :(" Is the absolute coldest take, for one straight trans people exist, for another I am a whole bisexual woman, if I ever date a man, that is not going to be a "cishet relationship" because I am not and never will be "straight" thanks for your time.

[quixoticprince]

Yayyy!! Yippee!! I finally get to make one of these!! Art without the text under the cut and some long-winded elaborations:

How long I've been playing: well, it hasn't been a straight 11 years, rather off and on - but I have drawings of these guys dating back to when I was 14, so I'll give it to me. And man I had no business reading the fanfics I was reading back then It's also crazy how this was a super influential media for me in so many ways. It's the reason I ever made a tumblr, it changed the direction of my drawings for a long while, my broken sense of humor (gmod animation memes and yt poops were the brainrot back then), tf2 Sniper changed my god damned gender (rather, it was the inspiration for me to start socially transitioning at 15). This is part of my personal lore that I tend to not admit to 😓

Your main: I've always been completely ass at the game, and I can play flexibly, but I enjoy playing Sniper, and more recently as Heavy. Whenever I'm sitting around somewhere, occasionally throwing sandwiches and attracting Medics, I feel like this:

Favorite character: When I was younger it was definitely Medic, and I think you can tell that he's still up there based on how much I've drawn him! However, since getting back into it, I've felt quite a shift in focus towards Heavy, very strongly. It's unfortunate that he's side-lined in a lot of fanwork, and I think I'm also complicit in this so far - but for me it's cuz, how tf2 works is that it's going to prioritize humor over character and consistency haha, and Medic is just so loud and insane that he's really easy to make fun stuff with. Heavy is a more serious and grounded character, not to say that he's not funny or that he doesn't have his own cartoon slapstick moments! But that aspect of him is what is really really intriguing to me. I love his quiet, stoic, and intimidating character, I like how loud and boisterous he is when filled with bloodlust in contrast! I love his bird story and him getting into wrestling as a child from Poker Night. I love his back story setting, there's so much to extrapolate from a young boy in Russia growing up during WWII, what his parents must have been through before that from the aftermaths of the revolution, all the way to his fathers execution and his imprisonment. I love his strong relationship with his family, his role as an older brother, as a protector, as a man - the way that he performs these roles - and because I personally see him as bisexual - how his orientation intersects with all that! He is incredibly fascinating to me and I wish that he was played around with more to see a lot more corners and angles of these things that I listed! There's way more that I want to say here too but this is getting very long 😅

Character I relate to: It's so interesting that a lot of the characters have very strong, tho maybe dysfunctional, families. Heavy, Demo, and Sniper in particular really speak to me in that relation. From Heavy being an eldest brother (I am also an eldest sibling) the parentification that comes with that, especially with him probably being like 10 years older than his sisters from the looks of it. Demo and Sniper both struggle living up to their parents expectations (although there's a lot of love there from everyone), being disappointments in one way or another (not gonna deep dive into that lol), and the general alienation both of them feel. From Sniper not knowing why he's not like other Australians to Demo being "a black Scottish cyclops." And well, I'm Filipino, I'm queer, and mentally ill so - there's a lot to project there!

Class you want to play as: I find Medic incredibly stressful to play as but I find the idea of battle medics incredibly funny. However I usually find myself rushing around madly trying to cater to everyone, and I'd like to just not give a shit and just start stabbing people with a saw lol

Favorite ship: "I just like the dynamic" - The dynamic:

No but fr, they're really compelling to me, I'd probably need a longer more thought out post as to what I like about them and I was already going crazy up there ^ Overall tho I like that they're practically built for each other in terms of mechanics, really plays into my desire to spiral into intense codependency haha. I also think that Medic's drive to cheat death and hide behind meat shields plays really well into Heavy's desire to be a meat shield and a protector, and how nice it is in turn, that Medic can grant this man who's been around death, starvation, and war invulnerability. (He outsmart boolet, yknow?) They're also depicted together a lot and I like how much they enjoy each others company, and bring a lot of joy to each other. It's beautiful to me :'^)

Character you like to draw: What can I say! Medic is handsome! He is very fun to draw and easy to make memes and shit posts out of!

[0-therw-0-rldly]

I’ll preface this by saying I’m not really a shipper. I just enjoy canon couples on TV Series/films.

Terms I’d like B*ddies to remove from their vocabulary because they don’t know how to use them correctly:

Media literacy: For a group that uses this term a lot you sure do misinterpret everything in this show.

Queerbaiting: Going to expand on this one. A show that’s already been pre established for having queer characters simply cannot queerbait.

Ship baiting: While sometimes you can argue that they could be doing that, that’s only if you look at the show in a very biased manner. You might think this is the case but the general audience doesn’t think the way you do.

Ship war: This isn’t a one tree hill situation where there was Team Brooke Vs. Team Peyton where the middle guy (Lucas Scott) had canonically been with both women. This is people not understanding fanon vs. canon and not being able to just watch the show. It’s like playing quarterback on Madden and thinking you could be better than Patrick Mahomes.

Plot device: everything’s a plot device. Move tf on.

Predator: You sound like crazy MAGA supporters calling everything regarding the LGBTQIA+ community as predatory. Sit down.

Co-parenting: I know this is a big one and discourse was brought up during the hiatus. Oliver and Ryan have loosely mentioned this years ago but it was never to be taken this seriously. Do y’all even know what co-parenting is or are you that big of a donut? Buck is someone who loves his best friend deeply and by extension, his kid too. Him taking care of him frequently does not make him a co-parent. Maybe he is a parental or uncle figure, but he isn’t a co-parent. Also, I swear y’all need to learn how a will works. He is a GODPARENT, not a GUARDIAN. Stfu.

Hag: This especially applies to women, but to say that someone 25-30+ is a hag for still being in fandoms or enjoying tv shows/films is inherently misogynistic. Men are never held to this much criticism for enjoying fictional media, but women aren’t allowed to?

Queer Coding: people of the same sex “looking at each other”, hugging, or having intimate moments all together doesn’t make them queer coded. It could mean that they just love each other that deeply platonically. While representation is amazing and just because you interpret a character as queer coded (just like my ship baiting comment) doesn’t mean others interpret it that way as well. In addition, network TV has stipulations, and also actors are allowed to decline storylines. Ryan has mentioned his character is heterosexual an abundance of times which means (at least for now) that he isn’t willing to go for this storyline.

Dead naming: Y’all construing the fact that Buck wants people like coworkers and some of his former love interests, to saying Evan is his dead name is inherently transphobic because do you even understand what a dead name is? Evan Buckley is shown as being fine with being called Evan by both Tommy and his sister. I’m pretty sure some of his love interests have called him Evan as well.

Fetishizing: You guys saw two hot guys who “looked at each other” and for 6 seasons have wanted nothing but to see those two make out with each other. Those of us who enjoy Tevan saw Buck giddy at the thought of Tommy and have wanted domestic fluff for them since.

Anything to do with racism, homophobia, and misogyny: I’ve seen the way you guys have conveniently weaponized Henren and by extension Aisha/Tracie when you didn’t get the Ryan/Oliver interview, don’t try to act like you’re morally superior. Not to mention wanting a canonically gay man to die in a show and not even holding those who use your ship name to write CSA fics accountable because you’re petty and want to throw hissy fits. Anyone looking at your comments as an outsider would think you’re homophobes and yes queer people can be homophobic.

I do hope you can expand your vocabulary. 🤍

[utilitycaster]

Whenever people are like "well LIAM'S characters never faced any backlash when HE played characters in the spotlight" and "no one will let WOMEN have negative qualities" when Caleb and Vax and Orym have received pretty constant hate for main character/sadboy/scene stealing and when meta writers outright stopped talking about Imogen because a particularly mindless set of hit dogs are still hollering about how she is so good and kind and how dare you call her selfish, it's really like...in the service of trying to make your failure of a point you've just said something that literally anyone with a memory lasting longer than the apocryphal goldfish length can immediately debunk, which in turn absolutely shreds your credibility going forward, if you had it.

More generally there's something very vile here, because on the surface this statement does look like an attempt, if one ignorant of pretty much any fandom conversation, to defend women. The thing is it's come from a place of defending Dorian and Ashton's plan - a man, and a nb person who would not identify as a woman - that requires a particularly great deal of sacrifice from the women of the party. So of course they just switch tactics. Instead of "how dare the fandom not think women are always best" it's "how dare the fandom disrespect a disabled nb person and a person played by an indigenous actor." And I'm sure they'll switch again. Because pretty much every character in this campaign is on some axis of oppression, and there's a few people in this fandom who, instead of considering these things as important details that inform these characters, seem to largely treat their minority statuses as ammunition. Feminism and antiracism and queer advocacy are all just part of a shell game to them - accuse everyone who disagrees with them of being a bigot, say that their opinions are inviolate because they match that of literally any character who isn't a cis het white man, of which Bells Hells has none. Unsurprisingly, it's that social media purity culture that's just the evangelical church with a gay hat: they are always the victim, and everyone who disagrees is the devil, and being a good person always happens to line up with what you already wanted.

There are several posts from the past day or so accusing people of liking Campaign 3 less than the two previous ones which refused to accept that this might be due to the hurry-up-and-receive-an-infodump pacing, the singular focus without much time spent on backstory, the gaps in party composition, and the fact that the plot manages to combine the weakest elements of each campaign - the fetch quest/NPC guidance heavy nature of C1, and the meandering/slow start of C2. No, it must be the awful, sinful fandom unable to handle the lack of a major M/M ship (false; Dorian and Orym aren't canon, but neither were Vax and Gilmore, and the latter was sunk far sooner) and the fact that a female character is at the center of the story (see above re: how hostile the same people making these accusations have been to anyone who actually wants to discuss Imogen in a way that doesn't fit their specifications). Just to repeat this: many fans have outlined a number of purely narrative and structural reasons why C3 isn't working for them. These people have assumed this is all a lie, because assuming otherwise that would require either addressing these critiques, which in turn would require admitting other people can have valid opinions that oppose their own without being horrible bigots - in favor of throwing out whatever random accusations they think might stick. It doesn't matter what's actually being said; they're not actually listening, and for all they might talk about fans of color they sure all seem to be white; for all they talk about misogyny and queerphobia they sure won't hesitate to immediately assume the worst of queer people and women who say things they don't like. And rarely do they address any of the actual ongoing bigotry that does exist in the fandom; it's all random accusations because you agreed with the white woman instead of the brown man or vice versa; or it's the constant dredging of years past discourse that, as the first paragraph indicates, they will then ignore whenever convenient.

These are all pretty transparent signs of a bad faith actor spreading misinformation. To be clear I don't think this is any kind of conspiracy or has any organization to it. I think it's a just handful of deeply self-absorbed people who either refuse or literally cannot comprehend that someone could disagree with them without being a bad person and who will gleefully cry wolf with these accusations of bigotry. But it's been going on for quite some time and it's been a problem this campaign in a way I at least do not recall it in past ones, and it's had an absolutely devastating effect on the fandom conversation. Ironically, by trying to boost Imogen and Campaign 3 by shutting down any criticism of them, they've shut down far more of the conversation, hopefully not irreversibly, and I think it's time to point that out.

[gcballet]

Just saw someone complaining about the Newhart ending from 0611 being mockery of people who ship Nandermo and frankly I can only imagine that account is someone who's under 20 bc that is not what mockery/rejection of queer ship fans looks like. You were in preschool when BBC's Merlin came out, you don't know. S6 and finale spoilers below.

The point of the Newhart parody ending was to provide an ending for fans who just wanted WWDITS to stay a goofy status quo sitcom. It's answering the black and white footage of the vampires in the 1950s. The sitcom status quo is a famously really hard trope to work with. The Simpsons is literally still struggling with it - decades of skilled comedy writers have never defeated it. It's a commentary on being satisified by the media we consume. The vampire can never fully be satisfied, no matter how many lives she consumes. The status quo can never be broken no matter how many episodes it attempts.

The 1980s trope of 'it was all a dream' happens in The Bob Newhart Show, it happens in St. Elsewhere, it happens in Dallas. They aren't mocking a queer ship, they're mocking sitcoms and how they've been hamstrung by format in terms of the story they can tell. Assume they did pursue Nandermo unambiguously, onscreen. It would be legitimately too dark for a sitcom. Or conversely, too hopeful for a documentary.

The other generic format choice restricting them is the documentary, because everything the characters do in the show is them being watched by a group of strangers with film equipment. None of their behaviour is wholly real. The entirety of the finale is Guillermo realising his behaviour will change when the crew leave. His behaviour has been influenced by the presence of cameras, and it will happen again. For the first time in six years, he's going to experience actual privacy, and there will be scope for him to express things he has deliberately suppressed with the cameras on. In the first episodes of S5, we saw him get increasingly frustrated with the crew, calling them vultures, as they tried to get the story on what happened with Derek. He's ready for his privacy back, and space to change, but the vampires live by sitcom rules. They aren't prepared to change, or at least, he isn't confident about it.

What We Do In The Shadows (2019-2024) is restricted by two specific genres and their conventions, and the first two 'endings' - the dream sequence and the switching off the cameras - represent exiting both of those genres before any significant radical moves can be implied for Nandermo.

It's a sitcom, therefore the central couple must be in perpetual will-they-won't-they (Friends), the gays must be physically chaste (Modern Family), and the status quo must be maintained (The Simpsons). Once the sitcom is ended via the Newhart ending (which positions Guillermo and Nandor as a married couple, that's not a small thing at all), the documentary tropes can close out.

Documentary tropes are a little harder to pin down, but generally the story should end with Guillermo truly moving on and leaving in a poignant and somewhat tragic way.

Guillermo's narrative thread throughout the documentary version of the show is about his identity and relationship with Nandor. He gives the cameras a big show of finally saying goodbye to Nandor, going on to be a new version of himself, and waits until the crew begin to derig before acknowledging again that a documentary is performative, and he intends to continue their relationship. The documentary format means intimate moments must be captured. When the documentary ends, the intimacy may be private. That's why we don't get a Nandermo kiss. It's allowed to be private now.

Guillermo is sad throughout the finale, yes, but I would argue he's actually mostly stressed, because on one level he understands that the show must commit to one of two trope endings. The sitcom, the repeating lives of the vampires where nothing matters and you can be hypnotised to believe there was nothing deep about it. Or the documentary, where he is forced to tragically leave forever, having learnt a valuable 16 year lesson, perhaps meeting again for a 'where are they now?' Twenty years later.

He thinks he has to choose in under an hour, between the endless sitcom cycle the vampires find natural, or walking away with the humans who made the documentary to capture something ephemeral and temporary.

They do both, and then Nandor and Guillermo get what is clearly the ultimate ending. It's not formatted in such a way that you choose between endings. They're not alternate endings, they're subsequent endings. It doesn't have multiple endings like Clue, it has multiple endings like The Return of the King.

And maybe Guillermo and Nandor don't kiss on the mouth and declare their love for one another, but the camera crew is still leaving the room. What they do do is agree to stay together and work together on something to make themselves and/or the world better. Then Nandor invites Guillermo to share his pseudo-bed and disappear into a private space he has created in secret for the two of them. Even phrased matter of factly that's romantic. Someone flippantly called it 'the gays getting sent to super hell' and wow way to deliberately miss the point. Nandor never follows through on big projects, but he built a miles deep tunnel under the earth so he and Guillermo could at last be alone away from a huge documentary crew and roommates with super hearing. That's beautiful. They don't owe you an onscreen kiss to prove they're in love. They (Nandermo and the show producers) don't even owe you representation, and if you think otherwise, you've not bought into the premise of the show. You are the voyeur watching the documentary, the fan watching the Ross and Rachel (Nandor and Guillermo have been compared to them by the cast).

The whole point of the endings is that they moved Nandermo outside the unreality of TV genres. Not a sitcom will-they-wont-they, not a tragedy within a documentary, just two weird guys in a coffin in a hole in the ground, doing whatever they want because nobody is watching and judging.

They didn't make Nandermo canon, they made Nandermo real.

[olderthannetfic]

I don't get my fandom. They want more queer rep. The main cast is a bisexual femme woman with a preference for women, an aroace gender-indifferent AMAB man, a genderfluid all-pronouns using AMAB person with a beard who wears a dress, and a biromantic asexual bigender AMAB man who is agender + male. The supporting cast has a lesbian girl, a middle-aged ace het woman living semi-romantically with another woman who is the main cast's (emotional) adoptive mom, and a ambiguously queer character whose gender is never really confirmed or discussed.

A big criticism I also see is "the writing team is all cishet". One, we don't know that, someone could be closeted. Two, why is that a problem? I think it's great that they went, "this makes sense for who this character is. We don't have to force them to be cishetallo just because that's what you normally see in animation. Web animation can be different. This is who this person is and that's fine."

I'm 19. I talked to my half brother, who is 38, about this and he actually choked on his coffee. He said when he was my age, nothing like this was easily accessible for him. It would have been jaw-dropping representation for him. I asked about the writers being cishetallo and he said, "who fucking cares? I would've moved Heaven and Earth to see these characters hanging out and just fucking existing back then!"

I know you get a metric fuckton of asks, but I'd love to hear your take on this. You've been in the queer community way longer than I have (I've barely started interacting with queer people IRL; I grew up in rural Wyoming) and I do wonder what this debacle looks like to people in other age groups. I'd also be curious to know what older people would've thought if they'd seen this friend group in media when they were younger. I know it means a lot to me. But I feel like I don't get what it would have meant back then.

--

Well, written up like this, it might get an eye-roll for sounding like Captain Planet casting. (You know "One of A and one of B and one of C" in a way that feels kind of forced.)

But yes, I think most older queer people when looking at the actual canon would be like "Sweet! A cast full of queer characters!"

I grew up somewhere shockingly liberal for the 90s next door to some old, married lesbians (who still live there, as it happens). It still sucked for teenagers. I had an okay time, but I was always hearing about other teens having an awful time even as the adults in the same communities did okay. And that's a very, very good version of what it was like in the 90s.

I did have access to queer media, vastly more access than most teens had. It was still mostly art films, boring coming out memoir, and The Pain of Being a Minority serious literature. What I wanted was genre fiction with a romance b-plot between queer characters I found hot. There was a bit of that, but not much.

I don't know that I personally would have killed for the exact set of queer rep in a modern show, but that makes sense. There are plenty of identities that present about the same but where people have internal reasons for choosing one or another. There are different forces making one queer identity or another more embattled at a given point in time. So while broadly similar queer people have always existed, there actually are fads in identity to an extent. (This is different from "wharrgarbl, the blue hairs with their pronouns!!!", which is just people being ahistorical assholes.) Modern media does and should reflect these differences. It might be for me, but it's going to be for 40-something me, not teenage me if it's coming out right now. If it's for current teens, it's not for teen me.

But yeah, in a general sense, I agree with your brother: "Damn, we have so much today! That's cool!"

The kvetching is usually people being angry that it's not representing their exact slice of queerness instead of someone else's. Or, let's be honest, a lot of it is "You didn't make my ship happen! How dare?!" dressed up as activism.

...

One thing I will say is that teenagers were extremely dramatic in my day too, and black-and-white thinking was just as common. Looking a gift horse in the mouth is not new. Yes, your fandom is full of idiots, but I wouldn't read too much into it.

[angelsdean]

I need people to understand how S&P (standards and practices) works in television and how much influence they have over what gets to stay IN an episode of a show and how the big time network execs are the ones holding the purse strings and making final decisions on a show's content, not the writers / showrunners / creatives involved.

So many creators have shared S&P notes over the years of the wild and nonsensical things networks wanted them to omit / change / forbid. Most famously on tumblr, I've seen it so many times, is the notes from Gravity Falls. But here's a post compiling a bunch of particularly bad ones from various networks too. Do you see the things they're asking to be changed / cut ?

Now imagine, anything you want to get into your show and actually air has to get through S&P and the network execs. A lot of creators have had to resort to underhanded methods. A lot of creators have had to relegate things to subtext and innuendo and scenes that are "open to interpretation" instead of explicit in meaning. Things have had to be coded and symbolized. And they're relying on their audience to be good readers, good at media literacy, to notice and get it. This stuff isn't the ramblings of conspiracy theorists, it's the true practices creatives have had to use to be able to tell diverse stories for ages. The Hays Code is pretty well known, it exists because of censorship. It was a way to symbolize certain things and get past censors.

Queercoding, in particular, has been used for ages in both visual media and literature do signal to queer audiences that yes, this character is one of us, but no, we can't be explicit about it because TPTB won't allow it. It's a wink-wink, nudge-nudge to those in the know. It's the deliberate use of certain queer imagery / clothing / mannerisms / phrases / references to other queer media / subtle glances and lingering touches. Things that offer plausible deniability and can be explained away or go unnoticed by straight audiences to get past those network censors. But that queer viewers WILL (hopefully) pick up on.

Because, unfortunately, still to this day, a lot of antiquated network execs don't think queer narratives are profitable. They don't think they'll appeal to general audiences, because that's what matters, whatever appeals to most of the audience demographic so they can keep watching and keep making the network more money. The networks don't care about telling good stories! Most of them are old white cishet business men, not creatives. They don't care about character arcs and what will make fans happy. They don't care about storytelling. What they care about is profit and they're basing their ideas of what's profitable on what they believe is the predominate target demographic, usually white cis heterosexual audiences.

So, imagine a show that started airing in the early 2000s. Imagine a show where the two main characters are based on two characters from a famous Beat Generation novel, where one of the characters is queer! based on a real like bisexual man! The creator is aware of this, most definitely. And sure, it's 2005, there's no way they were thinking of making that explicit about Dean in the text because it just wouldn't fly back then to have a main character be queer. But! it's made subtext. And there are nods to that queerness placed in the text. Things that are open to interpretation. Things that are drenched in metaphor (looking at you 1x06 Skin "I know I'm a freak" "maybe this thing was born human but was different...hated. Until he learned to become someone else.") Things that are blink-and-you-miss-it and left to plausible deniability (things like seemingly spending an hour in the men's bathroom, or always reacting a little vulnerable and awkward when you're clocked instead of laughing it off and making a homophobic joke abt it)

And then, years later there's a ship! It's popular and at first the writers aren't really seriously thinking about it but they'll throw the fans a bone here and there. Then, some writers do get on the destiel train and start actively writing scenes for them that are suggestive. And only a fraction of what they write actually makes it into the text. So many lines left on the cutting room floor: i love past you. i forgive you i love you. i lost cas and it damn near broke me. spread cas's ashes alone. of course i wanted you to stay. if cas were here. -- etc. Everything cut was not cut by the writers! Why would a writer write something to then sabotage their own story and cut it? No, these are things that didn't make it past the network. Somewhere a note was made maybe "too gay" or "don't feed the shippers" or simply "no destiel."

So, "no destiel." That's pretty clearly the message we got from the CW for years. "No destiel. Destiel will alienate our general audience. Two of our main characters being queer? And in a relationship? No way." So what can the pro-destiel creatives involved do, if the network is saying no? What can the writers do if most of their explicit destiel (or queer dean) lines / moments are getting cut? Relegate things to subtext. Make jokes that straight people can wave off but queer people can read into. Make costuming and set design choices that the hardcore fans who are already looking will notice while the general audience and the out-of-touch network execs won't blink and eye at (I'm looking at you Jerry and your lamps and disappearing second nightstands and your gay flamingo bar!)

And then, when the audience asks, "is destiel real? is this proof of destiel?" what can the creatives do but deny? Yes, it hurts, to be told "No no I don't know what you're talking about. There's no destiel in supernatural" a la "there is no war in Ba Sing Se" but! if the network said "no destiel!" and you and your creative team have been working to keep putting destiel in the subtext of the narrative in a way that will get past censors, you can't just go "Yes, actually, all that subtext and symbolism you're picking up, yea it's because destiel is actually in the narrative."

But, there's a BIG difference between actively putting queer themes and subtext into the narrative and then saying it's not there (but it is! and the audience sees it!) versus NOT putting any queer content into the text but SAYING it is there to entice queer fans to continue watching. The latter, is textbook queerbaiting. The former? Is not. The former is the tactics so many creatives have had to use for years, decades, centuries, to get past censorship and signal to those in the know that yea, characters like you are here, they exist in this story.

Were the spn writers perfect? No, absolutely not. And I don't think every instance of queer content was a secret signal. Some stuff, depending on the writer, might've been a period-typical gay joke. These writers are flawed. But it's no secret that there were pro-destiel writers in the writing room throughout the years, and that efforts were made to make it explicitly canon (the market research!)

So no, the writers weren't ever perfect or a homogeneous entity. But they definitely were fighting an uphill battle constantly for 15 yrs against S&P and network execs with antiquated ideas of what's profitable / appealing.

Spn even called out the networks before, on the show, using a silly example of complaints abt the lighting of the show and how dark the early seasons were. Brightening the later seasons wasn't a creative choice, but a network choice. And if the networks can complain abt and change something as trivial as the lighting of a show, they definitely are having a hand in influencing the content of the show, especially queer content.

Even in s15, (seasons fifteen!!!) Misha has said he worried Castiel's confession would not air. In 2020!!! And Jensen recorded that scene on his personal phone! Why? Sure, for the memories. But also, I do not doubt for a second that part of it was for insurance, should the scene mysteriously disappear completely. We've seen the finale script. We've seen the omitted omitted omitted scenes. We all saw how they hacked the confession scene to bits. The weird cuts and close-ups. That's not the writers doing. That's likely not even the editors (willingly). That's orders from on high. All of the fuckery we saw in s15 reeks of network interference. Writers are not trying to sabotage their own stories, believe me.

Anyways, TLDR: Networks have a lot more power than many think and they get final say in what makes it to air. And for years creative teams have had to find ways to get past network censorship if they want "banned" or "unapproved" "unprofitable" "unwanted" content to make it into the show. That means relying on techniques like symbolism, subtext, and queercoding, and then shutting up about it. Denying its there, saying it's all "open to interpretation" all while they continue to put that open to interpretation content into the show. And that's not queerbaiting, as frustrating as it might be for queer audiences to be told that what they're seeing isn't there, it's still not queerbaiting. Queerbaiting is a marketing technique to draw in queer fans by baiting them with the promise of queer content and then having no queer content in said media. But if you are picking up on queer themes / subtext / symbolism / coding that is in front of your face IN the text, that's not queerbaiting. It's there, covertly, for you, because someone higher up didn't want it to be there explicitly or at all.

[bengiyo]

Hi, i'm a newish bl drama watcher from thailand that just started watching thai bls. i'm a bit ashamed to say that for a long time as a gay man living here i've been avoiding bl shows like the plague cuz of both the fandom reputation and of misconception from my yaoi era which i leave far behind. i'm just want to ask how did you got into watching thai bls and what were you preconception before you got into it.

Welcome to the Tumblr side of BL fandom. I'd actually like to also hear more of your experience with yaoi and BL as a gay person growing up in Thailand if you're willing to share.

For me, I'm a Black American from the Gulf Coast (the South). I grew up in a Catholic city and spent my entire adolescence in the closet. Despite having a sense of who I was as early as 8 years old, I kept most of that to myself. Because I didn't talk about it much with people, I found out most information about queer media and queerness from the internet.

I entered BL via queer cinema. I think the first explicitly gay character that I remember from TV was Marco from Degrassi: The Next Generation. There were probably others, and definitely more subtle expressions, but when I think about the oldest gay character I remember and connect to, it's Marco. I don't like counting things like shipping Shawn and Corey on Boy Meets World or Tai and Matt on Digimon for oldest gay characters. Sailor Moon can't even count because we got a censored version of it in America.

I got access to satellite television away from observing eyes around age 16 and started watching content on Logo back when they aired gay content regularly. I watched basically whatever I could late at night. It's how I saw movies like Get Real (1998), Beautiful Thing (1996), and Bent (1997). It's also how I saw Queer as Folk (2000-2005) Noah's Arc (2005-06).

After hitting adulthood I mostly got lost in video games and standard American TV for a while, but I did basically show up to any Gay Event in TV. I appreciate that Stef and Lena from The Fosters (2013-2018) were some of the only TV lesbians to survive the horror of 2016.

I watched a bunch of movies in this time, many of which appear on the Queer Cinema Syllabus I made for a hypothetical Westerner new to BL and queer cinema, which @wen-kexing-apologist has decided to try to complete.

I got into Thai BL in 2018 accidentally. I started seeing gifsets of Kongpob telling Arthit he'll make him his wife passing around Tumblr and was basically like, "Right, what's all this then?"

I had watched a few Thai gay films, mostly notably Love of Siam (2007), Bangkok Love Story (2007), How to Win at Checkers Every Time (2015), and The Blue Hour (2015), but this was the first time I was seeing a long series made available so easily from any Asian country.

From there I got into Make It Right (2016-17) and Love Sick the series (2014). Once I realized that yaoi had moved beyond manga and a few anime adaptations, I went looking for a lot more. I basically haven't left since I started in about 2016 with SOTUS.

There's my basic entry into the genre. I don't think I was as worried about fandom and worries at the time because so much of being a fan of queer cinema was a mostly-private experience for me for so long. I didn't realize that BL fans active in the space would predominantly be women or queers figuring themselves out. It took a while to adjust to that, and also to adjust my expectations of the kinds of queer stories BL distributors were willing to fund.

That being said, I tend to agree with @absolutebl that BL has a useful role in normalization for non-queer audiences who encounter it. I like cheering BL when it does things I think work really well, and also deriding it when I think it does things that are offensive to help nudge the genre and offer my perspective as a gay man.

I like the place we're at right now where there's way too much to watch for any person with other hobbies and responsibilities because it means that people can pick and choose what's to their tastes.

More often than not, I'm probably most-invested in something airing from Japan because of my melancholy nature, but there's so much variety these days that it's okay if you don't like everything. I certainly don't!

I'm glad you joined us on Tumblr and look forward to your thoughts!

[sciderman]

Recently joined a spideypool discord and. I'm not gonna lie. Not a single one of these people make either of these boys as queer as they are in my head. This is probably your fault by some metric.

most things to do with spideypool are my fault by some metric, and i take full pride ownership of that - i make it a point to leave my grubby, cheese-dusted fingerprints over everything.

it's kind of really funny to hear this line of thought, remembering back to all those years that spideypoolers hounded me for queerbaiting, when truly - even those days where wade and peter weren't boning, they truly had one of the greatest queerplatonic relationships of all time, and the straights just didn't get it. not everything that's queer has to be full-frontal with tongue. i love looking back at their no-homo era, because it is so undeniably queer still.

there's a huge portion of the spideypool fanbase that are cis het, you know - not that there's anything wrong with that

but it has always felt a little different than the way i go about queer ships, and the sort of perceptions i faced in the decade that i've been running ask-spiderpool. and while i've definitely left my mark and a lot of people love what i've done with the place - what i've done with the place has always kind of intentionally been counter-to the usual fandom perception of spideypool. so much that wade and peter are actually constantly battling off the creeps.

i wrote it this way because i didn't like much of what i was seeing, and wanted something that catered to my weird taste. my taste for seeing just two unsexy losers who kind of don't know how to go about it. i wasn't in it for sexual gratification - kind of just here to make jokes about things i found funny. i found people fetishising wade and peter really funny, considering how unattractive and slobbish they are in my head. and now i find the concept of labels and sexuality and people trying to define them kind of funny, and that's what i'm exploring now.

it helps to be an insider, i guess. that's the big difference I find, from reading a lot of gay fanfiction, or gay media in general. you can tell if it's written by an insider, or an outsider. and me - i just love something confusing, sincere and messy when it comes to sexuality. just like me.

[aveteranofathousandpsychicwars]

Since (Tiktok is being banned and) we're all gonna die anyway, I have one more secret I'd (like to jump into tumblr with) share with you (in the hopes that I find like-minded individuals)

I don't understand people who think Buddie is ever going canon.

I understand why people ship them. I understand why people thought there was a chance. I acknowledge they could work as a really epic slow burn romance.

They're not going canon.

It's not even because of Tommy and Tevan. I'll be happy to argue with anyone about Tevan.

Buddie is still not going canon.

Are they the majority of the shippers in the online fandom? Absolutely. Most popular ship, hands down. Over thirty thousand fanworks on AO3 alone, something like a hundred thousand followers in the tag on Tumblr, they're a shipping juggernaut. But what people fail to understand is that online fandom is always, ALWAYS a minority of the audience. The average viewer is not making tumblr posts and writing fics and drawing art of their favorite TV show. It doesn't matter how much of a majority of the fandom Buddie has, it's a minority of the audience. We saw this EXACT. SAME. EFFECT. in the recent election. Democrats created a giant echo chamber that made a lot of us very, very confident, but we did not have the majority of the audience.

A hundred thousand followers of the Buddie tag on Tumblr. However many hundred thousand tweets on Twitter (I refuse to call it X and I refuse to get on it). Thirty thousand works on AO3.

6-8 MILLION people regularly tune into 911. I guarantee you, most of them do not know what shipping is, and even if they do, Buddie has not been presented as a potential romance for either Buck or Eddie. Every moment, every look, every action...joke all you want, there IS a heterosexual explanation. "You two have a beautiful son!" Oh my God, meant to be!

The majority of the audience was laughing at the joke of two dudes being assumed a couple and Buck's discombobulation.

The shooting (honestly, the only part where I think they MIGHT have done it). A gorgeous romantic scene where they finally realized how much they stood to lose. Most of the audience was sympathizing with Buck having to watch his best friend go down in the street. Military people were probably having band of brothers thoughts.

Because, Evan. THE definitive Buddie moment. At best, most of the audience was thinking how beautiful it was that Eddie considers Buck family.

Buddie is not going canon, and it's weird that you get so vicious over it to other fans instead of yelling at the show to stop ship baiting for views. Cause that's what they're doing. Marketing, media, social posts, interviews. It all reads the exact same as it ALWAYS does when a show wants the engagement and the clicks but doesn't want to piss off the general audience. You saw it with Destiel, you saw it with Sterek, you saw it with McDanno.

ABC cares about diversity and storytelling only insofar as it will make them money and I guaran-damn-tee you Disney is not going to let them give Eddie a coming out arc along with Buck. It was a HUGE risk for them to do it with Buck (speaking strictly from a business perspective...obviously I think there should be more queer characters on TV) and it only worked because Buck was always at least a little queer-coded.

I am not shitting on gay!Eddie headcanons or the ship itself. But the NASTINESS that has perpetuated itself in regards to Buddie is gross and tiresome. It's not going canon and honestly in the political climate that's about to engulf the US even further I'd be surprised if they ever let Buck seriously date a man again, let alone Eddie.

There was a really lovely mlm ship with a main character and people shit on it so hard that it has a real chance of making them think twice about ever giving Buck a male love interest again.

So congrats, I guess? Still never going canon.

[somethingforsenro]

today, i found out about b1gc4lgut.

some would be tempted to take this as a sob story about the dangers of online communities, and see the world as a darker place for having encountered this person. but i find something inspiring in the story of b1gc4l and how they were run off.

cw: incest and homophobia, under the cut

looking at their behavior… the squid sisters incest part didn't really surprise me, but how can you be homophobic and a splatoon fan? how does that work? literally everyone in the game has ✨queer energy✨, thats like a huge part of the reason why it's a unique game in the first place (other parts including the unique gameplay and the heavy social commentary of the story, both of which are celebrations of queerness and also neurodiversity in their own ways)

like, if you look at their blog, they say bye to the splatoon fandom and bigcal is canon. you'd think they got driven out for shipping bigcal, but… no, you got driven out for spamming people asks with an image of callie and marie kissing, making homophobic comments, and making a new account to harass people who previously blocked you. sit DOWN.

now, there are many bad things that can be said about the splatoon fandom, most of which are not unique to splatoon. but what really got bigcal laughed out of the community is not some great failing of the internet – it's a great success story of the splatoon fandom; one trait we have in spades, moreso than any other community i've ever been a part of.

in the splatoon fandom,

we look out for our own.

if you mess with one of us, you mess with all of us. if you act like a child and harass people, then we're all going to come together and block you until you can't get away with it anymore. if you make an alt account, we'll call you out on it and ID you, and we'll make sure that all our mutuals hear about it before you can get to them.

it's not just a tumblr thing, either. on a discord server i'm in – a crossover server, in fact; not even a splatoon server – a new person joined in recent memory who had a callie pfp. i recognized it as splatoon and got a little excited – it's a fellow splatoon fan! so, i approached them, but… they didn't really react how i expected.

they acted a bit strange – they barely acknowledged me, which is weird, since splatoon fans in my experience are generally excited to see each other in the wild. another person in the server, a fellow splatoon fan, thought the same thing… and also noticed the new person seemed rather familiar, even though the account wasn't one he'd seen before.

so, he asked them if they knew each other. all of a sudden, they got super evasive and suspicious, then suddenly went offline. not a good look!

that other long-time member and i had only really had one conversation before, where i chatted with them about splatoon lore. we barely knew each other. but, when it became clear the new guy was hiding something, that other person DMed me and asked what i thought. i told him, truthfully, that i didn't recognize the new person at all, but i had a real bad gut feeling about them.

in minutes, we'd gotten in contact with a team of at least 10 other splatoon fans we knew, and all of us worked together to figure out what was up with this person based on publicly available information. the discord account on which they joined was just weeks old, and no one recognized it; it linked to a social media account, probably just to get past account verification, which was made the same day as the discord account and had zero activity.

it rapidly became clear that this was a very high-effort throwaway, created by someone who really didn't want us to know who they were, painstakingly crafted to dodge even the strictest verification algorithms while giving no information about the person behind the screen.

as it turns out, the person we were so suspicious of was a highly dangerous individual who had previously been banned from the server multiple times on multiple different accounts. this was just their latest, and most subtle, attempt to worm their way back into the server.

and they might have gotten away with it, too, if only they hadn't made one crucial mistake: they used a splatoon pfp without talking the talk, and that got the actual splatoon fans' attention.

i've never been prouder to say: don't fuck with the splatoon community. if you do, a plague upon thy house, woe upon thy relations, and shame upon thee. all hope abandon, ye who enter here; look upon our works, ye mighty, and despair.

never underestimate the power of community.

[stvrpst]

Bummy shippers are some of the weakest links I've ever seen in a fandom😭 Imagine being a die-hard buddie shipper for years just to give up when the writers throw buck at yet another romance with little chemistry or buildup simply because Tommy is a guy.

I'm glad Buck can explore this side of himself, but that doesn't mean I'm going to settle with a lazy and inadequate excuse for LGBT representation. Have your opinions, but the writers could have handled Buck's storyline far better, and it's clear they're being lazy about it because Oliver has been so fucking silent about the entire relationship as a whole.

There is a difference between shipping gay couples and being borderline fetishistic. You're nasty if you're shipping only to see two men kiss and fuck, rather than for the important reasons, to see a beautiful queer story with chemistry, depth, and buildup between the two

Which I'm sure half of bummy shippers are guilty of. Because bummy literally has the same build and chemistry as all of Buck's previous relationships, if not less. The same relationships you were complaining about weeks ago.

I thought y’all said we needed to stop putting buck in relationships that lacked chemistry and build up?💀

Why is it okay now? Cuz Tommy’s a man? I hope y’all are aware of how stupid y’all’s asses sound.

Cuz to claim Tommy is complex, or even has an ounce of characterization is absolutely insane, and hypocritical. His only attributes is him being a racist misogynistic asshole, and a borderline boring ass character.

And news flash! just because people want to see a realistic, queer, slow burn romance that isn’t rushed or built off of envy and jealousy, doesn’t make them homophobic. It has nothing to do with homophobia, it’s about chemistry and depth, and the relationship as whole. I could give less of a fuck if tommy is a man.

People can have their opinions and it doesn’t mean they’re homophobic just because they clocked the fact that the rep media is pushing is repetitive and shitty. It just means people are not wiling to settle for just two guys kissing. We want more then that.

"Why can't we just enjoy this!" Because it’s people like you who make media feel comfortable enough to hurl poor excuses of LGBTQ representation at us.

you're a bunch of weak fucking links who fold at just a fraction of poorly written stories about a man kissing another man, rather than advocating for authentic, original, compelling, and well-written representation for us.

And then you have the nerve to whine about our poor media reputation. You are the reason why. They see you folding at a man kissing a man and decide to just throw it in our faces without putting in the effort, like "Here!" "Now shut up!"

Because you don’t pressure them enough to actually look into and understand genuine queer representation. Y’all drool and foam from the mouth at just the thought of two men kissing or fucking, and that’s what they give us.

It's obvious that the "rep" we got was shit, because if it was good, why is half the rep y’all think we got, just made up headcanons? Why do you have to pay $200 for someone to discuss it and provide headcanons? Why is Tommy's entire non-existent personality based on headcanons that are neither canon nor depicted in the show?

Why is the relationship in general on Twitter and here primarily made up of headcanons? I promise you, if the representation was really that good, you wouldn't have to pay $200. If Tommy had true complexity and characterization, you wouldn't need to create all of these headcanons because it would’ve been displayed on the show instead.

If the representation was that good, Lou wouldn’t have deluded y’all with all these headcanons. He wouldn’t need to, cuz it would’ve been shown on the show. But alas, we got jack fucking shit, and now y’all have to rely on headcanons to give this relationship some substance and legs to stand on.

Like this isn’t about ships, and whose better or whatever the fuck. This is about getting good representation in media. This is about getting beautiful, complex, queer stories, which Buddie already had the foundation for.

And instead of the writers taking the perfect opportunity to tell a beautiful story that could’ve been told between the two, the writers decided to throw in a random ass white man with zero characteristics or chemistry with Buck. That’s why people are upset.

“They’re just mad because it’s not their ship!” and they have every right to be mad that it’s not their ship, because unlike yours, their ship had all the key components and foundational build that the writers could’ve used to bring a beautiful queer story to life. But alas, they took the easy way out.

It’s a reasonable response.

I don't understand criticizing and mocking people because they're outraged that the writers fumbled an opportunity to show accurate representation in media. I do not understand how the responses to the writer's poorly written storyline is homophobic.

I really don’t.

Also, some of us are tired of seeing the same boring ass gay white couples over and over. That shit is repetitive. Some of us, who are POC or even just white, want to witness a beautiful interracial queer couple. It's not all about your queer, white ass. The world already revolves around you. Excuse us for wanting to see some interracial queer representation.

Pushing for greater queer POC representation is not homophobic.

Do you know what is homophobic and racist tho? Being actively opposed to having an openly queer Mexican lead character because the idea threatens your bland ass, white ass ship.

So you'd rather keep them straight, knowing that there are Mexican and Latino queer fans that identify with Eddie and see him as a comfort character. But let's rescind the representation they could get so that another white queer couple in the media can capture their attention.

[rosearcanaeum]

(Ten) people I'd like to know better

Tagged by: @screechingfromthevoid <3

Last song: Far From Me by Chase Noseworthy is just on repeat. Sad boy Vax and perfect for my range!

Favorite color: it really depends on context honestly. But the most general is soft pink.

Last book: 😅 I've been struggling through Nein Eyes of Lucien for a while.... more honestly its Call of the Netherdeep and Explorers Guide to Wildemount. I truely read far more fanfic than anything else.

Last movie: I watched Night at the Museum for the first time this week. It was waaaaaay better than I ever imagined. I knew it was good and funny. It was also incredibly sincere and I can't get enough of that.

Last show: speaking of sincere, I'm about halfway through Frieren: beyond journey's end. And holy shit! I have never seen any media with a character who views and interacts with death the way i do. Its pretty heavy as shows go but its trustworthy. (I have a hard time with new stuff most of the time. Cr is one exception and this is too apparently)

Sweet/spicy/savory: no joke I've eaten salt before lol. But i prefer combos or all 3. Sweet spicy is underrated.

Relationship status: I live with my queer platonic partner. Its still just buckwild to me. As a kid i hated the idea of living with a partner cuz i didnt want so many aspects of what i was told that looked like. But hey guess what, y'all can decide what your relationships look like. We have separate rooms, are not sexually involved, rarely even touch tbh. And we love each other very much and want to grow old together in a house with cats.

They're touch averse and I'm sensory seeking. My fun Sunday night (out dancing) is their nightmare. But because we are who we are and how we understand and communicate in our relationship we rely on each other for only things that are available. I'll tell them all the dumb shit i see and do on Grindr and we'll sit on the couch and knit together.

Also my brain nearly explodes everytime I realize not only do we do couple stuff, we have couple friends we do couple stuff with. 18 year old me would have never believed you if you told them.

Last thing I looked up: I looked up the caffeine content of the thai tea concentrate I got my partner to see if i could try it. And shockingly i should be able to. Still gonna eat first and be careful though.

Current obsession: I'm pretty spread out rn, unusually. Ive got a sweater im excited about. And I'm on my 3rd attempt at a dorym water bottle sleeve I'm designing. This one should work now. Honestly dorym is probably no. 1 on my list. I shipped that back in exu, along with a bunch of stuff cuz I'm a delightful multishipper. So i feel particularly excited about dorym finally taking off. But also that while dorian was always looking to orym if anything else had come along he was there for the ride. I love robbie so so much. He is such a good character storyteller!

Looking forward to: today im hanging with 2 friends im usually in a larger group with so thats gonna be fun. Looking forward to baking off the beef wellingtons i made for my partner for xmas. And im looking forward to being able to work full time again in the new year. Ive been on part time for health reasons and stayed because i was spending hours on the phone fighting for insurance coverage. Now that both a done i can work more. I love my job and its a particular kind of boredom that i get when i cant work. Lol speaking of, im looking forward to the holidays being over. The office closures normally screw us but now im only working thurs fri for the next 2 weeks and I'll have try really hard to keep busy enough. At least my partner has 2 of the days off with me!

No pressure tags; not sure I can get to 10 and please dont feel obligated but I'd love to see yours (if you havent already. Ive been avoiding spoilers a lot recently so may not have seen it): @vigilante-apologist @standbyyourmantis @soedblackchaos @forestthechonkykitty @corrrvid @local-redhead-bookworm and luddles looks like you did already do this.

Thats all i got. If you see this and want to do it, consider yourself tagged!

[kuwanxs]

Hellooo there was something abt your post that kinda got me thinking. The mha fandom has always been populated by mostly fem and general queer people, which is probably the reason why these toxic brodudes were SO pissed whenever anything queer looking would happen in the story, and why their reaction to 430 was so bitter and vindictive. They hate when they see the queers feeling like they have been catered to, and they hate having to be creative by themselves.

I watched a video by a yt named Shaun, abt a fake outrage that the same kind of brodudes instigated, but with the difference being that it was abt video games. He said something that seriously makes sense even in the context of mha and various other mangas.

"They don't want to be a part of diversity, they want to be superior to it. They don't want a game with the option to cater to them, they want to be the ones who the game solely caters to".

And to me, that is exactly what 431 is.

Now i'm gonna be honest, my opinion of Hori wasn't the greatest before, and after that it just became really sour. But i recognized his capabilities and his passion. So being as chariable as possible coming from me; i think he just got angry that he had to see people criticizing the previous ending in such a humiliating way. It wouldn't be surprising, since the the fuss they made wasn't just in one place, it was everywhere. Everyone was spreading misinformation to hell and back and even attacking him personally.

He tried his best to counter all of what they were saying, by making everything they wanted a possibility at the very last minute. But, as you know, the things they wanted were absolutely nothing but the bland, underdeveloped het ship becoming canon. And for that, everything had to be dumbed down, forgotten, or forced in a shoddy way. Now all the same ppl who were pissed are praising him for "fixing" his ending.

He'll probably try to do damage control if the backlash of now gets to him, by like, idk making family/romantic illustrations for Iz/och? Which to me personally will just mean that he really is that lazy or weak willed. But maybe he will just show cool illustrations and stay quiet.

I think you are sooooo right about dudebros wanting a piece of media to only be catered to them. Your quotation is also so on point.

The biggest problem with mha is that it’s debut, and the initial few years of its publication, it mainly garnered a very dudebro like fanbase. Even during the first half of 2020 when it blew up, it catered heavily to dudebros with fan service and power scaling. The issue is that eventually as the manga transcended to become something that was much more inclusive, it stopped catering to these guys.

I have always said this but a man’s biggest enemy is women and queer people. So when a fanbase garners a massive female and queer audience, it becomes a job for these guys to shame said consumers who actually heavily heavily contribute to the popularisation of said media. I’m not sure if you have seen the video of that woman on tiktok who went viral for crying over chapter 431 and how aggressive these “normal” guys were towards her. I believe infiltration of fandom spaces mainly happens when the author tries to cater to EVERY side of the audience, the dudebros, women, queer people. And it simply cannot work that way. This is something i have always critiqued on Hori’s part, that despite that sheer density and strength of his story, he becomes directionless when it comes to appealing to certain sides of the fandom. Which is why we get sm fan service, sm forced izcha crumbs, its Hori’s attempt at keeping both bkdks and izchs happy. And it simply does not work that way.

However, i truly truly thought his choice of ending 430 the way he did was groundbreakingly beautiful. It was the most amazing open ending we could’ve had. But his choice to publish 431, which, he too, seemed unwilling to, really undid 430 chapters of his hard work because not only did it fracture the narrative and corrupt the characters but it also dismantled everything he had built. In a way, it also very much ruined mha in multiple ways.

I hadn’t seen a relationship as beautiful as tgchk and bkdk in shounen before, it was so raw and jarring in so many ways. And as a bisexual woman, Toga’s conclusion felt very dear and personal to me. But sadly, the ending really left a hole in my heart. So when i see these dudebros violently trashing ships and calling them senseless I cannot help but feel super sad because in a way, after chapter 430 the number of these aggressive dudebros had significantly reduced maybe because they were forced to come in terms with the finale. But 431 really resurfaced them in the worst way possible.

[tapwater118]

pinned post jumpscare blauughh

pronouns.cc | strawpage

hiya i’m flower!

i'm plural i think. i (the host) also go by golf ball, GB, box, gaty, maddie, tap water, tap, captain coinpin (<- silly), etc. queer person on the internet with too many names, check

collectively tap/tap water, she/they, 22 y.o. (individual names/pronouns can be found in the pronouns.cc)

fictkin with a bunch of weird blorbos (if you couldn’t tell from the first part) and a-ok with doubles! friends from across the multiverse

i like various things and then will proceed to draw them. big fat bfdi/osc special interest mostly (i am a huge multishipper (based) btw so erm yeah)

feel free to use my art and such as pfps/banners/whatever, just give credit pls

let the record show that i am bad at using social media so uh i am probably a terrible mutual sorry in advance

also if i like over explain something to you please do not take it as a slight against you, i am just autistic (as if it wasn’t obvious)

if ya wanna know more, feel free to shoot up the ask box or dms, i love answering questions. i also like taking requests over asks! just note that it may be some time before i get around to your request

(regarding dms, please come in with something more than ‘hi’. i’m not comfortable initiating conversation with someone im not familiar with.)

(also don’t flirt with me. you don’t have a rat’s chance)

strawpage stuff and other incoherent ramblings are over at @taps-other-blog so look there!

also pleeease tag fireafy neg around me ty. im not even really attached to that ship its just neg about it can really put me in a bad mental state for some unknown and probably dumb reason

if you ship and/or support adult/minor, incest, zoo, etc get tf away from me ewwwwww nasty

also no label discourse if you partake in that i am blowing you up with my mind

things you’ll probably see me blabber about/draw at some point:

object shows (particularly bfdi, but i also fw inanimate insanity, hfjone, boto, animatic battle, tr125, orb, tnm, burner, object kerfuffle, love of the s*n, ppt2, itft, ee, and others im probably forgetting) (oh and idfb fear garden tee hee)

mario

kirby

pikmin

undertale/deltarune

pizza tower

fnf

homestuck

fnaf

petscop

horror stuff in general

regretevator

to be expanded once i remember more stuff

(art may be suggestively crude in humor but never nsfw)

(also if you ask i can always add tags to stuff if you have something in particular you want to mute, i dont mind)

i am working on some cool projects i think you should check them out because they are cool:

Occasionally Coinpin: hosted over at @occasionallycoinpin. posting coinpin, occasionally (the main reason you don’t see coinpin content here all that often)

Book Askblog: hosted at @twotonedhardcover, where i pretend to be a gay little novel for shits and giggles

Battle for Hopes and Dreams: a bfdi x undertale au that puts the characters of bfdi in the world of undertale. tagged as “#battle for hopes and dreams”

Competition for Fantasy Retreat: a bfdi swap au that swaps characters’ compositions and parts of their personalities. tagged as “#competition for fantasy retreat”

BfDI 1990: an unfiction reimagining of bfdi as an NES game from 1990. tagged as “#BfDI1990” (unreality content warning for this). please note that this is NOT an ARG, there is no game or puzzle to be solved, it is simply unfiction

Tap’s BFDI D-Side: a bfdi d-side take, where characters’ designs and personalities are remixed for something new and refreshing! (based on fnf d-sides obviously) tagged as “#tap’s bfdi d side”

BFDI Redux: a hypothetical bfdi season 6, featuring many of the tpot rejects as well as underutilized veterans. tagged as “#bfdi redux”

OSC horror content: i like turning the silly blorbos into fucked up evil creatures. general tag is “#FLApasta” but each story has its own separate tag (general content warning for these)

other tags i’ll use frequently i think:

“#asks” all the crud that ends up in my inbox and also some very nice things. it is a mystery

“#yap fest” for general inane ramblings. i say some very stupid things

“#ultra yap fest” for long posts, including rants and character analyses

“#slop tier post” art and other things that are generally below a certain threshold of quality i hold for myself. i’m probably too harsh on myself but oh well

“#word salad yummy yummy” fanfic stuff. im on ao3 and wattpad if ya didnt know

“#top tier post” “#all the day every day” “#one for the ages” posts that i really really like. usually from moots

“#literally me” fictkin id posts. you get it. no you don’t. i don't get it either

“#oiny” wife

list of Friends :D

@booktaggy

@bottle-ditzy

@depraced

@lemonxlimee

@l1ghtbulb

@novaazurite

@ohmysheetmetal

@onion-makes-stimboards

@sourscheming

@therandomcreechur

@twig-gy