#problematic solo stans

[superbat-love]

Officer: So let me get this straight. You two were fighting on the streets because of a…fan war?

Clark: He started it! He was tearing down all my ‘Batman is the #1 Superhero’ banners! As the president of the official Batman fanclub, I had to do something!

Bruce: Your hero is a miserable weirdo who skulks around in caves like a rabid flying rat. How can someone like that be the #1 Superhero? Obviously, it should be a good role model like Superman. Besides, you protested against the final round of the annual popularity poll and tried to get our votes invalidated, didn’t you? This is payback.

Clark: Because it’s rigged! Batman was clearly leading the poll until a million votes for Superman appeared out of nowhere. I bet you bought those votes, you rich crook! And don’t call Batman a weirdo, he’s just misunderstood! He’s a hundred times braver than Superman!

Officer: Listen, gentlemen, can't we resolve this peacefully? After all, these two superheroes are on the same team — the Justice League. You should be showing support for both of them!

Bruce: You’re delusional. The Superman fan events were a massive success nationwide, clearly demonstrating his popularity. Where's your evidence that I was buying votes, Mr Investigative Journalist? Even you can't deny it: Superman, the visual king, inspires the masses more than that ugly, sad excuse of a gargoyle you call a hero.

Clark: Ugly?! [holds up a life size standee of Batman] You call someone with this chiseled jawline and these sculpted pecs ugly?

Bruce: [punches a hole through the standee]

Clark: Ahh! How dare you hit Batman! [lunges at Bruce]

Officer: Hey! Hey! Calm down!

[puppetshcw]

Which member has the most solo stans and why is it Tomie? (or Aimee if we're being serious now)

AINE ˳ ⠀⠀⠀ and what if i say it's JEANNE? out of all members, she definitely has the most solo stans, and some of them are really bad... like batshit crazy bad...

some of her solo fans are the worst sasaengs out there. i'm not going to get into the details yet, but what i'll say is that because she's such a private person, fans know barely anything about her life away from the cameras. maybe it's that fact that attracts crazy people to her side lmao–

if i have to put down all the members from most to least solo stans, it'd go : JEANNE > AIMEE = TOMIE > VIVA = CHESKA. viva and cheska have the least solo stans, and the ones that they have are the most chill! all they do is make cute threads on twitter, interact with fellow viva and cheska enthusiasts and are just... vibing.

tomie and aimee's solo stans are somewhere in between – some like starting fights with other fandoms for fun, but others are surprisingly normal enough to have an okay conversation with. most of them have a specific symbol in their bio, so it's easier to differentiate between an ot5 and a solo stan. by the symbol, i don't mean some cute emoticon or a number, i mean they like to put "ˢᶜ", yet there's no actual explanation as to why they're using the dwarf version of the group's initials. it's probably an inside joke of those solo stans; who knows...

[beautifulpersonpeach]

BTW BPP, what did you think of those HYBE internal documents AKA the HYBE Burn Book? I get market research but some of what was in there seemed to go way beyond that. They talked about idols in such a dehumanizing way and some of the included info didn't even seem particularly relevant.

I could never figure out entirely what I thought of it because you had 95% of ARMYs wanting to brush it off as simple market research and then on the opposite end kpop stans who wanted to use it to paint HYBE as the worst, most evil, immoral company to ever exist that sabotaged every other artist, caused the downfall of xyz group and used fraud tactics for all of their own artists whose achievements were now invalid.

Allegedly it was the weverse magazine former editor-in-chief who was compiling and putting all of this together too? Which makes me think back on a lot of the criticism for that magazine that has already been discussed. I'm not exactly sure how involved that person was with some of those articles though.

On another note, I was pretty uncomfortable seeing them mention PJMs causing ARMYs to resent Jimin. It was something I watched happen in real time but it was something else to see the company directly take note of it. I'm curious how exactly they were planning on dealing with that too... The parts on Jungkook were also really weird, but I think they were parroting what antis said about him and disagreeing with it, but the whole thing got really tangled up with all the various interpretations and translations and I just gave up on following it.

I just hope the BTS members are watching all this dirt on HYBE being leaked and taking it into consideration when deciding on who they trust and how they want to operate going forward. But I’m sure they already know all that way better than I do. While I'm on that, I hope that at least Namjoon read that whole New Yorker article where BangPD called himself the king of kpop 🙄 it felt pretty disrespectful to BTS in parts ngl, but I know they know BangPD way better than I do so I'm not trying to jump too hard onto the solo/manti hate train for him even if I'm definitely not a fan of him or the people he keeps around at all (I'm still not a fan of MHJ either but I can really sympathize when I think about the kind of men who seem to run so much of HYBE and how they seem to really be holding that company back).

Anyways sorry about the rambling, I was just curious if you had any thoughts or random takeaways from those internal documents.

***

(I ramble.)

Min Heejin had talked about those internal documents since her first whistleblower complaint against HYBE in March 2024. It was one of several issues she found problematic about HYBE's senior management that made her want even more independence from Bang Sihyuk's influence within the company, and like I've said before, I came to be sympathetic towards MHJ after reading her initial whistleblower report.

The existence of those documents have been public since April 2024 and known to anybody actually listening to Min Heejin and/or who understands Korean. The fact it was only after the National Assembly mentioned those reports and excerpts were released, that most other k-pop fandoms became aware of it, shows just how poorly international fans are following this dispute and also how tightly HYBE stans mostly control the narrative around NewJeans and MHJ in international fandom spaces.

You're right that the reactions to those reports both for and against HYBE were predictably extreme, but the fact is those documents are, plainly speaking, bad news. There's market research and then there's whatever the fuck those reports are - because while all k-pop agencies seem to monitor fan chatter around their groups, the HYBE reports show the extent to which HYBE in particular runs more like a well-capitalized psych-op machine, regularly making infinitesimal tweaks to reverse-engineer heightened emotional responses in the fandoms they have access to.

It was Kang Myeong-seok (Weverse's former EIC) who was the fall-guy after the backlash, but the reality is those documents reflect Bang Sihyuk's personal approach to fandom/group management more than anything else. This shouldn't be news because if you've been paying attention, you'd notice he's always put a priority on tapping fandom sentiment with impressive proficiency, since long before HYBE existed. For example, Bang Sihyuk has explicitly stated that since BTS was formed, BigHit will never debut a girl group because he wants to create a moat of perceived exclusivity (read 'assurance') for BTS's predominantly female fandom. If there's anything that tells you how cynically (or some would say pragmatically) he views the fandom, this is it.

That k-pop fans often see their idols as romantic placeholders is well known, but no other k-pop CEO has gone as far as Bang Sihyuk has in reinforcing that perception using the very structure of his company. He literally acquired another agency (Source Music) to develop his girl-groups rather than encroach on ARMY's personal fan space. I suspect the only reason BTS doesn't take their fan service further than they already do, is because of the limits the members personally set. Left to Bang Sihyuk, I highly doubt there is any limit too far, any detail too personal, to marshal towards creating ever more dedicated fandoms and ever more appealing products (aka idols). This is an opinion I've had about Bang Sihyuk for years.

This brings me to your point about the agency of BTS members in this mess. None of the guys are babies - I believe they are aware of those weekly internal reports and choose what to care about, and are also aware that HYBE's solvency, in very literal terms, depends on the members being content with the company. Despite the nonsense in those reports, BTS has a special status in the company, and I'd be disappointed if by now they didn't understand who Bang Sihyuk is, as well as their own positions in this power dynamic. Those reports are much more problematic for groups with smaller influence in the company, such as NewJeans.

At the end of the day, BTS are getting enough of what they want from HYBE and appear to maintain their trust in and allegiance to each other more than they do to anybody from HYBE, including Bang Sihyuk. And that's enough to tell me those reports have no real impact on the members.

For most of the fandom though, it's a different story.

[lokisasylum]

You know shit's going DOWNHILL for Hybe when they start PAYING the SAME journalist who defamed and downplayed Jimin's achievements on Billboard Hot 100, and every other record he got without the company's push to start fabricating dating rumors in order to use that artist as a shield from the backlash the company's already facing under the allegations being made/exposed by MHJ.

Such as the fact that Bongo tried to bribe MHJ into accepting him having NewJeans' album sales inflated so they could "beat aespa's record".

ALSO:

(The OP is referring to 2022 when "With You" was released and Jimin's personal information was sold to antis, who spread it to the media to make it seem like Jimin hadn't paid his apartment's rent [its called "health insurance", but in reality its apartment rent] in 3 months, when at the time BTS had been on tour in the US and therefore Hybe should have absorbed the payments until their return. But a manager who was in charge of delivering the mail stole Jimin's for those 3-4 months in order to sell it to antis on DCGallery. And Hybe "allegedly" had no knowledge that this was happening right under their noses and put up that halfassed apology.

And the girl group OP is referring to is Lesseraphim, since at the time one of the former members, Garam, got involved in a very ugly scandal that resulted in her getting kicked out of the agency. OG Armys know about Bighit/Hybe's past scandal with their first gg GLAM and without the fabricated distraction using jimin's mail, this would've put BH/Hybe under a very shitty position infront of investors. )

(Yes, you read all that right, Hybe personally chooses/hires problematic journalists in order to PAY THEM to write articles that favor THE COMPANY. Even if it means damaging their own artist's image/reputation. Like what they've been doing to Jimin since FACE was released last year. ALL of those Weverse Magazine articles that targeted, defamed, downplayed Jimin's achievements, but favored and praised ANOTHER MEMBER, were all PAID and APPROVED by Hybe themselves.

Jimin stans have been warning and talking about this since last year, but nobody believed us. They thought we were throwing baseless allegations "out of jealousy" only for it to be brought to light in the end.

The sales that were stolen and erased from Jimin's album so that he wouldn't get the record of "First 1Million Seller Ksoloist"? Got proven with an official Retail Chart near the end of year that proved Jimin's album had not only sold MORE copies than the other members, but he was the only member who's numbers matched the pre-order with the ones that were actually bought AND shipped/delivered to actual fans (and not some warehouse in China without owners only to be discarded in alleys, train stations and bathrooms << ).

I wrote something similar to this last year around June, how we should be cautious of content Hybe would be releasing in the following months; with possible shipping content included to benefit only ONE member who was obviously being favored above the others to prove a point.

That the company isn't blind, they KNOW which member currently has a large following of unique loyal fans and if said member wasn't the company's favorite they will do everything they can (rumors, scandals, forced shipping content, ect) to wear out the solo fans and make them leave that member to make him dependent only on the group's fandom or company support (even if its nonexistent).

And it amused me the amount of shippers and company stans that got hella triggered by that post I wrote, even though in the end it all came true.

As for that problematic (crazy bitch) girl from IG claiming to be "jimin's gf" ? Just know that she's been doing this since 2018 to MANY male Idols/Public figures for clout (i guess it helps to boost her already TANKING career as a mediocre "actress").

Hell, she even at some point in the past 2 or 3 years claimed to be f*cking JK too.

[not-goldy]

https://twitter.com/eleni_cherie/status/1769810189367030167

What kind of people HYBE is involving boys with ? Since 2022 beg I.e around the beginning of chapter 2, Scooter started introducing these problematic people with boys.. either for a friendship or for collabs. And more than favor it's whole downgrade music wise and can be harmful for them in long run. You won't know what shady things these people are into and eventually involve members too. To this day, there is a certain status and ethics BTS has exhibited which western industry lacks. Now that they are working solo it's easy to influence them especially with lack of proper language. They better keep their eyes and ears fully open when they are interacting with these kind of artists and crew because one second of messing up can cost their whole career and life.

You have a very valid point and I understand your concerns

However, Ahjumma me nuh kwenchana discussing BTS aligning themselves with problematic people

I'm too truth conscious to compartmentalize such issues.

if I have to drag Hybe ill have to drag Kook too cos he definitely has a choice and autonomy in there he's not a slave under a slave contract and in case you haven't noticed I'm kinda a Jungkook stan soo... bias it is🥲

Like I'm not even gonna lie biased me is💀

I'm a huge advocate for not infantilizing these grown men by assuming their company is forcing them into everything.

They are grown adults who decide who to work with. Jungkook decided he wanted to work with CK and he did I hate to think he's the same person being walked like a dog to Scooter's crib.

Kook is ambitious have his own goals and I reckon he's gonna shake hands with the devil a few times in his career. Scooter is the one you publicly see, you have no idea what goes on behind the scenes too.

Do I agree with that choice, no.

Am I going to drag him for it????

Looking away respectfully

We can just pray they don't sell their souls in their journey or compromise their values or be abused and manipulated and traumatized its a crazy world they are in

All I can tell you for now is.... there there

[himenako]

welcome to my blog 🪼🫧

⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡

about me 🪼⋆.ೃ࿔*:･ :

likes: lolita, jirai kei (the WHOLE culture), menhera, jfashion in general, oshikatsu, yume shipping, ita bags, sharks, the ocean, vtubers, video games, smoking, alcohol, anything designer handbags, shoes and jewellery, disney, kpop, jpop, cpop, makeup and plushies

dislikes: jfashion tourists (fuck off), able bodied people, seafood, fandom cops, anti akgaes (it’s not inherently problematic to be a solo stan), people who shame smokers (it’s a coping mechanism), body shamers

i am a landmine girl and i use menhera to cope with my physical disabilities. i dress in gothic lolita fashion but im trying to branch out! i also have autism and ocd and that causes me to have obsessive tendencies and go non verbal. i suffer from an eating disorder and i will post about it but i will tag it. i am fortunate enough to live a lavish lifestyle and i may post about it from time to time! i also smoke cigs, vapes and weed and drink as a coping mechanism from time to time and i will also tag those.

I will always TW certain topics like when i talk about drinking and smoking to cope (i don’t always use these things to cope so ill make sure to tag it when i am) and my eating disorder.

⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡ ⋆𐙚₊˚⊹♡

yumes:

🪼 rook hunt

🪼 kalista

🪼 azusa mukami

🪼 kou mukami

🪼subaru sakamaki

i am obsessive with my yumes but if you share them that’s ok 💕

kins:

🪼 celestia ludenberg

🪼 xayah

🪼 ahri

🪼 evelynn

🪼 elise

🪼D.Va

🪼yui komori

anyways welcome to my blog and i hope to connect with others like me xoxo💕🪼

[hawkgirlz]

oomf on twitter said this but yeah, a lot of john stewart's 'fanbase' is so fake. or as he said, 'faker than a 3 dollar bill'. dcau stans whine about how john doesn't get the spotlight he deserves but the minute he actually got a solo aka war journal, it's crickets.

i still remember when dcau john/shayera stans on twitter who claimed to care for john said that green lantern (2021) comic run should be boycotted not because the writer was problematic but because he made a thanagarian oc with shayera's color scheme to 'bait' dcau stans 😭😭😭

and even if that story for john was bad..... they did not care about that because this was way before the story even released lmao. they're genuinely a pathetic performative lot who don't care about john as his own character and only see him as an accessory to shayera the WHITE woman. like when will we finally stop entertaining this fanbase and call them out for what they really are?

[quicktimeeventfull]

hello everyone i am posting a preview of my kpop au -- an in-universe callout for one light yagami. rainfalls50 is L. (eight god is the alternate & more common kanji spelling of 'yagami'; 50 is the roman character for L)

ifyoubloom

ok i hesitated on writing about this for a while because i knew people would be mad but someone needs to say something. @/eighthgod/light is one of the most toxic people in the entire fandom. yes this is a callout post in 2023 but it needs to be done. problems with eighthgod: - he is an akage. no, not just a solo stan, he REGULARLY posts about how he thinks other members are untalented or ugly and how they should be kicked out of the group and he even celebrated when A had to go on mental health leave in 2021 because ‘they could have more time to focus on beyond.’ YES beyond gets sidelined sure but thats still no excuse to be negative about other members - tags hate - posted ‘kys’ when people tried to explain CALMLY to him about how his behaviour was causing hurt - toxic judgement about beyond and misa dating, idols are allowed to have private lives, they give so much to us and its not our place to say what they do in their personal life - accused of running a group order and switching the photocards so he could get the beyond photocards. this was not proven but there’s a lot of evidence - has had a harassment campaign against @/rainfalls50 for more than a year. you can look through his twitter or tumblr and see this, he posts negative things about him and reblogs his posts to add hate hate and makes up lies about him. rainfalls has a lot of hate anons and hate comments on ao3 because of this. its weird and could be a sign of a bigger problem. but he still uses his translations which is hypocritical  - a lot of people have shown evidence he’s lying about being a lawyer, this is not proven either but there are a lot of contradictions there’s a lot of other things too but these are just the major ones. i blocked him so he won’t see this PLEASE don’t screenshot. do not harass him. just block and ignore. i know people are going to be angry because ‘he’s joking’ or ‘he’s mentally ill’ but its not a joke if it’s causing stress and harm and mentally ill people are still responsible for their actions. i won’t tell people what they should do but he has shown AGAIN AND AGAIN he does not care about the effects of his actions. just because he’s a big account and posts good analysis doesn’t mean he’s a safe person to trust

regardingreaper

isn’t rainfalls an akage too though

ifyoubloom

no people just say that because he made a few vent posts that were taken out of context plus even if he is it’s still wrong to harass him. and if you read the rest of post you will know it’s not just his harassment of rain that’s the problem, he harasses other people too and is problematic in other ways 

yoxingisthighs

op is a beyond/A shipper btw

ifyoubloom

SO WHAT IF I AM how does that change anything??? and it’s not like they’re going to see it????? anyway the company encourages it i’m pretty sure they wouldn’t hold each others hands and FAKE KISS if they cared that much. everyone on this post is so obsessed with shipping and ‘rain is an akage’ when eighthgod is SCAMMING PEOPLE AND TYPING KYS. i’m turning off reblogs this whole post was a mistake sometimes im embarrassed to be associated with any of you

[piratecaptainswench]

I have this theory of why we never got to see Jack Sparrow doing shitty stuff

Jack's an iconic antihero character, but where is him doing problematic thing in 4th and 5th?

But I felt there's a reason

Extreme high favoritism by solo stans who wants him to be centered and "good" character

When Verbinski said Jack doesn't have to be the center of the films and he's right

I felt like that's missing for Jack's character, especially in 4th film. Pirates can be problematic in history (looking at you ofmd with Stede). Making Jack a unproblematic character is flat and boring in 4th and 5th. My pal from Discord said they're hints that he maybe problematic but we cannot see enough of him being problematic

As for the posts I remember

Jack is an anti-hero and we should let him be problematic

This is why I wrote him in OST musical concept than what writers in the movies did to him

[chim-chim1310]

Everytime I open twitter/X all I see in my timeline is pjms fighting with any and every fandom possible.

Sometimes it's justified, sometimes it's not. Though pjms can be a bit too much sometimes..

But most of the time their fight is justified. Kpop stans are behind jimin's ass everytime something happens with their faves.

Sometimes it's blinks, the other day there was a tweet about Gdragon's arrest and someone dragged jimin when he literally had no role their. Then we have jimin's own fandom subtly shading him. His own company downplaying his achievements. Then literally all bts members solos who for some reason only have problem with jimin. Then today we have seventeen fans unnecessarily dragging jimin into their mess when their faves f*cked up.

Like give my boy a break. Goddamn.

And it's funny because jimin is literally the most unproblematic kpop idol. Even some of bts members have done some things that's actually problematic. But there is literally no dirt on jimin.

Still they only chose to attack jimin when there's any fanwar no matter what the fandom is. Just because they can't get anything on him they try to make up lies to drag him.

Like wtf man.

It's literally so exhausting. Most of the time I just see pjms fighting only

I think we shouldn't start any fanwars unnecessarily but if someone else does talks shit about jimin then we should go all out to protect jimin. I would say even go as vile as they can. Because if you'll see the shit they say about jimin you're literally gonna puke.

If they started it pjms should give the same energy back. Why are we expected to act good when they're being disgusting towards jimin. Why they always try to police us only?

It's so infuriating honestly. These kpopies need to leave jimin alone and stop dragging him in shit which has nothing to do with him.

[starryjkoo]

I’m not against the fandom wanting to have fun at all!

As long as they are kept within fandom spaces and under a fictional context, things like AUs, fics, and fanart can be great ways for people to express creativity and provide entertainment. But a large majority don't know how to do that.

It’s why we had ARMYs upset at Jimin’s character in an AU in the replies of BTS’ official twitter account. It’s why TKKers are allowed to sell their fic that portrayed Jimin as a vile bully and used the BTS members’ images as an actual book with little to no push back from ARMYs. It’s why “non shipping” ARMYs reply “I like [other duo (mostly tk or ym)] fics more” when questioned about them not liking or even hating Jimin and Jungkook as a duo.

Another thing is the lack of care for the hate that Jimin gets from these fictional works. It gets twisted as “policing fandom spaces” when genuinely problematic creators are called out and reported. Then ARMYs make fics and AUs poking fun at said “policing” and no one (including some “OT7 Jikook Supporter” JKKers 🫥) see the problem, saying “people don’t get to police other people’s art” and comparing the art that inspired Jimin to extended his moon tattoo  down his back to NSFW shipping art from Jimin antis…

https://x.com/YooniesSquish/status/1839005207000228054

Or ARMYs responding to concerns of Jimin getting harassed for the millionth time, with sexual harassment….

https://x.com/vkoobiezluvr/status/1876625003233620031

I’m tired of solos too, but people claiming other ARMYs (not just solos) are overreacting for calling out the harassment Jimin gets, and then choosing to protect antis and fictional creations instead of a member part of the group they stan is insane.

As long as they are kept within fandom spaces and under a fictional context, things like AUs, fics, and fanart can be great ways for people to express creativity and provide entertainment. But a large majority don't know how to do that.

Yeah I totally agree! ARMYs and their odd, complicated, and problematic relationship with shipping is something I’ve thought about a lot tbh. Apologizing for the length of this reply, this one got away from me 💀 going to put it under the cut

I think part of the issue is that a lot of shipping etiquette has been lost as shipping and fandom culture have become more mainstream (and how that’s especially problematic with RPS). Taking something like kpop with its already existing issues with shipping and parasocialism and mixing it with a fandom the size of ARMYs was always going to be a recipe for disaster. So yeah, I absolutely do not think ARMYs are equipped to handle things like fandom-wide AU’s and I personally wish shipping was more contained like it used to be. Basically I think the normalization of shipping within the main fandom is problematic because it lacks a lot of the culture and know-how of navigating these things respectfully that most regular ship communities have (or used to at least).

I noticed you mentioned “non-shippers” & that’s another issue I have with ARMYs & shipping — the way they define what a “shipper” is. Most of them seem to define a shipper as someone who believes a ship is “real” but imo a shipper is anyone who regularly engages with shipping content. So when ARMYs say that they “hate” shippers and shippers “aren’t a part of our fandom” they only mean “serious-shippers” and not the millions of ARMYs who regularly engage with shipping content.

The thing is that again, at least in actual shipping communities (especially w/ content creators) there are some rules/etiquette that people are expected to follow and are somewhat held accountable for. While some of that may have eroded over time in ship spaces, a lot of these “non-shipper” ARMYs have no understanding of those rules at all. They don’t consider themselves shippers because shipping is so normalized in the fandom it’s seen as regular, default fan behavior and not “shipper” behavior. I personally think this lack of self-awareness, and also the absolute zero accountability bc of it, is another reason why these particular ARMYs are so comfortable crossing boundaries and are incapable of shipping responsibly.

Another major issue with the line between the two groups being so blurred is that a good chunk of the ARMYs who claim they don’t “believe any ships are real” still consume & believe content coming from toxic “serious-shippers” such as conspiracies, toxic narratives, misinformation, mistranslations. They then spread all of that into general fandom spaces. I’m sure we can all think of quite a few examples of this (y’all remember how quickly that lie spread about YGs concert and tkks parents? how many ARMYs “joke” about BH preventing the tkk subunit, how many ARMYs thought the “not for the camera” thing was real?).

“for fun shippers” are not rejected the way that “serious-shippers” are (supposed to be) in ARMY spaces, so they basically have free rein to spread those narratives. They also end up platforming, following, interacting and enabling actual toxic shippers & fanbases within ARMY spaces. And yet, they have zero accountability because when you call them out they’re “not a shipper!” “using a duo name doesn’t make you a shipper!” “everyone reads fic!” and they have lots of regular ARMY moots who back them up so… IMO these "for fun" shippers need to be held to the same standards as "serious-shippers" but they think they're absolved from that responsibility because they don't believe ships are real. Meanwhile they're a huge part of the reason why toxic tkkrs are so deeply embedded in our community.

Anyways, ARMYs should never have felt like it was normal or okay to spam official pages about an AU?? And my point on fandom etiquette is that actual AU writers block official accounts and censor names, the idea is to keep it far away from the actual ppl involved, and I don’t think a regular fic reader would ever even THINK of spamming an official account about an AU? But ARMYs normalizing shipping in the larger community without trying to enforce any proper rules/boundaries has made a good chunk of them think that this was an acceptable thing to do.

I mean, even huge ARMY fanbases joke about TH reading tkk AUs, or make CONSTANT shipping jokes (I’m not talking about one here or there, I mean it being nonstop the first thing they joke about when two members so much as glance at each other), that hundreds of ARMYs lined up to buy tkk fanfiction in Paris & thought nothing of it, that things like fandom-wide AUs are common and normalized, and there's a reason why ship content is one of the first things you encounter when getting into BTS… like no wonder these people do not have boundaries when shipping has seeped into every corner of the ARMY fandom, yet there is none of the accountability, rules, self-awareness, or self-regulation that most shipping communities are at least somewhat expected to have (not that a lot of BTS shippers atp follow them 😅 “serious-shipper” culture is a whole other convo, especially tkkrs, but imo at least most jkk content creators & their communities have these boundaries)

Like maybe that’s the buzzkill fun-police in me because I get that shipping jokes are a normal, fun & non-serious part of fandom, and I’m once again not against fic at all (I read it), but with ARMYs it’s just so much to the point it feels like shipping is the main thing a lot of them engage with and prioritize even over the actual BTS members (and I’m going to include Y/N’s in here too tbh). Most of them absolutely do not have the maturity to handle ship content either (like, obviously how many ARMYs fell for tkk narratives for one, but even the way many "non-serious" tkkrs also have a weird attitude towards jkk).

I guess I just feel like I wish there was more of a separation between shipping culture and general ARMY culture, and maybe this is idealistic and unrealistic bc obviously shipping was always going to be a part of the main fandom (and i mean, i find it fun sometimes too!), tkkrs having their own community and platforming their most toxic and insane is what led to this mess so I’m not saying it being separate would solve all that, this is also only scratching the surface of why kpop fandoms are so toxic (so many reasons), Y/N’s are a whole other thing, so are solos, general parasocialism, plus like I said ship communities are not perfect at all (serious-shippers are a whole other beast). but at the very least, ARMYs and their normalization of shipping without the moderation/self-awareness of normal shipping communities is what allowed toxic shippers in our fandom spaces & added to some ARMYs having terrible boundaries with the BTS members.

Another thing is the lack of care for the hate that Jimin gets from these fictional works. It gets twisted as “policing fandom spaces” when genuinely problematic creators are called out and reported. Then ARMYs make fics and AUs poking fun at said “policing” and no one (including some “OT7 Jikook Supporter” JKKers 🫥) see the problem, saying “people don’t get to police other people’s art” and comparing the art that inspired Jimin to extended his moon tattoo  down his back to NSFW shipping art from Jimin antis…

(that AU omfg 😭😭💀) yeah, I agree with you again! I guess that goes into how a lot of ARMYs do prioritize safeguarding ship content over caring about/protecting the actual members. No one was calling for a mass take down of all creative content during that Paris incident, they were calling for the accounts that literally anti members or write/draw some particularly exploitive/degrading stuff to be taken down (and I’m also anti censorship but I’m also atp where BTS shipping is so toxic, I get wanting conversations about how to curb it). And yet that part of the community took such a HUGE issue w/ just the idea of that they decided to literally protect actual full-blown antis over risking some of their ship content… It just shows you where the priority lies with some ARMYs and seeing them get on their soapbox about this was ridiculous to me.

Yes fan content is an important part of fandom and does benefit BTS by bringing/keeping people in the community, but lets not pretend content creators are inherently some sort of benevolent beings doing this selflessly for the good of BTS. Most people simply ship because it’s fun, people also create ship content bc it’s fun and they like it, so why are people being so morally righteous about this lmao? I fully understand arguments about the importance of fan work, and the legitimate concerns over censorship and the alarming cultural shift into right-wing ideologies. But I think some ARMYs are also just being obtuse when they refuse to acknowledge that the objection some people have for this content stems from BTS shipping culture being absolutely out of control and beyond toxic to the point that it has real life consequences. It’s not simply because they are morally against fic or trying to police fanwork (and I'm not saying anyone has to agree with that perspective, but the knee-jerk reaction to it is not helpful either imo). But also lets not forget this discourse arose from a content creator who absolutely overstepped boundaries by selling that book.

And I just want to say literally some of my very fave jkkrs are content creators who are super cool, respectful, chill and write the most beautiful thoughtful things about JM & JK and their music and character, they’re great and kind people who are very respectful of boundaries and all that. This is just my complaint about the specific parts of fandom who prioritize those fan spaces over the actual real life members involved in shipping.

I know that it’s much more nuanced than all this, and yeah I think JM is going to be okay even if someone spams “how could you” on one of his official posts lol, I just think BTS shipping has gotten so out of control this conversation is worth more consideration instead of outright rejection. I don’t think it’s fair to frame that concern as “moral policing” when a lot of people are just genuinely worried and upset by the very real and visible consequences of shipping in our fandom and want to try anything to help curb it. Like if they can not for a second pause and see why in this particular fandom people might be upset with shipping culture knowing the amount of hate Jimin gets over it then… you just can’t convince me they care about him at all. And I’m not saying I agree with policing the creative community, but some of their reactions about all of this were really callous and disappointing.

Or ARMYs responding to concerns of Jimin getting harassed for the millionth time, with sexual harassment….

this particular subgroup of ARMYs are always writing tweets with the corniest, weirdly over-sexualized comments like what you sent, and they think it’s hehe funny not-serious 🤪 “you guys cant take a joke” they’ve always been one of the worst at respecting or understanding boundaries with the BTS members 😬 what a bizarre response to the discourse over the AU. It also entirely validates the people who thought that ARMYs weren’t mature enough to handle it lol.

I’m tired of solos too, but people claiming other ARMYs (not just solos) are overreacting for calling out the harassment Jimin gets, and then choosing to protect antis and fictional creations instead of a member part of the group they stan is insane.

yeah this is better and more concise than all that rambling I just did lmao, I agree. I understand all the arguments about fanworks and protecting those spaces but just seeing the way some people have so much more visible concern over losing their ship content over the very real harassment Jimin receives over shipping is beyond gross.

anyways sorry for yapping on this so much 💀 I do just think ARMYs and shipping is such a bizarre and interesting topic ig, but I think this was the inevitable fate of any fandom this large with shipping at the forefront and it definitely just sucks. and I know all of this is way more nuanced than what I got into, but I stand by ARMYs and their approach and attitude towards shipping being kind of problematic, despite the fact that I’m a shipper that enjoys shipping content lol. maybe a little hypocritical, but oh well (I do think most jkkrs are pretty cool about some of this tho, or they were, everyone got a little crazy in CH2 lol).

[cantcompetewhereudontcompare]

No, you don't. You're one of those people who's intellectually aligned with The Hags, most likely a HUGE LT fan who's offended by this blog. It's kinda sad that you're ashamed to admit it.

Multiple reasons. Glad you asked!

I HATE hypocrisy and I think every single person on the planet has multiple skeletons in their closet. Whether it be racist biases, unchecked privilege, ignorant pressure points that inevitably end up with ignorant actions, etc. We're ALL flawed human beings with inherent privileges and blind spots. Pointing fingers with this sort of stuff is ridiculous because even the best person in the world has shit they've done in the past. And if you think you don't, you're probably covered in it.

Most of these issues (such as racism, cultural appropriation, misogyny, homophobia) hurt real people in real time. They destroy lives and families and can cause a lot of pain, sometimes generational. To dilute that into some sort of gotcha moment of "the celebrity I like is better than yours" feels like one of the worst things you can do, in terms of morality, on social media. You're essentially taking the pain and suffering of a minority and making it about the faces that entertain you on your screen. What kind of awful human being are you? How do you not realize that you're worse than whatever action you're condemning? I'm not saying that holding people accountable is bad. But 99.99% of the "problematic" online discourse is not about that. If I were to make that kind of post about artists I dislike, my motivation would be obvious.

There are lines in the sand, such as sexual or physical abuse or violence, consistently racist and dehumanizing views, etc, which I do think deserve to be called out consistently and everywhere. I don't think Louis has those attitudes, which is why I don't. I called out Zayn and Liam for being abusers. That's the difference.

I'm talking about Louis' homophobia because 99% of his fanbase believes he's queer in a myriad of conspiracy theories that affect real people — both Harry and Louis, but also their families and friends and significant others. I think having the tools to counteract those people is important. The fact that Louis has had homophobic attitudes his whole life directly contradicts those conspiracy theories.

What would be the point of the racism post? The only reason I might do it is to point out his fanbase's hypocrisy. I haven't decided if I think that's morally sound or not.

I wouldn't do it to "call Louis out" because I just think I'd be a hypocrite. Surely I've done stuff in the past I'm not proud of. I just don't happen to have my life and every word on display like he does.

Like I said, I dislike Louis because I dislike his personality and his music. Not because of how problematic he is or isn't. I don't measure the art I like by the attitudes of those who made it. I think Elvis Presley was an absolute turd but I think his music was incredible. I think Steven Tyler is morally abhorrent but his voice is amazing.

Perhaps I wouldn't feel comfortable "stanning" people that I find that morally challenging? That's the only concession I'm willing to make in this regard.

You sound white.

I'm an Asian woman living in Eastern Europe. I promise you, I don't have the luxury to not "see a problem with being racist."

The fact that you're comfortable telling this to a stranger because of a pop culture conversation is what makes you sound white, aka privileged, in case you were wondering.

Harry is not an asshole, as far as I'm aware😊

Is this "racist stuff" in the room with us right now? He's not morally clean because nobody is. He's had his faux pas, such as wearing a headdress (which is cultural appropriation but I wouldn't call racist), being ignorant about Israel in the past, being ignorant about they/them pronouns at the beginning of his solo career, and I'm sure that as a privileged white man he has his racist biases, but he's done nothing racist that we know of.

There's two things that I can possibly think you could be referencing.

One, that accusation of him doing "digital blackface" when he replied "hahaha" to Pixie Geldoff posting a pic of his with stickers. That accusation was fantastic, one of the best examples of the fake internet pearl clutching.

For the uninitiated, in 2012 Harry went to a Christmas dinner with friends. One of them, Pixie Geldoff (Bob Geldoff's daughter) posted a pic of his from that dinner, edited with Snoop Dogg's app "Snoopify" which added stickers of stuff that Snoop Dogg would do/wear. As in, it would "Snoopify" you.

Harry quoted that tweet with "hahaha" (back in the day, quote tweets didn't exist, so this is how you quote tweeted)

Pixie deleted the tweet (it had four photos of four different people, all present at that Christmas dinner, Harry being one of them) but here's the photo:

People said that this photo was edited to make his skin darker in an attempt to do digital blackface, which is obviously absolutely ridiculous. That's just iPhone camera quality in 2012.

Here's another pic from that night. That's Pixie in front of him, btw.

So, Harry saying "hahaha" (not even editing or posting it himself!) to a picture of himself edited with the fucking Snoop Dogg app, when he was eighteen years old, somehow got twisted into him being racist. Go fucking figure.

The other racist accusation is that he "kicked BLM flags" and "refused to talk about BLM until his fans begged him" which is, well.

Not true, for one. It's just not true. He didn't kick anything. It's unclear if he even saw the one BLM flag fans threw on stage during his second London show in 2017 (October 30), as there was a project to bring BLM signs to that show and someone threw a flag, but Harry didn't interact with it and there's no indication that he even saw it.

He did see the signs they brought and acknowledged them positively:

They did the project again for his Manchester show, no flag this time.

He then posted them on his Instagram the day after the Manchester show. November 1st was the Manchester show, November 2nd he posted:

View this post on Instagram

A post shared by @harrystyles

Fans weren't happy because they felt like he had to say something concrete, which I guess is valid criticism, but there was absolutely not ignoring on his part.

After that, in his next show (which was in Stockholm, November 5), he gave this speech:

There were no BLM projects after Manchester and up until the next year when his tour went to America in arenas. At one of his first few shows (I can't remember which one now), he met a fan for Make A Wish who brought a letter telling him how important it'd be for his black fans for him to head on address the BLM movement. After that show, he did this:

This was at the same show, but the video was posted later (he's wearing the same outfit):

And after that he went on to wave the BLM flag at basically every show:

On the first interview he gave after this tour (on his next album cycle) he said:

On tour, he had an End Gun Violence sticker on his guitar; he added a Black Lives Matter sticker, as well as the flag. “It’s not about me trying to champion the cause, because I’m not the person to do that,” he says. “It’s just about not ignoring it, I guess. I was a little nervous to do that because the last thing I wanted was for it to feel like I was saying, ‘Look at me! I’m the good guy!’ I didn’t want anyone who was really involved in the movement to think, ‘What the fuck do you know?’ But then when I did it, I realized people got it. Everyone in that room is on the same page and everyone knows what I stand for. I’m not saying I understand how it feels. I’m just trying to say, ‘I see you.’”

Essentially explaining that he didn't want to be performative, but once he understood why his voice mattered, he used it.

Mind you, this was years before the BLM movement became mainstream with non-black celebrities, most of which wouldn't acknowledge the movement until it became trendy in 2020.

As someone who isn't black, I can't actually say that he's never been racist against black people. It's not my place. I was being hyperbolic before. But I do know that the only two racist accusations that were leveraged against him were these two.

I've been a fan of this man for over a decade and I've seen every possible thing said about him, so I'd most likely remember if there was another instance. I think the only other adjacent accusation was when he made a (scripted) joke at the Late Late Show saying that Trump was going to deport James Corden? But that's not...? Racist against who? LMAO. I remember The Hags trying to use that against him, but the joke is that... Trump... didn't like James because he criticized him a lot, so he would force him to go back to the UK. This is almost as bad as the "hahaha" one.

The whole thing is very unserious.

Now, when I say that Louis has had racist attitudes, I mean saying the n word, reacting with a "you're on camera" when his sister said the n word instead of, you know "don't say that word," going on a press tour where he said over and over how much he hated the music on the radio for being "too urban" which

This

The first time there was more than one black headliner

He even followed that up with

What does he mean by "that genre"? Black? In 2018 Beyoncé's latest album was Lemonade, which had like, fifty-seven different genres, so he's gonna have to clarify that one.

Anyway, I'm doing this to piss you off, FYI. Not to stone Louis to death. He's tone deaf, ignorant, and has racist biases because he's a privileged white boy. Most privileged white boys will have to unlearn shit in order to not be racist.

Yes, even Harry. His (public) faults might not be quite as bad, but he's had them, and this isn't a competition. We also don't know either of these men in private, so it's impossible to actually qualify them as people.

I do think Louis is an asshole, but for multiple reasons, not just these "faux pas" (or whatever you want to call them). And if you "hated him" you wouldn't care, and you certainly wouldn't be in my inbox crying in whataboutism.

I don't think Harry supports any "genocidal maniacs." He's friends with questionable people, as is... literally every person on the planet. You included. Some of them I would even call very questionable. But I would put very few people in the category of "genocidal maniac," and as far as I'm aware, Harry isn't friends with any of them.

You're using a ridiculously overblown way of referring to very questionable individuals to attack a celebrity you (quote) hate (unquote). This isn't a joke. This isn't internet cookie points, girl. This is children dying, starving, being orphaned, losing their homes, losing limbs. Get a reality check.

I don't judge anyone by association, FYI. Unless we're talking something like, sending letters to the judge to shorten the sentence of a convicted rapist, as what happened with Mila Kunis and Ashton Kutcher. We all have questionable friends. An eye for an eye and we all go blind. Anyway, I addressed these friends almost three months ago.

I hope getting that off your chest helped. You're obviously blocked. Next time, own up to your intentions and you won't be.

[lokisasylum]

Lets talk about something controversial--

Lets talk about how BALLS-DEEP taekookers have embedded themselves inside the fandom to the point of Armys DEFENDING THEM over protecting the ones constantly being the target of this disgusting breed.

We (the OG fans who were there since the beginning and noticed the moment it started) warned ya'll about this; for MONTHS, for YEARS. But ya'll didn't listen. Just let it happen.

It started with Big “OT7″ accounts ignoring the issue and deeming it “just shipping wars”, “focus on BTS only”, to the fandom collectively turning a blind eye the bigger the hate got with every little "ignore and block", every "you need to curate your TL better so you don't constantly see that--"

We warned ya'll and you called us Crazy, you called us Delusional, you called us Entitled, you called us Problematic Old Hags. And now I fear we may never get rid of taekookers AT ALL.

EXHIBIT A:

Lets start with something that happened a few days ago. It started with a TKer using a set-up account to drag The Weekend for that weirdo netflix series. Which for some reason it called the attention of Abel (the lead vocal)'s attention to the point of quoting it, which in turn gave the tweet MORE attention/views.

As soon as the tweet started getting the desired amount of clout, the TKer changed the entire layout from taekook to Jimin to make it seem like "oh, pjms again starting shit because they're bored" (when in reality Jimin stans were hyper focused on streaming & buying 'Like Crazy' since the song was about to break the record for longest days charting and also the 119 #1s on iTunes), but what everyone ignored completely was the fact that despite switching the layout the person was actively dragging & defaming Jimin on that same acc & liking tweets from Jimin antis. But NOBODY CARED ABOUT THAT, because armys only saw "a jimin stan being problematic". And it took ONE Jennie solo stan calling out armys hypocrisy for the way they've always given trashcookers a free-pass in their fandom instead of defending Jimin, when both he and Jennie get the most hate from them on all platforms.

But AGAIN, what did the fandom do? Instead of actively reporting and trying to get the TKer suspended, they switched to attacking that Jennie solo stan AND slvtshaming Jennie as well. As for the person who started the whole thing? Deactivated and is probably STILL around with a different account spreading more hate and ways to get away with it.

EXHIBIT B: The #s war from yesterday.

Again, it was a TKer who started trending those disgusting tags over a harmless joke about spotify debut numbers. The hashtags were ALL initially AGAINST JIMIN ONLY, and each one more vile than the last and the bastards even celebrated that they got them to trend so quickly and were even putting money into keeping them up longer. 

(I spent an unhealthy amount of hours out of my life yesterday reporting & blocking people from BOTH ends, but it was just neverending! And for some reason twitter wasn’t showing all of the reports I made which frustrated me even more).

But armys only cared about the issue when Jimin stans actually started fighting back, using the SAME #s against TKers. NOT BECAUSE JIMIN HAD BEEN DEHUMANIZED/DEFAMED FIRST, BUT BECAUSE NOW IT INVOLVED 2 MORE MEMBERS (otherwise they would have ignored it). So instead of helping to clear the searches and reporting EVERYONE who was using the #s, they ONLY reported/suspended Jimin stans and instead trended “BTS IS 7″ initially, while the TKer who started this whole thing is STILL around, active on another acc after deactivating.

This gave TKers the upper-hand to once again SWITCH THE SITUATION IN THEIR FAVOR, by gaslighting armys/ot7s into thinking and trending: “solosOUT” “ALL SOLOS ARE ANTIS” “WE LOVE YOU TAEKOOK” “WE LOVE YOU [X, Y, Z member]”

(I even saw BTS members who weren’t involved in the issue being included in the tags as well to divert attention further from the fact that it was taekook shippers who started this shit).

And if you had looked closely at the first tweets using these tags, you would have noticed TONS of taekookers with the cult symbol on their username at the same time putting ALL of the blame on Jimin stans and accusing armys of ONLY caring about Jimin but never defending Taekook.

Which now has officially enabled the mentality inside the fandom that calling out Taekook Shippers = shading/hating Taehyung & Jungkook as individuals.

But its OKAY to call out Jikookers/Kookminers (cause they’re now “Tae antis” by association) & anyone who defends Jimin, because its OKAY for Jimin to get hate/shade as long as Taekook are protected.  LOL what a fucking joke of a fandom (Alexa, play “Face-Off” )

EXHIBIT C:  VMinKook at SG’s concert today

The 3 maknaes were literally standing/sitting together, playing. vibing to the concert (there’s literal clips of them talking, interacting and playing with the army bombs). But what topics made noise first?

“Taekook together at the concert” “Taekook concert date” “Taekook ignored Jimin, as they should” “Jimin left first/alone in his own car because he’s bitter.”

I even saw one where tkers were UPSET because “Jimin didnt pay attention” whenever tk interacted. Like sis makeup your mind, are you happy he’s no longer interacting like before or are you desperate for his validation that will never come???

Jimin is unbothered, happy and busy and probably had some schedule to attend after the concert, but these deranged mfers will always see what they want and armys will always give them a free-pass instead of addressing the pink elephants on parade in the room.

And if this is the fandom we have to go back to when and IF BTS ever return as 7 after enlistment (given that they don’t actually disband after that not so subtle hint suga made at the end of the concert)? Then I’m about ready to drop BTS as a whole the moment Jimin goes in for his service. ‘Cause this ain’t it.

[fuutakaji-official]

uhh excuse you but can you like delete yourself or something. i don't wanna see any fuutas on my dash or fuuta kinnies or fuuta apologists. cause i'm saur serious and like he's so problematic. like seriously he made a middle schooler or something die bc of cyberbullying like that's saurr messed up. like op you should seriously reconsider your whole gimmick. and like what kind of prison would even give their prisoners access to the internet????? i hope you find a better person to stan and base your blog around instead of a ginger 🫶

I am autistic and cant tell tone so idk if this is a joke or not so i'll treat it seriously

But like, the block button literally exists if you find me annoying and dont want me on your dash just. Block me??? Im not gonna stop rp'ing on tumblr bc some anon doesnt like me lmao

Your opinion does not matter to me whatsoever, so just block me, hell ill block you if you'd rather that 🤷

Anywaya fuuta solos your favs AND JUST BECAUSE OF YOU IM GIVING FUUTA ACCESS TO YOUTUBE, NETFLIX, AND CANDY CRUSH!!! JUST FOR YOUR HATE ASK!!!

Utilise your block button and grow up <3

If this was a joke ask, welp.....

/ooc

[not-goldy]

So Goldy this 11:08 discussion reminds me of a convo I just had with my sister recently... we were discussing of how bts members encourage the bad behaviors of their fans and her biggest point was Jungkook. For her, Jungkook encourages the toxic Y/N scenarios and the example she used was the white day live. I, being a jikooker immediately defended Jungkook however once she asked why I chose peace. But that just made me realize that most things Jungkook does to get his mimis attention has been stolen to feed off the Y/N delulus. Jungkook didn't come on live on white day to dine with you he came on live to dine with his mimi who was overseas... Jungkook dressed up handsomely to attract mimi, spoiled alert mimis solo projects and, even mentioned GCF Tokyo and there for you. This also happened during the jimin 2022 bday wish video when army's started trending for "What was the reason?"... well honey bcuz he wanted to thirst trap his babes to a after hours birthday present. Sorry to break it to you Y/Ns but he doesn't do shit to feed your delulus, you do that on your own. The Jungkook fan service king thing needs to come to an end.

Ahhh you should have called me so I join in the discussion.

I agree that all BTS members are guilty of this especially those who over share sensitive vulnerable tales of their lives and enable their fans to trauma bond with them. Those are the ones who inadvertently encourage parasocial attachments and its more insidious and dangerous if you ask me.

I think anyone who overly emphasize on Jungkook thirsttraping and love baiting his fans has their priorities misplaced cos no one truly believes Jungkook is dating them or saving himself for them when calling him baby irks him so much.

But I agree that writing love songs and sharing deep emotional feelings in a song and calling it a fan song is dangerous.

Like these are grown adults they shouldn't still be disguising their romantic feelings, expressions experiences as content made for fans at their big age.

If you want to have this conversation you have to HAVE IT. You have to go to the root of the problem and not just scratch the surface.

When two people are found in the back of a truck taking a break unwinding and enjoying eachother's company THEY SHOULD BE BOLD TO SAY HEY THIS IS OUR ME TIME AND WE DONT APPRECIATE THE INTRUSION.

But saying you hanging out for fans taking pictures for fans loving someone for fans IS HOW FANS GET CROSSED EYES THINKING THEY ARE ENTITLED TO YOUR HEART MIND AND SOUL.

That everything you do is for them and anything else that can't be co-opted should be explained away as fan service.

I mean speaking of encouraging bad behaviors.

I don't know how and why people fixate on Jungkook gyrating and thrusting his hips on live for fans when there are real issues like these to be discussed. I just don't get it.

And I think Jungkook is doing what the members did when they were his age. Someone has to pamper these fans and incentivize them to remain loyal or even to attract them to the group.

I recall we used to call Tae and JM the recruit fairies cos they were the one's who strong fanservice skills drew the crowd and converted new stans.

It's simply Jungkook's turn to do the necessary evil and I genuinely don't see how he's over doing it. Fans are just nuts if they truly fall for him calling Army his girlfriend cos if so he's cheating on every single one of them with the other😩😩😩😩😩😩😩

I take it all as a joke but if people are taking it seriously they need to seek psychiatric intervention.

Can I ask you a question??🤔

Do you not see the real actual problem with BTS or do you genuinely think what Jungkook does is an actual serious problem 🤔

Because it's the least concerning thing on my scale of problematic things BTS do with fans. If they were all just feeding y/n delusions I'd say that was not a problem at all cos Y/ns will always y/n regardless😩

[prbni]

Kpop opinion from a former stan that no one asked for

Kpop used to take western samples and then modify it since a long time ago but now its just the western samples sung partly in Korean and mostly in English, they don't even put the effort for putting in sounds and instruments to make it sound more like Korean pop.

I have argued with second and third gen stans against this in almost every comment section, but for 4th and 5th gen stans I do have to say that a lot of your faves can't sing live and dance simultaneously and NO its not okay, its the basic requirement to be an idol. Otherwise, you're just a backup dancer and not idol.

Echoing the first opinion, the only 4th gen boygroup that actually has been consistent in delivering a beautiful discography has been TXT. For others, I can mute the sound and just watch them dance and it won't make much difference.

If intense choreos are the issue, then they could just tone down a bit with the choreos and then make their artists perform LIVE. Older groups like Mamamoo, BTOB, and Winner-YG groups in general focus more on performing LIVE and vibe with the audiences and tbh that looks a lot better than groups just grinding that intense choreo and losing breath.

Le Sserafim have a really enjoyable discography but when it comes to live performance artists, Source Music has downgraded a lot considering they started with GFriend.

Since I brought up Source Music, I'd say HYBE should have delayed girlgroup debuts by a couple of years coz these girlies still need training on live performances. The boygroups tho *chefs kiss*

Girlgroup discographies have saved the 4th generation of Kpop. Hoping for boygroup discographies to have the same upgrade. TWS discography gives me hope even though they just debuted.

Groups like NMIXX, ITZY and G-Idle don't fall into the categories I mentioned above. Those babes can blast their mics with vocals AND shake that leg simultaneously.

The obsession with noise music needs to go. Not everyone can do it properly. Plus we don't need to hear the same kind of bass boosted music for every other Kpop group. Bring the diversity back.

The only company that kinda knows what they are doing with the noise music genre is SM Entertainment.Even though NCT songs are either hit or miss, atleast I can tell they aren't lazy about it and are methodically experimenting with the sound. SM might be shitty about a lot of things but they're serious when it comes to music.

Coming to SME, the management has messed up with things a lot of times and idk what changed but they've taken a few good decisions so far- like, Lucas solo debut, putting Sungtaro into RIIZE where they can individually grow as artists rather than being extensions of NCT,throwing away the idea of NCT Hollywood, debuting an entire unit of NCT instead of 1 or 2 members and doing it through a survival show for more exposure of the members, putting a stop to the avengers group concept etc. Now only if they could bring Seunghan back to RIIZE.

'Self-producing' worked for Seventeen coz their producer is Woozi. A lot of kpop groups are better off having actual composers and producers preparing songs for them.

The way most of the netizens have labeled New Jeans as a 'problematic' group just because these teenage girls have voiced their support for an adult they know (even though she is shady af 💀) over an entire bunch of adults and employees that make them feel uncomfortable and don't even try to hide their discrimination against these young girls is baffling to me. Yall expect these girlies who aren't even adults themselves to take a correct political stance when yall like to act like these girls aren't the biggest victims of the Hybe versus ADOR situation is so hypocritical and peak clownery 🤡.