#pandora’s vault has a singular purpose

[bleue-flora]

Ok, I recently wrote an essay [here] talking about the definition and duties of civil engineering as well as the ethics because of the brain rot @swordfright gave me with calling Dream Sam’s ultimate engineering project. So, because I actually am a civil engineer I took it upon myself to design the title and summary of quantities sheets just like I do at work for roads but with Dream as the project instead. And in honor of angst day sponsored by @sixteenth-day-event, I figured I’d share it because I feel like it kinda works for the prison of the mind prompt.

“Sam’s “ultimate engineering project” he deemed too damaged like a bumpy road or crumbling building that wasn’t worthy of patching and filling in the cracks or reinforcing, that’s too eroded to be fixed and preserved. So, Sam strived to tear him down to the bedrock so he could remake, remold, and reengineer Dream according to his design for the common safety, public health and well-fair.���

{These are very similar to the actual sheets I make day to day, which I shall not share for the sake of doxing my location, but yea pretty much everything has a significance. Some of it doesn’t necessarily make sense but that was because I was more so taking inventory of what we see in lore (so you know I counted ;) lol)}

[theminecraftbox]

oh. oh. watched the clip where tubbo kills dream, and there's a moment in tommy's pov where dream respawns before hes put into spectator mode. and he respawns in the spawn trap. in the main cell.

dream either 1) never set his spawn post escape, or 2) RESET his spawn back in the spawn trap. both options make me ill.

😭😭😭😭😭

I doubt that Dream didn’t reset his spawn post escape—I think that would be a high priority while Sam still has control of the prison.

However. After Daedalus, he moves in. The prison is secure. More secure than anywhere on the server. Obviously he would want his spawn set somewhere secure, right? If he is ambushed or has an accident or something, he needs to be recalled to the safest place possible. Obviously. His bed in the low security cell is fine, but it’s not quite as secure, is it?

And one more thing: if Punz and Dream are continuing their experiments with death with each other, of course Dream’s spawn needs to be set in prison, for science. They were in the main cell area when Tommy showed up in the last stream. Please consider the possibility that when Tommy killed Dream in his cell, that wasn’t the first time he’d died there.

[bleue-flora]

Sam pearls into the cell suddenly, startling Dream, who jumps back almost dropping the book he’s holding, “Ahhhhh. Stooop, I could’ve dropped my croissant.”

Sam rolls his eyes, “You don’t have a croissant.”

“I could if you gave me one.” Dream mutters, with an almost hopeful edge.

“I’m not giving you a croissant, Dream… Unless—unless you give me the revive book. Then I’ll give you a croissant.” Sam offers with reluctance like it physically hurts him to even consider feeding Dream anything but raw potatoes.

“No, then you’ll just kill me.” Dream huffs.

“I won’t kill you, Dream. I’ll let you stay in here.” Sam counters gesturing at the boiling, tiny, isolated cell, constantly oozing purple from almost all sides as if it’s some luxurious vacation home he’s offering on a game show.

Dream snorts in amusement before reenacting the iconic dance and lyrics, “Why the fuck you ly-ing? Why you always ly-ing? Mmm—Oh my god, stop fu-king ly-ing~”

Sam turns away, gripping his trident with white knuckles, clearly annoyed, “I’m not lying.”

Then as he’s leaving he turns around and tosses a raw potato. Dream ducks just in time for the spud to miss his head and smash into the wall with an explosion of mush.

Dream yells across the lava to Sam, “What the fuck, Richard?!”

He doesn’t bother addressing Sam for another, he knows he won’t get one anyways.

dsmp au where everything is the same but c!dream just continuously makes vine references when c!sam checks on him

[cruddyborderlandstheories]

Sanctuary-III: Demo Analysis

Hi again! I’m here to do my full Sanctuary-III analysis. (im back on my bullshit of actually structuring posts like a functioning human. holy mother of g-)

Tl;Dr: So from what I’ve gathered so far, Sanctuary-III looks like a Maliwan-inspired ship, but was actually built by a company named <SUPAMAX MFG>. I do think the ship we go on in the demo is taken from another part of the game, probably the time period when we’ve reached the Maliwan/Monastery planet of which I don’t know the name (the one we see Maya on). I understand that we can see Pandora in the demo, but it’d be easy to travel back there and simply remove the option for the monastery planet when we go to Promethea. I have a couple reasons for thinking this, so I’ll go over it when we get there.

For now, let’s get started :D

So, even though we’re going to be doing a full analysis of the demo, I did want to start with our previous sightings of the ship.

Ellie hanging onto a smaller version of the ship.

Lorelei resting her foot on a larger model

one hiding behind Zane near the car

better view below:

and a ship as we see it on the cover art:

notice I say A ship because there are definitely differences between this one and the Sanctuary-III we meet in the demo.

Most notably the colors/design, but also the back engines are missing from below the spoiler and the fins on the front are different shapes. Additionally, the one in the cover has windows that are significantly different from the demo and the engines in demo have fins coming off the tops that we don’t see here. I’ve been yelled at before that this isn’t a noticeable enough difference to think about, that the developers just decided to roll with it, but honestly I believe if the designers put that much time into ensuring the cover art has a dozen easter eggs to solve, why would they look at the ship and decide “eh, that’s good enough”? I wanna believe they’re not that laidback about this.

So I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt for now and provide a handful of theories as to what this cover art ship could be:

1. Sanctuary-II or an earlier model of Sanc-III (or both)

2. A shuttle used to move people to-and-from places Sanctuary-III is too large to access and the drop pods are too violent to hit (I’m thinking meteors/asteroids here) annnd hopefully we get to putz around space in one

3. A fully separate ship from Sanctuary-III that we’ll have to use later on in the game, either due to Sanctuary-III being destroyed, or other weird circumstances that would render it unavailable. Could possibly be used to reach Elpis?

Anyway, enough of that. Let’s get right into the thick of things with the actual ship from the demo!

This hit me right in the heart. I love that u can see Pandora in the background, too.

The actual ship! Do you see what I mean by those minor differences to the cover art ship? Moving on.

The reason I thought this ship was mainly because of the huge swaths of orange and the blue engines/bridge. I had thought it was Atlas as well at one point, but retracted both those statements when I saw the name of the manufacturer printed everywhere inside lol

It is possible it was made specifically for either of those companies. I am leaning towards Maliwan, so I’ll point out my reasons why as we move through this.

Also, check out the docking bay on the bottom there. That door leads to the large room we see Ellie in. I think the fins on the front of the ship are to hold it up when it’s landed so we can drive vehicles out the bottom. I am hoping for a scene near endgame where the ship is shielding us from huge attacks from above as we drive out of the bottom and, right as we escape, it collapses behind us. Fingers crossed.

the back of the ship. And the engines I mention you can’t see protruding out the back on the cover art.

Oh, and say hi to the CoV!

that’s where Troy’s sword gets launched from orbit

as we zoom in, we can see a whole bunch of things

to start, looks like Hyperion got some nice rebranding. I hope Blake took over tbh

a poster of moxxxi’s. I love the feather in her hat; I wonder if that means her a mordy got back together...

also im going to take the time to point out

how much I love that each Vault Hunter gets something that glows. Amara has her tattoos (and she can customize the color!), Fl4k has their eye, Moze has Iron Bear’s digistruct pack, and Zane has a cool jacket. Rock on my babies, you’re all beautiful. Oh, and the whole teleporting animation for this, I don’t know if its like a “first time” only thing or what, but I love it, I love it so much. I’m so glad we’re going to be able to see our Vault Hunters in the third person.

okay moving on

so right away you notice the guide telling you where places are, with arrows point in different directions. It’s quite hard to read at the moment, but we do see it again later. 

We all know about the quick change station and the lost-and-found, so I don’t think I ought to go over those right now. 

claptrap seems to have his own little cereal or something, not sure if that’s been sighted anywhere else, but im afraid for anyone who eats it

player quarters! holy balls im so excited for these

We can see the display cases everywhere, but there’s also a vault (not that kind) in the back left. I imagine that’s the bank. Hoooopefully we get a larger storage capacity or my mule characters are gonna have a ton of new buddies to talk to lol

better look at the cereals.

also apparently that water bottle we see in the Game of Thrones joke the twitter posted is an actual asset in the game.

While we have singular display cases for guns, it looks like items get their own display cases

it can show off rarity color and on the bottom left, you get to see exactly what you’re looking at. no more confusing grenade mods for shields in this house

a non-holographic poster for the Typhon Deleon movie. I think this is the first we’ve seen outside of Promethea. I guess Amara’s a fan.

A vault symbol rug, and the symbol spray painted onto her punching bag. I think that poster in the back is a Monty Python reference? I didn’t get quite a good look at it, we might see another one later on.

Amara has a window seat, I’m actually hoping we’ll be able to hang out in our rooms and look out the window at space. I would honestly spend so much time here. Also, regarding the bed (not pictured, that’s the window seat), I’m wondering if that will have any gameplay effects or if it's just aesthetics. I hope it’s at least bouncy...

she does have some jakobs crates holding up the plants. Don’t know if that has anything to do with her backstory or if its just to fit the aesthetic of her room.

we’re also told “again, you can modify your player quarters to how you want to play” which... I don’t know if I’m looking too deeply into that, but it seems like we’ll be able to pick and choose things like furniture or overall layout. I wonder if they’d let us cycle between the other VH’s rooms. Not sure exactly what it’s supposed to imply, but it is something to point out.

Our first look at the SUPAMAX MFG logo. “Ships made Quick”

We also get our first look at Ellie’s cargo bay. More on this later

behind the curtains to the left of here

a poster of Jack and some lootable washing machines. We’ve seen the poster before, from what I’ve heard it's a movie poster starring timothy doppleman. Which... What a legend. 

Now, I do want to point out we see this logo next to the cargo bay

this is one of the reasons I thought the ship was Atlas at first, however you can tell there’s no gap on the right of the triangle and the bottom edges don’t match. I definitely think the new Atlas logo is a delta to signify change, though, cause Rhys is a big ol nerd.

some blueprints of the ship and a bunch of reused posters from BL2 thrown in for decor purposes. There’s another poster of Typhon to the left of that, but since we’ve already seen it, fuck ‘em

We also see a buttload of Maliwan crates hanging around the ship, matching the color design of the one we saw floating around space 

here’s one of them!

a better look at the blueprints as a standalone poster. It looks like ‘Sanctuary’ was written over with something, but I can’t make out what. also checkout how the paint on top doesn’t match the paint on the cover art’s ship. Nor does the cover art have the fins coming off the engines like we see here. I actually just noticed that even the spoilers are different shapes.

Moving on before I go off on another tangent

a poster for Marcus’s shop

the new golden chest as Randy called it. I believe we’ve seen the animation already, where the guns splay upwards like a peacock or smth

a cowgirl hangin out on more Maliwan chests

Marcus’s new sign. Honestly? He’s rocking the bun.

this dude we find walking out of the store. Don’t know what his deal is, but I’m digging it.

this Amara already has 5/8 Pistol SDUs unlocked! (Also, there are 8 max SDUs) Makes me think she’s a high level character. That’ll come into play later lol

5/8 Backpack SDUS. I didn’t show it but she also had 1/8 Shotgun SDUs. Also only +3 to backpack space each. Considering Amara already has 5 unlocked, that means we get the regular 12 backpack space to start. D:

bank space only gets +2. Amara already has 2, meaning the bank can only hold 8 items without upgrades. F in chat for the big bank dreams. Max amount the bank can hold is 24. Somebody comfort me... hopefully these SDUs increase exponentially 😭

the mystery SDU. It looks like a box with a question mark on it, giving out guns and grenades. Makes me worry this is some form of loot box, but considering it can be bought with cash in-game, that’s probably a good sign. Maybe you can buy golden keys in game to open the gold chest now? Randy said no microtransactions and, while he is Randy, I want to believe him (disregarding the skins fiasco because we all knew that was coming).

since i’ve also seen speculation that it’s the upgrade for the capacity of the Lost-And-Found, I think that’s probably what this actually is.

the shooting range we can see from here. Doesn’t appear to have any targets yet, but it may be like the one in BL2 where they only appear when we enter.

more Maliwan boxes to the left of the shooting range.

Crew Quarters sign!

some very big (tm) Maliwan crates

tannis’s sign!

this NPC actually seems important, I’m wondering if she’ll give us a side quest or something

what i’m guessing is the power core to the ship. It’s in such a great place to get shot... i wonder if perhaps... we’re going to have to do that at some point...

“ain’t no place like space” I love this place.

also looks like there’s a shortcut here. You can see the planks across the pipes, the balcony, and the railing here that’s gonna be easy to get over. Excitement!

looks like a control panel right in front of the core. Yeah, there’s definitely going to be something related to it. Maybe we’ll get attacked and we have to go stabilize it. Maybe our ship will get hijacked and we’ll have to blow it up from the inside. I can’t be the only one who thinks this place is wayyy too grand to not get destroyed...

better look at that bad boy

the opening to moxxi’s bar

actual bar

i have no idea what this is, but i dig it. Also the zer0 for the O is making me go  🤔 i don’t THINK Zer0 would get involved, but then again, they are doing missions for Moxxi in Tales, so maybe the two got together to make something

this door seems different enough and detailed enough (red glowing light) to make me think we’re going to be unlocking this and going through it at some point. Then it shall glow green and make me happy instead of frustrated. the minimap, unfortunately, does not agree with me, but I want to believe. or that’s gonna bother me to no end. Maybe some sort of “we just escaped control core angel” situation, idk.

some slot machines. Ca$hTrap! and Tinx’s Hijinx. Looks like an NPC is using the latter though so idk if it will be available to use. 

scoring system. Looks like the ??x row will give us a new character skin!! hype.

the uhhh... Lava Lamp column... will give us...? ???

A devil fruit?? A grenade? wtf is that???

3 bananas gives us new colors! Crowns = head

the... Eridium...? That seems way too pink to be Eridium tbqh. It reminds me more of Seraph crystals, but maybe its a reference to the ‘Eridium’ growing out of the ground on Promethea? ...... Maybe that’s growing because Atlas/Typhon actually DID open the Vault on Promethea

uh anyway

The last column is about more crystals and then cash and then the last one... I assume the icons are Claptrap’s eye (considering the game), but the reward? i think that’s the grenade the demo player gets in the demo 

we’ve also got Loot Boxer (also taken by an NPC) and Vault Line. I’m wondering if the NPCs using the machines are just a gameplay mechanic and they’ll disappear after a certain level/event. Maybe those ones give us better loot. idk.

for Vault Line, i think that says “Knockout Prizes” but I could be wrong. More importantly, it looks like we can get legendaries from this one! First column shows a green/purple/yellow (legendary?) gun. I can’t tell what the other icons are meant to be, though. i think the next 3 are shields, then maybe class mods? or... grenade mods? i don’t know. The last one is a total blob for me, no ideas on that. Also wondering if that machine costs Eridium to play or something, 1) because of its design and 2) because the rewards seem sooo much better than Claptrap’s.

outside we see the Crew Quarters sign for the first time and, interestingly enough, a TV broadcasting the same symbol we see being broadcasted all across the CoV camps. What’s up with that?

infirmary and crew quarters signs on the wall this time

more Maliwan crap. even says it right on the tin. Why is there a pokeball on there?

a map of the ship. We see this on a bunch of monitors, even ones on Promethea, for some reason. This one is mirrored. dunno why.

more signs. Left top to bottom: “Cargo Bay” “Armory” “Infirmary”

Right top to bottom: “Engine Room” (OwO) “Crew Quarters” “Cargo Bay” “Armory” annnd nothing on the last line this bend around. when they turn the corner, you can see that it, too, says “infirmary”

Also, the Heatant and Coolant Pipes lmao

“LAB/SICK BAY” pointing to the left towards Tannis’s corner

so, here’s where we get our first glance at something very very interesting

now, the crew makes us think this is our first time visiting Promethea in the demo. But if it is, why are there Promethea civilians wandering around the ship? I believe i go over this some in an older post, but I’ll recap:

1) It could be that Sanctuary III was already in the air before the game starts and had already visited Promethea to take some Civilians off Rhys’s hands so he had less to worry about. That would mean that we’d need a shuttle or something to reach the ship in order to activate the fast travel station, which is (possibly) where the ship on the cover art could come in. Because in the borderlands universe, you need to reach a Fast Travel station first before you’re able to teleport to it and if Sanc III is flying and Lilith doesn’t have her powers, we’re stranded on Pandora. (Alternatively, the ship could come down from space, but... I kinda doubt it can without not being able to take off again. Maybe borderlands just has cooler spaceships... idk. They were able to make a caravan space capable). Unfortunately, this would mean those screencaps from the new trailer that looks like Sanctuary III being infested with wildlife would not take place on early-game Pandora/that we wouldn’t rescue the ship and claim it as our own. (We could possibly get Sanctuary III in the air in the new BL2 DLC if this is the case.) The ship getting infested then could take place above the Maliwan planet or Promethea or soon after we join the crew and we’re sent down there to clean it up as a side quest. Or there’s a time skip and the ship gets overrun and we have to fix it. Now that’d be rad... 

2) gearbox is being sneaky beaky about the demo time. We do see Maya later on, which leads me to believe this takes place after we meet her. Where does it look like she’ll be? On the Maliwan/Monastery planet. It could be possible that the devs took the ship back to Pandora and simply removed the Maliwan planet from the list of places to take our ship. That would leave Promethea as an option while also explaining why there are both Promethean citizens and Maya on board. Could also explain Lilith having her tattoos back, since we don’t know the events of the story that lead to us going to find Maya. Though, I think I have an idea... I’ll leave that for my Maya masterpost though. Lilith also says “We arrived in one piece... that’s a first” when we travel to Promethea, leading me to believe either that’s where Sanctuary-II warped and got destroyed (maybe explaining why there are Promethea Civilians with us now), possibly in the asteroid fields, also maybe due to a mechanical failure, or Sanctuary-III, when it first went to Promethea with us, got a bit damaged by the rocks floating around Promethea or some other thing like the CoV attacking, idk. What are those rocks for, anyway? ....... I gotta make a post on that, don’t I? oi oi oi...

Moving on

the front of the Infirmary

....

this kinda looks like a baby T-Rex. There are T-Rexes on the swamp planet, which we now are assuming is Promethea, aren’t there? Oh hell yeah. If the swamp planet ISN’T Promethea I’m gonna be all like [shocked pikachu face]. that outskirts area was really making me believe. 

anyway, see above lol

we also get another glimpse at the SUPAMAX logo

some lootables in the back

not sure if these are Maliwan or not.

Zed also has a machine in the back here. We haven’t seen him around yet, but odds are he’s still kicking because of this. And hopefully still friendly with the crimson raiders. Maybe Tannis locked him in a closet or something, idk.

oooo i haven’t seen this screen before

i want to know what it isssss

this also looks eerily familiar. brb, gonna go find what this reminds me of

okay, so

not sure if its exactly the same material/type of symbol, but this location, what i have dubbed the “temple” cuz i got no better name for it, does have square emblems across the floor with borders.

so, interestingly, this one has what looks like an eye with beams shooting out of it. if that description sounds familiar to you, it should, because

EYEBALL

now i got no idea if these are related aside from being in the same game, but it does interest me that they’ve both got eyeballs and streaky beams.

Oh and Tannis’s Vault symbol doesn’t have the writing (?) across the edges, but I will say, it does kinda look like cuneiform and eridian writing had a baby. Like, if you super heavily pixelate the Watcher’s name on her title card...

tbh I’ve theorized a lot about this place, but haven’t found anything I particularly like. From the place where the first Vault Atlas ever opened is (meaning its on Promethea and could explain why Tannis has that slab), the Great Vault’s holding place (where the skeleton on the ground is Typhon and his final journal) (perhaps the Great Vault is the entryway to the Eridian homeworld... that could explain why the CoV are trying to find it... might be a reason why they’re being manipulated by new aliens to find it. god please let them be the Seraphs...) uh, anyway, I also had an idea that it was someplace on the Maliwan planet, and maybe that it was in the archives area that was taken over by Maliwan and that the skeleton was of a Siren. That would explain why Maya is shown handing the book to Little Blue in the MoM. I go over that in an old post though, so moving on.

 oh, there’s also a frame of Tannis’s animation where the dinosaur she was inside stands up and clips through the table:

there’s a small room over here we don’t get to see, and I’m wondering if there’s another NPC joining us on Sanctuary-III that isn’t showcased. god I hope if its pickle he got more bearable as he got older because dear god i hated him in tps. I can’t see Athena nor Janey with a desk like that. Maybe Vaughn? Though would he really want to go back to being an accountant after everything...?

more maliwan boxes btw. looks like someone scribbled on this one lol

now we head to the bridge!!!

looks like an arcade game lol

but possibly a control mechanism for shuttles coming in???  👀 👀 👀

Crew Quarters and the SUPAMAX logo

oh yeah, and in case you were doubtful that this was a borderlands game:

“Caution: Excessive Farts Detected”

the Bridge!!!

We’ve got a holo-projector thing up front like we’ve seen Rhys use, as well as a mini one used as a digistructer during Lorelei’s hamburger quest. Most interesting, Lily has her tattoos! Definitely wondering if this takes place later on in the story or if they swapped her early game model in. either way, they’re definitely there. 

some cool art of Sanctuary III zooming away

just have to say

i love this so much

its great

okay moving on

I wish they’d be more specific. do ruins = vault? Typhon says he discovers the Vault and the Key in one fell swoop. if Typhon DID give atlas the Vault key and the location to the Vault (and we’re not just listening to an ARG for the movie or smth) then why didn’t Atlas open it immediately?! I mean, in TFTBL Cassius says Gortys is their last ditch attempt at opening a Vault! So what the heck?? I can’t believe that it would be less than 200 years from the first Vault being discovered to the Eridians abandoning everything. like vault keys take 200 years to naturally charge so there’s no reason why it wouldn’t be already charged and available (Unless its more of a cycle thing where it charges and then discharges after a while for safety’s sake??). 

And another thing, if that IS Eridium growing out of the ground on Promethea, then they totally DID open the first Vault. Or at least Typhon did. Unless there was something stopping them... like... Maybe in the temple those demon-looking-things stopped them from getting through and that’s why we find a bunch of skeletons around the place? Or maybe the Guardians got to them, or some other Eridian protection scheme. i don’t know... im so confused... brain hurt...

anyway

why the fuck does Elpis look like this

is that the light side of the moon? dear god im blind.

hhhh at least we can still see the crackening

lowkey wondering if the ship is based off of Eridian tech. I could totally see a slip-space drive being based off Lilith’s phasewalking

when we finish travelling, Lily says “We’ve arrived in one piece. that’s a first” and yeeah, i can see whyyy

rocks. rocks everywhere. tbh i think these rocks are 1) why lilith says that (we’ve either been to Promethea before in Sanc-III or Sanc-II got decimated slip jumping here) and 2) why the VH’s entry into Promethea is apparently so awful Lilith needs to ask if they’re actually still alive. also, we get to see just how much of Promethea is cities and goddamn. that’s a lot for a borderworld.

sorry for the youtube bar. 

Deck A: Hammerlock - Infirmary/Tannis - Deck B: Marcus - Moxxi Deck C: Cargo Bay

I am honestly so curious how they got this ship with that lettering on it. I guess they could’ve made it themselves, but... you gotta wonder... maybe we get the ship built on Pandora by Ellie. Or she helps us fix it up after we remove all gross rat things from it.

MAYAAAAA

better look at the Monty poster plus some other stuff, like a clock, dartboard, and a gas mask. Also if anyone knows what that says up top there, please let me know, im super curious!

Hammerlock’s quarters!

this guy has the same facial hair as Zane. I swear to god if I hear “Oh, that’s me fourth brother” im gonna lose my absolute shit

something to the far left outside of Hammerlock’s quarters we’re not allowed to see yet :(

there’s also graffiti of “Charge port here” around the ship and i think that’s hilarious. It’s like an airport

put your ports in, damn it!

Ellie!!!

More maliwan boxes to her left, btw

the actual cargo bay. remember how i said to look at the bottom of sanctuary III to find the door? I’m like 90% sure that’s it right there. Randy also says “down here we can check out the vehicles we’ve collected AND this is how/where we get access to the planets while we’re in orbit”.

Crazy Earl’s black market! dunno how he’s actually, like, connected to the black market from here, but, hey, who knows what he’s got in there.

veteran rewards, apparently drawn over one of Marcus’s machines lol

“Inter-Galactic” a little drawing of Sanc-III and another Maliwan box (you can see why I think this ship is Maliwan, right?)

Clappy and his GF... yeah...

one very big digistruct pad. listen... im praying for a space shuttle. i really am.

finally:

the drop pod

god this looks awesome. I bet we’re gonna have many a fun time in there lol

I finally get to live out my dream of being an ODST in borderlands. what badasses they are.

[bleue-flora]

[bleue-flora]

Well in light of @elmhat’s post [here]. I started thinking even further, specifically about the name of the prison - Pandora’s Vault, no doubt named after the infamous Pandora’s Box, which in mythology is described as containing, All the Troubles of the World that could never be recaptured after being opened. The name certainly only further adding to this image of Dream being this boundless inhuman evil. Of course, Sam wasn’t going to see Dream as human, they put him in the main cell of Pandora’s Vault. As the only prisoner he became the embodiment of all the troubles and woes of humanity, a larger than life evil that Sam had sole responsibly to keep contained in the box. Which wow that’d be a pretty big task for anyone to be fair…

And if that isn’t a big enough job, the second part of the prison’s name is Vault - a secure place to store valuables. In this case the Revival Book, the ultimate valuable, the key to life once life has been taken, a book made all the more important by Tubbo’s almost recent death. Furthermore, a vault is also a place used for burials, which is fitting because in many ways this is Dream’s tomb, his sentence for life. Like a dead body, it is Sam’s job to strip him of all his valuables and lay him to rest. Quite the responsibility I’d say for poor Sam, to be in charge of containing evil incarnate, stripping it of its power and killing if once and for all…

And the irony as Dream points out in Daedalus:

“You put me in a box. And you made me very angry. I was tortured, I was betrayed, I was lied to and each and every person that has done these things to me is now going to face my wrath. And guess what? You released me—into the world, releasing evil and hate and anger. It’s pretty, you know, pretty parallel. Funnily enough.”

is that Dream never was the embodiment of evil. War still happened, people still died while he was contained. But in the end, Pandora’s Vault still lived up to its name just not in the way Sam thought it did…

As an aside, apparently in the myth Pandora shut the box before Hope could escape and I think there’s also something tragically beautiful about that parallel because in many ways, I think Dream’s hope lived and died in Pandora’s Vault…

[bleue-flora]

It’s so wild how unbelievably cruel it was. And the fact that c!Dream said as much to people and some of them did nothing in response is crazy. Can you imagine if your former friend saw you so miserable - that you (a very talkative person) stopped talking, starting swimming in lava for fun out of boredom and were so desperate for human interaction you would sacrifice your only entertaining possession just for the chance to get someone to come scold and punish you when they replace it - and spit in your face and say you deserve it and if you ever try to escape it they’ll kill you? Can you imagine your former friend experiencing a fraction of it themselves and still say you deserve it? Can you imagine your former friend experiencing the alternative, death, and how terrible it is and still say you deserve it and even go as far as to try and send you there anyways? Not an acquaintance. Not a stranger. But friends - long term and short term friends, lovers, brothers, people you have fought side by side and sacrificed your life for. For them to witness it, for them to ignore it, for them to do nothing, for them to give up, for them to threaten if you ever escape and try to kill you is truly so fundamentally devastating. And to top it off, your 'crimes' for which you deserve this gross mistreatment are so undefinable that they fail to give proper answers to the new members who ask about it.

I don’t think any other story I’ve been into (with also extremely dark story lines) include such overwhelming cruelty to this degree. Just the suffering on every level, in every aspect of life. It was hell in a box before c!Quackity... and after, it became an abominable human existence of unfathomable suffering......

And he escaped… And he sought freedom, revenge, understanding, humanity, anything to make it hurt less… And he returned, because deep misery had become his home, his refuge, his safety… And he sought answers, reasons, logic, empathy, for anything, for any of it to make sense, to be worth it… And he died, because the sacrifice of living in the place that destroyed him still wasn’t enough to keep him safe… There.

/dsmp rp

This has most definitely been stated many times before, but rewatching all the prison VODs in order really puts into perspective the sheer cruelty and inhumanity that Dream faced in there.

Sam referring to Dream as "the prisoner" from the very start. Sam hounding visitors on whether Dream had said anything to them. Dream burning himself and killing himself in the lava as a source of entertainment. Dream being told to "behave" and not make Sam mad. Dream admitting he's getting fewer potatoes sometimes for burning his clocks because he wants human contact so badly. Dream admitting to Tommy that he's suffering in the prison. Visitors being cut off for arbitrary reasons. The cell being completely devoid of any kind of mental stimulation.

Then later, Dream getting tortured for not giving up the one thing that keeps him alive. Dream's one chance at escape, Techno, getting locked up with him. Techno telling Dream he needs a psychologist after Dream burns himself again. Dream thinking of throwing himself in the lava and drowning himself in the toilet after Techno wastes their wish with DreamXD. Dream telling Techno that he had no hope and was crestfallen until they came up with an escape plan. Dream getting blamed and tortured for Techno's disappearance from the cell. Dream getting told by Sam that all the horrible conditions are his own fault and that he deserves them and should be thankful for them. Dream believing that Techno would never come back for him.

The emotionless tone that Dream has when Bad visits for the first time, the silence when Sapnap visits, the terror and panic during Quackity's visits, the dejection and despair when Techno visits, the desperation when Sam finds him.

The entire prison arc is genuinely so bleak and harrowing. The almost non-stop misery that Dream experienced there is incomparable. And watching it all again while knowing that Dream later returns to a place like that is just heartbreaking.

[bleue-flora]

Umm… I just realized that out of c!Sam’s two Warden tridents, the one he has Channeling (the enchantment that summons lightning) on is named Wardens Mercy… like what?! Is that supposed to imply he used it or planned on using it on c!Dream as some form of electric shock torture?!…

[bleue-flora]

just a random thought/idea: where I'm from, parents used to make their kids kneel on mongo beans or rice grains for a while as a punishment. I wonder if that's how it feels like to kneel on the obsidian in the cell

Oh yea, 100% I love this. When I’ve gone rockhounding we often wear knee pads depending on the site, because of the sharp rocks, loose and solid, so I absolutely think the obsidian ground is very painful. Especially, because obsidian is volcanic glass so it breaks unevenly with pointy edges and unless they took a grinder to the floor (which even then) it’d be very course not unlike how it’d feel to kneel on beans like you describe, though potentially actually sharp to the point of breaking skin. (If you buy obsidian at a store lots of times the corners are rounded off because they’ve been tumbled (basically sanded down) a little to smooth it out.)

And not to get too engineery, but additionally, obsidian is very hard and not very shock absorbent, meaning it does not absorb much of the energy of your weight leaving the energy and force to essentially rebound back into you. If you’ve ever walked around all day on concrete floors and your legs and feet are sore afterwards this is part of the reason why. The floor isn’t taking a lot of the pressure off your feet like wood does when it bends under your weight. Hence, one of the reasons why we wear padded shoes, especially if you work on hard floors all day, to help absorb some of that energy.

So even without Quackity’s visits and the resulting injuries, Dream’s body would still be in bad condition as a result of the floor alone, not just because of all the cuts from the jagged surface, but the lack of shock absorption. He would likely develop calluses over time to deal with the floor, but there is also only so much you can do if it’s super uneven and sharp. And the result of the forces on his body from a lack of shock absorption would lead him to face a lot of joint strain and likely chronic pain in his knees, hips and lower back as well as muscle pain, posture deterioration and fatigue making it strenuous to stand for long periods of time… in other words, even if the cell wasn’t surrounded by lava, even if he wasn’t starved, even if he wasn’t in isolation, and even if he wasn’t tortured, Pandora’s Vault was still hell and he’d leave that cell in poor physical condition with chronic pain just from the obsidian…

[bleue-flora]

So… I have been obsessively rewatching streams to get as canon accurate as possible (as a perfectly sane person does… of course) and it kinda sparked a question. Clearly, Quackity’s lore is on the more scripted and edited side, so Punz’s talk with Purpled wasn’t a live impromptu and one of the things he specially highlights is “6 months” as the time frame for Dream being tortured in prison (not to mention the unspeakable and past people’s limits parts which there is no way Dream signed off on, but that’s a whole other can of worms…) We know that according to real life, Quackity tortured Dream daily for about 67 days if his last visit is the stream of making Dream write the letter (May 22nd, 2021), 75 days (from March 17th, 2021 - Quackity’s first visit stream to June 6th, 2021 - Techno’s stream where he visits Dream) if he holds up the deal to not torture Dream for a week or 82 days if he doesn’t, (we know he doesn’t get tortured while Techno is there because Dream mentions it in the podcast stream), which brings us to almost 3 months. Given this, why would Punz say 6 months? This isn’t a live stream slip up, this is scripted. They have time to verify the actual facts. So why would they say that and emphasize that point. 3 months is still a long time to be tortured daily, there’s no reason why that time frame wouldn’t be sufficient to convince Purpled of its ferocity.

One could make the argument that when Dream told Punz about it, he said 6 months because he didn’t know how long it was (which is actually what I thought at first), but Dream actually has a decent understanding of time at different points in prison so that’s not super likely. When Techno comes to visit Dream, Dream even says, he’s been there for 5 or 6 months (and that’s after Tommy’s stay and revival and stuff). We also know based on the jailbreak streams that Sam kept up the lie to Quackity that Dream escaped so even when Techno leaves it’s not like Quackity came back.

So, c!Dream knew, cc!Dream knew, cc!Quackity knew and given their attention to detail, I feel like they wouldn’t let cc!Punz get it wrong on accident. There’s no particular reason for c!Punz to lie and it’s not like an - I forgot how long let me just mention type of thing. No, this was one of the times in that talk with Purpled that he repeated himself for emphasis. So, why did he say 6 months?

[bleue-flora]

“Advanced Interrogation Technique.”

Techno can do no wrong. Obviously. 😉

[……… on a side note, anyone who thinks Quackity was the first one to think of torture on the server, look no further then Tommy & Techno and Sam’s weapons & shears (Vik and Lazer don’t count because that wasn’t torture as much as it was very painful inhumane testing ;) ). Really, the prison was always going to be a torture box, Quackity just had the gumption (amongst other things like enjoying causing people pain…) to take it to the next level.]

this is it. this is the worst thing c!techno ever did. the only wrong he ever committed. torturing c!connor.

and he's wearing a santa hat.

[bleue-flora]

Personally, I think that c!Sam's shovel and hoe were probably just intended as tools rather than weapons. That doesn't mean that they were never used as weapons, he could've brought them along to the prison with the intent to use them, but I guess I see it as more of a symbolic thing? He's finally stepping up. Ever since Tommy's death, Sam has felt like a failure of a warden, and now Quackity is prompting him to jump back into the role with both feet—and a warden needs all of his equipment, right? It would be unprofessional not to. He can't get caught off guard again. (Even if he knows that this stuff will probably never get used.)

But anyway, Sam's naming seems to follow his usual trend of grandiose righteousness—Warden's Will, Mercy, etc. The only real exception is Warden's Torment; that one really sticks out as dark and violent in contrast to his arguably worse sword, which is just his "will". Even Warden's Will Breaker doesn't have to be interpreted as sinister if you're seeing it through Sam's eyes; the will is only being broken as a necessary step, a means to an end, not out of cruelty.

So with a shovel and a hoe, things that aren't explicitly meant as weapons, I feel like Sam would continue to name them something grandiosely righteous. Your ideas of Warden's Generosity, Hospitality, Favor are nice—also maybe something like Warden's Gift or Bounty. These tools are intended to create life, not destroy it.

There's some scattered thoughts of mine anyway, I hope they make sense because I just. Have not slept. Behold my essay.

[context]

Oh 100%. Well said. It is for sure more symbolic and you never know what obstacles you might face as a Warden. Especially in a place with such mining fatigue, having the proper tool is important. I mean we all saw what Dream did in manhunt using hay bales to trap everyone in the water temple, an Efficiency IV netherite hoe would have been very useful then. He’s on a mission to kill Dream and this is right after a security issue, for him to be over prepared for anything makes sense. Whether or not he intended to use them for more cruel reasons is certainly debatable.

Still it is fun to think about. And I have always interpreted Dream’s line to Foolish - “Sam, you know, let him in the prison, let him bring in tools—and shears, and they tried to torture the revive book out of me…” - as making all Minecraft tools fair game, because why not? If shears, why not a shovel or hoe? A sharp edge is a sharp edge after all.

Regardless, Wardens Bounty has a good ring to it, yea you know what I’m gonna dub Sam’s Hoe with Efficiency IV, Fortune III, Mending and Unbreaking III as Wardens Bounty and Sam’s Shovel with Efficiency IV, Fortune III, Mending and Unbreaking III as Wardens Favor

Anyways, good thoughts and thanks for indulging my madness even while sleep deprived <3

[bleue-flora]

"While tbh i do think there's a bit of true in what cdream Said in those, it does get one to think, what we know of this guy that isn't a lie to make everyone think he's a crazy enough to be locked up?"

other anon come back and explain yourself here. why do you think severe enough mental illness can be treated with prison?

To be fair, I think anon is referring to - what lies does Dream tell to make the rest of the dsmp members afraid of him to the point of locking him up. In which case, it was never about treatment or necessarily mental health, but what lies did he tell to seem unhinged, evil, crazy to exasperate their fear and existing misconceptions about him. Wilbur and Tommy labeled him the crazy lunatic monster, but is that true? Or further, how much of Dream is actually purposely playing into that versus genuine. Regardless, I think anon is relating it to the dsmp characters not their own beliefs (I hope). And I think we can all agree that they are morons, their view of justice is massively scuffed and that they never intended to do anything but kill Dream. There was no thought process of treating his crazy, they were trying to end the threat until Dream made himself too valuable to kill. Pandora’s Vault was an added convenience because without it and the book they were perfectly fine with watching a “child” take his revenge by brutally murdering Dream in cold blood until he’s fully dead. There were no protests. The characters can hide behind some conceived notion of mercy and rehabilitation but that was never the actual purpose of the prison nor a possible outcome nor one they cared about anyways. It was about not killing him because of the book - which implies in some manner that they intended to get the book from him since they certainly didn’t seem willing to release him or give him anything to persuade him to use it for them (like for instance asking him to bring Wilbur back). So really as I’ve said before they kinda always intended to torture him. Maybe not realizing it as a direct thought, but at the end of the day that was what they deemed… they were never trying to treat his mental health, because they couldn’t see Dream as a person needing help. Prison is revenge, it is insurance and safety, it is a means to an end…

[bleue-flora]

Ya know, it's occurred to me from watching the way c!Dream talks about c!Tommy being trapped in there with him. He sounds not just glad to have company, but also like optimistic, if that makes sense. Like the "We have tons of time to bond," [46:17], "You're stuck in here with me, whether you like it or not. Okay? Whether you like it or not you're in here with me for a while. We're gonna talk. We're gonna have lots of fun. We’re gonna have lots of fun. Remember–remember when we had fun together, c!Tommy? Remember when we had fun together?–” [46:45], and the "I've changed. I’ve changed. I’ve changed–" [47:19]. He doesn’t say it in a malicious, threatening way, which certainly would be expected of him. I mean, the person who imprisoned you is now imprisoned with you, as the big bad guy that seems like some torture opportunity to me (it is the torture box after all lol ;D), but that’s not what he’s suggesting. No, he sounds adamant about change, about bonding, about talking things through. And given that the TNT Ranboo sets off to get c!Tommy trapped was a part of c!Dream’s plan, it’s very interesting that that would be his response. In fact, it’s almost as if he trapped c!Tommy in order to force them to reconcile, which very much aligns with a theory I’ve actually had for a while - what if the plan to put himself in the prison was about restoring his image.

He was renowned as the villain and everyone was after him and anyone associated with him. They all wanted his head, either because of fear or to be seen as some powerful hero who slayed the big monster. Even in the time of peace, they were plotting to kill him. All while he really just wanted peace and friendship, but he can’t exactly have that when everyone hates him and wants to kill him. Sure, he could seclude himself like Techno, but he didn’t want that. He wanted to be back in the fold.

And he doesn’t want to die, but clearly, they were never going to be satisfied until they destroy him. So, he lets them, and he forms a plan for him to be redeemed in the eyes of the server. He makes a prison so they can defeat him and he gets to live. And he makes the conditions horrible so they a) don’t suspect it was his plan and b) so they feel satisfied with his punishment. He makes it super secure so a) people can’t just get in to kill him, b) so they won’t suspect he’s there willingly (he’s very powerful after all), and everyone can feel safe from him. But he implements an extensive visitor system ("I just don’t want to ever be alone.") so now people can feel safe enough to visit him, and without weapons being involved, work through their issues. The idea being that everyone can come talk to him (which they were too scared or angry to do before) and see how he’s not so scary after all. So, that they then can ultimately release him and he can be a part of society again, now that he’s changed. The prison than was a way to de-villainize himself, so he was no longer the enemy.

Meaning, his favor with c!Techno was a backup plan, and that’s why he didn’t set up a system to get the message to c!Techno sooner, he planned on being let out. He just didn’t plan for things to go so wrong and for people to be so cold…

[bleue-flora]

Ummmmmm…. What?!?!! Omg!… I was rewatching Bad’s visit to Dream in the prison and what do I find but a conversation about living conditions and torture with Quackity! Wtf?!!

It’s too long of a clip, so here’s the time stamp 33:34-36:06.

And I did my best to transcribe it (but dang it’s hard when they talk over each other):

B: “I’ll talk to Quack—oh Quackity he’s studying to be a lawyer! We can get Quackity’s opinion.”

Q: ”Hi Bad.”

B: “Hi. Umm question for you. So you—you know Deam right?”

Q: ”Yeah…”

B: ”Yeah you know how he’s like in jail right now.”

Q: “Mm—hmm”

B: “Do you think it’d be too much to ask to go around and like try to improve like his living conditions in the prison? Like what do you think?”

Q: “Improve his living conditions?…”

B: “Yeah like I went and visited—have you visited him in the prison yet?”

Q: “Yeah yeah. no I—I haven’t—I have no reason to visit him right now… Oh, let me get this straight: improve his living conditions as in maybe like add a wall around him uhh probably bully him for awhile you know—”

B: “Na—noo!”

Q: “You know kind of like how he did with L’manberg?”

B: “Nooo!—that’s the opposite.”

Q: “Because that’s exactly what he did with L’manberg. You know what? You know what? You’re right—”

B: ”Oh my gosh…”

Q: “I could improve his living conditions—”

B: “Quackity—no!”

Q: “By boxing him in a goddamn box!”

B: “Language! Woah woah—woah.”

Q: “Yea I—I probably could do that.”

B: “Language. language. language.”

Q: “Sorry…”

B: “That’s all right.”

Q: “Maybe I could improve his living conditions like that. Maybe I could do that—”

B: “No no no-No no no.”

Q: “Maybe you’re right.”

B: “Listen, you gotta go visit him. Okay? You know what? I’m not even gonna say it I’m just saying you gotta go and visit him on one of your streams. Okay? Because—”

Q: “Oh I am. No no no believe me—believe me I’m going to.”

B: “At some point go visit him cuz—”

Q: “Oh I’m going to.”

B: “And you’ll see exactly what I’m saying then we can like discuss it. Okay?”

Q: “What—what is this? Did he—did he manipulate you? What—what did he tell you?—”

B: “No!”

Q: “Why are you acting all of the sudden so nice to him?”

B: “Look obviously Dream deserves to stay there cuz he did a lot of bad things, right?”

Q: “Mm—hmm.”

B: “But—doesn’t mean we should like—keep him in there and just have him like tortured all the time like even—”

Q: “No no, not right—not right—”

B: “No, that is right!”

Q: “No, I think that’s exactly what he deserves.”

B: ”Oh come on—”

Q: ”No no I think that’s exactly what he deserves.”

B: “Even Dream has rights as a prisoner. Right? You’re a lawyer.”

Q: “I’m sorry I’m sorry but I don’t recall Dream having any mercy on us when—”

B: “Well, yeah he didn’t but—”

Q: “He put that wall around us—”

B: “Okay..”

Q: “And he pulled all those things to Tubbo and—”

B: “Okay…”

Q: “W—why do you want to release him?”

B: “No one’s talking about releasing him!”

Q: “Okay.”

B: “I’m talking about giving him like a potted plant! Just don’t torture him while he’s locked up—he’s been locked up enough…You feel me?”

Q: “No, Bad—”

B: “Like he’s been—he’s suffering.”

[bleue-flora]

Well well well, would you look that, leather and leads found in a chest, in the prison next to a chest with Quackity’s and Ghostbur’s waivers… pretty sure this makes rope and whips canon right? I mean… what else are you making with those items in the prison, presumably during the time of the daily torture given the books’ context….