#obviously i'm referring to tma

[drdrizzey]

Late Halloween drawing!!

The good old Creepypastas from the mid 2017s are what basically got me into drawing and art in general. I quite literally started off just to make fanarts of them and boy, I made so much. I know some of those characters are outdated now but I don't want anyone to feel offended from me drawing them, that's really just a really nostalgic Fanart for me with the classic found family dynamic we loved!! Then later on I really got into those slenderverse ARGs and especially marble hornets and again, I filled sketchbooks just with marble hornets comics and fanarts so thats also something lmao

I had a hard time choosing who to draw here arggh

My inner child heals a bit more every time I draw any Slenderverse and Creepypasta character or even my old Creepypasta ocs

Also I want to add a disclaimer that I do not ship Creepypasta characters with anyone and that to me, they always acted all like siblings to each other! (Saying that because I know some people are really sensitive about ship art in this peculiar fandom and I agree that's a tricky one, but for me they've always just been a big silly family in their spooky manor, having fun)

Here's some dynamics I love and loved picturing them with :

- sally is the cute little sister that nobody can say no to and she KNOWS it, she WILL make everyone play dress up with pink ribbons and no one can do anything about it

- Jeff is a really good big brother to her and really tries his best for that

- Masky is 100% the tired big brother having to care for all of his annoying siblings. Since he's a proxy, Slenderman especially asked him to keep an eye on them and to quote, "give them what they ask for and not letting them break stuff or argue too much" which leads him quite often to having to drive to MacDonalds at 3am, because one of them whined for it. He also pretends he hates it but in reality he really cares about them. Also headcanon, this is some alternative version of Tim/Masky from marble hornets because we'll, obviously this is supposed to be Masky and somehow some people literally dont know where he comes from and just twinkifies him (which is a jumpscare to me because tim is literally amazing, hello?but a lot of people seemed to not know where he came from, well go watch marble hornets if you havent its awesome (i'm looking at yall tma and mouthwashing fans, you WILL love it too)

- my HC for Toby is that the guy has a lot going on but he's also not a kid, i like seeing him in his twenties or so. And he loves ranting about really random stuff just to annoy pretty much anyone and especially Masky because he doesn't complain much, and if he does then Toby will just find it even funnier and follow him around, explaining to him like...I don't know random stuff like describing his whole feed of cat videos or something or internet drama

(also that's not a mischaracterization of them as characters it's just my version of them in the way my little autistic brain in sixth grade pictured them, which means very non canon inaccurate)

Here's the fun reference I used :

[doberbutts]

(Some other guy entirely here) I do think there's not much of a reason to be so against the terms tma/tme though, and I don't really understand why some people are? Like, in the same way we want a word to describe our experiences so do transfems, and while I do believe that all trans people are affected by transphobia and misogyny, it's obviously also true that we're affected by it differently depending on how we present, cause otherwise we'd all be satisfied with just the term transphobia (not saying anything new here so far)

So, since it just so happened that the term transmisogyny was coined to mean specifically the oppression transfems face (regardless of what anyone might feel on the matter, that is what it means in practice), what's really so wrong with having terminology to specify whether you're affected by it or not in online discussions of specifically transmisogyny? I'd think that would be relevant enough information, and you're not obligated to share it unless you want to.

I think what's really bothering a lot of people is that these terms exist for half of our community but there's no acceptable equivalent for the other half, and there's constant backlash against attempts to fill that void in the language. But that's not the fault of anyone who advocates for the use of tme/tma, or rather, they are separate issues that I don't believe should be conflated even if the proponents of tme/tma are the same people who are against specific terms for transmasc oppression.

When we do this, from the pov of trans women we are the ones rejecting their terminology and trying to silence them when they talk about their discrimination, and since we know exactly how that feels, I think we as a community should take a step back on the matter and just let it be.

Just because we feel dismissed when it comes to a similar matter doesn't mean we should dismiss in turn.

Not that anyone needs my permission or anything for this but:

I don't really have any problem with the words transmisogyny or trans-misogyny, as I think they are valuable labels to discuss a specific intersection of transphobia and misogyny.

I am not sure I necessarily have a problem with the terms TMA or TME themselves, outside of that I think it is not possible to be exempt from oppression because it will apply to you even if the label itself is wrong. This is also how hate crime and discrimination law works in this country- it is both your label and what the offender thinks of you, not just one or the other.

In other words, the guy who screamed at me about how I'm a Mexican is incorrect because I'm not Mexican, but it is still considered to be discrimination against Mexicans because it was his hatred of Mexicans that fueled the attack. It doesn't mean that actual Mexicans aren't the actual targets or this, but it does mean that it's not possible for me to be exempt from anti-Mexican sentiment. It doesn't mean that hatred of Mexicans doesn't exist, it does mean that if I want to stop getting screamed at for saying non-English words while visibly brown (I said pate, which is FRENCH and not Spanish, in reference to a can of dog food he was buying), then I need to ally myself with Mexicans and see what I can do to help decrease this hatred of Mexicans within my country.

What I do have a problem with is how these words are used and applied.

Caster Semenya is a "TME" intersex woman who was caught by transmisogynist Olympic rulings intended to hurt trans women, and to this day is still not recognized as a woman. How is this exempt from transmisogyny? She is literally being affected by transmisogyny- and interphobia, and misogynoir, and lesbophobia. And there are more examples than that, but this will already be a long enough post.

Moreover, I'm finding a lot of hypocrisy in the theory itself, labeling certain instances of oppression as things only TMA people experience and then refusing to listen when TME people say that they experience it too. I don't really care what or how people talk about their own experiences, but I do think it's a little ridiculous to be told that someone else who is not me can tell me what I experience better than I can. And then refuse to listen when I say that I have felt the hurts they're saying don't apply to me.

If TMA/TME had stayed within the limits you've set, being about descriptors of your own personal experience rather than trying to apply theory to entire demographics in a way that very little other theorycrafting does, I wouldn't have cared. Unfortunately that's not how it's being used and I don't like that.

[broodingheroine]

tmagp7 thoughts

WRESTLING WITH TAPE RECORDERS AND MANILA FOLDERS??? immediately with the references wtf

celia don't be curious abt the computers

CELIA STOP BEING WEIRD

she def knows who's in the computers

SHES LISTING THE FEARS WHAT THE FUCK

"you won't need to know about tma to enjoy tmagp" yeah okay what the fuck is this then

HILLTOP?

is derek chambers a name I should remember. check this later.

can't remember his name 👀

shouting human face? wtf

also lol bumbling new volunteer who has nothing on his resume but is punctual and hardworking. not martin coded at all.

another name they can't remember

lowkey giving the anatomy students episode of tma

BEARSKIN RUG??? SKIN????

the items are definitely cursed right

more forgotten names and lost paperwork 🤨

it's REALLY giving anatomy students

taxidermy. hm.

also kind of breekon and hope taking over breekon and hope vibes

so hoarding

GUNSHOTS????

fire..... hilltop....... hmmmm.........

security organization.......

THE VOICE THREW YOU

CELIAAAAA YOU KNOWWWW

THOUGHT YOU RECOGNIZED IT AAAAA

SHES TOTALLY FROM THE EYEPOCALYPSE

colin :)

JON???? FUCKING JON????????? WHAT THE FUCK WHAT THE FUCK WHAT THE FUCK

the real stuff???? what the fuck colin

colin ur paranoia is showing

COLIN WHAT THE FUCK

go gwen! blackmail ur boss!

SHE SHOT HIM?

oh he's not dead? ohhhhhh

SHE GOT PAID TO KILL A GUY?

GWEN WHAT SOURCE WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT

bouchards old money confirmation?

REAL WORK?

EXTERNALS LIASON? WHAT THE FUCK WHAT THE FUCK WHAT THE FUCK

NOW I HAVE TO WAIT A WEEK??????????

god okay so

is the oiar secretly the security team that burned the hilltop place down? that's obviously what the external liason will be right. but then what would the response department end up being?

colin is devolving extremely quickly and im deeply upset about it. no "outside" electronics. as opposed to...?

once again: EMAIL FROM JON???? what did it say. what was it about.

"you don't need to know anything about tma to listen to tmagp" yeah BULLSHIT like I'm sure you don't NEED it but it certainly HELPS

gwen going to lena is giving the archival crew confronting elias abt murdering leitner except gwen has dubious morals and is unapologetically in it for her own gain

which I do appreciate. a protagonist who's willing to admit she's in it for herself and nothing else? love.

I do question whether the oiar office work is done purely as a front for whatever lena is bringing gwen into or if it does actually serve a purpose.

like I said up there somewhere, celia is definitely a transplant from the tma verse. there's no way she's not.

okay I think I'm done? that was a lot..... like a lot a lot

so I think I'm gonna go lay down and die now

[nemesis-is-my-middle-name]

john malevolent doe but he's doing the tma fears thing

(aka arthur lester fears list: the squeakquel)

@if-loki-was-a-fox and @princessbadassofbadassia were talking about it in the comments of this post and it got me thinking and well. ive already done one of these for arthur. so it felt appropriate to do john too. there's a lot of crossover here so i might skip over some things that got mentioned in that list and happened to them both. for the sake of time

in the interest of symmetry i'm just gonna run down the whole list again. up top tho, one thing that i think is Really Neat, and maybe this is just the way i've decided to read things, but arthur's list contained a lot of him being acted on by the fears, whereas john seems to just as, if not more often be the actor. which fits the way tma fears work, with john being more eldritch spooky thing and arthur just being A Guy. ok anyway let's get to it

the eye

...he's eyes. girl he's eyes.

is the Designated Witness for everything that happens to them. is not allowed to look away. the eye is often associated with a fear of being watched but it often positions people in the role of watcher as well, even ppl who aren't necessarily avatars (see: that dude who animorphed into a security system) and there is also. like. the avatars. sooo

per discussion of the dark world, he's unable to break down mentally and so makes for a perfect eternal observer to horror and violence. a ceaseless watcher, if you will

faust. faust faust witness this over and over and you cannot stop it you cannot escape you can't look away you can't even blink if you want to live you have to watch again and again and-

the spiral

not to do the same bit twice in a row but. girl he's madness. he was a madness god.

the distortion is also more specifically associated with deception, manipulating someone's perception of reality, making them trust you over their own senses, which john, much to his own shame and regret, happens to be very predisposed to

season 1 "i'm a friend arthur. also you murdered parker that was all you and i have no idea why you did that haha why did you do that arthur"

and also season 4's lying about anything and everything up to and including shit that was directly in front of their face. the distortion is in his nonexistent fuckin' blood, baby

the end

hm. i'm tempted to count the dark world here, but i'm not sure if that qualifies since while he obviously associates it with death it's not really death in the traditional sense as the end implies it? like it's not an End. it's just different. and worse.

it is Removal From The World though so maybe it counts i am not sure. and like, the dark world is apparently the terminus of all realities, which. makes it feel pretty end aligned?

regardless it does make him very very afraid of the notion of dying, or rather of arthur dying, on account of that means he has to go Back. so.

the stranger

is not human. wants to be human. is trying very hard to be human. sometimes fucking it up. yeah.

using parts of arthur's body as a meat puppet even tho the guy who owns the place is still in there. i still think this is a stranger aligned feature and you can't talk me out of it

him vs the KIY also feels very like a very the stranger conflict to me. "you and i are similar and yet so different as to be almost incomparable, in a way that feels almost paradoxical. and you desire to unmake me and remake me into something Like You, thereby making me unrecognizable to myself. i know you, i do not know you."

edit: apparently the KIY was also literally referred to as "the stranger" for part of the play?? that's fun ty luci

the lonely

isolated from basically all all human connection outside of arthur. that's some lonely shit

on the other side of the coin, tries to intentionally isolate arthur as a response to the above fear, meaning he both gives and receives the lonely in some sense

former isolation in the dark world, too!! yay!!

the month long coma where he just had to sit there, perceiving others but unable to communicate with them in any way. again, an acutely The Lonely experience

the desolation

idk man, hate to sound like a broken record but the dark world seems pretty Desolate

this one's tough with what we have in canon on account of john is both fairly insulated from being harmed, and unable to harm or destroy others directly, while he's with arthur. so.

actually what probably DOES fit here is how he tried to deal with oscar. knowingly trying to destroy something important and meaningful to his friend. yeah.

cauterized his finger too i guess

edit: ALSO the constant threats on arthur's life. the looming fear that he'll lose his friend, the most important person in his world, and be utterly powerless to stop it. and on the flipside, the fact that he's effectively burned arthur's life down once already, just by meeting him (ty loki)

the slaughter

the dark world. again. this time as an endless wheel of indifferent violence that demands submitting to the cycle in order to survive

also killed emily and an unspecified number of others who picked up his book for no real reason

then he escaped and killed parker. also for no reason.

the vast

"As the King In Yellow, I was not hostile towards your kind – I was indifferent. I did not hate or despise you, no more than you despise an ant. You are meaningless." (from part 13)

it's about the intimate understanding of how small a single life appears from the perspective of the gods they face, pressing up against the equal understanding that now he is one of those ants. i think he probably grasps a fear of the Vast more clearly than possibly any human could, because he's seen it from both sides.

has some awareness of timelines even pre-kayne so he's gotta deal with knowing That too as like, a fun bonus

edit: possibly also the dark world AGAIN lmao, considering its nature as something able to contain the refuse of so many realities and as something all-consuming and virtually inesapable (ty luci)

the buried

...actually i don't really have anything for this one

this is his version of arthur's buddying up with the vast i guess

is being confined to small parts of another body claustrophobic? i feel like it might be

he's been through a lot of shit while underground obv but he doesn't really seem specifically bothered by the undergroundness of it in the same way arthur is. he's accepted their lot in life. they're just gonna be underground going through horrible things, apparently. c'est la vie.

edit: ty luci and loki for reminding me about the metaphorical angle here!! you've also got the crushing weight of his past mistakes, the burden of the lies and secrets, the metaphorical mud in his lungs and throat choking him with the equal tension of wanting and not wanting to confess, to be truthful...

the dark

this is the thing that kicked off this whole analysis so i feel like i can just sort of gesture vaguely at it. you get it.

the dark world Is Dark and he is Scared Of The Dark because he Does Not Like Remembering It. before almost anything else, he fears the dark. he knows what it can herald.

also all he can DO is observe. so when he suddenly Can't Observe that is like, extra terrifying for that reason too

the corruption

he's living in his bff's body stealing pieces of it from him destroying his life hurting him and the things he cares about being constantly argued with and belittled and for some reason they love each other regardless. corruption ass relationship

he had to Watch the witch do her thing so, also that,

the web

the web and the KIY are both very associated with plays, puppets, stages, etc. and the idea of pulling another to dance on their strings, maybe even letting the victim believe they're in control while they do

and actually that's another thing he personally does to arthur in s1/s4!

and then kayne is playing him right back 👍

very similar to the Lonely, arthur can more or less revoke his agency whenever he wants and then john is just stuck going along with whatever bullshit he's decided to pull today. which feels web aligned though i may be miscategorizing it i'm not sure

the flesh

oh yeah it's FAUST TIME AGAIN, BABY

also arthur bit his finger off and now one of his fingers is a fucking tree. this too is the flesh

the hunt

he and arthur get to share in the constant terror of being a target for much larger, more dangerous things that want very badly to kill them. they sure do get Hunted an awful lot

aw hey the dark world's back too did you miss it. yeah i imagine this involved a lot of being both the predator and the prey

the extinction

wait i have something for this one this time actually. the dark world is canonically composed at least partially of dead realities right. he's personally witnessed the end of everything. he's been personally privy to extinction. yippee

CONCLUSION: lord almighty this guy is just fears all the way down huh

i know i said this up top but now that i've actually gone thru the whole thing. again. it does feel really fitting, given his nature, that john is often both the recipient of the fears and the vector through which they act on others. like yeah, he's a god turned mortal. of course they can't seem to decide what to do with him. that's fun we love to see it

[fox-guardian]

idk if you've said before but what r your assigned fursonas for the tma characters? and/or tmagp? i'm very curious

jon is a black oriental shorthair cat. the cat part is obvious, but also look at them. they are so long and silly. i love their faces and their huge ears.

martin is a bear. enough said i think

tim is a fox because. i'm biased what do you want from me (danny is also a fox because they're siblings)

sasha is a domestic rabbit with lop ears, while not!sasha is a hare

elias. i think i changed elias, he was gonna be a sphynx cat but i think i decided to change that and never settled on an alternative (@irradiatedsnakes has an excellent barn owl elias that i am Very fond of tbh) (all of his designs are top tier truly please go look at them)

peter is a polar bear as previously mentioned

melanie is a sphynx cat (that's why i changed elias) because i think melanie and jon both being cats is funny

georgie i think i went with capybara

i never drew it, but i think i was gonna go with sheep for daisy. and i don't think i ever had a plan for basira

nikola is a carousel horse <3 with jarringly human hands under her hooves like that deer from adventure time

gertrude was a persian cat, very fluffy and grumpy looking.

trevor was a terrier. specifically like the tramp from lady and the tramp. obviously.

i don't thiiiink i had many other solid ideas?? i think i was going to make oliver some kind of dog (maybe a guard or companion breed??) as a reference to church grims

for tmagp i don't really have many ideas?? i've drawn them as furries but just in an OOPS ALL CATS setting because cats are fun to draw. as actual specific animals i've been leaning towards mouse sam tbh

as a treat tho i'll drop the all cats furry ideas as well

sam is a tuxedo cat

alice is orange and white with a bob tail

gwen i think i'm going for some kind of shorthair calico

celia i think would be fun as a cornish rex perhaps (they both have the same nose <3)

colin is an orange lykoi cat because i think they look so fun and also it works with the hair i gave him (they're partially hairless and he's balding)

teddy is a brown british shorthair. that's basic i know but Have You Seen Them. they're so cute and teddy-bear like.

idk for lena yet

[thetriboulet]

Woooo so the Magnus Protocol premiered and I have things to say and things to overanalyse!

As we know, 'Chester', 'Neil' and 'Augustus' are, maybe?, Jon, Martin, and Jonah, respectively. Hence this:

And, of course, there's 'J1', 'M1' and 'J2' in the trailer.

However, I've seen confusion over the fact that the third 'Error' is voiced by Tim Fearon, who as far as I'm aware has not previously voiced any characters in the Magnus universe. Even though the name is distorted, I can make out what looks to be an H at the end of the name, so this very well may be Jonah.

My theory is this: 'Augustus' is Jonah (or just his voice). However, since the body of Elias was killed in the Panopticon, Jonah does not use Elias' voice anymore. Jon, Martin, and Jonah are all disembodied, if we are to believe they are somehow inside the computer/other technology (ie Alice/Sam's phone in the pub scene) or in some way somewhere adjacent to the world of Protocol. So it could, in a dream-logicy eldritch sense, follow that Jonah is able to survive in his own creepy old ass man way, and use his original voice. Obviously, I cannot corroborate this claim in any meaningful way. We have not heard Augustus speak yet, but I think it is a possibility nonetheless.

The fact that Augustus supposedly shows up to read cases aloud significantly less than Chester and Neil could also be a clue. Maybe Jonah is weaker than Jon and Martin due to his injuries, and is therefore unable to materialise as often as Jon and Martin. Maybe the voice that speaks the true cases (because, similarly to how true statements were identified using the tape recorder in TMA, I imagine true cases will be singled out using the text to speech system) is relevant to the case itself - ie, Jonah only speaks when a case is heavily linked to the Eye, etc.

Furthermore, there's the question of who is spying on who and when/why. By this I mean that we hear our perspective switch between devices (the phone, the computer, the security camera during Colin and Sam's interaction, etc), and I believe that this happens because one or more of the 'Errors' (as I am going to refer to them henceforth) is travelling between devices to spy on the characters' conversations. What we hear is dictated by what the Errors, characters who have prior knowledge of the Fears, deem important. This is backed up by the episode's closing scene: Colin's paranoid closing lines. It is clear that Colin believes someone is listening to them, and it is implied that he has made a connection between this and the Errors. What intrigues me is the Errors' motivation for doing this at all. If what they deem important is what we hear, and this is the first that we are hearing, then it seems to me that it is Sam's arrival that has given them cause for concern, or (in Jonah's case) hope (if he is plotting to return, or something, I don't put it past the scheming weasel). So, why are they listening? And how can we really tell if what we are hearing is the spying of Jonah, or of Jon and Martin?

Another thing. Jonny makes a point of letting us know that Alice does not think the work they do is of any significance, or is checked by anyone. She constantly mentions it in passing and is very casual in her attitude towards work. We obviously have the foresight to know this isn't true. The reason I point this out is because of what Sam does when filling out his paperwork: he ticks the 'Response' box, to which Alice responds that it doesn't matter. This could be nothing, it probably is nothing, but I feel like the fact that Sam has ticked the onboarding box of a mysterious department of an already mysertious organisation might come up later...

Yes I know I am jumping to a lot of conclusions, especially where the Errors are concerned. Please take every theory you hear, from me or anyone else, with a grain of salt, this is all speculative. From a writer's perspective, I honestly think it's pretty likely that Chester and Neil aren't actually Jon and Martin, and just their voices taken by the Web or something, but shh I can dream.

Edit: oh my god they changed his name to Norris that is even worse. Jonny and Alex were fr like 'neil is too kind, we need the name to be Chester levels of horrific'

[starborn-storyteller]

SHE KNOWS SHE KNOWS I'M RIGHT I HAVE TO BE OMG OMG OMG OMGOMG

ok so, magnus protocol theory (spoilers for, like, all of tma & tmp)

we don't know that georgie & melanie's followers died. we ONLY know that they were taken. where to, you ask? THE FUCKING WEB. THEY WERE TAKEN TO THE WEB AND DROPPED THROUGH. maybe to test that people could go through? BUT THAT'S WHY AND HOW CELIA'S HERE. also don't think I didn't notice hilltop!

she OBVIOUSLY knows: she recognizes jon's voice, that quip about tape recorders, her question at the beginning that CLEARLY references the buried, SHE KNOWS AND I'M RIGHT.

[crazycatmilo]

If you're a TMA fan and you like stuff that obviously was inspiration for JonMartin, you should definitely read the book Haunting of Hill House (not the movie or show because none of them are really faithful adaptations.) It's about a lonely woman named Eleanor who decides to take a job investigating ghosts, after her in-firmed mother dies. Part of the job entails living in a Haunted House, and once she's there, she meets another woman, Theodora, who's fresh off a break up, definitely gay, and may or may not have psychic powers.

Like Eleanor Vance is one of those characters that you can just see Martin's DNA in. Recollection feels like it came right out of The Haunting of Hill House. (I'm also 100% certain the House on Hilltop Road is a reference to The Haunting of Hill House.) The book is a very quick (and very scary) read, I highly recommend. Though unfortunately probably not as wholesome as Sam and Frodo.

TYSM FOR THE REC ‼️ This sounds very up my alley, it has already been added to my book wishlist 🙏

[starrypawz]

I'm aware I'm not the only person to do this but here's a post that was just meant to be me tracking up the description of Gerry's hair to see what is actually going on on that front but this also turned into a few other things that are quite interesting to think about. And I started

I will put this under a cut as it's long, also spoilers

So we first meet Gerry in 004

And he's described as having 'artificially black' hair and he's unshaven, this statement is set in Winter 2012 and is from the period where Mary is haunting Gerry post her death, this also occurs after the events of 012 as the incident in 012 is dated as happening on December 23rd 2011

Then in 012

Yet again, dyed hair, this time he's clean shaven which implies either Gerry tends to shave or he probably at least shaved for the sake of blending in for this incident

(This is also when Gerry had all his tattoos)

, this is also in 2011 and it's when Mary is still around but I'm not sure if she like actually somehow appeared at the hospital since it's never really said like how far Mary could like project herself as a ghost but either way somehow they signed him off to her.

Also to note from 012

Gerry has an expired passport with him, he's traveled a lot this lines up with what Gerry himself says in 111 that he and Mary traveled a lot (Also I personally feel he likely had a feeling he wasn't coming back from this and had that on him for... reasons)

Then in 035 we encounter teenage Gerry in 2002

He's described as thin, his hair is apparently obviously dyed, it's also described as 'greasy'

Also to note, this is where the statement giver implies Gerry is somehow stronger than he looks

Gerry then shows up in 048

He's described as scrawny here, and also described as having 'long black hair' this episode is set in September 2009 which would likely be about a year after Mary's death which is said to have happened in 2008 and in 111 Gerry does say the following

Also in 004 it's stated that Gerry seemingly disappeared after being acquitted

Also apparently someone moved into Pinhole Books in 2014

Also to note 062 where Mary talks to Gertrude and gives her Eric's page is set on the 3rd July 2008 meaning that Mary's death was somewhere after this point (I am going to assume likely not that long after this)

Mary speaks to Eric in 154 which is dated to the 21st July 2008 and also this is where Eric does ask her to track down Gerry and Gertrude has been aware of Gerry's existence for a good while by this point.

Also it's implied that Eric and Gertrude know what Mary was going to do

Another side note 080 is where we have Jurgen's encounter with Gerry which probably would've happened in 2014

And Gerry thinks this was in fact not Leitner

So now we come to 102

This statement was taken in June 2014 and is the source of the 'poorly dyed' description of Gerry's hair, this is the only time where the condition of his hair is really remarked upon other than in 035 where it's described as greasy (Which I personally feel was just as a result of Gerry being a teenager at a time as having greasy hair as a teenager happens to most people) so that was likely a one off moment.

Other references to Gerry's hair being dyed imply it's obviously dyed and an artificial looking black so I have another feeling that his hair looking the way it apparently does here is probably a one off since Gerry has been.... going through it to put it mildly.

And its stated that Gerry passes away a few months after this and in 111 Gerry states and since he says Mary haunted him for five years Gertrude seemingly was the one to seek Gerry out This was likely some point in 2013 (Going off what was calculated by people writing the tma wiki)

Allegedly The Catalogue was burned, or at least Mary's pages were Gertrude however seems to have The Catalogue in 2015 when she is arrested for tresspassing

Gerry was also unaware he was ill until it was too late

In 012 we find out Gerry's death was sometime in late 2015

And Jon finds the following out in 107

From what we have in 107 it's likely Gerry and Gertrude were heading to The Usher Foundation from Chicago but only got as far as Pittsburgh, this is where Gerry passes, Gertrude narrowly avoids arrest for being caught when binding Gerry to the Catalogue of the Trapped Dead and Gertrude travels back to England.

And then The Catalogue falls into Julia and Trevor's hands about a year late 109

(And yes can confirm the Greyhound route referenced by Jon does exist)

So that's the post

Things to Summarise

Gerry is apparently stronger than he looks, he is also canonically pale and thin/scrawny

He's described as having stubble in 004 but not 012 I have a feeling he tends to stay clean shaven but in 004 it's implied he looks like hes not slept for a few days (Likely due to Mary) 004 happened post 012

Gerry has an expired passport with him in 012 likely for identification reasons (I personally feel he had a feeling he might not be coming back)

Gerry was released into Mary's care after the events of 012 but it's not clear if Mary was physically there or not

His hair is obviously dyed, and always described as long. His hair is described as Greasy in 035 when he's a teenager, and Poorly Dyed in 102, 102 is set not long before Gerry died so I have a feeling that's probably part of the reason his hair is like that he's been going through it (tm)

Gertrude very likely knew about Gerry's existence pre 2008, she was asked to find him in July 2008 by Eric, She also spoke to Eric a few weeks after Mary approached her in July 2008 but didn't intervene until 2013

Mary's death was likely some point in Summer 2008, probably in July

Someone moved into Pinhole Books in 2014

Gerry also beat up Jurgen Leitner in 2014

Mary's pages were burned in 2013 but it seems The Catalogue was still usable since Gerry was put into it

Gertrude and Gerry most likely heading to The Usher Foundation before his death They'd been in Chicago and were traveling via Pittsburgh, which is as far as they got before Gerry died, Gertrude never did show up at The Usher Foundation.

Gerry died some point in late 2015, the Catalogue of the Trapped Dead was left behind and eventually vanished from the evidence locker and somehow ended up with Julia and Trevor just under a year later

[bonzos-number-1-fan]

TMAGP 27 Thoughts: Uber Eats

We've broken the guest writer run with another Jonny episode and it's quickly apparent why. Super pleased to hear another Augustus incident. As I mentioned the last time we had one of these I was half expecting it to be the last of the season. Glad to be wrong and glad for another fantastic episode.

Spoilers for episode 27 of TMP and general spoilers of TMA below the cut.

There isn't a whole lot to get into for the opening scene. Lena is obviously very anxious for this visit with the minister. I'm fairly sure that's just Lena being Lena but you never know.

As I've mentioned I'm thrilled for another Augustus episode. Tim Fearon has killed it in every performance and I think the style of incident he gets are some of the most enjoyable. In no small part to the gravitas he lends these older incidents. This is going to be another quote heavy breakdown too as there are a fair few bits to really pull apart in the incident.

I really enjoyed this incident. Just a lot of fun and Augustus incidents are always great. I'm not going to get into the plot of this one too much as I feel that's fairly easy to follow. There are some details to get into all the same though. Firstly, our PoV character is an unnamed Magnus and while it'd be tempting to say it's Jonah you can't rule out the fact that their first name, and gender, wasn't mentioned here. There are also few mentions of the Great Work here too. This is something I talked about it my ep 21 post Y2K [Errors] so I won't repeat myself here. This being set in 1845 is pretty important for a few of the details but it also means it takes place just 14 years after episode 4 and so the stranger with the violin could well be our PoV character, as has been speculated by myself and others. Our Magnus' mention of being at work for 3 decades would also line up well with that timeline.

With all the more general thoughts out of the way it's time for a lot of quote.

While I have no hesitation in accepting N’s recommendation, the particulars of the collapse must be confronted directly.

The only N I think this might be alluding to is Isaac Newton. There is a later reference that, while not directly supporting this idea, reinforces it. Newton would potentially be aligned with the Institutes goals. The Great Work is the goal of alchemy and as we've seen from ep 19 it's something he was invested in. However, this episode takes place in 1845. Newton died in 1727. The "recommendation" could be something foundational to the pursuit and as such laid down before Newton passed the phrasing does make it seem more immediate than that. Which probably means this N isn't Newton, or Newton never quite kicked the bucket. Whether because he's achieved the immortality alchemy promises, or is using more sinister means. It could also be a title that's passed down too. That would be fun.

and thus far are still unable to effect transmutations beyond those endeavours we each undertook alone.

This is a very interesting quote. There are two ways of looking at this to my mind. The first is that the Great Work is simply too vast a topic for any one mind to pursue to fruition. The second is that it's impossible for one man to do it alone because the aspects of the Great Work are governed by separate powers and you can only serve/be claimed by one. If it's the second one then this is a set up anyone familiar with TMA will be very familiar with.

No, I must excise such doubts from my mind. Purification is not only to be found in chemical processes, after all.

This one isn't super important but I did want to mention that purification is the second stage in the traditional four stage process to create the Magnum Opus.

It is strange how the work of natural philosophy attunes ones eye to the things that might be termed unusual.

The quote here isn't important. The way this quote is said very much is and I've not seen anyone mention it at the time of writing. There is an unnatural strain on the word "eye" and it's obviously not a coincidence. Given the text itself doesn't have any strong meaning so I can only conclude that the problem speaking the word is with the speaker rather than the text. While it's not exactly revelatory it's likely the strongest hint we have at who Augustus is: TMA's Jonah Magnus.

our London offices

Not a whole lot to say on this bit other than it's interesting they had these at all. We knew they were snatching up a lot of land but had these been particularly prominent you'd expect them to have been mentioned by now.

Perhaps my recent frustrations with our progress and the increased scrutiny by Boyle’s incessantly meddling inheritors have pressed me to put more significance on this than is warranted

This is our second reference to episode 19. You'll all no doubt remember that Robert Hooke wrote to Robert Boyle in that episode about Newton and referenced the "Protocol" multiple times. It would now appear that my earlier speculation is correct. The histories of the Institute and the Protocol are deeply tied together and that whatever the Protocol, or rather its enactors, grows into the OIAR is connected too.

Archibald Cameron’s notebook, and found it surprisingly legible, if somewhat soiled. It is no great loss to the Institute

Okay, so this one is just bizarre. Archibald Cameron is a fairly important historical figure. He was a very prominent figure in the Jacobite rising of 1745. 100 years before this incident is set. He was the last Jacobite to be executed, in 1753. While that's now viewed as a pretty shitty move it does mean he should be well dead. There isn't really another famous Archibald Cameron that would be alive here either. So this is either the "young" 138 year old Archibald Cameron, or it's just a very odd choice of naming/a mistake. If it's the first that also means our as yet unnamed Magnus is much older than 138 if Doctor Archie is "young". Which could very well be the case if our Magnus is famed alchemist Albertus Magnus. He was born somewhere around 1200.

the rate of digestion, for lack of a better word, seems to be linked to his own levels of fear

Fear makes it hungry. Hunger theorists are either in shambles or elated.

I think that's all the interesting stuff to pick out of this incident. A really fun listen and I can't wait to hear more about

I do always enjoy Gwen and Alice hating each other. It seems like strange emails are back on the menu. Although this time I think it's more likely to be from Klaus, or one of his potential associates like Einsamernarr, than it is another John email. Especially as the address was nonsense and it contained files. It's not the first time he's leaked stuff after all, and not the first time it's been direct to Gwen.

Just… junk. Old paperwork. Nothing important. bzzt Sorry. Already deleted. bzzt

Also Alice mentioned she's trans in text now. It was always canon but now people can't deny it.

Sam and Celia's continued Magnussing doesn't have as much to dig into as you might expect here. It's all pretty explanatory and if it isn't there isn't a load to say. The obvious stuff is Hilltop and Oxford. Celia's fascination with this is obvious as she ends up in or going towards Oxford when she "sleepwalks". The Institute, and other powers, interest seems to be tied to other worlds. The Hilltop Centre is where the charity shop the hard to remember strangers packed full of strange antiques. It's also now confirmed to be where the Magnus Institute's "Outreach Centre" was that scooped up Darrien 3 in episode 17. It's also burned down in either case. It's really nice to see Alice getting more on board with all this too. I thought it was rapidly approaching the point where she wouldn't be able to just do nothing. Totally weird Celia is so concerned about the word "Archivist". Its just a job title for boring nerds.

You also have no idea how much I regret not including a joke about Trevor Herbert being the minister. I wrote a joke about the irony of going from killing blood sucking leeches to being one. I cut it because I already made the better joke about Tories that post and thought it was enough politics.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Incident/CAT#R#DPHW Master Sheet and Terminology Sheet

DPHW Theory: 5535 seemed fine but I expected H to be a good bit higher on this. You can, obviously, just not fall for it. It does seem like a hard thing to escape from after it's gotten you though so I'd expect more H here. First one in a long time I've sort of disagreed with.

CAT# Theory: CAT3 is sort of interesting for the "It's not Person/Place/Object" thing. This is another one in the same sorts of realms as Mr. Bonzo or a doll, presumably, where something is ostensibly an object but has some higher level of reasoning. All three are different CAT#s too.

R# Theory: B felt quite high for this one but it's got multiple witnesses who both documented their sightings of it. For one of them they documented it while being victim to it. So that's probably fair.

Header talk: Kidnapping (Carriage) -/- Consumption [Letter]. WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU MEAN "[letter]"‽‽‽ Why did formats stop? Why did they start? Why does it not have a crosslink subsection? Can you only have 4 terms in a heading at once?

This was done to spite me, and me alone.

[anthroposeen]

tmagp 16 relisten notes!!

spoilers for ep 16 under the cut, and also some tma spoilers as well since i cross-reference for theories! :)

celia:

- she physically and verbally comforts alice even though they've had some rocky interactions in the recent past, and she comes off as genuine when giving alice her support

- "i believe you/im serious" -> there isn't a glitch after these lines, and i think its fair to say celia is from the tma universe, the question now is how much she knows/understands/remembers from the fearpocolypse

sam:

- despite being more distant with alice in recent episodes, he's still helping her and checking up on her

- "so that would be Z for zombie?" i thought this was a cute little callback, but also isolated the line because its the first instance we have of sam initiating a bit/joke and alice failing to continue it

- he checks in on alice after they hear Madam E die in the incident and leaves his desk with celia to see about her after she leaves

alice:

- "i haven't seen someone die since..." im taking this to mean that she saw one or both of her parents die and a part of why the drowning victim has shaken her so hard is because its a flashback to those memories

- the woman she met in the alleyway was announced dead by the paramedics immediately, they said she had a lot of water in her lungs and discounted the possibility she could walk or speak

- "maybe that i'm finally losing it" -> i dont think alice is as knowledgeable about the paranormal as we think. she definitely knows more than shes letting on, but i suspect whatever she knows is specific to the oiar and whatever power has touched her life. similar to georgie in tma s3, she knew the paranormal existed and trusted in jon's circumstances but she had little context for her belief, since the only fear she had encountered before was the end. i think alice is operating under a similar world view, and this event does make her question her sanity (shes mentioned old coworkers going odd before, and i think its a genuine worry she has for herself as well as sam and celia)

- she's very blunt and obviously upset after the incident ends, leaving to go get coffee and rebuffing sam as he tries to see about her

gwen:

- she's frustrated that the rest of the team left after the incident and she's alone in the office, and becomes even more aggravated by lena interrupting this to berate her

- she defends lady mowbray's civility (after lena calls externals dangerous) by saying shes a real lady, implying that since she's nobility she wouldn't behave rashly (like mr. bonzo)

- she's frustrated that lena is reprimanding her for breaking a rule she was never told about, and isn't given enough information to gauge risk on her own

- she expresses stress over the real dangers of her job, feeling its unfair she's expected to talk to externals alone without training when they're too dangerous and unpredictable to visit the offices

- despite all of her concerns, she still demands to keep her position and continue her work

lena:

- she's very (reasonably) angry at gwen for inviting lady mowbray to the office

- she says that bringing externals to the office is dangerous and poses risks to personnel

- she explains that the operation to keep balance with the externals, and to exercise power over them, is dependent on how they keep relationships with them. as in, the externals have to be kept at an arms length and not introduced to internal affairs staff to avoid losing the fear and respect the oiar exerts over them. without control over the externals, they lose balance and they may become targets

- she agrees to think on training gwen for a full position as the externals liason

incident:

- narrated by chester/jon, i think this falls into his normal thematic elements of curiosity killing the cat

- most of the incident is told through youtube video format, voiced by the influencer 'Madam E', a goth (im assuming beauty and lifestyle vlog influencer?) youtuber. She got to know ink5oul through online connections

- she received a heart tattoo (unsure of the placement, but i was imagining it over her real heart or ribcage?)

- the tattoo process seems incredibly painful even in this circumstance, and just like in ep 2, the recipient doesnt seem to know the design theyll get until they wake up from the session

- i think the heart tattoo (called the heart's desire by ink5oul) played a role in manipulated Madam E's emotions for them, seeing as how they began a (using ajn's exact terms) situationship following the session

- when Madam E questions ink5oul about how they come up w their design concepts they get cagey and won't disclose their secret method, but offer Madam E a chance to grave rob with them (assuming this is related to the design process)

- "dig." [bruh!] gave me hp damage

- "don't make me break your heart" this is obviously referring to the tattoo and her emotional state, but i think it ties into the tattoo manipulating the subject -> "i could feel the words in my chest"

- Madam E throws out the idea that ink5oul is stealing tattoo concepts from dead bodies, but i dont think thats the exact case. i think that bodies like the one found in ep 11 feed into ink5oul's power and creativity as inspiration and likely as a paranormal energy source of some kind, but this seems more akin to them studying the works of old important artists (and alchemists) and using those techniques to create their art

- ink5oul responds with a callout video targeting Madam E, and i suspect it was about her accusing them of stealing art, not about the grave robbing (which seems a bigger insult to me)

- "it hurts/ i can feel it" referencing the hate messages she's receiving while touching her heart. she then leans forward to show the camera you can physically see a difference (im assuming her tattoo was altered in some way)

- Madam E posted and recalled a video titled "help", then posts a video from a hospital bed where she is clearly ill, stating she has heart problems. the doctors said it was an infection from the tattoo

- she dies on-screen after coughing and choking, but theres a slushie cracking sound as she flatlined (what i'de call wet gore not dry gore) which indicates a problem messier and more visceral than regular heart issues

glitches/lies:

none

extra comments:

- as expected, ink5oul is going to be a reoccurring character functioning similar to a tma avatar. i don't think ink5oul is an external since they seem to be moving independently with their own agenda (and its clear they don't play well with others)

- there seems to be a rift forming between gwen and the rest of her coworkers, and she's been reacting hostile to both them and lena, but has been adamant about continuing her work with the externals. isolating herself from the others while conducting her own missions is a plotline johhny and alex explored plenty in tma (jon, basira, martin) so im excited to see how her journey branches from the themes they've already explored

- this incident falls into line with others chester has narrated, it deals with a person who sought out a relationship with the paranormal and got hurt because of it, though this seems to be targeted at alice moreso than sam (the person chester has narrated to the most), sending a message about how entanglement with the paranormal often leads to bad things. i also picked up on how Madam E says that comments, likes, and views specifically cause her harm, that her social reward had turned into a punishment. this is a pretty clear parallel to alice's situation with sam and celia (she's loosing her hold as the nonchalant, uncaring, funny girl and falling into more awkward and upsetting situations -> this episode she makes one half hearted joke about the victim she met before she moves on)

- huge shout out to ajn for the meta parallels in this episode. every time Madam E was hurt by a commebt i was also brutally stabbed by her garish use of slang. with every new sentence she spoke i felt hours of my lifespan dissolve, truly incredible writing in terms of twisting the meta knife and pouring lemon juice into it

- i think this falls into the category of 'body' (going off of the alchemic trinity of mind, body, and soul) but i could see an argument for any of these categories as well. in the episode, the incident is a category 1, but im not sure if these categories are a reference to the alchemic trinity, to externals, or other factors.

[doberbutts]

I very much see your points! I suppose the only real difference between your viewpoint and mine stands in the fact that while yes, I do agree that to use the terms TME/TMA to sort of "gatekeep" specific experiences is bad, I feel like that's more of an issue with individual (although decently widespread, unfortunately) misappropriation of the language, rather than a conceptual flaw with the framework. I believe there's a lot of people who intend to use the terms correctly, and if and when they happen not to we should aim to correct that individual behavior rather than throw the baby out with the water, so to speak. I do understand that it's a bit of a tall ask when everyone's at each other's throats and often not willing to return the favor, but at the very least that's what we should strive for if we want to reach mutual understanding (I say all this knowing that's your goal too, I wouldn't assume otherwise).

After all, I do believe that the way "transandrodorks" are treated stems from a similar misunderstanding or overgeneralization of what we actually stand for, and an unwillingness to reach out a hand and actually listen to what we have to say rather than assume the worst from a few bad actors. That's why when the positions are reversed I want to at least try to reach out and meet the other party in the middle, even if the same courtesy isn't always afforded to me.

As for your example with Caster Semenya, I do believe that intersex people should absolutely be allowed to use the term TMA to refer to themselves regardless of AGAB if they feel it's appropriate, as their experiences often exist outside the strict framework we tend to employ and they would know best which terminology applies to them and which doesn't (and should also obviously allowed to make up their own when needed). I don't see eye to eye with anyone who advocates for TMA/TME while disagreeing on this point (and I'll admit I'm not sure what the general consensus here is).

And as for the other example, I'm a bit hesitant to continue that specific analogy (which I do believe to be absolutely valid, btw) since I'm white and I would rather not say anything out of turn, so I'll instead offer the usual rebuttal to the analogous point: when someone who is TME experiences transmisogyny, it's an atomic experience, not continuous. They might be mistaken for a trans woman, but as they are not actually a trans woman they don't live in the same state of constant fear and threat of (this specific type of) violence. They can prove they're not transfem, and the attack will stop, or at least lessen. They have the option of simply not being transfem, something which obviously isn't afforded to transfems. That doesn't mean that the experience they went through didn't affect them, or did so less, but they would live it differently from someone who would be the actual intended target.

Now, I relayed that point but I personally am not sure I agree with it 100%, specifically the latter half. If the TME person being attacked happens to be another trans person, rather than cis, they don't get to escape the danger through proving they're not transfem, because then they're just trading a type of violence for another (the one actually meant to target them, which might look differently). Not to mention that you won't always be in a situation where you can/want to prove it, or where the other party will believe you or care either way. I guess the bigger point here is that if you're TME you're not always experiencing transmisogyny in every facet of your life, though.

Either way I believe there's plenty of more nuance that could be had here, and in that sense I do dislike how that's lost when using TME/TMA, but as terms they were never intended to encompass every possible experience in shorthand but rather just give a general idea, which could then be complemented by any additional info you would be willing to share.

Ah but you see, that's the talking over someone else's experience I'm talking about.

When TME people experience transmisogyny, it is incidental and not continuous. Well. For some, like my example of the idiot mistaking me for Mexican for being brown while saying a French word, that is true. I am not commonly mistaken for Mexican, though it's not unheard of, and it hasn't happened in years. Specifically, when I stopped wearing my hair long and started binding, I stopped being read as *Dominican* (which racist people do not see the difference between the various Latin American countries) and thus stopped experiencing this problem. It's incidental, but I still think that the best choice is to ally with Mexicans and other Latinos and Hispanics to stop the bigoted behavior from happening altogether.

But what happens when it IS continuous? Black cis women, also labeled TME, are disproportionately transvestigated and heavily punished by transmisogynist laws and rulings despite not being transgender themselves. Not only does showing birth certificates not help (and, also, I think this is Bad Logic, because if I have to show my personal private documents in order to be left alone, I'm still being Affected By The Oppression because I have to carry my documents everywhere. Like that's just Baby's First Fascism) but I have personally witnessed multiple black celebrity and politician cis women be forced to prove they are women *while they are pregnant*. And yes, that is misogynoir. But it is practiced by utilizing the exact same societal systems to hurt trans women. Thus my logic on the other post- all oppression hooks into each other and back onto itself somehow. Not only is that not incidental and very much continuous, but this a systemic problem and why cis and trans women and *especially* any person of color regardless of gender should ally among themselves to fight it.

And, finally "they can prove they're not trans fem and the attack will stop or lessen"- sure, much like how Hannah Gadsby was able to say "no no I'm not a faggot you see I am a lady a woman no man-liker here" and the guy left her alone wait no he didn't he beat the shit out of her anyway. Like that's the problem I have with this- the reality is that this does not apply to every single person and that real living people are being hurt and sometimes killed while being labeled exempt from the very thing that kills them. We have had cis people die due to bathroom laws meant to hurt trans women. It is absolutely not a matter of just proving you're not one because transmisogyny is one help of a drug and it is used as a dangerous weapon to any and everyone it's pointed towards.

And that is the crux of my problem. People can use whatever words they like to describe their own experiences. Pointing these words to describe someone else's experiences for them, however, and denying that their very real lived experiences have happened or that it matters less is where I draw the line.

[catboybiologist]

https://www.tumblr.com/radiantfissure/766164937299116032/yes-thank-you-prev-its-such-a-shitty-verbal?source=share

People of colour pointing out a pattern of racism and asking white queer people to do better is not the same thing as transmisogynistic femboys being used as an agp trope like she said. She is allover the place and jump from one point to another. I'm sorry that it makes you uncomfortable that we point out the trends of racism in the queer community and that we have to mention it over and over again to the point that you believe it is an harassment campaign because white queer people refuse to listen and change. If multiple ppl say the same thing over and over again, instead of believing it is a way to oppress white people, maybe take it as a sign that there is a huge problem racism in our community and white queer people must stop acting like victims when we point it out. There is a reason why you barely see any BIPOC in the online queer community. It is inhospitable to us and get called transphobic when we point it out. Not all white queers are like that but I shouldn't have to say it. Just listen to use BIPOC, I'm begging you.

Okay there's a lot here that's a bit of a storm of info and I'm going to be honest, I don't really know what's going on and I'm unpacking what you linked and what you said now.

I don't know if this ask is directed at me specifically, or if its just because I'm a white queer with some kind of following. I didn't interact with the linked post, and I don't know if its vagueing about a specific person or event, or just general sentiments.

First, if I genuinely have done or said anything directly to make BIPOC uncomfortable on my page or in the tumblr community, PLEASE tell me. This isn't a one time thing, I genuinely would appreciate if I'm "called out" in asks, DMs, or some other kind of interaction before something becomes a larger issue.

(This applies universally, btw, and is something I've asked for before. I appreciate directness and clarity a lot, and I do want to listen. I hope that comes across.)

(oh, and also, to white queer followers: don't try to "defend" me if this is pointing out something I did. Cut that bullshit out, its extremely uncomfortable.)

Second, if this isn't about something I've done or said specifically, and you mostly want comment on the post.... yeah, I'm going to be honest, that post is a big fucking problem. There's a LOT to unpack in that post and I don't have nearly the capacity to go through it all. Fuck. This is a half baked thought, but it genuinely feels like they're using some kind of "TMA status" as a deflection of criticism. I've absolutely seen memes about the "racist femboy", but honestly, its nothing more than memes.

I've actually probably seen more racist, internally queerphobic femboys than I've seen memes or stereotypes on the subject. So uh. Yeah.

Imma be blunt. If the stereotype of the "racist 4chan femboy" is something you come across commonly in a way that actually affects discussion and communication about trans issues, and feels more prevalent than the stereotypes that are flown around in political contexts and broader culture... then I'm really sorry, you're probably terminally online.

None of this is well formed thoughts. All of this is a mess. I can't agree with this post, though. The most favorable interpretation of it is that its coming from a place of being extremely online and not really knowing what the actual stereotypes held about trans women are. The less favorable reading is that its deflection.

Third, if there are specific people or events this is referring to, then I well and truly have 0 clue whats going on.

Also, I sympathize with the sheer exhaustion of feeling like you have to say "not all white queers" all the time. Obviously I haven't been in the exact situation, but I feel very similarly about a lot of social commentary- you oftentimes get tired of the little disclaimers intended to make other people more comfortable. Its fucking tiresome.

[vibinginthedreamlands]

I'm not saying you can't listen to TMP before hearing TMA. But, a little bit due to the fact that I *have* heard the original and am now unable to not hear the references and connections, what is TMP about outside of all the old gays and their updated nonsense? Like, obviously this world has its whole own thing going on (the Protocol is like if Gerry's book burning got big in superstitious circles and what's going on with the OIAR is its whole own thing) but also??? Sam is hunting down the Magnus Institue, Gwen is a Bouchard and just got compelled (alongside which the OG music played), there's a statis buzz, The Computers have Their Voices, and Celia is, she's, WELL SHE'S FREAKING CELIA Y'ALL. And her stories are all about universal doubles. And we've met Gerry, Gertrude, heard about alternate universe Jon and Martin, I've seen mention of Basira and Helen???

This show has to be such a fun spooky mystery for those that don't know and came in fresh but I swear every week I lose my mind a little more and I can't imagine anyone experiencing this as a lone show because I have been cursed with Knowing.

[velvetvexations]

Possibly they mean the current row over transphobes seeing people as their assigned sex? Some people are desperately insecure and seeing any even hypothetical relation to what they're transitioning away from to be so terrifyingly abhorrent that they entirely misunderstand what's being said. Case in point:

Not to psychoanalyze, but, like, wow, right? This is either maliciously lying or an incredibly sad coping mechanism. People are literally just saying that transphobes don't see people as the gender they identify as, but somehow this has led to the completely off the wall takeaway "trans women are men."

Like, no one is saying that. Literally no one is saying that, except for TERFs who I and every transmasc in this discourse shut down when they try to insert themselves into the conversation with their obviously wrong and vile bullshit.

And it's telling transradfems never actually...engage with what's being said at all. Like they never take a post and argue with it, they exclusively post about takes that don't exist. They're shadow boxing.

It breaks my brain a little. Like, how? How do you do this? How do you get this twisted a perception? Every single day anti-transandrophobia activists are repeating endlessly that they don't think transfems oppress them or anything remotely like that. Beyond intentionally trying to deceive their audience, it feels like transradfems are driven by an intense fear of anyone - even actual transphobes - seeing them as as the gender they were assigned that they not only deny that, but also take any acknowledgement of how transphobes think as misgendering them as well.

Which is just sad. It sucks that a transphobic society has made them this unbelievably skittish as to have a meltdown over the very thought that anyone could view them incorrectly. A person's gender validity is not dependent on what others think of them and it's not misgendering each other to understand that some people we are all aligned against have incorrect beliefs.

The "so you're saying we OPPRESS YOU?" reaction to "maybe don't slur other trans people?" may also arise out of this. It's plausible transradfems can't acknowledge trans women and trans men are on the same plane, with equal capacity (no more, no less) to harm each other, because they feel like they're somehow not getting the full Fymyle experience of being maximumly oppressed by all definitions of man at all times. Their problem with cis radical feminism is purely that they aren't allowed into the club, so naturally they can only relate trans men talking about their issues or expressing a belief that trans women are capable of causing them harm with MRAs. Cis men oppress all trans people, but to copy-and-paste the experience of being a cis woman as closely as possible, you can't be equal with any men whatsoever, even just trans men.

TERFs are well-understood to define womanhood around suffering and asserting themselves the biggest sufferers of all, and that's the definition transradfems have inherited.

I'm sorry, anon. You're a man and I'm so, so happy for that, your masculinity makes the world a better place. Please always be who you are. <3

my proposal is that we all start casually referring to all trans people as transmisogyny affected

"TMAs have it so rough" "yeah, trans women, men, and non-binary people of all sexual characteristics and assigned genders do have it rough, you're right"

trans radical feminism's one and only distinction form radical feminism is that they want to make a small edit to how it determines if someone is a man or a woman

I AM awesome!

Trans radical feminism and being a tankie are practically inseparable so it's a much more politically homogenous group taking a swing at a number of people likely to severely disagree on several things, like people who support Israel as a concept if not it's current actions vs. those who see the concept as the problem regardless of who's in charge.

Good instincts.

He seems like a very miserable guy.

Ideally we should make an effort to do work on behalf of others, but yes, it's not surprising and completely understandable that people tend to work on their needs first.

Yeah. It's based in radfem ideas of men being the ultimate evil and literally incapable of restraining themselves from harming women.

[sexiestpodcastcharacter]

Sexiest Podcast Character 2024 — Scripted Redemption Bracket — Round 2

Propaganda

Graham Casner (The White Vault):

White Vault spoilers:

[Coughing violently]

Graham Casner survived the Forrmynður, the thing that will stop at nothing to sacrifice you

He deserves this as a break and a reward

Thank you for coming to my TEDtalk.

Mab (Monstrous Agonies):

Queen of the fey, fabulous, frequent not-quite nemesis of the Presenter of the podcast, then ally against capitalism

Additional propaganda below the cut:

Graham Casner (The White Vault):

Peter Joseph Lewis hottest voice of all time

#I know he's gonna lose but gotta go with Graham

#I am tma girlie and I dropped The White Vault at season something #but Graham is sexier!!! (In reference to Tim Stoker)

#Look from the allos I know. The people voting have NOT heard TWV

#WHAT are these results #I understand that we're pitting the canonically sexiest men from each series against each other. But casner!!!! #Graham 'going to protect all of you if it kills me' Casner #Graham 'brooding in the corner but it's brooding like a mother hen' Casner #Come to think of it interesting that they both sort of kind of died the same way?? #Anyway pokemon go to the polls to vote for casner

#NOOOOOOO #VOTE FOR CASNER

#sorry tma followers. it's casner

#justice for Graham

#im sorry but have you people HEARD graham casner's voice #i think that might be the sexiest voice of every podcast ive ever listened to and that is. many #like i love tma and i love tim but this is specifically for sexiness and graham casner wins by a MILE. the injustice ...

#VOTE GRAHAM PLEASE GOD #i love tim so much but hes nothing put against Graham #im so sorry TMA girlies but i need you to listen to more than TMA #YOU SIMPLY DO NOT KNOW

With zero hesitation, it’s Graham. #sad strong Russian dad vibes #he’s such a gem

#Graham Casner #his voice is hot and he fought a giant arctic squid (and won???)

#i'm begging y'all listen to more than just tma #tim's voice isn't even that sexy compared to graham #graham got shit done #sorry tim #but i know you'd fuck graham too #AND YOU WOULDN'T SURVIVE

#it's graham casner #you're all wrong and i won't apologise

#rip casner I still love you

#graham might be the second sexiest character on the white vault #but he's still sexier than tim! #(dragana is objectively the sexiest white vault character)

anarchoanarchist420: GRAHAM CASNER SWEEP PLEASEEEEEE microwavebeeping: we can’t be mutuals anymore 😔 anarchoanarchist420: its okay to be wrong <3 Graham “Oh God What Is That” Casner is the most universally sexy man to ever be cursed by capitalism to die via eldrich horror microwavebeeping: Sorry! I can’t hear you over the sound of exploding mannequins :3

Mab (Monstrous Agonies):

#mab has my heart #but not my name

#okay this is MEAN #i love jonathan harker with my whole heart #but mab is SO memorable and has such an impact despite only rarely appearing 'onstage'

#obviously i voted for mab out of loyalty <3

#vote Mab!

This is propaganda for all the female characters. Voters please remember how pretty all women are and factor that into every single vote you make. Thank you.