#mspec problems

[frogsforthefrogwar]

[wanderingcritter]

Being a lesbian and nonhuman at the same time feels.. strange.

Because, like, human girls are these absolutely stunning, almost unreal beings. They're beautiful beyond words, the kind of beauty that can only ever be conveyed through the careful plucking of guitar strings, or through a vibrant splash of paint against barren canvases. They hold the stars in their eyes and flecks of gold in their hair, as if the forces of the cosmos themselves hand crafted their forms. They're soft and gentle and warm, but also strong and fierce and an unbelievable force to be reckoned with. Once when I was young, I got caught outside during a tropical hurricane and was almost lifted into the air by the winds; that is the closest thing I can compare to the feeling of falling for a girl. They are everything that a human being should be and more.

And then, there I am. A beast. This.. thing that stalks the woods in the darkest hours of the night, with dirt coated matted fur and piercing amber gaze, unseen and uncomprehended by man. Constant yearning, hunger. For flesh, for bloodlust, for isolation and freedom, to be feared, to be whispered about in hushed tales around a withering campfire. The creature in the forest, didn't you hear? If it catches you alone on a full moon it will peel your skin away from your body with fangs the size of your hand. Stay close. Your measly pocket knife won't do much in its wake I fear. A wild, snarling thing that flinches beneath humanity's touch and rejects their "civility" in favor of the murmuring creek that sings old and long forgotten hymns to the ancient mountains above.

I know when they look at me they see one of them, a human with soft skin and kind eyes, a human who smiles at them and perhaps offers a passing compliment, a human who always tries to coax the timid street cat and watchfully steps around sidewalk slugs. A human. But that is not what I am, at least not in the way that they are. And when I look back at them, with my green eyes that I wished glowed amber, I can't help but wonder "How could someone so divinely human find companionship with something so desperately unhuman as me? How long until you realize the humanoid body you see before you is merely a flawed disguise? Will you still grasp my hand with fond affection when it warps into a mangled paw?"

[guiltyidealist]

transmasc lesboys be like. lesbimen

[bilesproblems]

Ace(spec)s and aro(specs): hey romance and sex are TWO DIFFERENT things! Romantic and sexual attraction are different! It's extremely harmful to our community/communities to say they are the same. Aces can love without sex/without feeling sexual attraction and aros can have sex without it being a romantic thing/without feeling romantic attraction and that's fine!

Exclusionists online: um it's acephobic to use the split attraction model if you're not aspec btw. Your romantic and sexual orientations have to be the same. I am a good aspec ally.

[the-meme-monarch]

aww you don't like when people have multiple seemingly conflicting labels about their gender and/or sexuality? tell me more about how black and white and uncomplicated you think people are

[siwolism]

wtf is an mspec lesbian + how could a transmasc be a lesbian. this is a genuine question im not clocked into western queer discourse

[sirenium]

mourn for the loss of the days where queerness wasn't defined by rules. Remember that cis butches were the first group the radfems targeted, because in that fact there is the solid truth that masculinity is seen as a poison to more queer people than it should be. In our own community, people treat masculinity as a poison, an inherent danger, and we're pushed away for not being feminine women. In our own community, there are people adamant about erasing experiences they don't understand. 'Lesbians can't date men! they can't be men!' and yet, where's all the vitriol towards women being in the gay community? It definitely exists, but I have noticed a significant amount of pushback towards m-spec LESBIANS, not mspec GAYS (again, this is not to say that mspec gays don't get shit, because they do), and lesboys.

The simple fact is that the man hating virus is unfortunately very common in online lesbian discussions... I can only surmise it's due to the attempt to validate their own identities. They think the only way to not be attracted to men is to hate them and push out anyone who lives differently. Unfortunately though, they have one foot in the door to the radfem party without realizing it. They are doing their part to make the queer community hostile rather than an actual community. And that's very sad. I can only hope the hatred against those with 'contradictory' labels becomes just as frowned upon in queer spaces as more blatant TERFism one day, because infighting only weakens us. I can only hope these people will eventually see that.

[queercodedangel]

What's missing in the whole "bisexuals are valid regardless of preferences" discourse is an analysis of how compulsory heterosexuality (which is a systemic force) shapes these preferences.

We live in a society that will constantly (directly or indirectly) push you into heterosexual paths.

And in the case of bi people this means there is a certain pressure and compulsion to only act on one part of your attraction

[chaos-in-one]

The argument points about lesbian intercommunity discourse against xyz term/label/etc. that hinge on saying how this "only happens in lesbian communities, you don't see other orientations have to deal with this!!!!" has always been simultaneously funny and frustrating to me.

Because 9 times out of 10, the equivalent to that DOES in fact exist in other lgbtq+ communities. It just doesn't get anywhere near as much public attention & arguments over it.

"You don't see people trying to argue for trans women or women in general to be allowed in the gay community like you do with people arguing for trans men or men in general to be allowed into the lesbian community!!!" You literally do. There are women, including trans women as well as various others such as genderfluid, multigender, and other genderqueer people who consider themselves women, in the gay community. There's even an equivalent term to the term lesboy for women who are gay called turigirl.

"You don't see gay men unironically using she/her & calling their partner their girlfriend!!!" You do. There are definitely gay men, hell even gay cis men, who use she/her and/or prefer typically feminine terms.

(Both of these two above points are extra funny to me because both have been said to my face while I am a pangender gay guy who does use she/her. They are literally saying to my face that people like me don't exist when they do that.)

"You don't see people arguing gay men can actually be attracted to women!! You don't see people trying to call themselves mspec gays like people try to say they're mspec lesbians!!!!" mspec gays do in fact also exist. Also what world are you living in where homophobes who try to convince lesbians that are definitely not into men they actually all can and are attracted to men exist, but people who try to convince gay men who aren't attracted to women that they can be and are attracted to women don't? Way to say you don't talk to any gay men because most could tell you that they do in fact have experiences with that happening.

There's a lot more I could point out, but those three are ones I've seen the most recently. Point is, if you're going to make an argument that something is bad/a problem, and what you are using to help prove that point is the fact that it doesn't exist within other similar communities, maybe check that it actually doesn't exist in those communities first so you don't straight up erase shit from other communities to try to make a point about your own.

[edwardallenpoe]

okay so I've been questioning my sexuality for such a long time at this point and I've come across mspec lesbians. And, like. Yeah. Maybe I am a lesbian. I'm not going to label anything right now, I still gotta let it brew but yeah. I love that. It means so much to me, you know?

And I just fucking hate TERF's and radfems with a passion. All of this suffering, all of this confusion I've had to go through, and for what?? To keep your precious label as pure as possible?? Grow up. I'm a black, butch, dyke, and maybe a lesbian, who uses neos and he/him and I'm beautiful.

[hussyknee]

You know what? You're right about everything. In fact people who shit all over mspec gays/lesbians not only have no concept of how anything works, but they're also fucking selfish and horrible members of the community. I'll die on this hill. A bunch of assholes only out for themselves.

We are actively under fire in many countries. US and UK are actively heading into a trans genocide. Russia is getting worse, too now. Loads of other countries I haven't named. (Before anyone says jack shit the fucking center named after the person who coined the term genocide said we were headed that way. Genocide isnt an overnight thing you stupid leftists Do your damn research and shut up.)

We are at a high rate of suicide and sexual violence, regular violence housing and health care denial, etc. Do you think someone is going to stop and make sure someone isn't a snowflake queer or "tucute" or mspec lesbian before they bash their fucking head it? Do you think a doctor is gonna tell a nonbinary person who looks visibly queer "of course I'll treat you, you're not one of those trans people" Not to mention how you're so quick to exclude closeting and questioning kids who already want to kill themselves? Do you fucking hear the way you talk about your own people? LEAVE OUR OWN PEOPLE ALONE AND CALL YOUR GOVERNEBT REPS OR GET PETTITIONS CIRCULATED OR DONATION POSTS BOOSTED!

You would really rather attack people who's fucking LABELS you disagree with than do anything fucking positive to protect the rest of us? It makes me sick to my fucking stomach that y'all care more about policing than you do about your own people? Absolute selfish and cruel bootlicker behaviour. It's disgraceful, and I'm ashamed and enraged to share space with you people.

[storm-of-feathers]

Dgmw I am an inclusionist by the definition of this website but like. You gotta understand that inclusionism is the default mindset in irl queer spaces. I'm an inclusionist bc I actually interact with other queer people who are different from me instead of living in some bizarre echo chamber.

[rei-does-stuff]

Some of yall are absolutely miserable and need to go outside and do shit

[yourfavusescontradictorylabels]

I'm thinking about making a blog for talking about mspec gay men shit.. because I'm a shitty gay mspec man....

[bilesproblems]

I could make a funny joke about all mspec lesbian's problems but I thought of something for something I only know that I experience. So.

Mspec lesbian with no respect for the opinions of others, or respect for the feelings of others if I think their feelings are invalid (which is probably related to the low empathy) problems is other people telling me shit about experiences we both have and deciding only my feelings on the matter have any value because I have the correct opinion obviously.

"Listen to lesbians" I am a lesbian too. We have the same experience with attraction. Neither of us like dudes. I say it's okay for lesbians to like dudes sometimes. I get to decide this because I'm correct. "Mspec lesbians hurt nonbinary people, signed an nb lesbian" I'm a nonbinary lesbian too. I think people being attracted to women and nb people at the same time and saying that's NOT mspec is misgendering. My feelings matter more because they make more sense, yours contradict each other and are stupid. "It's appropriating aspecs" umm actually I'm aspec, I'm ace and arospec and maybe aplspec and I think you're promoting the relationship hierarchy and also saying sex and romance can't be fully separated so you're aphobic. "Your label feels invalidating :(" your hate feels invalidating too. But I'm not doing anything to you personally so your feelings are your problem and Not My Fault. They're also objectively incorrect so you don't deserve to feel them. My feelings, you are intentionally causing by going out of your way to harass me or post hate about my identity, therefore they are also a you problem and Your Fault. I have a right to feel them because you are being mean to me.

I have high compassion but it is very conditional. I gotta think someone's feelings are justified to care. And I know a lot of the things I express above (like "your feelings aren't valid so you don't deserve to feel them") are impossible and irrational but it's how I think and hence why this is an mspec lesbian problem and not mspec lesbian culture.

[elysianmadness]

funny how you suddenly care about men harassing lesbians when you're the lesbian being harassed by men. but when other lesbians speak out against mspec "lesbians", you're suddenly jumping to defend them :)

Yes because I actually think we should blame the men harassing us instead of targeting and harassing innocent lesbians who did nothing but use a multifaceted label in a different way from you. Hope this helps! :)