#marius. with the ass??

[suddenly-frankenstein]

uhmhmhmmm just occasional thoughts about Daniel's interaction with Marius

[cheesuschrist-iii]

Lips like sugar

Sugar kisses

I realised that as much as I love Lethicus I’ve only draw them together once so.

I also need to practice drawing ship art more.

They need each other so bad.

(Lyrics from “Lips like sugar” by Echo and the Bunnymen)

[foolsinferno]

[spinostarz]

some roadtrip sketchiesss

prompts by the wonderful @24601orwhatever :3!!!!!

[rocksanddeadflowers]

Marius, holding a door open for Lyf: See, silverware isn't dead!

Lyf:

Lyf: ... what?

[monstersinthecosmos]

I read your answer, where did you say "Pandora is his actual type and Armand was his pet"

But how could Armand be just a pet for him? He is one of only three of his turned children. Marius speaks of him as the greatest love (along with Pandora). Although I see some hypocrisy in this. Marius loves no one as much as Pandora. But certainly more than just a pet

Well !

Babe the thing is that, I said what I said and it’s okay if you don’t agree!!! And I’m gonna take this opportunity to double down. (Assuming that you’re asking in good faith and not to pick on me for my analysis lmao please this fandom has traumatized me too much.)

(((TLDR the text never treats Armand like he’s Marius’s equal but also I never said that being a pet was a bad thing.)))

I want to start by talking about the concept of MAKER in VC and how canon tells us that vampires exist outside of human social constructs, including traditional family roles right? Like for example, the moment Gabrielle is turned, she ceases to be Lestat’s mother. 

But with Marius I think a lot about how he’s crafted a persona for himself, and tries to operate in a very rigid set of rules. And part of this is like, how determined he is to live by stoicism even when he’s a mess on the inside, but I also think about in TVL when he says that thing about how it’s easier to just knock a glass on the floor, and how he goes out of his way to appear more human and retain human gestures. 

So like, in the way a MAKER is kinda like, a parent/lover/companion/something too big for our tiny human minds to comprehend. We still get a Marius who is determined to be a father & mentor, and I think a lot about how his need for stoicism and humanity is probably also expressed with his need to be the paterfamilias. 

I’ve been also thinking a lot lately about Bad Fathers in Media—specifically people like Tony Soprano, Logan Roy, Roderick Usher—and how the toxic patriarchy affects their relationships with their sons. Tony Soprano in particular is one who resonates with me a lot when I think about Marius—Tony often indulges in anger because he enjoys being feared (he thinks it’s respect but it’s usually fear), and that’s a bit different on a material level from Marius “anger is too pathetic” de Romanus but they’re both sort of obsessed with the idea of stoicism and trying to be a ~ strong silent type ~ on the outside, even when they’re actually quite messy and emotional underneath.

But wait — put a pin in this for a second. We’ll come back to this, and the concept of fathers and sons. I want to pause real quick to swerve to clarify:

Armand being a pet isn’t a bad thing.

It wasn’t “pet (derogatory) 😒” —  it’s “pet (adorable creature that I care for) 🥰”.

Here’s the thing about MARIMAND if you will (I hate all the VC ship names oh my god theyre all hideous lmao) but like OKAY OKAY. THE THING IS. WHAT ARE WE HERE FOR IF WE’RE NOT INTO THE FUCKEDUPEDNESS ? 

Like I’m not telling anyone how to enjoy a ship, please have fun ! Do you! But to ME? That inter-species friction and 1,517 year age gap is like WHAT THE DYNAMIC IS ABOUT, THAT’S THE FLAVOR BABY!!! Anne Rice herself even said the book was about “a boy’s love for a monster” !!

WHAT’S THE POINT OF MONSTERFUCKER EROTICA IF HE’S NOT A MONSTER LOL

And YEAH I get that not everyone wants to read TVA as a monsterfucker story. That’s okay! It also reads as a savior fantasy. But I enjoy the messiness of it—I LIKE that Marius is an apex predator & ghoulish ancient thing. I like that it’s problematic. I LOVE that Marius really does love him, though, amidst all these other themes. I find it SO compelling.

But I never once said that Marius doesn’t love him. Of course Marius loves him. What I said is that he loves Armand the way we love a pet. I would fucking die for my cats. I regularly burst into tears looking at my cats because I love them so much. But they’re fucking cats lmao.

I never for one minute forget that Marius isn’t human. He’s operating on a whole different wavelength with different points of references and ethics and life experiences. Like, people get so hung up on Armand being 17 and IT WOULD BE JUST AS BAD IF HE WAS 18 OR 25 OR 30 LOL. A frail little human cannot comprehend !!!!!

What’s interesting with Marius’s fledglings though is that he tends not to treat them as equals. Like I think you could read TVA thinking: Once Marius turns him, they’ll be real partners. But no, they stick to their mentor/mentee, dom/sub, father/son roles. We don’t have tons of examples in canon of other maker/fledgling relationships but it’s not a coincidence that Roman Patriarch Marius maintains status over his fledglings. Even once Armand is a vampire, he’s still not Marius’s equal, and Marius’s age and power are still held over him. 

BUT LIKE.

That’s weird, right?

I MEAN THE DARK GIFT IS DIFFERENT FOR EVERYONE but it’s interesting to me that Lestat & Gabrielle’s relationship completely dissolves once she’s a vampire, but Marius & Armand’s doesn’t.

(Sidebar that like, I think there’s also ways to acknowledge that if we think their relationship is good that it’s OKAY for them to maintain these roles because Armand WANTS to be his sub but let me focus on my point here. We should also make time to talk about diegetic BDSM and whether or not it’s appropriate to use a D/s framework for this discussion if the roles are baked into the text and not a choice for the characters and not a game they are agreeing to but that’s for another post.)

So back to the thing about fathers.

I’ve been thinking a lot about bad father characters, specifically Logan Roy and Tony Soprano (also bad mother Margaret Chenowith) and the impossible standards they give their children. Logan and Tony are both men who are disappointed in their sons for being soft, because they were able to provide better lives for their children. They both spoil their sons with all the material wealth that they did not have in their own lives. For Logan we see how badly he resents his kids—Kendall even accuses him of being jealous of what they have—and for Tony he seems to be at a loss on how to parse his feelings. Part of him literally hates AJ for being such a whimsical little fuckup, and at the same time he wants to protect that part of AJ and doesn’t even WANT AJ to follow in his footsteps. Still, he hates to see that AJ is spoiled with no work ethic, and doesn’t know how to set an example for him.

Everything in Venice is designed to spoil Armand with all the things Marius didn’t get—it’s such a specific & deliberate opposite of how Marius was turned. And I think him seeing Armand as a pet puts a little bit of distance between the hurt he’d feel if he thought of Armand as a true son, or even an equal. He doesn’t have to resent Armand for having it easier than he did, but also doesn’t have to feel extremely betrayed by Armand fitting in with the cult. Like, let’s never 4get that by the time Marius catches up with Armand, Armand is right at home and thriving with them. A CULT? THE THING THAT KILLED ME????? Marius has no idea what the fuck they did to him, he just knows that Armand settled in just fine and has discarded everything that Marius tried to teach him. 

I think these roles are appropriately all muddled because it’s VC—like we said, the No Social Constructs series—so like, how do we compare the words SON and PET and FLEDGLING and SUB, I’m not sure. But my point is that he’s never seen or treated Armand as an equal, and perhaps never even a full adult person. 

ARE THESE IDEAS CONFLICTING? A little. But that’s okay. Am I incoherent and ill-equipped to tackle this analysis or is it because Marius is not a consistent person and never quite lives up to the ideal he’s trying to be? Does he want Armand to be his pet but secretly has feelings? Does he fail at being a father figure? Is he brushing off his Big Big Emotions so that he doesn’t have to admit how wrecked and destroyed he is and how badly his feelings were hurt? Idk man. I’m sure you can send me another anon to tell me I’m wrong. 

I wonder sometimes if like, keeping Armand at this lower status (like a pet) actually protects Armand from Marius’s ire and disappointment. Marius is sort of a father, but sort of not. He’s crafted a role for himself that is never all the way sincere, and it allows him some space to protect his own feelings of betrayal and disappointment when it comes to Armand. Marius is also classically bad at following his own rules, and never quite sticks the landing on the people he’s trying to be. 

I can imagine a version of events where Armand does gain some ground with Marius, maybe pays his dues and matures into someone that Marius trusts and respects, but that’s not the version of events we get in canon. Marius turns Armand, Armand remains his pupil, they visit Kiev and Marius is jealous of Armand’s father, they make it all the way to the raid without Marius ever confiding about The Parents. Even in the present day, during a dispute, Marius tells Armand he has the savage & ignorant soul of a child. Even in the present day, Marius won’t stop calling him Amadeo!!!! 

And like!!!!! It feels like Marius is more upset about Santino wronging him by ruining his home and taking his toys than he is about what Santino did to ARMAND. It’s more about Marius’s own feelings and possessions than it is about Armand’s own feelings and experience of what happened. AN ARMAND FRIDGING, IF YOU WILL. 

Anyway.

By never seeing Armand as a complete person, Marius never has to feel threatened by him. We see this in toxic parents a lot. Like, I want you to be good, but I’m insecure if you’re better than me. Or I can never fully respect your feelings because I always see you as a child and not a fully grown adult. And the truth is that Marius is actually quite threatened by Armand, on the inside. He is very hurt. He cares what Armand thinks of him. He’s relieved at the end of BCtu when he assumes that Armand wants to open his heart again. 

So idk like. I think the books end with a little bit of a hope for them; we see a lot of growth and self-acceptance from Marius in the last book and it’s reasonable to assume that he and Armand might have a long chat and nice long cry and work it out. I don’t think it’s completely set in stone, but it’s nice to think about! A nice happy ending. And I wonder if this is when Marius finally takes Armand seriously and listens to what he has to say without demeaning him! 

Am I gonna add 2000 more words to this point by tying it what the whole like “I fear him because I could love him again” thing in TVA means? No I’m not. But like. Again! It’s okay to be a pet, I think Armand liked being his pet. :) 

[aworldunturning]

RIP Marius Pontmercy you would have loved to say "we did it Reddit, we found the Boston bomber"

[pawpunkao3]

I hate having a favorite character who's repressed as fuck. It's so easy to come up w smut fic ideas but almost impossible to figure out how to GET HIS ASS TO THAT POINT

[ormymarius]

comic accuracy 🍑

[luna-the-cretar]

As much as I love Marius’ goofy Lathander armor, you have to admit, his rose armor (?) looks so much better.

I dont necessarily have to like what the rose armor represents now, but I appreciate the aesthetic. Love it.

Like!!! It’s got those poofy sleeves you see in old-timey dresses!!!! Idk which era but yeah!!!! Love those poofy sleeves!!!

Also it’s just. Significantly easier to draw lmao.

[tulinokkaelain]

Daniel is on the mend and his recovery time hobbies include staring at Marius painting.

[fenicenera83]

I am so fed up and disgusted with the current chronicle fandom. What used to be a place of exchange of opinions, love of the material written by the author and her characters, respect and refuge even for all those who felt " different" or so they were called by other people, because we had different passions, and interests, maybe even too big for the kids we were, is now a pool of shit. There is no more understanding and respect for the story or the characters, there is instead negativity, toxicity, and contempt and total, personal superimposition on the characters, their feelings, their stories, lies disguised by the famous word ' interpretation', ship warfare, attacks towards other fans, bullying, victimhood, lack of accepting and understanding a historical context, certain topics, such as sexual fantasies, or the view on religion and the relationship with God.

Anne's books are not for everyone, the themes they deal with are not for everyone, and I am not talking about the romance between a millennial vampire who has no sexual appetites and a 15-year-old mortal boy in the late 1400s, but about the worldview, the changing nature of humankind, poetry and literature, history, the desperate need to understand the human soul, about monsters that sometimes seem more human than human beings. Of religion, of the relationship with God, of the mistakes that curiosity, pain, or too good a heart can lead one to make.Of the pain and acceptance of life and the path it takes us down, of the wonder there is in the world and in art. The deep search for meaning.

I have seen and read so much crap in the current fandom that my eyes have fallen out. I've seen my all-time favorite character dragged through the mud, linked to things he never did or said, I've seen him misled and defaced into something he is not and never was. I have seen people convince themselves and lead others toward their own insanity made up of completely made-up things and lies. And continue this circle of hatred and negativity of contempt and stupidity. Twitter, tiktok, YouTube, Tumblr, are full of absurd and flimsy 'interpretations' of something that is not, even, there in the Canon of books. No wonder that every time I ask, bring me the pages of the books, where this thing is written, the person on duty disappears, or when you mention Zenobia, or Gregory or Eudoxia, these people disappear. And yes I took the liberty of an outburst, because it is somewhat depressing to see how things are. At least I, as a deep and indefatigable lover of Marius, can say that my satisfaction I have it and no one can take it away from me, because it is in the Canon of the last book, Marius is happy, serene, he is healing, he is playing an important role, he is living in the palace among his peers and he is no longer alone, and most importantly he is finally reunited with Armand, they are together again and they are caring for each other by giving their hearts to each other again, like in Venice. Goodbye antis & haters 👋

[motions1ckn3ss]

no one:

marius and combeferre:

[sailorstickybunz]

If there are a million Marius de Romanus haters I am one of them.

If there are ten Marius de Romanus haters, I am one of them.

If there is one Marius de Romanus haters on earth, it is me.

If there are no Marius de Romanus haters, I have left the earth.

If the world is against Marius de Romanus hate, I am against the world.

I will hate Marius de Romanus with my dying breath.

[1shroom1]

Hello iwtv fandom there’s a piece of fanart I saw on here once and really want to see again so I’d appreciate some help:

It’s an image of book Daniel holding Marius’ decapitated head with the text “Kill your local pedophile”

Does anyone have this?? Know who drew it?? Please???

[monstersinthecosmos]

👁️👄👁️ do you ever think about the restraint marius must've had when whipping amadeo not to maim and permanently disfigure him

UGH like, yeah, all the time tbh, but also like, I really think that the Venice Era (both in TVA and B&G) is the raunchiest slowburn ever to Marius finally being able to murder him.

like can you imagine the blue balls of having to Little Drink from him for YEARS and how good it must have felt to finally glut himself?

And that's the thing too about all their impact play and whipping is that Amadeo was so fragile and naive and had NO IDEA how gentle Marius was probably being. Like, how easily Marius could've torn him apart or crushed him. Every time Marius drank from Amadeo he was edging himself and it must have taken so much restraint just to stop and let him live.

Like it makes me fucking insane thinking about Armand looking back on this later in life and re-examining some of those moments, and having to be equally gentle with Denis or Daniel.

It's about so much more than the BDSM moments for me, too, like, every moment with Amadeo he's being extremely gentle. Simply holding his hand, giving him a hug, brushing his hair -- all of it would have to be so so gentle. And when they do impact play, a little less gentle perhaps. But he's always in complete control. And like, within the myriad ways that people read these scenes and all the various interpretations, the bottom line is that he never lost control of himself. When he's upset and losing his temper he's taking it out in other ways (throwing paintbrushes, etc) but if he'd truly taken that much rage to Amadeo he would've killed him. 🥵

And even like, less generous/less shippy reads of them, even if he's finding ways to punish Amadeo either out of pettiness or in sincere discipline, he stays in control. He's gentle. He does just enough to get his point across, and doesn't permanently disfigure him. (Is this good or bad? Depends if you think Marius is The Worst or if you think Marius Hot, I'm not here to judge LOL). But we cannot deny that he handles Amadeo like a little baby bird. A little fragile egg!

ALSO it's like, such a question of pushing lines and boundaries, right, because like, he can disfigure Amadeo up to the point of giving him juuuust enough Blood to heal him. Like Amadeo was eventually feeling the effects of drinking too much Blood, like his senses were sharpened and he was maybe displaying some of the same signs of addiction that we saw in Daniel in QOTD. But how much of the Blood can you give someone!? Marius probably doesn't know! So like. It's always going to be, how far can we take this game, how badly can I split your legs open on the switch, how deeply can I bite you and how much can I let you bleed out before we do something irreparable here?

🥵🥵🥵 what a cozy thought, I am v. obsessed!