#like. the tone he was using to talk to tubbo was the same exact tone dream used with tommy during the exile arc which is !! terrifying

[strwbrryfire]

watching dream crash out has been the highlight of my 2025 already. however. i think tommy and tubbo should be allowed to kill him without repercussions

[sunnywritings]

Small idea/request I've had in my head for awhile: c!bbh finding and adopting a baby the same way he did Sapnap and introduce them to the family! I feel like Sapnap would be a better brother than he thinks :]

a cult's sacrifice? not anymore!

request: c!bbh x child!reader genre: fluff(parental and sibling kind y'know?) word count: 968 warnings: child ‘sacrifice’ summary: bbh got a child sacrificed to him from another world so the only reasonable thing to do is to take the child and raise it! right?

- - - - - - - - - -

bad glanced around frantically when he was suddenly warped away, mid-conversation with skeppy. around him was a dimly lit room with a dark tone to it all, below him a circle of red, though with all the wrong symbols they probably intended.

one spoke before him, “oh please great one, take this witch’s baby and rid us of our drought, our children are starving and dying of dehydration.” the demon stared at him before slowly taking the baby while speaking, “well- um, this is highly irresponsible, i’ll just take them- and uh, good luck with your drought!”

and with that he was gone, disappeared with the circle closing in. bad was warped back to his exact location from before, where skeppy spun around to stare at him. “bad! what hap-” skeppy paused before shrieking, “why do you have a fucking baby!” his shouting caused the baby to begin crying.

the demon furrowed his unseeable brows, “language skeppy, and look what you did!” bad gently rocked the child back and forth, cooing softly down at them, all while attempting to soften his expression to appear unintimidating. the cries slowly softened, dying down while the baby stared up at bad, eyes wide. when the noise faded the baby raised a hand, poking at bad’s face. a soft smile formed on his expression, temporarily becoming distracted.

skeppy cleared his throat, arms folded. “bad, you have sap to take care of already, and dream for a week or so now, how’re you gonna handle a baby as well as those two?” his brows were furrowed, staring at bad with both concern and mild frustration.

the child’s expression shifted over, before a few giggles left the baby at the sight of skeppy. he froze up in shock, shoulders stiffening. grabby hands were made as bad walked over, “awe, they like you skeppy! and don’t worry i’ll figure out what to do with this little muffin.” bad smiled, watching the baby stare at skeppy in amazement and awe.

his throat cleared, turning his head away with a scoff and a soft ‘whatever’. bad smiled wider before turning around, humming softly while walking home. surely the others would be excited to have a little sibling! right? that’s what he thought anyways, because who could resist this adorable little muffin! bad poked softly at the baby’s cheek while thinking all of this.

the baby giggled loudly, wiggling their arms and legs slightly. “woah there little muffin, try not to fall!” he exclaimed, though he made sure not to be too loud. bad shifted the baby, readjusting his grip on them while the kid cooed back at him.

bad hummed a soft tune to the kid while approaching the house in the woods, pushing the door open with his hip, the lock needed to be fixed anyways. the moment he stepped into the house he heard the two kids talking.

“dreammmm, c’mon!” this was definitely sapnap, “just one more game!” there was a groan that followed sapnap’s pleading. “fine! but i’m hiding this time!” dream’s voice held an undertone of excitement, clearly not as hesitant as he showed.

the demon smiled at the boy’s interaction, “sap! dream! before you go i’d like you both to come here!” clearly they hadn’t heard the door open. the moment bad called sapnap came running around the corner of the front hallway, grinning with his arms up in the air. “dad!” he shouted before skidding to a halt, dream almost crashing into his back, barely keeping himself up by grabbing onto sapnap’s shoulders.

“hey guys, um, i found this little muffin all alone and so i uh, brought them back.” bad smiled, crouching down so the kids could see the baby. sap inched forward, dream peering over his shoulder down at the baby. the baby’s hands rose, making grabbing motions and cooing at the two new kids.

sapnap gasped at the action, slowly putting his hand forward. the baby’s hand curled around one of his fingers, giggling. dream watched with owlish eyes from behind sapnap, who was still staring down at the baby with a look of shock. dad smiled, overjoyed on how the interaction was going.

“is this my new sibling dad?” sapnap glanced up at bad, blinking. the demon’s smile grew softer, “yes they are, this little muffin is your new baby sibling.” he hummed, “do you wanna hold them sappy?”

his eyes flickered back down to the baby briefly, gulping nervously. “can i?” he asked. bad merely nodded, carefully passing the baby over to the seven year old, adjusting sap’s arms so he held the baby correctly.

sapnap stared down at the child, glancing back at dream with a grin. “i’m a big brother! and i’m gonna be a better one than you!” he gloated. dream gasped in mock offense, “no you’re not! i already have tubbo and mama puffy says i’m the best brother!”

the two bickered quieter than normal as bad took the baby back, chuckling at their interaction. this was gonna be an interesting family, wasn’t it?

- - - - - - - - - -

a sharp cry filled the air, silence came briefly after it. running footsteps came right after the cry as bad opened the door to the house. before he could say anything he heard sapnap speak, “are you okay?” his voice was filled with concern, though it was deeper now, older.

someone sniffled after sapnap asked them that, a softer, younger voice following. “yeah, i’m fine, thanks sap!”

bad smiled, relieved and content. it had been seven years since he’d brought you home, sapnap was fourteen now. he never regretted bringing you back, through all the years of learning you weren’t human just like the rest of them, and to you immediately being accepted into the family.

this is what a family was, and that brought him immense joy.

[enneamage]

people have been saying this but I hope this shift is what makes tommy really step back and evaluate what he's doing bc his content has kind of been all over the place and he keeps making jokes he seems to regret I think in part due to this persona he thinks people want or he's afraid to drop and I don't know tubbo that well so I can speak to how mad he is but it's clear between the marriage bit and the snapchat jokes tommy has crossed a line and I'm hoping a genuine conversation can bring him back down to earth from this over the top content prioritizing mentality he's seems to have taken on and as much as I think tommy is a natural entertainer streams right now are not his friend I think they are too much pressure maybe losing some of his audience and having to rethink/rebuild might be the best thing for him honestly bc he seems so afraid of losing his current audience he's driving them off

I feel like the loss of public trust because of his connection to Dream and his Tubbo-endangering content-brain are separate pieces, even though they’re happening at the same time.

Tommy is very likely going to keep his relationship to Dream, and probably has an opinion on the information he has about the situation rather than just ignoring it. He hasn’t said anything explicit, so I can’t say anything definitive either, but he behaves like someone with moral doubts about the situation. I would have to know way more about what Tommy’s opinion of ethics and power dynamics are than I will ever realistically know to be able to say anything further than that, but I feel like I need to let people down easy on this one. Tommy is not letting go of Dream because of what’s happened, and he’s made that clear. His joke showed his hand (not about the immediate situation but him being on joking terms about Dream), but it was always there, so this moment was both accidental and inevitable. Because most of the talk on twitter is about his connection with Dream over the joke at this stage, there’s not much that can be done with Tommy’s values being what they are right now.

I’m not sure what time you’re comparing it to, but both his streams and his Youtube videos seem about as regular as I’ve ever known them to be. He seems to be really trying to get it together lately, maybe not ethically but career-wise. I know people are worried that his content-brain is going to cause him to damage the relationships in his life, so he’s got the classic battle for the Youtuber soul: work-life balance, both time wise and morally.

The wedding video was questionably moral. It was also really good. As a viewer how in-tune you are with Tubbo’s emotions or how he thinks is going to change your experience of videos wildly, and I think the same goes for streams. Tubblings have been suffering both for and on behalf of their streamer, and I fully get that, but it is an issue that’s mainly within the two-person dynamic between them. Unfortunately, Tommy has always trampled Tubbo in some form or another so this is less a recent development and more him being able to do so through more and more extreme means.   

I don’t want to dip too far into Mages Theory Of Self & Persona but the short version is I believe that for as long as Tommy is put in the unique situation of sitting in front of a camera and addressing the public he’s going to have a persona for doing that. I know that his twitter persona deliberately playing tone-deaf is driving people crazy right now because he’s flagging deflection and apathy when that’s exactly what people are afraid he really feels. People get pissed off at it for the exact reasons why it works, it’s unserious and provocative at the same time, which was the kind of deadly attention grab he used to turn towards a lot more when he was younger. I think it’s a big mistake for him to signal that he isn’t listening or taking things seriously right now, but that seems to primarily his twitter approach and not what he puts out in videos or livestreams.  

People seem to keep saying that losing his audience is freaking him out, but I haven’t picked up on raw panic from him yet. He seems to be reaching for a new context to be stable in, but I don’t think he’s acting out from pure anxiety right now. He’s talked about the idea of coming to peace with a smaller but more involved audience, and it seems to resonate with him. He’s making changes but he doesn’t seem more erratic to me than usual.

I’ve known of people who tend to blurt things out nervously that they don’t mean to say, and Tommy has always struck me as that kind of person. I’m compelled to say he used to be worse before he was taught moral guidelines, we can hear him talking about what can/can’t be said and what would be a stupid idea to say a lot more often now. It’s at least on his mind and you can see him thinking about it from time to time, even if things come out without him meaning for them to. It really feels like a trait he’ll never have total control over even if he changes as a person because of the way his comedy and his disasterbrain are connected. I would like him to get better with this, but it’s a hard trait to tame.

Overall things are shifting for him and he’s in the middle of a number of tense situations, but I don’t see him deprioritising content anytime soon. He can be very stubborn so I think he’ll try and fight his way upstream to evolve what he does over taking a break, so time will tell how his methods change.

[dreamsclock]

Tommy or whomever: WE HAVE TO STOP WILL! Phil: *Tucks him under his wing blocking his view of day light making his bird brain launch sleep mode* There :)

in true dreamsclock form, i had to turn this into something far more angsty than this fun prompt was probably hinting at !! :DDDD

warnings: major character death, death, murder, blood, dying, fighting, emotional distress, filicide, hurt no comfort

“Mmm,” Wilbur says, voice raspy, muffled, “‘s dark.”

Phil clutches his son tighter, wings shielding then both from everyone else’s view. He doesn’t need an audience for this. He doesn’t need anyone to see. “Understatement.”

“Been a while since you’ve done this.” Wilbur’s tone is softer, less manic than he’s heard it in a long time: it reminds him of the little boy he’d raised so many years ago, and for a minute Phil is sorrowful, for a minute Phil asks himself what happened to that boy?, and is close to inconsolable not to have an answer. “Longer for me than you.”

Phil knows he’s talking about the Void, and so his grip on Wilbur shifts, tightens protectively, even though he knows his son is slipping away from him, piece by piece, even as they sit pressed against each other. “I know,” he says, quiet, unable to say anything else, “I know, Wil.”

His son hums, and Phil feels his body shiver: it’s not cold, under his wings, under the warm sun beating down on them, but Wil has always been cold after coming back — even before then, he’d been icy to the touch, tainted by the cold from Pogtopia and its influence on him. “Didn’t think you’d do it again,” Wilbur admits, and there’s almost pride in his voice; sick, twisted pride, but it’s there nonetheless, making bile rise in Phil’s stomach, “I’m impressed.”

“Don’t.” Phil’s voice wavers. “Don’t you fuckin’ dare. Please.”

Because the son he’s cradling in his wings is dying, bleeding out because of Phil’s sword between his ribs in the exact same spot as last time and fuck, fuck, it hurts. Both of them have long since stopped trying to prevent the bleeding; Wilbur has ceased his hysterical anger and desperation not to die, Phil has stopped crying. Both of them know what’s coming.

All Phil can do is make it a little more manageable.

Wilbur exhales; slowly, like he’s savouring each breath in case it’s his last, and looks up at Phil through feathers and bloodstained fingers.

“It was going to be mine,” he murmurs, eyes dark, reminiscent of the Void, black and mean and suffocating both of them, “the world. It was supposed to be mine.”

“It wasn’t supposed to be yours.” Phil swallows, resists shouting with miserable anger at his stupid, prideful, ill son. “It was never supposed to be yours, Wil. It was for all of us.”

Wilbur chuckles, coughs up blood. His eyes are starting to look heavy; it’s clearly a struggle to keep them open, a struggle Wilbur doesn’t seem to care much about winning. “You told me when I was a child I could have anything I wanted, Phil. You told me the world was my oyster, do you remember?”

Phil’s heart is heavier and blacker than before. He makes a noise in affirmation, in agreement, because he does remember, remembers telling his son the cheesy little saying the same way all parents do — he hadn’t realised how damning it would be for Wil, hadn’t realised in a million years until he’d been staring him down as he’d pressed a button to detonate his country.

Not his country, Phil corrects himself, because it had never just been Wilbur’s. It had been Tommy’s, Tubbo’s, Niki’s, Fundy’s, fuck, even if he’d hated L’Manburg, he’s got enough sense to see how much it had meant to others.

“Do you think I’ll go back?”

“To the Void?” Phil keeps his voice as steady as possible. Wilbur, irritatingly, despairingly clever, blinks back at him knowingly, half gone already. “I think so, yeah. Yeah, maybe.”

“I want to stay,” Wilbur confesses, and his face creases up as he suddenly realised that as his truth, and his struggles begin anew; twisting, limbs knocking weakly against his father’s wings and arms, “I don’t want to die again, I don’t want to go back there, I won’t go back.”

Phil holds him tightly, simultaneously the judge, jury, executioner and the damned, feeling self hatred rise up inside his chest for doing so. “I know you don’t, Wil,” he says, and it’s supposed to be calm but it comes out ragged, “you don’t have a choice. This has to happen again. I’m so sorry.”

“Phil,” Wilbur chokes out, raw, eyes flickering open one last desperate time, “please don’t let me die, please—” And he’s crying, Phil realises in horror and heartbreak, both of them are crying and the sky has opened up above them in rain but his wings keep them dry, “Dad, Dad, please.”

(“Dad,” Wilbur chirps, and he’s four years old and the world is his oyster, “tell me a story, please, Dad.”

Phil laughs, warm, content, and rolls his eyes, sitting down beside his son again. “Another?” He teases, but begins anyway, voice low, calm, while a storm rages outside.)

“It’s going to be okay,” Phil consoles him the only way he can, useless, too late, as Wilbur sobs in rage and defeat and fear in his arms, “just go to sleep, Wil. You just need to sleep.”

And with his wings blocking out the sun, it’s hard for Wilbur to say otherwise. Distantly, Phil can hear Tommy barking orders at people outside, can hear Tubbo’s anxious inquiry and Techno’s low drawling voice as he speaks to a similarly injured and defeated Dream. Phil’s sole attention is on his son: too late, he thinks bitterly, too late, as per fucking usual.

“Just go to sleep, Wil,” he tells Wilbur, whose eyes have slipped shut, whose struggles have stopped, “I’ll be here when you wake up. I promise.”

[sapphire-knight]

You guys are giving me way too much power by letting me talk about acting

@minecant you wanted me to rant about Techno and Wilbur's acting? Well, you asked for it

Let's start with Techno bc I realized something this morning and I cannot get it out of my head, let's go.

Techno has a really peculiar way of acting compared to anyone else, his character is a lot more aware of the fourth wall than any other character is, and actually having to keep in check a character that, to certain acting degrees, could be almost considered self-aware is actually harder than you can imagine, and of course everything that's kinda hard in scripted acting goes to a whole new level of difficoult in improv; but on the other hand, his type of acting (more specifically: the voice acting) is on the same page of 3 other characters: Tubbo, Fundy and Niki. Follow me on this, alright? The basically only thing that these 4 characters, that narratively are so different from each other,is the way they are voiced. All four of then have a really specific way of talking and talking pattern, to the point where even if you were to put the voices in a voice-changer you could still know what character is talking just because of the way they talk. Let me elaborate: Fundy usually his voice doesn't let a lot of emotions through and his speech is usually straight to the point, keeping his tone medium and trying to keep his voice relaxed; Niki's usual tone is soft and lighter, is easy to not hear it with her low tone of voice and higher pitch that give her a kinder undertone; Tubbo's tone is also one in a softer scale and lower of volume, but where Niki is easy to miss Tubbo lets a bit more emotion in all phrases to make himself pop out, he doesn't tend to go straight to the point in conversations and his tone is pretty much constant; Techno doesn't let emotions shine through his voice, more like Fundy, but to the extreme, keeping a completly monotone type of speech in basically all the situations and isn't very talkative, a character that talks one when he feels like it's needed and goes straight to the point of the conversation, not caring how that makes him come across to the other characters.

These 4 have incredibly set in stone characters, keeping always to their own set of acting rules for them. It's not easy to set yourself acting rules for your characters in an improv, but if you manage to do it's an in incredible help. Even Wilbur's character was more unhinged under that point of view, his "standard" continuing to change slightly as his mental stage declined.

But you know where does the actual strenght of having these things set in stone for your characters? That the emotions are a lot more powerfull. Let's think about it, why most of the emotive scene shock us? You can usually feel the emotions because the tone of voice lets these emotions through, it hits you because it wasn't there before, it's a switch between the usual voice and the emotive one, it gives you whiplash, but why am I talking about this?

Because these characters are able to express their emotions with a lot more power, because they always talk in a really specific way, you get used ti their tone and speech pattern without noticing it, so you maybe not actually understand it, but your brain notices when the pattern breaks, and since it is a really set in stone one, when it gets broken the whiplash is extreme. Just like when Niki rebelled against Schlatt, the whiplash was her raising her voice and abandoning the soft tone she always used, but kept the classic amount of emotions in her voice, the same thing happens with Techno and his speech: some emotions start to get throught, he doesn't get to the point quickly as always, instead he keeps on talking with extreme confidence in every word, the same confidence he always has. Whiplash guys, whiplash.

I didn't mention Quackity as one of the set-in-stone-speaking characters, because he switches too much to set the rules enough to shock when broken. I'm not saying at all that he isn't a good actor, on the contrary, his acting just works on different bases, example, Try looking at the Quackity vs Schlatt argument compared to the Tubbo vs Tommy: when Quackity got angry it wasn't expected, it was a bit alienating, it didn't feel like the Quackity we know because it was incredibly different than how his character speaks, too different (Which still isn't bad, at all, that scene was phenomenal); when Tubbo got angry it still felt like Tubbo, you could still pinpoint it was Tubbo even without hearing his voice, because even if the voice is raised, the amount of emotions is the same and the speech pattern is the same, just to the next level. So yeah.

I don't even feel like talking about Techno's lines tho, these are amazing under every technical point of view and you guys know that, so let's go to Wilbur.

Wilbur, Wilbur, Wilbur, where can I begin with Wilbur? Not only he had an extraordinary arc for his own character, he also wrote an incredible story- this guy's voice acting is off the charts in every way possible, are you telling me he didn't take acting classes as a kid? i do not believe you. Like, at all. He has a perfect hang on his voice, but this could be because he's also a singer: expressing emotions during songs is harder than you think, because you cannot let emotions ruin your exibition by making your voice crack at the wrong part or making you mess up the timing, but you also need to let them shine through or the voice will seem flat and Wil knows that perfectly, just listen to Your City gave me asthma and you'll understand what I'm going on about here.

Wilbur Soot is a showman. He manovrated the stage to shine a spotlight on himself, making us see what he wants us to see: that's why it took us so much to realize that the character didn't just "go insane" out of nowhere, the seeds were always there, we had all the hints we needed, but he was able to move his character around it, around the arc, in such a way that made us overlook all of those details until they slapped us in the face. He showed us the consequences of his character through other characters, he acted and spoke in a certain way to get a reaction from the others, and the others reacted in the exact way Wilbur planned. And those things aren't scrpited, only major plotpoints are. Wheter this was intentional on his part or it was a coincidence it's not clear, but in either cases it's still pure skill and genius.

Wilbur knew how to act and interact with every character, it's impressive

He even knew how to get Dream on his act on the festival narrative, Dream isn't always top notch at improv and we know that, but if he can get in the loop he is absolutely a distructive force, it's terrifying, and Wilbur knew exactly what to do to get Dream inside the loop of events and it's incredible.

You could guess he knew how to act with Tommy, Tubbo, Ph1lza, Techno and Schlatt, of course he did, he already knew them, but right now he has an incredibly difficoult bit with someone I would have never guessed if I didn't watch the SMP, with Fundy. I have not been in the fandom for a lot of time, but it seems like the two actually met each other on the SMP. They are carrying and incredibly emotional taxing bit with each other, and the SMP lore started just this year- more or less 7/8 months I think? Correct me if I'm wrong. The story bit these two are on is a delicate one, one wrong step and the situation explodes. The fact that they are capable to carrying it even without having known each other for a long time is honestly impressive. Things like this are incredibly hard even when scripted, in improv usually only people who blindly trusted each other for a long time are able to carry it, meanwhile Wilbur and Fundy are flawlessly running with this story arc, the character interactions are perfect, ever act, every word is so incredibly in character for both of them, in scenes like this having to keep perfect track of your character is hard, you have to concentrate on the scene, you cannot stop to think about it, you have only one take and you cannot afford to slow down the act or you risk losing the atmosphere and the momentum of it, and if you do that you'e screwed, you lost an entire scene. In improv you cannot afford slipping up, but if you actually do you have to be incredibly quick to catch yourself, lose two seconds too many and the moment is broken.

Wilbur Soot is incredibly quick to adapt his acting to ever change in his character, having to jump from the power hungry, driven crazy, obsessive, unhinged, paranoid character that is Wilbur to the sad, guilty, scared, repressed, just-wanting-to-be-happy, forgetfull, ignoring character that is Ghostbur is not something easy. Like, at all. It's a cspital switch, and he did it from a day to the other like it's nothing.

Mr Soot please leave some talent to the rest of us come on-

[justalads]

this is an essay post that was written in response to an in-depth discussion i was having with another person on a lot of topics. that’s why it’s written like it’s addressing someone. because of that, it is a little confusing on its own (because the things in quotes are responding to things the other person said) but me and the person who runs this blog thought it would be better to make this a separate post, so that people who want to see this response can see it without it being attached to the person i was having the discussion with. we spoke to the person and they said that would be fine. with that being said, this is a very long post. if anyone finds parts of it useful, it will have served its original purpose.

so what i mean about it “making sense” that dream became like that is that it kind of does, you know? i’m saying that the desires were always there. not that he was always willing to go so far for them, or even that they were as strong as they ended up being! after all, there’s a difference between declaring war to reclaim land and people, and making a vault in order to take things that were important to people.

what he always did possess is a sort of “ownership” of the server. and this was probably founded from the fact that it was, you know, his server. he wanted l’manburg back because he didn’t like that people came onto his server and then said he couldn’t have something. and that’s one of his primary points in his conversation with skeppy: the analogy he uses of someone coming into his house and saying he can’t have a table.

and later, in the vault, this is the reason he gives for wanting control: that it is his server. he tells tommy it isn’t supposed to be fair, it doesn’t need to be fair, because fairness implies equality, and he doesn’t see everyone else as having equal claim to the server. so that’s what i mean when i say the signs were always there: his statements match upand paint a path through the story. true, you don’t just “become” a bad person. there’s no reason for him to suddenly get all weird and want ultimate control, if he was completely neutral and peaceful in the beginning. this is why his character is decently written!

and since the potential was there in the first place, that’s what gave him the ability to or put him in danger of doing what he did.

so yeah, it’s true that his spiral was not only his fault, because even someone who thinks they own something is not going to just jump to the lengths that he did. he had other experiences, and saw how other people worked, and then was met by pushback from people when he wanted them all to do what he said. because his house analogy is lacking something: he owns the house, but everyone else lives there too.

it may be “his” server in that he pays upkeep fees, but that doesn’t mean he deserves control over everything that happens on it! if your roommate goes “i want this table and you can’t have it”, even if the house belongs to you, it’s kind of weird to go “no you can’t have it, it’s mine”. especially if all the roommate wants the table for is so they can play monopoly or something with their group. and even more so if the roommate will let you play monopoly if you want to (remember the embassy?), and if you can just buy a new table then what’s the point in getting upset over the one?

i just think you put a lot more of the responsibility on other characters. saying that all they did was villainize him and treat him as pure evil and break his boundaries is wrong because one, no, that’s not all they did, it’s exaggerated, and two, he was also doing things to them! it did not come out of nowhere! and clearly, his mindset didn’t come from nothing, so a personal flaw contributed to it! people who are innocent and care too much about others and are then mistreated do not do what dream did, and we know this because there is a character very similar to that: ranboo.

(i could talk about this for a super long time honestly. it’s very interesting how close they are, and since enderwalk ranboo is just ranboo with all his memories and he helped dream... there’s clearly something that happened that he’s forgotten that’s very important.)

hates conflict, tries to mediate things, cares about the people he loves to a fault. and we don’t see him running around and telling people they can’t build nations because it “divides people”! he has also been hurt and betrayed, but he still recognizes his responsibility to respect others and their agency. the difference between dream and ranboo is that one, dream has a spine, and two, dream thinks of the server as his. dream’s belief is one of the driving causes of his actions.

it’s true that nobody deserves to lose half their friends at once. it’s also true that before he declared war, nobody had any actual negative feelings towards him. they made fun of him for saying his side had more women. he made fun of them for having none. it was playful banter. that’s the thing about the hot dog stream: the tone is incredibly light. wilbur soot, known dramatic idiot, decided he was going to go play capitalism on a minecraft server. both tommy and wilbur at that point had been making various stupid attempts to gain “power”. and none of this was treated seriously, because others were doing the same kinds of things.

you know how many times tommy logged on and got involved in small petty conflicts? pretty much none of them are mentioned in canon again, because at this point, there wasn’t even much of a canon to get involved in. the smp at this point was a place for people to go and do bits. and invoking wilbur’s joke hatred of tommy and those like him seems a little unfair. wilbur’s main bit was calling tommy an annoying child. when wilbur was stealing the blaze rods, it was not an actual attempt to get power because it was not treated as such by anyone, it was treated with the exact seriousness that it deserved: sapnap and tubbo declared themselves the “police”.

what kind of actual control is going to come from taking blaze rods, especially on a server where you can just go get more? and it’s not like theft is really a crime on the server. everyone else chose to play into the bit.

it’s like now, when tommy shows up with a new idea and people who don’t like him start claiming that this is proof that he never learned anything and he was actually bad all along. the church prime thing, l’sandburg, any time he steals something or is rude to jack manifold. because although semi-lore is fun, sometimes people treat it as serious lore when parts of it are not intended to be and then use it to imply things about the characters that don’t line up with canon.

that’s kinda off topic and not really about dream, so i’ll move on

“i’d like to ask you to once again watch the actual stream.”

i mean, yeah. i did watch the stream. i don’t know a lot about george, and i prefaced my thoughts at the start by saying that. obviously attempting to catch up after isn’t as good as knowing the context and plot, (this sounds sarcastic but it is genuine i’m sorry sjhksjs) but i do want to offer this: it’s an opportunity to look at the plot in a different way. you say that you are on dream’s side in this scene, and while having that bias alone isn’t bad, i think it’s a good idea to attempt to see the other side. that’s what i’ve been doing while going back and forth with you; examining my own bias and attempting to look past it, and explain why it’s there.so dream kicks george off the throne. and you say that it’s not bad that dream does it, because george’s monarchy was already a figurehead. you know, i don’t see this as being any better? this means that when dream made george king, he already did it with the fact that george wasn’t really in charge in dream’s mind, meaning that dream was, you know, the ultimate authority. that is a power dynamic. dream has control over who is king of his faction.

when you watch the stream where dream makes george king originally, dream doesn’t really let him know that his power isn’t real. that’s the problem with this situation: the presence of a power dynamic alone is not the issue, it’s the fact that dream was misleading about its presence. dream just tells him “you’re king.” in fact, dream demonstrates more control over eret, by telling them just that they can’t be in charge anymore and george is king now. he tells them to take off their crown, to which they protest because it’s a layer on their skin and it would show their eyes, something they’re uncomfortable with. dream says “i need you to do it. you gotta do it. i mean, i’m not asking you, we have three of us here.”

they physically threaten eret. and by the way, the reason that dream thought eret had “betrayed” the greater smp? eret was attempting to help pogtopia and make things right with the people of l’manburg, something you claim was also dream’s wish during this time (he had switched over to manburg at this point). dream told eret that the king had a duty to remain neutral.

it is only then, when dream tells eret to remain neutral on things, that dream tells eret that the act of being king means nothing. this is where the “what makes you king” quote coms from, by the way. dream has the ultimate control over who is king. but whenever he makes someone king, he doesn’t tell them that. and when dream leaves, eret fully realizes this and admits that dream’s right: they don’t have any power. so what was the point of betraying l’manburg?

if there was no power with being king, why did george accept it? why was there even a king in the first place? the only reason eret agreed to betray l’manburg in the first place was because dream offered them power.

when dream confronts eret about remaining neutral, dream says “my plan is that there’s no manburg, there’s no l’manburg, there’s no pogtopia, there’s just dream smp and there’s dream smp everywhere. and that’s been my plan since the very beginning, i’ve never wavered on that. that’s why i had you betray them, and that’s why i gave you kingship, because i felt like you’d be a good king because you’re neutral.”

ignoring the fact that he’s twisting why he made eret king (they were on the side of l’manburg and he tempted them away), he also claims that his faction only has been his goal since the beginning. this will be important later.

cc!eret confirmed in a twitter thread on their alt that their character was possibly the longest victim of dream’s manipulation.

and finally, watching the stream where dream dethrones george, the thing sticking out to me is how dream is phrasing it. he says that george should step down because people are attacking him, and dream isn’t always going to be able to protect him. and then he says this.

“and i think you’ll just be targeted if you’re the king. and you want to be able to like, get revenge on tommy and stuff, right? so we can work together.”

i kind of wish he didn’t bring up tommy. i kind of wish his main goal at this time wasn’t just going after tommy because he thought tommy was the root of all the problems. and i think this kind of highlights a little bit that when dream built the walls around l’manburg again, it wasn’t just because he was “defending george” or anything, because i don’t think george really cared that much? dream was using the fact that it was george’s house that blew up in order to go after tommy.

after this line, the others all kind of gang up on dream, true. it’s partially for the joke, as evidenced by quackity’s “THE GIRLS ARE FIGHTING!”, but it’s also kind of them being, you know, legitimately angry at his character. and it’s funny that it’s sapnap who leads it. sapnap brings up what dream said, that he doesn’t care about anything except for the disks. dream says that he didn’t mean it, and then george says “then why did you say it?” so dream saying that clearly hurt them, and he can’t just push it off by saying he didn’t mean it once.

and in the end, george doesn’t even agree before dream makes eret king again! george and sapnap are trying to have a conversation with dream about how they feel they’ve been treated, and dream brushes it off with “maybe this isn’t a good time to bring it up,” before ultimately ignoring what they’re both saying because in his mind he has a good enough reason and it doesn’t matter what george thinks.

dream is in the act of passing power over to eret, and george says “i’m still king. i’m literally right here.” dream shushes him. dream also implies that the reason george is getting attacked is because he backs up everything dream says, reducing george down to an extension of his own will or calling him a follower. dream accuses sapnap of trying to divide him and george, and sapnap says this: “i’m not dividing anyone, i stand by george. he’s my king but most importantly he’s my friend.” dream replies that george is his friend but not his king.

i just sort of want to show you the other side here. george and sapnap weren’t just running around instigating conflict any more than dream was. and although george didn’t do anything as king, it meant something to him, because it was a symbol of the trust he thought dream had for him. dream saying he was taking it away for his own good meant he didn’t even trust george to protect himself. he was treating him like a child.

and then when george is silent, listening to everyone debate whether he deserves this or not, dream accuses him of only pretending to be sad. it’s true that he was pretending to cry, but i don’t think that warranted dream telling him he’s “acting like a baby” and that he was a bad king.

sapnap and george had a real point, and dream ignored them. he hadn’t addressed the things he had said that hurt them, and so they raised legitimate grievances with him! dream doesn’t treat their concerns as important, and talks down to george in particular.

ignoring the fact that sapnap and george were also hurting is kind of hypocritical. you’re right, “abandonment hurts you, no matter if the people have good reasons for it or not”. dream said the spirit thing before sapnap did any sort of real leaving him. and dream’s reasons were definitely not good.

i have no idea why you got the idea that george is so awful. he was walking around with his head down. the only one also calling him things like manipulative and a drama queen is, well, dream.

basically: (/hj)

george: :(

dream: you are attempting to emotionally manipulate me

butternut is a master of psychological manipulation

anyway

so sapnap, george and quackity felt betrayed there. they left, and went to mexican l’manburg to try and console george. and then dream shoots quackity and kills him, and tries to attack the others as well. it’s worth noting that quackity also had a reason to be upset at dream: dream’s treatment of l’manburg. dream then shows up and calls george a tyrant. dream never listens to what george says during this, he just continues saying what he already said. dream taking the kingship away from george hurt him more than letting him stay would have.

watching this is painful, because it’s making me realize just how much dream doesn’t actually care what his friends think! he says he cares, and he might think he cares, but then he calls them babies and liars and tyrants. his argument with george here reads like something awful. he’s using the excuse of “caring about him” in order to undermine and insult him, and take the moral high ground. dream essentially tells george that he didn’t make george king out of any respect for him, it was just random. he doesn’t treat his friends well during this scene. i don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to get angry.

when quackity, after sitting in silence for the entire conversation, says he disagrees, dream tells him that he’s just dumb. doesn’t wait to hear his reasons, doesn’t value his opinion, because dream is so sure that he’s right and he knows what’s best for the server, and by extension, everyone.

other interesting things: dream brings tommy into it again by saying he’s what causes all the problems on the server. dream tells quackity to think about what tubbo would think about him picking this fight. dream says that george would probably do anything he told him to do. his entire position is “you guys can think whatever you want, but it won’t change anything.” genuinely, tell me how this is them abandoning him? and when they do drift away later, tell me why they don’t have a reason to? dream doesn’t respect them! he takes their friendship for granted!

“would you consider it justified for all of tommy’s friends (even tubbo who he’s been close with for so long) to abandon him just because he’s said basically the same thing about the discs - like three times?”

thank you for bringing up the disk thing. do you really think that tommy and dream acted the same when saying that an item held more worth than their friends?

think about what the disks symbolize. control over tommy. tommy wants them back because they are a sign of dream having power over him! tommy doesn’t want his abuser having power over him! and yeah! it was a messed up thing for him to say to tubbo that the disks were worth more than him, but he apologized! he understood that what he said hurt tubbo, and he tried to rebuild the relationship! tommy took responsibility for what he said, and tried to be better. notice how afterwards, he was willing to sacrifice anything for the safety of his friends? notice how in the vault he told dream to take the disks and do whatever he wanted with them, when dream switched from threatening the disks to threatening the life of tubbo?

and what do the disks mean to dream? they mean power over tommy. the disks have no power over dream. they are a tool that he can use to hurt and control tommy. and he never apologized for this, because he wasn’t sorry. sapnap told dream that this hurt him, and all dream said was that he didn’t mean it. who is he lying to, then? tommy or sapnap? it was so important to dream that he had ultimate control over the life of someone else that he almost drove them to take their own life. i’m sorry, but this comparison sucks.

people gave dream a chance. people gave him a lot of chances. the disregard he showed for others is disgusting, especially towards his friends, and even more so towards those who he didn’t like. my problem is that though you repeat that you don’t “blame” others for what they did, you still hold them to more responsibility than you’re willing to hold him to, or at least that’s what it seems like. i’ve been investigating the other side through this whole process. and yeah, there are definitely places where i was wrong. but sometimes i do not understand, and maybe that means i should just give up on trying to understand those places. if other people can see things i can’t, maybe we agree to disagree.

i legitimately cannot see dream being the person who was treated the worst here, but let me know if i’m misrepresenting you.

i’m sorry that i sound angry, and i’m not really upset at you, but the comparison of what dream said and what tommy said set me off.

“no one having respect for him as a person”

people did respect dream, man. he was the leader of his faction. he had a lot of power. his friends trusted him to be a good friend to them. but he didn’t feel like he had an obligation to do that, yeah? and you only get respect if you give it, so they stopped respecting them because he hurt them. he didn’t learn any hard lessons about violence being the only way because he never stopped to consider another way. when faced with a problem, his options were for the problem to go away or he would make it go away: surrender or die.

during the stream where he sets up the walls with sapnap, his message is the same throughout: wipe them out. no mercy. burn their land to the ground, leave no survivors. there’s no love in war. children get hurt in war. this is a warning shot, he says, as he fires into their land. as sapnap burns down tubbo’s house and chat spams “no mercy”. they don’t show mercy because mercy is weak, and they are powerful.

one day i’m gonna write a thing that talks about the greater smp like how people talk about early l’manburg because oh boy

i’d like to see evidence of dream learning that violence is the only way, and only being able to protect himself through fighting. i don’t remember this happening, i remember him generally choosing violence as the first option.

“dream didn’t have an arising god complex.”

a god complex means more than just saying “i’m a god.” there was buildup because that’s how characters work. tommy was also trapped in the prison, and he didn’t suddenly get a god complex at the slightest bit of power, did he? the definition of a god complex is “an unshakable belief characterized by consistently inflated feelings of personal ability, privilege, or infallibility.” dream cannot admit when he is wrong. he feels as if he has a right to the control of the server, and that grows into a state of obsession. and when he’s taking tubbo and tommy down into the vault, he mocks them for thinking he was weak or that he didn’t think ahead.

once dream knew he had control over death, the complex reached its peak, and that’s when he actually admits it. characters that antagonize others already possess traits that contribute to their arc.

and hey, i know that cc!dream says his character is blocked off emotionally. i also know that he’s been given a lot of chances to apologize to people, to be sorry, to admit fault, even in small situations. did dream show remorse during exile? did dream sound like he was being “forced” to isolate and control tommy, or did he sound like an abusive parent scolding a kid for something? when dream beat tommy and tubbo and took them down to the vault, did he sound sorry? the thing about subtext is that it has to actually be there, no matter how quiet, at least a little bit. listen to dream arguing with quackity after george was dethroned and tell me he sees himself as anything other than right.

a few one off lines are not enough evidence to wipe out the rest of his character’s development.

he sounds sorry once he is faced with direct consequences, because that is the only time he is held responsible for his actions.

it’s also a weak argument to say that something is happening when, as you said, we don’t see his pov. it is fair to say that i don’t know if it’s not happening, and that’s a good point. cc!dream’s comments about his character being closed off emotionally can mean a lot of things. for instance, they could mean that his character is willing to do this to himself in order to get control. or it could mean something else entirely, i don’t know. basing an entire fact about a character off something we don’t see at all doesn’t tell us anything useful about the character, and i apologize for doing that.

i guess my reason for saying that was that i don’t see evidence of him trying to get better during pogtopia. if we don’t see signs of him being sorry or attempting to treat other people better, why should we assume that he was doing those things?

“yes, and none of c!dream’s “friends” ever did.”

dream’s friends supported him until he abandoned them and disrespected them. his time in the prison is a consequence of his time out of the prison, albeit an unfair one.

“dream didn’t hurt george.”

dream’s disrespect of george is what hurt him. dream didn’t apologize for it, he didn’t attempt to understand what george was feeling, and he didn’t look for a compromise. and yeah, it was beckerson in the vault. he had a space for mars, he just hadn’t collected it yet. so yes, dream did betray sapnap. if you have legitimate evidence of sapnap doing something that made dream actually upset, before the vault, i’d like to see it. (there might be something lol i’m sorry i’m Very Bad on his lore but from what i’ve investigated i didn’t find anything really important.)

i don’t think puffy saying “this person does bad things” is her dismissing their trauma. and the eggpire and her have both hurt each other. puffy isn’t the Trauma Designator of the server. if there’s an instance of her straight up saying that someone doesn’t have trauma then i missed it.

“she’s another one c!dream was attached to and who failed to ever reach out to him”

i don’t see evidence of this? there was the one stream where the relationship was established, but after that he never tried to seek her out. he doesn’t even talk about her. it’s not a failure from her to not reach out to him, if their connection is light at best. i honestly feel like she was more attached to him than he was to her.

“like she’s doing something extra by being a decent person.”

she’s saying he didn’t deserve to see her because he did bad things! she still cares about someone who has done bad things, but she recognizes that those things are bad. she’s saying the punishment for what he’s done should involve not seeing her, personally, and i think she should be able to make that decision? she doesn’t endorse the rest of his punishment, because she doesn’t know what it entails.

she helped him by thinking he was in the right. she helped him by even trying to understand him, when everyone else could not. she gave him the help that she could by being on his side, by being friendly to him, and after she realized he was wrong she could not do that because he was off preparing the vault! and she had other things to worry about! “could have” is useless because it can mean anything! tommy “could have” not burned george’s house down. would it have mattered, when dream already had it out for him? no!

dream took anyone being close to him for granted. he did not give anything back to them once he started going down the path. if he did something bad to them, and they were angry, that was it for him. he did not attempt to fix the bond, like other characters do when they hurt someone they care about.

“i never said anything negative about them other than describing things they did that had a negative effect.”

here’s my main point: we don’t know they had a negative effect.

you criticize the characters for not taking an action that we do not know the implications of. everyone could have been super nice and worried about dream and that could have changed nothing. that’s why i think the criticism is unwarranted.

their crime is inattention to a situation that some of them did not even know was happening. that’s like saying that techno is “responsible” for some of the pain of tommy’s exile, because he did nothing to stop it. that’s like saying that quackity or tommy “should have” removed the tnt from the button room under l’manburg.

i just don’t get the point of the criticism. because it can apply to any character in any situation, you know? we could say that eret taking back the kingship from george enabled dream into taking more control over his friends, and that eret should have stopped him. we could say that skeppy telling dream he was wrong about l’manburg pushed him further into the role of the bad guy. if you aren’t being negative about the characters, then why bring it up in the first place?

“truly believe they did all those things” they didn’t do anything. if you’re talking about the “actual consequences and effect it had on him as a character”, you have to look at what affects his character.

we can say “sapnap should not have said this to dream”. because that is something sapnap actually did, directly to dream’s face, and it is something that visibly affected dream. considering the conditions of the prison, it is an inhumane thing to say. that’s something i would call reasonable to consider when analyzing dream’s character.

but puffy talking to herself, writing her own thoughts and reactions down? that does not impact dream in any way! and i think puffy thinking internally that dream is a bad person (when she has been given adequate reason to think so) has a lot less impact on Real Plot Events than the stuff that dream actually did.

what is her “fault” here? what harm did she do? what am i excusing? what did she do wrong, and how is the effect of her specifically visible in dream’s actions? he hasn’t mentioned her in months, and it’s my perspective that if he cared, we would know.

if a tree falls in the forest when nobody is around, does it make any noise?

(the person i was responding to linked a thread about how the prison isn’t helping dream and how puffy and sapnap saying he deserves it is inhumane)

that thread doesn’t actually seem to be assigning any fault to puffy, it’s just saying that hearing that kind of thing hurts.

(also, the person who wrote the thread saying “i told you so” is going to have nobody to tell it to. we all already know dream is going to be violent when he gets out, because he told tommy he would hunt down and take revenge on the things he loves. but he’s not going to be violent because puffy didn’t visit him.)

“another person he cared about who didn’t prove to care about him enough to stop him from spiralling or try help at all.”

how did puffy not care about him? what did she do before the vault that showed that? how did she specifically abandon him, by actions of her own will and not of consequences of his? for supposedly caring about her, dream did pretty much nothing to show it.

“if “they don’t owe him anything” is your base argument against someone being hurt via being left by people they care about over and over again until they’re utterly alone with no support system and unhealthy mindsets, we might have to agree to disagree”

we would disagree if that was my point, but it’s not. because that’s not what the characters did. they didn’t all abandon him, as i’ve said. he says that he cut ties with them, but if you say he’s lying when he says that you can disregard it, i guess. and five to six people are definitely not responsible for him. again, you’re critical of them for an action they didn’t take, and in some cases it was impossible for them to take like with tommy, who certainly didn’t abandon him, as hard as he tried to.

“his (dream’s) manipulation is the clumsiest thing i’ve ever seen”

i mean i don’t really find it funny that dream was “bad” at manipulation. and clearly it was powerful enough to work on multiple people, and if he was that ineffective at it it wouldn’t have worked. but i understand what you’re saying, although i disagree with your take on wilbur.

it’s true that wilbur’s smart, but this is again saying things about stuff we can’t prove. if you look at the context of wilbur’s actions next to everyone else’s, they seem pretty tame. and he can play a morally grey character without the intent being that the character was seriously manipulative all along. although i guess it’s nice to think that you’ve solved the code, if “solving the code” means “the majority of everyone else is wrong” then you may want to take a step back.

i think the principle of occam’s razor sort of applies here, and especially applies later to the conversion between dream and wilbur. unless there is strong, strong evidence for a theory that sort of goes against stuff, there may be a better explanation. i’ve scrapped like fifty theories because of this dude hskhdksjsthe things i said at the start about tommy and wilbur’s grabs for power not being serious still do apply, and so does the fact that at the start of the roleplay, the cc’s didn’t see their characters as that separate from themselves. i think it would be kind of weird for cc!wilbur’s intent to be genuine manipulation of his actual friends all along, especially when he wasn’t playing it as a bit.

“that’s precisely what he did and how he got them to side with him in the war.”

nope. he didn’t tell anyone they “needed” to to anything. anyone who joined the country joined of their own free will, and nobody joined during the war, just before and after.

wilbur didn’t really “recruit” tommy so much as they were on a team of causing small arguments. wilbur joined and he and tommy went to go scam people together, while tommy told him about the various other little schemes he had been running. and i don’t really think he was intending to do a real takeover, which is why i called it “weak”. the man told people that potions give you diarrhea. does that sound like the work of a mastermind? no, because it’s the self proclaimed “crime boy”. and that “drug empire” got shut down pretty quick for something that was supposed to last a long time.

“just put “revolution” instead of “business” as a guise of what he was actually doing.”

l’manburg was not the drug empire under a different name. l’manburg was about separation from the greater smp, admittedly because they felt that being stopped from selling drugs was a bad thing, but then they pretty much completely dropped the drugs and the empire throughout the wall vod.

so when he was recruiting people like fundy, he was doing it with the intent of getting them to make drugs with him. he says nothing about dream when fundy joins his drug empire. and yeah, he lied to him originally, but it didn’t work. fundy visited the van and saw through wilbur (and tommy)’s story, and then he decided to join, on his own. because he wanted to make drugs.

a quote from the wall vod:

“we’re starting a revolution, not a war.”

there was no targeted hatred towards dream until he approached them. and i would say the most “evidence” that wilbur was trying to go after dream in any way is the infamous “what’s tyrannical mean” moment. the thing about that moment is that taking a single moment and using it to define an entire period is unfair. it’s not like that’s a turning point, and after that they solely go after dream. they don’t. i agree that you have to watch the actions of wilbur, and his actions at the time were geared towards becoming independent and progressing the condition of l’manburg.

wilbur is honest with eret when they join that they are committing crimes. eret joins because “haha americans bad”. meanwhile, dream is in chat telling eret that there are “three defectors from the kingdom”.

“the only reason people disbelieve this is not because it doesn’t align with canon, but because they assume he’s lying for the sole reason that it doesn’t align with the way they see canon.”

if what revivedbur said agreed with canon, people wouldn’t be pointing out that it doesn’t. watch back the hot dog stream, the wall stream, the first war stream, even the stream after that when niki joins. look at how wilbur speaks, and also look at how he acts. it does not match up with all of what revivedbur says.

early wilbur is naive. he thinks he’s doing the right thing, so he therefore concludes the people against him are wrong. the only fighting back that l’manburg does before war is declared is killing alyssa (and this was tommy’s idea, wilbur was discouraging killing her), because they thought she set the fire. once she told them she didn’t, they gave her back the stuff they thought they had. tubbo still had her pickaxe, but didn’t realize. and for this? the people of the greater smp hunted him down, trapped him in a box, and killed him as well as killing tommy, who tried to save tubbo.

wilbur scolded tommy for killing alyssa. wilbur wanted to focus on building the nation, on declaring independence, and actively ignored the other side. he writes the declaration and he believes in everything it stands for! half the things in there are things that the other people of l’manburg yelled out, that he wrote in as they were being fired on by the greater smp. it comes from all the people.

the declaration of war from the greater smp pretty much says “sometimes you just gotta kill some people, you know?”

i am not disagreeing with you that after the first war, wilbur fell into corruption. it’s implied greatly that this is partially a consequence of the first war, and also partially stems from his fierce protectiveness of l’manburg.

also, if you’re saying that you have never and will never believe wilbur, i would urge you to re-examine that. it’s hard to avoid bias when you refuse to take most things that someone says as truth. i am also curious how you came to this conclusion as you began to watch the smp (if you never believed him at all) and who’s perspective you were watching.

“according to his actions and all known laws of logic” according to the streams and vods that very much still exist, and his actions in them, no, he wasn’t lying since the beginning. did he tell lies? yes, everyone did. was he being untruthful about his devotion to l’manburg when he took arrows for it and died for it? no. it’s pretty clear to see when you watch the vod. his actions speak louder than his words.

so no, it doesn’t make sense for him to be lying since the beginning. it doesn’t make sense that revivedbur’s ideals are a switch from how he was even right before he died, so we cannot trust his memory and his morals to remain intact! the man was alone for thirteen years, speaking of torture.

“he thought l'manberg his and no one else’s, a weapon of power for him to use however he pleases. unlike dream who destroyed himself bit by bit trying to take back what he cares about, because it was not power, but people - wilbur saw no more worth in it and destroyed it instead.”

hmm. i’ll come back to this later.

a point- not everything cc!wilbur says about his character is negative.

a lot of his commentary on his character came after his death, so it encompasses his spiral. i will again suggest that you listen to “eight” by sleeping at last. it’s true he can play a morally complex character, because he does, but he does not play an intentional antagonist the entire time, even in “secret”.

“i was just talking about how hypocritical and downright ridiculous his later accusations are, which you didn’t address.”

how are his later accusations hypocritical? wilbur calls him a tyrant in the moment, yeah. wilbur thinks that he should be able to do whatever he wants, and since it’s the dream smp, he assumes dream is the leader. dream never contradicts this, by the way. wilbur writes in the declaration of independence that “in the course of human events it becomes necessary for one to dissolve the bonds which bind us. disregarding of this truth is nothing short of tyranny.” so that’s what he considers tyranny. when he got stopped from selling drugs and tommy got arrested, he didn’t yell “tyranny”.

mistreatment of citizens by authority and denial of independence is tyranny.

dream and the people of the greater smp hurt and attack the people of l’manburg throughout the wall stream. importantly, since they denied l’manburg independence, the people they were firing and attacking were their own citizens in their eyes. mistreatment of citizens is cruel. upon hearing that l’manburg existed, they became even more tyrannical. thus when wilbur writes this in the book, as they are being fired on, he believes this to be true because it is.

“despite there being no evidence” watch the wall vod. think about the definition of tyranny, and even the different definitions of tyranny.

“a capitalistic empire on dream’s land” so wilbur did have reason for thinking dream was the leader, yes? because it was his land? his “house”? how dream said they were taking back the land that was rightfully theirs? how he called them “traitors to the kingdom”? ignoring the fact that once again, wilbur did not say anything negative towards dream until dream showed up and insulted l’manburg.

wilbur’s form of lying and deception for the drug empire was the norm for the server at the time. we don’t see him pulling this sort of exaggerated bit once he gets into l’manburg, because he’s idealistic and he really believes in it. if you watch tommy’s stream where wilbur first proposes the country, he jokingly says the reason he’s making it is because “americans ruin bits”. also during that stream, tommy asks if they’re making a drug empire, and wilbur says that no, they’re making a nation where drugs are legal.

“didn’t even do that much” hmm. no, i’m pretty sure dream and the people of the greater smp did do the stuff wilbur accused them of. one, he wasn’t directly accusing dream, (because. his problem wasn’t with dream specifically.) and two, the things he said in the declaration did happen?

“they have robbed us.”

to be fair everyone on the server did that lol

“imprisoned us.”

tommy was imprisoned for the drugs and for other things he was involved in, and tubbo was trapped and murdered for a thing he didn’t even know he had.

“threatened us.”

they were fired on multiple times when building l’manburg, they were threatened with consequences for the drug stuff, they told them in pretty clear terms that they were prepared to kill them instead of letting them be independent. the day of the war, dream and sapnap burned down all the trees around l’manburg and lavacast walls around it, saying it was a “warning”.

“killed many of our men.”

again, true. tommy and tubbo in particular died a lot during this time.

so since these things really did happen, how is wilbur lying about them?

“the people he was accusing of being tyrannical were very selective”

one, he accused sapnap of being an american, and it was the americans that were going for them. you don’t need to protect people that aren’t being hurt. most of his reasoning for “no americans” during this time was that anti-mask protests were happening in america, and he was making fun of them. two, the others imprisoned tommy, which does not count as “self defense in an anarchist society”. they accepted tubbo because he was european, and because he was willing to work for the nation like the rest of them. sapnap just wanted a drug dealer.

“dream’s “no factions” thing he had going on also included no government by default, showcased by him having problems with people starting countries.”

if there was no government, why did dream never point this out when wilbur said he was seceding? the server is dream’s faction! he doesn’t want “no factions”, he wants only his faction. dream refers to the server multiple times as a nation, and even a kingdom. anarchist societies don’t have prisons. the prison and the police is a system. if you have an anarchist society, but two specific people are going around arresting people, them going “oh but there’s no government” doesn’t take away the fact that they’re creating a hierarchy, using their own power? they also never claimed that there was no government.

everything that dream said later in the conversation with skeppy also lines up with this. ignoring the fact that there was a monarchy established because it “didn’t have any real power” is disregarding the fact that one, it was there, and two, that there was someone around with enough power to establish it in the first place. i don’t know how to say this any clearer. anarchist places do not have kings.

and anarchy is not the only thing that fits. it wasn’t designed to be a geopolitical drama, they just made the mistake of letting wilbur soot onto the server. so they didn’t need to have a name for the system, because the system was “do whatever you want”, including establishing authority.

“dream had all the reasons to believe they were aggressive and was fully justified in declaring war.”

dream didn’t declare war because alyssa was attacked. he had done stuff to them before that happened, and they got back all of her stuff (again, not by asking and trying to work it out, but by kidnapping someone who genuinely believed they were innocent and killing them as they begged for help.) dream started the official conflict because he declared war. he also started the unofficial conflict. he didn’t think they were aggressive, he thought they were weak.

“if he (wilbur) thought he was being mistreated he could just stop trying to mistreat others”

what, because he had any sort of power? he did stop mistreating others. l’manburg legitimately did nothing to intentionally hurt anyone, and tommy killing alyssa doesn’t count because that was his decision and revenge was already paid out for that. so wilbur stopped scamming people, built the walls to contain his country (he said that they needed nothing outside the walls at some point) and then was attacked multiple times. his mistreatment didn’t stop.

“it was supposed to be his l'manberg.”

wilbur didn’t destroy it because it was supposed to be his and it got away from him, that’s why he held the election: to try and restore peace through attempting to rig the election. he destroyed it because “the thing i built this nation for doesn’t exist anymore”, meaning the freedom it originally granted to its citizens was gone under schlatt. meaning the policy of no violence and using words was ruined. if the thing he built this nation for was power, this would make no sense. he could have taken power so easily. he passed off the presidency.

“something worth having power over” is something important. it is something that can be good for lots of people, and the power over it is what makes it safe. it’s worth having power over because when others, like schlatt, take that power, it is no longer safe.

violence and tyranny had become so much a part of l’manburg that wilbur felt the freedom and peace was gone. so when he blows it up, and says “my l’manburg”, he means it can no longer be used for evil. “my unfinished symphony, forever unfinished”. he saves it for himself by destroying it. so yes, he is being selfish, but not to ruin it for other people. he takes it into his own hands to weed out the fighting, and by doing so takes himself with it. his vision was never complete, because the wars had taught him that the only true freedom, the only true victory (“i won.”) for him was in death. (and then that turned out to be wrong.)

there’s a reddit post that cc!wilbur approved

that explains this a little better than i can, and cc!wilbur commented on it “any truers???” so i think it can be counted as reliable.

this full quote from cc!wilbur about his character (from his hey and stuff podcast) is very interesting. i’ll transcribe it here:

“i decided i was going to make a breaking bad style roleplay, where me and tommy would be drug dealers. and uh, one thing lead to another and i’m the president of a nation losing it due to my own insolence and uh, short sighted naivety. basically disregard for my fellow citizens who i claim to love so much. and a, and a dark, twisted understanding of what is possession. and what is, what is my right.”

i like this quote a lot because it highlights the initial traits that caused his spiral. it also places him as kind of similar to dream. the reason he lost the presidency is that he got too cocky. and the reason his spiral was so selfish is that it was all he could see— when his earlier vision of freedom was shattered by the first war, he didn’t know how to adapt and so became attached to power as it now felt like the only way to keep what mattered to him.

this is emphasized in his conversation with quackity during his second lore stream: that there was a drastic change between the person who made l’manburg and the person running for president. this quote matches up very well with the election arc. wilbur’s motives were different before the election, and they were different after.

once he had the freedom that he wanted, he became scared of losing it and that is what pushed him down. “if i can’t have it, no one can” is on the surface about the power, but the lament for what he once had (freedom in a country without tyranny) is there. that’s why he became so power-oriented. if he did not have control of l’manburg, it could be used to go against his original vision and it would be better off gone.

another good piece of information is cc!wilbur’s comment on his dnd alignment post, where he says this:

“wilbur is on the border of chaotic and neutral evil. wilbur, in his chaotic sense, is a crazy man who wants to blow up his old nation and kill his friends. but, more realistically, in his neutral sense, wilbur is the archetype of a man who had great power and who lost it all due to his own poor choices and negligence who sees destruction as his ratification.”

note the “realistically”.

he feels as if he owes it to l’manburg at the end to blow it up, and he didn’t mind taking himself with it as he thought that nobody cared about him anymore and he didn’t have any more to give.

(related to this, in the dnd alignment post, cc!wilbur places season 1 dream as chaotic evil and says his only motive is chaos. firstly, this would only apply to season one, and although cc!wilbur was working with cc!dream and everyone else to write the plot here, i wonder why he says this instead of saying anything else about dream’s motives. this seems to disagree pretty severely with what you think, but it also disagrees with what even i think about dream during this time.)

revivedbur comes back and has plans because he regrets his past. he hates that he gave up that easily. and he could absolutely lie about his past actions! there is no reason to ignore the contents of an entire war because someone who was alone for thirteen years says it!

“shouldn’t have it” doesn’t mean he was lying when he said he wanted it. he was just wrong, which he knew when he blew up l’manburg and that’s part of why he did it.

“they said they “fought with words”, like that doesn’t sound like a peaceful solution, more like a different approach, and it was because that is what they did”

they said the words thing a lot of times, and most of the time it was used as a “tommy don’t attack that person.” and “fighting with words” is arguing, it is replacing the trauma of real battle with talking it out. l’manburg did stick very closely to their motto of words over violence. look at the contents of the first war.

and once war was declared, wilbur was enthusiastic for it. sounds suspicious from someone claiming to not want war, right? he said it was a chance for them to prove themselves, to prove they could rule themselves. he also said that if they could defend themselves it would be proof. he never went “time to attack them”, and when he said he didn’t want a war in the past he meant that he didn’t want to start one. his being enthusiastic about the war ties into his naivety about running a country. it was also an acceptance in a way, no? it meant that the greater smp saw them as something worth declaring war on.

and it’s heartbreaking seeing him so excited to prove himself, because we know that the experience of the war is what lead to his spiral and his cynicism as president. we know that a few weeks later, he’s going to be crying into his pillow every night.

for the clip (the “something worth having power over and then you get killed by your dad” clip), i kind of don’t know what to say. i don’t think this is a clear condemnation of the entirety of l’manburg’s beginnings, but i do think that i was probably reaching a bit with trying to interpret it. there are definitely a lot of ways to see that, though.

no, he showed it in the first war and he clearly said it. i don’t think somebody who wants to mess with dream is going to not even think about him until he shows up, and even after then largely ignore him until he declares war.

“yes, it was worth something to wilbur, and that worth was power.”

question: power over what? power for what purpose? how did he use that power?

if it was only worth having power over, then why did he give it up? why didn’t he just kill schlatt in the first place? again i think the reddit post addresses a lot of this. original l’manburg was worth more to wilbur than power because he was willing to surrender when his life and his friend’s lives were threatened, and he told tommy it was not worth it to enter a duel and sacrifice his own life for it. after the war, he cared about power over it in order to keep peace, and then he realized that his own desire for power caused him to abandon his morals and he attempted to destroy it all.

“the greater smp did represent anarchy and peace.”

i just don’t think the ideals of the early smp line up with anarchy, and especially not dream’s actions later. he believes in forced peace, and unity under his terms although that belief is more gradual.

“see you tell me you didn’t fall for propaganda and then say this.”

it’s not “falling for propaganda” to watch the streams and interpret them. “propaganda” is defined as an attempt to spread information, often of a misleading nature. it’s what wilbur used during his presidential campaign, it’s what everyone used during the election. i do not base my opinion of his character off things that have been said about him after the fact. i watched the content when it happened.

so what about the facts that one, he wanted peace at the start, and two, that he cared about protecting his nation and the people he cared about is propaganda? it is information that i believe to be true based on my own analyzing of his actions during that time.

wilbur never says this as an attempt to lie to anyone. he wanted peace if it meant he could have freedom, but he would not attack anyone for freedom, he would defend it once he had established it. he wasn’t trying to establish an empire after the drug van stream (he says this in the vod where he discusses his plans for l’manburg with tommy) and the actions of the greater smp were tyrannical. what happened is that later, after the first war, he lost faith in peace because people continued to attack him!

“he did create division for his own benefit the way i see it.”

can you explain the “benefit” that division would give him? because like i said, his goal was his own personal freedom. he wasn’t attempting to divide people, he was reacting to mistreatment, whether perceived or real. and more often than not, people asked to join him, he didn’t try to convince them.

“yeah wilbur said it genuinely to tubbo when he first brought him armor”

as i was going through the old vods, i did find the origin of that quote (the quote where wilbur says “we go in with no armor and then stab them in the back” or something along those lines)! there’s something funny about it though. notice how he says it and then never does anything about it? and how nobody from l’manburg acts on it? because you have to look at his actions, something you emphasized that i agree with. they have more weight than his words. he also said “wanna kiss” to dream, so i don’t think this really counts as “proof” of an ulterior motive, because he said a lot of things.

“you see a pattern already?”

the “pattern” i see of his reactions to conflict in his nation is that he didn’t want to assert control in order to oppress people, he wanted to assert control to keep the peace, by rigging the election so that he had “legitimate” authority. was it a hypocritical? yeah! it reminds me of what dream was doing, too: placing his goal of peace over his wish for freedom of everyone.

the difference is that dream didn’t have any reserves about “starting an army and asserting dominance over his own people because they didn’t respect his authority and he was irritated by it”. weird that that can be used to describe dream as well, huh? and before it can be used to describe wilbur?

this is also after the first war, where wilbur learned a very important lesson! and it’s right before he realizes he’d become what he had tried to destroy. the other person who acts like this never realized this, though. it’s because he was never trying to destroy it. just saying.

“the friendships inside of it could’ve existed without, and would’ve probably been better off without being stained by war”

wilbur did not consider making l’manburg as a severing of relationships between the two nations. he even expresses neutrality towards some members of the greater smp. wilbur didn’t “make people think” they needed l’manburg, he saw it as a thing to devote yourself to, an ideology. he did not force others to think this way, although he encouraged it. people ended up sacrificing a lot for that (against their will sometimes), and so they became attached to it.

“the original dream smp was this but actually true instead of just being a front.”

ah yes, the dream smp with absolutely no hierarchies. nothing like mister “my house” at all. no “my land”, no “my server”, no “the king has no power”, no “it’s the dream smp”. /s

“wilbur didn’t fear for anyone’s safety”

hmm, no, wilbur did fear for everyone’s safety. you know, when they were being attacked continuously throughout the war? and when he finally surrendered because they were being threatened and killed?

“the dream smp was already safe”

dream and sapnap need better ways to “keep the server safe” than by blowing up people who wanted to go off and do their own thing and posed no threat to the greater server.

i don’t know how to provide “evidence” that dream and the others attacked l’manburg? the evidence is the fact that they did. again, wilbur’s initial goal was not conflict with the greater smp, it was emancipation. when tubbo was taken hostage and killed, shot at, robbed multiple times of materials it had taken him hours to get, and had his old house burned down simply because he was part of l’manburg, those were the reasons that tubbo ever fired a shot at them in the first place!

when wilbur lead his people out on the first day of the war, it was to negotiate. they dodged the arrows and went to the embassy, where they were then trapped and driven back into tommy’s house. it was then that they fought back. self defense. i don’t know what else to tell you.

“trying to end the war as soon as he could” is kind of misleading, because it implies that dream hated the violence. he just wanted to win as soon as he could. he didn’t care what he had to do to win it. no mercy.

the dream smp was not freedom because when you try to leave freedom, it doesn’t hunt you down and try to destroy you. anarchy doesn’t call you a traitor when you leave. and yeah, dream was real friendly to tommy when he continued the disk war when it first settled. and of course when your friends join a different nation, the most logical course of action is to murder them repeatedly! /s

the definition of anarchy includes personal freedom, the exact thing wilbur wanted. anarchy does not include authority, it is firmly opposed to it. i think i would place the early greater smp as more of a stateless society, if i had to put a name on it (again, i am extremely wary to do that because it wasn’t written as anything with a name. this is also a mediocre take that i don’t really believe because dream had his own faction.). a stateless society is one of the goals of anarchism, but does not encompass the entire belief.

dream’s main motivation was that he didn’t want anyone being independent. it didn’t matter who was leading it.

and i’m sorry, but you can’t just take away evidence by saying “he was lying” when there is no proof he is? if you take this conversation at face value it makes more sense! (this is about the conversation between wilbur and dream right before the “independence or death” scene)

“both sides had their losses and were ready to harm the other” what did the greater smp lose. its people? its land? there was other land, and the people could still remain friends. some of them did. dream even says before this that yeah, l’manburg is losing. and wilbur here is attempting to downplay that loss, claiming they’re on even ground because that’s what he wants to happen. he is trying to appear stronger than he really is. he’s bluffing, but it doesn’t work.

i don’t like saying “nobody’s the victim” here when one side was getting absolutely whaled on by the other. wilbur has the ability to be genuine, and he does. if he was trying to “play” the victim, he would exaggerate the damage his side had suffered. his words and his actions match up, and this is a pretty different circumstance from him doing a bit. he is a victim. that’s just straight up true.

i’m not surprised that you think this way, as you’ve said you were on dream’s side since the start, but i’d like to once again ask you to examine where you got these perceptions.

dream offering them “chances” was just offering them surrender. that’s not merciful, and it’s not fair, either. and he may not have wanted to hurt them, but he sure didn’t mind doing it. wilbur wasn’t sewing some kind of anti-dream propaganda in his nation while the battle was going on, the hatred for dream came from the fact that he was attacking all of them.

“colonize” is a bad word choice for what l’manburg was. nobody was living on that land before they got there. the land should have belonged to nobody, so why did dream get so mad about “his” land being taken? what about that specific area was so important to him, when he did have the ability to visit?

wilbur was pacifist, he was not the instigator, again i have to say i can’t offer up proof if you’re convinced that he was lying. when he fought back later it was in self defense. please watch the vods. and recognize that wilbur’s actions election era are consequences of his experiences revolution era.

i genuinely don’t understand what you mean by comparing this to exile. please rephrase your point. if you’re comparing what dream did to tommy to wilbur trying to stop dream from hurting him and his people more i have to say that’s a... questionable take. it’s probably a bad idea to make exile comparisons if you’re going to use them to victim-blame, as that’s very antithetical to exile as a whole and kid of ironic.

“i mean, what other choice was there?”

no, dream had a lot of choices. he did not offer them a peaceful way out. he declared war and then he attacked. it was then that he told them many times to surrender. and no, wilbur didn’t push them to go and die, evidenced again by the times he used himself as a distraction so that they could run, and that he didn’t want tommy to do the duel but ultimately respected his decision and his freedom.

“dream constantly asked them to give up instead of fighting.”

dream has a responsibility to not attack kids. dream also has a responsibility to attempt any sort of peaceful negotiation. tubbo was boxed and murdered before war was declared, and tubbo personally had done straight up nothing to the people of the greater smp, and he didn’t even know why he died until tommy saw that alyssa’s pickaxe was mixed in with his stuff.

if wilbur claimed to wish to prevent violence, and then he did, or at least attempted to, i don’t know why you think it’s untrue. calling someone a rude name is not equal to murder. “verbally violent” means pretty much nothing and was coming from both sides.

(this next part is about the “let me be your vassal” scene in pogtopia)

“there’s a theory wilbur legitimately thinks dream selfish”

i mean, yeah. i think that kind of sums it up. wilbur was appealing to dream’s personal goals. i don’t see how he was shut down though. he already helped pogtopia, so him being asked to further help someone from pogtopia shows that they trusted him enough to tell him the plan.

i’ve watched the clip a lot of times and i think that the meaning can be ambiguous. i am using dream’s other actions during that time to determine how much of an effect i think it had on him. i don’t think he got “shut down” in any sort of meaningful way here.

“he didn’t seem to hold even that against him as he tried to help get back l’manberg with him.”

if dream didn’t hold the disk thing against tommy then, he sure decided to get mad about it later (he brings it up when arguing with quackity), despite the fact that he had also re-opened the conflict in the past.

“i believe they (dream and tommy) had genuinely been friends once.”

sure, i think they were friends before dream did what he did with the disks, and allies during early pogtopia. dream still decided to switch sides and team with manburg because schlatt offered him the book. this is, ironically, dream abandoning tommy.

“he has a sense of responsibility (not control) over the people on his smp.”

i think it can be responsibility and control. most of the responsibility is misguided, and lots of it is just actual control. i don’t know where you’re getting a lot of this.

and i do not know where you got that his fatal flaw was caring too much? he “cares” in the way of having control! he doesn’t care about the well being of others as long as he thinks he’s right. i’m just saying that he sure could have walked away, because he did just that later when he sided with schlatt. it’s not a speculation about his character when it’s something that he did.

him walking away did not entail complete surrender to wilbur. there were a lot of other things he could have done, but i don’t want to get into “could have”’s as i don’t really think there’s a point. wilbur was attempting to convince him, yeah, but that didn’t mean it was true. we know that wilbur was lying about wanting ambition.

also, i don’t think dream was allied with pogtopia because he liked them or he was trying to be better or anything. he said in “tyrant” that it’s because schlatt was worse, and wilbur didn’t have any ambition to expand.

“maybe you misunderstood something i said, but no, he definitely didn’t.”

okay, so since dream didn’t think wilbur was a villain, wilbur was not “pressuring him” into becoming one by helping him. my point was that dream didn’t think that, and wilbur didn’t care. sorry for not making that clear, i was asking a rhetorical question.

(i said here that “someone calling someone else out for hurting them is not the same thing as villanizing them,” and they responded with this)

“yeah, they are. and dream was villanized.”

oh boy.

vilify: to utter slanderous and abusive statements against, to defame.

(i probably should have been saying vilify instead of villainize because they mean the same thing but i straight up did not know it was a word, sorry lol)

slanderous means false and malicious. abusive means offensive and insulting. defamation is things that are not true.

if somebody says, “this guy punched me.” that would not be vilifying them. it is a true statement with a neutral tone. if they add “he is a bad person”, that could possibly be seen as abusive, as it is insulting, but the point of vilifying someone is that you are making them out to be someone they’re not. it involves the use of lies and continuous exaggerated language. slanderous and abusive. abusive only is not enough to classify something as vilifying.

someone reacting to something dream did by calling him a name is not vilifying him. it is true that he did the thing, and it is also true that the person saying it believes it. it is rare that someone criticizes him without real reason or goes overboard (the person who really does this as far as i can remember is tommy), and when tommy does so it is almost always reciprocated. so we have dream and tommy constantly vilifying each other, and other people saying negative things about dream and sometimes vilifying him, if they lie about it. he sometimes vilifies them.

my point is that vilification is not wilbur telling niki, “dream burnt tubbo’s house down”, despite the fact that he calls dream a bad guy. it’s not slanderous because it is true. dream assisted sapnap with the act. vilification is not tommy explaining to ranboo what was happening during exile, or telling dream that dream makes him worse. “someone calling someone out for hurting them” implies truth, and it doesn’t necessarily imply abusive language, but it doesn’t matter because it’s true.

maybe we were going off different definitions of vilify. but when we’re accusing characters who are victims of abuse and manipulation, we need to be careful with what we accuse them of.

anyway

wilbur saying he wanted to use the tommys of the world was left in the drug van stream. tommy himself was pushing a lot of the “dream bad” stuff because he had more experience with him. when tommy was confused during those two scenes (vassal scene and revivedbur calling dream his hero)it was because he believed that wilbur respected him, and wilbur working with or idolizing someone who had hurt tommy in the past was a contradiction to that belief. wilbur does not question tommy’s anger during the vassal scene because he doesn’t care that dream is bad, and when he is revived he either does not believe it or does not want to acknowledge it. revivedbur cares a whole lot more about power for the sake of power than wilbur ever did.

again, tommy isn’t stupid. he has his own reasons for not liking dream, and the disconnect comes from a place of trusting wilbur.

by the way, wilbur left the vc before saying that tommy didn’t care. he was talking to himself (and chat). and he was more fearful that tommy was leaving than angry. plus, he didn’t actually force tommy to give up his house: there was miscommunication between them and the embassy was the power tower in the end. wilbur just wanted confirmation that tommy would spend time in l’manburg. it’s true that he went about it in a bad way, though.

he didn’t push patriotism onto them, they were also excited about the country. there were other scenes beside the tyrant scene, and the amount of times wilbur had to tell tommy to shut up about how great the country is is a lot higher than the one time he had them call dream a tyrant.

true, that scene (scene where wilbur asserts his authority as president) is before pogtopia. it’s also after the war for independence. i am not saying that wilbur should have said any of that stuff. i’m just pointing out that it wasn’t always like that.

also i do not really see “you’re never gonna be president” as a taunt or manipulation or anything. i think wilbur genuinely believed that having tommy in charge of the country would one, get them into more conflicts, and two, mess up tommy mentally. being the president sucked and wilbur knew that. wilbur was not kind to tommy. but a lot of stuff that’s pointed at as manipulative is pretty clearly wilbur’s own paranoia spilling over in a desire to protect tommy, ie saying that tubbo would betray them. wilbur genuinely thought that and he was trying to warn tommy.

“tommy, when i said you’d never be president, it wasn’t a challenge. it’s true. you’re never going to be president.”

tommy’s life has been hard, that’s true. not disagreeing with you there. but not every adult has been using him the whole time. and if you’re looking for fault, i would personally look at the guy who killed him three times first, just saying. other things had impacts but there’s a clear scale.

“tommy formed an attachment to them as a result of the disc war, not the other way around.”

so yeah, initially it was a shallow trade: the disks for the armor. once that conflict was resolved, and tommy apologized, that should have been the end of it, yeah? especially since tommy now had a stronger connection to the disks? that would have been nice.

the problem is that dream took them back for no reason. because he did, he went back and dug up tommy’s whole front yard and spawned months of conflict after. having “leverage” over someone like that is kinda messed up! it’s not like tommy was going around committing mass murder every tuesday, he got in scraps with other people on the server who also committed petty crimes. so i can’t really blame tommy for wanting them back, even though he stole them.

and if dream didn’t care about the disks, why did he later use it as “proof” that tommy caused all the trouble on the server? if they were so worthless to him that he gave them to skeppy, why did it matter that tommy stole them?

i don’t know what you mean about this being the only way dream could control people. the amount of genuine fear other characters felt when he logged on was there for a long time. he held a lot of power on the server, and a lot of his control was physical, evidenced by exile in particular but also the wars.

when he did ultimately use connections to control people, that was still a bad thing.

“his friend’s house got burnt down and he wanted the person who did it to be held accountable?”

okay, george’s house got burned down. do you remember the initial punishment that dream proposed? probation for tommy until he was eighteen. and when dream was arguing with his friends, he pointed out that the only reason l’manburg was being held hostage for tommy’s crime was that tommy was involved in the government. he said that if tommy hadn’t been involved in the government, he probably would have just hunted him down and killed him.

also, someone responding to this pointed out that dream was trying to frame tommy for things at the time. dream was intentionally creating other conflict in order to get to tommy. dream did not care about the house. he burnt down other people’s houses.

that’s not “holding someone accountable”. that’s not even close.

“he was taught this from experience”

the leather from the horse was used to blackmail him after he had already started doing that to people. you know how tommy mimicks him? that’s what was going on (still bad that he did it but like. come on.) so that may have been the push that caused dream to cut his own connections (so that nobody could ever do that to him again, and he would have no chance of failure), but it didn’t just happen to him for no reason: it was a behavior he taught someone else.

“he did genuinely think he was a villain before the war”

tommy called dream a lot of stuff before the war, and most of it was unprompted by wilbur. a lot of it was also, like you said, two friends joking around. just because wilbur taught him a new word (he didn’t really tell him what it meant though) doesn’t mean he was manipulated into using it all the time or something. and i’m pretty sure tommy got a decent definition of tyranny later, when the greater smp decided to attack l’manburg before anything went down.

“it’s just a character acknowledging what people who looked deeper into the narrative already knew.”

what i’m saying is that narratively, wilbur has an extremely good reason to be biased right now. taking anything he says as truth doesn’t solidify an interpretation as truth. there has to be enough evidence to actually back the entire thing up in the first place, and i’m just not seeing “wilbur was always going for power and division” as solidified by his actions during the first war.

and again, tommy’s not stupid, and the entire time tommy is yelling at him! tommy knows something is off! if people also in the story are saying “this isn’t right”, i feel like they’d know? tommy was also part of l’manburg, he has an opinion too. so when he says “we founded l’manburg because we knew dream was the bad guy”, he’s talking about why he did it. and he brings up a good point: “you say you did it to stick it to the man, but you’re idolizing dream, who is the man”. (paraphrased i don’t know his exact words but this was his point) this shows that wilbur’s motives have changed, even from what revivedbur will say.

(they linked three twitter threads here. i don’t know if relinking them here is a good idea as the whole point of this separate post is to disconnect the two sides, but the threads were by dr3amofagame on twitter, for reference purposes. i’m not going to link the independent threads but i think people can tell which ones i was responding to.

if this is wrong to say who made them please let me know, i do not know how Any of these websites work. if you’ve read this far, please don’t try to like,,, look up who any of these people are (especially the person i was debating with. don’t do that /srs) and send anything bad to them. that’s the whole point of this separate post. if anyone sends negativity directly towards people because of this post i’ll bite you)

that first analysis has some Opinions. oh man.

i don’t know man i’m just going to point some things out:

-the person who wrote the thread pulling the “child” card makes me laugh because tommy had committed more crimes than wilbur at that point. ah yes tommy innit innocent child being horribly dragged into a giant war by evil wilbur /s

-wilbur did not call dream a tyrant before dream showed up and made fun of their land

-wilbur did not legitimately think dream a tyrant when he told tommy and tubbo to call him that. neither, really, did tommy and tubbo. it was a joke. like infinite women. like dream saying “i’m evil” when he was blowing up creepers on their land before the battle. like dream and sapnap being all “down with the british”.

-their attitude on that changed when the greater smp begin exhibiting tyrannical behavior (before war was declared!).

-“having tommy and tubbo fight his battles and build his walls” is just untrue

-the l’manburg anthem was, one, not written by wilbur (he commissioned someone to do it on fiver), and two, was written after the first war. they sing it in the stream where niki joins. so yeah, at that point, they did emancipate from the brutality and tyranny of their rulers! it doesn’t say who the rulers are (therefore it’s. not blaming solely dream.) but pretty much all of them were brutal!

-also oh my god this thread has a lot of things that wilbur just straight up didn’t say (or do).

-“would rather die than submit to your tyrannical rule” is a quote from the speech wilbur gives before dream lights the tnt. dream had done stuff to them at that point. this is out of context.

-i don’t want to seriously critique this thread because a lot of it seems more like something emotional than an attempt to start conversation, and i can’t really go against that.

-the main argument, that dream did nothing before being irreversibly forced into the role of the villain does not really match up with what happened.

-there’s a lot less of people calling dream a villain than people seem to remember.

-and also, dream was lying about wanting l’manburg to be something. he says to eret a few days later the quote that i included a while back, that his goal has always been for there to be one faction: the dream smp. note that at this point he’s officially on manburg’s “side” now. he also says he has never wavered on this from the beginning. so he’s either continuing his manipulation of eret and lying to them, or he’s just saying that he wants l’manburg to be something to wilbur and tommy to try to get them to trust him. and hearing him yell “YES!” after the explosion? i’m inclined to think it’s the latter.

okay, so then looking at the second analysis:

-once again, calling wilbur a colonizer? there is a definition of that word that matches up with his actions, but that definition is something establishing itself in a place. by that definition, everyone on the server is a colonizer. so calling just wilbur that seems... a bit weird, considering that the common definition does not match up with what he did.

-“got his (wilbur’s) entire side killed” ignores the fact that it was Dream And His Friends Who Killed Them hghfnjgnfm

dream: wow wilbur you’re bad at this war thing

wilbur: please stop killing us

dream: how could you do this to your people

wilbur: you??? declared war???

dream: no you don’t understand. i had a really good reas—

sorry sorry i’m just. yeah

-also this thread reminded me that “tyrant” (the book) exists and yeah, i do see your point that dream did care about tommy (a little bit). i just wonder why he turned against him again? and why dream is willing to admit here that l’manburg was peaceful, and also that wilbur was not like schlatt in some key ways?

-and again i don’t see wilbur calling dream a villain during the vassal scene.

-some of this thread is just speculation. i’m not going to consider “wilbur may manipulate dream in the future because they had a conversation in the past”, especially because revivedbur’s mental state right now is godawful, because i don’t think it holds any value to examining the past. the important part is the breakdown of the vassal scene.

-i’ve already said what i think about the vassal scene. dream wasn’t getting tossed around during that. just because he’s quiet doesn’t mean he’s being manipulated? and wilbur isn’t going “you think this”, he’s asking dream what he thinks by paraphrasing what wilbur’s heard from him before, and adjusts it once dream corrects him. i do think this one is more open to interpretation though; this is just my opinion and it doesn’t have a lot of stuff to back it up lol but i’m not convinced either side has much evidence

and the third analysis:

-dream had no idea what kind of government they were setting up there. he didn’t ask, so he wouldn’t know if it was a dictatorship. and again he was allowed on the land, he just never built the embassy. the “no americans” rule was weakly enforced during the first war, and the reason wilbur got so serious about it later is that the americans were the ones who went after him and killed everyone during the war! so he had a reason to want them off. objectively a bad reason? maybe

-it would be cool if dream said “hey don’t do this here’s why” instead of stomping off during negotiations and then coming back to beat them up and declare war. he didn’t though

-the problem people have with greater smp vs. l’manburg is scale. the greater smp was quite literally infinite, and l’manburg was a small space. there wasn’t anything important in l’manburg that other server members needed to get to. people could still leave to visit their friends. they didn’t legitimately hate americans. but nooo, you can’t have the table because it’s my table. what if you do something bad with the table? remember when you tried to sell people “better air” for three dollars and then took someone’s air conditioning? you just want power! i’m going to go bring back rubber bands to pelt you with.

anywAys moving on

no, i do agree with you on the sam stuff. for some reason i was under the impression that cc!sam was uncomfortable with being depicted as torturing dream a while back, but with the stuff happening with quackity now, i’m reasonably sure that doesn’t apply. they don’t retcon stuff that was intentional but there may have been something taken back a few months ago before they planned this.

but yeah, clearly the prison stuff is awful and messed up. that’s why i noted the thing at the start of the reply: i am in no way saying that anything sam or quackity have done to dream since prison hasn’t affected him. these are things that i see as having visible impacts on the character.

(i pointed out that dream originally commissioned the prison)

i understand that it’s frustrating to hear that used as an excuse, but i wasn’t using it that way. i was pointing out that neither of them deserve it. during the vault stream, dream tells tommy that his plan is to put him in the prison. he says that exile was “perfect”, and the only issue was that tommy could get away. putting him in the prison fixes that.

so yeah, what dream was planning to do to tommy is different than what’s happening to him. but the reasons that other people wanted dream in the prison match why he wanted tommy in there: like you said, it’s a vault. it’s so he can store him and use him later, to give attachments and thus power and control over others.

tommy’s original plan was to kill dream. ultimately, he didn’t want him to suffer more, he wanted him gone. nobody on the server knew yet that death was limbo, and tommy probably thought it was mercy for someone like dream. dream was the one who brought up the book, as an attempt to save himself. he will say whatever he needs to say to avoid death, because anyone would (except someone like wilbur who’s. accepted his role. you know?) so he’s the one who reduced himself down the the book, saying if he goes, so does it. that’s when sam suggests the prison.

true, the arc is dark. this is where sam’s actions become corrupted and he loses sight of some of the responsibility he claims to have. it’s also the arc where dream lied to tommy that he had changed, and pressured him into staying by saying he was his friend. it’s the arc where dream kills tommy, and doesn’t allow sam to come get his body for days. it’s the arc where dream gets even worse, whether because of his time in the prison or because of his peaked god complex, probably both.

and again, my problem is that criticizing characters for actions they didn’t take is pointless. it tells you not much about the character, and considering the circumstances of what dream had done it does make sense for none of them to step in! they are looking at the fact that dream had an entire vault dedicated to controlling them. they are seeing that dream was fully prepared to murder tubbo and lock tommy away forever to be used. they are witnessing tommy giving dream exactly what he got.

so “acknowledging” this does nothing useful! we do not see these actions (or lack of) specifically affecting dream. i can tell you what dream told people he was doing, and it matches up with things he had done in the past, and there are moments he denies the narrative that you say drove him to do this. but i can’t really prove anything when you say he’s lying here because it fits how you interpret the story.

it’s what you’re saying people are doing to revivedbur: saying he’s lying without any proof, when with him there is evidence and he has the motive to lie. when revivedbur lies, tommy calls him on it. tommy doesn’t call dream on it. i’ve laid out why i think it’s not true, and i’ve seen stuff in early canon that directly contradicts what revivedbur says. occam’s razor! many pieces of evidence versus a few statements from someone who at that point commonly lied about things like that.

dream standing by while tommy and the other citizens get killed in l’manburg by his own orders isn’t very peaceful or non-tyrannical of him. tommy was enforcing an eye for an eye, and to be honest? i don’t think “kill your abuser” is such a terrible message to send, despite the fact that we know that tommy’s coping mechanisms come from a bad source. and tommy was far from free of what dream did to him, as evidenced by later when he again attempts to mirror what dream had done to him in the past.

yeah, i read your analysis of the interaction (skeppy and dream arguing over l’manburg). that’s not the only interpretation. skeppy doesn’t call him the villain. he is repeating back to dream the actions that dream took, and dream tells him he’s making him sound bad. skeppy wasn’t influenced by any “propaganda” you think l’manburg was putting out while they were getting murdered. skeppy was an outsider who was calling it as he saw it.

and if other people saw what dream was doing as bad, maybe he was... doing bad things? for bad reasons? skeppy was critical of dream for his actions. talking over somebody does not certify it as “twisting words”. skeppy was accusing him of doing the actions, like “so you did this? you started the war?”. dream was defending the logic behind his actions, like “well i did it because.”

basically

skeppy: hey it’s kind of. messed up that you killed a bunch of people. you know? you kind of just attacked them out of nowhere

dream: no no no you don’t understand. i had a really good reason

skeppy: i don’t see a reason?

dream: you’re making it seem like i didn’t have to do this

skeppy: you d i d n ‘ t

and skeppy didn’t finish the conversation with “you’re lying” or “you don’t know what you’re talking about”, he just told him he was wrong! as in his actions were cruel and needless! “people must have hated coming to your house”.

(they asked me to name one person who dream cut off first)

okay, name one? puffy. sam. punz? he did cut them off, he straight up told tommy he did it, and making a place in the vault for fran when sam had done nothing but work with him? and they didn’t “show up ready to kill him”, they showed up to see what he was doing. so he tells tommy he abandoned them, and indirectly tells them with the spirit scene. sapnap and george noticed this, and called him on it, but he just said he didn’t mean it?

if dream “wasn’t as close” with sam/puffy/punz, why are we putting responsibility on them for his actions.

so sapnap and george walked away from him, but because he did something to them. and puffy didn’t abandon him. punz didn’t abandon him, punz got paid off because that’s what punz cares about: money. he’s a mercenary.

using “they left him first” for sapnap and george doesn’t allow for why they left him: because he wasn’t treating them fairly. he isn’t their parent, he’s their friend, and he wasn’t acting like it.

“he was hurt and abandoned to the point” “he ended up hurting people doesn’t negate the fact he was hurt himself first” “the environment they all were a part of pushed him this far, and that’s just what happened”

so you’re saying it’s right that the reason dream did bad things to people is because bad things were done to him first? because dream was definitely the one who got attacked first during l’manburg. because he just cared so much about george that he kicked someone out of society just to defend his honor. /s and then, because his real purpose was protecting george, he went back and tried to make things right with george because it wasn’t about tommy? oh wait, he didn’t. he focused on only tommy. because george’s house was an excuse.

“that’s just what happened” is a bad take on “people got abused”. the fact is that dream started a lot of the conflict. looking at the retaliation and self-defense that people did towards him and saying “he got hurt a bunch that’s why he did the later bad stuff” completely negates that he started it? and his “retribution” was always exponentially worse than the actual crime committed?

dude, i’m just trying to point out that the story says he cut people off. yeah, he was hurt at times, but that is not an explanation for what he did. it’s not even a logical cause, because we do not see it affect his character. the subtext has gotta be there. the fact that he was hurt does not make him any more justified.

“circle of violence” does apply (not all of them, though). but in this situation, it’s a kid stealing someone’s lunch money, and then the other kid breaks their nose. the first kid punches the kid, the second kid puts them in the hospital. when the retribution dream gave was always worse than whatever happened to him, the issue is not “look at the people hurting him”, it’s “stop him from hurting people”!

so clearly dream needs some kind of therapy (not from puffy though i’m not letting him near her /hj), because just killing him would be a permanent solution but it would upset people who like his character. the prison is awful and not going to work. my personal solution for him is to send him out somewhere a long way away, so that nobody he’s hurt has to see him again. maybe people that wanted to go with him could, and it would be like a new smp. but when that idea was proposed, tommy said darkly that he was always going to come back. maybe it’ll be the solution in the future. who knows.

if the mistakes were unintentional, why criticize the characters for them? and what about “the environment” besides the other people changed how dream thought? a lot of it was internal.

we have him exiling tommy as a weird, desperate plea for friends (not really) when he very much could have gone back and spoken to the people who were his friends. we have him continuously saying that tommy causes all the problems, and he needs to be “restrained” or “controlled” or whatever other excuse he came up with for taking away a person’s free will.

we have him obsessing over the disks, and we know it’s not about the disks, it’s about power over tommy and power in general. he says this in the vault. he says this at the community house scene. his progression is towards a twisted sense of possession, same as wilbur, oddly enough. but they are different in that wilbur is possessive over the idea of freedom that he created with l’manburg (and having power over that) and dream is possessive over control over all.

wilbur’s idea is ruined. he tied his sense of self to the nation and when it was used for corruption (kind of by him and mostly by others) he saw himself as corrupted and decided to take them both out so that they couldn’t hurt anyone. he admits his own fault to the point of self destruction.

dream’s idea is threatened. other people live there, other people want to do things, and so he becomes so attached to the idea that it’s his server and he will do anything to control opposition. he cannot admit his fault unless forced to.

wilbur would do anything to control a tool of power, because he wanted to not use it as that tool. wilbur wanted anarchy at the end. he says so in his last presidential speech. his naive views about freedom from the start of the server had worn off, as he saw people use power as a tool in a way that he had never intended or meant to use it.

wilbur created the election so that he would have an actual authority over the land, and he could stop the fighting of its citizens. he thought he knew better, kind of like dream did. this is when his motives get the most twisted and selfish, he wanted peace so bad that he would take away freedom for it (like dream). but when he lost, he accepted it, and that’s the difference. he saw the desire for control in his own actions, and hated himself for it. that’s why he wanted to blow up l’manburg, to take away the tool for power and the person who had been tempted to use it.

wilbur was a good leader in the political sense (dream admits this in “tyrant”) but when he stands before the rubble of l’manburg and calls it his, he’s saying that his rule would only lead to destruction. anyone’s rule would. power corrupts. l’manburg ruined is his l’manburg, it’s his original vision of complete freedom laid out before him, and tracked to its inevitable end.

so then, you would say, dream was right, yeah? he didn’t want l’manburg. but wilbur before he explodes l’manburg doesn’t like dream. he thinks dream’s right in that factions lead to oppression, no matter how good the intentions, but he also knows that dream was a little too willing to hurt them and that dream doesn’t believe this. dream does not want anarchy, he wants chaos but only if it gives him control. he treats the smp like his country, and once again, power corrupts.

went off there, sorry. dream and wilbur are similar but different in some very important ways.

sapnap had been hurt by dream before the vault, and as dream didn’t see himself as in the wrong, he didn’t reach out. sapnap was with pogtopia (wait this might be wrong i do not remember but he was definitely on l’manburg’s side during doomsday) because tommy had shown him more kindness than dream, and that was originally dream’s side. dream just turned on them for the book.

and sapnap also witnessed dream mocking tubbo, making fun of tommy, exposing ranboo. he heard dream going off about how tubbo was so stupid for thinking dream was his friend, for thinking dream cared about him. why would sapnap side with dream if dream was showing no signs of even wanting him?

sapnap accused dream of that, and dream did not listen to him. he could not see the other side: he was so convinced that he was right. we do not know if sapnap went into the vault with the intent of killing dream. i’m pretty sure most of them were there to see if what tommy had said was true. and then, sapnap saw that it was.

nobody abandoned him because of the vault because he had already abandoned them. they just made it mutual. it being a “consequence” of stuff doesn’t make it any less of a messed up, power hungry thing to do, and some of them had done nothing to him before he decided he needed to control them. he was planning to use friend to control ghostbur, who he had already taken advantage of and tried to kill once.

“people do not decide to isolate themselves for no reason.”

true, people don’t cut themselves off for no reason. the reason was power and control. i once again have to emphasize that nobody forced him into this: it was a spiral. other people didn’t do everything “first”. the small taste he got of his own medicine was a poor mimic thrown at him by someone he had done terrible things to. he started spiraling before the spirit scene happened. and if people are telling him he can’t achieve peace, maybe they’re just... right? did he go up to someone and go “i don’t know how to make this server peaceful :(“? because if he did, and if they then pointed at his long list of war crimes and told him not like this, i don’t really see that as anything more than a consequence for things he had already done.

someone can lie about what they want. maybe he did originally want peace, or maybe he was lying to himself that he did. l’manburg did not invite war. he wanted unity above peace, and that “unity” dissolved into “control”.

it was a defense so that nobody could control him the way he was going to control them. cutting himself off was out of fear, yeah. collecting everyone else’s items? power and control. he says this a ton of times, sometimes not even out loud.

i did rewatch the vault vod. that’s how i got all the quotes of him stating his motives. i’m not saying it was a healthy thing to do at all. i never said dream was mentally healthy, i said he had a god complex and he was obsessed with control. someone’s bad mental state can hurt others as well as themself, and they’re still responsible for the others and for trying to be a better and more respectful person. that’s why revivedbur’s “apologies” mean nothing right now.

“he lists his reason for starting the war as them declaring independence, so i don’t think it really matters when the official document was sent.”

it does matter a little bit, actually. they were already attacking l’manburg before official war was declared. they also attacked them during the peace period. wilbur wrote the declaration as he was standing on the roof of the caravan, being shot at by the greater smp.

a country becomes independent when it officially declares itself to be independent. they were still united; it was tyranny.

when dream saw that l’manburg was writing the declaration, he scrambled to declare war. he had reopened and started other conflicts in the past, and involved himself in places he did not need to be. it’s true that a response is a response, but you cannot treat all responses the same way. quackity’s “response” to the things dream had done (killing tommy among those) was to torture him. we do not consider that good, or fair, or “just a response”, we consider it cruel and unusual punishment.

the greater smp fulfilled the words that wilbur had not yet written in the document, and that’s because they weren’t a prophesy, they were a history.

“...would be completely honest about (dream’s motivations in the vault) in front of his biggest enemy. /s”

i don’t see evidence that dream wasn’t being honest. what did he have to lose by it? tommy could do nothing to hurt him. so yep, he would be honest about it. and he’s listed his reasons as power before. he also has the ability to tell the truth about his motives.

dream does not see tommy that way. he sees him as someone whose only positive contribution to the server is attachment. he tells tommy that evil is relative, and to dream, tommy is the evil one. in fact, he says that tommy is evil lots of times. he only says that tommy sees himself as a hero when he’s trying to convince him to let him kill his friend. dream is using tommy’s black and white perception to get him to do what dream wants. he only says tommy sees himself as the hero, not that dream sees him that way. dream does not care about who’s the good guy and who’s the bad guy, because he’s not idealistic like wilbur and he’s not a kid like tommy.

him making a joke about building the prison with a “little bit of evil” doesn’t matter because next line he says that tommy’s evil to him. dream isn’t playing the villain, cc!dream is. cc!dream is playing a character that is antagonistic towards others, and he plays into it and jokes around with it, as other people playing antagonistic roles have in the past. cc!wilbur does this a lot during the election and pogtopia. cc!techno hints at it with his “ah yes, blowing up a country, we must be the good guys”.

it may sound like a character because someone’s playing it, but it’s not dream.

this video matches up with some of my points here, but it’s also framed like an english class. it is an interesting meta argument, and one that i would say i partially agree with, but as we’re not really arguing on terms of meta it does not act as a general opposition to your argument. the intent of the authors does not dictate how you see the story, but it can help with interpretation of it.

dream’s words during the vault scene sure do line up with his actions for the months before that. so yeah, no discredit to cc!dream. he’s playing his character. and it’s not like he’s unwilling to make him sympathetic. he’s done so in the past (and is doing so now) and the fact that he does not do it during the vault, and downplays the tragic part of it (him losing his friends) sure makes it seem like the main point here isn’t “poor dream”, it’s “poor tommy”. they’re telling a story. it has a moral.

dream being reserved about his plans may be shown in the fact that nobody knew about the vault (except punz i think?) until dream was ready to put it into play. he generally is quiet about what he wants, he just cares a lot about it and will do a lot to get it. he’s not one for speeches unless he’s trying to make a point. the point here being that tommy is trapped. dream’s capable of explaining his thoughts. tommy asks him why and invites him to share, so he does.

this isn’t really a “nobody can interpret it like this”, it’s just pointing out that the events of canon are there and should be fully considered. character dream’s perspective of the story is biased, so people can look at it and be correct in how dream sees the situation, but “how dream sees it” and “how the story goes” do not necessarily line up.

conflicts dream has started besides the vault? okay.

-reopening the disk war by digging up the hidden disks

-declaring war on l’manburg the first time

-burning down other buildings in order to frame tommy

-blowing up the community house (or having it done for him)

-attacking l’manburg again with techno and phil

(didn’t start really, but inserted himself into when it wasn’t his business:)

-helped pogtopia

-gave wilbur tnt

-sided with manburg in the fight

-built walls around l’manburg

-demanded tommy be punished

-took personal responsibility for exile and used it as a way to isolate tommy

there’s also this post that describes things dream has done in general. the tone of the post is biased, but the actions were canon. some of these may be “retribution” but they sure were uncalled for.

so when he exiled tommy, that was about “unity”? big happy family except for one guy because “he causes all the problems”? it doesn’t matter whether he believed he was in the right for his motives. the vault does not make sense for peace or unity. it is a twisted, controlled unity. what i’m saying is that he uses peace as an excuse for his actions. he had to exile tommy, tommy would have just gotten worse. he had to declare war on l’manburg, it was a necessary evil. because nothing screams “peace” like declaring war and killing the other side, right?

those may be his actual motives in the early scenes, and he thinks he’s doing the right thing. this changes with the vault. he no longer uses this as an excuse, his “excuse” is that he has a right to it. his self proclaimed motive is power and control, and unity through that. so why not accept that as his motive when he says it there?

“becoming a control freak as a result of feeling the loss of control over your own circumstances isn’t equal to dehumanizing the people you’re trying to control.”

nah dude he absolutely dehumanized them and took away their agency? he describes tommy as a pet and a tool, minutes before he switches and describes himself as the book. this could also be used to make an interesting point on how he sees people as their values, in item form. so he’s using one item to control another. tubbo’s a pawn, tommy’s a tool, techno’s a weapon, he’s the book.

he calls george a baby, and makes decisions for him. by planning to using the items to control the people, he was prepared to take away their freedom and agency by emotionally manipulating them. he did this to tommy. agency is the capacity of someone to act. he takes away that ability in order to have control.

he’s not just a control freak over his own life, the problem is that he does it to others. again, we’re talking true freedom here: the ability to do anything, even things that we would consider morally wrong. he takes away george’s power, which is revealed to be nothing. he then swiftly turns and tells him that if he tries to overthrow eret, he would be a tyrant. not acknowledging that dream just overthrew a king and stated in a new one, he hypocritically calls george the tyrant for planning to do that.

(i didn’t even notice this until now, but it’s actually interesting: dream is extremely hypocritical here, unless, of course, he sees himself as having more claim to who is king. now why would he think that? a hierarchy, perhaps?)

“which is understandable seeing as you’ve said already you never tried to look deeper into him, but it’s incorrect nonetheless.”

i said that before this i had not attempted to examine his character in a sympathetic light. that’s what i’ve been doing. his wish to “fix” his home is really just a wish to control his home, which is pretty evident when you look at right before exile. the smp was peaceful then. tommy had committed petty crimes before, and george didn’t even really care about the house. it was minimal damage. dream jumped at the opportunity to convince everyone else that tommy was the real problem (speaking of propaganda and vilifying).

and “he was getting better until the sixteenth” disregards that he threatened eret, enabled wilbur (however you interpret that, he still enabled him), and sided with schlatt for power reasons even though he said he would help pogtopia. giving pogtopia some stuff doesn’t make him the “good guy” because pogtopia were not the good guys! that’s the point! he sided with them because wilbur had less ambition than schlatt, and therefore posed less of a threat to the greater smp! he wasn’t helping them just purely out of the goodness of his heart. he didn’t think schlatt was right, he abandoned him very quickly, but he could have just taken the book and dipped. he fought in the war. he took the book for personal gain and he placed that above the trust of pogtopia.

“he wasn’t on a power trip at all, he didn’t have a god complex up until the prison stripped him of all his dignity and then threw an opportunity at him, and he wasn’t trying to prove anything to anyone.”

power trip: an activity or way of behaving that makes a person feel powerful

exile and the vault, arguably before that a few times as well. there are a few quotes that emphasize this.

dream’s god complex was already there in the vault. that’s why he was scared enough of being controlled that he shut everyone else away: he wanted to secure himself even more as the sole power.

and exactly. he wasn’t proving anything to anyone else, he was proving it to himself. therefore he also wasn’t trying to “prove” he was big and bad and evil and irredeemable, he was trying to feel confident about his own power!

if he doesn’t care if he’s thought as of evil, why did it supposedly drive him into the spiral? if he stopped caring about it, that would also explain why he was indifferent towards it (because he was indifferent towards it, every time someone called him that, indifferent or angry). he didn’t think he was evil because he thought he had a right to what he was doing. so he pushed himself into wanting more control, after seeing something he identified as a problem: tommy. you’re right that that’s part of what makes him tragic: that he stopped caring about what he owed to anyone else. that’s why he hurt them.

“it’s likely and fits perfectly into his character arc in canon.”

people who are emotionally repressed still show emotions, they just don’t show them as often. dream shows emotions but he does not show the specific emotion that would give evidence to this theory. i’m saying that claiming something is deeply rooted in his character (not the emotional repression, that’s confirmed) when he shows no sign of it doesn’t line up with canon. it’s more of a theory than an analysis.

“it is good storytelling because cc!wilbur pulls it off brilliantly.”

cc!wilbur still played a complex character! his behavior changed significantly after the war, but there is evidence that he was a certain way during the war. his character grew from that point but my argument is that he was not always a liar about important things and that he genuinely believed in the values he formed l’manburg for. if you want to watch wilbur being power hungry and hypocritical, rewatch the election arc.

actions, not words. cc!wilbur pointed out hypocritical things his character said, but that just shows he was playing a flawed character. people using the wall thing as some kind of proof that he was evil is stupid because part of the idea behind the wall was poking fun at america. it was “look, this is what you guys do”.

his early character was passionate and naive. cc!wilbur was aware of this. he was still a chaotic crimeboy, the nation was founded on drugs. but not everything he did was “for chaos” because again, he played a multi-dimensional character. he can make jokes about politics.

“his main support system left by themselves.”

i’ve already explained why i think dream broke most of his own bonds. again, there’s textual evidence to support this and actions as well that line up with it. and lots of people were willing to help dream. he didn’t murder all those people by himself.

“it also seems you’re strongly biased against c!dream, which, to be fair, the majority of the fandom is.”

it’s true my bias is against dream. it’s also true that my reasons for that bias are backed up by moments in the story where he clearly states his intentions, and a lot of the evidence to the contrary is, to me, one-off moments that can be interpreted in many ways. a lot of the bias also comes from the fact that he did pretty bad things and i’ve been watching this for a long time.

this post is pretty much what i’m saying, i guess.

alright @flypaw here it is :]

~ Lad 2

[the-fandomwriter]

Tubbo was so reckless during the entire fight. It was so heartbreaking to watch, he threw himself in front of Tommy to save him from the fireworks, jumped into tnt so he could regen quicker...it was just so sad.

/rp he’s become so careless, and has honestly lost so much self worth over time and it’s absolutely depressing. he’s got so much love in his heart, considering how quickly and mindlessly he jumped in front of the rocket that was aimed at tommy. he didn’t think twice, all he knew was that tommy was in danger and he had to protect him.

people see the clingy duo as very one sided on the protection scale. so many people talk about how tommy always defends tubbo and holds himself responsible to look after tubbo. but tubbo is the exact same?

he could’ve easily ran away or said no to schlatt when he was asked to be his right hand man, but tubbo knew that getting that close to schlatt would benefit the rebellion greatly. he’s always got everyone’s best intentions in mind, and will do anything to help tommy on his journey to get his discs because tommy trusts him so much. and he can’t let tommy go! so he goes to every extent, making the speech at the first festival, despite how anxious and scared he was. allowing schlatt to walk all over him just to assist the rebellion. being killed by techno for the sake of the rebellion. for the sake of tommy.

tubbo is a big picture kinda guy, he’s always looking for solutions to problems that’ll benefit every involved party, he’s never focused on the small things, he doesn’t like to dwell on small tasks as president, he prefers big projects like draining the ocean, rebuilding new l’manberg, he can never do something small, something simple. he’s always got an outline of a plan, but struggles to come up with every detail that fills in and completes the plan. he’s incredibly smart and puts that to use through big red stone projects.

but tommy is detail oriented. he prefers filling in the outlines of plans, adding in his own ideas and making sure everything is perfectly planned out, but can never come up with a through-and-through plan from start to finish. he remembers every detail of everything, noticing small things that nobody else notices, like the new builds in the distance and the slight changes in tone when people are speaking to him. he overthinks a lot, and constantly contradicts himself whilst trying to make major decisions, because he struggles to come to see the big picture.

they perfectly compliment each other in every which way. they would both die for each other because they’re both reckless as fuck and would doing practically anything for the other because they have such a deep emotional connection. they’re platonic soul mates in the best way possible. where tommy lacks in something, tubbo’s has a knack for it and vice versa.

their recklessness is their twisted way of showing affection for another. dying for each other was a given the moment they became friends during war-time. they were destined to sacrifice themself for the other the very moment their souls met.

[blee-bloop-im-a-bee]

a scuffed scuffed podcast summary/liveblogging?

(mostly focused on dream, quotes might be off but its the general gist, timestamps not exact to second lol)

- Praise and congratulations all around for Sapnap and Punz’s valorant skills 

- Dream: “well I woke up this morning and I found out I was a racist soo..” (context: Someone asked Jack how he felt about the Queen being racist and he replied that doesn’t really know anything about that and that he didn’t really care)

- They didn’t get into it though, Train said he was never going to get into Dream’s drama on this podcast (which he remarks is because it gives him anxiety, but I appreciate him for doing it nonetheless)

- on Tubbo joining in: Train confirming he would need a different cast because he’s concerned about Tubbo’s audience (& parents) and wants to set up another podcast properly where it would be more appropriate for them, to which Dream comments is respectable.  

- Dream mentioned geoguessr

- after Train’s weird (/lh) intro for dream 1:22:00---

     Dream: “You didn’t mention--oh nevermind it’s fine” 

     (Me, wondering if he was talking about his drama still)

     Train: “OH YEAH, AND ONE OF THE FATTEST C**** IN  HISTORY”

     Dream laughing and going “you didn’t mention it, you mentioned it for everyone else..” 

- Ludwig on having to limit his subs: yeah I’ve had to limit them but I found that some people have still managed to get around that

     “I don’t think anybody would try to get around that”- Dream

- They talked about the david dobrik drama, I didn’t care so much for the topic so I spaced out but Dream put in some thoughts about someone’s apology it seemed like he wasn’t on board with it (sorry I wasn’t paying attention)

- Dream, was that you that mentioned jenna marbles? (1:41:35) crumbs of my favorite ccs colliding??

- Dream: acknowledging the difficulty of females coming forward to speak out against creators for fear of being lashed out at by the fanbase (1:42:00)

- Abdou: Do you think big creators actually don’t realize the power they have?          Will: I think it’s more that they start forgetting that their fanbase are still real people... (neat food for thought, they were still talking in the context of david dobrik but because they were also mentioning how he achieved fame at a young age, i couldn’t help but think about dream)---- dream said nothing during this part

- topic on among us, Dream chiming in at 1:51:00 (spaced out didn’t listen)

- spaced out more, dream’s face reveal went trending on twitter apparently just cause of an earlier mixup when punz’s face showed up in the box where dream’s name was 

- in the background, dream was also on his private twt to reassure a fan commenting on how moe brought up dream’s fans negatively (i remember moe bringing us up but i didn’t catch the context)

- ~2:10:00 ish?? Youtube talk, dream didn’t say much :(

- Dream once again declaring that Ludwig will definitely keep streaming until the end of the month and that he’ll make sure of it

- Ludwig saying Dweam

- Ludwig not leaving until he heard Dream say goodbye which dream claims he did, and that Ludwig couldn’t pick and choose his goodbyes. Ludwig threatened to ban Dream’s alt to which Dream was like “NO no no don’t i want to be able to read your chat”

- Dream, loudly: “I have never had sushi” (not unprompted, they were talking about sushi, but I just liked how he said it-- he used the voice)

- Dream lore: He had walmart sushi. He got roasted for it (deserved)

- Talking about cancel culture:: ~~2:53:00        2:57:30 Dream brings up his drama and summarizes it but does agree that if he those videos about him been true, he should be cancelled (I think that was his gist?)

      Train’s point is that there is too many people who are quick to cancel, but when they are wrong, do nothing to make things right ie. Johnny Depp situation

      Moe acknowledging that theres a culture of bandwagoning on hating on popular creators

       3:01:00 Will bringing together all the points & mentioning Kacey and kpop stans bringing up the time they bought out trumps speech tickets- and hopes that all of the stans (kpop, minecraft) continue to have this passion when they turn 18 to affect the ballots

- Train talking about weebs and about to go a buck fifty, dream and karl were warning him to “be careful” lmao (i think train said something about how its always the ones with anime pfps saying the weirdest shit)

- I wonder what dream is doing while they’re all talking about manga/comics- I’m waiting for him to come in and say: I have never watched anime in that voice he didn’t end up saying this

Dream: “Gorillas are really strong..” King kong vs. Godzilla convo

Dream saying something about spiderman, then Train calling spiderman a pussy and like wtf man I was starting to think you were alright, and then talking over dream?? unforgiveable. /j

-oop they’re going back into cancel culture when Train reads out a tweet: ~3:34:00     I can’t summarize this, this is a little too deep for my sleepy brain, but I feel like train is talking about how quick to judge people are almost being ready to jump the gun just to cancel someone thinking that that person wanted to cancel him, but Dream is pointing out that both sides don’t really understand each other and that person probably wasn’t trying to cancel Train. Jack also spoke up to help clarify to which you could hear Dream agreeing.

     Dream acknowledges that there is a need for creators to make an effort to understand discussion that goes around and to be respectful at the same time, admitting that he’s reacted in anger in the past and disregarded discussions. 

     ^ There were a lot of points made, and I didn’t get all of dream’s responses. It was interesting conversation because we have Train being honest and venting his frustrations about cancel culture which I can sympathize with.  Dream (and Jack) spoke up a lot during the whole thing to try to shift Train’s point of view and the things he said were really admirable 

     Dream brings up the thing that happened with charlie a while back and said he dm’d charlie about that misunderstanding as dream puts it- and says that they are good now and saying something along the lines of open communication being so important

- Someone: “the only thing that matters is that my wife doesn’t cancel me.”      Dream: “that’s really sweet”  <- no u

-  “Would you let your kids watch on Twitch” Dream: As long as you’re aware and know about Twitch and Youtube, and as long as you teach your kids internet safety it should be fine

- Dream, on Train saying he hopes everyone will still be friends with him after this: “I actually hate you now” (in a joking tone). Dream wants to play among us with Train.     Dream, prompted to say one nice thing about Train and also the last words he said on the podcast: “An attractive motherfucker.”

[smelted-applejuice]

Peace Treaty, 02

(IMPORTANT) this fanfic was made before Fundy and KSI made their disgusting jokes, but I said it on my Quotev account; I want to go on with this book because I’ve had this planned for weeks, Fundy in this book is NOT AT ALL streamer Fundy but Dream SMP Fundy. I won’t write for him after this fanfic is over. Pairing(s): Fundy x Reader, Sapnap x Reader Pronouns: she/her Pre-picked: LAST NAME, FATHER'S NAME Pervious part , Next part

When [YourName] woke up, she freaked out not remembering anything before her passing out. She was still dressed properly, so she changed, and returned downstairs. Fundy and Wilbur were speaking to Sapnap and [YourName] froze in her place. “[YourName]?” Fundy asked, making everyone’s attention go toward her, [YourName] glared at Fundy who nervously chuckled. “Someone should’ve left a note or something saying Sapnap was here still!” [YourName] said flustering, she was in a nightgown and it embarrassed her to the extreme. Sapnap laughed and shook his head, “Sorry, you’re gonna have to get used to it eventually. I’m staying for the week, after George gets here we’ll be able to get married by next week. Sounds great, right?” he explained walking over and taking [YourName]’s hands into his own. [YourName] glanced over to Fundy who looked away sadly, but she nodded, “Yes, it sounds wonderful..” she replied sadly looking down. Sapnap softly placed her thumb under [YourName]’s chin and gently pushed her head up, “Are you okay?” he whispered softly. [YourName] didn’t like the heat on her cheeks, but she nodded, “Just feeling nervous” she smiled letting go of his other hand, “I’m going to eat and return to bed.” she said walking to the kitchen. Sapnap nodded and returned to the conversation, Fundy would follow after [YourName] though, he was sucking as much alone time with her as he could. He watched as she shuffled around the kitchen, warming up leftovers over the stove, “How’re you really feeling?” Fundy asked, making the poor girl jump. She laughed softly and shook her head, “I’m so tired, I’m scared, I’m going to miss you..” she admitted looking down at her food inside the pan. She quickly moved it over to the plate and looked up toward her boyfriend. He frowned, “It hurts to watch you interact with him,” he says “I know..” she said in the same tone. [YourName] made her way over and hugged Fundy tightly, he placed a hand in her hair. Fundy gently tugged at [YourName]’s roots, placing a hand around her, and hugged her. His ears pressed against his head and his tail relaxed a slight twitch now and then, “It’ll be okay..” Fundy lied, closing his eyes. He pressed a kiss onto her hair, letting her separate and eat her dinner in peace, he just watched carefully, taking in each detail. He took note of her little shift as she admired the kitchen she grew up with as she ate her stew, the way her hair moved as she moved around. Fundy gently placed his arm on his shoulder, “I’ll be up there tonight.” he whispered making her nod. [YourName] placed her dishes away and returned to her room. She laid there staring at her ceiling, she closed her eyes and felt tears form. She’s grown up in L’manberg, never lived outside of it, and never planned to. She expected to live here for the rest of her life, have children, and grow old right in this exact place- but instead, she’s being forced out of the house for the sake of this exact country she thought she’d grow up in. She sat up and threw her pillow on the ground violently just in time for her door to open. [YourName] stood on her knees glancing over quickly, Fundy had taken his jacket off and dressed for the night. They just stared at each other, [YourName] melting right then and there as she let her tears fall. Fundy made his way over, taking his place after shutting the door on her bed and offering his arms. [YourName] fell into his arms, sobbing, she buried her head into his shoulder. She let it all out, letting everything finally set and settle into her heart. She admits many things, her fear of losing Fundy in this mess, how she wanted to be with him forever, and beyond that. She didn’t want any of this and it was clear as day right now. All Fundy could do was hold [YourName] and listen, she had listened to him when he was upset about this- it was his turn to comfort his lover. He ran his fingers through [YourName]’s hair and coaxed her into sleep. He felt bad, he didn’t say anything throughout her whole break down- but it was the fact he sat there with her until she fell asleep that matter, he hoped so at least. “I love you, [YourName]” he whispered to her gently, placing her into her bed properly, he debated on staying but chose not to. He placed a final kiss on her lips, taking in her scent once more, rubbing his forehead against her neck before taking his shirt off and dropping it on her, and leaving. She is his, whether Sapnap knows it or not.  George had come into town that week, Dream and him deciding to stay in the same hotel Sapnap had decided to live in. With George, Gregory, Wilbur, and Dream- the wedding should be prepped and ready by next week. Sapnap was excited while [YourName] just smiled and nodded when asked if she was happy, everyone knew it must be awkward being placed into such a situation and Sapnap was being an absolute saint for showing his excitement for both himself and [YourName]. [YourName] sat on the floor with Wilbur at her house, Sapnap, George, and Dream talking next to them. Gregory came down with a brown torn up box and set it on the floor, Wilbur and [YourName] along with Dream, Geroge, and Sapnap all glanced over when Gregory stood up with pride. He dug through the box before offering something to [YourName], Wilbur’s eyes grew wide, “What’s.. this?” [YourName] asked curiously. “These were your mother’s, she wore them to our wedding,” Gregory explained with a smile to his daughter, she shook her head. The glovers were pretty and well kept up with for the amount of time they had spent in their location locked away from daylight. They were fingerless gloves, mesh ribbons at the end to tie around the wrist of their user, they were lace with pearls, rhinestones, and flower designs lining around the top of the hands. [YourName] shook her head again, “No offense Sapnap, but mother would’ve murdered you the second you told us about this marriage.” she confessed scooting them toward her father “She would not want me to wear these.” she said. Sapnap shrugged, no offense was taken. Gregory was offended though “No, you’re wearing these, honor your mother- please.” he begged, Wilbur stepped in “Let [YourName] have one thing for herself.” he told his friend. Gregory sighed, “Fine, alright.” he said tucking them away gently back in their spot. [YourName] focused on what she needed to focus on, the following morning she left and ordered her dress for the wedding. The rest of the day she sat there, not allowed to see Fundy until her wedding day as Wilbur placed him in charge of fixing up the altar and reception area speck and span with a few others like Tommy and Tubbo. [YourName] leaned against Sapnap and fell asleep listening to all the males talk about what colors should be. She didn’t care, she wanted this over, face her demons, marry them, and live with them. Sapnap glanced over to [YourName], noticing she was asleep he softly smiled. He quieted Dream and Geroge and softly asked for a blanket to place around [YourName], “She doesn’t seem happy..” George admitted taking his seat again. “Obviously she isn’t, she’s being forced out of her home and to a stranger.” Sapnap explained with a serious face, “At least you’re aware of how she feels.” Dream said, throwing his hands up and leaning back into his chair. “Doesn’t it feel... Wrong? Like you’re taking a girl away from her home, marrying her as a treaty, for all we know she had her life planned out with her secret lover!” George said joking at the end. Sapnap closed his eyes, shaking his head, “I feel horrible, but I like her.” he said as he wrapped an arm around her sleeping form protectively. Dream and Geroge glanced over to each other, both choosing to drop the subject. ‘Must’ve hit a sensitive spot.’ Dream though watching Sapnap freak out over [YourName], Dream wasn’t stupid- he watched Fundy and [YourName] interact. He walked into the kitchen the other night and watched the way Fundy comforted her, kissed her hair, stood there with her, he had to do something about it. He wanted Sapnap to remain happy and that was because of their friendship, no way was he going to let some random fox hybrid get in the way of this. The following week, it was wedding time. [YourName] stood in front of her mirror, friends had left the room and let her collect her thoughts. Her arms were itchy from the material that was used to create the see-through effect, but so were her corset and skirt which was covered in lace, glitter, jewels, beads, and flower designs. She had to admit, she felt pretty in this dress and preferred to feel pretty and sad on this big day than ugly and sad. Her hair was done nicely, with no loose strands or messy ends, and on top of her head was leaf design Rhinestone headpiece, the wires connected each stone to the next, which added to the mystical feeling she had felt when she looked at herself. Behind her were her boots that she had to lace up, the heels were tinier than she was used to, but she had practiced with them all week. There was a knock on her dressing room door, “Come in” she replied looking over. She expected her father, but instead, it was Fundy. “Hello,” He greeted, his ears perked up and tail wagged with excitement. He missed her dearly and if this was going to be their last moments together he was going to make it work. [YourName] brightened up, “Fundy!” she greeted rushing over bringing him into a hug which he returned. He squeezed her, kissing all over her face. [YourName] giggled nuzzling her nose against his making little squeak noises to be admitted from his mouth. “Gosh, I’m going to miss this,” she said softly pressing her forehead against his. Fundy shook his head, “I’m going to get you out of this marriage, even if it means having to kill later on down the line.” he explained making sure his point was proven. “Let’s not bubble down to murder, maybe there’ll be a new way of peace and I’ll be let go, and then we can live out our lives together within L’manberg,” she said giggling once more hugging him closely. He gently bent down and rubbed his face and head against her neck, [YourName] had no idea what he was doing, but she took it like a champ. “Well then” she chuckled, Fundy flustered but shook it off, “There’s a gift I need to give you personally before you leave, okay? You can’t lose it.” Fundy said seriously, pulling away from [YourName]. She nodded, making a mental note in her head for that, “Alright, I love you, please… be careful.” Fundy said, taking his leave. [YourName] laced her boots up and would meet up with her father in front of the doors of the aisle. She held onto her father’s arm, the bridesmaids and groomsmen along with the flower and ring boys had gone down already and it was her turn. She clung to her father’s arm and stuck a fake smile on as they passed church pews filled with close family friends and friends of Sapnap’s. Gregory let go of his daughter after pressing a kiss to her forehead and returning to his seat in the front row, Wilbur smiled between Sapnap and [YourName]. He proceeded to get both [YourName] and Geroge to say vows, [YourName] held her flower batch close with a soft smile at the faint smell of Fundy on her. She looked at Sapnap making him smile, “If there to be any objections, speak now.” Wilbur said loud and clear. [YourName] hoped someone would say something, that someone would stand up and whisk her away, but she knew better than to hope. She glanced at the crowd, especially at Fundy, but he didn’t act. Wilbur hummed, “Tommy, Tubbo, the rings please.” he asked, making the teenagers squirm and push each other to give [YourName] and Sapnap the rings making the room fill up with laughter. Dream carefully stepped up, removing [YourName]’s engagement necklace and placed it inside a provided glass box, and carried it away, letting the ring vows carry on. Sapnap looked into [YourName]’s eyes with a soft smile “Let this ring be a symbol of my promises to you and a reminder of my devotion to you, [YourName]. I am honored to call you my wife.” he spoke placing the ring onto her finger. “I will wear it. Whenever I look at it, I will remember this day and the vows we’ve made.” [YourName] spoke before she picked up Sapnap’s ring and carefully did the same thing as he had done, “Because this ring is perfectly symmetrical, it signifies our true love. As I place it on your finger, I give you all I am and hope to be” she said looking up at the male. “Because this ring has no end or beginning, it signifies the continuation of true love. I give you all that I am and ever hope to be.” Sapnap replied softly, but loud enough for everyone to hear. “You may now kiss the bride!” Wilbur said, shutting the book loudly, smiling toward [YourName] and Sapnap. The two hadn’t kissed once since they met, Sapnap had kissed [YourName]’s knuckles countless of times but this was different. [YourName] and Sapnap leaned in, placing their lips upon each other. [YourName]’s arms wrapped around Sapnap’s neck while Sapnap placed his hands against her waist. “Congratulations, [YourName] and Sapnap, you are now wedded and now proceed with the reception!” Wilbur said after the two pulled away, despite the hatred [YourName] knew she needed to feel, she quite enjoyed that kiss with Sapnap, and from the smile on her husband’s face-- he enjoyed it too. [YourName] and Sapnap led friends and family to the reception area, taking a seat at the sweetheart table after the food was served. “[YourName]?” An unknown voice spoke, [YourName] glanced around until she noticed a male in a black and red cloak, he had brown hair, his skin was covered in black spots and he wore glasses. “That’s me.” [YourName] said innocently, Sapnap too busy trying to prevent an argument between Geroge and Dream to notice, “I’m Bad, Sapnap’s father, it’s lovely to meet you!” he said with a smile offering his hand. [YourName] took it and shook it, “A shame I never got to meet you before this, but I uh.. I hope to see you around more.” [YourName] said nervously. Sapnap glanced over and smiled, busting into conversation with his father, easily placing Bad’s attention onto himself and not his new wife. Soon, Sapnap and [YourName] were in the middle of the spotlight and softly danced to a disc Tommy had carefully picked out with Wilbur and Fundy, they gently swayed between steps. [YourName]’s hand was placed on Sapnap’s shoulder while the other was being held out, while Sapnap’s hand was placed upon her waist and held [YourName]’s hand out guiding her with each step. The two couldn’t help but smile when they messed up now and then. After their first dance Gregory and [YourName] had the father-daughter dance, which was even more emotional than the first dance. The disc that played was the same one [YourName]’s mother had danced with her father to. [YourName] was soon able to sit back down, which she proceeded to do. At the end of the wedding, [YourName] met up with Fundy where he gave her a final wedding gift. She couldn’t open it until later when Sapnap left their new home and it was just her. [YourName] placed one final kiss against Fundy’s cheek and soon rushed over to Sapnap where they were seen off to spend a few weeks away from Dream SMP and L’manberg. [YourName] hoped nothing bad would happen within these next two weeks. 

[strawberrylemonz]

January 20, 2021 - DSMP

Here is my review of what happened on today’s stream! Keep in mind that I was only watching Tommy’s POV, but will be analyzing any other viewpoints that I come across (Mainly Tubbo’s)

I’m going to be honest with everyone, I was unsure as to whether not any of our boys would make it out alive. I went into the stream preparing the worst.

Tommy and Tubbo talking each other up, preparing to leave made me feel all kinds of thing. Like I stated earlier, I was prepared for the two to end their adventure today. I vibed with them when they walked down the prime path, and froze up when I saw the first person in line. I’m not ashamed to say that I nearly sobbed when I saw everyone line up to say their goodbyes to the boys (I’m sensitive, shut up). 

The way Sam kept giving them stuff??? Loved that

The way Tommy and Quackity’s voices quivered when they spoke to each other? Punch to the heart?

Tommy telling Eret that she was always the true king??? YES!!! POP OFF!!!

The entire trip to where Dream was both made me happy and broke my heart. Here, we saw these boys, children forced to grow up quickly to be used by those they trusted, do their best to be kids for a moment. They were kids for, what they believed, could be the last time. They had their serious moments where Tommy kept reminding Tubbo that it was okay to not feel okay about the situation. Where Tommy didn’t want Tubbo to hide his inner thoughts from him just to try and make him feel better. The moment that they watched the sun together made me all sentimental and shit. Tommy preparing to die and have Tubbo leave and tell his story broke me. 

“Why did you tell me to bring Tubbo?”

“Because, it’s always been you and Tubbo against me, remember? Ever since the beginning, Tommy and Tubbo against Dream” (paraphrasing)

I actually got hyped up when Tommy got the disc. It reminded me of Tommy’s clutch the time he dropped the disc down to Tubbo and knocked Dream off the tower using only planks. I had let my hope for them grow. And then I had my heart broken.

Dream using Tubbo against Tommy was something that I expected would happen, but I still wasn’t prepared for it to actually happen. I don’t think I’ll easily forget about how Tommy gave up the disc to Dream, even when Tubbo begged for Tommy to keep the disc and go. My heart nearly dropped to my stomach when I saw Dream break that first dirt block. It dropped when he told the boys to put their armor in the hole. 

I have to admit, I was kinda confused that the homeless man had an evil lair and not a home, but pop off I guess??? The elevator was pretty cool, ngl

When I saw the two discs on the floor, I thought, “Bitch, you better be polishing this fucking floor every 30 minutes. Disrespect Nicki Minaj? What?” My second thought was, “why tf did you make two giant ass shrines for these discs??? Didn’t even center them, wtf dude.”

When Dream was monologuing and showing off the stolen goods and pets (and Skeppy) he stole from everyone, I knew he was on something. Him calling Tommy the key confirmed that Dream was overthinking everything and seeing things in places they didn’t belong. Did Tommy initially bring these bonds? Bring all the things Dream said he did? Yeah, I’ll admit it, he did. But it was the people in the server that kept that going, kept it alive. If not Tommy, someone else would have started that chain. The way Tommy look horrified and uttered with a horrific tone, “how do you not hurt?” when Dream mentioned how he cut off all his attachments was hnnnnnnnn

Tubbo actively trying to protect Tommy from going to prison while Tommy was actively trying to protect Tubbo from permanently dying was-

Man

Man, that broke my heart.

“You wanna be the hero of this server? Every hero has an origin story. Batman had his parents, Spider-Man had Uncle Ben. You have Tubbo.”

The look of complete horror/terror that came across Tommy’s face the instant those words were spoken. He genuinely looked scared. He kept trying to defend Tubbo, despite Dream repeating how defenseless Tommy was against him. Dream telling the boys to say their good byes hurt me in more ways that I can describe. Tommy was panicking, actively trying to come up with ways to get Tubbo out of there, no matter the cost or price that he had to pay. Tubbo telling him that it was okay, everything would be okay, he would be okay. The way Tommy was desperate to hold onto his best friend, his Tubbo, whilst saying, “You can’t be okay with this! Why are you okay with this?”

My heart nearly stopped for a second the moment Tubbo said “goodbye, Tommy”

My mind flashed back to Tubbo saying those exact words whilst exiling Tommy, his best friend, for the sake of everyone being safe. Now, here he was again, saying those exact words to the exact same person. The only difference? He wasn’t sacrificing his best friend for the sake of everyone and Dream. No, he was sacrificing himself for the sake of his best friend, his only true friend, Tommy. 

“Get away from them”

“Punz?”

“I’m sorry Dream, but you should have paid me more.”

Literal chills. I cannot. It’s the “On your left” of the DSMP. The way everyone came through the portal to line up against this tyrant that manipulated them all. The way I imagined everyone coming through to see this decked out dude with a god complex about to murder a bloody and bruised child, said child’s best friend (also bloody and bruised) was watching, begging to have his friend spared. Imagining how they saw the tear streaks down the boys’ messed up faces as they accepted their fates. As they saw their fear turn to hope as Tommy got Tubbo behind them for safety. How Tommy entrusted them to keep Tubbo safe. How they all came, decked out, to defend these two children. 

How Quackity came in nothing but his yeezys because he just fucking knew that Dream wouldn’t put up a fight. The way Dream was so confident that he had power over everyone because he rid himself of his bonds towards objects and friends, only for that to be his downfall. The way Sapnap, Dream’s old friend, his buddy, was the one to give Tommy the pickaxe. The way Puffy was there to protect the two boys she renounced his duckling title for (and the nation).

The way Tommy dug a hole, without any protection or weapons, and had Dream throw his stuff in. The way he didn’t blow any of Dreams shit up, like he had happen to himself, and, instead, used Dream’s things to protect Tubbo and everyone else. The way Tommy took away Dream’s first two lives, paralleling the times Dream took Tommy’s two lives. The way Tommy boxed him in, like Tubbo was at the festival, and the way Tubbo held a bow to Dream. The way Tommy screamed at Dream to tell everyone what he had done. How Dream was the one to blow up the community house. How Dream tormented the poor boy in exile. The way Tommy didn’t spare him because he liked him, or wanted to play mind games with him. No, Tommy spared him because he had a chance to get his brother back, his family. 

“Let’s make Wilbur proud. SUCK IT GREEN BOY!!!!”

“SUCK IT GREEN BOY!!!!”

The way the boys sincerely thanked everyone for showing up, fully knowing that they didn’t have to do shit. The way that Tommy said to go to Tubbo’s vc, obviously warming Tubbo’s heart. The way they made it to bench, and finally had a chance to breathe. How they could sit their, listen to their discs, and be kids again. No wars, no going against Dream, nothing. They could just be Tommy and Tubbo, like it’s always been since the beginning. 

Then Wilbur fishfucking Soot had to crash the moment like the older brother he was, lmaooooo. 

“You didn’t die”

“Ghostbur?”

“I’m not Ghostbur.”

I sucked in a breath, not knowing how the interaction was going to go. Was Wilbur still in the mindset he was whilst blowing up the nation he and his younger brother created? Was he in a mindset before that? Was he sane? 

I must admit, their bickering match, along with Tubbo’s dancing, made me realize how much I missed their dynamic. I realized how much I missed Wilbur being in the picture. (Tommy whispering to Tubbo how he liked Ghostbur was hilarious)

Wilbur complaining about being stuck with Schlatt in the afterlife was hilarious. Wilbur admitting that he was preparing, waiting, for Tommy, his younger brother, to join him in the afterlife had me gripping my plushies. Wilbur telling Tommy that he’s proud of him put a sledgehammer into my fragile dam. 

“I’ll see you soon.”

“Yeah, I’ll see you soon.”

THEY. ARE. BROTHERS!!!!

It was just so refreshing to see these two get the happy ending they deserved in this arc. The pain and suffering these two children went through at the expense of others, how they were forced to grow up quickly because of their situations, all of that was finally pushed towards the path of recovery. And although they’ve been through hell and back, it’s still them. Although the future will be hard for them, throwing more trials and difficult choices, they know that they’ll make it out, because that how it’s always been. And if their strengthen bond after today can tell them anything, it’s that it’ll always be like that.

It’s always been Tommy and Tubbo.

What I want/what I predict

FOR GEORGE TO BE AWAKE FOR FIVE FUCKING SECONDS

Everyone complimenting Niki on her new fit better fucking happen, I will manifest it

Dream will use his favor from Techno to break out of prison

Connor playing a bigger role in the SMP

Foolish revealing that they don’t need Dream alive (hopefully)

Ghostbur to say a proper goodbye before Wilbur is revived

GLATT

GLATTBUR

SBI reunion with every alive for more than five fucking minutes

Wilbur ignoring his dad Phil and zooming over to little brother Tommy so that he can hug him and tell him that he’s safe now and that he’s so proud of him

THERAPY ARC!!!! FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYONE LOVELY, PLEASE

JUST GET EVERYONE INSIDE THE THERAPY GROUP SECTION AND TALK ABOUT THEIR TRAUMA AND FEELINGS SO THEY CAN ALL CLEAR UP THEIR MISUNDERSTANDINGS!!!!!

The egg will start to negatively affect people, causing those not affected to fear for their home and friends

SBI + TUBBO AND RANBOO VS EGGPIRE????? POG?????

Tubbo nuking L’manhole to get rid of the spreading red

Techno/Phil to come to an understanding with Tommy; vice versa

Those unaffected teaming up to safe those affected

Someone (preferably Ranboo) unintentionally activating the End Portal lmao

The rest of the SBI + Tubbo saving Tommy from being murdered by Jack and Niki

Jack and Niki learning that killing the child is not the fucking answer to their problems (If it didn’t work for William Afton, it won't work for y’all. Stop trying to be the man behind the slaughter)

Techno and Tommy rebuilding their trust and friendship with each other

Tommy giving Techno the Axe of Peace

Sam being influenced by the egg and becomes corrupted

Ranboo being free??? Pog???? Pog

Puffy and Niki having a one-to-one conversation about their personal opinions and goals

Puffy visiting Dream whilst he sits in his cell

Skeppy and Bad to be okay again :(

Everyone infected to be okay again :(

Tommy bonding with Eret

Big Q continuing to hold Clingy Duo close to him

Schlatt coming back but instead of trying to run for president and mess with everyone, he’s just everyone’s drunk uncle that somehow gives wise advice to every situation

Wilbur coming back but he’s that angry older cousin that only allows the favorite family members(Tommy)/friends to stay in his room 

GIVE ME MEXICAN DREAM AND GIRL DREAM!!! ONLY HETERO RELATIONSHIP I SEE THAT IS BEYOND POGGERS

Lani and Drista to make a comeback at the same time

Tommy meeting more family members

The kids being able to be kids

Lani selling yeezy

Drista w/ bedrock

Drista laughing at Dream’s imprisonment

Everyone finding peace within each other’s chaos and living in harmony

[daaziscoolbesties]

[REPOST] MY 2K WORD COMMENTARY/ANALYSIS OF RANBOO’S LORE STREAM

‼️‼️This post contains lore spoilers from Ranboo’s 4/23 stream, “The Enderwalk Saga. Chapter 1: The Lessons”. If you haven’t seen that stream don’t read ahead unless you want spoilers‼️‼️

disclaimer: this isnt really an analysis as much as a bunch of commentary and half-baked theories.

-on the way to the mansion he was sort of talking to himself saying stuff like "i'm good i'm good" which m a y be a normal thing but also maybe it's not and it flew over our heads cause he talks to chats and donos like that so often

-again, this one may just be a normal thing but when he was climbing up the stairs in the mansion looking for foolish, he repeats some of his words like down to the exact same tone of voice and everything. 12:42,  "this mansion is way too big actually. this mansion is way too big actually." (why the repeated actually? seems odd to me but again it might just be a normal thing that i haven't picked up on). (right after) "okay okay lemme find him lemme find him" again repeated words in the e x a c t same tone.

-does everyone know about ranboo's silk touch hands ability thing? or was that just a techno and ranboo main character moment. bc if it was, how would foolish know that ranboo could pick up the full cake after it'd been partially eaten. unless everyone on the sever knows about that in which case this means nothing. but if they d o n t know... how would foolish know? ranboo wrote about it in the do not read book so maybe if it's not a publicly known thing maybe foolish got his hands on the book and read it??

-14:53-ish, they're talking about the war room and how it was for tubbo or whatever and ranboo says, and i quote "he prepares for lore but he's never gonna do it." now funny thing is at first i couldn't tell if he said "war" like in reference to the war room or "lore". but after playing the clip over and over i can say with ALMOST 100% certainty that he said lore. there is a definite L sound at the beginning of the word. which either means a) this was a slip up (doubtful bc he said later that there were no mistakes), b) he broke the fourth wall because they were supposed to be rping at that point, or c) i'm completely wrong and he said "war" which leads down an entire other road of possibilities

-15:17 "are you a book reader?" "*checks inventory for do not read book* uh yeah i'd say i'm a book reader-" dunno how i didn't catch this the first time I HATE THAT DAMN BOOK

-15:18 there's blue in his hotbar. where did he get the blue.

-16:40 "it's like a metaphor- i have two minds: i have my normal self, my normal little shift-dancing self, and then the builder one. the builder one is demanding. it's a very demanding mind." ranboo then lets out a weird sigh after this. i feel like what foolish was talking about was an indirect(?) parallel to ranboo in and out of enderwalk, there's how he normally is, trying to do best for others, and then there's enderwalk, meeting up with bad guys and "demanding" things (its very late as i write this i really don't know what i'm talking about)

-17:11 "you have your panic closet" i'm sorry his what now 😀 no but seriously how the hell did i miss some of these

-18:04 "you're asking me if i remember?" very funny ranboo thank you for making jokes in these trying times

-18:25 WHY DID HE GET OUT THE AXE WHEN STARING AT THE BEE

-19:38 why did foolish hold the grass block- most of these observations probably mean nothing but- h u h - is that- i'm too tired for this

-19:54 "i never properly thanked you for the deal you made with me" so foolish got something out of this deal, we're not sure if ranboo did. "the green cardboard box" again do you mean dream's house- but seriously the only people i can think of on the server that are associated with green are dream and sam. and i have no idea what cardboard box could be referring to.  foolish got a lime colored shulker from drista

-20:30 "we're supposed to only talk about it at a certain location" hmm now where would that be? panic room maybe? cause like usually after doing a big thing in the enderwalk state ranboo wakes up in the panic room so maybe?  the deal was that they only talk about it in his house

-21:52 how does ranboo receive(?) the lessons? like are they whispered to him in his mind or is he seeing them as words in front of him like we see? hmm

-"Lesson 14: If you have the opportunity to gain a favor, take it." "gain a favor" don't you usually ask people for favors though? how does one "gain a favor"? anyways i'm pretty sure lesson 14 has to do with the deal foolish was talking about. (the deal explained because i now have info: at some point a bit ago foolish met up with ranboo and asked to make a deal, he'd gotten a shulker box from drista. the deal was that ranboo would have ownership of the box, it would be under his name but foolish rents/borrows it indefinitely. ranboo negotiated that if he took ownership of the box he would get a "war favor"  from foolish where if something happens that creates sides, ranboo can ask him a favor that could change his side. but why would foolish want ranboo to have ownership of the shulker you may ask? well i have an answer for you. a theory actually but still. basically since drista technically isn't supposed to give out shit on the server if someone where to have that stuff then they may get in trouble. foolish wants to be able to use the shulker but if it gets found he doesn't want to get in trouble, so he can blame it on ranboo seeing as it's under his name.)

-22:16-ish "i still have this from when you *can't understand whats said here*" well i guess that sort of explains why he had the grass block? idk man (info update: he had the grass block from when ranboo threw it at him telling him to calm down like what ghostbur does with blue)

-31:35 "i figured out how to cause it" how to cause the enderwalk state

-38:30 "ninety three lessons" I STILL DONT KNOW WHY HE KEPT SAYING NINETY THREE AND NOT NINETY FOUR AND ITS DRIVING ME CRAZY LMAO

-39:01 "it's all for the greater good" okay well when are you gonna start thinking about yourself and not everyone else for once huh. self care bitch.

-40:31 he started holding the axe when he was looking at sam- gonna say it i really don't like that axe ahahah- WAIT A DAMN MINUTE THE AXE IS NAMED "axe of ender" I DONT LIKE THAT I DONT LIKE THAT AT ALL

-41:53 is there something?? physically keeping him from telling sam??? or maybe it's sort of like his enderwalk state taking control to make him shut the fuck up??? so many questions and approximately zero answers

-43:18 ranboo raising his voice legitimately scares me 😀👍

-"Lesson 27: Do not reminisce on what you have lost for it will weigh you down." showed up when he was thinking about and REMINISCING about the community house 👀👀

-"Lesson 53: Never fully trust anyone." showed up literally after he said that he thinks he can trust the other people on the server enough to tell them about what he did

-"Lesson 67: Leave no evidence of what you have helped with." this is different from the others because there doesn't seem to be at least a semi-direct connection to it? unless maybe at the time ranboo was near something he may have "helped with"? not sure about this one

-"Lesson 94: DO NOT LET THEM KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE DONE" yeah yeah i get it i get it he's fucked up some shit in enderwalk i don't feel like analyzing this thanks

-OH OH NOTICE HOW HE SAYS "REMEMBERING" WHEN THE LESSONS SHOW UP. IMPLYING THAT THIS ISNT A NEW THING, ITS HAPPENED BEFORE AND NOW HES REMEMBERING IT. MAYBE HE WROTE DOWN THE LESSONS WHEN HE WAS IN ENDERWALK AND NOW THAT HES BEEN EXPERIMENTING ITS BEEN EASIER FOR HIM TO REMEMBER THOSE ENDERWALK MEMORIES

-okokok the experiments are that he's been e x p e r i m e n t i n g on how to purposefully induce the enderwalk state. and we know now that it wasn't from the pain of the water because on the stream afterwords he said that it's caused by the intense fear of something happening. and so the "side effects" of the experiments is that since he's in enderwalk more often(?) he starts remembering more things from it

-OH MY GOD WAIT "there is a reason sam, there's so many reasons, theres ninety three of them" (44:47) WHAT IF EVERY LESSON IS TIED TO A QUOTE UNQUOTE "reason" THAT RANBOO THINKS HES A BAD PERSON/NEEDS TO BE LOCKED UP BUT HE SAYS NINETY THREE INSTEAD OF NINETY FOUR BECAUSE THE NINETY FOURTH LESSON DOESNT HAVE A REASON YET/HE DOESNT REMEMBER IT HAVING A REASON

-dude honestly the whole sam part hurts so much this man is scarily good at acting

-46:46 "i cant put you in the prison you wouldn't be able to see michael anymore" bestie that's the point he doesn't want to accidentally hurt michael or tubbo in the enderwalk state—

-okay but there's no way that sam couldn't tell that ranboo was at least TRYING to confess to something- i feel like he definitely knows more than he's letting on because usually like when people do bad shit or admit to doing bad shit he's like in Prison Guard Mode™️ (he literally cut off ponk's arm because he stole some keycards or something) and whatever and idk what he knows but he definitely knows something and is trying to protect ranboo. or he's trying to manipulate him or smth either one works—

-50:38 "you are a good person" "i am?" you can hear my heart shatter. "yes you are" "i don't think so sam" "i do, even if you don't" "i really don't think so" and there it goes again

-51:25 hello badboyhalo i see you to the left of ranboo

-52:44 "but then my curiosity got the best of me" curiosity killed the cat, bitch

-52:54 "there's ninety three, ninety four, ninety- theres so many reasons!" SEE!! NOT ONLY ARE THERE THAT MANY LESSONS THERE ARE REASONS THAT CORRESPOND IM S O SMART—

-52:56 "i don't want to remember anymore!" *quietly brings forth my theory that when ranboo loses a canon life his memory gets wiped*

-53:13 "ive opened pandora's box" isn't the prison?? literally called pandora's VAULT??? so this m a y be a stretch but i'm thinking that maybe this could be taken in the literal sense that he "opened" the prison and let dream out (the sirens at the end of quackity's stream confirm that dream is indeed out)

-53:42 mans just straight up walked through a ghost i—

-55:37 so are we just gonna ignore the eleventh page of the book? "he's alive, but hopefully soon dream won't be"??? alright nevermind it's most likely bc when tommy came back he recruited ranboo in his plan to kill dream

-55:47 notice how he writes "what am i?" as opposed to "who am i?" no elaboration here idk what it could be

-56:08 just so it's clear for anyone who doesn't know- he's wearing armor at this point, and i'm like 90% sure that when he wears his armor water can't hurt him. and i saw someone say somewhere that like with splash potions when thrown it turns into a gas-like thing? so again, it didn't hurt him, he didn't get hurt. he said in the chill stream that he wasn't comfortable making it where his character had to hurt himself to do that. the thing that causes the enderwalk isn't pain, it's intense and sudden emotions like fear and stress. thank you for coming to my tedtalk.

[whoreforpunz]

kiss it off me - chapter one

❦ ❧ ❦

dreamnap

❦ ❧ ❦

Dream's eyes raked frantically over the limited options in his wardrobe. He was already running late thanks to rush hour traffic and he didn't want to mess up this date. Not when this guy actually seemed normal and someone he could genuinely grow to like. Being in his situation didn't exactly give him the opportunity to go out that much and neither of his best friends beloved him until he showed them the message.

Long, calloused fingers ran over the various hangers until he reached a dark green button up. They were going to a restaurant but not an extremely fancy one so he could get away with a pair of jeans with it. Glancing in the mirror on the adjacent wall, Dream ran a hand through his dirty blond locks tousling them until he was satisfied.

He slowly buttoned up the emerald fabric until he got to the top two. After a brief moment of consideration he left them both open purposefully, it looked better that way. Bronzed skin exposed along with his prominent collarbone. Even he couldn’t find a fault with his appearance.

Swallowing the nerves that were building up inside he forced himself out the door knowing that if he stayed any longer he would just talk himself out of it.

He left the small apartment and jogged down the stairs to the lobby before exiting it to find his old, run-down car. It struggled to run most days but seeing as it still worked and Dream couldn't afford a new one yet, he made do.

The engine hummed nosily when he started the car and reversed out of his space. Soft music played in the background in an attempt to calm his desperately trembling knuckles so he didn't crash his car before he even got there. His journey was familiar along with the flashing scenery that disappeared just as quickly as it came into peripheral .

Dream sped along the winding roads to the other side of town where his closest and only real friends George and Wilbur resided with Wilbur's son Tommy. Seeing as he was also a single father, both of them made an effort to help each other out when they needed it except it was usually Wilbur helping Dream since he had the additional help of George. But Wilbur got it. Sure their situations weren’t the exact same but it was comforting to have someone so close to him in the same scenario.

As he reached their apartment block, Dream halted the car rapidly and grabbed the small bag he placed in the passenger seat and he slammed the door. Running up the stairs was difficult since they lived on a much higher floor than him and the elevator was out of use.

Unfortunately he didn't get to go to the gym as much as he would've liked to. In high school he'd been rather athletic and got a lot of attention for it. But that's what landed him in his current situation. Not that he didn't appreciate the blessing that came out of his mistake but there was always a small feeling of regret in the back of his mind.

Noise was emitted from their apartment from the stairwell and Dream chuckled when he heard the shrieks of laughter that undoubtedly belonged to Tommy.

The scene he was greeted with upon opening the creaky door was one that was typical of visiting George and Wilbur's place after work. Tommy and Tubbo were being chased by Wilbur as the two young boys who still had the remnants of their dinner smeared around their mouths attempted to bang on the door which he knew lead to George's room.

It was more of a struggle than he'd like to admit to hold back his sniggers at the sight. Tommy terrorised his dad's roommate at any given chance, even without Tubbo, but having his best friend at his side just amped up that energy and fed into his mischievous tendencies.

Their frantic dashing around the living room, trying to get into George's room which also functioned as his office proved to be futile as Wilbur scooped them gently into his arms and then strung the duo who were still shrieking with obnoxious laughter onto his shoulders, tickling their sides lightly as he did so.

Only then did Tubbo notice his dad's presence at the doorway. He nearly jumped off from where he was perched comfortably on Wilbur's shoulder. Running into Dream's arms with an excited squeal and attaching onto his leg, bearing a startling resemblance to a koala. This was a moment of domestic bliss. Of elevated suburbia to where it could be considered art. Dream had lifted his child off his leg and pulled him closely into his chest. Tubbo snuggled into him and let out a content sigh as Dream rubbed comforting little circles into his back.

The moment was short lived, Tommy was climbing his leg - well attempting to climb it so he could reach Tubbo and they could go back to playing together. Eventually Dream put Tubbo back on the ground gently and reluctantly watched as the two boys immediately engaged themselves in their previous game. Will shook his head fondly at the joyful giggles that filled the apartment once more.

Seeming to sense that it was safe to come out for a while, George emerged from his room but not before making sure to lock it after himself. Tommy had gotten in once before and been such a menace that they banned him from going in there. To tell the truth Dream was envious of the taller man who adorned mustard yellow sweaters and had the support of his family along with his perfect best friend. Dream was all alone.

Sure he had Tubbo who was more than enough, his little boy alone could make him infinitely happy. However his heart ached and longed for some kind of support, whether it was platonic or romantic. Wilbur and George server the platonic purpose but he didn't like to intrude on them more than he already did. They were already extremely helpful by collecting Tubbo from school with Tommy everyday because Dream would never be able to make it in time. Maybe if this date worked out though, he might find his other half.

Dream wasn't certain he believed in soulmates. In high school when he was beyond naive, the idea had seemed perfectly plausible and he truly believed he had found his in Tubbo's mother. Well that didn't end up being the case he reminded himself whenever his mind would drift to her. It never happened intentionally but Tubbo had her eyes and he couldn't meet his gaze without thinking of the woman who broke his heart into smithereens.

The concept wasn't something he had a lot of faith in anymore but maybe this time it could be different. That was a lot of faith to put in a tinder date of all things though. Even with George and Wilbur persistently trying to get him back into dating for the last year and a half, Dream had politely refused their efforts. Well, until now.

He remembered it clearly like yesterday, the three of them sat on the couch after Wilbur and Dream had put the boys to bed which was a challenge. Tommy and Tubbo were a nightmare to get to sleep when they were having a sleepover and you had to exhaust them to ensure they didn't wake up ten minutes later and start chatting for half the night. George hadn't bothered to help them and had instead chosen to nap on the couch but not after opening a bottle of red wine and pouring himself a glass.

Dream and Wilbur had found him half asleep on the grey fabric, wine glass tipping dangerously in his hand. Dream had placed it on the coffee table as George stirred in his sleep and blinked wearily. The three men all held a glass of red wine and maintained idle chatter until a natural halt occurred in the conversation. In which Dream seized the opportunity to try bring up something that had been lingering in the back of his mind for a while. And what better people to ask than his two closest friends. His two only friends.

It was impossible to forget the cheshire grin that formed on Wilbur's face after he confided in them about his loneliness and wanting to get back into dating. Dream was shaking inside as they discussed it, heart fluttering and beating so rapidly that it felt as though it would just burst out of his chest as any moment without warning. Both of them had relished in the opportunity to tease him lightly but he knew it was just their way of showing support.

George had grabbed his laptop with a slight smirk and began typing so quickly that Dream couldn't tell what he was doing. Wilbur raised an eyebrow at what George was setting up before the two of them turned around at the same time, facing him eerily.

"I feel like I'm about to be inducted into a cult," Dream commented, a nervous air to his tone.

Wilbur shared a glance with George "not a cult but we're signing you up to tinder..."

His eyes widened comically fast "wait what? guys I can barely talk to you in person - I won't be able to hold a conversation with some stranger online."

"You were literally the biggest Chad in school," George pointed out "you'll be fine."

Dream still wasn't convinced about the idea "but isn't this more of a like straight person thing...shouldn't we use grindr?"

In sync again, to the point where Dream was actually both curious and concerned about how many times they must practice this, George and Wilbur shared a look and appeared to be on the edge of laughter.

"What?" Dream asked, not getting why they found it so funny. Maybe it was just the contrast to how straight he'd acted and thought he was in high school and now he was fully out.

"Oh innoncent little Dreamie," Wilbur teased condescendingly while George giggled "you're too classy for grindr darling."

Whether that supposed to be a compliment or some weird backhanded one Dream didn't know "isn't it for gay guys though?"

George seemed to have had enough of drawing out the whole situation "it depends Dream, do you want to get dicked down for a night or do you want to try find a relationship."

"I'm not leaving Tubbo for a night just to get dick," Dream said pointedly "and wait...are you calling me a bottom?"

George clapped his hands together awkwardly "so anyway for your pictures I was thinking-"

Dream was persistent though and a mischievous gleam that was oddly similar to the one Tommy and Tubbo had appeared in his gaze. George had placed his wine glass back on the coffee table so Dream full on tackled him and tickled his sides relentlessly.

Wilbur joined in and both of the taller men were teasing George about being so ticklish everywhere. After George started fighting back and regained some breath, the trio stared up at the ceiling from where they were pilled up on top of each other on the old carpet. It wasn't exactly comfortable but his best friends made it bearable.

Wilbur broke the silence eventually by blurting out something that left them all cackling down loud that it woke Tommy and Tubbo from their slumber. Yet they had followed his advice and put the so called hottest picture Wilbur's ever seen of Dream at the front of his profile.

Dream supposed that he could see the appeal of it, he had looked good there. Eyes a unique hue of green that bared a striking resemblance to the new spring growth, bright and soft all at once. Along with a white shirt only half buttoned and veiny knuckles which adorned a set of rings. It was at least a year old this picture, he couldn't exactly remember when but Wilbur had demanded that he used it.

The other one that the two British men used for him was a surprise. One that he had from the gym, a light layer of sweat coating the surface of his chest, shimmering in the light. His muscles were slightly flexed, not enough for it to be cringy but they were eye-catching. He hadn't looked that good in a while, work had picked up more than usual and Tubbo had started school in the time since the picture was taken. Even he couldn't deny that he looked hot though and both of his friends strongly agreed.

Yet despite their confidence in their work, neither of the two believed him at first when he said that he had been talking to a guy and secured a date. The look on their faces after he proved them wrong had been worth it though.

A tug at his leg brought Dream out of the never ending stream of thoughts in his head and he glanced down to see Tubbo smiling up at him giving him the sweetest, softest stare. If Wilbur's tall frame wasn't blocking his view of the mirror, Dream was certain he'd be greeted with the sight of himself completely overcome with love and adoration.

"Dad can I please sleepover tonight?" Tommy wants to show me his new plushie." Tubbo asked.

Dream's smile widened as he told Tubbo that he could causing his little bit to hug him tightly before joining his best friend once more.

"George and I will take care of him," Wilbur placed a reassuring hand on his shoulder blade.

He didn't know how to respond to that so Dream just nodded in appreciation. There were so many worries coursing through his brain, all of them building up to the point where he could feel himself begin to shake. His body trembled ever so slightly and Will looked concerned. At first the date had seemed like a good idea, a chance to get into dating after nearly two years of working up the courage to even try again.

Now he was seriously regretting his decision though. What if this guy was nothing like who he said he was? Did he like kids? Was he prepared to deal with the surprise of Dream having a kid?

Dream couldn't even ask the latter question despite it being the most essential one. Nobody would want to take on the responsibility of dating a guy who had a child. Tubbo wasn't that young, there were no smelly nappies or bottles involved anymore but it was still a lot to ask of someone. Dream didn't want Tubbo to be just viewed as a burden or accessory to him, he would always come first.

The states he received whenever he dropped Tubbo to school in the morning were intense, full of preconceived judgements. He had a right to be nervous about the outcome of this date though, how it would go if he revealed that he was actually a single dad. It was better to lie than to make himself vulnerable though. For both himself and Tubbo.

They couldn't get attached to someone who would just up and leave them. Not like last time.

"Are you alright Dream?" George shook him gently.

Dream wasn't alright but despite all of his nerves, something was telling him to go on the date. And if he didn't go willingly, George and Wilbur would march him back down the stairs and drive him all the way to the restaurant themselves just to ensure that he went. They meant well but as soon as he'd brought the idea up, neither of the two had let go of it, both equally persistent.

"Yeah you kept zoning out," Wilbur added.

Dream shrugged in an effort to dismiss it "just some pre-date jitters," he lied smoothly - well was it really a lie "you know...it's been a long time since I've gone out anywhere, let alone on a date."

"Maybe he can help you unwind," Wilbur wiggled his eyebrows suggestively.

"I'm leaving," Dream groaned "bye George I'll see you later."

"Why is George the only one to get a goodbye?" Wilbur whined as Dream headed for the door again.

"He's pretty," Dream rolled his eyes "bye Will."

In the distance he could hear what sounded like words of affirmation, reassuring him that it was all going to work out. Or at least he hoped they were words of encouragement. This date could turn out amazing but the stress it was putting him under before he'd even driven to the place wasn't.

Dream had never actually been to the restaurant that the other man had suggested. It was on the outskirts of town, quite far away from his apartment and a bit out of his and Tubbo's budget. Not that Tubbo cared, he'd order chicken nuggets no matter where they were. As his car crawled up the busy road, his nerves increased tenfold and the anxious feeling bubbling inside of him was overwhelming.

When he reached the destination just two minutes before they were supposed to meet, Dream let out a sigh of relief. He didn't want to make a bad first impression by being late or causing the other boy to panic and think he wasn't going to come at all. In the fairly empty car park, illuminated only by a flickering pink neon sign across the road and one faded street lamp, Dream hyped himself up inside, working up the nerve to get out and meet this guy.

A warm atmosphere, golden even, greeted him as he pushed the wooden door open. The hostess immediately guided him to a table in the back right of the restaurant where the guy was already sitting. This place was beyond what Dream had expected, it wasn't supposed to be that fancy or expressive but the deep red walls with golden accents proved that wrong.

His jaw unhinged slightly and Dream froze once he made eye contact with the brunette man sitting at the table for two by himself. He wrung his hands together anxiously on the white tablecloth, not having noticed Dream approaching the table. The blonde was blown away though, he hadn't thought it to be possible but he somehow looked even better than his pictures and they were, well they were something else.

Small stubble lined the edge of soft cheeks that were tinted a pale pink and luscious lips captivated him. Just when he thought he couldn't be more enthralled by the man sitting at the table, his gaze shifted upwards and oh fuck his eyes. They were beautiful and Dream couldn't stop himself from staring.

Brown eyes. So deep that he could feel himself getting lost in them already and it had been mere seconds. Dark, rich and decadent pools that reminded Dream of the colour of fresh earth after rain. Even in the dim light, he could tell they'd be stunning in the sunlight, brilliant and clear. They'd melt into shocking golden rays or copper against honey and shade. He was entrancing beyond all fathomable belief. Little flicks of jet black eyeliner tracing the edge of his lids.

Dream tried to keep his expression as neutral as possible but that proved to be rather difficult considering how long he'd stared at his date. Nevertheless, he let a confident yet faint smirk form in an attempt to convey a calm persona and not the man closer to crumbling than an eroded cliff or a rapid landslide.

With a similar bravado to his high school self, Dream smiled coyly "you're Sapnap right?"

He reflected a similar smirk "I don't know am I? It depends whose asking."

Dream hadn't anticipated being this attracted to a man's voice ever but here he was. Smooth, dulcet tones laced with something sweeter than honey that only drew Dream in more of that was possible. His voice was compelling and he'd only just spoken but Dream was hooked. Like a siren pulling him into the deep end to drown him, Dream would willingly let him do it though. The nerves had been soothed slightly but he was wondering what he'd done to deserve to go on a date with a man this gorgeous.

"I'm Dream," he introduced himself smoothly with a charming grin.

Despite already knowing his name, the other man rose an eyebrow at it before a teasing half smile grew on his face "hmm are you going to say you're the man of my dreams now?"

He chuckled quietly "I could be but no, cheesy pick up lines aren't really my thing."

"Good because I would've left if you had," Sapnap remarked casually "and it would've been such a shame because the pictures really don't do you justice."

Now it was Dream's turn to raise an eyebrow "oh really?"

Sapnap nodded, tauntingly slow "you were already attractive but wow - I didn't know I was going on a date with someone who looks like they could be a Greek god."

Normally comments like that didn't get to Dream but there was something about him and his stupidly perfect southern drawl that was even more prominent in that comment. So he could feel his cheeks flush an embarrassing shade of crimson and Sapnap noticed. He didn't mention it but Dream saw the hint of a satisfied smirk creep onto his face.

Their intensely held stare was promptly removed by the arrival of a waiter at the secluded table. dream was grateful for their intervention because it gave him the chance to catch his breath which he didn't realise he'd been holding in anticipation. As Sapnap gave his order, Dream took the opportunity to admire him further since he wouldn't notice it. A silver chain hung from his neck and if he wasn't imagining things , there was a small tattoo on his right bicep.

"And for you sir?" The waiter turned to him expectantly.

Dream hadn't payed attention to what Sapnap had chosen, nor had he even read through the menu but he wasn't going to admit that.

"The same," he answered with as much confidence as he could muster up.

A nod from the waiter lead him to intense but the sly and mocking expression Sapnap bore let him know that he hadn't been as slick and subtle as he would've liked to think.

"Did you even hear what I ordered?" He asked, the amusement evident in his voice.

"No," Dream found himself blurting out before he could stop "please tell me you didn't order something gross like cow liver."

Sapnap's face was deadpan, totally neutral and unreadable "that's my favourite," and he kept it like that for a moment to internally snigger at Dream's expression of utter horror "I'm joking dude, I ordered steak don't worry."

Dream's eyes widened comically as he exclaimed "you dickhead!" but they both knew his words weren't genuine.

"Maybe," Sapnap shrugged indifferently "but it's not really my problem, you were the one who couldn't look away from me long enough to read it."

“And what if I was,” Dream retorted “I can’t help it when you look like that.”

It was Sapnap’s turn to flush brightly and the two fell into a natural flow of teasing comments as they got to know each other further. Dream was surprised at how easy talking to Sapnap came to him, there was never a dull or silent moment in their conversation and he didn’t have to overthink it or portray himself in a certain way. Something that he hadn’t experienced in a long time.

Sapnap was in his final year of college, studying computer science which surprised Dream considering he worked in it. He was freaking out way more than he’d liked to admit over this information but kept it hidden behind a collected facade. Part of him was a bit worried about being five years older than Sapnap before coming on the date but they had so many common interests and meshed so well that those thoughts were quickly silenced.

The tattoo on his bicep was a little one of a cat. Not the first thing Dream was expecting given his aesthetic and personality but he learnt that Sapnap had three cats and that the tattoo had been a dare while on a night out and it had been the first thing to come to mind. Nevertheless Dream found it adorable how it completely juxtaposed his appearance.

As the two were finishing up their steak, Dream felt his phone vibrating in the back pocket of his jeans. Worry instantly overcame him, he’d left it on do not disturb for everyone except George and Wilbur in case there was an emergency with Tubbo or something went wrong. Obviously something had happened. It was a shame that it had to occur in the middle of his date and that said date would probably hate him for ditching and he’d ruin any chances at love for the foreseeable future. But Tubbo was his number one priority and that wasn’t going to change, no matter how much it hurt him.

Visions of all his worst nightmares sprang to the forefront of his mind and Dream cursed his active imagination because it really wasn’t helping put him at ease. How could he try to reassure himself that it wasn’t anything too serious, hope that things were alright when all of the worst scenarios imaginable were tormenting him.

He winced slightly as he faced the concerned expression Sapnap wore. “I’m really sorry for this but I have to go, like now, it’s urgent.”

“Oh,” the other man breathed softly, not knowing how to react or what to say.

“My friend called, I told them not to unless it was an emergency. I’m sorry Sapnap.”

Before the younger man even had a chance to check he was alright or say goodbye, Dream had gotten up from the table and left some money on the side for the meal. Part of him was tempted to go back and make it a rain check and that they’d continue this date another time, but he had a feeling this just fucked everything up. Sapnap probably believed he was lying and just trying to get away from the date but no matter how much it hurt both of them, it was easier than explaining that he was a single dad this early on in a potential relationship.

Dream overtook a string of slow vehicles and was definitely going above the speed limit. But that wasn’t his concern even though it should have been. He needed to get to Tubbo. To make sure he was safe and help solve whatever problem had arisen. While stuck at a red light he texted George to let him know that he was on the way home, he would’ve called, demanding to know what happened but he knew it would just stress him out even more and there would be no way he could focus on driving.

When he reached the apartment building that he’d been at just a few hours prior, Dream nearly forgot to lock his car in his haste to get to Tubbo. He ran up the stairs at a speed that he didn’t know was possible in his current physical state and banged harshly on the wooden door to get their attention. Wilbur opened it quickly and guided him over to the room where the boy’s had been sleeping.

And curled up in a little ball over a bowl of what appeared to be vomit was Tubbo. Pearlescent and trembling but still reaching out towards him, longing for the comfort of his dad. Tommy was patting his arm awkwardly, unsure as to how he could support and help him but wanting to help or reassure his best friend somehow.

Dream pulled Tubbo close to his chest, not caring if he ended up getting sick on him. After raising a baby all by himself from day one, that didn’t phase him. In the back of his mind Sapnap lingered along with the pure bliss he’d experienced on their date. He wanted desperately to say he regretted leaving without much of an explanation but it was easier this way. It had to be.

[mythrilhusk]

Korosensei Never Dies - Chapter 7

Words - 2,153 AO3 Version Chapter 6 (Last)

Chapter 8 (Next)

TW: vague body horror, violence, threats

The floor trembles as a nearby generator turns on to power the flickering lights. The sterile brightness slices painfully through Ranboo's head. He winces and tries to cover his eyes, only to discover his wrists are bound behind his metal chair. Out of curiousity, he tries to move his feet. Also bound. The taste of dry cotton in his mouth warns of the muffled noises he produces when he tries to shout. 

Lacking options, Ranboo takes in his surroundings. The tight, grimy walls and lack of windows hint that he could be in a bunker. For the moment, his mind is calmly blank, clear of panic, but that could change in an instant. Not this again. Ranboo shakes his head. His fingers reach and clench in thin air, desperate to cling to his book, feel the glittery cover, see the bright colors of the kittens dolphins. 

Sounds of muffled outrage echo through the otherwise silent halls. Ranboo perks up, listening intently. He can't tell who else is in this predicament with him. 

What happened? Blurry flashes of terror, of pain, of rage, boil just beneath the level of recollection. The dart in his neck, spitting poison into his veins, weakening his limbs- 

He can't recall anything. Not even the terror as his friends scream for help, scream in anger, what are they angry for, why are they scared, why are you scared? 

Ranboo clenches his eyes closed, trying to shut out the creeping panic and the soft voice. 

You're scared because you hurt them.

Ranboo shakes his head frantically. No! No, he would never hurt anyone.

But you would. And you did. They're all here, now, because of your little display. Oh, you won't die. But does he need them?

Who's he?? Ranboo glares at the wall, unable to visualize the voice that sounds so very familiar.

"Aren't you an unusual find." The man slouches in the door, draped in an oversized purple hoodie. "Heh. Techno will want you back, won't he." 

Ranboo scowls at the man as best he can with a sock in his mouth. Technoblade and Philza wouldn't care if he disappeared. 

"You want to talk? Too bad. Maybe later. You don't get privileges after what you did to us." 

The sock contains Ranboo's shouts and curses. 

The man smiles grimly and turns, limping out. "Your friends are fine. For now. Fuck up and one of them dies." 

Tears leak out of Ranboo's eyes, burning and blurring his vision. He hangs his head and trembles with small, miserable sobs. He can't even remember what he did to deserve this.

++++

It's the weekend after exams. Summer vacation. And that means time to fuck shit up. Philza has given out a schedule for the fighting classes, so he'll be preoccupied with that, but Technoblade has other plans. 

Techno strides out of the building, narrowing his eyes at the camouflaged form of Awesamdude in the trees. The government security agent has been watching him for a while. Techno's not technically allowed out of Sam's perimeter around the building, but rules are for losers. 

"Techno." Sam greets him as Techno strides past. "Where are you going?" 

Techno wrinkles his nose, wishing he'd transformed into his chrysaor state earlier. Human form tends to be limiting, and the boar-like attributes, not to mention the multiple sets of wings, are useful for intimidation purposes. "Oh, nowhere in particular. I just thought I'd boost the economy of the nearby town with some of your president's money." 

"Have you seen Tommy anywhere?" 

"Mm, no. I'd assume he's on vacation." 

"Interesting." Sam's expression is completely unreadable. The leaves behind him make a fascinating shape, almost like a dog. Techno stares at the waving greenery, failing to catch Sam's next words. 

"What's that? The leaves distracted me." 

"I said, I got a strange call from him, but now I can't find him anywhere." 

"That's odd." Techno yawns. The kid is probably off gallivanting somewhere and laughing about pranking Sam. "Did you try Quackity's treehouse?" 

"No- he has a treehouse? Where?" 

"Forget I said anything." Technoblade waves a dismissive hand. 

"Tell me, Techno." Sam growls. 

Technoblade considers the effort of intimidating Sam, added to the potential backlash onto Philza, and decides it's totally worth it. "Oh, I'm keeping you safe. It's for your own good." 

"Huh? Techno, what do you mean?" 

"Quackity and the Ducklings will shoot first." Technoblade lets a slow smile crack across his face. He can see Quackity sneaking up behind Sam. 

"They're teens, how aggressive can they be?" 

"We sharpen the motherfucking bones of our enemies and use them to slaughter every bastard who stands in our way." Quackity drops down from the tree, grinning wickedly. "Oh, and Tommy isn't at our place, either. I was just looking for him." 

"Quackity." Techno greets the teen with equanimity. 

"Techno." Quackity returns in the exact same tone. 

"Uh, alright, I'm going to go see if Tubbo knows." Sam moves off awkwardly. "Techno, don't leave the perimeter. I will know." 

"Will you, now." Techno returns in a slow drawl. 

"I've got the kill switch, Techno. Don't push me." Sam scowls, then yelps as Quackity kicks him in the shin.  

"Fucking don't ever threaten the old man again, you bastard." 

"Don't let Phil hear you call him that." Techno reproaches with a grim smile. 

"Alright, alright!" Sam cries, losing the battle for his dignity as Quackity manages to steal his cap and then proceeds to wear it. "Techno, go ahead, but if you hurt anyone in the town, there will be consequences." 

"Who said anything about killing? There's no major governmental figures down there. They're safe from me." 

Sam gives a pained sigh and then strides off to look for Tommy. Quackity sticks his tongue out at Techno, then trots to catch up with Sam, still wearing the agent's hat. 

Techno heaves a relieved sigh at finally being alone and free to wander. Hidden in the seclusion of the trees, he stretches out his wings and breathes in the aromatic air. The thousands of souls murmuring in his veins hunger for blood. Not yet, though. Not quite yet. 

++++

Wilbur keeps his eyes closed, feigning sleep as he examines his situation. His feet are free, but his wrists are bound, and there's a gag tied around his mouth. He can hear Tommy beside him, raging through his own gag. Charlie whimpers on Tommy's other side. 

Where's Eret and Ranboo?? What the hell happened?? Wilbur tries to think back.

<<~rewind~<< 

Eret suggested building a treehouse like the Ducklings'. He said he knew a good place for it, so Wilbur and Tommy followed him. Charlie tagged along, cracking terrible jokes with Wilbur. 

After passing the perimeter, which seemed to have been deactivated, Eret stopped at a huge tree. Ranboo showed up out of the blue, disoriented and asking Eret why he was there. 

And then- and then- what happened? 

Wings, so many wings, bird and bat and beetle and butterfly- 

Ranboo transformed. There's no other way to say it. The quiet, creepy boy who had always sat at the back of the classroom went absolutely feral for no goddamn reason. 

A man appeared, dropping from the trees, buried in an oversized hoodie. He was unfamiliar, but Eret fought by his side like they'd sparred together before. Ranboo, or whatever creature Ranboo had become, grew weaker and slower by the moment, lashing out at whatever was closest. Wilbur dragged Tommy away from the fight and tried to flee. 

Charlie was wounded while trying to break up the fight and calm Ranboo down. Tommy screamed and tried to run back to save him. Wilbur had to follow, he couldn't let his idiot friend die on his own. 

Eret stepped back as Ranboo finally fell unconscious to the ground. The mutant-- or angel-- looked almost adorable, lying there in a limp puddle of wings and eyes and claws. Tommy pulled bandages out of his backpack and started binding Charlie's wounds. 

Wilbur remembers the next few moments vividly. 

"Eret, fucking help me!" Tommy snapped. 

"No hard feelings, boys." Eret said. 

A dart pricked Wilbur's arm. Tommy shrieked as he was darted as well. "You bastard, you fuckin basss..." He didn't get to finish his words. 

Unable to move, Wilbur soon followed Tommy into unconsciousness. 

>>~present~>>

Remembering the events only leaves Wilbur with more questions. But one of them is about to be answered. The man in the hoodie stands over him, his heavy footsteps so unlike Eret's. 

"I know you're awake, Wilbur." 

Wilbur opens his eyes and shrugs eloquently. 

"I want you to write a letter." 

Wilbur makes an agreeable noise through the gag.

"Alright, I'll take the gag off. There's nobody near for miles, so screaming won't do anything besides piss me off." 

"Who are you?" Wilbur asks as soon as the gag is off. 

"Purpled." The man checks his wrists to make sure they're still tightly bound. 

"What would you like me to write?" Wilbur attempts civility. There's no point in pissing off his captor yet. 

"A ransom note." Purpled doesn't smile as he moves to check Tommy's wrists. Tommy attempts to headbutt him, but recieves a smack for his trouble. 

"Don't fucking touch Tommy, you son of a bitch." Wilbur snarls, anger sparking in his eyes. 

"Alright." Purpled laughs, pissing Wilbur off further. "Eret, got a pencil and paper?" 

"Yes, sir." Eret limps inside, one arm dangling, broken. 

"I hope it hurts like hell." Wilbur glares at him, baring his teeth. 

"Ha... I assure you, it hurts plenty." Eret gives a small, guilty laugh. "But you'll all be safe. We aren't going to hurt any of you. All we need is bait." 

Purpled unties Wilbur's hands. "Be good." 

"He just said none of us will be hurt." Wilbur retorts, stretching his sore fingers. "What're you going to do if I try to escape?" 

"I'll kill Tommy." Purpled says darkly. 

Wilbur shoots a venomous glare at Eret. "Hm??" 

Eret puts the pencil and paper on a nearby table and moves to the door silently. Purpled answers for him, "We don't plan to hurt you if everyone behaves. But step a toe out of line, and someone will get hurt." 

"What do you want me to write?" Wilbur decides to change the subject. He won't let Tommy be hurt, no matter what. 

++++

Technoblade returns to the school at night, practically inhaling pockies from the several boxes he acquired in the town. The townspeople had freaked out upon his arrival, but they'd been amenable to contributing food in return for his timely departure without harming anyone. 

He enters the school building and flicks on the lights. Philza tilts his head up, raising the brim of his hat to peer at Techno with narrowed eyes. "You're back late." 

"I got distracted." Read: there were fluffy dogs, and Techno gave all of them pats. "Want some pocky?" 

"Sure, mate." Philza catches the box thrown to him, and snaps one of the chocolate-covered biscuits between his teeth. "I just got some troubling news, Techno. But I want you to stay out of this one. I have reason to think it's a trap." 

Techno shrugs with a dry grin. "You really think I'd let myself be taken down by a trap? What's going on?" 

"It's Purpled, mate." 

"Oh." Technoblade clenches his claws into fists, his eyes darkening. "What makes you think I don't want revenge?" 

"I know you do, Techno." Philza says apologetically. "But it ain't safe. He's gotta be working with Schlatt, you know that. If Schlatt is making a move, that means he's got something up his sleeve he thinks can take care of you." He chomps another pocky. "Look, I'll take care of this one." 

Techno strides up to Philza and snatches him up by his coat. "I can't let you be captured, too." He growls. He can't let Philza be taken away, not again.

"I won't be. I'll get help." Philza smiles and presses his hand to Techno's bristly cheek. Techno pulls him into an embrace. "There, there, you big lug, I'll be fine." 

"What happened?" 

"Purpled kidnapped some of your students. Wilbur, Tommy, Charlie, and Ranboo. Eret helped him. I just got the ransom note." 

Technoblade drops Philza with a gruff snort and turns away. "I'm coming with." 

"No, you're not." Philza retorts. "It's a trap." 

"How can you be sure it's not a trap for you, too?? I can't- I can't let them take you, Philza, I can't." 

"If Schlatt wanted me, he'd have me. He's got President Skeppy in his pocket. You know that." 

"Take Sam." Techno growls. "If you refuse to take me with you, at least take Sam." 

"I already asked. He's not allowed to interfere." 

"He will be held accountable if you're harmed." 

"I'll be okay, mate." 

"You better be, Philza. Or I don't know what I'll do." Technoblade gives a dry, ragged laugh. That's a lie. He knows exactly what he'll do. 

Chapter 8 (Next)

[dreamsclock]

'Dream wasanipulating them in the visits' dream when asked if he was treated well: yeah I'm fine I get fed! When asked if hes okay: I like to play pranks! If sam is treating him right: yeah, hes doing his job!

Like dreams doing a real awful job of manipulating the people that come to visit bc not only does he insist hes fine, the moment people leave they just dont think about him anymore like tommy didnt come back to revisit and bad has the egg to deal with.

I feel like no matter what dream does it will always seem like manipulation, starts being honest about the way hes been treated-youre just trying to make me feel bad for you to release you >:(, goes quiet-now you're trying to make yourself look pitiful so I feel bad for you, you said you're losing your mind bc the prison is very inhumane-well you should have thought about that before you went all evil :/

No matter what he does he'll be seen as a manipulator and if hes only ever going to be seen as a bad guy why try to be the good guy yknow?

you hit the nail on the head, anon! i swear we’re all a hivemind, because i was just about to make a post on this.

let’s talk manipulation for a second. there are two definitions - “control or influence (a person or situation) cleverly or unscrupulously” AND “alter or present (data) so as to mislead”. time and time again we see dream manipulate people, making them turn on themselves and each other and everything they care about. we see him do this specifically to tubbo and tommy (we have confirmation ooc that the voice in ranboo’s head is NOT dream, so i’m leaving ranboo out for now). 

the exile arc - both tubbo and tommy are manipulated. dream tells tommy he’s the only one who cares, that he’s his friend, that things are going better without him in l’manburg. this is both methods of manipulation, and he does the exact same to tubbo - telling him tommy doesn’t want to see him, telling him he’s his friend, deliberately appearing as an ally, all to get the discs. he was clever, cunning, driving the knife home where it hurt for both of them and putting a band-aid over it and eventually getting them to thank him for it, basically. we as the audience know this is manipulation, because of dream’s tone of voice/in-game body language, because of the context, because we know dream’s role in the story.

he’s not being clever in prison. he’s manipulating the information he’s giving out, but if anything, he’s turning people that would want to help him AGAINST him - reassuring bad he’s fine and gets enough food, refusing to elaborate on his reasons for striking, telling bad that the warden treats him well. the information we learn about dream does nothing to tell us he’s being mistreated, other than the snippets of information he seems not to class as important or slips up in telling us. 

examining dream’s body language in-game and paying extra special attention to his voice acting helps us figure out that dream is not being manipulative. i’m gonna make a whole post on body language and voice later (yey, theatre kid things), but if you analyse it and notice how DIFFERENT it is from how he usually speaks/acts, you can see very clearly that he’s,, genuinely suffering.

i doubt his apology to tommy was real. it was far too early and incredibly too good to be true. but now? people insist every little thing smp!dream says and does is manipulation.

the thing is, we knew about it as the audience before. and i’m positive that we would be very very aware if dream was doing the same now. the context is different - dream’s role as the villain has been taken away from him now. he hasn’t suddenly lost the ability to manipulate, which is what it would look like if he really was trying to be manipulative in prison. he’s HURTING, he’s suffering, and no matter what he says/does, you’re right anon, he’s always gonna be seen as just manipulating us.

[thefanficdude]

The Winter Months: OCTOBER, Part 4 (CHAPTER FINALE)

TRIGGER WARNING: Implied character death

Wilbur was wrong in his predictions. What should have come in another two days came today. Sure, two days doesn’t seem like a lot, but to the village, it meant life or death. Just one more day and Tommy would’ve been able to find food, Tubbo would’ve mastered his ability, and Phil… Well, it’s best not to spoil the best part.

While everyone was making really rushed winter preparations, Tubbo was put in charge to keep watch of the forest by Wilbur himself.

“Why do you need me to look after the forest?” Tubbo asked. “Wouldn’t somebody else be better?”

“Tubbo, don’t be so humble,” Wilbur said, putting a hand on Tubbo’s shoulder. “You’re the best person for the job because I know you’ll do the job perfectly.” In reality, everyone else was busy and Tubbo was the only one available. Tubbo knew that but agreed anyway. After all, he could practise using his ability while walking around.

So there Tubbo was, walking around the snow-covered leaves, keeping watch but not actually paying attention to anything around him. Every once in a while he’d stop, move aside some snow and leaves with his feet and pick up some dirt underneath. Of course, he wasn’t using his hands. Tubbo was practicing his ability. He made chunks of dirt float around his hand in a smooth animation, occasionally making a shape or an imitation of something he saw, like an animal that didn’t expect winter to come so soon either.

When Tubbo felt comfortable enough with the amount of dirt he had, he picked up a little more. The more there was to control, the harder it was to focus on every little part of it. To make it all do as he commanded, he needed to command every little piece, speck, and atom of it, otherwise, it would fall. Tubbo was quite good at controlling large amounts of earth, but it needed his full attention. It wouldn’t work if he was in a conversation or in a battle where he needed to focus on other things as well, but that’s something he would be taught in combat training.

Tubbo wasn’t sure how to feel about combat training. When he was little, he and Tommy would excitedly talk about the day they would be able to qualify for it. Naturally, even though he was younger than Tubbo, Tommy was the one to have training first. Tommy always encouraged Tubbo the best he could. Tubbo accepted the compliments but knew he would never be to the same skill level as him. And Tubbo was ok with that. He loved seeing his best friend - no, his brother - succeed in a way he never could. Tubbo admired how much potential Tommy saw in him but knew it was all just talk. Tommy was very good at talking, except when he was talking with girls. Oh, the many disasters of Tommy attempting to talk to a girl.

Tubbo continued to fiddle with dirt until a twig snapped in the distance. The dirt quickly fell to the ground as Tubbo turned his head to the source of the sound. He searched the woods for whatever made the sound but found nothing.

Must’ve been an animal, Tubbo thought. But it’s snowing. What animal that big would be outside right now instead of hibernating? Another stick broke in the distance, but it was now on the opposite side of him. No animal can travel that fast without being seen. Tubbo knew at that moment this wasn’t an animal. He picked up a little bit of dirt to prepare for the worst.

“Show yourself!” Tubbo shouted into the forestry. Small bits of dirt fell back to the ground as he did. “There’s no use hiding!” Tubbo heard something like a poof behind him.

“I’m not hiding.”

“AH-” Tubbo fell to the ground, surprised by the sudden appearance of the man behind him.

“Oh no, I didn’t mean to scare you!” The man knelt down to offer help. “Are you ok?” Tubbo sat up, rubbing the shoulder he landed on.

“I’m fine,” Tubbo looked at the man and realized he wasn’t familiar. He wore a rather sharp suit with a red tie, and a half-white mask. His hair was dirty blonde and very fluffy and long, it almost entirely covered his sunglasses. Tubbo clumsily crawled backwards away from him. “Wait, who are you!? You aren’t from my village!”

“I know,” He said, adjusting himself to sit comfortably on the ground. “My name is Ranboo. I’m from a town not so far from here. I was told to come into these woods to, as he said it, ‘be a distraction. I’m not sure how much of a distraction I am if there’s only one person in these woods though.” Tubbo thought for a moment.

“A town…” It suddenly clicked. “You’re with Dream.” Ranboo nodded.

“But don’t worry, I’m not nearly as violent as him,” Ranboo assured. “I actually don’t agree with most of his morals. But he keeps my friends and me safe, so I stick around.” Tubbo gave an understanding nod but didn’t fully understand. Dream was the bad guy, or so he was told. “You’re with Phil, right?” Ranboo asked.

“Well, the leadership has since been handed to Phil’s son, Wilbur.”

“Ah, I see. I didn’t know that. Sorry for your loss.”

“Loss?” Tubbo was a little lost.

“Well, the power is given to the child when the leader passes on,” Ranboo said. “That means Phil has… continued in another life.”

“What? No, Phil is still alive,” Tubbo explained. “He stepped down to teach Wilbur how to rule.” Realization hit Ranboo.

“Oh,” He stopped to think. “Oh, that’s not good.”

“Why is that not good?” Tubbo asked. “I think it was a rather smart choice on his part.”

“No, I mean… didn’t you see the letter we sent?”

“Yes, Wilbur told us about it,” Tubbo said. “He told us it said George has left us and joined Dream.”

“Nothing else?” Ranboo asked.

“No, that’s all he said,” Tubbo replied. Ranboo grabbed Tubbo’s hand.

“Listen to me, I tried to stop them, trust me, but they wouldn’t listen. All Dream wants is chaos and I don’t know why.”

“Woah, slow down,” Tubbo said. “What are you talking about?”

“Look, I don’t know who you are,” Ranboo said. “But you need to trust me. We sent that letter to Phil. The letter was a declaration of war.” Tubbo made himself free of Ranboo’s grip.

“Why are you telling me this?” Tubbo asked.

“Because if your leader won’t tell you, I will,” Ranboo said. “In the letter, it said we’d kill your leader the week of the first snow.” Ranboo took a breath. “We didn’t know Wilbur is now your leader.” Tubbo hurriedly stood up, but Ranboo stayed put and his gaze simply followed him. “You need to save Phil.”

There was no way this was happening. He was just a kid. This shouldn’t be a responsibility put on him. Tubbo’s thoughts swirled like a storm in his head.

“How do I know you’re telling the truth?” Tubbo asked.

“Because I want Dream gone as much as you do.” Ranboo didn’t hesitate. He was telling the truth, and Tubbo knew it. “You don’t have much time. You need to go, now.” Tubbo took a couple of steps but looked back at Ranboo. He offered his hand to Ranboo.

“You can come too,” Tubbo said. “If you truly don’t like Dream, you can join us and take him down.” Ranboo smiled, but lightly pushed Tubbo’s hand away.

“Thanks, but I think I’m better as a spy,” Ranboo said, standing up. “Come out here every day at dawn and I’ll give you updates.”

“How do I know you’ll be ok?” Tubbo asked. Ranboo laughed.

“You literally just met me,” He said. “How do you trust me so quickly? Why do you care?” Tubbo shrugged.

“I guess you could say it’s a weakness.” Tubbo turned around to head back to the village.

“Wait!” Ranboo called out. Tubbo turned around. “What’s your name?” Tubbo smiled.

“Tubbo,” He said. “But you can call me Toby.”

“Ok,” Ranboo said with a smile. “Nice to meet you, Toby.” And with that, Ranboo disappeared with a poof.

Where the hell did he go? Tubbo wondered, but then remembered what Ranboo had said. His expression turned serious.

I need to get back to the village.

~~~

Tubbo ran through the forest, thinking of all the questions he wanted to ask Wilbur and Phil.

Why didn���t you tell us?

When did you get it?

Why didn’t you tell us you’re going to die?

He couldn’t think of a single answer to any of these that made sense, or an answer that would explain why they didn’t say anything. Then he started questioning himself.

How can I trust Ranboo?

Who should I tell first?

Should I go to Wilbur right away?

Should I tell Tommy?

As Tubbo ran through the forest, he realized how thick the snow had gotten on the ground already. If Tubbo had to guess, he’d say there was about 1-2 cm. It wasn’t a lot, but it was enough to make the woods look like a winter wonderland. It would’ve shimmered like the ocean if it weren’t so cloudy.

Phil was supposed to keep a part of the sky open for Eret.

The snow should’ve been shimmering. Phil’s task was to open the clouds so that Eret could guide the sunlight to the greenhouse. But the sky was closed. The depressing tone of grey covered the light blue skies as far as Tubbo could see.

He might’ve just run out of energy, Tubbo thought. Phil is getting pretty old, he may be just taking a break. Please let him be taking a break. Don’t be dead, don’t be dead, don’t be dead. Ranboo said they were going to attack sometime during the week, not the exact day of the first snow. It’s more likely Phil’s just taking a break. Tubbo tried reasoning with his own mind. Everything was going to turn out well. It had to. It had to because they were the good guys, and Dream is the bad guy. In all the stories Tubbo had heard, the heroes always won, so they had to as well. Tubbo wouldn’t be able to keep himself sane if it wasn’t so.

Unfortunately, he wasn’t the only one that would be struggling in the same way.

Tubbo got to the clearing of the village, still running because a life depended on it. It wasn’t until he saw everyone huddled closely together in the center of the village that he realized he was out of breath. Tubbo tried to make his breathing normal again as he walked towards the gathering.

As he got closer, he heard something. Laughter? No, it was much more uncontrollable than laughter.

Crying. Sobbing.

It was coming from Wilbur.

Tubbo pushed his way through a thin layer of crowd to see what was happening. He would later wish he didn’t.

There, surrounded by his people, a leader - a son - held his father’s corpse.

Tubbo was too late.

Wilbur cradled Phil in his arms, covered in his blood and picturely framed by black feathers. Tubbo had never seen Phil’s wings so bare, nor his skin so pale or an arrow shot through his heart. Looking at the scene, one could think Phil was still breathing, but it was Wilbur and his uncontrollable sobbing that made himself and his father move in such uncanny ways. The sound of Wilbur’s tears was a sound like no other; the person who’s always been the strongest and always been the rock of the people was now on the ground before them, experiencing the worst, and only emotion he’d never felt before. This emotion was called grief, and the emotion itself could be broken down into stages, but Wilbur wasn’t even on the first. He was still in shock, just like everyone else.

Tubbo looked around at everyone else who was there. Tommy was standing quietly and solemnly. He was shaking but did not allow himself to cry. Niki was sobbing on Eret’s shoulder, and Eret cried silently while holding Niki’s hand in comfort. And Tubbo… Tubbo didn’t know what to do or what to feel. So instead, he felt everything at once. He was sad, but there were no tears. He was angry at himself for not coming sooner. He hated Ranboo for not reaching out sooner. If Tubbo had come back sooner, maybe he would have saved Phil. Maybe he could’ve done something. Maybe he…

But the thoughts did nothing because he could not change the past. He could only deal with the present and prepare for the unknowable future.

“He…” Wilbur tried speaking, but his voice cracked. He swallowed and tried again. “We fought a few days ago. His last thought was… ‘I love you. I’m sorry.’' Wilbur's lips curled and he buried his head into Phil’s shoulder as more tears came from his eyes. Nobody could even imagine the pain Wilbur was feeling. To lose a parent is to lose a part of yourself. A piece of Wilbur died with Phil.

Tommy knelt down and put a hand on Wilbur’s shoulder, but Wilbur didn’t react. He continued to sob into his father’s cold shoulder. He accepted the comfort, yet didn’t acknowledge it. Tommy didn’t care. He was there for his brother, and that’s all that mattered to him.

Everyone stayed there for 20 minutes, watching Wilbur give his final goodbye to his dad, and giving their silent condolences while also grieving. Eventually, Wilbur's crying went quiet, though nobody would be able to say when if you asked them. It faded out so slowly that nobody realized it was going until it was gone.

Wilbur sat up, Phil still laying on his lap. He looked up at everyone, tears still streaming down his face.

“It was supposed to be me,” Wilbur said. “And now I’ll never be able to say sorry to him.”

[dystopiandilfs]

honestly yeah, ever since the whole uk trip thing started, i’ve gotten that vibe from him and it’s upsetting! i never had an issue with him prior to this and i’ve been feeling this way for about 3 weeks now. he talks to his chat sometimes like we’re stupid and i get it, a lot of the audience doesn’t quite understand things or is ignorant sometimes, but even then, he’s still using such a condescending tone to explain things???? it’s just frustrating bc he thinks he knows it all bc he’s the cc and we’re the viewers but he needs to realize that him being the cc doesn’t make him all-knowing or more informed about certain things than us. and i feel bad thinking this and feeling this bc he really is a nice person to watch and i enjoy watching him, but it’s just been a bit frustrating as of late

I do think that a large amount of it is down to his switch from the stan side to the creator side. People are going to be more entitled because he came from the same place. I love Ranboo but he needs to realise that a lot of his fans don't have the mindset of him being a creator and "he's not your friend". They still treat him like a mutual stan account. But it goes both ways he needs to realise that we're all on the same level, he's not better than his fans, he's not worse than them. I do think the hivemind mentality is starting to appear.

I think he needs to realise that there's no point trying to communicate with his audience in the same way as stans do with each other because unfortunately creators quickly become so distant from it that instead of it coming across like him being in on a joke it looks like mocking. He can't act the same with his audience as he does with people like Tubbo because it's not the same.

In my opinion he needs to take time off to realise that his situation has changed and that he needs to approach things differently. It's not his fault but it's just the downside of being a stan turned creator you lose sense of reality especially when the switch is fast. Especially when switching platforms for example Tubbo thrives more because he's a streamer who posts on youtuber rather than a youtuber turned streamer. Honestly Ranboo cares too much about pleasing people.

It's sad but if you look at the creators who get shit on the most by fans and are held to a higher standard it's always the ones who want to please people more than make content because they want to make it. Not saying that people like Tubbo, Sapnap etc don't care about their fans but they play games that they want to play, they make content that they want to make. Compare Sapnap and Tubbo playing games because they want to and only streaming it because they think it'd be fun vs Ranboo who plays games because "I had people spamming me to play this game because they wanted to watch me play it" A good middle ground is Dream he does his podcasts when he feels like it, when he wants to stream he asks if anyone wants to and joins their streams instead of people pleasing. The Dream Team basketball streams are them just streaming what they do when they're bored.

Ranboo needs to not have a schedule and honestly it will be so much better for his mental health and sanity. I think him setting times for streams is a strangely high contributor to his change in mindset because if he's a minute late people will spam him and constantly mention it. Yes he gets more viewers but that also means more stress,

TLDR; Ranboo needs to just take a week off and when he comes back he needs to only stream when he wants to instead of having a schedule and when he streams to do a rough timing rather than an exact one for his own mental health.