#incorrect irish mythology

[godsofhumanity]

Cu Chulainn: Just want to wish Ferdiad the most special, magical birthday ever. I love you with all my heart. Cu Chulainn: Also, happy birthday to my wife, Emer.

[incorrect-ulster-cycle]

Cú Chulainn: You want what I have.

Fer Diad: A stupid name and a death wish?

[15pantheons]

Bres: When I first met you, I did not like you.  Lugh: I'm aware of that.  Bres: But then you and I had some time together.  Lugh: Uh-huh?  Bres: It did not get better. 

[colleenbrooke]

Some incorrect fianna quotes made with the Perchance Incorrect Quotes Generator:

Caoilte: Oisín learned how to fold origami penguins from Diarmuid the other day. I told him, “I feel a little bad for the penguins, it’s hot here”, and the next day he put them in the fridge.

Fionn: Goll is not allowed to decide which one of us is the chosen one.

Fionn: I told Conán that his ears turn red when he lie.

Diarmuid: Does he though?

Fionn: No.

Diarmuid: Then why did you tell him that?

Fionn: Because I can do this.

Fionn: Hey Conán! Do you love us?

Conán, with his hands over his ears: No.

Caoilte: I won a new phone in a race.

Oisín: Huh? What kind of race lets you win a phone, Caoilte?

Caoilte: A race between the store owner, the cop, and me.

Fionn: You saved me! Why?

Goll: People would think I murdered you if I didn't.

Caoilte: I love you.

Fionn: How many people have you said that to?

Caoilte: Everyone.

Fionn: What?

Caoilte: I told everyone that I love you.

[atlantic-riona]

hi, welcome to medieval Irish literature, where everybody dies

[pomefioredove]

so yesterday I theorized that the fae in twst could be french, possibly breton inspiration, and was mercifully corrected by @tresgansosenunabrigo who actually knows things about french folklore unlike meee

we had a really good talk, which breathed life into a thought of mine about Briar Valley being parallel to ancient Irish mythology, that I had brushed off as insane months ago

some of the following is an old essay that I wrote, that I now find very very... um, incomplete at best, incorrect at worst. I've done my best to put out something more accurate, relevant, and interesting

but, for the sake of this essay: this is only for speculative purposes in the context of fiction. I am only drawing small parallels, and this is not a theory. I am not a teacher. I am not claiming to know everything. I'm just some guy who reads

a brief forward:

my credentials are "religious studies major" and not much else. I am not Irish, nor am I pagan, and my knowledge/study in Irish mythology is very secondary to Catholicism. I have been close to and spoken to a handful of experts within the field but am not one myself.

furthermore, I look to old/historical sources for knowledge, and reject eclectic and appropriative wiccan ideas. this has been a seven year long labor of love, but I'm still not perfect, and continue to sift through my sources every day. The misinformation that eclectics have created about Irish mythology have made way into books, into articles, into common belief, so it is, in fact very difficult not to internalize misinformation. I'm trying </3

and I am begging anyone in this field to correct any mistakes I make.

additionally I've only read a little bit of book 7 so I may be totally crazy. this is just a speculative piece, after all.

a glossary of knowledge:

for the purpose of this essay, I may use "fae" as an umbrella term, which includes pixies, medieval French fae, the aos sí, and the Tuatha de Danann*

*please note that the Tuatha de were gods in their original sources, but were changed to fairies, other supernatural beings, and occasionally kings in later Catholicized retellings.

I will be focusing most on ancient beliefs, with vague mentions of medieval/post-Catholicism ones. Catholicism is extremely important in the context of these stories, as it was the Catholic monks who preserved them in written form, and it's quite literally impossible not to mention. it's had a huge influence.

etc.

when talking about folklore, mythology, or religion, it's literally impossible to draw definite lines. it's why I hate when people say "well this religion stole this thing!" because religions intermingle, they share, they swap, they sometimes even meld with each other into something unique. ever-changing and different and the same. the Romans adopted their beliefs from the Greeks, and they shared gods with the Gauls, and then Christianity used the image of Jupiter as God. a big part of being a history major is understanding how to draw connections between cultures and peoples.

Admittedly, I am not familiar with the French idea of fae. I know that it is medieval. post-Christianity. it's a fairly loose term that denotes a "magical woman, skilled with words, herbs and stones" (via Wikipedia) and not much else. this is relevant to the Sleeping Beauty story, in which all the fairies are women. Maleficent's guards are not fairies, but ghouls (is that the right word?). I couldn't tell you the exact origin of French fairies, but it's not far-fetched to say they could have had "Celtic"* influence

*in reference to more than one culture in this context. scottish, manx, welsh, irish, etc

It is, perhaps, more important to add that French fairies are romantic figures in nature. very... fairy-tale esque. characters such as the fairy godmother and the good fairies in Perrault's version of Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty are good examples of this.

TWST fae... are... a little different. obviously. while it may be easy to simply argue that "it's twisted, so they're darker" or "Briar Valley is based off Maleficent's domain so of course it's dark", it's implied (and shown!) that good entities come from Briar Valley, too. pixies exist in TWST, for example. then there are the good fairies from Sleeping Beauty, which have to exist alongside Maleficent in the canon of TWST. The fae here are layered, much more so than in their sources.

This is where I start seeing shit.

war, weapons, and invasion

When speculating on the influence of French folklore in Briar Valley, I was told that "war" is a rather uncommon thing in their stories. Invasion is, of course, an imperative theme in Briar Valley history, in Lilia's background, and in book 7 as a whole. So. I get thinking.

The war between the fae and the humans carries significant parallels to the war between the Tuatha de Danann and the humans in the Lebor Gabála Érenn, the Book of Invasions, wherein the "fae" and the humans warred over land and resources until the former were driven out of Ireland and the humans became the ancestors of the modern Irish. And by "parallels" I mean this exact thing happens. THE EXACT THING. The Book of Invasions was literally the first thing I thought about when in Lilia's dream.

War is, of course, a recurring theme in Irish mythology. Ná Morríghan is associated with war, there's that entire book of invasions, like, anything about Cú Chulainn, etc.

I also, very quickly, want to draw a comparison between Lilia's magearm and the four treasures of the Tuatha de Danann, which are described in literature such as the Lebor Gabála and Cath Maige Tuired (iirc). magical weaponry is a fairly common motif in various Celtic mythologies. in Irish mythology, it's the Spear of Lugh, and various swords, clubs, etc. The magearm just struck the same chord for me.

nature

I fear this is about to get very ~ohooo magical pagan connection to nature!~ please bear with me.

The mythology of Ireland is very, very, very tied to the land. You can still see this today, actually. Various natural formations- hills, islands, etc- have mythological names. Much like Olympus in Greek mythology, places mentioned in Irish mythological sources have real-world counterparts, such as Tech Duinn, the House of the Dead, being Bull Rock- a tiny island off the coast of Cork (cool post about that and the ancient Irish belief in death here). Trees had important religious, cultural, and linguistic (see: Ogham) connotations. Many of the Tuatha de had animalistic attributes and associations, such as Morríghan and crows. Even more were associated with fertility and agriculture, which was kind of a big deal. Symbols that which represent fertility, are rather common motifs (such as the Lia Fáil on the Hill of Tara, which I've read is theorized to be phallic).

That's not even mentioning the oceans, the cliffs, the forests, or the sidhe (a "fairy mounds", manmade or natural features that connect our world to the otherworld of Irish mythology).

At multiple points in Lilia's dream do we hear the fae talk about how important nature is to fae. I am unsure if this strong love for land is a theme in French folklore.

I also want to briefly point out that, in reputable sources, the "Celtic" day began at sunset. Darkness- night, winter, cold- were important to the ancient Irish, both in culture and in mythology. It's probable that their "New Year" began at Samhain (soh-wen), the holiday that celebrated the beginning of winter, to put it briefly. Here's a discussion post about this (and I sent this ask!!!!)

I just find the significance of darkness and night to hold some ground with the concept of "nocturnal fae" in TWST. "Night's blessing's", they say.

form

I also want to add, very quickly, that there are multiple different iterations of "fairies" in Irish mythology and folklore. The Tuatha de resemble humans. The modern aos sí are more mystical. The Fomorians (whom are or are not fairies, depending on who you ask?) are described as more animalistic and monstrous. The nature of fae in TWST is unclear, but they read, to me, as human-like with different abilities, different physical attributes, and a different connection to land and nature. Which is, in form, similar enough to the "fae" of Irish (and other Celtic) folklore.

Lilia

Head in hands. Shall we talk about the importance of the paternal figure in Irish mythology. I feel I have to.

I really really hate saying the word "fertility" so much because I start sounding like a Wiccan, I promise I'm going somewhere with this.

In the Nature segment, I briefly touched on the importance of fertility and the phallic symbol. I know that usually, when talking about ~fertility~ in reference to paganism, people are talking women/goddesses, but throughout my readings of Irish mythology, I've found that male fertility is just as important. More specifically, fatherhood. I, unfortunately, couldn't find much input on this, but I think it's safe to say that The Dagda, for example, is considered an important father figure and is associated with fatherhood.

It's just important.

Head in hands again. Now let's talk about fostering. Fosterage was, by most sources, a really big thing in ancient Ireland. Raising someone else's child, including that of your enemy, was not only acceptable, not only common, but traditional. And the themes of fosterage exist in the mythos, too- in Tóraigheacht Dhiarmada agus Ghráinne, the demi-god Diarmuid was fostered by Aengus Og. Aengus Og was also fostered. Fosterage is a theme in Cú Chulainn's story, so on and so forth. The gods/fae/etc foster humans, they foster demi-gods, they foster other gods.

I wanted to mention both of these as important themes in both Irish mythology and Lilia's story because like. come onnn lol.

And One More Thing!!!

This isn't super relevant to this essay, I just like to bring it up: Lilia is vampiric? Well, there's vampires in Irish folklore (or close enough, anyway. the link gives a few different versions of the story and their origins). Some think that Abhartach was actually the true inspiration behind Bram Stoker's Dracula. I don't know how much credibility this theory has, I've read a few essays on it. I just think this is fun.

Silver

Much of what I said in Lilia could be said here, too. All I really want to bring up is the symbolism of acorns. I've mentioned that certain trees had mythological connections, and the oak tree was. Um. A big one. It's a recurring theme, past, and present. Even the "Celtic Tree of Life" is an oak. I don't know, it's just important.

I could also draw some pretty stark comparisons between the story of Fionn mac Cumhaill, a heroic figure in Irish Mythology, and Silver, but that would be a bit much.

Sebek

Half-god and half-human heroes, fae, whatever etc are very much present and important in Irish mythology. That's all I can think of for now.

Malleus

I suppose I could, if I tried very hard, find something to say about Malleus, but this is where the ~medieval Europe~ starts to seep in. I am unaware of any dragons or dragonlike creatures in Irish, or other Celtic, myth.

Nobility is, however, a major theme in Irish mythology. There are many rules, there are laws, there are gods and goddesses of sovereignty, it's huge, and sort of parallels Diasomnia's structure, in a strange way. I'd need to know how their housewarden is chosen, lmao.

conclusion

Do I think the TWST writers have an intimate knowledge of ancient Irish mythology and are purposefully making allusions to drive me insane specifically? no. obviously not. is it possible that these myths have influenced the general idea of fae, and thus were included in the writing process unconsciously? yes. absolutely!

Ultimately, this is more of a thought exercise and an analysis than a theory. Take it as you will.

so on and so forth.

[bjfinn]

The original Senshi.

The Dagda:

[camptara]

Alrightie! So, I googled a bit, and I couldn't find a lot of details on Mannanan mac lir, could you tell me some more about them?

((Mannannan mac lir, meaning “son of the sea”, is a warrior, ruler, and guardian of the Otherworld in Irish mythology, making him a bit of a psychopomp. He is the sea god, and while he’s affiliated with Tuatha te Danann, he’s also occasionally described as one of their enemies, a Fomorian.

He has a special chariot drawn by the white mare Enbarr, which means “sea foam.” He’s only one of the owners of Enbarr. She had a flowing mane, made of water or sea foam, and helps in his duties. She transports his daughter Niamh to and from Tir na Nóg, the Land of Youth.

He also owns a powerful sword named Fragarach and a cloak of invisibility.

Some say the Isle of Mann is named after him, while others say he’s named after the Isle. He appears in all four of the mythological cycles of Irish mythology, though he doesn’t play much of a prominent role.

He’s considered a lawgiver among the Tuatha te Danann. He possesses the power of necromancy and the ability to envelop himself and others in a mist so they’re not seen by their enemies. Thus on Camp Tara, he’s our equivalent of the goddess Hecate as the god of the mist!))

((hope this helps! and please forgive any incorrect information, as this was transcribed by arcana from word of a sleep deprived oleander’s mouth ;;; - arc))

[dullahandyke]

>see person with irish mythology url

>'oh sweet i'll check them out'

>pinned post is collage au fic of the ulster cycle

>'We Are Fundamentally Different People'

[incorrect-tuatha]

[godsofhumanity]

Ferdiad: That's a crazy idea, Cú Chulainn. Ferdiad: Absolutely insane. Ferdiad: It doesn't make any sense. None at all. Cú Chulainn: Cú Chulainn: So, you'll do it? Ferdiad: Of course!

[incorrect-ulster-cycle]

Cú Chulainn: I was arrested for being too handsome.

Láeg: Yeah, the charges were dropped due to no supporting evidence.

[15pantheons]

Nuada: While I’m gone, you’re in charge Bres.

Bres: Yes!

Nuada, whispering to Lugh: You’re secretly in charge, but I don’t want him to feel bad.

Lugh: Obviously.

[greekschist]

Demeter: Hestia, do you smell that? It smells like Irish Spring.

Demeter: And betrayal.

Hestia:

Demeter: Hades took my fucking daughter.

[godsourvia]

Danae

(Gustav Klimt 1907)

According to the myth, Danae was the daughter of King Acrisius of Argos. The King receives a prophecy from the Oracle, which foretells that he will be killed by Danae’s child. In an attempt to defy fate, he locks up his daughter in a cellar. However, the ever crafty Jupiter turns himself into golden rain and enters her room. The fruit of their union is Perseus, who years later, fulfills the prophecy and kills his grandfather.

In his painting, Gustav Klimt blends Symbolism with Art Nouveau aesthetics. In Danae, the figure of the young woman and the golden rain dominate the canvas. The purple cloth represents her royal origins and the Art Nouveau circular designs represent her female nature. The artist candidly explores female sexuality. However, the heavy ornamental style decreases the sexual tension of the piece.

[a-little-slice-of-fandom]

Cú Chulainn: you can't just steal our prized cattle!!!

Medb: oh it's okay I have a permit

Cú Chulainn: this just says "I can do what I want"