#i love lukanette and adrigami but like

[yunyin]

Zag is making a Hawkyura statue

the way my mouth dropped open

I don't think they've made something that has surprised me this much in a while!

[rainbow-arrow]

i have. so many thoughts. about how all five seasons of miraculous have taken place within nine months.

mostly about how fucked over lukanette and adrigami was but wHATEVER

[sidsinning]

Do you ever think the flaw of Lukanette is that the couple is too good to be true?

Because it's interesting that the only thing keeping them from being together and break them apart in canon had been Marinette's secret instead of her crush.

Which, for a show that hinges on the main duo's romance shenanigans, isn't a good way to sell their main couple if the side couple is too compatible 😂

Think the writers kinda didn't gaf about Lukanette or Luka in general on god

Always felt like he was an after thought

We didn't even get a fundamental reason why they wouldn't work out like we did with Adrigami

So her getting with Adrien feels like a retcon of their whole break up episode, something else I really disliked about season 5

I think it's factually correct to say Kagami got wayyyy more character development and screentime with the main characters than Luka did

Man they were so cute he was so compatible with Mari bc his chill personality totally balanced Mari's chaotic energy. He's very clearly a source of comfort for her before, during, and after their relationship.

But Marinette's affect on Luka too,,,, Luka deciding to give up on convincing Bob Roth to credit their stolen art, only for Marinette to shock him by turning right back around to give him even more hell for his misdeeds??? Feels like both got something out of their relationship,,, or at least could've,,,,if they'd been explored a lil more,,,,

Am I saying they were perfect? Fuck no the writers made sure their OTP always got hammered into their relationship to stop it dead in its tracks somehow no matter how unnatural it was

But their foundation was so natural and strong and beautiful,,,the way they were both implied to be crushing but their big episode together wasn't even surrounding that,,,,just them hanging out,,,then getting angry their friend was being ripped off,,,,,friends before anything else,,,,,ugh,,,,

idk i think the "he's too perfect for her" reason for not choosing one love interest over another is nonsense...idk if that was what they were trying to say but if so I disagree like why wouldn't you choose someone you literally acknowledge as the better option (Not saying this about Adrien, just about this trope in general)?

I have a lot of feelings

[zoe-oneesama]

Not to say either of them is right here, but what's wrong with the ice cream guy? I haven't kept up with the show proper in several seasons, so I'm probably very out of touch.

He is The Villain of ML in my heart.

His magic ice cream is wildly inconsistent. It's Soulmate Ice Cream! Except when it's Just Friend Ice Cream! Well, until he ONLY gives ice cream to lovers, NOT good friends who have fun together! But sometimes he gives ice cream to couples that DO break up! What are the rules? WHO CARES, CERTAINLY NOT ANDRE! I can't even put stock in his ability ACTUALLY being magic when it's constantly contradicting itself. I'm pretty sure he's just convinced himself that he has magic when he doesn't and his ego is easily bruised if anything pulls him out of his fantasy.

Plus he inexplicably always blames Marinette every time he's akumatized, no matter how far he has to stretch to do so. Once when she didn't even interact with him directly!

The first time because she went home without eating his "Soulmate Ice Cream(tm)" by herself as a 5th wheel. Because, what, her leaving meant his ice cream "failed"? Wasn't the point that two people are supposed to share the ice cream for the magic to work? But because she was like "no thanks", he swears revenge on her???

The second time because he was so invested in shipping two strangers that he got mad at Marinette for...being seen in public with one leg of the ship? After Ladybug had made it perfectly clear that she and Chat Noir were NOT a couple and so Chat Noir has the right to have fun with whoever he wants to???? Because "my ice cream is never wrong"?!?!

It didn't seem to work out for Lukanette or Adrigami so I don't know where you get the gall to even continue to make that bullshit claim, but OKAY.

And the third time, HE had the audacity to blame HER for making him "lose faith in ice cream and love" when he REFUSED TO SERVE HER! He flat out denied her and Chat Noir ice cream because he doesn't make "good friend" ice cream despite them BEING ON A DATE, and then has the GLUTEN FREE AUDACITY to be mad when tHEY are UPSET by it!

Oh but that wasn't a problem in "Wishmaker" when it was Marinette sharing with Luka, but sure, make up new things just so you can get mad about it, that makes sense.

I also have a personal vendetta against him for being the one to out Marinette's feelings for Adrien to Adrien. After 4 seasons of build up, this is how Adrien finds out? Horrible, vile, detention, exile, I hate him. I mean I've been done with him since "Heart Hunter"/"Miracle Queen", but they just loooooove to PILE IT ON.

Like, wouldn't it make more sense for Andre to have been the one person to see through the Love Square? Even if he didn't fully understand it, since Ladybug = Marinette and Chat Noir = Adrien, wouldn't it just make sense for Magic Ice Cream to be able to see past that because They're Soulmates(tm)? But he's only invested in ONE of the pairings, not even like two of the pairings that are seemingly unrelated. He is NEVER as passionate about Adrienette as he is about LadyNoir...but why???? Why is he so blase about Marinette going with Luka or Adrien being with whoever when he can't even handle Chat Noir LAUGHING with a girl who Isn't Ladybug?

They never even have fun and explore what he'd do if he caught a Ladrien date, would he be angry at Adrien like he is with Marinette, or does he just have it out for her specifically?

At this point I'm just convinced he's only so invested in the LadyNoir pairing because he's publicly endorsed them so much and if they don't end up together he'll be outed for being a Hack Fraud. His fixation on two teenagers becoming a couple as a grown adult and falling to pieces just because Marinette has other ways to have fun instead of eating Ice Cream she doesn't even get to choose the flavor of...

Yeah, throw him in jail Chloe.

[miraculouslbcnreactions]

I was just thinking about the thing with Lukanette and Adrigami, and I was wondering: what made Luka and Kagami like Adrien and Marinette anyway?

Luka and Marinette have next to nothing in common, as far as I know, and even though you don't always need common hobbies to date, what did either have going for them that they were even attracted to each other? Especially when Marinette was obsessed with Adrien.

And Kagami.... I don't know. She gets akumatized in one episode, and then the next she has a crush on him? It's the same question, what really did Kagami or Adrien have going for them that they even started dating in the first place? Trauma? Especially since Adrien was apparently in love with Ladybug.

Maybe I'm just missing some things, but as far as I saw, neither couples had anything to even INDICATE they would start dating, besides proximity, I guess. I mean, Kagami and Adrien sounded more trauma-bonded ngl

As far as I can tell, the writers said, "we need more padding, let's make a non-threatening love triangle" and the crushes came to be. There's not really anything in canon to make these couples feel meaningful and that's on purpose. You're not supposed to ship Lukanette or Adrigami. They are just obstacles for the love square.

I like Luka and Kagami, but I never viewed them as true love interest who were designed around Marinette and Adrien. It was glaringly obvious that they weren't real competition. That's why their relationships with the leads are just a cheap cliffhanger to make people tune in to season four. You weren't supposed to think that these relationships had a chance. It was supposed to make you ask, "but how will the love square get together now???"

I will say that it's super annoying that Kagami and Marinette get to fight over Adrien while Luka and Adrien never get anything like that. I get that it's just a factor of which sides the crushes are on, but I am so tired of women fighting over men in media aimed at women! The entire draw of the love square is that it's all the fun of a love triangle without any of the awkward "who wins?" issues and the writers went and ruined that by adding love triangles on top of the square. Why???? Come up with better padding! Please!

[baenyth]

Bethany's Bizarre Miraculous Rewrite: The Romance Subplot for the Planned Seasons

One of my goals for my rewrite is to make the romance subplot of the series less drawn-out, more cathartic, feature more of the side ships of Lukanette, Adrigami, and even Marichat, and also get more gay. So without further ado, here's the romance subplot for the first five seasons:

Season 1 (Equivalent to seasons 1 and 2, twice the length of a normal season): Basic lovesquare antics. Marinette loves Adrien, but not Chat Noir. Adrien loves Ladybug, but not Marinette. They're also both fucked-up. Marinette knows Adrien's schedule and far too many personal details about him. Adrien as Chat acts entitled to Ladybug's love and even causes an akuma with his entitlement. He does get raked over the coals for that and after Glaciator/the Ice Cream akuma becomes far more respectful towards Ladybug, but still harbors love for her. He starts to move on from her after Frozer/the Ice Skating akuma, however.

Season 2 (Equivalent to season 3): The love square reversal happens a few episodes in. Yes, really. Adrien gets over Ladybug in favor of Marinette, while Marinette tries to put her feelings of Adrien aside to prove to her class that she isn't just jealous of Lila and targets Chat Noir instead. She does act salty at Kagami for a few episodes, however. During the kwamiswap Lady Noire is utterly down bad for Mister Bug as they fight All Eyes on Mecha. Desperada's arc of Ladybug picking Adrien in favor of Luka is replaced with picking Chat in favor of Luka. The season 5 episode where Marinette and Chat Noir go on a date and gets the ice cream man akumatized occurs here. Alya has doubts about Marinette's crush. She's right, and eventually Marinette realizes that and goes back to Adrien. Since the two are in love with eachother, things work out quickly and easily and they get together and kiss by the season finale.

Season 3 (Equivalent to seasons 3 and 4): On the first episode of Season 3 Adrienette has a horrific messy breakup after Adrien discovers the Schedule and similar things. I was thinking of putting it four episodes in, but I decided 1. it would be better if it was the beginning of the season and 2. I want Adrienette fans to feel the same despair I felt as a Lukanette and Adrigami fan at the start of season 4. The rest of the season focuses on the aftermath of this nightmare breakup. Ladybug and Chat Noir comfort and give advice to each other about the breakup and coalesce into a queerplatonic couple. They still don't figure out their identities because they're dumb teens. Marinette and Adrien start dating Luka and Kagami respectively halfway through the season and their relationships get plenty of time to shine. Marinette genuinely falls in love with Luka. Same with Adrien and Kagami. The love square is dead. Good riddance. Thankfully, Marinette does apologize to Adrien, and they make up and become just friends.

Season 4 (Equivalent to season 4): Here's some context: in the Season 3 finale, Hawkmoth was finally defeated but not Coeur, the woman behind Hawkmoth. What's worse is 1. Master Fu had to abdicate guardianship to Ladybug and 2. Coeur managed to discover multiple hero identities. So now Ladybug is working overtime creating guardian potions and doing nightly patrols to check up on everyone who got exposed. She's getting stressed, she's burning herself out, and so her parents start helping her with her guardian duties (they've known since season 1,) giving Ladybug a support group that she's not telling Chat Noir about. And kittycat's getting suspicious. He knows Ladybug's not telling him information and in general he feels like he's on the level of the side heroes rather than one of the main two, causing relationship troubles in their queerplatonic couple. Chat Noir starts training to compensate for this, to the point where he awakening his fullest Miraculous powers (infinite cataclysms!). All of this hard work for both of them causes strain in their civilian relationships, and they unfortunately have to break up because of it and because they can't tell Luka/Kagami their secret identities. And then Luka accidentally finds out both heroes' identities while Kagami manages to figure them out on her own. As for the stuff between Ladybug and Chat Noir, it gets resolved by Cat Walker, although here Ladybug is more unnerved by Cat Walker, and she apologizes to Chat Noir and lets him as much in the loop as she can without compromising her identity.

Season 5 (Equivalent to season 5 except not really): Ladybug and Chat Noir are back as a queerplatonic couple, baby! The two of them against the world! And also the other heroes! The fun parts come from their civilian relationships. Luka and Kagami, now that they know our heroes' identities, start dating them again, but the other way around. Lukadrien and Marigami. These relationships are arguably better than the other ones, too. Luka and Adrien share so much in common that they really get eachother, while Marinette is more comfortable with her sexuality and has a girlfriend that pushes her to be more, and Kagami has a loving relationship with little-to-no secrets! Rose is ecstatic. Tomoe is pissed because no Adrigami. Also, at the end of the season, after Coeur fucking dies and Felix, her last minion, is arrested for being a butt, we finally get an identity reveal between Ladybug and Chat Noir! And if this ends up as the series finale, Lukadrien and Marigami converge into the polycule of the gods, Lukadrigaminette!

[raphaellight]

What your favourite ship says about you?

Disclaimer, I come up with it way back, before love square reversed, so take it thru lens of first four seasons. Lets bug into it

Ladrien

You chase the highest ideal of love. You want all the butterflies you can get, chase the high and wish for a perfect romance. You look for someone who you will adore and who will adore you back. It also has a "forbiden fruit" edge, romance that can't happen, but you still dream about it anyway. On that note, you want to meet a real life version of Adrien Agreste or Marinette, whichever way you swing.

Adrinette

What you wish for is the "happily ever after" type of romance. Quick to make plans for future. But you also might look for someone who will accept the quirky side of you. Because you root for it, you probably relate to Mari's inabillity to confess. But most importantly, you want someone who will notice and appreciate you, just like Mari sees the best in Adrien past his celebrity persona and how Adrien notices acts of services Marinette does for him and everyone else.

Ladynoir

Here I can speak from my own perspective: you look for someone who works best with you. Contrary to other ships, Ladynoir often feels like an old married couple pairing instead of teenage drama. It's not about butterflies in stomach but casuall intimacy, trust and loyalty. They feel comfortable around eachother, depend on eachother and face the world together. It's less about feelings of love, more about feeling like nothing is impossible with her/him on your side. Great sense of humor is also very appreciated by you.

Marichat

Friends to lovers is your favourite romance plot. You don't want to chace love, you want to one day open your eyes and realise that someone is already there for you. You want to find a home with that person. And if you are thinking "how does feeling of finding home connects with actual Marichat in the show", you are not a real Marichat shipper, those can't differentiate between actual show and fanficions they read or listened to because home is where Marinette is.

Lukanette, Adrigami or any other ship

You don't believe in the "made for eachother", not allowing yourself to get stuck up on some ideal vision, focusing on love you can build, not what you can find. You want to feel the attracion to the kind person and see if it works out well. Destiny does not dictate your love life and neither Master Fu nor Ted Mosby can convince you that destiny knows better. If you like someone, thats enough for a start, because the most important is what you build after.

[gamerknight7310]

Miraculous Ship Names

I hate when people just mush characters's names together to have it as their ship name, so I, and two friends of mine, have come up with a couple unique names we think fit all the canon and semi-canon ships of miraculous. I'll also give my brief opinion on what I think of the ship, so be nice as my tastes might be different from yours, but with that out of the way, let's get started.

Name: Catastrophe Ship: Adrinette (Adrien x Marinette) Type: Het Opinion: I kind of only see them as just friends

Name: Betrothed Ship: Adrigami (Adrien x Kagami) Type: Het Opinion: I wished these two got together over what we got in canon

Name: Regal Lily Ship: Alirose (Prince Ali x Rose) Type: Het Opinion: I think it's really cute, but it probably wouldn't last too long

Name: Legally Blonde Ship: Chlodrien (Chloe x Adrien) Type: Het Opinion: I wished these two had a sibling dynamic towards the end of the show, but we can't have nice things

Name: Shining Armor Ship: Chlokim (Chloe x Kim) Type: Het Opinion: I can kind of see the vision with them, definitely toxic for sure

Name: Insecurities Ship: DjWifi (Alya x Nino) Type: Het Opinion: It felt rushed in the episode that introduced them as a couple and I don't know just never felt anything with them

Name: Stockholm Syndrome Ship: Feligami (Felix x Kagami) Type: Het Opinion: It was rushed and Kagami wouldn't realistically hook up with someone that looks like her ex especially their cousin

Name: Toxic Love Ship: Gabenath (Gabriel x Nathalie) Type: Het Opinion: I love how toxic this ship is and wished it continued for the entirety of the Agreste arc

Name: Princess & The Tailor Ship: Gabmilie (Gabriel x Emilie) Type: Het Opinion: I mean… it's alright for what we got in canon, but that's pretty much it

Name: Goths & Roses Ship: Julerose (Juleka x Rose) Type: Femslash Opinion: I think these two are absolute cuties and I absolutely love them

Name: Sinking Ship Ship: Kimdine (Kim x Ondine) Type: Het Opinion: I don't like this ship as both people are at fault in the relationship

Name: Just Business Ship: Liladrien (Lila x Adrien) Type: Het Opinion: Eh don't really see it

Name: What Could've Been Ship: Lukanette (Luka x Marinette) Type: Het Opinion: This should've been endgame over Adrinette

Name: Infatuated Ship: Marcaniel (Marc x Nathaniel) Type: Slash Opinion: I don't like Nathaniel he's a bitch and Marc deserved better

Name: Delusion Ship: Marikim (Marinette x Kim) Type: Het Opinion: I didn't like how the writers made Kim look evil when he's just a himbo

Name: Gentle Hearts Ship: Myvan (Mylene x Ivan) Type: Het Opinion: I wish we got more of them as I do think they're cute together

Name: Sketches Ship: Nathanette (Nathaniel x Marinette) Type: Het Opinion: Eh I don't really see it at all plus this came out on the second episode of the first season so yeah no

Name: Just Friends Ship: Ninette (Nino x Marinette) Type: Het Opinion: Honestly this came out of nowhere as it was meant to put Alya and Nino together by the end of the episode

Name: Tell Me Why Ship: Zoenette (Zoe x Marinette) Type: Femslash Opinion: There weren't that many moments with Zoe and all of a sudden she's in love with Marinette yeah fucking right

[ilikekidsshows]

The Love Square black hole is the reason why I prefer Lukanette and Adrigami.

Luka is the calming presence that Marinette needs when she spirals, and Marinette helps Luka make his music career come true.

Adrien encourages Kagami to rebel against her similarly controlling mother, and Kagami encourages Adrien to stand up for himself.

---

Gonna be honest here, Anon, ‘Silencer’ was the only time in the entire show I rooted for Lukanette. Outside of this one episode, Marinette takes advantage of Luka very similarly to how she takes advantage of Adrien. It’s all about what Marinette needs and Luka constantly takes care of Marinette without Marinette even considering if she could possibly ever do something for him in return. And this was the normal of their relationship even before they started dating and the retool turned Marinette into a narrative black hole.

But, like, at least with Luka, there is some precedent of Marinette having a (potentially) romantic relationship with some actualy give and take instead of her just taking.

Totally agree on rooting for Adrigami over Adrinette, though. Season four and beyond would have been better if they stayed together, because a lot of Kagami's character assassination is related to their breakup and her rebound Sentimonster relationship.

[mystic-myrtille]

I'm in a salt mode so lets get into this

One of the biggest problems people had with the L//S is how poorly developed it's been and how less effort it has been put into it, And don't get me started how Adrichat and Maribug barely interact basically making the ship have 0 chemistry.

But then when ships like Lukanette and Adrigami came along, then there's some Toxic L//S stans who bash the characters (and doxx lukanette and adrigami shippers), with their only excuse being "ThEy R iN tHe Way of adr///ette/L//s (Mainly because they're insecure that Lukanette/Adrigami has Chemistry, proper development and effort and their ship doesn't)

I'm so sick and tired of the hate that Lukanette/Adrigami gets.

I'm so sick and tired of the hate that Luka/Kagami gets.

I'm so sick and tired of toxic L//S stans projecting their ship on every. single. damn. thing

I'm so sick and tired of seeing Lukanette/Adrigami shippers get d0xxed, threatened and bullied just because they don't ship the L//S or Adr//ette

Yikes, people doxxed each other because of ships?? For some reason I'm not entirely surprised. I've seen fandoms with super toxic people and the ml fandom sure can be toxic as hell. If you (general) get so worked up about people's opinions about characters from a kids show, you should be denied access to the internet and instead have access to tons grass to touch. But yeah, even just "normal hate" can be frustrating and discouraging, so it's best to just block those people. I completely understand your frustration.

Luka//nette isn't good because they were half canon, it's good because they have a meaningful bond and the root for drama is always outside circumstances and not the fact that they fundementally don't work together. If Mari wasn't Ladybug, they probably wouldn't have split up. That's why I love this ship so much. Besides, they never got in the way of anything. Realistically, no ship can get in the way of a confirmed endgame ship bc, well, it's endgame. So this argument is kind of falls flat (honestly most arguments against Luka//nette I've heard were either not really important or kind of a very outlandish interpretation of their relationship, I don't care about either.)

Heck, even if Luka//nette wasn't the rival ship but just friends in canon who interacted twice, who cares? Shipping isn't supposed to be serious, it's exploring different dynamics between characters and having fun putting them in different scenarios and have them have 6176310278 different first kisses. There's no rule that you have to be on board with the canon ship.

Now speaking of L//S developement (bc now I'm also in a salty mood and I have thoughts)

I and many others have already talked about how s1-4 didn't really do much with them. But I find it funny when people say that s5 did a great job developing they're relationship because... bitch where? I've watched season 5 (I have no self respect) and everything was confusing and over the place and I think that's bc the writers can't make up their minds about which problems the L//S might face actually matter and how they can be solved.

The season starts with Mari making a big deal about how loving Adrien is dangerous because hero stuff. Oh but actually it doesn’t matter, she likes CN now, problem solved! Oh wait no Chat friendzoned her and Adrien is pushing real hard for Adr//nette so they give up their fucking miraculous (in times of crisis I might add), problem solved! No wait, actually the new heroes suck so they take them back, but that’s okay bc being in love and being a superhero at the same time is actually no longer a problem for some reason! The actual problem is that Mari is incapable of expressing herself because she has trauma. And THAT’S the real shit because fucking everybody gets so invested they organize literal dates for them and watch from a distance until they smooch instead of, oh idk, letting them do things their own way. But actually that also doesn't matter anymore bc Zoe just confessed and Mari was so inspired she immediately ran to Adrien. Oh but Adrien is a senti without free will and he goes to england soon whoopsie. Also Gabriel and Tomoe are now Adri//gami shippers because of course we need an arranged marriage deal type of plot. Oh yeah there's also something about Monarch apparently having all the miraculouses but who cares amirite

See what I mean? There's no structure, no actually overcoming problems, it's just random shit happening without any connection to the previous random shit. The characters don't develop in a meaningful way. Mari's only life goal is making one cohesive sentence in front of Adrien and he's kind of just there. I mean he could maybe feel inspired by Marinette's passion for arts and crafts and try out some stuff or he could continue to have no direction in life. Yes, as a teen it's hard knowing what you want to do later in life, but Adrien doesn't even really have actual hobbies he can define himself through. The writers fail not only to develop the relationship as a whole but also the characters involved as people. They could as easily be a situationship where they meed every two days to make out and it wouldn't change anyting. It's just fan service here and there combined with shallow and forgettable dialogue (I think, there wasn't a conversation that stick with me at least) and idk this maybe works as a first love that maybe lasts for a year before they have a dramatic break up and then move on with their lives, But the show tries to sell this idea that the square will actually stay together forever (or have a constant toxic on-off thing bc that's the vibe I'm getting. Plus Bunnyx sort of implied that).

[theerurishipper]

Lukanette and Adrigami are looking like better ships by the day.

We don't talk about Feligami.

I mean, I've always loved Adrigami, and I never hated Lukanette. Though Lukanette does suffer from the same problem as Adrienette in that Luka is just expected to be Marinette's emotional support boyfriend rather than his own person with his own needs and feelings. In the end, it all sorta comes down to how Marinette is written to have emotional support partners rather than boyfriends tbh. I blame the writers for this one.

But Adrigami was *chef's kiss* before they ruined Kagami's character and gave her a boyfriend as a consolation prize.

Thank you for your ask!

[libellule-saphique]

Miraculous Season 5: Luka & Kagami's Wasted Potential

If this show wasn't already bad enough.........

Like everything else, it disappoints me that the writers of this show are lazy when it comes to additional character development essentially in the love rivals

but who am I kidding? I knew what to expect when Thomas quite literally said Gabriel was redeemable after torturing all of Paris for years simply because he wants his wife back actively neglecting & abusing his son in the process while in the same breath saying Chloe is beyond redemption and she's a teenage girl who's dad couldn't give a rat's ass about her and spoils her crazy to get her off his back 24/7 and her mom who wants nothing to do with her verbally & mentally abuses her with the only real people who like her to the slightest and tolerate her are Sabrina and Armand who's practically her butler. The double comparison and double standard is wild but nonetheless not surprising seeing how the show's narrative is already bias when it comes down to Adrien & Marinette's character treatment. (the misogyny and racism is loud as hell)

Season 4 of Miraculous was already beginning to go downhill and season 5 simply added icing on the cake. To be honest I was partly excited to see the relationship dynamic within the love rival relationships, Lukanette & Adrigami at the start of season 4 because it was different from the repetitive love square and we got to see our two main leads interact with other characters in a romantic light other than themselves only to end before they could really start. It was a slap in the face and a huge cut from some possible major character development and love square progress. But the writers are so afraid of change and cant manage to make a good progressive storyline and felt that Luka & Kagami were too much of a threat to their Love Square that could've heavily improved because of them in the first place. Some episodes could've been focused on friendships between the love rivals and Marinette & Adrien. But ofc we get the same monotonous plotline mid season 3 to the beginning of season 4 Adrien & Kagami spend more time together, Marinette is conflicted and overwhelmed with feelings, Luka is there for emotional support (which felt like his sole purpose in earlier episodes even until now) Kagami is constantly frustrated by Adrien's indecisiveness, passiveness, and hesitance, etc, etc whatever and it continues all until they break up.

Then out of the wood works, we get Adrien realizing he has feelings for Marinette despite her being quote on quote "just a friend" 3-4 seasons straight. Despite. Marinette putting a hold on relationships ever since Lukanette's breakup and the fact that Monarch is still on the prowl and her responsibilities as a hero, because lets be honest if Ladybug/Marinette doesn't tend to Paris & Monarch no one else will, (Chat Noir definitely won't) the writers still say "hey lets tend to and coddle Adrien's feelings bc now he likes her more than "just a friend" and it doesn't matter how Marinette feels, doesn't matter if she's not ready for a relationship even though she's made that clear on multiple occasions after her and Luka's breakup bc at the end of day what we learn is what we already know "Adrien's feelings are more important than Marinette's overall treatment as the female protagonist and discomfort."

And what do you ask happens to the love rivals? Of course! the writers have to find a way to string them away from the complicated love square

Instead we get Luka shipped off with his dad on a world tour and Kagami paired with Felix (which........also doesn't feel right and for what reason did this have to happen?) Felix is the same guy who quite literally SH Ladybug, but ok? the writers feel like it makes sense to pair Kagami with this guy? She seems to like him for the same reasons her and Adrien's relationship took so long to work out in the first place. I don't even know what she saw in him, he's so bland, so passive, and everyone characterizes him as a "perfect cinnamon catboy who's abused and needs emotional support leaning on our main female lead who's not responsible for his baggage at all but hey! Everything is Marinette's responsibility after all right? They decide to give Felix more purpose in the show as Felix's a more assertive, serious, proactive version of Adrien and that's exactly what Kagami's looking for but I honestly think that it's a cop out for the possible unresolved feelings she had/has for Adrien (though he doesn't deserve her anyway) . It's like the show's message when it comes to romance and love is the only way to be genuinely happy is in a relationship which is so beyond fucked up, and its a overall bad message to kids and teens, no one in the show learns to love themselves and learn themselves first, Kagami would be simply fine without any relationship I can say the same for many other characters especially Marinette & Adrien. Why are romantic relationships needed to began with?

Season 5 is a prime example of the garbage dump Miraculous has become over the years and the poor writing decisions the writers have made.

[immaturityofthomasastruc]

Is it just me or has Adrien been lacking in everything lately. Especially his personality. I haven’t watched miraculous episodes in awhile and I haven’t seen season 5 but Adrien just seems so bland now. I remember loving him in season 1 and the movie captured him so well from the clips I’ve seen. Now it seems like he’s been reduced to just being Marinette’s love interest.

Between Adrien, breaking up Lukanette and Adrigami, and what happened to Nino, I'm starting to think the people who work on this show aren't the best at writing romantic relationships.

[flightfoot]

Hey, do you have any recommendations for Lukanette, Adrigami, and/or Julerose fics?

I don't generally read Lukanette. The pairing's fine in and of itself, I think that Luka and Marinette would have a happy marriage and a good time together, but I've had so many bad experiences with Lukanette shippers vilifying Adrien, Alya, and the class, that I can't really derive any enjoyment from the ship, I just have too many negative associations with it. Lukadrienette and Lukadrigaminette are fine since I've never had bad experiences with other characters being bashed to promote the poly, but Lukanette... no.

I had about a year where saltfics NEVER LEFT MY HEAD and I kept on having flashbacks to my favorite characters being demonized and vilified and punished for it, with those flashbacks running through my head for hours on end while my throat choked up like I was about to cry, for hours at a time, on a daily basis. I REALLY can't stand anything I associate with that. I still can't stand saltfics, but my throat doesn't close up and I don't get a ton of flashbacks anymore when I see them at least, I just get angry.

There IS still one Lukanette fic series I've liked and recommended, but it's less because of the Lukanette and more because of the exploration of Luka's and Felix's characters (and it turns into FeLuka later on).

As for Adrigami... it's a nice ship, but there's very little content for it, especially in more recent years. It mostly vanished once season 4 got going, and it wasn't exactly common before that. I've got some Adrigaminette and Lukadrigaminette recs if you're interested in those though?

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Boomer!Luka: FeLuka Ending series by @19thsentry-blog

In the Shadows (the first fic in the series) summary:

On one side is Luka, 140-year-old Snake Miraculous holder and keeper of the Guardian's secrets, on the other is Marinette Dupain-Cheng, a relatively newly minted hero of Paris and Guardian of the Miracle Box. Each is looking to fulfill their promises to their now gone mentors to reunite the Kwamis and keep them safe. Sounds simple--until you throw in a rocky start, the Atlantic Ocean, Félix Graham de Vanily, and a whole host of secrets…and suddenly simple becomes complicated (story of Marinette's life, right?).

So this is obviously way outside my normal wheelhouse. I don’t typically read Lukanette fics, even ones that turn into FeLuka later on in the series (though boy it becomes apparent quickly that the author’s fascinated with FeLuka’s dynamic.) But this one is really good, with the best Luka-centric fics I’ve ever read, and some of the best Felix-centric content as well. I love how Luka has his own baggage here, with all the pressure of wandering around for over a century, looking after the few Miraculous he found, trying to keep what’s left of the Order alive, unaware of Fu’s survival or of the Miraculous user’s re-emergence in Paris. There’s a lot of focus on Luka’s own feelings and thoughts and problems, not just on helping other people with them. 

The plot works even without the romantic aspect, so even if Lukanette isn’t a pairing that draws you in, I still recommend this fic, so long as you don’t actively dislike the pairing itself. And even though it’s a Lukanette fic, Adrien and Alya are treated fairly and with respect. Adrien may not end up with Marinette and is bummed about it, but the narrative is still kind to him overall, there’s clearly no ill well towards him, or Alya for that matter. (There are later fics in the series that focus more on Adrien just healing and coping and living after finding out that his father’s a villain and his mom’s been in the basement this whole time, and in the multiversal travel fic, Alya gets some standout appearances as Scarabella which are fun).

And FELIX - it’s clear that 19thsentry has this whole conception about Felix’s psychology. He’s wrapped in a ton of self-loathing until it started to consume him, made him lash out. Him being a sentimonster, wanting to get the Peacock Miraculous, actually gave him some direction for that at least. And he’s just in this pit of his own making, until he meets Luka, who can see through him when no one else can, who cares for him even though he doesn’t understand why, who’d been through so much over the years and yet kept himself kind. He’s attracted like a moth to a flame, infuriated that he cares, yet not able to stop himself from caring about this mysterious, infuriating musician. 

Yeah if you can’t tell this is the series that really sold me on FeLuka as a couple.

Oh yeah, one of the fics in here is M-rated, and it does earn the M rating for sexual content, though it’s nothing too major.

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Three’s company by @torvalvt

Kagami has been doing her best for years to ignore her feelings for her friends. It doesn’t help that Adrien and Marinette insist on spending as much time as possible with her, even going so far as inviting her along on their dates together. If only the affection she felt for them wouldn’t get in the way of their relationship. Because it is growing harder and harder to tamp down her feelings with how close they are getting to her.

This is adorable. Adrien and Marinette really want Kagami to join their relationship and she just doesn’t dare hope for it. If you want some adorable Adrigaminette from Kagami’s perspective, I recommend checking this fic out!

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Hold Me By Both Hands by @angelofthequeers

“I know he said never to take you back,” Plagg mutters. “But he’d change his tune if he knew.” He looks Adrien straight in the eye and, more serious than Adrien’s ever seen him before, says, “There’s someone you gotta meet. He’s been looking for that book for ages.” How differently might the events of season 2 have gone if Adrien had also known of Master Fu from the start?

Look I've literally written a series of essays going over the various aspects of the plot threads in this fic, it's one of the best ML fics I've ever read if you've wanted a fix-it for seasons 2 and 3. Especially with the way Chloe's redemption arc was handled, it's STILL the best Chloedemption arc I've ever read in a Miraculous fic, and I've read a LOT of Miraculous fics.

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You’ll be the prince and I’ll be the princess by @mexicancat-girl

With Team Miraculous now full-time holders, Ladybug has them patrolling in pairs like her and Chat Noir. New partners Pigella and Purple Tigress get along phenomenally, their easy banter and similar wavelengths making working with each other a joy in and out of combat. But sometimes Tigress is surprised just how close she is with her partner. Sometimes she tries not to feel too guilty thinking about it.

There’s some nice Julerose here! I love them kinda getting into a lovesquare with each other, though it’s not as much of a problem as it is in canon since it’s reciprocal in every relationship and they’re both down for a poly. It’s fun, and I love the “Luka attempting to woo some of his love interests” plot going on in the background XD.

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How Could I Not? by SorryJustAnotherPerson

In fairy tale books, Princesses were saved by nights from ferocious dragons. Those books were not their story, but Rose was happy to flip over a new page with her Juleka every single day. Many years ago, she was put to this tower by her parents and her kingdom, along with a fire breathing dragon, so she could find her prince charming one day. How foolish for them to not calculate her falling in love with the dragon. I mean seriously. How could she not?

I love fairy tale type stories, especially fractured fairy tales. And Juleka being a dragon is awesome. This is just a fun and adorable story.

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The echoes there of me and you (The voices that are carrying this tune) by @tiredfloridianbutverygay

Juleka finds herself gifted an old castle in Scotland by an auntie she never even knew she had. At first, she's thinking she'll use it as a vacation home. Then she meets Rose, a ghostly blonde woman from another time who's been alone for decades and who's achingly in need of a friend. Juleka's never believed in the paranormal, the supernatural but it's hard to deny the blonde's existence. It's also hard to deny her growing affection for the specter. The specter, who Juleka knows should be moving on and the specter who Juleka knows might just need a bit of help doing so...

[msweebyness]

Miraculous Second Gen- School for Monstrous Youths (My Characters)

Hey, ya’ll! These are the first set of kids from the Monstrous Youths AU! I figured I’d let Artzy post the kids for their OC couples on their own time! Enjoy! @artzychic27 @imsparky2002

Polycule:

Emma:

Voodoo Doll/Human Hybrid, Adrinette

She/Her

Age 15

As clumsy as her (bio) mom

Still has a ton of energy, but must be more careful due to voodoo powers

Struggles with some OCD

Influencer for monster-made products

Louie:

Vampire/Dragon Hybrid, Lukagami

He/Him

Age 14

Can see people’s auras

Musician like his (bio) dad, super mellow

Struggles with hoarding like his bio mom

Kinda the family therapist

Hugo:

Voodoo Doll/Vampire Hybrid, Lukanette

He/Him

Age 10

Emerging Himbo still

Wants to play sports, but can’t do contact due to voodoo powers

Sometimes forgets about said powers

Loves going bat mode

Best friends with Hector

Alison:

Dragon/Human Hybrid, Adrigami

She/Her

Age 6

Only hoards items that symbolize significant memories

As stoic as Kagami

Intelligent for her age but doesn’t talk much

Scariest dragon glare ever

Alyno:

Cecily “CeCe”:

Ghost/Stein Hybrid

She/Her

Age 16

Super driven, like her mom

Has a bit of a problem with remembering to knock before phasing through a door

Runs a monster activism news site

Always arguing with her brother

Loses track of her limbs often

Cody:

Ghost/Stein Hybrid

He/Him

Age 16

Gives off ectoplasmic static when excited

Really chill, but does meditation to help with anxiety

Plays the keyboard, and writes a comic series about a group of hybrid monster spies

Really wants to ask June out

Julerose:

Marek:

Vampire/Angel Hybrid, Bio Mom Juleka with a donor

He/They

Age 17

Incredibly shy like Jules, but has a love for all things cute

Flying helps him calm down

Learning guitar from his uncle

Will stab someone who threatens their loved ones

Dating Vicki

Myvan:

Juniper “June”:

Plant Monster/Yeti Hybrid

She/Her

Age 16

Mega blunt like her father, but with her mom’s caring demeanor

Has a fierce yeti temper and WILL throw rocks

RBF for days

Activist for the environment and monster rights

Gets tangled in her vines

Wants to ask Cody out but nerves are a thing

Hector:

Plant Monster/Yeti Hybrid

He/Him

Age 10

Gentle giant like his dad

Speaks too quiet to hear most of the time

Loves working with plants and animals

Fidgets with his vines when nervous

Best friends with Hugo

NathMarc:

Elicia:

Moth Creature/Werecat Hybrid, Bio Dad Marc with a surrogate

She/Her

Age 17

Sassiest lil missy, must be the werecat genes

A very talented sculptor

High-functioning autism, limited emotional expression

Spooks at loud noises, like Marc

Has a crush on Destiny

Kimdine:

Victoria “Vicki”:

Aquatic Monster/Werewolf Hybrid

She/Her

Age 17

Has the energy of three people

Fastest swimmer in the region, and a track and field star

Models for Mari’s fashion label, has a good number of fans

Herbo, but like, book-smart

Dating Marek

Nicolette “Nikki”:

Aquatic Monster/Werewolf Hybrid

She/Her

Age 13

Much more subdued and reserved than her fam

Voice of reason mixed with deadpan snarker

Really tech savvy, makes her own software

Really fast swimmer like her sister, and super agile

Besties with River

Alix:

River:

Manticore, Adopted at 1

They/Them

Age 13

Snarkiest lil shit, it’s why they and Nikki get along

Daredevil like their mama, they do extreme sports together

Really smart, makes top grades

Wonders about their birth parents sometimes, but loves Alix and wouldn’t trade being with her

Has to be careful with their tail spines

Breckvie:

Destiny:

Centaur/Siren Hybrid

She/Her

Age 17

Only one of the three with the power of siren song

Loves to sing but has to be careful with her powers

Proper lady like her mama, manners are impeccable

Sweetest girl alive, takes care of people out of instinct

Has a crush on Elicia

Reagan:

Centaur/Siren Hybrid

She/Her

Age 12

Only one with the full lower body of a horse

School’s sprinting champ

Herbo™️

Crazy good cook, big Kronk vibes

Daddy’s Girl

Milo:

Centaur/Siren Hybrid

He/Him

Age 9

Wants to be a vet, adopts random animals

Ray of sunshine 24/7

Has hooves and wings, and a good singer

Very perceptive for his age

Jessthony:

Warren:

Daemon, Adopted at 3

He/They

Age 15

Super shy, but has a quiet snarkiness

Mari’s design protégé, fashion sense is on point

Always fidgeting, usually has stim toys

Starting a foundation for abandoned daemon kids like himself and his Dad

Leave your thoughts in the comments and reblogs! Enjoy the monster kiddies!

[miraculouslbcnreactions]

Idk if you already discussed this but how do you feel about Adrinette being canon when there wasn‘t a reveal yet? Because I think the show just took all the exciting aspects of the love square away by making one side canon and the others strictly platonic.

Sure, they‘re cute and whatnot, but I don‘t think they‘re exactly interesting without the identity shenanigans and stuff? Especially because (to me at least) Adrinette always felt like the weakest side. It‘s a school crush romcom type of love, which is great and all, but like…. You have superheroes in your show?? Hello??? Why not combine the two elements more effectively???The others are either badass superhero couple (I loved the Ladynoir dynamic in the movie for example) or one superhero hangs out with the civilian and they bond. That‘s literally all of fanon Marichat, and I personally think it works with Ladrien too. There‘s different aspects of those relationships that can be explored and create problems that they have to overcome (like the power imbalance with the civilian x hero ships, how do you handle that while dating?)

I wish the writers would use the square more effectively

I'm not against pre-reveal dating, but I agree that Adrienette is the worst side to chose from a story telling perspective because - as you so rightly pointed out - it's arguably the side with the least identity shenanigans and the side that has the least ties to the superhero stuff that's supposed to be the show's main focus. Adrienette is the side you chose if you're focusing on civilian drama which, to be fair, was season five's main focus even though Gabriel had stolen the miraculous and we were all expecting that complication to be the focus of the season five plot.

Instead the focus was "will Marinette ever have the courage to say a kind word to Adrien's face instead of just telling others how much she loves him even though she knows that he explicitly returns her feelings, making this plot kind painful on every level" which was... a choice.... Five seasons and we're still doing this shit? Really?

This may mean that the writer's plan in season six is to continue to focus on civilian drama or it could mean that they didn't think further than season five and we're about to get a lot of awkward writing. Who knows? I have no idea how they're going to handle civilian dating plus secret identities for long since the writers chose the only side of the square where running off to fight akumas isn't a given thing that the couple-in-question knows will happen. My best guess is that the writers will probably just avoid putting Adrienette in the type of situations Adrigami and Lukanette were put in, I guess?

No matter how they handle it, I don't expect major identity shenanigans because the show has never done much with identity shenanigans probably because quality identity shenanigans require you to be able to draw out plots over multiple episodes and then resolve those plots. This show cannot have that kind of plot progression given it's formulaic nature and the "there must always be a secret between Adrien and Marinette" rule, thus the identity shenanigans being so limited.

This means that the side best suited to the show's writing is probably Ladynoir. Still room for the minor identity shenanigans that the show limits itself to, baked-in-yet-low-stakes tension from having to keep the relationship a complete secret, and a much more logical result of the writing in the first four seasons. While Adrien is far from perfect and has issues to rival Marinette's, his crush always felt like the stronger one given that he actually spent time with Ladybug and had a true relationship with her.

Marinette, on the other hand, barely talked to Adrien because the show literally has a rule that she can never successfully confess her crush, so they needed to keep her and Adrien from becoming close to make those continued failed confessions somewhat plausible. Given all that, it's hard for me to buy that Adrien's crush flipped to this girl that he barely knows. Meanwhile Ladybug's crush flipping had a pretty strong setup given that Chat Noir has been her loyal support in her darkest hours.

But that's not what they went with! Instead of having the secret be the low-stakes identities secret, the secret between them is, "Your father was a super villain whose minions killed you on multiple occasions and whose death you were arguably involved with. While were on the topic of your messed up family, you're an artificial being whose creation killed you mother. Oh, and we're also hero partners, which feels like a minor thing compared to all of that, but we might as well mention that, too."

...choice were made folks. Choices were made. This is so not how you write a formula show! You never go this serious!

Since you mentioned the Civilian/hero pairings, let's talk about those both to end on a lighter note and because that's where my personal favorite lies as I am here for identity shenanigans. That's right, folks, I am once again here to sell you on my Ladrien supremacy agenda.

While I have nothing against Marichat, it is not a good fit for canon. It's simply too limiting because Marinette is not a celebrity. There's a reason that of Marinette's canon hangouts with Chat Noir (and almost all Marichat fics) start on her balcony. That's really the only place they can meet up without drawing attention, which should be a major concern for them.

I physically cringed when the show had them go to the movies and on an ice cream date because Chat Noir was being so irresponsible! He cannot be shown to have a close relationship with a civilian, which is the excuse he should have given at the end Elation since that the episode included Gabriel discovering their relationship. The excuse Chat Noir actually gave feels pretty dismissive of his canon relationship with Marinette. She has canonically spent more time talking to Chat Noir then she's spent talking to Adrien and the same actually goes for the amount of time Ladynoir spends talking about non-hero things, so this feels off:

Cat Noir: I’m sorry about what happened, Marinette. You’re right, you have the right to love anyone you want. Even a superhero. But it’s easy for a person to mistake idolization of a superhero for love. So, even if I like this person very much, I could be taking advantage of the situation, and I just can’t do that. It would be wrong.

Evil Illustrator, their heartfelt talk in Glaciator, the movie date in Glaciator 2, and a bunch of other little moments add up to somehow make Marichat the deepest side of the square, which is painfully bad writing given how little screen time this side gets, but it's still what canon gave us. Marinette is not just a fan who only knows him from a distance. They are friends and even occasional teammates. The only reason this pairing doesn't work in canon is because there's nowhere for the relationship to go until a partial or total reveal happens.

Prior to that, it's just these two hanging out on her balcony or maybe going on secret dates around the city. Cute, but not suited to a silly superhero romcom aimed at kids where every story needs to be told in about 20 minutes. It's best left to long form fan content that is allowed to be more about drama and romance than the actual show and also a little more spicy than the actual show because - let's be real here - those rooftop dates would not just be talking. I don't know how you'd write this pairing in a way that's both genuine and well suited to the intended audience. It's simply way more suited to a teen drama than a kid's show.

Ladrien, on the other hand, could work if canon wanted to go there. I don't think it would be a good fit for more than a season*, so Ladynoir is still the better pick for canon's format, but Ladrien could be a nice bit of pre-reveal padding to draw out the reveal and add some fun comedy if the show were allowed to have a reveal.

Because Ladybug and Adrien are both celebrities, you can have them interact in diverse settings without anyone thinking twice. This allows for a good amount of hijinks where Ladybug is trying to protect her boyfriend at public events without revealing their relationship while Adrien is trying to get her to let him run off and transform.

You can also do things like the public seeing them together, thinking they're a couple, and having them both deny it because they aren't, leading to Ladynoir comedy where Ladybug cries because she wishes they were and Chat Noir is like, "Wait, what? You what? ...My Lady, as your loyal partner who is here to support you in all things, I will get you your man even if it kills me!" The thinking-they're-a-couple thing could also be solved via Ladynoir by Ladynoir going public while Adrien remains "single". There's just a lot of potential for the show's style of absurdist humor here.

*Ladrien does eventually fall into the same issues as Marichat where it feels like the reveal needs to happen otherwise you're just repeating the same plots or going too spicy for a kids show via bedroom-based meetups, thus me saying that it's only good for about a season. There's also the problem that Akuma fights and supervillains are endless fodder for Ladynoir issues, but the only issue Ladrien could possibly address is Gabriel and Marichat's got nothing save for maybe Lila? So if you don't want to let a reveal happen, Ladynoir really is the best pick by far. Adrienette can work, but it's way less fun since they have to keep all these secrets while Ladynoir really only has one major secret or, at least, Ladynoir should only have one major secret (the identities). Canon has really dropped the ball on this one.

Now that I've written all this out, maybe the spicy issue is why canon went Adrienette? It's a lot easier to limit their alone time than it is to limit the alone time of any other side. I maintain that you could get away with it in pre-reveal Ladynoir by just ignoring the issue and giving them things to fight any time they try to have a date. You could also end episodes on them starting their date, leaving everything to the imagination but also keeping the setting relatively public (rooftops and the like) unlike the civilian/hero sides whose dates are going to be way more private. I fully understand why a show aimed at 5-to-12-year-olds wouldn't want to go there. That is far more suited to the teen drama Miraculous so desperately wants to be based on the ill-suited plots the writers keep going with.