#i get some people in this fandom are young..

[lizardsfromspace]

It's wild to me that so many people are saying "you need to realize Gen Z aren't going to save us" when they were the people saying that in the first place. They're lecturing themselves

"We need to explain why Gen Z males are the Hitler Youth now"

I'm not sure we do, because I don't think a 45-55 split are Hitler Youth numbers, especially when that bracket leaned more towards Harris than older ones. and when Gen Z voted Harris overall. I don't know why we have to leap between the wild extremes of Zoomers Are All Progressives Who Will Save Us and Never Vote Republican Ever & Zoomers Are All Hyper-Conservative Hitler Youth Who Will Destroy Democrats Forever.

I don't know why every online "debate" now is just people stating the most extreme possible version of a thing and then coming up with explanations for it, or why "is this true" has become a forbidden question. You can't question, you can only Explain The Trend and come up with solutions, which are similarly maximalist. It can't be "maybe we need some deradicalization programs", it has to jump to "ban people under 18 from the internet???"

But this panic that Gen Z will be Really Conservative has been going on for a while, and was driven mainly by fandom circles, and people are tacking on those fandom arguments to this. Because being told your fanfic is bad is oppression, and makes the person telling you it sucks not only themselves a Nazi, but everyone in their arbitrary age bracket a Nazi.

The answer is, yes, there are a lot of Gen Z who are censorious prudes, just like there were a lot of Gen X who were, and Boomers, and so on. They're kind of a eternal facet of mankind, actually? Gen Z will be conservative because every generation has a lot of conservatives in it. Gen Z will have a cult problem because people of all generations get drawn into cults. Maybe if you see one shitty person born within a certain age range you can just accept them as one shitty person and not representative of the whole

Young people were never coming to save you, and never thought they were coming to save you, and they aren't now monsters you need to be saved from

Looking at the debate over if Gen Z are all progressives who are going to save us or all reactionary fascist puritans and wondering if, perhaps, trying to draw a opinion about the political beliefs universal to every single person born between 1997 and 2012 is a bit silly

[ghouljams]

I just wanted to know if I'm alone in this, but do you ever wish the COD fandom was a little less ghost centric? No hate to anyone who writes about or loves ghost, I like reading fics about him, it just feels a little boring sometimes when 80% of all fics, fan art and cosplays are of him. No hate at all, I love your work, I'm just curious.

Oh no I agree it's very Ghost centric, and I say that as part of the problem. That's my boy, I love that mess of a man. I think the reason behind it is really simple though, and it's TikTok.

I think a lot of people(especially young people) were exposed to MW2 through TikTok because someone on their feed was gushing about the masked men in it. I have serious doubts as to how much of the fandom has actually played the games, and while sure there's always one character every fandom latches onto, I would've thought it would be Soap because he's one of the playable characters, or even Graves for the same reason! (Unfortunately there's too much racism in fandom for Gaz to become the one everyone latches onto, but he should've been, he's so charming and pretty everyone should've gone crazy over him.)

Another part of the issue is how Activision treats Ghost. He's constantly getting new skins and merchandise, and while this could be because he was the darling of the original MW2 franchise('09 Ghost my love) it's also probably a response to fandom engagement.

I agree, it does get boring when he's all that's out there. And again when there's so much of the fandom that's never played the game, sometimes it can be hard to sift through and find actual accurate characterization of him. There's so much flanderized Ghost in fandom and it kinda grinds my gears. Not because I think my interpretation is perfect or anything, just because some of it is so far from Canon that it's painfully clear the writer is a fan of Ghost cosplayers and not Ghost the character.

So I think a lot of folks would agree with you. That's why I see such a push towards Gaz/Soap/Price as the main love interest in fics. There's just so much Simon Riley to wade through...

[sunglassesmish]

ngl. since lou seems to have been p active online up until he joined 911, and since he was already very familiar with the show, i think he went quiet because he knew/could predict that a segment of the fandom would not be great. i think he was just surprised by how bad it got.

honestly, that could be possible. in all his interviews right after 7x04 came out and in cameos too, he was like guys i know you love buddie and it’s great and all but like.. can we appreciate the story right now for a second? but i don’t think he realised just how bad some people in that fandom could get, and he’s probably not had much interaction with online fans since not many of his past shows/movies had such an active (and young) fanbase.

especially after buddie wasn’t happening and bucktommy was still going strong. i know most people saw bucktommy as something short and just a stepping stone for buddie, and then when it didn’t happen around 7x06 and after, it got a lot worse.

it’s kinda crazy that actors of love interests for buck and eddie both get harassed or disliked for the mere crime of being a love interest. and i think he may have known that going into this, and once it started getting worse he realised he had to step back.

[goodhickey]

okay can we talk about this actually. I was having a similar conversation with a friend this morning and this is exactly right and more people need to acknowledge this I feel like.

personally, I don't find anything inherently wrong with shipping and headcanons, nor do I think viewing art through those lenses inherently devalues it or indicates a lack of understanding of the source material but I won't lie. in service of some of the headcanons people make, a lot of the actual point of the show can get lost in the weeds.

I understand jokingly saying a character didn't deserve their fate or having some sympathy for the young men who didn't know any better, but like, we must remember that above everything else these men were a part of this expedition as an act of colonization which necessitates native displacement. they are all racist and rotten to their cores for their participation in and blind faith in imperialism and they committed atrocities and hurt countless people, not just themselves.

and, if that's something you don't want to have to reckon with, I'm not sure why you're in the fandom for this show honestly, but I also understand not feeling qualified enough to speak about these topics in depth for fear of accidentally misstepping. what I don't understand is why people will willfully disregard the core of this show in service of pretending that these men were anything but what they were. have empathy if you must, but not without remembering that foremost, every man on both of these ships were colonizers.

the irony and tragedy in their collective death isn't that they didn't deserve it, but because their pointless effort to expand their empire is the very thing that killed them. it's the sheer unnecessity of their violence and their lust to conquer. they did this to themselves, and they didn't even have to. they did deserve it.

my beef with most of the terror meta on this site is that almost all of it forgets the central premise of the whole thing which is the black sucking nihility of settler colonialism

none of these men are martyrs. martyrs die for something. all of these sailors came to the arctic to claim and conquer it and they ended up dying horrifying, needless, preventable deaths for queen and country

the irl franklin expedition refused help from native peoples and refused to learn how to survive so they all died in like the worst ways imaginable

that’s what manifest destiny gets you in the end!! a long legless drop into a small icy hole

it’s not martyrdom because they didn’t even succeed lmao dying in the most prolonged agonizing way you can to conquer the globe for the british empire and you failed spectacularly

[dreamings-free]

idk if this is something but it’s weird

https://x.com/louistmedia/status/1747311267138941382?s=46

oh twitter.. 🙄 a tour manager has no say in whether a tour happens or not that’s on the artist, their management and the tour promoter. and believe me tours get cancelled all the time for a multitude of reasons. if there’s an issue they’d just hire another tour manager.

eta: apparently the tweet is private now so here’s a screen cap under the cut

[natjennie]

sorry I really don't know how to shut up but I think it's possible that a lot of the takes that are like. "ouagh but they should've stayed together forever what happened to them being family 😭" are kind of mm. immature? naive? like have you never had a family member move out? have you never had a sibling go off to college? have you never moved away from a best friend? your family doesn't stop being your family if you don't live together. you don't stop loving people if you're not right next to them. I thought this was the "I keep a part of everyone I've ever met with me" website. what happened to the "I learned how to ride a bike from my best friend's dad when I was 7 and we don't talk anymore but I think about her every time I ride one" like. so much of growing up and being an adult is losing people. in every conceivable way. you grow apart, you talk less, you don't visit as much, you move away. that doesn't make them any less important to you. it doesn't make them any less family. it doesn't make the love any less real. something being over doesn't cheapen the fact that it happened. a show ending doesn't make the rest of it not worth watching. "it's a sad song, it's a sad tale it's a tragedy, it's a sad song but we sing it anyway," right?

[necrotic-nephilim]

I started in DC by reading fanfics, but as I began to read actual comics, I started to be unable to read the actual fanfic that got me into it in the first place because it's so out of character.

But there are still some stories that I love to read because I love the found family trope so much, even if it isn't really accurate to the source material.

As a comics purist (sometimes), are there tropes that you like enough that you'll still enjoy a fic even if it's not accurate to canon?

oh my god this is SUCH a fun question. bc while i started with the comics, there were certain characters and/or character dynamics where i was exposed to the fanon before the canon (just bc it's hard to read everything when you start out just to read some fanfic) and so i've definitely experienced the fanon to canon transition. (*especially* with Jason Todd. i had only read 80s/90s stuff where he was already dead or the New-52 bc that was on-going when i got into comics and man. the fanon misunderstandings i had about him before i got frustrated and sat down to read all his pre-Flashpoint stuff were absolutely bonkers.) and aside from that, whilst i tend to prefer canon over fanon, i'm not past giving fanon its flowers for occasionally having really interesting insights. occasionally. so some of my fanon "guilty pleasure" tropes would probably be

Morally Grey Tim Drake - this is one where if you try to back it up with canon, i *will* get salty about it. of everyone in the Batfam aside from maybe Bruce and Cass, Tim has the *most* black and white morals. often his internal conflicts are routed in such an inability to compromise his moral views and it can cause him to clash with other characters. he's *very* stiff and rigid in his beliefs and is *rare* to compromise in even the smallest ways. i mean, DC has repeatedly used Tim Drake of Tomorrow/Savior/Gun Batman!Tim for a reason. it's to demonstrate that of everyone, Tim *cannot* have his morals compromised. there's no grey area for him. he's zero or a hundred, so if he tips over the edge of "too far" he tips *all the way*, and doing so is one of his worst fears, how he could go "too far" if he let himself. a couple panels out of context from Red Robin (2009) (which was a grief spiral for Tim to begin with) don't change that. now that said. if it's done *right*, i sort of love Tim being morally grey in fanfic. it takes a specific flavor for me, and it's incredibly important to include that mental spiral along with it, of him struggling to justify it. i don't have any interest in "Tim Drake is loosy goosy with Bruce's morals and has the highest kill count and no one knows teehee" bc it doesn't play with the interesting parts of making Tim morally grey, which are fracturing his psyche. but all in all, i think it's fun to put Tim in a morally grey area and i will read it in fanfic and i enjoy writing it a lot

Joker Junior!Tim Drake - i've not written it on this account (yet) but on my main ao3 account one of my biggest fics surrounds this concept. this is one of those "well *technically* it's canon but only in a specific very divorced from the comics universe and would not work at all in the main timeline" so, i categorize it as fanon in that 95% of fics exploring the concept are not doing so within the Batman Beyond universe, but the main timeline. i just love it. I'll take any excuse to whump Tim, but this concept is so fun. psychologically breaking Tim will always be my favorite pastime. there are so many ways to explore the long-term effects this could have on him, how it could affect the Batfam. i'm not a fan of it being used as a "gotcha" to Jason or Babs' trauma with the Joker to paint Tim as the Ultimate Victim, but it is fun to see how their relationships would be affected by being mutual victims of him. (i have a vague JayTim idea where TIm fully retires from being Robin after being Joker Junior and killing the Joker, making Steph Robin for most of his typical Robin era and Jason still tracks him down out of curiosity bc he wants to know what happened and all. very underbaked but i've got thoughts.)

Renegade/Apprentice of Slade!Dick Grayson - this is another one where yes, this happened *sort of* in canon, but i highly doubt most people writing Renegate!Dick have read or are actually pulling from Nightwing: Renegade. it's just an exploration fo the concept fo Dick being Slade's apprentice and i will always eat it up in any capacity. whether Dick grows up with Slade from a young age, or chooses Slade for whatever reason later in life. it's not anything that works in canon bc it compromises Dick morally (similar to the above with Tim) and therefore will always come across incredibly fanon in most fics. but i can't say i don't enjoy it. it's fun to make Dick a little morally fucked up and see what you can make him under Slade's tutelage.

Jason & Damian Meeting in the League -there's no world where i believe this could work in the canon comics. (maybe in the Young Justice cartoon i suppose, but even then i think it's iffy) i would go as far to say it's wildly unrealistic. i don't see a world where Ra's would let Jason anywhere *near* Damian, bc Jason was Talia's pet project that he didn't approve of. that all said, there's something very interesting about how they *could've* met and them potentially bonding during that timeframe. them being somewhat brotherly during this time because Jason sees Bruce in Damian and sort of latches onto the kid and Damian is full of wonder hearing real stories about Batman and Robin, then that getting violently ripped away by Jason leaving the League is fun to me. it's fun how that could affect them within the Batfam and all. it's super fanon to me, but i do not care. i will eat it up

Bad Dad Clark Kent/Good Dad Lex Luthor - i will admit as a late, i've been less and less kind to this particular fanon bc of everything i've argued with people about, *this* one seems the most pervasive as misunderstood fanon. i don't mind when fanon exists, my gripe is when ppl try to claim it's canon. and the *arguments* i've had over this with people who can never seem to cite an actual comic are... frustrating. but that said, i think there is something fun to this strictly in fanon. the duality of who you expect to accept Kon and who you expect to hurt him being flipped is just sort of fun for the occasional guilty pleasure fic. it can make Kon's internal conflict a bit more interesting. the same goes for the Jon favoritism from Clark, it's not a canon thing (and i rlly wish ppl understood how complicated the timeline of Kon and Jon is and any distance from Clark toward Kon isn't malice, it's that Kon is from a timeline that Clark does not remember in the current canon so Clark just straight up doesn't know the poor kid.) but it's sort of fun to give Kon that complex of being overlooked and forgotten sometimes. making Kon just a *bit* more Luthor than Kent will *always* appeal to me in fanfic, especially if he *knows* it's wrong but craves approval from anyone who will give it.

Good Dad Bruce Wayne - i'll die on the hill Bruce is canonically a shitty father. maybe not to the extreme some people write him as, but he's not great at it. that said, i enjoy it in fanfiction. sometimes, i just want silly fluff or hurt/comfort where Bruce finally gets it right and manages to comfort whatever Batkid is in the fic. one of my favorite fics of all time is hinged on Bruce being a good dad, so i think it's just fun to explore how good the relationships *could* be, if Bruce was slightly less of an asshole. i usually prefer him as an asshole, but there are times i want low stakes nonsense.

Gotham Rogues Having Soft Spots for Robin(s) - just about every Rogue in Gotham has done something absolutely irredeemable, and most of them don't like or care about anyone in the Batfamily. but if there's a fic where one of the Robins inexplicably is sort of close with a Rogue and they have a cute silly relationship out of it? I'll eat it up i fear. Steph and the Riddler are besties? I'll believe it. Tim and Scarecrow get along pretty well? give me ten of these. Rogues protecting Robins just hits a spot. the unexpected nature of the relationship, as well as the fact they see each other regularly, can make a lot of good fodder.

[daffi-990]

Yeah how about we don’t be this person.

[utilitycaster]

I enjoy shipping, but I cannot see the appeal in watching shows only for the purpose of shipping; I think it closes you off to so much. I think coming into a work with the expectation that it will only succeed if a particular configuration of people end up happily in a relationship with each other when the curtain closes means you will reject so many unexpected choices altogether. It destroys your ability to appreciate the entire concept of tragedy. Just, imagine refusing to let yourself enjoy "I'm not a gardener" because you are too furious that a different kiss than the one you wanted happened to feel other emotions.

[shiraishi--kanade]

Another thing I need pjsk fandom to realize:

1) there are literal 10 years old (and younger) children in this fandom;

2) the percentage of these children in the fandom is MUCH, MUCH higher than every single one of you here on tumbrl think it is.

"why do people write so much for popular characters?" "why do people write for kudos only?" aside from the fact that the "write for yourself" is a self-perpetuating issue in every fandom and the fact that every writer deserves engagement with their works, it's because there are kids here. Who want to fit in and get praised for their creativity. Which they can only achieve by writing for popular stuff. So maybe take that into account.

[neversam]

I agree, Teru is a character who we see more on the job, as an exorcist in my opinion. This leads the fandom into thinking his personality is more sadistic, which it is, but that’s not his whole personality. It’s like how a person can act completely different with two people. He cares for people, it’s one of the reasons he’s an exorcist on top of being in the minamoto clan. I can’t remember the chapter exactly, but I know in the first ASHK episode of season 2, he says it’s the job of an exorcist to get rid of nightmares (or something similar I can’t remember lmao) after he calls Yashiro cute so she doesn’t get any more bad dreams. He didn’t have to do that. There are more examples of him being kind or being other things other than sadistic. He’s also the student council president, people love him. If he was sadistic to everyone no one would like him.

Oh also, people tend to forget he was the one who practically raised Kou, and look how respectful and kind he turned out to be? Teru doesn’t exactly get many options being the oldest of the minamoto clan, having an absent father, and a dead mother. He was trained since he was young, he was taught to kill these supernaturals without another thought. He grew up having to go out and do missions so his siblings didn’t have to. He’s gotten used to killing these supernaturals without a second thought because that’s how he’s survived so far—no mercy on them, because if he tried to help every single one he came across he would probably be dead by now. So this is why he probably doesn’t trust any of them, and sometimes gets a kick out of them suffering. Wouldn’t you also feel a little joy if these so called monsters, or supernaturals who might want to kill you, suffer a little bit? Suffer like a human would when they might die to the hands of one of them?

I got a little off topic oops, but yeah in summary he isn’t only sadistic he has other traits and his sadism has a reason to it but it isn’t him as a whole, he’s a teenager still guys! Not some heartless killing machine!

So yeah random ramble ignore this lmao

Ok I feel like people over play Teru being sadistic in his character???

Yes he is (when it comes to supernaturals mostly) and I'm all for toxic Terukane but I feel like people are putting to much focus on it to the point of OOC- I think it's people's lingering hate for Teru that there still trying to make him the soul bad person even tho I absolutely KNOW Akane is also bad and would add to it as well-

I also have a mutual that ships NatsuTeru that thinks Teru would get enjoyment out of hurting/killing Hiko- ofc everyone can have there option on how a ship would be and if you enjoy the more toxic side of it that's completely fine but they think Teru would GENUINELY enjoy it- like canonically? And I've seen Terukane fics similar and idk it makes no sense to me? Teru isn't THAT sadistic at all in canon (ofc AGAIN he IS sadistic but not to that degree-)

Idk OFC no hate to any people I'm talking about- just bc I disagree doesn't mean you can't think what you do- and I'm not hating on my mutual at all ok lmao I love there crazy out of box takes and that's exactly why I'm mutuals with them even if I don't agree

I just wanted to talk a little about this bc a lot of people think this also mischaracterized version of Teru is how he would in Canon feel- ofc everyone's take on a character will be a little OOC but I personally don't think Teru's nearly as sadistic as people make him out to be and I feel like it's aggregated in his character a lot more then it actually is-

Idk I'm just sharing my thoughts a bit- don't take it to seriously lmao

[anonfromtheflight]

Once again incredibly grateful that in November last year after watching Young Royals season 1 for the first time, I opened Tumblr instead of Twitter. (And thank you again for you @simonsapelsin for @young-royals-confessions) 🫶🏽🫶🏽🫶🏽💜💜💜💜

[edgyh3dgy]

I see so much of the atla fandom saying that “sokka died young”…NO?? WHERE ARE YOU GUYS GETTING THIS?? HE LIVED PAST AANG, WHO DIED AT 66?? HE HELPED ZUKO AND TONRAQ FIGHT AGAINST THE RED LOTUS…WHICH WAS WHEN KORRA WAS ALIVE?? AN ACCURATE ASSUMPTION OF WHAT AGE HE DIED IS LIKE…EARLY 70S?? THATS NOT YOUNG??

[thebookworm0001]

I just think the fandom’s nastier responses to the bg3 men is wildly interesting

like. you have three men who are coming out of highly unhealthy relationships.

One of them gets super sexualized and infantilized at the exact same time. literally people put him in the bdsm harness while simultaneously misinterpreting elven cultural norms to say he’s mentally no more mature than a teenager despite having been a whole-ass local judge who died because he gave out corrupt rulings and got his ass jumped because of them.

the other gets treated like he’s an incel because he catches feelings quickly, despite being wildly respectful when you turn him down. Half the issues were due to a bug, the other is that this man is so starved for validation because his goddess - whom has paid special interest to him since he was a toddler - kept him constantly feeling lesser-than because despite calling him her Chosen, she gives him none of the power we see Chosens be given by other gods. Not to mention she sends her other ex - his mentor and friend - to tell him to off himself to earn her forgiveness. For some reason his attempts to gain god-like power are received worse than the borm-sexy-yesterday-vampire despite both of them having the goal of being safe from manipulation and control. I assume because the vampire gets a sex scene when you let him destroy his soul for power and the wizard does not.

The fairytale prince route, despite typically being very popular, is being called boring and dull and while, yes, he has less drama than some of the others, is still compelling and has high stakes for that character. He’s sold his soul but he thinks the price is worth it and he’s made his peace with the personal cost because he’s helping people. The only real difference between this character and others who are willing to sell their souls for the good of their lands is that this time around, he’s Black

[vladdyissues]

If only everyone had the same mindset (as in "You do you, don't bother me and I won't bother you"), something as silly as ship discourse wouldn't exist. It's unfortunate that there will always be people who think of themselves as having higher moral grounds over fictional matters. I find it ironic, considering it's mostly antis who send death threats to normal fans.

I admire your courage, but I also worry that those antis might falsely report you and others in the same boat (or, God forbid, send death threats) just for the sake of being petty. Here's hoping they have more decorum. Stay safe, will you? I'm eagerly looking forward to your next creation. Have a nice day/night!

Thank you, anon. In my experience, most people in fandom—I'd say around 75-85%, depending on the media—abide by the precept of Live and Let Live, especially in matters concerting fiction. The ones turning fandom into a battleground are the minority. A loud, misinformed minority who use provocative language and make sensational, bogus claims, which draws a lot of attention and leaves outsiders with the impression that the fandom in question is a war zone, when it truly isn't.

Speaking broadly, the DP fandom is wonderful, full of some really awesome, funny, kind, talented people. I'm really glad to be a part of it :)

[fishyfishyfishtimes]

Re: moomin fandom

I don't want to get all old man yells at cloud in here but I agree wholeheartedly. Finding community in something you enjoy is great and all but there's something about fandoms in particular that puts me off, particularly the flattening of characters into simple tropes and the misinterpretation issue you mentioned. (<- those two go pretty much hand in hand anyway)

This is an INCREDIBLY first world problem and I often just keep my thoughts to myself because it does not matter one bit but 🤝 you are not alone.

Oh phew, good thing I'm not that out of touch! Yeah there's something about fandom that does that. Perhaps fandom jokes that start out small eventually spiral in the fandom echo chamber into large exaggerations, which slowly go and replace whatever happens in the source material? Err, maybe. That's how I feel it happens in some fandoms. Perhaps I'm only nostalgic because there really were no Moomin fanworks back in the day (besides heavily satirical ones, Moomin YTP I love you), so there could be no major misunderstandings, and if there had been more in the past then they would've contained just as many as there now are ^^'

Fortunately there is a solution, which is not interacting with the fandom at all! It usually works for me very nicely, people in fandom can enjoy their interpretations and I can enjoy the source material and the fanworks I wish to consume UU