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mutable-manifestation · 2 years ago

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The Ghost King (of Miscommunication) Ch. 20

Part 1-12,Part 13,Part 14,Part 15, Part 16, Part 17, Part 18, Part 19

Part 20!

Info:

DC timeline is fucked, I’m going with the “Batman know most ids but hasn’t revealed himself yet” and a use of the ol’ canon “Brucie Wayne is That Famous(™)" and known as being a serial adopter.

As for how Deadman knows things: Rama pulled a favor with clockwork to let Deadman mature as a ghost/learn about important zone information & culture before yeeting him back to the living world with no time lost bc balance reasons.

He doesn’t know everything about the zone - he’d be garbage at finding his way around and he doesn’t really know anybody - but he knows customs and he knows about halfas bc all info about the Ghost King was High Priority Know This Or Don’t At Your Own Risk (the risk is that will turn u into a . He basically spent a subjective decade practicing his powers or reading books on ‘how to ghost’ next to Rama. He never has to go back to the realm to ‘recharge’ because Rama just kinda beams him what he needs to keep going.

***

“Well,” Constantine starts as he - ‘Finally,’ Bruce thinks - steps up to the table, evidently finished examining the scene, “I can tell you why we couldn’t find shit wrong in Gotham.”

“Elaborate,” Bru- Batman - he has to be Batman, now, has to be calm and think if he wants to get Jason back - demands.

“Don’t get your cape in a twist, Dadman, I’m getting there.” Constantine rolls his eyes, taking a seat.

“There’s a reason I don’t visit Gotham if I can help it - other than its stellar reputation and your renowned hospitality to outsiders.”

His amused snort very quickly transitions to a grimace.

“Gotham’s got the magical equivalent of background radiation. Real uncomfortable stuff. Feels like walking in the world’s biggest graveyard. And that-” he jabs a thumb over his shoulder “-feels just like it.”

“You’re saying he’s being kept somewhere in Gotham?” Red Robin perks up, voice hopeful and doubtful at once.

“No,” Constantine shoots down. “I’m saying whatever little fairy theory the kid had going was wrong, the fae haven’t lived in hell for centuries now. Even if it were them, pocket dimensions don’t actually work like that.”

“Wherever that portal led to reeks of death-” the Gotham heroes all tense at this, the others shooting them tentative looks of concern as Constantine steamrolls on “-and Gotham is exactly enough of a cesspit to have covered up the stink of it before. If it weren't for him being treated relatively well there, I woulda guessed he’d been dragged to hell. Dunno much about heaven - obviously - but I’ve never heard of them having escapees.”

“Obviously not,” Robin snaps, standing. “Red Hood is not dead, he was just here. We were able to see and interact with him, without any need for your tricks. Now can you tell us what it is, or do you just intend to sit there and list off all of the things that it is not?”

Beside him, a brace of batarangs appears in Black Bat’s hand, fanned out threateningly.

“Black Bat, Robin, that’s enough.” Batman commands, voice leaving no room for argument.

“He didn’t have a pulse.”

All eyes snap to Oracle, whose voice is only barely heard thanks to the silence following Batman’s words.

“That doesn’t mean anything!” Red Robin insists. “Superman and Martian Manhunter don’t always have a detectable pulse! We already know Hood is…different now. But that doesn’t mean he’s dead! Some kind of magic or advanced tech could’ve-”

“You think I don’t know that?” Oracle demands softly. “I don’t want him to be dead either, but lying to ourselves will just make things harder. We need to know the truth if we’re going to get him back, whether we like that truth or not.”

Constantine allows a few seconds of somber silence before opening his mouth to break it, but is cut off by the door slamming open.

“I’m here,” Shazam says, rushing to his seat, “What’s going on?”

“One second,” Constantine interjects, “Deadman is here too. Let me just….”

Deadman pops into visibility over the table.

In lieu of re-explaining, they play back the relevant recordings - Batman had started them the moment he sat down, just in case.

There were only perhaps 15 minutes of relevant video, including the explanation, the re-kidnapping, and what little Constantine had told them - they’d spent much of the time Jason had been present getting details, brainstorming potential counter-strategies, and just generally killing time in the hopes that the clock would run out and everything would be fine.

“And that’s everything we have so far,” Batman says as he pauses the video - no need to replay the argument. “Thoughts?”

“Well, Conny’s right that they ain’t fairies. You’re not gonna like the answer, though.” Deadman starts, ignoring Constantine’s glare.

“If you have answers we want to hear them, whether we like them or not.” Batman insists, trying to reign in the fragile hope trying to bloom in his chest in favor of bracing himself.

“That portal led to the Infinite Realms - more commonly called ‘The Ghost Zone.’ As the name implies, it’s infinite and - whaddaya know - full of the dead.”

“Then Red Hood is…what? In heaven? Limbo?” Batman’s mind races; was it even possible to steal him back? Had they just…been allowed a final goodbye?

“Nah,” Deadman says, breaking him out of his thoughts.

“Heaven, Hell, Purgatory - those places might be all Constantine has interacted with, but you gotta remember that I talk to Rama. Avatar of Vishnu? Yeah. The afterlife is a lot more complicated than most people think; fact of the matter is, all the afterlives people have believed in over the ages exist, and they all sit neatly in their own little slices of the Realms.”

Deadman floats to sit cross-legged at the head of the table.

“The only reason portals to hell and other locations in the Realms look different is because the local deity and/or devil makes them so, but much of the Zone is ungoverned by any specific deities or devils, so if you just open a portal to a random location, odds are it’s gonna be the green swirly.”

“So he is dead,” Signal concludes mournfully.

“Not necessarily. Kid said he got pulled through a portal to some kind of medical center, right? And his body was completely normal until one day he woke up looking different. And you lot didn’t find a body anywhere?”

“No,” Batman answered, “All we could find was the residue from the portal.”

“Well, if he’d up and died he shoulda left a body behind; it woulda been dumped back out by now - somewhere obvious, too, ghosts are big on proper burials. So unless someone managed to vaporize him, odds are he’s not fully dead, but he’s definitely at least a little dead.”

Robin scoffs, “‘A little dead.’ Do you hear yourself? Either he is dead or he is alive, there is no in between for that kind of thing.”

Deadman merely snorts.

“Says the liminal.”

Robin frowns.

“Liminal?” Robin, Batman, and Constantine all chorus.

“I thought that was just Gotham being possessive,” Constantine continues with a raised brow, turning an appraising eye on the batfamily.

“No,” Deadman answers, “All of you bats and birds are liminal - some more than others. Just a little changed, just a little touched by death. With any luck, the missing kid’s case is just a bit more severe. But we can talk more about that later. Back to the kid.”

And they will get to it later. Jason is their priority now, but if something is going on with his kids Bruce intends to know about it.

Deadman pauses to take an unneeded breath.

“I’m gonna be real with you - and Batman, don’t freak out - but it sounds to me like he’s been ghost adopted.”

A beat.

“Excuse me?”

Deadman waits for the litany of ‘what the hell’s and ‘ghost adopted???’s and ‘he already has a family!’s to die down.

The non-Gotham members of the League remain quietly confused - hoping this means things can be resolved peacefully while privately wondering if the bats and birds really would turn out to be some kind of self-unaware cryptids.

“Okay. Ghosts form when enough ectoplasm and ectoenergy - which you can think of as basically the carbon and electricity of the Zone, I guess, at least in this context - are present at the death of a being experiencing strong emotions. In the absence of that perfect mixture, a shade - just a soul with no real power - is formed, only able to become a proper ghost and form a core if brought to the Infinite Realms-”

“A core?” Batman asks.

“Ghost brains, basically. Anyway, ghosts can also form if there’s enough ectoplasm and energy in one place, either from the zone itself - known as neverborns - or from strong enough ghosts intentionally forming them - known as naturalborns. Now, ghost families don’t work the same as living families do. Ghost families form from a sort of ‘dibs’ system-”

“Dibs?” comes Flash’s incredulous voice.

“I’m gettin’ there,” Deadman sighed at the second interruption. “As I was sayin’. Regardless’a how, once a core is formed the new ghost is considered a baby ghost. It isn’t really a one-and-done process. Sure, once you’ve got a core you’ve got a ghost now, but not a mature one. Cores have to grow until they reach a stable size and energy level - usually marked by natural power acquisition settling down and ectoplasm fluctuations stabilizing. How long it takes depends on the quality and quantity of ectoplasm and ectoenergy available - the shortest known time was just under 5 years, longest was a few hundred, I think? Average is a decade or two.

This is relevant,” Deadman emphasizes for those who are visibly growing impatient, “For two reasons.”

“Firstly,” he holds up a finger, “The ecto a ghost takes in while maturing has an impact on how it develops, the powers it ends up with naturally. Everything in the zone is made of ectoplasm, and ghosts both take it in and echo out the excess - like plants, kinda. Maybe.

So if a baby ghost is around, say, a fire ghost a lot of the time it’ll probably end up with fire powers of its own. Assuming it was early enough and their core wasn’t already leaning towards ice or something. A stronger ghost parent also means faster growth.

Now, the Infinite Realms are infinite. People can’t always find each other, some people die at different times, some people return to the cycle before their loved ones die, some are neverborns, etc. Most sapient beings want friends and family, it’s just how it goes. So ghosts sometimes just kinda. Dibs each other.

Multiple dibs’ are pretty abnormal; baby ghosts aren’t actual babies in the human sense of the word. They don’t just pick a parent and stay there all the time while they’re waiting to mature. There’s generally that first few week-to-month period where they’ll stay put with whoever dibses them first for safety until the basics settle in, but after that? Ghosts explore, and dibs occur, and lots of newbies end up with something like a dozen parents and however many siblings-in-dibs.

Secondly,” another finger joins the first in a peace sign, “And what I suspect - and hope - is that while souls can fail to form cores and become shades, the opposite is also possible; a living being can become liminal enough to form a core. Making dibsing pretty much inevitable - no decent ghost is going to leave a baby seemingly stranded in the living world to starve into nonexistence. Gotham might have enough polluting the place, but it’s pretty much all rancid so that would’ve made them even more eager to get the kid outta there.”

“So what you’re saying,” Red Robin drawls, “Is that he’s dead-but-not-really and is only missing because a dead-for-sure person took one look at him, went ‘that’s baby,’ and pulled a Bruce Wayne?”

“Pretty much.”

“Even if it wasn’t intended to be malicious it’s still a kidnapping,” Batman says.

“Well, Wulf did offer to let the kid bring guests back with him-”

“What!?” Everyone choruses.

“Yeah, though given the whole fae-kidnapping assumption I think the kid took it as a threat, but he asked the kid how many of you he wanted to bring as guests. He said none, so Wulf said do not pass go, do not collect two-hundred dollars." Deadman said casually, as if that wasn't a heartbreaking bombshell to drop.

"Anyway, point is, if this really is just one big misunderstanding then you can go talk it out. Ghostspeak isn’t really living-friendly and the living language he did know clearly didn’t help. Lucky you, I can translate. And the Realms are a human-safe environment. Well, the air is breathable at least.”

"Human-safe my ass," Constantine spits. "If the demons I deal with dwell in one little slice I don't even wanna think about the kind of nightmares strolling around the rest of the place."

"We're not leaving Red Hood in there."

The Gotham heroes' words leave no room for argument.

They get down to planning.

***

Fun Fact:

Ghosts do change their names because of the whole ‘holds power’ thing - not in a mind control way, but in an emotional way. If someone can dig up how you died they’re probably gonna say something insensitive. Case in point: people on ghost shows being like “hey *ghost name* we heard *insert horrible thing here* happened to you. Is that true?” Rude. You’re a complete stranger.

Anyway here’re the ghost names.

The trio had been dating for over a year when Sam & Tucker died and it was a very stable relationship. They’d been planning out their future together by that point, down to details like where to live so all of their work would overlap, how to manage Danny’s lack of aging (aka moving frequency), etc. When they brought up thinking of ghost names Danny - distracted - immediately just said, “Well you could just go by Phantom now since you will be in another year or two anyway.” He’s incredibly embarrassed when he realizes what he’s just said, but they’re all happy and engaged by the end of the day. (They tease him mercilessly about that being the world's smoothest yet most clueless proposal ever for the next 10 years)

Jazz & Spike Spook were already mentioned in canon with their sense of humor being explained (you’d think the joke would get old after 40 years, it hasn’t. Not when Danny still pouts when he hears Spike’s full name)

Jack was really excited to help fight ghosts as a ghost to protect Danny (he’s really proud of his baby boy growing up and becoming a king via fighting ghosts). He dies before Maddie and calls himself Jack Specter “after the specter deflector, because I be deflecting [your enemies implied here]” (Danny had to go lie down after hearing this sentence [Jazz’s sense of humor came from somewhere and that somewhere is Jack Fenton. Jack Fenton’s knowledge of ‘hip phrases’ comes from Jazz and Jazz’s sense of humor, also known as brother-torture or simply ‘betrayal’ as Danny claims]). Maddie likes that it fits the family name theme and calls back to one of their inventions (& wants to match her husband).

Dani stay a Phantom, ofc, and is formally ghost-adopted by Danny after he tells his parents everything (his parents formally human-adopt her so she has a stable human-world home if she want it, but she calls them Gran and Gramps as a joke that becomes sincere over time)

Wes goes by Wes Wraith because it’s close to wrath and he is fully and consistently angry about fenton=phantom and also a slight edgelord.

Ida Mason is also a ghost. She simply goes by ‘Wilda’ now (pronounced like wild-uh) and looks shockingly like Ember if she was an adult. And her hair wasn’t made of fire. And also went more pink than blue. So barely like Ember at all lol. She died in the middle of trying to finish knitting a scarf and now her obsession is knitting. She knitted a moped. She knitted a house. Home girl knitted herself an entire island and has not stopped.

The Manson parents have a little door-realm connected to their house in the living realm (like Poindexter with the school) and spend their time pretending everything is normal (like how Poindexter was stuck in the bullying loop but just. Reading the same newspaper/remaking the same dress, watching the same shows/etc).

The Foley parents were perhaps the most normal people on the show.

When Sam and Tucker died, the only ones who knew what happened were them and Danny - even Jazz didn’t get an explanation until she & the Fenton parents followed them into the ghost zone to find out what was going on - so the police were left to draw their own conclusions.

The GIW had already proven themselves to be reprehensible and overly willing to step on anyone who got in their way. The tech the police found was a collab between Dalv Co & the GIW and with Vlad’s disappearance and the GIW’s emotionless denial no one ever gets prosecuted for Sam & Tucker’s deaths (Vlad has a warrant out for him & the Mansons try to drag the GIW to court but it never goes anywhere).

The Foleys switch job tracks to take down the GIW/the Anti-Ecto Acts/any other asshole ghost hunters they can find. The Fentons are only exempt because they tell them what happened, explain how their stance on ghosts changed when they found out about Danny, and help the Foleys on their journey.

As ghosts Angela is obsessed with Justice & takes the name Justitia and Maurice is obsessed with ethics (bc if the GIW had any they wouldn’t have made weapons like that in the first place. Literal animals had more rights than ghosts at the point despite them being provably sapient) & takes the name Ethos. (They keep Foley as their last names tho). Yes, Danny does royal-decree them into being Walker’s oversight. Pretty much everyone is a fan of that. Except for the observants, who complain about everything but especially about how much Ethos & Justitia argue with them (what is the ‘greater good’ does not often match up with what is right. Especially when their idea of greater good is ‘eliminate problem via murder or core-crushing before it can become one’ instead of literally anything else).

@mayoota-blog1 @kyrianclawraith, @do3y, @someonebored0100 @omegasmileyface

#dpxdc #Batfam #Justice League #Deadman #John Constantine #poor batfam running the emotional rollercoaster of is he-isn't he #(dead)

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glompcat · 1 year ago

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Do you watch My Adventures With Superman? I feel like you would like it

I have been, and the first six episodes very much were my jam, they felt like after years of being burnt by DC to a point where I actively trained myself to stop caring - and more recently feeling like they specifically felt queer Jews should fuck off (Batwoman followed immediately by the Harley Quinn animated show was such a gut stab and very loud announcement on their part that if any of their queer Jewish characters were to star in something outside of comics they must leave their Jewishness behind) they were starting to redeem themselves.

However I really disliked a lot of "Kiss Kiss Fall in Portal" and it makes me wary of the show moving forward. Granted I basically have been doing my best to ignore DC since the insult that was the new 52, but back when I was a superfan of DC comics one of the key events in any timeline where Superman went evil was Lois died horribly and Clark was twisted up over it. Suggesting that throughout the multiverse Clark goes evil in enough timelines where Lois is alive and well that a collective of Lois's from across the multiverse would be packing Kryptonite and refuse to give him the benefit of the doubt really left a horrible taste in my mouth.

Additionally the way the multiverse Lois's behaved towards the one we are currently following did not feel true to the character to me. That is without getting into why I disliked the League of Lois's in the first place! Lois is not a scifi hero, and the idea that she actually is one in all the other universes - including ones we have followed in the past ourselves such as the DCAU and the dang Fleishman cartoons - really falls flat for me. Lois Lane is the greatest journalist of any universe she is in, defined by her unhinged willingness to do anything to get a story and bravery in the face of danger that puts metahumans to shame. Lois does not need any sort of dimension hopping craft or kryptonite guns or anything like that to be a badass.

Obviously I have no issue with the multiverse itself, DC has had a very well established and robust multiverse ever since the Silver Age when the Silver Age characters and the Golden Age characters would travel from Earth-1 to Earth-2 to have meetings, the only way to get rid of that multiverse is a Crisis and no one wants that, but the whole episode felt badly constructed to me and a truly badly thought out way to introduce doubts in Lois's mind about Superman's innate goodness, and probably also Krypton and Clark learning more about himself. There are far easier ways to establish these things, and even tie them directly to Lois's conflicted feelings about Sam Lane while setting up the big reveal that ~The General~ is General Sam Lane, Lois's father.

What made the show a delight up to that point was a sense that the creators really got what makes these particular characters so iconic they have stood the test of time. Clark being the most powerful man in the universe and also a total sweetheart. This is a character who was literally designed by Jewish immigrants in the 1930s to be a symbol of hope! He is supposed to cut through the noise of a toxic society to show a better way while also of course being an outsider trying to fit in. Lois being tenacious in the pursuit of a story to the point where it puts herself and everyone around her in danger - and that being exactly what Clark loves about her. Jimmy being a chipper and perpetually kinda youthful figure who loves his friends and they love him too (even if, lbr, Jimmy often also kinda annoys the often much older Lois and Clark) and rolls with the punches.

However the set up of that last ep went out of its way to single these versions of the characters out and say they are different from other versions of themselves.

I am not giving up on the show yet - I am hopeful with time the writers will find a way to redeem this plot they are setting up, but for right now? I felt like that episode missed the mark in a way that casts a long shadow over the rest of the show.

#lol thanks for remembering I used to be a massive DC fan anon

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stxleslyds · 4 years ago

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MY TOUGHTS ON PART ONE OF RED HOOD BY CHIP ZDARSKY :)

Finally I have read part one of the Red Hood story in Batman: Urban Legends!

This story is very interesting, we start with the Red Hood looking for the people who are providing Gotham with a new drug. This drug “Cheerdrops” has been passed around for weeks at this point and it has had devastating results among it's users. If you know Jason you understand that drugs are a big issue for him and one that he treats very carefully and seriously.

As he interrogates people he arrives to the building where one of the dealers of this drug is supposed to be, there he finds a horrific scene, a boy is desperately trying to wake up his mother who appears to have overdosed in her bed. Jason is quick to call an ambulance and get in contact with Oracle in order to find the boy's father who is (as he finds out later) the man that he was looking for.

Jason sees this scene and can't help but compare it to the time he went through this situation with his mom all those years ago, so he takes the boy with him so he can take him to his father, who Jason is hoping is a good man that had to sell drugs in order to help his family.

That's basically the premise of this first part of the story but now i will write about my thoughts on the specifics of the story.

The story begins with Jason giving a speech about fear and how it's used,

"Fear. Its a tool, it's his tool. I never really adopted it, maybe because he kept that fear all to himself." Then he continues with "Never had to rely on it, had to work harder to take out the bad guys, had to be...more direct." he finishes that thought with "Rubber Bullets. So that fear doesn't get turned around on me."

I for one really liked this Fear speech, it does really sum up what the Batman does, he relies on the Fear that he imposes on Gotham's criminals and such while Robin on the other hand was never meant to work with fear, which is true.

It did remind me of the speech that Alfred gave in issue #10 of Under the Red Hood about how Batman works with fear and Jason had some thoughts on it, here is some of it,

"Master Jason had a condescending practice of referring to the costumed criminals elements as 'dress ups'. He also noted that such individuals did not fear the Batman the way street thugs and mafioso did. The 'dress ups' did not believe he was a monster." "...the boy did say something to me that chilled me to the bone...even then. 'They all know he won't kill them.'"

Anyway let's go back to the actual comic I am talking about...

Jason speaks from his position as Red Hood in current time and says that he uses rubber bullets in order to keep the Bat at bay, the fear that the Bat uses against other criminals cannot be used against him if he plays within the Bat's rules.

As he was doing that he was actually trying to get info about who is making the drug but all he was able to get was who was selling it to the person he was interrogating. This drug is dangerous and Jason has to work fast.

Here is where we see the first flashback scene, we see Jason in the cave before he was able to go out as Robin and he is not to happy about it. The art is very beautiful but sadly in these panels i found my first problem with the context of Jason becoming Robin and how Zdarsky seems to set Jason's feelings on the first Robin.

It seems that Zdarsky is going for the “Jason believed Dick was the perfect Robin and no matter what he did he would never be as good as him” route, which fine ok, that's your right but, is it really necessary? I must admit i am a little tired of this particular thing because i adore the fact that when Dick and Jason first met they were fine with one another (even if a little wary at the very start). And the whole competitive and “i will never be as good as X person” is really tiring in the Robin/Batfamily fandom.

That problem is not as significant as the next one though.

Jason not thinking that Robin was “badass”. Well this is not only a bad take but it's completely OOC for Jason, no matter how you see it. From his first appearance as Robin to the flashbacks in Winick's UtRH and even through both of Lobdell's runs Jason has always loved the concept and the mantle of Robin as a child.

Batman v1, #385.

So that whole take is wrong, i don't like it and also who on this or any universe would rather call themselves Batboy? Honestly i hope this is never brought up again or i will cry. ((((Also in this house Robin will always be the name that Mary gave Dick and then he used as his hero name so it hurts a lot more))))

Also at the end of this first flashback Jason discovers a room full of firearms and is obviously surprised because Batman hates those so he asks why he has them, B responds that he has to understand how they work for his detective work, but that's not all he says, he also says this “...Guns are a coward's weapon, and we will not be cowards.”

Alright Mr. Zdarsky i see the irony... i also see the Daredevil / Punisher thingie right there.

Anyway we are now back to the present where we see Batman seeing the effects of the drug in one of its victims, after saving that person he takes some samples of the drug. We also get to see two police officers with different views on the “masks”, that's a nice way to set the story after the Joker War and before the Magistrate.

Back to Jason, he seems to be struggling, he can't find the people making/providing the drugs in Gotham and is also doubting his skills, he tells a man that if the information that he gave him is incorrect he “will find him” followed with another internal speech full of self doubt, “...sure thing Red Hood, right now you can't even find a street drug. Half of Gotham's teenagers could find it no problem. You never were the best detective.”

Alright, so Jason feels insecure about his skills now? First you have pre-Robin Jason not feeling like he could be able to keep up with the first Robin and now, Jason as a grown man has doubts about the skills that he has used for a long while now? I mean, press X for DOUBT because UtRH showed us how much of a badass and extremely skilled he is. This man planed everything in order to turn the Bat's world upside down (and this story has references to UtRH so it definitely happened) and now he feels like he is not that good?

Shit. i know where this is going, first the insecurities that he has already worked out... I can see it coming, the next big thing will be Daddy issues. Wonderful i hate it and i hope i am wrong because those “issues” are more than resolved, i know that's the only trope DC throws at Jason but honestly how different will it be this time?

Fine, lets move on. Jason finds himself in one of the apartments and what he sees is horrifying. Lying on a bed there is a woman completely catatonic with a horrible smile on her face and right next to her a terrified little boy.

Here is the best take on Jason's character so far.

Realizing that the child is scared of the situation and the masked man that just came into his home Jason takes off his mask and reassures the kid that he is there to help, it's quickly made obvious that the woman has overdosed on Cheerdrops, he makes sure to call an ambulance for her stating that she seems to be in a drug-related coma.

Its important to note that Jason is doing this as he is having troubling thoughts about how much this scene reminds him of the time he was in this little boy's (Tyler) shoes. Its hard for him but he soon realizes that he needs to make sure Tyler is safe.

He asks Tyler if he has another parent, he does and his name is Andy, after taking a look around the house Jason deduces that maybe the father is also taking drugs so if the police comes they will surely take Tyler and put him in the system, this idea is not one Jason is fond of so he calls Oracle, he asks if she can locate Tyler's dad's phone, when she asks about the kid Jason says that he will be the one keeping him safe.

Now we find ourselves back with Batman where he is investigating the components of Cheerdrops, he finds out that the drug is a modified version of Scarecrow's fear gas that gives the victim a sense of extreme happiness instead of fear.

Here we get confirmation of when in the timeline this story occurs, which is after the events of Infinite Frontier (where there was an attack on Arkham and many patients/prisoners were killed or escaped).

B suggests to Oracle that maybe Crane didn't die there and that he might be behind this drug, he will be on the job right away! To this Oracle is like well shit, so she tells B that Jason is also working this case...and here comes a funny yet confusing interaction.

Barbara says “I know you two aren't exactly friends right now but...” before she finishes Batman interrupts her by saying “He is a killer Barbara. I will do this alone.”

OH BOY is this interaction confusing! First of all may i point out how different this conversation is from the one in Three Jokers where the roles were basically reversed??? Please tell me that i am not the only one who finds that funny! Anyway that story doesn't matter here, but Red Hood Outlaw from Rebirth does, right?

Here is the thing, the last person that Jason “killed” in rebirth was Penguin and he actually didn't do it, he had him trapped in a panic room in his own Casino. Batman already beat the living shit out of Jason in RHatO #25 for it...and some time has passed, B surely found out that Jason didn't kill Penguin by now, i mean isn't he like the best detective to ever detective in the history of the universe??

Not only that but Jason has been using rubber bullets for a while and even at the start he mentions that, he basically implies that he is playing by the Bat's rules to keep him off his back. Maybe B hasn't let go of the duffel bag full of heads or any of the shitty people Jason killed during UtRH??? If B still holds that against Jason then why would he try to make Jason part of his Bat clan at the beginning of RHatO Rebirth?

Maybe he still thinks that Jason killed the penguin...but even then isn't B working with Harley and Ghost-Maker? You know, people who have killed? Why is Jason different? Did Jason kill someone recently that we don't know about? Jason only kills a very distinct set of people (that are very not nice) so i guess i don't see the logic...

Anyway second flashback, and this time we have a look at what was going on in the Batcave with B and Alfred during the events of UtRH! Nothing that wasn't explored in UtRH is said here but we do see Alfred explicitly telling Bruce how much they failed Jason. There is a heavy insinuation that the fact that Batman keeps sending the Joker to Arkham only for him to escape and kill more people actually makes B responsible for those deaths and i love that. Thank you.

Back to Jason and Tyler we get to see some very adorable scenes between the two. Jason gives the lower half of his mask to Tyler to protect his identity like a superhero and we have a really sweet moment in which Tyler chooses the Blue Hood as his name because he likes the colour blue (same Tyler).

After he leaves Tyler in a place where he will be safe he goes to the building where Andy should be and let me tell you the more Jason sees the less hopeful he becomes about Andy being just one of the people selling the drug... He does some shooting and incapacitating and then follows the man that is trying to escape and here is when shit hits the fan.

Andy is a disgusting human being. He hates Tyler's mother and doesn't care that she might be dead and the piece of shit hates his son so much that he gave a barely 10 year old drugs.

Yeah. BANG BANG BANG MOTHERFUKER.

If you think that this leads to Jason being a little more like his UtRH self, you know the guy that said that people who gave drugs to kids will get killed without a thought...yeah that's not happening, here comes the guilt!

I get it he just killed a man, but, did you read what that man said?

Anyway that's how the first part of this story ends.

The story is good. it has things that don't make much sense but i think it's because Zdarsky is a Batman fan and not a Red Hood fan in the sense that he doesnt know much about Jason's character and that this is his first ever DC work.

I cant wait to see where this story goes, while i hope “unresolved daddy issues” doesn't become a theme yet again in a Red Hood story i believe it's where we are headed. I will keep on reading because i am invested in Jason and Tyler's relationship and what is going to happen now that Jason killed Andy.

Let me know what you thought about the issue and my post if you want! Bye!

#jason todd #red hood #red hood outlaw #batman urban legends #robin #batman and robin

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bigskydreaming · 4 years ago

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@fuyunoakegata

#reblogging now that I've actually had time to sit down and give this proper attention and take it all in#and damn i love that you managed to get through all of this and never veer off topic into Deathwing#:)

*snorts* You give me too much credit. Deathwing was absolutely on the to do list for that post, he was just in the part I never got to because I hit my ‘oh right, physiological needs are a thing’ threshold and was like fuck it, I’ll do that later.

Kalen’s Razor: Never attribute to willpower what can be better explained by him just running out of steam.

But I mean tbh, he was in the part I delayed for another time because I didn’t want to like.....shortchange the importance of that part and how much attention and thought I gave it. Because like, I don’t actually think he’s off topic at all. I think he’s absolutely central to the topic, and in fact, he’s part of the thing I TRULY despise about this whole mess of a story and DC’s actions in regards to it. Faaaaaar more than their failure to call it rape or the victim-blaming, and you KNOW how much I love me a good ‘how dare they’ victim-blaming rant. So.

Still don’t quite have the time or spoons to dig into all that just yet, but I mean.....I think it definitely also needs to be acknowledged that Mirage was raped by Dick’s future timeline evil doppelganger like, right after she did it and before the wedding issue even.....with the timing being really sketchy. Like, its literally just a handful of issues after her rape of him.....in fact, given the timeline publishing works according to and taking into account the lagtime between scripting/art and then to printers and then actual publication....its pretty damn clear they had to have started writing THAT storyline basically the month AFTER Mirage’s reveal that it was her Dick slept with hit stands. Ie, the month they would have started hearing reactions to that story.

So like.....there’s pretty much no way in hell that the Deathwing story WASN’T written specifically in response to that earlier story, or more specifically to REACTIONS to that....which leaves literally only two real options for WHY they would have felt the need for that. One would be as a ‘just desserts’ type thing, like if it was meant as a punishment - which ugh, no, that would not be any better for a whole host of reasons I don’t have time for right now.....but tbh, that doesn’t really track because if that was the reason for that direction you would assume they WOULD bring up what she did to Dick again as relevant. Like that direction literally only makes sense IF you WANT to focus on what she did and why it was fucked up. Which....they clearly didn’t, since they never did that.

Which leaves the only other real likely option....that it was done in an attempt to drum up sympathy for her character and distract from what she’d done, as for whatever reason DC was still interested in keeping her as a hero and eventually a full time Titan, and they’d only realized after the fact that where they had previously had taken her was now making that damn near impossible without ‘damage control.’ And I deeply resent the fuck out of that, and using rape as a ploy to drum up sympathy for a character, particularly one who only needs sympathy drummed up because of doing basically the same damn thing, like....ugh. Fuck you DC. Its cheap, and manipulative, and compounds the refusal to address Dick’s rape as rape now juxtaposed to the rape of his rapist, which in contrast they have ZERO problem addressing as rape.

But unfortunately, its really hard to see any other possible reason they would have gone that direction since it marked the point at which they REVISITED the others’ reactions to what happened with her and Dick and had Kory, who had previously expressed forgiveness and more of a focus on her anger at Mirage....THIS was the point where Kory reversed course and characters en masse started only addressing what Dick ‘had done’ as an active act of cheating. As well as being the point past which no character again brought up to Mirage any mention of her role in that, and the focus around her switched entirely to the ongoing storyline of her pregnancy due to Deathwing’s rape and his ensuing fixation on her and the baby, with a TON of focus on his obsession with HIS unborn child....all of which is basically tailor made to keep the narrative context around her actively sympathetic and further and further distant from what had happened with Dick. Culminating of course in the point where Julienne was born, Deathwing was in a coma and never talked about again, and Mirage left the team and the book to go raise Julienne.

Except there’s one thing that has driven me fucking bonkers for years, because its the part that never made ANY sense and seems entirely contradictory with their seeming desire to never actually address what happened with her and Dick and keep her at least as firmly separate and distanced in readers’ minds....from him and her actions there as possible.

Like, if that was the goal, I would THINK that they would go out of their way to leave as little wiggle room as possible as to who Julienne’s father actually was. I mean, right? If you don’t want people ever thinking or focusing on what she did to Dick and her connection to HIM rather than Deathwing.....I would think the LAST thing you would want is for people - characters OR readers - to have any reason to doubt that Deathwing was the baby’s father. Instead, its like they went out of their way TO make wiggle room for that very thing? Which makes NO sense.

But that’s exactly what they did. What happened with Dick and then what happened with Deathwing were mere issues apart and given the context of everything else happening, was at MOST a few weeks apart. Which isn’t a big deal, logistically, until you factor in that when they did reveal Mirage’s pregnancy a good twenty (maybe more) issues or so after THAT point.....they made a point to reveal that Mirage had used her powers to hide her pregnancy for some time. With it specifically pointed out that she went out of her way to hide it from her teammates as well as Deathwing. Like.....the ONLY thing that particular plot point really accomplished OR was ever brought up in context of.....was in terms of how it literally made it impossible to ever know for sure how long Mirage actually spent pregnant....ie, when exactly she got pregnant.

And THEN, on TOP of that......after Deathwing being firmly established as Dick’s future timeline counterpart for actual YEARS at that point, real world time....at the very end of his appearances, once in his coma and right about when Mirage gave birth.....they for whatever reason decided to reveal that actually, Deathwing had never been any version of Dick Grayson at all. That he was only brainwashed to THINK he had the backstory he had...by whomever had selected him for how similar he appeared to the real Dick Grayson and then surgically altered him to further the impression.

And this was pretty much the last time the pre-Flashpoint version of Deathwing ever appeared or was even referenced, just kept at S.T.A.R. Labs in his coma from that point on and never revisited.....which again makes it like....WHY? Why go to that trouble? Like especially because if you DIDN’T actually want anyone ever really being like ‘hey has anyone ever considered Julienne might be Dick’s? Like do we know for sure, like, the two events DID happen awfully close together”.....like, if that’s what you DON’T want ever happening, then it actually works BETTER if Deathwing is Dick’s evil alternate counterpart? Because then there’s literally no element that can ever be brought up or introduced to suggest that Julienne is actually Dick Grayson’s daughter.....that CAN’T be dismissed with “well yes, and Deathwing WAS, technically, Dick Grayson, that explains that.” It effectively makes the question of who is Julienne’s true father impossible to ever conclusively answer.....which in turn basically makes it an irrelevant question. There’s no reason to ask that question instead of just accepting the narrative that its Deathwing....because what’s the point when the only answer that can ever be found is still always going to be “Dick Grayson” either way?

But making a point to reveal that Deathwing ISN’T a version of Dick and never was....is what actually ALLOWS for doubt and creates a reason to make the real Dick Grayson relevant to the subject of Mirage and Julienne again....AFTER the comics just spent the last thirty or so issues doing every other thing possible to make Dick IRRELEVANT to their storyline. Because only NOW, after that specific reveal, is there an actual reason characters might some day revisit the matter and actually raise the question of Julienne’s parentage....because only NOW does it become a question that would require a conclusive answer of one or the other, Dick Grayson or Deathwing...where a definitive answer that is NOT Deathwing, is actually a viable prospect.

I just....*pulls hair and eats it* I don’t understand what they were going for. Its entirely counter intuitive, and both elements - the pregnancy timeline and Deathwing specifically not being a genetic double of the real Nightwing - are entirely SUPERFICIAL to the entire storyline they created for Mirage and Julienne. There is absolutely ZERO reason to bring those things up or focus on them at all, nothing is added to the story BY bringing those up. And literally every other thing they did with both Dick and Mirage over the course of like, the entire last couple years of Mirage’s regular appearances before she left the team to raise Julienne....every other thing they did follows a clear pattern of deliberately putting as much distance between the two and their shared storyline as possible....

Except for these two specific details that they never needed to put in and ONLY serve one singular purpose: to throw the otherwise clear picture and timeline into question, and bring the possibility of Dick being the true father BACK into the equation that they’d just spent umpteen issues writing him OUT of.

Ugh. Its one of those things that’s always gonna bug me even though its never going to matter at this point. Hell, even with the Mirage story obliquely mentioned recently in the Batman B&W story and continuity being open season, like, I’ll be pretty surprised if they ever actually bring Mirage back into the picture, but I’d be stunned if they ever even reference Julienne again. Like, as far as canon goes at least, its literally never gonna matter, but its such a weird unnecessary little discrepancy that I’ve always just wanted to track down one of the writers involved and be like....”can you walk me through that? I really just want to understand what your logic was there” lolol.

#rape tw #yes that was me still not actually digging into it yet #shut up #you know I can dig deeper than that dont act surprised

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kid-crashed · 6 years ago

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Jon Kent and Damian Wayne in the Young Justice Animated Series

It’s been a good long while since Young Justice: Outsiders came out, so I feel like I can finally write about this without worrying about tagging spoilers and ruining lives or something. This is something I thought about the second this episode aired, and I’ve been waiting to write it. So here it goes!

Young Justice: Outsiders was obviously exciting for many reasons, but some of the most excitement came from introductions of well beloved characters, such as Jason Todd and Damian Wayne (seen in Episode 6) and Jon Kent (seen in Episode 9). Anyone who follows Super Sons already knows that this is a massive deal, because it establishes that Damian and Jon both exist in the same animated timeline for the very first time, as well as it being Jon’s animated debut.

While I’m obviously extremely excited for the possibility of a Super Sons animated moment, it got me thinking. The screen shots above show that Damian and Jon are both infants, likely somewhere around one (1) year old. This is completely different from the three (3) year age difference we’re used to, and while this difference might not seem like that big of a deal to some people, it has the capacity to completely change their character dynamics.

Let’s start by looking at Damian:

We all know Damian’s backstory by now; raised in the League of Assassins by Ra’s and Talia Al Ghul, until he was ten (10) years old, when he moved to Gotham to live with Bruce Wayne. It was at this point that he became Robin. This is a pretty concrete point in Damian’s character, and is very unlikely to change. At some point in the YJ series, he needs to become Robin. But lets take a minute to think about what kind of person he was at that age: arrogant, violent, stubborn, and desperately trying to prove his worth to a father he just met. At this point, he was a killer, and regularly fought with just about every member of the Batfam, Bruce and Dick in particular, as he tried to break the habits he’d been brought up with.

In the context of YJ, we can assume that Dick would at some point bring Damian along to join the Team, but the question is, at what age? Damian joining almost immediately fits pretty well with how quickly he was introduced to the Teen Titans. But, at that age, he was hardly a team player. It wasn’t until he was about thirteen (13) that he really started developing actual friendships. However, the age Damian joins the Team - in my opinion at least - would depend very heavily on when the other “Next Generation” heroes join.

This brings us to Jon:

Jon is known for being the complete antithesis to Damian. Rather than being raised to be a loyal machine, he was raised to be a loyal friend. Jon is a character who puts family first, and thinks of his friends as family. He’s truly a breath of childish fresh air in an industry that loves feeding us doom and gloom. While he is beloved by the majority of the fanbase, other characters were very apprehensive about him when he first got into the hero business at ten (10) years old; not-so-coincidentally, the same age as Damian.

However, Jon is also the character in DC comics with the most amount of pressure on him. You imagine being the son of Superman for a moment, and growing up knowing that every single person you meet expects you to one day take over that title. Do you think you’d be able to handle that? Let alone at ten years old? I certainly can’t. Yet it seems like Jon doesn’t actually realize just how heavy that weight on his shoulders is.

While Supers are known for being power houses, and every team seems to want one, Jon was a kid, and very new to his abilities. He was unpolished; constantly making mistakes, misjudging his own strength, overshooting his speed and flight, and who could possibly forget when he lost control Manchester Black, or when he went full Super Nova and nearly killed the Teen Titans? It became very clear at the end of the first Super Sons run that Damian was actually the only other young hero that trusted Jon, which is why they continued to function as the newest take on a dynamic duo.

How does this all come back to Young Justice: Outsiders? Well it’s actually very simple. All of that mistrust that characters were going to have in Jon was immediately erased the second the series did this:

Right here is the next generation of the Team. We all know it, and unlike previous heroes, this is the first generation that’s growing up together. Unlike every other iteration of the Justice League, Teen Titans, Young Justice, and literally every other team you can think of, these kids are all going to grow up watching each other’s powers come in. They’re going to know each other’s weaknesses and flaws, from weekly play dates, birthday parties, and any other hero-family get-together; some of them might even end up going to the same schools in this universe. Yes, Jon is the youngest out of them, but that just means that every single one of these kiddos is going to watch him grow up, knowing that S on his chest will always be there.

Let’s think about what we know about Jon again. He’s charismatic, funny, loyal and true, and has this uncanny ability to be able to talk to literally anyone, regardless of who the are, where they’re from, or what circumstance he’s in. You know what those traits line up perfectly with? A natural born leader.

Growing up in this environment, where all these super kids play all the time, it’s so easy to imagine Jon growing up and being this larger than life personality that everyone just naturally seems to listen to. Jon would be the kid coming up with new games to play, and teaching them to everyone else. He would be one of the team captains when they play kickball, soccer, or any other sport. He would be genuinely interested in everyone’s hobbies and skills. He would be the one everyone turns to when they need someone to talk to. If someone’s unsure about him, chances are they’ll just do what everyone does; take one look at that S on his chest and just start listening.

The series progresses. There’s another time skip, and Damian and Jon are now both ten years old, taking on their respective superhero mantels for the first time. As all young heroes in this series eventually do, they join the Team. Perhaps around the same time, perhaps Damian joins a few months before hand, or vice versa. But that doesn’t matter, because the effect will be exactly the same.

Damian is harsh. He’s vindictive, and unemphatic; the exact opposite of what everyone expects a Robin to be. He refuses to take orders, and is very clearly trying to fight his was to the top of the food chain. Plus, he comes right in and kicks Tim Drake out of the Robin title, someone who could very likely be the current leader. Chances are, everyone would hate Damian from the get-go. Meanwhile, everyone would be looking forward to the day Jon joins. They all knew he would. It was just a matter of time.

Rather than being introduced to each other with a clear difference in experience like in the comics, Jon and Damian are now on relatively even playing fields because they’re the same age. Damian would have more combat skills, but Jon’s already an integral part of the group, and he’s a fast learner. Obviously they would but heads, likely even more than they did in Supers Sons.

One of the biggest debates we see in every single season of YJ is “Ok, but who’s in charge?” This would undoubtedly come up as Damian flat out refuses that listen to any leadership if he doesn’t deem them worthy. Even at ten (10) years old, he would likely be fighting for that position of head honcho, because at this point in his life, Damian’s driving forces are his ego and his ambition. Unfortunately for him, at ten (10) years old, with that personality, and after having just left the League of Assassins, he’s completely untrustworthy.

Jon on the other hand is a perfect candidate for eventual leader. Everyone would have followed Kon, the Superboy before him, to the ends of the Earth. Superman led the Justice League at one point, plus he’s, you know, Superman. Here we’ve got that legend’s kid, with all the makings to eventually take over the whole operation. He’s young, and pretty green, but chances are every single person on the team would have it in the back of their minds that this kid was born to lead.

The biggest problem? Jon has a tendency to crack under pressure, and second guess himself. There is a chance that Damian rushing to be in charge would force Jon to be pushed forward far too quickly, long before he’s ready. Meanwhile, Damian’s smart as sin. No one on the Team would be able to deny that Damian’s a perfect strategist, who analyses and memorizes every skill set and strength of the people he has to work with. He can come up with a flawless plan at the drop of a hat. Meanwhile, Jon would be the kind of person to lead with his heart, and build morale on a foundation of morals and trust.

That’s going to be the conflict between Damian and Jon in Young Justice because of how they were introduced in the series, and with their lack of age gap. Damian doesn’t have the time to grow and gain everyone’s trust before Jon becomes Superboy, where as Jon wouldn’t have the chance to learn before getting pushed into leadership positions he isn’t ready for. They’re likely going to but heads even more than before, and right now, there’s no way to tell if they will ever be able to achieve the friendship they have in the comics, or if they’ll be stuck as rivals.

Is it too early to make assumptions? Yeah. Probably. Who knows what the writers have planned. But I don’t think there’s any way to doubt the conflict they just created for themselves.

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hufflepuff-ravenclaw-reviews · 4 years ago

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Titans Season 2

So I wouldn't exactly say that Titans season 2 was bad, exactly. But I felt like it kind of meandered through a bunch of different plot points without actually seeming to go anywhere?

And I was thinking about the constant “five years ago” backstory episodes, and I was like “But they make sense”. So it's not like things felt... unnecessary, by any means. However, I felt like the plot kind of zig-zagged around a lot different points, zipped back to a couple different backstory episodes, rerouted back to the present for something completely different, and then... somehow managed to wind up at episode thirteen (the last of the season).

We left off in season one with Rachel's demon father literally being brought to the human world, and all hope seemingly lost.

However, the entire subplot of resolving this barely lasted for five minutes, when all way said and done. Most of the first episode was just these darker timelines in which every one of Rachel's new-found friends and adoptive family sunk into evil ways. But not to worry, because Rachel was able to just talk to them and remind them of how much she means to them.

And then she stopped her father. Somehow. I can't swear that Princess Celestia didn't show up and preach about the power of friendship.

It was such a huge build-up in the first season, and the fact that it was resolved so quickly in the first episode of season two is honestly the first of many let-downs, I felt.

Following this, Dick is adamant that he take the new kids to San Francisco, where, with Bruce's permission, he's going to start up the Titans again.

Back in the day, it was Robin, Hawk and Dove, Wondergirl, and Aqualad. You might remember that we've met all of these characters from the first season... except for Aqualad.

And if you're wondering if he died... bingo. You win a prize of a depressing episode in which we're introduced to his character and his budding romance with Donna Troy... only to have him be murdered by a man named Slade Wilson.

This asshole was the entire reason why the original Titans broke up. See, following Aqualad's murder, Dick got it into his head that he could befriend Slade's son, Jericho. And the others were on board with this, because their friend was killed. But when they actually got to know Jericho, they all felt bad.

Until they find out that Jericho has “body snatching” powers, and can “possess” other people so long as he has initial eye-contact with them. And then suddenly, they tell him everything and even make him an official member of the team.

And that's all fine and dandy, but Slade is upset over this and murders his son. Because reasons.

And all of these memories suddenly being brought to the surface because of Slade's reappearance cause a break in Dick's already fragile psyche and he starts to have intense hallucinations in which Bruce Wayne follows him around and offers advice. It got old after a while.

Eventually, it reached a point with Dick this season that he went out and punched a security guard at the airport just so that he could be locked in jail. And this subplot dragged on forever, and never seemed to actually go anywhere.

But eventually, Dick made nice with the suit maker who seems to supply all of the suits for all of the heroes. Bruce had already designed the Nightwing costume for Dick, although this didn't make an appearance until the final episode.

Kori does have a lot of interesting developments this season, but a lot of them are seemingly being put on the backburner for the next season. She goes off for a while to help Donna do crime-stopping stuff, and ends up getting “kidnapped” by a guard from her homeplanet... Who also is a former lover of hers. He tells her that it's time to go home and rule, but Kori decides to go to California and help Rachel instead.

Eventually, her lover is taken over by her sister, Blackfire's mind-controlling jelly-thing, and Kori ends up needing to kill him in order to help stop her sister.

And then... that's it. Kori's duties are literally never brought up again for the rest of the season. Or the fact that Blackfire killed her entire family and seemingly started some sort of war on the planet. Kori can't even be bothered to tell Blackfire that she would prefer to stay on earth. Just... okay, this is a thing that's happening. BUT TITANS. Ugh.

There is a little teaser of Blackfire taking over some random lady at the very end of the last episode. But, as I said. Season three material.

Hank and Dawn... exist. That's pretty much the only thing that I can say about their characters this season. They simultaniously don't want to do crime-fighting anymore, yet refuse to actually walk away. Hank eventually pushes Dawn away to the point where he suggests that they should break up. And then he goes off the deep-end and starts doing hard-core drugs.

Anything that happened with them this entire season could have literally been cut out, and I doubt that the overall plot would have changed much.

I feel like the same could probably go for Donna as well. Although she had two exciting parts. One with her lover dying. Which... felt weird and forced and I honestly couldn't care either way about Aqualad's relationship with Wondergirl.

And then Donna herself died. Which was just so random and seemingly out of the blue. Especially because they'd just gone done taking down a mind-controlled Superboy (I will get to him in a second), and she had a full-powered fight with him. And then she'd killed by a ferris wheel falling on her.

And then Rachel says that she's going to go with the other ladies and probably learn how to better control her powers for next season. I don't know, and at that point, it all just seemed like characters moving around without having any actual motive.

And then there's Jason Todd. His plot basically revolves around Slade giving Jason PTSD, and then Jason fucking Slade's daughter, Rose.

When the season started, and it became clear that Jason was going to be on the team as the official Robin (leaving Dick to take over the role as Nightwing), I had really hoped for some decent character development from him. But instead, all we get is thirsty asshole with daddy and authority issues. Moving on.

And speaking of Rose... I felt like her character was given the proverbial shaft. She has an interesting character of being the daughter of a villain, but wanting to break away from her father after coming to understand a few things about found family.

She realized that she had healing powers, and told her father. He then trained her, and used her to further his own goals. Meaning to get vengeance on the Titans for using Jericho to get to him. But after having spent some time with Jason, Rose decides not to have anything to do with her father at all.

In the end, Rose and Nightwing team up and take down Slade. Which is something that the original Titans said that they'd struggled with “the first time around”. So how is it that “circus boy” and “girl who can heal herself” can do what actual super-powered Wondergirl, with the help of Robin, Hawk, and Dove failed to do?

All in all, the take down of Slade coupled with the destruction of Rachel's father is leaving a sour taste in my mouth. Don't get all excited over things like the build-up of villains, because the show will probably let you down in this regard.

And then there's Rachel. So much time in the first season was devoted to building up her character and everything, that it was honestly kind of disappointing that she seemed to take a back-seat in the second season. There was too much going on.

On top of a pointless side story where Rachel ran away from Donna and beat up some girl's father. It went nowhere, none of this was explained, and it was almost like the development of Donna, Dawn, and Hank.

Finally, the introduction of Superboy. For those not familiar with DC lore, Superboy is a science experiment to basically make an mpreg baby between Lex Luthor and Superman. He's got all of Superman's powers, and all of Lex's intelligence. However, the thing that comes out from the CADMUS lab is as innocent as a newborn baby... which makes him insanely dangerous.

There was a really long and honestly kind of tedious episode where he escaped from the lab with Krypto the Superdog, and how the project lead came to find him.

And then he went off and saved Jason from falling to his death, thanks to Slade. Only to be shot with kryptonite bullets for his trouble.

When Connor wakes up from this shooting, it's to find that Gar is the only one remaining at Titan's Tower, the others having taken off because of REASONS. However, Gar is certain that teaching Connor how to do proper hero stuff, that it'll make the other Titans want to come back. But circles around to Connor's innocence, he goes off and attacks a bunch of police officers.

This results in CADMUS breaking into Titan's Tower. Once the leader sees what Gar can do, they take him, too.

They then brainwash both of them to follow orders without objection. For Gar, this means transforming into a tiger whenever classical music is played, and killing anybody who is nearby.

This comes to a head after the others have taken down Slade. Gar attacks a street carnival, and Superboy is sent in to “stop” him. However, all of this was a ploy of CADMUS in order to convince people to buy Superboy for millions of dollars.

Rachel is somehow able to un-brainwash Gar simply through THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP. And Dick is able to get to Connor again, using nothing but talking. AND THEN EVERYBODY SANG AND THERE WERE MAGICAL BIRDS AND A UNICORN SHOWED UP. /sarcasm

Overall, this season wasn't bad. It was trying REALLY hard to be good, I felt. But I also felt like it was trying to do too much in just thirteen episodes.

#Titans #The Ravenclaw mod

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fancoloredglasses · 5 years ago

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Crisis on Infinite Arrowverses

(Thanks to TV Line)

Having watched the Crisis on Infinite Earths event on CW, I decided to break from my usual theme (stuff I watched when younger) to give my thoughts on it.

It was a lot to take in between the cameos, the revelations, and the aftermath. I will be discussing all that shortly (behind a spoiler wall for those who haven’t seen it yet), but for those who aren’t In The Know, here’s what you’ll need to know first...

Crisis on Infinite Earths was originally a comic miniseries in 1985 that attempted to bring all (or most...sorry Captain Carrot) of DC’s universes (both in-house and acquired properties, such as Fawcett and Charleton) into one shared timeline instead of parallel universes. As many readers know I did a review of Crisis a while ago (in fact, my review of issue 7 is one of my more popular entries, no doubt due to the many fans of Supergirl)

Now, before I can talk about Crisis, we need to discuss exactly what an “Arrowverse” is for the uninitiated. The Arrowverse is the collection of television shows created by DC Entertainment and aired on the CW (though one was originally on CBS, but we’ll get to that...) that share an interconnected continuity (though one has only recently been linked, but again we’ll get to that). All told, there have been over 90 (yes, I counted!) superheroes (and at least one anti-hero) from the pages of DC Comics that have been on screen, mentioned, or at least hinted at (for example, Oracle was mentioned in an offhand comment on an early episode of Arrow, so one can assume that Batman, Batgirl, and likely Robin/Nightwing exist as well) and (thanks to the “villain of the week” syndrome) countless villains. It all started with...

(Thanks to Arrowverse wiki)

I have been a fan of Green Arrow since his all-too brief appearance on an episode of Superfriends, so it should be little surprise that when it was announced that CW would be airing a series based on the character, I immediately checked to see if we still has a CW affiliate in the area (at the time, Supernatural was the only thing worth watching on the network and even that was just limping along...and as of this writing still is) Luckily, there was and I tuned in, hoping it was better that was DC was putting on the big screens at the time.

It did not disappoint. Arrow tells the story of Oliver Queen, sole survivor of the bombing of his father’s yacht. Following the bombing he spent 5 years fending for himself of an uncharted island (with Gilligan, the Skipper, the millionaire and his wife...actually with a mercenary, a zen archer, and several Bad People)...or at least that was the original story. It was later revealed he got off the island but circumstances kept him from going home and eventually he wound up back on the island (it’s all very confusing and convoluted and suffers from prequel-itis as he had to be rescued from the island eventually) In any event, he was rescued and brought home to Starling City (which eventually was renamed Star City due to fans crying foul at CW arbitrarily initially giving a different name to GA’s home)

The problem with a show based on Green Arrow (other than naming the city wrong and the origin story changing week to week) is that Green Arrow does not have a deep roster of enemies. In fact, I can probably count on one hand the number of memorable villains that came from his pages. So, the writers stole borrowed villains from other heroes that would fit his power level (suck as Ra’s al Ghul and Deadshot from Batman and Deathstroke, Brother Blood, and Damien Darhk from the Teen Titans)

The season-spanning metaplots usually revolved around the Big Bad having a plot to take over/raze Star(ling) City, usually revolving around the poor region of the city known as the Glades. The season also (for the first 5 seasons) involved flashbacks to Oliver’s time in exile on the island (as well as Hong Kong and Russia...again, his backstory kept changing as the writers realized they were running out of things for him to do on the island) as well as a glimpse into Star City’s future.

The plots and villains were for the most part on a Batman level of power, with very few super-powered villains (though two were immortal and one had magical powers), as were his allies (among whom were Black Canary, Speedy, Arsenal, and Wild Dog)

I will give star Stephen Amell credit. While the producers wouldn’t let him do 100% of his stunts, (but he did as many as they’d allow) he does his best to show the viewer that he could do most of the stunts...

(Thanks to Gizmodo)

Season 2 featured a CSI from Central City named Barry Allen, and that dovetailed into...

(Thanks again to Arrowverse wiki)

The Flash is one of the few “A-list” DC heroes I religiously followed in the comics when I was regularly reading. I remembered The Flash from the 90s, and while I enjoyed it, the current version is a vast improvement. For starters CGI technology had finally advanced enough to make the effects necessary for super powers to be filmed inexpensively. Secondly, as I said in my review of the 90s series, the Flash has a villain roster that is just as colorful (and possibly more populated) than Batman’s.

It also added two elements to what was now starting to be called the Arrowverse that were lacking. The first was metahumans (what DC calls those with super powers), and while not many came over to Arrow, there was always the possibility. The second was crossovers, something that DC hadn’t yet done in their movies (but Marvel had been doing for a few years with the fledgling MCU) You didn’t often see Oliver Queen in The Flash, (or Barry Allen in Arrow) but names were dropped a few times and events in one could impact the other (especially when the Flash traveled through time)

The Flash tells the story of the aforementioned Central City CSI Barry Allen. Allen was caught in a lab accident that splashed chemicals on him that were infused with particles known as Dark Matter, granting him the ability to move at supersonic speed. The Dark Matter affected others (mostly criminals) in Central City, granting them powers as well. The plots mostly dealt with the Metahuman Villain of the Week (and there were a ton of them!)

I should also note that viewers were told Crisis was coming in the first few episodes of the series...

(Thanks to reddit)

The Flash also introduces two concepts to the Arrowverse that would become important in the coming seasons. The first was time travel, as the first season-spanning villain was Eobard Thawne, the Reverse Flash, a speedster (as those with super speed were dubbed) from the 25th century who traveled back in time to...well, the reason was kinda convoluted, but regardless he had a hatred of the Flash and wanted to destroy him. The second was introduced at the end of season one, where we were introduced to Jay Garrick, the Flash of Earth-2 (sorta); yes, this is where the multiverse entered the Arrowverse. On an accidental trip through the multiverse, Barry not only crosses dimensions, but networks and encounters...

(yes, Arrowverse wiki again)

When I first heard of Supergirl coming to CBS, my first thought was hoping they didn’t screw it up like they did her movie in the 80s. My second was wondering why it wasn’t on CW, but then you’d have Supergirl swooping in to save the day everywhere. And then (after what I’m sure was a metric shit-ton of negotiations between CBS and CW) Barry Allen made his leap, securing Supergirl as part of the Arrowverse. Lo and behold, we would see CW pick up Supergirl for season 2, ensuring much less negotiating for future crossovers. (In case you were wondering, the official designation of Supergirl’s Earth is Earth-38)

Supergirl follows the story of Kara Zor-El, cousin to Kal-El, the Kryptonian who would become known as Superman. Kara was in a second escape rocket when Krypton died, but was hit by debris and knocked into a wormhole that kept her in suspended animation for about 20 years (she was a pre-teen when Krypton exploded and didn’t age a day while Kal-El crashed on Earth, was found by the Kents yadda yadda yadda) Kara’s rocket was eventually freed and crashed on Earth where it was found by Jeremiah Danvers and adopted as his daughter (and sister to Jeremiah’s biological daughter Alex). Kara kept her powers secret until forced into the light saving a passenger plane and given the name Supergirl.

While The Flash brought metahumans into the Arrowverse, Supergirl brought aliens, and in a recent season used them to speak out (in kind of a heavy-handed way) about the US immigration policies at the time.

Before Supergirl was officially brought into the fold by switching networks, there were a number of heroes that had been introduced that didn’t earn a regular recurring role, (or perhaps the fans wanted to see more of) which brings us to...

(Yep, Arrowverse wiki again)

Legends of Tomorrow once again brought a few things to the Arrowverse. The first was a rotating/ensemble cast. Where the other three series had an obvious central figure (I mean, their names are the titles of the series!) with a strong supporting cast, Legends was designed such that anyone could join or leave at any time (In fact, as of this writing, only 3 members of the original crew of 9 are still with the show). The second is humor. While all of the Arrowverse shows can have their light-hearted moments, there are times where Legends skirts just this side of campy (including fighting a giant death god with a giant version of Beebo (Basically a cross between Elmo and a furby) and Julius Caesar trying to build an army from a spring break crowd in Aruba)

Legends of Tomorrow chronicles (see what I did there?) the story of Rip Hunter as he attempts to change his history by preventing the rise of an immortal tyrant by defeating him in the past using his timeship, the Waverider. The initial crew he recruited included the second Firestorm (Jefferson “Jax” Jackson and Martin Stein), the Atom (Ray Palmer) Hawkman and Hawkgirl (Carter Hall and Kendra Saunders), the White Canary (Sara Lance, sister to “Black Canary” Laurel Lance) and Flash villains Captain Cold (Leonard Snart) and Heat Wave (Mick Rory). Other heroes join and leave the crew in later seasons, including John Constantine (from the cancelled NBC series Constantine, effectively pulling that series into the Arrowverse as well!)

But it’s not just forgotten heroes that are given new life, as three former season spanning villains (Reverse Flash, Malcolm Merlyn, and Damien Darhk) return to make life hell for the Legends in later seasons as well.

While not as “required viewing” as the others (in fact, Legends “opted out” of the latest two crossover events Elseworlds and of course Crisis on Infinite Earths, though the core crew still found their way into the latter story)

In the “Elseworlds” story, we’re introduced to a hero who didn’t debut in her own series...

(Thanks to Wikipedia)

This is the series people had been waiting for...sorta. As soon as Oliver Queen name-dropped Bruce Wayne, people had been waiting for Batman to appear (I mean, Superman makes the odd appearance on Supergirl, so why not?) Unfortunately, there is all kinds of legal reason why Bats (and most of his villains) can’t appear in a new live-action TV series, so...

Batwoman follows Katherine “Kate” Kane, cousin to Bruce Wayne (so THAT’S who Aunt Harriet was!), who lost her mother and twin sister when their car fell into a river, though her sister’s body was never found. Fast forward to modern day (or rather about 6 months before Elseworlds, as Batwoman was established by the crossover), where Bruce Wayne has left Gotham and Batman hasn’t been seen for 3 years. Things have sorta-kinda been quiet until a new villain named Alice (as in Alice in Wonderland...does that mean we may see the Mad Hatter?) comes on the scene and attacks Kate’s father (the head of a private security firm competing with GCPD to protect the citizens of Gotham) Along the way, Kate discovers her cousin’s secret and dons the cowl.

The series is still in its freshman season, but thus far I’m liking what I’m seeing.

Finally, we have the latest series to join the Arrowverse (though it debuted before Batwoman)...

(Arrowverse Wiki once again)

Black Lightning is one of those characters that was criminally underused thanks to legal issues at DC. The character should have been part of Superfriends, but due to a lawsuit between DC and the character’s creator, he morphed into Black Vulcan. Therefore, I was happy to see the character finally get his due.

Black Lightning follows the story of Jefferson Pierce, (what is it about DC comics and black characters named Jefferson?) who fought injustice on the streets of Freeland years ago as Black Lightning. However, when an old foe resurfaces, Jefferson (now with 2 daughters, the youngest in high school) once again dons his power suit and uncovers a government conspiracy involving dosing youths with a serum that was supposed to make them docile but instead gave them super powers.

The show very much deals with racial and class tensions as its central theme. It wasn’t originally part of the Arrowverse due to it originally being produced for Fox, who backed out after the show was green-lit. Therefore, it found a home on CW, and fans were waiting to see when/how it would join the Arrowverse. It finally did as part of Crisis.

Now that all the background exposition is out of the way, here are my thoughts. I will not be doing a plot review like my usual entries as it’s still fresh and you can find the series on CW’s web site. Rather, I will be giving my thoughts and comparing the TV event to the comic series...after the break

First off, the cameos...OMG the cameos! Of course, I had to look up the Titans one at the end of part 5 as I didn’t recognize Raven (as an excuse, I don’t have DC’s streaming service) What would have been epic would have been if they could somehow bring in Christian Bale or Gary Oldman, but I imagine bringing in who they did was pushing the budget as it was. Seeing Kevin Conroy as a bitter, burnt-out, and broken Bruce Wayne was kind of awesome...and of course the acknowledgement of Brandon Routh’s stint as the Man of Steel (and what happened after Superman Returns). And OMG they brought in Ezra Miller from the DCEU! That was something I did NOT expect!

But enough about the fanboying. On to the comparisons!

First off, the fact that the first dying Earth given significant attention in both is the one where the alignments are reversed (Earth-2 in the Arrowverse, Earth-3 in the comics). I did not like the change of who became Pariah (and why). Nash Wells was not given significant time to explain why he was transformed into Pariah, and his role was mostly unnecessary. Also Lyna Diggle as Harbinger seemed kinda unnecessary, especially when the unification seemed to nullify that reveal (and now the Diggles have 2 kids?!)

The unification of Supergirl and the other Arrowverse shows was expected, and I wondered if Black Lightning would be brought into the fold when this started, but I’m a little curious why the show wasn’t featured as a chapter instead of him being added as an afterthought.

Oliver’s first death scene was fitting, but the fact he was given a second...wow. I half-expected him to move on as the Spectre, opening the door for cameos in the future. Instead, we got a swan song for Stephen Amell’s character, and then the revelation...

youtube

(Thanks to We Got This Covered)

THE FORMATION OF THE JUSTICE LEAGUE!

(It would have been perfect if not for Gleek)

#dc cómics #arrowverse #crisis on infinite earths #arrow #the flash #legends of tomorrow #supergirl #black lightning #Fan Colored Glasses

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wanderingmind867 · 17 days ago

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My interpretation of Hourman (Rex Tyler): Rex Tyler was born in Ithaca, New York, on November 5th, 1913. Rex loved science, specifically chemistry. He couldn't get enough of experimenting with all the different elements and compounds. He was so fascinated by it that he goes to Cornell University in his home of Ithaca, and he manages to score himself a degree in chemistry. After working his way through the education system, rex manages to take his chemistry skills and get a job at the Bannerman Chemical corporation in NYC, a veritable powerhouse in the world of chemical manufacturing.

He got his job in 1938 or 1939. But in early 1940, Rex wound up discovering a new element he would end up calling Miraclo. Testing the newly discovered element on some lab mice, rex found it gave them increased strength and vitality for several hours at a time. Curious, Rex then tries it on himself. And he finds that the element of Miraclo also gives him increased strength and physical endurance, but only for around 60 minutes. Because the human body is so much bigger than a mouse's body, the effects of the miraclo wear off much quicker.

But still, rex realizes he's discovered an amazing, wonder drug here. Secretly manufacturing it into a pill format, rex realized he needed to use this gift to help humanity. So he placed an ad in the newspaper, saying that the "Man of the Hour is here to help you solve all your problems!". Tracking down one respondent to the ad, he aided a housewife whose husband was falling in with the wrong crowd, and stopped a robbery. Using a costume he found in an abandoned costume shop, Rex began his secret career as The Hourman, guardian of New York City! At this point in time, rex has told nobody else about his discovery of miraclo, fearing what criminals could do if they got their hands on it.

In any case, Rex fights crime all through the 1940s as the Hourman, eventually even acquiring a fanclub and group of sidekicks amongst the youth of New York City and beyond. These kids would call themselves the Minutemen, and they'd be led by two main kids; Jimmy Martin and Thorndyke Thompkins. These kids would be given smaller doses of miraclo, doses that empowered them for only a few minutes at a time (as compared to his hour length dosage). So by day, Rex Tyler worked for Kenneth Bannerman's chemical plant (which sometimes led him to watch over Kenneth's daughter, Regina). But by night, he would fight crime as The Hourman with his Minutemen sidekicks, all with the aid of Miraclo.

Due to his exploits as The Hourman, Rex gets invited to join the Justice Society of America. He did (becoming one of their many founding members), but he left after a year because he felt he couldn't keep up with them. He was a nobody compared to The Spectre or Doctor Fate, and Rex humbly chose to bow out and go on a hiatus from the team. Meanwhile, he lets the team bring in new members to work in his stead.

But even after going on hiatus from the JSA, Rex continued operating as The Hourman throughout the 40s. It was only in 1948 that he retired. He began slowing down in 1945 (after he realized that excessive use of miraclo could cause addiction like symptoms after a while), but he didn't fully retire until 1948. And this is something Rex wouldn't realize until he retired and went back dedicating himself to his research, but Miraclo also gives it's user a prolonged lifespan if it's taken for a long time. It really is a miracle drug. Although it's going to give him some pains (both emotional and mental) later in life, it's also made him nearly immortal.

But yeah, Rex Tyler retires in 1948, fully rededicating himself to his chemistry research. Ten years later (in 1958), Terry Sloane buys Bannerman Chemical when it's on the verge of bankruptcy. To repay his friend for saving his life in 1955, Terry makes sure the company is rebranded to become Tyler Chemical, and Rex Tyler becomes CEO of his own chemical company.

A year or two after this (in 1961), Rex meets an aspiring young actress named Wendi Harris while on a business trip to LA. Wendi began acting in 1947, but she was blacklisted in 1951 because her brother was accused of being a communist. But Wendi hadn't given up, and she's still trying it make something of herself. Rex quickly begins bonding with her, and they become close friends.

Since I've already made nearly 8 paragraphs, I'll speed things up now: the Justice Society of America reforms in 1963. Terry Sloane drags Rex into taking up the mantle of Hourman again, and Hourman and Mister Terrific subsequently become crime fighting partners. In 1966, Rex and Wendi end up having a kid together, a boy they name Richard (or as he eventually becomes more well known, Rick). Terry Sloane is also heavily involved in Rick's life, becoming like a second dad to him. But together, Rex and Terry form a deep friendship and bond (which I cover more in my Mister Terrific note).

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gumnut-logic · 6 years ago

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Prank War IV - You can’t stop the music!

Title: Prank War

Warm Rain Series

Author: Gumnut

6 - 8 Nov 2018

Fandom: Thunderbirds Are Go 2015/ Thunderbirds TOS

Rating: Teen

Summary: it was war.

Word count: 3215 (Part IV) - Total 5098

Spoilers & warnings: Virgil/Kayo, crackfic

Timeline: After ‘Home’ and before ‘The Proposal’.

Author’s note: This is total crack. I blame a combination of the lurgy that is messing with my muse and @vegetacide who inadvertently asked for it.

From this conversation.

Nutty: Are you requesting a whump? 😁

Veggie: No.. Not me.. I want one with fluffy unicorns and rainbow farts.. Lol

Nutty: Really??

And here is the last of the crazy :D I hope you enjoy it :D I’m feeling much better now :D

Disclaimer: Mine? You’ve got to be kidding. Money? Don’t have any, don’t bother.

-o-o-o-

Prank War I - Rainbows Prank War II - Jello Prank War III - The Unicorn

Prank War IV - You can’t stop the music!

It started with his alarm.

Usually Gordon was woken in the morning to the slowly increasing sounds of the ocean, a little whale song and a few waves crashing on the shore. It was a nice comforting way to slowly ease out of sleep. It gave him energy. It got him slowly geared up and into his morning routine.

AC/DC suddenly screaming out ‘Big Gun’ at the full volume his alarm was capable of didn’t quite have the same effect.

Gordon shot up and fell out of bed.

The floor was hard first thing in the morning.

As the song played out, he rolled over on the floor groaning. Okay, okay, I’m up. He aimed to turn it off. Somehow the alarm ended up in pieces on the floor.

Great.

He sat there for a moment and let his heart rate slow and his circulation catch up. There were only two possible reasons his alarm had done that...Virgil’s revenge...or, well, yeah, Virgil.

Gordon took a deep breath and stood up. He had no doubt there would be more. An altered alarm clock just did not add up to alginate in the pool.

He had to admit it. That had been some damn good revenge. It had taken days. Days. To get the stuff out of the pool. And for a good part of it, Virgil had sat on the balcony with a smirk on his face just watching Gordon dig it all out.

Alan had helped. Gordon loved his little brother.

Virgil, however.

He twisted his lips. Virgil was a challenge. Of course, the man was a loveable bear, and he couldn’t resist poking the bear.

It had just escalated recently.

Gordon reached for his swimwear and frowned.

What was that sound?

He made the movement again.

The sound happened again.

He grabbed his swimwear and began to change.

The sound became instrumental. Orchestral. Tuba? Trombone?

The theme from Jaws.

Each time Gordon moved, a strain from the theme echoed throughout his quarters. The faster he moved, the faster the music. The slower he moved, the more paced and threatening the music.

He looked about the room, but couldn’t see anything obvious that could be following his movements.

Experimentally, he walked into the bathroom.

“I’ve got a lovely bunch of coconuts...”

He yelped. It was at full volume and threw him back into his bedroom.

Jaws resumed.

Okay, Virgil, you smart ass, I’ll give you this, it’s creative.

Jaws followed him into his living room and out into the corridor with his towel.

When he hit the kitchen, the soundtrack switched to the Beatles and “Love Me Do.” Which wasn’t too bad, he didn’t mind the occasional Beatles track.

Moving out onto the patio, however, proved to be bit more of a challenge.

Italian Opera was never really considered motivational for swimming or any other kind of exercise. Between the smell of the slowly decaying alginate to the west of the pool and the accompanying music, Gordon’s exercise routine was cut short.

Returning to his room brought back Jaws, however his bathroom chose to sing ‘Agadoo’ during his shower.

On loop.

By the time he was fully dressed, he had just about reached his limit.

He activated his comms. “Virgil?”

“The Thunderbird you are trying to contact is currently unavailable. Please leave a message after the...” And his comms let off an awful screech.

Okay, so he jumped. He’d admit it. He was used to relying on the infallibility of IR equipment. But then if comms was involved with this, then that meant...

John.

He tapped his comms again.

“John?”

“You rang?”

Blink. “What are you doing?”

“Eating breakfast.” As if to prove it, there were some sloppy chewing sounds on the line.

“Are you siding with Virgil?”

“What do you mean?”

“In the prank war.”

“Is there a prank war? Sounds highly unprofessional.”

Gordon grit his teeth. “Which is why I’m finding it hard to believe that you are involved.”

“And what could you possibly think I have done?”

“There is music wherever I go.”

“Nope. That was totally Virg.” There were more chewing sounds. And a belch.

“Ugh, gross.”

“Better out than in.” Another burp. “Is there anything else I can help you with?”

“What? Are you on something?”

“Thunderbird Five, but I thought you knew that.” And then the line cut off

“John? John!”

“The Thunderbird you are trying to contact is currently unavailable. Too bad, so sad, go eat a lemon.”

Okay, that left him trying to stare at his collar.

John was definitely in Virgil’s pocket.

Jaws once again followed him down the corridor, but upon entering the kitchen it switched to piano music.

Virgil’s piano music.

Kayo was sitting at the breakfast bar with a bowl of fruit salad. “Good morning, Gordon.”

“Hey, Tin.”

He chose to ignore the music, perhaps if he paid it no attention it would simply go away.

“This is truly a lovely piece of music. Virgil is quite talented.”

Gordon grit his teeth. “Yes. Yes, he is.” He dug the butter out of the refrigerator before diving into the bread bin.

“This piece is special.” An involuntary glance at his sister found her gazing somewhat dreamily at the ceiling, her fork waving a chunk of pineapple on its tines.” I was there for both the inspiration and the writing of this piece. It is written so well, I can hear the waves on the beach, feel the sand between my toes, his hands on my skin...”

Gordon dropped his butter knife and it clattered across the floor.

“Virgil is very good with his hands.” Tin’s smile was lascivious. “Of course, he does quite well with the rest of his body as well.”

Gordon stared at her.

“He has a very nice tongue.”

Gordon fled.

But it got worse.

The moment he hit the comms room, the music switched to the godawful ‘It’s a small world after all’.

If there was a song out there that promoted ripping ears out that was it.

“Ooh, I like this one.” And to Gordon’s horror, Alan, who had been sitting on the couch playing his computer game, started singing along.

“What? How? Whose side are you on?!”

“Huh? It’s a cool song.”

“It’s a horrible song. How can you possibly-?” This had to stop. “Where is Scott?”

“In Bermuda.”

Gordon blinked. “What?”

“He’s taken a weekend and gone to Bermuda. Apparently, he has wanted to go for a while.”

“How could he do that?”

Alan frowned. “He deserves a break, Gordon.” He turned back to his game. “Big Bro hardly ever gets to relax around here.”

“But what about International Rescue?”

“Eh, we’ll survive. Virgil and the rest of us are here.”

Virgil.

“Yes, and where exactly is Virgil?”

“Dunno. Probably still in bed. You know him, midnight to midday if he could.” And his brother started humming along to the damn song again.

Aaargh.

Okay, okay, take a deep breath. Get out of the house. “I’m going for a walk.”

“Cool.” Alan went back to his game, still humming that damn song.

-o-o-o-

Gordon set off along the cliff tops to the eastern side of the island, his shoulders still tense, muttering under his breath. For the first few steps he revelled in the sudden quiet, but just as he turned the corner, finally out of sight of the villa, a train whistle echoed amongst the rocks.

And a kids choir started singing.

We'll sing a song for Gordon

He's big, he's fast, he's proud

His paint is blue, so strong and true

And his whistle's really loud

The fastest train on Sodor

You can't forget his name,

So when we've sung for Gordon, well

Let's sing it once again.

His jaw dropped. Oh god, no, not Thomas the frickin’ Tank Engine!

And the song looped.

Awwwgh. He had fists full of hair.

Young Alan had absolutely adored that damn program as a toddler, and when he discovered one of the engines had the same name as his big brother...

Oh, the ear worms.

Gordon rubbed his face in his hands.

But he kept walking. Maybe he could out pace it.

Halfway around the island, it faded out and Gordon sighed.

Then Virgil’s voice echoed amongst the rocks.

We’ll sing a song for Gordon

And torture his little ass

He comes in yellow, not so mellow

But in this war he’s last.

He is the biggest fish on Tracy

And you can’t forget his name

Because he simply will not let you

And he thinks it’s all a game.

But when you sing a song for Gordon

You have to know it’s true

He’s forgotten who he’s playing with

And big brother is two for two.

If he knows what is good for him

He will throw in the towel

And wave the flag of truce tonight

Before it gets really loud.

Gordon had just a moment to consider that, yes, his brother could sing really well, before that too went on loop, bellowing out from a series of loudspeakers amongst the rocks.

It followed him the rest of the circumference of Tracy Island.

It wasn’t even ten am when he got back to the villa (the pool had switched to the Beatles ‘I wanna hold your hand’ as he walked through it) and already he felt he was going to lose it.

Jaws chased him up the staircases, but when he entered his rooms, Dory started encouraging him to ‘just keep swimming’.

Over and over again.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, nooooooooo......

In desperation, he jabbed his comms. “Scott?”

“The Thunderbird you are trying to contact is currently unavailable. You’ve driven him insane and he has fled to the Bermuda Triangle.” Twilight Zone music danced with Dory.

“John?”

“Yo?”

“What can I offer you to make this stop?”

“Make what stop?”

“The music!”

“Oh, you can’t stop the music...” And John was singing another ear worm and his singing skill definitely wasn’t up there with Virgil’s. “Nobody can stop the music!”

“Oh, for the love of god!”

“Is something wrong, Gordon?”

“I’m going to kill him.”

“Oh, I don’t think so.”

“I am. He’s had it. This is beyond the rule book.”

“Nope. Sorry. Not going to happen.”

“Watch me.”

“Okay then. You might want to check out your balcony.”

“My balcony?”

“Oh, yeah, baby.”

Gordon was attempting to stare at his collar again.

“Go on, I haven’t got all day. Important rescue calls to be sorted.”

Against his better judgement, Gordon stepped through the double doors and out onto his balcony.

“The hills are alive with the sound of music!”

Julie Andrews. Echoing across the Tracy Island volcano.

“Take a look downstairs.” John was smug, there was no other word for it.

On the side lawn, Grandma was twirling.

Twirling to Julie Andrews.

Gordon fled to Dory.

“Why, John?”

“Why what?”

“Why did you side with Virgil? You’re the middle kid, the casting vote. What did I ever do to you?”

“I have a list, Gordon.”

“Really?”

“A long list.”

“Okay, but c’mon, I’m the prankster in this family. It is to be expected. Before the pool, I don’t think he ever even thought of pranking anyone.”

“Point One to the Virg.”

“Are you sure you’re not smoking something up there?”

“Thunderbird Five is a non-smoking habitat. Unless it is on fire.”

Blink. “Okay. You sure it is not on fire?”

“You may be the prankster Gordon, but you forgot one very important fact.”

“What?”

“Virgil is an engineer. A fully qualified and creative engineer. And you pissed him off.”

Another blink. “Okay, you may have a point.”

“Oh, and although traditionally Virgil is the kind of guy who wouldn’t hurt a fly, he has a girlfriend who would be quite capable of stringing you up by your eyelids.”

Now that was an image that hurt.

“So, you see, little brother, logic dictates that if I want to keep my eyelids intact and my Thunderbird in one piece, I’m sticking with the pissed off engineer.” A pause. “You are, of course, welcome to join us on the not so dark side. All it takes is the waving of that little white towel or flag. Do you have a white pair of underwear? I’m sure Virgil will accept those if they are clean.”

“Where is he?” It was low, it was dark.

“Oh, where you won’t think to look.”

“John, you suck.”

“Such rumours, young padawan.”

Yet another blink and he shivered, cutting off the connection.

So, Virgil was a smart ass engineer, huh?

There is more than one engineer on this island, and the other one has a smarter ass!

Gordon grimaced at that thought. It didn’t quite come out the way he had intended.

The music followed him down to Brains’ labs, alternating between two of the most annoying advertising jingles ever composed.

The door to the labs was shut. It was locked. It had a great big sign on it.

‘For the duration of the current argument, these labs are a Tracy-free zone. Keep Out.’

Gordon muttered under his breath and reached for the button to activate the door anyway.

A whirring of wheels and suddenly MAX was in his face.

Glaring at him.

Gordon flung his hands up in defence. “Okay, okay. I get the message.” Another threatening whir. “I’m going. I’m going.”

As he turned around, Elvis started crooning Jailhouse Rock.

Okay, so that one wasn’t so bad.

He stomped off to plan B.

The hangers and Thunderbird Four.

He never knew that the cavernous Thunderbird Two hanger was so acoustic. But then it may have sounded better if it wasn’t screaming ABBA’s Dancing Queen off all the technology housed inside it.

He hated ABBA with a passion. It may have had something to do with John liking it, a lot, all through yet another revival during his teenage years. God forbid if it switched to Mamma Mia.

Which, of course, it did.

Virgil obviously knew him very well.

He clambered into Module Four, sighing in relief as it closed and dampened the echoed out in the hangar. He then threw himself into TB4, sealing her hatch behind him. Ah, blessed silence.

He closed his eyes and simply breathed out.

“Badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger, badger...”

It was so quiet, he didn’t hear it at first, but it slowly increased in volume until it was just distinct enough that he couldn’t ignore it any longer.

“Mushroom, mushroom!”

“Badger, badger, badger...”

What’s with the badgers?

“IT’S A SNAKE! IT’S A SNAAAAKE!”

Gordon yelped and almost fell out of his chair. Oh god.

And it was badgering again.

It only took three more screamed snakes to have him stumbling out of his little sub.

Okay, Virgil, I admit it. You’re good.

-o-o-o-

He went boating and snorkeling that afternoon.

And discovered that not only had Virgil rigged the boat, but he had also added music to the fishing equipment and his snorkel and mask. How the hell he had managed that, Gordon had spent an hour going over said mask and snorkel failing to work out how.

There may have been tears of frustration at one point.

He spent the entirety of his boat trip home ‘Row, row, rowing his boat gently down the stream’, but it wasn’t the crocodile that made him want to scream.

By six o’clock he was ready to give in. He had a headache, his ear worms were breeding in his brain and, for the love of god, could he please have some peace and quiet?

John was useless.

Scott had migrated to another country.

Alan...Alan had disappeared. He would be slightly worried, but this was Virgil, he had a moral code, and Alan was easily distracted. Gordon himself had used candy in the past.

Kayo...well, her allegiance was obvious. And her commentary on Virgil’s music...he so wasn’t going there again.

Brains was Switzerland. If Switzerland had robotic defences and didn’t let anyone in.

Grandma was still excited about the volcano spouting Julie Andrews. Who knew she would be such a fan. The movie had been made over fifty years before she had been born.

That left Virgil the evil demonic overload of all this musical hell.

And Shirley.

Gordon had managed to find one small niche of the island that was music free. The small grassed area where they had constructed a little pen for Shirley the pony. Obviously Virgil was above torturing wannabe unicorns. He sat with Shirley for two hours while the miniature horse chewed on his shirt.

Despite this, the music continued in his head. Particularly that Thomas the Tank Engine torture device, except now the original lyrics kept warping into his brother’s voice.

Surrender was apparently the only option.

So, it was with red faced annoyance, temper and humiliation that he climbed the stairs to the residential areas and knocked on Virgil’s door.

As John had said. It was the last place he had looked.

Perhaps because that was where he knew he would find him.

“Come in.”

The room was dark when he entered, lit only by the lights in the corridor and some faint light from the long set sun. The music of choice in the corridor had returned to its preferred Jaws theme.

“Close the door behind you.”

He did as he was told. And discovered the second music free spot on the island. Oh god, blessed silence.

“Hello, Gordon.”

His brother appeared out of the shadows by the window, his outline only lit by that pink sunset remnant. It made him look large and mysterious. Far from the gentle artistic demonic overlord he knew him to be.

“Please make it stop.”

“It already has.”

“What?”

You only had to come to see me to get it to stop. I’m surprised you lasted this long.” He sighed. “In fact, it worries me. Does this prank war mean that much to you?”

Gordon blinked. “What?”

“I thought we were closer as brothers than a petty prank fest. That you would rather suffer than simply come and ask me to stop...Gords, really?”

“It’s war.”

“You started it.”

“Yeah, that was hilarious.” A grin.

He didn’t need to see his brother’s eyes to know he had rolled them. “For some.” A sigh. “Well, the fun is now over.”

“Why? I owe you big time, bro.”

He saw his brother move and suddenly the room was filled with ‘It’s a small world after all.” Gordon flinched. “Okay, okay, I get the message.” The music stopped.

“Anytime, Gordon, anytime, and it can all start again. I have ABBA’s complete collection at my disposal.”

Disposal was the right word. He was going to kill John.

“And it’s not John’s.”

Wha-?

“It’s Kay’s.”

Shit.

“Virgil, love, come back to bed.”

Speak of the devil, and Tin walked into the room, turning on the light.

Gordon blinked. Virgil was shirtless. Kayo was in a short, very short, negligee, a silky green one.

“Gordon, you’re staring.” Tin smiled that same smile she had weaponised at breakfast, leant over and licked Virgil’s ear.

Gordon shuddered.

“I-I’ll be going.”

Tin smiled again. “You do that.”

“Virg?”

“Yes, Gordon.” He was kissing Tin’s nose.

“You win.”

“I know.”

Gordon fled.

-o-o-o-

FIN.

#thunderbirds #thunderbirds are go #thunderbirds fanfiction #virgil tracy #gordon tracy #scott tracy #kayo kyrano #virgil/kayo #warm rain

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theawkwardterrier · 6 years ago

Text

Out of the Frying Pan

Steggy Week, day 2 Prompt: When Timelines Collide

Summary: Jack and Daniel are in DC for their annual review, but it's in the SHIELD kitchen that they stumble upon some new information.

AO3 link here.

Jack’s proud to work for SHIELD, and he’s damn good at it, don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. He’s glad to be doing his bit to help the country, and especially with a cutting edge outfit that does its work quietly so Americans can sleep safely in their beds, not even knowing that they’ve been saved from danger. SHIELD does important work, and does it well.

The food they’re serving at headquarters is godawful.

“Look.” Jack elbows Daniel so he’ll look over at the limp, oily string bean dangling from Jack’s fork. “They really expect us to believe this was once attached to a real plant?”

Daniel looks at it dubiously. “Put it in a bag, we’ll bring it over to the lab for examination,” he jokes. “How’s the dessert looking?”

Jack lets his eyes wander over the waitress coming in with a new course headed toward their table. She’s pretty enough, her soft blonde hair held back with pins, but the contents of her cart… “Come on, I know where the kitchen is in this place. Let’s go scrounge up a real meal before it’s our turn with the boss.”

“You could at least pretend to have some respect for her,” Daniel says predictably, but he stands and follows Jack anyway.

“Oh, I’ve got plenty of respect for old Marge. It was a real feat, leapfrogging right to the top of the organization without stopping in for a leadership position along the way.” Jack stuffs his hands in his pockets. It’s the right look, casual, in case any staff might be looking his way. He has a badge in his pocket and as much right to be walking around this building as anyone, but might as well not call attention.

“Ever think that she might have gotten the job because she was too good just to be a city chief? Or that she’d have been happy to do that instead but no one gave her the chance?” Jack gives him a stare because it’s a funny thing for Souza to say seeing as he hadn’t exactly been begging to give up the LA job when it was offered to him, but Jack won’t mention that.

They’re getting close to the kitchen now. He can hear clatter and clanking and the sound of people calling back and forth every time the door swings open. “Whether she deserves it or not, we’re going to have to see her in an hour,” Jack says. He’ll admit that Carter’s too smart to have all the city chiefs in at once for annual review. It would be like painting a big target on the group of them. He and Daniel were scheduled alongside some broad who runs the Chicago office and already had her one-on-one with Carter and jetted out after lunch. “We don’t have to talk about her until then. You been to see a Dodgers game yet this season?”

The conversational choice is a good one - it makes them look like two pals on their way to a set meet instead of two guys who were supposed to stay in the slowly emptying dining room until Carter’s secretary came to fetch them - and Jack is about to congratulate himself when he hears from behind him say, “I’d have preferred the Dodgers stay in Brooklyn, but I suppose I’m biased.”

Even if she hadn’t already been on his mind, even if he hadn’t been in DC to see her, Jack would have recognized the voice immediately. “You coming onto me, Carter?” he says slyly before he turns around. As he spins to face her, he registers Souza, already turned and looking stunned, then the scattering of rugrats, then Carter looking at him impassively from the head of a small table tucked into a corner of the busy kitchen.

“Decidedly not,” she says, turning her attention to what looks like the littlest kid, a pint-sized girl who is very carefully dumping what seems to be an entire bottle of ketchup onto the plate in front of her. Without even looking away from securing the cap and using her knife to transfer a generous dollop of ketchup to her own plate, Carter asks, “I was under the impression that our meeting wasn’t for another hour at least. Have I mistaken my times?”

Jack had a schoolteacher who used to do that, ask questions to try to confuse you or make you feel guilty, but he refuses to be caught out. “We’re still on for seven,” he says casually. “Just came to find some better grub than the stuff they handed us out there. Didn’t realize we’d wandered into a junior agent recruitment meeting.”

“What’s grub?” pipes the tallest of the three brats, though that’s not saying much.

“In this case, it means food,” Carter tells her, then says mildly to Jack, “I’m committed to the family for a timely dinner at least four times a week, which can require some creative solutions on nights like tonight.”

Jack opens his mouth, more because it’s his turn to volley a comment back than because he has something to say. He can’t believe she managed to keep it from spreading around that she’s been raising kids for what he’d guess is upwards of ten years now (and was probably pregnant, considering that all of them share her exact hair color). Either no one in the office knows about it, which seems doubtful, or she’s successfully thwarted the SHIELD gossip chain, which speaks chilling things about her power. Luckily a remark isn’t needed, because the chattiest little Carter says, “I think that was a rude thing to say, that the food wasn’t good, and probably not even true. The food here is good, it’s always good, because even if Linda isn’t cooking, Amos is, and if they made you something bad it just means that they don’t like you very much and I think they have a good reason, too.” She juts her chin and shoves her glasses up her nose, and though it’s been a few of decades since Jack was last on the playground, he can easily read the so there.

Carter gives a little sigh. “What have we said, Cassandra?”

Heaving a sigh exponentially more exhausted than her mother’s, the kids recites, “That I should think before I say something rude, and count to ten. And then you told me that it’s better to be smart and wait for the best moment to make sure a person learns a lesson, but Daddy said that you have to remind people what’s right even if it’s hard, and I know it’s not right to be mean about the cooks.”

“That logic’s pretty foolproof,” says a new, amused voice from behind them. “Although usually you don’t think it’s too hard to be rude, Cass.”

The guy is just around Jack’s height, but with apparent muscles that he wears easily under a black polo tucked into a pair of chinos. He’s holding a small glass dish of butter in one hand.

“You’re probably Jack Thompson,” says the guy, and only when the pressure of his handshake is just a touch firmer than normal does Jack realize who he is. But Steve Rogers is already turning to Souza, reaching out to shake with him too. “Good to see you again, Daniel.”

Jack cuts a glare toward Souza, who covers his guilty look by saying, “Steve came out to the West Coast to help us with a situation a couple of years ago.”

Unbelievable. Not only is Captain America alive and kicking, but Souza’s apparently been in the know for years. At least he looks pretty shocked that Carter and the Captain are shacking up again, although from the lack of interest the kitchen staff is showing, it seems to be common enough knowledge. She must have dirt on every agent in DC to keep something like this quiet.

“That was a bad one,” says Rogers, maneuvering around Jack and Daniel toward the table. “Although I usually only get called in for the bad ones. Most of the rest of the time, I like my job a lot better.” He sets the butter dish down and lifts the little one up so she can sit on his lap. “I guess the butter crisis was easily averted,” he says, leaning over to Carter with quiet amusement. They both watch the middle boy continue to doggedly scoop up his potatoes and ignore the rest of them.

“It seems that Benjamin didn’t need butter for his potatoes as much as we had thought,” Carter replies primly. “I, on the other hand…” She slices herself a sliver and leaves it to melt while she cuts blithely into her salmon.

Rogers laughs. “I’d have gotten it for you too if you’d asked.”

The way she touches his hand should be nothing. It’s a brush of her fingers on his, a fond, quirked smile she glances in his direction over the head of the toddler. But Jack can’t help but stare, and Daniel says, his voice just a note too loud, “Well, we’ll leave you to finish your dinner. Maybe they’ll have put out a good dessert.”

“The apple pie is especially worthwhile,” Carter tells him. “I’ll make sure they send out a few slices. Carol will come find you at the usual time.”

Rogers nods his goodbye, seeming distracted as he attempts to eat while the smallest girl tries to grab and redirect his fork (“Thanks for the help, Annie, except I think you like ketchup a little more than I do.”). Cassandra gives them - mostly Jack - a good glare. But Benjamin looks up from his plate for the first time, and politely says, “You should try the mashed potatoes. If they let you,” before he returns immediately to eating.

As Jack walks away, he tries to tell himself that he’s discovered some great secret of Carter’s, the family that she wants to keep hidden not only from the eyes of the enemy, but from her employees as well. But somehow he can’t quite convince himself. He and Daniel reenter the dining room, empty now except for a couple of agents picking up coffee and sandwiches for a late shift, and Jack has the definite notion that Carter’s well and truly won this round.

Well, maybe not the part with the kids. Jack can’t see how they could be considered a good thing.

#steggyweek2k18 #Steggy fic #Steve Rogers #Peggy Carter #Steve/Peggy #Steggy #Jack Thompson #Daniel Sousa #this barely counts but it's kidfic so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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davidmann95 · 7 years ago

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What's your Marvel Starter Pack?

My Marvel knowledge isn’t nearly as extensive as what I have for DC, so this’ll be scaled back to 12 books from the 15 I had there (nevermind Superman and Batman’s own personal lists). Additionally, since Marvel’s even more about Right Now than DC, nothing here is earlier than the turn of the century; a lot of my older recommended reading is by my dad’s suggestion since he had plenty of firsthand experience with the Silver and Bronze ages. Also worth noting that my Marvel tastes don’t exactly fall in line with the general sensibilities of Tumblr or fandom at large - I’m not a big X-Men guy, for instance - so your results may vary. But anyway, again, if you’re following me but new to actually collecting comics and wondering what to look into to gauge your interests, I’ve got plenty for you.

1. Daredevil by Mark Waid

What it’s about: Blinded as a child pushing an old man out of the path of an oncoming truck transporting radioactive waste, Matt Murdock grew up to become a lawyer, encouraged by his pugilist father Battlin’ Jack Murdock not to rely on his fists as he had throughout life. But when Jack was murdered for refusing to throw a fight, Matt was forced to rely on the talents he had developed in secret under his sensei Stick - the same isotopes that took away his sight boosted his remaining four to superhuman levels, as well as granting him a 360° awareness of his surroundings he termed his ‘radar sense’ - to find justice for his father and those like him, becoming the vigilante Daredevil. Now, after a crimefighting career marked by agony, loss, and an increasingly deteriorating psyche, his identity has been unofficially exposed by the tabloid press…but attempting to turn around both his life and his mental health, Matt’s chosen to try and re-embrace the good in both his daytime career and in the thrill of his adventures as the Man Without Fear.

Why you should read it: Aside from being in my opinion the most influential superhero comic of the decade, Mark Waid’s tenure on Daredevil is the complete package of superhero comics. Energizing, gorgeous, accessible, character-driven, innovative, and bold, it’s a platonic ideal of Good Superhero Comics, and most especially Good Marvel Superhero Comics, and as such there’s little better place to start.

Further recommendations if you liked it: Shockingly, few modern Marvel titles seem to operate on a similar frequency to this run, even among those that clearly wouldn’t have existed without it; of those I don’t mention in one capacity or another below, the only modern books that leap out to me as being of a similar breed are Roger Langridge and Chris Samnee’s (the latter ending up the primary artist on Waid’s Daredevil) tragically cut short Thor: The Mighty Avenger, Dan Slott and Mike Allred’s Silver Surfer, and Al Ewing’s Contest of Champions. Given the classic mood it evokes, you might also be interested in some of Marvel’s older stuff in general - as probably most conveniently packaged in the Essential volumes - as well as the more recent Marvel Adventures line of all-ages titles. For hornhead himself, most of his classic work tends to operate in a pitch-black noir mood that much of Waid’s run is meant to contrast; if you want to delve into it, go to Frank Miller’s run (primarily Born Again), then Brian Bendis’s followed by Ed Brubaker’s and, following Waid, Chip Zdarsky’s (the Charles Soule run in the middle seems largely forgettable).

2. Marvels

What: Following the career of photojournalist Phil Sheldon - beginning in World War II with the rise of the likes of the Human Torch, Namor, and Captain America, and forward into the reemergence of superheroes with the Fantastic Four - Marvels shows what the battles that define a world look like to the helpless spectators, from the controversy surrounding mysterious vigilantes such as Spider-Man, the fear of the “mutant menace” represented by the X-Men, and the terror when the planet is first truly threatened at the hands of Galactus.

Why: As well as being one of Marvel’s best and most defining works period - this is Kurt Busiek and Alex Ross’s coming out party as two of the most significant names in the genre, and it articulates Marvel’s avowed “it’s the world outside your window!” philosophy better than perhaps any other title - Marvel is ruled by history and continuity in a way DC isn’t. The latter may have reboots to contend with, but Marvel has a much more upfront and consistently significant timeline of what happened when and what’s important, and if you’re going to have to immerse yourself in that ridiculous lore, there’s no more fulfilling way of getting an injection of pure backstory than this.

Recommendations: There’s a follow-up by Busiek, Roger Stern and Jay Anacleto titled Marvels: Eye of the Camera; I haven’t read it yet myself, but given the pedigree involved I can’t imagine it’s anything less than entirely solid. For other Major Marvel Events, the defining one of the 21st century is Mark Millar and Steve McNiven’s Civil War, which set a tone that still reverberates through the line; also worth checking out the recent Marvel Legacy oneshot, which seems to be laying the groundwork for things to come. Speaking of setting a tone, while it’s not directly ‘relevant’ continuity-wise, Millar also worked with Bryan Hitch on Ultimates 1 & 2, which proved to be the aesthetic model for the current wave of Marvel movies and added plenty of ideas that have been extensively mined since. History of the Marvel Universe by Mark Waid and Javier Rodriguez fits its title and is absolutely worth a library checkout, but is mainly a rote checklist elevated by all-timer artwork.

3. Kieron Gillen and Jamie McKelvie’s Young Avengers

What: The heroes of the group once known as the ‘Young Avengers’ have gone their separate ways, each trying to figure things out on the cusp of adulthood. But when Wiccan’s attempt at helping his boyfriend goes horribly wrong - mixed in with a pint-sized god of mischief’s machinations, an interdimensional bruiser’s attempts at routing him, and non-Hawkguy Hawkeye’s extraterrestrial hookup - the gang’s forced back together again and on the run before old age literally swallows them whole.

Why: Here’s the bummer truth, daddy-o: I am not, in the common parlance, down with the hep cats, at least as far as gateway young-readers Marvel books go. I flipped through Runaways and wasn’t compelled to pick it up; I kept on with Ms. Marvel for a couple years but always on the edge of falling out of my monthly pile. Unless it’s truly next-level spectacular or heart-pouring-out sincere, gimme superfolks routing fiendish plots and going on trippy adventures any day over a bunch of sad kids in tights figuring out adolescence all over again: Spidey already did it first and better, and when emotionally-down-to-Earth superhero comics do get me fired up it’s usually set a little later on in life (even when I was the target audience for this sort of thing). But fire it through Gillen/McKelvie laser neon sexytime pop, and suddenly you’re in business. Slick, smart, raw, and wild, this was the best comic of 2013, and’ll certainly go down as one of the best superhero titles of this decade, Marvel as the Cool Kids of superherodom dialed up to 11.

Recommendations: Nothing else quite like this out there - the closest in feeling is Grant Morrison and J.G. Jones’ excellent original Marvel Boy miniseries, though that’s more about becoming a 20-something out in the world in the sense of wanting to burn it all down to the ground - but as I said, Runaways and Ms. Marvel do generally appeal to the same audience (and to be clear, I did like the latter just fine), as do the original Young Avengers run and Avengers Academy. Personally, I checked out and liked Avengers Arena, where all the fun teen heroes got forced into Hunger Gamsing each other on a murder island run by Arcade, followed up by them breaking bad in Avengers Undercover - please note that I’m like one of the three people on Earth who liked this book as opposed to ravenously despising it, which probably has in part do to with my lack of prior attachment to the characters involved. Also, important to note that this book is in the middle of a thematic Loki trilogy, preceded by Gillen’s Journey Into Mystery (which I haven’t read but don’t for a second doubt the quality of), and completed by Al Ewing and Lee Garbett’s truly magnificent Loki: Agent of Asgard; also worth noting that these books, and really modern Loki as a whole, are deeply rooted in Robert Rodi and Esad Ribic’s Thor & Loki: Blood Brothers. And for perfect entry books, I don’t think there’s much of anything better out there, especially for young readers, than Ryan North and Erica Henderson’s The Unbeatable Squirrel Girl, one of Marvel’s most consistently high-quality ongoings of the last several years.

4. Hawkeye: My Life As A Weapon

What: Clint Barton, aka Hawkeye, aka Hawkguy, is the Avenger who’s Just A Dude. No super-steroids and vita-rays, no magic hammer or Pym particles, a distinct lack of multi-billion dollar armor or immortality serum. Dude has a bow and arrow, and while he is very, very good with that bow and arrow, he still gets his ass kicked a frankly disproportionate amount relative to his teammates. Between meeting a dog, buying a car, and hanging out with friends - even if each incident goes significantly more wrong that they would for anyone other than Clint Barton, with non-Hawkguy Hawkeye Kate Bishop typically along for the ride - this is what he gets up to when he’s not helping save the world.

Why: Gonna show my heresy again: I’m not actually over the moon about Fraction/Aja’s Hawkeye past the first arc. But that first arc? Man oh man oh man, are they about as good as Marvel gets. This is absolute next-level storytelling on every front, with Aja and Pulido pulling out all the stops and Fraction - who by all accounts thinks more about the process of how comics work than anyone else in the field - just pouring heart and style all over the thing. It’s as tight and energetic as comics get, and the perfect introduction to Marvel’s street-level corner.

Recommendations: Aside from the rest of this run, there’s the recent Hawkeye (starring the non-Hawkguy Hawkeye Kate Bishop) by Kelly Thompson and Leonardo Romero, and there’s a generous helping of Hawkguy in Ales Kot and Michael Walsh’s Secret Avengers, a book as tight and out-of-the-box and oddly joyous in its own way as this. If you’re looking for other Marvel material that gets this explicitly experimental and afield of the house style, go for Jim Steranko’s much-loved work with Nick Fury. And for the other, considerably grimmer side of the street, aside from the Daredevil stuff I mentioned above, check out anything and everything you can get your hands on from Garth Ennis’s work with the Punisher, along with Greg Rucka’s and Jason Aaron’s.

5. Moon Knight: From The Dead

EDIT: This list was written prior to allegations made against Warren Ellis. It’s your money, but while I’d still recommend checking the book out of the library - the quality of the work isn’t going to change now that it’s out there in the universe - if you’re looking to pad your bookshelf I might recommend skipping to some of the books suggested below in its place.

What: Marc Spector was a mercenary until the day he died, betrayed in the desert before an Egyptian temple by his comrades…and then he kept going. No one knows for sure whether the truth is what his doctors have to say - that sharing his head with the likes of Steven Grant and Jake Lockley is a manifestation of DID, and he’s a profoundly sick man - or his own interpretation - that his fragile human personality buckled and shattered before the immensity when dying by its temple, he bowed his head at death’s door to the moon god Khonshu and let it seize his soul. Whatever the truth, he now knows his purpose: to defend travelers by night from whatever horrors would cross their path.

Why: There’s no story as such to be told here; Ellis and Shalvey simply show six adventures over six issues that establish Moon Knight and the scope of what he’s capable of when handled properly, ranging from straightforward detective work to psychedelic journeys through a rotting dream to a jaw-dropping issue-long fight scene. Marvel has a proud history of material skewing slightly to the left of the rest of their output, tonally and conceptually, and this is your ideal gateway to Weird Marvel.

Recommendations: For the further adventures of Moon Knight, by recommendation would be Max Bemis and Jacen Burrows’ current volume, which is following up on the seeds Ellis and Shalvey laid down quite satisfactorily, with a few twists of their own on top. Ellis himself used Moon Knight before this in his run on Secret Avengers with a number of different artists, which was very much a precursor to his work above in its high-concept done-in-one style; also check out his book Nextwave with Stuart Immonen, which is as out there as it gets for Marvel and also the best comic ever. Delving into Marvel’s spooky side, if this did anything at all for you absolutely get all of Al Ewing and Joe Bennett’s massively and rightfully acclaimed The Immortal Hulk (and if you’re looking for more something more traditional with the Green Goliath, Mark Waid’s The Indestructible Hulk is a hoot). If you really want to go to ground zero of Weird Marvel, you’re in the market for Steve Gerber’s work, primarily Defenders and his own creation Howard the Duck (who had another very entertaining via Chip Zdarsky and Joe Quinones recently worth checking out). Another notably out-there character worth checking out is She-Hulk, particularly in Dan Slott’s run and Charles Soule/Javier Pulido’s. Two more figures existing on Marvel’s weirder end are Doctor Strange - whose ‘classic’ work would as I understand it be Steve Englehart and Frank Brunner’s run, and who’s worth checking out more recently in Brian K. Vaughan and Marcos Martin’s miniseries The Oath, Jason Aaron and Chris Bachalo’s run, and Donny Cates and Gabriel Hernandez Walta’s - and the Inhumans - while contemporary attempts to push them have been a failure, there have been excellent individual successes in Ellis, Gerardo Zaffino, and Roland Boschi’s Karnak, Al Ewing and company’s Royals, and Saladin Ahmed and Christian Ward’s Black Bolt. And I’d be remiss in the extreme not to bring up Gabriel Walta and Tom King’s Vision, which I don’t want to give anything away of, but has a serious claim to being the best thing Marvel’s ever published.

6. Ultimate Spider-Man by Bendis & Bagley

What: When bitten by a genetically mutated spider Peter Parker thought he could use his newfound powers to make a quick buck, and come on, you already know this.

Why: This is the foundational modern Spider-Man. The first arc’s aged a little wonky in bits as Bendis was trying to make late-90s/early-00s Teen Slang work, but by and large, Brian Bendis and Mark Bagley’s original 111-issue tenure on Ultimate Spider-Man reimagining his early years was pound-for-pound one of Marvel’s all-time most engaging, exciting, dramatic, and authentic long-term runs. This is the template for every movie (especially Homecoming) and TV show he’s had in the last decade, a sizable part of what got me into comics in the first place, and one of the company’s most reliable perennials. You want to get onboard with maybe the most popular superhero in the world, you do it here.

Recommendations: With the remainder of the list I’m getting into more character/concept-specific reccs, and for other great Spider-Man, your best bet truly is the classic early material by Stan Lee, Steve Ditko, and John Romita as collected in the Essential volumes, which has aged unbelievably well compared to its contemporaries; Bendis’s post-Bagley material just doesn’t hold up, even with the introduction of fan-favorite Miles Morales. For other ‘classics’, your best bests are Spider-Man: Blue, and by my understanding the runs of Roger Stern and J.M. DeMatteis, particularly the latters’ Kraven’s Last Hunt. For the modern stuff, Chip Zdarksy’s current Peter Parker: The Spectacular Spider-Man is just getting better and better, I’ve heard very good things about Spider-Man Loves Mary Jane, I personally enjoyed Mark Millar and (at his peak) JMS’s runs, and while most agree Dan Slott’s soon-concluding decade-long tenure on the character has outstayed its welcome, he’s also turned in some stone-cold classics like No One Dies and Spider-Man/Human Torch, as well as other entertaining work such as the original Renew Your Vows and Superior Spider-Man. Most recently, Chip Zdarsky’s work with the character in The Spectacular Spider-Man and the high-concept out-of-continuity miniseries Spider-Man: Life Story are some of Mr. Parker’s all-time best, while Tom Taylor’s Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man is a charming relatively small-scale superhero adventure book, and Saladin Ahmed and Javier Garron’s Miles Morales: Spider-Man is easily the best possible introduction to that guy.

7. Thor: God of Thunder Vol. 1

What: Though Thor, the god of thunder and mighty Avenger, has faced limitless threats to even divine life and limb over his many millennia, only one figure has ever truly frightened him. Now, as he discovers a serial killer of deities is loose in the cosmos, he must turn to his past and future alike in order to survive the coming of the God-Butcher.

Why: The pick on this list most directly relevant to those coming in from the movies right now, I’m afraid that while a bit of this was plucked for Ragnarok, this isn’t remotely on the same wavelength. This is black metal death opera screamed through the megaphone of wild space-spanning superheroics, and not only is it the best Thor comic, it’s the perfect introduction to Marvel’s cosmic side.

Recommendations: Along with the Loki books I namechecked above, the defining run on Thor (though the rest of his continuing work there is also very much worth checking out) is Walter Simonson, which laid down a lot of the fundamentals of the character as he exists today; along with that and the rest of Aaron’s run, my understanding is that Lee/Kirby’s original run holds up very well. For more satisfying fight comics, I’d also suggest World War Hulk, and I hear Marvel’s early Conan comics were standouts. On the cosmic end, I know the Guardians of the Galaxy are where it’s at these days; they sprang to life in their current incarnation in the much-loved Annihilation, and while I haven’t been reading their current Gerry Duggan/Aaron Kuder run, it’s well-liked and probably a good place to drop on, as would be the recent Chip Zdarsky/Kris Anka Starlord, and I’d personally recommend Al Ewing and Adam Gorhan’s Rocket. Beyond them, Jonathan Hickman’s comics are where it’s really at, from his Fantastic Four to S.H.I.E.L.D. to Ultimates to Avengers/New Avengers to the big finale to his overarching story in Secret Wars; it’s a complicated reading order to figure out, but oh-so-worth it.

8. Iron Man: Extremis

What: Faced with the horrors of his amoral past and the questions of a future coming quicker than he can manage, Tony Stark faces his most dangerous enemy yet when experimental post-human body modification tech is let loose into the world and lands in the hands of a white supremacist terrorist cell.

Why: More than anything other than Robert Downey Jr. smirking and quipping, this story is the definitive model for the modern Iron Man, taking a C-lister most notable for dealing with alcoholism decades earlier and hanging out on the B-list team in the Avengers (at least until 2012), and redefining his personality, aesthetic, and role in the 21st century as a man who might be smart enough to save the world if he can ever pull together enough to somehow save himself from his own compromises and weaknesses. The road to this guy becoming a household name is paved here.

Recommendations: Prior to this, his biggest stories were Demon in a Bottle, showing his first reckoning with his alcohol abuse, and Denny O’Neil’s 40-issue run introducing Obadiah Stane and showing Stark’s darkest hour as he sinks completely into his illness. Post-Ellis, the big run is Matt Fraction and Salvador Larroca, which seizes both on the ideas here and the momentum granted by his Hollywood debut to cement his status as an A-lister; after that check out Kieron Gillen’s, which is not only a fun big-idea series in its own right but paves the way for Al Ewing’s spinoff Fatal Frontier, easily one of Iron Man’s best and most overlooked titles. Finally, while it was derided in its own time (that it was a spinoff of an event that turned him evil but the comic never especially explained the circumstances didn’t help), Superior Iron Man is also worth a look as a horrifying contrast to the rest of these.

9. Captain America: Man Out Of Time

What: A sickly young man who volunteered to participate in an experimental super-soldier program to serve his country in World War II, Steve Rogers became Captain America and protected the world from the Nazis with unimaginable courage and distinction, until the day he died disarming a drone plane rigged to blow aimed at America’s shores. He was honored throughout history…until the day he was found alive by the Avengers, frozen in the Atlantic and ready to emerge into the lights of the 21st century when needed most. Most people know that story. This is the story of what happened next.

Why: The search for the definitive statement on Captain America is one that’s driven his character for decades: after all, handling him doesn’t just mean talking about one man’s character, but the character of a nation. Successes are typically qualified, but one of the more successful creators in the pool is Mark Waid, who’s up to his fourth time at bat with Steve right now on the main book. His own most notable effort however is here, showing Rogers’ earliest days post-iceberg as he adjusts to living in what is to him the far-flung future, seeing the ways the nation has both surpassed his wildest dreams and fallen short of his humblest expectations, leaving him in the end to make the choice of whether this is truly the world he wants to defend.

Recommendations: As I mentioned, Waid’s had a few times up at bat with Captain America, and while he initial 90s stints might not be ideal for new readers for a number of reasons, his current run with frequent partner Chris Samnee is a solid crowdpleaser and a perfect place to jump onboard. Prior to that, worth checking out are Jim Steranko’s bizarre and transformative 3-issue run, Steve Englehart’s legendary Secret Empire (not the recent contentious Marvel event comic, to be clear), Ed Brubaker’s turn of the character towards grounded espionage, and his co-creator Jack Kirby’s bombastic, passionate 1970s tenure on the Captain. Currently, Ta-Nehisi Coates’ run is quite solid. Regarding related characters, for the Winter Soldier I’d suggest Ales Kot and Marco Rudy’s unconventional cosmic thriller Bucky Barnes: Winter Soldier; Black Widow had her own recent and excellent Mark Waid/Chris Samnee run, and I’d also recommend the one-shot Avengers Assemble 14AU by Al Ewing and Butch Guice, and issue #20 from Warren Ellis’s previously mentioned time on Secret Avengers; for Black Panther, his definitive runs are under Don McGregor and Christopher Priest, and I’d also note Jason Aaron and Jefte Palo’s Secret Invasion arc as showing T’Challa at his best.

10. Fantastic Four By Waid & Wieringo

What: Bathed in cosmic radiation on an ill-fated journey to the stars, Reed Richards, Sue and Johnny Storm, and Ben Grimm were transformed, and became the Fantastic Four, first family of an age of heroes! Now, years into their careers and with Reed and Sue’s young children in tow, they continue to explore new frontiers, whether battling a sentient equation gone mad, contending with an extradimensional roach infestation, or perhaps most perilous of all, Johnny trying to deal with getting a real job.

Why: Plenty consider the Fantastic Four one of Marvel’s most difficult groups to get right, but Waid and Wieringo nail the formula here as well as anyone ever has, just the right mix of high adventure and family dynamics to draw just about anyone in; this is as crowdpleasing as comics get and the perfect introduction to the best superhero team out there.

Recommendations: The FF’s another group where it’s worth going back to their earliest days of Lee and Kirby; while much of the writing’s aged awkwardly at best, they’re the absolute foundational comics of the entire universe and lay down concepts that are still getting use today throughout that universe. Past that initial run, John Byrne and Walter Simonson’s are among the best by reputation, as well as Jonathan Hickman’s as I discussed before (Mark Millar and Bryan Hitch’s is worth tracking down as well, especially since concepts there end up feeding directly into Hickman). For more outside-the-box material, Joe Casey and Chris Weston’s First Family is worth a look, as is Grant Morrison and Jae Lee’s 1234. And for the all-time best showing of bashful Benjamin J. Grimm, the ever-lovin’ blue-eyed Thing, find Marvel Two-In-One Annual #7 to see him defend the entire planet in a boxing match at Madison Square Garden. And while the team’s sadly off the table at the moment, Thing and the Torch are returning in Chip Zdarsky and Jim Cheung’s new volume of Marvel Two-In-One as they set out to find their missing family.

11. Mighty Avengers by Al Ewing

What: When Thanos takes to the skies as Earth’s Mightiest Heroes are off-planet, it’s a day unlike any other, as those left standing are forced to band together as the Mighty Avengers. And as the danger passes, the team remains, looking to truly work alongside those they protect rather than above them to make things better, even as forces conspire in the background to enslave them all.

Why: This title is something of a limitus test, in that it’s one where you’ll have to deal with it being constantly, infuriatingly forced to deal with crossover nonsense. It’s one of the big prices to pay for engaging with a larger universe, but the trade-off is that this is where Al Ewing gets set loose on the Marvel universe, drawing on every weird corner to pull together a run of genuine moral intent, note-perfect character work, and all-out adventure. This may be the ‘secondary’ team, but it’s as perfect as the Avengers have ever gotten.

Recommendations: The title itself is relaunched as Captain America and the Mighty Avengers, and as that ends but Ewing continues his time at Marvel, the characters and concepts end up divided among a number of titles: Contest of Champions, where a number of heroes are plucked from the timestream to duel for the power and amusement of the Grandmaster, New Avengers (later turned U.S.Avengers), where former X-Man Sunspot assembles a new team to act as a James Bond-ified international strike force, and Ultimates (later turned Ultimates2), where some of Earth’s most powerful and brilliant heroes band together to proactively defend against unimaginable cosmic threats; also try his mini-event Ultron Forever with Alan Davis sometime. Based on your response to numerous aspects of those titles, there’s a good chance you might be in the market for David Walker’s Luke Cage titles, Matt Fraction’s Defenders, and Jim Starlin’s cosmic 70s books such as Captain Marvel and Warlock (and make sure to read Nextwave at some point, Ewing actually follows up on that gonzo delight in some surprising ways here). For the ‘main’ team, aside from Hickman’s previously mentioned run - which while spectacular is pretty far afield of the usual tone - some suggestions might be Kurt Busiek and George Perez’s much-loved run, Roger Stern’s Under Siege, I have to imagine given the pedigree of the creators Earth’s Mightiest Heroes by Joe Casey and Scott Kolins, Brian Bendis’s extended ownership of the Avengers books, and The Kree-Skrull War.

12. Wolverine & The X-Men by Jason Aaron

What: Dwindled down to a few in a world that hates and fears them as much as ever, mutantkind has been split in two, with by-the-books Cyclops taking a hardline approach against oppression and feeling that the youth in the X-Men’s charge must be made ready to fight, while Wolverine has grown tired of throwing children into battle and has left to find a new way. Founding the Jean Gray School For Higher Learning, Logan’s found himself in the most unexpected role of all as a professor, fighting just has hard to keep the unimaginable high-tech academy and the hormonal super-powered student body in check as to fend off the supervillains inevitably sent their way.

Why: The X-Men aren’t exactly my forte, with a wobbly batting average at best over the years as the books devote at least as much effort to trying to juggle the continuity and soap opera demands as the actual sci-fi premise. There have been successes though, and few so geared towards new reader engagement as Wolverine & The X-Men, where Aaron strips the franchise down to the base essentials of a team living in a school for super-kids. It’s poppy, it’s weird, it’s touching, and it’s accessible. It’s the X-Men at its best.

Recommendations: The most direct predecessor to this run (aside from its actual lead-in miniseries X-Men: Schism, which is actually worth checking out) is Grant Morrison’s New X-Men, which takes the sci-fi aspects of the concept to the very limit in what I’m inclined to consider the best X-Men run, though it’s proven controversial over the years among longtime fans. The base of the team as it exists today is in Chris Clarmemont’s work, which I’m not wild about myself but has a few hits such as God Loves, Man Kills; if you’re looking for a modern update on the formula developed there, Astonishing X-Men by Joss Whedon and John Cassaday is probably your ticket (and the follow-up run by Warren Ellis is a great weird paramilitary sci-fi book for a bit). Jonathan Hickman’s relaunch is a radicaly and brilliant departure paving a new way forward; it’s perhaps best experienced after a bit of ‘traditional’ X-Men to understand the scale of the contrast, but check that out as soon as possible. For classic material, I understand the Roy Thomas/Neal Adams run was an early success, and Jeff Parker’s X-Men: First Class is by all accounts a charming look at the team’s earliest days. Jason Aaron’s work elsewhere on the X-Men proper was limited to the first 6 issues of the short-lived Amazing X-Men, but he had a very extended and successful tenure on Wolverine which would be my go-to recommendation for him; past that, Death of Wolverine actually satisfies, and All-New Wolverine starring his successor Laura Kinney was the best X-Men book on the stands for some time (writer Tom Taylor is also had a short-lived ‘proper’ X-book in X-Men: Red). As for the group’s many spin-offs, I’d suggest Rick Remender’s X-Force, Peter Milligan and Mike Allred’s X-Factor/X-Statix, and Joe Kelly and Ed McGuiness’s Spider-Man/Deadpool, which should serve as a decent introduction to the latter dude’s own oddball territory in the franchise along with the truly mad and utterly delightful You Are Deadpool.

#Marvel #Opinion

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hellacre13 · 7 years ago

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It’s been brought to my notice a clois shipper is taking my comments on CBR without my permission, screen grabbing and pasting in his tumblr to talk trash . So glad you think my comments so worthy that you need to pull out your straw man arguments instead of being honest enough to reply to me there. But I won’t give any credence to your cowardice. You know, some people have been making a habit of this. Taking what I and other posters have said on public forums and going on twitter and tumblr and trying to act all smug and smart and trying...TRYING...to ridicule us. But you know I tend to ignore these cowards. I don’t like wasting my time on shipping wars which is why I rarely get into to and fros with these folks here. Fact, I have most of them blocked. But this I decided has given me a great opportunity to share with my fellow comic fans.

In retrospect, my post my post must have been thought provoking . 😉 😚 Glad to see it got him reacting. So I thought why waste it on CBR alone? I MEAN I DON’T HAVE TO ASK MYSELF PERMISSION. Let me share what it was about. Here was my thoughts on that debacle Batman #39 before it was released based on the Bleeding Cool article that it seemed to have ripped from that notorious Action 571 by Joe Kelly 18 years ago. Now some people, usually clois fans, love Action because it, in their eyes, hold their pairing up as some great love because of this issue. But then there is another side to it and I ask people to sincerely think about this given the fact we have moved on in terms of how we view relationships and dynamics. I am not talking about political correctedness gone mad. Not at all. And no way I would be so disrespectful to call Joe Kelly the man a sexist or anything like that the way some clois fans attack Superman/Wonder Woman fans and writers because they so “hurt” fiction simply paired up two single people in one story line ie the new 52 despite them having tons of stuff in other books and media. Some writers just do stories using outdated troupes that have evolved into sexist plots because times change and they at times miss their mark with a section of the fandom or can be a hit depending which side of the fence you are on. And they should never be personally attacked for it. You can critique them but don’t for the love of god try to label people you don’t know anything about other than you read a comic that you don’t like.

I hate Action #761. Not because of the premise that two people who have been attracted to each other, who have a long history of closeness in BOTH their comics...ie they actually have been shown in the narrative...it's not just dragged in left field... that they can end up closer or intimate. It's actually pretty normal I'd think if two friends with some unresolved tension, after they lose their spouses etc find solace or love again. It's morbid to be so guilt ridden that a dead partner you cannot recall and who you think is dead makes you close your self off to love, when it's clear you really really tempted. But this was never the point of Action #761 to explore love and loss. How can you as a writer if you want to sincerely tackle it when you full well KNOW you cannot shake the boat? It's not AU. It's not an altered timeline where you can follow through without messing up canon. You obviously, in such a scenario, will set up one character to be humiliated by doing something so absurd and heavy handed to try to prop a relationship that supposed to great because it's human etc etc...and being human is supposed to encompass the highs and lows of love, including tragedy and honoring a love by living etc. It tries so hard to beat you over the head Clark would rather be a monk for the rest of his life to honor one dead woman's memory. I did not come away and go aww that's love. I thought sheesh, what a dysfunctional love . Superman is actually crippled by Lois memory or lack thereof. Diana seemed pretty normal to me. And SHE never crossed boundaries or propositioned him. HE was the one raising it. And she backed off and never made him feel at all as if he did anything wrong by rejecting her. She was selfless in one vein and just a prop in another with no pov about how she dealt with it as a woman and someone who left behind friends and loved ones too. It was all about Superman and Lois to prop them at her expense. She comes off as the reject when in fact it's a story that used her in a cheap way knowing all the time that was the only outcome. Can't we all just assume Superman would be faithful to Lois while they together simply because he is that kind of a dude? Why did Joe Kelly need to drag Diana in as some temptation? Just like Superman fans hate when they use Superman as the punching bag to show the strongest character can take a beating by all and sundry, am I to assume Diana has to be used as the apple because she happens to be beautiful and THE premiere female? So, if you refuse Wonder Woman of all people...wow...you gotta love Lois so much. That's pretty sexist crap right there by Kelly. It was a poorly thought out story. But it was 18 years ago and we have moved forward in terms of the way women are used. So color me totally unimpressed King takes this lame troupe and play with it again.Because you can do nothing good with it. Neither Batman or Diana are single. It is not AU. Unless there is a plan to make them dump Selina and Steve. I hardly think this likely since why would DC make such a big deal of the Batcat stuff only to dump on it in this manner. BOTH are with their "love interests". Bruce has made a huge step in his canon. Love with commitment and pending marriage. Diana is shacked up with Steve Trevor. I am not fan of Rebirth. But she is with Steve cureently so why is there this need to muddy the waters at this stage? They could have done this easily when both were single. People might not like or might like it depending on your shipping preferences but at least they free, single and disengaged. They can kiss or date who they please as single people. Batman sure as hell has umpteen women in his books. Wanting a beautiful woman is not exactly strange for him. And King is cheating by trying to say they have some deep, great friendship based on one lame two parter? Because they spend some time in a pocket universe where time passes but is only two issues we to assume their friendship has the same magnitude as say Clark and Bruce's which has had so many books devoted to it? Diana pre new 52 and new 52 could never be seen to be Bruce's close friend and boast of a friendship to equal Superman and Batman or even a romantic dynamic as her other canonical love interests because they had limited stories together. King premises this as some great deep friendship because he wants to retroactively in a paltry two issues cement something they never earned? That's how lazy and arrogant DC and Batman writers are. It was done by Joe Kelly in the JLA run where Batman sucked Diana's face with no build up. It was done by Rucka in Black Night. Seems King is doing it again. Pushing something that just has not been earned. And using the cheapest way to try to claim it. It is baffling he uses Superman and Lois is positive ways and supportive of Selina and chooses to put Diana, a symbol of sisterhood in a story where you have to dredge up sex and intimacy to show how good friends they are. I don't get it. This arc is supposed to be about Batman's friends response to his pending marriage . So he and Diana couldn't spend some time bonding in any other way? What is the purpose? It does not sound at all good to me. So this is why I think that him even borrowing the premise or homaging or whatever he's done a poor choice. Diana will come off looking bad again and a prop or mouthpiece because it is a Batman book and about his issues.

Then Batman 39 hit and I said this.

I'm sorry to say I told you so. But yeah. Whenever batman fan boy writers handle Wonder Woman this is what you get. Lazy ooc plots to claim her as hooked on Batman's irresistible charms. They don't build anything over time. They just slap it in your face. Bruce Timm. Joe Kelly. Greg Rucka, Now Tom King and no doubt soon Liam Sharp. Like I say it doesn't bug me two friends who are close and attracted to each other if they are single try a relationship. But Action wasn't about that. It could not any way explore anything in canon. And no one I know who liked smww or ww cared for it. It was one sided to ensure smll came out smelling rosy and Diana ...oh poor Diana...just rejected because if you turn down Wonder Woman...wow, what a man. What a love! So dumb. Like he couldn't just be seen as faithful because he's a loyal guy in a normal situation. They just needed to go all heavy handed to make a pointless point at WW expense.

Batman 39. Worse. The pacing in Action at least tried to show a bond already there knitting tighter...they did not need this issue to show they are friends. They already were close etc. Diana did not proposition Clark. They maintained boundaries and yadda yadda for a moment looked at each other and then Clark pulled back and Diana is fine with it blah blah. This shows a Wonder Woman in terms of the art, flirting heavily in her body language from the get go. Batman as you clearly see is still trying to be faithful in his body language. She even suggests they get it on knowing he will go back to Selina. I just don't how to take that. No Diana I know would openly suggest that. It's so out of character. She's the apple/ temptress. She has no pov or remembers she has her own lover and life. He's a non issue. Poor Steve prob sitting in their apartment waiting for her.

Now if this is based on Rucka's Diana...then this is not the way I want my Wonder Woman. Not so lacking in empathy, emotional intelligence and wisdom . I don't understand how any one as old as she is with so much relationships under her belt as suggested by Rucka, cannot understand and respect the nuances and boundaries in relationships at this stage. That she views all that she has "loved" as not able to teach her anything. It is baffling to me this Rucka Diana with all this delusion and madness nonsense. She's not a naive here but comes across as very self centered and stiff for a character who is about sisterhood and compassion. You'd think as she has her own lover she would empathize how much Bruce misses Selina...is bizarre what we have here. So whether they kiss or not is not the point. It's the set up and Diana's poor characterization. [/SPOIL]

DC dropped the ball on Diana with Rebirth. Badly and this is where she is now. Batman writers are getting to dictate her motivations, character, personality in throw away arcs and they just don't feel right at all. No matter how people say they hate the new 52...Diana maintained her core personality under the pens of Azzarello, and Soule and hell even Finch and Johns wasn't all bad.

For those who never read either books...you’re missing nothing but Action is the lesser of two evils. You can go read them to at least keep make your own minds up but context is important in everything and timing. Personally I say don’t give DC $ for nonsense. I’m pretty sure you can get it online free to read or see many spoilers around. As much as I don’t like Wonderbat, if it had been done when both were single...(and to be fair it had been back in JLA in 2002 by Joe Kelly and went nowhere)...it would have not been so bad as to raise so much ire. Pissed off fandoms, sure, but I am not so into shipping wars that I would be writing about any issue on this blog. Same way I ignore clois in Rebirth because they are not my new 52 Superman or Wonder Woman. So not sure why in God’s name DC wants to force it now when they did a Batcat engagement and choose to put Diana with Steve. I mean, are they crazy to be playing with that kind of fire when people are so sensitive the way women are used? And then that mini coming up by Liam Sharp is hinting at the same kind of crap trying to write retroactive wonderbat stuff just to have his own shipping preference. After Batman 39, I’d say, he needs to thread carefully. I mean come on, DC. Treat Diana better. It’s no skin of Batman’s nose. He sells no matter his status quo. He can have a harem his fan boys don’t care. But DC chose to go a very important step and make Bruce take a huge decision to tell the woman he loves he wants to commit to her and her be a part of his life. This is not something you sully with this kind of thing at this time. And let’s just say Bruce and Selina break up someway along the line does DC really want it to be because people blame Diana for it? Now is not the time for it. God, DC, you had your chance and never took it. Don’t mess about now. Now maybe King might have a better part two to subvert what we are seeing here but I still think using Wonder Woman imagery as the temptress was ill advised.

And those trying to drag SuperWonder into this. Please. Our New 52 couple is dead. They are not part of this. Try reaching somewhere else. The clois shipper using my CBR comments, your example is so silly of trying to use DC Presents #32 as the same as Batman #39. That story was set in the Silver Age where there was an innocent whimsy and silliness in stories. Eros shot SM and WW with arrows and they kissy kissy for a bit while trying to find a cure. Both were dating Steve and Lois but most pointedly neither had told Steve and Lois they were Clark Kent and Diana Prince in those stories. Both Steve and Lois use to treat Diana and Clark like shit in favor of Wonder Woman and Superman back then. So let’s not even start with the faux outrage. It was just a different time and the Batman Brave and the Bold kids comic replicated it because again, it’s the context and kind of story. No one batted an eye lid nor cared Bats and Wondy kissed under a love spell. The innocence is there unless you’re reaching big time.

Here is that lovely thread people. http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?106190-Batman-39-Could-Be-Borrowing-A-Plot-From-An-Issue-of-Action-Comics

And here is Bleeding Cool’s pov.

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2018/01/17/batman-39-action-comics-761-temptations-wonder-woman-spoilers/

Oh and since I am an admin on Hellyeahsupermanandwonderwoman...it has permission to reblog me.

#superman #wonder woman #action comics #batman #catwoman

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pro-bee · 7 years ago

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“She knew you wouldn't be pleased.” “Then she never knew me at all”

Let me get this off my chest:

THIS ENTIRE CONVERSATION IS BULLSHIT.

...

Now that that’s out of the way:

This entire conversation is bullshit.

I’m sorry, but this is the mother of all plot devices.

And this is coming from a show where a major character was introduced in her first episode as the sister of the assassin who killed her predecessor before shooting him, has killed off at least one major character a season For Reasons, has terrorist plots endangering Washington DC at least once a year, retconned character histories and past actions to repeat plots, INTRODUCED A HALF-BROTHER TO POINT #1′S VILLAIN TEN YEARS AFTER KILLING HIM OFF FOR NO REASON only to then kill him off, etc.

I’m saying, there’s a lot of bullshit on this show.

But this takes the cake.

Long-lost children are cheesy at the best of times, and that alone would be enough to make any fan raise their arms in frustration.

Even though on the flip side this is Confirmed!Tiva.

It’s complete character assassination for Ziva, which is so unnecessary, especially given how she was written out in season 11.

The Ziva who longed for something permanent (HER WORDS), who’s had feelings for Tony arguably since season 4 at the very least (IN THE SHOW’S WORDS), who knew how much family meant for Tony, who knew how committed he was to her ( “I can change with you”/ “I just want you to come home, with me” / “Hardest 180 of my life” etc.), who knew how much he’d grown in the last year before she left and stood by her side after she was in turmoil, who was trying to better herself and heal her old wounds and turn a new page?

You’re saying, Show, that that Ziva wouldn’t have told Tony she was pregnant?

(The very man she said she loved -- AGAIN, ACTUALLY IN THE SHOW IT’S ON TAPE PEOPLE)

NO FUCKING WAY.

(more under the cut because WE’RE IN FOR A WILD RIDE FOLKS)

[[more]]

First of all, it kills me (no pun intended) that this probably adds fuel to the fire for the Ziva-haters who thought she was selfish, because, well, that sure proves their point, doesn’t it?

It almost seems callous, like it was to get back at Cote de Pablo for whatever it was that went down when she left the show.

Except I don’t think the writers/producers were actually being that nasty or inconsiderate. Because given the show’s history -- by that I mean, trying to inflict the most Tragic Man Pain™ on its male characters -- I honestly do think they just thought this was a great way to create Drama and didn’t think twice about what this meant for the female character in question.

Again, I give you: Agent Lee, Jackie Vance, Diane, Paula Cassidy, and I’m sure lots of others that I can’t remember at the moment, but the point is that they are all female characters whose deaths were written specifically to heap more tragedy onto a male character to give them something to fight for/feel guilt over.

(I don’t really count Shannon & Kelly, since their deaths were pre-Show and were part of Gibbs’ origin story, nor do I count Kate’s, because that’s probably the one death that I feel was probably a legitimate “Gotcha!” for the audience to drive the story. Then again I’ve never actually seen season 2 so what do I know.)

So what I’m saying is killing Ziva off is bad enough.

But now adding another layer to that with her hiding said male character’s child from him for almost three years is even more infuriating, because it perpetuates the stereotype that so-called “independent” women as Orli puts it completely eschew their male partners’ feelings, doing what they want and damn the torpedoes. And in this context, specifically reverts to the notion of Ziva essentially being a stone-cold (former) killer who lacks any empathy, especially towards the supposed love of her life.

Which, if you are a Ziva fan, you know is untrue, and there is ample evidence to the contrary on the show. Ziva was traumatized and self-destructive and often made terrible life choices, but when she felt safe she was also compassionate and warm-hearted and generous.

But this decision by the writers throws that out the window. They hand-wave it off as, “well, she decided she didn’t need no man and had a baby by herself,” when we know that’s pretty much the opposite of what she was -- hell, did they watch the season 10 finale?! I don’t know if the fact that it seems like they genuinely didn’t even think this through or realize how it would look softens the blow or makes it worse.

The only way I can even remotely fanwank this so that Ziva doesn’t seem like a total self-centered jerk (and let me clarify I DO NOT THINK ON ANY PLANET THAT ZIVA IS A SELF-CENTERED JERK but that is what the subtext of this writing implies) is if you explain this away by thinking that Ziva was so terrified when she found out that she was pregnant that she froze and put off telling Tony until one day it just seemed like it was too late.

(I may or may not have written a fic about that. I may or may not get around to posting it if I ever finish writing about this episode. It’s been sitting on my computer since July.)

It’s not a good explanation, by any means, but it’s like you have to twist yourself into circles to make this even remotely palatable. And it shouldn’t be palatable, because this flies in the face of 10 years of character development.

The Ziva who grew up with a distant father and a presumably unhappy mother (from the flashbacks we’ve seen), who never really recovered from her family breaking up as a teen, who gravitated towards this group of people an ocean way from her homeland and came to consider them her chosen family, who started to think about her future and settling down and planting roots and having a family of her own, who canonically loved Tony -- you’re telling me this person would decide to cut the father of her child out of her life because she was “independent”?

Yeah, right.

Ziva was (is) reckless, impulsive, temperamental, brash -- all of these things, yes. But callous? I’ve never thought so.

Looks like I got ahead of myself.

- Poor Tali. She cried throughout the flight, enduring more in her last day than most people do in a lifetime. - Does she even know? I mean, does she understand? - All she knows is that her mother has gone away. Ziva assured me you were the only biological possibility, in case you were wondering. - I wasn't. But if she had any doubts that would explain why she didn't tell me. - No doubts. Yes, she's the image of her mother, but the eyes are all you, Tony. - If I'd known she was pregnant, I would've been there in a second.

First of all: MY HEART. That poor little nugget.

Second: UUUUUUUUGH my head hurts. Because whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy.

There’s so much to unpack here.

Let’s take the first hair-pulling morsel: the “biological possibility.” Which is one of many hints about how little Orli knows him.

Part of me really likes this, because again I enjoy how Tony doesn’t give Orli even an inch. But also, because you get hints of before here -- in spite of everything that is happening, of how his life has just been flipped upside down over and over again in the last 24 hours, some things remain, like the fact that he knows the timeline and he knows Ziva, and he knows there was no one else.

Orli may not know what they were, or may assume that they were casual or a one-time thing, and is almost clinical about how Tali came to be. It’s just a totally different mindset to where these two were and who they were three years ago.

But it’s Tony who gets me -- despite his own grief, and now yet another shock, he’s cognizant enough to know that some things still hold true. He’d have every right to be angry right now and imo should be, but he can separate that from what he knows of Ziva. That whatever they were that summer/fall, it meant something.

Yet he follows it up with his own doubts, because now that that possibility has been introduced, maybe that rewrites things, like maybe what he thought was true then was just an illusion, just like everything else is now. Because he probably never thought Ziva would drop off the face off the earth for three years and leave him on the sidelines, and never thought she’d end up blown up in a house fire when she’d quit law enforcement years ago, and definitely never thought she wouldn’t tell him that she was having his baby. So maybe she left him and never told him because there was more he didn’t know, maybe he’d read the whole situation wrong after all.

(Also, the eyes may be Tony’s in, um, spirit, but the baby actor playing Tali looks so much like Ziva, eyes and all, that it’s hard to believe they could have casted that part any better. I mean she’s even got Ziva/Cote’s wild curly hair, that’s crazy.)

If I'd known she was pregnant, I would've been there in a second.

Oh, Tony.

Sigh.

Because this is exactly the guy who left Ziva on the tarmac, who committed to her in that field, who searched for her for months, who stood by her when her life was in shambles, who stepped back to let her find her happy ending even if it wasn’t with him on more than one occasion.

We know all Tony wanted was to be by her side. He would have left everything behind if she’d said the word, and he would have brought her home if she’d wanted it. So he let her make her choices, even if it killed him. (And her WHAT.) But if he would have been by her side the second he knew she was pregnant, would have dropped everything because really, he wouldn’t be giving anything up at all, because that’s what he really wanted. And that’s what so tragic about PPF and now “Family First,” because they both want the same things but neither can voice them for their own reasons. Tony, because he’s trying to give her space and let her figure out what she needs when she’s ready. And Ziva, because she doesn’t think she’s deserving of him or in a space ready to be the partner she thinks he needs. Now, we see everything they’ve missed out on -- in even greater relief.

Oh, Tony, indeed.

But our mourning doesn’t get a chance to fester because irritation is far more salient at the moment:

- Which is precisely why she didn't tell you. She didn't want to disrupt your life any more than she already had. - That was not her decision to make. - You know better than anyone how fiercely independent Ziva was. She did not need a man to complete her. She was quite comfortable and confident raising Tali on her own. - Without ever telling me. - Actually, she came to regret that decision as Tali grew, but she struggled with how to break the news. She didn’t— she knew you wouldn't be pleased. - Then she never knew me at all.

UUUUUUUUUUUUGH MAKE IT STOP.

Like I spent the last 20 paragraphs extrapolating, the idea of Ziva being so “independent” that she wouldn’t tell the father of her child -- who she was in love with and knew loved her -- that she was pregnant is absolutely unconscionable and inexcusable.

It’s not like Tony is some random hookup or one night stand who she’d never see again. Tony is the guy who she’s stood by for almost a decade, who she’s seen grown and has grown along side, who’s been something to her in varying stages that whole time, who was even more something to her that summer to the point that they were planning on spending their newfound unemployment doing that something together indeterminably until the shit hit the fan.

The Ziva we’d grown to love for eight seasons wouldn’t unilaterally decide to deny Tony’s right to be a father (like she wouldn’t deny her child’s right to know her father) because she was independent. The Ziva who yearned to rebuild the family she lost as a kid wouldn’t knowingly repeat those same secrets in her own, or at least I’d be hard-pressed to believe it.

But I have no problem, unfortunately, believing the writers would find it perfectly acceptable.

(Which is why I’ve fanwanked it as Ziva being paralyzed by fear but WHATEVER SHOW)

It reeks of, “those man-hating independent women, they just hate us all so much.” (Misogynistic much?)

Again, this whole notion of Ziva “not needing a man to complete her,” is such bullshit, because that’s not the fucking point, and it contradicts everything we know about her. That doesn’t sound like her, and sounds more like someone making a superficial, impersonal assessment of her. (I could almost believe this was a cover for something or someone than I could believe this actually came out of fictional Ziva’s mouth.)

On the flip side, though, I like that Tony’s starting to get angry, because he should be. As much as I love Ziva and she is my favorite, this whole plot stinks, and Tony has every right to be mad right now. Because this sucks, and this is a huge betrayal, and none of this makes sense. So I like that he’s calling Orli out on her bullshit, and by extension, Ziva out on hers too. (As much as that hurts.) I like that he’s saying no, this is not okay, and just because you have an excuse for something doesn’t excuse it. Ziva being “independent” (blech) doesn’t excuse not telling him about Tali, no matter how matter-of-fact Orli presents it.

It sucks. Plain and simple.

I mean, I suppose Orli reassuring him that Ziva regretted shutting him out softens the blow a little, and lends credence to the idea that she just didn’t know how to get out of this mess -- which, to be fair, is kind of her M.O. when she gets into trouble -- but it still is beyond frustrating.

But then the second part of that statement, “She knew you wouldn’t be pleased,” is MADDENING.

MADDENING I TELL YOU.

Because again, if there’s one thing Ziva knew from the last time she saw Tony, it’s that he would be pleased. That he practically spelled it out for her back then, and that he wanted a future with her and she wanted one with him. (Again, I give you this.)

He wouldn’t be pleased? OF COURSE HE WOULD BE PLEASED.

Shocked? Yes. Confused? Probably. Though on the other hand he would have known exactly how that happened.

“Not pleased”? Not a chance.

It would have been what both of them had searched for.

So, Tony has every right to be angry.

And it saddens me that he thinks that Ziva never knew him at all if she believed that of him, because of any of them Ziva knew him the best, and she would never have thought that of him, but the writers went there, why?

MAN PAIN.

That’s what this all comes down to.

ARGH.

I’m going to end this now because I’m just talking in circles, but to sum up: Tony yes, Orli no.

#13x24 #family first #long post #tiva #too many thoughts and feelings #none of them very happy #THIS MAKES NO FUCKING SENSE #WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYY #WHY ARE THEY KILLING MY FAVORITE CHARACTER AND MY CHARACTER'S CHARACTER?!#CHARACTER ASSASSINATION ALERT #like was this really necessary #they really had to go there #just to give tony a reason to live for #this show sometimes #is a trainwreck

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