#hildorien

[thekingofwinterblog]

The First Sin

So one bit of Tolkien's legendarium that most people miss, because it's only talked about in a rather obscure story, and never actually shown, is the thematic connection between Morgoth and Sauron's respective corruptions of humanity.

Sauron greatest "achievement" when he got to Numenor and corrupted the people there, was to get them to abandon Eru, and build an enormous temple dedicated to worshipping Morgoth, where they sacrificed Human beings in real, pagan sacrificial style.

It was in short, the ultimate defilement of the holy Island, far greater and more devastating to the Numenoreans than anything Morgoth did to Beleriand, for it brought the Numenoreans down to Sauron's level of their own free will.

The funny thing is though, Morgoth did the exact same thing. To such a degree that it's safe to assume that Sauron deliberately modelled his corruption of the Numenoreans in their blessed Island paradise, on the corruption of the Human race in their birthplace of Hildórien(this universe version of/inspiration for the Garden of Eden).

Like Sauron, Morgoth sought out the Human race when they were young, back when they were were still blessed by their inborn gifts of Illuvatar, and possessed a capacity/potential for creation that the King of Nargothrond would later describe as greater than the Valar.

And like Sauron, through lies and displays of power, he tricked the early Humans into abandoning Eru's words and teachings, culminating in them building a great temple to Morgoth in the great holy valley, in which either out of fear or genuine belief, every single human being alive at the time passed through at least once.

This all culminated when Humanity in it's folly, finally crossed a line, and on Morgoth's orders, began to sacrifice their fellow men in that great temple of stone they had used their godgiven powers of creation to make.

What followed was the entire Human race being stripped of that godgiven ability, and a lot of their blessings going with it. The true understanding of the "gift of man" aka natural death, that was humanity's great blessing and doom was broken, and ever after Humanity would need to face it with uncertainty and fear.

And where once the Human race was one, hereafter as Morgoth fled back west, the diminished Humankind splintered into many different parts, becoming the ancestors of all the various tribes and ethnicities that would follow.

Many turned away from Morgoth then, but the damage had been done, just as though the faithful survived the fall of Numenor, the entire Human race was now touched by the Original, first Sin, and all their descendants would be diminshed compared to what that original generation of Humankind had the potential to be.

[lesbiansforboromir]

You know with the amount of times men are compared to melkor, I wouldn't mind an au where melkor storms off and lands on middle earth and is the first valar to encounter men. I think he would have really liked men for their constant development and need to improve and be better than their ancestors 🤔

But Melkor was the first Valar to encounter men! Thats why men have it so fuckin' bad, and why there were men within Morgoth's armies, the first men were absolutely plagued by that awful guy. Morgoth doesn't really care about the ideals of self improvement, he likes to dominate people and believes he has the right to do it, hence the everything that happens.

[ceescedasticity]

FINALLY i have written SOMETHING

skipping ahead a little bit in unforsaken—

Caution rises as they approach the Pass of Gundabad — not that they weren't alert before, but there hadn't been any expectation of threat.

Gimli grumbles about such a holy place being profaned.

Khitwê points out that Pelnûru scholars' best guess at the former location of Kuynennu — Cuiviénen — is in Dead Empire territory, and even the geography isn't there anymore, so really the dwarves are still ahead!

Elladan: "I thought no one knew where Cuiviénen used to be!"

Khitwê: "They don't know for sure, but there were people who knew how to get to Kuynennu from Pelndoru and back, so even after everything got torn up they could get approximately there…"

Of course they couldn't investigate after the White Empire started up.

Maglor: "…So Mount Gundabad is full of orcs—"

(Celegorm: "Not that many orcs—")

Maglor, ignoring the interruption: "—And what's left of Cuiviénen has an entire human empire squatting in it. But does anyone know what happened to Hildorien?"

No. In fact, there is some skepticism on the Hildorien story generally.

Before they can get into that, Zena asks what exactly they're talking about — it turns out no one has told the Hirnedhrim about the various awakenings. So they have to go over that.

The Hirnedhrim are — not skeptical, exactly, but they have questions. There are things you have to be taught, that you can't just conjure out of nowhere. What was the difference in wisdom between these magically-awakening adults and someone who lived alone in a pit their entire life finally getting out? How did the difference get there?

Zena: "And there must have been a difference, because an entire village full of just-retrieved Usazilas would have problems."

Zuste: "I had three bite scars for over a hundred years."

…

What?

[aureentuluva70]

Thinking about @fistfuloflightning's Daeron AU has gotten me thinking about my own Leithian AU where Daeron, while out searching for Luthien after she's escaped from Hildorien, is captured by orcs, taken to Angband and made into one of Morgoth's minstrels, rather than him just getting lost and never showing up in the story again because that's boring.

Eventually Beren and Luthien discover that Daeron is in Angband, and go to rescue him. They manage to free him(and a silmaril of course) after Luthien puts Morgoth and his court into a magical slumber. The three of them escape Angband together and soon return to Doriath.

[dalliansss]

9 and 5 red??

WIP-Centric Ask the Writer! || @skaelds

9) Was there ever a scene or character you ever had to cut?

In Red, oh yes. I had to tone down the non-con scenes, and there were many of them. I had to gloss over them because I wasn't sure how far to write yet, even with the Dead Dove tag.

5) What's your favorite location in the story?

Hildorien, especally the first settlement of the Fathers of Men. I didn't get to elaborate with all the worlding I had in mind, because it would have swallowed the entire chapter 🤣

[arofili]

men of middle-earth ϟ the first men ϟ headcanon disclaimer

          The first Men were Unbegotten as were the elves, and as the Firstborn woke beneath the stars, so did the Secondborn awake with the first rising of the Sun. Even as plants and animals woke from the Sleep of Yavanna, the first Men opened their eyes and wondered at the light above them, rejoicing in their gift of life and the discovery of the world around them.           But before even this awakening there were two Men who knew Arda under the cloak of Darkness, for the elf Nuin of the Hwenti was a curious wanderer who stumbled upon Murmenalda, the Vale of Sleep, where the forms of Mankind awaited the first Sunrise. Nuin wondered greatly at this sight, deep in the mountains of Hildórien in the land of Palisor, and watched over the sleeping figures for long stretches of time.           Eventually Nuin’s curiosity overwhelmed them, and when they stumbled against one of the Sleepers, causing the Man to stir, they could wait no longer. Nuin woke two Sleepers, a man and a woman, and though they had yet no speech and no understanding, they saw Nuin as a friend from the beginning. Nuin gave them the names Ermon and Elmir and taught them a little of the speech of the Hwenti, and it was not long before the Sun rose at last and the other Men awoke around the first two.           Nuin remained in dear friendship with the first Men, especially Ermon and Elmir, and though they were eventually slain by the treachery of the Úmaia Túvon, the Men of the East held them in legend forever after, and the Edain remembered the kindness of Nuin when they first encountered the Eldar in Beleriand.

[hildorien]

My ideal silm show would have the sun rising, elves being prissy about it, and then the camera moves from focusing on Valinor to rolling over the seas, past the Noldor, into hildorien where as the sun rises humans come out the dark woods, and then....

A taliska translated version of “Immigrant Song” plays loudly as the credits roll.

[alicebeckstrom]

But it was said afterwards among the Eldar that when Men awoke in Hildórien at the rising of the Sun the spies of Morgoth were watchful, and tidings were soon brought to him; ~ The Silmarillion, Chapter 17 (The Journey of Morwen and Níenor to Nargothrond by Alan Lee) 

[light-miracles]

Alright tell me if I’m crazy or not. First off, it should go without saying that regardless of how I feel about RoP I do not in any way condone racism or bullying of the actors. But I pretty much live on the “anti rings of power” tag and I … haven’t seen any racism? All I’ve seen are fans (and Amazon) talking about how racist antis are. I know Reddit and other places are probably worse but here on Tumblr? I haven’t seen it. Thoughts?

I joined the fandom in February. Started reading the books and then PJ's movies. Following fans and YouTubers who knew about the lore more than me. All of them said the same thing.

"When the show airs, and Tolkien's fans don't watch it because they don't like it, and new generations don't watch it because they don't know/like Tolkien, they'll scream Racism because they'll realize they don't have any target audience. People unfamiliar with Tolkien won't understand it so they won't watch. Tolkien's fandom won't like it so they won't watch. They're making a show for nobody. And they'll blame racism as a marketing strategy because what else can they do? Admitting they made a mistake?"

Hildorien said this in February. And it's exactly what I'm seeing.

[tolkien-feels]

Huh. By transitive property, I guess @hildorien and I are saying Arafinweans are cat people and Nolofinweans are dog people, and somehow this feels right

[umarthiels]

thinks about how menelmacar was set in the skies long before hildorien. thinks about how when the elves awoke they loved the stars. thinks about a sword of starmetal. thinks about a fated swordsman. thinks about fate. 

[lesbiansforboromir]

I have a question for a fanfic I am writing. What would be the native language of the Southlanders like Bronwyn and Theo? Would it be something related to a Southron language, or would it be a dialect of Adûnaic, or something else entirely?? I tried to do some research about it, but I could not find much. Thanks!!

OKAY SO well this is essentially your initial issue; Southlanders as the concept given in RoP do not have a particular basis in canon, in so far as there is no mention of elves taking the surviving servants of Morgoth and putting them all somewhere to live together under elven watch.

And it's a tricky thing to puzzle out, because the men who fell under Morgoth's control were all from different cultures themselves. And they came under his sway by different origins. Many were yoked by Morgoth even at the very earliest point of their awakening, the First Age was only about 700 years long and men awoke at the very beginning of it so they were incredibly new to the world and vulnerable, having cultures defined down borders of 'where they awoke' rather than a rich history.

But if you wanted to try and simplify it, you could say the men under Morgoth's control were in two camps; those that fell in 'Hildorien' (place to the far east and south where Men first awoke, not on any maps) and those that fell after journeying west to Beleriand in an attempt to escape Morgoth.

Those in Hildorien were probably from a vast number of different cultures, but they are all likely broadly lumped together under the title of 'Haradrim' or Southrons. Those in Beleriand were also probably individuals from many of the different Houses of men there, captured or afraid and accepting service in exchange for their lives. But the largest defined group to betray the elves and serve Morgoth were the House of Ulfang (not even actually his true name, rather a pejorative term given by Sindar elves, literally the names of him and all his sons just mean ugly something in Sindarin and we dont know their real names I hate elves) and they were essentially proto-easterlings.

Canonically speaking, the remnants of Ulfang's house fled into Eriador and beyond and eventually developed and merged into a variety of other people groups, but if we're going with show-canon where all these disparate peoples were gathered together and essentially forced to make a new community then the initial languages would be;

Whatever Ulfang's people spoke

However many languages the Haradrim brought with them

Just a lil smattering of Taliska

A flavour of the Haladin's language, MAYBE bringing with them some Drug (language of the druedain)

In short, it's a mess. To be honest, I suspect rather than let them sort it out themselves, the elves somewhat forcibly taught them Sindarin (this actually might also be the language many of the Beleriand-originating men had in common considering we know some of them learned it to converse with elves and the Edain). Especially since we see Arondir speaking the same 'English' language with the Southlanders as he does with his Captain and elven friends.

However, Bronwyn mentions interacting with Traders. But... fuckin... aaaa this relies so heavily on whether or not Pelargir is an abandoned ruin in show canon or if it's still populated by a Numenorean/Mountaineers mix but if they are trading with mannish settlements and Adunaic is a spoken current language in Pelargir, Umbar and other coastal numenorean holdouts, then Proto-Westron is already likely somewhat popular. Though that depends entirely upon which direction these Traders are coming from. It's likely that Bronwyn knows several languages in order to interact with different traders coming from all cardinal directions.

Essentially I suspect the southlanders are speaking a dialect of Sindarin, as expressed by them all having these thick british-northern accents but still being understood and understanding Arondir's more received pronunciation version. And then perhaps each settlement has preserved to varying degrees their own specific language of origin, depending on where they come from.

[ataniweek]

Atani Week: January 6-12, 2021

This is a week-long event celebrating the Atani, or better known as the Race Of Men. This is a week designed to help show case some of the lesser known men and give them a time to shine, though of course some fan favorites I’m sure will be included (and should be!). This week is to prove without a doubt that the phrase second is best, without saying first is the worst. 

Any content and creations are welcome as long! You can create edits, gifs, fanart, fanfic, fanmixes, and more! To participate, create your fanwork and post it in the #ataniweek or please just at the @ataniweek blog!

Below are some prompts for each day of the week. They are not mandatory.

DAY ONE: Men and Arda/Men and Eru/Men and the Dark Lords DAY TWO: Three Houses of the Edain. DAY THREE: Numenor.   DAY FOUR: Numenor’s descendants (Gondor, Arnor, and Umbar) DAY FIVE: Northmen (Rohan, Dale, and Laketown) and Hobbits DAY SIX: Easterlings and Haradrim and Dunlendings DAY SEVEN: Free Day

This event is being run, solo by @hildorien​. If you have any questions or suggestions, feel free to message this blog or there. Also a rules list is here.

Thank you!

[comparativelysuperlative]

Kind of amazing how little the Elves know about the human origin story.

—Appeared in Hildorien. That’s off in the east somewhere, and do they even know where? It literally just means “the land of the humans.” —There are conflicting accounts of whether there was an idyllic joy-in-the-springtime-of-the-undiscovered-world period or if Morgoth messed with them right off the bat. Both versions are nicely labeled as speculation and BOTH OF THEM MAKE IT INTO THE SILMARILLION. —Possibly one Elf stumbled on the sleeping humans and woke them up by accident? That’s kind of inconsistent with both. Guess I’ll just assume it happened but Nuin had shockingly little effect on human history/development after. —Beor’s people turn up in Beleriand, and 100% of them are “shadowed” with a “darkness.” They tell the Elves it’s backstory stuff and they don’t want to talk about it. —Elves conclude it was “doubtless” Morgoth unsuccessfully trying to turn them against the Elves. Sure. Doubtless it’s really all about us, the narrators. (That does make sense, but it’s not the only thing that would make sense, and honestly if first contact was with Morgoth and this was his play then I don’t see how he could have screwed it up.) —Elves do think Morgoth was there personally for an extended period doing something.  —Humans, including different human populations, say they used to be immortal and lifespans gradually shrank; they blame Morgoth. They hide this belief for ~100 years until Andreth tells Finrod. (Hiding it makes sense because, well, “we are all of us touched by the hand of your hated enemy, nbd,” while they know about orcs, but it turns out it’s safe. Finrod just says that didn’t happen.) Even then, the details are something they still don’t want to talk about.

...honestly it’s kind of looking like Morgoth did cause mortality?

Finrod thinks only Eru can do that. Okay. But some people headcanon that Morgoth genetically engineered orcs to be in constant pain just because, and I don’t know if that’s true but hopefully we all agree it’s the kind of thing he could do? Because if so, he could just make it get worse until the spirit can’t handle being in such a damaged body. That’s all dying means, for Elves. Voila, there’s an immortal species made apparently mortal, without messing with any Eru-only soul stuff. (Bonus: this resolves some canon confusion by allowing different orc lineages to have long/short/infinite life spans.)

It’d be even easier to do to that to humans, since humans depend on little things like “having organs work right.” Skip the chronic pain and just mess with them enough that you can be sure something will break eventually and you’re good. I think it’s safe-ish to say Finrod’s wrong and Morgoth could pull off something that looked like making immortal humans mortal, if he got the chance and wanted to.

The Valar aren’t great communicators, but they’re pretty unambiguous that Death Was A Gift. Could they just all have misunderstood what Eru told them about the Gift of Men? Maybe? They’ve gotten confused on other stuff, and the connection between free will and eventually leaving Arda always seemed kind of tenuous. I kind of wish I could say the Valar are wrong, but really there’s not enough evidence either way. 

It basically comes down to who do you trust more, human oral tradition across generations that even they don’t remember very clearly, or the Valar who were told directly by Eru and restate it very confidently. It’s a toss-up.

[clayvedevs]

Finwe and Feanor

(inspired by a post I found on @hildorien​‘s blog)

[absynthe--minded]

imagine that you’ve been tasked with soundtracking the Silmarillion, only you can’t commission a composer, you can’t use any existing Tolkien-themed music, and you can’t use more than a couple of individual songs from other unrelated movies. all you’ve got is infinite song licensing.

how would you score this story?

.png template here, and don’t forget to post links to your playlists!

gonna tag @arofili, @vanjalism, @thefifthbattle, @princess-faelivrin, and @hildorien to start; my own is in progress