#he hates how jc hurts wwx

[add1ctedt0you]

I am craving for a zcx' modern au, where, after years apart, jc, wwx and lwj encounter again. lwj and wwx are married and after some time, jc starts to hang out with lwj, but only with him (they are kind of exs... Or at least so lwj thinks!)

[labyrynth]

man jc antis really are something else

like imagine a 16yo telling you “my dad doesn’t like me” and your response for some reason is “well maybe he’d like you if you weren’t such an awful person”

[littlemushroomwreath]

Lan Wangji is a Gryffindor, and I stand by that

[runespoor7]

@demoiselledefortune's tags

hm hm.

This isn't really new or anything but the more I reread random passages the more convinced I am that there's something very unique about the way Jiang Cheng reacts to Wen Ning and it's just so interesting!

I'm convinced it's more than just being angry. It's more than just hating him, or blaming him for Jin Zixuan's death or his sister's life. It's more than being a Wen, and it comes long before so many of those tragedies unfold anyway.

There's a sort of urgent, visceral reaction to Wen Ning's presence that just has this different feeling to it than how he reacts to any of the other characters. Even characters he has strong emotional responses to, it's never with the same panic or recklessness. It's not the same as the whole "vengeful wrath, fathomless hatred, or raving ecstasy" situation he's got going on with Wei Wuxian (sexy as that might be).

When it's Wei Wuxian, it's all "...well, well. So you're back?" and "Haven't you got anything to say to me?" Even when he's not being very nice, even when he's throwing teacups and furious at Wei Wuxian, there's still an edge of calmness in the way he lashes out. He's fucking mad but he's had more than a decade to think about this and he's got things to say and he's trying so hard to get a reaction from Wei Wuxian that he just won't give him.

But he can't tolerate having Wen Ning anywhere near him. Much of the time he instantly lashes out, physically, in ways to create space between them. He's mean to Wen Ning, but he doesn't really have much to say to him; he just wants to get away from him.

It really stuck out to me how instinctive and instantaneous and emotional that reaction is when I was reading this passage from chapter 81 (ExR translation since I've got it on hand in digital text form), when Jin Ling returns Zidian and rushes back into the fray during the Second Siege:

When Jiang Cheng was unaware, he stuffed Zidian's ring back into his hand and sprinted toward the crowd, all the way up to the most dangerous area before the mouth of the cave. Jiang Cheng was about to chase after him when he managed to slice a few corpses, staggering. He felt that Sandu was no lighter than hundreds of pounds. Two female corpses threw themselves at him from both directions.

Jiang Cheng cursed. As he lifted his sword again, another pair of hands tore the two corpses into pieces, "Sect Leader..."

Jiang Cheng lost his temper as soon as he heard the voice. He kicked Wen Ning away and cursed, "Get the fuck away from me!"

Obviously that is not very nice and poor Wen Ning didn't deserve a kick for being legitimately helpful there, but the point is that not only does he lash out - the reaction happens even when he's clearly got higher priorities going on in a chaotic situation. Throughout that entire event he reacts in a somewhat more even-keeled way to almost everything except Wen Ning being in his vicinity.

And it's not just after Wen Ning's death, not just after he became Wei Wuxian's greatest weapon, not just after he was forced to kill Jin Zixuan - it's specifically a pattern established from the moment he woke up in the Supervisory Office without a core:

Before he could say anything, those sun robes reflected against Jiang Cheng's eyes. His pupils suddenly shrunk.

Jiang Cheng kicked Wen Ning, toppling over the bowl of medicine. The black liquid all spilled onto Wen Ning. Wei WuXian wanted to take the bowl of medicine. He pulled up Wen Ning as well, who had been shocked speechless. Jiang Cheng roared at him, "What's wrong with you?!"

At this point he doesn't even know how he was rescued, since he was unconscious for all of that, and thinks they're in a Wen trap and likely going to die (or worse). But there's so many echoes of that interaction again, and again, and again between them.

And combined with Wen Ning's remarks during the scene just before this, where he tells Wei Wuxian about the discipline whip injuries and how Jiang Cheng 'should have other injuries as well', the way the narrative is so deliberately ambiguous on what exactly occurred, it all makes me want to crawl up the walls and gnaw on the light fixtures wailing WHAT DID YOU SEE, WEN NING?! WHAT DID YOU SEE?

At a minimum, Jiang Cheng knows that Wen Ning was there at Lotus Pier prior to his capture by the Wen guards, because they'd both seen Wen Ning examining Jiang corpses on the training field before they fled for Meishan.

But everything after that is only implication and subtext and suppositions and speculation, not directly stated in the text. But based on his reaction, you can pry my headcanon from my cold dead hands that that Wen Ning probably witnessed all or much of what happened to Jiang Cheng after he was captured, and Jiang Cheng knows it.

I've also posted before how I think there's an at least nonzero chance that Jiang Cheng was never directly told that Wen Ning wasn't actually there with Wen Chao when they saw him early on, but came later to try to help (because when Wen Ning gives Wei Wuxian that information Jiang Cheng isn't conscious, and nobody tells Jiang Cheng anything. I don't think that headcanon changes much either way, but there is a slight difference, at least emotionally, between 'I helped you while I was there to slaughter your clan and destroy your life' and 'I came when I heard my crazy cousin was slaughtering your clan and tried to help you' and I think it's a juicy thing to add to the pile of misunderstandings they each have of the other's motivations and actions).

Which, if I go with these two ideas together, really drives home what a bespoke and specific nightmare the way the Golden Core reveal played out - not only the substance of the reveal, but the fact it was Wen Ning who revealed it.

He was already furious that they were even there at Lotus Pier, particularly Wen Ning. But the way it all happens it feels like it's not just echoes of the amplified emotions of the confrontation with Lan Wangji & Wei Wuxian in the Ancestral Hall, it's not just Wen Ning being a Wen, or even Jin Zixuan's death, the way the narration calls out. It feels like there are deeper layers to it.

I also feel a bit stupid for not noticing before this probably extremely obvious to literally everyone else who isn't a dumbass like me parallel of Wen Ning getting a gruesome scorching whip mark across his chest at Lotus Pier in the course of saving Wei Wuxian (more or less, sort of - we know as readers Jiang Cheng was intentionally trying not to hurt them with Zidian, but I don't think Wen Ning knew that when he jumped in).

Jiang Cheng looked to find that the uninvited guest was Wen Ning. Immediately, he raged, "Who let you inside Lotus Pier?! How dare you!"

He could manage to tolerate others, but definitely not Wen Ning, the Wen-dog who put his hand through Jin ZiXuan's heart and ended both his sister's happiness and her life. Just a look, and he felt the urge to kill him right there. How dare he step foot on the earth of Lotus Pier—he really was looking for his death!

Because of the two lives and many other reasons, Wen Ning had always felt guilty, and so he'd always been somewhat scared of Jiang Cheng, consciously avoiding him all the time. Right now, however, he blocked Wei WuXian and Lan WangJi as he faced him, taking the hard lash. A gruesome scorch climbed across his chest, but still he didn't flinch.

I don't know that it actually means anything but it's making me FEEL THINGS incoherently at this specific moment, so. Also I find it legitimately sad that Wen Ning has to live with guilt over things that happened when he was controlled by someone else, though the scene before the Ancestral Hall when Jin Ling starts crying on the boat is probably a better example of that. Anyway.

It's just there's so, so many layers to how uniquely horrible it is for Jiang Cheng that he not only finds out about the Golden Core transfer this way, but also that Wen Ning, specifically, directly witnessed this life-shatteringly huge deception and sacrifice too - while Jiang Cheng was unconscious, no less.

And, well, we know how everything got capped off in that scene...

Obviously the shock of the information was going to get a huge reaction no matter what, no matter who or how he found out. Even without the Wen Ning element, it already hits every one of his deepest weaknesses and insecurities and fears.

But to come from the guy who'd witnessed his family being slaughtered, who'd witnessed who-knows-what humiliations heaped on him (who also happens to be the same fucking guy that Wei Wuxian thought it was worth leaving Yunmeng Jiang for, breaking his promise for...), the guy he blames for his sister's tragic fate (whether that blame is misplaced or not), the guy he exhibits a panic response towards even decades later, and goddamn.

There are just so many layers to this perfect little nightmare reveal on so many different levels aren't there?

There's just SO much meaty stuff for these two to dig into post-canon and all we get is an extra with a 'oh yeah sometimes Jiang Cheng yells on night hunts and Wen Ning is there' about it?!

I should probably just shut up and go read some Jiang Cheng and Wen Ning focused fics or something (whether romantic or platonic that's probably an area I really haven't explored enough vs. the amount of sheer interesting hints and material the novel gives to work with! If by some miracle anyone made it to the end of this beast feel free to drop any recs that explore them, especially that 'what did Wen Ning see?!' aspect of the whole situation because that is the current little brain worm haunting me right now).

[llycaons]

I really do ike jc as a character and I like seeing him in fic but if the author is convinced he can do no wrong and all of his cruelty and aggression are just ~ tough love~ and he’s deep down only a loving brother and uncle who always has the best judgement and who’s entirely justified in everything he does I can’t do it you gotta reckon with the kind of person he is you just have to

[lgbtlunaverse]

Fandom is so nice to Jiang Cheng's inferiority complex because in reality every single thing he gets accused of is something Wei Wuxian is better at than him.

Jiang Cheng killed Wei Wuxian? Nope. Didn't even get close. Wei Wuxian's own spirits tore him apart before jc could even get there. wwx:1 jc:0

Jiang Cheng tortures people? We get two and a half rumours and a mention from jin ling that jc has 'captured' demonic cultivators before, but who is also apparently confident that just letting wwx run off will kill the issue even though those earlier rumours said ~no one who sandu shengshou captured was ever seen again~

The word jiang cheng uses when he tries to talk big game about 'beating the truth' out of Wei Wuxian's is a word that carries the context of pestering someone to do their homework. Doesn't exactly strike fear into my heart.

Wei Wuxian? Excellent at torture. A prodigy. Did you fucking see what he did to Wen Chao? Dude didn't have fingers anymore because wei wuxian made him eat them. He ripped out his hair, burned his skin off, and then stalked him for several days just to prolong the pain. He forced Wang Lingjiao to bite Wen Chao's dick off and then made her shove a stool leg down her own throat! 10/10, no notes. Absolutely horrifying.

Meanwhile Jiang Cheng's idea of torture is getting a dog to bark at Wei Wuxian for a few seconds. Weak, unoriginal, I bet fairy was literally wagging her tail the whole time. 2-0

Jiang Cheng made the entire cultivation world believe Wei Wuxian was up to no good on the burial mounds and ultimately orchestrated his downfall? lol. lmao, even

It's a big thing in certain corners of the fandom to really zoom in one one particular phrase at the end of chapter 73, where after wwx and jc have their staged duel to make the world believe they hate each other jiang cheng tells everyone wwx has defected and become "a public enemy'' or "an enemy to the cultivation world" or whatever the translation you're familiar with decided upon.

(As an aside, something I really like about this line is that the last half of it is almost exactly the same, like verbatim, as what wwx told him to say. like, the chapter is really hammering home just how much jc is speaking from a script here. wwx tells jc to say "今后魏无羡无论做出什么事，都与云梦江氏无关." and jc says "今后无论此人有何动作，一概与云梦江氏无关" the only meaningful difference is that he says 'this person' instead of wwx's name)

I've seen it said that this bit, the use of 'enemy' was said without wei wuxian's approval, that jc deviated from the script just to hurt his ex-shixiong for leaving him. And that this is what caused all the other clans to turn against wei wuxian. Regardless of if this is what jc and wwx discussed, or if jc had malicious motivations for it (considering my conclusions above, you can guess where i fall) it doesn't really matter, because the novel tells us when the clans completely freak out and become convinced wei wuxian is out to get them (though of course they've been wringing their hands about it since the literal day wwx ran off with the wen, months before jiang cheng visited) very neatly in chapter 75!

It's when they find out about Wen Ning.

And how do they find out about Wen Ning?

Because Wei Wuxian took him on nighthunts! And they kicked ass!

...Wei Wuxian, my man, why are you on nighthunts??? Why are you showing off your incredibly cool sentient fierce corpse buddy, who is way better and stronger than all the other fierce corpses, in front of the whole cultivation world??

Whatever his motivations (extra money, maybe?? they were strapped for crash) I can only draw the conclusion wwx had already given up on appearing calm or non-threatening and didn't care if the clans thought he was a threat, because they'd believe whatever they wanted anyway. Which he seems to clearly be aware of the whole time.

Regardless, we know that this is what created the myth of the Yiling patriarch. It's literally when the title first shows up!

Even if you really believe jc was secretly plotting against wwx in chapter 73, he's clearly doing a shit job of it because nothing he said made anywhere near as big an impact as this. Flopped!

The other point people use to argue Jiang Cheng caused wei wuxian's downfall is Jin Guangyao's speech in Guanyin temple about how jiang cheng could have saved wei wuxian if only he stood by him. Setting aside that jin guangyao is trying to get into jiang cheng's head here, and isn't necessarily saying what he really believes (though it very well might be! who knows with a character like jgy. assuming he's always lying is just as misleading as assuming he's always saying the truth) the fact is, if you read the speech closely, what he's talking about is not the 'public enemy' line, he's talking about the bond between them. The fact that people wanted wei wuxian out of yunmeng jiang, because the two were too powerful together.

He's talking about that one time Jiang Cheng very publically kicked wei wuxian out of the sect!

Which, unbeknownst to Jin Guangyao, was in fact Wei Wuxian's idea the whole time.

final score: 3 for you wei wuxian, you go wei wuxian! And nothing for Jiang Cheng bye.

[wangxianficfinder]

I'm in the mood for...

Aug 21st

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1. hii! ITMF fics where the cultivation world finds out the truth about the Wen remnants in burial mounds either through a memory viewing/array spying thing at a discussion conference or someone personally visiting the burial mounds and sees the truth for themselves. Some of the fics I've enjoyed that has this: A Step in the Wrong Direction by pupeez4eva, Revealing Truth by DreamNightmare, The Path by Seastar98, Green-gege Saves a lot of Lives by Eternal_writes, Righteous at a Cost by thunderwear

Teen Project to Change the World by animeloverhomura (Not Rated, WIP, 841k, WangXian, JYL/JZX, Watching the Show, With a bit of the Manhua and Book thrown in, BAMF WWX, Fix-It, JGS is his own warning, Attractive WWX, Homophobia, disturbing imagery)

Misunderstood by Silver_Flame_2724 (M, 250k, WIP, WangXian, Alcohol Abuse/Alcoholism, Heavy Angst, Suicidal Thoughts, Canon-Typical Violence, Self-Worth Issues)

Discordant Rhapsody by nirejseki (T, 49k, LQR & WWX, wangxian, JC & WWX, WQ & WWX & WN, LWJ & LQR & LXC, canon divergence, fix-it, hurt/comfort, trauma, politics, protective LQR, protective LWJ, protective WWX, LQR centric, whump, angst)

Grave dirt by esama (T, 92k, WangXian, canon divergence, yiling wei sect au, demonic cultivation, farming, found family, pre-slash, politics, fix-it of sorts)

while covered in mud by merthurlin (T, 12k, NHS & WWX, NHS & NMJ, NHS & Wen remnants, mentioned wangxian, canon divergence, fix-it, NHS goes farming and Hates It)

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2. Hi! I could have sworn there were reaction fics where both the older wangxian and younger wangxian were there but I can't find any right now, could you help me?

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3. Hi!!!!! Itmf request for any fics where LWJ is uber powerful and pampers the hell out of WWX but the focus isn't on smut? I don't mind sex being included,I just don't want it to be 90% of the fic or the driving plot point! Thank you!!! <3

我的皇后是農民 | sowing seeds in the cold palace by sweetlolixo (E, 84k, WangXian, Imperial Palace, Emperor LWJ, Imperial Consort WWX, Farmer WWX, Angst, Romance, Wingman LJY, Wife-chasing-LWJ, Arranged Marriage, Best Boy A-Yuan)

願陛下 | by his majesty's decree by sweetlolixo (E, 40k, WangXian, Imperial Palace, Emperor LWJ, Concubine WWX, Harems, Pining LWJ, LWJ is not a dragon in this one but he descended from them :), Childhood Sweethearts (sort of), Romance, minimal angst, Happy Ending, NHS & WWX are concubine BFFs, LWJ has NO EYES for anyone besides WWX don’t worry the harem is only for the plot setting, Fantasy, Pregnant WWX, Possessive LWJ, Fluff)

To Deliver an Heir by cerbykerby (E, 49k, WangXian, slight dubcon/noncon but wangxian are into it, A/B/O, Alpha LWJ, Omega WWX, Heat Sex, Knotting, Royalty Medical, Emperor LWJ, Physician WWX, Mpreg, Postpartum Depression, Breeding, Creampie, LWJ literally cannot stop himself from coming in WWX, Breastfeeding)

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4. Any good outside pov fics? ITMF any fic where a character sees wangxian's bond or is surprised at how much wwx can get away with irt the rules with lwj. Just... Idrc about the plot, I just wanna see some reactions to wangxian lol! Preferably not a modern or no cultivation au tho, I love the canon universe too much!!

pitfalls of greed by glitteringmoonlight (T, 3k, WangXian, POV Outsider, BAMF WWX, Kidnapping, Violence, YLLZ WWX, not exactly but the vibes are there, Post-Canon)

The following are time travel fics but involve outsiders being astonished by Wei Wuxian & Lan Wangji's behavior towards each other

trouble with time by cloudpd (T, 5k, WangXian, Time Travel, Cloud Recesses Study Arc, POV Outsider, Humor, POV JC, he's so fed up with wangxian, rightfully so, wangxian are shameless, kind of crack, JC's inner dialogue for this whole fic is just: what the fuck, POV LXC, because LXC deserves to be subjected to gross wangxian as well!!, the third chapter is LJY going "WWX rights!!", and that's all im going to say about that, horny wangxian time travel: the thrilling conclusion)

Wait, What? by MarbleGlove (G, 1k, WangXian, Time Travel, POV Outsider)

the world is but a stage for the two of us by MandMandM (Not Rated, 10k, WIP, WangXian, Time Travel, Established Relationship, Shameless WangXian)

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5. Hello, can i get wangxian fic recs where meng yao is a good guy and close friends with wei wuxian? canonverse, modern day, etc doesn't matter. I'd also love wangxian recs where they adopt jingyi please <3

Meng Yao becomes more like a brother to Wei Ying than a close friend so I hope these are okay:

what builds a home by Stratisphyre (T, 45k, WangXian, MY & WWX, Canon Divergence, Adopted WWX, POV Multiple, warning for JGS behaving exactly as expected, child endangerment, Brother Feels, Minor Character Death, [Podfic] Cold read of "what builds a home" by Stratisphyre by KeriArentikaiPods (KeriArentikai))

and

Debts of a Child Part 2 by Hauntcats (M, 111k, WangXian, YZY Bashing, Not Jiang Family Friendly, Angst and Feels, lots of anger, JC Bashing, not Jiang friendly, Angst with a Happy Ending, Content warning for icky spiders in later chapters., hurt no comfort for Jiang siblings.) (link in 8C)

Meng Yao vs. the Board of the Homeowner's Association Series by Ariaste (M/T, 119k, WIP, XiYao, WangXian, Modern AU, Established Relationship, xiyao and wangxian are both already married, Family Feels, Domestic Fluff, Family Bonding, Slice of Life, Discussions of Past Trauma, wwx's canonical kinks, HOAverse)

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6. Hello! I finished reading Digging Graves by nirejseki so i am itmf any fics where someone asks/begs wei wuxian to bring someone back to life/turn someone they loved who died into a fierce corpse. Thanks :D

some good mistakes by Lise (T, 18k, WangXian, JC & WWX, Post-Canon, Road trips, rescue Missions, Hurt/Comfort, Awkward Conversations, Yunmeng Bros Reconciliation, [Podfic] some good mistakes by kisahawklin)

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7. Hi! for the next itmf, i was wondering if there are any fics where wei wuxian gets his core back after giving it to jiang cheng? not him cultivating a new core but getting his original core back

i just find that idea fascinating. thank you for your help always!!

A Child’s Wish by Hauntcats (Not rated, 13k, wangxian, WWX & Wen remnants, Celestial meddling, Not JC Friendly, Fix-It, Canon Divergence, Angst with a Happy Ending, Everyone gets what they deserve, Age Regression/De-Aging, Child LWJ)

💖 Return to Sender by Thesaurus_with_no_words (M, 73k, WIP, WangXian, Canon Divergence, BAMF WWX , WangXian Get a Happy Ending, YLLZ WWX, Golden Core Transfer Fix-It, Not Everyone Dies, canon JC characteristics, Temporary Amnesia, Partial Memory Loss, Literal Emotional Manipulation, Unreliable Narrator, Unreliable Narrator WWX, they are all unreliable ok, Burial Mounds Settlement Days, Canon-Typical Violence, Canon typical horror and gore, Slow Burn)

The Core Issue by Hauntcats (T, 21k, WangXian, Angst with a Happy Ending, Not JC Friendly, Canon Divergence)

Can’t Tell Me Nothin by natacup82 (T, 35k, wangxian, Canon Divergence, Everybody Lives, Family Feels, Communication, BAMF Women)

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8. Hello! itmf these three types of fics:

A) canonverse, Madam Lan lives, wangxian (i didnt know madam lan lives was a tag now I need to see how her existence in canon can change the storyline and wangxian as a whole)

B) Yiling Wei Sect fics (could be wangxian or other wei wuxian M/M ships)

C) Fics where Wei Wuxian takes disciples (whether as Yiling Wei sect Yiling Patriarch or any other reason... preferably xue yang or mo xuanyo)

8A)

💖 An Unexpected Visitor by Hauntcats (G, 8k, QHJ/Madam Lan, wangxian, fix-it of sorts, not Jiang friendly, not jin friendly, happy ending)

Every Mother's Son by Chrononautical (T, 11k, WangXian, Madam Lán Lives, Madam Lán Deserves Better, Madam Lán Leaves Cloud Recesses, Madam Lan rescues women from abusive husbands in feudal Japan and honestly that's so valid of her, mentions of rape/non-con between Madam Lan & Qingheng-Jun)

no step had trodden black by Stratisphyre (T, 32k, wangxian, LQR & WWX, JYL/JZX, canon divergence, madam lan lives, past rape, golden core reveal, hurt/Comfort, referenced to attempted suicide & suicidal thoughts, canon-typical violence)

8B)

🔒 a star called sun by thelastdboy (E, 120k, wangxian, SL/XXC, JC & JYL & WWX, JYL & LWJ, WWX & WN & WQ, JYL/JZX, Canon Divergence after Xuanwu Cave, Fall of Lotus Pier, But worse!, Power Imbalance, It Gets Worse Before It Gets Better, Not Everyone Dies AU, Implied/Referenced Child Abuse, Canon-Typical Violence, Sunshot Campaign, Miscommunication, Heavy Angst with a Happy Ending, Slow Burn, Major Character Injury, Loss of Limbs, Chronic Illness, Seizures, WWX’s Three Months in the Burial Mounds, Wēn Remnants Live, Wēn Remnants Deserve Better, WWX Creates a Sect | Yílíng Wèi Sect, Additional Warnings In Author’s Note, Hurt/Comfort, Selectively Mute LWJ, Service Animals, Crows)

body and soul by TooSel (E, 41k, wangxian, Canon Divergence, Fix-It, Marriage Proposal, Everyone Lives AU, Cultivation Sect Politics, Yílíng Wèi Sect AU, Adoption, Smut, Friends to Lovers, Angst with a Happy Ending)

Grave dirt by esama (T, 92k, WangXian, canon divergence, yiling wei sect au, demonic cultivation, farming, found family, pre-slash, politics, fix-it of sorts)

💖🔒 love, in fire and blood by cicer (E, 360k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, YLLZ WWX, Arranged Marriage, political scheming, Gratuitous Domesticity, Mutual Pining, EXTREME SLOWBURN, the inherent eroticism of the forehead ribbon, The Mortifying Ordeal of Being Known, neither wwx nor lwj want to be Perceived, but sorry kids! it’s gonna happen!, rated E but the the NSFW stuff doesn’t begin until chapter 19!, bottom LWJ in chapter 20 and 27, Mojo’s post)

Run Off The World by Sapphire_Roses (M, 302k, wangxian, JYL/JZX, SL/XXC, WIP, Not Everyone Dies AU, Canon Divergence, Wen Remnants Live, Flashbacks, YLLZ WWX, WWX Creates a Sect | Yiling Wei Sect, Sect Leader WWX, Married WangXian, OCs, POV Outsider, Morally Grey Characters, (Do Take That Tag Seriously), Angst, Hurt/Comfort, Family Feels, Developing Friendships, Fluff, Attempt at Humor, Yunmeng Siblings Feels, Gusu Siblings Feels, Sibling Bonding, Pining, Character Study, Tenderness, Mild Smut, POV Alternating, It Gets Worse Before It Gets Better, Minor Character Death) link in #8C

the sea meets the moon-blanched land by rkivees (G, 44k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, YLLZ WWX, Canon-Typical Violence, Developing Relationship, Childhood Trauma, Sect Leader WWX, BAMF WWX, BAMF LWJ, BAMF WQ, Good Parent LQR, First Love, Love Confessions, minor jiang sibs appearance, Mentioned LXC, Past Child Abuse, Drunken Shenanigans, Past Violence, No Golden Core Transfer, Non-Linear Narrative)

8C)

Debts of a Child Part 2 by Hauntcats (M, 111k, WangXian, YZY Bashing, Not Jiang Family Friendly, Angst and Feels, lots of anger, JC Bashing, not Jiang friendly, Angst with a Happy Ending, Content warning for icky spiders in later chapters., hurt no comfort for Jiang siblings.)

Run Off The World by Sapphire_Roses (M, 302k, wangxian, JYL/JZX, SL/XXC, WIP, Not Everyone Dies AU, Canon Divergence, Wen Remnants Live, Flashbacks, YLLZ WWX, WWX Creates a Sect | Yiling Wei Sect, Sect Leader WWX, Married WangXian, OCs, POV Outsider, Morally Grey Characters, (Do Take That Tag Seriously), Angst, Hurt/Comfort, Family Feels, Developing Friendships, Fluff, Attempt at Humor, Yunmeng Siblings Feels, Gusu Siblings Feels, Sibling Bonding, Pining, Character Study, Tenderness, Mild Smut, POV Alternating, It Gets Worse Before It Gets Better, Minor Character Death)

🔒necromancy is a valid career path! Series by coslyons, Skadiseven (T, 41k, WangXian, XY & WWX & WN & WQ, Modern with Magic AU, Seattle, Necromancy, Found Family, Food as a Metaphor for Love, Gardens & Gardening, Mathematics, Running, Growing up)

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9. Heyo, this is for ITMF!

Can you rec any fics that have WWX return to his old body? Can be post-canon or during canon after his resurrection. I wanna see how people react to him being in his Glorious Beautiful Sexy self :>

Transcend by covalentbonds (not rated, 7k, WIP, WangXian, Post-Canon, Fluff and Humor, Smut, YLLZ WWX is prettiest fight me) features Wei Ying transforming into his original body and being lusted after.

Tripped at Every Step by brooklinegirl (E, 28k, WangXian) These

the hidden source is the watchful heart by o_honeybees (E, 10k, WangXian, Post-Canon, Getting Together, Domesticity, Touch-Starved, Grief/Mourning, Misunderstandings, Non-Sexual Intimacy, Unresolved Sexual Tension,Eventual Smut, reflections on selfishness and selflessness) fics

This House of Ill Repute by Jo Lasalle (Jo_Lasalle) (M, 13k, WangXian, First Time, Post-Canon, Getting Together) also have Wei Ying in his original body but it's not the focus of the story

Saw My Life in a Stranger's Face by timetoboldlygo (T, 27k, WangXian, Post-Canon, Established Relationship, Married Life, Domestic Fluff, Light Angst, wwx's face changes post-canon to look like his original face, Slight Panic Attack, because lwj doesn't recognize his husband, the mortifying ordeal of not knowing your own body, the terrifying inevitability of change, taller!wwx theory)

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10. hello! thank you for the work you do.. do you have recs for novel canon only (no cql) fics?

~*~

11. hello this is for itmf! do you have any fics where sizhui remembers wei wuxian after the fever/doesn't lose his early memories, or lan wangji making the effort to talk about wei wuxian to sizhui? thank you!

although my mind is young, it is not gentle by everythingispoetry ( T, 27k, Canon Divergence, Hurt/Comfort, Disability, Parenthood, Growing Up, Family Dynamics, Character Study, Self-Discovery) Sizhui doesn't really know who he remembers about but there are moments of him remembering wei wuxian through dreams

~*~

12. I was rewatching the show recently and got to the scene where the Lan juniors and LWJ all stood in front of WWX when Jin Ling approached him in the caves after the stabbing. I was wondering for ITMF if there were any fics where the juniors are protective of WWX? Preferably if Sizhui is a prominent character in the fics, but I'll take any junior being protective tbh. Thank you!

🧡 the stone-filled sea by yukla (T, 9k, WangXian, LSZ & WWX, Post-Canon, senior wei defense squad, a study of the way prejudice and injustice and anger trickle down from generation to generation)

bespoke by cafecliche (G, 3k, WangXian, Post-Canon, Fluff, LSZ is a very good boy, which is specifically a tag for the fic but also just true in general, mostly novel-compliant but could easily be CQL-compliant too)

🔒 The Absolutely True Story of the Yiling Patriarch: A Manifesto in Many Parts by aubreyli (T, 19k, WangXian, In-Universe RPF, Romance Novel, LJY’s sense of justice, OYZZ’s sense of romance, Featuring a surprise appearance by WWX’s oft-absent sense of shame, Look the ducklings just want their sort-of dads to be happy okay?, And it’s not like WWX or LWJ are doing a good job of ensuring their own happiness, LJY rejects canon reality and substitutes his own, highly relatable actually, Post-Canon Fix-It, primarily drama-canon with cameos from novel-canon, Podfic Available, Russian Translation Available)

one of our own by glitteringmoonlight (G, 7k, WangXian, Post-Canon, POV Outsider, 5+1 Things) has Lan Jingyi, as well as other Lans, standing up for Wei Ying.

~*~

13. Wwx as royal prince with hidden identity

~*~

14. Wwx gets badly hurt while protecting jzx during jl 100 day celebration

the breaking of your soul (upon my lips) by sunsandships (M, 40k, WangXian, Canon Divergence, Fix-It, Mutual Pining, Golden Core Reveal, Happy Ending) Wei Ying gets badly injured at Qiongqi Path while protecting Jin Zixuan in chapter 8 but Wei Ying was escorting betrothal gifts from the Jin, rather than attending Jin Ling's celebration.

Cradle by Dragonesque (T, 196k, WIP, Canon Divergenc, Adopted children, Yiling Wei Sect, BAMF WWX) Wwx gets badly hurt while protecting jzx during jl 100 day celebration - cradle by dragonesque on ao3 (and its inspiration fic) both feature wwx getting badly hurt and origins of yiling wei sect

~*~

15. I finished reading a wangxian oneshot in which lan xichen tries to get wei wuxian in his bed but fails and so...itmf lan xichen/wei wuxian, nie mingjue/wei wuxian, wen ruohan/wei wuxian fic recs. Preferably complete with bottom wei wuxian if they have smut. Thank you!!

The Joke of Fate by ShallChair (E, 357k, LXC/WWX, Canon Divergence, Marriage First Love Later, Love at First Sleep, Smut, First Time, First Kiss, the Flower Banquet's timeline is before Baifeng Mountain hunt so, Comedy, a little bit humor in the lines, Fix-It of Sorts, Fluff, The man who succeeds in both Love and Career-LXC, Dark LXC, Dark LWJ, The Dark side mean "Fuck off Cultivation World!", The Exchange of Fate, LXC-centric, DoubleJade centric, The one who stands against the world-LXC; A/B/O, Alpha LXC, Omega WWX, Alpha LWJ, Mpreg, Mating Cycles/In Heat, Mating Bites, Scenting, Historical, Royalty, Arranged Marriage, Slight Drama, Bad Parent YZY, Cultivation Empire, Alpha NHS, Older NHS, The flustered Alpha and the handsome Omega, Half Lime Half Plot, YLLZ era, YLLZ WWX, The Thirsty LXC, Martial Arts AU, Wuxia AU, General WWX, Emperor LXC, Qianyuan, Kunze, Zhongyong, Enemy to lover, Concubine WWX, BAMF WWX, Precognitive Dream, the Second elopement, Wen Remnants Live, Burial Mounds Settlement Days, Intervention From the Outside World, Teleportation, Sunshot Campaign, Those Days When LXC Chased After YLLZ All Over the Central Plain)

~*~

16. itmf some wwx & jzx bonding similar to 'watch what we'll become' by glitteringmoonlight modern/canon/au it doesn't matter just give me that sweet sweet friendship/brotherly bonding

🧡 Stunted, Starving Juvenility by TomatenMark (E, 828k, WangXian, WIP, Fix-it of sorts, Talisman master WWX, Not JFM Friendly, Study Arc, Getting together, Fluff and Angst, Engagement)

atlas in his sleepin’ by anatheme (E, 48k, WangXian, XuanLi, Canon Divergence, Fix-It, Reincarnation, Family Reunions, Dimension Travel, temporary transmigration, Transmigrator!LWJ, Yunmeng Shuangjie Reconciliation, jzx motherhenning wwx, First Time, Sharing Clothes, Angst with a Happy Ending, Somebody Lives/Not Everyone Dies)

~*~

17. itmf a fic where wangxian get horny about "ruining" a hole. You know, there's penetration, or a lot of penetration, and the body is different afterwards. Idc who bottoms, omegaverse, consent, whatever. But no underage please. Thanks!

~*~

If you didn’t get an answer to your ask here, don’t forget to make use of @mdzs-kinkmeme and MDZS KINK MEME on Dreamwidth. Authors actually do use them for ideas. You may get what you order!***Your prompt doesn’t have to be kink! Fluff, crack, whatever - it’s all good!***

[restingdomface]

Wei Wuxian: *crashes out of Jiang Cheng’s guest quarters in a fury* -and that is ANOTHER reason why you NEVER ask me to sit down for a talk like this ever again-

Jiang Cheng: *looking just as furious* -how DARE you, Wei Wuxian, I came here as a curtesy, you don’t OWN being a cutsleeve! If I fall for a man then I fall for a man-

Wei Wuxian: You little brat, that’s not why I’m mad!

Jiang Cheng: THEN WHY ARE YOU MAD?

Wei Wuxian: YOU ASKED ME TO SIT DOWN FOR THE TALK AND IT MADE ME THINK YOUD TELL ME YOU WERE DYING OR ONE OF THE JUNIORS GOT HURT!

Jiang Cheng: …fuck… that’s fair… how DOES one break the news they’re a cutsleeve?

Wei Wuxian: Adopt a baby and have your beloved raise it into the perfect child to prove them all wrong idk

Jiang Cheng: Too slow, I hate this method. Gimme another one.

Wei Wuxian: idk, then, idk, tell me the next time you’re trying to distract me after someone actually gets hurt?

Jiang Cheng: Okay, I’ll wait til his dad is on his deathbed to tell him.

Wei Wuxian: …that rules out it being any of our friends. None of them have dads anymore.

Lan Sizhui: *was volunteered to go interrupt WWX and JC out of an entire group of worried juniors* Senior Wei-

Wei Wuxian: A-Die, if you please.

Lan Sizhui: *blushy blush of happiness* A-Die 🥰

Wei Wuxian: Yes, my radish?

Lan Sizhui: I was asked to remind you both that telling someone you’re a cutsleeve on their deathbed is considered shocking enough that it might expedite the death to occur in that bed :)

Wei Wuxian: …that sounds like something Wen Ning would say; is Shushu Ning back already?

Lan Sizhui: :) he is. He’s helping Baba with the bunnies.

Jiang Cheng: *having been looking at his hands in confusion til now, looks up to study LSZ carefully* Where’d you get this one? Let’s just go with your first idea. I could hand my beloved a child.

Wei Wuxian: Labor Camp :)

Lan Sizhui: :/

Jiang Cheng: …I’m gonna find a street urchin. It ruined my parents marriage but maybe if I’m not married yet it’s a good luck charm…

Poor Scarred Juniors Who Had To Watch That: -~- 👁️👄👁️

[lancabbage]

Just seen some fan art with a JC/JYL personality swap and a panel with JFM saying "I still don't like him" pointing at the new, kind and selfless JC. Which is just 🙄

But what was worse was the reblogs with "there is no universe where JFM cares about JC"...erm.... Hello? Try the canon universe you idiots!!! Honestly, these people are so dense it just hurts my brain.

These people reading MDZS:

JC: My daddy hates me! He made me give up my puppies because some dirty orphan he brought home has a crippling fear thanks to fighting for food and his life while living on the settee for years! Boohoo! He likes WWX more than me because he actually cares about my education and tries to teach me how to be a good future sect leader. Boohoo!

The actual text:

JFM says goodbye to his son before he rushes off to defend LP and only acknowledges WWX after HE speaks up. And even then JFM did not say anything to him other than a carefully word order request to look after JC, to literally protect the heir of the sect. If JFM truly cared about WWX, he would not have asked him to do this, knowing just how loyal and indebted he felt. Knowing how far WWX would go to "look after" JC because of that. Knowing WWX felt he owed them a life debt, when it was in fact the other way around and keeping this major fact from him the whole time.

JFM did not tell WWX one single thing about his parents... Did not stop the physical abuse the boy was suffering at the hands of his own wife... Did not adopt WWX into the family to ensure his status was secure and that he was given respect. These are all major clues that JFM did not care about WWX more than his own son 🙄 Morons.

How can people be so stupid? MXTX expects her readers to see what is really happening, to use their brains to understand what is really going on rather than taking one bitter character's warped opinion of the whole situation (thanks to his mother's abusive personality) and running to the hills with it!

[nobleocaste]

u know how for 13 years jin ling was the only thing jiang cheng had??? its just so devastating and the bond they have should be more talked about like i want to know how jiang cheng handled everything i want to know how jin ling felt about it. i wonder how it wouldve been if lan wangji had told jc about a yuan and how much he meant to wwx (i am aware jc hates the wen but cmon he wouldn’t hurt a child) i like to think that with lwj’s help jc wouldve spent those 13 years a bit less angry

im sad and im making donuts and im already thinking about my 20th birthday (we’re 10 months away) and im gonna do the right thing and make a mdzs cake and be really cringe about it and also make it my whole personality until i get bored

(im a little bit annoying with this whole mdzs thing am i not) (i dont care)

[letteredlettered]

Continuing after this post, which is my list of changes CQL made from MDZS that I did not like, changes from MDZS in CQL that I liked:

I really liked that Wen Ning and Wen Qing come to the Lan Sect lectures for the opening scenes. I think establishing them early both makes for a rounder story, because this way WN and WQ don't just show up when necessary for the plot but are people in their own right from the very beginning. I love WQ in the book, and I felt that the expansion of her character for the drama was very true to her character and made me love her that much more. I also really liked the WQ/JC relationship. I really think that you could have introduced these Wen characters early on, as the drama did, without using the stupid Yin Iron plot to get there. Just have them study at Cloud Recesses and then show the archery competition.

This is pertinent to the expansion of WQ's character and also to the point I'm about to make below about Jiang Yanli's character, but I appreciated how the drama expanded the roles of these two female characters. The women in MDZS are really interesting, complex characters, and yet for some reason they are not given the page-time and attention that the much larger cast of male characters gets. I'm frustrated that the drama does not show what happened to WQ, but at least they gave her a bigger part.

I also really liked that Jiang Yanli was at the Lan Sect lectures. Honestly, I felt there wasn't enough of her in the book for her death to really have the necessary impact. What was there was beautiful--but she wasn't just very present.

In fact, in general, I feel like you can feel the relationship between WWX and the Jiang family a lot better in the drama. You can really feel how close these people are and why WWX feels such a responsibility toward them. There's just a lot more time spent showing the three of them being together rather than just telling you about it.

On that note, I think that the days WWX spends at WQ's in the drama, searching for a solution to JC's core, really helps you understand just how desperate WWX is at this point. I also think it does a really good job of showing that WWX can actually be very scholarly if he is interested, which the fact that he wrote dissertations on demonic cultivation in the book also shows. (I really hate the fanon!WWX who cannot be an intellectual even if he wants it; he only studies if he's interested is all.)

No rape, which for me was a plus

I think it was helpful that there was a lot of NHS hanging out with WWX in the drama. It really establishes his character and you do care about him. I think that if I had read the book without the drama I'd keep forgetting who NHS even was.

For me, Xiao Zhan made WWX a lot sweeter, kinder, and more serious than the book, which in general was a good thing. I don't really need WWX to be nice, but there were honestly times when I felt like he was impossible to know in the novel because he was always joking around, teasing, being smart-mouthed, being sarcastic, or if he was sincere, he was angry. And that's a very interesting thing for a character to have going on! But I really felt like the author also could not really dwell inside his head, so it's kind of bizarre to me that it feels like the actor did, in fact, do so; there are so many moments in the drama where you can see that WWX feels hurt or affectionate or regretful or upset, and you can see him decide to adopt a joking persona. And that's different than the WWX of the novel, who seems like he doesn't decide and can't actually help himself, but at least I know what CQL!WWX is thinking more of the time. (One of the best WWX parts in the novel was when he told Jin Ling he was sorry for the comment about Jin Ling's mother, because it was one of the only moments he really felt deeply sincere, no jokes.)

Similarly, I for the most part found LWJ more dimensional in the drama, for similar reasons. You can see what LWJ feels in WYB's microexpressions, but since most of the book is from WWX's pov and WWX can't read LWJ, LWJ kind of seems like a tree for large portions. Thank goodness that LXC can read him, and that once or twice, MXTX does at least show us what LWJ does when people aren't looking, even if she still doesn't jump into his head.

Anyway, in the end, the characters and relationships in the book are very strong, but so much is told rather than shown, whereas the drama really shows a lot of those characters and relationships. You would think the fact that a drama shows and a novel tells is a somewhat tautological observation, but honestly, I find that many live action adaptations of books are in fact bad at showing. It helps that the drama has 50+ episodes. Meanwhile, the parts that should be told imo in the book (such as more interiority for everyone overall) are shown in the drama. I think you can use the book to clarify lots of the plot and fill in certain character details that are left out of the drama, but you can use the drama to (for lack of a better word) really dramatize who these people are and how they felt.

I was surprised that in the end, I didn't actually feel these two stories were as vastly different as I expected. The biggest change besides the gay is, of course, the fact that the drama is unwilling to let WWX be as much of a villain as he becomes in MDZS, which is something I'll save for another post, maybe.

[memory-lane-and-back-again]

A Thought About Wei Wuxian's Death

Spoilers for... I don't remember which book it is (Book 3 I think)

When WWX is captured by the Wens and tossed into the burial mounds he is so full of rage and anger that it is a terrifying possibility that he will come back as a fierce corpse full of resentful energy. (Arguable he does, but that's a point to make for after exams when I can actually have fun and analyse the heck out of these)

I find it an interesting parallel that when he actually does die he is an incredibly 'well behaved ghost.' as in, he's well... if not moved on, at least not inclined to try and act and in some state of peace: not happy but at least tolerating how things have ended. WWX's character is permeated by a deep, inextricable sadness and I think, though it is not ever blatantly acknowledge, this is foregrounded right at the beginning with the story: he doesn't know why he's been brought back, does not understand and is incredibly fixed on the fact that it was not his choice. To infer... he didn't really want to come back.

I found his present mellowness, that contrasts so brutally with his fury and anger and ability to feel such intensity before he died, to be a bit strange---not unbelievable but strange. That kind of anger burns incredibly brightly and is incredibly hard to tamper down and yes, he grows and matures but it feels a bit strange to me that this comes on from spending ten years without a body. I think it is more an extension of his grief and guilt: after Wen Qing and Wen Ning go to die on his behalf is when he gets truly angry... his anger gets out of control and Jiang Yanli is hurt and then dies for him. Jiang Cheng takes his anger out on him. As far as WWX can remember even LWJ is disgusted by him... is it so hard to believe that he too is disgusted with himself. Present day, he cringes at his past arrogance---the illusion of omnipotence and control he thought he had.

I am of the opinion he's the sort of person with the mindset that if he can make the world a better place, fix one problem, even if it is at the expense of his own, he'd do it. He is raised to protect JC, doesn't even bat an eye at losing his core because if it can help JC it is good; he doesn't fear dying if he can come back as a fierce corpse to still help destroy the Wens; he doesn't care to humiliate himself to try and give Wen Ning a chance at archery; his public image does not matter if he is helping people. This carries forward where he is willing to sacrifice discovery to protect Jin Ling; he turns himself into a spirit attraction flag for people who hate him; the moment LWJ freaks out about sleeping with him, WWX first priority is to take all the blame for everything and then leave and go do the stupid mission all by himself because he doesn't want to force LWJ to put up with him, even though it leaves WWX himself incredibly wrought. And then of course, he doesn't even bat an eye at luring Nie Minguie away by himself.

My point is he's a willing martyr, happy to get himself into trouble and deep water for pretty much anyone (mianmian, LWJ, JC, the Wens) so it must feel like hell when his efforts only succeed in getting everyone killed, when he's kind of forced to confront that he is loved and had people willing to stand by him that he did not consider when he made his plans and that they are dead because of to an extent his actions. I truly believe him trying to destroy the Yin Tiger Tally is his last attempt to try and rectify things and he is a bit like Xiao Xingchen in that regard, trying so hard to follow his principles and failing abysmally. At that point his jiejie is dead, who is like the very symbol of innocence and unconditional love in his life at that point and he knows they are coming to kill him. His big character difference I think has a lot to do with the three months after the nightless city and before his death because he feels the world is better off with him dead.

A lot of people compare Xue Yang and WWX and whilst I think that is valid, I think a lot of people forget his inherent connection to XXC through his mother. I think it is important to acknowledge that they share a very similar mindset: naively wanting to change the world with their beliefs alone as if people will see altruism and kindness as the best path whilst most people are out searching very selfishly for their own greatness and success---something neither WWX adn XXC need to think about because A) the are already powerful and successful and B) they were never raised to think themselves as needing to be supremely powerful to be successful and Good.

Anyways, it does make me wonder how much of WWX's characterisation present day is put on. He slaps himself in the face when no one is around to see it after he finds out who Jin Ling is, he lets Jin Ling stab him and feels he deserves it---that by proxy is when he's most open with LWJ: 'you don't need to come with me, your reputation will be ruined.' It so, so clearly speaks of self-loathing that he is so so good at hiding.

I think actually when LWJ and WWX first sleep together the physical undressing is also a metaphor for an emotional undressing on WWX's part because he strips himself of his insincerity and arrogance and allows himself to be vulnerable. The only other times we see his vulnerability is when he's passed out unconscious and when he realises to stop hurting LWJ he needs to kind of bare his soul to him in book 5 after LXC reveals the truth about nightless city.

Gosh, I love these characters so much.

[sonik-kun]

In case anyone needed reminding that Jiang Cheng did in fact mourn WWX for 13 years:

- He kept a hold of his flute for him during all that time he was dead. WWX notes that it had been well looked after, which he didn't even have to do.. if he you know.. Hated him

- The rumours about him torturing DCs are exactly that. Rumours. We don't know the details or why they had been "tortured." The author doesn't delve into it too much, nor does WWX seem that strung up on it for that matter lmao. To say he did it because he resented WWX is kinda baseless and was an assumption WWX made. Every other DC we've seen aside from WWX and MXY were kinda shitty people anyway, so the chances are they probably deserved it (though I do love my little gremlin Xue Yang, don't get me wrong 💜).

Also, hunting DCs is kinda his job.. He can't exactly let them run rampant if they're hurting people. I'd also like to point out how quick he was to let MXY!WWX go the first time with LWJ. He clearly didn't think he was a great threat. And OG MXY was never on his radar, despite dabbling in the dark arts. Makes me think that he only went after notorious DCs who were hurting people and/or were a potential threat. 🤷‍♀️

- If JC truly resented WWX, he would have killed him when he could have. He had so many opportunities to do so, and yet he never did. He also had plenty of opportunities to rat him out to JGY and expose him multiple times, but again, he didn't.

- He even stepped in front of WWX to protect him during the Guanyin Temple conflict which again, he certainly didn't have to do. If he hated him, he wouldn't have defended him, come on now.

- Whenever the rumours about him killing WWX are brought up, he always looks extremely upset and hurt (perhaps believes himself that he had a part in his death anyway).

- He never revealed his own sacrifice or held it over WWX in any way when he could have.

- He apologised and let him go in the end. His hatred clearly didn't run that deep if he was willing to let it all go.

- There has also been concept art in the past of him reminiscing on his times with WWX in Lotus Pier. The creators wouldn't make such blatant art if that wasn't true.

The whole point of Jiang Cheng's character is that he struggles to show "positive" feelings, but shows his love in other ways, like through acts of service, and y'all failed to realise that.

In short, Jiang Cheng mourned, albeit in an unhealthy way, but he mourned and clearly missed Wei Wuxian nonetheless.

[en-d-d]

So, this is my first post, so hello everyone! I don't really know how to properly navigate this platform just yet, but I'm sure I will figure it out, so please bear with me.

Having said that, unfortunately, I've come here today to rant a little on social media about things that make me borderline insane just from listening to. Most specifically, from MTXT's works. (Because if I ever see another wrong characterization for those fictional people I've became very attached to, I'm actually going to go mad.)

(This is not meant to be an attack of any sorts, I'm just a teenager on social media pulling my nerves into writing because who knows, maybe I can finally be at peace then.)

Let's start then!

Xie Lian is not owo small cutie or sum, and if I hear that one time... my man may be short, but he could fight off almost anyone, just thanos clapping people out of existence. He's also very insane and very horny about the Calamity attached to his hip. My guy is pretty smart and also just kinda gives patient auntie vibes (you know, that auntie that can see beyond everyone's bull but choses not to).

And if I already started with TGCF, may as well continue with it. Hua Cheng is a switch and you can't convince me otherwise. (If his Dianxia wanted to top, he would be as elated as he would be if Dianxia wanted to bottom. My man doesn't care.)

Luo Binge being referred as a white lotus and people not knowing what it means ("In Chinese internet novels, the term "white lotus" refers to a character who appears innocent, naive, and pure on the surface but uses this reputation to backstab, blame, or sling mud on others.") (I believe maybe people confuse this with the other meanings of the white lotus, like, actually naive or pure in character, but those are obliviously not what they mean in the chinese novels)

Shen Yuan is Kim Dokja, but chinese (or maybe KD is SY but korean)

Lan Wangji did not like Wei Wuxian despite him being 'evil', he loved him exactly because he isn't evil. I can't stress this enough. If wwx was a actually bad person, lwj would not hesitate to cut his head off and be done with the matter. Whenever I see someone saying something about him liking wwx even if he's evil, I'm slowly loosing my mind, bcz no, lwj is not such a shallow person, to be attracted to someone based purely on looks (and we do know this bcz he loves wwx in mxy's body just as much as he loved him in his original body.)

Now, we're moving into a territory I like exploring. I just want to start this off saying that I don't like Jiang Wanyin. I just don't care very much about him and I find him annoying as a person. With that being said, I'm a little miffed with fellow jc dislikers bcz they sometimes invent some things up about him or such shenanigans. Like. Man, you do not need to invent things to hate abt him, there are already plenty of them. I'm pretty unbiased when it comes to actual judgements about others. I will protect someone if the points made about them is incorrect as much as I will point out every thing they actually did bad.

And the next point is still abt jc (wow, what a surprise) just bcz, honest to god, a lot of his fans are straight up annoying. I've said it. A lot of y'all are hella annoying. (Not to say that there exist a lor of annoying fans for other characters, it's just that jc has a very high number of them) Some of the ones I don't find bad are those that like him just becouse of how bad of a person he is. I can respect that. What I can't respect is another owo he's innocent and traumatized and a tsundere and everything is wwx's fault owo jc fan. Fam, did we read the same book, or has media really rotten our colective brain that much??

(I believe I have more comments on this jc topic, but my brain is starting to hurt.)

And the last one is Wei Wuxian, probably the most controversial character in all of MTXT's novels. First of all, I have to be clear about this, but in all of this post, I'm purely referring to the characters from the books, not the other adaptations. This is important, bcz the adaptations further skewed wwx's image in the fandom.

I have saved him for least because of just how much things tick me off in this fandom when discussing wwx in special.

Disclaimer that I sincerely believe that you should enjoy and do art and fanfiction of characters however you want. If you want wwx to be, idk, a demon that terrorizes people and breaks lwj's heart and then jc comes and saves the situation from the evil patriarch and then french kisses Lan Xichen, then go ahead, idc (Unless you say he's owo, you have no excuse that would allow you to do that unless you're a child, and if you are, then you shouldn't even be here). But I draw the line when people lie about canon characterizations.

And there is just so much misconceptions on wwx's character that I would need an essay just to compose a list of them. They range from huge details that somehow miss people like how their neurons miss firing, to small details, like his handwriting (I believe the novel said it was cursive, not messy, like how almost all the fandom has apparently mutually agreed on. Do corect me if I'm wrong on this, some things are lost from translation to translation)

I will be discussing just some of them here. Maybe I will do another post where I go in more detail, we will see.

ADHD Wei Wuxian. The people that believe wwx has ADHD should probably reread the novel, bcz that characterization comes mostly from CQL. In the novel, wwx is a very chill guy that can stay in one place perfectly fine. I will not go into more details, just read the novel.

Wei Wuxian is the reason for the Jiang's collapse. Bull statement, everytime I see it, well, I go a little more insane. If you know a little politics, you would realize the Jiangs were next on the list for sure. Why, you would ask. The Lans already burnt themselves to the ground. The Nies have a fortress for a sect. The Jins are almost-not-exactly allies with the Wens. Now, guess who is the most unfavorably positioned gentry sect (lakes are not a good strategic spot), with lax protection (how did the Wens just march in like that like what) and a little too carele leader (Jiang Fenmiang really thought the Wens will give them back the swords after that whole disaster that was the indoctrination? Really??). Oh! I think I know who it is! And maybe you guessed it too. Glad we're on the same page.

Now, wwx being the reason why jc lost his core. Very many people already came to their own conclusion on why jc gave himself up. Brotherly affection, suicidal thoughts or just straight up idiocy. Whatever you believe, it's fine with me (but I do have a brother and I can assure you, wwx and jc never really seemed like brothers to me. They are a little too far to the left to be considered brothers, but this is my opinion, take it however you will). So, was it wwx's fault?

We're finally getting into the juicy stuff. The blame game. I hate it with my being, still, as long as I'm in fandoms, I must persist. My answer is yes & no. Did wwx deliberately made it so jc would be captured? Of course not. Did it still happened? Unfortunately, yes. To go deeper, we will look a little at fate. There are some things that are outside of our control. As much as we prepare, some things will still blow us over. So the definite answer is no. Jc made the decision to be seen by the Wens. It might sound callous , but the decisions you make are yours, even if you protect someone's life or not. Wwx did not ask to be protected. In conclusions, it's not his fault.

And that is a very good statement to make, seeing as we got to the core transfer. People often criticize wwx for giving non-consensualy his core to jc. I always thought it as a weird thing to hate him about, but whatever, I still shall address it. I will start with an exemple. If you loved someone very much, and they would die if they don't get, idk, a new arm (maybe think of something less inconspicuous, but you understand the ideea) they would die. You are the single person that can do it. But you're sure that if someone told your loved one that you would give it, they would refuze it. Are you still going to give your arm? Will you let your loved one die? Knowing that you can help?

And for those that say jc was not on the brink of death. He was suicidal. He would not have resisted a week with the shame of inferiority plus all the trauma that the Lotus Pier massacre was, combined. 'Regaining' his core might have actually made him feel better, like he beat the odds, like he has another chance. That's also why wwx never told him he gave him his core. Bcz he knew jc would not take it easy, finding out that all his accomplishments were thanks to wwx's sacrifice. Because jc has a big ego that's clearly evident through the story.

Anyways, let's continue.

Ghostly Cultivation. It's more popularity used the Demonic Cultivation term, but they are not the same think for Christ's sake. Modao Zushi does mean The Grandmaster of Demonic Cultivation, however the title is for click bait. In the actual novel, I believe wwx talks abt ghostly cultivation, not demonic. It was probably lost in translations.

I don't think I need to explain how wwx needed guidao to escape the Burial Mounds, so at least half of my job is already done. Now I go into dangerous territory however, bcz guidao is not expended upon. Still, I would rather listen to wwx when it's about, you know, the path he himself created?

To explain my stance, we would need to go deeper into the novel's points. A novel can have multiple themes, ranging from obvious ones, like love, family, to obscure ones, like, the importance of standing up for oneself (not the best exemple, but I believe y'all understand what I mean).

I'm someone that loves thinking abt MDZS. It's my dearest. So, I tend to analyze it pretty often. And the themes I usually get are things like 'the danger of hearsay and mob mentality', 'the importance of standing true to your ideals', 'the inherit unpredictability of life' and so on, and so on.

Anyways, what does that have to do with guidao? Well, everything, I believe. The MDZS world has a mentality resembling that of the curent China. Or well, the China of when MXTX wrote the novel. If you know some history, I believe you can connect the similarities. What does that mean then?

Wwx is someone that does not fallow the path set by the ancestors. He creates his own. When the cultivators see that, they are revolted. Becouse everything that strays from the 'right' path must surely be evil. And so, after Wen Ruohan, the Jins paint him as the new anarchist, and the rest is history.

Now, I would actually love to continue, but I've been typing nonstop for hours now, I need to stop. I will continue my points in another post, bcz I still have a lot of them.

Thanks for reading, and have a wonderful day 💐

[jingyi-ma-boi]

Yunmeng Twin Heroes' complicated dynamics

So, my tags in one of the last posts I reblogged got a little out of hand and were long enough to deserve their own post, cause, even if I was commenting on other people’s meta and headcannons I ended up 'writing' my own. If you click on the link, you'll see that @featherfur's post was all about the post-canon chengxian feels of seeing the changes in each other while not being able to directly participate in each other's lives. Go read that. It's a bit long, but it's worth it. The angst of seeing somebody you love(d) being so similar yet so different from what you remember, and thinking knowing that you do not get to be a part of their lives like you'd want to hits just right.

However, I don't think that level of 'deep yearning to be able to love each other like they once did' is everything there really is. To me, there’d be a point in post-canon where they do feel like that, but they would resent each other often and even feel something akin to hate as well whenever their feelings regarding everything that has happened in canon got too much to bear.

Now, you can go on reading what I think their emotional journey towards reconciliation would be like, or you can just skip to the end, where I’ve put a TLDR. You’ll get the general idea but if you want to dive into the complexity of their feelings, keep reading (please, I’d love for other people to read and discuss this with me, or give their thoughts at least T.T).

We all know how JC feels about everything WWX has done and how he blames him. For all that the fandom pegs him as someone who doesn’t know how to express his feelings other than through anger, he's actually pretty aware of them and lets himself experience them (although not in a healthy way, re: being angry most of the time). Meanwhile, WWX has always been incredibly detached from his emotions —that's why it takes him so long to realize he's been in love with LWJ since their teens— because 1) he's been raised to think that his value lies not on him as a person, but on him as a protector that has to right all his wrongs to everybody around him because of filial duty, life debts, and class differences; and 2) he doesn't think he deserves feeling them, as a result of that.

And although I'm all for the chengxian feels and the fluff of Yungmeng Jiang' bros reconciliation, (really, I love that trope) I don't see it happening organically.

Listen here, I'm talking from personal experience. You can feel enormous amounts of longing, missing the closeness you once had with someone who hurt you deeply, and resent that person at the same time. It seems obvious, but it’s the kind of obvious thing that needs to be reminded. In a situation like this, you can, and will, get bursts of anger at that person for everything they did and everything they didn't do. You hate yourself for missing them because you have all the right to be angry at them, and disapointed and sad, and you shouldn't be missing them nor contemplating the possibility of going back to how things were once. You can be glad to see that they are doing well in their new life and be jealous that it is not you who they're sharing all these new experiences with, while you're watching awkwardly from the sidelines, letting the guilt from the swarm of contradictory emotions eat at you, because at the end of the day it doesn't matter how you feel. What matters is the facts. What you did. What THEY DID.

I see JC going through a mix of less complicated emotions at first. After canon, where he scowls at WWX with anger at first, the underlying pain gains a new companion. A feeling of sadness that drives JC to avoid WWX in the same way that the latter’s pain and guilt drives him to avoid his shidi. WWX, on the other hand, would take the longest time to let himself feel more complex and contradictory emotions. He might even get stuck on that guilt and not let himself feel the anger, disappointment, and resentment towards JC that he has always buried deep inside if things at Cloud Recesses stay the same as ever and he and LWJ isolate themselves from everyone else while LXC withers away in his tormented seclusion.

(Here comes the important reminder that MDZS is full of parallelisms and as such, LWJ and LXC share the same complicated feelings that exist between the Yunmeng bros, even if the details of their relationships are different. I won't go further into the Twin Jades of Lan, cause they deserve their own post, but let it be known that their reconciliation is as unlikely as the Yunmeng Twin Heroes’. They’re totally related. Any advances in one of the pairs would positively reflect on the other and viceversa, that’s why it’s so difficult for them to avoid emotional stagnation.)

The key to WWX getting more in touch with his feelings would be in the changes brought forth by the juniors. LSZ and LJY would work through WWX's façade even better than LWJ does, cause WWX doesn't think them as biased. His two Lan ducklings would charge headlong into his emotional mess through gentle words (LZS) and earth-shattering remarks disguised as snark (LJY), and force help him through the mess of recognizing and sorting out those emotions.

Still, JC and WWX being aware of their feelings is not enough for them to solve things.

However, it might help them all to take a step forward and start acknowledging each other in a better manner. They’d go from having raw, more simple feelings preventing them to even wanting to hear each other’s name, to gradually being able to share the same space amicably. That doesn’t mean that looking at each other in the eyes or feeling each other’s gaze isn’t simply too much because it makes them spiral. This is the point where they’d yearn for this new, happier version of their brother, their emotions getting as complicated as I described at the beginning. But that's the most I can see them achieving on their own because they’re both so stubborn. They’re set in their own ways and it would take a huge external force for them to make the slightest changes (ie. golden-core transfer reveal and the little ducklings intervening to make WWX feel his feelings is what causes changes in their perspective).

Why do I feel like this? Am I allowed to feel this? How can I dare to want this when I can’t even forgive him? How could I ever forgive him? Would he ever forgive me? How is it possible that I still love him so much? Do I even deserve to have that with him after everything I did? And what about him? Am I ready to truly forgive him and trust him? Will I ever be? I can’t, I couldn’t even if I wanted to and it hurts SO MUCH! IT HURTS!

IT HURTS!ITHURTSITHURTSITHURTS IHATEHIMIHATEHIMIHATEHIM

WHYDIDHEDODTHAT!?!WHYDIDHEDOTHATTOME?! WHYDIDHENOTDOANYTHING?!

WHY DID HE LEAVE ME?!?!?

…

You see? After everything I’ve laid down, any of them could have this exact internal conflict anytime.

The thing is they are both more alike than they think. JL would see through their bullshit and be so frustrated with it all through the years. Already an adult and experienced sect leader, he’d understand but not completely, because he’d be the first to realize that nothing can compare to what they’ve gone through. And yet, he’d want them to talk and make up because he loves his maternal uncles so much. He won’t admit it to anyone, (LJY, LZS and OYZZ don’t need him to. it’s been years since WWX returned and JL’s already an open book to them), but he wants them to be happy around each other. To not feel so torn apart between them. He’d want an opportunity to have some semblance of the family that could’ve been and he will take any chance, as small as it might be, to achieve that.

Cue the junior-now-adult-quartet shenanigans. They’ve been seeing how every adult they love is miserable to some extent, and now that they’re adults too, they can and will do something about it. Cause hey, if they were able to bulldoze in and force WWX to actually feel his feelings, they can do this too! So now, their new goal is to get these two grown-ass adults to talk. Although technically, WWX is only a few years older, and a great deal more traumatized than them too. They’re aware of it. But they’d rather not think too much about it because they most definitely didn’t cry for hours on end after they got him to talk and started thinking about his life. And they most definitely didn’t attract attention when, weeks later, they finally grasped the scope of everything that their seniors had suffered when they had been even younger than they were at that moment.

LJY and OYZZ would be totally and completely over-invested in this. They’d scheme and help JL trace a plan for how and when to talk to each of them individually to subtly let them know how he felt. LSZ would use his power as heir and acting sect leader to stage the encounter among the three of them, securing LWJ’s reluctant approval after a great deal of convincing. And JL would trigger the conversation with a spontaneous outburst at his two uncles’ ridiculous yearning. They’d probably use a combination of WWX’s inventions and Lan techniques to lock them into a room, and force them to talk and have a truthful heart to heart, and they’d hope that after that, everything would be okay.

A LONG bout of silence later, they’d hear shouting and objects shattering and hitting the floor. They’d hear them fight, without sensing any spiritual or resentful energy of any kind, and LWJ would have to be stopped from dismantling the arrays and talismans in place just so he could go pounce on JC’s throat himself. The blows would soon be replaced with more silence, then soft murmurs. Sobbing. More yelling, and cracked voices. It’d be almost time for waking up the next morning when the arrays disappeared on their own. The doors opening to show the two brothers splayed on the floor next to each other, robes and hair disastrously askew. Holding their forearms over their eyes, barely covering the tear trails and reddened cheeks, their chests would be rising peacefully as they’d finally seem to sleep from exhaustion. LWJ’s eyes would get stuck on the way their fingertips touch ever so slightly. The ducklings don’t say a thing, but they’d totally stare too. JL would be the one to break the silence and tell everyone they should be going to sleep as well (and if LSZ and LJY see JL’s glassy eyes and a lone tear… no, they don’t).

Would that be it? Nope. Haven’t I said already it’s not easy? They’d have started talking and acknowledging that they both want the same thing, but it’s still not enough. They’d have to WORK for it. Hard. They would need to build a support system if they wanted to achieve the relationship they want to have. LWJ would have to start seeing JC as a person, and one that is able to give his Wei Ying the happiness he deserves, now that he’s at it. JC would have to start relying more on the other adults in his live. And it wouldn’t hurt WWX if he expanded his circle to include people other than his husband, his son, his son’s friends, and his undead cinnamon-roll of a friend.

In this way, they would be working on their respective issues to obtain each other’s forgiveness. They would face setbacks on more than one occasion, questioning whether it’s even worthwhile. This is the only way I see them regaining trust in each other.

The two of them mending their relationship without strong external factors would be OOC and unrealistic. It doesn’t matter if you’re going by MDZS or CQL canon. Although if we’re going by CQL canon, I don’t think they would ever go further than the ‘avoiding each other’ stage, and neither would any plot device help them do it. CQL WWX is very tame in the war-crime front and even though he’s just as ‘selflessly’ quick to put himself in harm’s way as in the novel, nobody can blame him for an attack that was clearly planned years before (most of the ‘facts’ stated on the novel turned out to be complete hearsay and/or senseless bullshit, this translates to CQL too even though if the censorship fucked a big part of this by drawing extreme caricatures of everyone). His misdeeds boil down to war crimes of varying moral weight, and not trusting people enough to include them in decisions they should’ve been included in, cause JZX and JYL’s deaths were caused by SMS.

And CQL JC is… not good. His decision to completely ignore the Wens even when he personally knew them and knew they had helped them repeatedly (first encounter in the Dafan Mountain and then, after the fall of Lotus Pier) meant he’s the only character to blatantly disregard a life debt, one he had to the Wen siblings. And on top of that, he still pulls the same shit that novel JC does after WWX returns, which makes him even worse.

Novel JC, on the other hand, took the right decision by not getting involved with the Wens. They were complete strangers, and he couldn’t risk the safety of the sect and the people of Yunmeng. He was powerless against the wishes and whims of the cultivational world cause that's how politics work. You’re forced to choose duty towards your people over your heart.

But let’s get back on track. I’ll make a full post on my view of JC as whole another time. The reason why it would be so complicated and they’d have to work so hard towards mending their relationship is that they would first have to realize that they cannot go back to how things were before. JC would need to recognize that WWX is not to blame for all his misfortunes and he’d have to apologize for all the fucked-up shit he does after WWX’s return. Psychologically torturing his 21-year-old brother with dogs while being a 34 year-old sect leader that has had 13 years to deal with his emotions was a dick-move of the highest category. And so it is the stunt he pulls right before the golden-core reveal at Lotus Pier. Yes, the golden-core transfer was sketchy but made complete sense. Yunmeng Jiang needed a leader and WWX was not fit for the role, not due to a lack of skills, but because it would’ve worked as badly as JGY given how the whole Jianghu cared only about birth status and nothing else.

This doesn’t mean that JC’s evil, WWX is the ultimate child-abuse victim, and that JC should never get close to WWX ever again (I’m looking at you, JC antis, though this whole post is also a call-out to JC apologists, cause he ain’t no innocent snowflake wronged by bad, evil /WWX/YLLZ). It simply means that JC has to claim responsibility. He also needs to see that just like WWX was abused, he and JYL were victims of the same abuse. They both need to come to terms with that fact and know that they had some sort of trauma-bond given that JC’s coping mechanism for enduring the abuse was reflecting that same abusive behavior on WWX. Yes, siblings who grow up abused often abuse each other as well, and/or end up enabling their abusers through a fawn response (this was JYL’s case).

TLDR; I love the idea of these two hot-heads making up and having strong feelings about each other. But the abuse they endured growing up, and the abyss it slowly carved up between them is something they both need to acknowledge and heal from before even considering the idea of mending their relationship. That, and the extend of the wounds they’ve inflicted on each other since WWX returned are things I don’t see them working on unless prompted by external forces. Their relationship is too complicated and nuanced for anything other than that being possible, which means that they wouldn't be able to forgive and trust each other unless some freaking major plot-event forced them to actually talk. That’s why I see their reconciliation as highly unlikely.

[marshmallowwitharubberband]

I have a complicated relationship with Jiang Cheng.

As a character, I love his complexity, but I especially love how realistically it portrays one of the real-life outcomes of growing up in a violent, emotionally-repressive environment. When every display of emotion is labeled as weakness and answered with violence, some people eventually become programmed to turn any emotion into agression, see everything as an attack, and become secretly-people-pleasers with zero tolerance to frustration.

Actually, the Jiang siblings are excellent portraits of the different outcomes of what growing up in violence can do to you: you either become small and unnoticeable to survive, you become the kindest person ever so no one goes through the same, your self-worth gets reduced to what you can do for others, you go into substance abuse...

Thinking about it, I wouldn't be surprised if MXTX studied psychology in some form because the personalities resulting of her character's backgrounds are surprisingly realistic, for the most part, but back to Cheng-Cheng.

Guy had all the pressure put on him by his emotions-hating helicopter mom. Yanli got a pass for being a woman and being "destined" to be a wife, and maybe Mme. Yu may have projected a little, maybe she thought if she, herself, was sweeter and meeker JFM would treat her better? Idk, but the fact is, Yanli was allowed to not be "strong" ('Cause Mommy Yu is definitely the type of person to equal strength to agression). WWX "didn't count" because he was just a servant, so she merely ground his self-worth into the dirt.

Poor Jiang Cheng had to bear the brunt of his mom's horrible expectations and it broke him. His agression is more like a scared animal's, he lashes out his fear and frustration as violence because it's the only "acceptable" way, the only way he learned to be taken seriously or handle emotions at all. Much like today's wall-punching macho wannabes.

I wouldn't be surprised if Jiang Cheng, in a modern AU, would be sucked into the red pill rhetoric, he's exactly the lonely, stressed, emotionally hurt and vulnerable demographic those jerks target.

So yeah, he is a complex character with very valid motivations and a horribly tragic story handled in a very realistic way, I love that.

As a person, though, I really, really hate him and admit that, at some points in the book I would skip over his dialogue because yeah, yeah, your suffering, your sacrifices, boo hoo, poor you, my god, just shut up, everyone in this place has suffered and lost and is majorly messed up, you're not special! (At least he didn't actively murder anyone)

But I am aware it's because he reminds me, uncannily accurately, of someone who irl emotionally abused me all through childhood while the other adults around me did nothing. They, too, were obsessed with what I "owed" them both literally and metaphorically, and showed their affection with criticism, aggressiveness, and irate explosions. And while I understand them more now and the cycle of violence they were a victim of, I cannot forgive their actions. And I kin Wei Wuxian too hard to ever forgive Jiang Cheng.

But I do like how The Untamed softened him a lot and took care to emphasize that he was just an insecure kid who wanted to be accepted and the universe made him its chew toy. It re-portrayed him as that younger sibling who just wants to be included in his big bro's adventures and keeps being pushed aside by everybody. TU JC is my sweet little baby and needs a hug.

Book JC can go fry asparagus.