#fans would hate him and agree with Jason’s ‘replacement’ thing he never said

[starlooove]

I only like black tim when y’all woobify him like you do white tim (which you don’t btw)

[aalghul]

Honestly, sorry just need to say it but, one thing that irks the heck out of me about the "UWU, soft boi, insecure, Tim!" Fanon is that there's several kids it applies too much more than it ever did Tim.

Off the cuff:

Jason's first response to meeting Dick after a full year at the manor is fear that Dick will replace him, showing a deep insecurity about his place in the family despite a full year as a full on adopted child of Bruce. Plus, part of the reason Alfred wanted him to be benched as Robin is that he'd found Jason crying in his room multiple times!

Then there's Steph, whose early sense of self worth was really, really not great and led her to putting up with extremely messy power dynamics and crummy treatment just for scraps of approval or affection. And also she died smiling, after multiple dies of violation and torture, just because Bruce said she was Robin!

Then there's Cass, who is very confident in her skills, but also initially had no work life balance and sort of had to be roped and cajoled into anything outside of crime fighting and she takes any perceived rejection from Bruce incredibly hard. Oh and also her massive death wish!

So true!!! And what’s interesting is that these three are also hit hardest by the “stop trying to make them the victims of every situation” gang (who make Tim the blameless victim of everything, but don’t get me started on that). Everyone is allergic to admitting that

A) Jason and Steph were never the “bad, reckless, stupid robins that only feel arrogance and anger” and are in fact the two Robins most insecure about their performance as Robin. And the ones constantly reminded that they were failures compared to the others (excluding Duke cuz when is Duke included in Robin conversations. Sigh. Off topic). These two canonically have the insecurities and “be a good Robin above all else, and maybe my life will have been worth something” drive that people write Tim with.

B) Cass is not a fighting robot that you can bust out to make a “she’s Bruce’s favourite” joke, use as a mind reader for some impromptu therapy, or some personal bodyguard (usually for Tim). Cass doesn’t just magically understand Bruce, and she’s shown fo be very hurt by his inability to communicate his actual feelings. And his inability to healthily have feelings in general actually. Cass is not perfect and that’s exactly why she’s not a boring, side character (like some people so clearly want her to be). I never hear any discussion of Cass’s very canon death wish but there’s dozens of posts at any time about why Tim was suicidal and him saying he knew Dick would save him is bs (not arguing or agreeing, just saying).

I’m not one to get on people for ignoring canon characterization when it sucks (and most of Tim’s does suck ass) but this specific type usually happens at the expense of other characters for Tim. So there’s that. I’m also not saying Tim didn’t have moments that match this characterization, but if we’re strictly discussing it what a majority of canon is, then it’s not even an option to have him near these three. “Don’t compare characters like this” etc etc but one of these characters is a rich, white boy while one is a former homeless kid (with a history of being hated by fans for not fitting their idea of billionaire heroes), a lower class girl (with a history of being treated as a love interest for the rich, white boy, on top of the classism) and an East Asian girl not to mention that she was raised to be mute and people are still weird about it (I really don’t have to explain this one.) So, I think it won’t hurt one of the most well treated characters in the fandom to have me do this.

[marauderundercover]

Day 6: Party

WARNING: GRAPHIC VIOLENCE 

Continuation of days two and three

Marinette grins at her reflection in the mirror. The costume was perfect- close enough to the original that you could tell who she was, but also with her own touch so that she didn’t hate looking at the costume. She’d even curled her hair slightly. The knock at the front door makes her squeal in excitement, knowing exactly who it is. 

��Cass!” She cheers, opening the door and grinning widely at her best friend. Sure, Cass didn’t talk a lot (she was like Luka in that way), but she always seemed to know when Marinette needed help out of her own head. And she was eternally grateful for that. She was even more grateful that Cass had agreed to do a duo costume with her since Jason apparently didn’t want to dress up. He was ‘too old’ or something. Well, Marinette wanted to have fun and wear a damn costume. 

“The suit is amazing! I’m not sure the cowl I made will be good enough for it.” Marinette says worriedly, examining the stitches on Cass’ costume. “Where’d you say you got this?” She asks, frowning. It was definitely higher quality than the Halloween store downtown. Cass just smiles, the one that basically says ‘not telling’. Mari just grins, used to it by now. She passes the cowl to Cass and grabs her own domino mask, sliding it on. Posing next to Cass in the full length mirror, Marinette takes a picture and sends it to the group chat that Jason had recently added her to. Dropping her phone into her purse and grabbing her keys, she turns to Cass. 

“Ready?” She asks. 

“Ready.” Cass says. Marinette grins. Look out, Gotham, Batman and Robin are out on the town. 

---

Dick squeals as the picture comes through on the groupchat. He was beyond relieved that Jagged had scheduled his Halloween party two weeks before the actual holiday. It meant that he, and the rest of his brothers, could actually go instead of being on the extra patrols they always had to schedule around the holiday. Grinning, he opens twitter. 

@flyingrayson

Look at my little sisters! Aren’t they the cutest?! #halloween #Waynefam #jaggedstone

[image description: One girl stands with a hand on her hip, dressed in what is obviously a spin on a Robin costume, including: a domino mask, black tights, dark red tunic with a Robin logo, gold belt, knee high emerald boots, and a dual sided cape black on the outside and gold on the inside. Another girl stands next to her with her arms crossed over her chest, dressed in what is obviously a Batman costume, including: black catsuit, yellow utility belt, black cape, and a redesigned black cowl.]

---

Marinette pecks Jason’s cheek and grins. 

“What, not a Robin fan?” She asks teasingly at his frown. He huffs. 

“Not really. More of a...Red Hood guy.” He says, and she snorts. 

“Of course you’d like the one with guns.” She says, shaking her head with a smile. “His costume is actually probably one of my favorites. Well, besides the whole helmet thing.” Jason grins, pulling her in and giving her a sweet kiss before he glances behind her and groans. 

“My brothers just walked in.” He says and she smiles. 

“Go say hi, I’ve gotta go ask Uncle Jagged a question really quick. I’ll be right back and Cass and I can show your brothers our awesome costumes in person.” She says, pecking his cheek before walking away. She looks around for Jagged, but frowns when she doesn’t see him in the main room. Pulling out her phone, she sends him a quick text asking where he is. 

In the garden with Fang!!!!!!!

She shakes her head fondly. Of course he skipped out on his own party to spend time with his crocodile. Smiling, she heads out to the garden to try and get to him. She’d wanted to see if the man planned on being in the US around Thanksgiving. Bruce had already invited her (probably to get Jason to show up) and said she could invite any of her family as well. Since her parents and superhero partner were both dead and her grandparents didn’t celebrate Thanksgiving, she decided she’d really love Jagged and Penny to come instead. As she walks outside, she’s shocked that Fang doesn’t immediately run up to her. 

“Uncle Jagged?” She calls, frowning. Where was he? And why was it so dark out here? Fang was scared of the dark. Jagged never would have brought him outside without more lights on, he was too protective of him. She tenses when she notices a slumped figure next to the bench Jagged had put in the gardens for when she visits. It was one of her favorite places to sit and design. 

“Hello?” She calls, watching the figure for any movement. Seeing none, she steps closer and her stomach drops. Immediately she runs over and checks her Uncle for a pulse. She sighs in relief when she feels it, but the gash on his head is worrisome. How-

“Hello, Birdie!” An amused voice rings behind her, making her blood run cold. She whirls around and manages to catch a glimpse of the man’s pale face before a thick piece of metal flies at her head and the world goes black. 

---

“Jaybird! Where’s Mari and Cass? They’re blowing up on twitter, even MDC liked my tweet!” Dick says happily, making Jason scowl. 

“Did you seriously post my girlfriend all over your twitter?” He asks grumpily. Dick nods. 

“Oh yeah. Her and Cass looked too cute to keep it to ourselves. Where are they anyway?” Dick asks, scanning the room. 

“M said she needed to go talk to her Uncle about something. Personally, I think she was just avoiding you guys. You all crowd her every time you see her.” Jason reprimands, crossing his arms. Replacement rolls his eyes. 

“It’s ‘cause she’s so much cooler than you. And she’s not an asshole like you are.” He says. 

“Something’s wrong.” Cass says, suddenly appearing at Jason’s side. He jumps slightly, but then frowns at her. 

“What?” He asks, surprised to see the deep scowl form on her face. 

“Don’t know.” She huffs. 

“Well if Cassandra believes that something is wrong, we should investigate.” Damian says, looking relieved that he wouldn’t be asked to socialize with anyone. A startled scream from outside makes the five vigilantes tense before running towards the noise. Jason curses when he realizes it’s Penny Rolling, Jagged Stone’s….something. She’s kneeling by a slumped figure, shaking it until a groan escapes it. Jason feels his blood run cold when the figure’s hair catches the light. It’s Jagged. Then where-

“Where’s she? Where’s she at?” Jagged slurs out, blinking wildly. 

“Who?” Penny asks, gently holding the man’s face. Jason frowns at the gash. 

“M. He wanted ‘er.” He says, and though the man is looking around crazily and slurring his words, Jason can tell he’s completely serious. And M-

“Do you mean Marinette?” Jason asks, stepping forward. Jagged frowns, but nods. 

“Crazy clown.” He adds before turning and throwing up in the grass. Jason growls and turns on his heel, ready to go hunt the damned clown down. Out of everyone in this damned city that he could’ve targeted, why did he choose her?

“Jason, wait.” Dick says, grabbing his wrist. “We need to have a plan. Come on. You can’t just go out like this.” He reminds him lowly, Jason’s eyes narrow but he follows anyway. Might as well use the good tools. That fucking clown won’t make it to morning. 

---

Ice cold water falls over her and Marinette sits up, gasping in shock at the sudden temperature change. 

“Little cold, Birdie?” A voice asks before walking around and standing in front of her- a huge smile on his face and a thick piece of metal in his hands.

“Nothing I can’t handle.” Marinette says, trying not to let her voice shake. This was the villain. The one she never wanted to meet. The one that gave her boyfriend nightmares that he couldn’t explain to her. And now she was alone with him. 

“If you’re sure, we could have some...fun before Batsy arrives.” He laughs. 

“Why would Batman show up?” She asks. “You do realize this is just a Halloween costume, right?” She flinches as the piece of metal- a crowbar, she thinks shakily- stops inches in front of her face.

“How stupid do you think I am? Of course it’s a costume. A costume posted by one Dick Grayson. You’re a Wayne, somehow. And Batsy always shows up when a Wayne is involved.” Joker says, his twisted grin making her sick to her stomach. 

“I’m not a Wayne! Batman isn’t going to come for me.” She argues, cursing her decision to not wear her earrings today. Some days were harder than others, especially leaving in a mask. Even if the mask was a costume. Every time she tried to put on her earrings today, she shook and started to panic. Granted, it was probably for the best. Because she would definitely be tempted to transform and she did not want to give Joker that kind of knowledge. 

“Wayne or not, one of the bats will come. You have friends in very high places, Birdie.” Joker tuts, twirling the crowbar in his hand. She flinches as it nears her face, making Joker laugh. “If I wanted to hit you, I would.” He says. She doesn’t even have time to figure out what he means because her shoulder explodes in pain. The pain is blinding and she wants to scream but no sound will come out of her mouth as she gasps for breath. 

“That’s no good. A silent bird is a dead bird. So sing, Birdie.” Joker demands, and he aims slightly lower this time, shattering her left arm. And she screams. The pain tearing at her throat nothing compared to the pain in her arm, her shoulder. She sobs, the shaking making the pain worse, but she was unable to stop. It hurt. 

“S-stop!” She manages to yell, nearly biting her tongue when Joker grabs her chin and forces her to look up at him. 

“Hmm. You’re right! The internet should definitely see this.” He laughs, pulling a phone out. She shakes her head, flinching as he whacks the crowbar against the floor near her chair. He points the phone at her, and she knows he’s recording. The bastard. 

“Hello Gotham! Look at this little Birdie. I’m afraid she flew too far, and now we have to clip her wings.” He says, sighing as if he’s actually apologetic. He sets his phone up on the table and stalks over to her before turning and waving at the camera. She watches him move the crowbar around warily, her breathing shaky. God, she hoped Jason wasn’t watching this. Hoped he was somewhere safe, not trying to go do something stupid. She winces as Joker acts like he’s about to hit her, only to stop before the crowbar actually connects with her good arm.

“I told you, I’d only hit you if I wanted to.” He chuckles. 

“Go to hell.” She spits out, ignoring the voice in her head (that sounded suspiciously like Tikki) telling her to shut up. To not antagonize the crazy man with the crowbar. 

“Gladly.” He says with a grin, rearing back and swinging the crowbar out to hit her in the ribs. Her scream echoes around the room and she has no time to catch her breath before he’s attacking her ribs again. Tears stream down her face, but she can’t scream, she can’t even catch her breath. I’m going to die, she thinks, and the thought is terrifying. She didn’t want to die, she wanted to live. 

---

“Do we have a fucking location or am I about to go shoot up every goddamned warehouse in this city?” Jason growls as he zips through the streets on his bike. He knew Babs and Alfred were back at the cave, watching the livestream and working to locate Marinette. And even though he couldn’t see the video, the audio playing through the comms was enough to make his stomach churn. 

He didn’t give one singular fuck what Bruce said. He was going to kill that goddamned clown the minute he saw him. 

---

Marinette glares at the Joker, barely able to keep her head up. For some unknown reason, he’d decided to use his fists on her face instead of the crowbar. Not that she was complaining. She wouldn’t have survived multiple hits to the head. Not with the force he had. She watches him, and she knows he’s saying something, but she can’t tell what it is. She’s too tired, too hurt, to care what he’s saying anyway. Unless it’s some magical cure to stop her from feeling like she’s broken into a million pieces, she doesn’t want to hear it. 

Eyes wandering behind him, she’s relieved when she notices the costumed figure. The cowl, the cape- Batman did come. How strange. Though, she had assumed that Joker was live streaming. So that could definitely explain that one. Deciding she was out of immediate danger, she lets her eyes droop shut, reveling in the darkness that surrounds her. She let’s it stay, and she can feel things slipping away, some of the pain lessening. It’s nice, until someone is poking her and talking much too close to her. She lets out a whine as the person forces her eyes open. 

“‘m tired.” She mumbles, wincing at the pain that comes with breathing, with talking. 

“I know, kid, god I know. Just keep your eyes open.” A voice says. She blinks, the blue marks on the suit in front of her helping her to identify the vigilante. 

“Couldn’t fight.” She spits out, tears springing to her eyes as her attempt at conversation makes her chest ache. 

“But you’re fighting now, you’re staying awake. You’re doing such a good job, I’m proud of you. Stay awake kiddo.” Nightwing says quietly. She vaguely feels the ropes slide off her wrists and ankles. Fighting to stay sitting up, because slumping will hurt more than she’s willing to allow, she sighs. 

“Jason’s gonna worry.” She mumbles, and Nightwing hums. 

“Ambulance is almost here, kid, just stay awake.” He says instead of asking about Jason. She hopes Jason is okay. Hopes he isn’t mad at himself for letting her go talk to Jagged alone. Suddenly, sirens are close and she lets the world finally slip away.

---

The pain is the first thing that clues her in. She isn’t dead. Which is a relief. But the way her entire body aches, is not a relief. Forcing her eyes open, she sighs at Jason’s slumped form in a chair next to her bed. She wished she knew how long she’d been in the hospital so she could scold him. Because he was still wearing the outfit he had on at the party. Which meant he hadn’t given himself a break. Just as she’s trying to decide how to ask the nurses for pain medicine, Jason’s eyes open. 

“Marinette!” He gasps, starting to lunge forward, then stopping himself. “I thought, god, M, I thought-”

“‘m okay.” She says softly, and he frowns. 

“Okay? You were nearly beaten to death with a goddamned crowbar. You’re not okay.” He argues. She sighs. 

“I’m alive, and I’m with you. I’m okay.” She insists, wincing. He looks like he still wants to argue, but stops himself. He scoots closer and holds her hand, kissing the back of it softly. 

“I’ll never leave you.” He promises. She smiles softly, before falling back asleep, finally safe.

Tag list:  @maribat-october-rarepairs @stainedglassm @kittenmywaythrulife @laydeekrayzee @doll246 @queenz-z @deathssilentapproach-blog @literaryhiraeth @unoriginalmess 

[stxleslyds]

I saw your rant about the Red Hood Movie lol (I agree DC keeps hurting my boy Jason) and you said something that interested me, you mentioned that you don’t like it when Jason is drawn with a bat symbol on him but why? Personally I feel that him wearing the bat symbol makes sense because he’s always tried to fit in with the family and it’s his way of connecting with them because he’s never had a family before. He gets along with his other siblings sometimes so I don’t think it’s ooc. I consider ‘bat symbol’ Jason an era of the past and am perfectly fine with his new Red Hood logo it looks sweet (but I wouldn’t be angry if he had the bat symbol on or not in the future). I’m curious what you’re thoughts are!

Hey there Anon, I have to be honest with you, your ask has been proven very difficult to answer, this here is my third draft. I have decided that instead of explaining my thoughts as I was trying to do in my previous drafts, I will now just link you to some of my past posts when I bring up certain points that make me think Jason should have never worn the bat-symbol on his chest.

Just a heads up, I am not a fan of Batman, the “Batfamily”, or Jason being dragged to any Bat-related content, I think it makes his character bland.

In order to make the answer clear to me as well as to anyone who reads this post, I will be separating my thoughts on how I think Jason’s relationship with Bruce has led me to think that he shouldn’t wear a bat-symbol or be involved with any Batman related content, and how Jason’s relationship with his brothers has led me to think that he isn’t part of any Batfamily or has ever been written as someone with true reasons to consider the others his brothers/allies/friends. I will separate each of those two groups in four different sections: pre-New 52, New 52, Rebirth and Infinite Frontier.

First though I would like to say that Jason as the Red Hood wearing a bat-symbol doesn’t make sense to me from the most basic of things, Jason’s vigilante name has nothing to do with Bats. Who wears bat-symbols? Batman, Batwoman, Batgirl, Batwing… All people that who have the “Bat” prefix on their names, nobody else wears a bat-symbol, Nightwing, Robin, Red Robin (Robin), none of them wear it, so why would Red Hood do it? It just makes zero sense. But anyway, that’s just me being annoying, I guess.

Jason and Bruce’s relationship.

First let’s go back in time to when Jason hadn’t died yet. You said that Jason wore the bat-symbol so he could connect with his family because Jason had never had that before, well, I see things differently, Jason had a family and that was his mother, the mother that he cared for when she was sick and the mother that he saw die to drugs after his father was put in jail. He had a family with her. And then he had a family with Bruce when he was Robin, but because Bruce started to neglect and not pay enough attention to him after he realized they weren’t seeing eye to eye in various things, Jason was pushed to act the way he did when he found that his birth mother was alive and “being manipulated by Joker”.

Jason’s father was abusive with his mother and didn’t care for Jason, Bruce wasn’t ready to be a father (even after Dick) and when Jason started to not want to follow his every rule Bruce neglected him, later his birth mother betrayed him and was one of the people involved in Jason’s death.

My point here is that Jason had a family with one person who died to drugs and then every other “family” that he found ended up betraying him or neglecting him. So, I don’t really think that Jason has much trust in the whole concept of “family” at least not when it comes to any of his experiences outside of Catherine Todd.

Now let’s move to the events of Under the Red Hood where Jason comes back to comics. Jason doesn’t hate Bruce then but he felt betrayed by him and felt like Batman’s whole crusade was not good anymore. Jason expressed several times in that book the fact that he didn’t believe Batman was good for Gotham and that he became a better version of Batman, the Red Hood.

Red Hood could do things that Batman didn’t dare do, he was better. So, why on earth would Jason wear a bat-symbol then? Well, Jason never wore a bat-symbol pre-New 52 when he was wearing his Red Hood suit. NEVER.

Jason didn’t care for Dick or Tim, he saw Dick as inferior to him because of Nightwing’s no killing ways and he was completely indifferent to Tim, his only interactions with him were when he cut his throat a little bit in Batman: Hush and when he called him “the pretender”.

So, Jason wasn’t looking for family he just wanted Bruce to kill Joker for him, and Bruce didn’t. When things got complicated and Jason realized that Bruce was too much of a coward he improvised, he told Batman that in order to stop him from killing the Joker Batman would have to shoot him (Jason). Batman didn’t use the gun, but he did save the Joker by throwing a batarang at Jason’s throat. When Joker detonated the explosives in the building they were in Bruce once again saved Joker from the rubble and didn’t look much for Jason.

That my dead Anon is the first time Bruce betrays Jason in such a big way that made me think that Jason would have never wanted to interact with Bruce in a good way. I will repeat it now, Bruce SAVED the Joker instead of letting Jason KILL the Joker.

After Under the Red Hood we got to see that Jason was alive and well in Green Arrow #69-72, where he made an appearance, there I can say with a 100% certainty that Jason hated both Batman and Bruce. He actively did things that pissed Bruce off and was searching for conflict with the man.

Jason and Bruce don’t interact much after all that because at some point Bruce “died” and that’s where Battle for the Cowl comes in. There is where we see one of the craziest Jason characterizations, there Jason took on the mantle of Batman because Gotham needed Batman (what? Red Hood was created to replace Batman!). But in that book Jason actually harmed both his brothers and left them for dead. In that book we also see a horrible message that Bruce left for Jason where Bruce told him that “Jason was broken and he tried to fix him” and that “Jason was my (Bruce’s) biggest failure”. I don’t know about you Anon, but if my father saw me that way, I would be packing my bags. And Jason didn’t look like he was looking to connect with his “family”.

After all that we don’t see Jason until Batman and Robin vol.1, where we see the weirdest characterization of Red Hood, this Red Hood hates Batman and would kill anyone just because. Jason had zero need to connect with his family there.

I just want to remind you here that Jason never wore a Batman symbol until here in his Red Hood suits, he only wore the symbol when he ��was” Batman and that was OOC.

So now I welcome you to the New 52, where Jason wears a bat-symbol on his Red Hood suit for the first time. I HATE New 52 Jason Anon; you will find zero love for him here. That man wore a bat-symbol on his chest even though he didn’t believe in Batman’s ways and while he had this internal conflict about whether he hated or not Bruce. This Jason gave up a memory from his Robin years with Batman because he didn’t care enough to keep it, then he was seen acting like an ass towards Bruce and Barbara in the “Court of Owls” event.

But this whole shit show was written by Lobdell and one day he decided that Jason cared about what Bruce thought and let us know that maybe Jason secretly admired Bruce (in the post I will link here! I talk about what happened in those issues among other things). That story would be followed by Batman and Robin vol.2 #20, or what I like to call “the second time Bruce betrayed Jason in an even more painful way”. I am not going to explain what happened there, but I will like here! the post where I talked about what happened there and why I think that Jason should have never been on good terms with Bruce again from that moment on.

In that post I also discuss how much of an abusive and manipulative person and father, Bruce has and can be. He is a disgusting human being and Jason called him out about it but DC loves to write Bruce being abusive and then swiping it under the rug, Jason being on good terms with Bruce or wearing a bat-symbol on his chest is just horrifying after witnessing that issue, and it normalized Bruce’s abusive behaviour when issues later the same writer (Tomasi) had Jason interact with Bruce as if nothing had happened.

After that Jason was seen interacting with Bruce when the latter lost his memory, Jason even hugged Bruce there, it was OOC, and like I said it normalized Bruce’s abusive behaviour or at the very least made it look as something of no real importance.

Now, we are entering the Rebirth era of Bruce and Jason’s relationship, Jason was still wearing that fucking bat-symbol on his chest and this time around Jason even made a deal where he wouldn’t kill anyone while in Gotham (RHatO vol.1 #6), Lobdell even wrote them as being all buddy-buddy after the mess that was the New 52, absolutely disgusting.

Jason didn’t interact with Bruce in Rebirth that much, in fact the next time that Batman made a big appearance in the Red Hood book was in Red Hood and the Outlaws vol.2 #25, yeah, the issue where Batman beats the living shit out of Jason twice because he thought that Jason had killed Penguin. Father of the year, Jason wasn’t dying to be part of Bruce’s family, he was just brutally beat to be part of it. Bruce also ripped the vat-symbol off of Jason’s chest and told him that he didn’t “belong” with him or in Gotham any more. The AUDACITY of that bitch, can you believe? Jason belongs in Gotham as much if not more than Bruce.

Later when Red Hood and the Outlaws became Red Hood Outlaw, we saw Bruce and Jason interact again when Bruce informed Jason of Roy’s death, hugged him and also told him that he was still not allowed in Gotham, what a swell guy that Batman lad!

After that Batman went after Jason Todd when Jason came back to Gotham (without King Batman’s permission) and told the world that Jason Todd was alive and well and taking over Penguin’s Casino. Jason actually threatened Batman with revealing too much information about himself to the world (meaning, Jason threatened Bruce with revealing his secret identity) and that was that. Jason and Bruce only saw each other a few times when DC needed to make money with one of their boring ass events like Joker War and Bruce was shown “welcoming” Jason to Gotham in Red Hood Outlaw #51 or #52, I don’t remember but either way, it was absolutely hilarious and made zero sense. I am sorry, but after Bruce being a manipulative, abusive and all around a horrible person, I don’t feel anything except rage when they make them interact as if they cared for one another.

Shit hits the fan in Infinite Frontier with Urban Legends: Cheer, once again instead of explaining what happens there, I will just link you to the six posts I made about that mini. Part one, Part two, Part three, Part four, Part five and Part six.

Here I will only talk about the comeback of the bat-symbol in Jason’s life. Like you said Jason used (still has in some books) his own logo on his chest after Bruce ripped off the bat-symbol and told him to fuck off. That Red Hood logo was still done with the bat-symbol in mind and I just thought that it was ugly, like, there is no need for a logo if you are going to give him an ugly one along an even uglier suit. But that’s not what matter here, what matters is that the bat-symbol IS making a comeback because at the end of UL: Cheer, Bruce gives Jason a brand new (ugly) suit that has the bat-symbol again. That gift comes as a slap to the face after the disaster that was that book, from every point of view that mini should have not come out to the public. But it did because it forced the “Batfamily” down our throats through Bruce deciding to welcome Jason back to the “family” by giving him a suit with HIS logo on the Red Hood suit that kinda looks to me like Bruce saying “glad that I own you too as well”. The whole bat-symbol thing doesn’t sit right with him and sadly I don’t see it like a “Jason era of the past”, I see it like a metaphorical jail for Jason’s character, he is not free to be the character that he is supposed to be (a perfect opposite to Batman that shows that duality MUST exist in Gotham), and instead all we get is another Batman wannabe that is just as boring as the Batman himself.

Jason and his brother’s relationship.

The funny ha-ha thing with this is that we are not supposed to see Dick, Jason, Tim and Damian as four brothers (and to be honest I have never seen them four as brothers, as far as I see it, Jason hasn’t had a brother since before died). DC always makes it clear that Damian is Bruce’s only son so yeah, there is a big misunderstanding there within DC themselves, they have no problem with trying to sell us their absolutely nasty version of a family but at the same time they refuse to acknowledge any one except for Damian as Bruce’s son.

Even though I don’t necessarily believe that Jason sees his brothers as such I still call them that way because they were/are all Bruce’s children.

But this is not about Bruce so let me talk about Jason’s interactions with his brothers in the pre-New 52 era. So, as I said earlier in this post Jason didn’t think Dick was a big deal in UtRH because *just* like Batman Dick never killed and his way didn’t work or whatever (if only Jason knew what Dick did), and with Tim, Jason was mostly indifferent, he only hurt him a little bit in Batman: Hush (for the little bit that he took Clayface’s place) and then he referred to him as “the pretender”. Then we jump to the events of Teen Titans for Tim and Nightwing for Dick. In Teen Titans #29 Jason went to Titans Tower and beat the living hell out of Tim just because, now that thing was OOC and written by Geoff Johns but it existed and it further proves that DC writes this “family” through violence every time they can and then they just hope we forget it happened. With Dick, well, there was the Brothers in Blood arc where Jason dressed up as Nightwing and killed people in his name, he did it because he wanted to “bond” with Dick because he thought that Dick had killed Blockbuster, the whole arc was a mess and I can tell you this about it, Jason wanted to bond for all the wrong reasons and Dick was written as actually preferring Jason to be dead.

Then we jump right into Battle for the Cowl and even though (once again) this Jason was extremely OOC he did try to kill both Damian and Tim and fought Dick too, so, so far, I am not seeing Jason wanting to connect with his brothers, it was more like him going “be robin to my weird ass version of Batman or suffer!”. It was just weird.

Then there was Batman and Robin vol.1, where Jason’s Red Hood was just a blood thirsty and crazy and he didn’t want to be part of any family. I might not like Jason being written as part of the family but what this book had going on was not it.

Now, get ready because it is New 52 time again and this is messier than his relationship with Bruce in this timeline. The most recognizable relationship (or lack of thereof) was Jason and Dick. Lobdell just let us know one thing about what Jason thought of Dick and that was HATE. Jason HATED Dick, why, you ask? Oh, um, no one really knows, the only panel we were shown as “proof” of why Jason hated Dick was when Jason was acting like a little bitch when Dick was teaching him stuff during patrol (RHatO vol.1 #6). But, yes, Jason “had” (apparently) a good relationship with Tim. Yeah, no gracias, listen, Jason and Tim having brunch for two pages (RHatO vol.1 #8) isn’t making me believe that Jason cares or sees Tim in a good light, just throwing a brunch between them isn’t proof of them being the best of brothers but then again Lobdell loved giving Jason every character trait and relationship that Dick once had (examples: Tim, Roy and Kory). That brunch didn’t mean much because later on during the Death of the Family event Jason almost killed Tim (Teen Titans #16) to “save” his father from Joker (talk about bad writing). Jason and Damian had a very weird and forced “bonding” moment in that same event (you can include Damian to the relationships that Lobdell borrowed from Dick), all of the sudden Jason cared for Damian and he was acting all brotherly, because “they worked together” as different people in Batman Incorporated #4, this weird interaction between Jason and Damian (it can only be called weird because it looked out of place and you cannot change my mind, even Jason thinks it is weird in those panels) happened in RHatO vol.1 #17. In that same issue is where Jason tells Dick that he was trash because he didn’t want to say hi to Kory and kinda tells him that Dick “underestimates” Kory, listen, New Teen Titans isn’t a book that I enjoy reading most of the time but Lobdell needs to do some re-reading himself, Dick isn’t trash to Kory, Lobdell was trash to Kory. Anyway, at that point in time, Jason had a bad relationship with Dick, a secret admiration for Bruce, and a weird ass relationship with Tim and Damian.

Before we go on let me tell you what I think about the whole New 52 dynamic. Jason was used as a replacement of Dick Grayson. Dick was the one that had good relationships with his brothers and father, Jason up until the start of New 52 didn’t care for Tim or Damian, hated Bruce and kinda had a soft spot for Dick. In the New 52 the tables were turned. Jason’s relationship with Tim was never developed in paper, they for some reason were friends only when they stood together like they did in Robin War and Batman and Robin Eternal, there was never development or a reason as to why they “were in good terms”, they just *were*. The whole Jason and Damian thing didn’t last long because Damian died and then the whole mess of Batman and Robin #20 happened with Bruce.

Ahh, Grayson #12, the time when Jason and Tim’s last braincell died, they threw so much shit Dick’s way and for nothing. I will forever be mad at this, they really thought that Dick of all people faked his death, and because Bruce was conveniently amnesiac nobody dared say “hey, wasn’t it Bruce the one that told us that Dick was dead?”, seems to me like New 52 Jason and Tim can go be friends with that one braincell all by themselves. This is not family; this is people teaming up with whoever so DC can sell another weird comic event. Also at that time Damian was alive and Jason couldn’t have cared less about him being there (maybe it was because Jason was there when Damian was resurrected? Who knows?).

And now we jump to Rebirth because I hate the New 52. Tim was nowhere to be seen. Jason just forgot Tim existed and it wasn’t until the Red Hood Outlaw era in which we saw Jason interact with Damian again. What we did see, was a reconciliation between Jason and Dick, Jason was written as acting completely different in RHatO Annual #1, Jason respected Dick and his work and also said that Dick “had been a better brother than he had given him credit for”. Then Jason appeared once in Nightwing and they talked about Dick’s new girlfriend. And that was that for a long while.

As I said, during the RHO era Jason and Damian shared a couple of issues in the Teen Titans run, I have talked about these issues before in two posts (Post 1 and Post 2) but I will summarize what happened there here quickly.

Apparently, Jason and Damian had been working together in secret (never shown in actual comics), Jason gave Damian targets and intel of people for Damian to put in his secret prison for villains. When Damian and the Titans go after a target something goes wrong and the Titans end up hurt. Damian goes after Jason without a second thought and accuses him of betraying him, a physical and emotional fight ensues and it ends with Jason promising that if he sees Damian again, he will kill him. That’s all for Jason and Damian being on good terms in Rebirth.

But it all changes in Infinite Frontier, in August of 2021 we see the *real* comeback of the “Batfamily” in Robin #5. Dick, Damian, Jason, Tim and Stephanie appear in this issue but the only things of essence happen between Jason and Damian and Dick and Damian. Only one of them made sense, and it wasn’t Jason and Damian.

Jason was there to bring Damian back to Bruce. Listen, the last time Jason and Damian were seen together they were actively hiding their work from Batman and then they ended promising to kill each other, and now Jason came fresh out of Urban Legends: Cheer #6 wanting Damian to go back to Bruce. Damian tricks Jason into a hug, but surprise! it wasn’t a hug, Damian electrocuted Jason to get him of his back.

And that’s all.

-

I understand that there have been moments where Jason has been written as wanting to connect to one or two people from the “family” but its never developed or based on something of true essence. You might consider it actually strong family connections but I just don’t see it that way.

Jason wearing a bat-symbol after the abuse and manipulation that Bruce put him through in new 52 onwards is just dumb to me. And given Red Hood’s origin, Jason wearing a bat-symbol in the first place is absurd and goes against everything that he once was.

Jason officially started wearing the bat-symbol again in Detective Comic's back up story written by Rosenberg and will continue to use it in the ongoing book Task Force Z.

The bat-symbol is annoying but Rosenberg writes Jason beautifully so yeah, I am biased there...

We just have different opinions on the matter Anon, but don't take this post as an attack towards you and what you think, it is just that I just don't like Jason being involved with anything Batman.

I hope you have a fantastic week Anon!

[anondudeao3]

Fic Recs!

Since I'm on hiatus, I've finally had time to do some reading, and I thought I'd give some fic recommendations, since I won't be posting for quite a while. These are my absolute favourites!

(I split this into two posts — one for JayDick and one for JayTim — because once I finished with the first half, I realised it was quite long)

JayTim

19th of October

By: gothamnight

Word Count: 8,395

Summary: Jason's stuck in a time loop and forced to relive the same day over and over again. Surprisingly, it's not that bad when he spends every day with Tim.

→ A 'Groundhog Day' scenario! It's so (bitter)sweet seeing Jason slowly fall in love with a Tim who completely doesn't even remember that they don't hate each other. And a happy ending!

Honeymoon

By: cinnamon_skull

Word Count: 14,793

Summary: Tim and Jason go undercover as a just-married couple celebrating their honeymoon in order to catch a high-profile drug lord. Hand-holding, kissing, secret rendezvous and bed sharing ahead.

→ Who doesn't love a good fake relationship fic? The ever-mounting tension between Jay and Tim is just chef's kiss, and seeing the difference between the ease with which Tim seduces people for the case vs how flustered he gets when things get too intimate with Jay is hilarious.

Worlds Apart

By: commanderquill

Word Count: 22,984

Summary: “Let me get this straight,” Bruce says, in full Batman regalia save for the cowl hanging from his neck, and Jason shuffles awkwardly. “You met the only merboy in all of Poseidonis, and within minutes of knowing him agreed to break into Atlantis’ highest acclaimed science laboratory to steal an experiment of top research priority, because it felt like the right thing to do? Even though you didn’t actually know what you were doing at first?”

“Was he cute?” Barbara pipes in with zero grace. “What?” she says in response to Bruce’s look. “It’s an important question. Boys are stupid around pretty people. You’ve met Dick, right?”

→ Okay, this one is pre-slash, but it's so fucking cute and well written I had to include it! It's little Jay and little mer!Tim having an adventure (small heist) together! It's so fun, you won't regret reading it. (I also recommend checking out their other works, especially 'One Step Closer', although it is unfinished and possibly abandoned it's so good. More kid Jay and Tim goodness!)

Forget Me Not

By: wellthatjusthappend

Word Count: 30,423

Summary: “It’s always nice to know how disposable we are to them, isn’t Replacement?”

“Jason?” Tim’s head snapped up, tension coiling all through him.

“Don’t worry though, we’re gonna prove them all wrong again.”

→ This is a heavy, angry one, but it hits so fucking good. Tim has been missing for almost two years, and when Jason finds him he has a lot to work through with how the whole family assumed he was dead and didn't look for him. Jason is only grudgingly helping him recover at first, and they don't exactly like each other, but watching them slowly get closer, and watching Tim grow into himself and the ways he's changed because of his experience is really beautiful. It's always fun to read morally grey Tim, and the writing really makes it feel so righteous, like Tim deserves to do the things he does.

strange fear i ain’t felt for years

By: Sister

Word Count: 31,350

Summary: “Can’t believe a pretty thing like you has to come begging to the Red Hood,” he says against Tim’s neck. “Thought they’d be lining up down the block for you. Thought Daddy would need to get the shotgun.”

“You’re the one with the shotgun,” Tim points out.

++

Tim’s benched with a broken arm and starts playing Jason’s personal Oracle. Things escalate.

→ Probably hilariously unnecessary to rec this, since it has almost 86.5k views on AO3, but it was one of the (if not possibly the) first JayTim fic I ever read. I reread it somewhat recently and still love it. The whole concept of Tim playing Jay's personal Oracle is one I love dearly, and I go wild for it every time I see it in fics. There's hot phone sex and exciting casefic elements too! If you somehow haven't read this, I definitely recommend!

The Knight's Quest

By: chibi_nightowl

Word Count: 67,449

Summary: Sir Timothy Drake never wanted to be a knight. But when his parents send him off on a quest to slay a dragon, what else was he to do? Of course, said dragon has his own thoughts on the matter and his counterproposal is much more enticing than a fiery death.

→ Ohhhh this one. THIS ONE. The fantasy was done so well. The plot was amazingly engaging, the descriptions were so immersive, the emotion, the worldbuilding. This story has it all. I promise you, you will not regret reading this one, it's positively magical. (I also recommend all of their other works, especially the 'Moon, Snow, and Ice' series! But seriously, all their works. There are so many and I've read them all, and they're all amazing.)

Bite Your Tongue

By: dnawhite76, Prubbs

Word Count: 109,135

Summary: Being raised by a famous actress and and hockey legend, Jason learned at an early age that his dirty laundry would always be up for public display. But that never bothered him until rumors started flying about his relationship with the internet's favorite rookie defenseman.

→ Now, if you're like me and you generally don't like super AU AUs — particularly no capes — (despite the surprisingly several over both rec lists, which I guess just shows that some of the best fics can be the ones that aren't what you're looking for!), you may be thinking why hockey? Just read it. It's so good. I honestly have no fucking clue what made me click it the first time, but I'm so glad I did. I don't know anything about hockey, I have zero interest in sports normally, yet this fic managed to be super engaging and interesting with all of the playing and hockey talk. And also the premise of them being shipped together by fans? Adorable and hilarious.

Edit: because I am just now rereading BYT for the first time in a while and I forgot, just a warning, it does use a slur for Romani once.

[catxsnow]

SPITFIRE J.T.

Summary: Maybe working with the Red Hood wasn’t as bad as you thought it was going to be. 

Warning: Suggestive Sexual Content but nothing major. Jason getting his ass kicked

A/N: I love Jason Todd more than myself. Welcome to my TED Talk

getting 100+ notes on my Puppy Love absolutely warmed my heart, thank you for the support!!

GIF is not mine - I’ve always been a fan of Matthew Daddario as Jason I’m sorry if think otherwise!

Word Count: 3.7k

The thing about being a hero, was that you never felt like a hero.

No matter who you took down, it was never going to be enough. There was always going to be someone to replace the person you caught.  Always someone bigger, badder, and harder to defeat than the last. After years of going through the motions, it was hard to see that your tactics changed to being more violent, more aggressive, but never lethal.

When you first started the game, you would try to make sure that no one would get hurt - including the people that you were going after. Now? Well, you'd have to wipe the blood off your suit and hide the bruises on your knuckles. You were dangerous, but that didn't mean that crime ever feared you.

The first time you saw him, you wondered who dared to try and take your city away from you and your protection. It wasn't hard to find him with his shining red helmet and the echo of ricocheting bullets. You were pissed to begin with that he was there but the fact that he was using guns as well? That just ticked you off.

Your first encounter was bloody, bruised, and maybe even broken. He was standing on the roof top, watching the people down below to see what was going on. After being in the hero game for a while, it was a little too easy to sneak up on people. He was just as surprised to feel a boot slam into his back with such force that he fell forward.

Your costume was sleek, skin tight, and as dark as the night itself. It took him half a second to realize that it was just a girl that had taken him down. His brief moment of underestimating you had been a mistake and you had taken the opportunity.

In a quick, precise, sequence of attacks, you took Jason down in seconds. You knew that one of his shoulders were popped out of place and the wind was knocked out of him. Your foot pressed into his chest the second he landed on his ass. His guns were knocked out of his hands and he was rendered defenseless by someone he didn't even know.

"Get out of my city," You nearly threatened him. This red helmet guy never said a word and you left without another. If you could take him down that easily the first time then you doubted that he was much of a threat - especially when he was hiding behind guns as a weapon.

Jason was in awe of you the moment that he saw you standing above him. However, he was also extremely pissed off - and that was something you should have been worried about. But, after not seeing him again for a week, the thought of him was out of your mind and you didn't think that he was going to come back.

That was your mistake.

Jason Todd was not the kind of person that someone should have messed with and you had pissed him off the second you laid eyes on him. While you thought he was gone from your home, he was actually picking up on your nightly routine. Where you would go as a vigilante, what your fighting style was like, he knew you just as much as you knew yourself.

You had been in the hero game for a while now. After seeing kids being slaughtered on your last day of high school, you wanted to make sure that no other kid had to go through that as well. Instead of going to like post-secondary like you had wanted, you had trained and trained until you knew that you could take down anyone that stood in your way.

Ten years later and you were standing there about to face your greatest foe yet: the Red Hood.

After not expecting to see Red Hood again, you were taken down by surprise while out on patrol. Jason had pulled the same trick on you that you had pulled on him. He had sneaked up behind you and pinned you to the ground. You didn't think that you would ever see this man again, yet here you both were.

Jason stood above you the same way that you had all those weeks ago with the exception of having a gun pointed at your head. "Who are you?" He asked with a modulated voice. As much as he had discovered about your fighting style, he never learned about your personal life or anything about who you really were.

"Get that gun out of my face and I might tell you," You snapped. Jason didn't budge. Using your elbow, you jammed it into the side of his knee with every ounce of strength you had. Thankfully he became off balanced enough that you could get out from under him and back on your feet.

The gun that Jason held was forced out of his hand and into your own. The moment that he realized you held one of his weapons, he had pulled out an identical gun. The two of you had the guns raised at each other. You couldn't see his expression, but judging by his body, he seemed laid back - like he knew you weren't going to shoot him.

After a moment of hesitance, you grabbed the gun by the chamber and held it out for him to take back. He grabbed it out of your hand, stepping back so you were out of arms reach. It was impossible to tell what he was thinking.

Seeing you, in that suit and holding his gun? Jason was more smitten than he wanted to admit.

"Red Hood," Jason told you upon realizing that you weren't going to attack him again. You couldn't see his face from under his helmet but he was eyeing you up like a next meal. Jason was attracted to you without even knowing what all of your face looked like.

"I thought I told you to get out of my city," You sneered at him. Jason holstered his guns and crossed his arms over his chest. “You’re going to get your ass handed to you if you don’t learn to listen to me.”

"I have some business here. The sooner I'm done, the sooner I'll leave," Jason gave you a vague answer. His business had been delayed after you made an appearance in his life. An idea popped into his head. "You know this city. Give me a hand and I'll be out of your life for good."

You hated guns. You hated what they could do to people and you hated being reminded of that terrifying, awful day at the high school every time you heard a shot go off. Yet, some how, up on that roof, you agreed to help this gun slaying vigilante so that he could get the hell out of your city.

After thinking for a couple moments, you stuck your hand out for him to shake. "Deal, Red," You squeezed his hand with a little more force than necessary. "You hurt one innocent civilian in my city and I won't hesitate to kill you myself. We get your guy and then you get the hell out of here and don't come back."

"I think you and I are going to get along just fine, spitfire."

><

You hated to admit it, but you and Jason got along a little too well while working together.

It took another week and a half to gather enough information about the man Jason was after. The two of you scouted and researched during the night, stopping a few criminals along the way. Jason would watch your six and you would do the same for him. In the short time that you worked together, it seemed that you were unstoppable.

Working with him had been an experience that you weren't expecting. On the streets the two of you were vicious, nothing and no one was going to stop you. However, when the two of you were in his hotel room, trying to figure out the connections of everything going on, the air felt lighter.

He would tease you, trying to get any sort of reaction out of you. Normally, you would hate when a man would do that to you, but with Red Hood, you couldn't help but tease him right back. You only hoped that under that helmet that he was at least smiling to your jokes.

He was.

Fighting a bunch of thugs alongside of him was more fun than it had been on your own and it looked like you guys had been at it for years.

You moved in sync with him and without even having to communicate that much, he had your back and you had his. It was as if the two of you were made to fight crime together. The time that it took to find who he was after had gone by far too fast and the night that you went after him finally arrived.

It was down by the docks, a new shipment of whatever he was trying to transport being brought in. You assumed guns, weapons, maybe even drugs. Never in your time in the city had you ever seen anyone try to smuggle in shipments. The bay that you had was small and big ships never made it in. Crime lords never found it worthy to bring in such small shipments until now.

You didn't know who the man was, or what he was bringing in but it had to have been bad. The night that you and Jason went after him was cold and rainy. However, the weather wasn't going to stop all of your hard work of trying to catch this guy.

There weren't many men. Being such a small area, you had to assume that they wanted to gain the least amount of attention as possible. Even only a dozen armed men, it still caught the attention of the Red Hood, and now, you too.

You and Jason quietly and efficiently took care of all the guards protecting the ship. Once again, the two of you fought so well and you were cherishing that this was going to be your last fight together. Jason was leaving you after tonight and you were a little disappointed.

You didn't know anything about him. Not once had he ever taken his helmet off in front of you or gave you any information about who he was. You were much the same, though. Your mask stayed on and he didn't even know your vigilante name - he continued to just call you spitfire.

So why were you so upset that you were never going to see him again? You didn't know the man, and yet you found yourself wanting - needing - to know more about him. To fight crime with him like this every night.

By the time that you reached the man that Jason was after, everyone that was protecting him was unconscious on the ground and he was left unguarded. Easy to take him down and easy to see what the hell he was trying to bring into the country through your city. He gave up like a scared puppy with his tail between his legs.

You and Jason looked intimidating above him. Between his broad shoulders, wide stance, and weapons laced up his legs and your arms wrapped snugly around his neck, he was terrified.

The shipment he was trying to bring in was destroyed with the help of Jason's tech that he carried around. It was hundreds of kilos of drugs and there was no chance that you were going to let that anywhere near the people of your city. The man and his crew were tied up and awaiting the police.

You and Jason got out of there before they showed up and ended up on the same roof top that you had met. "Guess this is goodbye," You crossed your arms over your chest, suddenly feeling uncomfortable. "Thank you, Hood. I would have never discovered that shipment in time."

Jason shrugged. Upon arriving in the city, he didn't care if those drugs had gotten into the city - he cared about the guy in charge and how he could lead Jason one step closer to taking down Black Mask once and for all. After spending time with you, and seeing how much you cared for the city, he knew that he couldn't let those drugs get loose.

"Do you want to get a drink?" You asked, suddenly. "I like to think that my liquor collection is quite extensive and to be honest, I could use a hand to finish up some bottles."

Jason knew that going for a drink would mean that he would have to reveal himself to you. However, he also knew that you would have to do the same. As much as he didn't want to expose himself about his real identity, he also knew his curiosity of who you were under your own mask was to great to let go of.

So, he agreed.

The two of you jumped from roof top to roof top until you finally stopped on the roof of an apartment building. The two of you used the fire escape to sneak into your home, making sure that no one saw either of you.

Jason was in awe as he saw your home. It was a decent size studio apartment and the decor you had was simple, elegant, and nothing like he expected. Out on the streets, you were ruthless, didn't hesitate to break a few bones when necessary, and you didn't have a fear of getting your hands dirty. Your apartment didn't share the same appearance.

While you left to get out of your wet suit, Jason looked around your place. He picked up the variety of mugs that you used, wondering why you had picked each of the different designs and how much they matched your personality. Leaving your small kitchen area, he looked at the pictures you had around your home.

The picture of you and your parents caught his attention. He could tell that it was you, without your mask you were drop-dead gorgeous. Jason admired you from the picture, still shocked that you were willing to trust him with your identity. He nearly dropped the picture as you came out of your room.

Your black suit had been replaced with an old shirt with your high school logo on it as well as a pair of cotton shorts that were a little too short to wear in public. Jason was thankfully that he was still wearing his helmet, at least then you couldn't see his eyes latched onto you.

"Guess it's time for a proper introduction," You told him, sticking your hand out. "My names (Y/N) (L/N)."

Jason finally brought himself out of daze. You watched as he brought his hands up to his helmet and lifted it off his head. Your breath caught in your throat, under that intimidating red helmet was the most gorgeous man you had ever seen in your life. Black hair with the smallest tuft of white in the front. Bright blue eyes locked onto yours.

His jawline was sharp and he had high cheek bones that put yours to shame. You already knew just by looking at him that under that dripping wet suit of his, that his body was incredible. Broad shoulders, muscular thighs, you had to assume that his torso was just the same.

Holy shit, you had no idea he was going to be this attractive.

"Jason Todd," he finally shook your hand. "If I would have known you were this beautiful I would have tried to get you back to your place a long time ago."

"Trust me, I was thinking exactly the same thing."

><

You woke up the next morning completely naked at a strong arm wrapped around your waist. There was a slight pain in your head, but not nearly close to the worst hangover that you've had. Jason. Jason had come over and the two of you had drank away a couple of the nearly empty bottles of whiskey you had.

The night was filled with stories of the horrors each of you saw on the streets and the life threatening wounds that you had received. It felt as if it was a competition to who had seen the worst and had the worst done to them. Jason had won, easily, when he announced that he had died and come back to life.

You didn't question who had done it, or what his life was like before he died. The look in his eyes told you enough - he didn't want to talk about it. You couldn't blame him. You were basically a stranger to him and although he might have trusted you enough to not let him die, he didn't trust you with his secrets.

Jason brought the topics to something more light. He talked about the places he had seen, the people he got to meet - and even some of the iconic Justice League members he worked with. Though you thought that it was incredible that he knew someone of the biggest heroes in the world, he made sure that you knew that they were nothing like they were projected to be.

One thing led to another, drinks upon drinks, and you had ended up leading him into your bedroom. Jason proved your point that in fact every part of his body was just as incredible as you thought it would be. You had sex quite a few times, but he was easily the best - and biggest - that you've ever had.

The moment that you stirred awake, Jason's arms pulled you tighter against his bare chest. You absorbed the warmth his body radiated. Waking up like this was a rare case for you. Often times you had to leave with a walk of shame or had awoken and left your home before whoever was in your bed was would wake.

This morning with Jason felt different. Everything with him felt different. You didn't feel the need to prove yourself to him or run away in shame. From what you learned about him the night before, Jason was the kind of man that saw the flaws in a person, but he was also willing to accept them.

Jason saw your flaws and instead of running from them, he embraced them. He saw you for the person that you were, not the kind of person that you showed yourself to be in front of everyone. He was quick to realize your facade and cut through the bullshit of it.

Soft kisses trailed up your back and your neck. The warm air suddenly felt cool and a shiver raked over your body. Jason couldn't get enough of your taste, you noticed that the night before and it was the same that morning too. His lips constantly only any bare skin he could find.

"Jason," you breathed out. The moment you rolled over to face him his lips were on yours and you were succumbed into the same trance you were in last night. The warmth in you chest, between your legs, god, his touch was addicting. "Jay," you broke apart trying to get his attention.

He was supposed to leave that morning. Jason came to your apartment last night to have a drink to say goodbye and today he was going to be gone and never to return. You didn't want to get more addicted to him than you already were in the short two weeks that you worked together.

Jason met your eyes. He pushed the loose hairs out of your face and kept his hand cupped on your cheek. He didn't want to leave you that morning. Not when he felt something other than anger and frustration since he came back from the dead. He wasn't aware of what this feeling was, but he knew he needed more of it.

But you wanted him out of your city. You told him that when you agreed to help him take down this criminal. As much as he didn't want to heed to his promise, he knew he needed to. Messing with you was something that he didn't want to do. He knew how deadly you were, and he didn't dare want to get on your bad side.

Just because you slept with him, didn't mean that you wanted him to stay. At least, that was what he thought.

"How do you feel about sticking around a little longer? I could use your help to take out some more guys," You suddenly asked. Your fingers trailed up his bare chest and then began to play with the scruff on his face that had grown over the few days. It was risky to ask him, you didn't want him to think that you were clingy, but you wanted to get to know him. You wanted to appease your cravings of him.

Jason held shock in his eyes but kept from making any faces with your question. He thought you would want him gone, out of your life forever. He wasn't going to be good for you - not when your ideals of how to save the city were different. He was just thankful that your line wasn't so far back as Batman's.

You knew that sometimes, lives had to be taken to solve any real problems - you just didn't want to admit it. You knew that you could never take a life, but you also knew why Jason could. Maybe you could learn from each other, maybe you could both learn yourselves to become more suited to the world you lived in.

Maybe that feeling in your chest when you were with him was meant to be more than just an addiction. Even after all these years you had so much to learn - and not just about crime fighting, but about life too. And maybe, just maybe, it was going to be Jason that was going to be the one to teach you these things, to learn these things with him.

"I was hoping that you'd keep me around, Spitfire."

[anjuschiffer]

Amira Wayne - Chapter 11

A/N: Something I want to address - Updates will be coming slowly because not only am I writing this fic as I go, I have other irl issues that need my full attention. Just wanted to let you guys know incase you see inconsistent updates in the future.Thank you for reading and understanding! <3

Day 11 of @biodad-bruce-month event!

Chapter 11: The “Talk”

-

P.Tag: @theatreandcomicfreak @damianette-is-life @toodaloo-kangaroo @elijahcrevan

Tag: @vixen-uchiha @we-want-mini-mini @ramos123 @bluesimani @redscarlet95 @greatcatblaze @promiswords @fantasiame @corabeth11 @anonymously-odd @alexandriamw @officiallydarkgeek

-

MASTERLIST | FIRST | PREV | AO3

The weekend ended up uneventful (in terms of akuma attacks), allowing Amira to catch up with Dick and Wally. 

The three went to the arcade the following day, Dick smiling the entire time as he watched Amira enjoy herself. 

He watched as she went from arcade machine to arcade machine, pulling Wally along. He watched as she cursed out claw machines but shouted in victory at the pinball machines. 

He watched as Wally showed her how the ring toss worked, Amira easily nailing it after watching Wally miss his second and fourth shot. 

Dick watched as the two ventured around the arcade, Amira racking up the tickets as time went on. In the end, she was able to get herself the most expensive prize there. 

“Did you seriously just spend all day trying to get that?” Wally asked her, earning a huff. “And wait, where’s the other one?”

Wally looked as Amira swung around the lit up dagger, watching as she twirled it around with ease. The soft lavender glow came to a halt when Amira placed it on her holster that would usually carry an actual dagger.

“I can protect myself with just one.” Amira tried to brush off, only to confess when she saw Dick raise a brow. “I gave my other one to the girl that was beside me at the prize area. Every girl deserves to have a weapon.”  That caused the two boys to laugh, causing Amira to pout.

“Whatever you say, Mimi.”

“Shouldn’t we start heading back home? Looks like it's about to rain.” Wally pointed out. 

Looking at the darkening skies, the trio agreed to call it a day.

-

Amira had a bounce to her step as she entered the apartment, bouncing onto the sofa and grabbing the remote to see what was on the news.

Much to her disappointment, it was some news coverage about Batgirl’s latest appearance. 

“-amateur footage of the vigilante taking down-”

Amira quickly flipped to another channel, a frown now on her face.

“If you keep doing that, you’re going to end up with scowl lines for life.” Dick commented, taking out some ingredients to cook.

“Did you know about Drake replacing Jason?” Amira asked out of the blue, causing Dick to almost drop the cabbage in his hands. “Or what about Barbara being Batgirl?

“I...I didn’t know about Tim being the new Robin.” Dick stuttered, placing down carrots and potatoes on the table. He didn’t want this day to come. But he knew he was going to have to eventually tell Amira the truth. “I recently found out about it when I went to the Cave to retrieve some data. As for Barbara being Batgirl…”

He could feel Amira’s eyes on him, analyzing his every move. Taking a deep breath, Dick continued. “I was the one who gave her the mantle.”

Amira dropped the remote in her hands, staring at Dick with wide eyes. 

“You?” Amira whispered. “You asked her to become Batgirl?” Amira felt her chest begin to twist. 

“Amira, Bruce needed-“

“Why did you drag Babs-”

“I didn’t- she, ugh.” Dick ran a hand through his hair. “I didn’t drag her into this. She already knew about us.” Dick defended. “I simply-“

“Then why did you let her! Why did you encourage her?” Amira screamed. “She didn’t need to be roped into our messed up family-”

“Gotham needed him back.” Dick cut off. “Gotham needed Batman back. And we both knew that. We understood that. With his head still in the gutter-”

“Then why didn’t you stay there with him?” Amira cried, hating that she was having trouble breathing. “Why didn’t you-”

“Because I couldn’t forgive him with what he did to you!” Dick shouted, Amira watching him look down at his feet despite his head being held up high. “He shouldn’t have sent you to Paris when we were all mourning Jason!  He should’ve let you go to the funeral, to visit him one last time before forcing you out of the country! He didn’t have to push you away just because he was mourning!” Duck didn’t care if his shoulder shook or if his voice warbled a bit. 

This was Amira. He could trust her. She was his sister. 

Amira watched as Dick walked up to the couch and plopped next to her. “We both know he’s still in mourning, hell all of us are. But that doesn’t excuse him for doing the shit he did!” Dick growled out before letting out a deep sigh. “Did you know he almost sent me to Germany?”

“Germany?”

“Alfred told me after I fled here.” Dick threw himself back, looking up at the ceiling fan. “To think he would try to pull that on me as well.”

“I...I didn’t know.” Amira said, pulling her legs to her chest and resting her forehead on her knees. All this time, she was venting towards Dick and she never asked how he was dealing with all this. He had to deal with all of his emotions on his own, storing them inside while he played peacekeeper. 

How selfish she was. How stupid and blind did she have to be to not notice her brother’s suffering? 

“Where are you going?” Dick asked her as she got up and started to storm towards the window. She whispered ‘Spots On’, watching as a soft red glow engulfed her. “Amira!” She heard Dick yell, but she didn’t turn back.

The sun was beginning to set, but she didn’t care. She was Ladybird. She can handle a few Gothamite thugs. With that in mind, Amira got on the railing before dropping from it and swinging herself towards Gotham.

-

If there was one thing any villain in Gotham hated, it was newbies waltzing into their terf. 

As for Selina, the moment she noticed this newbie, she knew something was up. After all, no one survived longer than ten minutes while on enemy turf. 

“I’ve never seen you around here before.” Selina looked at the girl from top to bottom, critiquing the girl’s choice of red and black. “New to the game, aren’t you?” She asked, noticing a dagger hidden within the shadows cast by her skirt. “Tell me, what brings you to these parts of Gotham?”

Selina watched as the cloaked girl continued to analyze her, trying to circle around her. 

“Okay then, would you like to tell me your name, kitten?”

“Marienkäfer.” The girl spoke, glaring at her with an ever so familiar glare through her red domino mask. 

So she spoke German. Great. To be honest, she wished the kid spoke Mandarin just like- “Wie heißt du?“ The girl asked her, or at least Selina judged from the way her brows furrowed a bit. She huffed, knowing this is going to go nowhere without help. 

Pressing her comm, Selina awaited for the other end to pick up. 

“Hey. Got a kid here who only speaks German. No, she doesn’t seem- yea. Yes she’s wearing- wait hold on. What do you mean-“ a frustrated sigh left Selina. 

What did he mean by he knew her? 

Selina kept watching over the girl, deciding to watch her as the girl started to make her way towards her. 

Her hooded cape flew back from the autumn breeze, exposing the girl’s midnight hair. 

Selina watched as the girl stood mere feet away from her, her green eyes holding a curious twinkle in them. She saw how the girl approached her before quickly falling back, her hand hovering over something at her side. Was that a yo-yo?

“Is this the girl you were talking about?” Bruce’s voice trickled down Selina’s back. 

“Why do you always have the need to do that?” Selina hissed, but Bruce remained silent. “Anyways, how do you know her?” She frowned when he ignored her. 

“Amira.” Bruce called out, Selina watching as the girl didn’t budge. “Amira, what-”

“She smells like you.” The girl -no- Amira said, Selina watching her scowl. So she knew English, so why did she act as if she didn’t know it? 

Or did she do it on purpose? Was it just a ploy?

“What-“

“Your cologne...it’s all over her...the cologne I gave you for your birthday two years ago.” Amira growled. “That could only mean one thing. When were you going to introduce us to each other, Father?”

Selina looked at Amira and then at Bruce for some type of explanation. She was his daughter? Why is she learning about this now? As far as she knew, he only had Dick and Jason...and currently Tim.

“Bats, explain.” Selina demanded, Bruce feeling a headache starting to form.

“Fine. But not here.”

-

Selina felt as Amira continued to glare at her, Selina starting to hate the attention from the younger Wayne.

They finally arrived at the manor, currently walking towards Bruce’s study. Of course, Amira didn’t change out of her costume yet, walking in the red and black suit.

“So Amira, how come I haven’t heard about you?” Selina decided to ask.

“I wonder.” Amira spat with venom, causing a brow to raise. “It couldn’t possibly have anything to do with my father-”

“Amira.” Bruce cut off, prompting Amira to frown. “I meant to say this earlier, but welcome back home.”

“Home?” Amira let out a dry laugh. “Last I recall, the apartment back in Paris is my home. Not this place despite having been raised here for 13 years.”

“Amira.” 

“I didn’t come back here to see you. I didn’t even plan on seeing you, yet you always seem to find a way to find me.”

“Amira, you said you used to live here for 13 years. So tell me, how old are you?” Selina asked, hoping to ease the suffocating tension. 

“Turning 14 in July. And you don’t have to worry about having to see me for the rest of the year. I’m going back to Paris in a few hours. After that, I won’t be back in Gotham for another half year or year.” Amira looked at Selina, her eyes dull and void of the anger from earlier. “Father’s never let me attend any gala or any event that requires showing my face, so coming back to Gotham would be pointless for me.”

Selina stopped herself from coming to a halt, absorbing Amira’s words. 

She was 14, living in Paris by herself while her family lived in Gotham...not only that, but she seemed so distant to Bruce despite loving -no- adoring Gotham... 

“Bruce, did you really send her to Paris...by herself?”

“What if I did?” Selina let out a scoff.

“Are you being serious right now? Bruce, she’s 14!”

“She’s still a child.”

“And yet you still thought of doing the same thing to Dick and he was 17 at the time, turning 18.” Amira interjected. “

She didn’t know what overcame her, she really didn’t.

“I’m going to Paris with Amira.” She never saw Bruce turn around so quickly before, noticing Amira had the same reaction as him when she said that.

“Selina. You-”

“I’m only going to be there for a week, make sure Amira is doing well and from there, I’ll come back.” Selina walked up to Bruce, sinking her nails into his arm. “After that, you and I are going to have a talk.” She whispered, letting go of Bruce. “So Amira, where are your things?”

Selina waited for a few minutes before getting a response from the girl.

“A-At Dick’s. I didn’t think I was going to be here for that long. I just wanted to talk to my father before heading back, although it seems like there will be a change of plans.”

“You wanted to speak to me?” Bruce asked, wondering what exactly Amira wanted.

“Yes. But of course, in your office.”

-

Selina had gone to pick up Amira’s things from Dick’s apartment, leaving father and daughter by themselves.

“So, what was it you wanted to talk about?”

“Is it true you wanted to send Dick to Germany?” Amira threw out the first thing in her mind, watching as her father tensed. “You could’ve just sent him to France with me. The two of us would’ve kept each other company, be safe with each other. But no. You thought it was best to separate us, to keep us isolated from each other because-”

“I...I didn’t actually want to send him to Germany.” Bruce confessed. “I...I also didn’t want to send you to Paris either, but I knew that if I didn’t, the two of you ran the risk-”

“But isn’t that why you fight? Wasn’t becoming Batman the solution to your worries?” 

“I can only do so much. I can only guide the villains towards redemption, I can’t force them to-“

“Then why? Why didn’t you simply kill them off?” Amira asked. “Why don't you just get rid of them...or rather, him? Of Joker? Of the bastard clown that took Jason away from us! Why didn’t you-”

“You don’t understand, Amira. Getting rid of Joker isn’t the solution nor is getting rid of anyone for that matter. Killing isn’t-“

“Don’t you realize it? He’s the main problem. He’s the one racking up the deaths in Gotham. The reason why we have to keep constructing new cemeteries. The madman behind the cruelest tortures. The one who-“

“Killing Joker won’t do anything!” Bruce yelled. “It won’t bring Jason back and it definitely-”

“I never said it would bring Jason back. I said it because if you did kill him, it would bring you peace of mind. It would make Gotham safer for me...and countless other children.”

“Amira, I don’t think you understand. I don’t think you nor Jason understood.” Jason had told Bruce this before? “Killing only brings out the worst of people.” Amira watched as Bruce walked up to her and placed his hands on her shoulders. “If I were to kill anyone, I won’t be able to get back from there. My hands will no longer withhold the justice I claim to uphold...I also don’t want my children to have a murderer for a father.”

Amira watched as her father shook, but she didn’t care.

“You always said you wanted to be someone we could be proud of. A father whom we adored...but in your mission to become that, you’ve become a stranger to me.” Amira said, pushing Bruce off her. “I claim you my father, but...I don’t know much about you. 

I have a stranger for a father instead of a respected man. 

I found out about your girlfriend-no...fiance around a day ago, only to find out you’ve known her for longer. Did you really think I wouldn’t notice the inconsistencies in her files?” Amira brought up.

“You looked at her files? When? Why?”

“Why wouldn’t I? Despite not being in Gotham, I like being up to date with the news. As for how, I was downloading information from the computer to take back with me to Paris. Got bored and started to look at the criminal files you had there. That’s how I landed on Selina’s file.

To think you’re engaged, nonetheless to a thieve.” Amira glared at her father. “Then again, why am I surprised at you for hiding things from me? You’ve always hid me away from anyone else. Just like how you hid Barbara and Drake from me.”

“I never hid that from-” Amira raised her hand and shook her head.

“I don’t care about that. I don’t care about what the hell you do anymore. But just know this. I will never forgive that bastard from taking Jason away from us. Now, I better get going. I have a plane to catch.”

NEXT

[rickriordanfandam]

opinions on riordanverse ; my edition

a lot of people have been doing this so i decided why not right. probably gna lose some followers or smth but anyways. pls respect my opinions! if u disagree, thats fine, but please be polite. unless any of my opinions strikes u as morally wrong then pls point it out to me respectfully. thanks!

- i actually liked drew. im so sorry to everyone who hates her but full offence, why. think about it this way ok, first of all drew became hc because silena died. silena was the traitor, the one who betrayed chb, yet after she died campers celebrated her as a hero? and then drew suddenly has to replace her and live up to idk that legacy she left behind,, when all of a sudden this girl named piper swoops in and takes her place. idk abt u but i wld be salty abt that too. not only that, but as an asian, the chances of drew having faced racism/bullying as a child is pretty high (she studies at brooklyn academy). which means that when she finds out shes a demigod, and arrives at chb where most of the campers are white (this is an assumption btw), she’d obviously be scared of being bullied for her skin color right?? so the first thing she wld do before the campers get to bully her is to bully them before they can do so. (sentence structure here is wack i apologize) ofc this might not even have happened, drew could have had a perfect childhood && was a b1tch for no reason, BUT EVEN THEN HER ROLE AS A BULLY WAS PRETTY VITAL BECAUSE THAT FURTHER SHOWED THE CONTRAST BETWEEN HER AND PIPER,, HIGHLIGHTING PIPER AS A HERO//GOOD CHARACTER,, AND THEREFORE MAKING READERS LIKE PIPER MORE. anyway stop hating on drew please. ALSO WHY IS THIS SO LONGA SDFJHG

- jason isnt bland, the fandom just kinda erased his backstory (thanks to @pjohoo-memes for the phrasing lol)

- reynabeth wouldnt have lasted/would have broken up several times. idk i just see them as two extremely powerful characters who have firm opinions and will definitely clash at some point. in a platonic relationship,, i can see them as really good friends but as lovers? idk i just think theyll break up

- PIPABETH

- i dont really like jercy,, i see them as better friends than lovers. also idt jason and percy were that close..?

- the dam and not my type jokes are srsly cringey and were never funny. ik that seems hypocritical since my username literally makes use of the dam joke but honestly i dont actually like the joke. its not funny to me and has never been funny

- the seven were not best friends. they definitely argued,, and honestly probably werent as close as the fandom makes them seem. like ure dumped with 6 other people, out of which u only know a few. my introverted ass would have jumped off the argo 2 quicker than leo valdez could bomb camp jupiter up. also leo was a dick to frank. so what if frank is bigger sized?? thats not a valid reason to tease him

- the fandom needs to stop hating on octavian while worshipping luke. if u hate luke and u say u hate octavian too, then okay. but if u tell me ure a luke stan but u despise octavian?? imma disagree w u. luke was worse than octavian im sorry. first of all, octavian being a dick was kinda justified. hes been after the praetor position for so long, and everyone keeps saying to “wait for jason” when suddenly this dude, whos a son of NEPTUNE (neptune wasnt liked much by romans), and the camp decides to make him praetor?? dude i would be pissed off big time. and then afterwards, he finds out that greek demigods are real and the dude they made praetor is greek. AND THEN GREEK DEMIGODS COME TO CJ AND ONE OF THEM BOMB IT UP?? octavian has been told all his life that greeks are scum and this dude called leo valdez attacks cj. sure it was an accident, but did octavian know that? no. so it was honestly justified that he was such a salty prick im just saying. also some of yall be hating on octavian for cutting a teddy bear open and thats the funniest shit ive ever heard i swear 

- luke didnt go to elysium

- travis and connor stoll r way too underrated. the two have been head counselors of the hermes cabin since luke was revealed as a traitor, can u imagine the stress? luke, the person they probably looked up to as a brother, betrayed them. and they didnt even have time to process this when they were  thrown the roles of being hcs. that would have been so stressful and i would probably have broken down if i were them. the stoll brothers taking turns to wake up at ungodly hours because a new camper is crying and homesick and terrified, the stoll brothers having to comfort and take care of new campers, having to deal with the amount of people in that cramped space because not enough campers are being claimed fast enough. having to resolve issues between campers in the hermes cabin all the time. the stolls arent just comedic relief, and we need to stop treating them as such

- tratie shldve been canon idc idc

- demigods of the demeter cabin arent talked about enough and i love the fact that meg was demeters kid. like she isnt the child of one of the big three yet shes so powerful.

- we need to hype clarisse up more her character arc was phucking amazing 

- rachel is overhated. sis found out greek gods exist and regularly come down to earth to fuck around and went “ok cool”. queen shit behavior methinks

- the floor 19 crew of mcga is srsly underrated. like do u even remember halfborn gunderson, mallory keen, tj, etc??? bc i feel like we only remember samirah, magnus, alex, and sometimes blitz and hearthstone

- sadie (tkc) was kinda annoying at first. i like her more now tho but i rmb not liking her for a phat while

- tkc and mcga need more love

- carter kane and jason grace arent boring. theyre just really sweet boys who are too good for this world and yes yes yes 

- hazel and frank (especially frank) need to be hyped up more. i hardly ever see anything about them. also yall seem to forget that frank was literally made praetor and that even hecate admired hazel and was willing to fight beside her because of how powerful she was

- frazels age gap is kinda sketch but i still think theyre really cute

- nico definitely had trauma from going to tartarus on his own

- GROVER IS PERCYS BEST FRIEND

- annabeth isnt smarter than leo but neither is leo smarter than annabeth. ive seen a lot of discussions about who is smarter and heres my hot take on it: neither. theyre equally smart, just in different ways. leos a genius mathematically speaking. he has no issues solving math problems meant for people much, much older than him. annabeth on the otherhand, is great at strategies etc. she can make an army of 1000 more powerful than the enemy, even if theyre outnumbered. so in my opinion, both are equally as smart//u cant compare their intelligence, because their talents lie in two different areas.

- while i do agree rick riordan isnt a god and that hes bound to make mistakes,, AND that hes given us a lot of representation,, if the representation offends the people its sposed to represent, then theres a problem. im talking about piper as a poc and wearing feathers in her hair. im not a poc, so i cant speak for them on whether or not its wrong, because i dont know either. HOWEVER, i have seen multiple posts BY pocs talking about how they didnt really like rick’s representation of piper, and thats an issue. pocs have been and are still oppressed and discriminated against by many. as a white cis man, we cant really blame him for not knowing (tho he could have done a research,, asked some pocs,, idk), but by representing pocs in that manner, hes influencing impressionable kids/teens into thinking “oh pocs wear feathers in their hair all the time” etc, which isnt true. the pjo/hoo series is extremely successful, and kids who read the books will probably start forming inaccurate opinions on pocs. the amount of fan art that depicts piper with feathers in her hair dont help either. “but rick said so in the books, so its canon” yeah well rick isnt a god and he can get some things wrong at times. im not saying we should cancel him, im saying we should start educating ourselves and not spread false info like pocs wearing feathers in their hair all the time. also that snake song shit where she sang Summertime was just- yeah. bc heres the thing you can be racist, and still include minorities, but portray them in a racist way. And even then, ignorance isn't a thing to admire. Getting those facts wrong still has a major impact. It continues to perpetuate racist stereotypes.

“ With the feather thing, I looked it up myself; it takes less than five minutes to figure out that Cherokees don't braid feathers into their hair. I didn't grow up in the country where my parents are from. I have many other first/second generation American friends who have also been through that, with a bit of a disconnect from their culture. But something that most of us have in common is that when we didn't know something, and when our parents weren't that big of a help, we looked it up. We sought out resources online and through other people from our culture to be able to connect more with where we came from. Some of that took a Google search. So I find it hard to believe that Piper, a girl who Rick's trying to portray as someone who is attempting to connect with her culture and is totally against racist stereotypes, wouldn't know that eagle feathers aren't supposed to be braided into your hair casually. She may be disconnected from her culture, but she's also shown to want to connect back to it. Piper wouldn't be casually braiding feathers into her hair while also telling off people for being racist. It makes no sense.” - reddit thread (down below) 

for those of yall who wanna know more please please read this, it has a lot of things i wanna add in here : https://www.reddit.com/r/camphalfblood/comments/gy3gl2/piper_mcleans_portrayal_is_innacurate/ 

as well as https://finding-my-culture.tumblr.com/post/189422373260/maxie-ratties-and-cattie-finding-my-culture 

i will be posting screenshots of these in future posts so if ure viewing this on ig and u dont have tumblr,, dont worry 

- the fact that most of the strong female characters in the series refuse to be “girly”, and ngl i dont really like that. just because ure girly doesnt mean u cant be strong. 

- piper would have been a great way for him to start making the strong characters act girlier, but instead he went with the “I’m not like other girls” trope which is quite obnoxious to hear constantly, and I don’t think it’s necessarily great for younger girls to read that idea growing up.  the closest we've ever had to a strong female character who was also into "girly" things was Silena. when I was younger I admired Piper's "I'm not like other girls" thing, but then I got older and realized that the whole mentality of "not like other girls" is super obnoxious, and a little bit toxic

i have a heck load more that i cant rmb rn but yeah feel free to add more 

[thattimdrakeguy]

Why, uh, do ppl hate Tim so much? I just fell down a hole of anti tim and I can’t find a..valid reason for the hate besides that fact tht hes rich and white?

From my experience it’s one of those things where Tim has antagonistic relationships with other Bat-Family members like Damian, Jason, and even partially Steph. So they just crap on Tim, because it’ll make their favs look better.

Like that’s genuinely been the main reason I see, and they use the fact he’s rich and white to make it seem like it’s a social justice thing, even though in the end it really isn’t.

I sort of rant for the rest of the post going in more detail, and mentioning things I’ve been shown, and why I think a lot of it is dumb, but basically it’s just people being petty and insecure, and being unable to handle things in any other way than childishly.

For some Jason fans I’ve seen them talk about how much they hate Tim because they replaced the poor kid with a rich kid, but I’m really freaking poor myself. Obviously I’m not homeless, but there was a time in my life where I slept on the floor, and later on after I did have a bed my bed room had a hole in the floor. But, they’re just looking too deep into stuff just to find a problem anywhere they can.

I’ve also seen some say Tim bullied his way into being Robin after the poor kid died. When 1) that isn’t even an accurate description of what happened and 2) they’re obviously just trying to word it the worst way possible, because they’re pretty freaking childish.

Damian fans try to make Tim and his fans out to be racist cause Tim doesn’t like Damian, when that’s actually because Damian got so close to killing Tim I’m pretty sure Tim actually did nearly die from bleeding out. I think also because Tim once said “what about his biology” when referring to Damian, when Tim wasn’t referring to his race, he was referring to how he’s related to criminals and Damian literally had his biology messed with to make him a fierce warrior and a good body for Ra’s.

Steph fans also try to make Tim and his fans out to be sexist. But their reasoning is really weak, because it’s literally just boiled down to Tim being mean to Steph sometimes, but it’s not like that’s cause of her gender for that to make sense. It’s because in context she is an untrained citizens constantly putting herself and potentially others in-danger without any training to feel safe with her constantly being out there. Plus she flirted with him so much to the point it made him uncomfortable and fit the literal definition of sexual harassment.

And they always do that thing where they gotta make their favs sound better, and Tim sound worse. Which admittedly Tim fans do the same thing, but I’m not really here to pick a side. I’m just here pointing out how freaking annoying fandoms can be, because ultimately I don’t really care what fandom does it. At the moment though I can confidently say, that other fandoms are doing it a lot more than Tim ones lately, because I’m in the Tim tags at least twice a day most days and I’ve barely seen it lately.

It’s kind of a thing to project a lot of stuff on the Tim fandom for the same faux-social-justice kind of jargon they try to do. When you see it from a view like mine, where I’m not on any side of any fandom, even if I am a Tim fan (cause I never really been into deep fandom stuff), it just comes off as hypocritical frankly.

(If you want to hear some dumb things some Tim fans do to even it up, they make him the most frail, emo, emotionally unstable kid ever sometimes. They can focus way too much on making him sympathetic (but even then, literally every fandom does that, but the Tim fandom always does it in a very notable depressing way). They also focus so much on coffee and practically act like he’s all pilled up on anti-depressants he just acts weird that it just seems obsessive and very out of character.)

Like as some examples they’ll bring up how Tim doesn’t trust Damian and put him on a list of potential threats. But Damian literally nearly caused Tim’s death, nearly caused it again in the same story, and at the end it’s shown that Damian isn’t on there because Tim considers him a villain, it’s because he has potential to be dangerous. Wonder Woman and Red Tornado are also on the same list.

To me, I just look at that story as ridiculous, because Damian isn’t dumb, and Tim literally spoke against contingency plan stuff before. Damian’s going to need more than to be on a vague list as a potential threat, especially when he’s visibly on the hero side of it. Damian’s not that thinned skin. He’s got a temper, and obviously really doesn’t like Tim, but even when he felt Tim was insulting him or being patronizing to him before he didn’t try to kill him then immediately. He tried to kill him because he thought that’s what he was supposed to do to earn his place beside his father.

The story’s just dumb in-general.

And then they pull out the New 52 story where Tim is just being a dick to Damian for no good reason, but it’s the same kind of thing. Tim was never that much of a dick without being provoked. The only time I think Tim started a fight was in Red Robin where he was on pills that messed with his mental state, and again had everyone out of character regardless. Because 1) Dick wouldn’t just give away Robin from Tim, because he knows better than that. 2) Damian acts like he’s happy his dad is dead and just acts like a generic child and not even like Damian. And 3) I legitimately can’t see Tim just hitting a kid, even Damian, unless a fight already breaks out.

For Steph fans they point out how Tim is passive aggressive to her, constantly doesn’t want her to be Spoiler, and yada yada. Probably because her Batgirl run portrayed that as being mentally scarring to Steph. Even though one of the panels they chose of Tim being upset and not wanting her to be Spoiler, was after Steph caused Tim to be disfigured and on the pills that messed with his mental state to begin with. Which inadvertedly just makes her look self-centered and narcissistic. But again, I don’t even consider that in-character, because 1) I don’t buy that Steph would listen to Batman especially when it puts Tim in danger, because she never gave a crap about what Batman said till they needed to villainize her before she died. 2) Steph can be arrogant and self-centered, she has it in her, but she wouldn’t ever be that self-centered, to the point she just looks narcissistic. 3) I’m pretty sure at the actual time it happened, Steph is shown being aware she messed up. 4) Steph never cared what others thought. She trespassed on other people’s property to party. She’s a very confident person the majority of the time. Batman tells her to knock it off, she might as well flip him the bird because she just finds him more annoying than anything else. It’s literally in her origin that she doesn’t even like Batman.

There’s also the context for in the 90s when Tim first started doing it. Steph was portrayed as a reckless citizen that could potentially get herself and others into harm because she didn’t know what she was doing, and didn’t have the highest morals. That’s not anything any of the bats would encourage. If Tim was extra passive aggressive, he’s a literal thirteen to fifteen year old boy during that time, no duh he’s going to be immature. That still isn’t a sexism thing. Steph may had saved him twice, but that wasn’t portrayed even in-story as a sign she can handle it like a pro. It was always portrayed as “thank goodness she was with Tim at that time, and knew where he was to save him”. Not to say she was completely unskilled, because I’m not taking that far, but just speaking in generalizations.

She was originally added into Robin to be a very specific foil to Tim, and be a general pain in his side. That was their dynamic. If that makes it seem weird that they eventually had them date then I agree.

And at the same time for both of their characters they also ignore what the character they’re trying to defend has done, because Damian literally nearly killed Tim. They act like Tim should just get over it, because Damian was a kid in a cult, but that explains why Damian did it, it doesn’t excuse it. When something like that happens the person who was nearly killed is probably going to be traumatized (rather or not Tim was can be argued, I’m not saying he was or wasn’t), and not ever trust the person. Like that is the natural and most accurate response for it.

It’s just villainizing for the sake of being petty.

With Steph they ignore the fact she essentially sexually harassed Tim all the time and straight up emotionally abused him for an arc. Which her fans hate to hear, but that is stuff that happened. It was written by her creator. I don’t really care if Tim took her costume away or kissed her first, because I’m aware, and I know the contexts, and it doesn’t take away from what she’s done, because that’s not how that works. They also ignore she caused Tim to be disfigured by saying she was just doing what Batman said. But at that point she was also an adult, and would know better.

Like Steph can be reckless, that’s part of her character, but she isn’t an idiot.

In the end, from what all I’ve seen, it’s literally just fandom pettiness. There’s a lot of fans out there that act childish, treat people like idiots, blatantly lie about things, or exaggerate stuff.

It’s all very dumb, but I find it hard to take serious, because if they can’t acknowledge what their own favs have actually done, it just comes across like they genuinely don’t like the character and can’t admit it. They prefer to stay in their candy land so they gaslit others instead.

For me it’s as easy as paying attention to the story, seeing the contexts, and a lot of the time it’s not even a thing that’s in-character for any of the characters involved, or at least the very least not nearly as serious as they treat it.

Especially for around the past 15 or more years or so. By then the care in making everything is crafted and makes sense went down the drain so it’s often that a story doesn’t even make sense to begin with.

They think fandom is about making everyone else look bad apparently, or at least they sure act like it.

Like it’s comics. I think the fandom in-general that gets so worked up over stuff needs to relax, deattach yourself to look at it from the grander view, and calm down over it. Because things aren’t always what they seem. People try to convince themselves of so much stuff, or bully others for so much stuff, and it’s all so petty and unhealthy.

My personal philosophy in the fandom to avoid any toxic behavior is to just keep it real. I don’t lie to myself, I give everything the same standard, I definitely don’t bully or gaslit anyone, I don’t treat my favorite like they’re a real dang person either, and I look at it all like how it is, fiction.

It’s the reason why I get upset at writing and not fictional characters. I don’t ultimately care when a character does a bad thing, unless it’s out of character. To me the only thing I get upset with is the writing, because it’s the only thing that’s real.

Don’t be obsessed, and keep the peace essentially.

[cultofbeatles]

beginners guide to the members of led zeppelin (kind of)

a disclaimer before anyone starts reading: we all know led zeppelin is shady as hell and we hardly ever get anything confirmed or denied around here. so some stuff is up for speculation. everything in this post are things i've read in books, heard in interviews, or got from some other source. when it comes to “facts about led zeppelin” sometimes you gotta take it with a grain of salt. but honestly it’s led zeppelin we’re talking about, anything is possible. also this is all in good fun and giggles. with that being said, let’s get started with introductions to the members themselves.

jimmy page 

james patrick page 

born on January 9, 1944 

he’s a capricorn sun, cancer moon, and scorpio rising so you just know he’s a crazy motherfucker 

was an amazing session guitarist and basically everyone wanted him 

went to art school bc he’s just talented at everything i guess 

if you didn't know already he played the guitar for Joe cocker’s ‘with a little help from my friends’

declined his first offer to join the yardbirds but later decided to join 

was the last member to leave the group

basically was the leader of led zeppelin 

was gifted a telecaster guitar by his friend jeff beck and he adored it 

and he painted a cool dragon design on it 

played on it for the first led zeppelin album 

when he was on tour one of his friends painted over his dragon design and ruined the guitar 

he produced all of led zeppelin’s albums and is responsible for the remastering of those same albums 

paid for led zeppelin’s first album to be produced with his own money

deadass would have whips and handcuffs around with him on tour for the groupies 

but was apparently an amazing lover and cared for the people he slept with

one time he got naked on a food cart thingy, put whip cream over his body, and had john bonham push him into a room with groupies in it 

has such a small and soft voice 

was fascinated in aleister crowley and his work

would collect crowely memorabilia 

even bought crowley’s boleskine house 

had a bookstore at one point so he could get books easier 

struggled with addiction to drugs for most of the seventies 

went on a liquid diet late seventies and refused to eat solid food 

he got really skinny bc of it :( 

miss pamela (one of his girlfriends/lovers) once said that jimmy cried on the phone to her over her playboy photoshoot lmaoo

once flied pamela’s pet raccoon in first class 

allegedly had a relationship with lori maddox who was about 15 years old 

laughed as two of his girlfriends were fighting each other 

was kind of constantly nervous about his and the band’s image

has amazing guitar solos and improvisation but damn sometimes they drag on foreverrrr

deadass scared the shit out of david bowie so much that he had his house exorcised and would avoid jimmy at parties 

we love demons 

zoso

he’ll never tell us what zoso means and I'm mad

had two people die in his home. one was a friend who died from a drug overdose, and the other was john bonham when he died from choking on his vomit.  

has been accused for the deaths of john bonham and robert plant’s son karac bc of that stupid “curse” rumor

deserves critiques for several things but doesn't deserve hate for that 

has been through a lot and come out pretty okay

produced his current girlfriend’s, scarlett sabet, spoken poetry vinyl 

check out scarlett’s work bc it’s amazing

would probably always be down for another led zeppelin reunion 

robert plant

robert anthony plant 

born on august 20, 1948

this is the most attractive man ever. do not argue with me. 

nicknamed percy 

wasnt jimmy’s first pick for a singer 

jerry reid suggested robert to jimmy. and when jimmy asked what he looked like jerry said, “like a greek god.”

jimmy thought something was wrong with robert when he first found him bc he was such a good singer and hadn't been signed yet 

after a practice together jimmy knew he had his singer 

he would call robert “the young guy with the powerful voice.”

he thought about leaving the band early on bc he was so nervous about being in it 

convinced john bonham to join the group bc they were the bestest of buddies 

he’s not credited on the first album bc he was still under another contract 

started song writing for the second album by jimmy’s memory 

it didn't take long for him to gain confidence and start owning the stage 

once when he was performing a dove flew in his hands 

there’s an audio of him singing john bonham happy birthday and it makes me so happy 

he would call himself a greek god 

would party with john bonham a lot 

kind of the hippy of the group 

moans moans moans and even louder moans into the microphone 

would wear women’s shirts and looked amazing in them 

nurses do it better 

not to mention his super tight jeans 

we all know his dick is huge and he’s just showing it off 

has the prettiest, fluffiest blonde hair 

and the sweetest smile 

can you tell that i find him attractive yet?

has a fear of earthquakes 

also supposedly had some sort of a relationship to an underage groupie named sable starr (14)

also has a fear of led zeppelin nowadays 

either fear or amnesia 

it’s likely that he’s the reason we’ll never get another led zeppelin reunion 

though a close friend thinks that if the show went to charity robert would probably do it 

robert loved john bonham too much to play in led zeppelin without him

and i respect that a lot 

no matter how much he’s offered for a show he turns it down every time

in 1975 he got in a severe car crash and ended up being in a wheelchair 

still went on to record zeppelin’s album 

once while recording on crutches and started to fall and jimmy apparently zoomed in to save him. robert never saw him move that fast before

his five year old son (karac) died from a sudden stomach illness while he was in america on tour

absolutely crushed him 

was deeply upset that neither jimmy page or john paul jones reached out to him during that time of his life 

john bonham was there for him though 

robert apparently never forgave them for that 

a car he was working on fell on top of him and crushed some of his ribs as well 

late seventies was not a good time for robert plant 

but he got through it all like a champ

hates stairway to heaven with a passion lmao  

one time he paid a radio station a shit ton of money just to make sure they'd never play stairway to heaven again 

almost didn't sing stairway for the 2007 reunion but ended up agreeing to it after all 

he said he breaks out in hives when he has to play that song 

he and jimmy made their own symbols. robert’s is the feather inside the circle 

in 2007 he won beard of the year 

john bonham

john bonham 

born on may 31, 1948

nickname is bonzo

oh boy, there’s a lot of stories about bonzo 

he was known as the nicest and sweetest guy ever 

unless he was drunk 

he drank a lot :/

denied jimmy’s offer to join the group and continued to deny it until robert convinced him 

once flew the starship (led zeppelin’s plane) even though he didn't have a license to 

hated touring so much 

he always missed his family 

so he drank 

he was so damn crazy when drunk that the other members would book rooms floors above where his was so he wouldn't disturb them

tore about his hotel rooms like no other 

he has a son named jason bonham who he loved a lot 

bought him a nice drum kit when he was younger 

jason is just about led zeppelin’s biggest fan next to jimmy page 

one time bonzo broke a girl’s vibrator when drunk

also punched a girl in the face when drunk once bc she waved at him 

partly responsible for the famous mud shark story where a girl was apparently fucked with a dead shark by him and zeppelin’s tour manager 

liked cars a lot 

really really loved his family. cannot stress it enough

was irked that john paul jones got out of playing shows during the christmas holiday and he didn't 

punched robert in the face once too 

him and john paul jones equals the best rhythm section ever 

jimmy would call it magic how well him and bonzo got along 

bonzo could handle anything jimmy threw at him 

he wasn't really a part of it, but he had to go to jail bc peter grant and two other dudes almost killing a man (long story omfg, but apparently the doctors had to put the dude’s eyeball back into his socket)

was there for robert when karac died 

they were really good friends 

there’s an interview with them together where bonzo is laughing at robert about his little farm 

gave good hugs apparently 

played drums like no other could and knew he was good 

but still sometimes got insecure and got upset when someone he looked up to said his drumming wasn't all that special 

his symbol is the three rings and he picked it out of a book like john paul jones did his 

he died in jimmy page’s house (not the crowley house btw)

he had to drink the equivalent of 40 shots of vodka and choked on his vomit in his sleep 

led zeppelin died on the same day 

nobody can replace john bonham 

his son filled in his role for the 2007 reunion show and did an amazing job of it. the whole show is on youtube, go check it out

john paul jones

 john richard baldwin 

born on january 3, 1946

nickname is jonesy 

was also a session guitarist like jimmy 

they had worked together before 

when he found out jimmy was forming a group he called jimmy and was basically given the spot immediately 

not only was the bassist but also the keyboardist 

and could play the recorder 

insanely talented. put some respect on his name 

he talks in italics i swear to god 

i don't have mainly crazy stories about jonesy bc he wasn't about that life 

deadass he would go on stage, perform, walk off stage and go to a whole separate hotel from the other

he would only tell one person where he was at and told them not to call unless for super urgent emergencies 

pissed peter grant off so much lmao 

wasn't really super close to anyone in the band tbh 

but bonzo was probably his greatest friend in the band 

jimmy and robert kind of leave him out in my opinion 

or they use to 

when he found out that jimmy and robert were making their own symbols instead of picking out of a book like he was he said “of course!”  and laughed 

was pretty much left out of the live aid show 

he had to squeeze himself on the stage and wasn't even able to play bass. he had to play the keyboard 

“and thank you to my friends for finally remembering my phone number” -savage as hell john paul jones 

he was one of the two people who found john bonham dead 

it’s sad to think about

is actually quite funny

he has this kind of dry humor?? idk but it’s amazing 10/10 content 

when john paul jones walks into the room interviewers break into a sweat

managed to look like a completely different person every year throughout the seventies or is it just my eyes?

has an Instagram account now go follow it for cute throwback photos lol

that’s all i really have for generic useless information about led zeppelin members for beginners. i hope it was somewhat entertaining. i'll make some more beginners stuff for led zeppelin. i will make y'all stan them lmao. i'm tagging @babygotblueeyes​ bc i know for a fact you want to get into them <3

[tired-college-student-writing]

Tim’s Secret Weapon: Chapter 2

I’ve been slightly obsessed with @ozmav​ ‘s Damien Wayne/Marinette Dupain-Cheng pairing as of late, and just saw a post that has inspired me more than anything else has in months, so I felt the need to write it

Summary- Tim has always seen the numbers floating above people’s heads, been able to perceive their threat levels with a single glance. After being a hero for so long he thought he was desensitized to seeing high numbers above people’s heads until Damien brings a new friend home.

Part 1 

Part 2 (HERE)

Part 3

_______________________________________________________________________

Of all the ways Tim had imagined his secret getting out, he had to say that his family finding his research into Damien’s girlfriend was pretty low on the list, practically nonexistent. Especially since it didn’t take a genius to figure out what they thought his interest in her was more than a little creepily obsessive in the worst way possible. 

Though he had to admit that the evidence against him didn’t paint a pretty picture. Any other twenty three year old with this much info on a sixteen-year-old would no doubt be placed on a list. Though he’s pretty sure from the white-knuckled grip his brothers had on their weapons, they’d rather rip him a new asshole if he didn’t give them an answer they liked soon. 

He settled for an even, “I do background checks on people that spend time here, why is it surprising that I have one on Marinette?” 

He was fairly certain that the others would be able to hear his heartbeat if it started pounding any faster. He worked with heroes of all shape and size, seen powers of all types, faced down villains of every magnitude and yet the idea of his secret getting out terrified him more than anything he’d ever experience.  Bruce gave him a steely look, “Tim, your file on Rah al Ghul is 3.4 GB, your file on Marinette Dupian-Cheng is nearly 8 GB.” 

“Not to mention,” Dick’s voice was dripping with so much venom Tim couldn’t help but wince, that didn’t sound like his carefree brother, “You went to great lengths to hide the check from us. You’re paranoid, but this is different Tim.” 

“I just wanted to talk to Marinette about something before I put it on the server…” He snapped, trying to shift the fear clawing at his very essence to anger, “Just because I did background on her doesn’t mean she’s not allowed to have her privacy. She… ” 

He knew it was a flimsy excuse, but the glares getting icier around him made everything instinct he ever had told him to run. He can see why Bruce had said no costumes tonight, he would have been on his motorcycle halfway to Star City by now if he was wearing his mask. 

“Tim,” Bruce cuts in, “Just tell us what’s going on. We can’t help if you don’t tell us.” 

He clenched his hands into his pants, trying to get them to stop shaking.  He had no choice, did he? 

“Okay,” He agreed, “I need to grab something from my room, first.”

“Todd, Go with him,” Damien ordered. Tim was sure the brat wanted to go himself, but Dick had a strong hand on his shoulder, no doubt holding him back from using “non-approved by Bruce” interrogation methods. 

Jason clapped a hand on Tim’s back making him flinch before the taller man pulled him back up the staircase. 

“This better be good, replacement,” 

“Do you really think so little of me?” Tim couldn’t help but ask as he was shoved through his door, “because it’s not hard to figure out what you guys think of me right now, but…” 

Jason's refusal to look at him hurt more then he was willing to admit. 

“We’re praying we’re wrong,” He finally said, “but we can’t think of a single other reason for you being like this.” 

Tim flinched as he entered the code into the padlock on his side table, he knew that at least two of his siblings knew the code at this point, but placing the embarrassing pictures of him from his first year as Robin seemed enough to appease them from looking further. 

“Bruce doesn’t like working with Metas,” He managed out as he pulled up the false bottom and snatched his journal. As he turned back to Jason he could see the older boy blinking at him in startled befuddlement. 

“Marinette is a Meta?”  He questioned causing Tim to hug the book tight to his chest, eyes focusing on the rusty looking 10 over his brother's head as it twisted around, he couldn’t be more relieved when it faded from the venomous green as the Laruaz sickness faded. 

He didn’t answer instead brushing past him towards the stairs to the Batcave. Jason was right on his heels. 

“What the fuck Timmy,” He questioned instantly. Tim let out a weak chuckle. 

Jason wasn’t stupid, no matter what he tried to convince people, and Tim knew his brother would put it together quickly if he said anything else, but he didn’t want to talk about it, but… he kinda wished he had longer in the shadows he was used to. He remained quiet. 

“You can’t just say that and go rushing off,” He pushed as they entered the stairwell, causing Tim to scrunch his shoulders more. 

Tim was halfway down the steps when he felt Jason stop behind him, a heavy hand landing on his shoulder. He held back a wince as he glanced at his brother's face. 

The serious set of Jason’s jaw and the understanding in his eyes put Tim on edge. 

“Mari’s not the one that’s Meta, is she?” 

“...”

“Come on Tim, answer the question.” 

I don’t know if she is or not…” 

“But she’s not what you meant when you said Bruce doesn’t like working with Metas, is she?” 

Tim couldn’t force his mouth to work. 

“Shit…” Jason groaned, rubbing a hand down his face as he sank down to sit on the stairs, “We really are assholes.” 

“Jay?” 

He waved a hand dismissing Tim’s questioning tone, “You kept notes about what you can do in that book?” 

“I…” Tim’s brain was having trouble keeping up with what was happening, “Yeah?” 

“Great, hand it over and go back upstairs,” 

Tim flinched back, grip tightening, “What?” 

Jason just looked away, crossing his arms, “Look, we jumped to the wrong conclusion, and I don’t know what your power is but it made you wary of Marinette. You look like a frightened rabbit right now, so I doubt you’ll want to go through Bruce’s shitty menagerie of questions on your powers, so give me the fucking notes you have on yourself and I’ll keep them down here until we’ve gone through your book and figure it out. Then maybe by patrol, we’ll all calm down enough to… ya know fucking talk about it.” 

Tears weld up in Tim’s eyes as he sits on the stairs next to Jason, knees trembling too much to hold him up, “You… You don’t hate me?” 

The ideas startled the older boy into looking back to Tim’s face, face softening as he saw the look in his eyes. 

“Ah Timmy,” He sighed, pulling the other boy into his side “None of us are going to hate you for being meta.” 

Tim gave a shaky nod into his shoulder, reluctantly holding out the book, “It’s mostly just data… I…” 

Jason took the book carefully, bouncing it in his hand lightly, “Did you write down what your power is?” 

“Yeah but…” 

“Great skedaddle,” 

“Wait,” Tim cut Jason off as he goes to stand, “I… I want to tell someone before you find out through… through my journal.” 

Jason settles back down, “Alright replacement, What can you do?” 

Slowly he explains the numbers, the levels he had been able to see since he a baby, how he used it to know where to focus in a battle, used it to figure out every secret identity without trying. 

“Well damn,” Jason whistled, once Tim’s explanation started trailing off, “No wonder you were always good at the detective shtick, no one could hide from you.” 

Tim let out a startled laugh, “Ye... yeah, even if the color and number themselves change the font stays the same so it’s pretty easy to keep track of people...” 

“So two questions before I let you go hide in the woods, and go relay all this info to the others.” 

Tim nodded, relaxing more. He never imagined his power being revealed going so well.

“First, who’s the most dangerous of the Batfam?” 

Tim smirked, “Alfred, he’s a 12, same as Wonderwoman. Bruce and the demon spawn are tie for second at 11 and then you and Dick both have 10s, same as Superman. I... I don’t have a number.” 

“Fucking knew it,” 

“We all knew Alfred was dangerous, even without my power.” 

“Truth. Alright question dos, Why does Marinette freak you out?” 

His jaw clenched, he knew this one was coming, but he also knew how it would sound.

“She’s... She’s a 15.” 

Jason’s eyes bugged out, “15?! We’re talking about the same girl, right? Pigtails, freckles, makes sweets for us every time she visits, looks like a strong wind will fly her back to Paris?” 

“Yes!” Tim groaned, “I can’t find a single fucking thing that explains why she’s so high! Before this, the highest I’ve seen is 12!” 

“No wonder you’ve been going insane... or well more insane.” 

“Thank you for being an understanding asshole.”

“Hey what else are brothers for?” He asked, smile a little tight as he climbed to his feet, still holding Tim’s journal, “Now let's go, before the brat knocks out Dick and comes looking for you.” 

Tim gave a weary smile before disappearing up the stairs. 

When Jason reached cave the others were starting to look impatient. 

“Where’s Drake,” Damien asked instantly, body coiling dangerously. 

“I don’t him to scram,” The tall man said with a shrug, “He explained what’s happening to me, and trust me he has a good fucking reason, and probably thinks that Bruce is going to kick him out so I told him to take it easy until I calm all of you down.” 

“He what?” Bruce choked out, as the other boys stopped, all eyes focusing on Jason. 

“Yup!” Jason popped the ‘p’ before holding up the book Tim had given him, “Who’s ready for story time?” 

_______________________________________________________________________

Taglist: @vixen-uchiha @iggy-of-fans @mewwitch @roseinbloom02 @worlds-tiniest-spook-pastry @mochinek0 @royalchaoticfangirl @09shell-sea09 @mystery-5-5 @derpingrainbow @aloha-posts-stuff @hauntedfreakdeputyhero @maribat-archive @blue-peach14 @kae690 @zazzlejazzle @vincentvangoose

[bigskydreaming]

Small response ask to that anon who brought up Chris Priest and your response of DC should focus less on Bruce being abusive to his kids. Not sure if you noticed the up and down of the Batman comics but it seems the arc that have him being a caring dad has less asshole dad and abusive dad in them and yet the arc that have Bruce hitting the boys or kicking them out of the house has Bruce not acknowledging the boys as his sons and even the writers say Dick is more of a brother of partner than son.

Oh for sure, its absolutely true that a huge part of the problem with the Batman comics is the sheer inconsistency in writer visions of the characters - which is why IMO its up to DC’s editorial staff to maintain internal consistency for how the characters officially relate to each other at the very least. 

Like I’ve said before, you can’t roll back the clock on them being his kids once you’ve established they’re his kids. People haven’t forgotten that Tim was adopted by Bruce in the old continuity just because they decided to have his parents alive in the New 52 - and ‘teenage kinda sorta ally’ is an inherently weaker emotional tether compared to ‘actual adopted son’ so when presented with two options, most people aren’t going to give a shit about their attempt to ‘unbond’ a character from their actual parent and will stick with viewing them as father and son, whether DC likes it or not.

So its just plain foolishness IMO for DC to attempt to apply any sort of ambiguity to Bruce and his kids. Along with his biological son Damian, Dick, Jason, Tim and Cass at least have all been officially adopted by Bruce (or in Cass’ case, they were stated to be starting adoption proceedings last we saw before the Reboot). Like....those are just hard facts, no matter how much people try and ‘undo’ that if they don’t personally like the idea of Bruce as a father of five....fans are not going to cooperate and its just sheer stubbornness to pretend otherwise. People before the current writers and editors made a creative choice to have Bruce adopt these kids. Readers liked it. Readers know what they like and once given the option of having Bruce the father of five, you can protest all you want as the ‘official’ overseers of Batman, but you can’t erase what was already written, and you can’t ask readers to forget they liked something better than how you’re currently trying to push it.

But that’s just me being like hey DC what if you weren’t a flock of fucking dumbasses, just to try something different for a change.

And related to your ask, there’s absolutely a direct correlation in my mind between the DC writers who intensely dislike the idea of Bruce as a father and writing him as being callous, insensitive, aloof and outright abusive with various of his kids. Because it all goes hand in hand with them - they dislike the idea of Bruce as a dad because they’re all about him being the brooding lone wolf whose entire life is just an endless pursuit of justice for the sake of others because he’s convinced himself that he can never be happy and shouldn’t try. YAWN. But this view of Bruce is outright threatened by the warm, caring father Bruce rendition, so they try and erode the latter as much as possible in pursuit of the former....

Only to later have writers revert to the latter and erode the former.

And around and around and around we go. And they all keep trying to reset things that fundamentally CAN NOT BE RESET because this is the problem when you staff a creative industry top to bottom with fanboys who can’t and won’t separate their personal desires from their professional shepherding of these IPs. And so each new crop of writers tries to write Batman and related characters the way they like them, most often the way they remembered reading them as kids through the lens filter of nostalgia, and thus Bruce’s kids’ status flip flops either officially or unofficially every five to ten years, Hal Jordan is replaced by Kyle Rayner is replaced by Hal Jordan and a wave of new diverse characters are created in the span of a couple years and ten years later no one’s heard of any of them except for Jaime Reyes.

And its the reason IMO that superhero comics have never grown beyond a niche industry despite the VAST appeal of superheroes that superhero movies have proven still exists....and its why superhero movies will end up in the exact same stagnated niche if they don’t learn from the former’s mistake and let their characters grow and age and be replaced by new ones rather than just rebooted versions of the old one, because there’s only so many times you can go round and round on the merry go round before people just flat out stop caring because you’re not doing or saying anything new.

Change is good, except for when people refuse to let it happen because they’ve settled for what they know as being the optimal plateau, never to truly be reached past because the unknown and untested is scary and might bite.

Anyway. All of that is to say yes, I agree, and as a PS I just have to froth at the mouth a little on a personal note because god do I hate the interpretation that Bruce and Dick are more like brothers than father and son, lololol, and can’t refrain from mentioning that any time its brought up even in passing. 

(This is totally not directed at you btw, just the concept itself, lololol, sorry). 

People can talk about the smaller age gap between them all they want, but the fact of the matter is, Dick isn’t Damian, and the relationship between Dick and Bruce has NEVER been nearly as ambiguous or as open to interpretation as the one between Dick and Damian.

Because the contrast between the two is Bruce had something that nobody who is just an older sibling has over a younger....absolute uncontested parental authority, total responsibility for his education, living arrangements, emotional development, etc....with no other comparable figure in the younger’s life occupying a same or even similar role. Dick occupied that role for Damian for about a year of his life, but Bruce has occupied that role for Dick every single year since his first parents died. It might have taken awhile for them to individually and together VIEW their dynamic as parent and child, but from the moment Dick stepped foot into Wayne Manor, Bruce started out day one as someone who stepped into the role of sole guardian and caretaker with no prior emotional attachment.....and that just is NOT a sibling. That’s a legal guardian or parent.

(And yes, Alfred was there of course, but despite being viewed as a father figure to Bruce himself, Alfred never ever ever once has been shown to occupy an equal position to Bruce in Dick’s life....he’s very firmly slotted into the grandfather role himself, and has never stepped forward to definitively intercede between the two of them or usurp or even truly challenge Bruce’s parental authority of Dick).

If people want to say that at times Dick and Bruce’s dynamic has been more relaxed and they’ve related to each other as more like siblings than parent and child due to the relatively small age gap between them (still well over a decade, like yeah Bruce would have had to have been fourteen or so to have Dick himself, but the point is he DIDN’T, and he was already completely done with education and globe-trotting and was firmly established in his life and life’s purpose by the time he became Dick’s guardian, so the small age gap is not quite as influential as I think some people try to make it out to be - the reality is the Bruce that Dick met as a child couldn’t be any more decisively in the ‘adult/equivalent of a parent’ category in Dick’s eyes if he were five years older....it wouldn’t have changed a single thing about their actual situation or the positioning of their dynamic.)

But anyway, my point just being that yeah, due to the relatively small age gap between them, I can see people making a case for them at times enjoying a more relaxed camaraderie more akin to brothers than father and son, but the part that’s a pet peeve is when people try and outright replace the idea of them having a father/son dynamic with one where they’re brothers and partners and equals because.....no. Bruce always had full authority and guardianship of Dick from the day he met him, and he’s never been anyone BUT the figure who occupies that role in Dick’s mind, no matter whether the name for that changed over time. And that’s not a sibling, because even siblings who end up raising their younger siblings after the death of their parents, say....except for extreme cases like Dick and Damian, they usually still already have prior connection and perceptions of each other....like the younger, if already Dick’s age when raised by someone Bruce’s age....like, if they were siblings and Bruce ended up raising Dick himself, Dick would still have an image in his mind of a time before their mutual parents died, before he shifted into that parent role....and thus there’d be some ambiguity. 

But like I said, Bruce always (and without exception or alternative) from day one existed as the one responsible for Dick’s care, the one responsible for raising him, the one who got the ultimate say in every aspect of his life from education to what he ate to whether he could go hang out with his friends...and call that whatever you want, but that’s a parent. Not an older brother.

And more importantly, that dynamic between parent and child, rather than between older and younger sibling, is never going to fully shift into true equals. There’s a degree to which our parents will always be our parents and exist on a different footing than us in our mutual perspectives. There’s no getting around that. And Dick will never ever be positioned to be Bruce’s brother-figure rather than his son. Never someone who can challenge Bruce on ACTUAL equal footing rather than always with the vestiges of ‘this is the man who raised me’ and ‘I raised this man’ hanging over them. 

Anyway, like I said, pet peeve, and I always get a little grrr about people suggesting they’re more brother and brother than father and son because its disingenuous in my mind....there’s never been any kind of reality to it. And more importantly, its one of those things that only really seems to serve one purpose - and that’s to lessen Bruce’s responsibility to Dick, because if they’re just brothers, then the times when Bruce has done less than stellar as his parent, let’s say - like, those aren’t as big a deal or big a failing or an injustice to Dick if Bruce is JUST his brother and not actually his father and thus not actually responsible for filling that role.

Its the exact flip side of why I argue that its shitty to heap the kind of expectations on Dick that fandom usually does....because he’s NOT Damian’s father or any of his siblings.....but the key point I always bring up there is that this is more than just a matter of labels, but rather due to the fact that someone with significantly more and undeniable parental authority than Dick exists for all of his siblings....Bruce himself.

And that’s why Dick will never truly be Bruce’s equal within the family rather than his son - he doesn’t carry equivalent power even if equivalent expectations or responsibilities are heaped on him. And that’s why Bruce will never truly be Dick’s equal rather than his parent - because from day one, he DID carry sole parental power and responsibility for Dick. And there’s no getting around that and no changing that.....unless you CLAIM that Bruce is ‘just’ Dick’s brother DESPITE all the evidence of him being the only parent Dick’s had since he was eight years old.

And the other thing that bugs about the Bruce is more Dick’s brother than parent thing....even if Alfred has never officially been designated Bruce’s father, there’s never been any doubt that they are far more a parent/child dynamic than an older brother/younger brother. And all of Dick’s siblings have unequivocally been interpreted as Bruce’s children.

So.....

According to the Bruce is more Dick’s brother than parent argument, Dick is the one and only member of the Batfamily who just....doesn’t get to have a parent figure after he loses his parents at age eight? He never needs or wants one after that point? Bruce is more kinda just his brother and partner and Dick wants it this way, because he loved his parents, and so the eight years he got with them was all the parental love and guidance he needed, he was all set, no need or desire for any more after that point, because that’s how it works, apparently, if you love your parents and they die while you’re still a kid, sorry but you can’t have new ones? You can have a guardian but not another parent, you already filled the ‘I had parents who loved me’ quota so whether you only got eight years with them or eighteen, that’s all folks, but its okay because its not like you’d even want parents again if you had even just eight years with ones already?

LOLOL.

Yeah. 

DISLIKE.

[animalpetcel]

Ideal RHATO

Okay, so I’ve done some thinking. While Red Hood and the Outlaws was an interesting concept; give Jason friends and a team of his own, get him out of the Batfam Shadow, it’s been bogged down by L*bdell spotty writing and questionable Editorial decisions. So I’ve taken the time to think of what I would personally want the Outlaws to be.

First of all, I don’t believe that Jason would be better of if he remained solo. While he does deserve a good solo run other than UtH, the idea of permanently sequestering from creating meaningful, recurring relationships with other heroes is just repulsive to me. He should be allowed to have friends and people to talk to outside of the Batfamily guys, there’s only so many adventures he can have by himself before they all start sounding the same. You could even have him gaining friends as part of his character development.

Okay! So let’s begin

In my version, the Outlaws would be a more obvious antihero team. They take cases by those who feel that regular heroes can’t help them, that they won’t go far enough to achieve justice. The Outlaws won’t kill often, but it would usually be awful criminals like drug dealers, traffickers or those in charge, but if they don’t kill, they won’t be above dissing out harsh, lasting punishments to those who cross them. There could be the possibility of them being a team looking for redemption, but I’ve never really thought about them going in that direction.

Btw: This will be a hard reboot, everything from New52 to Rebirth regarding RHATO will be completely retconned, because Lobdell wrote almost all of them and despite what people want to believe most of it is bad save for some barely passable moments

Outlaw Members

Jason Todd

Can’t have the Outlaws without their infamous leader. Like I said above, I believe that having his own team can be a good thing for Jason, he can establish a history disconnected from his history with Bruce and actually start to move on. I’d imagine him being a reluctant leader, preferring to work alone but admitting that having people to rely on has made his mission a lot easier. He’s a very driven and calculated person, and after reading Arkham Knight Genesis, I have no doubt in his leadership skills and his ability to turn a ragtag group of antiheroes into a team to be reckoned with.

Idk if I’d keep his All-Caste stuff. I know that it was probably created to give his backstory something that stands out, since he’s the third Batfam member to have the League of Assassins in his backstory and isn’t the only one that’s died before, but he barely uses the All-blades or brings up the All-Caste to the point were you can omit it and don’t really have to do that much to replace it. At this point, I’d accept Talia making him train with Brother Blood over the All-Caste.

I’d probably say that the Lazurus pit Talia used to bring him back was kinda special, giving him a minor healing factor and increasing his strength, idk, something small.

Eddie Bloomberg

(I hate Tom King and this dialogue too but I wanted a recent image of him)

Did you know that unlike Roy Harper, Eddie was actually Jason’s best friend pre-reboot? Most people don’t because DC doesn’t care about using pre-established canon or developing its less popular heroes! 🙃

Okay, I used to be a huge fan of Jason and Roy’s friendship in New52 RHATO, but then I learned that Roy was originally Dick’s friends, that his personality was dumbed down for New52, Roy actually hates mercenaries and would never become one, they only used Roy because he was more popular and that most Titan/Roy friends actually hate his New52 counterpart and friendship with Jason. While I believe that Roy and be both friendship with Dick AND Jason (but in different ways. Dick is more of a close friend while he and Jason should have a more big brother kind of relationship), I have to admit that DC dropped the ball here, and it would be easier to just scrap everything instead of trying to make it work.

Eddie’s personality is actually quite similar to New52 Roy’s, and he and Jason already have unexplored history, so switching Roy with him won’t mess anything too much.

And now, I hear you ask “Ani, what about the Outlaw’s being an antihero group? Wouldn’t that make Eddie stand out?”, and I will reply “Don’t worry, I have a plan!”

Back when Eddie first got his powers, Neron, the king of hell at the time (?) wanted Eddie to be his protege, but Eddie refuses. But what if Neron was more forceful? Eddie could be offered, now powerless again because of the events of TT (but his death is retconned to just getting badly injured), to become Neron’s protege once again. With nothing left to lose (his relationship with Blue Devil is still in the fritz, Teen Titans no longer seem to give a damn and Rose & Jaime is still off doing their own things), he takes it. I guess he’s probably look different with more of Neron’s power coursing through his veins, but the point is that Outlaws become a “Fall from grace” for him. He’s trying to still be a hero, but as Neron’s influence continues to grow, his ability to tell right from wrong gets more and more clouded.

He’s the one to approach Jason with the idea of being a team, wanting to relive the “Good Ol’ Days” when they were younger and less bogged down with personal trauma. While Jason is reluctant, he admits that since being self-exiled from the Batfamily that it’s been kinda lonely, so he agrees, but only short-term. Eddie then segways into the next member of their burgeoning group–

Rose Wilson

While pre-reboot, Rose and Jason did not have the friendliest interactions, with her holding a blade to her throat while his brothers threatened him with a crime he never committed. Post-reboot, he and Rose seem to have a more “friendlier” relationship, but the Wilson family have been rebooted at least theee times in both New52 and Rebirth, so who knows if they even still know each other now,

Rose and Eddie were very close friends in Teen Titans, and I think that getting Rose away from the madness of her family and father could be good for her character.

Eddie manages to convince her to join the “Outlaws”, but like Jason, she goes into it thinking that it’ll be a one-time thing. She cares a lot about Eddie, and sticks with the team to make sure that he’s doing alright. She probably could have an arc were Nightwing confronts her on her work in the Outlaws (since the other heroes see them as white-hat mercenaries) since he mentored her in being a hero, so it could be about dealing with what other people expect of her.

Essence

While L*bdell might be basically a shit writer, he does create interesting concepts. With a better writer, Essence could be a very interesting character, watching from the shadows and judging whether or not the Outlaws are actually “good” people, before she eventually starts taking a more active role in helping them punish criminals.

While she would at first interact solely with Jason, asking him questions about his deeds and ordering him in what direction she feels is best, she would eventually introduce herself to the rest of the group. I think she’d get along best with Komand’r, while the others might test her absolutism, Black-And-White morality a bit.

Rankorr (Jack Moore)

I know that there’s some people who want Guy Gardner to be Jason’s lantern, but what about a lantern who is close to Jason in age and actually fits the Outlaw theme?

Jack Moore is a Red Lantern, not only a Red Lantern, but the first human lantern who is also the first Red Lantern to be capable of creating constructs. He struggles with his rage, and deep down, he wants to enjoy a normal life on earth.

Maybe after Red Lantern (retconning Lobo or if not, he’s brought back using Red Lantern Blood Magic), he decides that the RL’s are a bit too cult-like for him and tries to lay low on Earth, finishing his literature degree and opening up a small bookstore somewhere in London. He’s close with Guy, but still can’t/refuses to let go of his rage, so Jack is still a RL

Of course, keeping his rage at bay is hard work, and after witnessing police brutality one more time, he loses control.

The Outlaws were hired by the family of the victim to make the officers see justice, but after seeing Jack work, they realize that this might be their easiest case yet.

Afterwards, Jack tries to downplay the entire thing (before resorting to threats when the Outlaws won’t listen), but Jason eventually convinced him that his talents would be wasted just being a civilian (and that his rage will only get worse if he continues to just let it boil without an “outlet”) so he joins the team

Blackfire

I’ve read Komand’r’s backstory, I know how bad it looks. However, in a medium where retcons and reimaginings are features instead of bugs (and can benefit a character’s story if done right), I really think it could be possible to make her work.

After reading New52 RHATO, I began thinking that it could be so much better if not only Eddie took Roy’s spot, but also if Komand’r took Starfire’s, since I feel like she had more potential beyond “Kori’s evil disabled sister”, “War Criminal” and “Struggling queen of Tamaran”

First, I’d change her pre-reboot backstory so instead of taking over the Gordanians, she is instead captured by them after Starfire frees her from the Psions (Komand’r still hates her sister and refuses to follow her). Through her clever mind and manipulations, she manages to earn favor with Lord Damyn, feigning romantic interest. Of course, given Komand’r’s nature, she ends up killing and replacing him, but her rule doesn’t go over well and she is again recaptured, but this time she’s brought to Earth.

Realizing that she’s now trapped on the planet whete her sister has become a successful and popular hero, Komand’r is at first angry, and then conspires to free herself and take revenge on her sister (who she still blames for everything despite that not being the case).

The Outlaws bust the alien trafficking ring, and Komand’r, seeing her chance, decides to show off and make nice with them to eventually use them for her revenge.

She finds Eddie and Rankorr easy to manipulate, but she bumps Heads with Jason whenever she tries to take his role as leader away from him and finds Rose’s mind to be “weak”. Overtime however, she bonds with Jason over feeling inferior to their siblings, realizes that her anger shares Rankorr’s intensity, and grows a genuine friendship with Rose and Eddie

Oh yeah, and maybe she tries to make things right with Kori

Artemis Grace

What would the Outlaws be without the greatest Amazon to have ever lived? Nothing, that’s for sure.

While I don’t agree with Jaytemis (at least not yet), I have to admit that Jason would be a fool not to like her. She’s a cool, confident character with a lot of interesting lore behind her.

Her joining will probably be pretty close to canon. The Outlaws are tasked with going after Black Mask, and Jason decides to go undercover, as the Red Hood still has his fingers in various criminal pies. While investigating, he runs into Artemis, who is looking for the Bow of Ra, and rest is history.

I feel like she’ll get along really well with Rose and Komand’r and maybe she’ll date one. She’ll definitely view Eddie a bit dismissively, and she isn’t a huge fan of demons. Rankorr would probably come off as stuck up to her.

Bizarro

Anyone who knows me will know that I’m am not a huge fan of Bizarro clones. I consider them to be an overused concept (that sometimes feels as if it relies on gene superiority, but idk if I’ll ever fully process my dislike for them), and the fact that as the time I’m writing this, there are at least four currently in continuity does not enamor me with the concept more.

However, after re-reading RHATO a few times, I’ll admit that the Outlaws’ Bizarro has grown on me. Since he already kinda has a unique name (Bizz), all I think he needs is a more visually distinct costume (doesn’t even have to directly reference Superman, but I can go 50/50 on the backwards “S”)

The Outlaws getting Bizz is exactly the same as canon. I’d imagine that he and Eddie would be as close as brothers. While Rankorr might find Bizz’s way of thinking and speaking to be annoying, I’d think that Rankorr will eventually warm up to him and probably teach him how to read and help Artemis teach him. Komand’r and Rose will probably be less receptive to him, but who knows

August Heart

I’m a Godspeed fan first and human second, we’ve been knew.

In all seriousness, Godspeed is the perfect Rebirth era character for RHATO and the fact that he and Jason still haven’t met is why DC doesn’t have any rights.

Okay okay, but he’s honestly a perfect fit. Like Jason, he also kills when dealing with crimes, but he isn’t so good and knowing who’s guilty and who isn’t just yet.

This will probably be after Death of the Speedforce, with August finally making things right with Barry, but still not forgiving himself for everything that happened. Deciding to self-exile himself rather than go back to Iron Heights, August travels, trying to figure out what do to do next, trying to follow Barry’s rules (which he finds to be very wishy-washy) to the best of his ability.

Eventually, he learns that Black Hole is still running, and against his better instincts, he goes after them.

His trail of lightning destruction catches the eye of the Outlaws.

Barry, realizing that his best-friend might need someone who can actually be there all the time to help reign him in, Barry goes to the Outlaws and asks them if they can help him once they catch up to him

They do in the form of offering a spot on the team.

August is very self-assured (even if it is hiding a softer, more emotional center), but has proven to be able to work with others, so I can see the other Outlaws coming to like him. They might find him a little cocky/early to jump the gun, but still a trusted and valued member of the team.

Since every Robin has their own flash, it only makes sense to finally give Jason (and have them date) a speedster of his own, and it should be someone who fits his morals, and who else could Then the speedster fans literally call “The Red Hood of the Flashfam”?

Final Thoughts

Other possible members I would consider/accept are

Eradicator Superman

Koryak

Vanessa Kapatelis/Silver Swan lll

Simon Amal (Crux)

Danny Chase

Clone!Roy Harper

Connor Hawke

Orm Marvius

Man O’ War

Lagoon Boy

Scarlet

Zachary Zatara

Thomas Merlyn

Ragman

Bleez

Walter West

Even with a cast as sizable as the one I just listed, with a good enough writer, there could still a few minor side characters. I would personally want the them to be

Scarlet: Jason’s former sidekick. She could be either a civilian who he talks to get experience some normalcy or the leader of her own version of the Outlaws made of up the Generation Outlaws we meet in RHATO #37-40. Either way, it could contrast with Bruce and the way he (mis)treats his own sidekicks and family

Zachary Zatara: Eddie’s old friend who helped him get his devil powers. Zachary would definitely be worried over Eddie once again accepting Neron’s power and will want to try to help. Whether he suceeds or not will depend if the writers want to go in that direction

Isabel Ardila: She’s a nothing character, but there’s a small chance that with a better writer, she might gain an interesting personality or an actual purpose in RHATO

Talia Al Ghul: before the reboot, Talia was Jason’s mentor figure and even gave him a cool dagger. It would be so cool if we can bring that back and erase Morrison’s problematic charactization of her. Maybe the dagger she gives Jason could be an All-Blade or smth. They’d definitely take a few cases from her however

Batfam, Titans and respective groups: it would have to happen eventually. It could lead to some interesting, angst filled conversations. And who knows, maybe they’ll actually make progress with their issues

But this post has gone on long enough. I just really wanted to talk a bit about my ideal Outlaws team that I will never see anywhere except for my dreams because mass media hates me and DC still thinks that Lobdell deserves to write Jason 😔😭

[zitkaplushie]

nightwing secret files liveblog:

this is gonna be a long one so it’s under a cut!

taking wing-

is that jason??

i like this 'a christmas carol' type exposition i'm ngl

i'm not sure if 'jason''s dismissal of the circus is dixon using an unreliable narrator, or if dixon actually believes that

god i hate this art so much

how dare u insult the teen titans in any way 😤 i like the name

also titans cameo!!

more awful jason characterisation (pls dixon just stay 8732894738 feet away from jason)

"without robin i have no family" i guess the titans are just chopped liver huh

"i always thought that one day i'd be batman" nope nope nope nope you have 0 understanding of dick's character if that's what you think mr dixon

i love clark having a part in dick becoming nightwing - i adore it - but the way dixon retcons the importance of the titans, and especially kory, in dick becoming nightwing rubs me the complete wrong way. i'm choosing to read this as a between the scenes moment, but i 100% dixon intended this to replace the titans' importance. and the way ppl just swallow it up w/o thinking about the reasons behind why dixon would want to erase the titans - and kory - pisses me off lmao

"i didn't mean to stay so long [with the titans]" *eternal screaming* he really wants to undermine the titans at every possible turn wow

at least the next page acknowledges the importance of kory in dick's life, but right afterwards we have "lmao she must've liked your costume. all the girls did. you're a chick magnet" (paraphrased) and i'm just back to sighing

also hi i'm mad at the framing of babs being the endgame bc of course they'd do that. and also at kory being shorter than dick. thanks! i hate it! i'm willing to bet that dixon asked for that specifically.

"this is where i came in" i'm confused at this part but tbh i don't care enough to think abt it any more

i'm also ughhhh at the way they're trying to give bludhaven importance. i don't care, i don't like it, he should've never moved there

ok i do really like that last page

the fact files things are good enough, i love the art for the haly's circus one! the pt barnum ref is 😬 though (ik ik it's the 90s but fjskdh why)

lost pages: teen titans-

ok so, i don't like devin grayson. i don't like her writing at all, i don't think she gets the characters at all, and hot take: if you dislike a character who's super important part of dick's life, and helped him come into his own and be who he is, you shouldn't be writing that character. (i'm talking about kory here, but tbh if you dislike any of the characters who dick interacts with frequently and are a huge part of his life - especially his love interests, and his family - you shouldn't be writing dick.) so i'm not going into this story with high hopes. however i've seen ppl talk about this story as being really good so i hope i'll like it too

you can tell she mostly cares about the fab five, which wouldn't be a problem if she treated the ntt characters better but alas ://

kory and vic both say 1 thing the entire page lmao

ALSO KORY NOT KNOWING WHAT DAY IT IS IS ABSOLUTE BULLSHIT I CANNOT BELIEVE

i loooove the parallel between dick grasping wally's hand and young!dick holding his dad's hand 🥺🥺🥺🥺

vic legit says one thing the entire story lmaoooooooo 🙃🙃🙃

i love garth and roy being brought to the tower 🥺

this is def some of grayson's better work, but it suffers from the same thing all of her stories do. she doesn't fully understand all the characters. if one character is off it affects the whole story. a lot of her stories have good ideas and poor execution, and this one definitely doesn't have awful execution but there's still something missing and as someone who loves the titans it's just sad. i get why people like this story - it made me tear up at the end ngl - but the rest of the titans are just as important as dick and it feels like the writer doesn't understand that. (i get this is a dick comic but it's still a titans story.) (it does however make me want to write a fic expanding upon this moment and the aftermath bc the idea of the titans all coming together to cheer dick up is so goooooood. are they gonna have a party celebrating dick's parent's lives? are they gonna eat junk food and watch a comfort movie? are they gonna just sit and talk?? the possibilities are endless!!)

the art is gorgeous as all of jimenez' art is, i love his style so freaking much!!

the next page is of the bludhaven supporting cast and all it does is remind me how much i do not care abt them. i think the only one i actually like is clancy, the others are expendable and forgettable. (i do love clancy a lot though, i wish she'd been written by more people than just dixon). though, i usually love guice's art, i think i actually prefer mcdaniel's take on clancy??? which is 100% a first for me.

i like seeing the set up to dick's apartment, bc i'm a sucker for layouts and maps. i wish this comic was way better written bc the concept of dick living in an apartment building and interacting with his neighbours is one i really like, esp in superhero comics. but again i have to say, alas.

a day in the life of nite-wing/hangin'-with tad:

painful... just painful...

i physically couldn't care less about this if you paid me

the next page is tad's file and i am Not Reading That. nope nope nope. and also fuck you.

next is a map of bludhaven, and like i said, i'm a sucker for maps.

the page after that is brutale's file and again i just do not care. the art is by damion scott who i really like, but the design looks like knock off scarecrow so

the next pages are files for double dare, lady vidc, shrike and blockbuster and i'm skipping them all bc i give negative fucks

next is a spread of what i assume is dick's cork-board? it looks kinda interesting but the writing is hard to make out and i don't care enough to try to decipher it

next is torque's files and same same, idc idc

nightwing's romances/orange you glad i didn't say banana?:

ok so y'all know i hate dickbabs. i hate everything about how it was built on the foundation of tearing down kory and dickkory and i'm a kory fan first and foremost so i hate this whole situation. so i'm already predisposed to disliking anything that talks about how babs is dick's true love, and talks down any of his other love interests. i come into this with an admitted bias. i'd try to be charitable but i don't see why i should when no one involved in the writing of dickbabs is charitable towards my faves so 🤷

i love love love stelfreeze's art! he's drawn babs in something else i read and i loved it then and i love it here!

i adore dick and babs' friendship, so the beginning is really sweet and cute. i also love the concept of baby!dickie being obsessed with watermelons and wanting to eat them forever

dewey decimal system!!! librarian babs reference!! fdjkh she's such a nerd i love it

babs trying to talk about romance and dick's like 'lol nah what abt fighting' lmao

i Do Not like babs hitting dick while talking abt 'i was segueing into talking about romance, hint hint'

this is romance? dick giving exactly 0 fucks?

why are these writers obsessed with hinting at dick and donna??? like first dixon and now grayson??? please stop!!!! i do love how he says he loves her bc 🥺🥺🥺 i love them

ur not being slick having babs call donna 'donna' and kory 'starfire', i see you grayson. i see ur hate for kory.

and reducing kory to just her body, and dick's sexual attraction to her boils my blood

i'm choosing to interpret babs's face in that panel as her being attracted to kory too

i do like that dick talks about being in love with kory, and thinking about still being with her. a) i'll take those crumbs, and b) thats how i see dick's relationship to love as being (though devin views him as kinda flighty and unfaithful so idk how we're agreeing on this lmao)

pls stop talking shit abt huntress devin, ur the one who made dick/hel a thing

since devin loves her brudick subtext, i'm side-eyeing the mention of bruce there

also why are we hinting at cass pls stop

babs being jealous and petty pls stop

the ending was smooth i have to admit it. if it was any other ship i'd probs love it but as it is, i'm tired of everyone else being downplayed in favour of the ~babs is dick's true loooooveee, it's always been herrrrr, from the beginningggggg~

i don't mind babs being dick's first crush though, in fact that's my hc for him because hello?? who wouldn't have a crush on babs??

thank you mr stelfreeze for accurately portraying babs' bitchface bc she's being a petty bitch here (and i love her but lmaooo i hate this whole thing)

next is the files on the bludhaven pd and i do not caaaare

then there's a timeline, but i don't care about any timeline that dixon writes. i'm petty though so i'm gonna read it and talk abt why i don't like the retcons.

i hate the dickbabs reference in YEAR FUCKING 3 jfc. pls stop with the retcons.

also lmao the difference between the way dick's canon relationship from that time is described in the shittiest way possible (though reluctant at first, dick begins a long and tumultuous romance with teammate starfire.) and how he wrote dick and babs' relationship (robin first teams with ... barbara in her guise as batgirl. the two will pair time and again over the course of their careers and develop a burgeoning affection for one another) this was at a time when they weren't even remotely interested in each other!!! there was no affections there dixon! no matter how much you wish it to be true!! and again the contrast with 'starfire' and 'barbara'! like it's dehumanising and i hate it.

and he can't even bother to get the new teen titans' team name right.

no mention of kory's importance in dick becoming nightwing, nope we ignore that bc it's thanks to superman now.

stepping away from the way he hates kory to talk about the way he hates jason! jason's described as a 'troubled orphan' and a 'juvenile delinquent'.

no mentions of how jason and dick bonded but as soon as tim gets introduced he talks about how dick and tim 'switfly bond as brothers'.

another incredibly impersonal description of dick and kory's relationship (the wedding of dick grayson and kory anders (aka starfire) is aborted by the rogue titan raven. dick and kory soon part company and dissolve their relationship.) but at least he calls her kory this time.

also i love how he speeds up through all the 'non important' development for dick but spends a whole page talking about all the bullshit he's been writing for nightwing. i understand why, but it's just lmaooooo 🙃 when you read it like that, it really shows how shitty this comic is.

talks of the 'doomed relationship' between dick and hel and i really hate it pls stop

the last page is dick's evaluation by the police academy and i do not care so i'm skipping it too.

[ethanlivemere]

Nobody asked, but here’s my opinion on the CATS-trailer

So it’s been about three months since the CATS-trailer came out and somehow I thought NOW would be a good time to express my opinion on it. It’s quite controversial, but have you ever wanted to hear what a long-time hardcore CATS-fan who has been wanting a CATS-movie for years thinks about it? Probably not, but I went and made this very long post anyway.

1)      Cast

Can’t spell ‘cats’ without ‘cast’ and there’s some big names in the list of actors they’ve released. Some are excellent choices, some are more… questionable.

Ian McKellen as Gus: Now this is something that makes me profoundly happy. Sir McKellen honestly seems perfect for the role, I mean, he practically IS Gus the Theatre Cat (maybe a little younger, and less feline). Great choice, looking forward to it. Judi Dench as Old Deuteronomy: Now here’s one of the more questionable ones. I love dame Dench, that isn’t the problem; it’s just that Old D is supposed to be a large, old, deep-voiced male cat, and dame Dench only fits one of those characteristics. Of course, they could very well change Old Deuteronomy to be the matriarch of the tribe rather than the patriarch, and that would probably be fine. I’m more worried about whether Old D’s singing parts (like The Ad-dressing of Cats) would work as well with a higher, female voice. And of course, they would have to do tweaks to the song Old Deuteronomy itself, and ‘Old Deuteronomy’s buried nine husbands’ doesn’t sound that great. Idris Elba as Macavity: Here’s one that I’m very interested in. I think they might give Macavity a larger role in the film, which is a big ‘heck yeah’ for me, and Elba seems like he could portray the Napoleon of Crime like the menacing figure it’s supposed to be very well. I look forward to both the portrayal, and what the writers do with him. Jennifer Hudson as Grizabella: There’s an old saying that goes: “a CATS-performance is only as good as its Grizabella”. Will this one be any good? I don’t know, we’ll have to see. The bits of Memory we have heard so far sound decent, although nothing will ever top Elaine Paige for me (as you will notice further in this post, I’m a bit of a ‘1998 video version’-purist) It should be noted that her design doesn’t look a whole lot like Grizabella, but that’s a different category. As long as she can deliver a Memory that almost makes me cry, then it’s fine. James Corden as Bustopher Jones: I know a lot of people hate Corden, but I personally don’t mind him. He’s okay in my opinion (I have never seen his late night show, so that might be the reason). Whether he’ll be able to pull of BJ’s almost opera-like singing is something we’ll have to wait and see, because I very much doubt he did the singing in One Chance himself. Taylor Swift as Bombalurina: I have no idea how this will turn out. She can certainly sing (something we can’t say for sure about a lot of other cast members) but I have no idea if she’ll make a good Bomba. Rebel Wilson as Jennyanydots: I’ll go ahead and say it: I wasn’t too fond of the Jennyanydots bits in the trailer. They were a bit too slapstick-y for my likes, and Rebel Wilson isn’t exactly known for subtle humor. Once again, we’ll see how it turns out. Jason Derulo as Rum Tum Tugger: Recent CATS-productions have been changing the classic RTT we know and love to some sort of rapper abomination, and many fans (including myself, as you may notice by that wording) don’t like it. It’s unclear which version the movie will be going for: Derulo certainly resembles the rapper version more, but what we saw in the trailer looks like neither, though slightly leaning towards the classic version. Let’s hope we don’t have to hear RTT rap his own song. Ray Winstone as Growltiger: Look, I have never seen or heard of Ray Winstone, but just seeing Growltiger on the cast list fills me with profound happiness, because that’s the one big complaint I have about my beloved 1998 video version: no Growltiger. Hurray for Growltiger’s return!

That’s the main ones I wanted to discuss. Munkustrap seems unimportant in the trailer (we’ll get to that in a bit) so I won’t discuss him. Victoria mainly just has to be a good dancer, and Francesca Hayward seems to be just that, so no further comment (though more on Victoria later).

2)      Character design

Alright, let’s address the elephant in the room: the CGI. Yes, some of the characters make me very uncomfortable. Yes, I hope they change some things before the final product. But what I want to discuss is the designs themselves.

First of all: head shapes. Apart from some exceptions (Grizabella, Old D, Gus) all cats seem to have a human shape of head, and this bothers me. Usually, Cassandra stands out by her head shape, and so do Cori and Tanto, but here they all have that shape. Usually, RTT has a very wide head to go with his mane, but here? This is my biggest problem with RTT in this trailer (ignoring the threat of rapper-Tugger): the combination of his thin head, kind of small mane and completely different colors make him barely recognizable as Tugger. Many cats look very different: Old D, even ignoring the fact that it’s a woman now, has completely different colors. The same goes for Bombalurina. Maybe this is the ‘don’t you dare change anything’-fanboy side of me talking, but in cases where fur color is the only way to recognize a character, this is a big deal. Macavity also looks completely different, although cool. The hat looks be a bit weird on him though. Also Mistoffelees has black patches on his eyes, not sure how I feel about that.

Overall, the awkward CGI and many changes make character design one of the things I’m less happy about, but oh well.

3)      Sets & backgrounds

I think the backgrounds look gorgeous, although some are very obviously CGI (here we are at the CGI again). But there’s one problem: CATS takes place on a junkyard. I know, obviously they would want to expand a little in the film and include more different settings, and I completely agree: I would’ve been disappointed if they hadn’t. The problem is that I haven’t seen a single junkyard in the trailer. We see streets, a theater, a fancy house, a square, a graveyard, a bar… but no junkyard. Some shots may look like they’re on a junkyard, but trust me: they’re either in the theater, graveyard, or the alley at the back of Bustopher’s favorite club. Again, this is basically me going ‘they changed something reeee’, but come on. It’s like if the Les Mis movie was set in Italy. Tom Hooper, do me a favor and include at least ONE scene on a junkyard.

4)      Story

The musical is, much like Les Mis, 100% singing and talking with music accompaniment, and 0% regular dialogue. From the line said by Victoria at the end of the trailer, we know that they won’t do like Les Mis and completely sing the movie, and I’m perfectly fine with that. CATS’ story has always been a bit unclear for a casual patron who doesn’t know the lyrics and deep lore of the musical, so I’m glad they’re putting in some regular dialogue. If anything, it’ll give us a chance to see the Jellicles’ personalities better.

But speaking of Victoria: it seems like she and Mistoffelees will be the main characters in the movie. This is odd, but understandable. CATS doesn’t have a clear main character. You could say it’s Grizabella, but she’s only in a couple of scenes. You could say it’s Munkustrap, although he is regarded more as the narrator than the main character. However, the trailer has a disappointingly small amount of Munk, and his name is very low on the IMDB cast list. The same goes for Skimbleshanks, who I’m not sure if he’s in trailer at all (unless he’s the cat with the pants) and is even lower on the list than Munkustrap, plus there are no trains or train stations in the trailer. Odd.

Anyway, back to Misto and Vic. Normally, Victoria’s only role is performing a couple of amazing ballet routines, but that doesn’t seem to be case here. I personally would’ve picked Jemima over Victoria as a main character, but I guess her design isn’t as easily recognizable as Victoria’s (have I mentioned how many of the cats look pretty much the same in this version?)

Someone who also seems to have a much larger role is Bustopher. Normally he only appears during his own song, but here he seems to be a more general presence. We’ll see how that works out.

Anyway, if Munkustrap is reduced to just being the cat who sings about the Old Gumbie Cat and maybe Old Deuteronomy, I’ll be mad. (AND THEY BETTER NOT REMOVE HIS FIGHT OVER DEMETER WITH MACAVITY OR I’LL BE VERY MAD) Speaking of Demeter, she’s also very absent in the trailer and low on the cast list. Guess they made Bombalurina more prominent because they got a big name to play her.

5)      Background characters (specifically Tumblebrutus)

As I said in the previous bit, it looks like many characters will be reduced to minor characters, so cats who already were background characters in the musical (like my boy Tumblebrutus) will probably have very little time to shine. I guess that’s inevitable, but I hope they at least make an effort to include the various background characters rather than replace them with generic OC’s. Luckily, I already recognized Pouncival in the background of one of the shots, so there’s hope. But if they don’t include my boy, my all-time favorite Jellicle, the best character in CATS, known as Tumblebrutus, then I’ll be even more mad than if they remove the Munk vs. Mac fight. He’s not on the IMDB list (unless he’s one of the ‘ensemble’ characters) but neither is Pounce and I definitely saw him so fingers crossed I can spot Tumbles when I watch this movie.

Conclusion

Am I excited for this movie? Heck yeah! Am I scared this movie might turn out shit? Heck yeah! There’s really no telling how good this will be (a lot depends on whether the final product has better CGI cats), but I think my viewing experience will be a mix of “Oh my god I’ve been waiting so long for a CATS movie oh look I recognize that character this is awesome oh here comes my favorite song I literally know this entire 2 hour musical by heart” and “Oh my god what is this RTT design where is Tumblebrutus why is there no junkyard why did they slightly alter this one lyric why isn’t this EXACTLY like the 1998 video version I love so much when I get home I’m just gonna watch that version again it’s much better anyway”.

Yours sincerely,

Ethan Livemere, certified CATS-expert and Tumblebrutus fanboy

[clairebeauchampfan]

Hysteria, hubris, hype, histrionics....that’s one thing. But the rampant hypocrisy, hate and  homophobia now displayed by a number of shippers....that’s another.

Here’s a heartfelt post by @rainmanjdog, a plea for shippers to be left to have ‘fun’ in the way they want to without others’ disapprobation ( I assume she didn’t literally mean to compare shippers to members of the NRA)

(My bold for emphasis).

rainmanjdog

Quote “Why do people who don’t like what is said on Tumblr read it then?  I HATE the NRA, so why would I subject myself to pro-NRA blogs?

Here is my truth.  I sometimes go to Twitter, like last night, to just have fun. Sometimes, I just want to be a normal fan and have fun with it all.  I thought Caitriona looked beautiful last night.  Its subjective.   I wasn’t a fan of the hearts, but if I tried to pull off that look?  Heaven help you all!  I dislike Sam’s people trying to turn him into a cookie-cutter Hollywood actor.  Because that is what he becomes, lost in the crowd.  Sam shines when Sam is unique Sam, so enhance that, don’t turn him into something he is not.  The guy has freaking natural curls?  Why not enhance that?  But, its subjective.

What I don’t understand and never have?  Why don’t people stay in their own lanes?  My feelings are MY feelings.  Your take is YOUR take.

I try really hard to not take all of this too seriously or personally.  But I fail at it, obviously, or I wouldn’t spend so much time here talking about how I feel!  With her scientific mind, @tvuckic has really helped me see this whole thing as a puzzle.  A game?  (No matter that I am an analyst by profession, I will ALWAYS be an emotional processor first.)  My expectations as a “shipper” are so low, in fact, that I kinda saw last night as…..predictable, and “successful” because a puzzle piece fit.  I was just happy to not see the appearance of someone who cheered and laughed while an animal was being sworn at as it was being beaten because it wasn’t dying fast enough.  That is how low my expectations have become.  Marina?  Success.  She is a loyal, trusted friend to BOTH Sam and Caitriona and a keeper of secrets.  Whatever you choose to believe those secrets are or aren’t.

For an hour or two last night?  I actually had fun again.  I did.  So?  What isn’t fun is women judging other women’s feelings or perceptions.  YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO FEEL OR THINK AS YOU DO.  Your feelings are YOUR feelings.  Your perceptions are YOUR PERCEPTIONS.

The reality is, as long as I base my emotions and happiness on the actions of two people who care less about me?  Its going to be a bumpy ride.  I want off that ride.  If you are able to rise above any of it and just block out the rest?  More power to you.  If you aren’t?  I get it.

Remember when we had a picture of Sam with his machete BTS from Caitriona filming Season 4?  They were making an IG story/“home movie” of an ax-murderer.  They are two seriously ridiculous, silly people who I think either take themselves too seriously in HW at times or there are circumstances I don’t understand. Hey!  This sea-sick shipper is grateful they at least didn’t attend different parties or let the cat out of the bag that they actually attended the same party this time.  I understand feeling cheated.  No, I FEEL cheated because while the two seemed to pretend they were ships-passing-in-the-night at the VF party?  We get treated to my darlingly adorable, always-smiling Emelia Clark with her GOT husband (and “my Hawaiian BF”) Jason.  To Sam and Caitriona?  What’s a few hours at a party pretending you don’t know the other is there?   To us the fans?  A picture would have gone a long way.  A LONG WAY in bringing positivity to a pretty dreary fandom.  So…..I call BS.   I don’t see Bradley or Lady Gaga outraged people are shipping them.

The unkindness, judgments, sanctimonious opinions in the Outlander fandom is what I call BS on the most.  THE MOST.  

Sam, Caitriona, Outlander?  It may feel serious, but it really isn’t.  None of it is worth an iota of my anger.  I wish it was easier said than done. You know what IS serious?  Human-trafficking.  You know what really makes me angry?  My country can’t go a single week without a mass shooting.  I can’t do ANYTHING about Sam, Caitriona or condescending fans, but I can certainly TRY to do something about the recent statistics showing we may have wild orangutans wiped off the face of the earth in five years.  I am NOT OK with that.” Unquote

Let’s look again at Rainmanjdog’s line:

“The unkindness, judgments, sanctimonious opinions in the Outlander fandom is what I call BS on the most.  THE MOST.” 

Does that apply then to the group of ‘fans’ who say Sophie Skelton can’t act? No unkindness there. 

Or the ‘fans’ who, far from giving ‘constructive criticism’ of Season 4, described it as the worst season ever, and (unlike the vast majority of viewers) could find NOTHING positive to say about it? The ‘fans’ who didn’t even watch the last three episodes, but relied upon the relentlessly negative critiques of @pissed- offsoka13?  The fans who rubbished the writing, the ‘fans’ like @jamesandclairefraser who called for Maril, Toni and Matt to be fired? The fans  who even called for Cait to be replaced because in Season 4 she frowned a lot and crossed her arms, just like she has done in every other season, if you were paying attention? 

Or does she mean the unkindness of the ‘fans’ who have traduced  Cait’s motives and character ever since the engagement, whilst trashing  the morals and motivation of Sam’s unfortunate blonde girlfriend ....what do they call her....’trashy’? No sanctimonious judgmentalism there.....no unkindness

Or perhaps she’s referring to ‘former’ fans like @its-moopoint, who never ceases to lose an opportunity to ‘ping’ with her finely tuned gaydar Sam (because he isn’t married to Caitriona, so he must be gay), or  Duncan (because he has no visible girlfriend) or John Bell (gaydar again), even  Tony (because he has a floppy fringe, and is Caitriona’s ‘fake’ fiance, so he must be gay too). Oh, and she accused ‘Tuna girl’ of being a whore, because she was photographed once in the same boat as Sam. Ergo, she must be Sam’s ‘ beard’, or a call girl. 

  No homophobia there then, no judgement, no sanctimony. Just ‘normal ‘ fanning (for me it beggars belief that in 2019 so many ‘liberal’ shippers follow someone with attitudes like that.But it’s okay, isn’t it?  She has A RIGHT TO FEEL OR THINK AS she does .  Her feelings are HER feelings.  Her perceptions are HER PERCEPTIONS.

Presumably that’s the same Tuna girl who @rainmanjdog was relieved not to see on Sam’s arm because she cheered when ....stop!...no sanctimonious opinions or judgments are permitted here on tumblr in the Outlander fandom.  

_________________________________________________________

Well then, I shall get back in my own lane. I won’t criticize the NRA’s objection to having the right to bear arms restricted to a well-regulated militia, like it implies in the American constitution, with good regulations like background checks and the banning of sales of automatic weapons.  I shall just ignore.

 I won’t criticize human traffickers, because I don’t want to stop wicked old men  ‘having fun’ and I don’t want to come over all sanctimonious and judgmental. I shall just ignore. 

And maybe, just maybe, I won’t criticize and be all judgmental and sanctimonious about women being mean, vicious, nasty, horrible and unkind to other women and thinking they can get away with it because their victims work in Hollywood, and are therefore paid to take such judgmental, unkind sanctimoniousness on the chin. I shall just ignore. 

( I do agree though with @rainmanjdog about the destruction of the rainforest and the loss of the orangutans. Take a look, people, at Google satellite on the island of Borneo. See the light green colours...zoom in and take a closer look . see those faint checkerboard grids; that’s all palm-oil plantations planted in the last twenty or thirty years; see how little natural habitat there is left for orangutans : in Malay orang  hutan, ‘man of the forest.’ Now look at the island of Sumatra, once home to elephant, tiger and rhinoceros as well as orangutans, and weep. 

Sorry, I’m straying into the lane of the palm oil manufacturers. My bad.)

#judgmental, unkind and sanctimonious #staying in your lane#normal fanning