#choosing to think its jaehaerys though

[enobariasteeth]

shes sewing Jaehaerys funeral shroud while he sits in the background... im gonna kms

[g0lightly]

Visenya and Rhaenys; Rhaena and Alysanne; Sansa and Arya: An analysis of older and younger sisters' relationships to love and duty in Westeros

While Arya may be the more obvious Visenya comparison at first glance due to her inclination toward warfare, bear in mind that both Rhaenys and Visenya were warriors; arguably, Visenya's impact on Westeros is more defined by her diplomacy (an art Sansa has been learning her entire arc, specifically in the Vale and the Crownlands, the places Visenya conquered) while Rhaenys' impact is one of a warrior (specifically in the place that Arya's direwolf's namesake once ruled). I think that Sansa will ultimately be the Stark sister to fall into the Visenya archetype while Arya is more of the Rhaenys.

To be clear, this analysis is more about the Fire and Blood characters' roles in the story than their actual personalities since the text inherently leaves F&B characters' personalities way more open for interpretation than any POV character. With that in mind, I will be commenting on choices made by F&B characters that demonstrate character traits that the Stark girls also demonstrate and situations/events that mirror their stories. I also do not think that any character in ASOIAF is ever anything even close to a perfect 1:1 of any other character and do not intend to imply that this is the case.

Here's a previous reblog with my commentary on this subject, some of which I will repeat here. To summarize that commentary, I believe that Visenya and Rhaena (who directly compared herself to Visenya while comparing Alysanne to Rhaenys) establish a pattern of eldest sisters who were sought-after wives due to their place in the line of succession but ultimately choose to buck the rules when they realize their sense of duty to the system they live under will never truly help them. I strongly believe that Sansa is on her way to a similar arc and that this is (at least partially) what Lady's death means for her story.

Though one may be quick to think of Rhaenys as a more dutiful wife than Visenya since she is framed as the more traditional of the two women, I would like to remind my fellow readers that Visenya married Aegon for duty while Rhaenys married him for love. Visenya also established the first Kingsguard along with its vows because she believed that Aegon's guards were not attentive enough -- not unlike Sansa establishing the Brotherhood of the Winged Knight in the Vale to protect the young Lord Robert Arryn. While Sansa does not wish to be a warrior herself, she loves everything to do with knights, tourneys, and heraldry -- that is more of the way I see her emulating Visenya.

Regarding Visenya's diplomacy in the Vale specifically, I think it is notable that the Vale during the conquest was ruled by a regent on behalf of a boy king, not unlike Sweetrobin and Littlefinger. Though one might expect Visenya and Vhagar to burn the Eyrie to a crisp, as they had previously done to ships in Gullstown, she instead invited the young King Ronnel onto Vhagar to amuse the boy. The dragon's presence was also an inherent threat to Queen Regent Sharra Arryn, don't get me wrong. Without dragons in Westeros, the Eyrie was impenetrable. With dragons in Westeros, it was not -- and Visenya chose a very diplomatic way to remind Sharra Arryn of that fact. This is the kind of approach I expect Sansa to come away with from the Vale: Tactful and courteous but no less effective. She just needs to wield the power to back it up.

If Rhaenys had been more duty-minded, perhaps she would have married into a great house to give the Targaryens more allies in their conquest of Westeros. Instead she followed her heart and I believe Arya would do the same -- especially if she had a goddamn dragon. Additionally, because Alysanne and Jaehaerys are remembered in the histories as this perfect couple, it is easy to forget that they defied Alyssa when they married. Because of the reaction to Rhaena's marriage to Aegon, Alyssa reasonably worried that Jaehaerys and Alysanne's marriage would be unpopular. Nevertheless, Jaehaerys and Alysanne overcame this and went on to be remembered as the most beloved rulers in Westerosi history.

Sansa, on the other hand, pursues a man she actively dislikes (Harry Hardyng) because she believes she must marry him to retake Winterfell. This same pattern can be seen with Rhaena as well -- despite Rhaena clearly being a lesbian, she marries her own Aegon and has his children. Not unlike Sansa, Rhaena's place in her family's line of succession leads her to become one of Maegor's Black Brides. Though Sansa did not marry Joffrey, like Rhaena she experienced physical and sexual abuse from a cruel king at the Red Keep. Both Sansa and Rhaena had to mourn their fathers and brothers -- their most trusted male protector figures -- during their time in the Red Keep and were forced to marry into the political faction responsible for their deaths.

After Maegor's death, Rhaena shocked her family when she married the simple second son of the modest Fair Isle rather than making a match that would benefit House Targaryen. Of course, it was Elissa Farman that Rhaena loved rather than Androw Farman. As the closest thing to a canonically lesbian character in the ASOIAF-verse, Rhaena's place in the Targaryen line of succession meant that love and duty would always be at odds for her. When Rhaena fulfilled her duty by marrying Aegon, she was rewarded with the loss of her lover (Melony Piper), the loss of two of her brothers (one of whom happened to be the father of her children), being separated from her daughters, and her marriage to Maegor the Cruel. I can't blame her if that experience made her decide that a woman's "duty" in Westeros is a trap, because it absolutely is. After all of the losses she has endured, I would not be surprised if Sansa goes on to feel the same.

Since Rhaena is one of the more fleshed out characters from Fire and Blood, we also know a bit about how she dealt with her emotions. Like Sansa at the Tourney of the Hand when a young knight from the Vale was killed, Rhaena is noted to have had stony reactions to the many tragedies in her life (I believe this is because she was a dragon dreamer; that's for another meta but I mention this because Sansa was also emotionless for a reason that may have been related to her magic bond with her magic pet). This creates a little triad with Sansa and Alyssa Arryn, for whom Alyssa's Tears was named. Rhaena also had a favourite from the Vale named Alayne Royce, I'm just saying.

Just as I believe Sansa will have to kill the idea of being a lady to become the leader she needs to be, I think that Arya had to break away from civilization as her direwolf did to grow into someone who can lead her own pack just as Nymeria does. Like Alysanne, I think Arya will use her power to help the most powerless people in Westeros. Like Rhaenys, I think her impact on Westeros will be one of a warrior. However, I think Arya's unique experiences and personality will ultimately make her more effective than either Rhaenys or Alysanne were in both warfare and welfare. I especially think this will be true if she is able to work closely with Sansa and Bran -- they're the real trio that mirror the conquerors of the Starklings IMO, sorry Jon. With Arya the warrior, Sansa the diplomat, and Bran the greenseer king, they would be unstoppable in ruling Westeros.

A pair of sisters from Fire and Blood that make for a more obvious comparison to Sansa and Arya would be Rhaena and Baela. Unlike the other examples, however, their place in the line of succession does not shape their lives in the way it does for Visenya, Rhaena, and Sansa. When the matter of their place in succession does come up in choosing an heir for the young Aegon III, however, his regents argued that Rhaena would be the more suitable choice despite being the younger twin. When they suggest that the "willful" Baela make a proper match as a possible future queen consort, she defies them by sailing off to Driftmark where she marries Alyn Velaryon. Rhaena, however, agreed to marry Lord Corbray per the regents' wishes.

Sadly, Rhaena suffered miscarriages in her effort to fulfill her duty to the realm as heir. Some time after Baela bore a daughter, the two sisters united to present Daenaera as Aegon III's queen consort. Alyn also brought back to court an heir with a better claim -- Viserys II -- taking the pressure off of Rhaena to endure more miscarriages to provide heirs. I believe that for Baela, presenting Daenaera and Viserys to court was in part an act of love for her sister, to free her from the demands of being heir. I believe this most likely also took the pressure off of Baela because her own daughter would be Aegon's heir if anything happened to Rhaena and I don't think she wanted that for Laena.

Baela and Rhaena were not the first twin girls whose place in the line of succession was determined by their own choices rather than their birth order, however. Assuming you believe that Rhaella and Aerea (which sounds a bit like Arya) really did switch places at their mother's wedding to Maegor, these two little girls determined their own places in the line of succession by seizing one of the only scraps of agency they would realistically ever get in their lives. Both Sansa and Arya repeatedly demonstrate this same willingness to seize whatever agency they have in the books, though the form that agency takes looks as different for them as it did for Aerea and Septa Rhaella. The twin switch means that the twin who wanted to live with the Faith got to do so and the twin who wanted to explore could do so as well. For Septa Rhaella, I believe there was a certain freedom in giving up her claim to live a quiet life.

I firmly believe that both Sansa and Arya will be significant leaders of some kind by the end of the series. Assuming Bran is king at the end, I think they will have a lot more agency in shaping their own titles/roles as leaders than they might in other circumstances. Or at least that's my hope. Even though I am first and foremost a Sansa fan, I don't think her story needs for her to be Queen in the North. I love the idea of her becoming a leader outside of the traditional power structure she initially wanted to be a part of. As for Arya, I love the idea of her bringing what she learned in her life outside of that power structure to be an effective leader within it.

I think Ned put it best:

"Sansa is your sister. You may be as different as the sun and the moon, but the same blood flows through both your hearts. You need her, as she needs you … and I need both of you, gods help me." - A Game of Thrones, Arya II

Shoutout to this ask on @atopvisenyashill for kicking me back into hyperfocus about Visenya's commonalities with Sansa so I remembered that I was ever even working on this... this meta sat unfinished in my drafts since the summer! Many such cases in my drafts, I'm afraid.

[horizon-verizon]

Alysanne is treated awfully by her husband, who is never once confronted by the narrative for his horrible behaviour. Who would rather risk her dying in childbirth than take any steps to prevent pregnancy as she requests, forces her beloved and mentally disabled daughter to be married off despite the obvious risk to her life and refuses to take responsibility when Daella inevitable suffers an awful death, and who values people of Alysanne’s gender so little that he completely goes against Westerosi custom by passing over his own granddaughter.

If Alysanne, powerless apart from what Jaehaerys deigned to grant her, helpless to stop her daughters being out at risk or to decide for herself to see Saera again, is GRRM’s example of a good queen, it’s pretty sad.

I understand the frustration, since again we never get more queens exactly like Rhaenys or Visenya and even here we may comment on how un-feminist or anti woman it is to not have them as "ideal" queens when Rhaenys died in the violence of war (the eradication of women in fiction) while Visenya enables a tyrant to rule...but really F&B and the Targaryens' history was not really supposed to be a feminist tale BECAUSE the history--though not-- was meant to show the decline of royal female power & agency that happened due to the assimilation into Andal patriarchy for power and/or to get a foothold and unified state to fight against the Others if you think of the theory of Aegon having a dragon dream about this. Especially in connection to Dany's rise.

AND I will say I do agree to critique on how GRRM's writing sometimes inspires anti-woman-ess through a paltry (thought we can't say nonexistent, there is a punishment against rape or sense of social taboo on rape in Westeros, but...) pushback or punishment for rape and violence against women [joannalannister]. I'm saying that GRRM's work is not meant to be taken as actual feminist literature but a series that really sets out to dramatize already obvious and present/past truths and conditions...sometimes to the detriment of its female characters and the impression made on readers. GRRM is still a liberal-ist white man.

AT THE SAME TIME, SINCE THIS ISN'T A FEMINIST SERIES BUT A "LOOK WHAT CAN HAPPEN" SORT OF THING:

I think that the whole point is that, yes, this is sad and it stems from how limiting such a set up/social conditions are AND Alysanne was a politically "good" queen. How she treats her own kids and is complicit in how they died or ran away should be a part of how "good" one is as a general sort of leader, yeah, but unlike Jaehaerys and the "good" he did, Alysanne's "good" acts for the realm had much more of a necessary impact in the sociopolitical landscape of their subjects. And I mean towards more marginalized groups, esp women. It's like she made sure to "round up" those left behind in other aristocrat's projects.

la-pheacienne says this:

Whether that someone has been chosen by the people, or by the gods, or by destiny, or by circumstances, and regardless of the political system that allowed them to yield that power, the point is that someone has power ad hoc at any given time, and power equals responsibility. What do you do with it? How do you govern? How do you choose between two equally grievous alternatives? Who do you listen to? Who do you trust? How can you learn? What if everything you've been told was a lie? How do you move on from there? What if the promises you made contradict each other? What if you fail? How do you live with the guilt, how do you go on? How do you instigate a structural change? What if you try to do that and people die? What if you try to do that and it kills you? Was it worth it?

On top of that, Alysanne was still a Consort, not a Regnant. (POST & POST) She had less power than Rhaenya or Visenya, who though were not exactly Regnants they also weren't just Aegon's wives but consummate and active politicians themselves, making deals in the open, riding dragons into wars, enacting laws, and creating institutions.

Alysanne had to rely on her husband's power to have and hope to have her thoughts on legislation come to reality. It is just a fact that queen consorts, unlike Queen Regnants, had to depend on their royal husband's favor, regard, or perception of need of them to have any semblance of power. Because they were women and consorts. It's part of the deal, the sociopolitical conditions. In reality and real history, it was such for MOST queen consorts.

Yeah they had more power at court and influenced their husbands, but you are seeing in Alysanne something that looks like what that sort of power could have been like. Even Alysanne had more influence over Jaehaerys than some real queen Consorts and those that came after her! Think of Rhaella, Naerys, Myriah Martell, etc.

Were there female consorts in real history who practiced more influence, power, etc. than their officially ruling husband or were their active equals in terms of policy making while showing some power over their kids lives than just, of course! But this is not the rule of the land, but exceptions. Nor the most common experience of medieval/early-mod-period women/female consorts precisely bc it was thought women didn't make good rulers. There is Empress Sisi, who couldn't even keep her own children close to her because royal children are not considered the Queen's but those "of the state", so the emperor and/or his mother could force them apart for any reason.

Juxtapose this to the Viserra situation. Alysanne actually was the one to arrange for the marriages she knew her husband wanted (esp after the whole deal with Daella refusing nearly every man/boy), and insisted to Viserra she had to marry Theomore Manderly. She had more power over her kids than you may think...it's not perfect because she is of course anticipating & complying with Jaehaerys' desires for the girls to be married off quick enough to build certain alliances or to just get rid of them, but she does not allow herself to really think the match bad and refuses to listen to her daughter. There was will here, from Alysanne not present in Sisi, and again, she had more power than later Consorts...yet based in Jaehaerys' will because she is a Consort and a dragonrider (helps the impression and image to gain "respect").

So we're presented with another question this series inspires: when & how should someone lay blame or responsibility on marginalized groups, identities, etc. like women of aristocratic classes, men of lower classes, either of different "races" (fiction and reality), and with what evidence?

First, Alysanne married Jaehaerys as his companion since she was 13. Before that, they were very close and were more or less each other's most important and intimate companions for years. She saw him as the default king, the leader, and herself as a necessary ingredient to Westeros' prosperity. That they would work more together than other couples...She was both right and wrong, and I think/headcanon she was sorely and quietly disappointed well before she observed Jaehaerys pass a girl over the 2nd time. So she acted the way she did at "home" towards her kids to feel more in control bc that is where Jaehaerys left her to act with some agency or authority more.

Second, Daenerys is the example of a "perfect", ideal, but also realistic "good queen"; someone that realistically and optimistically chooses to do good with the power she has and has managed to find value and meaning to use said power for others other than herself despite all that she went through. How those things would likely have turned some other women out, who were compelled to be more self-oriented, like Rhaenyra or Daena. She is purposefully different from her ancestors this way, but also similar to a lot of them, in that particular inner strength that she has to reinforce her altruism. That doesn't mean that people who don't do that special balance of strong altruism to her level are completely incapable, evil, or "bad queens".

Cersei? Hell yes, but even with Cersei we must acknowledge how while she is how she is bc she herself is pretty narcissistic and has been since young, most of her circumstances also has her try to make things better for herself due to certain circumstances and most criticism against her in the fandom--or the loudest--are sexist or just unfair. Alysanne? She at least did something where most did nothing and went against the clear wishes of her husband, and within the timeline she still is a source of inspiration for people like Dany. That has to mean something or there really is less of a source to compare oneself and learn from or to be able to analyze the good, bad, and how things developed the way they have.

This is a world where you are not encouraged to think outside of your own class, much less the principles and ideology about your gender. There are little to no thinkpieces or essays about how sexist some men and women are, what gives them the feeling that the way they think is correct, etc. There was and is no vocabulary for that; there is just experience and having to respond to your environment. You have to do the legwork yourself, and your group and support system, your own connections, and play the game. Sometime, you will fall off and especially when you have been bested or someone has used their socially given advantage over you...was Jaehaerys has done to Alysanne a few times or what courtiers and other lords can do.

So, with this in mind, I think it's important to acknowledge that yes while GRRM did not supply more examples of ideally acting "good queens", he does provide a clear outlook on how women could, would, and did act in real life history and TODAY. Because those questions about how to be a good ruler or a good person or how to differentiate. But it's not GRRM's personal example, necessarily or what he thinks a woman is capable of in his idea of a what a good medieval queen cold be. Alysanne is a "good" queen in that she does try to think of her subjects' needs before aristocrats' even with her behavior towards her daughters. To undermine that in our understanding that she did what did to her daughters is probably on GRRM, but more on others.

Jaehaerys was that sincerely altruistic: right of first night abolishment, the KL drinking water, her attempts to convince maesters of girls and women becoming maesters, etc. Again, It is Queen Consorts, unlike Queen regnants, had to depend on her royal husband's favor, regard, or perception of need of her to have any semblance of power because she is a woman and a Consort. I

I suppose I'm trying to say that in the process of understanding rather than being told what is right or logical, it's important to "good queens" from the context of which they come and take serious their conditions to understand the nuances of how truly "good" they were...even if we can say being a "good" queen needs to be an absolute in the first place.

Does Alysanne need to be a perfect feminist to be a good Queen? What if she is also responding to the setbacks against her AS she is trying to rule better, these setbacks that are designed for a man, her husband, to have more power than her and even to stop inhibit her ability to address certain problems without fear of losing said power given to her in the first place bc of her connection to him and official subordination to his paternal rule?

Outside of how he writes sexual violence and general violence against women, the line b/t power of self vs power from men, present in women's authority (especially in pre-feminist movement history), must be studied with some more nuance than with men's power. On our part as readers.

I'd say that GRRM uses violence against women as too much of a "gotcha" or flagrantly uses it as a device of emphasis than it needs to be, which simultaneously converts it to something psychologically insubstantial, something we shouldn't pay as much mind to, yes. The specific events of violence or normalization of violence done to women in ASoIaF that doesn't match real historical realities for women is definitely a huge concern because of this, but to mistake the power dynamics b/t a Consort and her ruling husband and most women to men does not help matters.

[stromuprisahat]

Hi! I saw you read fire and blood, and i really like your commentary on books, so i wanted to ask what you think of the "theory" that the targaryen women are curse or that the have the some of the worse fates of the book? Cause i see that on tiktok a lot, i dont think it is very true.

Any way, hope your having a good end of year and a lovely new year! Ps. English is not my first language, sorry for any mistakes haha

Well, their fates are not exactly rosy, but tbh woman's fate in most of Westeros rarely is.

What makes it more prominent is that Targaryens are both ruling family- therefore theoretically closest to possible change- and foreigners with different customs at the beginning. Customs they abandoned to better fit in and because *cough* Jaehaerys is a dick, who got sick of listening to his personal babymaker *cough*.

It's a gradual loss of importance.

Rhaenys and Visenya ruled alongside Aegon. They made decisions in his absence, they sat the Iron Throne just like him.

Alyssa lived in the shadow of the Queen Dowager and her own weak husband. Later she got married off to an abusive prick, who fucked her into her early grave. That's certainly a horrible way to go.

And the long reign of Jaehaerys "Viva La Patriarchy!" came.

You can trace plenty of what went wrong to him.

The original Heir was his older brother Aegon. Perhaps "Uncrowned", but he had heirs of his own before he died- twins Aerea and Rhaella- girls, but heirs. What's more- their mother, Rhaena Targaryen, was three years older than her brother-husband. There's the question how does Valyrian succession really work, since Targaryens always liked to marry the oldest "couple" to keep the line "pure", but more than man/woman, they seems to care about whether you're a dragonrider or not. Even if we accept Westerosi law, where son comes before daughter, Rhaena should still be Regent to her children. Instead they're skipped in favour of a third son of their grandfather, their uncle. Apparently, Andal and First Men's laws can be ignored as long as it strengthens patriarchy.

At first, Jaehaerys claimed he'll rule with Alysanne, but then she started to get unpleasant ideas and it got more comfortable to sidetrack her to cradles and children's rooms. Once wifey was out of the way, it was unlikely daughters will fare better. Especially since there was so many of them. Their value shrunk to their maidenhead, Jaehaerys' interest in them to how to get rid of them before they lose their worth. Although one could argue (I totally would.) he didn't see daughters as "enough" even before there was so many of them.

Jaehaerys was a sexist pig, who shouldn't even sit the Iron Throne.

Next on the list of his dick-enforcing deeds, is the Great Council. His Heir died- again, uncrowned-, but with a granchild on its way. Instead of naming Rhaenys, or even waiting for her firstborn to arrive, so they can check for appropriate parts, Jaehaerys names his own secondborn- Balon- and after his death, poor Jaehaedick has no idea, who else should rule after him. It's not like the rule above says it's clearly Rhaenys- at that point with a son of her own for fuck's sake-, so he figures the fate of the kingdom should be decided by a bunch of MEN, and summons the Lords to choose their next liege. Surprise, surprise! They pick a weak man, instead of "a fiery maiden".

There's not much positive to be said about Viserys, but his insistance on succession would certainly be the no. 1. Rhaenyra could've been Targaryen's way out of stiff patriarchy. Feminine, adored by masses, supported by her spouse, leaning to her Valyrian heritage... that could've changed Westerosi society from up, but the Dance killed that hope. Even though her children ruled eventually, neither the Broken king, nor his wife-less brother were likely to do anything.

Targaryen or not, a woman is a walking womb now.

Their "curse" is patriarchy and shitty men with power.

Their fates fit their "importance".

Rhaenys and Visenya died as conquering Queens- in a battle and lucky to die of old age.

Rhaena was sidelined by her weak father, by her younger brother, she lost too much and never learned to let go. It killed one of her daughters- ironically the skipped Heir.

Alysanne was killed by her brother-husband's sexism. He was at least partly to blame for the fates of all his daughters (and I count Aemma here too, because her marriage was his doing too). Only the most strong-headed one managed to escape.

Rhaenys died as the Queen she was- perhaps uncrowned just like her father-, but she went out in a battle, mutilating her foes, leaving grandchildren in the line on the Throne behind. If only they'd live long enough to get there. She might have died relatively young, but she played important part in her side of the Dance and she's one of few, whose death I'd call good.

Rhaenyra had particularly cruel life. Ironically, it was work of a woman working within the confinces of patriarchy that kept ruining her life, and said woman's sons, who eventually took everything from her, including her life.

No curse's necessary.

P.S.: Neither is it mine, so as long as we figure out what we mean... 😉

[unusual-raccoon]

Hey so a few days ago I saw this post about how Rhaenyra not telling Alicent that she lost her v card is not the same as Alicent meeting Viserys in the middle of the night and not telling Rhaenyra. And it occurred to me, did anyone question why Viserys would choose the daughter of a second son from a family that doesn't even bring that much into prestige into the Royal Family. Like many could argue it was because of the Hightowers connection to the Faith and the Citadel but House Targaryen has two daughters as members of the faith (Rhaella daughter of Rhaena and Aegon the Uncrowned and Maegelle daughter of Alyssanne and Jaehaerys as septas) and a son in the citadel( Vaegon son of Alyssanne andJaehaerys) so that argument wouldn't really work.

I just wanted to know your thoughts on it as many people tend to gloss over this part when talking Viserys choosing Alicent over literally any other available female in his court(not counting his daughter).

This is a really interesting point! Honestly, I think Viserys was choosing what he believed was the lesser of two evils, someone that he thought would be a decent fit with him (she took an "interest" in his model of Valyria 🥺) and potentially the bigger concern was someone he thought could get along with Rhaenyra.

It feels like a dad move, he's trying his best in the midst of his grief and still thinks his 15-year-old wants a doll or something... The analogy isn't perfect, but I think you understand. The decision was two-fold. He was trying to make a choice that he thought would be beneficial to them both, without considering the way Rhaenyra would be hurt by the decision. This is why their dinner together (Rhaenyra & Viserys) where they discuss the expectation for him to remarry is so interesting, because Rhaenyra is fine with Viserys marrying for duty, and Viseyrs is like great!! Because he thinks marrying Alicent is dutiful to Rhaenyra. He's raising her best friend tremendously in station and has found a wife that is in her childbearing years (he wouldn't have to wait like with Laena) and she is ok with his hobbies - it feels like the best of a bad situation.

Except it backfired so hard because, from Rhaenyra's perspective, her dad just married her best friend for no reason. She had no clue that Alicent was visiting her father and nurturing some sort of affection there with the intention of being his queen.

Realistically House Hightower added nothing. They brought nothing to the table, unlike House Baratheon, Velaryon, etc.

Laena was easily the better choice for him, and the show completely glosses over her close relationship with Rhaenyra, simply to make the Rhaenicent besties angle work.

IDK, it's interesting, but also ppl will make the argument that if Viserys and Laena had gotten married, Corlys would've pushed for any sons through that marriage to be named as heir above Rhaenyra...

Even though, really, its a win-win, if Rhaenyra married Laenor as well... like

I've gone completely off-topic, I'm sorry.

I don't think the late-night visits and the v-card are on the same level in terms of what they're lying about. Alicent never admitted to visiting Viserys because it would've made Rhaenyra aware much sooner that Otto was vying for power, whereas Rhaenyra lied about the v-card because she knew it would be used to ruin her reputation/undermine her position as heir.

It's honestly "You lied for power, I lied to protect myself - we are not the same."

Anyway, I hope this gave you some insight into my thoughts on the matter!

Thank you for the ask 💕🫶

[zeciex]

The anguish and suffering I like it, because it is what will change the dynamics of the characters with each team. What I was afraid of with the loss of the baby is this, losing Daenera with the maternal instinct and Aemond too, as a child gives them that purposeful responsibility of "this is my real family and I will fight to the last breath for them " But if it's going to do almost at the end it's like a conclusion and not during the big part of the war. At least if we take away Daenera's child we will see one version of her being in the war? I hated that Rhaenyra will spend the whole war inactive, depressed, doing nothing while others died for her. Thank goodness the show is changing that. I want the same for Daenera.

And another thing, I hate book purists, can they shut up already and stop throwing shit at a epidose that hasn't even aired yet? This is just an adaptation. Get over it.

The birth of their child does mend the rift between them and give them a common cause--to keep their child safe and well. And losing the child will create a new rift as Aemond pulls back and Daenera being the one to hang onto him for once. But in that shared grief, they also find some common ground. Aemond will give Daenera a choice; to stay with him or to go back to her mother. And Daenera will choose. There will actually be, within the next many chapters, choices that Aemond gives her and I think that's important for their relationship, especially after losing their child.

We'll also see Daenera maintain that maternal instinct as Helaena starts to lose herself to grief. Daenera will try and keep her afloat, as well as offer Jaehaera and Maelor some comfort. But we'll also see Daenera start to gain influence, particularly over and though Aemond. She will be involved with the war as much as the council of men will allow, which isn't much, but we'll see her make more of an effort once she goes to Harrenhal.

I do intend to have her be part of the political side of the war--not so much fighting in it, she might be okay with a knife but she's not going on the battlefield anytime soon, if anything, she'd be the one taking care of the wounded. BUT she will be part of a battle at some point ;)

I also intend to have Rhaenyra be a bit more decisive than what we've seen in the first episodes of the show. She might still be hoping for a peaceful resolution and she might still be indecisive/hold back but it is only because that the Greens have Daenera and she doesn't want to lose another child. That being said, there will be some minor battles and war efforts within the 7 months that happens before B&C--and some of these battles/war efforts originally happens after B&C but as they don't have too much of an effect on the overall arc/story, they can easily happen in those 7 months.

I understand why book readers want the show to be more loyal to the source material as some of the writing decisions for this season in particular has been mediocre at best and down right nonsensical at worst. Personally, I think what ticks off people the most are the writing decisions on how to handle some of the characters--Alicent and Daemon, as well as Rhaenyra to an extent. Alicents character has left much to be desired this season and half of her scenes should have been given to developing other characters because they've done nothing for the story (why the fuck did we have to see 3 AliCole sex scenes AND why did we get her depression camping trip when it did nothing for the plot?) The biggest gripe with this season is how the writers has chosen to handle characters, the pacing, and expecting the viewer to come up with plausible explanations of things that happens off screen (why did Aemond go to the brothel in the first place? What brought him there? How has his relationship deteriorated with Aegon so quickly and no its not just bullying, why wasn't Jaehaerys brought up? What was his reaction to Jaehaerys death and being the cause of it? Why did Daemon devolve as a character to have this haunted mansion plotline where he eats his mother out when he had already accepted Rhaenyra as his queen in s1)

I think many book readers miss the consistency of the characters. But, as a person that have only read snippets of the book, I also miss the consistency of the characters.

[wild-as-a-winter-storm]

Ahh okay so now i've kind of processed episode one of the new season of HOTD...

Overall I though it was good! It was slow and steady but I don't think that's a bad thing, and it was good to get an idea of all these different dynamics and what sort of place they're in.

The stuff with Aegon this episode was actually really fun!

I was definitely expecting more in the north- we get an interesting glimpse into that in fire and blood and I thought that would have been something they'd want to explore and expand on for the show, but I guess not. Would have loved to have seen Sara Snow! I can kind of see why they wanted to get jace back to his family quickly though.

His reunion with rhaenyra was very emotional 😢 as was luke's funeral, i cried over that. Jace holding joffrey, them throwing his clothes and the toy on the fire, alicent lighting a candle for him!!

I should also say Emma gave such an amazing performance this ep with only one line, it was incredible! What an actor they are.

And then there was blood and cheese ... well, it wasn't what I was expecting, certainly. As a lot of people have said, it was toned down, made less brutal, and i would have liked to have seen it stick to the book, particularly in terms of including maelor. But I can also see what they were going for- House of the Dragon does violence in a different way to Game of Thrones, it's less of a spectacle, the sadness of it and people's emotional reactions to it are more the focus than gore or pure shock and horror value. In some ways it's good that they're going a bit more subtle, and the hearing it rather than seeing it, it being just off screen, was horrible in its own way. I mean the sound of a child's neck being sawn through... And phia saban did a great job, helaena's shock and horror and disassociation were heartbreaking. But i dont know, i still think perhaps it didn't feel like a big enough moment? This is supposed to be the most horrific thing that happens in the dance, and I don't know if that would have come across to show-only fans? perhaps it could've had a bit more power if helaena had to make more of a choice. I mean, she still did have to choose who to point at i suppose, but she didn't know if blood and cheese would believe her, if they'd check which was the boy, and they had already decided it was jaehaerys they wanted, so there wasn't this moment of tension and guilt and horror of a mother forced to name which of her children would die. And also there's the fact that maelor isn't going to be there going forward which is a shame.

Yeah, so I have mixed feelings about it basically, but am excited to see the next episode!

[daenystheedreamer]

idk if i should send this as like an ask or a message but the latest omeagorverse post is so delicious and wonderful omg. LOVE WINS! like the detail of the subtle violence of viserys three births really caught my eye. having to have three c- sections to have his children is such a small but important detail to me. did maegor stop making him have children after three because he wasn't producing any more boys or because his body couldn't take being cut open again? and also like I love the surprising detail of Viserys having the autonomy to name his children and naming babyjay after his brother idk I don't want to misinterpret anything but to me that is surprising for maegor to do or allow (like I would've thought he would name his kids all maegor maenor visenya2) just very interesting that he still chooses to honor his family and history in his own fucked up way. like sorry your brother jae is dead :/ you can name our baby after him tho! thanks for the hier ;)

any and all scraps and morsels that you give on this AU are always beyond fabulous!!!

MWAH hello bestie from my puter always lovely to hear from you heartiest apologies for letting you languish in my inbox for honestly probably weeks i dont have a concept of time 😭 answers below <3

c-sections in history are always so visceral i love them 🫶 alyssa velaryon murdered by rogar i LOVED that i loved adapting that to viserys/aemma. childbirth is such a violent act in westeros it really comes across as gendered domestic violence at times, the way it is simply expected for women to destroy their bodies/die in the process of producing an heir for their husband who doesnt daf about them beyond their ability to do this, and then the dismissiveness that men will consider this with. like how tywin is so uncaring about how he has set this up for cersei's life. and c-section is such a fun horror when u dont have epidurals lol so i jst HAD to do c-section<3 plus i didnt want to think about the mpreg reproductive system lol

there's a certain horror too with how close births are in westeros. it's mostly a plot thing but having children every year without modern medicine is so evil... jae/viserra/daenys are all born within a five-year timeline starting from when vis is 15(sorry baby<3) years 44, 47, and 48. i think maegor did try to have more after that but a combo of fate/destiny/dragon has three heads/destroying vis' body it ended after that and maeg was like well if one dies there's two more. plus i think while he would value a son>daughter for Society reasons he respects viserra more than jae cos power>social norms. so he's ultimately fine with the three heirs he has, though he def enjoys tormenting vis with the thought of having to go through another birth ^_^ also i figure after the double whammy 2 daughters in 2 years rhaena is like Put your dick away or i chop it off.

and yee vis picks the names mostly<3 i think he doesnt ask maegor for ANYTHING cos no doubt maegor will use it to fuck with him but when he has a son he's like please please please can i name him after jaehaerys. plus it'll be comnfusing if there's two viseryses. i think maegor would want to name his son aegon as a power play (after his father + to spit on aegon the uncrowned's grave) but he's like damn u actually asked something of me instead of pissing yourself and crying, Ight fine but the next one has to be named after visenya. which makes viserys go a little crazy cos if there's one thing he knows the gods will love its a maegor kid named VISENYA. they compromise on viserra (aww<3 normal marriage!). then its daughter #2 and maegor's like yeah idgaf anymore. if it was a boy he'd name it aegon but its a stupid girl so he's like god idk name is aegelle for all i care. so vis picks daenys after the dreamer.

oo and whenever vis snaps and gets pissy about maegor treating him like horseshit maegor is like well i let you name the kids didnt i. arent you grateful for that lmao i let you name my HEIR. i give you everything... and vis is like sigh might kill myself about this. and it's all part of maegor's grand Make Viserys Insane plan that he's not even doing consciously he just thinks its funny that viserys cries for months after giving birth to jaehaerys cos lol YOU chose to name him after your dead brother! i said aegon YOU chose jae!

canon maegor was really focused on having an heir cos it was like the one masculine ideal he couldnt achieve but i feel like once he's had the kid he doesn't care about them beyond that. his parenting strategy is that kids should just be swole from birth and if they arent that's their problem its not his job to raise them. as The Mother it is viserys' job to raise the kids into mini maegors/visenyas and if the kids dont turn out that way it is viserys' fault.

anyway ily 🫶 hope that was an okay answer<3 im honestly considering making a seperate sideblog for this content cos its so embarrassing 😭

[lya-dustin]

Someone will remember us

Chapter 41

Cw: animal death, sexism, mentions of death in childbirth

Gif by @ben--solos

Though much weakened by his ordeal, King Viserys soon resumed the rule. To celebrate his recovery, a feast was held on the first day of 127 AC. The princess and the queen were both commanded to attend, with all their children.

--- The Rogue Prince, or, A King's Brother: A Consideration of the Early Life, Adventures, Misdeeds, and Marriages of Prince Daemon Targaryen

----

Dragons do not decompose like the other animals; they take longer as their scales are harder than the strongest steel.

Not a single dragon has turned to stone like Ghar did.

The eggs that didn’t hatch became stones, but never a dragon that had lived.

Ghar who had made a nest on grandfather’s stone city and died there.

Ghar who is given a funeral and placed in his own altar amongst the great dragons.

Elēnar Ōghar, five and ten years old, claimed by Princess Aemma of House Targaryen and House Velaryon.

There is no mention of the king, it was a secret that the dwarf dragon had attached himself to a dying Viserys.

A man could not survive with his dignity intact if it were known that a dragon that was more of a lapdog had claimed him as an owner.

“My granddaughter claims it is an ill omen.” Otto Hightower comes to stand with her and she fights the urge to run.

“It may as well be the dying of the dragons.” Aemma points to the last claimed dragon to die, Balerion. Grandfather had been twenty when his dragon died. Viserys Dragonsbane, the first man to kill a dragon after Maegor the Cruel.

An ill omen then and an ill omen now.

Less eggs were hatching since the Black Dread died, then the queens started producing fewer eggs if they had any at all after Queen Aemma died.

The last time Syrax had a clutch of eggs was when Joff was born and only one egg had hatched. Syrax was the only other dragon besides Vhagar to successfully bring forth a clutch of eggs these past four years.

It didn’t help that Dreamfyre and Meleys had lost interest in their mates, the Cannibal ate most young dragons and Sunfyre like Vermithor tended to kill whatever hatchling Silverwing managed to have.

“And yet Vhagar has brought forth an egg for the second time in its life.” It, not she as the dragon likes to be referred as.

Vhagar was the queen of the dragons and demanded that you remembered that.

She was as arrogant as Aemond sometimes.

“She, Vhagar hates being called it.” Aemma corrects. “First Moondancer and now Ēbrior.”

“The Valyrian God that ate its own children?” he asks waiting for her to elaborate on the name.

“Vhagar coiled with a dragon called the Cannibal, seemed fitting.” Aemma said making the man she loathes chuckle. “Besides, my son will choose the name for his dragon when the time comes.”

“Son?” Hightower latched on the word and Aemma knows he is trying to catch her saying something he and his supporters can use.

“I have five brothers; I know the signs. I will have a son, so if the lords wait long enough, they will see a king once again.” This is the longest conversation she has had with the overreaching snake.

Aemma prays it lasts a little longer.

“If they aren’t patient, what then, your highness?”

“Their good names will be soiled; the ringleaders will be executed and perhaps the lesson will be remembered far longer than the one Jaehaerys taught his uncle’s followers.” The princess hides her smirk as she lights a candle in front of Quicksilver, Aenys’ mount. “To quote him, every person in Westeros is House Targaryen’s hostage, if they wish to supplant the King’s heir with their puppet, they will pay for their treasons with fire and blood.”

“Your grandmother has taught you well, your highness, a shame the two of you could not have been men.” Hightower says thinking it is the highest praise he could ever give a woman.

Gods, she couldn’t wait until this man was dead.

He is the curse that’s befallen on her house.

He is the reason their house has begun to decay just like the king.

-----

They were happiest in those four moons away from everything.

They were free to be themselves ---not that either had any fucks to give about people’s opinion to begin with---- and best of all, free from the headache inducing bullshit in court.

His eye plagues him from time to time, migraines or just the damage leftover from his disfigurement. This day is one of those.

Aemond used to rest his head on her stomach and she’d stroke his hair until he fell asleep. Then her belly grew and now she cried because she had enjoyed that moment of intimacy between them.

The babe is strong, kicking like a mule and refusing to give his poor mother any peace unless Aemond draped his arm over her belly.

He is seven and ten, six moons older than Aegon was when the twins were born.

And just like his brother, he does not feel up to the challenge.

Not that he will tell anyone, no, he is a Targaryen, he is a prince and he must always be in control.

And unlike Aegon, he will be a good father and husband.

“What are you thinking, Aemond sapphire-eye?” she asks as he rests his head on her shoulder as she reads.

“If all their progresses were like ours, it is no wonder the Old King always loved traveling.” He lies and hopes she doesn’t pry, but his Aemee knows him too well.

“You know, I am scared too.” Aemma was not taught to swallow her feelings and thoughts and make sure no one knows.

No, Aemma was taught to express such things and worse, talk about them.

Teora had been a wonderful mother to her, but Aemond wished she had taught her to repress things like all the nobles teach their children.

“Hm,” he scoffed. “Your mother and father despite their faults were good at being parents, my mother’s love is conditional on me not being a disappointment like Aegon.”

He speaks nothing about his father, who would he say was his father, Viserys who was too ill and indolent to care or Cole who would have done more if his post allowed him to?

Gods, he is going to fuck up their son.

But that is not his biggest fear, no it pales in comparison to the real thing. Like comparing the now defunct Ghar to Vhagar.

“And yet, that feels trivial because you are the one who may die and leave me to love the child that killed you.” And if her vision comes true, their son will be left orphaned because Aemond’s fucking father did not bother codifying the amendments to the law of primogeniture nor keep his grandfather away from the honeypot.

“I am not dying, and you are not dying either. Aemon will have two parents, an army of nurses and four younger siblings.” She takes his hand and comforts him when he should be the one comforting her. “We won’t fuck up our son, this I promise you, Aemond.”

----

“I have a new job for you.” Mysaria toyed with the silver in her hands as Talya finished her report.

The Pearl was to have a son, Hightower did not trust the One Eye and the King was given a month to live as all his sores reopened following the death of the little dragon.

The winds of war could be felt, the Greens and Blacks alike readied themselves for it while maintaining the façade of peace.

“Whatever you ask for, my lady, I am your servant.” The woman said unprompted.

“I need you to gain the Princess’ trust, I need you to tell her about the tansy tea the queen has.” Mysaria ordered.

The Green Queen had warmed up to the Black Princess, the realm would lose its chance for good rulers if this friendship was allowed to continue.

-----

The Princess is writing in her diary when Talya is allowed an audience with her.

She was not like the Queen, the queen may be kind, but never friendly nor even treating her as an equal like the Pearl of Dragonstone does.

Septa Teora had been like that, so nice and good. If her children take after her and not their father, the realm will thank her.

“Has the Queen sent you, Goodwife Talya?” the princess asked closing the journal shut.

What had been in there that Lady Misery had read? What was so secret about it?

Could it be true that the girl is a lightskirt like her mother, or that she is mad?

“No, my lady. I came by my own accord.” Talya had been trained enough no to fuck it up. “I, there,” she feigns nervousness and clears her throat for effect, “I know things that I am afraid will be used to hurt you and your unborn baby.”

The princess falls for the lie like the gullible little girl she still is.

At first, she doesn’t believe it, but then, remembering how awful the queen was to her and her brothers as a child, she starts to consider her words as truthful.

“The Queen has had me copy the maester’s recipe for moon tea, this morning she asked me to purchase tansy and pennyroyal for her.”

Talya swallows her guilt as the princess gasps and places a hand on her swollen belly as the handmaiden plays on her secret fears just as Lady Misery told her to.

[vivacissimx]

The part where Viserra is opening up to Baelon, she says she does doesn't love Desmond, but that's not the truth tho is it?

To be honest with Baelon, she has to be honest with herself, which is something she doesn't want to do.

Does she love him?

Is it just a crush?

A comfort in pain?

Or just a momentary pleasure?

Also, Stupid headcanon of mine;

If SOME Maester writes abt Jaehaerys' reign in the future, And the part written abt Viserra, it's written as;

Though the princess Queen (King Baelon's queen) wed twice, her true love was always her Last Delena Fassoway Woolfield.

Hehe just a stupid headcanon😋

ITS NOT STUPID IT'S TRUE!!! VISERRADELENA HIVE ASSEMBLE

naur but being serious, delena is viserra's BEST girl. there's a really invaluable trust between two people who bonded together so young and lived parallel/relied on each other for years. it may not be quite so intense as the other relationships she has but yes, ldlh!viserra learned true friendship, devotion, and sexual pleasure with delena. so in many ways your headcanon is just facts. they're irreplaceable to each other.

onto desmond: she's lying to herself. yes, she loves the guy. ultimately the pivotal question for viserra came down to, a) stick around in white harbor as desmond's mistress out of love for him & because they could probably have a good life together--or b) follow her personal dreams/ambitions aka leaving him behind for king's landing. obviously she chooses the latter, and justifies it with the ol' "what happened between us was a weird brand new type of relationship that no one else has ever experienced & we invented, i'm not gonna linger on it, only we will ever understand what we meant to each other."

(lol. everyone has thought this about A Situation they're in at some point btw, it's just human)

what i wanted to stress in the fic is that there was an element there of her resenting needing him the way she did (to convince jaehaerys to bypass widow's law), because during their big argument he basically threw in her face that she needed him (once he became lord of white harbor, he would be in charge). so it took a lot out of her to ask anything of him. clearly she weaponized his guilt to do so rather than being mew mew big eyes pwetty pwease, but she's still a proud person. the situation upset her. their affair came at a strange time, with the both of them spooked by the knowledge that viserra would be departing soon and pushing them together in this last chance to indulge their unsaid feelings. i do think it weighed on viserra in her transition period, the horrible question of can i live without him, knowing deep down what he means to me?

so saying "i didn't love him" is more an affirmation of "i don't need him & i can live without him" than anything. in reality, they loved each other very much, and will always be quite special to each other.

thanks for the question! ❤

[sebeth]

The Self-Delusional Grandeur of Aegon the Conqueror

Warning, Spoilers Ahead…

  House of the Dragon established as cannon that Aegon conquered the Seven Kingdoms to unify the realm for an unknown threat from the North.

I’m fine with that as its been a belief in the fandom for a long time. Attempting to weave the catspaw dagger back to Targaryens was lame. I give the creators points for trying to salvage the “Arya kills the Night’s King” nonsense but I will never believe a tiny dagger was the promised Targaryen weapon designed to kill an unknown threat – why would you choose a tiny dagger when you have Blackfyre or Dark Sister? The creators tried, it failed, moving on.

Before I cover the non-warring aspects of Aegon’s reign, I thought I would see if Aegon’s unification worked or whether it was the egotistical delusions of a man trying to put a noble spin on the deaths of tens of thousands.

We only have an actual ending in the books but we can speculate on upcoming events in the Winds of Winter and A Dream Of Spring.

The short answer is “no”. By the start of the main series, the Targaryen dynasty has been deposed and is down to an exiled prince and princess plus an unknown bastard. And the Seven Kingdoms will be at war with each other before A Game Of Thrones ends.

“Whenever a Targaryen is born, the gods flip a coin” to decide if madness or greatness awaits the individual”. A saying we here in the books and the show. I wonder when the saying entered the Westeros consciousness. Does it pre-date the Doom of Valyria? Did it occur after the Targaryens settled on Dragonstone or after Aegon’s conquest? If the saying was common before Aegon’s conquest if might explain why he so reluctant to share his vision with other people. No need to further the reputation of insanity.

On the other hand, Aegon descends from a famous prophetess – Daenys the Dreamer – which should lend weight to his claims of having a vision. The North and the Blackwoods are familiar with greenseers. Aegon’s lords (especially in the North) may have been more receptive than he anticipated.

In my opinion, Aegon shared his vision with Rhaenys, Visenya, and Orys – those were his “ride or dies” and his partners-in-crime. And we are told that starting with Aegon only the direct heir was informed of the upcoming threat. I don’t understand the logic behind the “only the heir is informed” practice.

Despite Jaehaery’s proclamation, the Targaryens are not exceptional – they die in the same ways non-Targaryens do: illness, injuries, drowning, drunk horse-riding, etc. Betting on the fate of the world by only imparting knowledge to the heir seems a risky way to ensure knowledge of the threat continues to later generations.

I still find it odd the knowledge of Aegon’s threat lasted in the post-Maegor years. How did Jaehaerys find out? Aegon, Rhaenys, Visenya, and Orys were long dead by this point. Aenys and Aegon the Unrowned were also dead. Visenya must have told Maegor but that leaves Jaehaerys. Aerea was Maegor’s heir but I highly doubt he told her about the Others. Did Maegor leave a letter in his belongings detailing the threat?

And as we saw in the Dance of the Dragons, only telling the heir backfires spectacularly when the family nearly wipes each other out, causing the later generations to lose all knowledge of the threat.

As for preparing for the upcoming threat, Aegon did nothing after conquering the Kingdoms. The North – more specifically the Night’s Watch aka the organization on the front lines of the upcoming threat – wouldn’t receive any aid from the Targaryens until the reign of Jaehaerys I. I would think Jaehaerys informed Alysanne of Aegon’s vision (despite not being the heir) as she was a very active partner in his reign. Alysanne granted the New Gift to the Night’s Watch though they didn’t have the personnel to properly use the land. Alysanne journeyed to the North and made a point to visit the Wall. Possibly scoping out the potential threat. We know she was unsettled by Silverwing’s refusal to cross the Wall.

Did Aegon’s conquering the Kingdoms aid the fight against the Others. A definite “no” in the tv show, a most likely “no” in the series:

Daenerys was the only acknowledged Targaryen to participate in the Long Night, round two. Her greatest contribution in armed forces were the Dothraki and the Unsullied (neither native to Westeros). Her dragons contributed to the battle but Viserion was killed and then used to bring the Wall down (not great).

The Targaryens could have contributed as much if they had simply remained as Lords of Dragonstone the entire time. Their contributions would have been greater as there would have been more Targaryens and more dragons as they wouldn’t have killed each other in the Dance of the Dragons.

The North, the Free Folk, and the Night’s Watch would have been involved with or without the unification of the Seven Kingdoms. They are on the front line either way.

Jon Snow”s Targaryen blood was irrelevant in the show and if Bran becomes King in the books, I don’t see it having much effect in the series. No one is following Jon because he has Valyrian blood, it has been his Stark heritage that rallied the North to him, and his own merits that have the Night’s Watch and the Free Folk following him. Hopefully, Jon is allowed to defeat the Others in the books – its only been his plotline since book 1.

The Westerlands. Jaime, Pod, Sandor, and Tyrion in the show. Most likely Jaime in the books as well.

The Stormlands. Brienne, Davos, Beric in the show. Most likely Brienne in the show. Possibly Stannis, and the remnants of his forces if they survive the Battle of Ice. The rest of the Stormlands are dealing with Aegon’s invasion and may end up battling the Daenery’s forces.

The Riverlands. The remnants of the Brotherhood participated in the show. This area is my big question mark. I feel the Blackwoods would gladly answer the call. They were a Northern house, they worship the Old Gods, and have intermarried with the Starks. The Mallisters are also strong Stark supporters. The remnants of the Tullys are the big question marks. Edmure is on his way to Casterly Rock, the Blackfish has esacaped and Lady Stoneheart is on a murder spree. The Brotherhood has split into multiple factions and the Riverlands has been annihilated as it was ground zero for the War of the Five Kings.

The Vale answered the call in the books and will in the show as long as Littlefinger is eliminated. But they won’t be aiding the North because of the unification but because of the close ties between the Starks and the Arryns/Royces.

The Iron Islands. Theon and a few Ironborn helped in the show. Assuming Theon , Asha, and the captured Ironborn aren’t executed by Stannis, they will aid in the battle against the Others. They won’t have a choise as they will be in the thick of the insanity. I’m not sure if Theon will be able to help as his mutilation is much more severe in the books.

The Reach didn’t contribute in the show and won’t in the books. The Reach has been coasting through the War of the Five Kings with minimal casualties but this is Westeros and no one is allowed to have nice things. The Reach will be too busy dealing with Euron’s attack, the arrival of Aegon (and later Daenerys) plus the madness/incompetence of Cersei Lannister. That is a three-pronged attack to ward off and we can’t forget the Golden Company’s insistence on “friends in the Reach” which implies a possible civil war within the Reach. The survivors of the insanity won’t have the strength or motivation to travel to the North.

Dorne. No contributions in the show or the books. The desire for vengeance will be the downfall of the Martells. It killed Oberyn and will destroy the rest of the family. The only Martells I anticipate surviving the series is Ellaria’s younger daughters and Sarella Sand (if she survives Euron’s attack). The rest are caught up in Cerei’s madness and the upcoming Aegon vs Daenerys war – and the Martells seem to be allying with the side that doesn’t have dragons which is a bad idea.

The Crownlands will not have any strength to aid the North. They are dead center for the Cersei-Aegon-Daenerys confrontation. Rest in peace, King’s Landing, it was nice knowing you.

As for Aegon and Daenerys, Aegon will not go North but Dany will. We know King’s Landing is going to be wiped off the map. The exact circumstances are unknown.  Who’s to blame is unknown. But it’s going to happen. I don’t know if Aegon and Daenerys will receive requests to come North before the inferno of King’s Landing occurs but I think said destruction is the reason Dany’ heads North with her forces. She has a Stannis-moment where she realizes she needs to put the people before her own desire for the crown.

In Summary, Aegon’s Conquest did not prepare Westeros for the return of the Others but is did provide Aegon with a delusional justification for killing tens of thousands of people in order to obtain power.

[nogoodsheepstealing-greatgrandma]

@duxbelisarius I think its safe to assume that while having relations with boys and men came when Baela was older, she did have a personality prior to the dance. She wasn't a blank state waiting in stasis until the dance was over, so it's safe to assume that every other age-appropriate aspect of her personality was present when she was 12, like being a tomboy. Though Daemon did get a letter during the Dance from a worried maester telling hims his daughter was 'overly fond of boys', and she did play innocent kissing games with boys as a kid. So, yeah I will assume she had a personality.

Since Rhaenyra is married to Baela's father, I think Baela and Rhaena are pretty invested in Rhaenyra's cause without having to get married aged 12. I mean, by your logic why didn't Laena and Rhaenyra get the kids married earlier when they first agreed to betroth them? Because there's no need to get the kids hitched that young, that's why.

The Vale was one of the allies that Jace secured. So there's that. And it was the presence of Cregan's massive northern army that contributed to the powerful Green seats of Storms End, Casterly Rock and Oldtown deciding not to keep fighting. And yeah, the 14-year-old made some military mistakes. If you want a story where everything goes smoothly and perfectly and there's no tragedy, then idk go watch a disney movie I guess. Do you think ASOIAF is stupid for the mistakes Robb Stark made, or do you think its tragic and compelling?

It's a war where dragons turn the tide, so having more dragons on your side is a good idea. Especially when the other side has Vhagar. It did turn out to be gamble in the case of Ulf the White and Hugh Hammer, but Addam, Alyn and Nettles were loyal, and Addam and Alyn weren't randos, they were Corlys Velaryon's sons. It's an understandable gamble, and Nettles in particular is thematically important as she challenges the myth of targ supremacy. Yeah two of them are bastards of house velaryon, and Jace argued in favour of their legitimisation. Probably because he sympathised with them. The whole point of the dragonseeds is that bastards are, surprise surprise, no more or less capable of treachery than 'trueborn'. It challenges the lie behind the stigma.

With Lord Manderly there had been a promised alliance with House Targaryen before that didn't pan out due to Viserra's death, so Jace was merely honouring that by agreeing to betroth his little brother Joffrey (who will be behind Jace's children in the line of succession) to Lord Manderly's daughter. Cregan got the more rewarding marriage offer, to marry his son to Jace's future daughter. And evidence suggests they got along.

Munkun’s True Telling says that Cregan and Jacaerys took a liking to each other, for the boy prince reminded the Lord of Winterfell of his own younger brother, who had died ten years before. They drank together, hunted together, trained together, and swore an oath of brotherhood, sealed in blood.

Also, Cregan was usurped, because 16 is the age of majority in Westeros. That's the legal age where the uncle was supposed to hand over power. And it is generally approved of for sons to honour their father's oaths, and that oath was not 'legally dead' because Viserys never removed Rhaenyra as heir. I get the feeling you're one of those 'but the grand council' people, but just because the greens like to claim that the grand council codified male inheritance of the iron throne into law doesn't make it true. The decision at the council was to choose between two claimants, because Jaehaerys knew that if he did try to codify it then Alysanne's ghost would flay him alive.

Telling your child that the world's prejudices are wrong isn't gaslighting. Again, gaslighting would be if she tried to pretend there was no stigma against bastards, and manipulated her kids whenever they brought up evidence that there are plenty of bigots who hate bastards. Also, seriously, George ignored inworld prejudice so he could have the story his way? It's his story! He wrote it to critique that prejudice! There's this book series you may have heard of called A Song Of Ice And Fire, it's really good, one of the main characters is called Jon Snow-

Well if Rhaenyra has no Arryn traits, and Rhaenys' children have no Baratheon traits, and Alicent's children have no Hightower traits, and Jaehaerys son of Alyssa Velaryon is the whitest old man I've ever seen, then maybe genetics are just too weird in this universe to draw any conclusions. The boys are Harwin's I don't deny that, but she does have wiggle room to pass them off as Laenor's, that explains why many people are fine to let it slide (look up rumoured royal bastards and that attitude is actually more common than you'd think, because the reality is that despite societal prejudices you also have always had people just being people).

'Viserys is a terrible father' yes in many ways but tbh considering he's half a corpse, terminally ill and high on milk of the poppy I cut him some slack. Also consider that Laenor claimed the sons as his own, and that very early on in the book Rhaenyra and Laena arranged for their kids betrothals. Since Laenor and Laena have a claim to the throne in their own right, appeasing the Velaryons by supporting Jace and Baela as the future King and Queen is actually a good move to make things right after Rhaenys was passed over.

It makes perfect sense for half the realm to support Rhaenyra, because she does have a claim, and in the book had been training for the role since she was 8 and has 5 sons to follow her. Laenor was only a baby when they voted against him. Jaehaerys bane of women Targaryen was also very clearly not backing Rhaenys - the fact that he called the council at all was his cowardly way of bypassing her while keeping his hands clean. Whereas Viserys was very clearly backing Rhaenyra since she was 8, and that gave the lords years to grow accustomed to her eventual rule.

Finally, GRRM wrote a story critiquing misogyny and bigotry against bastards, and wrote a fictional history book from the point of view of people who hold those prejudices as a way to critique biased historiographies. I love it, but if you don't like that, if you think its poorly written, then you are entitled to that opinion. But I don't get why you're putting yourself through engaging with his work when you could find a more conservative book series more to your liking.

Team Green: Sorry your faves are boring 😊🤷‍♂️ Sure you're supposed to root for the Blacks but the Greens are just more fun. Jace is boring I'm here for my angsty disaster mess 💚

You realise that's bad writing, right? This is a family civil war drama. One side of that family civil war shouldn't be populated with blank slates. If no effort is made into making Rhaenyra and Daemon's children as fleshed out as Alicent's children then that is bad writing.

Some people find the Lannisters more fun than the Starks, but the Starks are still fleshed out characters (and considering in the books Jace is 14/15, Luke is 13, Joffrey, Baela & Rhaena are 12, Aegon the younger is 9 and Viserys is 7 - these kids ages almost map straight onto the Starklings so they were so meant to be our Targlings). It didn't have to be a zero sum "you can only have ONE side that's interesting". The show is poorer for it. Game of Thrones was a disaster in many ways, but at least the different sides of the conflict had equal screen time and attention.

How hard would it have been to flesh out Jace, or at least give him a half-decent haircut? He could have been a mirror to Jon Snow (they technically have the same initials). One is a bastard who does not know he's a targaryen prince, the other is a targaryen prince who discovers he is a bastard. In a world that hates bastards, that insists they are 'wanton and treacherous by nature', there was plenty of potential to explore some complicated emotions, to give weight to how he feels about being a bastard. The whispers that would have followed him, the scrutiny he would have felt, the internalised guilt and shame, his protectiveness over his little brothers and wish to spare them the truth. Maybe after Alicent confronted Aegon over the pig there could have been a shift where Aegon turns his bullying away from Aemond and towards Jace (more in keeping with book canon). Maybe Jace could feel anxious about lessons with Criston Cole due to his open hatred of him. Maybe he could be equal parts devoted to and resentful of his mother over his parentage, maybe he could be driven to perfectionism to prove himself worthy.

The show made Jace more violent in the fight with Aemond than in the book, by changing who started the fight (from Aemond to Rhaena and co.), by narrowing the age gap to make Jace more of a match for Aemond, and by having him draw a knife instead of a wooden toy sword. But they didn't earn that moment. How much more satisfying would it have been if both Aemond and Jace were given equal emotional weight in the build-up to the fight? If the hurt and anxiety at discovering he was a bastard had been building and building until it burst out. The entire reason the show changed the age dynamic between Rhaenyra and Alicent to make them peers and best friends was supposedly to make their conflict more dramatic - why would you then drop that approach with their kids? How does it make the civil war story better if one half of the next generation of characters aren't really characters?

They didn't even have to put much effort into Baela, as GRRM already had her brimming with personality on the page, but they just... ignored that and made her a non-entity. Oh she gets one punch in, and there's a blink and you'll miss it background shot of her trying to hit Aegon (at this point I don't think the actors were even directed to do that I think they just took it upon themselves). Meanwhile Baela in the books is wild and fearless and deliberately provocative and quick to anger and fiercely defensive of her loved ones and wrestles squires in the training yard and has a pet monkey and sneaks out in search of adventure and brings home 'unsuitable' friends. Including a legless beggar, a blacksmith's apprentice whose muscles she admired, a street conjurer, twin prostitutes and an entire troupe of mummers. And she alarms everyone due to being 'overly fond of boys' and gets epic lines like this when it is suggested she marry Lord Rowan:

“I’ve bedded two of his sons. The eldest and thirdborn, I think it was. Not both at once, that would have been improper.”

She could have been an absolutely chaotic presence onscreen. Rhaena meanwhile is a little more like Sansa to Baela's Arya, but would have needed more work to flesh her out onscreen. Her insecurities and wish for a dragon seemed promising at first, but they were dropped as soon as Aemond lost his eye. Because that was ultimately the narrative purpose she served - to provide a new reason for the fight to start that wasn't Aemond hitting and pushing a toddler into a pile of dragon poo. She helps Aemond's image by being the one to start the fight instead of him, and from then on she becomes a voiceless non-entity. We watch Aemond fly away victoriously on Vhagar, we don't see Rhaena tearfully watching the last link to her mother vanish over the horizon.

Considering the prominent role of bastards during the dance (especially the dragonseeds), the uninterest in exploring bastardy in Jace makes little sense. Considering the centrality of gender to the story (and considering a certain event involving key players during the dance), the lack of effort into Baela and Rhaena makes zero sense (the show doesn't even bring up their right to Driftmark in an episode dedicated to discussing the rightful heir to Driftmark).

Considering especially that in fantasy black women are so often consigned to minor Missandei roles, the fact that we were robbed of Baela and Rhaena as main characters particularly stings. Baela in particular was an easy fan favourite in the book, and its a role that black women and girls so rarely get to play. If you had told me before the show that Helaena would be a fan favourite over Baela, I wouldn't have believed it. And don't get me wrong, I like that they fleshed out Helaena in the show, like Rhaena she didn't have much of a presence in the book. But it is so typical that the relative non-entity that they kept white gets to be fleshed out, while the more fleshed out character that they made black becomes a non-entity. And Helaena is skinny now, of course (all love to Phia Saban, but I am mourning plump Helaena).

And don't get me started on Kylo Raemond.

[goodqueenaly]

What if Prince Duncan Targaryen had broken his betrothal to lord Baratheons daughter in order to marry a Westerosi or Essosi woman of noble birth instead of a commoner and would he still have been pressured to abdicate?

As a matter of clarification, it does not appear that Duncan Targaryen was pressured to abdicate. Quite the opposite, in fact: Aegon V "did all he could to have the marriage undone, demanding that Duncan put Jenny aside" and "the High Septon, Grand Maester, and small council joined together to insist King Aegon force his son to choose between the Iron Throne and this wild woman of the woods". Rather than being pressured to abdicate, it sounds like Prince Duncan was pressured to give up Jenny and declare that he had never really, validly married her.

In any event, I think that the answer depends a great deal on both the woman in question and the personality of Lyonel Baratheon. A significant part of the scandal with Duncan's marriage to Jenny was that she was not just not his betrothed, but a member of the smallfolk, mocked even by her neighbors as "some half-mad peasant girl, and perhaps even a witch"; by marrying her, Duncan was sending the unspoken message that he found such a peasant girl better than a Baratheon, as aristocratic a family as Westeros can offer. That specific message-sending would not be the case, obviously, if Duncan married an aristocrat (though not necessarily as much for an Essosi woman as a Westerosi - more on that in a moment), although there are of course degrees among the Westerosi aristocracy. This is a point I made about a speculative marriage between Jeyne Poole and Bran or Rickon, and it's the point Catelyn makes to Robb about his marriage to Jeyne (which Robb tries to rebuff): such a bride might have the right to a sigil and to be ranked among the nobility, but that does not mean that any noble male - much less, in this case, a prince and heir to the Iron Throne - would necessarily be open to marriage with her, nor that a bluer-blood family would not find such a marriage an insult. So Duncan marrying, say, an Erenford of Erenford, bannermen to the "only" 600-year-old House Frey, could I think be looked on quite differently than Duncan marrying, say, Alys Arryn of the Eyrie. (Which is not to say that sufficiently high rank would automatically cover the scandal either: after all, Aegon V "had to deal with the wounded pride and anger of the noble houses ... affronted" by the secret marriage of his children Jaehaerys and Shaera - obviously both royals themselves - because "Jaehaerys had been betrothed to Celia Tully, daughter of the Lord of Riverrun, and Shaera to Luthor Tyrell, the heir to Highgarden".)

Now, as I noted, this calculus would likely be considerably different for an Essosi noblewoman as compared to a Westerosi. While Essos certainly has its own aristocrats, some of much older lineages than those in Westeros, Essosi women can in turn face significant xenophobia in coming to Westeros. Look at Larra Rogare: Westerosi suspicion of her and her family's foreignness played a key role in motivating the violent reaction against her and her brothers, and she had very nearly been arrested and killed solely to replace her with a "proper" Westerosi wife for Prince Viserys. Look at Serala Darklyn, still reviled despite her agonizing (and specifically sexual) punishment during the Defiance of Duskendale, still negatively compared to hypothetical Westerosi brides who of course would never have "filled her husband's ear with Myrish poison" so that he "rose against his king and took him captive". Look at Taena Merryweather, constantly exoticized and sexualized for her foreign origins (not the least of which being Cersei raping her). So I think Lyonel Baratheon would still have been deeply insulted had Duncan married an Esssoi noblewoman instead of his Baratheon betrothed - a foreigner, daughter of some Essosi cheesemonger or coin clinker, considered better than his own, eminently aristocratic, perfectly Westerosi daughter?

Likewise, it is unclear what exactly motivated Lyonel to rise in rebellion, outside of the thin descriptions given in TWOIAF. The extent to which we are meant to see Lyonel's rebellion as a sort of prefigurement of Robert's Rebellion - a fiery, commanding Baratheon Lord of Storm's End being deprived of a marriage for his family by a Targaryen crown prince and then raising a rebellion against the crown - is at this point speculative (and there are obviously many differences between Lyonel's rebellion and Robert's). However, just as Robert's Rebellion was kicked off by both the immediate tyranny of Aerys II and, I think, the long-simmering concerns of the aristocratic southron ambitions bloc, so it might have been that Lyonel Baratheon had more motivations beyond the mere broken betrothal to declare himself the new Storm King. (A comparison might also be drawn to Walder Frey, who was looking to get out of his support for Robb even before he found out about Robb's secret marriage to Jeyne Westerling.) What, I certainly can't say - after all, Yandel says that Lyonel "had always been amongst King Aegon's most leal supporters" - but it's at least worth considering.

[aboveallarescuer]

Parallels between Aerys II Targaryen and Cersei Lannister (and why they are both foils to Dany)

In this post, I gathered all the parallels I could find between Cersei and Aerys II after recently rereading Cersei’s chapters and Aerys’s section in TWOIAF. While a lot of people have made good points criticizing how Cersei was written (namely, as incompetent, misogynistic and irredeemable, at least in the canon timeline where her fate is already sealed) considering her special place in the narrative (namely, as arguably the female character who most frequently and openly questions and challenges the validity of Westerosi patriarchy, as well as the only major female villain of the story and the only woman among the three Lannister siblings), it’s also true that GRRM intended her to be paralleled with Aerys II in many ways, which will be laid out here.

Recognizing how Aerys II and Cersei are alike is particularly important for emphasizing that both characters were written as foils to Daenerys, so I will also explain how Dany doesn’t share their similarities.

Both believe they are destined for greatness

Aerys II:

Aerys II did not lack for ambition. Upon his coronation, he declared that it was his wish to be the greatest king in the history of the Seven Kingdoms, a conceit certain of his friends encouraged by suggesting that one day he might be remembered as Aerys the Wise or even Aerys the Great. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

The Lord of Casterly Rock deserved rainbows. He had been a great man. I shall be greater, though. A thousand years from now, when the maesters write about this time, you shall be remembered only as Queen Cersei’s sire. (AFFC Cersei II)

That’s not the case with Dany. Her titles (the Unburnt, Mother of Dragons, Mhysa, Azor Ahai, etc) were given to her by other people, she doesn’t think she’s special despite birthing dragons and receiving multiple prophecies and she’s incredibly hard on herself for every mistake she makes. She simply doesn’t have an exaggerated sense of her importance or abilities like Cersei and Aerys II do.

Both are cut by the Iron Throne

Aerys II:

Yet still the blades tormented him, the ones he could never escape, the blades of the Iron Throne. His arms and legs were always covered with scabs and half-healed cuts. (AFFC Jaime II)

Cersei:

The barbs and blades of the Iron Throne bit into her flesh as she crouched to hide her shame. Blood ran red down her legs, as steel teeth gnawed at her buttocks. When she tried to stand, her foot slipped through a gap in the twisted metal. The more she struggled the more the throne engulfed her, tearing chunks of flesh from her breasts and belly, slicing at her arms and legs until they were slick and red, glistening. (AFFC Cersei I)

While Cersei was only cut in a dream, this moment is still significant because the Iron Throne is infamous for only harming and ‘rejecting’ the bad rulers. GRRM could have written a similar dream for Dany if he wanted to make her and Cersei follow the same direction, specially in AFFC/ADWD where he noted multiple times that they’re meant to be paralleled and contrasted. Instead, while Cersei’s first chapter in AFFC begins with her dreaming of being on the Iron Throne and being cut by it, Dany’s first chapter in ADWD begins with her dreaming of a house with a red door. Also, while Cersei wishes she could sit on the Iron Throne but is unable to because only the King and the Hand can sit on it, Dany willingly gives up on the privilege to sit on an elaborate throne and chooses an ebony bench that "did not befit a queen" in Meereen. So, not only the author emphasized that Dany doesn’t want power for its own sake (but rather to help people) and that she wants to be at the level of her people, he also didn’t take the chance to portray her as a bad ruler (because she is a good one) like he did with Cersei and Aerys II.

Both feel excitement and pleasure at the sight of wildfire

Aerys II:

Frustrated, Aerys turned to the Wisdoms of the ancient Guild of Alchemists, who knew the secret of producing the volatile jade green substance known as wildfire, said to be a close cousin to dragonflame. The pyromancers became a regular fixture at his court as the king's fascination with fire grew. By 280 AC, Aerys II had taken to burning traitors, murderers, and plotters, rather than hanging or beheading them. The king seemed to take great pleasure in these fiery executions, which were presided over by Wisdom Rossart, the grand master of the Guild of Alchemists...so much so that he granted Rossart the title of Lord and gave him a seat upon the small council. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The sight had filled him with disquiet, reminding him of Aerys Targaryen and the way a burning would arouse him. A king has no secrets from his Kingsguard. Relations between Aerys and his queen had been strained during the last years of his reign. They slept apart and did their best to avoid each other during the waking hours. But whenever Aerys gave a man to the flames, Queen Rhaella would have a visitor in the night. (AFFC Jaime II)

Cersei:

Cersei thought of all the King’s Hands that she had known through the years: Owen Merryweather, Jon Connington, Qarlton Chelsted, Jon Arryn, Eddard Stark, her brother Tyrion. And her father, Lord Tywin Lannister, her father most of all. All of them are burning now, she told herself, savoring the thought. They are dead and burning, every one, with all their plots and schemes and betrayals. It is my day now. It is my castle and my kingdom. (AFFC Cersei III)

~

Cersei felt too alive for sleep. The wildfire was cleansing her, burning away all her rage and fear, filling her with resolve. “The flames are so pretty. I want to watch them for a while.” (AFFC Cersei III)

~

Jaime knew the look in his sister's eyes. He had seen it before, most recently on the night of Tommen's wedding, when she burned the Tower of the Hand. The green light of the wildfire had bathed the face of the watchers, so they looked like nothing so much as rotting corpses, a pack of gleeful ghouls, but some of the corpses were prettier than others. Even in the baleful glow, Cersei had been beautiful to look upon. She'd stood with one hand on her breast, her lips parted, her green eyes shining. She is crying, Jaime had realized, but whether it was from grief or ecstasy he could not have said.

The sight had filled him with disquiet, reminding him of Aerys Targaryen and the way a burning would arouse him. (AFFC Jaime II)

That never happens with Dany. She does describe the flames positively during the ritual to hatch the dragon eggs, but so does Jon Snow and GRRM himself. She does claim the fire as hers, but it has to do with her magical intuition as she puts two and two to birth her children and is ultimately validated. Most importantly, unlike Aerys II and Cersei, Dany a) never feels excitement while watching things burn for their own sake, b) never takes pleasure viewing or imagining her enemies burning and c) is never compared to Aerys II to highlight any disturbing behavior from her part. She is called the Mad King’s daughter by her enemies (the slavers and Mace Tyrell), but the characters around her and the ones who have nothing to gain by defaming her (Barristan, Tyrion, Illyrio, Quentyn) reiterate that she’s nothing like him. Meanwhile, two of the people who have known Cersei the longest (Jaime on the quotes above, Tyrion) compare her to Aerys II.

Both grow paranoid with time; they imagine implausible scenarios in which their perceived enemies are working (often together) against them, accept their baseless fears as truth and make hasty decisions based on them

Aerys II:

The march of the king's madness seemed to abate for a time in 274 AC, when Queen Rhaella gave birth to a son. So profound was His Grace's joy that it seemed to restore him to his old self once again...but Prince Jaehaerys died later that same year, plunging Aerys into despair. In his black rage, he decided the babe's wet nurse was to blame and had the woman beheaded. Not long after, in a change of heart, Aerys announced that Jaehaerys had been poisoned by his own mistress, the pretty young daughter of one of his household knights. The king had the girl and all her kin tortured to death. During the course of their torment, it is recorded, all confessed to the murder, though the details of their confessions were greatly at odds. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The birth of Prince Viserys only seemed to make Aerys II more fearful and obsessive, however. Though the new young princeling seemed healthy enough, the king was terrified lest he suffer the same fate as his brothers. Kingsguard knights were commanded to stand over him night and day to see that no one touched the boy without the king's leave. Even the queen herself was forbidden to be alone with the infant. When her milk dried up, Aerys insisted on having his own food taster suckle at the teats of the prince's wet nurse, to ascertain that the woman had not smeared poison on her nipples. As gifts for the young prince arrived from all the lords of the Seven Kingdoms, the king had them piled in the yard and burned, for fear that some of them might have been ensorcelled or cursed. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Captivity at Duskendale had shattered whatever sanity had remained to Aerys II Targaryen. From that day forth, the king's madness reigned unchecked, growing worse with every passing year. The Darklyns had dared lay hands upon his person, shoving him roughly, stripping him of his royal raiment, even daring to strike him. After his release, King Aerys would no longer allow himself to be touched, even by his own servants. Uncut and unwashed, his hair grew ever longer and more tangled, whilst his fingernails lengthened and thickened into grotesque yellow talons. He forbade any blade in his presence save for the swords carried by the knights of his Kingsguard, sworn to protect him. His judgments became ever harsher and crueler. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Once safely returned to King's Landing, His Grace refused to leave the Red Keep for any cause and remained a virtual prisoner in his own castle for the next four years, during which time he grew ever more wary of those around him, Tywin Lannister in particular. His suspicions extended even to his own son and heir. Prince Rhaegar, he was convinced, had conspired with Tywin Lannister to have him slain at Duskendale. They had planned to storm the town walls so that Lord Darklyn would put him to death, opening the way for Rhaegar to mount the Iron Throne and marry Lord Tywin's daughter. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

And when the triumphant Prince of Dragonstone named Lyanna Stark, daughter of the Lord of Winterfell, the queen of love and beauty, placing a garland of blue roses in her lap with the tip of his lance, the lickspittle lords gathered around the king declared that further proof of his perfidy. Why would the prince have thus given insult to his own wife, the Princess Elia Martell of Dorne (who was present), unless it was to help him gain the Iron Throne? The crowning of the Stark girl, who was by all reports a wild and boyish young thing with none of the Princess Elia's delicate beauty, could only have been meant to win the allegiance of Winterfell to Prince Rhaegar's cause, Symond Staunton suggested to the king. (TWOIAF The Fall of the Dragons: The Year of the False Spring)

~

When the news reached the Red Keep, it was said that Aerys cursed the Dornish, certain that Lewyn had betrayed Rhaegar. He sent his pregnant queen, Rhaella, and his younger son and new heir, Viserys, away to Dragonstone, but Princess Elia was forced to remain in King's Landing with Rhaegar's children as a hostage against Dorne. (TWOIAF The Fall of the Dragons: The End)

Cersei:

“I am counseling you. If you will not yield the regency to me, name me your castellan for Casterly Rock and make either Mathis Rowan or Randyll Tarly the Hand of the King.”

Tyrell bannermen, both of them. The suggestion left her speechless. Is he bought? she wondered. Has he taken Tyrell gold to betray House Lannister? (AFFC Cersei II)

~

“Lord Manderly hacked the head and hands off the onion knight, we have that from the Freys, and half a dozen other northern lords have rallied to Lord Bolton. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. Where else can Stannis turn, but to the ironmen and the wildlings, the enemies of the north? But if he thinks that I am going to walk into his trap, he is a bigger fool than you.” (AFFC Cersei VII)

~

“No doubt. Tell me, was it our little queen who commanded you to kill Lord Gyles?”

“K-kill?” Grand Maester Pycelle’s eyes grew as big as boiled eggs. “Your Grace cannot believe ... it was his cough, by all the gods, I ... Her Grace would not ... she bore Lord Gyles no ill will, why would Queen Margaery want him ...”

“... dead? Why, to plant another rose on Tommen’s council. Are you blind or bought? Rosby stood in her way, so she put him in his grave. With your connivance.” (AFFC Cersei IX)

~

She knew Joff was too strong for her, Cersei thought, remembering the gold coin Qyburn had found. For House Tyrell to hope to rule, he had to be removed. It came back to her that Margaery and her hideous grandmother had once plotted to marry Sansa Stark to the little queen’s crippled brother Willas. Lord Tywin had forestalled that by stealing a march on them and wedding Sansa to Tyrion, but the link had been there. They are all in it together, she realized with a start. The Tyrells bribed the gaolers to free Tyrion, and whisked him down the roseroad to join his vile bride. By now the both of them are safe in Highgarden, hidden away behind a wall of roses. (AFFC Cersei VI)

Cersei’s case is complicated in that she has valid reasons to be anxious: prophecies come true in her world, the Tyrells did kill Joffrey (she’s right in that regard, at least) and the coin found in the cell could be evidence that the Tyrells were involved in Tyrion’s escape. The problem is how she deals with her suspicions. To defeat Margaery, she projected her experiences on her (every widow definitely has sexual appetites, so Margaery definitely has lovers), held on to the few dubious signs that she was cheating on the king (Margaery asking Pycelle for moon tea or having a lively court), tortured an innocent man to confirm the story she needs to incriminate Margaery and arrested several innocent people. Besides that, Cersei also: alienates Kevan by avoiding his recommendations and giving important titles to other cousins based on her hunch that he was bought by the Tyrells (quote above); avoids giving the Tyrells help when the ironmen attack the Shield Islands based on her baseless suspicion that Stannis made an alliance with the ironmen and was, therefore, behind the attack on the Shield Islands with the intention to turn Cersei’s eyes away from the Storm’s End and Dragonstone (quote above); forces Pycelle to "confirm" what she wants to believe because of her guess that he helped the Tyrells kill Gyles Rosby (quote above). And these are just some of the major examples.

Dany has moments when she is unsure of whether the people around her are reliable or not. She questions if Reznak is trustworthy or if he, Hizdahr and the Green Grace joined forces against her or if Groleo could be one of the three prophesied treasons, but she remains willing to listen to their advice and never undermines or punishes them solely based on her suspicions because, unlike her father or Cersei, she has a healthy distrust of others.

Both choose to be excessively and needlessly brutal against their enemies and the people who offend them (even when their offenses are relatively minor and/or not supported by facts)

Aerys II:

When one such reported that the captain of the Hand's personal guard, a knight named Ser Ilyn Payne, had been heard boasting it was Lord Tywin who truly ruled the Seven Kingdoms, His Grace sent the Kingsguard to arrest the man and had his tongue ripped out with red-hot pincers. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The march of the king's madness seemed to abate for a time in 274 AC, when Queen Rhaella gave birth to a son. So profound was His Grace's joy that it seemed to restore him to his old self once again...but Prince Jaehaerys died later that same year, plunging Aerys into despair. In his black rage, he decided the babe's wet nurse was to blame and had the woman beheaded. Not long after, in a change of heart, Aerys announced that Jaehaerys had been poisoned by his own mistress, the pretty young daughter of one of his household knights. The king had the girl and all her kin tortured to death. During the course of their torment, it is recorded, all confessed to the murder, though the details of their confessions were greatly at odds. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

By 280 AC, Aerys II had taken to burning traitors, murderers, and plotters, rather than hanging or beheading them. The king seemed to take great pleasure in these fiery executions, which were presided over by Wisdom Rossart, the grand master of the Guild of Alchemists...so much so that he granted Rossart the title of Lord and gave him a seat upon the small council. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

When Darklyn and his family were presented to him in chains, Aerys demanded their deaths—and not only Darklyn's immediate kin but his uncles and aunts and even distant kinsmen in Duskendale. Even his goodkin, the Hollards, were attainted and destroyed. Only Ser Symon's young nephew, Dontos Hollard, was spared—and only then because Ser Barristan begged that mercy as a boon, and the king he had saved could not refuse him. As to Lady Serala, hers was a crueler death. Aerys had the Lace Serpent's tongue and her womanly parts torn out before she was burned alive (yet her enemies say that she should have suffered more and worse for the ruin she brought down upon the town). (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

"M'lord, begging your pardon, Her Grace said those as didn't meet their numbers would have their hands crushed," the anxious smith persisted. "Smashed on their own anvils, she said."

Sweet Cersei, always striving to make the smallfolk love us. (ACOK Tyrion III)

~

"Y'Grace," he said quietly, "the boys caught a groom and two maidservants trying to sneak out a postern with three of the king's horses."

"The night's first traitors," the queen said, "but not the last, I fear. Have Ser Ilyn see to them, and put their heads on pikes outside the stables as a warning." (ACOK Sansa VI)

~

“I hope you did not wake them, Ser Boros. Let them sleep.”

“Sleep?” He looked up, jowly and confused. “Aye, Your Grace. How long shall—”

“Forever. See that they sleep forever, ser. I will not suffer guards to sleep on watch.” (AFFC Cersei I)

~

“His Grace should send the Wall a hundred men. To take the black, ostensibly, but in truth …”

“... to remove Jon Snow from the command,” Cersei finished, delighted. I knew I was right to want him on my council. “That is just what we shall do.” She laughed. If this bastard boy is truly his father's son, he will not suspect a thing. Perhaps he will even thank me, before the blade slides between his ribs. “It will need to be done carefully, to be sure. Leave the rest to me, my lords.” This was how an enemy should be dealt with: with a dagger, not a declaration. (AFFC Cersei IV)

~

“Send some of your whisperers to these shows and make note of who attends. If any of them should be men of note, I would know their names.”

“What will be done with them, if I may be so bold?”

“Any men of substance shall be fined. Half their worth should be sufficient to teach them a sharp lesson and refill our coffers, without quite ruining them. Those too poor to pay can lose an eye, for watching treason. For the puppeteers, the axe.”

“There are four. Perhaps Your Grace might allow me two of them for mine own purposes. A woman would be especially ...”

“I gave you Senelle,” the queen said sharply.

“Alas. The poor girl is quite ... exhausted.”

[...] “Yes, you may take a woman. Two, if it please you. But first I will have names. (AFFC Cersei V)

~

“I cannot have Falyse spreading tales about the city. Her grief has made her witless. Do you still need women for your ... work?”

“I do, Your Grace. The puppeteers are quite used up.”

“Take her and do with her as you will, then. But once she goes down into the black cells ... need I say more?” (AFFC Cersei VII)

Dany doesn’t act like this. She burned the masters in Astapor to protect her retinue and punished the Meereenese leaders who ordered the crucifixion of the slave children, but she also spared all the Yunkish masters and most of the Meereenese masters. Her leniency is the root of her problems in ADWD, since it allowed them to retaliate against the abolition of slavery. Additionally, Dany doesn’t punish Ghael for spitting on her, she doesn’t punish a boy for trying to attack her, she doesn't punish Xaro for threatening her to her face, she chooses not to follow her councillors' advice to punish the former slavers indiscriminately and so on. You can read more about how Dany's tendency is to avoid using violence in this meta.

Both use torture to get people to confirm what they believe or what's convenient for them

Aerys II:

The march of the king's madness seemed to abate for a time in 274 AC, when Queen Rhaella gave birth to a son. So profound was His Grace's joy that it seemed to restore him to his old self once again...but Prince Jaehaerys died later that same year, plunging Aerys into despair. In his black rage, he decided the babe's wet nurse was to blame and had the woman beheaded. Not long after, in a change of heart, Aerys announced that Jaehaerys had been poisoned by his own mistress, the pretty young daughter of one of his household knights. The king had the girl and all her kin tortured to death. During the course of their torment, it is recorded, all confessed to the murder, though the details of their confessions were greatly at odds. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

“Tell us how you pleasured the little queen. [...] How many of them did you have carnal knowledge of?”

“None of them. I’m just a singer. Please.”

[...] Lord Qyburn ran a hand up the Blue Bard’s chest. “Does she take your nipples in her mouth during your love play?” He took one between his thumb and forefinger, and twisted. “Some men enjoy that. Their nipples are as sensitive as a woman’s.” The razor flashed, the singer shrieked. On his chest a wet red eye wept blood. [...]

By dawn the singer’s high blue boots were full of blood, and he had told them how Margaery would fondle herself as she watched her cousins pleasuring him with their mouths. At other times he would sing for her whilst she sated her lusts with other lovers. “Who were they?” the queen demanded, and the wretched Wat named Ser Tallad the Tall, Lambert Turnberry, Jalabhar Xho, the Redwyne twins, Osney Kettleblack, Hugh Clifton, and the Knight of Flowers.

That displeased her. She dare not besmirch the name of the hero of Dragonstone. [...] The Redwynes could not be a part of it either. [...] “All you are doing is spitting up the names of men you saw about her chambers. We want the truth! [...] Horas and Hobber had no part of this, did they?”

“No,” he admitted. “Not them.”

“As for Ser Loras, I am certain Margaery took pains to hide what she was doing from her brother.”

“She did. I remember now. Once I had to hide under the bed when Ser Loras came to see her. He must never know, she said.”

“I prefer this song to the other.” (AFFC Cersei IX)

Dany doesn't act like her father or Cersei in that regard either. She allows the use of torture (which is normalized in her world) to question people regarding the murders of former slaves, but she stops it once she realizes that the results are unreliable because, unlike her foils, she cares about punishing the actual perpetrators, not about having her beliefs confirmed at any cost.

Both are often cruel, rude and disrespectful to others

Aerys II:

At the great Anniversary Tourney of 272 AC, held to commemorate Aerys's tenth year upon the Iron Throne, Joanna Lannister brought her six-year-old twins Jaime and Cersei from Casterly Rock to present before the court. The king (very much in his cups) asked her if giving suck to them had "ruined your breasts, which were so high and proud." (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Over his Hand's strenuous objections, the king doubled the port fees at King's Landing and Oldtown, and tripled them for Lannisport and the realm's other ports and harbors. When a delegation of small lords and rich merchants came before the Iron Throne to complain, however, Aerys blamed the Hand for the exactions, saying, "Lord Tywin shits gold, but of late he has been constipated and had to find some other way to fill our coffers." (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Tyrion, as the babe was named, was a malformed, dwarfish babe born with stunted legs, an oversized head, and mismatched, demonic eyes (some reports also suggested he had a tail, which was lopped off at his lord father's command). Lord Tywin's Doom, the smallfolk called this ill-made creature, and Lord Tywin's Bane. Upon hearing of his birth, King Aerys infamously said, "The gods cannot abide such arrogance. They have plucked a fair flower from his hand and given him a monster in her place, to teach him some humility at last." (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

Cersei stared at her, aghast. “Your lackwit sister gets herself raped by half of King’s Landing, and Tanda thinks to honor the bastard with my lord father’s name? I think not.” (AFFC Cersei II)

~

She wanted a storm to match her rage. To Jocelyn she said, “Tighter. Cinch it tighter, you simpering little fool.”

It was the wedding that enraged her, though the slow-witted Swyft girl made a safer target. (AFFC Cersei III)

~

“Would Your Grace honor her white knight with a dance?”

She gave him a withering look. “And have you fumbling at me with that stump? No. I will let you fill my wine cup for me, though. If you think you can manage it without spilling.” (AFFC Cersei III)

~

“Very well. Get off those saggy knees and try to remember what it was to be a man.” Pycelle struggled to rise, but took so long about it that she had to tell Osmund Kettleblack to give him another yank. (AFFC Cersei IX)

For the vast majority of the time, Dany is kind and courteous. Her detractors tend to question that fact with two main arguments: a) she laughed at Quentyn; b) she is intolerant about Meereenese culture. Their first argument is very weak. Dany didn't laugh at Quentyn, she laughed about the reason why Quentyn is called frog and then forgot to explain why she did so in the Common Tongue. Even then, though, Quentyn is so overwhelmed by her kindness that he only remembers that "the queen had always spoken to him gently". Their second argument is also unconvincing because Dany's dislike of several aspects of Meereenese culture has to do with their ties to slavery (case in point: the fighting pits) and, even then, she makes several concessions to culturally adapt. Additionally, unlike Aerys II or Cersei, she doesn't express her critical thoughts (which are way less common and way less derogatory than Cersei's) verbally.

Both give rewards and promotions to those who blindly obey and agree with them, regardless of whether they’re experienced, competent or trustworthy

Aerys II:

He was also vain, proud, and changeable, traits that made him easy prey for flatterers and lickspittles, but these flaws were not immediately apparent to most at the time of his ascension. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

His father's court had been made up largely of older, seasoned men, many of whom had also served during the reign of King Aegon V. Aerys II dismissed them one and all, replacing them with lords of his own generation. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The king replaced him as Hand with Lord Owen Merryweather, an aged and amiable lickspittle famed for laughing loudest at every jape and witticism uttered by the king, no matter how feeble. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The Mad King could be savagely cruel, as seen most plainly when he burned those he perceived to be his enemies, but he could also be extravagant, showering men who pleased him with honors, offices, and lands. The lickspittle lords who surrounded Aerys II had gained much and more from the king's madness and eagerly seized upon any opportunity to speak ill of Prince Rhaegar and inflame the father's suspicions of the son. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

"A weak ruler needs a strong Hand, as Aerys needed Father. A strong ruler requires only a diligent servant to carry out his orders." (AFFC Jaime II)

~

The Kettleblacks would charm her, take her coin, and promise her anything she asked, and why not, when Bronn was matching every copper penny, coin for coin? Amiable rogues all three, the brothers were in truth much more skilled at deceit than they'd ever been at bloodletting. Cersei had managed to buy herself three hollow drums; they would make all the fierce booming sounds she required, but there was nothing inside. (ACOK Tyrion IX)

~

My councillors. Cersei had uprooted every rose, and all those beholden to her uncle and her brothers. In their places were men whose loyalty would be to her. She had even given them new styles, borrowed from the Free Cities; the queen would have no “masters” at court beside herself. (AFFC Cersei IV)

~

Grand Maester Pycelle had wanted an older man “more seasoned in the ways of war” to command the gold cloaks, and several of her other councillors had agreed with him. “Ser Osfryd is seasoned quite sufficiently,” she had told them, but even that did not shut them up. They yap at me like a pack of small, annoying dogs. (AFFC Cersei V)

~

"She would have done better to leave the tower and burn her Hand. Harys Swyft? If ever a man deserved his arms, it is Ser Harys. And Gyles Rosby, Seven save us, I thought he died years ago. Merryweather ... your father used to call his grandsire 'the Chuckler,' I'll have you know. Tywin claimed the only thing Merryweather was good for was chuckling at the king's witticisms. His lordship chuckled himself right into exile, as I recall. Cersei has put some bastard on the council too, and a kettle in the Kingsguard. (AFFC Jaime V)

Besides the Kettleblacks (as shown above), Cersei rewards many other people that are rarely, if ever, willing to question her - Harys Swyft, Orton Merryweather, Aurane Waters, Gyles Rosby, Meryn Trant, Qyburn (the only one who doesn't turn his back on Cersei after she falls from power), etc. The only one that disagrees with her decisions regularly is Pycelle, which is why she rebukes him quite a few times throughout AFFC. Also, while Cersei considers Aerys a weak ruler, they both believe that their Hands should be servants that know their place and follow them blindly.

Dany doesn't restrict herself to only listening to the people she agrees with. She welcomes dissent multiple times throughout the books and so, consequently, her council gives voice to multiple groups (from the Unsullied to the freedmen to the former slavers to the Dothraki).

Both alienate and undermine important allies because of disagreements that could have been mended and fears that lead both rulers to perceive these potential allies as enemies

Aerys II:

The growing rift between the king and the King's Hand was also apparent in the matter of appointments. Whereas previously His Grace had always heeded his Hand's counsel, bestowing offices, honors, and inheritances as Lord Tywin recommended, after 270 AC he began to disregard the men put forward by his lordship in favor of his own choices. Many westermen found themselves dismissed from the king's service for no better cause than the suspicion that they might be "Hand's men." In their places, King Aerys appointed his own favorites...but the king's favor had become a chancy thing, his mistrust easy to awaken. Even the Hand's own kin were not exempt from royal displeasure. When Lord Tywin wished to name his brother Ser Tygett Lannister as the Red Keep's master-at-arms, King Aerys gave the post to Ser Willem Darry instead. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Perhaps seeking to gain advantage of His Grace's high spirits, Lord Tywin chose that very night to suggest that it was past time the king's heir wed and produced an heir of his own; he proposed his own daughter, Cersei, as wife for the crown prince. Aerys II rejected this proposal brusquely, informing Lord Tywin that he was a good and valuable servant, yet a servant nonetheless. Nor did His Grace agree to appoint Lord Tywin's son Jaime as squire to Prince Rhaegar; that honor he granted instead to the sons of several of his own favorites, men known to be no friends of House Lannister or the Hand. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

Lord Denys, seeing that Aerys's erratic behavior had begun to strain his relations with Lord Tywin, refused to pay the taxes expected of him and instead invited the king to come to Duskendale and hear his petition. It seems most unlikely that King Aerys would ever have considered accepting this invitation...until Lord Tywin advised him to refuse in the strongest possible terms, whereupon the king decided to accept, informing Grand Maester Pycelle and the small council that he meant to settle this matter himself and bring the defiant Darklyn to heel. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

Garth the Gross on the small council and his two bastards in the gold cloaks ... do the Tyrells think I will just serve the realm up to them on a gilded platter? The arrogance of it took her breath away.

“Garth has served me well as Lord Seneschal, as he served my father before me,” Tyrell was going on. “Littlefinger had a nose for gold, I grant you, but Garth—”

“My lord,” Cersei broke in, “I fear there has been some misunderstanding. I have asked Lord Gyles Rosby to serve as our new master of coin, and he has done me the honor of accepting.”

Mace gaped at her. “Rosby? That ... cougher? But ... the matter was agreed, Your Grace. Garth is on his way to Oldtown.”

“Best send a raven to Lord Hightower and ask him to make certain your uncle does not take ship. We would hate for Garth to brave an autumn sea for nought.” She smiled pleasantly.

A flush crept up Tyrell’s thick neck. “This ... your lord father assured me ...” (AFFC Cersei II)

~

Cersei had named her cousin Damion Lannister her castellan for the Rock, and another cousin, Ser Daven Lannister, the Warden of the West. Insolence has its price, Uncle. (AFFC Cersei III)

~

“I have been remiss. With a realm to rule, a war to fight, and a father to mourn, somehow I overlooked the crucial matter of naming a new master-at-arms. I shall rectify that error at once.”

Ser Loras pushed back a brown curl that had fallen across his forehead. “Your Grace will not find any man half so skilled with sword and lance as I.”

Humble, aren’t we? “Tommen is your king, not your squire. You are to fight for him and die for him, if need be. No more.”

She left him on the drawbridge that spanned the dry moat with its bed of iron spikes and entered Maegor’s Holdfast alone. Where am I to find a master-at-arms? she wondered as she climbed to her apartments. [...]

Aron Santagar was Dornish, Cersei recalled. I could send to Dorne. Centuries of blood and war lay between Sunspear and Highgarden. Yes, a Dornishman might suit my needs admirably. There must be some good swords in Dorne. (AFFC Cersei V)

~

He had even had the temerity to object to her sending to Dorne for a master-at-arms, on the grounds that it might offend the Tyrells. “Why do you think I’m doing it?” she had asked him scornfully. (AFFC Cersei VI)

~

“Your Grace, let me take Dragonstone.”

[...] No one had given Cersei such a lovely gift since Sansa Stark had run to her to divulge Lord Eddard’s plans. She was pleased to see that Margaery had gone pale. “Your courage takes my breath away, Ser Loras. [...] Swear to me that you shall not return until Dragonstone is Tommen’s.”

“I shall, Your Grace.” He rose.

[...] Pycelle had to struggle to keep up. “If it please Your Grace,” he puffed, “young men are overbold, and think only of the glory of battle and never of its dangers. Ser Loras ... this plan of his is fraught with peril. To storm the very walls of Dragonstone ...”

“... is very brave. [...] I have no doubt that our Knight of Flowers will be the first man to gain the battlements.” And perhaps the first to fall. (AFFC Cersei VII)

Dany doesn't do this; instead, she makes plenty of concessions to appease her influential allies, from wearing the tokar to marrying Hizdahr by Ghiscari rites if he gives her ninety days of peace to allowing Hizdahr to reopen the fighting pits to accepting a deal between Meereen and Yunkai that allows the latter to reinstall slavery. All of these decisions are ultimately mistakes since they unwittingly prioritize the privileges of the former masters over the rights of the former slaves, but they still show that Dany is capable of making alliances in a way that Aerys II and Cersei aren't due to their black and white thinking.

Both are extravagant rulers who plan grand schemes that are never realized

Aerys II:

His Grace was full of grand schemes as well. Not long after his coronation, he announced his intent to conquer the Stepstones and make them a part of his realm for all time. In 264 AC, a visit to King's Landing by Lord Rickard Stark of Winterfell awakened his interest in the North, and he hatched a plan to build a new Wall a hundred leagues north of the existing one and claim all the lands between. In 265 AC, offended by "the stink of King's Landing," he spoke of building a "white city" entirely of marble on the south bank of the Blackwater Rush. In 267 AC, after a dispute with the Iron Bank of Braavos regarding certain monies borrowed by his father, he announced that he would build the largest war fleet in the history of the world "to bring the Titan to his knees." In 270 AC, during a visit to Sunspear, he told the Princess of Dorne that he would "make the Dornish deserts bloom" by digging a great underground canal beneath the mountains to bring water down from the rainwood.

None of these grandiose plans ever came to fruition; most, indeed, were forgotten within a moon's turn, for Aerys II seemed to grow bored with his royal enthusiasms as quickly as he did his royal paramours. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

“Would that we could do the same to the rest of this foul castle,” said Cersei. “After the war I mean to build a new palace beyond the river.” She had dreamed of it the night before last, a magnificent white castle surrounded by woods and gardens, long leagues from the stinks and noise of King’s Landing. “This city is a cesspit. For half a groat I would move the court to Lannisport and rule the realm from Casterly Rock.” (AFFC Cersei III)

~

A group of merchants appeared before her to beg the throne to intercede for them with the Iron Bank of Braavos. The Braavosi were demanding repayment of their outstanding debts, it seemed, and refusing all new loans. We need our own bank, Cersei decided, the Golden Bank of Lannisport. (AFFC Cersei VIII)

That's not the case with Dany either. Throughout her reign, she only makes reasonable and attainable decisions to improve Meereen's economy, such as planting grapes, beans and wheat, replanting olive trees, making an alliance with the Lhazareen and freeing the slaves of the hinterlands to bring crops to the city.

Both are unpopular with the common people

Aerys II: (note that Tywin himself is unpopular with the smallfolk)

They cheered Father twice as loudly as they cheered the king, the queen recalled, but only half as loudly as they cheered Prince Rhaegar. (AFFC Cersei V)

Cersei:

As she made her way through the ragged throng, past their cookfires, wagons, and crude shelters, the queen found herself remembering another crowd that had once gathered on this plaza. The day she wed Robert Baratheon, thousands had turned out to cheer for them. [...]

No one was smiling now. The looks the sparrows gave her were dull, sullen, hostile. They made way but reluctantly. (AFFC Cersei VI)

~

Thrice that day she heard the sound of distant shouting drifting up from the plaza, but it was Margaery’s name that the mob was calling, not hers. (AFFC Cersei X)

We have yet to see how the common people in Westeros will view Dany, but she is very popular among freedmen and slaves from all over Essos, so she doesn't fit this either.

Both feel threatened by the shadow of Tywin Lannister

Aerys II:

By this time, King Aerys had become aware of the widespread belief that he himself was but a hollow figurehead and Tywin Lannister the true master of the Seven Kingdoms. These sentiments greatly angered the king, and His Grace became determined to disprove them and to humble his "overmighty servant" and "put him back into his place." (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

“Lord Tywin was a great man, an extraordinary man,” he declared ponderously after he had kissed both her cheeks. “We shall never see his like again, I fear.”

You are looking at his like, fool, Cersei thought. It is his daughter standing here before you. (AFFC Cersei II)

~

She was tired of Jaime balking her. No one had ever balked her lord father. When Tywin Lannister spoke, men obeyed. When Cersei spoke, they felt free to counsel her, to contradict her, even refuse her. (AFFC Cersei V)

This is not a perfect parallel because Cersei alternates between hero-worshiping and drawing inspiration and strength from Tywin to resenting the control he had over her, so much so that she lists her father alongside her enemies and takes pleasure in the fact that he's now dead. Even so, both Aerys II and Cersei feel that they were owed the treatment that people gave Tywin.

This doesn't happen with Dany because she doesn't feel threatened by anyone nor does Tywin play an important role in her story.

Both feel threatened by a younger, more beautiful, more popular would-be king/queen

Aerys II:

The cheers of the crowd were said to be deafening, but King Aerys did not join them. Far from being proud and pleased by his heir's skill at arms, His Grace saw it as a threat. Lords Chelsted and Staunton inflamed his suspicions further, declaring that Prince Rhaegar had entered the lists to curry favor with the commons and remind the assembled lords that he was a puissant warrior, a true heir to Aegon the Conqueror. (TWOIAF The Fall of the Dragons: The Year of the False Spring)

~

The lickspittle lords who surrounded Aerys II had gained much and more from the king's madness and eagerly seized upon any opportunity to speak ill of Prince Rhaegar and inflame the father's suspicions of the son. (TWOIAF The Fall of the Dragons: The Year of the False Spring)

~

Meanwhile, King Aerys was becoming ever more estranged from his own son and heir. Early in the year 279 AC, Rhaegar Targaryen, Prince of Dragonstone, was formally betrothed to Princess Elia Martell, the delicate young sister of Doran Martell, Prince of Dorne. They were wed the following year, in a lavish ceremony at the Great Sept of Baelor in King's Landing, but Aerys II did not attend. He told the small council that he feared an attempt upon his life if he left the confines of the Red Keep, even with his Kingsguard to protect him. Nor would he allow his younger son, Viserys, to attend his brother's wedding. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

~

The memory was still bitter. Old Lord Whent had announced the tourney shortly after a visit from his brother, Ser Oswell Whent of the Kingsguard. With Varys whispering in his ear, King Aerys became convinced that his son was conspiring to depose him, that Whent's tourney was but a ploy to give Rhaegar a pretext for meeting with as many great lords as could be brought together. Aerys had not set foot outside the Red Keep since Duskendale, yet suddenly he announced that he would accompany Prince Rhaegar to Harrenhal, and everything had gone awry from there. (ADWD The Kingbreaker)

Cersei:

Her mood was not improved when Mace Tyrell arose to lead the toasts. He raised a golden goblet high, smiling at his pretty little daughter, and in a booming voice said, “To the king and queen!” The other sheep all baaaaaaed along with him. “The king and queen!” they cried, smashing their cups together. “The king and queen!” She had no choice but to drink along with them, all the time wishing that the guests had but a single face, so she could throw her wine into their eyes and remind them that she was the true queen. (AFFC Cersei III)

~

“Your Grace, she ... she is the queen ...”

“I am the queen. (AFFC Cersei IX)

~

It was a pity that Maggy the Frog was dead. Piss on your prophecy, old woman. The little queen may be younger than I, but she has never been more beautiful, and soon she will be dead. (AFFC Cersei IX)

Cersei's case is more justified in that she believes that, by defeating the YMBQ, she'll also prevent her children from dying and the valonqar from killing her.

This doesn't happen with Dany.

Both lost a child (children, in Aerys’s case) and fear for the safety of their remaining child (children, in Cersei’s case) to the point that these concerns become intertwined with their fears that someone is out to get them

Aerys II:

The birth of Prince Viserys only seemed to make Aerys II more fearful and obsessive, however. Though the new young princeling seemed healthy enough, the king was terrified lest he suffer the same fate as his brothers. Kingsguard knights were commanded to stand over him night and day to see that no one touched the boy without the king's leave. Even the queen herself was forbidden to be alone with the infant. When her milk dried up, Aerys insisted on having his own food taster suckle at the teats of the prince's wet nurse, to ascertain that the woman had not smeared poison on her nipples. As gifts for the young prince arrived from all the lords of the Seven Kingdoms, the king had them piled in the yard and burned, for fear that some of them might have been ensorcelled or cursed. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

I am dreaming still, Cersei thought. I have not woken, nor has my nightmare ended. Tyrion will creep out from under the bed soon and begin to laugh at me.

[...] A dream, that’s all it was, a dream. I drank too much last night, these fears are only humors born of wine. I will be the one laughing, come dusk. My children will be safe, Tommen’s throne will be secure, and my twisted little valonqar will be short a head and rotting. (AFFC Cersei I)

~

Cersei had a sudden vision of the dwarf crawling out from behind a tapestry in Tommen’s bedchamber with blade in hand. Tommen is well guarded, she told herself. But Lord Tywin had been well guarded too. (AFFC Cersei I)

~

The younger queen whose coming she’d foretold was finished, and if that prophecy could fail, so could the rest. No golden shrouds, no valonqar, I am free of your croaking malice at last. (AFFC Cersei X)

Like in the previous parallel, Cersei's bad reactions are more justified due to the fact that prophecies come true in her world and due to her understandable sense of self-preservation.

This doesn't happen with Dany.

Both had unhappy marriages and believed that their spouses weren’t the right ones for them

Aerys II:

What Tywin Lannister made of this is not recorded, but in 266 AC, at Casterly Rock, Lady Joanna gave birth to a pair of twins, a girl and a boy, "healthy and beautiful, with hair like beaten gold." This birth only exacerbated the tension between Aerys II Targaryen and his Hand. "I appear to have married the wrong woman," His Grace was reported to have said, when informed of the happy event. (TWOIAF The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)

Cersei:

“...Your father will find another man for you, a better man than Rhaegar.”

Her aunt had lied, though, and her father had failed her, just as Jaime was failing her now. Father found no better man. Instead he gave me Robert, and Maggy’s curse bloomed like some poisonous flower. If she had only married Rhaegar as the gods intended, he would never have looked twice at the wolf girl. Rhaegar would be our king today and I would be his queen, the mother of his sons.

She had never forgiven Robert for killing him. (AFFC Cersei V)

The major difference in this parallel, of course, is that Aerys raped his wife and Cersei was raped by her husband.

This doesn't happen with Dany.

Comparisons in the text between Aerys II and Cersei

"Let all of King's Landing see the flames. It will be a lesson to our enemies."

"Now you sound like Aerys."

Her nostrils flared. "Guard your tongue, ser." (AFFC Cersei III)

~

Jaime knew the look in his sister's eyes. He had seen it before, most recently on the night of Tommen's wedding, when she burned the Tower of the Hand. The green light of the wildfire had bathed the face of the watchers, so they looked like nothing so much as rotting corpses, a pack of gleeful ghouls, but some of the corpses were prettier than others. Even in the baleful glow, Cersei had been beautiful to look upon. She'd stood with one hand on her breast, her lips parted, her green eyes shining. She is crying, Jaime had realized, but whether it was from grief or ecstasy he could not have said.

The sight had filled him with disquiet, reminding him of Aerys Targaryen and the way a burning would arouse him. (AFFC Jaime II)

~

"Westeros is torn and bleeding, and I do not doubt that even now my sweet sister is binding up the wounds … with salt. Cersei is as gentle as King Maegor, as selfless as Aegon the Unworthy, as wise as Mad Aerys. She never forgets a slight, real or imagined. She takes caution for cowardice and dissent for defiance. And she is greedy. Greedy for power, for honor, for love. Tommen's rule is bolstered by all of the alliances that my lord father built so carefully, but soon enough she will destroy them, every one.” (ADWD Tyrion VI)

Again, as I said above, the comparisons between Cersei and Aerys II come from two of the people who have known Cersei the longest (Jaime, Tyrion).

Meanwhile, Dany is only called the Mad King’s daughter by her enemies (the slavers and Mace Tyrell). The characters who actually know her and the characters who have nothing to gain by defaming her (Barristan, Tyrion, Illyrio, Quentyn) reiterate that she’s nothing like him.

[dwellordream]

If you could rewrite Alysanne and J****erys’ daughters to make them fully-fledged characters instead of paper-thin stereotypes, what would you change? (Censored you-know-who’s name because we don’t acknowledge him in my house 🙅🏿‍♀️)

Lmfao at you-know-who.  Daenerys: I actually think Fire and Blood does an okay job of building up Daenerys’ character (though of course it’s pretty obvious from her very first appearance she’s going to die tragically young, forever the ‘darling of the realm’). I don’t know, maybe we could have had a scene of her interacting with Aerea or Rhaena or something to get their reactions to her being heir for the first two years of her life before Aemon’s birth. Alyssa: My problem with Alyssa is not that she’s a tomboy. My problem with Alysaa is that she is a generic trope of ‘not like other girls!’ with no actual development. Unlike Arya’s very well-written arc in canon, Alyssa’s failure to conform to her society’s rigid gender roles and her interest in more traditionally masculine Westerosi pursuits like dueling, riding, climbing, etc is never examined in terms of how it effects her relationships with her family members and her thoughts about her future. There’s no scene like the one between Arya and Ned where Arya questions why she can’t be rule in her own right or build castles or advise kings, etc. There’s no detail given to how she got along with her mother and if Alysanne encouraged her ‘wild’ behavior or was more disapproving of it, etc.  Despite all this attention paid to how Alyssa refuses to conform to the expected role of a ladylike and demure princess, she seemingly has no problems with being married off at 15 and being expected to stick to being a wife and mother? There’s absolutely no conflict there, and there should be. Even if she was really in love with Baelon and had no issues marrying him, I find it hard to believe that she would pivot from wanting to spar with her brothers in the training yard to telling Baelon, totally seriously, “You were made for battles, and I was made for this. ...As soon as I am well, let’s make another. An army of your own!”  That seems like a pretty drastic shift in personality, and it’s never explained. Maegelle: Maegelle just needs more development, in general. She’s not this offensive character archetype, she’s just incredibly barebones, the barest outline of a character. Only one line is spared to her relationship with Alyssa, who was only two years older, and that is ‘Alyssa bristled at the baby at her skirts’. It would have been nice to see some interaction between them, any at all; they were close in age growing up, surely they spent time together, even if they had very different interests, and they must have been educated together by a septa. There’s also barely anything devoted to how Maegelle viewed Daella beyond being her ‘guiding star’. What does that mean? Was she protective of Daella? Did she spend more time with her little sister than the rest of the family? Was she upset when Daella was married off? How did she and Daella react to Alyssa’s untimely death?  What about Maegelle’s ‘gift for healing’? When did that show up? When did she begin to study healing? What motherhouse did she go to? She was very bright, so what else did she like to study? Did she ever wish she could study at the Citadel? Did she correspond with Vaegon? Did she do any writing of her own? How did she help her parents resolve their conflicts? Did she help resolve any other political or familial strife? Did she wish for Viserys or Daemon to join the Faith as boys? Daella: Daella seems to have been intellectually disabled in some way. How did that affect her everyday life? To what extent was she aware of this? How did it affect the way her siblings treated her? Was she scared of her father, who she seemed incapable of pleasing, no matter what she did? She liked flowers, did she like to spend a lot of time in the gardens, or did she have a personal flower garden of her own that she tended to, like Myrcella in canon? What caused her to be scared of gardens? Was she bullied in one by her siblings?  Daella didn’t speak until she was almost two. Was this scene as a cause for concern at the time? What did the maesters think? Did Maegelle teach her to read, and praise her when she was able to read aloud, albeit haltingly? Who were her other tutors? What did Alysanne and Jaehaerys think of her being known as ‘simple’? Why was she scared of Alyssa?  Was Saera punished for her cruel pranks on Daella? Did Saera single her out because Daella annoyed her or because she felt Daella took up attention from their parents that Saera did not get? How much did Saera and Vaegon’s bullying contribute to Daella’s obvious anxiety and many phobias? Why was someone asking the 9 year old Daella when she would marry Vaegon?  Why did Alysanne and Jaehaerys feel Daella needed to be wed at all? At the time they had plenty of healthy children who would presumably have multiple grandchildren to continue the Targaryen line. The overwhelming pressure for Daella to marry does not make sense when the family tree was still fairly vast in 77 AC. Why was Daella left alone with for young squires seemingly encouraged to flirt with and pursue her, a frightened teenage girl with a child-like mentality? Why was there no uproar over Simon trying to get her drunk, and Ellard forcing a kiss on her? Why was this incident seen as ‘Daella being picky’ and not an assault on a royal princess? What drew Daella to Royce Blackwood? Was he kind to her? Why did no one consider that Daella’s strong religious faith in the Seven might pose an obstacle to this marriage? Why could Daella not be permitted to wed in a sept and raise her children in an interfaith marriage, as Catelyn and Ned do in canon?  Why did Jaehaerys feel Daella needed to be married off by the end of her sixteenth year seemingly for no reason other than annoyance? Why would the marriage of a royal princess be treated so lightly? Why did Jaehaerys then threaten to send Daella to the Silent Sisters when Alysanne asked why Daella could not wait to be married? Why did Jaehaerys hold such animosity towards his 16 year old daughter that he would rather her be forced into a severe religious order where she would likely never see her family again, rather than simply let her wait to marry or not marry at all? Why were two of the men Daella was then ordered to choose between old enough to be her father? Why was she not offered the choice of Rodrik’s sons or Boremund’s son? What was to be gained from wedding her to Rodrik, since her children by him would never inherit the Eyrie? Jaehaerys just decided to chuck politics out the window in order to be rid of her? He loathed his daughter that much at that point? Daella is given no voice following her marriage to Rodrik, nor is there any interrogation of his frankly disturbing interest in a 16 year old girl he’d known since birth and watched grow up over the years, calling her his ‘precious princess’ and seemingly fetishizing her naive, child-like innocence and fragile physical state? To add onto this, there is then zero outcry towards Rodrik himself when he proceeds to impregnate Daella, leading to her horrible death in childbirth. Why do we not even get Jaehaerys’ reaction to the realization that he essentially pushed his daughter into an early, agonizing death?  Saera and Viserra: Saera is brave and clever but that gets one brief mention, and then the rest of the narrative spends all its time harping on how she’s an evil, sexy, manipulative teenage girl. Viserra is just a slightly watered down version of her. They don’t just need to be rewritten, they need actual personalities to work with, because they have none, they’re just plot devices with names designed to make their parents fight with each other.  The same goes for Gael, who seems to just be ‘Daella 2.0′ in terms of being regarded as ‘simple-minded but sweet’, and then being raped (I don’t think Gael was capable of giving proper consent to sex or understood what that meant) and left to commit suicide after her stillborn son.

[shieldofrohan]

I don't know how Brienne would escort Sansa to the Wall . I think Sansa has to go there on her own and Brienne's story now is intertwined with LSH. I think the irony will be that in ADWD Jon thought of rescuing Arya but will meet Sansa in TWOW. Similarly Brienne starts her quest in search for Sansa in AFFC but the sister that she might run first into would be Arya.

Hello @lazypizzagiantpalace ,

I do believe that Brienne will come to Vale. Why do I believe this?

One of the dangers that Sansa faces in the Vale is Shadrich. 

Shadrich of the Shady Glen aka The Mad Mouse [according to TWOW; Alayne sample] is in Vale... And he is one of the hunters who are after Sansa. And he seems to found her.

When did we meet him? 

AFFC; Brienne I chapter:

“Aye, love of gold. Unlike your good Ser Creighton, I did fight upon the Blackwater, but on the losing side. My ransom ruined me. You know who Varys is, I trust? The eunuch has offered a plump bag of gold for this girl you’ve never heard of. I am not a greedy man. If some oversized wench would help me find this naughty child, I would split the Spider’s coin with her.”

So for some reason GRRM chose Brienne chapter to introduce us to this man. Brienne is the one who knows Shadrich and his plans for Sansa.

Another reason that makes me believe that Brienne will be in Vale is that the parallels between Ashford Tourney and Vale Tourney.

Examples:

(source: xx ) 

Sansa and Dunk watching the respective tourneys being set up on the grounds:

Whitewashing the Barriers and Competitors' entryway:

Sansa's POV:

Lord Nestor’s men were painting the barriers with whitewash, draping the stands with bright banners, and hanging shields on the gate the competitors would pass through when they made their entrance.

Dunk's POV: 

Lord Ashford’s carpenters were whitewashing the waist- high wooden barriers that would separate the jousters. There were five lanes, arrayed north to south so none of the competitors would ride with the sun in his eyes.

Viewing stands for the audience:

Sansa's POV:

Viewing stands had raised for all those who had come to watch, with four long tilting barriers in between.

Dunk's POV:

A three- tiered viewing stand had been raised on the eastern side of the lists, with an orange canopy to shield the lords and ladies from rain and sun

Participants training with Quitains at the edge of the grounds and our POV characters recognize the competitors involved:

Sansa's POV:

At the north end of the yard, three quintains had been set up, and some of the competitors were riding at them. Alayne knew them by their shields.. Ser Mychel Redfort set one quintain spinning with a perfectly placed blow. He was one of those favored to win wings.

Dunk's POV:

On the eastern verge of the meadow, a quintain had been set up and a dozen knights were tilting at it, sending the pole arm spinning every time they struck the splintered shield suspended from one end. Dunk watched the Brute of Bracken take his turn, and then Lord Caron of the Marches.

Both POVs watch a lithe knight beat down a large knight who gets his head injured. Both POVs recocgnize the knights via their shields:

Sansa's POV:

A few feet away, two knights were fighting with blunted practice swords. Their blades crashed together twice, then slipped past each other only to be blocked by upraised shields, but the bigger man gave ground at the impact. Alayne could not see the front of his shield from where she stood, but his attacker bore three ravens in flight, each clutching a red heart in its claws.A few moments later and the big man sprawled dazed in the dust with his helm askew. When his squire undid the fastenings to bare his head, there was blood trickling down his scalp

  Dunk's POV:

Elsewhere, men were training afoot, going at each other with wooden swords while their squires stood shouting ribald advice. Dunk watched a stocky youth try to hold off a muscular knight who seemed lithe and quick as a mountain cat. Both had the red apple of the Fossoways painted on their shields, but the younger man’s was soon hacked and chipped to pieces. “Here’s an apple that’s not ripe yet,” the older said as he slammed the other’s helm.The younger Fossoway was bruised and bloody by the time he yielded, but his foe was hardly winded

And we can safely assume that Brienne is one of Dunk's descendants. So her being at that Tourney makes great sense. Almost every tourney in ASOIAF had a mystery knight and Brienne would fit into this one nicely.

Another reason for my Sansa-Brienne meeting in Vale is the Alysanne-Jonquil Darke parallels.

( For Alysanne//Sansa please read: xx )

[ Jonquil was from Duskendale btw. And that's where Brienne met Shadrich in AFFC; Brienne I - AND Sansa is literally called Jonquil so they are all connected somehow- ]

This was how we meet with Jonquil:

At the Golden Wedding in 49 AC, a test of arms that became known as the War for the White Cloaks was held with hundreds of knights competing for the honor of serving in the Kingsguard of Jaehaerys I Targaryen. Jonquil took part as a slender mystery knight known as the Serpent in Scarlet. She was eventually defeated and unmasked, and became a great favorite with the small folk. [AWOIAF] 

"Knight competing for the honor of serving in the Kingsguard" sounds really like this:

She closed the window, gathered up the fallen papers, and stacked them on the table. One was a list of the competitors. Four-and-sixty knights had been invited to vie for places amongst Lord Robert Arryn’s new Brotherhood of Winged Knights, and four­ and-sixty knights had come to tilt for the right to wear falcon’s wings upon their warhelms and guard their lord.

[...]

And they came, Alayne thought proudly. They all came.

[TWOW; Alayne I]

So these are my reasons for believing that Brienne is really linked with Vale tourney.

Also Brienne is close to Sansa:

In conclusion: I believe that Brienne will be with Sansa during her journey up North. I see no way for Sansa being alone in that kind of journey. And I think Brienne will be her companion at some point. 

I disagree with the part that you say: "Brienne's story now is intertwined with LSH"

Lady Stoneheart plot is just a test for Brienne. Just like Jaime had to do in the past, Brienne also has to choose between two oaths. Will she choose Jaime, Catelyn, Sansa or LSH? This will be an important point of her arc as an ideal knight. But the choice is quite clear if you ask me:

“I have made kings and unmade them. Sansa Stark is my last chance for honor.” Jaime smiled thinly. “Besides, kingslayers should band together. Are you ever going to go?”

Her big hand wrapped tight around Oathkeeper. “I will. And I will find the girl and keep her safe. For her lady mother’s sake. And for yours.” She bowed stiffly, whirled, and went.

[A Storm of Swords - Jaime IX]

Sansa, though... I will find her, my lady, Brienne swore to Lady Catelyn’s restless shade. I will never stop looking. I will give up my life if need be, give up my honor, give up all my dreams, but I will find her.

[A Feast for Crows - Brienne II]

Sansa is the way of her keeping her promise to Catelyn and Jaime AND herself. Even Jaime's honor is linked with Sansa.

So, Brienne's journey is still linked with her knighthood ideals and Sansa... 

Arya doesn't even need a knight. It is Sansa who needs a protector who won't abuse her. So it would be waste to bringing them together because they have nothing to give each other right now tbh.

(BTW: I think Arya's story is linked with LSH.. she needs to see that revenge is not good and she is linked with Riverlands and Red Wedding 2.0)

And Sansa is the character that was always praying for a "true knight".

By the time she reached the godswood, the noises had faded to a faint rattle of steel and a distant shouting. Sansa pulled her cloak tighter. The air was rich with the smells of earth and leaf. Lady would have liked this place, she thought. There was something wild about a godswood; even here, in the heart of the castle at the heart of the city, you could feel the old gods watching with a thousand unseen eyes.

Sansa had favored her mother's gods over her father's. She loved the statues, the pictures in leaded glass, the fragrance of burning incense, the septons with their robes and crystals, the magical play of the rainbows over altars inlaid with mother-of-pearl and onyx and lapis lazuli. Yet she could not deny that the godswood had a certain power too. Especially by night. Help me, she prayed, send me a friend, a true knight to champion me . . .

[A Clash of Kings - Sansa II]

About looking for Arya/Sansa but finding Sansa/Arya thing:

Fake!Arya and Melisandre's Grey Girl prophecy were there to "distract" us from Sansa... 

What I mean is: Sansa was always the GG but Martin was trying to distract us by making Jon only thinking about Arya.

He does such things:

GRRM: There are some mysteries in these books. There are some things that I’m gonna reveal later on that I’m planting clues for. There are some later plot twists that I’m foreshadowing. There are things that are gonna happen in Book 5 and Book 6 and Book 7 where I’ve planted a seed for it in Book 1. But I don’t necessarily want to give away my hand. So, what do I do when I plant the seed? Well, I plant the seed, but I try to do a little literary sleight of hand, and while I’m planting the seed, my other hand is up there waving and is distracting you with some flashy bit of wordplay or something that’s going on in the foreground, while the seed is being planted in the background. So hopefully the seed is there, the foreshadowing is there, but maybe you won’t notice it, because it’s surrounded by so many other things.

Thanks for the ask; I hope it was helpful.