#chinese mythos

[the-monkey-ruler]

I am not familiar with the rules so I am curious (I love reading all your explanations so much), what are the rules in the underworld? Can everyone just go there? or is Sun Wukong an exception? Like, is death permanent for the demons/gods/mortals alike? Or is there some process they have to go through to be rebirth? Because I am wondering if (this is like speculation/headcanon) there was ever a chance for Erlang's older brother to be reborn/rebirth, or if Erlang had ever thought of going down the underworld to find him? I am so interested in the Yang Siblings, because despite not being there, I love that Yang Jiao haunts both of his siblings, like being known as Second Son and Third Sister feels like a reminder that they had an older brother, haha.

I am not familiar with the rules so I am curious (I love reading all your explanations so much), what are the rules in the underworld?

Actually funny enough someone gave a GREAT explanation of the death/rebirth process and what that would look like to an average person! @ryin-silverfish made a wonderful comprehensible and walk-through guide of what dying and going through rebirth are like for normal human beings and what they are most likely to see.

Can everyone just go there?

It sounds like you are more asking if people that are alive and are planning to stay alive can go to the underworld?

Normally for most humans, this isn't the case as the only way for a mortal to go to the underworld is to die. As for Immortals or gods then they would have the Walking Cloud (at the very least) and should be able to physically go to the underworld however I don't see most deities doing so without at least some cause or permission. The underworld is run like a business/branch of government/etc. so if a deity goes there and just gets in the way then that could still be rude. In short, I can see deities CAN go but if they don't have a reason then it would be better if they stay out of the way.

or is Sun Wukong an exception?

Sun Wukong is always the exception. He is different from most and if not all deities as he is shown to move and travel anywhere without fear of repercussions. Wukong goes to the underworld because he KNOWS he can and knows that no one can stop him even if he holds other deities' duties to do so. Wukong has no qualms about having others be inconvenienced for his sake and shows this well when he goes to the underworld multiple times in the journey to recruit people's help. It isn't... proper to say the least but Wukong never let social etiquette stop him from completing his goals. I doubt any other deities would have the gall but Wukong has the power to back up his boldness so no one really stops him.

Like, is death permanent for the demons/gods/mortals alike?

"Permanent" isn't really... permanent so to speak. If we are talking about general yao/deities/mortals then all things have a soul and eventually, these souls are all trapped in the wheel of reincarnation. The only beings that are outside of this trap are the Buddha (hence Wukong reaching his goal for true immorality/freedom at the end). There are different details depending on which dynasty lore you might be looking at but all beings are still bound by reincarnation and can still die.

Mortals normally die as such with old age or being killed and thus they go back to the underworld, get evaluated, and go through the incarnation process after their memory is wiped.

Yao are just spirits that skip their human cycle and try to cheat in their animal/object life. If you don't know how yao work read this and understand that Yao are just animals/objects that cultivate to get a humanoid form. Once they die/killed their souls go back into the cycle and either pay for the karma by one of the judges, or they are reincarnated back into their animal/object form to properly life out their lives until they get enough karma to be a human. Or maybe they were a good enough Yao and can be a human in their next life.

Deities while immortal can still be killed. I've seen in Journey to the South how some deities can even use reincarnation to avoid being arrested by heaven by being reborn as someone else and still retaining their past life's memories. This is illegal as you SHOULD have your memory wiped before you are reborn but it can happen if a person goes through other means. But in most cases, if a deity is 'killed' then they would most likely go to the underworld, live out their good karma in a paradise and then be reborn in a very good life. Usually, when I see deities being sent into the reincarnation cycle it is usually a punishment and they will eventually come back to heaven once they have earned their cultivation all over again. We see this with Tang Sanang who was the Golden Cicada who had to live through 10 lifetimes of pure lives to get back to where his cultivation needed to be. And we see this with Zhu Bajie who was reborn as a pig but turned into a yao as he kept his past life's cultivation.

Or is there some process they have to go through to be rebirth?

The process should be the same for everyone going through the judgment halls. But there are certainly a lot of cases of people coming back from the dead (like in FYSS) or mortals being deified after death when they are worshipped.

But normally mortals/yao/deities have their karma weighted and depending on their good/bad deeds they either be reborn into a life that is easy or one that is filled with struggles. If they are really bad then they are usually born as an animal/object as punishment until their next life to be a human to work for a better life. Hence why Yao tend to cheat and skip to the humanoid form so they don't have to live out their lives as animals/objects.

Because I am wondering if (this is like speculation/headcanon) there was ever a chance for Erlang's older brother to be reborn/rebirth, or if Erlang had ever thought of going down the underworld to find him?

Yang Jaio would have been reborn certainly as that is the process all mortals go through.

However, by the time Erlang got his own cultivation/enough power to fight the Jade Emporer, I personally think that Yang Jaio would have been reincarnated and forget all his past life. Erlang could certainly go to the underworld and perhaps ask about his brother's next life but at that point this wouldn't be the brother he would know and would be someone with his soul but not his memories.

He could still go and look but depending on if Erlang would want the weight of knowledge knowing who his brother would be and living out hundreds of mortals' lives might be exhausting.

I am so interested in the Yang Siblings, because despite not being there, I love that Yang Jiao haunts both of his siblings, like being known as Second Son and Third Sister feels like a reminder that they had an older brother, haha.

This is a personal headcanon of my own because I love the Yang siblings but I always liked to think that Yang Jiao got reborn as the Howling Sky Dog so that he was always by his brother's side even after death.

[imminent-danger-came]

" it's okay to ship her and Chang'e but not Mk and Syntax" please tell me where that happens. No really. Shipping literally anyone with chang'e starts a fight because she is supposedly suppose to stay forever devoted to Hou Yi. Even shipping her with macaque or spider queen is seen as culturally insensitive

I presumed that the "Chang'e X Mei" anon had actually had this experience in the fandom, taking them at their word. It sounds reasonable, as there are misogyny and infantilization issues within the lmk fandom.

When it comes to Chang'e, there are many versions of her myth. In one version, Chang'e stole the elixir from Hou Yi and ascended to the moon so that she couldn't be followed, in another, she took both pills of immortality out of greed. You also have adaptations like Over the Moon, a film entirely about coping with grief and accepting death and moving on, which was produced in association with a Chinese studio (if you want to learn more, watch this great video by Xiran Jay Zhao!). So like, it's just not culturally insensitive. Being Chinese isn't a monolith

[mericanasshole83]

[jcflfytt23]

[hisclockworkservants]

Chinese Bronze Style - Old Ones & Outer Gods

Compilation post! Also I want to know which of the designs people like better XD

Check out my Patreon here!

[linya333]

Got a sudden hankering for a bingqiu fic where lbh is a dragon who sqq nurses back to health after finding him hurt as an adolescent. Sqq being the type of cultivator who is currently cultivating in seclusion on some type of mountain top by himself but still gets regular visits from just about everyone.

And lbh is afraid at first but just loves this man so much. And swears himself to the service of sqq for saving his life but despite being half human he has not yet cultivated a human form.

So sqq has this really cool dragon friend/disciple who helps him out and keeps him company.

And lbh has to leave to truly learn to change forms but also to master his abilities. And asks sqq to wait for him

And comes back a few years later a very handsome young man to court sqq.

But is having trouble getting anywhere!

And there are all these other annoying men about also wanting his man!? The outrage!

Except sqq doesn't actually realize this is his dragon? Just a charming and handsome stranger.

So there are shenanigans. Because lbh does also visit sqq in his dragon form! And is so warmly received. But though sqq is courteous to him in human form he is also rejecting his courting gestures there. how can this man be more accepting of his dragon from?

Lbh gets in fights with lqq in both forms. Someone gets it.

Eventually lbh cries to sqq and they figure things out. But it takes a while. Also sqq says something like: though lbh's human form is handsome it is not any better than he already looked! And they have a great relationship with lbh regularly switching between forms and being treated the same regardless

[makosxa]

The Shambler from the Stars or here's my take on the star vampire's gijinka–

[fluffypotatey]

Don't cancel me Fluffy, but I like to separate LMK from the OG text. NOT because I hate themes and motifs and classical novels, nah. But rather for the regular amount of separation fans need in acknowledging when the show puts its own spin on things. And also because a subsection of fandom is very persistent that everything that happened in JTTW is canon in the exact same way to LMK and like to bash on characters for that. A lot different from writers pulling inspo is assuming LMK is a 1:1 adaptation when even the writers said it wasn't what they wanted.

yeah see that’s different (also i don’t have nor want the power to cancel you)

my personal beef is when people butcher the themes and character dynamics from jttw. (Tripitaka for example 🤨 like wtf is UP with that???? also, HISTORICAL CONTEXT PPL 👏👏👏👏👏I WILL TAP THE SIGN HOWEVER TIMES I NEED TO!!!! this story is old, old so reading with footnotes that provide context on what the original meant to convey is ok. if you need it for Shakespeare plays, then you’ll need it for the older shit too) lmk very clearly isn’t being an honest adaptation and this story is old as balls so i don’t expect it to. if it holds the heart of the story then it’s an A in my book.

Red Son’s origin isn’t even the same from jttw, and PVD is shown to be more of a threat than she was in the book. so, lmk is taking plenty of creative liberties where they feel they need to.

my thing is mostly with the Western audience who aren’t as familiar with not just the og text, but how much this story has an impact on a lot of cultural stories in Asian countries.

in a way it’s like Arthuriana to me (except jttw is older than Arthuriana lol) because there’s not a lot of “canon” beside Arthur is king, dies in the battle of Camlann, Merlin is a powerful wizard, Morgana is an important antagonist, and Mordred makes the killing blow. but despite that, many Western audiences are vaguely familiar with the legends enough to have their own interpretations. some people like theirs to be closer to the course materials and some like to keeps theirs a little loose

there is a ton of jttw adaptations (you can go ahead and watch this video by The Dom where he lists a plethora of adaptations from the most “honest” to the least) and i am sure many Asian cultures and communities have their own personal interpretations and omissions from the legend

so yeah. long story short: when it comes to lmk, i agree that ppl should if he holding the jttw as gospel since it is used as a source of inspiration (sure the main source but you get what i mean). however, that shouldn’t discount it from your analysis and interpretations when looking at the themes and character dynamics

[hermesmoly]

Honestly being active in two fandoms is akin to having two separate lives

[joemerl]

Inspired by the fact that "May" sort of looks like "myth," for the last several years I've been toying with the idea of making a mythology-themed event, akin to Mermay or Inktober. It would be for writing, art, whatever, and any mythology you want.

Details (dates, how many prompts, etc.) to follow, assuming that people seem interested.

[adanaac]

On a unimportant and more chatty thing, do you have a suggestion for the name of a snake-kami in human form? I can't think of a good one, and the option otherwise is to flick through all my manga for name picks.

Also, I love your new OC, they are so great. I hope you are doing well, and thank you very much for your help with my questions recently. I greatly appreciate it.

hmmmmmm tbh i feel like i cant help much without knowing more abt this character beyond "snake theme", bc physical characteristics and what other kinds of mythologies u want to invoke are pretty important i think, and whether the "snake" part is supposed to be subtle or not

orochi is a good general name i think, almost all snakes i see in manga either directly or indirectly reference yamata no orochi anyway

and also physical characteristics like eye color especially, like hoozuki which is used to describe yamata no orochi's eyes

theres also 巴 tomoe which i think would be a cute name for a snake bc its the character 巳 mi (representing snake in the chinese zodiac) with a stroke through it and it looks like a snake eye

[the-monkey-ruler]

Would you happen to know what the san jie/3 realms are in the context of JTTW?

I assume you mean Heaven, Earth, and the Underworld?

Heaven is where the celestials reside, there are two heavens in xiyouji. Eastern Heaven where the immortals and deities reside that are more associated with the Chinese patheon and are under the Jade Emporer. And then there is Western Heaven which is where the Buddhas and Bodhisattvas reside. It's a tad different but they are considered both general heaven even if they are separate. Buddha does not report to the Jade Emperor and technically the Jade Emperor doesn't report to Buddha but Buddha is considered to be more powerful than him since he was the one to take down Sun Wukong.

Earth is there the mortals and earth immortals reside, also Yao as they cultivate there. Not much to say on earth since it is generally well-known.

And the Underworld which is there King Yama and Ksitigarbha Bodhisattva are there to take care of the ghosts. Honestly, this does play as a branch of Heaven in xiyouji as King Yama does report to the Jade Emperor (when Wukong fought his way out King Yama sent a formal complaint to Heaven).

Heaven is to be considered the one in charge overall as its main purpose is to keep the balance of Earth and Heaven, making sure the weather is on track, ghosts are properly sent to the Underworld to be reincarnated, and making sure yaos are stopped from harming humans. Earth in turn is where humans are able to cultivate with immortal teachers and become immortal to go to be hired in heaven as well.

[lunarlxdy]

My Chang'e follows the tyrant HouYi version.

Chang'e had a big falling out with HouYi over the course of time, their little arguments soon turned into spats and the rebellion was fueled b how HouYi started to treat Chang'e as nothing more but an extention of himself and more like a means to continue his reign. The elixirs were to ensure himself and keep his wife around eternal and bound to him. Though they never got that far in the beginning nor towards the end. Power corrupted her husband, Chang'e feared him, she grew to despise him but still loved him. However their arguments turned physical sometimes and some in the inner court became greedy and wanting of the power HouYi boasted. Which eventually when the rebellion struck, they did as well.

Unfortunately Chang'e got to the elixirs first. Though given her only 'self defense' was a simple bow and arrow, she was overpowered and the elixirs nearly fell into the wrong hands. Which forced her to drink both. Enraged when she began to float away, HouYi attempted to shoot her down, nicking her shoulder but eventually she floated too far from him.

When it comes to shipping. Chang'e needs time. She will want an emotional bond, she will want trust. She will want a firm belief that it won't end up like how HouYi did. Anger will cause her to retaliate in kind. Chang'e is a cinnamon roll that will kill you (if you push her hard enough). While she is not on the same level as many big shot gods. She IS the goddess of the moon. Able to dream walk, able to visit earth for only six hours, she is able to do all sorts of things but she mainly enjoys recreating what she once had before she had been demoted to a human. Even still, Chang'e's most prominent building has to be the greenhouse and the entire building committed to cooking. Her vast garden is another area. Though in an unassuming storage closet is a portal to the pocket dimension which houses what you would expect a goddess to live in. Except maybe the most depressing thing about it is the fact she has worked on guest rooms, betraying just how lonely the goddess feels.

[mericanasshole83]

[jcflfytt23]

[hisclockworkservants]

Chinese Bronze Style - Cthulhu

I was inspired to draw various Old Ones and Outer Gods in the style of Chinese Ritual Bronzes. Not following the usual patterns super strictly of course.

So this is the first one of the set and I'm really satisfied with it :D I didn't clean up all the details because they actually look better this way XD

Check out my Patreon here!