#chicago analysis

[twilight-zoned-out]

"Seven years ago we all went through the flames; and the happiness of some of us since then is, we think, well worth the pain we endured."

Although Dracula was published in 1897, some think that it takes place in 1893 because of the way the days and dates used line up. If that's the case, Jonathan Harker's epilogue, seven years later, would have been added around 1900. A new era bubbling with new change and new conventions. The story ends with Jonathan looking ahead to a new century filled with the unknown and being able to look on the past, despite its darkness, "without despair."

[bonebabbles]

This is the pettiest thing I will ever post. But when I see Gray Wing put up with the song Mr. Cellophane I think,

Don't you dare compare Amos Hart to that hideous beast. Amos deserves the ENTIRE WORLD and also A UNION

good. gray wing deserves this, actually. Cry about it

It does legitimately interest me though, how the song becomes re-contextualized by changing the singer like this.

For those who don't know; Chicago is a musical about awful people and the way Roxie Hart and her lawyer, Billy Flynn, are able to whip the media surrounding Roxie's trial into a tool to get her acquitted of a coldblooded murder.

It's about trickery, with the only two well-meaning people in the entire cast taking the consequences. A hotshot prosecutor hangs the only innocent woman in the jail (Hunyak, a Hungarian who can't speak English and whose public defender refuses to do his job), and Roxie's husband, Amos Hart, bankrupts himself to pay for Roxie's lawyer.

Roxie haaaates Amos. She lies to him about her victim, convincing him cover up her murder, only for it to fall apart when he finds out she had been cheating on him with this man and the truth comes together. Yet, he still spends every cent he has on Billy Flynn, a very expensive lawyer, to save her from the noose.

He's not a smart man, and that's the tragedy. He's a rube she takes advantage of. She was always planning to leave him.

The whole time, Amos is kept out of the loop and used in even more schemes. Roxie feigns pregnancy to get media sympathy, frames him as a mastermind who "convinced a nun to elope one day," and ignores him for the entire trial before leaving him in the end.

So when he sings Mr. Cellophane, what that serves is to show that Amos wants ONE thing. He just wants to be noticed. Not loved, he doesn't want to own her, he doesn't wish he never paid for her defense. He wants to be NOTICED.

And that's very unlike Gray Wing, but people will hear Mr. Cellophane out of context and just think it's about sadboy pining.

Gray Wing treats Turtle Tail like shit as he obsesses over Storm, who was never interested in him. He treats her buddy Bumble like shit and yells at Turtle for having the wrong friend. He doesn't run after heavily pregnant Storm when she leaves Clear Sky for being a controlling, war-hungry monster who argues with her in public and exiled his disabled brother.

He holds a grudge against Bumble for "taking" Turtle from him, happy to watch her dragged back to a domestic abuser, and couldn't give less of a shit when she dies violently because she just HAD to go and get herself killed by his Beloved Brother and now no one will like him :(

And even worse-- he's NOT Mr. Cellophane. People think Gray Wing is the wisest motherfucker in the forest, they run after him and beg him to help them lead all the time, trusting his dumb, terrible choices and clouded judgement to the point of absurdity.

He's the writer's pet, even "rewarded" with a woman in the end to birth his biological kittens

There's something really interesting in that, though.

The song from the mouth of Amos Hart, it's insight to his goodness. Even after all this mistreatment, after being so OBVIOUSLY taken advantage of, slandered, drained of everything, all he wants is to be noticed. It's a fatal flaw.

In the mouth of Gray Wing, it's whining. It's the same bitching and moaning he does all series long, crying about how people don't listen to him when really they should listen to him less. It's "But I'm a Nice Guy!" entitlement, a refusal to self-reflect on why those three women didn't fucking like him. A fatal flaw, but in the opposite way.

[biregrets]

There are very few stories that do the trope of a good character slowly becoming more corrupt by their circumstances and it gets to the point that season 1 character wouldn’t recognize them ( a facet of grumpy/sunshine character’s slowly switching places)

One of my favorite examples of this is Chicago PD. In one of Jay Halsteads last appearances in the show he makes the comment, “we’re doing it again”. This comes on the second happenstance of the team covering up an unjustifiable killing.

You can see as we go from season one Jay who makes no secret of not trusting Voight and practically outright saying he’s dirty to season 10 Jay who is slowly turning into Voight by letting more and more things slide.

I feel like it gets to a point where you can see the guilt eating Jay alive which is why he leaves.

Anyway please let me know if you disagree with this take or if you have any thoughts!

Honorable mentions for this trope: Merlin from BBC’s Merlin, Lucy from The Rookie and I’ll come up with other characters shortly

[readymades2002]

iirc episode 6 of s1 of the bear is the closest we get to acknowledging Le Gentrification. that's a pretty central theme of that episode obviously, though its done through richie kind of losing his place in the world as it constantly changes and dies around him. his conflict with that change is extremely visible in how he relates to sydney, which i think kind of muddles that theme a bit? sydney's treatment by richie (and carmy, though i haven't seen that discussed as much) feels incrediblyyyyy racialized and his war against her gets combined with his fear of everything around him changing. when he goes through his character development moment in s2, he finds that he actually fits in beautifully with the newly whitewashed Bear and he's able to start cooperating better with sydney as well, and its like...hm. his conflict. in episode 6. that fear of change. its shown as largely a personal issue and causes him to butt heads with sydney and to call the cops on her handiwork later on. its hard for me to express in a more coherent way but it feels like the show is conflating his issues with the bigotry he later attempts to unlearn and we see him improving and growing on both fronts through how he adapts to the fine dining atmosphere. and this is an interesting vehicle to show that, but it also means that the gentrification stuff is kind of just hovering uncomfortably over your shoulder and i don't know if that's intentional or not. because the bear DOES show its black characters with so much love and compassion and respect for their flaws and their struggle to live in the world and be part of it and their desires and learning to strive for more than they were. it just...hm. a lot of characters realize they want Something Greater through joining the world of fine dining. which is cool! but the beef is still closed for this and there is still an existing base of people who ate there who are not going to anymore. that's a community you're losing! that's a community that you're not feeding anymore! what do the longtime employees of the beef feel about this and why is this a conflict that's mostly shown through richie's pov

[ytcomments-archive]

[yugonostalgia2019]

How do you make it through the Slaughterhouse Nine clone arc? It just feels like endless “who would win” mashing your dolls against each other hypotheticals? Nine cherishes could beat three teams working together, etc—feels like it’s impossible to care about any of the characters involved and what happens

Great question! See I also didn't appreciate the S9k arc until my 2nd read-through. It definitely suffers the most from the missing 2 Chicago Wards arcs that should've been written - the abrupt transition really throws off the otherwise very well paced book

However, the S9k arc is really important for *Taylor*

Remember that no one but Cauldron knows anything about GM - Taylor's acting hypothesis is that Jack will cause a 2nd trigger during his mayhem that ends the world. So this moment is EVERYTHING that Taylor has been working towards for over two years - the reason she left the Undersiders, the reason she works her Wards to the bone, the reason she's been on a one-girl crusade to make allies and break uncooperatives. So in a lot of ways, it's Taylor's time to shine. She took Dinah's 'prophesy' more seriously than anyone, Chevalier lets her take the lead, and we get to see her at her most badass.

Jack, on the other hand, is in it for the fun and chaos - he treats 8 out of each 9 clones as totally expendable - it's boring to have more than one crawler or more than one Winter - his ideal scenario is watching the fireworks as 8/9ths of them die, and taking one of each remainder and creating a much more tightly focused marauding band.

Meanwhile, we get to see Dragon unleash her full potential, after years of incremental freedom she can undercut the S9 at all fronts - the 8 cherishes are a great example - Jack wasn't counting on Dragon's progress so those 8 cherishes on the bus were intercepted long before they reached their destination and started wreaking havoc.

Plus, there was a lot of cool & tense shit that you just gotta enjoy, before the real tragedies begin

[frmulcahy]

I think I should be allowed to quote that “two Kinsey 5s making it work” review of Much Ado 2011 in my essay due tonight

[cboffshore]

I'm not sure how many of y'all that I've told about my jokey plans to make a Nadakhan analysis playlist that's entirely Fall Out Boy, but I think it's going to happen for real, and that's all because I came up with the FUNNIEST possible name for the playlist that's also a lyric pun. anyway if you have any candidates for Nadakhany FOB songs, please let me know

[finexbright]

do you think saturdays is about zayn? and if not do you think any songs on fitf is about zayn? i love coming to you w zouis anons ngl

i will forever die on the hill about the grief of losing a friendship and how it shatters you so much and so of course i do think there's songs on fitf about zayn. and i get why so many people are thinking that saturdays is about zayn, but i think i'm reluctant because saturdays has a more childhood tinge to it and i think it's about a friend he used to have as a kid but doesn't anymore (thinking it's stan but i definitely could be wrong). it just gives me the vibes of going to the park on a saturday, sitting on the swings and chatting about all your big dreams and your identity and being from a small town and how you can't really truly be out and open and having this monumental conversation while knowing that you need to go back and get ready for the next week and what it brings and telling each other that if nothing, at least we'll have saturdays. but then years laters you're moved out and you don't even have those saturdays.

while on the other hand with chicago, it has the bittersweet tinge to it. it addresses themes like regret and wistfulness and it talks about wanting this person back in your life but there's always something holding you back and realising your own role in this distant-ness. it's about wondering what this person, who you shared so much of your life with, is doing without you and how they're getting by. because this person knew you so well and you knew them so well that you want to hear about their life straight from them instead of other sources because you know what the truth is. and it also ties up with how both zayn and louis have sort of expressed themselves in the past few years about that friendship and how they know they could've done things differently now, but also know that they still would've done what they did in the first place. and now it's just too late (or it's what they think) to fix it because their lives are so so different and they've been through so much so where and how do you even start circling back to each other? so you just sit and wonder about the could've beens and hope that the other person is doing okay and that you're always thinking about them because there's still so much left to say.

saturdays is a song about lost friendship but you've already accepted that because maybe you just grew apart or lost touch or became distant and somewhere deep inside you know that if you rang them up, they'll pick up your call. chicago is also about a lost friendship that's filled so much with grief and pain and wishful thinking and wanting to reunite with this person but you don't know how because you think it's too late because it's not that you lost touch it's because for a minute there, you sort of let this person go and neither of you fought for it or convinced yourself that you're better off without them only to realise much later on that you were so so wrong. chicago is also about this person who meant so much to you, who taught you so much, helped you be yourself, accepted you for who you are, indulged you, and now that they're gone you still remember it all and you're grateful and glad that at some point your paths crossed and now finally you're brave enough to talk about it and admit that yes there was a point when you thought you needed this person or you'd crumble but in their own way they taught you how to not need them, or anyone, and to always count on yourself and you're so grateful they taught you that and you just want to thank them for it but you just. can't.

[cpd-55055]

I think upstead fans were more worried about Gwen’s interview comments post/pre episode not about the episode itself. She just said some pretty inflammatory stuff (likely to just get clicks) so that got people riled up

Ahhh.... I read those articles. But here is the thing. After 9x09, Gwen said in one of her interviews that there will be plenty more Upstead in the remainder of the season. And we basically got nothing (and I'm still bitter about that). She said during the S10 premiere interviews that the tension between Hailey and Voight will continue. But it seems like Voight and Hailey have moved past that whole situation. She said Voight will continue to deal with Anna's death throughout the season. Still nothing. She said last season that Kevin is getting a love interest finally, and we all know how that ended.

At this point, I wouldn't believe anything said in interviews until it actually happens on the show. And from what I read, Gwen never said that Upstead is over. She said that Hailey will have to deal with the situation now that her distraction is over. That could mean a lot of things. Maybe she realizes she wants a fresh start after the traumatic few years she has had. Maybe she decides to be patient and wait till Jay gets home to make a decision about their future. We won't know until it actually happens.

I still think Upstead will be fine. This next half of the season will be even tough for Hailey, but I think she will get through it. And if you ever start to lose hope, rewatch the ending 10x03 scene with Hailey and Jay. I don't think that scene would have been written that way if it was the actual end.

[thelastattempt]

Chicago

This starts with an acoustic guitar, really stripped back. Louis uses this technique throughout Walls, and it tends to be on his most hard-hitting lyrical moments. 

The vocals enter this song quite early, hardly any intro, and I think that’s because he had a lot to say here. And the title; I do think it’s a purposeful choice for whatever Chicago means to the songwriter, but we’ll never know why unless Louis chooses to tell us so I’m not going to dwell. 

Saw you had a baby  Did you use any of the names we liked?

I do think this is a weird thing to be asking an ex - Did you use any of the names we hypothetically discussed when we were together? - and for this reason, I lean towards the idea that Chicago isn’t about a lost love at all, but about another relationship entirely. People may discuss baby names with their friends, when the subject crops up, when they’re lounging. Maybe? There are romantic notes here, but I don’t find them convincing.  And is your brother doing okay? Is he still getting out of fights?  I’m sorry that your mum don’t like me, I’m sorry that I brought that on myself  The theme of clarity and taking responsibility where it both is and isn’t due is prevalent in Louis’ work, and this is another example - He is taking responsibility for what happened, but I do think there’s movement here. He’s not saying it’s entirely his fault, I think it’s an acknowledgement that in this persons story, he wouldn’t have been a good guy, but that doesn’t make him a bad guy in general. 

I think it’s interesting to note that the speaker is discussing this from a distance. And the way it’s paired; the baby the singer has clearly only heard about, sat next to the brother he has personal knowledge of. Something he knew from a past life, next to something that’s newer in the subjects new life, a life the speaker isn’t a part of anymore. 

They say bitter ends turn sweet in time  Is that true for yours and mine? 

This is the theme of the album - shit happens, but maybe something good can come out of it; has it come out of it yet? Are we there yet? It’s a question that I don’t think the singer is ready to answer, otherwise it would have been worded as a certainty. 

‘Cause if you’re lonely in Chicago, You can call me, baby 

You can call me, not that you will, not that you should, not that there’s even the slightest hint of expectation. But that you can. You can. 

Has it been long enough that you can forgive me?  Just because it didn’t work, doesn’t mean it’s meaningless to me

Now, I know, I know. This sounds sappy as fuck, it sounds like a romantic love, but I’m still not convinced. I think this is one of those songs that have been dressed up as a love song because it’s easier to digest that way. But okay, let’s say it’s a romantic love that didn’t end great, and the singer is opening up that door for communication again; the singer isn’t actually approaching whoever they’re calling ‘baby’, they’re not going for it, they’re just telepathically putting the vibes out there.  

I think this resonates harder if you do think of a friend, someone that you shared everything with, that was a massive part of your life until they suddenly aren’t. And you can’t call them anymore, because too much happened, and too much was said, but you hope they know that if they needed anything, if they’re low, that you wouldn’t turn them away. You hope they know that your time wasn’t ‘meaningless’. 

It just wasn’t meant to be 

There’s no blame here in this line; it wasn’t the singer’s fault, it wasn’t subjects fault, it was the universe, it was predestined, let the blame go. 

Have you seen how my life been goin’?  Cause I’ve been wondering what you’d say  Would you have told me to keep goin’?  Or would you say to walk away? 

The singers been keeping tabs on them, have they been keeping tabs on the singer too? Do they still care? And if they did still care, what advice would they give him? It strikes me as a conversation with someone that already knows so much, someone who has an opinion the singer values. 

This is also very reminiscent of the journey theme throughout the album. In this song especially with the way the music is paced; it’s a step, by step, by step of a beat that doesn’t really change until the end.

You always made me feel much better  And I’ll always be grateful for that 

This is so melancholy, it’s in the past tense. This relationship is in the past, and despite this song, there’s not much hope that ‘baby’ will ever call. 

CHORUS

I didn’t have to search cause I still know your number  I bet that you didn’t think that I’d remember 

For me this goes two ways: - 

A) This was before everyone and their aunt had a smart phone, back when memorising numbers was actually a thing people did. But because of the life Louis leads and his need to change his phone or have multiple phones, it seems logical that the people in his life wouldn’t have the same number over a long period of time, making this useless knowledge. 

B) Much more likely to me is that he doesn’t literally know their number; but he knows them. He doesn’t have to search for that feeling they give him, because he knows them, and they know him. He’s got their number. He remembers. 

I think there’s also acknowledgement here that the singer puts on a good show ‘I bet you didn’t think that I’d remember’ because I’ve moved on and we’ve moved apart, and you wouldn’t know it by looking, but I lived it and I know and I remember. 

It just wasn’t meant to be  It just wasn’t meant to be  No, it just wasn’t meant to be  It just wasn’t meant to be 

There’s no blame here. Repetitive. I don’t blame you, do you still blame me? I don’t think it was anyone’s fault. 

The way the music breaks down here; it’s almost joyous which creates as dissonance from the lyrics, but seems cathartic. These words need to be said. The strings emphasis that.   

I didn’t have to search ‘cause I still know your number I bet sometimes you still like to wear my jumper 

I like this line so much, but it does feel like it’s leaning on that romantic interpretation and ‘jumper’ just sat well with ‘number’. But let’s say that it’s not a rhythmic choice; I think it’s another question. Do you hold onto this like I do? Do you wear my jumper? Do you wear our past? I bet you do. 

And that — my heart. I imagine for someone so nostalgic it’s impossible to imagine that someone with such a big impact in your life wouldn’t tread over old ground in their private time too. 

The fade out at the end of this song has me in a chokehold - It makes sure that it still doesn’t feel resolved. It’s reaching, tendrils from the last vocal, until it fades into nothing. It’s almost ‘ball in your court’, but the singer hasn’t actually done anything to move this relationship forward at all. 

CLIFF NOTES:- Romantic or platonic, this relationship meant a lot to the songwriter, he hope they know they can lean on him if they need to but he won’t be reaching out and he doesn’t really expect them to either, he hopes they think about their past positively, but if they blame him and if everyone else in their new life blames him too, he can accept that. It just wasn’t meant to be. 

[thewingedwolf]

listen if u explain the reference to paris hilton with the chuck taylors as being a great example of using an anachronism to say something about both the past and the present, but then don’t explain the MUSICAL REFERENCES to lily allen & avril lavigne’s MUSIC in a MUSICAL and how that might be making a comment on both our current culture and history than i think maybe you just don’t really listen to musicals much and that’s fine but maybe preface it with “i understand i’m the baby and you’re socrates in that meme” so i don’t have to STEW OVER IT for DAYS ON END.

[twopoppies]

Hiii :) what do you think of the interpretation that Chicago is about Zayn?

Hi darling. I’ve answered this a few times already. In my opinion, Chicago isn’t about anyone in particular. I think it’s just a theme he wanted to tackle, so he wrote a song with a couple of people, and that’s what they came up with. He’s made it very clear that this album is a lot less autobiographical than Walls, and I think people are barking up the wrong tree trying to assign a deeper meaning to this song.

[imthefailedartist]

The number of dreams I have in which I am naked or half dressed in public is out of pocket.

I hate it. Every time it happens, I can feel real me panicking in my sleep. Dream me never finds any clothes, just a towel (like last night's dream) or a too small something.

Every time, it feels so real even though I'm dreaming, and I know I'm dreaming. These are the only dreams I have where I'm not lucid dreaming. I am fully aware it's a dream, but I can't do anything about it.

I will say last night's had a better ending than most of them. I eventually stopped panicking, wore the towel top, saved the world, got flirted with by a guy I knew from high school, and got free wings. Normally, I spend the entire dream trying and failing to cover myself.

Last night, I was thankfully wearing pants, a cousin had a towel, I tucked underneath my arms, then having to walk through dream chicago with a majority of my family after I decided to go to dinner with them instead of traveling around by myself like I usually do. Then I got to the restaurant and decided to go to the more relaxed pub food section of the restaurant. Also, I was a former Power Ranger and was fighting 3 evil original toy versions of Optimus Prime. This whole dream was wild. People were being tricked into using open restaurant public compost toilets. While off-brand and nice, Irina and Micah from Love Is Blind, and I found the real bathroom and had a good crack up.

[builtyouahousefromabrokenhome]

"It's mostly ... it's half theoretical, imaginative, and half based on real events, let me put it like that.”

- Louis about Chicago on 102.7KIISFM

That would fit with the theory that parts of the song are about Jay, and maybe specifically about the time when she was very ill and Louis was in Chicago (and/or stunting with someone from Chicago ^^), and presumably couldn’t be with her although he would have wanted to. But it’s written as a fictional supportive message to an ex (who is a lonely single mom ... or parent, since it’s gender neutral :3). 

Obviously we can only speculate on the specifics, but clearly there is something real in the song, that’s important and emotional to him, the way he speaks about it.

[insanethrottlebikernews]

Debunking the Myth: Chicago Outlaws MC and Chicago Mob Collaboration

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