#cc!tommy critical

[cloffmoff]

been working on this for a little bit and thought ‘tumblr would like it!’ so here you guys go, happy birthday c!tommy the favorite character ever <33 im nowhere near an animator lol, just some guy with inspiration and flipaclip

[barzfrommarz]

thought i’ve had recently but why don’t we just let people be apologists for whatever dsmp character they want? Why is it such an issue and why do some people automatically accuse anyone who says they are apologist for c!dream of supporting irl child abuse?? Like you do realize the dsmp is fictional and some of the people you could be accusing this of could actually be victims of abuse themselves and this could really be hurtful to say. I don’t like c!dream apologist either but that’s because I think their takes are bad, not because i’m assuming they support child abuse because of a fictional character they like.

[empiressmp]

So you wanna know what's going on with dream?

Here is your crash course so you can enjoy the nonsense with all of us, this is super high speed so I am missing a fair bit but if I miss anything that you think is vitally important to the context of this drama please add it!!

Background context: dream and quackity had the same idea for a server, a multilingual server with live translation, they announced them at the same time, quackity ignored dream and dream had a breakdown, Tommy made a video making fun of youtubers where he made fun of dream, dream dm'd Tommy's mother on twitter because she was fighting with his stans.

Also: After Dream's face reveal several people accused him of grooming, Dream put these rumours to bed very succinctly in a video, however people continue to joke that he's a nonce including Tommy's best friends Jack Manifold and AverageHarry.

Okay so onto the drama:

Tommy and Jack make a podcast, Tommy says that the person he disliked meeting the most in 2024 was Mizkif, Mizkif responds, XQC butts in and says Tommy is cringe, Tommy says XQC is cringe XQC says Tommy is cringe, Dream replies with this, unprompted.

Nobody liked that.png

Dream makes and deletes a Reddit post where he says he doesn't get why everyone thinks it's okay when gumball called him slurs but now he can't say slurs, he also says Tommy is spineless:

Tubbo responds, says you shouldn't say slurs, defends Tommy and shares that he dislikes dream because he dmed Tommy's mum when they weren't friends and he facilitated inappropriate behaviour in the dsmp discord and he is a very toxic friend

Dream responds in a 3 hour stream where he:

doesnt apologise for saying a slur

yells about quackity for ages

cherry picks tubbos criticisms of him to make tubbo seem unreasonable

Claims he made no money on the dsmp (??)

sends weird shots at HannahxxRose, Aimsey, and Caitibugzz*, while saying he is opposed to naming people with unfounded rumours

Says people hate him because he played the villain on the dsmp?????

reveals he called a friend of ludwig a whore (unprompted)

reveals that porn was shared in the dsmp discord around MINORS

He's very upset that Tommy and his friends have continued to make jokes that he is a groomer.

deflects all criticism and plays the victim

* Caitibugzz is the person that George groped when she was 18 and drunk and he was 26.

Tommy responds with a 5 minute video saying: don't say slurs, you're a man child who demanded credit for everyone else's success, you're a misogynist, and you need to get a life.

Tubbo responds to the live stream with a 6 hour live stream where he slowly goes insane watching Dream absolutely lose it, he makes a lot of arguments here but honestly it's mostly just debunking wording and correcting statements, Tubbo is genuinely very mature and he only loses it a little bit.

Dream makes a 9 minute video response to Tommy where he claims Tommy is running and editor sweatshop where he doesn't pay his editors, and that Tommy did child slave labour for his merch. He also says he has no idea why Tommy thinks he's misogynistic.

Ludwig mentions the drama in a clip and says that he doesn't like dream cause dream called his friend a whore, then when confronted sent a 5 paragraph message defending himself, but the entire message was about a DIFFERENT GIRL HE CALLED A WHORE

Tubbo responds to Dreams video where he reveals:

Dream is talking about the merch situation because he knows for a fact no cc's involved can legally discuss it so he could get away with saying whatever he wanted, however when claiming that the merch company scammed Tommy's followers and friends he uses screenshots of invoices that were actually from a weekend tubbo and some friends spent in LA, where tubbo rented a mansion and a fancy car, and dream doesn't know this because he was using the screenshots without any actual context because he is entirely clueless on the facts of the situation.

And: all of Tommy's editors have formed an Avengers team to say "no actually he pays us great" and the only screenshots used in the video to claim he doesn't are actually 2 from Jack Manifold (who paid a new editor $50 because they didn't know what rates to charge) and 1 which was actually talking about Corpse which he maliciously cropped to hide that immediately after saying "he was talking about maybe using fans to do a rough cut to save time" said "he didn't"

Tubbo also reiterated that Dream has a history of misogyny but from this drama ALONE he has: called two women whores, called out only women/fem presenting people with unfounded claims while supposedly being against that, and entirely downplayed, made jokes about, and ignored any criticism about the fact that his best friend sexually assaulted someone.

Today dream and tubbo will discuss this on call live and then god help us we may be free

Someone end the fucking party.

[the-cockroach-that-survived]

This is kinda a “we’ve known” take for this community and it isn’t relevant to anything actively happening (except just yk. The never ending Dream slander) but lowkey it’s crazy to me that saying “people’s perception of c!Dream, especially with c!Tommy, absolutely affected how people view cc!Dream” like isn’t even a crazy thing to say. Like it’s literally true. Isn’t that crazy. That’s crazy. It makes me feel crazy. Like how do people lack such critical thinking skills

[deepcoraldragon]

Ccs publicly supporting Tommy & Tubbo and/or against Dream: a condensed list

A few days ago, I started a masterlist compiling every content creator (and other notable figures in the community) that I could find who reacted to the Dream-calls-inniters-the-r-slur-and-subsequent-crashout incident.

But since I updated the list in real time as new people reacted, and since I tried to include at least one (1) screenshot per person, it got messy and very long to scroll through. So here’s the organized, clean, final-ish version

Note 1: Take the categories with a grain of salt because I had to sort A Lot of different reactions from different contexts in like… less than 10 boxes. Which I failed at, by the way, there's 12. The "against Dream" category in particular has a big spectrum from jokey to serious. To know what people specifically said, refer to the other list, it has screenshots for almost everyone, or message me.

Note 2: this is wayyy more ccs than I could reasonably keep tabs on, so keep in mind people might've discussed the situation more than I was aware of, or generally could be in a different category. Also, reminder that this is only about what they said/did publicly from January 10th to 20th. Here goes

Directly and specifically discussed the situation

Tubbo (duh)

Sneegsnag

Ludwig

Robbo

AverageHarry

Purpled

Jack

In support of T&T and against Dream

MaxGGs

Aimsey

Bitzel

Dean Withers

Snifferish

Kara Corvus (I think)

Seapeekay

Jameskii

SophieTexas

ConnorEatsPants

Molly (melinks)

Yammy

Scott Smajor

Mysticat

CoyPiso

Pokimane

Kaceytron

Nan_dre

Pangi

ItsZoil

Raegan Revord, aka SettingSunset

Shayy

Jonnayy

In support of T&T

Philza

Shelby Shubble

RosannaPansino

James Marriott

WadZee

Étoiles

JojoSolos

Izethetic

Billzo

Roscumber (to aimsey)

MythicalSausage (to aimsey)

Daniel Howell

Phil Lester

BBNO$

Spoke against Dream (critics, jokes, etc.)

Ranboo

Kwite

Krinios

Its_blarg

Michael McChill

tapL

a6d

Mithzan

KyleEff

CG5

Martyn Inthelittlewood

Camman18

MunchingBrotato

BoomerNA

Valkyrae

Saltydkdan

Winner of the idgaf war

Quackity

Joked about the situation

Roier

Deadlox

CaptainPuffy

Possibly Crumb

Derivakat promoted her music does that count?

Ba Sing Se update

The rat bot

Santa decides

Reaction videos

Adam McIntyre

Louis McClung

Omni

PyroLIVE

Ludwig’s ex-roommates and co-podcasters

Neutral / unclear / staying out of it

Welsknight

xBCrafted

HannahRose

Vikkstar

Badboyhalo

Soupforeloise

Unfollowed Dream

Joel smallishbeans

Jimmy (solidaritygaming)

CubFan

Lizzie (LDShadowlady)

Editors & co.

Larry (talentlacking)

Yahiamice

Lettucesandwich

ArchieMcW

PepsB

Connor (ne0neclipse)

NoGoodDavis

Connie (luvconnies)

Hunter-hhhh

Alyssa

Animagician

Vinni2003

Lily (spxcelily)

Kit (reinfalllz)

VC-david (VCTF_)

Rudy (Rudylmaolive)

Lurkers

Antfrost

Freddy Badlinu

Guqqie

Aypierre

EvanMcGaming

Kristin

Niki Nihachu (probably)

Jonnay

Fundy

VelvetIsCake

Sapnap

Im a Squid Kid

Captainsparklez

Fitmc

Firebreathman

Lee_500

CaptainPuffy

Bekyamon

Crumb cuptoast

Oli TheOrionSound

Owengejuicetv

Ollie Highkeyhateme

Krowfang

Michela

YoItsGold

Spideyarmy

Apokuna

Prezoh

[and several more people]

Not ccs

Sarah Simons (Tommy’s mom)

Aby Manifold (Jack’s dad)

Andi (andivmg, Punz’s ex)

Hannah (25hamjam, Sneeg’s wife)

I know I made the list but Wow that is a lot of people

Hopefully I didn't misspell anyone's name but at this point... This already took way too long. Thanks again to the people who sent me tips and insider info!

Once again, full post is here, hope you enjoyed, bye!

[bonesandthebees]

im confused sorry but why is everyone celebrating tommy, jack, and phil talking about dream that way?? im seeing a lot of mixed sides on them talking about this so im so sorry if you cant answer

oh boy anon uh. this is a bit like opening pandora's box ngl.

I don't know how much context to give but basically a very very pared down version is: back when the dsmp was in its heyday with cctommy being, yknow, 16 years old, there were some instances of interactions he and dream had that seemed off in certain ways, but given that us fans only saw the public thing + general fandom opinion of dream being very different at that time we generally tended to believe that the interactions were joking and friendly on all sides

over the years, as we've come to learn more about the person dream really is a lot of fans have looked back on these somewhat strange interactions with a more critical eye. specifically with the podcast clip I reblogged, tommy, jack, and phil were referring to a twitter interaction dream and tommy had back in 2021. tommy had made a dumb joke about dream, dream replied basically saying he made tommy's career and that tommy owed his success to him and even posted graphs of sub counts and stuff to prove his point?? I don't remember exactly what the reply was but it was along those lines and was strangely aggressive for an obvious joke tommy was making. so phil replied to dream with his own tweet basically saying "imagine taking credit for another creator's success because you helped guide them a bit" which was such an eloquent and simple takedown that the tweet has achieved somewhat legendary status in the fanbase lol

so yeah, in the podcast tommy, jack, and phil were talking about the behind the scenes of that whole thing basically revealing what most of us figured: tommy was joking and dream took it way too seriously and got aggressive publicly on twitter with someone who was ostensibly his friend, who he could've just dmed to clear things up. the reason phil jumped in is because tommy had dmed him at the time asking phil to help because he wasn't sure if dream was trying to joke as well or if he was genuinely pissed at him.

also on this podcast (which is a bonus episode only technically available on their paid patreon) tommy, jack, and phil all talked pretty openly about their true feelings regarding dream during that time and also now. basically, what phil and jack were both saying was there were a lot of red flags with dream's behavior back then with the way he treated the people around him. it's basically very cathartic for a lot of the fanbase to hear about this because we've all suspected for a long time there was a lot more animosity between cc's behind the scenes, especially after that spilled over to dream's public behavior on twitter.

sorry if that's not exactly coherent I am tired but I hope that explains things a bit

[bloodpen-to-paper]

Gonna throw my hat into the ring here, as someone who very recently had a streamer they loved and supported go down for serious allegations and crimes. Feel free to skip around my long ass response, I'll break it down into parts:

---Public Reception

Part of the reason I despise these situations is because people online don't ever know enough to make 100% accurate assessments, but will act like they do anyway (I don't care if its authoritarian, I want a bill where people on Twitter can't post about drama until after at least 5 minutes of being forced to critically think). Having said that, here's my opinions on how everything should go forward:

-Shelby shared her story in order to spread awareness on domestic abuse and the signs, so that others can read those signs and keep themselves safe (or leave an actively abusive situation they've been convincing themselves isn't that bad). That is the priority here, that is what people should be focusing on. If you make this situation about stirring drama with the other CCs, you're a dumbass and you need to stop posting. Give support to Shelby, uplift the voices of women like her sharing their stories, spread awareness on what domestic abuse can look like so everyone can learn, and wait for more information. Its that simple.

-CCs don't owe statements for conflicts they weren't involved in. Philza, Tommy, Quackity, Charlie, and other CCs close to Wilbur who aren't part of this don't owe you an explanation. They're people, they're most likely having to come to terms with the fact that a dear friend, someone who could've been like family, isn't who they thought he was. Have a fucking heart and cut it with the parasocial entitlement. I'm hoping Quackity will remove Wilbur from the Qsmp, but just like with Forever, he probably won't make a big announcement of it, and that's perfectly ok. I understand wanting to make sure you're not supporting a CC who would defend someone guilty of committing domestic abuse, but its still not your right to get anything from these people. If they share, they share. If not, then they don't. If you can't handle that, then leave.

-Having said the above, its worth noting that CCs aren't just a fun group of friends, they're coworkers. Much of what they say publicly and when they say it can be shaped or restricted by situations that can affect their careers or get them in legal trouble. You don't know these people personally or what goes on behind the scenes, its a network and you can't measure their responses the same way you would your own opinion piece. The CCs will always need to be careful about how they respond to an issue, and they will most likely respond in "safe" ways considering what's on the line. Not accusing anyone of anything, nor demonizing them for it, just something to keep in mind. They're human, but they're also working a job.

-If you have Lovejoy or Wilbur-related merch, DON'T THROW IT AWAY OR DESTROY IT. I've seen lots of people pointing out merch can be donated to thrift shops or shelters, and its more eco-friendly than burning or trashing. Remember, anything can be repurposed; a book, a hoodie, there's always someone who can find a use for it. Likewise if you want to keep your old merch, that's fine to. You can wear it if it brings you comfort, or if its something you just like the look of. As long as you're not supporting the source, you already have the merch so don't let people pressure you into thinking you're bad for keeping it if you're not ready to let go/throw away those $70.

---My Opinion Regarding His Response

Everyone and their cousin has been dogpiling on Wilbur's response (rightfully), but I think people online don't understand how public responses work when there's legal team and PR interference. The tweet for me had a weird lack of personal touch and emotion from the guy I've observed to be very personal in his writings, whether its his music or a community post about a life update (blah blah parasociality I know, but I'm letting you know the observations I've made of his behavior simply as someone who notices these things). He also never explicitly stated Shelby's name, rather saying "that person" (you even had the textbook 'black text on a blank white background' screenshotted response). Finally, there was a consistent standing on Wilbur 'not being aware of how the other person really felt' regarding his actions. What I'm trying to say is... y'all really gotta start putting two and two together. Its a textbook PR response. As in, I'd be surprised if Wilbur had over 50% involvement in making it because the wording is exactly how it reads when a response has been initiated by someone's lawyers rather than themselves. The reason he doesn't take more accountability and openly admit to having abused Shelby (other than the obvious public backlash) is probably cause his lawyers are banking on the feigning ignorance angle, that Wilbur didn't intentionally abuse Shelby and was ignorant to how his actions affected her. Its the best way to get him out of hot water on the legal side, because again, this isn't messy drama; its a genuine accusation of a crime. I don't think the response is tone deaf and unaware, I think its a deliberate and measured legal move not even fully created by Wilbur himself. This isn't to say I think he's innocent, but I do know that Shelby and others have brought up some serious accusations, and Wilbur is lawyering up as a result.

---Nuance

Prefacing this part by saying that things are not looking good for Wilbur in regards to what other CCs have brought up about him, and I fully believe and support Shelby, hence why I support that the community should start distancing from him and his work. But I would like to take this opportunity to look into the greater aspects at play. We are within a system that brings up men to do what they want without teaching them to be considerate and aware of the consequences. Men are taught their harmful behavior is perfectly fine, often at women's expense, which makes these situation a very different story depending on who's telling it. Its because of this that we need to critically analyze the system and how it causes men to turn out as they do, instead of giving an immediate opinion without any nuance.

There's a possibility that Wilbur is being genuine in not realizing how bad his actions were. There's a possibility he truly is a manipulative liar who knew exactly what he was doing. He could be a piece of shit. He could be genuinely trying to improve and do better. We don't know. I'd say its pretty cut and dry that he hurt Shelby, and for that I'm glad she's getting justice for herself and spreading awareness. But if we're to entertain the idea of redemption, we need to look at situations like these with nuance so that we can understand the "why". I'm not trying to justify Wilbur's actions or even give him the benefit of the doubt, I have no idea what's going on in that guy's head. I'm just putting this out there because its something I want everyone to think about, especially when it comes to topics regarding narcissism and mental health issues. Don't support him or Lovejoy, just keep something like this in mind for the future.

---The Community/Now Displaced Fans

To everyone who's immediately telling Wilbur's fans (the ones that don't support his actions and are actively mourning no longer being able to enjoy his stuff) to just listen to other music or move on, and who are celebrating each negative new thing that comes out about Wilbur's current status, sincerely, shut the fuck up. You are completely lacking in empathy or emotional intelligence, and what you're doing is the last thing the community needs. Wilbur and his work could have and for many did get fans through some of their hardest moments, and losing that wonderful sense of community you get from streamers and their work (especially with the roleplay stuff) is awful. It fucked me up losing that after almost a year, for some of his fans its been even longer.

If you're a (former) fan of his, its ok to feel like shit. We're human, we get attached and we grieve losing something like this because that's how capable we are of loving. Take your time, as long as you know where to stand (supporting Shelby and raising awareness on domestic abuse), you're doing good. You can keep enjoying his characters and work and making content about it, separating the art from the artist (though don't stream his music from platforms that would give him the money, find a way to pirate it).

This sucks. I feel it as a casual fan who was once hugely into his content, I can imagine what its like for those who were huge supporters all the way up until now. You didn't do anything wrong supporting someone you thought was a good person, its just a thing that happens and its so fucking shitty. You ain't alone though, I know some of you have that knee-jerk reaction to avoid anything to do with him but reaching out to others in the community and actually processing it all is way better, you won't be bottling it all up. Don't be afraid to continue engaging with this part of your life until you're ready to move on from it in your own time, and be kind to yourself. From someone who went through exactly what you are now, trust me, you'll get through it.

[aureumms]

Would love to hear your case on why goldenduo should be changed to neutral/negative on the DSMP wiki

thank you anon for the ask, i can now go apeshit since i have been freed from the “nobody asked for that” anxiety

so here we go (p.s., i am talking STRICTLY about c!, not cc!—they are separated here)

I’m gonna clarify two things:

First, this is literally just me yapping in a very unorganized manner, I am NOT demanding a change of the wiki, just giving my thoughts. I’m doing this just for fun, and am in no way shape or form criticizing the work of people who have spent hours upon hours making such a detailed wiki. It’s great.

Second, I am looking in between the lines for something invisible to the naked eye when there probably isn’t anything, but that’s the point. I’m like the guy you see on street corners holding up signs and spewing nonsense—I get it if you think this post will just be a huge nothing-burger of goldenboys yapping where I point at clips where they’re in the same frame and fall into a rant about the unconscious mind and its wants .

I’m gonna be honest when I say I don’t think c!Purpled technically disliked c!Tommy, even when they had their spats or whatever. Even in the earlier days when Tommy expressed disliking Purpled to his face, Purpled stated he did like Tommy. While this could be taken as sarcasm because Purpled was very sarcastic in the stream he and Tommy had a “group” for about an hour or two, I think it’s still worth nothing because Purpled is still serious at some points.

There are also some points where I believe Purpled wanted Tommy’s trust, or he didn’t want a stupid feud anymore. The first instance of this could be when Purpled was the only one who saw Tommy and Wilbur spying on the Manberg Festival, Oct. 16th 2020. Purpled saw Tommy and Wilbur, made direct eye contact with Tommy—but he didn’t snitch. He said nothing, and pretended like he saw nothing. (I so badly wished Purpled was streaming so we could have gotten his thoughts on that.) I’m also gonna make a point here that almost every instance where Purpled and Tommy fought, Purpled was almost never the initial instigator, he was merely fighting back since he felt threatened. I’m referring to when Tommy threw the first stab during the Manberg festival, and then Purpled eventually got a kill on him.

I’m gonna pick up with the Manberg vs. Pogtopia war + the Chaos War, where the info about their relationship on the wiki leaves Off. Like it states, Tommy did in fact mock Purpled for a few second because he defected to their side. And yeah, that happens—Tommy hits him a couple of times and mocks, repeating “i changed my mind” two or three times. But this doesn’t seem to really Affect Purpled. Sure, he defends himself, but he doesn’t seem too swayed since he isn’t kicked off of Pogtopia’s side. Points for that?

Here’s the thing that I’m not sure a lot of people noticed during the war though; Purpled basically made almost subconscious attempts to protect Tommy throughout. (Almost none of the clips I am going to talk about are linked in the wiki, so at the END of this post I will have a master video posted so you can look at every clip I am talking about.) The Manberg vs Pogtopia war is a TREASURE trove for these clips. First, (making a stretch here,) when everyone is surrounding Dream to get info out of him, Purpled jumps to Tommy’s side and has a bow out, pointed at Dream. He also says “thanks” when Tommy calls the rest of them cool looking, which made me cheer !

Purpled also at one point expresses he’s worried about if he made the right decision, and if he made the right decision too late, RIGHT before looking at Tommy. To me this says that he’s worried he isn’t gonna be taken seriously by Pogtopia’s side since he is a Manberg defector, and he still wants a positive relationship with Tommy. What a yearner /j

Before L’Manberg is blown to literal bits, while everyone is expressing their confusion—mostly about Philza joining and Wilbur being M.I.A—Tommy is attempting to fight Technoblade on the roof and nobody notices it. Except Purpled. He literally zooms in on Tommy on the roof, runs closer to the building he’s on, and throws two enderpearls, saying “Are we just all going to ignore that?” Before you say that he could be referring to Phil joining, that likely is not the case considering MULTIPLE people referenced Philza joining in the previous moments. Purpled is focused on Tommy and Technoblade. Focused on helping TOMMY. When Purpled eventually does teleport up and sees Tommy is no longer up on the roof and therefore no longer in immediate danger, Purpled backs off from Technoblade.

Later, when Techno has a crossbow to Tommy and Tubbo after L’Manberg has been blown up, Purpled pulls out an AXE and slowly but very surely makes his way over to Tommy’s side, like he is ready to attack Techno if he decides to shoot Tommy or Tubbo. (Neighborsduo AND Clingyduo mention) Unconscious mind folks UNCONSCIOUS MIND.

Okay, timeskip time ! I want to make a point by saying I think there was like. a flip in their perspectives. Purpled becomes the one who wants nothing to do with the possibility of a friendship, Tommy seems indifferent to the idea and/or pities Purpled + still teases him.

Post-Wilbur Revival, Tommy and Wilbur are strolling the main path when Wilbur points out Purpled’s destroyed UFO. Tommy is immediately confused and expresses that the UFO being destroyed “isn’t very right.” While Wilbur goes on about “someone’s been a copycat,” Tommy is still showing remorse and pity over the fact Purpled’s UFO has been destroyed. In fact, he says nothing negative about Purpled, and even says that the UFO was one of the staple builds of the DSMP—saying it’s “shit” that it’s been destroyed.

Now to the stream where Tommy visits Las Nevadas, WITHOUT Wilbur (for clarification.) Who knows how long it’s been since Tommy and Purpled have even spotted each other by this point. It has to have been a while, because Tommy seems delighted at the fact he’s seen Purpled again, saying “I haven’t seen this man in a fuckin’…” (he trails off.) Now while Tommy does steal two ender pearls, and Purpled punches him, Purpled doesn’t make a point to persist after Tommy throws a pearl. I think that this could add to the Neutral/Negative aspect, since while there is teasing/slight conflict, there is no ill feelings. At least on Tommy’s end, since we don’t have Purpled’s POV.

That’s all I have. Now: The clips! Thank you for reading this.

[Video time: 2:22]

[shadows-discourse]

Look, all the info I'm getting is second hand from those who listened to the podcast and third hand from those who spoke with those who listened I'll admit but

From what I'm gathering all I see was revealed was "Dream was rude" and "Tommy had to remind himself to not be awful to Dream", both if which... Aren't news?

Dream was rude. Like 90% of that server was rude to each other. This isn't like some big revelation. That’s what happens when you get a bunch of people who most are in the range of 16-25 in age and few even knew each other beforehand. This isn’t new.

And did we all forget that Tommy had to be told by others as well as Dream himself to cool it with the insulting jokes? That he took the jokes too far? Like I remember back in 2020-2021 Wilbur, Tubbo, and BadBoyHalo all had to tell him as well that he was taking things too far.

I also read somewhere that in that same podcast Tommy admitted to ignoring Tubbo's safeword that basically said "hey the jokes at my expense aren't funny anymore" because he thought it was funny? I am definitely taking that with a bigger grain of salt than the rest but yeah.

(Also what Jack said of Dream taking credit for everything contributed to the server is literally verifiably false. He made one joke matching energy with what Tommy said, likely as a joke, and ig Jack and Tommy decided that was serious)

This doesn’t strike me as a “Dream was awful to everyone and overly sensitive” as much as it does “Tommy realized he made a few mistakes but wasn’t the only one”.

I feel Tommy and Jack need to do like everyone else did who mostly/completely cut ties and just not talk about it anymore

Again, I haven’t listened. I could be wrong. I just feel we need another viewpoint on this topic than just that of obvious Dream antis here on Tumblr…

(Note: I have become mostly neutral/uncaring on most CCs from the DSMP. This is about critical thinking and not automatically having knee-jerk reactions to things and not about defending or attacking anyone who can defend themselves or doesn’t deserve being attacked. Even if conveying that is hard for me.)

[dansemacabre]

every so often (especially in october) i remember the cricket crew halloween stream and i stop in my tracks in shock and horror. i really do not like talking about ccs as their irl selves in a critical sense (when they’re obviously not in their Youtuber Voice Mode and something is visibly A Bit Off) but yall what the FUCK was that about. literally daisy jones and the six last concert before the band split up levels of what the fuck. the 1997 silver springs performance of the dsmp mcyt fandom. lore so layered it could be considered a complex multicellular organism. im so fucking genuine and serious in my real human life i will actually genuinely stop doing tasks to think about the cricket crew halloween stream. was it all a bit? was none of it a bit? which parts were bits? whose idea was it? what did they all expect to happen? what the fuck was up with tommy and the mud shit? why did the group never speak again??? and like i don’t even think this is a parasocial thing i don’t fuck w half of the ccs on that stream but as someone who is confounded by human connection and any large group gathering i desperately need need to dissect that entire situation. we could all be cricket crewed one day. i must to be ready

[pmonarch96]

(If I don't specify between cc and character, i am either talking about both or I'm unsure whether something was ooc or not)

I've beeen catching up on VODs, and I was watching Owen's pov of the ball, and it's interesting seeing how chats treat certain actions

Like Owen made a comment while muted when Sneeg mentioned he doesn't mind working with the other factions aside from Owen, that he doesn't know how he's supposed to work with that. Some people in chat were criticizing sneeg for focusing too much on the logic behind the Keepers motives, a few chatters were taking that as one of tr!sneeg's faults. I agree somewhat.

Sneeg's focusing on how were the Snails a incentive to leveling up, or why create a red faction when the objective is working together. Owen responded while muted that maybe it's because it's a lore server, and that's just how it is. There are actual explanations to those things, I imagine Beky would've presented those if they were talking 1 on 1 instead of trying to have the group make a decision.

I started thinking on how Owen is supposed to deal with tr!Sneeg lorewise, it reminded on how cc!Owen tweeted a meme on how cc!Ros apparently didn't know that tr!Owen was spy , despite being there (she thought it was just an excuse to have him accept leaving, kinda like reframing a chore to make a kid do it). On the tweet he said that about yellow as a whole, probably because when tr!Ros mentioned that she didn't know he actually was a spy, Sneeg agreed with her. But what he meant was more that he was planing to disregard whatever information tr!Owen told them as spy, because tr!Sneeg does not trust him, effectively making it the same as if he weren't a spy.

But well, I think that while the way tr!Sneeg shuts down tr!Owen makes sense for his character, it is way less fun for cc!Owen. But I also think it makes for an interesting dynamic as well, so I'm selfishly more interested in seeing Owen trying to navigate it

It's also unfortunate when someone doesn't get their mannerisms, like i saw a chatter bothered about sneeg saying "whatever", taking it to mean that he doesn't care about the truth, when he usually says it when dropping the subject.

There's also something I noticed even back on DSMP, when the person speaking the most is not the POV you are watching, it can get very annoying/uncomfortable (I'm thinking on Techno and Tommy screaming at each other during Doomsday being very awkward on anyone else's pov, and on Sneeg's heckling during the speeches at the ball being funny on his pov, but kinda embarassing when Owen turns him down to hear the speeches properly).

[wildpeachfarm]

this reminds me explicitly of what drew me to being a dream team main in the first place. i’m the same age as tommy/tubbo/most of their friend group and i’m also from the uk so we were always at the same stage of education essentially. every day i’d wake up to go to school and i’d think ‘these people are my age and have millions already’ and of course i was jealous of that when i was younger but one day i woke up and thought ‘all of these people are going to freeze at this age if they make no move to better themselves’ they all dropped out, none of them have sought a higher education, and unsurprisingly i’ve watched the gap between our mindsets get bigger and bigger as i’ve carried on with my life. really most of the brighton ccs are eternally 16 and doomed to stay glued in that mindset until something happens that forces them to move forward because none of them are proactive enough to do it themselves.

oh I would absolutely agree I think especially with tommy's humor as of late it's very obvious they all stopped mentally maturing as soon as they got famous. I will die on the hill that highschool/college/job life experience matures you in unfathomable ways that are so crucial to being a functioning member of society and having critical thinking skills. Considering the uk group is lacking in most of those experiences, it's obvious why they are acting like children all the time.

[narcissusinvain]

a teeny rant about dream again

look man i've been transported back to 2020, watching twitch and everything so I think i have to say something now that's bothered me since then

I'm not going to stand up and say that dream is evil (though i do severely dislike him) but the ignorance as to the power he has over other ccs, ESPECIALLY those younger such as tommy and tubbo astounds me.

friendships with a larger age gap CAN work, even online, but the way dream went about it was either cruel or fucking idiotic man. At this point, dream has said multiple times how he helped tommy out, calling with him for hours to talk stats and youtube and dream smp, helping tommy out as best as he could.

as he's said time and time again he never expected anything back from it but I just don't understand how dream could think that all this help wouldn't create a fundamental power imbalance between them - dream DID at the very least try help (from what it seems like tommys been saying, unsure how good much of this advice was) tommy out loads! of course he's going to feel grateful!! tbh i might even feel a bit guilty!!

dream could make tiny tiny remarks, little jokes (as he perceives them) about how he's 'made tommy' or literally an off-handed comment about it, and of COURSE tommy would freak out about it! of COURSE he's going to be worried that dream really is holding a grudge!! dream had a shit ton of power, so of COURSE tommy would be scared of it.

While i can play devils advocate and acknowledge that it's entirely possible that dream saying that he made tommy popular is just a joke, i will never be able to look past the fact that dream never thought to affirm tommy made himself, or that he never seemingly addressed/find ways around this major power imbalance they had!!

idk. it's either a severe lack of empathy and any semblance of critical thinking OR it's straight up manipulation.

[modelbus]

I’m so sick idk if this is coherent at all. Enjoy some stupid fluff where you and Tommy simp for Chris Evans.

Pairing: Cc!Tommy x Gn!Reader (platonic)

Silly Simping

Your jaw drops.

Tommy laughs manically, you having been on a call with him. This was all his fault. All of it. He was the sole reason you were looking up shirtless guys, and maybe you shouldn't have clicked the first link, but fuck.

You weren't particularly vulgar, but there were a lot of words running through your head right now.

Tommy had been complaining about not getting a good photo during golden hour, a sentiment you deeply agreed with. That led to you screen sharing as you googled how to optimize golden hour, both trading suggestions. And then that led to searching photos of golden hour for inspiration. And it just so happened that one photo was of a shirtless guy.

You had casually remarked that most photos of shirtless guys looked weird, like they were trying too hard. He egged you on, telling you that you two could criticize all the guys on Google.

So you googled shirtless guys.

And yeah, the first few were funny, pointing out how the one guy was clearly trying to flex his muscles and how the other obviously tried too hard, because who does a handstand to flex? It wasn't body shaming, it was simply not understanding why people tried.

And then you landed on a photo of Chris Evans working out.

"As a man, I can say that there is not a single flaw in this photo." Tommy chokes out.

"Holy fucking shit. That's hot." You sputter.

"Amen. Look at that undisguised sweat, that's what I want in the photo industry. Not any of that fake shit. Just pure, perfect-"

"-hot as fuck Evans?"

"What the hell." Dream says, voice projecting his panic.

Tommy did not erupt into laughter this time. Instead, his eyes go wide with shock and he freezes. Why, oh why, did you have to have your cameras on?

You flush bright red, your jaw that was dropped closing.

"Dream, Dream I can explain—"

"What are you screen sharing?"

In your panic, you click to move to the next picture.

The next picture is Sapnap.

Tommy screams, and you do too, trying to close your tab with frantic clicking.

"WHAT THE HELL?!" This time, Dream is even more panicked.

"No! I swear we weren't calling Sapnap hot!"

"We're not lying!" Tommy adds. "We were talking about Chris Evans."

"I mean, have you seen the man?" You can't help but ask.

"Mhm! Mhm!"

"His wife ain't bad either."

"Wait, who is his wife?" A pause. "Oh, they're such a power couple."

"Yeah, have you found the photo of them at that charity ball yet?"

"Charity... ball... fuck. I think my sexuality just changed for Chris Evans."

"Amen."

"Guys." Dream sighs.

You both shut up.

"I'm- Sapnap just heard that entire thing." Dream tells you.

"Fuck." You both say in unison.

"He- Goddammit he wants to see the photos."

"I'm already sending them to him."

In the background you can hear Sapnap say "oh, he is hot."

"SAPNAP!"

[lasnevadaslaborunion]

I think part of why I'm a little bit softer towards Quackity's finale, or simply unsure of how to criticize it, is that, perhaps more than any other ending we've seen, the meta elements are... very difficult to ignore.

DSMP was a roleplay server. Even at its most highly produced and pre-written, it was still a roleplay server. Moreover, it was a roleplay in which all of the characters shared a name with their player, the lines between the fiction and the OOC friendships were frequently blurred, and very few people had much if any experience with roleplay and its associated pitfalls such as the dreaded "character bleed." That is an environment ripe for joy and excitement. It's also an environment rife with turbulence and wounded feelings.

So, the first thing is that this doesn't just represent an ending for c!Quackity, it represents closing a chapter in cc!Quackity's career. When he got the chance to stream in his native language without fear of being judged or mocked for it, k!Quackity was born. When he embarked on a project that reconciled his two audiences, there was q!Quackity. c!Quackity was a storytelling triumph as far as MCYT goes, but where was he to go next?

On a narrative level, I find it interesting that the two survivors, and the traits portrayed that helped them decide to continue living, represent what were once c!Quackity's best traits - k!Quackity's determination and sense of justice, and q!Quackity's love and desire to connect with others. Combined with c!Slime's parting words of "Thank you for teaching me what it's like to be human," this might underscore a point that c!Quackity was ultimately a learning experience, both for the writer and the other characters. He might be gone, but he still left some positive impact. The ones who came after him chose not to continue a negative cycle.

However, the other snag here is... the other people. Yeah. No need for detail, you know who I mean. The controversies, the racism mentioned above, the legitimately awful treatment of those within and without the DSMP circle. A lot of us won't excuse the writing because of that. And I get it - we, the audience, can easily separate the story from the people behind it. If this were a film franchise or television show, it would be easy to replace the actors and move on. Not so in a roleplay. Not so when the actor and character have bled together so much.

I've got to get a little personal.

Within the last few months, I've dealt with a similar experience - someone who I frequently roleplayed with and who I considered a close friend became incredibly abusive to one of my other friends, to the point where he needed to be distanced from our lives and cut from future plots entirely. Logistically, that is a hard thing to deal with, especially when your character was closely entwined with theirs and dozens of others. But emotionally, it's even harder. You start questioning past interactions, wondering whether the signs were always there. You start noticing strange details in their writing that you know you might be reading too much into, but still make you sick to think about. In extreme cases, the thought of even playing your own character again becomes unbearable, because they were so clearly impacted by the choices of people you no longer want anything to do with.

I had an easier time adapting my character to the new course of events. My other friend, the one who had suffered his betrayal firsthand, nearly had her character disappear alongside his.

Sometimes, people cope with endings the way Tommy did. By saying, "No, I'm going to go back and end on a happy note, because my character deserves that, and the goodness was there." Sometimes, that just... doesn't feel possible. I really truly have to wonder if c!Quackity, for all the pride and care that was clearly taken in crafting his story, was just a holder of too many negative experiences and attributes for the writer to do anything but throw up one last cathartic hurrah and shelve him forever.

I'm not saying it was the ideal ending for c!Quackity. I'm not saying it was perfectly written, or that the absence of certain characters wasn't baffling or frustrating. I'm not even saying people aren't justified in hating how our favorite character's story concluded. Hell, I'm still not sure whether I like how brutal, how final, how bitterly tragic it was.

I'm just saying it's hard for me not to empathize.

[cdroloisms]

I think there is nothing weird about bringing back 21-22 discourse, cause there are a lot of people who still have very weird takes on c!vaultduo. Like, youtube recommended me some recently released (end of 2024) video analysis of dsmp with "lore-criticism" and I watched it purely out of interest, and it was so bad: author said that the torture in prison was a "narrative consequence" for c!Dream and praised c!whoreduo for avenging c!Tommy, they also added that prison conditions can be considered inhumane and usually they would criticize the media for not condemning such things, but PV is a whole different thing, since c!Dream chose such conditions himself for everyone except himself!! and they used c!Dream remaining silent while c!Sam scolded and victimblamed him as a "gotcha!! c!Sam is right!!", but these takes were pretty popular with c!sam apologists back in the day, what made me really laugh was when they said that originally, cc!Dream *intended* for his character to die at the hands of the people he hurt the most as revenge, and that list included c!whoreduo, BUT they added that they doubt c!Sam specifically would be capable of doing that, cause he is just so kind and not cruel at all!! You know, the guy who fantasized about c!Dream kneeling in front of him and crying isn't cruel enough to kill him haha what a clown...

you cant say this and not send the video man i miss c!sam apologists so bad