#byler sexuality

[pinksmonkey]

Posting my Ultimate Byler Evidence/Analysis List here directly because it probably makes it more convenient and I should have done this a while ago. XD

There is so much proof for Byler being endgame in S5 of Stranger Things. They are so cute together, and so much in the show has been building up to their relationship. I just wanted to share some of my favourite Byler analyses, because they are so cool, detailed, and in-depth. I love reading about all the hints, symbolism, and subtext for Byler, it's amazing how much thought must have been put into all these things. Why go through all the effort of adding these details if they aren't actually going anywhere with them? Mike is so queercoded, and they are truly in love with each other.

🫥 Just gonna leave some good Byler analyses here 🤐

Most of the links go to written Tumblr posts, and a couple of them are Reddit posts. So it's a lot of reading. If you prefer watching videos over reading, I highlighted my Byler YouTube playlist in green so it's easy to find.

And apologies for any of the links that aren't working, I know some of the posts have been deleted now sadly, but there's no way I'm re-numbering all these so I'm just leaving them in. My fellow Bylers, please stop deleting your amazing posts. ;-;

So anyway, here is the list of some of my favourite Byler evidence/analyses of all time (not in any particular order):

1. Mike's Season 4 Monologue To El

2. Camera Roll Byler Proof Part 3

3. Mike's Monologue and Milkvan

4. Mostly Byler Post Index

5. Dawson's Creek Parallel

6. "My Experience With Stranger Things"

7. What Ollie Learned From Film School

8. Byler Music Analysis

9. Why Don't The Duffers Discuss This?

10. ST Theories Masterpost

11. If Byler Isn't Endgame Then Someone Screwed Up

12. Byler Crumbs From The Cast and Crew

13. Favourite Combination of Endgame Byler Proof

14. I Doubt Byler Then I Remember This

15. The Fact That We Have This Interview

16. You Know Your Ship is Endgame When

17. Mostly Byler Post Index 2

18. Losing Hope Of Byler Endgame?

19. Why I Think Byler is Endgame

20. So Many Thoughts on This

21. Mike's Wall Art

22. Painting Miscommunication Leading to Mike's Monologue Coded

23. Yes, That Scene Did Foreshadow Mike's Monologue as Disingenuous

24. Mike's Monologue Didn't Sit Right With Me

25. Blue And Yellow Pen

26. That Tweet Is So Sweet

27. Heart Eyes, Literally

28. "My Process of Realizing Byler is Real"

29. Looking at Will, Not El

30. High School Musical Parallel

31. Said It Before and I'll Say It Again

32. Delusional Milkdud?

33. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 1

34. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 2

35. For When You Are Doubting Byler

36. Is Mike Bi or Gay?

37. Fully Convinced

38. The Ultimate Byler Playlist (my Byler YouTube playlist)

39. 100% Confident

40. Mike in S4 and S2

41. Mike Is Angry With Himself

42. It's Been A Year, Mike

43. Rink-O-Mania Remodel

44. The Development Of Will And Mike's Relationship

45. Mike's Lies

46. El Was Holding So Much In

47. Flickergate + Lettergate

48. Did Mike Ever Like El Romantically?

49. Mike Is Stupid

50. Byler Won't Write Itself

51. What's The Alternative Explanation?

52. Comparing Mileven and Byler

53. It Was Always About Them

54. Mike Is Not Ok

55. He Has A Love Interest

56. Will's Happy Ending

57. Trying To Be Normal

58. It's Not That Milevens Are Homophobic

59. Byler Is Reality

60. A Proper Look At El's Shrine To Mike

61. Mileven Through The Seasons

62. Suspicious

63. I Can't Doubt Byler

64. D&D Soulmates

65. Let's Talk Phones

66. Not Delusional

67. What Do They Want?

68. The Main Character

69. Mike's Mental Health

70. So Close

71. This Look Confirms Byler Isn't One Sided

72. Mileven Is Bones

73. They Don't Care About Mileven?

74. The Airport Hug Will Always Be Famous

75. The Monologue Mystery, Why Did They Lose?

76. The Cabin Scene

77. Why Couldn't Mike Say It For 2 Seasons?

78. He Was Trying To Find Will

79. Mike The Surfer Boy

80. Mike Definitely Shows Attraction To Girls

81. The Cast Knows

82. Mileven Loses On All Fronts

83. The Bouquet

84. 53 Minutes And 5 Seconds

85. Pink Panther

86. El And Choice

87. Will's Spotify Playlist

88. He'll Come Crawling Back To You, Begging For Forgiveness

89. Mike's Character Arc Prediction

90. It's The Same Look

91. Will's Truly Happy Ending

92. That's The Same Look, Right?

93. You're The Heart

94. Mike And El's Relationship In S4 Was Really Weird

95. Fireworks Parallel

96. Mileven Has Been Built Up For 4 Seasons

97. Not Stupid: The Fate of Mileven and Byler

98. This Suddenly Makes So Much Sense

99. Metaphors In Filmmaking

And unfortunately Tumblr will only let me add 100 links per post, so when I've posted part 2 of this list, I'll link it here: Part 2

[byler-invested]

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles x Stranger Things official comic

Be prepared, because… there’s…..….

A LOT.

> “11 o’clock” in focus for no reason (Eleven symbolizes Will’s closet, internalised homophobia, innocence, virginity).

> open yellow curtain (probably signifies Will coming out in s5).

> “theme for the day” (meaning this sequence is thematic of something: Will’s trauma and coming of age).

> “Do whatever you want. Go see Mike and the boys… it’s up to you” (this refers to the perceived freedom of Will coming out or starting his sexual life).

> “not a trick?” (It is a trick unfortunately…)

> “Nope. I’ll even be your chauffeur if you need me. That means I’ll drive.” (gay top subtext)

> “For once, freedom is on the other side of that door. And it’s all yours.” (!!! — someone coercing Will into the gay sexual lifestyle before he’s ready or in an unsafe manner).

> Eggos and maple syrup are Mike coded. But orange juice is NOT! Mike would drink and is associated to white milk. This is a subtle hint that something’s WRONG.

“Technical” meaning in s5 they will start to delve into the mythology of the series.

But also… sexual subtext.

> “Time to get a move on, kid. Go before I realize this is a huge mistake” (something or someone coercing Will into letting go of heteronormativity and virginity).

> “It won’t… open”, “Just give it a push. You get everything you’ve ever wanted and you’re going to let a door stop you? There you go. Put some muscle into it.” (clearly subtext about coming out and first sexual experience from a bottom’s perspective).

Dustin is Jonathan in s5 when he realizes Will is being manipulated/ coerced by some guy.

The alarmed/ surprised turtle on the right is Lucas.

Raph (on the left) is Mike— he’s PISSED. Jealous Mike absolutely CONFIRMED.

> “Most importantly… why does Stockman want to open a gate, and why do they need him hooked up to that machine, too?” Lucas is absolutely shocked that the top (it’s his former basketball teammate Chance) is into guys and that Will, of all people, would be into Chance.

> “There are no good reasons to open a gate. They’re always bad.” Jonathan is protective of his little brother to whom he also represents a father figure. To him, it can never be good that Will’s having a sexual experience.

> “Maybe that machine is using her powers against her?” Meaning Chance is a dark mirror/ foil of Mike and one of the made-up characters we’ve been talking about.

> “Where are you going, Raph?” Lucas is surprised that Mike is so pissed and already springing into action (he won’t have come out at this point).

> “I’m gonna do the rescuing!” White Knight paladin Mike moment.

> “You can’t pull Eleven out. The mind is fragile.” (Will is in a vulnerable situation).

> “Donny, relax. I wasn’t talking about rescuing the girl”. This is the writers telling us this is all a metaphor and they’re not talking about Eleven, but Byler. They even make a point of showing us a bunch of Byler and Mike-coded stuff in the next image: two crossed swords, a walkie-talkie, Mike’s backpack and a huge phallic object…

> Mike makes use of his coding/ programming skills (Alan Turing reference).

> “Well, the two of them are definitely linked”. Mike and Chance are linked in some way.

> “Wait, so this whole thing is designed to create a big illusion? To feed Eleven a lie?” The writers referring to their gigantic five season long straightbait but also, manifestation theory IKTR.

> “Only those inside can shut down the projection”. Like I suspected, the scientists fucked up and Brenner as the lab leader was probably the one who made this decision of ‘trapping’ everyone in the simulation. Also subtext for “only those in Will’s trust and heart can shut down his illusion” aka Mike.

> Nice reference to The Cabin in the Woods movie there in the first pic (heavily recommend).

> Mike doesn’t even ask anyone and just brutally storms in to interrupt whatever Will and Chance are doing.

> We could even infer that his extreme jealousy straight up brutally OUTS Mike, not only to the audience, but maybe also to other characters. He unintentionally crashes down his own closet…

> “That’s not your friend.” Mike telling Will this about Chance.

> The background changes to orange as the villain (Chance) loses his disguise/ farce.

> “Fine, I’ll gladly stop pretending to be this buffoon.” Chance stops pretending to be nice and/or is revealed to be a Vecna/ Mindflayer trap.

> “Like it or not… this place is mine”. Mike and Chance will fight and compete for Will.

Note: Chance is heavily associated with orange even in the show, because of being a Tiger in the basketball team.

TAKEAWAY:

Unfortunately, I think at some point in s5— besides the supernatural plotline— we are about to witness Will delve into real unhealthy coping mechanisms (prematurity, hypersexuality, low self-worth and/or drugs) and reliving the trauma with his father (attraction to unhealthy people, as Chance will remind Will of a mix of both Mike and Lonnie).

These are extremely common results of CSA in many people.

Jonathan, Lucas and especially Mike will save him.

There’s a lot more. I just picked some of the most incriminating pages lmfao. And I’ll leave you with this Paladin Mike bonus:

If you wanna read more ⬇️

masterpost:

part 1:

part 2:

[byler-invested]

LOVERSLAKEGATE. This one is very important.

I have lost count on how many gates we have. Someone pls tell me. From the beginning of vol 2 until now, how many have we created?

[gayofthefae]

Thinking about Mike, who is confirmed to not have liked girls before season 1.

Thinking about Mike, and the terrifying queer experience of standing right next to your straight friend who keeps being called gay, shaking, silent, terrified thinking, "They got the wrong one. Just don't draw attention to yourself."

Thinking about Mike, who in some ways was shielded by Will in that.

Thinking about Mike when Will went missing, and how without Will around to target it at, Troy took his homophobia to Mike. It was still about Will, but it was only a matter of time.

Thinking about Mike, just a kid, terrified of getting caught.

Thinking about Mike and the timing of it all.

[will80sbyers]

Look he might be bi or gay, I don't know for sure, but one thing I'm sure about Mike Wheeler is that HE doesn't know

[idksjdhshdhd]

When I’m bored, I like to giggle at the old YouTube comments on Will Byers’ sexuality

[byler-invested]

“No buts.” And then that shot of Mike in Cali checking out Will’s backside I’M—🫢😭

Re-watching the fourth season, you can see back in the first episode, a very funny and interesting detail.

The scene takes place in the first 15 minutes of season 4 episode 1. Nancy yells at Mike for being late, then we get to the most interesting part. Karen starts talking about how Mike needs to finish their hellclub game earlier to get to bed at 9pm because his flight is at 6am.

There's some dialog going on.

Karen: No buts. Nine or no California

Ted: And no sweetie pie.

After Ted's words, Mike has a confused look on his face. But why? Mike knows his dad isn't talking about his girlfriend El.

We remember that Ted and Karen don't know about El because in season one the government people came and told the family to stay away from the girl. I don't think Mike, Lucas or Dustin's parents know about El.

So then who could Ted be talking about if it's not El? Will. He was talking about Will. In season one, Ted threw phrases like, "our son with a girl?" which makes it clear that Ted's making homophobic comments about his son and he's probably thinking about his son dating his friend.

Also, the letters that come to Mike from Colifornia, the parents may think it's from Will, since they don't even know about Mike's girlfriend and only Will, in this case, in their eyes, sends Will to Mike in return.

+The pie is made mainly from fruit, but we remember what they call people who are gay.

I think this is another way of showing us that Byler exists and we didn't make it up.

[sp0o0kylights]

There were a lot of things Mike hated in life.

The demogorgon, and how it had essentially destroyed his life.

 Brenner, and the madhouse laboratory El had survived. 

How each and every one of his friends now did something weird--were weird, because flashing lights or fireworks or some stupid tune a toy horse played dragged up memories that made their eyes flat and faces hollow. 

Most of all though, Mike hated how much they relied on Steve.

There was no reason he should be the person to call when it started pouring and no one wanted to bike home from AV. 

Steve wasn’t Nancy, or Jonathan, or a parent--he wasn’t even dating anyone related to any of the Party anymore so what excuse did he have to keep hanging around? 

(Even if Jonathan was always working, and Nancy was always busy with some club or homework, and everyone’s parents all seemed to be in a race of who could get back to normal the fastest…) 

They should at least try to get a hold of other people, instead of constantly going to Steve first.

“Why?” Dusitn had scoffed at him the last time this had happened, feeding quarters into a phone and staring at Mike like he was the one being unreasonable. “I’m not gonna waste money just to hear your sister tell us no again when we all know Steve will do it.” 

Which was perhaps the most infuriating part of it all.

That Steve would do it. 

Show up and help them, even if he bitched the whole time. 

Hell, Steve Harrington knew more about Mike’s life offhand than Nancy did, and that made him want to punch a wall more days than it didn’t. Why the hell was Steve so involved? 

It was stupid. 

Weird, even! They weren’t friends, (even if Dustin and Max and El of all people said the opposite) he wasn’t being paid to babysit, (Mike had double checked; going round to ask Ma Henderson and Mrs. Sinclair, only to get an earful of how wonderful Steve was from both.) he had no reason to hang around! 

It didn’t make sense that Steve could be harassed into picking them up from school. 

Would take them to get ice cream, or hand over extra quarters for the arcade. He even gave out advice like some kind of--brother that Mike had never wanted. 

Above all?

Mike hated that when he needed someone, the number he punched in on automatic was Steve’s.

“I need you to come get me.” He said into the receiver, mad at himself and the world, but mostly mad that beyond the normal amount of squawking Steve did, he shut up and came. 

Drove up in his rich boy car, stepping out and herding Mike into it like the rain hadn’t already seeped into his bones. 

“You wanna tell me why you snuck into a bar two towns over?” Steve asked, long after Mike had slung himself into the passenger seat, arms crossed defensively over his chest.

“No.” 

One of Steve’s hands went right to his hair, running through it before adjusting the mess he’d just made. 

It was a nervous habit, and Mike hated that he knew that too. 

“Okay, well.” Steve’s hand fell back to the steering wheel, clenching tight around it. “Next time you want to do something dumb could you at least come talk to me about it beforehand?”

“What the hell would that do?” Mike bitched, staring firmly out of the window. 

“Not waste my gas for starters.” Steve bitched right back. “But I dunno man, we could have taken some bats and gone and wailed on cars in the junkyard and talked or some shit, not--whatever this all was.”

‘This all’ was accompanied by a wave of his hand, indicating not just the bar Mike had been standing in front of, but his general sopping wet state. 

“You’d actually go to the junkyard with me?” Mike challenged, doubtful. 

Steve made a face. “Did you lose your hearing in there? I just said--.” 

“Why?” Mike interrupted. “Why the fuck would you come out with me?”

Matching his entire aggressive tone, Steve said; “Because it’s better than trying to sneak into the one local gay bar when you’re barely fourteen, Michael.” 

And that? 

Steve being oddly aware of shit he really shouldn’t have?

Mike hated that too. 

“You knew what the bar was?” He asked, his voice coming out much smaller than he intended. 

“Everyone knows what that bar is, except it’s more of a biker bar than a gay bar.” Steve shot back--which did actually explain about ten different questions Mike had about the place. “Also, language you little shit.” 

Under his breath, Steve continued in a muttered; “I swear I’m going to start carrying around soap.”

“You cuss more than we do.” Mike responded, and if his own voice was a little strangled as he fought back the sudden swell of tears, then that was between him and God. 

He was not crying in front of Steve Harrington, he outright refused. 

“The point I’m making is that there are way better bars to sneak into. That one’s not nearly as welcoming as people make it out to be, probably because they’re sick of all the rumors.” 

Steve seemed to realize what he was implying because he quickly added; “Not that you should be sneaking into any bars at all!” 

“You’re not my mom.” Mike’s voice turned wet as he lost his battle with his throat, voice cracking as he failed to choke the tears back.  

“No shit Wheeler.”  Steve said, and at least he was good enough not to call attention to Mike’s crying. 

If he had, Mike was pretty sure he’d just up and die of embarrassment, right there. 

“I don’t get why you care.” He muttered, angrily swiping at his eyes. 

“I didn’t keep you alive this long just so you could die of something stupid.” Steve countered easily.

Which was kinda fair, if you thought about it.

Mike very much did not want to think about it. 

Any of it.

Ever. 

“Are you gonna tell my parents?” He asked after a painfully long moment. 

Long enough that Steve had begun fiddling with the radio, trying to find a station as they drove back that wasn’t wailing country or gospel music. 

“I’m not a narc, so no.”  

“Not about the bar.”  

Now Steve just looked confused. 

Probably because he was, because he was without a doubt the stupidest almost adult Mike knew. 

(Not that he could say that out loud--last time he had, Max had made one of her pissy faces and then El got mad because Max was, which led to a break up, which led to Mike having to beg his way back into his girlfriend’s good graces while explaining that he hadn’t meant it like that.

“How did you mean it then?” Max demanded, and Mike wasn’t sure how he managed to dodge that entire conversation but he had, on grounds that untangling his own emotions regarding stupid Steve made him want to pull his hair out and scream.) 

“What about then?” 

 “You know. Don’t make me say it.” Mike absolutely didn’t plead, even if it did sort of, kind of, sound like pleading. 

Steve flicked his eyes away from the road to give one long, weird look at Mike. The same one he gave Dustin when he went off on a rant about Cerebro or Lucas when he started discussing the stats of different D&D weapons. 

Unlike those times, Steve’s face cleared. 

“Oh.” He said, blinking, and Mike could practically see the light bulb flash above his head.

Then; 

“Nah.” 

Mike waited.

And waited.

And kept waiting as Steve went back to searching through radio channels, as if that was the end of the conversation.

It couldn't be the end of this conversation.

Not when this was the part that was eating Mike alive.

He didn’t know if this was Steve repressing it on purpose or if this was what he had to look forward to for the rest of his life if he kept trying to figure his own head out, but either way, he knew he had a choice to make. 

To let the unspoken part of today die quietly. Go unsaid, and remain unsaid, for all eternity--or he could let it out. 

Shove the “gay” part of “gay bar” in Steve’s stupid, jock face. 

Make him acknowledge it, even if it got Mike kicked out of the car, and who cared if it did? 

Steve wasn’t the person who should have picked him up anyway. 

The anger climbed higher and higher in his chest, tears and rage combining until Mike spat it all out, furious. 

“You’re not going to ask if I’m gay?”  

Steve didn’t turn to face him, but Mike saw his eyebrow cocking anyway, given how he was currently glaring a hole in the side of the older teen’s head. 

“Do you want me to?” 

“No.” Mike bit out automatically. “Yes. I don’t know!” 

Steve’s hand found its way back into his hair. 

“Okay then.” Steve paused, clearly fishing for something to say. 

Gleefully, Mike watched him struggle. 

“Do you like guys?” He managed finally, looking like he was navigating a minefield more than just talking.

“I don’t know.” Mike stressed, sinking lower in his seat. “Why do you think I was at the bar? I was trying to figure it out!” 

“Honestly I assumed this was some sort of stupid dare--but!” Steve held up a finger, before Mike could interrupt, “But let’s--shit, hold on, I had a speech for this but I kinda wasn’t expecting to use it this soon. Um.”

“You have a speech for me being gay?”

“Not for you.” Steve rolled his eyes. “For--in general! It was an in general, just in case speech!” 

He rounded on Mike, for longer than the younger was comfortable with given Steve took his eyes off the road to do it. “Okay--you can like boobies, you can like, uh--not boobies, and that’s fine! It’s all totally fine!” 

“You are not making it sound like it’s fine.” Mike said, feeling like he’d been taken out by hearing Steve say the word “boobies.” 

Gross, gross, gross. 

“Well it is.” Steve said, in a tone that felt like he was two seconds from adding in a smarmy ‘so there!’ at the end. 

“But I’m dating El.” Mike whined, which really, was both the heart of the matter and the eye of the storm that had been growing in his head for months now. “I can’t be gay if I like her.” 

“Don’t you guys break up and get together like four times a week?”

“No, that's Max and Lucas, El and I are stable.” Mike scoffed. “Or we--we were stable.” 

Before he started to have thoughts about people that weren't his girlfriend. 

Or women.

“Stable for being in middle school, sure.” Steve snorted. “You don’t just have to like one or the other you know. You can like dudes and chicks at the same time.”

Which Mike did not know, on account of being fourteen. 

He did his absolute damndest not to show that realization, instead adding that to the list of reasons why he hated Steve Harrington too.

Steve shouldn't be the one teaching him about who you could like!

“The point is that who you end up loving isn’t a problem.” Steve finally looked back to the road. “Other people might be an issue, and those people we can punch in the face so long as the cops aren’t looking, which isn’t part of the speech so let’s not tell people I said that part, but whatever you do choose, there’s nothing wrong with you.” 

Steve’s voice went firm, as he apparently recalled his speech or something close enough to it because his next words sounded a little rehearsed. “You have people who are here for you, no matter what. Okay?” 

Oh God, Mike was crying again. 

He wanted to punch Steve in his stupid face.

Wanted to hold onto the fury he'd built inside himself. Thrash around, throw himself out of the car, get away from the emotions that felt too big for his chest to contain. 

Instead he felt it all break on Steve's acceptance. On word's he didn't know he needed to hear until they'd been spoken, and sniffed out a quiet; “Okay.” 

Steve of course had to take it too far by reaching over and patting his knee, which they both regretted judging by how quickly Steve took his hand back and the face Mike made at his hand--but it…

It was appreciated, even amongst all Mike's rage.

Steve was appreciated. 

Not that Mike would ever, on pain of death, tell him that. 

Neither said a word for a while, Steve finally landing on a radio that was playing some Top 40 hit, Tears for Fears singing about ruling the world while Mike found himself trying to rebuild his own once again, tired of it having shattered so many times over. 

At least he finally felt better, even if he refused to admit Steve was the reason for it. 

He wasn’t quite done though.

 There was a piece Steve had skipped over, that Mike felt was critically important, if only because it was partly the reason he was having thoughts about being gay in the first place. 

He had to know if Steve saw it too. 

That it wasn’t just him and his stupid head, making up things that weren’t there. 

“Hey Steve?” 

“Yeah?”

“Who was the speech for?” 

Steve sighed. 

“Rule one of the whole queer thing Wheeler, you don’t out other people.” 

Like there were written rules or something.

(Maybe there were, it wasn't like Mike knew.)

“Was it Will?” Mike asked, and pretended like he didn’t desperately want the answer to be yes. 

 Steve didn’t say a thing, but the fact he nearly took the car off the road was a pretty solid answer in itself. 

“We’re not playing guessing games about other people’s sexualites!” He yelped, hands gripping the steering wheel as Mike felt a wave of relief crash through him. 

Will was--maybe, possibly, also--queer too. 

Which didn’t make this any better but it--wasn’t the not preferred outcome, either. 

(It wasn’t just Mike struggling alone, trying to figure out if his best friend wanted to be more than that, if El was breaking up with him and more and more because she wanted to be less than a girlfriend, if things were changing and he would have no one--) 

“I’m not out here picking Will up from a gay bar dipshit, I’m picking you up, and this is your reminder that next time, you should just come talk to me!” Steve ranted. 

Mike snorted.

He absolutely hated Steve Harrington, but--

“Fine.” He said, talking so low he could barely be heard. “I will.”

--maybe Mike did have someone in his corner after all. 

Even if it was just Steve. 

xXx

Bonus: 

“Between you and me, that kid is gayer than a two dollar bill.” 

“Wow Robin,” Steve teased, “Isn’t that like, a slur or whatever?” 

He snickered when she rolled her eyes and threw a roll of stickers his way. 

“I’m just saying. Did you see the way he was looking at you when you were showing off your stupid biceps?” Robin said, nudging her shoulder into Steve’s. “Will’s gonna have a rude awakening later if he hasn’t already.” 

Steve nudged her back, but kept his gaze on the Party as they trooped their way from Family Video to the arcade next door, the realization that they now had connections for free rentals making them downright gleeful. 

Will was the last one in, and Steve watched him hurry so as to not be left behind. 

He didn’t like to worry about the dipshits, but Robin was just putting voice to a thought Steve knew he wasn’t the first person to have.

And if he noticed it, then it didn't exactly bode well as being kept a secret. 

“Should we like…talk to him about that?” He asked after a long moment, turning to face Robin.

“Us?” She pointed at herself, before turning her finger on Steve. “Why us?” 

“Well you’re into girls.” He gave her a pointed look, glad that the store was empty of everyone but them so he could actually voice all this. “And I’m fine with it.”

“Yeah I’m sure he wants to know you’re fine with it.” Robin taunted, but she had her thinking face on, eyes out to the middle distance. “I barely know him. You barely know him--he’s the quietest out of all your kids.”

“They’re not my kids.” Steve argued automatically. “They're like a weird cross between shitty siblings and that kid in your class who never leaves you alone.” 

A fact Steve no longer took for granted, even if he made it sound like the worst thing ever.

“I just think it’d be nice if he knew that he had people in his corner, you know? Who supported him and shit.” 

“Steve, you compared my crush to a muppet, that wasn’t supportive.” Robin countered, but it too was on automatic. 

Softer she admitted; “You’re right though. If I had known other queer people, if I had known people would accept me...it would have made things a lot easier.”

A very long pause, in which both of them stewed for a moment, before Robin abruptly slapped her hand down on the table.

“Okay, you got me. We're doing it, and I'm making us a speech.”

“A speech?” 

“Yes dingus, a speech. I know you, you’re terrible when you’re put on the spot with this kinda thing, and trust me with things like this the moment will be spontaneous.”

“It’s Will, how spontaneous can it be?” Steve challenged back. “Getting a dinner order out of him is a chore.” 

“Stop whining and hand me that notepad. Im telling you its gonna happen when you least expect it and then you're gonna thank me later.”

“It better not happen without you.”  Steve sighed, but passed the notepad over.

God the things he did for those stupid kids. 

Bonus x2

Steve would later go on to use the speech on himself, in a gas station bathroom mirror, eyes wide and freaked out after Eddie Munson called him Big Boy in a van they stole, while Robin snickered behind him. 

He would turn on her, snapping that she; “Help me with this dammit!” 

In return she’d remind him that Tammy might sing like a muppet but Eddie  was the guy who stepped on lunches while giving speeches at lunch and sticking his tongue out, and “Really Steve, I think I won best gay awakening, here.” 

Which would promptly start an argument regarding how it wasn’t a competition, which would continue for another fifteen or so odd years before finding its way as a reference into both of their speeches as each other’s best man. 

Nancy and Eddie wouldn’t get it at either wedding, but Mike would.

[chirpsythismorning]

INTERESTING a storyline that ppl say would be impossible for Mike bc of x y z and yet here is Jack Mcphee in Dawson's Creek living his forced conforming lifestyle, dating a girl and denying his sexuality, having a mental breakdown in his nuclear family front hallway and everything...

[pinksmonkey]

I'm deciding to post a link to specifically my Byler Evidence YouTube playlist, because it is in my ultimate list, but this will make it easier for people to find who just want to watch videos and not read hundreds of posts. XD

Have fun I guess. Share this if you want. Byler is so endgame fr fr.

[pinksmonkey]

Come join us on Saturday! :D

Hello Bylers,

(and non-Bylers too)

@pinksmonkey and I are planning a special Byler Theory live stream this Saturday (Sept. 28th, starting at about 4pm MDT) to discuss a very important topic -- purity culture and the stigma surrounding teen sexuality in fictional characters -- with Byler, Hosegate and sexual imagery in Stranger Things as a jumping off point.

And you are all invited! (Yay) 😁

We've noticed this weird double standard around fanfics and fanart that showcase high-school aged kids in sexual relationships being taboo when the original source material does the same thing without issue.

(And by this, I mean tasteful stories and art that explore these themes in a thoughtful and respectful way, not pornographic or fetishizing depictions.)

So we'd like to talk about it.

(photo taken from a YouTube video by LesbianMindflayer)

We fully believe open, honest conversations about sexuality are crucial for teens to develop healthy attitudes towards sex, without feeling ashamed of their bodies and their naturally evolving desires. And fan works of art (in whichever medium you prefer - writing, drawing, music, film, interpretive dance, what have you...) are a great means of prompting and normalizing these conversations.

So, if this is a topic that interests you as well, please join us on Saturday at PinksMonkey's YouTube channel (the link is in their Tumblr profile @pinksmonkey) for what we hope will be an enthusiastic and thought-provoking discussion.

Hope to see you there!

Love,

Byler Mom

🍕😱🍆

[basiltonpitch]

byler having sex could be extremely important to will's coming of age as a gay man.

hear me out.

(also - before anyone comes at me for sexualizing minors - i'm not saying i want an explicit sex scene. i don't! something like jancy's s2 fade to black would be more than enough for me.)

now back to the point:

will has heard his whole life how being gay is this disgusting, dirty, vile thing - from his father & from bullies at school. likely other adults around the town, as well, considering we hear troy referencing what his dad said about will being killed by "some other queer" in season 1. not to mention this story is set in the midst of the aids epidemic. i mean, he's from a small town in bumfuck indiana, he's no doubt heard his share of casual and overt homophobia throughout the years. (and then there's the alan turing poster in s4...) long story short, he's only heard negative things about being gay. about loving other boys and wanting other boys and desiring other boys.

but then there's mike. his best friend. the one person that makes him feel like he's not a mistake for being different. for being gay.

mike & will having sex, being intimate and together in a way will was always taught was gross and wrong, and learning that it isn't any of those things - will learning that loving mike and wanting mike and desiring mike is beautiful, and wonderful, and right - and having mike want him back, desire him back, learning that it's okay, it's good, continuing that arc of mike making him feel like he's not a mistake, that he's better for being different because he gets to have this with mike - he deserves that moment, i think. and mike does, too.

[byers-bowlcut]

Mike’s love for El being platonic, and not romantic, and realizing it over the course of season 3 reconciles nearly every contradiction with his behaviour.

He stands like a gay scarecrow as she kisses him in front of Will’s closet. That's him realizing that when he blurted out "I love her and I can't lose her again!" he meant it platonically. But her saying "ily too” WAS CLEARLY NOT PLATONIC, so now he’s left very confused (If he was simply shocked by the fact that she overheard him, he would’ve been surprised initially, and then kissed her back, and been all emotional and happy. But he wasnt.) 

In fact he probably realized his heart fluttered when Will said “not possible” to him in the scene literally 1 minute prior, but NOT when his gf was attempting to make out with him? That’s clearly a problem! lol

This leads flawlessly into season 4.

Mike has apparently been refusing to even write the word 'love’ in his letters for 6 whole months. Why? Cause he didn't want them to look like love letters.

Meanwhile, he’s jealous of Will painting something for a girl. So he argues with Will about growing apart.

El argues with him about not saying ily. In the fight, he deflects romantic connotations with words like “care” and superhero idolization that he seems suuuper into this season.

He NODS when Will says “What if they don’t like the truth?”. That’s him thinking “Yeah, El won’t like the truth that I don't return her romantic feelings.”

In the van, he says their meeting was dumb luck and anyone could've been there for her that night. That’s hinting that he was just being a decent human. Not that it was a fated love at first sight meeting.

Then Will says, “You’re afraid of losing her”. And THAT is the true issue here.

This whole concept of ‘losing El’ (be it in relationship/daily life, or in death), is scary to Mike, because of what he went through seasons 1-2. At 12 years old, he saw another kid that he developed a bond with, die right in front of his freaking eyes. But they didn’t have a body or anything. So Mike kept getting signs and intuitive feelings that she was still alive. So he questioned his own sanity. For a WHOLE YEAR. Can you imagine how traumatic that is? And then for a kid that age?? That’s exactly why he develops an unhealthy codependency with her in Season 3. And we see it have a negative impact on the unity of the party, and on Will.

But a traumatic response doesn’t change the fact that Season 3 transitions us through the party’s puberty and growth into teenage hood. 

And because of said puberty, Mike starts to realize what actual attraction towards someone is, or in this case… isnt.

Like if we think about the first two seasons, for a 12-13 year old living in that type of society, era, and a picture perfect white suburban American family, it would’ve been really really hard to figure it out back then! Like simply becoming very close friends with the opposite gender caused everyone (cough Nancy cough Lucas) to tell him that “ooooh you must like her”. So yeah, he thinks “I really must like her”. Because he does! He just can’t separate it from actual romantic attraction at that point due to age, and strong heteronormative standards, and no role models like Jonathan telling him “it’s okay to stray from the norm bro”. So of course he acts on it? That’s the NORM. He’s like, “You’re supposed to take a girl you like to the ball”, “We're supposed like girls now”, “This is what growing up means”, “This what old people do”. Like HELLO? Mike says stuff similar to that constantly. Dustin and Lucas do not. So yeah, it can be easily be read as heteronormativity. Not romantic attraction!

And so despite wanting to spend every day in the summer with El because of copious amounts of trauma from S1-2, he can’t continue believing its romantic attraction when his hormones say otherwise. 

Like just look at their kissing scenes S3-4:

Seasons 3 starts with him pulling her hands OFF of him when kissing. He’s voluntarily kissing her instead of spending time with his friends, cause he thinks that’s what he’s supposed to do as he’s “not a kid anymore!”, yet he’s evidently not even enjoying it if he’s taking her hands off lol. Then by the end of the season he doesn’t even kiss back, and has his eyes wide open. Then six months later, when he’s way more self aware of his own feelings, this dude wears SUNGLASSES to the airport. We (and all the characters there) can’t even see his true expression when kissing her. And what’s more, he puts the bouquet of flowers between their bodies, to SEPARATE FASTER. When he could’ve very easily put that hand/arm around her, not between them (that's what he does with his other hand holding the bags).  

And all of this: all this repression, the contradictions, the unsaid things... it all culminates to the monologue. Will told Mike in the van that El really needed him. And then Will reminds him of this again when El is in the piggyback, cause Will is annoying! (jokes lol). So of course, all rationality, all of Mike's realizations or progression, goes out the window. After all, he is THE HEART. He is needed by her. He can’t go through what he went through in season 1-2 again! It doesn’t matter if it’s not totally true. He needs to tell her what she wants to hear so she won’t DIE. The stakes are extremely high. So he delivers. He even takes all his knowledge of mediocre romance stories, and blurts out that it was love at first sight. It's silly to us the audience, cause if you actually go back and watch season 1 you can see that it's not even fucking true. 

So why would he lie? Well because he doesn’t KNOW when he fell in love with El. Because he never fell in love with her. So yeah. It’s PLATONIC with a capital P.

(And to add a cherry on top, he gives his sister’s ring to her jfc) 

[pinksmonkey]

I'm a teenager and personally I don't see anything wrong with acknowledging that most teenagers have sexual thoughts and feelings, that's just a fact. We're full of hormones and a developing brain that is impulsive and rebellious.

When I started shipping Byler I was around the same age as them, and I had sexual thoughts and feelings for lots of girls my age (and celebrities because obviously XD). Most teenagers are sexual in some way, and that's ok to talk about, especially with fictional characters. Like let's not just go around sexualizing real people regardless of age unless it's in an appropriate context, but characters aren't real, they are made up. I believe it's ok to discuss the sexuality of fictional teens, and teens in general because it's an important thing to talk about. I really don't like that sex is so taboo, it's just a natural part of life like anything else.

Anyway, so Mike was totally checking Will out in my opinion, and there's nothing wrong with that. You said the other party members don't do stuff like that, which is fairly true for the main party, but Nancy and Steve had sex in season 1 when they were around the same age as Mike and Will are now. So it's not like the show has never dealt with teen sexuality before.

I always get confused when people argue about this kind of thing when it comes to fan art and fanfic about teenagers when there are tons of TV shows that feature teenagers and their sex lives. It feels kind of like a double standard to me. Like Sex Education centered around teenagers the same age as Mike and Will, and the show was very explicit. There's nudity in the show, pretty explicit sex scenes and conversations about sexuality, with a main cast of teenage characters played by adults. The same thing can be said about Glee but on a less explicit level. What's the difference with Mike and Will? The actors are now adults, and the characters are the same age as the teens in the other shows I mentioned. I don't understand what the issue is if Sex Education and Glee (plus lots of other shows about teenagers) are allowed to talk about or show teen sexuality, why can't we talk about teenage Mike and Will in a sexual context or write fanfiction about them doing normal teenage things. I just don't get it, someone please explain this to me. ;-;

I had sex for the first time with my girlfriend when we were both 16. That's pretty average from what I've heard. So why are people so upset about even just mentioning that Mike and Will might have sexual thoughts and feelings about each other?

Also Noah himself described season 4 using an eggplant emoji, so I think if the actor is sexualizing his own character then it's definitely not a problem to talk about that. The eggplant emoji literally has no other meaning than being sexual.

Gidusrufgkfgkzrysurdid. Anyway, sorry for the long rant I just really had to get that off my chest and share my perspective as a teenager myself. 👍

Here's an analysis about Byler and sexuality in Stranger Things that I really like.

Since you are giving your interpretations of byler theories... What do you think of the scene where Mike is in Will's room and Will is kneeling on the floor and Mike is saying Hawkins wasn't the same without Will? Because Will is kneeling on the floor in front of Mike with his back to him while Mike goes to sit on his bed. So Will's butt is directly in his line of sight. And you can see Mike noticing and looking him up and down. The only mileven response to this that I've seen is "he wasn't doing that." But he plainly is and you can see it. Many people noticed it and it worried a lot of milevens. So what do you think that meant if Mike loves El? Because we have never seen him look at El like that. And because of this, this scene tends to upset a lot of milevens along with the fact that no one can come up with a good explanation for it. I have yet to see a well thought out reason for the way Mike behaves with Will if he doesn't have some interest in him. Because I have never seen a straight guy look at another guys butt before. A lot of milevens were uneasy after seeing this scene especially since people either pretend it didn't happen or just say it was an accident. And it wasn't accidental. Mike didn't do that because Will happened to be kneeling there. Mike could have sat anywhere else in the room and intentionally sat there. He could have sat next to him or asked Will to turn around. But he doesn't do those things. He has no problem with Will being there and isn't uncomfortable. In fact, he looks happy and relieved to be talking to him. I don't think the reason Mike hasn't checked out El is because he respects her (which is the reason I always see). He's a 15 year old boy and checking out girls would be normal and it's also not disrespectful. People check out attractive people they are interested in, especially hormonal teenage boys. So then why is Mike checking out Will? Do you have a good take on that that isn't a dismissal of something we can all clearly see happening?

I'm not really sure how to respond to this, I just disagree with what's happening in that scene. I don't see Mike checking out Will, I don't interpret it that way. I think Mike was just being friendly and trying to mend his relationship with a friend he really cares about. I've seen that scene a lot of times from Byler videos, but I really just don't see it the way Bylers do. I believe Mike loves El, because he's said that and shown that time and time again, every season. I don't think Mike's glancing up and down is him checking Will out, people move their eyes around lots when talking, he wasn't necessarily looking at Will's butt, he could have been looking at his shoes or the floor or something else. I don't know, that's just how I see it.

If anyone has anything else to say about this please leave a comment or reblog.

[gayofthefae]

Thinking about how Mike wasn't just told to like El then he liked her. No. There's a third event that happens between them that we skip over so often but is vital and Mike's crush might not have even happened without it.

Mike is being teased about El, yes. But he actually doesn't even get the chance to respond, let alone have his following actions be influenced by only that. Because before he can even react, look who's here:

Stakes.

This scene isn't about El. This scene plays out in one, very simple way.

Lucas: you like El.

Mike: I don't.

Troy: Let me remind you what will happen if you don't.

Just like the ily speech, Lucas is Will, but that's not all it took. It didn't just take the suggestion of something. It took the STAKES. It took threat. He was told to do something then he turned to see just what would happen to him if he didn't do it. The romantic trope is feigned: realize your feelings once someone points out that someone could be romantic. Steve has the same with Robin in season 3. But one thing here is different.

Before he has a chance to respond (to ensure we don't know what would have happened), he is given incentive to lie.

It isn't just suggestibility. "Huh, maybe I should like her. I guess I will." It's fear. It's "you need to hide, like right fucking now, and there's a hiding spot right there." Yeah. You run to the hiding spot and you do not fucking come out ever.

[counting-stars-gayly]

They’re not going to rebuild Castle Byers because Will can’t rebuild his childhood, which is the reason he destroyed Castle Byers in the first place. He’d been trying to hold on to a level of carefree ignorance that no longer existed for him. The problems Castle Byers saved him from have been replaced by new problems that are bigger and stronger than a child’s fort. He needs to face them differently. Thank you and goodnight