#but this does make me think of a “parallel”/vaguely related feeling I've had

[liketwoswansinbalance]

Trial run prompt thing: Does anyone get what I mean (in the way that I'm describing it or similarly) or does this sound strange?

It's nice to see someone articulate this actually, hence the fact that is is a reblog, of course.

(The thoughts of substance are in the tags, this time.)

does anyone feel the layer of plexiglass between themselves and the rest of the world or is that just a me thing

[oiblackestsheep]

what, in your opinion, are an intp’s needs in a relationship? (coming from an infj.) love your blog, you’ve got some amazing insights 🫶

Aww, thanks INFJ anon. 🫶 I try my best to have interesting insights that bring something fresh to the table!

INTP's Needs in a Relationship

I've been in the same relationship for 8.5 years (and we actually MET ON TUMBLR BECAUSE OF THIS BLOG WHICH IS SO FUNNY AND NERDY), all of this to say, I've had a lot of time to think about my relationship needs even from the MBTI perspective as an INTP, because that was how my ENFJ and I kinda started out getting to know, like, what we each needed from each other, so, here we go!

Disclaimer: This is assuming that the INTP is already getting everything that everyone needs in a basic healthy relationship like, you know, feeling emotionally safe and being treated with respect, etc..

Intellectual stimulation: INTPs generally love understanding new things and how they work, so ideally their partner can share that interest with them in some way! They can be pretty curious people, so joining them in their quest for uncovering the "how" and "why" of everything will make them feel understood, themselves, and closer to you in the process!

Clear explanations of your feelings: Because INTPs have inferior Fe, they tend to have a habit of intellectualizing their own emotions when they talk about them, which can cause complications with understanding other people's emotions, too. Finding a way to be patient and know that even healthy INTPs might still struggle with connecting with other people's emotions (especially at first in a relationship) isn't necessarily because they don't want to, but more that it doesn't always come naturally, so they don't always know how to. If they're a healthy person, they will want to understand, just try not to take it personally while they are practicing/learning!

Alone time: This one should be pretty straight-forward lmao. They're introverted, so they like to recharge doing solo-activities, and they're intuitives, so they have their own little theoretical world full of bizarre ideas to entertain themselves with that might not always be easy to follow at first. I find that introverts in general (maybe the INxx types even moreso) like to engage in parallel play where their partner also does something quietly nearby, but still a separate activity. As an INFJ, yourself, I'm sure you can relate in your own way, so it's likely easy to give them what they need!

Humor them/hear them out: This might sound a little vague, and I guess in some ways it is, but this is mostly about their auxiliary Ne. ENTPs and ENFPs get most of the attention when it comes to high Ne, but INTPs (and INFPs, too!) place a lot of importance on it, too, which can often manifest itself in conversations like "what if __", "imagine if __", etc.. To put it bluntly, it might seem a bit... directionless, and that's because sometimes it kind of is! It's just about thinking of random possibilities that are non-serious and funny in the moment, and don't really go anywhere else outside of the current discussion or hold any larger, overarching significance. Sometimes it's less about the actual topic itself, and more about having some random fun and "playing along" that makes a world of a difference to a playful INTP (or high Ne user in general). This point got away from me a little bit which I think, in a way, is the perfect exemplification of what I was trying to say in the first place, lmao. Hope that makes sense! If your INTP ever sounds like whatever the hell I just said, just try not to disengage right away, because they probably have a point that they are struggling to reach. Put that dom Ni to work and summarize it for them, I know you can do it from experience with my own ENFJ lmao.

Anyway, uhhhhh: Every single point on this list has gotten progressively longer because my Ne loves extrapolating (and I love Ne, but sometimes its gotta CHILL you know?), so I'm gonna end it here before it gets WILDLY OUT OF CONTROL.

This was a fun question, anon!: Thanks again for reaching out, and basically giving me full range to just write multiple paragraphs about myself and my relationship!

[zerolostwalks]

(sorry ignore the last one, I realized I hit the wrong thing just after hitting send) ☔

^_^ It's all good, thanks for the ask!!

So I've actually had a few ideas over the past couple of years of fics I find intriguing but may never pursue. However I think the one idea I absolutely will never actually write would be the Trapped in a Nightmare idea I had.

A major part of that is conceptually I don't think my writing would be able to capture the level of trippy I feel this story would need.

Under the cut because it gets a little long and rambly 😅

Send an emoji for a snippet (and to force encourage me to write more)

(First and foremost let it be known this would be a post S1 story, so the story would be relatively canon compliant)

Essentially due to magic shenanigans Julie ends up trapped in a nightmare-scape. The story would start without either Julie or the reader being aware of this. Initially it's just her alone, and the more she explores the more she realizes she is like alone alone. (her exploring would be done in that dreamy jumpy way. Like home leads to school or she'd just jump straight from her room to the studio. Plus the studio is noticeably unused.)

Anyway when Julie does eventually come across people, it's like they don't even notice her there. (Like I wanted to make it sort of initially read like when we first meet Julie in JatP and she's trying to be invisible only even when Julie does try to get people's attention they just ignore her.)

Then (preferably when the Julie section is reaching peal WTF and anxiety inducing) jump cut to everyone else in Julie's life freaking out because Julie will not wake up and no one knows why. Ray takes her to the hospital, but they're at a loss.

Eventually, (possibly through Willie) Reggie, Luke, Alex, and Flynn learn what's happening to Julie is magic related. (I never did settle on if it's Caleb revenge related or not). Then they go into a research mode trying to figure out a way to get her out. They theorize that because of the special ghost bond thing the guys might be able to project into Julie's nightmare to pull her out.

So Reggie, Luke, and Alex (and maybe Willie?) do that and at first their nightmares line up with Julies. They're alone and incapable of finding anybody. But then, the nightmares start shifting to accommodate their fears as well. So then it's a hodge podge of fears and all of them trying to work through them.

In the end, the power of friendship/love ends up being the thing to break through. I have like this weird vague concept that like after the guys enter the nightmare they can all intermittently hear each other calling out to each other. And somehow because of dream logic they start having these weird parallel moments where they can see the other's dreams while still stuck experiencing their own. Like picture those weird mirror/living photo things you see in movies sometimes.

Anyway it's during one of those weird parallel moments where they are able to start helping each other and after they're able to overcome their fears that they can get Julie to wake up.

Which HOORAY Julie's awake but also there's a period of time post her waking up where they have to still work through some things. Like a lot of the stuff they may have been brushing to the side or bottling up needs to get worked through. As well as some new things like Julie avoiding sleep. (This leads to lots of group cuddle sessions to help her calm down)

Anyway together they work through it. In the end I want it to be more focused on the friendship (or maybe even QPR) between the gang.

[asteracaea]

I feel like those references are so vague that I don’t even think the GP will catch on (if they even are about T). Also don’t think it’s big enough for T to even care about. Idk.

Side note and no hate to Olivia for this, but is it just me or does she kind of use phrases/lines that Taylor has had in her songs as well? This all feels a little weird to me

oh i hope you're right because i feel like the internet immediately decided who and what that song was about! i would love for them both to do something that puts this feud narrative to rest. it's just misogynistic when you boil it down.

i know what you mean and i find lots of parallel themes and imagery in olivia and taylor's songs but i think that's because these are experiences that young women go through. i have never had the feeling that olivia has copied taylor in any way. i've always felt that olivia writes about her own authentic experiences, and those experiences were similar to things taylor also went through. it's part of what makes both of their music so relatable and cathartic and beloved. LOTS of us have gone through, if not the same exact situation, very similar emotional experiences. and the way they write about them leaves room for listeners to interpret them how they will.

i've seen a lot of discourse today saying things like "has the world forgotten alanís morrisette existed? and fiona apple? joni mitchell and carly simon?" it's in response to certain groups who seem to insist that taylor invented the female experience (and was the first to write songs about it) and olivia is just copying her. yes, taylor changed the industry and the world in a lot of ways, but there were others who came before her. it seems that some people have a very limited exposure to artists, and history, and narrow views tend to result in drama.

several blogs i follow will often post thematic or lyrical parallels between taylor and other artists' songs, and it's always done in a loving, analytical way, exploring possible meaning and illuminate the listener's experience of the songs. it's never a criticism of copying. and that's how i feel when i notice parallels between tay and liv's songs. i have been wanting to point out the thematic similarities between vampire and dear john but i've been kind of afraid to draw any comparisons because of the negativity directed at olivia these days :( but it's so fascinating!! and maybe instead of criticizing, people could start saying "hey, why does this kind of thing keep happening to vulnerable young girls.... maybe we should do something about this..."

[agoddamn]

Was thinking about fuckable old men, and had some thoughts about mentor figures in stories. Often with a wise mentor/guide, people will either complain about how boringly perfect they are, or be weirdly resentful of any flaws. Even more so if the character is initially presented as very wise, only to later show any flaws (thinking of like Rose Quartz and idk. Dumbledore). It's weirdly common for people to go on about how boring and perfect a mentor is, and then freak out that they're not perfect and instead just a person.

It's like. It seems like a very childish response to me, and whenever I see that kind of behavior from older people, it just screams "I have mommy/daddy issues". Idk where I'm going with this, but you're the #1 fucker of old and pathetic characters so, thoughts?

Tangent: I think I'm like the only person who liked Dumbledore being gay and thought it was believable. Usually, if a narrative introduces an older male and female pair (Dumbledore and McGonagall, from the literal page 1) it's with the intent of eventually setting them up.

Otherwise, if there's no implicit romantic match for a mentor character it's because a similar-age women literally does not exist (Obi-Wan Kenobi pre-TCW)--or because they're so narratively isolated it would be impractical, typically by their imminent death (Yoda). Batman's Alfred has Leslie Thompson to play off of, frex. Dumbledore having no vague chemistry with Minerva whatsoever was noticeable, even way back before the announcement. His fondness for flamboyant fashion is also, in retrospect, classic gay coding. I fully believe that JKR purposely set that up and didn't just go "uhhh yeah Hogwarts was SUPER diverse" after the fact.

(She did do that with a bunch of other things, to be clear, just not gay Dumbledore.)

(As a tangent to a tangent, we can safely blame Wertham's Seduction of the Innocent for all characters ever having a bad case of the not-gays. It all comes back to comics every time!)

Anyway! Real answer!

Yes, I agree that people tend to get a bad case of projection when it comes to older characters. It happens to characters in any form of fiction that features a relatable everyman protag, but older mentor characters seem to get it extra bad.

I think some of it comes from mentor characters typically being presented as entirely supportive figures; they don't get the same narrative real estate--the same opportunity for character growth-- that, say, the rival gets. A mentor's job is to Be Good And Support MC, not have a character arc. Thus, the particular sense of betrayal the audience has when the mentor character has slightly different goals than the protagonist.

And I do mean "slightly different" goals--to use OT Obi-Wan as an example again, think of how angry people get at him hiding that Anakin was Vader. People get angrier than Luke did in the actual canon discussion the characters have about it! Luke and Obi-Wan align in 99.5% of their goals--the only difference is that Obi-Wan feels that Luke has to accept the reality that he may have to kill Vader.

This is a viewpoint that makes perfect sense for his character. Even before the prequels added the backstory that put Obi-Wan in the same position as Luke, where he could have killed him but chose not to deal a finishing blow, it's...not actually all that strange to keep the sordid details of a parent's past from a kid. Kids want to love their parents. Kids don't want to hear, "hey, your dad tried to kill you!" and they certainly don't want to hear that at a formative, tender age.

You can argue the technical logistics of Force connections and whether Luke was more or less at-risk with his knowledge of Vader, but I genuinely believe that the intended real-world parallel was this situation ("I want to let the kid believe he had a good father") rather than...some of the more extreme interpretations I've seen.

Because people hate this lie. In spite of it being a perfectly logical choice for Obi-Wan's character, they hate him for it and rail against him for "stealing Anakin's children." I've seen fics/headcanons/'metas' that go "Obi-Wan had to have been planning on setting him off like a school shooter in 20 years" or "Obi-Wan was planning to use him as a guided missile from the beginning" and...that's just way harder for me to buy than "he couldn't tell this kid who wanted to love his father than Anakin tried to kill him."

tl;dr mentor characters typically don't get character arcs and so people feel betrayed when they have visible needs and desires outside of validating the protagonist.

[fruiteggsaladit]

general consensus may or may not b that hiei doesn't and cannot cook but consider this: What if he Could and he Does.

Not because of Kurama, gtf out of here with that, I want a PROPER KOORIME ARC that isn't just "he lost the one precious thing he had and decided he'd go back to Hyouga for genocide; nvm once he heard the details he decided not to" Nobody talks abt Rui and so my mind is in two camps: mary-sue her by removing her suicidality and make her the Perfect Parental Figure, or have her be a deeply flawed character so deep she should have had her own manga.

I want her to fulfill the role Mukuro kind of fulfilled with Hiei but that she does the very dadly thing of Never Talking About Her Feelings unless through a very Traumatic Lens- wait no Mukuro does that too, anyways, I want her to parallel Hiei's belief that he needs to do something to make up for his existence. Except in Rui's case, it's not her own existence, but her actions that have made her irredeemable in her own eyes, and so "making up for it" is not the matter here, but making reparations instead, with the vague hope/expectation that her loved one(s) will abandon her after she's paid her debts.

Togashi being burnt out likely contributed to the very weak "the only way I can make up for Hina dying is making way for her cursed child (dude) to return here and kill us, starting with me", and her not even being able to kill herself on her own, instead begging 13/14-years-old-coded Hiei to do that for her. And prior to that, she had raised Yukina and eventually told her the truth about Hina and Hiei.

Also I'm sorry but the misogyny shines through in the story there too, with Hiei wanting to kill an entire race of female-coded beings he's never really known, but apparently doing nothing towards the bandits that adopted him? Not a canonical word is given about him retaliating at them for it, even though they abandoned him similarly as the Koorime did, because this time Hiei had actually known them. Its stated (by Mukuro, who as we all know is a reliable narrator and Togashi has never employed an unreliable narrator ever (lying)) that he is vengeful enough to desire death to those who abandoned him! Why make a point about genociding the Koorime and say nothing about the bandits...

RIGHT BUT THIS WAS ABOUT

_C O O K I N G_

I'm formerly big fan of Hiei-ifying Yukina to make her more interesting and less of a "perfect bean who's done nothing wrong", I've been coming around lately to Yukina-ifying Hiei?

Like, Hiei getting attached a very strongly once he's attached to someone; Going out of his way to do something for someone, even when they tell him he's being excessive (murder yes But nope that's the whole sentence; is this not equivalent to a shoujo protag exhausting herself to exhausting cleaning the house and doing the cleaning and the cooking, bc how else will she make up for the room she's taking in someone's life and home?); over-thinking himself into circles about whether or not his twin really wants him in her life...

Long concept short! Rui doesn't immediately trauma-dump Hiei and Hiei is entranced/angry with her bc HE remembers HER throwing him away and her being related to his mother in some way, but SHE doesn't? And they journey together in some way. And while Rui is choosing to stay alive, she's also not letting herself experience joys in life, especially with Yukina's absence. I'm fascinated by the concept that she embodies the journey Hiei is taking for himself, the whole-- preparing himself for saving Yukina, and once that is done, die? Wither away? -- very neat if she is doing the same, and Hiei is not introspective or reflective enough to clock that the idealised suicidality is something he intends once he leaves Hyouga. It's the hearing about a lost sister throws a wrench into that plan.

Fascinated w the idea of Hiei trying to endear her to open up by learning to cook from her and cooking for them both. Rui doesn't teach him, he watches her make it and learns from there.

Just, the preparation of food and the sharing of it. Learning how much spice someone likes and how that differs from your own, and how that isn't a matter of morals, it just is. And comparing that to how Hiei is never shown eating on-screen, or eating at all.

Hiei comparing this kind of service to what he considered a service to the bandits. But here it was through being methodical, previously it was almost reactionary. "I'm being helpful, why aren't you glad?" versus "She isn't opening up to me, I'm doing something not-right". Particularly the new state of no longer having the power levels he had prior to the Evil Eye surgery, would probably be a large reason why he becomes more introspective and careful, bc he can't afford not to be.

I just like the idea that Hiei can cook, but has an aversion to people knowing about it, esp. bc of something that happened in the past with Rui. That they did get close, but it wasn't enough for Rui to understand Hiei. Worse, that once she realised who he was, that it overrides what she's learned of him in their journey, and that her reaction to this is what makes Hiei eventually revert to the violence and the carelessness he exhibits with Kurama, until he is again betrayed in some respect, and finds yet again that he's overestimated how well the one he's begun to trust, trusts in him in return.

[kiss-me-cill-me]

@mothhball Well, it's taken me weeks, but I've finally had a moment to sit down and give this fic the time and attention it deserves lol

And yet, no words of mine could really do it justice, besides: oh. my. god.

I knew I was going to want to savor this, because I always feel that way about longer oneshots, and I did in fact savor every moment of it. But somehow even though this is over 6k words, I lost myself so completely that it felt like the blink of an eye? That's how you know I was really and totally captivated lol 😆

Firstly, I thought the setup was amazing. I'm always a sucker for doctor/patient relationships (or, let's be honest, any power imbalance lol) and I loved the reader's perspective here. Her becoming obsessed with Crane due to him being the first person to "listen" to her and "let her talk about love" was genius! Love love loved the whole concept; you definitely put a fresh spin on a classic dynamic!

I also really liked the symbolism and contrast of the blood beneath her fingernail from hurting another patient, and the blood around her nail bed from picking at her own skin. The parallel imagery was stunning. Just as her actions hurt others, so do they also hurt herself 🥹🥲

It's like catnip for your ears, almost making you melt in your little grippy socks.

10/10, would melt in my grippy socks over Crane's voice again 😂

You’re laying your heart completely bare, ripping apart skin and flesh to expose the bloody, weakly beating thing to his unimpressed eyes.

After reading several of your Crane fics, I think I can confidently say that this style of visceral, macabre description of love is something I really appreciate and look forward to in your writing! It just fits him so well; I love when there's a vaguely creepy/medical undertone in a Crane fic 🥰

Also, what a jerk - still insisting that she call him Dr. Crane when his dick is halfway down her throat 😆 This was also very on brand for him lmao

You’re on a mission. A mission to drive him to the brink of insanity like his mere presence does you.

Relatable 👀

And can I just say? That their first kiss was actually so cute lol. Steamy and depraved and made my entire body feel like it was on fire, yes. But also, like, sweet at the same time 😆🫠

But I ALSO need to say that I literally feel like I need to punch a wall to calm down over all of the filth coming out of this man's mouth. Because 🥵🥵

I'm so sorry again that it's taken me forever to read this! But once again, I am floored lol. And now that I've finally caught up on this, I just need to find the time to read your new Neil fic 👀👀👀

Positive Reinforcement

Pairing | Jonathan Crane x delusional!Reader (fem)

Warnings | 18+ SMUT, DUB-CON (bc Jon is playing a little hard to get), L-BOMB, fingering, oral sex (both m + f receiving), deepthroating, brief breathplay, mutual body worship, p in v sex, unprotected sex, multiple rounds, overstim, clothed male/naked female, threats of drugging, violence mention, reader is a little unhinged

Summary | You’re convinced he’s the one, but you’ve been causing nothing but trouble for Jonathan. Maybe it’s time to switch up the strategy.

Words | 6.2k

Notes | FILTH. Jon may be ooc, whoops. Honestly, this is very self-indulgent and was a struggle to write lol

Arkham certainly has its charms. From the noisy, dark hallways to the scratchy and shapeless patient uniforms - there’s something for everyone here. As far as you’re concerned, you’re here for no reason. At least no serious reason. You’re a lover and a fighter. Literally just a girl. Even though the GCPD certainly didn’t agree when they arrested you for attempted murder, assault, breaking and entering, and a bunch of other rude accusations.

Your ex broke your heart, so you crashed your car into him in an attempt to get back at him, breaking both his legs in the process. He may never walk again – big deal! A crime of passion, your honor! Revenge for the two years that you’ve wasted on a person, only for him to break up with you once he noticed the tracker sown into the bottom hem of his favorite jacket. Bummer.

But life goes on, and as long as your heart can beat, it can love. And the person who made you believe in romance again is sitting right in front of you in his office, narrowing his eyes as he stares you down over the rim of the coffee cup he’s sipping from. If only you could trade places with an inanimate object. Jonathan Crane in his entirety is worth the stay at Arkham. He’s worth the uncomfortable bed, colorless food and horrible daytime television that’s always running in the recreation room. Who needs freedom when you have love?

Crane was the first to listen to you. The first person to let you speak and philosophize about the nature of your devotion and the way you love people. And he didn’t judge you. At least not out loud.

But now, two months after being admitted to the asylum, he’s grown tired and agitated. Unhealthy attachment and mood-natural delusionships involving someone who wants nothing to do with you. That’s the addition to your diagnosis that Crane is currently rattling off right in front of you, but you’re too busy staring at every detail of his face, trying to manifest his hands on your skin and his tongue down your throat.

“Are you trying to go for a new record in weeks spent in solitary confinement?” Crane sets down the cup to have a free hand to rub his temple with.

The question makes you smile. Oh, he’s always so funny. So charming. But being sentenced to solitude wasn’t the goal you had in mind when you smashed another patient’s face into the cafeteria wall, not easing up until her teeth were scattered around like the shiny pearls of a rich lady’s ripped necklace. Even though you were hosed down by a guard and received a fresh set of clothes, the other woman’s dried blood is still crusted under the nail of your left ring finger. A secret little sign of your devotion. You didn’t do it out of anger or jealousy either. You did it because you knew that Crane would be forced to sit you down for an emergency therapy session. It’s his own fault for reducing your sessions to only once a week.

A playfully coy smile pulls at the corners of your lips, and you lean forward a little, wanting to get a better look at him even though you’ve already perfectly memorized every detail of him after just the first two days of being here.

“She shouldn’t have provoked me. I was defending myself. You understand me. Right, Jonathan?”

You slowly inch your hand across the table, almost making contact with his fingertips until he opts to grab your file instead. It’s a pointed gesture, and you quietly mourn the chance for physical contact with him. Crane clears his throat to bring your focus back to the here and now. And of course, the first thing he does is correct you.

“Whistler?” You furrow your eyebrows. “What does she have to do with this? I thought… I thought you were trying to help me.”

“It’s Dr. Crane for you. And I understand that you have very little self-control.” He pauses for a moment, struggling with a sudden surge of anger before he manages to continue. “I’ll be honest. My patience is wearing thin. You’re a danger to the other inmates, and Dr. Whistler of all people already offered to take you off my hands.”

This revelation makes you perk up suddenly, and there’s a bitter taste in your mouth. He’s thinking of giving you away?

“Yes, emphasis on trying. But as you can see, we’re not getting anywhere, are we? And Whistler mentioned how optimistic she is about your case. If you want my opinion, I think she’s itching to test out some new sedatives we’ve added to the catalog.” Crane adjusts his glasses, and the way he speaks almost makes you think he doesn’t care. But you’re sure he does. Of course he does. He has to. Nevertheless, the mere thought of not seeing him on a regular basis makes anxiety crawl up your spine, and you absently pick at your cuticles until you tear a little too deep, and another line of red pools around your fingernail.

“You can’t do this,” you try to argue, searching your brain for any good reason for him to keep you aside from the fact that you two belong together. You briefly lick your lips, daring to appeal to his pride. “If you hand me off, everyone will know that you failed. They’ll all know that you gave up on me because you couldn’t handle me.”

Crane’s eyes narrow into cold slits, and his grip on your file tightens. Uh-oh. That’s a very ugly expression on your darling doctor. He’s quiet for a moment, silently reigning himself back in. The rage that’s simmering beneath his skin dissipates a little when he has a sudden idea.

Maybe a different approach could work better. Realization sets in, and he almost wants to smack himself for not thinking of this sooner. Evidently, you don't care that much for punishment. Solitary confinement and restriction from activities do little to keep you in check. But how about a different motivation? How about reward?

"Alright, here's what we're going to do. We'll keep up the weekly frequency of solo therapy sessions." He thinks out loud, crossing his arms over his chest and occasionally tapping his fingers on his biceps. You want to voice your protest about not getting more sessions with him, but he continues with this lovely, rumbly tone that he uses whenever he's planning something and getting matter-of-fact with you. It's like catnip for your ears, almost making you melt in your little grippy socks.

"And if I don't hear any complaints about you from the other members of staff, you'll get a reward each time. So, be a good girl for a week and you'll get a treat. Easy, right?"

His eyebrows are raised expectantly as he waits for your reply, and you think about his offer, picking at your sleeve as you weigh out the pros and cons.

"Do I get to pick the reward?" you eventually ask, looking back at him with a glint in your eyes that he immediately recognizes. Crane firmly shakes his head, resisting the urge to roll his eyes.

"No. Because I know what you'll choose."

"Then I'm not doing it."

Crane sighs, pulling out his work phone.

"I'll give Whistler a call," he states, concentrating on trying not to smirk at the way your expression falls. Like threatening a child by calling Santa.

"Wait! No, I - ... how about a compromise?" You plead, not missing the parallel either. But if you don't want to settle for coal (or in this case, withdrawal from your man), you'll have to suck it up.

Crane looks up from his phone, thumb hovering over the buttons for another moment before he tucks it back into the pocket of his suit jacket. "A compromise? Doll, we’re not arguing over who does the dishes and brings out the trash. You have no say in this aside from agreeing to either a good or a bad time.”

Damn. Did he have to make it domestic?

“Let me burst your bubble for a moment,” He continues, not allowing you to fantasize over his choice of words for longer than necessary. “You have no power here. No agency, no privileges. You’re not ‘doing’ anything, you’re having things ‘done to’ you. You may think you have me in the palm of your hand, because I’m forced to see you every time you get yourself into trouble, but I could just as well keep you drugged and docile for the rest of your indefinite stay here. So,” he leans forward, resting his palms on the table and clearing his throat.

“No more nonsense. This is your very last warning. If you lash out again, I’ll hand you over to Dr. Whistler, advise her to keep you sedated and move onto other much more interesting and agreeable patients, my reputation be damned.”

The silence that follows his words is deafening, and you can hear the blood rushing in your ears as the air suddenly feels thinner. Tears well up in your eyes. Bitter tears of shame and disappointment, and you feel like a petulant child, but it does nothing to stop them from rolling down your face and dripping onto the table below.

Crane stiffens, visibly taken aback by your sudden display of emotion. He thought he’s seen it all from you. The smirks, the winking, the way you bite your lip in an attempt to seduce a man who’s as emotionally available as one of the brick walls making up this very building. Part of him wants to escape the conversation immediately, but it’s his job to at least attempt to help you through your issues, and leaving you in a state of distress is the entire opposite of that.

“Listen,” he starts, almost tentative. “I don’t want to do any of that. Not really. I want to keep working with you. And I believe you’ve made a little progress so far, but you’d be even further along if you’d stop antagonizing everyone for a chance to speak to me.”

“But I need to. You don’t understand.”

“Understand what?”

You sniffle, unable to articulate properly. He should know. He should understand from a single second of eye contact. Yet here you are, forced to spell it out for him. Crane’s eyes soften ever so slightly, and he pulls out a pack of pocket tissues, sliding it across the desk so you can dry your tears. His tone is calmer now, almost gentle.

“Why are you doing this? All of this resistance… the altercations with other patients… your life could be so easy. So why?”

“To make you notice me,” you sniffle, gingerly patting your cheeks with one of the paper tissues. Crane’s eyebrows furrow in response.

“You don’t think I would’ve noticed you without all of this mess?” He tilts his head, slightly amused by your melodramatic performance. You scoff at the question, frowning when he actually smirks at you this time.

“No, you wouldn’t. You wouldn’t notice me if I were a model patient. You wouldn’t spare me a single glance if I was docile like the others… I want you to think about me even when your shift is over.”

Crane shrugs, letting out a sigh through his nose as he does. A corner of his lip twitches, and you can’t tell whether it’s in amusement or disgust. The fact that you tried to manipulate him by being a ‘bad’ patient irritates him, but he has to admit that your strategy worked.

“You’re right. I wouldn’t notice you. You have no idea how difficult and repetitive this job gets… how much the faces start to blur together after a while. You’re not very special at all, if I’m being honest.”

The comment and the monotony in his voice sting, and just for a split second, the mask of sweetness slips to reveal the anger and hurt in your eyes. You quickly manage to reel yourself back in, and you clear your throat as you look away from him. At least he’s being honest with you. The basis of a good and healthy relationship.

“I could… make myself special to you.” A pause.

“Do you think you’re capable of doing that? I mean, so far, you’ve just been causing problems and it’s getting stale. Can you really do something better for me?”

“I can be good… I could show you how I feel for you.” It’s a gamble and you know it. But the possible reward outweighs the risk. At least to your infatuated brain. Crane shifts in his seat, deciding to humor you.

“How do you feel for me? Enlighten me a little bit.”

“I’m in love with you. I love you.” Your sweetheart bristles like a cat, and you feel let down by his reaction. During the countless times you’ve fantasized about this moment in the showers, scrubbing yourself with cheap soap, he was elated by your confession. But the real-life Jonathan Crane just looks at you with mild pity. Pity that doesn’t quite reach his eyes.

“That was… fast. Didn’t even waste a moment to admit it. But I suppose it’s expected from you,” he sighs, shaking his head as he writes something down in your file. You’re quick to defend yourself. This isn’t a joke to you, after all. You’re laying your heart completely bare, ripping apart skin and flesh to expose the bloody, weakly beating thing to his unimpressed eyes.

“I mean it.”

He lets out a low whistle, and his eyebrows raise ever so slightly. For an agonizingly long moment (about 30 seconds), he punishes your honesty with silence before he finally sets his pen down and looks at you.

 “Then do something to prove it.” He says it so nonchalantly. As if he’s not really expecting anything at all. But he’s severely underestimating how deep your devotion runs for him. Your chair screeches across the floor as you get up, and Crane looks alarmed for a fleeting moment before you lower yourself to your knees and crawl under his desk until you come up between his thighs. Your sweetheart’s eyes soften, and he reaches down to brush his fingers through your hair almost instinctively.

“I’ll show you…” you murmur softly, running your hands over his thighs and lightly digging your nails into the fabric of his slacks. Crane lets out a barely audible sigh, shifting a little in his seat to part his legs for easier access. So considerate. Your man really is such a darling.

Looking up at him from beneath the table, you make quick work of his belt and zipper before you pull up his shirt that he kept tucked into his pants. Your mouth waters at the sight of his skin, and you lean in to kiss his stomach while your hand moves to palm his cock through his boxers. Crane hisses softly, keeping his eyes locked on your devoted form between his thighs, and a shiver runs down his spine when you pull down his underwear, exposing him to the cool air of his office.

“God… your cock is so beautiful… you don’t know how long I’ve been dreaming of sucking you off…” you murmur, eyes lighting up as you wrap your hand around him. Crane licks his lips, unsure how to feel about the compliment. You’ve been his biggest headache for months now, and yet here you are, sweettalking him while you’re sitting under his desk with your fingers around his dick.

“I bet you taste as sweet as you look.” You giggle, gathering some saliva in your mouth before you let it dribble down onto his tip so you can pump his cock more easily. Crane’s brows furrow, and you smile up at him before licking from his base up to his tip, causing him to twitch against your tongue. You know he’s always pent up, always stressed, and you don’t really have to worry about him seeking release elsewhere since he’s always focused on his work. And, in some abstract way, always focused on you.

Loyalty. Another pillar of an unbreakable bond.

You can feel him hardening within your grasp, and you swear you can hear an almost silent breath of relief when you finally take his cock into your mouth. You start off slow, moaning at the feeling of his length on your tongue, and you continue to caress his thighs and stomach in an effort to worship him like he deserves.

“No teeth, doll.” He smirks down at you, smoothing his thumb over your cheekbone as you continue to suck the precum from his tip. The taste of him makes your mind fog up, and you nod eagerly, pulling away from him for just a moment to answer properly.

“Cross my heart, Jon.” Your mouth is back on him within seconds, and you bob your head up and down, taking him deeper down your throat every time. Crane hisses in response, and his grip on your hair tightens.

“It’s still Dr. Crane to you…” His protest is half-hearted at best, and you witness his composure crumbling in real time as you suck him off like you’re trying to devour him whole. You’re on a mission. A mission to drive him to the brink of insanity like his mere presence does you. Crane huffs out another sharp breath, and his hips twitch forward, generously helping you to breach your throat barrier and causing you to splutter around him. Tears well up in your eyes, but you stay down on his cock, pushing down all the way until the neatly trimmed hair on the base of his length tickles your nose.

“Fuck… You’re so pretty when you gag on it.”

You pull off of him, only managing to swallow half the spit that gathered in your mouth while the rest drips down your chin, but he doesn’t seem to mind at all. Crane’s hand massages the back of your head encouragingly, and you flash him a bright smile before you go back down at him with a little more vigor.

After a while, you go to catch your breath, but before you can pull away completely, both his hands shoot out to grab your head and push you back down on his cock. Your eyes widen, and you let out a slight noise of protest as he begins to fuck into your throat. Drool dribbles down your chin, soiling the shirt of your patient uniform while your nails dig into Crane’s thighs in an attempt to ground yourself. He clenches his jaw, moaning through his teeth while your throat contracts around him.

“Perfect little cocksucker… so eager to show me your love…” He cuts himself off with a little grunt, and his grip on your head tightens as he moves your skull up and down. “All the way down… yes, keep your tongue out…”

You continue to gag around his length, trying to keep up with the rhythm of his thrusts as he forces his cock down your pharynx, enjoying the way your muscles clench and contract. His soft moans become more urgent, and pride makes your heart swell. He’s making these noises because of you.

“That’s it… good girl. Eyes on me. I want you to look at my face when I cum down your pretty little throat...”

You whine in response, nodding your head as best as you can, and you start to work in tandem with him as he gets close. The moment you feel him pulse on your tongue, he pushes you down all the way again, and his hand reaches around to your face. You catch a dark glint in his eyes when he suddenly pinches your nose shut, constricting your airflow completely as he chokes you on his cock. You struggle against him, but he doesn’t budge as his eyes fall shut and he grunts out more praise. Panic rises in your chest, and your muscles convulse in a desperate attempt to get air into your neglected lungs. And it’s exactly this panic in your eyes that pushes Crane over the edge and he shoots his load directly down your throat, giving you no other option but to swallow the hot ropes of cum that he lazily continues to fuck into your mouth.

Finally, he lets go of your head, and you immediately flinch back to suck in some much-needed air. The both of you are panting, and you keep your watery eyes locked on his satisfied expression while strings of spit still connect your swollen lips to the flushed head of his cock.

“You okay?”

“Yeah...“ you breathe out in reply, trying to swallow the soreness in your throat. Crane’s hand reaches out to you again, caressing your head like a cherished pet, and he chuckles to himself.

“Catch your breath, doll. That was one hell of a way to prove yourself…” He murmurs, reaching across the table to retrieve the pack of pocket tissues and hand it to you. Your fingers are a little shaky as you wipe the mess from your chin and neck, and you slowly return to your chair. Crane’s brows furrow when he watches you retreat, and you blink at him.

Immediately, your thoughts begin to spiral. What are you doing? Sitting back down, that much is evident. Did he want you to stay and keep on sucking him off? Were you supposed to keep the spit on your face intact? Does he – Crane effectively snaps you out of your mental gymnastics routine by brushing his foot against your calf, and you’re immediately focused on the butterflies that fill up your chest.

“What?”

“What are you doing?” He asks, not bothering to elaborate.

“As far as I’m concerned, you behaved very well just now. So, I’d like to keep my word and reward you.”

He points over to the leather couch in the corner of his office, and you find yourself standing before he can even fully extend his arm. Crane follows after you, leading you with his hands on your hips until your knees softly bump against the furniture. He’s pressed up behind you, breathing in the scent of your skin while his hands begin to trail all over your body. You tilt your head back, resting it on his shoulder as his touch slips under your shirt, and you can feel the way his fingers are trembling against your flesh. Crane clicks his tongue as he pinches your nipples, slowly rolling the hardening bud between index and thumb in a way that makes you jolt in his grasp.

“Let me see what I’m working with, doll,” he murmurs, pulling your shirt over your head and tossing it aside before the cotton bustier that the asylum provided follows suit. Your first instinct is to shy away, but he grabs your shoulders and spins you around to get a good look at you. His gaze is detached. Clinical. And you can feel yourself shrinking away until he finally decides to open his mouth. “Fucking hell… maybe I should’ve indulged you sooner.”

It isn’t much in terms of a compliment, but to you it might as well be a marriage proposal. Your breath catches in your lungs as Crane leans in, sucking your nipple into his mouth while his hands wander lower to push down your pants and sneak into your underwear. He chuckles when his fingers dip into the mess that has built up between your thighs.

“Did sucking my cock make you this wet already?”

“I mean… it is a pretty cock…” you try to defend your already half-unraveled state, and he lets out a laugh. A genuine one of honest amusement, and the noise makes your heart soar up into the sky.

“Quiet. Lie back on the couch for me, sweetheart.” The new pet name almost makes your body collapse in on itself. Your back meets the cold faux leather, and you let out a quiet hiss of discomfort as you sink a little into the cushions. Crane pulls your pants and underwear off completely, letting them join the already existing pile on the floor before he gets on the couch with you. He grabs your thighs, pulling you a little closer so he can rest your legs over his shoulders while he lies flat between them. His breath ghosts over your pussy, and he spreads your folds open with his thumbs to get a good look at your drooling entrance.

“Pretty… so, so pretty,” he murmurs, kissing up the insides of your thighs before he circles his tongue around your eager hole, savoring your taste with a deep, guttural groan.

You reach out your hand to hold his, but he swats it away, causing you to give his hair a harsh tug when he doesn’t do as you want him to. This, however makes him answer with a rough bite to the meat of your thigh, and you’re almost embarrassed by the wanton noise that slips past your lips. Pain tingles down your spine, and you try to sit up, only for him to push you back down. In a second attempt, you manage to catch his hand and immediately link your fingers together so he can’t escape your clammy, possessive grip. To your absolute delight, he’s not even trying to this time around. You knew he’d come around.

His tongue dances around your dripping entrance yet again, licking a stripe up your pussy that makes your grip on his hand tighten and your toes curl. Finally, finally, he sinks a finger into you, already sliding in to where his digit meets his palm, and he moans along with you when he feels how your pussy flutters around him.

“Jonathan…”

For the first time, he doesn’t correct you. Instead, he chooses to lean in and devour you, eagerly lapping at your juicy cunt as he presses the pad of his fingers against that sweet spot inside of you. He’s insatiable, parting your folds with his tongue and groaning at your taste as you grind your clit against the diligent muscle. And his eyes. Oh, God his eyes. He’s almost crushing you beneath his heated gaze, keeping you pinned while he eats you out like a starved man. Now, it’s Jonathan’s turn to get messy, and he doesn’t mind in the slightest as your saccharine slick coats his chin. He adds another finger into your cunt, pulling away from your clit to bite and suck on your thighs while he stretches you open.

“Fuck – “

“Just another finger, doll. Let yourself go for me…” He murmurs between licks and gentle bites as he returns to your pussy, his glasses fogging up from the heat.

Your hands are still intertwined, even as your back arches and you continue to pant and moan out his name. Even as your breath hitches when he latches back onto that sensitive bundle of nerves. Even when he adds a third finger and you finally come on his tongue with a wail that sounds as blissful as it does delirious.

Your brain is clouded by euphoria, and your bite your lip to keep quiet as he continues to pump his fingers inside of you. You can hear the mess he’s made between your thighs. A mix of his saliva and your juices, and Jonathan is not wasting a single drop of it. Pleasure quickly turns to overstimulation, and you only faintly register the little laugh he lets out at your state.

“Christ, I want to kiss that expression off your face… Actually, don’t mind if I do.”

Jonathan leans over you, laughing again when he gets a closer look at your expression. And then months of yearning and dreams of romance become reality when his lips meet yours. Fireworks go off in your head, and you immediately pull him closer, almost causing him to topple over on top of you. It’s messy and overly excited on your part, but you couldn’t care less as your teeth clash a few times and you lick against his tongue and taste yourself on it.

Jonathan pulls back for a moment, despite the vise grip you have on his shoulders, but he calms you by pressing his lips against your brow, whispering like he’s trying to calm a wild animal. “Easy there… come on, be good.”

You whine in response, but when his thumb brushes over your clit again, your body jolts and you immediately shut up. Jonathan pushes his own pants down further, freeing his leaking cock again and giving himself a few pumps before he pushes his hips forward to coat his length in your slick. Every time the heard of his cock brushes up against you, you let out a soft little noise, and it’s in that moment that Jonathan decides he’d like to hear a lot more of it in the future. He grits his teeth, slowly sinking into your cunt while keeping his eyes fixed on yours.

Once upon a time, you were nothing special. You have an interesting backstory, sure. And your obsession with him does wonders for his ego. But right here, right now, something cracks the stony façade and he silently dares to venture a little further into the dreamworld you’ve built around the two of you. He sees parts of himself in you. The obsessive, volatile behavior. The inability to love in a way that’s considered normal. The desire to possess something or someone in its entirety.

You shiver when he bottoms out inside of you, his hips meeting yours and slightly squishing you into the faux leather cushions of the couch. You’re still tight and sensitive from your previous climax, and Jonathan can feel your pulse in the velvety walls of your pussy that’s clenched around him. Despite your heightened sensitivity, his thumb returns to your clit, rubbing a tight figure eight into it that makes your head spin. His other hand leaves yours, grabbing your jaw instead to keep you from squirming.

“You’re gonna come for me again,” he states, rubbing you a little faster and applying more pressure along with it. Your muscles tighten, and your heart hammers in your chest as you stare up at him through half-lidded eyes.

“C… can you – “

“Move?” he finishes for you, pressing his forehead against yours. “Only if you cum again, I’m afraid. It’ll be another reward.”

You sob out a moan, face scrunching up when that familiar pressure begins to build inside of you for a second time. Jonathan keeps his hand on your jaw, watching every twitch and flinch of your expression with a look of genuine fascination.

“God, why would anyone ever leave you…” he murmurs, and his word pierce right into your heart and the black depths of your lonely little soul. “Pretty thing… if you didn’t break his legs, I’d recommend for him to get a cell on the opposite end of the hall…”

Your breath hitches as he continues to rub your clit and softly speak to you. “Insanity, I tell you… abandoning such a cute toy... It’s beyond me.” He lets out a soft groan when you tighten around his cock. “That’s it… thaaat’s it.”

You reach the edge again, clenching your eyes shut as you come a second time. Jonathan captures your lips with his own yet again, and while you’re stuck on cloud nine, he pulls his cock out all the way only to slam back inside with an intensity that pushes the air from your lungs. You cry into his mouth as he picks up a consistent, slow rhythm of deep thrusts that make your eyes clench shut. Jonathan releases you from the kiss and gives your jaw a little warning squeeze, wanting your eyes to stay on his while he’s rearranging your anatomy with his cock.

“There we go… stretched open so well.”

You squirm back on your elbows, looking up at him with dilated pupils and burning cheeks, but he grabs your waist and pulls you back right to the base of his cock. A truly sinful noise spills from your lips and for a moment you don't even register that it came from you.

Crane chuckles as he starts to roll his hips again, his right hand hovering dangerously close to your poor, abused clit again. A silent threat almost. Then again, he's quite literally threatening you with a good time.

"S'too much...," you groan out, your body rocking every time he spears you open with his girth.

"Shh... no, no.." he tuts, tightening his grip to prevent you from escaping. "You're gonna stay right here and take it. Stay right. Fucking. Here."

Every word he speaks is empathized by a sharp thrust into your drooling cunt, causing you to howl in pleasure and claw at his back. Every nerve in your body is on fire, drowning you in sweet, sweet agony.

"You wanted this, right? For months you've been begging. And now it's suddenly too much?"

You can only nod, babbling some incoherent nonsense in response. Crane lets out a condescending laugh which quickly twists into a moan when you clench around his cock. No matter how much he tries to pretend, he's just as close as you are.

His fingers dig into the flesh of your thighs, clinging to you like you're a lifeboat in a storm as he keeps on thrusting into your slick heat.

"So good for me... God, you're so beautiful when you're sweet and obedient... accepting your reward like a good little patient."

You look up at him, trying to focus on his flushed face even though your eyes are rolling back in your head. Crane leans down to capture your mouth in another heated kiss, nipping at your lips and tasting your tongue while he moans down your throat.

The rhythm of his hips stutters when he pulls away to press his face into the crook of your neck, and suck and bite at your skin in a desperate attempt to leave traces of himself.

“Are you going to cum again?” He groans into your skin, flattening his tongue against your pulse.

“N… no…” you whine

“No? This –“ He’s cut off by a moan of his own, and it takes a moment for him to pull himself together to finish his sentence. “This is your reward, doll… We’re going to have to work on – fffuck – on gratitude…”

“I can’t...! Please… please…” you beg, but you’re not sure what you’re even begging for. Certainly not for him to stop.

“You can’t? Well… you’re going to.” His thrusts begin to get faster and more erratic as he tries to fuck into you as deeply as possible “Do it for me, hm? Just for me…”

“No- fuck, please! Jonathan -!!” Tears well up in your eyes from the delicious pain, and you actually scream when he starts to rub your clit again. Colors explode behind your closed eyelids. “Please, please, please- “

“I know you can do it… one more time, doll… Just one more time…”

And you finally do as you’re told, cumming around his cock with an intensity that feels as if someone punched you in the gut. Your brain short-circuits, and you’re not even making noises anymore as he fucks you through your climax like you’re a toy that was handmade for his pleasure.

“Fuuuck – Christ, fuck -“ Jonathan’s voice completely lacks the air of authority and superiority that you are so used to when he whimpers into your neck, his hands tightening around you. It feels like you’re wrapped in cotton, and you can only hear him faintly due to the volume of your pulse that’s hammering in your ears. Finally, his hips still, and he sinks down on top of you as he finishes inside of your fluttering cunt. Rational thought is absent in this moment, and you’re absolutely certain that this is what paradise must feel like. Connected to the one you love so dearly. Overwhelmed by pleasure.

For a long while, the office is silent aside from the rugged breathing that’s coming from both of you, and you bask in his warmth, absolutely content to stay like this for the rest of time. Jonathan clears his dry throat, lifting himself up onto his elbows as he looks down at you, and you’re struck by overwhelming affection once again.

“I love you…”

“Shut up…” But there’s no bite to it. He huffs out a laugh and shakes his head, and for a moment, there’s a very real glimpse of fondness in his eyes. Crane stays silent, taking in your features like it’s the first time he sees you properly, and his hand comes up to gingerly trace over your cheekbone and eyebrow before he brushes a strand of hair out of your forehead. Then finally, he lets out a soft breath before he murmurs gently, intimately.

“Looks like I’ll have to come up with more rewards in the future.”

[pumpkinpaix]

Hello! Feel free not to answer this question if it is in any way too much, but I've been wondering about something concerning the "western" mdzs fandom. Lately, i have seen multiple pieces of fanart that use what is clearly Christian symbolism and sometimes downright iconography in depicting the characters. I'm a european fan, but it still makes me vaguely uneasy. I know that these things are rarely easy to judge. I'm definitely not qualified to do so and was wondering if you have an opinion

Hi there! thank you for your patience and for the interesting question! I’ve been thinking about this since i received this ask because it?? idk, it’s difficult to answer, but it also touches on a a few things that I find really interesting.

the short answer: it’s complicated, and I also don’t know what I feel!

the longer answer:

i think that this question is particularly difficult to answer because of how deeply christianity is tied to the western art and literary canon. so much of what is considered great european art is christian art! If you just take a quick glance at wiki’s page on european art, you can see how inextricable christianity is, and how integral christian iconography has been in the history of european art. If you study western art history, you must study christian imagery and christian canon because it’s just impossible to engage with a lot of the work in a meaningful way without it. that’s just the reality of it.

Christianity, of course, also has a strong presence in european colonial and imperialist history and has been used as a tool of oppression against many peoples and nations, including China. I would be lying if I said I had a good relationship with Christianity--I have always faced it with a deep suspicion because I think it did some very, very real damage, not just to chinese people, but to many cultures and peoples around the world, and that’s not a trauma that can be easily brushed aside or reconciled with.

here is what is also true: my maternal grandmother was devoutly christian. my aunt is devoutly christian. my uncle’s family is devoutly christian. my favorite cousin is devoutly christian. when I attended my cousin’s wedding, he had both a traditional chinese ceremony (tea-serving, bride-fetching, ABSURDLY long reception), and also a christian ceremony in a church. christianity is a really important part of his life, just as it’s important to my uncle’s family, and as it was important to my grandmother. I don’t think it’s my right or place to label them as simply victims of a colonialist past--they’re real people with real agency and choice and beliefs. I think it would be disrespectful to act otherwise.

that doesn’t negate the harm that christianity has done--but it does complicate things. is it inherently a bad thing that they’re christian, due to the political history of the religion and their heritage? that’s... not a question I’m really interested in debating. the fact remains that they are christian, that they are chinese, and that they chose their religion.

so! now here we are with mdzs, a chinese piece of media that is clearly Not christian, but is quickly gaining popularity in euroamerican spaces. people are making fanart! people are making A LOT of fanart! and art is, by nature, intertextual. a lot of the most interesting art (imo) makes deliberate use of that! for example (cyan art nerdery time let’s go), Nikolai Ge’s What is Truth?

I love this painting! it’s notable for its unusual depiction of christ: shabby, unkempt, slouched, in shadow. if you look for other paintings of this scene, christ is usually dignified, elegant, beautiful, melancholy -- there’s something very humanizing and humbling about this depiction, specifically because of the way it contrasts the standard. it’s powerful because we as the audience are expected to be familiar with the iconography of this scene, the story behind it, and its place in the christian canon.

you can make similar comments about Gentileschi’s Judith vs Caravaggio’s, or Manet’s Olympia vs Ingres’ Grande Odalisque -- all of these paintings exist in relation to one another and also to the larger canon (i’m simplifying: you can’t just compare one to another directly in isolation etc etc.) Gauguin’s Jacob Wrestling the Angel is also especially interesting because of how its portrayal of its content contrasts to its predecessors!

or! because i’m really In It now, one of my favorite paintings in the world, Joan of Arc by Bastien-Lepage:

I just!!! gosh, idk, what’s most interesting to me in this painting is the way it seems to hover between movements: the hyperrealistic, neoclassical-esque take on the figure, but the impressionistic brushstrokes of the background AAA gosh i love it so much. it’s really beautiful if you ever get a chance to see it in person at the Met. i’m putting this here both because i personally just really like it and also as an example of how intertextuality isn’t just about content, but also about visual elements.

anyways, sorry most of this is 19thc, that was what i studied the most lol.

(a final note: if you want to read about a really interesting painting that sits in the midst of just a Lot of different works, check out the wiki page on Géricault’s Raft of the Medusa, specifically under “Interpretation and Legacy”)

this is all a really long-winded way of getting to this point: if you want to make allusory fanart of mdzs with regards to western art canon, you kind of have to go out of your way to avoid christian imagery/iconography, especially when that’s the lens through which a lot of really intensely emotional art was created. many of my favorite paintings are christian: Vrubel’s Demon, Seated, Perov’s Christ in the Garden of Gethsemane, Ge’s Conscience, Judas, Bastien-Lepage’s Joan of Arc, as shown above. that’s not to say there ISN’T plenty of non-christian art -- but christian art is very prominent and impossible to ignore.

so here are a few pieces of fanwork that I’ve seen that are very clearly making allusions to christian imagery:

1. this beautiful pietà nielan by tinynarwhals on twitter

2. a lovely jiang yanli as our lady of tears by @satuwilhelmiina

3. my second gif in this set here, which I will also show below:

i’m only going to talk about mine in depth because well, i know exactly what i was thinking when I put this gif together while I can’t speak for anyone else.

first: the two lines of the song that I wanted to use for lan xichen were “baby, I’m a fighter//in the robes of a saint” because i felt that they fit him very well. of course, just the word “saint” evokes catholicism, even if it’s become so entwined in the english language that it’s taken on a secular meaning as well.

second: when I saw this scene, my immediate thought was just “PIETÀ!!” because LOOK at that composition! lan xichen’s lap! nie mingjue lying perpendicular to it! the light blue/white/silver of lan xichen in contrast to the darker robes of both nie mingjue and meng yao! not just that, but the very cool triangular structure of the image is intensely striking, and Yes, i Do love that it simultaneously ALSO evokes deposition of christ vibes. (baxia as the cross.... god..... is that not the Tightest Shit) does this make meng yao joseph of arimathea? does it make him john the evangelist? both options are equally interesting, I think when viewed in relation to his roles in the story: as a spy in qishan and as nmj’s deputy. maybe he’s both.

anyways, did I do this intentionally? yes, though a lot of it is happy accident/discovered after the fact since I’m relying on CQL to have provided the image. i wanted to draw attention to all of that by superimposing that line over that image! (to be clear: I didn’t expect it to all come through because like. that’s ridiculous. the layers you’d have to go through to get from “pretty lxc gifset” --> “if we cast nie mingjue as a christ figure, what is the interesting commentary we could do on meng yao by casting him as either joseph of arimathea or john the evangelist” are like. ok ur gonna need to work a little harder than slapping a song lyric over an image to achieve an effect like that.)

the point of this is: yes, it’s intentionally christian, yes I did this, yes I am casting these very much non-christian characters into christian roles for this specific visual work -- is this okay?

I obviously thought it was because I made it. but would I feel the same about a work that was written doing something similar? probably not. I think that would make me quite uncomfortable in most situations. but there’s something about visual art that makes it slightly different that I have trouble articulating -- something about how the visual often seeks to illustrate parallels or ideas, whereas writing characters as a different religion can fundamentally change who those characters are, the world they inhabit, etc. in a more... invasive?? way. that’s still not quite right, but I genuinely am not sure how to explain what i mean! I hope the general idea comes across. ><

something else to think about is like, what are pieces I find acceptable and why?

what makes the pieces above that reference christian imagery different than this stunning nieyao piece by @cyandemise after klimt’s kiss? (warnings for like, dead bodies and vague body horror) like i ADORE this piece (PLEASE click for fullview it’s worth it for the quality). it’s incredibly beautiful and evocative and very obviously references a piece of european art. I have no problem with it. why? because it isn’t explicitly christian? it’s still deeply entrenched in western canon. klimt certainly made other pieces that were explicit christian references.

another piece I’d like to invite you all to consider is this incredible naruto fanart of sakura and ino beheading sasuke after caravaggio’s judith. (warnings for beheading, blood, etc. you know.) i also adore this piece! i think it’s very good both technically and conceptually. the reference that it makes has a real power when viewed in relation to the roles of the characters in their original story -- seeing the women that sasuke fucked over and treated so disrespectfully collaborating in his demise Says Something. this is also!! an explicitly christian reference made with non-christian japanese characters. is this okay? does it evoke the same discomfort as seeing mdzs characters being drawn with christian iconography? why or why not?

the point is, I don’t think there’s a neat answer, but I do think there are a lot of interesting issues surrounding cultural erasure/hegemony that are raised by this question. i don’t think there are easy resolutions to any of them either, but I think that it’s a good opportunity to reexamine our own discomfort and try and see where it comes from. all emotions are valid but not all are justified etc. so I try to ask, is it fair? do i apply my criticisms and standards equally? why or why not? does it do real harm, or do i just not like it? what makes one work okay and another not?

i’ve felt that there’s a real danger with the kind of like, deep moral scrutiny of recent years in quashing interesting work in the name of fear. this morality tends to be expressed in black and white, good and bad dichotomies that i really do think stymies meaningful conversation and progress. you’ll often see angry takes that boil down to things like, “POC good, queer people good, white people bad, christianity bad” etc. without a serious critical examination of the actual issues at hand. I feel that these are extraordinarily harmful simplifications that can lead to an increased insularity that isn’t necessarily good for anyone. there’s a fine line between asking people to stay in their lane and cultural gatekeeping sometimes, and I think that it’s something we should be mindful of when we’re engaging in conversations about cultural erasure, appropriation etc.

PERHAPS IT IS OBVIOUS that I have no idea where that line falls LMAO since after all that rambling I have given you basically nothing. but! I hope that you found it interesting at least, and that it gives you a bit more material to think on while you figure out where you stand ahaha.

was this just an excuse to show off cool (fan)art i like? maybe ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

(ko-fi)

[romulussy]

Hello I was the anon with the insane Roman thoughts earlier! love ur points, very much agree roman’s been to therapy but only for a bit (also think he does the thing where he’s a bit attached to his suffering so he kind of rejects help because of it)

So my gender thoughts! they’re mostly about both shiv and Roman. Roman in particular I think could read very interesting as a trans man who lacks confidence in his own masculinity, a trans woman who doesn’t get it yet (imagine the internalized shame of that after growing up with Logan and after the way he’s treated for not being masculine enough even with people seeing him as cis? Also makes the “Roman fills the ‘daughter’ duties of the family better than shiv but both are resented for that due to their sexes’ thing the show has going kind of more interesting tbh) and/or a non-binary person/non-binary man who will never get it because like. Environment, Fox News etc. It’s not necessarily that I think Roman isn’t cis in canon, but I do think that interpreting Roman in those ways can be compelling for different reasons and is all possible with how vague everything is.

Shiv I also think could be read as a non-binary woman who will never get it. Her disconnection to her own womanhood is so compelling to me & it’s clear to me that she barely even considers her gender aside from when it’s used against her (to her surprise) or she can use it strategically. There’s this remove she seems to feel from women in general. Ofc this is just as interesting and realistic as a cis woman with internalized misogyny & who fails to perform expected femininity but yeah idk it was just a thought I had that I felt worth thinking about in it implications are least

Obviously I do think that Roman and Shiv both being obviously bisexual/gay within canon does affect their gender performance and identity and is actually a really interesting parallel, how both of the children coded queer are the ones Logan is unsatisfied for because they fail to fill the gender stereotypes he expects, and this is just as much an experience relatable to cis gayness ofc and there’s interesting analysis to be had there too

Oof that’s long oops hope this is something???

he’s a bit attached to his suffering so he kind of rejects help because of it oooooo very good point, i can def see that with him

also i love the parallel you've drawn between shiv and roman. with shiv i've always attributed that disconnect she has with women as internalised misogyny and a product of the environment she grew up in, but i love this spin and can def see where you're coming from!! and again i agree there are multiple ways to read roman, and the tragedy ofc is that regardless of what you settle on, he's never going to be at ease with his identity with logan still in his life.

also that last part makes me want to eat drywall because like, if roman could perform the masculine ideal logan wants from his son, logan would respect him more for it (though there'd still be a million other things to pick at, no doubt), whereas even if shiv fit logan's ideal of what his daughter should be like, she's still always going to be at a disadvantage because ultimately she's still a woman.

[mozukumi]

sorry for the two asks but i saw that guy was the youngest then i remembered his backstory... and omg, how is he related to citron this time?? is his arc gonna be like act 5 masumi? :0 AND TAICHI THE GODZA ACTOR??? AM I THINKING CORRECTLY?? IS HE THE GODZA TOP IN THIS AU???

also... kumon finding his brother at mankai when they thought he was dead... WGGFNFJDBSJF AND JUZA LOOKING AFTER SAKYO TO MAKE SURE HE DOESN'T GO DOWN THE SAME PATH AS HE DID also does sakyo still meet azami or not :0? because i find it pretty funny to think that azami is the dad this time instead of sakyo

- 🌸

ANON AS ALWAYS... i give your asks a big ol chefs kiss! no need to apologize, it means a lot to me that you care so much!

As always, I cannot stop talking abt this AU, so it's under the cut. For those who don't know what mAnkAi swAp is (link to tag), it's an age and role swap AU for A3!

IM ALSO VERY GLAD THAT YOU NOTICED GUY WAS THE YOUNGEST BC IT MAKES ME. Man. I get emo.

Guy - So his basic attitude and demeanor is relatively similar to canon, actually! He still believes himself to be an android, and thinks his only purpose in life is to serve Citron.

The differences really shine when it comes to his interactions with Citron, though. Whereas in canon Guy is implied to be like, around the same age as Azuma - so definitely an older figure in his life. But here? Citron and Guy have the same age difference and him and Tangerine. He is distinctly and noticeably young in ways that Citron will never be able to avoid thinking about.

Of course, Citron still teases Guy. That is a classic sibling dynamic, after all. But his approach is much MUCH softer then in canon. [sidenote: I always forget if um, it's canon that the reason Citron always tried to rile Guy up was to try and get him to feel his emotions again, or if that was just something I made up. Either way, that's how I view Citrons POV in canon, and it's a lens that colors my approach to this AU.]

After Act 8 completes, Guy realizes that he has this brand new world (mankai stage voice: BRAND NEW WOOORLD) to explore, this whole new life... it's definitely a daunting task for him. But thankfully, he has all of Mankai to help him navigate it.

I hadn't actually considered drawing parallels to act 5 Masumi before, but I think that makes a ton of sense anon!!

As for Godza, this ask made me realize um. An assumption I had made regarding Godza that has some big implications in this AU: my vague memory of it was that Godza was only formed after Mankai had disbanded. This ask made me realize that I'm not sure if that's the case? I plan to do a reread soon to try and clarify this, but I'm glad you asked bc it got me thinking abt it!

And Taichi isn't currently involved in Godza in this AU - actually, the vague idea I've been floating is that Omi is the Godza traitor. We know he just found out about Nachi's dream of becoming an actor when he was 20, and he's 21 in this AU. So he joined Godza when it was first formed, just after he learned of Nachi's dream, but he never got any big roles. Reni offered him the chance to be the spy, and he told himself that he had already spent a year of his life doing this, and that he shouldn't half-ass fulfilling Nachi's dream. He wanted to be a star actor. So Omi had to see this through.

Taichi, whose plot thread for this AU that I've been pitching is 'he was involved in the scandal that defamed Tenma' (SIDENOTE: the reason famed actor Tenma Sumeragi joins the inky dinky Mankai Company in this AU is that he was involved in a major scandal that ruined his reputation in the TV community. what exactly this scandal was hasn't been decided, but Tenma didn't actually do anything wrong. He just got caught up in the wrong place at the wrong time, or perhaps he took the fall to cover for somebody else.) And so when he realizes what Omi is doing, he can't bring himself to speak up, because he can relate.

AND MAN YEAH... Kumon doesn't actually think Juza is dead, though - they've been getting money transfers from him every month, so they know he's alive, he just. Refuses to show himself. (How exactly Muku comes into this equation I'm not sure. Much to think about.)

And I mentioned this in the previous ask, but Azami does become a father figure for Sakyo, yes! Even though he won't let Sakyo join the yakuza, Sakyo is a persistent bugger, so he keeps trying to ask. And so eventually Azami is like "I'm not letting you join my yakuza you brat. Do you want to come in for some tea tho."

as always, anon.... ty for caring so much.

[breadboylovin]

NEW POST FOR MY 95060 PLAYLIST!!! complete with explanations of every song choice under the cut because i love explaining my own creative decisions for some reason (PLEASE DO NOT FEEL COMPELLED TO READ ALL OF IT IF YOU DONT WANT TO ITS VERY LONG LOL). i may add a few songs here and there later on, or more likely rearrange what i've already put in slightly, but for now i consider it done.

alright now heres a look into my twisted mind

PART 1: TEMPTATION

Franz Ferdinand - Michael: It's a song about seducing someone named Michael. What more can I ask for (serious explanation is that it’s also very homosexually charged like you just have to listen to it… also feels taunting in a way where it’s like ‘oooooh you want me so bad’ and he’s RIGHT Michael DOES want him so bad). Also credit to this post for letting me know this song existed and inspiring me to make this playlist in the first place :-3

Mystery Skulls - Paralyzed: Just another song about how Michael is awestruck by David and feels compelled to follow him for whatever reason (the reason is that he wants him so bad)

TAEMIN - WANT: This is one of three Taemin songs on here because I think if David survived until present day he would fucking LOVE Taemin. Anyways this is a song about knowing you’re hot shit and everyone wants you and I think after seducing Michael through fucking?? Fatal motorcycle races and evil noodle mind tricks??? David deserves to feel that

Glass Animals - Gooey: OHGHGHGHFH THIS SONG… the vibes are impeccable on this one, Dave Bayley’s alluring voice feels like a slight remix of what David is going for and the way it feels like the singer is trying to convince the listener of something (even though it’s purposely vague) just FEELS like David with Michael. The line “I can’t take this place, I can’t take this place/I just need to go where I can get some space” especially fits when imagining how Michael is new to Santa Carla and may want a place to belong that David and the boys are happy to provide

TAEMIN - Impressionable: I see this as the moment that Michael downs the bottle of “wine”, where this song is David’s internal monologue reveling in how easy it was to charm Michael and get him to join. I always thought this sounded like a taunting villain song so it just fits. Also it’s like ridiculously horny which is a plus

PART 2: THE RELATIONSHIP ITSELF

MGMT - Me and Michael: In my head this is directly after Michael drinks the “wine”, and if it were an actual song in the movie, it’d play instead of Cry Little Sister in that scene. I already made art related to this but I really just love the juxtaposition between something that Michael will later see as horrible (becoming a half-vampire) and David seeing it as a perfect slow-dance moment. Also “Me and Michael, it’s not a question now” because the blood drinking has now linked them together… mmmmm. Credit to this post again for making me find this song!!

ALI - DESPERADO: This one is less about David and Michael specifically and more about how the night in the cave went down for everyone there, starting with a soft slowness as they ate and then descending into chaos as Michael downs the wine and they celebrate a new addition to the pack. The bacchanal energy is off the charts

Dorian Electra - Man to Man: This song is just one that I attribute to all of the boys because I think they do a lot of homoerotic sparring. Also the part of the movie where Michael punches David in the face and David just goes >:-3 back at him

Chase Atlantic - Friends: I don't know what it is about this one but it just Hits… The chorus kinda sounds like David and the boys trying to convince Michael to stay with them instead of coming back to human society after drinking the blood, in the same sort of taunting manner that they had when David (presumably?) made Michael hallucinate the bike lights and sounds outside of his house

Taking Back Sunday - You're So Last Summer: THIS SONG IS JUST REALLY GOOD. I don't know what it is about this one either… I guess the “Maybe I should hate you for this/Never really did ever quite get that far” part could represent the first glimpse of Michael’s more conflicted feelings about David. Also the second half of verse 2 not only fucks so hard but could also be indicative of Michael’s repressed gay feelings, lying to himself about how he wanted to be around David because he’s cool or whatever but he actually just has the hots for him and would let him do anything if he asked to

MGMT - Little Dark Age: Mostly here just for vibes. Have y’all seen that one edit set to this song? Yeah

The Neighborhood - Prey: I feel like this song captures the general unease that Michael feels right before he sees the boys kill for the first time, knowing that he’s probably turning into a vampire and something horrible is happening… especially with “Something is wrong, I feel like prey” just generally describing what it must feel like to be a human among vampires (though he’s not fully human anymore at this point)

PART 3: REALIZATION + FIGHTING BACK

TAEMIN - Criminal: YET ANOTHER TAEMIN SONG!!!! It’s all about realizing you're with someone who’s like, an evil manipulative villain and genuinely bad for you but you can’t escape just yet because you’re kinda into it. I don't think David is THAT bad of a guy, but Michael could be like “I need to get out of this situation because this man is a vampire but I feel attracted to him and it’s hard to really get away”. Also the line “My hands holding yours that stabbed me are not clean either” just HITS cus Michael hates David’s vampirism but HE’S a half-vampire now so it’s not like he’s innocent either. This is just a really good 95060 song AND a good song in general, listen to it even if you don't normally like K-pop cus it slaps

Glass Animals - Wyrd: This would be the moment where Michael snaps out of it and just starts running away, but to no avail, because he’s still a half-vampire (“You can’t run so you must hide” meaning that he can’t outrun his new monstrous nature, the best he can do is hide it until it eats him alive). Meanwhile David laments over how this is a stupid decision from his perspective (“So, my friend, our time is done/You and I could’ve had so much”)

Moonface - Minotaur Forgiving Theseus: This is a very veeeeery bitter song from Michael’s perspective about David being a vampire… with the “You’re just a hitman” repetition referencing how David. Y’know. Eats people. And the “I heard you're coming for me now” references both how David first approached him and the impending confrontation

The Neighborhood - The Beach: This song goes from the bitterness of the previous one to a pseudo-acceptance of the end of their brief friendship and what’s inevitably going to happen next. However, I think the bridge of the song illustrates the little bit of Michael that doesn’t want this to happen, that wants this relationship to somehow work out because he cares about David even if he is a vampire (unfortunately he ends up repressing this because he feels a duty to kill David now)

Gorillaz - Rhinestone Eyes: This is mostly in here because of the music video, the buildup to a battle just echoes in my head whenever I hear this song now. In the context of this playlist it makes me imagine David looking up at the Emerson’s house from the hotel (and Michael doing the opposite) knowing that something’s about to happen and it’s going to be horrible

Glass Animals - JDNT: This entire song feels like the climax of the movie. Verse 1 feels like the Emersons and Frogs getting ready to attack the cave (“I’m all armored up”) with “I feel that final poke” being when Marko gets staked, and the chorus right after is a tinge of regret that Michael feels once the plan starts to take shape. Verse 2 is the other boys waking up to see that Marko is dead + them dying themselves (“Where my funny friends gone?”) and the bridge is Michael and David’s fight before Michael finally gores David on the antlers. The outro of “You can’t breathe without me” VERY much feels like David taunting Michael from beyond the grave, knowing how much Michael loved him and how horrible what he’s just done is

PART 4: GRIEF

The Brazen Youth - Burn Slowly/I Love You: Ooooooghghgh the conflicted feelings about their relationship is STRONG in this one… The “Burn Slowly” part being him trying to convince himself that he did the right thing by killing David while the “I Love You” part is him realizing that he really did love David and it fucking hurts

Sufjan Stevens - The Predatory Wasp Of The Palisades Is Out To Get Us: MAN. MAN… Everything past “I can’t explain the state that I'm in” is just so… it’s Michael realizing what he had even more and just how much it hurts that he’s lost it. He knows he was in love now and it fucking hurts SO MUCH!!!!!

Sufjan Stevens - The Only Thing: [head in my fucking hands] Michael moping around Santa Carla because it feels empty without David. All the “should I tear my eyes out now?/Should I tear my heart out now?” parts oh my GOOOOOOOOD sufjan stevens i'm going to slap you on the head.

Paramore - Tell Me How: THIS SONG HURTS SO MUCH ITS SO. It’s another one about conflicting feelings so theoretically it should be earlier in the story but I always envision something very morbid when listening to this (and have now written a fic about it so check that out)… Michael going back to the hotel where he put David’s body and musing to no one, asking how he’s supposed to feel now, the “And always coming to your defenses” where Michael keeps defending David and their relationship to his family who all think David was a horrible monster… this song fucking hurts. Also I unintentionally drew a parallel between JDNT’s “You can’t breathe without me” and this song’s “Do I suffocate or let go?” and now that I’ve realized that it hurts even more. Fuck this song

[geckomoon]

Yuri!!! on ice as irl skaters (part 1???)

Its 2020 and I miss yoi so here are my personal headcanons about which irl skater the you cast skate &/or act like because why the hell not.

(photos at the bottom of the post because I couldn't get the format to work the way I wanted it to)

Yuri Katsuki ➡️ Boyang Jin (China)/Evgenia Medvedeva (Russia)

Yes, 2 people because PARALLELS.

So my reason for saying Yuri is like Boyang is because, his step sequences are always gorgeous and his jumping power, oofttttt, and that one scene where Yuri tries a jump and lands in the wall, you know the one. Boyang Jin is known for jumping super close to the boards and scaring the hell out of us all, seriously, just watch one of his skates, it's amazing and terrifying. Also Boyang is a bit of a nerd and Yuri is canonicaly pretty into video games, nuff said.

Boyang is a two-time World bronze medalist (2016–2017), the 2018 Four Continents champion, a two-time Four Continents silver medalist (2016, 2019), the 2017 Asian Winter Games silver medalist, and a five-time (2014–2017, 2019) Chinese national champion.

Evgenia however, this is more of a parallel in how her 2018/19 season went and how Yuri kinda flopped. Zhenya had a crappy start to the 18/19 season, she'd just switched coaches and mover halfway across the world, for the 1st time in her senior career she didn't make the gpf. However by the end of the season she had bounced back and won bronze at worlds and my god what a skate that fp was. Remind you of anyone huh???

Evgenia has a lot of medals (and actually made a cameo in the end credits of episode 10) She is a two-time Olympic silver medalist (2018 ladies' singles, 2018 team event), a two-time world champion (2016, 2017), a two-time European champion (2016, 2017), a two-time Grand Prix Final champion (2015, 2016), a two-time Russian national champion (2016, 2017), silver medalist at the 2018 European Figure Skating Championships and bronze medalist at the 2019 World Championships. Also, she is a huge Anime fan and has a sailor moon exhibition program and its adorable.

Victor Nikiforov ➡️ Yuzuru Hanyu (Japan)

I know a lot of people compare Yuri to Yuzu but I think Victor is a better fit.

Yuzuru has a legion of super duper dedicated fans, they are pretty scary at times. If you watch the 2018 Olympics, the ice literally was covered in Pooh bears after his skate. People love this man, and rightly so. Clearly Yuri isn't the only one who loves Victor, he's very popular in the yoi skating world and almost everyone loves and looks up to him.

His skates are almost immaculate every time. Not only is his technique amazing but his artistry is what really sets him apart from other skaters who may have higher bv on jumps etc. Not that he dosent have high bv, seriously he tries combos that are super wierd just for the bv (see the wierd 4t-3a combo thing he does idk). Plus he's dead set on doing a quad axel. See Victor's super high bv with all the quads and also the fact everyone goes nuts over how his skating is 'like no other'.

Also his medal collection is absolutely mad, he is a two-time Olympic champion (2014, 2018), two-time World champion (2014, 2017), four-time Grand Prix Final champion (2013–2016), Four Continents champion (2020) and three times silver medalist (2011, 2013, 2017). Just like how Victor is canonicaly an Olympic champion and 5x world champion and probably many time euros champ.

Also, he's a sweetheart, he literally crawled behind Shoma Uno because he didn't want the attention taken away from Shoma. I love him.

Victor Nikiforov gives big Yuzuru Hanyu energy.

Yuri Plisetsky ➡️ Yulia Lipnitskaya (Russia)/Alexandra Trusova (Russia)

Again, 2 people.

It's canon that Yuri P was modeled after Yulia for the flexibility and artistic portion of his skates so I feel like I don't need to elaborate much in it however his determination and his wanting to back load with quads reminds me a lot of Sasha Trusova.

Sasha only started juniors the year after yoi came out (she had a Makkachin tissue box which was given to her by Evgenia M which is adorable) so she was not really that popular when the show was being made but she really made a statement when she became the 1st woman to land 2 quads in 1 program (4 salchow and 4 toeloop) at the age of 13 at 2018 junior worlds.

She has just started senior and this season she had 5 quads in one program and I think I cried. She now has a quad sal, toe, flip and lutz and is apparently working on a loop. On top of that she can land a 3 axel but has yet to do so in competition. Did I mention SHE'S 15 AND I'M TERRIFIED.

She currently holds the world record for the free skate (166.62 points). She is the 2020 European Bronze Medalist, the 2019 Grand Prix Final bronze medalist, the 2019 Skate Canada champion, the 2019 Rostelecom Cup champion, the 2019 CS Ondrej Nepela champion, the 2019 Russian national silver medalist, and the 2020 Russian national bronze medalist.

Her determination to win and high TES reminds me of Yurio a lot.

Phichit Chulanont ➡️ Nam Nguyen (Canada)

This one is fun.

I love Nam with all my heart, he's actually my favourite male skater and not just because of his skating. However his skating is great. He is the 2014 World Junior champion, 2019 Skate Canada silver medalist, and two-time Canadian national champion (2015, 2019). He has placed as high as fifth at the World Championships, in 2015. He's not the best skater ever, kinda like Phichit but his personality shines through so much when he skates and I love it.

My main comparison to Phichit is the fact that Nam Nguyen is a huge meme. His Instagram is one of the most hilarious things I've ever seen (@ namnamnoodle). I can't explain it with words seriously just go look at it, he makes memes using professionnally taken skating photos of himself and honestly it's just a giggle. He's almost always posting on his story and half the videos he takes end up on fan twitter and everyone freaks out.

Also he's good friends with Evgenia, thought I'd mention that seeing as who I compared her to :)).

Yeah, Phichit and Nam are memes and I adore them both.

Jean-Jacques Leroy ➡️ Nathan Chen (USA)

Jj is definitely more of a technical focused skater. He tends to put all his eggs in the '800000 quads' bucket and isn't as artistic, in my humble opinion.

Just like Nathan surprisingly, though Nate isn't as egotistical (not a dig, just an observation).

Nathan is compared to Yuzu a lot, and had actually scored higher than him a few times in competition. He is an amazing jumper and is the first skater to have landed five types of quadruple jumps in competitions: toe loop, Salchow, loop, flip and Lutz. Currently he is two-time World champion (2018, 2019), a 2018 Winter Olympic bronze medalist in the team event, the 2017 Four Continents champion, three-time Grand Prix Final champion (2017, 2018, 2019), and four-time U.S. national champion (2017, 2018, 2019, 2020).

So yeah, he's good.

However at the 2018 Olympics (he was only 18 at the time) he bombed under pressure in the team event and in the sp, only to come back with a WR free skate, but didn't medal because of his sp score,kinda like how Jj bombed at the GPF. (Ngl, I cried in school when I saw Nate bomb at the Olympics, I was so upset).

Also, Nathan is super smart and is training to be a doctor. Not related to Jj but I thought I would point it out.

Christophe Giacometti➡️ Adam Rippon (USA)/Javier Fernández (Spain)

Chris is a hard one to pin to an irl skater because he's just so... Chris.

The closest comparison I can get is Adam Rippon but dialed up to 11 because Adam is quite a bit more tame than Chris is. However he did have a point in his sp where he literally beckons the judges to him in a way that can only be described as vaguely sexual. Seeing that at the Olympics was an event I'll tell you that.

Adam was the first openly gay man to make a U.S. Winter Olympic team, and the first to win a medal at the Winter Games. (team bronze).

Plus, I'm pretty sure he owned a Chris plushie at one point or another.

However other than the obvious Chrissness, his technique and medal winning achievements most closely match up with Javier Fernández (who may I add is pretty much Yuzuru Hanyu's best friend). He is the 2018 Olympic bronze medalist, a two-time World champion (2015, 2016), a two-time World bronze medalist (2013, 2014), a seven-time European champion (2013–2019), a two-time Grand Prix Final silver medalist (2014, 2015), a three-time Rostelecom Cup champion (2014–2016), a two-time Grand Prix in France champion (2016–2017) and an eight-time Spanish national champion (2010, 2012–2018). Javi is an amazing skater but usually ended up playing 2nd fiddle to Yuzuru on the world stage, but with euros, he literally won 7 times consecutively. Anndddd, he was the flag bearer for Spain at the 2014 Olympics and I still cry about it.

Otabek Altin➡️ Denis Ten (Kazakhstan)/ Matteo Rizzo

So it's canon that Otabek was based on Denis (rip Denis) so like Yuri and Yulia I do not feel like I need to elaborate much as you can read it on the wikia page. But Otabek also reminds me of a less talkative version of Matteo Rizzo. Matteo is the 2019 European bronze medalist, 2018 NHK Trophy bronze medalist, 2019 Winter Universiade champion, and 2018 Italian national champion.

The reason he reminds me of Otabek is that they just joth exude the same level of cool and I can't explain it any further than that. That's it. Just watch him skate and you'll see.

So that's all I have for now because this post got pretty long so if this gets enough attention I'll do a part 2 :)).

[x0401x]

Hi there! Just want to thank you so much for translating for the VE fandom! I've been looking through your VE posts and noticed you mentioned how anime!Gil is completely different from LN!Gil. I agree with you and was wholeheartedly disappointed in the anime. I was hoping you could elaborate more on your thoughts, where you thought anime!Gil and anime!Violet went wrong and how they were different from the anime. Sorry if you've already made a post on this previously. Thanks again!

Hi! You’re welcome!

This reply took me long enough, lol. I haven’t gone too much into detail, or else I’d just end up writing a bible. It still turned out long as hell, though, so I’ve put it under a cut.

I really didn’t know how to begin with this. “Where they went wrong” kinda implies that those two were going right until some point, and that’s just… not the case. They were a trainwreck from start to finish. And it’s kind of impossible to really discuss this without touching upon the massive fails in the writing of the entire show. It does try to convey important messages to the viewers, but mostly with visuals and repetitive lines, never with the actual plot or the characters. You get an inkling of what the story was attempting to do with them, and that initial idea is what seems to stay with most people, because there’s nearly nothing beyond it.

As director Ishidate has stated more than once before, he made changes to the story because he thought the novel was, in his words, “too orthodox”. But watering it down meant watering the characters down too, Gil and Violet more than anyone else. And this results in a show that ironically fails to grasp its own themes and cast — the personalities and conflicts get lost in the details and have to be patched up with excuses that end up displaying how little the show trusts its own audience. It keeps spelling out plot devices and character traits in an almost robotic manner, with very scarce effort put into actually showcasing them in the situations and dialogues. Everyone is too one-dimensional and the main plot line is repeated over and over instead of being alluded in parallels or even just slightly more intelligent exchanges. Animators like Ishidate have grown dangerously used to committing a grave narrative suicide: to give vague and unconvincing reasons for things to be the way they are and expect the audience to take it all as is simply because it was stated there. Everything is oversimplified because they clearly want the viewers to get invested in the emotional baggage of the show, and only the emotional baggage, because they think that’s all we get invested on. They forget that details are necessary for the whole experience.

These problems are recurrent in Violet and Gil, and they never stop. I’ll start with Gil, since he was mentioned first.

Gilbert Bougainvillea is a very complex, humane and multi-faceted character in the novel. What’s interesting is that he doesn’t look like it at first, so he surprised many readers in volume 1 with how caring and endearing he can be. And I mean caring for real. Anime!Gil seemed like a poor excuse for what he was supposed to represent, which in turn made him into a walking contradiction. In the novel, Gil is by far the person that emphasizes the most with Violet, because the two of them are two sides of the same coin. This is where the anime falls short most frequently. They at first look like polar-opposites, but are absolutely not, yet the show portrays them as such. Novel!Gil is gratuitously kind and righteous, and he’s brave and pure-hearted enough to stand by his values no matter what. He’s used to giving up everything for the sake of other people, but he has morals that he holds to the roots of his very being, so he always chooses to donate himself to what he deems as good causes. And once he has his mind set on an objective, he doesn’t mind playing dirty to achieve it, as long as he’s not hurting anyone. That’s exactly the same as Violet, and Gil isn’t the only one who sees himself in her — Hodgins and Dietfried also notice how alike the two are. Novel!Gil relates to Violet on a spiritual level, and he knows first-hand how she must feel. He’s been there and done that. And that’s why she’s his number one priority. His purpose in life is to protect her and keep her in a healthy lifestyle within a blessed working environment and a loving family. Quite literally, all he wants is to make sure that she’s happy, and he’s active and vocal about it. He’s also an unapologetic and unabashed feminist, so he completely approves of her doing anything for a living — she doesn’t need to live her life like an ordinary woman and whatever she wants for herself is fine, as long as it’s not too dangerous.

Apparently, his personality is one of the book aspects that Ishidate believed to be “too orthodox”. He depicts Gil the way you’d expect any male creator to depict a man — a brooding martyr figure who only has a heart of gold in fleeting moments that get replayed again and again in flashbacks to serve as justification for Violet’s undying love. He makes very little strides and there’s a lot of flawed reasoning behind his affection that makes it oddly disconnected, which is the fact that said affection is barely ever there. Gil hardly treats Violet like a person, let alone an equal. Violet is ready to give her life for him anytime, and as we see in the last battle at Intense, he’s ready to cling onto that to save his own life. Ishidate doesn’t shy away from making very evident that he thinks it’s okay for Gil to do only the minimum to earn Violet’s respect and trust, like it’s a given and all he’s required in order to earn her love is to exist. This is very visible in scenes like the one where they first met. Gil seems to shield Violet from the abuse of his brother, but shows next to no distress or even interest over it as he doesn’t even question where she came from or why Dietfried was treating her that way. There’s also the scene where he takes her to one of his family’s residences, and she has his jacket on, just like in the novel… yet he’s letting her walk barefoot in the snow without giving a single flying fuck. He then leaves her side as soon as he instructs the maid what to do with her, not looking back. I also hate that scene where he gets back home and she bumps into him and falls on her butt. He just stares at her and makes no effort to help her back up. But the one I hate the most is that festival scene where he nearly thanks Violet for fighting so well in battle. I mean, she’s killing people for him. She, a literal child, is in the frontlines of a long-lasting war, risking her life and committing mass murder for his sake. That’s literally nothing to be grateful for. Especially not when he’s supposed to love her. And I despise that he only stopped himself from finishing the phrase because he noticed the bruises on her.

Another major defect of the anime was changing Gil’s backstory. Anime!Gil was, by the looks of it, just a rich kid who enlisted simply because that’s the family tradition. And if you take away Gil’s backstory, you take away the viewers’ reason to empathize with him. Why? Because that means he’s morphed into someone who can make choices. Erase any factor that binds Gil to doing what his family and his superiors make him do, and what you have is a grown man with his free will intact. And he uses none of it to help Violet. Anime!Gil was always given the opportunity to say no. He could’ve said no to Dietfried and sent Violet straight to the Evergardens, he could’ve said no to his superior officer and not taken her into the military, or he could’ve at least said no to assigning her to the men’s troops. He didn’t because there would be no story otherwise. Novel!Gil is always attempting to save Violet from the war and from herself, while anime!Gil’s actions beg to differ. And so, anime!Violet’s obsession with Gil stems from the fact that he was the first to treat her remotely like a human being and that, for a long time, he was all she had. None of that fate thing, because it’s also “too orthodox”. But without the fate element and without Gil having no control whatsoever over how he feels about Violet, he’s straight-up a pedophile. If he feels regular romantic love for Violet, who is in her mid-teens, that’s pedophilia right there. This one is my biggest beef with anime!Gil, and I don’t take criticism for it.

Now Violet. Not to be rude, but I see so many people talk about how interesting her anime counterpart is, yet I rarely ever see anyone going in-depth on it. It’s like the way the fans talks about the show. Literally every single person who comments that they liked it always says the exact same thing: “I cried during every episode”. I sort of feel like most of them are just reproducing what they see other people say out there, which is probably what got them interested in watching it in the first place. I don’t mean this with ill-intent; it’s just seriously the impression I get from looking at the tag. I’ve accompanied it since the novel came out all the way back in 2015, and when the show was running, believe it or not, I didn’t really see much of those comments. It started becoming a habit to say it after episode 10, which seems to be the highest-rating episode (the irony being that it was the closest the anime ever got to the novels). Hence why it feels to me like some people just say it on automatic, and I get the same vibe from the fans of anime!Violet.

I’ll just be blunt here: the main difference between anime!Violet and canon!Violet is that canon!Violet was made to be liked by girls and women, and anime!Violet was made to be liked by men. I have already said this before, but Violet is the very definition of independent professional woman in the novel. She’s educated, confident, strong, reliable, altruistic and overall well-versed in at least a little bit of everything. Half of it is due to luck and half of it is her own merits, but all in all, she was created not just to be relatable but also a character that people could look up to. Meanwhile, anime!Violet was clearly made to be waifubait.

I can’t really stress how little thought was actually put into her portrayal and development. We never truly see her internalizing the lessons that she supposedly learns in each of the self-contained episodes. We only ever witness her displaying sudden significant hints of emotion at convenient times, paired to her either repeating what she was told earlier by one of the characters or taking an extremely obvious conclusion to a question that was already half-answered by someone else. Because of this, Violet’s growth process has an unsteady pacing in the anime and mostly feels disjointed. In comparison, novel!Violet is usually not the point of view — she’s often in the role of observer, and we notice through the solutions she comes up with for her clients’ issues that she does have a very humane connection with them. We also notice through the clients’ opinions on Violet that she shows subtle changes at certain specific points, such as smiling just a little when she manages to not only accomplish her duties but also help solve their problems. This makes her more real and believable because, unlike the anime, it presents no abrupt alteration to the essence of her person. She’s growing in her own way, but it’s still easy to tell. It’s also very clever to have Violet be disliked or misunderstood by her clients at first because she’s so aloof and apathetic-looking, but then she grows on them after they actually understand her, and the readers can absorb that from them. I’ve seen many people complain that they can’t really empathize with anime!Violet, but in the novel, the author takes care not to let this happen, and it really doesn’t.

What upsets me the most is that anime!Violet is overly infantilized. We all know that director Ishidate loves her like a father loves a daughter; it’s been said by himself and his colleagues quite a lot. That’s cute and all, but it made her depiction extremely shallow. The biggest problem was making her 14 in the anime. I still struggle to understand what would’ve been so bad with keeping her as a 17-year-old. Sum that up with removing many of her merits and adding forceful childish traits, such as being okay with changing clothes anywhere in front of anyone or pouting when she’s frustrated, and you have the perfect recipe of what waifu junkies like to be spoon-fed with. In my opinion, anime!Violet was a downgraded tragic heroine played in a cheap and boring way to attract tearjerker lovers.

I hope this has covered enough of my take on the matter. ✌️

[moralhymn]

honestly im curious after seeing it on your blog what is sort of the foundation of ignis/ardyn or the dynamic? I've never seen the ship before!

hi there hello you’ve opened up a WHOLE CAN OF WORMS HERE BECAUSE I LOVE THIS SHIP SO DAMN MUCH–

honestly i– i don’t remember how i started shipping it. for.. context, i will say that when i first dipped my toe into the 15 fandom, i actually started as a gladio rper. he was my favorite, with the combination of the anger issues and obvious intelligence that he had ( and lbr gladio does have some serious anger issues; he’s not a bad guy for it though! it just makes him more interesting to me as a character because how many times is something like that shown having consequences? you see it with gladio and how he grows and matures. i love it! ) and my twin from another mother was like “why aren’t you writing ardyn?” 

me and my unsuspecting ass: “i don’t know i guess i’m trying to veer away from villains here.”

she just laughed at me. a lot. because she knew. she knew what was coming. so i, in my dumb naivety, forge ahead in the game and then i met ardyn and it was all downhill from there. especially after altissia. so i kinda… acquired ardyn as a muse and boy i didn’t know what i was getting in for. i really, truly didn’t. he’s come to mean so much to me as a character because he’s so beautifully complex. i have a serious love for seeing dark side characters, especially if they started on the good side of things, and between his flamboyant mannerisms, his speech patterns ( WHICH I ABSOLUTELY LOATHE TRYING TO IMITATE IN RP BECAUSE I NEVER FEEL LIKE I GET CLOSE ENOUGH TO THEM ), and his choice of archaic wording, he was practically gift-wrapped for me.

and his parallels to both jesus and lucifer are both seriously big draws for me too.

so, anyways, about the ship! 

honestly, i couldn’t begin to tell you where it came from for me or where i started looking into it. it just sorta… happened! i think it also happened in large part because i am honestly dissatisfied with ignis’s popular ships of gladnis and ignoct, seeing him together with ardyn just drew me in. i mean, i can appreciate those two ships and more power to anyone who ships them! if it makes you happy, then go for it! but a lot of gladnis is written in ways that set my teeth on edge ( and i must reference one fic where gladio was calling ignis baby. i am fairly certain that ignis would stab you with a fork if you tried that. ) and as for ignoct… it’s probably the fact that it’s a gross misinterpretation of the warrior-retainer archetype relationship that they share, not to mention how maternal ignis is towards noctis. i can see and understand the basis for both ships but they lack a certain luster for me.

but boy, for some reason, ignis and ardyn just have this fascinating interaction with one another. i could go into over analysis here on every scene they share together but i won’t, lmfao. but there’s something interesting about the fact that ignis gets especially bitchy when talking to or about ardyn, to me. i mean, ignis can be pretty bitchy in general ( and before anyone tries to say he’s not, he really is. his dialogue in the japanese is legit him trying to sound like a tough guy and he just gets so bristly when talking about ardyn. ) but there’s like an uptick in it where ardyn’s concerned. now, some people might go “but wait doesn’t that mean he doesn’t like him?” and, yeah, i can see that. but when you ship a rarepair, you reach for what you can get and are satisfied with things. also, everyone interprets things differently! ignis seems… acutely interested in some way in ardyn but there’s also other subtle hints of their interactions, at least to me.

two of the biggest factors are sagefire and ignis being able to tell noctis who ardyn really is once he’s free of the crystal, including his history.

now, exactly where could ignis have learned this stuff? the answer is, of course, ardyn. ardyn, whose new dlc literally calls him the sage. ardyn, who would probably answer ignis’s demands because heaven knows gladio and prompto don’t go near him.

also the fact that prompto asks ignis if ardyn’s not his type and ignis doesn’t bother saying that, no, ardyn is not my type, kinda… raised my eyebrows more than a little. ( also, ignis not really contributing to talks about that kind of stuff? hm. interesting. )

so i honestly believe that ignis has met with ardyn, more than once, to learn both sagefire and ardyn’s history. i mean, the only person who could have reliably told ignis about it was him. sagefire is another thing that i’m working out in my head but, you know, ignis is definitely a man who’ll pursue knowledge in all its forms and ardyn, being ardyn, being this two thousand year old being who can show him so many different things, would probably lure him in like a moth to a flame. and given how i view ardyn, i know that he’d respect ignis for his own person. not as noctis’s caretaker. not as a man who was being groomed to be a general. not as part of the flock. but his own individual with his own wants and desires. and i think that’d suck ignis right on in, to be honest. now, i’m not saying that the bros don’t recognize ignis as his own person, far from it - but the way that they handle things just kinda shows that, as tight as they are, there’s misunderstandings between them. 

i just see ignis and ardyn having this super dazzling chemistry and interesting influence on one another as well. like, ardyn might sleep around, but if he finds someone who can stand as his equal, the way i see ignis being able to, then you’ve got his interest securely on you and that can be a powerful, frightening thing, to be honest. after all, it’d make one wonder what it is about them that would bring in the attention of a man who’s seen so much and done so many things in his life, right? but ardyn would see ignis for his intelligence, his skill, probably even finding his sharp tongue and wit charming too. and there’s the fact that he never seems to take any action against ignis either. i mean, even in altissia, he doesn’t really fight ignis; he just kinda makes a few cursory gestures but overall? ignis beat the snot out of him and ardyn just seemed to take it. i mean, yeah, there was probably the whole “oh you can’t really do anything to hurt me” deal, but this is ardyn we’re talking about here. ardyn, who messes with the other three something awful, after all.

but ignis? he literally stops him with a raised hand at the stronghold. he’s impressed by him putting on the ring ( and rather surprised ). he probably taught him the sagefire technique. and i will never shake the idea that it was ignis who got ardyn to talk about himself, his past, his relation to the lucis caelum bloodline, and so much more. 

i just honestly find their dynamic so fascinating to look at and to explore. i think that out of all four of the bros, ignis would be the one ardyn would go for anyways. prompto, he already knows how to handle. gladio? well, ardyn’s just going to irritate him. noctis? he hates the poor kid. but ignis? ignis would definitely make ardyn’s head turn so fast that it’s a wonder it doesn’t fly off his neck. so, yeah, i just think that out of all the people ignis could hook up with, ardyn would probably just lure him in so fast and so hard that it’s amazing to me. 

so i guess the foundation is, in the end, this whole… ( vague hand gestures. ) this whole deal of thinking that they’d just have this super magnetic interest in one another. i mean, yeah, even after altissia? yeah, even after altissia. it just? i don’t know. i think that in some ways ignis would lure ardyn in as well for how he’s both selfish and selfless at the same damn time. ardyn would crave that level of devotion for himself, since it was something he lost before he was cast out of history. to see it in ignis? oh, it’s just like icing on the cake. how can he resist that? he wouldn’t be able to.

i just have a lot of reasons and viewpoints for this ship and oh my god i rambled i will shut up now.

[lyonface]

if i could see the inside of your head, I could. I love hearing your thoughts as they're pretty sophisticated ideas. I've seen a small discussion around whether or not Jumin was sexually harassed (or abused/kidnapped) based on his current behaviour and the VM. I wanted to know what you think? Thank you! Feel free to ignore if this is a subject you are not comfortable discussing and I apologize in advance if this does make you uncomfortable. Have a great day!

Oh geez, anon (〃´ﾉω`〃) Thank you~

Nah man you’ll be hard pressed to find a topic I’m uncomfortable at least touching. The only ones I don’t really like discussing are ones I’m not qualified to discuss because I’m the wrong audience, or I lack a particular frame of reference. Even then, I do at least try to approach them tactfully.

There is actually an article in the True Believer’s Pack that details a kidnapping attempt made against Jumin when he was 17. A criminal knocked out Driver Kim (presumably) and took his place to pick Jumin up from school, but went a route that was not the route back to Jumin’s home. Jumin noticed this and was calm, had his GPS tracker on on his phone and left it in the vehicle when they went to a gas station for gas and he was told to get out. The police found him because he stayed cool under pressure, just like our Jumin~, and thankfully Driver Kim had little more than a bit of a headache after the ordeal. During the Another Story route in his only phone call to the player on the Day 2 Common Route, he mentions multiple kidnapping attempts being made on him, specifically in elementary school. You can easily deduce then that he has had many attempts made against him if he can say multiple happened just when he was a child, paired with the one of when he was in high school. Honestly, his calm attitude when he was 17 could easily have resulted from practice considering this has not been a rare thing for him, even if the kidnapper succeeding just that far was a rare occurence.

That last part almost gives me chills at the possibility that he’d been called “a cute little child” in such perilous circumstances. Honestly I have almost no doubt that that’s the case. Talking about a traumatic event like you’re shooting the breeze is usually something that happens when you’re passed it emotionally. If we know Jumin though, it’s probably a mixture of acceptance and repression. “Perhaps I was shocked back then.” You’re not sure, Juju? Yeah okay.

He follows that string up with this not long after:

He says it so casually that it’s almost like fridge horror when you realize that he’s surmising that people would kidnap him for something like the sex trade if he wasn’t worth so much in ransom. That’s…terrible.

As for the abuse/assault discussion, I’ve seen a bit of that revolving around two specific things: his severe repression of sexual and romantic feelings to the point of talking about them as if they don’t apply to him (when we know later in his route they do,) and how his step mother insists that he should let her comfort him following closely after complimenting his looks.

To be fair, this could just be a step mom wanting to kiss up to her husband’s son to get favor (I realize my wording and I’ll let it stay.) But the question arises because of how they frame this interaction. His nightmare/memory has a deliberate parallel between his step mother and a woman that his vying for his attention/affection.

The game is being extremely vague in really elaborating on what Jumin has experienced with women when it comes to things like sex, largely by the nature of Jumin generally just avoiding the topic all together since it obviously makes him uncomfortable when the topic is pointed in his direction. I don’t doubt that he was sexually harassed growing up or even on a fairly regular basis now, though I hesitate to ascribe that he was sexually abused because that is a large crime being placed on another character(s) and can change the scope of his character a decent amount, as well as raise questions that didn’t exist before.

I think Jumin has definitely gone through emotional trauma from many different points in his life. It only makes it that much more painful if characters dismiss him as not being able to relate to him because of how “good he has it.”

[elizabethrobertajones]

So I saw that gifset of Kripke's commentary on that season 3 episode (I'm a newbie watcher but I started the new season and and slowly working my way through!) and I guess I'm a little confused? Kripke is basically saying "yeah Dean really wants that apple pie life" and when I've been going through and reading people's meta, I've seen a lot of people's opinion (especially season 6 metas) that kind of disagree and that Dean really doesn't want that suburban life. Any opinions? Thanks much :-)

Heya!

https://elizabethrobertajones.tumblr.com/post/162713109665/sensitivehandsomeactionman-eric-kripke-on

Oh! Yeah, I reblogged this with the sense of irony about what Kripke was saying in place that you get from being a long-time watcher or deeply embedded in the meta community :P (I should have a /irony tag I use for the benefit of people knowing I’m thinking deep dark shade at whatever I’m reblogging but you know not in a mean way just in a this goes way deeper than what it looks like to me but maybe I just don’t feel like commenting right now :P)

I can’t remember if I have a Dean x Lisa tag that’s actually well-kept except for cute gifsets but 3x02 and 3x10 probably have a fair amount of discussion about it if you want to dig deeper… But I have literally just watched Dean’s conversation with Rufus in 3x15 which reminds me that this was a season-long arc, and 3x10 was a weird little part of it… 3x02 sets up that Dean has a sort of wistfulness for what he COULD have had, and 3x10 and 3x12 (and all these are Gamble-related episodes) have stuff about Dean yearning - this bit and the conversation with Victor where he makes it blatantly obvious that even with Sam he has a sense that he might want more from life and he is not currently getting it - Victor’s comparison of ex-wives and empty apartments is paralleled to Dean’s feelings. And in 3x15 Rufus warns him that this is what he has to look forward to becoming if he survives. (In 12x14 we had a parallel where Ketch buys his way in the door the same way Dean buys his way in the door with Rufus & scotch, but it was subverted in so many ways, it just seemed like the BMoL had sketchy intel you might be able to buy Dean this way.)

Anyway, by the end of the season the message is quite clear that Dean sort of years for it but can’t have it and in many ways has chosen this life of saving people over it. Though he’s dying for Sam, and never un-wishes that or can even think of it, from about the midpoint of the season he wants to find a way to break the deal but I think a lot of that is driven by not wanting to be a demon rather than wanting to grow old, since becoming a demon will pretty quickly undo all the good work Dean did saving people, he’d have to assume. 3x09 gives him any motivation to fight rather than cheerfully stroll off to Hell because Sam’s alive and that’s all that matters, you know?

I think in the context of season 3 the Lisa stuff was pretty interesting because I think Dean can have a contradictory yearning but Lisa is a ghost of an idea, literally where she fizzles out of the dream in the same way ghosts disappear, and to feel wedded to the hunter lifestyle and in many ways he’s been rejecting it from the start… In 1x08 (Bugs) especially he’s making a point about beeing skeeved out by suburbia and the idea of living SUCH a normal life. In 2x20 we see him as a civilian and he enjoys it for a day or two to hang out with Mary and Sam and Jess, and I’ve written a LOT on the over-lap of Carmen in that episode and Lisa in 6x01 since they’re connected by djinn dreams and I feel like the message is his year with Lisa was emotionally/functionally practically the same to Dean as if he’d been strung up in a warehouse the whole time. (That’s something in my 6x01 tag or 2x20 depending which you feel like scrolling through :P Sorry, I’m kind of in advanced brain bleeh from sitting in a noisy room so you can get surface brain rambling to answer this but no research or links in this state >.>) 

Anyway in 2x20 he unequivocally rejects the civilian life because people died without him doing his job, even though he called Carmen “the One” and everything else seemed fixable or exciting to him, including his relationship with Sam. It was after discovering he’d “un-wished” all their work as hunters he angrily appealed to John about why it was his job, before stomping off to find and kill the djinn, and un-make his wish, assuming at this point it was a wish and not a dream. (I still call it a wish-verse sometimes because of how DEAN analysed it and I find it FASCINATING to look at that way when it comes to these decisions, while I’d just call it the djinn dream when looking at it from another angle). 

I suppose Lisa comes not long after but he goes to see her as part of a farewell tour revisiting the best hookup of his life, and ends up smacked with the potential he’s mission out on of raising a kid and all that - a long-term investment he can’t get involved in for one year (do you feel the knife turning :P) because that’s not fair on them and offers them no long-term stability. He CAN’T make a home when he has a 1 year demon deal weighing on him, so the episode is just there to psychologically torture him. I think he never dreamed of suburbia before Lisa in 3x02 but by 3x10 we can see he took some unexpected emotionally scarring just from being told he CAN’T have something. Because posing the question opens up “what if”s (this incidentally is my entire rationale when you boil it down for why the male siren proves Dean’s bi :P). Dean had a moment to seriously imagine a NICE life where he would be with Lisa and have Ben as a son and it’s impossible for he can even start to have it. And in 3x15 Rufus confirms that even if Dean survives (or comes back from Hell as it turns out), being a crotchety old hunter who only opens his door to people if they show up with nice Scotch is about as much as he can hope to look forward to.

I think that’s a bad message too but it gels more with Dean’s outlook and experiences and I think helps him shut away the feelings he could ever have had more or that he was being unfairly denied, in a combination of personal choices to hunt/seeing the benefits of doing it over a normal life, and pessimism about his lifespan or what they can reasonably expect from their lives. In 5x18 he tells Lisa that when he thinks of himself being happy it’s with her, because of the scarring I mentioned that 3x02 specifically denies him this endgame and leaves an impression of it in his psyche as the Thing Dean Can’t Have, but DOES turn into a nice thought to hold onto as a what if. And Sam tells him to go for it and he does, and by the end of season 6 it’s a “never mention this again or I’ll kill you” situation and Dean doesn’t think about endgame out loud for like 5 more years until season 10, and the question is slooowly reintroduced through hesitant confessions and car conversations and meeting a pair of married hunters at a bar one day, to finally get the idea that while Dean’s unequivocally written off suburbia, wife & kids, there’s other things he could get out of life to make him happy and feel less like Victor or Rufus, dark mirrors of his present and future, like the ghosts of endgame visiting a long-term-relationship Scrooge :P 

But yeah Kripke saying that Dean secretly has a romantic soft spot for the normal life and fluffy romance, personified in this case by Lisa, is really because he’s talking compare and contrast to Sam. He says Sam isn’t interested in Bela that way really, he’s just horny and they know no women really so… that happened. (I side-eye but whatever, different discussion :P) and that’s in contrast to Sam’s supposed sweet and nerdy surface layer, while Dean’s got the macho horndog outer layer so Kripke’s explaining in 1 go performing!Dean (and Sam) and that Sam n Dean are yin and yang to each other (which, again, in Baby, we have that great shot of them in red and blue contrasting colours, sleeping top & tail in the Impala from above that demonstrates this… Can’t tell if you’ve seen season 11 actually or joined in season 12 (oops apologies for those spoilers too, I tried to keep them super vague and if you’ve seen season 12 you sort of know where it led to >.>) but this is what it looked like:

from a meta POV it’s absolutely one of my favourite shots of Sam and Dean in the entire show. Anyway it’s visually demonstrating the same thing Kripke is saying in that commentary. Sam presents one way so they write Dean presenting in the absolute opposite way, and then choose to subvert both presented faces with an image each to absolutely destroy that image and show something deep underneath. From the way he was talking it sounded like they thought the Bela thing first so the Lisa thing might literally just have been a part of it because it was amusing to them to do that with Sam, and the rule is absolutely probably 1st thing in their character bible to always make Sam and Dean at odds with each other even if it’s in some innocent visual/character demonstration.

(This is why I hate Buckleming writing btw - they’ve been increasingly writing Sam and Dean as an utterly unified unit who think and breathe on the same wavelength and it drives me nuts because that is not their dynamic at all no matter how fan favourite “winsync” is (which is of course a totally different thing to do with them working well together meta-textually as actors and in the text as kids raised closely together, and who also have worked together for most of/their entire adult lives so of course they naturally move and talk together sometimes - I can be in sync with my twin and we have core personality overlap but we’re also utterly different people in extremely obvious ways e.g. quiet vs chatty - guess which :P)… In Buckleming’s hands it just means they can use Sam and Dean to alternately deliver exposition in lengthy talking scenes as if they’re one character, and that exposition to Mick in 12x17 when he “Hello boys” them in the Bunker was one of their worst incidents so far >.>)

Anyway, I don’t think that makes the Lisa thing insincere especially as it sounds like 3x10 more than 3x02 actually cemented her as Dean’s imaginary choice of perfect dream girl to fill the space Carmen the El Sol ad lady previously held, when it came to the writing. 3x02 stand alone is good to torment Dean as a “Hahahaha you will never have this” but 3x10 builds on it and shows them being intuitive to the character and things that make sense to write him… And I think from the very start they were aware of the contradiction and that Dean might sort of have a soft spot/dream of the normal apple pie life but that he was also at the same time profoundly aware of all the ways in which he hadn’t chosen it, it wasn’t his life, and there were abundant reasons he wasn’t having it and even in the same core places this dream resides, didn’t want it. If you go deep in my 3x02/2x20/6x01 Lisa x Dean metas (again, sorry, I’ll add tags to this post at least :P) you’ll probably find the post I made collecting my rewatch notes as I discovered this subtextual story through the season, realised where it all came from later, and by the end of the season realised that they knew and had talked themselves out of it being something Dean could have because the subtext took the same route as the actual Dean and Lisa arc in season 6, probably because Gamble helped craft the entire thing in season 3 and then brought Lisa back for season 6 and had a whole season to play the entire thing over again. So I feel like that suggests Dean talked himself out of it too with Rufus and Victor’s help, and fundamentally never changed track even with season 5 & 6′s Lisa stuff, because that closed the book on it so hard we have this parallel to Dean and Rufus in 12x14 and the idea he can have something more with a hunter maybe or ~someone in the life~ is now the subtext under that in the same way Kripke talked about him having this squishy interior to do with Lisa back in season 3.