#but that is essentially how it happened at the end of S1

[miraculouslbcnreactions]

Speaking of how the heroes are chosen, the temp system might be one of the worst writing choices the writers ever made. I mean I get it, permanent heroes would require the show to have continuity and it makes for yet another parallel with Gabriel, but it just ends up being another one of those instances of the show trying to have its cake and eat it too, like. The new heroes eat up screen time that could've gone to the OG duo, but they also don't get to be heroes in their own right and are essentially Ladybug's Pokemon. It makes both people who liked the duo and people who like team-based shows unhappy for no real benefit.

It's also just a massive security risk. Fu says that it's dangerous for the Miraculous to be out in the open, but it's actually way less risky to put the Miraculous in circulation, because then Hawk Moth has to retrieve them by defeating every hero individually, which is a lot more effort. Keeping them all in one place and distributing them one at a time like this means Hawk Moth only has to figure out who's in charge of the distributing and follow that person right to the Miracle Box. Ferrying the Miraculous for every battle also creates more opportunities to lose them, which is how Queen Bee ended up happening.

Looking back, the problems of just about every season finale past S1 can be traced back to this system. It's almost like the writers are trying to set Marinette up to fail.

Ladybug's Pokemon

I love that phrasing! I've just called them her powerups, but this paints a much clearer picture of what I mean. They're not her autonomous teammates who feel vital to the story. They're her cute little friends who do whatever she says. All she has to do is pick which ones she wants for today's battle.

Fu says that it's dangerous for the Miraculous to be out in the open, but it's actually way less risky to put the Miraculous in circulation, because then Hawk Moth has to retrieve them by defeating every hero individually, which is a lot more effort.

Ferrying the Miraculous for every battle... creates more opportunities to lose them, which is how Queen Bee ended up happening.

These are two of my biggest issue with the temp heroes as a general concept. Fetching them every battle gives Gabriel endless chances to find out the temp heroes identities and/or where the guardian is hiding. I don't know why the show acts like the problem was Ladybug forgetting to detransform in Heart Hunter:

Ladybug: Master Fu, I need your help! Master Fu: (sees Ladybug, gasps) This costume is very cute, miss, but is it really fitting in this place? Ladybug: (gasps) I forgot to transform back. (Looks arounds enters the center of the merry-go-round trying to remain unseen) I haven't been followed Master, I'm sure of it.

Nathalie would have been able to track Ladybug either way. At least this way Marinette's identity stayed a secret!

It would make infinitely more sense for Fu to be the one to hand out the miraculous to the temp heroes for two reasons. The first one was laid out above. Having him or some other support character do it is the best way to keep his identity a secret. You should not have Ladybug leaving battles to do it. That's too easy to track because the villains know where she's going to be when she goes running off for help.

The other reason is because it's asinine to have Ladybug run off every time they face a major threat. Think about that logic for a second.

Ladybug: This akuma is too hard for us to fight as a duo! Chat Noir, you stay here and fight this super hard akuma alone while I go get reinforcements. I'll be back in half an hour or so. Chat Noir: Wait, what? How am I supposed to- Ladybug: Have fun! Don't die! Bye!

How did that never backfire on them? I get temp heroes being temp for a few fights, but they should have all been given their miraculous full time ages ago.

[avelera]

Weird double feature anime rec but I recommend watching Vinland Saga followed by The Apothecary Diaries

- Vinland Saga is all about the tragedy of the male side of history. It deplores violence, which is unusual for the shounen genre. It doesn’t shy away from the ugliness of warfare, slavery, and death in the Viking Era but it always holds in it this hope for a brighter future where violence is no longer necessary. It is atypical for the genre because of the grief and sensitivity it brings to these traditionally masculine themes and how it refuses to idolize the butchers of history even as it depicts them.

- The Apothecary Diaries (as far as I’ve seen halfway through S1) is about the female side of history, but it is also an atypical story of a woman who is an apothecary but essentially a doctor and a detective within the walled gardens of the Emperor’s harem. After the blood and dirt of Vinland Saga, it’s a a breath of fresh air to see the perfumed paradises of the Song Dynasty which is ironically happening at the same time on the opposite side of the world. The show has a bit more of a YA feel at first but promises deeper intricacy as we delve into the human dramas and intrigue playing out behind the scenes of this gilded cage of the harem.

- Both Vinland and Apothecary Diaries are deeply concerned with the importance of everyday people even as they cross paths with kings and emperors who could end their lives in an instant, a fact that both stories are deeply aware of. Both series stress how important these everyday lives are, their inherent dignity, and their right to a better life even as they live in an era that could dispose of them without a thought.

It can be hard to watch another show after watching a masterpiece like Vinland Saga but I have to say, once I adjusted to the lighter tone, Apothecary Diaries has been a worthy and fulfilling successor.

[anxious-witch]

I apologize for irritable tone of this post, but a portion of this fandom is starting to irritate me, so let's analyze catwin through the lens of how age works for ghosts and how situational irony is used in a scene where Edwin and Niko talk about kissing.

Let's start with age. Right at the beginning, when Emma asks Charles and Edwin to take her case, she tries to play it off as her being just a little girl. This is what Edwin replies:

And before anyone jumps the gun and says: "He said SUPERNATURALLY speaking! He is still physically 16!"

Okay. Let's unpack that. Considering how for people who are immortal, which ghosts essentially are, and as such unchanging, that isn't quite a proper argument, is it? Because the way I see it, there are two ways someone could argue this. Either your gripe is about the Cat King finding Edwin attractive despite him physically being a 16 year old or your gripe is that Edwin is mentally 16 and as such, cannot consent.

If it's the first, I think that argument is quite lacking here, because we know the Cat King is aware Edwin is older than 16. And as someone who is an adult and often gets mistaken for a minor, I think the idea that you can just always tell someone's age by looking at them quite funny. Also, by that logic, I shouldn't be able to consent either, because people generally gauge my age to be between 16-18, when I am in my mid 20s.

If it's the second, your point doesn't work because being frozen at 16 would mean being unable to learn and develop firther than what you did by that age. Which we know is false for ghosts, especially Edwin. He changes and develops constantly throughout the s1, and we have a front row seat to that! Human brains aren't clear cut, and before you jump under the post to say your brain isn't fully develop until age 25, I will kindly tell you that human brains, in fact, never stop changing and developing. And that experiences, traumas, etc hugely impact developments of individuals.

One argument I can sort of is perhaps Edwin and Charles having somewhat stunted emotional growth, but as we also see throughout the season, that has more to do with them stagnanting rather than them being unable to emotionally develop. And frankly, I know bunch of adults with the same issues, so.

Now for the "But Edwin said he doesn't want to kiss the Cat King!" argument. How about we look at what Edwin says before that, huh?

He says he has never been kissed and didnt understand the appeal, until recently. And you cannot tell me it wasn't the Cat King who made him realize it. Yes, he wanted to kiss Charles and I am not saying he didn't like Monty too, but if it wasn't for the Cat King getting physically close to him and playing into his desires, he wouldn't have realized that he too, feel physical attraction!

As for him saying "Absolutely not!" When Niko asks him if he wants to kiss the Cat King, I think that's laughable argument to saying "Well, see, he didn't want him!" Because first of all, characters can lie. Edwin most certain, lies about things he wants, both to himself and others, up until pressed.

Besides, if I am not mistaken, given English isn't my first language and I learned this stuff in a different language, this is also called situational irony, aka, someone say something won't/can't happen and then it happens. This is very often seen in romance plots too. A characters says they hate someone and then they end up dating them.

Think of Lizzy Benett and Darcy

And then she goes ahead and married him later, once her opinion of him changes. It's a classic romance trope!

Similarly, Edwin says he doesn't want to kiss the Cat King and what happens at the end? Oh yeah!

He kisses the Cat King. Shocker.

But yeah just like. Y'all are free to not like the ship for whatever reason, but for the love of god, stop making up stuff that's just blantantly untrue. There is an "anti catwin" tag for a reason, if you truly cannot stop yourself from commenting, but in all honestly, you could just enjoy your own ship without putting other ppl's ships down. Cat King is not perfect by any means, but this isn't a predator type of situation. I and many others have addressed the whole "coercion" bit quite a few times so I won't get into it again, but these two arguments I have seen pop up and I just had to address it. Thank you for coming to my ted talk

[beautifulmorningstar]

I think it's insufferable that most of the content for Caitlyn is either that she's a diCtAToR or "uwu so hot princess glowup" etc etc

Caitlyn Kiramman is a genuinely curious, intelligent, investigative, noble, fair-minded and just woman.

That shit that happened to her end of S1 - Jinx kidnapping her when she was NAKED, and we can see how terrified she was of Jinx in the "mad hatter picnic" scene, that shit was PERSONAL to her and she knew it. maybe Jinx specifically blowing up her mother (and a bunch of other counselors) wasn't personal towards Caitlyn, but Jinx had gotten pretty personal towards Caitlyn since the start of their interactions bec of her thinking Vi "had chosen" Caitlyn over her (a false dichotomy in Jinx's mind, but we do know Jinx was severely battling mental illness and long-time trauma. It's also worth bearing in mind that Silco essentially is a villain of Zaun - he was controlling all the criminal enterprises that turned a poor place into a destitute and dangerous place, effectively turning a huge chunk of Zaunites into drug addicts. This is part of the problem for Vi when she finds out Powder became Silco's family. See: Ekko and his Firelights literally existing in revolution against the underworld's crime empire). The background context matters. Jinx was on the wrong side of not just the tracks, but ethically of the narrative. Caitlyn had to take all this into account during a VERY SHORT period of time, secondary to the fact that she was falling in love with Vi, a sister that Jinx was clearly possessive over.

And then of course she was grieving her mother after the bombing.

And the memorial they held for the fallen counselors got attacked. She couldn't even grieve in peace.

Did Caitlyn do bad things and make some questionable decisions in the immediate aftermath and ensuing six months of her mother's murder? Yes she did. We know she was unstable and violent in the first arc of S2, utilizing the information in the Kiramman Key to weaponize the Grey, we know she came down brutal on informants in her search for Jinx. But we also know that she was still softening for Vi, the only person she seemed able to grieve in front of. She was not irredeemable and Vi knew this.

(Also BTW Vi donned the uniform because she saw firsthand the attack on the memorial and despite all her internal conflict over it, she resigned to the fact that her sister - who again, was with the criminal underground actively harming Zaun anyway - was doing too much harm. She was not wrong for this conclusion)

Caitlyn was unbalanced and full of rage and betrayal and trauma and emotional vulnerability when she thought Vi was protecting Jinx from her. Obviously she shouldn't have hurt Vi, I do think it was unnecessarily nasty that Caitlyn hit her in the gut where she was hurt before - but from a narrative standpoint, Caitlyn snapping makes sense. Her vision is clouded, she is now lost to questioning if all her decisions and trust regarding Vi was unfounded, she's in a place where she feels Vi betrayed her.

After that, her decisions are further fueled by a loss where Vi was before. Obviously that's gonna make things worse - hence the working alongside Ambessa, the raids, etc. And yet, 6 months after the timeskip, we see that Caitlyn is hesitant now - the momentum of her rage has faded, and her vision is returning. She pushes back against Ambessa, she disapproves of unnecessary brutality, she's regained her personal values.

When she sees Vi again, she immediately panics that someone she "technically shouldn't be hung up on anymore" is so close to the site of an upcoming battle. THAT'S her first reaction - "You can't be here!"; Caitlyn doesn't even hesitate in still caring. The rest of their interaction brings her to terms with her remorse, her guilt, her ache for Vi - any dunderhead watching can see THAT being conveyed in her facial expressions, her movements and her choices (if not directly by dialogue). She literally flips on the spot to help Vi out, to betray Ambessa's ambush.

She's even gotten so in control of her emotions that she doesn't shoot first, observe later when she sees Jinx (the uncharacteristically impulsive streak we see in her closer to her mother's murder). Especially when she must've realized on the spot that Vi had a contingency plan because Vi didn't fully trust her again yet - it must've hurt but Caitlyn chose to understand it since she didn't do anything violent or even argumentative in that moment. Hell, she didn't do anything but watch, she didn't even ask questions - she recognized the moment for what it was for the family in front of her.

Caitlyn's turn against Ambessa seems sudden but in the narrative, it was her gradual restabilizing during the timeskip and her observing the effects of Ambessa's plans that made her realize how bad things had gotten in Piltover and Zaun. This is Caitlyn Kiramman rising out of her personal blinding grief, betrayal and confusion to once again see and understand the state of things, her new position and influence, and regain some sense of control.

And of course in Isha's sacrifice scene, who does Caitlyn run to save out of instinct? Vi. Of course.

Their relationship is now deeper than even current emotions or logic or controlled reactions. It's instinct.

The fact that after all that, Caitlyn can find it in herself to just allow her guards ("they were hauling her away before I even had a chance to think") to leave Jinx in a cell - and, according to other fans, take away anything (bands, bandages, etc) that Jinx might use to kill herself with after Isha's death - says so much about how far she has come emotionally. She waits for Vi to wake up so she can handle it - she shows understanding that this is something only Jinx's sister can really attempt to handle. She shows understanding that this is important to Vi, that Vi's been torn between their budding inter-class relationship and the interrupted relationship with her own sister. She's showing up to support WHATEVER decision Vi makes, even if it's potentially leaving with Jinx - leaving Caitlyn behind.

There are so many times that Caitlyn displays compassion and intelligence and care beyond someone of her position and situation might (even though she ALSO displays emotional instability, rage, and one-track hatred). The entire show even tells us how she returns to her values through a very difficult personal loss. They could never make me hate her.

[ven0moir]

What to expect from Will's arc at the start of S5. ( & how Bychance is a personification of his compound trauma ) v01

bychance part i - introduction bychance part ii - narrative structure

I've talked about before how S4 Willelmike essentially follows The Swan Princess' narrative logic. And what happened to Odette when Rothbart tricked Derek into confessing to "Odile", an Odette in disguise he had created via an enchantment? ( they don't call her Odile in this movie, but that's what she's called in the og Swan Lake play )

( HELP I'm sorry this is so dramatic but yeah )

She almost died until Derek was able to rectify his mistake. Derek specifically saying "I make a vow to break all vows" reminded me immediately of S2. Something something about that script talking about Will looking at Mike throughout.

Something something Vecna has been watching every vow mike breaks and every smile will fakes.

HELP ME WHAT IF MIKE GETS VECNA'D and we think we're getting allll this super complex "realization" sequence but instead Vecna's just legit like

"Wdym? I love El."

HAHRDSOKFOEHW IM CRYINGGGGGGG a funny thought but ( hopefully not ) I hate the idea of Mike's love confession to El being meant for Will. Please don't Mileven 2.0 my Byler, Duffers.

Anyway, I trust them, so I know that won't happen ( squints at them )

Something about Will being forgotten/fading into nothing. Something about Hopper having lost the "spirit to live" .... The Nothing being this force that takes away hopes and dreams ... it's giving birthdaygate. It's giving Will feeling like he's a mistake. Some of this could also apply to Mike ( and I'll ... talk about Mike eventually bc im mustering up the courage. But this is about Will rn )

Now there's only so much I can handle thinking about Will's arc because it's just way too freaking angsty for the payoff to just be "Mike realizes he loves Will and then tells Will he loves him in this super dramatic sequence" as in, again, Mileven 2.0? This already happened in S4, not to mention Will cannot look like a second option. The Duffers aren't perfect, sure, but they're more creative than that. ( I say about the derivative af show lmfao but even that is intention ) So they'll likely do something different.

My first guess is that Will is probably not going to be drawing at the start of S5, just like Mike's love for DMing was suppressed under the weight of his trauma at the end of S1.

In Will's case, the reason is even more specific--it is the medium through which he expressed his love to Mike in S4. And if he's suppressing his love for Mike, then if he does any art at all, his heart won't really be in it/he'd be doing it on autopilot/for Vecna related purposes.

Art is also the way he basically gives himself therapy, so if that's not a thing available to him at the moment, then yeah. My guess is he'll be in a similar position as S1 Joyce after they found Will's dead body and Lonnie showed up.

Joyce ( Will ) had hope that Will ( love ) was alive ( aka there was hope Mike loved him and he wasn't delusional for believing that ).

But the "proof", Will's dead body ( Mike's love confession ) makes it clear.

And when I say 'love' I don't just mean Mike, I mean in general. His hope of finding love at all died in that surfer boy's pizza because the chances ( lmao ) of meeting someone else like him, and bonding with that person, are very low. Hence his belief that he wasn't going to fall in love at the start of S3.

But if, like Joyce, Will still had any hope left, then the lie complicates things. Because chances are, that ...

Mike is going to be mad when he finds out about the lie. And even though Will was right, and El shouldn't have lied, after he'd had time to self-reflect, what was his conclusion?

Just like when Lucas tried to apologize to him in S3.

By the time Will's S5 arc begins, he'd have time to reflect on his painting lie, which he really didn't think through, he just acted on impulse to help Mike when Mike needed him, he's likely thinking;

"Whatever happens, whatever he does next, I'll deserve it."

And what's the worst case scenario in this situation? Mike being mad, and banishing him from the party. Telling Mike the truth would probably only make Mike hate him/be disgusted by him so imho I think Will would literally rather die than tell Mike he loves him.

And how things have gone for him so far, he's expecting the worst. He will be operating on the belief that it's only a matter of time before he experiences the worst trauma ever: officially losing his party, the people who saved him.

So S5 Will's emotional landscape is going to be the equivalent of his S1 self--meaning, Will is going to be trying to survive emotionally now like he tried to survive physically in S1. He'll be doing whatever he could and lived off of whatever water-like substance he could find ( unless the show provides a more supernatural reason for his survival ). So when Chance approaches him I kind of picture it being the emotional equivalent of like ...

And them paralleling Jonnie would kind of bring it home to me that Chance is a personification of Will's compound trauma. Lonnie, to Joyce is something not good/toxic ( Chance is a bully ) but god, she is trying to survive emotionally and needs all the help she can get, AND he is familiar ( Chance reminds Will of Mike, likely. At least at first ). He thinks he's making a choice for himself, but Chance is just using him. It's just an illusion--a lie.

However, the thing with Chance isn't all just another way for Vecna ( metaphorically or directly ) to wear down/exhaust Will--it's also a trial, a test to prepare Will for his final showdown with Vecna and finally Break The Cycle. Being with someone before Mike also gives Will perspective--even if he couldn't be with Mike, Chance is evidence that there *are* other guys like him out there, and he could eventually meet someone given enough time to heal.

This is why I think this storyline IS important for his growth. It offers the opportunity for self-exploration and reconnecting with himself. That way, Byler will feel more deserved. More of a choice rather than Will being Mike's last-minute second option.

I admit this one I'm still mewling over, so if there are any changes I'll post updated versions!

[everythingisamazing]

"How Viktors story overshadows the tragedy of Jayce" or "Why disliking Jayce means you don't understand him (yet)." Disclaimer: This is a long one. Since starting to post my (mostly) Jayvik thoughts, I've discovered layers to Jayces character that I feel don't get talked about enough. I disliked him in S1 - he grew on me in S2, but what makes him so compelling to me NOW is how the show replicates the central tragedy of his character with the viewers. Let's start with the assumptions the show encourages us to make about him: Good looking, smart, a little naive, selfish, overachiever, golden boy. These are then strengthened by comparisons to Viktor, caused by their shared screen time and narrative connection. And since V is the one being "framed" with the tragic story (escaping an inescapable death), the tragedy of Jayce, that is happening simultaneously (more on that later), gets obscured. Truth is: If Jayces life looks like success to us, that's mostly because he has to make it look like that. Let me explain: Jayce, as a boy, almost dies on his way to Piltover. As tragedy would have it, he gets saved by and falls in love with what's forbidden in his new home - magic. So he researches the thing he is basically destined to create in secret, only to get found out in the worst way possible. Cue the trial scene. I think the reason why we don't empathize with him enough here (especially not on the first watch) is because it happens so early in the show and we are still busy getting situated in the universe of Arcane. But if you look at it from Jayces perspective, it's pretty traumatizing: He is the heir of his house and having apparently lost his father early, responsibility rests heavy on his shoulders. A house, comparably low on wealth and influence. And you could say it's arrogance, that makes him blurt out "I was trying to create magic." but if you consider his behavior throughout the whole show, I'd actually call it impulsivity and not being able to hide his emotions (I hc Jayce as having ADHD). What we get next, is him wanting to throw himself off a building - which can get misread as "wow, this guy was so obsessed with his vanity project, he'd off himself", when his moms words at the trial ("My son is not well") point to him struggling with something for a while and this being the final straw. And I mean, just think about that - You have a character that starts off at rock bottom, but because we didn't see the journey of how he got there, we fail to empathize with him going forward. If you put yourself in Jayces shoes, would you not feel like you had to do everything it takes, to never get to that point again? Can you imagine the fear, having almost lost your future because a mistake you made escalated to the point where they wanted to exile you? Wouldn't you feel like becoming everyones "golden boy" to make good on that, is something you had to do? THAT'S what I mean, when I say the show replicates the central tragedy of his character with the viewers. We see his story (until a certain point) as the story of someone who wants to go up, up up, but miss, that from his pov, the alternative means going all the way down. I want to end this by giving an example, how Viktors presence plays into that: There is one time, where Jayce actually voices his feelings regarding this matter, when he says "I never asked for this!" And isn't that true in more ways than one (hint hint). But because Viktor is the one who died and is (understandably) upset in this scene, revived and changed against his will, it seems selfish, that Jayce would even bring that up. But is it? Or is he rightfully pointing out, how every single thing he did (and I will give examples in future posts), after Viktor essentially stopped HIM from dying (another amazing parallel) in the very beginning was trying to make the best out of the circumstances he was given? Circumstances, that, quite frankly, ANY character in that show would have severely struggled with?

[collectivephilosopher]

JINX'S ATTACK AT THE COUNCIL

Alright, I need to get this out of my system.

I really don't get how people can portray Jinx's attack at the council as "lashing out" and "throwing tantrum"

I'm not sure if the show is potraying it as such but I'm not saying otherwise either.

First.

If Jinx was lashing out and throwing tantrum, she would show this by lashing out to others other than Piltover. I'm not saying she wasn't angry but she was angry specifically at Piltover. She did not bomb anyone/anything else but the council aka Piltover. Was it personal? Probably yeah. But this is like someone finally attacking their abuser who has been abusing them for years. It's not tantrum. Tantrum is destroying irrelevant things to channel your anger like when you're angry at your parents and destroy the table instead.

What Jinx is doing is showing to piltover. ("We'll show them, we will show them all"). She's telling the council, "look here, I am what you've made, I am the consquence of your action/inaction and I am done. I will show you how much you have hurt me."

"But they were about to vote for peace and Jinx ruined it!" Wrong.

The council were voting for "councilor Talis's proposal for peace." What is this proposal? His deal with Silco ("Jayce has brokered a deal with Silco"). His deal specifically asked for JINX which Silco would not give thus this deal and the meeting was useless because it would never happen anyways.

I need to say btw that his demand for Jinx was ass. He was asking for an individual to essentially be the pound of flesh to satisfy Piltover. Like okay, if Jinx has to pay for the crimes she did then what about the enforcers who has done brutality for years in Zaun? They get free pass? Really? Why? Because Jinx is an individual who did crime on her own? Then what about Jayce who killed an innocent child while attacking a factory filled with people who just work there for living? (Mind you in S1 the show never show Jinx killing civilians)

Now about the tea party.

The reason why Jinx was there at the cannery, why Silco was there which leads to his death, was BECAUSE OF PILTOVER.

Jinx overheard Silco's lament about his deal with piltover and thought he's going to go through with the deal, giving her up, betraying her. Had Jayce never demanded Jinx, she would literally never kidnap Silco.

Silco told Jinx about the deal again at the tea party and he until the end said he would never gave up Jinx. This goofy peace will literally never happen. Besides until the end of S1 the demand for Jinx was never dropped so we can safely assume that the council are still out for Jinx's blood. What else was Jinx supposed to do when she was put at the end of a spear like that?

Jinx attacked the council for all the pain they caused her. While she might not think of other Zaunites at the moment, it's still a political attack. Jinx was also the victim of the system here. She's an oppressed individual. The enforcers hunted Zaunite like they're animals. Jinx is just a Zaunite who happen to grew up stronger than the people who hunt her and in return hunt them back.

She attacked nothing else but the council tower and disappeared after. She was not lashing out.

[love-byers]

i've seen a few anti-byler people say they view byler the same as percy and nico from percy jackson, meaning that both dynamics are just a tool to reveal one character's sexuality. and i think that's interesting because i've always thought the opposite

if you're not familiar with percy jackson, percy is of course the main character, and nico is a recurring side character introduced in the third book (there are 5 books total). in the sequel series, heroes of olympus, it is revealed in the fourth book (of five total) that nico once had a crush on percy.

nico's crush on percy was undoubtedly just a tool to reveal the fact that nico was gay. so let's go through the several differences between these two dynamics, because it's actually in byler's favor

first of all, percy and nico have a four year age gap. when they meet in book 3 nico is 10 and percy is 14, so this comparison is automatically garbage. will is literally 2 weeks older than mike. needed to get that out of the way at the beginning lol

aside from that, mike and will are best friends of 7 years when s1 begins. they became best friends on the first day of kindergarten, they are extremely close, they hang out every day. mike's entire arc in s1 is about finding will. we see how he defends will behind his back, how devastated he is when he thinks will is dead, how he clings to the first bit of proof that he may be alive even though no one believes him, how happy he is when will is found. he runs into will's hospital room and lays his head on will's chest. and we all know about s2 byler...

in the first pjo book, we have no idea nico exists, and neither does percy. percy bonds with annabeth (his love interest) for the entire story (as well as every book besides the third because she was kidnapped at the beginning, and percy's sole motivation was to save her. sounds familiar...).

pjo spoilers ahead (its been out for 20 years come on...)

in the third book, nico is absent for the majority of it because percy leaves camp on a quest with bianca, nico's older sister. bianca dies on the quest, and at the very end of the book percy tells him what happened. nico is devastated and blames percy for her death. the few times percy and nico interact in the 4th book, their arc is entirely centered around nico accepting bianca's death and the fact that it wasn't percy's fault. in the final book they briefly team up at the beginning and make peace, and nico fights on the good side in the final battle. percy and annabeth have their first kiss in the 4th book and start dating at the end of the 5th (looooong situationship)

nico doesn't appear in the first book of the sequel series. he does briefly appear at the beginning of the second, and then leaves to go off on his own business. he is absent for basically all of the third book because he was trapped in a jar by a titan (long story). but percy and the others save him at the end. in the fourth nico is a main character for the first time. he's present for the whole story (while percy and annabeth are stuck in tartarus) and heavily involved. this is the book where we find out nico had feelings for percy. nico and another charcter, jason, are attacked by cupid and cupid forces nico to admit that he had a crush on percy, therefore admitting that he is gay, outing himself to jason. then in the fifth and final book, nico narrates about a quarter of the chapters so we get his more insight on his thoughts and feelings. he feels like a mistake for being gay and feels like he'll be alone forever. when he had a crush on percy he viewed him basically as a superhero. percy was an older, stronger, powerful demigod that protected him, and nico idolized him. but at this point in the story nico is essentially over it. near the end of the book, nico teams up with a guy his age named will solace. and there's a scene in nico's last pov chapter after the final battle is over where nico tells percy that he used to have a crush on him, but that he's over it and percy isn't really his type anyway (lmfao). and then nico walks over to will who had been waiting for him, obviously symbolizing him moving on from percy and choosing will. and in the trials of apollo series we find out that nico and will are dating. (solangelo my bookies<333)

how is this in ANY way shape or form similar to byler??

percy and nico do not have the depth and backstory that mike and will do. percy does not give nico a tearful monologue about how asking nico to be his friend when they were children is the best decision he's ever made. percy and nico do not agree to go crazy together. percy does not tell nico that home isn't the same without him. percy doesn't emphasize that they are just friends. nico isn't the one to push percy into confessing his love to annabeth. nico and percy don't spend every single book attached at the hip. percy doesn't choose to stand with nico instead of following annabeth when the world is ending. percy and nico barely bond at all. their relationship is complicated. they are borderline enemies in the 4th and 5th books (the hate is one sided, but nico has also yet to earn percy's trust), but they become allies and friends in the end.

percy and nico are a good example of a character's feelings for another solely being a tool to reveal their sexuality. byler would be an awful attempt at that. there is unnecessary depth and development. mike and will's bond is a plot point every single season, which would be pointless if they don't end up together. nico had a crush on percy. a crush. it is only every referred to as a crush. will is in love with mike. deeply, devastatingly in love, and always will be. percy was not the only person capable of making nico not feel like a mistake. nico never said he needs percy. nico never says that he's lost without percy.

IF I EVER HEAR P*RNICO EQUATED TO BYLER AGAIN I WILL DRINK BLEACH ON INSTAGRAM LIVE FOR EVERYONE TO SEE AND I MEAN IT. miss me with that bullshit

[chaifootsteps]

here's a question: who do you think is worse, Valentino or Stolas?

the fandom would automatically say Valentino or 'you can't even compare them are you serious' but idk, I don't think it's that clear cut

Make no mistake, Valentino is physically and verbally abusive and he treats Angel like garbage.

But I think the fandom is really underestimating the damage someone like Stolas can do. a sensitive abuser is way better at getting people on their side, because if they're crying then they must care, right? (even if that care is only about themselves)

and on top of that there's the way Stolas rewrites reality to suit himself

if I were Blitzo on the receiving end of that argument in Apology Tour I'd feel like I was going insane because Stolas' framing of events is so warped

to claim he's never looked down on Blitzo (he has, all of s1) and Blitzo couldn't be bothered to help him (he sent his employees because his daughter needed a medical appointment) and that Striker is his "friend" (after his employees risked their lives fighting him to a standstill) and that he's been "trying so hard to support him" (y'know, by using his book to extort sex out of Blitzo, that's what support means now)?

and instead of ever considering if he's done something to make Blitzo feel the way he does, he just pouts and moans and plays the victim? and whenever he does consider if he's done something wrong it's always in internal monologue before he snaps right back to calling Blitzo an idiot or acting like he doesn't deserve Stolas' love

if it were me in that situation I'd want to scream. the extorting Blitzo for sex he did not want to have is dealbreakingly bad enough, but all the gaslighting that comes after? oof. It would seriously mess up my ability to trust anyone for a long time. I'd need a support network around me to point out how out of line Stolas is, not retroactively call the deal ending 'a breakup' and act like Stolas was an ex and not, essentially, an abusive boss (what do you know, the exact same way you could describe Valentino)

idk, besides feeling bewildered at Viv's writing choices and disgusted at the fandom for breaking out every victim blaming trick in the book to demonize Blitzo just to get Stolas off the hook (and Viv enabling it) I mostly just feel... sad

helluva could have been really great material that soft & sensitive does not equal nice and does not excuse abuse. it could have really shone a light on the way abrasive, hypersexual people like Blitzo are framed as culpable in their own abuse even when literally coerced at gunpoint into it

instead it's become one of those 'no longer satirizing the thing but just is the thing' type of media. and I honestly think that's the biggest letdown out of all of this. we have so many pernicious attitudes to dismantle and this show could helped do that for male, especially queer, victims of SA. instead it excuses it at best and romanticizes it and promotes victim blaming at worst

I find it so telling the only instance of SA in Helluva the show's remaining standom cares about is one line from Stella implying Stolas wasn't into having sex with her (sex she also did not want to have, but who cares about that, right?). what happens to Blitzo, then Moxxie being assaulted by Verosika & crew, and then Stolas making out with someone while drunk, plus Andre's creepy comments at Stella - that's all fine and not worth unpacking, because it can't be used to demonize one character while propping Stolas up

sorry this got long, I just wanted to vent!

Easily Stolas. Ridiculously transparent, over the top abusers like Valentino definitely exist in real life, but when their victims call them out, people tend to believe it. Sad, conventionally attractive men employing DARVO techniques and sob stories are pure poison, and they have a tendency to get people on their side. Stolas is a testament to that, and it's genuinely terrifying.

[butterflydm]

WoT 3x07 - additional thoughts

Spoilers through Knife of Dreams in the books, as well as through 3x07 in the show.

Singing the Manetheren song instead of giving a big speech was so perfect!

Shades of late book Perrin here - instead of making a deal with a Seanchan to save his wife, he made a deal with a darkfriend to save his people. I like this "deal with the devil" much better than what we got in the books, tbh. And it tracks with Perrin walking this line between war and peace, and wanting peace to win out in the end.

I am so curious about Fain's deal in the show, because it is VERY different than his deal in the books. He was definitely being affected by the dagger in s2 but now that he's away from it, he seems to be a pretty loyal darkfriend again. He's actually putting in the work to do what the Dark One/Ishamael would want (destroying the Two Rivers to try to help turn Rand dark) as opposed to the infighting that most of the Forsaken seem to be doing. Ishy really was the glue holding the side of the Shadow together.

Regarding Aram, for me, minor characters always need to be seen for what they bring to the main storyline, especially in such a short time frame as we have (similar to how I felt about the changes in Natti & Abell, and in Faile's mom in her backstory). The Tuatha'an & the Aiel served to narratively connect Rand to Perrin's storyline-- that's why Ila echoes the words from the columns, that's why Aram picks up a sword for the same reason that Lewin picked up a spear (immediate self-defense & defense of others). That's why we have Bain & Chiad connect Rand "al'Thor" to "al Thorin" from the Manetheren story that Loial tells them.

We had the Cauthon twins to connect Mat & Perrin together. We had the Tuatha'an & the Aiel to connect Rand & Perrin together.

(and, in Mat's storyline, he's actively on a quest to help Rand; and we've had nods to his friendship with Perrin in his dream where Perrin had made him a weapon)

Back when I thought Loial had died at the end of s1, I basically went - "this is heartbreaking but I understand why they might make this choice" and that is essentially how I feel now too. Loial is a lovely side character but he is not essential to any main storyline beats. The Ogier subplot can just be trimmed off. But it is heartbreaking! I love Loial! But narratively, I think it's not a bad call -- emotionally affecting but not plot breaking. This is also Loial living up to the speech that he gave the others at the end of s2 -- "we are all the heroes of another Age's legends."

Speaking of cutting off subplots, Valda's death here also implies a lot about what will or won't happen with Morgase in the future (though I've felt for a while that she's probably destined to die as opposed to escaping when she gets dethroned).

And Aram taking up blacksmithing instead of following Perrin around also cuts off a subplot -- and another one that I felt like the show might cut anyway, because it was really hard to believe that show!Perrin would ever ignore Aram spiraling the way that book!Perrin did. Show!Perrin would notice, show!Perrin would care and do something to help Aram before it got so bad.

The show continues to do a bit of 'the road not traveled' from the books - in the books, Egwene was ready to kill Renna & stopped because of Nynaeve & Elayne. Here, they didn't make it to Egwene in time, and Renna dies.

In the books, the Whitecloaks fail to help defend the Two Rivers, so Perrin doesn't go with them. Here, Dain does fulfill his end of the bargain & so Perrin also fulfills his.

It does make me feel that s4 (fingers crossed for renewal!) is potentially gonna have a lot less Lord of Chaos than people have been speculating, because Perrin was just given a plotline to fill the empty space where he is Sir Not Appearing in The Fires of Heaven.

I let the people on reddit influence me into thinking Dumai's Wells would happen s4 no matter what lol, even though I originally felt it would suit a s5 ending better. Maksim living here makes me lean towards Dumai's Wells being a s5 finale event instead (if we get the seasons, etc).

[dearinglovebot]

the handler and owen approach raptor handling in such an opposite way that the handler is essentially the reason why he was ultimately against his own project as soon as it was successful.

the way IBRIS began was as a question of Could This Thing Happen without much should it. until it actually WORKED. until they actually realized huh these guys really do imprint and follow commands. and you guys want to use that for warfare? that’s kind of fucked up. maybe science should lose if this is how it’s all going to end up.

owen does not want his raptors used by humans to service their own desires. he believes these are wild animals. theyre brilliant animals but they aren’t his dogs. it’s mutual respect. he is a human who raised them but he’s still a human and they are still raptors. they aren’t working dogs. a distinction has to be made for everyone’s own good. he approaches his research like he is robert oppenheimer regretting the nuclear bomb.

meanwhile, the handler’s raptors are the equivalent of purebred dobermans. they’re designed to have aggressive prey drives, to be a little stupider to follow commands easier, and be able to take a good amount of hits. human benefit is the ONLY reason biosyn creates them. they’re not wild animals, they are ASSETS.

but the handler does not make a distinction between herself and the raptors. she is functionally a sister. she does not care about the well being of other humans thus has no problem with their military intentions. the ethics frankly don’t bother her. because she has that same prey drive as seen in scenes such as the s1 finale where she smiles getting to Hunt the N5. and it’s that inevitable bloodshed that has him and barry so against hoskins doing field tests at the beginning of jurassic world and so against using the raptors to tackle the indominus because as he says in the deleted scene, it’s worse if it DOES work

[robomusical]

Hrrrggg everything hurts. Thinking about the MegOP sparkling (I need names, but am thinking about naming her Stronghold) I’ve had rattling around in brain for the past month or so, so here goes, continuity soup because I said so. This is… a long one 😅

So we start with the usual pre war MegOP situation with Gladiator Megs and Archivist Orion, who go talk to the high council and yadah yadah, you know what happens next. (think TFP) OP gets the Matrix and Megatron is betrayed and starts up his intergalactic terrorist group (yippee!) When he finds out, Uh-Oh! He carrying and it’s Optimus’s… he freaks out pretty hard but WaveWave is there to support him during his pregnancy (Soundwaves a bit jealous about not being the one who’s currently carrying but is excited to see/raise a new spark). Eventually he has the baby and there are a few.. complications.

1. Sparklings are supposed to have strong bonds with their carrier and sire, but in Strongholds case, they have no sire bond with Optimus (the matrix prevented it), which causes her to have spark flutters (essentially heart problems) causing the little one lots of pain with no exception of expressing it but crying/being a fussy baby while she’s young. The only was they find this out is with Soundwaves telepathy, something they are VERY grateful for.

2. Megatron suffers from GREATLY from postpartum depression, and can’t even bear to look at his daughter. He can bring himself to feed her or try to establish any type of bond between the two and ends up hating her and what she stands for in his mind (having OP and trying to have a family with him)

This causes the young heiress to be raised by the deception high command with very little input on Megatrons behalf besides being an abusive mom and wanting her to be a warrior. She’s mainly being raised by Wavewave, the elite trine and Hook due to having to be in the med bay almost constantly in her sparkling hood. As a sparkling she showed major talent and interests in the arts, something that was supported by their caregivers, but almost gets beaten to death by Megatron finds out she wants to be an artist and not a warrior. (Megatron has “training” sessions with her, where she essentially gets beaten half to death but her carrier, who claims it’ll make her stronger. And when she’s finally able to beat him, she’ll be able to lead the decepticons) (this also leads to her hiding her passions) This is how she wins over Starscream and he decides to help raise/guide her (and who knows, maybe one day he or she will kill Megatron and he’ll be the leader of the decepticons) She’s raised to be a master spy (Soundwave) and interrogator/torturer (Shockwave and Starscream). Eventually though the war starts to pick up and everyone is headed to earth (think G1, but shockwave goes with the decepticons) leaving Stronghold alone on Cybertron with Rumble, Buzzsaw, Thundercraker, and the Constructicons to watch/take care of her; and her mentor Tarn (and the rest of the DJD) and a few other decepticons at about ~10 years old to Cybertronian standards. She finds herself forced to grow up and lead the Decepticons, being raised by the most ruthless and cunning bots has its advantages, and she ends up quickly taking out the Autobots on Cyberton leading the planet under Decepticon rule. However there was complications with the others (G1 style, went missing for a few billion years type-beat) She grows up a warlord, conquering Autobot territory’s and wiping them out, searching for her lost family comrades, with the Deceptions ruling the galaxy, (exterminating the Autobots and making allies with/converting Neutrals). She’s ends up creating a vast and powerful empire (Thundercraker, Hook and Tarn are very proud).

On earth is the normal G1 -> Earthspark timeline, expect I ignore everything that happens after s1. Soundwave manages to get a SOS comm into deep space, which gets intercepted to the Decepticon empire. This happens around/a little after her spark almost gave out, as her carrier/sparkling bond was broken with Megatron, which was assumed to be due to his death. This made her spark unstable, and made her even more vulnerable to her spark attacks (also her occasional maniac episodes go worse/more common) She leads a ship to Earth where she finds that not only is her carrier ALIVE, which means he LEFT her HE DOESNT WANT HER HE NEVER WANTED HER- but also joined the enemy. And started a new family, one without her This is also how she and Optimus find out they’re related, because honestly, Meg’s forgot all about her. (Also, megaton has more of a major role in the Terran’s lives, which leaves Stronghold seething, swearing to end them) ((You know when/how Megatrons calls Twitch “little bird”? THAT USED TO BE HER NICKNAME SHE USED TO BE HIS LITTLE BIRD WHEN HE WAS HAPPY WITH HER)) (think of when shockwave was racist towards the Terran’s) Stronghold finds out that the decepticons have been stranded on earth, and have been being tortured by Autobots and their human allies (GHOST). She stages a jailbreak for the others and begins to plan war with the others left on earth (she’s not leaving until Megatrons head is on a platter and she’s ripped the matrix out of OP’s chest). (They chill in the atmosphere like the Nemesis in prime) Needless to say, Shockwave Soundwave and Starscream are very surprised/proud to see her and her accomplishments (if not sad that she (now about 15) had to grow up so fast and what has happened to her)

There are a few ways this AU can end and there’ll prolly be a few alt timelines… 👀

Uhh anyways that’s it,,, I hope you like her and I will probably draw the creature soon

(Please please ask me about her and my silly little AU 🥺🥺🥺)

[books-and-omens]

Okay okay, so I really want to talk about S2 Crowley.

I’ve been thinking about who Crowley is in the book and who he is in the show, and the gap is significant. (@tbutchaziraphale has fantastic meta over here which I think is spot on.)

Book!Crowley is an optimist, yes? I mean, we’re outright told this:

“Because, underneath it all, Crowley was an optimist. If there was one rock-hard certainty that had sustained him through the bad times—he thought briefly of the fourteenth century—then it was utter surety that he would come out on top; that the universe would look after him.”

Honestly, what a thing for a fallen angel to believe! And to me, it’s powerful, yes, but it never quite answers the question: where is he getting that certainty?

Tv!Crowley, in the meantime, is emphatically not this. He’s never been an optimist, not even in S1—although in S1, it might have been easier to look at A & C and consider them essentially similar to their book selves if a little out of sync.

In S1, Crowley gives the whole “don’t test them to destruction” speech. He cares about humanity deeply, even if he won’t admit it. He will try to stop the Apocalypse.

And there is still a moment when he feels helpless. When he has no innate optimism to carry him through, no deep belief in the universe looking after him or anyone. When his instincts tell him to run, and he tries to follow them. When he despairs. Aziraphale pulls him back out of that despair; they make a stand together. As we know, it works.

But the thing is, the thing is. I find tv!Crowley’s lack of optimism so very relatable.

I find despair so very relatable, too.

We live in an age of deep anxiety. (Climate change, anyone? Just for starters! The promise and wonder of the Moon landing and the end of the Cold War are far in the past; day to day, we deal with the effects of capitalism, of reactionism, of continued exclusionism. It’s far too easy to feel helpless.)

So in S2, Crowley is very much the same character as he was in S1, except we see it even clearer.

He is not an optimist. He wants to run; he wants to escape when faced with Gabriel’s arrival; he wants to protect Aziraphale and himself, and believes that the best—perhaps only—way to do that is by them retreating as far away from the problem as they can.

In Heaven, Crowley finds out about The Second Coming. His need to escape and to keep his angel safe become overwhelming. But he doesn’t tell Aziraphale about the Second Coming, does he? And his repeated offer to run away together doesn't even make sense to Aziraphale. (Not that Aziraphale would want to run if he knew. Quite the opposite, in fact, which Crowley must know.)

Anyway, Crowley already knows that the clock is ticking. Aziraphale is about to find it out. (Do you notice how often, in the last fifteen minutes of S2, we hear nothing in the background but the ticking of a clock?)

And just—the despair, the desire to retreat and escape when you are faced with overwhelming odds, with a fundamentally broken system, are so relatable.

And yet escape has never been the answer.

I hope, of course, that this is what we’ll see in S3 if there is a S3. Crowley deciding, emphatically, that running away is not the answer. 

We didn't get there yet. We were dropped out of the story at the darkest point.

But I think being at this point is precisely what makes Crowley’s confession at the end of S2 transcendent.

Because it’s the same conflict, isn’t it, except on a personal scale. Despair in the face of overwhelming odds, followed by the decision to not give up.

Crowley, who’d been ready to confess, sees what is likely to happen. He sees the way the deck is stacked against him, sees that he is unlikely to get through. He feels the coming loss. 

And then he does it anyway. 

He confesses anyway. He says what he has set out to say, gasping and clawing for every word. He does it at the point when everything appears lost.

And no, we don’t see the effects of it, not yet. We don’t see what he has launched, the hook that sank into Aziraphale, the change it has wrought in Crowley himself.

But his bravery won’t be lost.

We live in a dark timeline. I maintain that this is precisely what makes this story so compelling.

Be brave. Do the difficult thing anyway. Do it anyway. Do it anyway.

Even in the face of overwhelming odds. Especially in the face of overwhelming odds. While not being an optimist in the slightest.

This is what hope is.

This is what we have to do.

(And to all of us who’d lost a comfort story: I’m so sorry. I, too, am still grieving for it. I know, I know.

Emphatically: all is not lost.)

[arcanecor3]

Sister parallels.

Okay so, this is me trying my best to explain my view of the parallel between these 2 scenes

Firstly, a little thing to keep in mind is that in this parallel, s2 Cait represents s1 Vi and s2 Vi represents Powder 

A big fight just happened, s1’s was the Vander rescue mission and s2’s was find Jinx, and both ended up going wrong because of someone who was supposed to help (Powder; s2Vi). After everything goes down at the s1 warehouse, we see Vi screaming and she is angry (i’ll come back to that later), and then Powder shows up with the “my monkey bomb finally worked” line we all know, and on s2 we have Caitlyn being the angry one because Vi didn’t let her shoot.

a little parallel with the lines:

“you did this?”-s1vi to powder

“you stopped me”-s2cait to vi

“i was saving you”-powder to s1vi

“that was a kid! what if you missed?”- s2vi to cait

Now, both s1 Vi and s2 Cait are blinded by anger and grief, so even tho the other person (Powder; s2vi) is explaining themselves (in Powder’s case it wasn’t the greatest explanation, but she does states that it was an accident, and s2 Vi was being rational), they don’t really listen because of all the anger.

then, Vi slaps powder, making her fall, and that’s when Powder desperately asks: “why did you leave me?” to which Vi answers: “because you’re a jinx! do you hear me? mylo was right". Now on s2, basically the same thing happens, just in a different order: s2 Cait says: “I keep telling myself that you’re different. but you’re not. it’s her (Jinx’s) blood that runs in your veins”, then Vi asks her: “then why are you the one acting like her?” and Caitlyn hits vi, knocking her to the ground. AND IN S2 WE EVEN GET A SHOT OF ANGRY CAITLYN LOOKING AT VI CRYING, JUST LIKE S1 VI LOOKED ANGRY AT POWDER CRYING. LIKE HOW SICK AND TWISTED IS THAT.

Then both s1 Vi and s2 Cait walk away, leaving the other one crying alone on the floor. 

The thing is that crying is the exactly what we expect from Powder, since that’s how she was during the entire scene, because that’s how her character is. but not Vi. Because during the entire of the s2 scene vi wasn’t actually crying, in fact, Vi barely cries in the whole show, the only time we see her actually sobbing is during the bridge scene from s1e1, when she saw her dead parents. And since then, she has trained and fought to become a person who can protect those she loves. And even when everything goes down at the s1 warehouse, we only get to see her a glimpse of her crying before she tried to go back to powder, but she’s mainly angry, that’s the way Vi usually reacts to these situations. She gets angry. And she tries to do everything in her power to go after who hurt her/the people she loves.

But this s2 scene is different. She simply has nowhere to go. Once again, she lost everything. Her family? dead. you might argue there’s Jinx but as Vi herself said: “my sister is gone”. the last person she had was Caitlyn, and she left, and Vi now feels like she ruined everything again, because that’s how she is, she burdens herself with the guilt and blames herself. So when you see Vi just, on her knees, crying, it’s just so devastating when you think that she is like that because her life is essentially over. All there’s left to her is cry. Just like Powder in the end of s1e3, s2e3 Vi lost everyone.

But that’s when the parallel ends, because it’s when Powder was in that desperate state that silco came, and even though his character divides opinions, you can’t deny that he took care of and loved Powder (who became Jinx).

Vi doesn’t have anyone to come and save her, to wipe away her tears like she had done so many times before for Caitlyn and before that for Powder. She is alone.

thank you to whoever read this entire thing for contributing to my arcane obsession, and shoutout to my amazing friend who helped me put this together @crzytoogetherr 🥰🥰

[violent-viscera]

okay, so most definitely an unpopular opinion considering the amount of caitlyn fans/stans (in addition to fans solely bc of caitvi) but i wanted to articulate my thoughts on her s2.

firstly, i loved the idea of her character in s1. along with jayce, i understand that they were both fundamentally flawed due to inherent, latent prejudices that they held against zaunites. they often misspoke and stepped out of line when speaking to ppl like vi and viktor just on the basis of their privilege of being born piltovan.

but it was interesting to see how their good hearts and intentions led them to being forced to face their troubled and unfair prejudices. of course, i didn't agree with how they viewed zaunites, but i was rooting for them to become spearheads of change and reform.

anyway, i digress to where i am now where i am feel incredibly disappointed by the writing of her character.

i love a good villainess and was actually quite excited to see where her fascist arc would take her. it would be such a diametric, polar opposite of her character in s1 where she was slowly beginning to see piltover's role in the systematic oppression of zaun.

it would've been compelling to see her become completely lost to her grief and rage and the message behind how the repercussions of cataclysmic calamity that she and jinx cause as mirrors of one another would've been interesting (ie. jinx shooting a rocket launcher at the council in her loss of silco vs. caitlyn gassing innocent civilians in a bid to discover jinx after losing her mother)

but again, the writing didn't do much for me in the way of caitlyn or her mother in s2 in so many different ways.

i understand that there are nuances and complexities in difficult mother-daughter relationships and i understand caitlyn has every right to grieve. but her grief is not parallel to the grief of vi or jinx or any other zaunite when most of the misfortune that befell zaunite deaths can indirectly stem from the choices made by ppl like cassandra and the council.

yes, cassandra built systems to ensure that the grey did not completely suffocate zaunites. but this still by no means absolves all her other sins in her complacency in the oppression of zaunites–not to mention her attitude towards zaunites or anyone else that she deems "less than"

caitlyn's villain arc was watery and diluted at best. it was initially really interesting to see count caitlyn and her cape step up to the plate under ambessa's encouragement, but by the next episode she was already wavering and uncommitted. it seemed like a pointless route to entertain with how brief it was. and as others mentioned, caitlyn was being a cruel asshole without the direction of ambessa with the usage of chemical warfare.

caitlyn's choices had very little repercussions throughout the season. she hits vi with a rifle and turns her back on her and is basically instantly forgiven. she performs chemical warfare and her guilty conscience is the only real consequence she faces. she loses her eye in a fight, yes, but it is also a battle she invited when she accepted tutelage under ambessa to sustain a fascist regime. she makes it blatantly clear that she accepts vi bc she views vi as an entity separate of the rest of the animals of zaun and there isn't really any content that implies these views have changed or that there will be any reform imminent for enforcers/piltovan-zaun relations aside from reluctantly allowing Sevika a spot on the council

i dont even want to get into how vi become completely a shell of the amazing, compelling character she was in s1 and how the heart and soul of the show (the sisters' rs) was essentially abandoned to make caitvi happen rather than rly considering the optics and pragmatism of having an oppressed, falsely imprisoned, vulnerable zaunite being with an enforcer without due sensitivity and consideration of what needs happen to make caitvi happen in a sensible fashion.

i just feel like by the end of the show, caitlyn ends up right where she started where she's a privileged piltovan living her cushy life with no repercussions. there was no real reason to write her as an empathetic character, struggling with what she knew as a piltovan vs. what she sees when she is with vi down in zaun, bc in the end, the empathy did nothing to change how she treated zaunites or how her enforcers operate on the day-to-day.

and i actually think if the writers didn't try to play caitvi off as being a healthy, beautiful representation of a lesbian relationship instead of toxic one marred by power imbalances, it would've been a compelling and tragic message.

TLDR: i think many ppl have expressed their disappointment in how vi (and jinx) were written in s2, but i also think the writers did a terrible job in writing caitlyn as well.

[familyvideostevie]

I have loved tlou since the first game came out and I really loved that episode so I’m super interested in why you felt is was bad if you’d be comfortable sharing!

/gen

you know what, what the hell. sure! thoughts and spoilers for tlou part ii and s2 below.

first of all, super happy for anyone who loves the show and the way it adapts the story. my beef is my beef! i have like, a lot of things i don't like about they way the show characterized joel and ellie in s1 that are probably the foundation for some of this, but the main thing i Do Not Like about they way they're setting up s2 is the positioning they seem to be doing to the status of ellie and joel's relationship as it exists a few years after the end of part i, the day before/day of joel's death (since it seems to me they cherry picked from the timeline of the patrols/the dance, etc).

now, in part ii, we drop into ellie and joel's life a few years later with only very small indications that something is wrong. she asks jesse about joel right away, she entertains maria's inquiry into their relationship in a way that seems very teenager-ish. when dina asks, ellie is a little cagey, but she talks about him to her. she says she's thinking about inviting him to a movie. whatever. and then we all know what comes next, right? when joel dies, we don't know how bad it was. we don't know that they are, essentially, estranged. as we find this out as the game goes on it makes everything more intense. her loss, her desire for revenge. because she's fighting for something that was taken from her. and then. after we've fought so hard and after we've gotten abby's side of the story -- then we get the dance flashback. and we learn that despite their estrangement, joel steps in to defend ellie and dina from seth and it makes her so angry for just a second because how dare he still love her enough? how dare he, after she told him not to? because if joel loved her enough to damn the whole world, well. what does she do with that? but in the cut scene in the game -- after she said i don't need your fucking help, joel, to me, ellie regrets it. for just a second, she regrets it. cause they have not spoken! by her boundary! she told him in salt lake -- we're done. and he accepted that. so it makes sense to me that she's been coming to her own conclusions about what she wants from him and she goes to the porch because she needs to talk it out. and then they are on the cusp of reconciliation and then it's gone forever.

okay. so, my beef with what they've done in the show. they made joel angry about the whole thing. they made him upset that she's icing him, they made him frustrated that she's upset with him. that she doesn't understand why he did what he did, why he lied to her (i assume she knows that by now), that he thinks she should just accept it and treat him like she loves him. be nice to him. doesn't he deserve that? this, to me, is a million fucking miles off. even for the characterization of joel they've written in season 1! because, in my opinion, the whole fucking point is that he accepts the consequences. he killed that entire hospital full of people, he took away a cure, he saved her because he had to. he made that choice and he sticks with it until he dies. in the game, joel accepts ellie's estrangement. he doesn't push her, he doesn't cross her boundary. because at least she stays in jackson once he tells her the truth, because at least she's alive. because that is the only thing that has ever fucking mattered. and everything else he can live with.

even when faced with death -- a death he doesn't understand, by the way, nor does he seem to care to because of course this was going to happen someday -- he doesn't regret it. he only cares that she's okay. and not for nothing, to me they keep this under wraps in the game. he respects her lines and never crosses them until the dance. it's a private thing. and so it's tragic because no one knows or understands what she's lost when he is killed. and then for the rest of part ii we have this example of joel doing something he believed in unequivocally and feeling no guilt for it even if it cost him, in a way, everything, because did it really? ellie is alive, so he can live with it. and then we have abby and ellie, who are discovering what they can live with and what they can't.

so. i guess i just think it undermines, well, everything, to have joel behave this way. is it making him more complex? not really. it makes ellie look like a petulant child. it makes us wish she would treat him better (which will probably be the show's version of a gotcha when it comes to the narrative truth of the matter). it's making him more realistic, maybe, but when did we start caring about that? part of what is so compelling about him is he is, in many ways, very black and white (which they seem to be hinting at with this refugee plot but don't get me started on that). part of what is compelling about the last of us is we are required to live with his choice, too. we have to understand that everything that happens is a consequence of that and we are the only ones who really understand just how much. ellie doesn't, joel doesn't, abby doesn't. no one has all of the pieces but us, the player/viewer. and i just think muddling a line in the sand that was there for a reason is, well. stupid. what purpose does it serve to show that joel would damn the world for ellie, but he won't respect her boundaries after the fact? he would go so far for her and no more?

yeah. that's my main beef. i have like, 100 more things, but. this is long enough. thanks for asking!

(for the record, there were things i liked, too! i liked the stalker, i liked the game callbacks (the grocery store, ellie's journal and her cleaning her gun at the workbench, the incredibly random easter egg of the employee of the month board even though that actually happens in Seattle, whatever). I'm interested by dina, i think jesse is fantastic. we'll see! I'm going to be watching and I'm going to be critical but I'm still excited to see where it goes. )