#both different flavors
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Sure, “the cycle is cycling” is a fun and cute thing to say but in all honesty? To me, the succession ending sort of accidentally broke that logic. Can you really draw the logical conclusion that the siblings end up like Ewan and Logan? No, because what was the reason for their estrangement? Ultimately, Ewan resents Logan for letting himself become the person he died as. Why was Logan like that? Because of the company (very simplisitc, there is more here obviously). Shiv literally takes that possibility away from Kendall by voting against him.
Does that mean being “out” magically fixes their shit? Of course not. Here is the thing. Kendall will always be trapped in the cycle of thinking he was meant to be CEO, it was instilled into him as a child! Part of him will always resent Shiv for her vote and will always come back to this formative moment. But. Does that mean he can never care about anything else, doomed to wander around as an empty shell? I don’t think so, we’ve been through the epic highs and lows of corporate fuckery with Ken, he somehow always returns to himself in the end, partially because of his siblings.
Shiv will always be stuck knowing that her being a woman plays a major part in the way her father and every other man in her life treats her. That resentment won’t go away either, it may even take a new shape with motherhood mixed in. But also, she is probably working a new angle with Tom as we speak. Maybe she’ll return to her political roots, who knows, she certainly will do everything to not become her mother even if she jokes about the opposite at the funeral. But the most important thing to me is the fact that, even in her resentment towards Ken, she tells him “I love you, but I can’t fucking stomach you”. The first part did not need to be there. And yet.
And Roman (always hardest to talk about for me, lol). Well, he will always look for guidance outside of himself, he will always need his family. His ending is lonely on one side, but there is a quiet beauty in it as well. After everything, there is a moment of solitude and being able to breathe, even reminisce. He just started really grieving and wherever the path leads, it will never lead back to Logan. It can’t. He will always love his father (and I need to take the moment to say- that is totally fine, we as observers have a different view on their relationship than him), but his father will never be able to abuse that or hold it against him again. The wheels have come off the cycle and the engine is dead. The entire fourth season can be seen as an attempt to keep the cycle alive, because it is comforting in a way. But it doesn’t work, because, I repeat, THE ENGINE IS LITERALLY DEAD.
See, succession clearly has shown that whereas Logan and Ewan had no desire to be a family, the sibs always find their way back to each other. After Ken’s season 1 bullshit. After Ken’s press conference. After the confrontation with Logan. Ewan tells people at the funeral “I loved him I suppose, but-” but none of them would ever say that. The love is so clearly, inarguably there and maybe that is the real tragedy; that in another world it could have been a much easier kind of love (but it rarely is, for most of us anyways).
#i guess you could say i have a personal gripe with the logan-ewan-rose kendall-shiv-roman allignment so what?#i also have a gripe with being needlessly melodramatic but don't feel to attacked by that i get it#it makes for poetic analysis#not gonna lie i have like two more posts about this in the drafts#both different flavors#because i will tell you one thing i had a gut reaction to all three sibling's endings and none of them were what you might expect#and i keep returning to them so those really inform my reading and rejection of certain theories#succession#succession season 4#kendall roy#shiv roy#roman roy#logan roy
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Ye old Shen twins au where they both become peak lords EXCEPT. Instead of making them twin peak lords or something, we pretend the evidence that the beast peak does likely not exist is lies, and Shen Yuan gets to become peak lord of the beast peak. Why? Because he would LOVE IT there. It's his territory. He gets to be unapologetically nerdy about beasts 24/7 and make it everyone's problem.
As he should.
And bonus! He can snatch LBH at the disciple hole digging. Plot solved! (Assuming the system wouldn't you know. Pull system stuff and force LBH to end up on Qing Jing or some shit.)
And everyone lived happily ever after or some bullshit idk. I reread the 79 extras as well as the TLJ & ZZL ones let me have fluffy AU thoughts goddamnit, my heart has been irreparably damaged-
#svsss#shen qingqiu#shen yuan#shen jiu#shen twins#shen bros#svsss au#cue everyone having to look out for their overly beast enthusiastic pl SY#one of these days yqy and sj are gonna die of an aneurysm due to SY constantly seeking out the most dangerous beasts#sy looking at obviously dangerous monster: OOOO IS THAT A [insert pidw monster here]??? *runs towards it*#yqy: Yuan-di please stop xiao jiu's gonna be on his third qi deviation this week#sj: if u die I'll master necromancy so I can revive you to kILL YOU MYSELF GODDAMNIT A-YUAN STOP APPROACHING IT#liu qingge probably gets promoted from uber driver to full time babysitter (and enabler) of Shen Yuan#yqy having to juggle two (2) chaotic shidis (though different flavors of chaotic)#at least in this one SY probs helped yqy and sj sort their shit out so they're both a) more chill and b) actually talking#also please imagine white lotus LBH as very enthusiastic lil disciple among a bunch of fluffy beasts the beast peak is keeping
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really telling how in their efforts to retcon Bruce and Dick’s golden age relationship, which was so openly loving and respectful that people thought of it as romantic, the geniuses at DC swung so hard in the other direction that they just changed the flavor of the ship
like making Bruce obsessive, controlling and abusive towards Dick didn’t dispel the rumors, it just turned a healthy (albeit unconventional) gay relationship into an unhealthy or predatory gay relationship
#brudick#and now in rebirth they (DC) are trying to push the fatherly angle so hard they don’t care what kind of dad Bruce is portrayed to be#both current batman and WFA are pushing the familial aspect so hard from different angles#like !!!don’t forget he’s a father!!! he’s daddy!!!!#idc idc#incest shippers are the final boss DC- no way you’re getting rid of me#the more you insist that Bruce is his dad the more I like this flavor of the ship
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"Who needs a break down when you can simply break it down?"
-Casey Jones, probably
#Don't be fooled#they're both having breakdowns#just different flavors#rottmnt#rise of the teenage mutant ninja turtles#rottmnt raphael#rottmnt cassandra jones#gremsgoodies#check yourself before you wreck yourself#CYBYWY
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what is up with me and fictional guys who are generally well liked in universe, no matter how much of a red flag they actually are, with their goddamn tits and flamboyance
#first leander and now oleander#instantly went i need this man so badly when i finally got around to his routes#they have such different flavors tho#like with leander i'd want to give in because of that sense of extreme relief he provides the mc was just written SO WELL UGHHH#and with oleander it's so very much a game and it's so very fun and that mc seems to have their head screwed on a lil more tightly#absolutely no offense ofc i adore both of these vn's a lot#and i find the name similarity somewhat amusing#anyway. :3#obscura vn#obscura oleander#touchstarved game#touchstarved leander
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These are highly subjective interpretations but to me Jadzia and Seven are two (opposite?) flavors of gender indifference:
Jadzia: gender depends on what's funnier in the moment/what allows her to commit further to the bit. Always aware on some level that she's putting on a show and she loves it, especially if other people get confused. Not her job to explain! Figure it out yourself!
Seven (Voyager edition): wants OFF this ride, it's already a concession that Seven is using I/my/myself pronouns instead of we/us/ourselves, why is being an individual tied so closely to gender in the first place. She/her is, for the moment, just the least exhausting option when interacting with others among pronouns that all feel alien to her
#releasing this post into the wild after months of sitting in my drafts#i'm using the 'canonical' pronouns as a basis here but i really love when people use different pronouns for both of them#they/them jadzia and they/them seven are also very different gender flavors to me but i don't think i'm the right person to make that post#anyway. discussion very welcome!#seven of nine#jadzia dax#obviously like. canon never intended to support these readings /at all/ but i can do what i want etc
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Everything around the Isabeau confession is so well written.
Firstly, the set up. When you're playing the game, killing the King is just a vague goal. A natural one! But other than the vague desire to hit an end point, there isn't really a strong emotional reason compelling the player forward. But Isabeau!!! Telling you he will tell you something once you beat the King!!! That!!! That is a tangible goal to lean onto especially over time as you get more and more endeared to the whole party. Even if you're not aware of it being a love confession, getting to Isabeau to hear what he has to say is still a compelling reason get to the end.
And if you're Aware of how these things go for stories like these, you may also say, "Well shit, we're not gonna get a confession until the end of the game, are we?"
Second, the interruptions. The order of the interruptions are so quietly brilliant. I can't get over it. Bonnie interrupting first is such an excellent choice. You know Bonnie!!! Bonnie has been jumping into conversations all game so far. So interrupting Isabeau doesn't seem all that out of place. Then Mirabelle interrupts next time. And you go, okay. Thats two of three.... but surely Odile won't interrupt, right? By this point, the player has seen Odile tease Isabeau multiple times about him liking Siffrin, so surely she won't interrupt... right? Right??? But she does. And despite it being obvious that she would, the player is still left in tension if she would.
The way things are set up, there's a plausible deniability each time. You don't expect the first interruption, Bonnie naturally would interrupt so Mirabelle could be surprising, and Odile interrupting feels so outside of what she'd usually do that you don't expect it.
And yet!!!! Saying all this!!! This is very tropey!!! Very time loop tropey!!! Stopping people from messing things up so you can have your moment is quintessential time loop tropes and yet!!! It doesn't feel tropey due to good characterization and story structure.
(And if you do realize that all three are going to interrupt from the beginning, you get a wave of DREAD when you realize that you're going to be here. Again and again. That you have to beat the King again and again and again... and as you watch the confession fizzle, seeing the Head Housemaiden there, despite Siffrin's happy demeanor, you can't help but feel it all about to crash down before it even happens. In that moment you have a taste of what the game is about to put you through).
Third, the family quests. I have two points here. Firstly, "yelling at your screen like it's a telenovela" is the best summary of my feelings on the stargazing scene. Even if you KNOW Isabeau isn't going to confess until the end of the game bc that's how these things go, it won't happen until the end because that's how good writing works, You Still Want It To Happen. So Badly. You want Isabeau to confess to Siffrin!!! You want that tension to release!!! But you have to watch and see that perfect confession slip away every time and it hurts to watch, especially if you do the quests multiple times. Second point is the fact you can't continue the Isabeau confessions on a family run kills me. It's so good. Like you're never going to get everything in one go no matter what you do so you have to pick and choose. And!!! That plays into Siffrin feeling like he's manipulating Isabeau!!!
Of course Siffrin isn't actually manipulating Isabeau but when you're so aware of what you're doing and how events could have played out, it's difficult not to see a situation where you changed the outcome as manipulation. Which... of course leads us to Siffrin's feelings at the end of trying to stop the interruptions...
Fourth, Isabeau stopping himself when confessing. It hurts so good. Idk just. Denying the player that payoff. Denying Siffrin that moment of confession. Because really Siffrin didn't learn the lesson needed to actually get this moment of vulnerability between the two of them. It's such a genius choice that brings that awful dread and hopelessness. And in the end, I suppose all five of them stop the confession from happening because from that point onward, Siffrin interrupts the confession every time. Siffrin doing everything they can to get what they want only to accept that they're never going to get it. Never CAN get this because he doesn't deserve it.
Finally, bad touch. People have talked about bad touch enough, so I dont need to go too far with it. I will say I appreciate how much it doubles down on subverting the "romancing someone in a time loop" narrative. These loops while in some ways made Siffrin more perceptive, they're also PAINFUL. They mess with his head, lean towards making worse and worse decisions, and a large part of that is his role in his family's lives. Especially with Isabeau!!! So yeah. Of course the surprise kiss doesn't go well. Especially with the context that Isabeau doesn't think Siffrin wants to be touched let alone kissed? It ends in disaster just like most of the sidequests do.
In general, the ongoing Isabeau plot is very well implemented. The seeds for it are planted immediately, and it takes a lot of commitment to see all the parts of it. As a result, unless you try to do a ton of runs in act 3 immediately just to get the confession, it's a very slow burn part of the story, doing well to parallel Siffrin's mental state and the growing hopelessness in the loops. It grounds the story in a tangible goal from the beginning and in many ways, once you get to the end of it, get to bad touch, you're left bereft. Something... lost after you spent so much time being aware of Isabeau. That tangible feeling that you're slowly running out of things to do, of ways to spend these two days.
(And of course, then you have act 6 confession, and the pure relief, the joy in finally having the confession after it being set up from act 1. Siffrin doesn't need to reciprocate for it to have its impact. Something has CHANGED they have changed. And finally FINALLY after all this time, the moment can happen. And it's beautiful).
#isat#long post#isat spoilers#isafrin#isabeau isat#siffrin isat#this post is half talking about structure and half plain storytelling#but both are really interesting in regards to the isabeau confession plotline#Also adding here: and the game does all this without the confession feeling like the main plot!!! bc its not!!! its about siffrin and his-#relationship with himself and the sense of home who they are and what they can even be#and while isabeau is a major part so is everyone else!!!! and that!!! that also makes isabeau impactful because he is a piece of a greater#whole of support from the family he isnt the special one he loves siffrin but that doesnt mean his love is any more important than the#others but rather its a different flavor of love that siffrin doesnt have experience in... and thats what makes it harder to deal with in#the loops. Siffrin can do this friendship thing but romance is its own beast#anyway rambling but the writing in the isabeau confession is done so so well I adore it#my posts
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new gemini update was so good as always but I can't stop thinking:
big mama: there's nothing wrong with my sons
splinter: you fucked up two perfectly good kids is what you did. look at blue. he's got an eating disorder
wwhhhattttt? nooo, don't be silly. leo doesn't have an eating disorder.
leo and donnie have eating disorders--
#this is a Joke but also No It's Not#it's just different flavors lmao#but both of them have absolutely fucked relationships with food#my poor babies... :(... who did this to you...?#(it was me i did)#leo spends a lot of time worrying about whAT hes eating and how mUCH hes eating and if hes eating the rIGHT thing#largely due to his mom and also just being a celebrity/child celebrity in general#but also in part due to:#donnie has a lot of food sensitivities which have really never been accommodated for at all and as a result he just#has a very negative association with food and eating. he doesnt LIKE eating and he avoids it a majority of the time.#its stressful and unpleasant and he doesnt like it#which ofc only gave leo another reason to hyperfixate on food and calories and nutritional value etc etc etc#which leads to#ironically#leo (who def has an undiagnosed ed and restricts/denies himself food regularly): worrying abt making sure donnie eats enough#donnie will do the same thing back sometimes but not with the same obsessiveness that leo does#esp because the ideals surrounding eating and dieting set up around them really kind of just#lead them both to believe (at least to an extent) that leo is fine and eats a totally healthy and ok amount of food (esp in comparison to d#(no he doesnt)(and even when he does thats not the point)#tw eating disorders#cw eating disorders#eating disorders#tw disorders eating#cw disordered eating#disordered eating#gemini au asks#asks#anon
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just gonna pop this idea here
Sun going through the regeneration protocol and is way too close to y/n
food for thought
secondary idea: Sun going through the Regeneration Protocol and is way too close to Moon
#dialogue dump#dca who au#honestly. either of them being too close to ANYONE when the protocol activates is a stellar idea#different flavors of angst here but i like both <3
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Spock and Kirk are t4t lesbians send post
#spirk#my sillies#star trek the original series#star trek tos#star trek#k/s#the premise#Kirk is a butch T boy obvs#and Spock is a trans femme girlie#t4t#they’re both nonbinary but different flavors
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zen’in “i’m going to fuck you” maki + okkotsu “i’m going to make love to you” yuuta
#different yan flavors that are so delicious when paired together#uuuugggghhhhh i wont them both#yutamaki#tw yandere#cw yandere
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The objectsonas
#grey art#lab notebook#heart monitor#objectsona#booksona#they have different vibes but they’re both me I think just different flavors
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POOLVERINE IS KINDA LIKE MARVEL'S BATJOKES MINUS THE TOXICITY, CHANGE MY MIND-
mmm sort of?? poolverine and batjokes share the "annoying x stoic" kind of ship type but beyond that... not really? the toxicity of batjokes mostly MAKES it batjokes AND poolverine is kind of toxic in that they hated/tried to kill each other at one point? batjokes is villain x hero, poolverine is hero x hero, yada yada...
overall i can see theres some similarities but I wouldnt say that /nm !!
#ty for asking!#bepou talks#i love them both#just different flavors#LOL#i gotta draw more poolverine...#they be on my mind sometimes#sighhhhh
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[I really can't with this fandom sometimes. Where the hell does the idea that Trunks--especially FUTURE Trunks--is like Vegeta? He's not! And that's a really good thing! Hot take: It's an insult to say TO Future Trunks to say he is anything like Vegeta.]
#.:ooc:.#discourse cw#yall idk am i the weird one#probably but holy shit#that's just a horribly bad fucking take#is there some popular fanon writing of trunks where he is like vegeta#like i guess if you want to say they're both self-deprecating sure#but even that's like...a really different flavor
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Gabv1 being an unintentional situationship at first simply because Gabriel assumes the machine is unfeeling and he can't come to terms with his own desires, while the machine simply doesn't know what Gabriel wants or how to approach his needs. So they both keep awkwardly avoiding eachother
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Gold and Silver are good kids and Gold likes to show up unannounced to Lance's house post-game to bother Silver and Silver is like 'ugh great just what I need a loud annoying weirdo' but they are neither loud nor annoying while they hang out they just quietly sit on the floor reading magazines abt pokemon or playing video games and sometimes Gold will shove something in Silver's face like 'WHOA CHECK THIS OUT' and Silver will be like 'can you quiet down. What stupid thing could possibly get you that excited' as if he wouldn't also be equally excited about the very cool article about Sharpedo Gold just found
#spitblaze says things#i just thing gold and silver are two different flavors of neurodivergent#gold has the overactive adhd kind and had issues w volume and impulse control#silver has the quiet (traumatized) autistic kind where he basically makes his way thru life by playing 4d Social Expectation chess#v good at masking. unfortunately his mask is aggression#gold doesnt care hes hot garbage with social cues too but makes zero effort to mask or compensate#its fine tho they both have the same special interest. Pokemon#(also gold makes a very good compression stim. silver will just be like 'will you lay on me please' and gold is like 'sure thing buddy :)'#and theyre just like that. on the floor. like cats. clair doesnt really know what to make of it but silver doesnt seem bothered#so its probably fine)#pokemon#preciousmetalshipping#(i mean i guess lol. either way they are Best Fwiends)#trainer gold#rival silver#idk why im so invested in these two. johto isnt even in my top 5#pokemon gsc
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