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#ben and anakin
hexgirling · 1 year
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“that character is a war criminal” that character is from a fictional fantasy world and did not attend the geneva convention
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4lienat · 2 months
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galactic-rhea · 3 months
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More silly Luke Skysilverfoxwalker doodles
in my mind, almost nothing of the sequels is canon, but Luke is still grumpy and somewhat depressed, his dad tries to help tho
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getooine · 1 year
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Two generations of Skywalker…and the long-suffering soul who has to look out for them
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david-talks-sw · 1 month
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Debunking myths in the GFFA: Luke Skywalker isn't the One True Jedi™ and doesn't "reject the Jedi teachings."
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The myth:
Luke's Jedi mentors - trained to be dispassionate and mission-driven - callously tell him to let his friends die in service of a greater cause.
"In The Empire Strikes Back, Luke becomes Yoda's Padawan, and there are echoes of Anakin's training and the dilemmas he faced. Like Anakin, Luke is told he is too old to begin the training. Like Anakin, he has a vision of his loved ones suffering in captivity, and receives cold advice from Yoda, who tells him to sacrifice Han and Leia if he honors what they fight for." - Jason Fry, “Family Tradition; Rejecting the Jedi Teachings” Star Wars Insider #130, 2012
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The intended narrative:
The Jedi are actually right on all points. Luke isn't ready or fully trained and he's arrogantly letting his emotions rule him and rushing into danger. By ignoring them, Luke gets himself into a spot of trouble that actually jeopardizes the lives of the very friends he tried to help, as they now need to rescue him.
“It’s pivotal that Luke doesn’t have patience. He doesn’t want to finish his training. He’s being succumbed by his emotional feelings for his friends rather than the practical feelings of “I’ve got to get this job done before I can actually save them. I can’t save them, really.” But he sort of takes the easy route, the arrogant route, the emotional but least practical route, which is to say, “I’m just going to go off and do this without thinking too much.” And the result is that he fails and doesn’t do well for Han Solo or himself.”
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“Luke is making a critical mistake in his life of going after- to try to save his friends when he’s not ready. There’s a lot being taught here about patience and about waiting for the right moment to do whatever you’re going to do.”
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“Luke is in the process of going into an extremely dangerous situation out of his compassion— Without the proper training, without the proper thought, without the proper foresight to figure out how he’s gonna get out of it. His impulses are right, but his methodology is wrong.”
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The myth:
The Jedi want Luke to repress his feelings and kill his father, to destroy the Sith, their religious enemies. As emotionally-detached Jedi, it is inconceivable that a Sith would come back from the Dark Side, and thus wrongly believe that the only solution is to kill Vader.
"It's easy to miss that Luke disagrees sharply with his Jedi teachers about what to do. Obi-Wan and Yoda have trained Luke and push him toward a second confrontation with Vader. He is, they believe, the Jedi weapon that will destroy both Vader and the Emperor. When Luke insists there is still good in Vader, Obi-Wan retorts that "he's more machine than man-twisted and evil." When Luke says he can't kill his own father, Obi-Wan despairs, "Then the Emperor has already won."  But Obi-Wan could not be more wrong. It is precisely because Luke can't kill his own father that he defeats the Sith." - Jason Fry, Star Wars Insider #130, 2012
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The intended narrative:
The Jedi never tell Luke to "kill" his father. That's just a fact.
They tell him to "confront" and "face" him.
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Their bottom line is that Vader and the Emperor need to be stopped.
If Luke can manage to do so without killing his father, that's great.
"In Jedi the film is really about the redemption of this fallen angel. Ben is the fitting good angel, and Vader is the bad angel who started off good. All these years Ben has been waiting for Luke to come of age so that he can become a Jedi and redeem his father. That's what Ben has been doing, but you don't know this in the first film." - Star Wars: The Annotated Screenplays, 1998
(credit to @writerbuddha for finding the above quote)
The problem is: Darth Vader has a track record of murdering loved ones who refuse to kill him. Be it his wife...
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... his father/brother...
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... and if you're going by Canon, his little sister.
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As such, there's a very strong chance that Vader might do the same to his son as well.
“A Jedi can’t kill for the sake of killing. The mission isn’t for Luke to go out and kill his father and get rid of him. The issue is, if he confronts his father again, he may, in defending himself, have to kill him, because his father will try to kill him.” - 1981 story conference, from The Making of Return of the Jedi
Now, as the last Jedi left, the fate of the galaxy rests entirely on Luke's shoulders.
If he dies, then the galaxy and its billions of inhabitants are doomed to live in a tyrannical dictatorship forever.
“He knows a confrontation is brewing between Luke and his father. Ben hopes Luke will either save his father or kill him, because whatever extra powers Luke's got in his lineage, he is the one person that can probably fight his father and win.” - The Star Wars Archives: 1977-1983, 2018
There's a time for talking things through... and a time to do your duty. Above all else, a Jedi's duty is to end conflict.
Obi-Wan was once tasked with this same duty.
And while he managed to weaken Vader considerably (thus avoiding the catastrophe of a full-powered Vader being unleashed onto the galaxy)... because of his attachment, he failed to kill Vader.
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Twice, if you include the Kenobi show.
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(A show which, per Pablo Hidalgo, is one of George Lucas' favorite recent Star Wars projects, a tidbit that doesn't surprise me one bit considering how much the series perfectly aligns with what Lucas said about Star Wars (see here, here and here))
Point being: because Ben failed his duty, the galaxy suffered for it.
Luke is now in danger of doing the same.
If he's unable to end the conflict in a peaceful way, then Luke needs to be ready to do so in a more permanent manner. Because while Luke has qualms about killing his father, there's a very big chance that the feeling won't be mutual.
So Luke isn't rejecting his teachers' orders to kill Vader. He's saying he's unable to confront Vader altogether, because he'll be half-assing the task. In the (very likely) worst case scenario where reasoning with Vader fails, Luke is concerned he won't be able to follow-through and do what he must.
Further, there's also a worse outcome to Luke dying: Luke joining the Dark Side and becoming yet another asset of the Emperor, more dangerous than Vader himself.
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It's thus essential that Luke steel himself and mask his emotions, because the Emperor is a master manipulator who'll likely attempt to corrupt Luke via the strong emotions he has for his friends.
Obi-Wan is not telling Luke to repress his emotions. On the contrary, he acknowledges that these feelings do Luke credit. But the fact remains that when your opponent can jiu-jitsu those feelings against you and your friends, you need to keep a poker face.
And judging by how close the Sith Lords come to seducing Luke to the Dark Side...
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... that advice is completely on point.
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The myth:
"It isn't Jedi teachings that save the galaxy, but bonds the Jedi tried to forbid - such as the love of a father for his son, and a son for his father. Emotional attachments, in other words." - Jason Fry, Star Wars Insider #130, 2012
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The intended narrative:
In Return of the Jedi, Luke isn't doing anything different than what other Jedi have done.
He does his best to avoid lethal force unless he deems that it is necessary (see his fight against Jabba's hostile forces).
He sacrifices himself for the greater good and let himself be captured, in order to allow the mission to be carried out.
He tries to reason with his enemy, hoping to avoid conflict.
He spares his enemy, showing mercy.
That's all standard Jedi stuff. We've seen other Jedi do all those things, both in the films and The Clone Wars.
If that isn't enough, just look at how Lucas describes what Jedi normally do (left), versus what Luke does in Return of the Jedi (right):
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See what I mean? There’s pretty much no difference.
In Lucas' narrative, Luke isn’t “better than” or “rejecting the teachings” of the Jedi who came before him. He’s following the Jedi path. And he's really good at doing so.
Because this idea that Luke "rejects the teachings" makes no sense! They're Lucas' teachings. He agrees with the Jedi, they're the mouthpieces he uses to deliver the audience his own values.
Lucas having his main character do something he'd ideologically disagree with is something that doesn't make sense.
And part of this confusion comes from a misunderstanding of the word "attachment", in Star Wars.
It doesn't mean "emotional attachments" or "feelings" or "affection." It comes from the Buddhist principle of non-attachment.
It's not about depriving yourself of relationships or affection, it's about accepting that everything comes and goes and letting go of those very things you hold on to, when the time comes.
Lucas makes a distinction in his discourse between attachment and compassion.
"The whole idea of the movie, ultimately is that you have the Light Side and the Dark Side. The Light Side is compassion, which means you care about other people. The Dark Side is you care only about yourself. And you are obsessed with yourself. Getting your pleasure and getting all your stuff. The other one, you give it to everybody. You give goodness and health to everybody else.  So the issue of love... there’s a line between loving somebody compassionately and caring about them and helping them. But the other line is not to be greedy or... once you are greedy then you get fearful. You don’t want to lose what it is you have that you are getting. So you have to learn to give up everything. And ultimately for a Jedi Knight, it’s very easy to give up." - Celebration V, Main Event, 2010
In-universe, this is something Anakin knew the theory of, but never really applied all that much.
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Luke on the other hand, was able to learn the lesson and apply it.
Speaking in Lucas lingo, it's not Luke's attachment that makes him spare Vader. It's his compassion. And in turn, that compassion inspires Vader to do the same.
"It really has to do with learning. Children teach you compassion. They teach you to love unconditionally. Anakin can’t be redeemed for all the pain and suffering he’s caused. He doesn’t right the wrongs, but he stops the horror. The end of the Saga is simply Anakin saying, ‘I care about this person, regardless of what it means to me. I will throw away everything that I have, everything that I have grown to love - primarily the Emperor - and throw away my life, to save this person. And I’m doing this because he has faith in me, loves me despite all the horrible things I’ve done. I broke his mother’s heart, but he still cares about me, and I can’t let that die.’" - The Making of Revenge of The Sith; page 221
Or, to put things more simply:
Attachment (selfish love), is what makes Anakin do this:
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Compassion (selfless love), is what makes Luke do this:
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Now, could Lucas have made his narrative more explicit, to avoid confusion? Maybe.
But I think it's also fair to point the finger at the biggest cause of these muddied waters:
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Simply put, the Expanded Universe (the Star Wars books, novels and games that spun out of the films) established new lore elements that didn't necessarily align with Lucas' vision of things. Namely:
Jedi can get married, and Luke marries Mara Jade.
Jedi can begin their training as adults, and Luke takes on many apprentices that are already adults.
When considering George's minimal involvement in the development of EU stories, it's easy to see why these plot points were allowed to come through.
But when he made the Prequels, his headcanons came to light and the above plot points needed to be retconned.
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George Lucas' narrative:
"Nope. You can't be a Jedi and be married."
This isn't actually coming out of left field.
When Timothy Zahn asked for Luke and Mara to be married or engaged, back in 1993, Lucasfilm initially vetoed the idea.
And over the years, Lucas and other Lucasfilm employees have made it it clear that "Luke getting married" did not align with his vision (so much so that it's a plot point in Attack of the Clones).
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So the question becomes: why can't Jedi get married?
It's about commitment.
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Simply put: you can't have two marriages. Eventually, your commitment to one of them will falter and you'll ruin them both. A Jedi is already married to the cause and to the Order.
If they want to get married, they have to leave the Jedi.
"One of the things [the Jedi] give up is marriage. They can still love people. But they can’t possess them. They can’t own them. They can’t demand that they do things. They have to be able to accept the fact, one, their mortality, that they are going to die. And not worry about it. That the loved ones they have, everything they love is going to die and they can’t do anything about it. I mean they can protect them as you would ordinarily protect, you know, ‘Get out of the way of that car.’ Somebody charges you with a gun, you knock the gun out, but there is an inevitability to life which is death and you have to accept that." - Celebration V, Main Event, 2010
And this is another example, really, of how Lucas' own values and past experiences shape the Jedi's teachings.
Marcia Lucas divorced George because he was constantly working on Star Wars, even when he wasn't directing it, which she said led to an emotional blockage in their marriage...
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... and this leads us to the reason why George didn't double-down on the success of the Original Trilogy: he decided to take time off to raise his three kids as a single Dad.
He learned his lesson, reasoned that he wouldn't be able to be both a good, present father and a successful blockbuster film director.
When you're dealing with time-consuming commitments of this scale, you need to make a choice, or you'll end up (half-assing and thus ruining) both of them.
"Nope. Jedi get taken in as babies for a reason."
Once again, this has to do with Lucas' definition of "attachment."
"Jedi Knights get taken from their families very young. They do not grow attachments, because attachment is a path to the Dark Side. You can love people, but you can't want to possess them. They're not yours. Accept that they have a fate. Even those you love most are going to die. You can't do anything about that. Protect them with your lightsaber, but if they die they were going to die. There's nothing you can do. All you can do is accept that fact. In mythology, if you go to Hades to get them back, you're not doing it for them, you're doing it for yourself. You're doing it because you don't want to give them up. You're afraid to be without them. The key to the Dark Side is fear. You must be clean of fear, and fear of loss is the greatest fear. If you're set up for fear of loss, you will do anything to keep that loss from happening, and you're going to end up in the Dark Side. That's the basic premise of Star Wars and the Jedi, and how it works. That's why they're taken at a young age to be trained. They cannot get themselves killed trying to save their best buddy when it's a hopeless exercise." - The Star Wars Archives: 1977-1983, 2018
Jedi need to maintain objectivity and neutrality, in their day-to-day lives of mediating peace between planets.
And learning to "let go of your attachments when the time comes" is part of that training. But it is something that takes discipline and time, and thus the child needs to be young enough to develop this skill. Otherwise, they end up like Anakin, who always struggled to properly learn it and eventually was doomed by his greed.
This being part of Lucas narrative is also evidenced that in his earlier plans for the Sequel trilogy, he'd have Luke train children, not adults like he does in the EU.
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"Luke is trying to restart the Jedi. He puts the word out, so out of 100,000 Jedi, maybe 50 or 100 are left. The Jedi have to grow again from scratch, so Luke has to find two- and three-year-olds, and train them. It’ll be 20 years before you have a new generation of Jedi." The Star Wars Archives: 1999-2005, 2020
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The EU's retcons of Lucas' narrative:
Now, obviously, the addition of all these rules and other elements such as midi-chlorians... it does something to the older audience. They grew up on the Original Trilogy, dreaming they could be a Jedi too if they just believed enough. Now that bubble is burst.
"Wait, if I'm a Jedi I can't get married?! And I need to be taken in as a toddler, with a certain kind of blood score?! That's bullshit!"
More importantly... it goes against about a decade's worth of established EU lore (which Lucas never factored into his storytelling)!
So what does Lucasfilm Licensing do? They go with it.
They take these "weird" rules the older audience and authors don't like, and retcon a new narrative around them to ensure both the books and the new films all stay canon within the EU own continuity.
George Lucas revealed new information about his universe in Episode II that ran counter to earlier stories of the Expanded Universe. Among the surprises: the Jedi Order is monastic, with love and marriage forbidden to its members. This would necessitate reforms to the Jedi Code over time to separate the ancient era when Nomi Sunrider was married to a Jedi, seen in the Tales of the Jedi (1993–94) comics, as well as the post-Empire era when Luke Skywalker married Mara Jade in the comic series Union (1999–2000). LucasBooks also needed to create plausible exceptions for Ki-Adi-Mundi, a Jedi Master who had multiple wives in the Prelude to Rebellion comics (1999). - Pablo Hidalgo, The Essential Reader’s Companion, 2012
When it comes to Luke specifically, the narrative becomes:
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"Uh... y-yes. The old Jedi Order forbid marriage, only took in toddlers and had a blood pre-requisite... which was weird, wrong, too detached, too systemic, and part of why their Order failed! But, uh, Luke's New Jedi Order allows marriage, unlike his dogmatic predecessors, because anyone can be a Jedi guys!" Hahaha! (fuck's sake George)
But as already explained above: those new rules aren't meant to be perceived negatively. It would make no sense if they were, they're based on Lucas' own values.
You know what it does do, though?
It cements the narrative that Luke is the One True Jedi™, who rejected the dogmatic teachings to forge a new path forward.
That's not the intended narrative of the Original Trilogy, nor the six-film saga as a whole.
If you've made it this far in the post (congratulations) and are interested to read another all-encompassing post about that, you can check out the link below :)
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noramsblog · 8 months
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Fire hazard
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grandkhan221b · 1 year
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More spidersoka stuff! This started as a fun character design thing but I've turned it into a full blown AU woops
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hedonistbyheart · 2 years
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Phew! This was an endeavour! But I’ve wanted to draw the twins talking to all the force ghosts we know of for a while now, so here they are.
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padawansuggest · 10 months
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I’m not even sure if this is my Roman Empire or just an accepted thing by the fandom at this point but Ben Kenobi was unkillable until he fuckin decided it was time to go and I think he should have reformed as a force ghost then and there lookin 25 (for the flashbacks) so he could yell at Vader and scare the shit outta him.
No. Anakin Skywalker never had a fucking chance in hell at winning against Obi-Wan, and my Roman Empire is that Vader didn’t have a chance either until Ben decided he was gonna have the last laugh.
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stealingpotatoes · 1 year
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In your AUs when Snoke tries to turn Ben does force ghost Anakin and Obi-wan turn up to force punch Snoke in the face?
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leia took care of that already <3 BUT anakin can totally provide post-yelling backup!!
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dalekofchaos · 5 months
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The Rules:
Every twenty-four hours there will be another round. After every round, the character in last place will be eliminated.
If there are multiple characters tying for last place, there will be a special elimination round. In these rounds, every character in last place will be eliminated, even if all the characters have tied equally.
When there are only two characters remaining, they will face off against one another in a week-long poll to determine the victor.
If the character that you consider the hottest isn't listed here, hit the 'what about ___???' option and reply to this post with the overlooked character. The character with the highest 'write-in' votes will be added to the next round. Unless the 'what about ___???' option is the least voted for, in which case it will be eliminated. Welcome to the party, Han and Cassian!
This is all for fun. Don't take it too seriously ;)
It’s now time to say goodbye to Han. Well… he was a scruffy-looking nerf-herder anyway.
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Only joking! My condolences to the Han fans. You guys rallied behind him but unfortunately it wasn’t enough.
Things are heating up! Round Seven!
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mickandmusings · 5 months
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mickandmusings masterlist
Last Updated: 8-29-24
Requests: Open!
Requesting rules here!
Supernatural:
Dean Winchester
Sam Winchester
Castiel
Marvel:
Bucky Barnes
Thor Odinson
Loki Laufeyson
Natasha Romanoff
Stephen Strange
Bridgerton:
Anthony Bridgerton
Benedict Bridgerton
Colin Bridgerton
Star Wars:
Din Djarin
Poe Dameron
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Anakin Skywalker
Ben Solo
Top Gun:
Jake 'Hangman' Seresin
Bradley 'Rooster' Bradshaw
Robert 'Bob' Floyd
Natasha 'Phoenix' Trace
Pete 'Maverick' Mitchell
Tom 'Iceman' Kazansky
The Bear:
Carmy Berzatto
Stranger Things:
Steve Harrington
Eddie Munson
Other:
Joel Miller
Javier Pena
Rafe Cameron
Indiana Jones
Prince Eric (live action)
Tyler Owens
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galactic-rhea · 20 days
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This one was for my partner! He asked this little scene from an AU we have.
Very short context for this particular scene: Anakin survives ROTJ to b come the most bonkers dad and then grandpa ever, which means the whole Sequels timeline gets a bit to the left (or more like a 180° shift), Rose builds what's basically an UFO and, accidentally, it's so dangerous and intuitive that only a force sensitive can fly it.
Luke, like usually, is pretty much amused. Poe and Ben are...confused.
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twinterrors29 · 8 months
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during the clone wars, the 212th found themselves staying for a day or two on a planet who they'd saved
despite the language barrier, the citizens managed to communicate that they'd like to build a monument to the Jedi who saved them, Master Obi-Wan Kenobi, and got the Jedi and his Commander's permission before they were abruptly called away to the next battle
however, they never actually asked which of the men they talked to was the Jedi, and which the Commander, and since they didn't speak Basic (or any other language common off their own planet), weren't able to fact check their model
and of course, since Marshall Commander Cody was the one carrying his Jedi's lightsaber on his hip nearly the entire visit, they picked up a skewed impression of which of the pair was the General
due to the hardship of the war and the years following it, it takes the people years to build their intended statue, long enough for the event to be separated in the minds of any Imperial watchers, and since all signage and discussion took place in the local language, no one picked up on the fact that this monument was intended dedicated to the Jedi
miraculously, this saved it from the Imperial purge of any and all remnants of the Jedi
after all, to an outside observer, the statue depicted a clone, not a Jedi, and only a very select handful would have recognized the significance of the strange cylinder hanging from the statue's belt
decades later, while Luke Skywalker desperately searched for any remnants of the Jedi's legacy, he found a mention of a remote planet that Ben had visited during the Clone Wars in the man's journals, which included the addendum that the citizens had informed him that they intended to construct a monument to him, but that he never got to actually see it
Luke, excited for this chance to learn about this period of his people's history, rushed to borrow Threepio for the trip and raced off across the galaxy in search of this monument
when Threepio pointed him to the statue in question though, Luke was terribly confused
who was this man? his face seemed strangely familiar, but he'd think he'd remember meeting someone with such a memorable scar on their face! and that cylinder on his belt did look like what he remembered of Ben's lightsaber...
so Luke called for Ben for an explanation, only for the man to take one look at the statue and start laughing his ass off before disappearing, saying only that he needed to go tell someone about this
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babkaboy · 1 year
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force ghosts obikin
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