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dballzposting · 1 year ago

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DBALLZPOSTING RAMBLE

Amount of evidence: LOW!!!!

Word count: Not the longest.

Eloquency: I haven't been sleeping very well lately ....

Subject: Trunks & Goten's different views of authority and power balances; Trunks is a follower while Goten is exempt.

Befote I say anything let me preface this post with: Goten and Trunks are, everything considered, very free spirits. They're not afraid of feelings and they love adventuring. When they're kids they love to have fun, and when they're older you can see in the both of them a sort of contentedness/satisfaction. They're living life well.

OK now I want to point out that despite what you'd assume when you first see them, Trunks is very much a follower, while Goten is exempt from any idea of a hierarchy.

You would assume that Trunks would be a leader given who his parents are and what his status is. He just HAS to be a natural-borne leader, right? It's in his blood? But he's just not.

When he's a kid he's very good at bossing Goten around. He's good at being player 1. But this isn't his "true" nature. He acts all arrogant when he's a kid becasue he's doing what kids do: emulating hardcore. What he is is a follower emulating the leadership behaviors of his parents.

We know this isn't his true self becasue he tangibly grows out of it. Even by EOZ, he's no longer a bitch - he's respectful, he's self-assured, he's relaxed in that confidence, he emotes freely. I think he still cares what people think about him, judging by his epic swag outfit and the way that he couldn't just live-and-let-live when it came to that flamboyant gay dude, but he's getting there.

By GT he is just a completely different man. He just wants to chill and hang out. He wants to make wisecracks. He doesnt care about work and he doesnt care enough to let himself be stressed by it. He just dips. He continues to emote freely, even coming apart at the beginning of the series when he was realizing how stressful this space journey was shaping out to be, but he pulled himself together and didn't need to freak out like that again. he adapted to the situation fine.

I don't have solid evidence I just need you to watch GT and see what I've seen and understand that he's literally just some guy ... he's some dude .... Scary shit is happening and he still has time to chill and hang out when the battle is over. I've seen it. Please believe me

In the outro there's a moment where they're showing different epic images throughout the history of dragon ball. And there's a picture from DBZ times, where Trunks is sitting on the handlebars of a motorcycle while Gohan is trying to drive it and Trunks has his arms crossed and he just looks like such a bitch. He's somebody arrogant bastard whelp

VERY NEXT IMAGE: A GT image of Trunks & Pan & Goku & Giru on the hunt for dragon balls out on an alien planet. And UGH. The CONTRAST is so much. Like maybe I should just get the images. I probably won't. But I should

The image changes to GT and you realize that THIS is who Trunks is. Not the kid. Poeple change so much from childhood. On one hand your true nature is available to you as a child but on the other hand you're emulating hardcore and changing rapidly. Trunks's truest nature was probably when he was a baby and he'd cry becasue Vegeta was so ugly

Trunks grows up and circles back and finds his true nature again. And that true nature is in those FUCKING HUGE SHORTS. That JACKET. Those DUMB GLOVES. Those THICK SOCKS and BARE KNEES. Like HWAT was he THINKING !?!??!

His TRUE NATURE is being LAME. That's who he is. He had phases where he wanted to be Cool but he's grown out of it. He's come to accept what style he really feels like himself in. He has changed a lot since childhood: He Doesnt care what people think about him, and he is Not concerned with status anymore.

He's President of Capsule Corp becasue he's gotta be. He doesnt give a shit. You'd think he'd give a shit and you'd assume that he'd give a shit but if you watch GT there is something so calm and cool about him. He's so authentic that he can even be shallow and lack self-awareness in little ways (like he doesnt think he's lame for instance). This is really as deep as he goes fellas. And he's not trying to deny that. He's not trying to look Cool or Smart or Strong. He just wears his huge shorts and reads his Cosmo magazine and readily displays when he's feeling tired or bored, but not in an immature way that demands amelioration. He's a fine adult and he keeps himself together, especially when he has to be babysitter.

He does what he must and he rests when he can.

So. All of that put together: you would think that that makes him not necessarily a leader but definitely not a follower, right? A follower WOULD care what people think about them, right?

NOT what I'm getting at though. He's not insecure, but he's still a follower. And he's not a leader, becasue he doesnt care enough to be, but mostly, becasue it's not in his nature.

Vegeta is a leader by nature. He's not interested in controlling others' freedom, but he is interested in setting them straight. Bulma is a leader by nature. She'll let weirdos be weirdos but as long as there is something she cares about, she NEEDS things to go the way she wants them to. She needs you to do what she tells you to do.

Both ultimately have good judgement in the end.

And then there's Trunks...

WAYS THAT TRUNKS IS A FOLLOWER:

I don't think it's all nurture, but I'll still point out that: being raised by leaders could have very well trained him to be a follower. As a kid, he emulated the leadership role with Goten, but still snaps to such sudden attention when his parents tell him what to do (seen in Z and Super). A truly arrogant kid would blow his parents off.

HIS RESPECT FOR RULES. So many times as a kid we see him say something about The Rules. One example is when in the second Broly movie (English sub), he was terrifically put off by how Broly wasn't "following the rules" and was fighting to kill. For another example, he TOLD OFF Majin Buu when he came at him with that sucker punch. Those are NOT the rules of the battlefield!!!!! There were more times but I can't remember. Another thing I'll put here is how self-aware he was as a kid about being a kid: i swear it came up like three different times when he was chasticing someone for saying/doing something to him because he was "just a kid" and it was pathetic or rude of them to be behaving that way in front of him. It's like, it's hard to teach a kid about Honor, so Vegeta just taught him about Rules instead and hoped that one day it would turn into honor. But in the meantime and arguably the long term, it became the backdrop of his understanding of the world: the world is made out of rules. Rules of the battlefield. Rules of social interactions. Rules of computers and engineering. In this way, he's a follower: if it's against the rules, don't do it! (Some rules he does not respect, however. Like beating up that one tournament contestant and stealing his clothes. It's becasue Trunks was overall emulating the irreverency of his father. This, in a way, is still following what's proper.)

Okay, kids lack nuance and they follow rules like law. That doesn't mean he's a follower. BUT CONSIDER: His reverence for AUTHORITY and HIERARCHY. This was an essential element of his childhood, his parents being who they were, and he learned to DEFER TO AUTHORITY. In Super he seems much nicer than in Z, and the way he listens to adults seems more overt (honestly he's coming more into himself with that lame yellow sweatshirt but we haven't the time to discuss that). My best exmaples are THE WAY HE THINKS OF SHENRON: In one of the Z movies that i dont fucking rmeebr which one, there was a scene where Goten calls Shenron a CHEAPSKATE. Trunks FLIPS and COVERS Goten's mouth. Actuially I think I can find the gif

^ see.

He's like YOU DONT FUCKING TALK TO HIM THAT WAY...!

AND THEN IN GT, when they try to summon Shenron with the busted ass dragon balls, Bulma says of the new Shenron: He's much more crass, isn't he? AND TRUNKS TURNS TO HIS MOTHER and is like, "MOM!!!" I watched the english sub but literally what happened was that she said some barely-rude comment about this new Shenron's lack of manners, and Trunks actually said really dramatically "MOM-!!!" and then basically that She Can't Talk about Shenron That Way...!!!!!

We all know that Bulma has no respect for authority over herself, specifically when she feels that they haven't earned it. And This Evil-Looking Blue Draghon Shows Up an Literally Lights a Stoagie in front of them and Bulma says soemthing so TAME for what her lexicon is capable of, and Trunks was like MOM! ! !!!!!!!

In that moment, his respect for the concept of an in-borne hierarchy or authority surpassed any obligation he may feel to defer to his mother. As is the case with some real-life men, he may even has grown up to believe that actually, his mother is a little batshit cuckoo and maybe needs to be corralled some. (This is an unfortunate perspective).

Anyway. Another way that Trunks is a follower is the way that he never tries that hard to counter anyone. He doesn't fall back into line either but he just ... GHoes to work ...... Does what his parents want him to do .... He's not authoritative enough to be able to keep Pan wrangled in.

I want to make clear that I am NOT saying that Trunks is a follower by nature of a crushed will. I'm not saying that he's all small and pusillanimous. He's absolutely not. The first paragraph in this post holds up. I don't think he feels all small inside

I just think that his lifestyle has fostered an avenue for authenticity, because self-awareness is essential for his warrior craft, and the authentic person that we are seeing is someone who wears those Huge Shorts and does what his parents want him to do. And if he REALLY hated it then he would argue back. But he doesnt care enough too. He's cool. He's a chill dude. He's a follower. Just hanging out

Forgot to say that also: He has manners. We see that at every age past 8. He's not trying to disrespect his elders. He's respectful to Gohan and his wife. He follows the rules of respect and hierarchies.

The reason that we see Trunks a lot of the time as this chill dude is because he himself is at the top of some hierarchy. He's rich and president. He's the son of a prince. Were he on a shittier tier then I think that we'd see him be much quicker to obsequiousness.

It's interesting becasue I think that in theory, a totally healthy and authentic human would want to do away with hierarchies altogether. But Trunks is still of a culture. This is his most authentic self - within his culture. Sure, there are no hierarchies when he's hanging out with friends and doing what he wants, but the rest of the time there is. At work. At home. In space it was a bit complicated - he was the captain, and he was technically the oldest, but he would never try to tell Goku-San what to do, and Trunks just lacked the innate leadership abilities to keep Pan under control! Partly becasue Pan comes with a lot of fire for freedom because of the way that she is being treated at home.

Trunks has totally come into himself and he wears .............. "interesting" outfits. And I think that his parents have had to come to accept that he's lame. Bulma makes him be president but it's becasue he can't be head engineer so she makes him be the head bureaucrat. Vegeta hasnt given up on him becasue it's just not his nature too, but he has accepted that Trunks is lame. Every now and then he'll throw out "I'll be in the gravity chamber if you want to shake the rust off" but Trunks never takes the bait. He's always busy with something else. He's slacking. He's a slacker. Vegeta knows this. Trunks doesnt think he's lame but he is. This is just a fact.

Though he was able to shake off Baby's initial attempt at control. He was able to expel him from his body whereas the sloppy-messy Goten just had all of his memories wide-open for Baby to read. Trunks does have a due CONFIDENCE, and you CAN find his father's influence in him. He's also lame. Just a fact

ANYWAY: FOR COMPARISON:

Son Goten is much more like Goku in that: there are no hierarchies. We're all equal. The difference is that Goten does respect authority. The reason that Goku doesn't is partly his pure-hearted nature and partly because the first person who demanded respect out of him was Bulma and her insistence for honorifics. Of course Goku would say no to that. But Goten was encouraged (or beaten) by his loving mother to be respectful, and he's a sweet kid, so he took to it naturally. Everybody gets an honorifc. Everybody gets a bow. Be kind to everyone and everything. All is right in the world

He did very much tell Shenron that he was a cheapskate in that one movie. He YELLED it. This is Son Goten: authentic and fully expressive of himself. There are no leaders and followers, just people with opinions that need expressing.

In GT he was so rude to Mr Satan. Mr Satan needed some fucking help and Goten was like, "Um, I am NOT your student, and I am ON a date. >:( -.-" That was honestly so fucking rude of him. It's becasue, despite being the youngest in his house, he doesnt have the perpetual reflex to defer built in. He was raised in a way that must've been more free and forgiving. He knows in his head that Mr Satan is old and in need and that's why it was so fucking rude of him to not drop everything and play along. But Goten wasn't being a dick on purpose for the sole express purpose of being a dick, he was just prioritizing his own life over Mr Satan's right now; he was honoring himself. Can't beat someone down for looking out for number 1. He was rude to Mr Satan AND good for himself and Palace-chan. Two things can be true

I know I don't have any hard proof and this post has been very much a "remember this? no? I don't either. Take my word for it" type of a ramble, but I would postulate that when Goten is respectful, it's because he wants to be nice and proper, as a kid or as an adult, but he understands naturally that leaders are not gods; and when Trunks is respectful, it's as if the world is dependent on this order, and he feels real fear when authority is disrespected, and he probably doesnt even know why, but it's probably becasue as a kid he learned fear from his dad, and as an adult he can use reason to surmise who's deserving of respect, but on some level he is always anticipating that pattern of authority to exist as a ubiquitous order.

I think the biggest place where you can find their different responses to authority is how they interact with Gohan. I have very little canon evidence I just want to tell a story. Trunks is obviously very polite. He's known Gohan since he was little and Gohan has always been good to him. He's always been patient, helpful, and informative. This fosters safety and spontaneity, but at home Trunks gets yelled at for talking out of turn so ultimately that's what perseveres. He walks into Gohan's house and he's sooo civil. And I know that if he has questions to ask he chooses his words very carefully. He would never say anything uncouth to Son Gohan. He minds his manners so much. Honestly he behaves as if he believes that he should be shot

and then there's GOTEN and even if he didnt have the privilege of kin status with Gohan he would STILL act the way he does. He #RESPECTS Gohan, so much, and at the end of the day, Gohan does have authority in the sense that if Goten was pissing him off he could tell him firmly to Leave His House. And Goten would listen. He woudlnt defy him. He'd be mad but staying is more than asking for a fight, it's breaking a heart. He'll leave if he's told to . But other than that he can say whatever he wants to Gohan always and for forever EVEN IF IT'S SHIT THAT GOHAN DOESNT WANT TO HEAR Goten lacks the finesse to read through Gohan's composed exterior and see that he doesnt want to hear agbout it. And he'll ask him the worst questions too. Just absolutely ruin his week with it. "Gohan-Niichan is it true that men have g-spots up their BUTTS?" just the worst shit . There are no stupid questions but there are indeed bad ones

And Gohan takes it upon himself to deal with this. He wants to be a trustworthy source of information and comfort in Goten's life. So he deals wioth this

And Trunks is so courteous and careful and kind and he keeps a respectful distance meanwhile if Goten were really excited to see Gohan then he would chew through the wall and rocket toward him and lick him on the cheek like a dog . And Gohan would just very politely pull out a handkerchief and wipe his cheek off and then put the handkerchief back and not say antyhing about it. Very professional guy

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