#anyway this is what i was doing and this is my moral philosophy
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#anyway this is what i was doing and this is my moral philosophy#dickie's cool hat :)#my edits#my (joke) edits#jack knight#mikaal tomas#the shade
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i wanna write lore about my characters but i am in the eternal struggle of how do i start
#the pain of wanting to talk about ocs but not what to say#s o b#forget art block how do i deal with oc block#id call it writing block but i always have that lol#vibrates#i wanna talk about my idiots#like the corpse trade in london#especially since depending on what youre reading on site people come back to their bodies or they dont#its not super consistant#like i know darcy wouldnt care but others WOULD depending on if you come back ot your original body#which i think is true???#idk man its super unclear#but its super morally dubious and I KNOW det doe isnt cool with it at all think of the FIGHTS#couples arguments but make them about philosophy and the fact that youre both actually diametrically opposed to things and you cant always#have a healthy work life balance between the two of you#because even if it works most of the time darcy is going to end up working on someone his husband thinks deserves better#especially if he finds out about the burking darcy did on the surface#cutting out the middleman as it were#and cutting the middleman#anyway i wanna talk about ocs help
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People will be like "idc who you are, seriously block me if you do/support x" and then i block them and they react like this everytime
#gu6chan's musings#normally im not so pissed off about it but this fuckin dude; man#i admit i didn't like a lot about their philosophy on things and in retrospect it should've been a red flag#but they weren't like.... a BAD person. i just figured they had some issues to work through or something and just chatted when they wanted#then they follow me here and it's like 😭 do they know im a marxist. bc they were having WHOLE fits like 'if you're voting third party or#not voting at all you're just LARPing a revolution; you're going to be the downfall of this country get off my fucking blog if you aren't#voting blue' and i was like 'holy SHIT those are some strong opinions what the hell'#like ive seen people SETTLE for kamala??? but this was the first time ive seen anyone actively try and PROMOTE her like wtf#but anyways i shrug it off; think maybe they're just having a bad time till after election where they're having a whole meltdown like#'FUCK YOU THIRD PARTY VOTERS/PPL WHO DIDN'T VOTE; WHAT DO YOU THINK THIS WILL DO FOR PALESTINE' and im like#are you forgetting all the arab families who were completely crushed by fucking harris REFUSING to take a stance on palestine and refusing#to vote for her in turn??? those who scraped together just ENOUGH faith in the system to vote third party?????#THE FUCKING PLFP ITSELF SAYING 'BOYCOTT THE ELECTION'????? dude. they were blaming it ENTIRELY on#'leftists just wanting to show off moral superiority and wanting to larp a revolution' as opposed to like.... literally anything else and#im just#'damn okay. you get what you asked for ig' and blocked them lmao#they just now found out apparently bc they tried friend rqing on discord and I'm like#'hmmmm were you just not serious when you were saying that shit or did you not know what words actually mean'#anyways i hate that it turned out like this bc i thought they were at least interesting but talk shit get hit or whatever they say lmao
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morality: a character creation guide
creating and understanding your oc’s personal moral code! no, i cannot tell you whether they’re gonna come out good or bad or grey; that part is up to you.
anyway, let’s rock.
i. politics
politics are a good way to indicate things your character values, especially when it comes to large-scale concepts such as government, community, and humanity as a whole.
say what you will about either image; i’d argue for the unintiated, the right image is a good introduction to some lesser discussed ideologies… some of which your oc may or may not fall under.
either way, taking a good look at your character’s values on the economic + social side of things is a good place to start, as politics are something that, well… we all have ‘em, you can’t avoid ‘em.
clearly, this will have to be adjusted for settings that utilize other schools of thought (such as fantasy + historical fiction and the divine right of kings), but again, economic/social scale plotting will be a good start for most.
ii. religion + philosophy
is your oc religious? do they believe in a form of higher power? do they follow some sort of philosophy?
are they devout? yes, this applies to non-religious theist and atheist characters as well; in the former’s case… is their belief in a higher power something that guides many of their actions or is their belief in a higher power something that only informs a few of their actions? for the atheists; do they militant anti-theists who believe atheism is the only way and that religion is harmful? or do they not care about religion, so long as it’s thrust upon them?
for the religious: what is your oc’s relationship with the higher power in question? are they very progressive by their religion’s standards or more orthodox? how well informed of their own religion are they?
does your oc follow a particular school of philosophical thought? how does that interact with their religious identification?
iii. values
by taking their political stance and their religious + philosophical stance, you have a fairly good grasp on the things your character values.
is there anything they value - due to backstory, or what they do, or what they love - that isn’t explained by political stance and religious and/or philosophical identification? some big players here will likely be your oc’s culture and past.
of everything you’ve determined they value, what do they value the most?
iv. “the line”
everyone draws it somewhere. we all have a line we won’t cross, no matter the lengths we go for what we believe is a noble cause. where does your character draw it? how far will they go for something they truly believe is a noble cause? as discussed in part iii of my tips for morally grey characters,
would they lie? cheat? steal? manipulate? maim? what about commit acts of vandalism? arson? would they kill?
but even when we have a line, sometimes we make exceptions for a variety of reasons. additionally, there are limits to some of the lengths we’d go to.
find your character’s line, their limits and their exceptions.
v. objectivism/relativism
objectivism, as defined by the merriam-webster dictionary, is “an ethical theory that moral good is objectively real or that moral precepts are objectively valid.”
relativism, as defined by the merriam-webster dictionary, is “a view that ethical truths depend on the individuals and groups holding them.”
what take on morality, as a concept, does your character have? is morality objective? is morality subjective?
we could really delve deep into this one, but this post is long enough that i don’t think we need to get into philosophical rambling… so this is a good starting point.
either way, exploring morality as a concept and how your character views it will allow for better application of their personal moral code.
vi. application
so, now you know what they believe and have a deep understanding of your character’s moral code, all that’s left is to apply it and understand how it informs their actions while taking their personality into account.
and interesting thing to note is that we are all hypocrites; you don’t have to do this, but it might be fun to play around with the concept of their moral code and add a little bit of hypocrisy to their actions as a treat.
either way, how do your character’s various beliefs interact? how does it make them interact with the world? with others? with their friends, family, and community? with their government? with their employment? with their studies? with the earth and environment itself?
in conclusion:
there’s a lot of things that inform one’s moral compass and i will never be able to touch on them all; however, this should hopefully serve as at least a basic guide.
#ldknightshade.txt#writing#writing tips#creative writing#writing ideas#writing inspiration#writing advice#writing help#how to write#writing tumblr#writeblr
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Ok thought not fully formed yet but I think everything would make a lot more sense if we thought of "sin" as more along the lines of "something that weakens your connection with God" and less "a morally bad action in the secular philosophical sense."
In modern secular philosophy, usually we only think of an action as "bad" if it causes measurable harm to society/the environment/another person etc. No victim = no crime. This makes perfect sense when we're thinking about regulating behavior with laws, rules, and, to an extent, social norms. The goal of this kind of thinking/regulating is to create a harmonious, free, and safe society in our mortal/temporal/earthly condition.
In contrast, Sin as a religious (Christian) concept is more concerned with the state of an individual soul and that soul's relationship with God. It is possible for something to be a sin and yet be a "victimless crime." (Arguably the "victim" here is actually the "perpetrator" but you know what I mean.) The goal of this kind of thinking is to help the individual be in harmony with God.
I think the problem here is when we conflate the two uncritically. Yes, there is a lot of overlap (murder, for example, would draw you further from God and also is harmful to the murder victim/their family/society.) But the two concepts are not one and the same. Just because a behavior is sinful doesn't mean it can and should be forbidden by law, rule, or even social norm. Likewise, just because enforcing or encouraging a certain behavior is beneficial to society doesn't mean that behavior is or isn't a sin.
I think this conflation is a source of miscommunication and misunderstanding. Lots of people seem to interpret calling a behavior sinful to mean "if you do this you are an bad person who is actively harming society."
I also think that's why people get so turned off by the concept of all sin being equal in the eyes of God. That isn't the same thing as all morally bad actions having equal weight or consequences in society. The point is that all sin separates us from God, and what His plan requires for us is for there to be zero separation. (That's where Jesus comes in). The point of saying all sin is the same in the eyes of God isn't to say that murder and not praying are equivalent in secular morality. The point is that someone "guilty" of not praying needs Jesus just as much as a murderer. (Because! We all need Jesus completely and equally.)
So anyway I guess my point is that Christians need to recognize that just because something is sinful (separates a soul from God) doesn't mean that that thing should be illegal or against the rules or even socially shamed.
But! Non-Christians should also understand that the concept of sin is distinct from secular morality. If I say that something is a sin, don't take it as me saying "anyone who does this is evil and depraved and deserves to be executed by firing squad." girl I sin. we all sin.
#help does this make sense#again! There's overlap#because chances are if you are knowingly causing undue harm (morally wrong) that's also a sin babey#can't think of an exception tbh#also there is kind of a gray area in the middle involving intention and impact#I could do something that causes unforeseen harm#that might not be a sin (I had good intentions) but had bad consequences#but secular morality imo usually has concessions for that sort of thing as well?#christian#christianity#religion#tumblrstake
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okay so we all know saiki is a genius. we all know this. I’d love to elaborate.
Saiki can pretty much passively absorb everything he learns, and it seems like he doesn’t really forget anything. Even when he has those ‘uh oh’ moments that we’ve seen, it’s always been because of a distraction and not because lack of knowledge. Bc he absorbs so much information from his direct surroundings, it takes almost nothing for him to learn what’s required of him. ie; how he’s expected to act, the best route to get somewhere, what he learns in school etc.
Consequently, it takes him very little effort to accomplish the ‘regular’ academic expectations for his age. We’ve seen him do a years worth of homework in the blink of an eye… (here comes my hc)
Thus he has a lot of time on his hands. And Saiki is innately curious. To bide his time, he likes to delve into obscure topics, to learn things that are completely unfamiliar to the average person. So Saiki knows a lot, and Saiki reads a lot. At the very ~least~ he knows all about advanced quantum physics, from Kusuke’s mind. Now this MAY be me projecting, but I like to think that Saiki loves to research all things history and philosophy (the average person is not often thinking about these things beyond the surface level).
As a result, his classmates often see him reading about some of the most random and specific subjects ever (after all, what exudes ‘don’t talk to me’ more than reading a dense book?). They come to know that Saiki is the one to go to if they have any questions about ANY general knowledge (see also: kaido asking saiki for homework help even though his own class rank is much higher)
And maybe some of them wonder: why? Why does Saiki perform averagely at school, when he seems so interested in learning? Maybe someone finally asks him about some miscellaneous inconsequential fact…. and the next thing they know Saiki is spouting facts at a mile a minute. Oh you’re asking about Alexander the Great? Did you know that he died so young because he became paralyzed from contaminated wine and then was buried alive? Did you know Alexander’s lineage supposedly traces back to Achilles himself, suggesting that the events of the Trojan War have basis in truth? And if that is the case, what could have caused the decade long Mediterranean sea journeys of Odysseus and Menelaus who were descendants of the Minoan sea experts?
Okay anyways. Moral of the story, Saiki is a secret NERD and you cannot take that away from me. I live by the fact that he is just a random scholar of all things.
Plz expand, I would love to know ur thoughts/reactions
#observant aren is intruiged by saiki’s knowledge#guys it’s kubosai#don’t even play me cuz its fckn kubosai#i am a kubosai truther and i’m hungry#the disastrous life of saiki k#saiki k#tdlosk#disastrous life of saiki k#kubosai#🥺
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"If you describe a horrific and detailed act of racism committed by an IDF soldier or a Kahanist or other anti Arab extremist (say Baruch Goldstein's massacre), you'll find that a huge majority of Jews condemn him, his philosophy, his actions, denounce him and consider him a poor practitioner of Judaism"
No they don't, that's the whole fucking point.
Whenever IDF soldiers kill Palestinians the only reaction from Israelis you would get is them bringing up how military service is mandatory in Israel so you can't be mad at the soldier, how this is an extremely complex two-sided "conflict" where both sides are equally wrong and equally victims, how everything is the fault of the entire government of Hamas and Bibi (but just Bibi, they will never hold anyone else in the government accountable) and gaslighting people into believing that this is an isolated incident that doesn't normally happen and that the Israeli committing the crime will actually face any type of justice.
And this assuming that they would even acknowledge a crime has been committed instead of calling it "blood libel" and using what happens as a segue to talk about anti-semitism even more.
So you clearly don't know any Jews because Baruch Goldstein is one of the least controversial figures in Jewish history to condemn. Like, he probably has defenders in Israel but they're definitely a pretty small minority, and you'd be very hard pressed to find any diaspora Jews who approve of his crimes.
And aside from that, because yes people do defend the IDF when they are presented with similarly horrific sounding stories... but look what happens, most of these stories turn out to be exaggerated or completely false to begin with! This isn't about starry-eyed Jewish supremacy vs Muslims just doing an oopsie and they had good reasons for it, this is about truth. That's the key element. It's a little ridiculous to whine that Jews won't full throatedly condemn bombing a hospital and killing 500 people when that turned out to be a lie!
Baruch Goldstein was a terrorist, he factually provably committed horrific crimes. Osama Bin Laden was also a terrorist, he factually provably orchestrated horrific crimes. If you ask the average Jew to defend the former, they'd be equally as uncomfortable as if you asked the average Muslim to defend the latter. There are always going to be braindead terrorism fanboys in both groups, duh. I'm talking about the average person.
And here you are, deciding that no, the average Jew is a savage devotee to terrorism and genocide, just like every other Jew Hater online. It's becoming a bit stale. See that last part in particular, this is about a deep envious rage you feel that Jewish people "get away" with doing/thinking/saying "The Bad Thing" and you feel a need to bring them down a peg. You frame a very real thing (like blood libel is not trivial and Jewish people do not actually talk about it frivolously), as a privilege, a cheat code. You're jealous because you probably belong to a demographic that can't "milk" it's own historic oppression and tragedy, so you feel that Jews shouldn't "get" to.
But this is the real world, where exaggerating the alleged crimes of Jews is demonstrably linked with an increase in antisemitic rhetoric (check), harassment of Jews and Jewish institutions (check), and even violence (they just thwarted a planned terrorist attack in Brooklyn, very much the last roadblock to a liberated Palestine).
Anyway my point was that if you zoom out to more and more abstract concepts, a greater percentage of both Jewish and Muslim populations will probably support them. And I think it's telling that "a Jewish state founded on war and large violent population transfers" has a higher moral burden on it than "a Muslim state founded on war and large violent population transfers."
Ask a Muslim if they support "Pakistan exists" and how many would disagree? Realistically? But you dare act disgusted and shocked that a similar number and percentage of Jews support "Israel exists"? My entire question is why "This is a country that has done bad things and it exists amid ethnic conflict" is even on par with "this niche cult within a giant religion (literally they admitted to it) did a massacre on civilians."
If that's the moral equivalence then we're done here. I'm not playing games like that.
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i have another 2.1 character dynamic post in the recesses of my brain but i need to get this out first
star rail's 2.1 update main plotline leans a lot more into existentialism and absurdism than i thought it would which is a really nice surprise
like i thought before 2.0 that at most it was just going to be some "oh no capitalism bad ipc bad cults also bad" thing but honestly what we got is so much more interesting. the spoilers start now
also massive disclaimer i am not a philosophist and actually i really don't like philosophy because it makes my brain hurt and i would much rather just look at logical nice things like math and plants so. if i get anything wrong please correct me
acheron's past and how she became an emanator of nihility reminds me somewhat of the absurdist theme of how people always look for meaning when there isn't any, until they finally realize that the universe is meaningless
and the entire path of nihility basically is a road towards that realization that people tread on, and the difference between the real world and star rail is that in the real world here we have people who will see that and then go write a book about a guy not crying at his mother's funeral, whereas in star rail it seems that just accepting that the universe is meaningless turns you into a pathstrider or even emanator of the nihility (not sure if i remember the details, correct me if i'm wrong)
and then aventurine's whole motivation is trying to understand why the universe is so cruel to him, and to find meaning when you have everything except freedom, both of which are absurdist themes
the leap of faith argument often attributed to søren kierkegaard claims that even though there is no rational logic for believing in god, you should do it anyway because the alternatives are madness, suicide, and ignorance. this was one solution to the problem of confronting the universe's meaninglessness: choosing to believe in a higher being regardless
later world wars i and ii both contributed heavily to the rise of absurdism as people returned from the war, having seen so many others die around them, and then just going back to a normal society with none of what they as individual soldiers had contributed seemingly doing anything. and then it happened again, but on a much greater scale with even more deaths. both wars and the destruction they brought led many people to start questioning why a supposedly moral god could allow this suffering, and this is where camus comes in and says that actually religion and nationalism both aren't good solutions, and instead we should just accept meaninglessness and keep living despite the absurdity
and i think dr ratio's scroll thing kind of relates to that
he tells aventurine to open it when he's about to die, or when he's completely out of answers for the question of how to confront absurdity
and dr ratio's answer for aventurine is to just tell him to keep living, good luck
which is. yeah
it's the argument that there are more answers to nihilism than just 1) going insane, 2) pretending like it doesn't exist, and 3) dying
it's the bold claim that despite everything, you can still choose to live
sure nothing makes sense but that does not detract from your life. it doesn't need to make sense at all
and with the understanding that things do not need to fit our human definition of meaning, we can continue on knowing our true place in the universe
and with that aventurine walks into the very big black hole like look at that thing you cannot tell me there is no symbolism there
let's go back to acheron.
in the part where you get a snippet of acheron's conversation with some guy just before this cutscene, the other party states that "[IX] leave[s] woven strands of fate for humans to walk, and together THEY weave a great shadow...And this shadow silently envelops them."
which to me sounds like a statement on how people across time and space have again and again come to the same question, what is the meaning of life?
and acheron's whole color thing seems to mean that she is one of the few who, after walking so far on the path of nihility, somehow have not died yet, be it from madness or something else
like it seems implied that many many more have seen the meaninglessness of the universe and have not reacted as well as acheron has
ok i have more to say about the elation and how it in turn relates to the nihility but that will have to come later but there is. a lot of interesting things there to explore
once again disclaimer: I Am Not A Philosophist And Do Not Know What The Correct Definitions Of These Words I'm Throwing Around Are. thank you for coming to my ted talk that was more of a longwinded ramble
#hsr#honkai star rail#2.1 spoilers#hsr aventurine#dr ratio#(briefly but i think i might have more to say about him later once my brain gets working)#acheron#hsr analysis#i should make a tag for that because this is probably not the last time i'm going on a wild tangent about star rail#but bad#bad hsr analysis#someone save me and take me back to the luofu i don't want to be doing english homework while playing a supposedly relaxing upbeat game#or whatever it was that shaoji promised in the 2.0 livestream#i just want to go back and see dan heng and jing yuan and qingque and bailu and you get the point#get me out of this dreamscape.
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You keep saying refusing to vote for Biden on moral grounds because of Palestine is ineffective because Trump would be worse, but that really isn't the point. Largely (with the exception of a few extremists and a contingency of people who wouldn't have voted anyways) the philosophy of a movement that has people withhold their vote is to force a significant policy change that wouldn't have changed otherwise. Its a form of protest. I understand from your perspective, election-focused and pragmatic, it is a threat to whoever is running, but if Biden had wanted the votes being withheld he would have capitulated.
Not that this isn't a moot point since he's out, but whatever.
See, this is intensely fucking dumb.
"force a significant policy change" it would not. One, because Biden is the president of the United States, and Israel is not one of those states. Short of sending the CIA to, idk, assassinate Netanyahu in his bed, which most of these people would be against I think because of how much they bitch and moan about US foreign policy at any given opportunity, he cannot actually make an independent foreign power do what he wants and what is electorally convenient for him. Like, I'm very sure Biden would love it if Netanyahu and his partisans stopped acting like fucking freaks for five minutes, if only so that it would stop being a PR nightmare for him. But that's not happening, because he cannot control what Netanyahu does. He could vastly reduce the support the US is providing Israel, and in my view he should, but that's not going to stop what Netanyahu and the Israeli government is doing. Because, I hate to break it to you, but the reason they're carpetbombing Gaza is because they want to be carpetbombing Gaza, and even without US aid they will continue to do it, even it just means with older and less effective weapons. Ultimately, the change that leads to a ceasefire and an end to the war is going to come from the actual parties involved, not Joe Biden.
Two, you've already gotten the significant policy change. Biden has, on multiple occasions now, come out in favor a ceasefire. He has actively been working, along with the Qatari government, to try and broker some kind of peace agreement between Israel and Hamas, but those two keep on fucking it up because they're both run by bloodthirsty psychopaths who don't care one iota about the people they're meant to be governing and only on killing whoever they want. That's been open fact for months now. And it has meant fuckall. The people doing their moral purity about how they'd never vote for Biden were still doing it, just moving the goalposts on what they wanted. First it was ceasefire, then it was 'no ceasefire until [insert impossible demand here] is given', because moving goalposts is what these people do. It's the same mentality as people who saw that Biden was doing COVID stimulus, or cancelling student loans, or reclassifying marijuana, and decided that the issue now was that he wasn't doing enough of it. It's a movement that's been consistently comprised of dogs that caught the car, and are angry that they caught the car because now they can't complain, and they don't want to actually affect meaningful change, they just want to complain because that's easier. And if that's what these people have been doing for his entire presidency, why on Earth would any reasonable person suddenly believe it's different on this one specific issue?
Three, cool you're protesting, then what? Your protest is utterly unserious and completely meaningless if it's not going to have any tangible effects, so what's the next step? You've decided to make your moral purity stance an issue that the vast majority of you learned from infographics on Instagram rather than listening to the voices involved (which is why the red triangle brigade is still a thing on Twitter), so what happens now? No political party is ever going to capitulate entirely to it, because the constituency is just too small (that "uncommitted" gambit was only getting like 10% of the vote wherever it was happening, Biden won over it as a literal write-in candidate in at least one state), so other than the compromise that's already happening, the goalpost movers are gonna withhold their votes because blah blah blah my morals. And their next step is, what? Trump gets elected. And their movement, which has no thought or serious effort put behind it or any actual attempt to provide material aid to the people actually suffering, has helped put a man who is going to be far worse for it in power. The "significant policy change" is going to be that Trump gives Netanyahu whatever he wants and he proceeds to wipe Gaza off the map. The "significant policy change" is that President "Trump Heights" actively makes things worse for the people this protest is supposed to help, as a consequence of that very protest.
It's not about me only being concerned with being "election focused" or some cold hearted bitch. It's about me, as a person who thinks what Israel has been doing since the start is godawful and deeply horrendous, realizing that this entire "protest" is not only asinine but will result in deeply negative consequences and very real harm for the people this protest is purported to be for, and being sickened by that. I live in the real world, and in the real world action speaks far louder than intent. I don't have to acknowledge that the protest wants this or that outcome or what the hypothetical impossible asks that are never going to be answered are, because I understand that they will not matter. What matters is what you get out of your protest, what gains are received, how that protest actually affects change, not the change it gives wishy washy lip service to.
#personal#answered#anonymous#this isn't very eloquent because i've been feeling a bit off all day#but if your protest is not only ineffectual but actually going to make things worse for the people you claim to 'help'#it deserves to be called stupid and be given the disrespect it engenders#i don't CARE about the philosophy behind it#it doesn't matter#it means fuck all that this protest is meant to convey this or that#because the outcome is what matters#the outcome that is going to affect real people who are already suffering#and are certainly not going to have their suffering alleviated if these people don't get their heads out of their asses
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I read your review of Poor Things and I was wondering if you had any thoughts on the section in Alexandria? It was horrifically executed on many levels but narratively, that part of the film is about Bella learning about class structure. She rebels against the cruelty of society through charity then by working as a prostitute, during which time she has cruelty inflicted upon her instead. Finally, she realizes that God’s creation of her was ultimately cruel, and then she runs away with her ex-husband-father only to realize that her prior self-mother was fundamentally characterized by cruelty, especially to her “lessers.” She then decides once again that she does not want to be cruel, but then she achieves this by taking God’s place as the doctor-patriarch and ruling his household with a new pet goat. The entire film is also about Bella learning about feminism: the arbitrary oppression of women is not only nonsensical, it’s bad! But then the ending has her reproduce almost all those power structures and cruelty she claims to reject, and has the unfortunate consequence of positioning her as ultimately equally cruel/callous as God, the guy she meets on the boat who shows her all the starving people, and her former self-mother, etc. I was wondering if you had any thoughts on why this is or like, what the director’s message was beyond self-contradiction and taking cheap shots at starving people?
so i would quibble a bit with the idea that bella's experience in the maison-close is exclusively or even primarily portraying sex-for-pay as a site of cruelty. i think it's more depicting paid sex as work, and work as unpleasant and repressive, and that's why the maison is the site where bella gets involved in socialist politics—if moral philosophy is the arena by which she responds to the injustice of the poverty in alexandria, then labour politics plays the analogous role where the maison is concerned. her problems there aren't inherently with the idea of being paid for sex, but with specific elements of the work arrangement (eg, she suggests that the women should choose their clients, rather than vice versa). ofc she has some customers who are cruel or thoughtless or rude, but i didn't read the film as suggesting that was universal to sex work, and the effect of the position is more to demystify sex, for bella, than to convert it into being purely a site of trauma or misery. now i don't think this film offers a particularly blistering or deep analysis of sex work or socialism or wage labour, dgmw, but i do think the function of the maison is different narratively to that of the alexandria section.
anyway to answer your actual question: yeah so this is really my central gripe with the film. lanthimos (slash his screenwriter tony mcnamara) spends much of the film gesturing toward bella's growing awareness of several hierarchical structures that other characters take for granted: the uneven nature of the parent/child relationship (god took her body and created her without asking); class stratification (alexandria); the 'civilisation' of individuals and societies via education and bio-alteration (bella's talk about 'improving' herself; her 'progression' from essentially a pleasure-seeking child to an educated and 'articulate' adult). these three dimensions often overlap (eg, the conflation of 'childishness' with lack of education with inability to behave in 'high society'), though, most overtly, it's in that third one that we can see how these notions of improvement and biological melioration speak to discourses about the 'progress' and 'regress' of whole societies and peoples, and voluntarist ideas about how human alteration of biology (namely, our own) might produce people, and therefore societies, that are better or worse on some metric: beauty, fitness, intelligence, morality, longevity, &c. this is why i keep saying that like.... this film is about eugenics djkdjsk.
the issue with the alexandria section to me is, first, it's like 2 minutes (processed in the hollywood yellow filter) where the abject poverty of other people is a life lesson for bella. we're not asking any questions like, how is that poverty produced, and might it have anything to do with the ship bella is on or the fantastical lisbon she left or the comparative wealth of paris and london...? secondly, everything that the film thinks it's doing for the entire runtime by having bella grapple with learning about cruelty, and misery, and the kinds of received social truths that lanthimos is able to problematise through her eyes because she's literally tabula rasa—all of that is just so negated by having an ending in which she bio-engineers her shitty ex-husband, played as a triumphant moment. i don't even inherently have an issue with the actual plot point; certainly she has motive, and narratively it could have worked if it were framed as what it is: bella ascending to the powerful position in the oppressive system that created her, and using her status to enact cruelty against someone who 'deserves' it—ie, leveraging her class and race within the existing social forms rather than continuing to question or challenge them. if that ending were played as a tragedy, or a bleak satire, it would at least be making A Point. but it's not even, because it's just framed as deserved comeuppance for this guy we were introduced to in the 11th hour as a scumbag, so it's psychologically beneficial for bella actually to do the sci-fi surgery to him that literally reduces him to what's framed as a lower life form. unserious
#the favourite and the lobster also have some troubling body and disability politics and i think this is a throughline with lanthimos#but this one is particularly egregious to me given the ending lol#poor things
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I’ve got my eyes on you
Pairing: Boyfriend! Heeseung X Fem! Reader X Roommate! Jake
Genre: Smut🔞 (Minors DNI), Heeseung and reader have a established relationship, Roommate AU!
Warnings: unprotected sex (wrap it up before you tap it), Hard Dom! Heeseung, Sub! Reader, Jake is like neutral, threesome, double penetration, anal sex, voyeurism, nipple play, squirting, cum eating, clit play and slapping, dirty talking, slut shaming, degradation, blowjob, degradation, multiple orgasm, cream pie, dacryphilia, overstimulation, fingering, Heeseung being mean. Hopefully I didn’t miss out anything else.
Summary: Jake has always loved capturing the beauty in any subject, the camera being his appendage for as long as he could remember. But pursuing what he loves in college didn’t end as well as he thought before he met the two of you, the couple who would change his black-and-white perspective for years to come.
Main masterlist
Word count: 6,242 words
a/n: I have no words to describe how horny I was while writing this. Anyways, I hope you guys enjoy reading this while I slave away to do my long awaited thesis 🥲 🥲 Also, I want to say thank you so much for 1,600+ followers 🫶🫶 🤧
Jake was always told that he had an eye for art.
Aligning the clear lens near to his right eye while the other shut closed, feeling the robust outline of the camera weighing his arms as he brings it up and the subtle tap on the flat button before—
Snap
He took a picture worth a thousand words.
From photography to filmography, Jake’s aptitude talent to be able to capture the nuances of angles and depth earned him a scholarship from a rather prestigious college to further his education.
Succumbing to the naivety of pursuing his skill in a more formal method, his passion for the art had been confined in a small defined box. The initial gratification and contentment of crafting a piece of pure refinery were moulded into the rules of academic guidelines.
He might abide by his philosophy, but he’s not stupid to flop his studies.
The semesters were filled with bleak and gruelling days— suffering through classes, assignments and professors that seemed to come and go. Nevertheless, he thought that he would spend his roaring twenties enjoying life and creating projects, with the possibility of doing a gallery show to display pieces of his creation to the world.
What seemed to be a rock bottom situation has graced him with the silver lining he needed.
Lee Heeseung was another fellow student in the school, a year older than him, who needed a new roommate in his apartment.
Coincidentally, Jake decided to move out of his parent’s house for independence, finding solace in the fact that the male was reasonably trustable and able to save money simultaneously.
It was initially awkward, mostly coming from him, who was slightly tense about living with an older person other than his family. Jake upholds respect as a constitution to his morals, but he slowly loosens up his relationship with Heeseung from a stranger to his best friend.
But it seemed Heeseung came with a combo, and that was you, his roommate’s girlfriend.
Intertwining his life with Heeseung meant that you were also in the package, often visiting the apartment to bring food or have a movie night together. As a result, Jake often feels like he is imposing on the couple because no one wants a third wheel tailing your scarce intimate time with each other.
However, it seemed like you and Heeeseung didn’t mind his company, often inviting Jake to activities like a trip to the aquarium or a study picnic on the grass field on the campus ground.
The couple knew about Jake’s talent with the camera, often asking him to take pictures of the memories for sentimental purposes.
For all his life in filming and snapping pictures, whether it be organisms to inanimate objects, the subject of his inspiration has never come close to how perfectly the two of you looked through the camera’s lens from his eyes.
At first, his impression of the couple’s relationship was admiration, understanding and respect for each other in overcoming complex obstacles, seeing one another as equal rather than subject to the emotion and stress that manifested during those squabbles.
Still, it didn’t sit right with him to call it admiration, and the turning point soon tests the hypothesis when in the dead of the night one day, he heard you and Heeseung having sex for the first time.
The walls that separate his room and Heeseung’s were arguably not that thin, but it wasn’t thick enough either to muffle the whimpers and moans coming from the room next door.
Jake felt like he had a stomach ache listening to the couple’s soft lewd sounds, not because he hated it, but quite the opposite; the noises turned him on.
It began as something that flew over his head, not dissecting the whole thing in great detail until he heard it for the second time, and then the third time, and before he knew it, he had his pyjama pants down to his knees, desperately humping his pillow to the rhythm of his friends having sex with a palm clamp over his mouth.
He fantasizes about the two bodies mingled with one another on the white sheets of Heeseung’s bed; the eloquent actions of touching, grabbing and thrusting that aggregated into white milky beautiful essence oozing out of your hole—
Jake came on the fabric of his pillowcase with the thought of capturing the cinematography of such an imaginary masterpiece deeply rooted in the reality he could never witness.
So much adrenaline was pumping through his body that he could hear his heart beating.
He woke up groggy and tired the next morning on those days, feeling like he got hit by a truck at how uneasy he felt. He dreaded coming outside, knowing he’d see you and Heeseung making breakfast together, embarrassed to even make eye contact with them.
The male felt nauseous, in fact, filthy to the core of even masturbating silently to the notion of them fucking. Realization slowly dawned on him that the search for the term to describe how he feels about the two of you has concluded in his head— infatuation.
No words could ever express the emotion better on how he felt in the enchanting relationship they shared.
The mundane life he had owned morphed into restless torture of constant tossing and turning. He felt guilt eating him up, more so because he hid such a deceitful act of touching himself while putting up a disguise behind his friend’s back.
At the culmination of the chaotic situation, Jake saw Heeseung's gallery by accident.
The younger male wanted to call his missing phone in his room, asking permission from Heeseung, who was doing the laundry at the time, if he could use the older male’s phone. However, while pressing on the phone app to search for his number, his clumsy fingers, by chance, opened up the gallery instead, causing his eyes to bulge out at what he saw.
It was a thumbnail of a recent video logged into the first file, big enough for him to decipher the image that made him almost drop the phone.
The camera's angle was situated visibly at the side view of Heeseung in between your legs, missionary position with a blanket covering the area where your bodies meet. You were gripping his arm that was caging the sides of your head against the familiar bed, and Jake didn’t need to stare for too long to understand what was going on.
A dull sound rang in his ears, and his throat grew dry as his heart erratically beat against his ribcage. Then, with a shaking thumb hovering above the video icon, Jake’s breathing was as loud as his swallowing before pressing on it reluctantly, pupils trembling in nervousness.
The video played.
Heeseung was thrusting into you, hearing the sound of soft skin slapping mixed with whiny, muffled moans and grunts that echoed against the phone’s speaker. The upper part of their faces was cut out from the shot, but in the dimly lit room, the smirk on Heeseung’s face was evident.
“Shhh, didn’t I tell you to quiet down princess, or are you purposely doing it for Jake to hear you?” Heeseung whispered slowly against your ear, eliciting a small cry from your lips.
Eyes as wide as saucers, Jake couldn’t believe what he was witnessing, his name leaving his roommate’s mouth while fucking you.
Heeseung chuckled darkly, smacking his hips harder against yours. “Fuck, that’s it, isn’t it? You tighten up everytime I say his name. Such a dirty girl.”
Jake’s breathing shallowed beyond disbelief at what he was hearing.
Heeseung fastens his pace, causing you to sink your nails into his arm desperately. “That’s why you like it when I fuck your ass, right? Reserving your pretty pussy just for Jakey to ruin it.”
A gasp left his lips in total shock.
Something unfathomable brewed deep inside Jake’s stomach when he realized that Heeseung was penetrating your ass the whole time under the cover.
Jake envisioned your drenched, sweet pussy clenching around nothing at the thought of his cock in you and the little nickname that Heeseung teasingly used to build up the tension— a taut knot settling at the bottom of his gut at how turned on he was by the act.
But the last sentence that Heeseung said made him freeze like a deer in headlights.
“Imagining he was the one filming us right now.”
Every fibre of his body reacted to those words, playing them repeatedly in his head like a broken record. Jake felt like his head was doused with a bucket of cold water without warning; mind and body underwent a spiralled loophole of a fever dream.
He was in a state of disorientation when Heeseung walked into his room obliviously.
“Hey, Jake. Did you find your— wow, you okay dude?” Heeseung’s voice fell into deep worry at how ghostly his friend’s expression was.
Jake’s lack of response causes Heeseung’s eyes to trail to the phone he was holding tightly and the obvious sound emitting from the device.
The older male’s face distorts into multiple stages of horror and dread in recognition. The fear that pierced his wide eyes while looking back and forth between Jake’s face and the phone indicated that he was caught red-handed.
The taller male swallowed hard. “We can explain.”
It didn’t take long for Heeseung to call you to come to the shared apartment, albeit in between explaining to you on the phone, Jake heard muffled shouting of fury on your end while his roommate walked mindlessly in circles, trying to calm you down.
Sitting on the sofa patiently in the living room, Jake didn’t know how to handle the whole ordeal or if he was ready to accept whatever lay ahead with the two of you.
The sound of the apartment door swinging open echoed the space, revealing a dishevelled you trudging past the hallway into the living area. Jake felt guilty at your current dismay, possibly running directly here after finishing your class on campus as you were still carrying your backpack.
When you make eye contact with Jake, you look down in embarrassment.
“Okay.” Heeseung tried to fill in the awkward silence calmly, the pregnant pause giving away how thick the tension was in the room. “Where do we even start?”
You scoff distastefully, putting your backpack down harshly on the ground. “Start? How about you explain to me how the video was even found out in the first place!”
Jake drowned out the disputed exchange between the couple, trying to mallow down his rapid breathing. If he let this kind of situation escalate, it might end up being a dumpster fire in a few minutes. His mind wandered to articulate the proper sentence to begin, finally settling on the information he had been aching to know.
“How long…..has this been going on?” Jake didn’t realize how nervous he was until he spoke with a slight rasp, breaking his silence since he discovered the video.
His question shifted the attention of the two to him, realizing that the true dupe of the sitch had been wearily calmed the whole time. But, of course, they didn’t know that Jake himself kept a not-so-innocent secrecy as well.
“The first time we did it…..in my room.” Heeseung glanced your way as a confirmation while you gave a subtle nod back at his reply.
“Why did you guys film it?”
You and Heeseung exchange eye contact with each other apprehensively.
“We did it for the first time out of impulse, and when Heeseung mentioned your name in the middle of it—” You grimaced, trying to explain, but the words died in your throat out of pure awkwardness.
Heeseung flashes you a consoling look.
“Long story short, we didn’t realize how much you have an effect on us that we kept going even after the first. Well, the video, it's…..a living proof of that.” Heeseung continues, biting on his lower lip at the end.
Another excruciating pause follows suit.
It was hard to focus as you tried to read Jake’s facial expression but to no avail. It made you realize the loud ticking sound of the clock in the living room or the soft noises coming from the neighbours above behind the pin-drop silence in the backdrop.
The agitation was getting on your nerves, and all you could think about was the guilt that overshadowed everything else.
“We’re really sorry, Jake.” You apologize sincerely. “We didn’t mean to use you in that kind of way.”
“Yeah,” Heeseung muttered in agreement, flashing a remorseful downward glance towards the younger male with a sigh. “So, we totally get it if you want nothing to do with us and move out of the apartment.”
Anyone who was in Jake’s position would be bewildered by circumstance— finding out that your roommate and his girlfriend had been deliberately having sex for you to hear next door and, on top of that, gaining arousal from your existence unknowingly undermines the friendship that was built on trust seemed borderline intrusive.
But that was the perception that the two of you presumed.
In his mind, he couldn’t fathom such a surreal moment he thought was just an erotic fantasy in his mind was happening, as if the planets had aligned for the sky above to bless a disparate soul like him with the epitome of heaven.
Jake could feel the thrill of revealing his divulgence without a second thought; a small smirk curled his lips.
“Oh no, I don’t think I can do that.”
He chuckled slowly, watching the two faces turn perplexed by his words.
Jake gave a nonchalant shrug. “I mean, have you guys seen how horrible the set-up for the video was? It looks like a cheap DVD porno that many juvenile teens would drool over. Who else other than me can prevent that kind of thing from happening again.”
At this point, the two looked like a pair of gaping fishes standing in front of him, as if he grew a third head or said something wildly demented, completely disregarding the fact that he had insulted the camera work of the video.
There was a notable doubt in their expression, yet slightly reposed by the tether of hope that Jake was saying what they thought he was saying based on his words' innuendo.
“You guys weren’t really being sly about the whole thing, you know. I can hear you banging from a mile away.” Jake revealed, smiling cheekily when the couple immediately flushed in embarrassment.
“Oh my God, Jake.” You let out a tired sigh, but a hint of relief flooded the way you dragged your breath at the end. “Why didn’t you say anything?”
The younger male was slightly taken aback by the question but answered earnestly with his feelings because what he was about to say next will completely overturn the course of each other’s relationship.
The corners of his mouth slid upwards knowingly.
“You guys aren’t the only ones secretly enjoying it.”
If someone asked Jake what his proudest creation was, he wished that he could show them the sight he was capturing right now with his camera.
His figure stood a few feet away from Heeseung’s bed, perfectly encapsulating the shot of the couple making out with your back facing the camera, watching through the crips lens as he zoomed in the way Heeseung shoved his tongue into your mouth as he pulled you closer on his lap.
Jake’s fantasy of the two could never compare to the one he witnessed.
He felt excitement overwhelming his body, holding the camera steadily to focus on Heeseung’s hands, grabbing onto your ass, pulling on the strings of your lace panties until the crotch was wedged between your crack.
Your sweet moans filled the room, no longer timid like before when Heeseung convinced you and Jake that it was the perfect time to film.
The younger male was also nervous— it wasn’t that long ago when the three of you talked about what happened, finally coming to a conclusion about the addition of Jake into the bedroom.
He didn’t realize how nerve-wracking it was, feeling his cock growing hard against his jeans at the way your hips were desperately grinding on Heeseung’s clothed erection, facilitated with the help of the said male’s hand grabbing onto the flesh of your exposed ass.
“Such a needy girl.” Heeseung chuckled darkly after releasing your lips messily with saliva, kissing your neck as he buckled back to meet your movement. “You love it, don’t you? Knowing that Jake is watching you hump my cock so desperately while you show your bare ass to him.”
Heeeseung looked directly into the camera between your shoulders while nibbling on your skin, enjoying how Jake’s fingers tightened their hold on the equipment when you whimpered loudly in confirmation.
He moves close to whisper into your ears, hands snaking along your back to unclasp your bra.
“Let’s show him how much of a little slut you can be, okay?”
Jake’s breath hitched when Heeseung turned you around to face the camera, revealing your ample chest for him to marvel at as it bounced softly, nipples beautifully erect under the dimly warm lights of the room.
You caught sight of how Jake moved forward eagerly until his knees were flushed at the edge of the bed, your skin turning hot at the fact that he was filming your exposed breast so minuscule.
Heeseung pulled you roughly until your back was leaning on his naked chest, narrowing your chance of curling away from the vulnerable position. His large hands cup your breast from behind, kneading the swell in a tender and circular motion.
“Hands behind your back, baby.” Heeseung thumb at your stiff peaks, his nails digging at the sensitive area that you gasp out at the sensation. “Or I’ll have to show Jake that you can come with just your tits being played with like before.”
Jake couldn’t believe his ears, and his mind was already running wild at the thought, wishing that you'll keep pushing Heeseung’s button until he did carry out the punishment for Jake to see.
But you shook your head between the junction of his neck with your eyes squeezed shut, obviously not wanting to be subjected to such a humiliating act, especially for Jake to witness.
“No?” Heeseung teased, pinching your nipples before pulling them away harshly, twirling the hard peaks back and forth with his thumb and forefingers.
You whimpered in agony, clawing at his thighs resting between your hips while shoving your nose deeper into the crevice of his neck in mercy. Heeseung laughed at your state, panting hotly against his skin as he abused your tits.
“Then be a good girl and spread your legs apart for us, yeah?”
Us.
That specific pronoun sends waves of unfathomable pleasure between your and Jake’s legs, reducing both of you into a brazen state.
Following Heeseung’s order, Jake almost let out a moan behind the camera when you slowly opened your legs, his hands trembling at the sight of the very prominent dark and wet patch in the middle of your panties that sticks to the outline of your pussy like a glove.
Heeseung let a breathy chuckle at Jake’s striking reaction. “Beautiful, isn’t she?”
A hand escaped to curved downward along your stomach, dipping in between your hips to rub at your clothed folds. You buck your hips at the friction as Heeseung’s deft fingers drag along your puffy lips, eliciting a mantra of moans from your throat.
“This pussy gets nice and soaked just thinking about us. Right, baby girl?” Heeseung cooed, causing you to nod obediently, chest heaving at the way his fingers probed at your sweet entrance teasingly, letting a gush of juices escape to drench your panties even more.
Jake was enamoured at the sight, absolutely winded with a whole zoo churning in his stomach that he didn’t realize he was kneeling on the soft mattress of the bed, capturing the way Heeseung was stroking your clothed pussy while the other was still playing with one of your nipples lazily.
It didn’t help that you were watching him through half-lidded eyes, head lolling to the side with mouth agape when you eyed the visible bulge of his cock through his pants.
Heeseung glances at you when you squeeze his thighs a little harder, following your gaze to see what has captured your attention, causing him to grin.
“Looks like we got a big boy in our hands, huh, princess.”
Jake’s ears immediately perked up behind the camera, unbestowed to him that two sets of eyes were prowling on the outline of his aching cock like a predator hunting for its prey.
Heeseung nudged his nose against the underside of your ear. “Why don’t you be a sweetheart and help him out a little?”
There was no hesitation in the way you hooked on the belt hoop of his jeans, pulling the younger male closer until his crotch was arm’s length from your face. Jake was taken aback by your action, almost letting the camera fall while shuffling his knees on the bed to follow your lead.
You spread your palm over his bulge, dragging sensually with a little pressure to feel him over his jeans. A breathy hiss left his lips when you squeezed lightly on the head, and the friction felt deliciously good that he buckled slightly when you continued to smooth his erection.
The sound of his belt clicking and feeling the tight confinement of his jeans slowly loosening up, he throbs hotly when you tug at his pants, bringing them down to his thighs with his briefs.
“Fuck, Hee…..his so beautiful.” Jake immediately blushed when you whined incredulously at the male behind.
Jake’s cock stood proudly against his abdomen, fully pink and erected from the stimulation of watching Heeseung play with your tits and pussy. Milky pearls of cum had dribbled out of his slit and down to his length, head twitching when he felt your hungry gaze on him.
But you were drooling at how his veins pop up prominently, and his cute balls are nice and tight; it entices you to reach out and fist him firmly.
“Shit—“ Jake could hold it any longer, moaning at the sensation of your hand pumping him slowly and smearing his precum along his thick length.
Still, Jake was determined to fix the shot to you stroking his cock so deliciously, his abdomen tensing up when you flick your wrist harder when you reach his sensitive head, and then moaning loudly when you drag down to the base with a pressure, collecting his wetness between your fingers.
Heeseung watched you play with Jake’s cock as he rested his chin on your shoulder, heavy eyes soaking in the pleasurable sight of his girlfriend giving a handjob to his roommate.
“Baby, use your other hand to play with his balls.” Heeseung mumbled his command close to your ear. “I think he’ll enjoy it.”
Jake rolled his eyes to the back of his head when you fondled his heavy balls, gritting his teeth when you massaged the soft flesh indolently enough to make his hips stutter, igniting the knot in his stomach and making him lightheaded to the touch.
The younger male was gasping for air behind the camera, never thinking such minuscule action could drive him insane.
You lick your dry lips at how adorable his body reacted as you continue to use both hands, feeling an ache in your mouth and wondering how he would feel against your tongue.
Fuck, you bet he tasted sweet.
“Hee, Can I…..?” You ask gullibly to the side, and Heeseung doesn’t need any clarification before shaking his head at your antics with disapproval.
“If you want something in your mouth, baby, you have to ask him nicely. Where are your manners?” You whimpered when Heeseung slapped your clothed clit hard for Jake to witness before pushing your panties to the side, rubbing you raw against his padded fingers.
Jake observed with amazement how Heeseung treated you roughly, loving how you cried pathetically before looking up at him with hope-pooled eyes between your lashes.
“Jakey, can I please suck your cock?”
The way you asked him so crudely with such innocence had him swallowing hard, letting a sound of approval leave his throat.
Jake thanked the heaven and stars when you engulfed his head around your plump lips, reaching out to rest a hand on your head to steady himself. With your hands around the base, you tongue at his slit to taste his sticky precum before suckling to take more and more of his length into your mouth.
At the same time, Heeseung slipped two fingers into your tight hole without warning; the sudden stretch of your velvet walls to accommodate his long fingers almost caused you to choke on Jake’s cock with saliva.
“Easy, princess. You don’t want to hurt our precious Jakey.” Heeseung used his other hand to securely hold your jaw, ensuring that your mouth was still attached to his length.
“I’m sure the underside is very, very sensitive…..”
Heeseung had never been wrong with Jake’s ticks, and you flattened your tongue to rub on the veiny side of his erection until he felt the drag of your textured taste buds that accentuated the pleasure.
The exact pace was established momentarily— Heeseung was pumping his fingers in and out of your pussy hole with the rhythm of your head bobbing and tongue swirling around Jake’s cock.
The hand holding the camera felt heavy when he grabbed your hair tighter as you plunged your mouth deeper, and he groaned when the tip of your nose was flush against his pubic area, feeling his tip pressing against the back of your throat.
You did this a couple of times, gliding in and out of his length until the wet sound that emitted echoed in the room.
Heeseung scissored your hole relentlessly, feeling you soaking his fingers until it dripped down his knuckles. “Look at you, letting your boyfriend watch you stuff your mouth full with another man’s cock, you dumb fucking slut.”
Tears blurred your eyesight as Heeseung spat at you with degrading words, swallowing around Jake’s hard cock as your boyfriend inserted another finger to abuse your hole, loving how the rough stretch enlightened your arousal.
Jake watches you through the foggy lens simultaneously as you look up to show him the lewdest expression through the camera, the corner of your mouth wide open with his cock and drool dripping down your chin so obscenely.
His cock pulsates at the picture-perfect moment, feeling his threshold teetering around the edge before he loads your mouth with his creamy seed, bucking his hips as a loud moan ripples out from deep within his chest.
“…..that’s it, you eat up Jake so well.” Heeseung’s three fingers curl to press on the tender spot of your cervix, and your walls spasm around them as your sweet release encapsulates you with euphoric pleasure.
The vibrations of your moans around his spent cock kept Jake’s orgasm elevated beyond the clouds.
Everything happens in tandem with each other— you were swallowing Jake’s hot cum while Heeseung rides you off your orgasm as you rock his fingers for more friction.
It gave Jake the perfect moment to readjust the camera's focus on the couple as the tension simmered.
But it didn’t end just yet.
“Come here, pretty girl.” Heeseung coaxes you after licking his fingers clean with your arousal, making you release Jake’s cock with a loud pop as he manoeuvres your head to the side. “I want to have a taste too.”
Jake’s heart lurches from his chest when Heeseung captures your lips and devours your mouth full of his cum. The kiss was sloppy and wet, even downright dirty, as two tongues wrestled to taste each other’s cavern, frenching with open mouths so vulgarly that the slimy spit mixed with yours and Jake’s essence dripped down straight out of a porno.
The proud smirk on Heeseung’s face while he sucked on your lower lip and glanced over at him briefly told Jake everything he needed to know.
“Do you need me to prepare you, princess?” Heeseung asks, wiping away the white strings that form when he pulls away.
He watches you tentatively through hooded eyes, chest rising and falling with puffy lips before looking at Jake nervously. The older male had the gall to chuckle at your state, finding gratification in your shy reaction as he tucked away a few strands of hair behind your ear.
“Don’t worry, I don’t think Jake minds filming me finger fucking your pretty asshole with your head down.” Heeseung curiously looks at Jake’s way at the end.
The said male was heaving in his breath, having the front row seat as he imagined your pink, puckered hole being shoved in and out with Heeseung’s lanky fingers to loosen up your walls, your face flush against the pillow muffled with your cries.
He might get lucky if Heeseung felt the need to take the extra step of letting you come again, your pussy in full display for him to see you clench against absolutely nothing as you drown your folds with your own slick.
This must be a dream; it has to be.
“N-no, I want it to be tight…..” Your desperate plea cuts through the tension, tucking your bottom lip with your teeth as you tug on Heeseung’s pants impatiently.
Heeseung smiled gently, knowingly.
“Okay, baby. But next time, we'll show Jakey how I prepared you, alright?” Heeseung was surprisingly considerate, kissing you on the forehead softly as you nodded at his reply.
Heeseung didn’t want to overload the two with too many things.
Of course, the dominant side of him sought out the ecstasy of showing off to Jake how much he could turn you into a messy whore for their cocks, but this was the first time, and he much preferred if you were in a state where you were confident enough to share it with Jake.
As for the said younger male, Heeseung couldn’t tell with the camera in front of his face but by the adorable body language visible for him to see— Jake’s cock that went limp was hard again against his stomach, head leaking with creamy white beads.
It reassured Heeseung that Jake had no plans to run away anytime soon.
Your soaked panties and Heeseung’s pants and briefs were discarded to the floor of the room. Scooching to hover over Heeseung’s lap with your back to him, the said male was fisting his cock with his precum while his other hand grips on your hip.
“Down you go, princess.”
With the swollen tip of his cock probing at your hole, you whimpered as you slowly sank to ease his length into your walls. It took you a few more breaths at the tightness, but the comforting thumb massaging your sides urged you to bottom down to his base, completely sitting on his lap.
“How does that feel, baby?” Heeseung was nibbling at your earlobe, wrapping his arms around your waist as he slowly rocked your tense figure.
You were breathing heavily, and the initial stretch was a bit painful at how big Heeseung was, but soon, the discomfort slowly disintegrated into waves of pleasure as your walls adjusted to his size.
“So, so good— I can feel you deep inside me.” You huffed, clenching around him as a sign for him to move.
Heeseung pulled your back to his chest before he descended to lay on the mattress with you on top of him. The position nudges him deeper as he locks his legs around your knees, thrusting up leisurely as an appetizer for what’s to come.
Jake listens to your soft pitchy moans every time Heeseung moves his hips, getting off to the visual of your hole clenching around your boyfriend’s cock with your legs wide apart for the camera to capture.
A callous hand unconsciously trails to fist his hard cock as Jake jerks to the sound of your ass clapping on Heeseung’s thighs.
The once sensual pace turns heavily ruthless as he relentlessly thrusts up, yet the aching in your wet pussy makes you realize its emptiness as you clench back at Heeseung’s cock.
“Ah-aah— Jake— please…..I need you in me.” You call the younger male out as you pull your outer lips for him to see how desperate and pink your hole is, causing him to freeze at how completely fuck out you were.
His action seemed to garner frustration down the older male’s throat.
“Jake,” Heeseung growled sharply, gripping your waist as he rammed you harder with a dark glare over your shoulder. “Put the camera down and fuck her pussy.”
Jake frantically crawls towards you, the camera thrown on the soft mattress somewhere without a second thought.
A drool dripped down the corner of your mouth, teary eyes watching him align his head to your entrance as he filled you up so deliciously good that it hurt to have your holes simultaneously penetrated.
“Oh my god— yes, Jake— fuck, Hee—“
You choke out incoherently when Jake moves to slam his cock in and out at the same time as Heeseung did without mercy, arching your back as your tits bounce with every impact from both the back and the front.
You feel so full to the core, being fuck out of your mind, that you claw at the bedsheets from the pleasure.
“Dirty slut, one cock is not enough for you, is it?” Heeseung hisses out right below your ears, reaching out to slap your tender clit forcefully.
You cried out in pain, clenching around the girth of their cocks as they ruined your insides roughly. Jake bit the inside of his cheeks, watching from above as Heeseung landed another harsh slap against your clit that you almost lurch forward if he hadn’t forced your hips down.
“Hee—hahhhh— stop—“
“Stop?” Heeseung's laugh was almost sinister, rubbing circles around your tender clit precisely with his thumb as tears streamed down your cheeks, burning with humiliation.
“Fuck, you deserve to be treated like a dumb slut. Letting another man fuck your womb instead of your loving boyfriend.” He snapped.
Your surroundings were starting to blur, disappearing from your spatial consciousness until the pleasure numbed your body to your extremities at the way their cocks were abusing your sensitive walls. You were on the brink of bursting into a million pieces, and Heeseung could tell that you needed one more push to bring you to heaven.
“Jake.” Heeseung held your wrist until his nails dug into the thin skin to stop you from trashing any further.
Jake was stunted out of his mind at his name being called out, especially when he was close to reaching his high. Heeseung gave him a powerful stare down with a gleam of insanity behind those big eyes.
“Slap her clit.”
Jake knew the older male wasn’t asking; it was a direct command for him to carry without question.
Immediately Jake’s eyes went to yours below, only to see it begging with helplessness for him to follow Heeseung’s order. He could recognize the blown-out desire to release yourself from the prison of being edged for so long, and all you ever wanted was to come.
Like he was being bewitched by the couple, Jake felt a click at the back of his mind that he had never felt before in his life— even during his time with endless capturing of the camera, nothing could ever compare to how perfect this moment was.
The sound of his slap on your wet clit erupted you into a fit of moans, your abdomen tensing up before you squirt with your back arched on Heeseung’s sweating chest.
All your liquid drenches him with your sweet scent, spraying his lower half and the bed wet as your body convulses uncontrollably. Your skin was breaking into goosebumps that seemed never ending as Jake and Heeseung filled you with their hot seed blissfully.
It felt like time had stopped momentarily, letting the three enjoy the well-deserved orgasm that tumbled over their senses.
With a hand over your eyes, you were sobbing loudly in the backdrop of their groans, bucking your hips in the air until the last drop of your liquid leaked out.
The limpness of your body urged Jake to pull out, watching his creamy load bubble down to the crack of your asshole so ethereally until it met the white rim that formed as Heeseung lovingly rode you out of your orgasm, his heavy balls drowned with arousal as well.
Soft whispers of praises escape Heeseung’s lips against your ears, stroking your stomach with butterfly touches as he licks your salty tears away at how well you wet the bed for them, hearing your hiccups bounce through the walls.
Jake peeks to rummage around in search of his camera, taking it in his hands as he switches to taking a picture and saving the video content he filmed. He aligns the lens to his eye despite trembling at how heady your scent was sticking to his body.
Snap
He could never get enough of the sight of his artistic muses, all picture-perfect for him to capture.
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KFC breakup.
I’m seeing it from a slightly different perspective which is still kind of aligned with what my thoughts were over what Geto meant when he posed the question:
Are you Gojo Satoru therefore the Strongest? Or are you the Strongest therefore you’re Gojo Satoru?
Was this hinting at how he wanted Gojo to think about who he is, because he cannot be by his side anymore following his choice. Leaving him with this question.
He wished to push him away. Never asked him to leave with him despite needing strength to realise it. Was he intending for Gojo to remain as the Human Satoru, who was the Strongest?
Since he said, “if I were you, this foolish dream would not be impossible”. So he took on the role of what Gojo could’ve done, to do it to the best of his ability, knowing he probably wouldn’t be as strong, but was committed to anyway.
And tried to leave Satoru as the one who could retain humanity? (And he did, trying to realise Geto’s own dreams because Geto did model humanity for Gojo and he made it his own set of morals and philosophy - which he did fulfil as best as he could).
More context:
Spoiler for chapter 261:
I’ll loosely translate:
Yuta says don’t become a monster all on your own, please. Gojo turns much like Geto did in chapter 78.
He then recollects his memory of Geto when Yuta expressed this concern for him, he thought to himself that it was an impossibility to not become a monster on his own. He was left behind then (when Geto left) and then in the white panel, that he has to catch up to him.
I think there is a parallel with how he has decided to proceed with the plan to kill mercilessly. To opt for moral greyness for the sake of his students and their future. Even if it is a future without him.
This is paralleled with what Geto was trying to do. Protect Gojo. Keep him humane. Since, he opted to do what Yuki thought was crazy. Since, he opted to do what he told Gojo not to do at the hideout in retaliation for Riko’s death.
Chasing after Geto could possibly mean he wished to repent for not killing him then and there, but I think it’s more about what Yuta said and the futility of it, with the burden he now bore to fight Sukuna and protect by weatherproofing the future. He had made up his mind like Geto did. Even if he isn’t alive to see it. To try his best for an impossible dream.
He seemed to understand and think about Geto’s motives then, and wished to wield his strength as The Strongest with a solid purpose this time. He would do it to protect those he cared about. He would chase the same dream as Geto. To catch up to him and not be left alone, for this (meaning/purpose) was all he had of his best friend lover all along.
That’s my interpretation anyway. Thoughts?
#jujutsu kaisen#jujutsu kaisen leaks#jujutsu kaisen meta#jujutsu kaisen theories#jujutsu kaisen gojo#jujutsu kaisen spoilers#jujutsu kaisen 261#jjk 261#jjk kfc breakup#jjk satosugu#satosugu#gojo satoru analysis#gojo Satoru#geto suguru analysis#Geto Suguru#stsg#jjk analysis#jjk#jjk spoilers#jjk meta#jjk manga#jjk 78#stsg thoughts#jujutsu kaisen satosugu
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what each of the boys major/minor in
note i have my own version of post covid. it’s an AU and I recognize that. What I’m doing is an AU. so. keep that in mind.
Cartman
Cartman majors in business
i mean-look at how he was in Dikinbaus. He would be really good at business. He’s really good at bribing people to buy his shit
He’s also smarter than people give him credit for. He just has no motivation.
He minors in food science.
I like to headcanon that once Liane realized she was spoiling Cartman she kinda locked in (like she did in HumanCentiPad) and teaches him how to cook.
He actually comes to enjoy it and he seemed to have some knowledge of food science beforehand so
Stan
Animal science major. You can’t convince me otherwise.
He becomes a veterinarian in the future. He works with pets, though he got a job at a zoo at some point (he hates putting animals down)
Hes really gentle with animals. He’s one of those people that thinks dogs are better than people/hj
He minors in biochemistry
I already know some of you are thinking ‘Oh WhY nOt MuSiC?’ but like…realistically I don’t think science and music would really clash together when it comes to jobs
I think he recognizes that. So he does Crimson Dawn on the side when he’s free.
Kyle
This was the toughest ngl
He majors in Psychology
I like to headcanon he becomes a therapist. He likes helping people. Hes compassionate. And no, I don’t wanna hear the ‘Oh He DoeSnT UndErStAnD dEprEsSiOn How CaN hE dO pSycH’ like he was nine at the time
I think he would be the type of person to do research on the side about mental diseases because he wants to learn
And hear me out on this. He originally wanted to major in law. I feel like his dad would be big on ‘having his oldest son carry the family name on’ but Kyle ends up not enjoying it so he drops out
He double minors in political science and philosophy
He seems very high on his morals, so I think he would find interest in philosophy, a place where he can express his moral opinions
And he’s great at debate. So I like to think he would go into political science. Not just because he likes debate but also so he can say he’s ’qualified to talk about this because he’s a minor in political science’
Kenny
Okay okay but imagine Engineer Kenny
He’s creative. He has the ideas. He has the ability. I like to think he worked a lot of odd jobs and got really into building things. And he decided he wanted to do that in his life.
I like to think he’s actually really smart. He just doesn’t really have the best home situation so he isn’t given as many opportunities as he would’ve liked.
Although I also like to think that he would buckle down in high school and actually gets into the top five for his class. He applies to pretty good schools and gets a near full ride for some of them. But anyway, I’m yapping too much
As for a minor, he, like Kyle, double minors. in accounting and math.
He wants to make sure nobody has economic issues like he had. And he has a leg up in what he does because he’s dealt with money his whole life practically.
He’s fairly good at math. Plus he’s already got a leg up, like I said.
ahe really pushes himself in college to become someone who can help people who were in the same situations as him. So he works hard and actually does good.
#south park#skipper speaks#eric cartman#stan marsh#kyle broflovski#kenny mccormick#south park headcanons#south park college au#college au#eric cartman headcanons#stan marsh headcanons#kyle broflovski headcanons#kenny mccormick headcanons
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Sunday apologist here, I lvoe this man. He is def off the rails but I think a lot of people in the fandom seem to ignore that he is doing what he thinks is morally right to protect others! I think at one point he was a kind person, truly and fully, but life twisted him into who he is now, theres hints at him doing what he does because he thinks only he should have to live with burdens. Anyways yandere sunday def would gaslight you and control you, you're his pretty and weak darling after all <3
I think his philosophy is very fascinating! Contrasted with Robin's, who believes that birds (people) should fly freely no matter what, Sunday wants to protect and shelter others because he knows that they are destined to fall to their deaths. "Not everyone really has a future" is such an interesting perspective considering the entire point of the Dreamscape is to provide a future for its inhabitants, even if it's mostly an idyllic escape from reality. Sunday's philosophy revolves around the concept of a caged bird and that, though it may be weak and unable to protect itself, it can still live if sheltered behind bars.
"I want it to live no matter what." But then that's at the cost of the bird's freedom, as it must now forsake the vastness of the sky in which it rightfully belongs.
I'm rambling, but I also agree that he was probably a sweet person in the beginning. When we learn a little about the inner workings of his mind, it's that flashback with the Charmony Dove. Perhaps his intentions of caging the bird really were inherently pure (as he was much younger then), but as he grows up those intentions will naturally grow alongside him. They just happened to shape themselves into a very crooked ideal, which is why he's so very paranoid and controlling and meticulous. If the Dreamscape is the cage and its inhabitants are all birds, then Sunday is the one who watches over and protects them. Almost like a god (hehe). He's omniscient in the way that he keeps a watchful eye on everyone and everything, and the people put their trust in him and look to him almost reverently (the confessional scene........ WOW), as one might a god.
Perhaps it's an incorrect reading of his character, as I've yet to fully finish Penacony, but these are my current thoughts. :D now onto more deranged thoughts.........
I LOVE HIM. I LOVE HIM SO MUCH. AAAAAAA OTL when hsr was cooking him, they put some sort of drug in him because I am hopelessly addicted. orz don't even get me started on all of the religious references in his character design. I am frothing at the mouth,,,,, he really is so perfect.... he would absolutely gaslight and control you,,, you're like that Charmony Dove in his eyes, feeble and frail, unable to fly without the risk of crashing to your death. He must cage you. It's to keep you safe!!! He just wants you to be happy; he'll take on every single one of your burdens if it means you can live blissfully unaware, forever wrapped in the embrace of a sweet dream.
#honkai chit chat#i reached the confessional part and screamed#he was quite literally made for me#i thought it was over when i saw rollo#sunday is like that but ten times worse orz#the fact that he used to have a big sweet tooth... that he would steal robin's desserts when he was little#SUNDAY YOU ARE EVERYTHING TO ME#'i shall ascend to the heavens' please take me with you <3
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John Kramer and The Denlon's
Cracks everything in my body. It's time to yap. I keep going on in many posts about the fact John is just as flawed as those he tries to ''better'', so I want to go over one of my main comparisons in a tad more depth than I have before. John Kramer and Jeff Denlon honestly are very similar when it comes to their backstory and need for revenge due to grief. Even though John always states that he tests people so they become grateful for being alive- It's very obvious in some cases, he's doing it for his own type of gratification too. For example, Cecil Adams who caused Jill Tuck to miscarry and then Cecilia Pederson who scammed John. He didn't put these people in traps just because of his philosophy, but because they were also very ''close to home'' for him.
The loss of a child is very integral to both John and Jeff's character. Both of these men crave justice.... However, the way they want it and how they achieve it isn't exactly the most healthy thing. It leads both of them to neglect their partners, Jill and Lynn. (Just took a break to eat leftover spaghetti I am legit lost in the sauce- I don't plan out these little rants I do, so I just go where rambling takes me.) When it comes to the major differences between them, Jeff is more rage fuelled, at least in how he carries himself. His anger manifests more verbally and physically than John- Which is his downfall, alongside him not listening or acting when needed. This is a bit of a reach, but another thought nonetheless and nothing I say needs to be something I'm 100% on anyway. Danica Scott, the only other witness to Dylan's death didn't cause Jeff's son's demise, however her lack of action and fleeing the scene made her someone Jeff would want to take revenge upon anyway.
Amanda, although she had more involvement with Gideon's death, seeing as she was the one to convince Cecil to rob the clinic, didn't take physical action either. However, outside of her just being a drug addict- It is debated whether or not John always knew about her role in Jill Tuck's miscarriage, another reason for her to be tested.
We've also got basic comparisons such as the fact Jill and Lynn are both in the medical field and having mentioned Lynn again? Her demeanour is more like John than anybody else I have brought up in this post I'd say- I can't really word well why I think that, but it's there anyway. (Another thing to add is how in Saw 3, John in his delirious state starts getting confused and thinking Lynn is Jill.)
Might as well slip some others thoughts in here too whilst I'm fucking rambling this much- I don't have too many complex thoughts on Jeff Denlon I guess, I basically seem him as an example within the Saw universe about a person who cannot let go enough that it results in his trauma and vengeance taking over his life and ending it too. He's not a evil or terrible man, just very flawed. He had some of the physically easiest traps in the franchise to complete, but because he never made an effort to heal and instead remained stagnant within his grief... He takes too long to take action and morally flip flops all over the place when it comes to what decision he'll make- It's that or he doesn't assess the long term consequences of things such as never forgiving. I personally don't think he ever has to forgive someone like Timothy Young- However, I do believe he let's it impact his life and those around him too much. Corbett didn't deserve the neglect she faced and she herself is a child grieving her sibling. Grief and forgiveness are very hard topics to navigate, but I honestly as a viewer felt the most bad for Corbett more so than Jeff or even Lynn. Coming back to Lynn, I believe she ''learnt'' the most or at least came to terms with things faster within her trap than Jeff. She didn't have time to dwell or not be fast paced with her choices, because her life was connected to John's. She was doing her best not only to stay alive, but to get back to her family even if it was dysfunctional. (Me when I come back to this in my drafts weeks later, time to attempt to find the wave length I was on whilst doing this before.) It's an interesting though to picture different people in other traps. For example, if Lynn was going through Jeff's test. Would she have reacted faster than him and made clear cut decisions? Could she forgive? Jeff is no medical professional and his rage wouldn't let him care for John to the best of his ability so we know he'd fumble that, which is why I'm more so focused on Lynn in his test. Lynn's grief is more ''subtle'' compared to Jeff's and as an audience it's hard to pinpoint what her thoughts and opinions of those involved with her sons death would've been. She turned to antidepressants and her fractured marriage led her to having an affair, not to mention the child neglect. But when it comes down to it, we don't see as much as a drive for revenge and justice within Lynn as we do Jeff. This would mainly come down to screen time, setting and general context but it's an interesting thought of how she'd handle someone like Danica or Timothy if they were right in front of her.
This is why I say she learnt the most from her test compared to Jeff in his? After everything she went through with Amanda constantly up her ass and power drilling through a guys skull- All Lynn wanted was to reunite with her family. Like, the only time we see Lynn exert full physical violence is in a deleted scene where she attacks Amanda.... And even then that is because she wants the key for her collar more so than a drive to murder the other woman. On all accounts, she actually won that scuffle as well.
But then for example Jeff when he finally encounters John? He just can't help himself! Lynn literally is on the floor bleeding out, reaching for him not to leave and this man just can't NOT go and fulfil his need for vengeance. He'd literally just acted upon it before too by shooting Amanda, though that is more understandable giving the context of the fact she shot Lynn..... I think overall this is why so many people dislike Jeff but they just can't word it? Like he's been dubbed ''slow ass motherfucking Jeff''- But it's not really the speed of execution, it's either the lack of long term critical thinking and or the fact he's indecisive? Jeff doesn't have the weight of a contraption around his neck and or his life truly on the line like his wife.... However, somehow Lynn is still managing her test better than him with a freaky little lesbian on her ass and doing backhouse brain surgery on some random old dude with a fucking power drill. I'll also bring up the fact that like John and Jeff, Mark Hoffman has a pretty similar drive and motive to the both of these men. Just like how Jeff saw his sons death, Mark saw the aftermath of his sisters murder for example. All three of them feel justified in their actions against those who have wronged them and etc....
And as I always bring up in character studies like these, the perceptions from the audience are so interesting- Especially when you start comparing characters. It will come as no surprise when I say, I am a pretty active Tumblr user... Through this? The interactions with media and popularity of characters from Saw on this platform are decently clear. First I'll get it out the way that screen time plays a big role in making characters fan favourites. Although, Adam is a subversion to this as he's only in one movie (alive) and likely the most popular Saw character- Anyway! Using John, Jeff and Mark as examples here still... As previously stated, these three men can be considered quite alike in some aspects! But our perceptions of them are quite different due to how they're presented and what we know about them. John is an older sickly man, his life being cut short by the fact he has terminal cancer. His wife miscarries and later on then becomes ex-wife and then also somewhere down the line he gets scammed by a fake cancer treatment....All in all? Dude's kinda got fucked over. But what I haven't mentioned yet in this brief is the fact that whilst most of this is going on, peepaw is designing elaborate death traps and testing people in them slash indoctrinating some into his fuckass ideology! He as a character get's quite a neutral response and or a 50/50 split? He's Jigsaw, the face of the franchise.... There is a decent amount to discuss in regards to him. However, when it all comes down to it it I wouldn’t say he’s favoured as much as other characters.
Moving to Jeff, he witnessed his own son get killed in a hit and run and the grief and injustice of that basically made him spiral into neglecting himself but also his family. He cannot move forward from the loss of Dylan and this is why during his test he is so slow to act- I think one thing to mention here too, is this is something John likely accounted for. Jeff’s test is designed for him and the challenge isn’t that of " OH CUT YOU ARM” it’s for him to overcome his grief and to choose whether to forgive or let those involved with Dylan’s passing die. It’s easy for us as viewers behind the screen to think that he could’ve done almost everything faster. But we’re not Jeff. It’s shown time and time again mentally he just cannot move on and the only reason he is making progress though the test is due to its nature, average therapy? Jeff just wouldn’t go because he refuses to confront HIMSELF in regards to his own grief and would rather wallow in fantasies of revenge.
Mark Hoffman? Obviously the case I’ll bring up with him is that of his sister's murder. Angelina is his only close relative, with no other mention of Mark’s family in the franchise really. So, when she is killed in a case of domestic violence and he also sees her dead body? Yeah, that’s certainly the kind of thing to fuck someone up mentally. Which is why Mark then developed a drinking problem to cope and started to display more erratic behaviour such as shooting a man three times who’d actually surrendered beforehand…. By the time Seth Baxter his sister's killer is released from prison via a technicality- Mark has no quarrels with taking his revenge via abducting him and placing him in a Jigsaw like trap. However, as we all know, this trap is by no means escapable and is only being used by Mark as a scapegoat to get away with murdering Seth. This act then kickstarts his life as an apprentice for John when he himself is abducted.
(I legit forgot this was in my drafts- Months later. I’ll post this now even if it’s not really complete…)
#jeff denlon#john kramer#lynn denlon#jill tuck#danica scott#amanda young#dylan denlon#corbett denlon#timothy young#mark hoffman#angelina acomb#saw#saw study#character study#saw franchise#saw movies#sawposting
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It's not that NMJ doesn't understand what going undercover means.
I think what some people get wrong about the nieyao conflict specifically in regards to the wen spy thing is that they assume nie mingjue doesn't believe in or understand that someone can do a morally wrong thing because it's in the interest of the greater good. And while I totally get why that's the conclusion people come to, because "it was wrong but necessary" is the key to SO many of Meng Yao's actions and Mingjue's refusal to accept that as a justification is at the heart of the nieyao conflict. But I... don't think it's that he doesn't understand or accept that it can be necessary to do something wrong. I think he knows that very well. It's just that he thinks that, even if it was necessary, you still have to face the consequences of that wrong action.
He, in fact, shows just that, and that he still applies that rule to himself, in the very chapter this conflict stands central.
Yes yes Evi talks about the "very well I'll kill myself after I kill you" quote, must be a day ending in y. Anyway. What nie mingjue is saying here is that he will do something wrong (killing meng yao, which is wrong becuase meng yao saved his life and he owes him a life debt) but which he considers to be necessary (Meng yao killed his men and worked for wen ruohan, which makes him a danger to the cultivation world) but that doesn't make the act less wrong and he must still face the consequences (since he owes him a life debt, that's death) hence: murder-suicide.
This also explains why, when he is eventually told meng yao was spying, he no longer wants to kill meng yao, but still doesn't trust him. If meng yao was a spy, he's not dangerous to other people, and killing him isn't necessary (he will be moved back into the "necessary" category in a few years time, but for now he's not) but he doesn't forgive him. Because on some level he still believes that, even if meng yao was doing it for a greater good, he still shouldn't fully escape the consequences of killing so many people for wen ruohan. It was still wrong.
It's not a personal philosophy I agree with, but I do think it's important to understand the nuanced difference between "you can never do something wrong for the greater good/ because you had no other choice" and "you can do something wrong for the greater good, and in fact it might be your moral obligation to, but this does not exempt you of consequences" because assuming the former might lead you to believe that Nie mingjue thinks all of his own actions (or ones he plans or tries to take) are right. When in fact, Nie Mingjue is quite willing to do the "wrong" thing if it's necessary, he just thinks those actions should be owned up to.
Its part of my larger read of his character as someone who is not so much taken with righteousness (like his reputation says) as he is with balance. With things being owned up to and paid back. Which is, I think, an important distinction to make.
If you have read my other post specifically about how I think meng yao very much considers his own actions to be wrong and finds himself to be morally accountable but doesn't think he should be punished for them, and think "hey wow it sounds like those are diametrically opposed worldviews on the nature of punishment" then congratulations! you win!!
#this comes in play with his condemnation of the wen siblings too#which i think should illustrate even to those who do not like jgy why this attitude can be harmful#mdzs#mdzs meta#meta#nie mingjue#and oh sure i'll tag a-yao too#jin guangyao#meng yao#any post i make about either of them is always gonna be at least a little bit about the other one
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