#anti traviss

[mysticaltora8276]

"So how do we justify what we are doing now? Breeding men without choice, and without freedom, to fight and die for us? When do the means justify the end? Where is our society heading? What are our ideals, and what are we without them? If we give in to expedience this way, where do we draw the line between ourselves and those we find unacceptably evil? I have no answer, Master. Do you?"

Padawan Bardan Jusik to the Jedi Council

Okay break down time

1. "So how do we justify what we are doing now? Breeding men without choice, and without freedom, to fight and die for us?" They didn't. The Sith instigated that........The Jedi know this. Jusik did you just ignore history? Or for that matter the entirity of Obi-Wan's mission. Oh right she hates Obi....

2. "When do the means justify the end? Where is our society heading? What are our ideals, and what are we without them? If we give in to expedience this way, where do we draw the line between ourselves and those we find unacceptably evil? I have no answer, Master. Do you?" Funny considering later on your fine with an abuser and someone who murders civilians for expediency.........Yeah shut up Jusik.

[mysticaltora8276]

Oh, you had to bring in that woman’s work. Let’s not get into the fact that she tried to rewrite the galaxy as of the Jedi were the “elites.“ Which they weren’t and basically throughout a lot of anti-religion stuff and stuff that could be considered xenophobic, as well as racist and misogynistic, as well as worshiping the people who had previously been shown to be nothing more than war murderers, who were so bad that the Republic had to preemptively strike and glass their planet to make them stop going on murderous Crusades that dragged the entire galaxy into war. Not to mention the fact that they ended up worshiping war as the concept itself and were perfectly OK with committing various genocides…

Then this author had the absolute nerve to portray the Jedi is somehow worse than them. She kept going on and on about how they’re mean to the clones, but all she showed were clones that she personally crafted into being her main character “exemplary” father’s slaves. He literally starts a cult, and they automatically go to him with no choice whatsoever, and no discussion given the fact that the man essentially formed a cult of a personality.

As for the rest of the authors, they were OK to varying degrees. Some were bad like Traviss. Scratch that. She was probably the worst. Others were slightly incompetent like Jude Watson. Yes I read a multitude of her books, but in hindsight, I realized that a lot of the misconceptions about the Jedi order came from her. And that’s not getting into the other expanded universe authors, who decided to put their own spin on it, whether it lined up with a canon or not. So that’s kind of why I look back on the EU particularly anything written before attack of the clones just kind of rubs me wrong. It just seems like that they had a problem with a religious order and they took it out on the Jedi. Constantly saying that they were “wrong.“ Which they weren’t. At all. Again, aside from Traviss I’ll give them credit for at least portraying them as victims as opposed to Karen Traviss, who literally had one of her characters that is supposedly the morally righteous one basically say “well they deserve it.“ Piss off Karen Traviss

I really dislike it when anti-Jedi and Jedi-critical crowd uses EU books as a prove for their points. Why they’re all wrong:

a) The books were written by various people who didn’t consult George Lucas about what they’re going to write. Everyone understood SW as they did. When an original author has never claimed such art as canon and actually refused it – this is a definition of fanfiction, isn’t it? Paid, yes, but fanfiction nonetheless.

b) Most of these books were created way before PT. They didn’t know about the Jedi things what we know now. It becomes quite hypocritical – I mean, in the EU the clones were enemies, not allies, but somehow I don’t see any claims ‘but the clones are enemies! The EU says so!’. Even in Karen Traviss books not all the clones have a personality, but we all ignore it now, aren’t we? She wrote her books before the TCW, not knowing how the series would spin the story. So EU retcon works for the clones, but not for the Jedi?

[mandalorianhistorian]

expanded universe mando females vs Disney Mando females a short post on actual diverse women vs lazily written my thoughts

(little reminder EU mando culture was written by a women and disneys and clone wars was written by a man)

what makes a mandalorian women in the expanded universe

calling A mandalorian woman, weak or small, is a huge insult to them, so start running if you can. Mandalorian women come in all kinds of ways, human, alien, any shape, height, etc., but for them, strength, honor, and loyalty are of the utmost regard. Mandalorian women do the same as their fellow men, equal in all parts of Mandalorian life. Women of the Manda can raise children adopted or born by themselves or with a partner. Mando women do look after their home wherever the nomads may travel next and raise their kids, but that responsibility isn't just for women; their partner must always help, regardless of species or sex. Mandalorian women are feared by many, especially by their own brothers. Mandalorian men are not scared by many things, but Mandalorian women terrify them Deeply. Mandalorian women in Mando society and culture are the same as the men. We have many moments in the books, games, and comics with amazing women. There are too many to name, but the most known would be Shae Vizla, Mirta gev, Rav Bralor, Parja Bralor. The stories that have these women are amazingly written by many authors but mainly Karen traviss.

why the Disney mandalorian women are not the same as EU mando women

the mandalorian women of Disney do not have the same values or honor as the EU mandalorians instead they seem to have a system that has royalty and hierarchy which was never present in the EU and lets not forget Disney seems to have death watch and the pacifists as the main vocal point when in the EU we have many different groups but Disney mandao women seem to have no value of equality and work. When we do see them they seem angry bitter hostile and just nasty to mandalorian men and the main one we have seen the most is bo katan and by god that women is not fit to be a mandalorian apparently shes the princess which is like how on earth do nomads go to that but that's a topic for another day but it seems Disney has also forgotten alien mandalorian women we see quit a few in the expanded universe. it really just baffles me how terrible their female mandos are. Mandalorian culture has been diverse, and they took it 50 steps back in modern Disney star wars.

difference in Armour non gendered and gendered

The armor in Mandalorian culture is shaped in many ways, but men and women do not have a certain design fixated on them in the expanded universe; they can share the same look or wear any design armor shape, Kama cloak jetpack with their armor, or any other add-on they want for themselves.

expanded universe Armour

the armor of the EU Yes, there is way more in SWTOR, so many helmets and gear, but men and women both wear them; there is no special so-called lady armor for female Mandalorians.

Disney Armour

For Disney Mandalorian women, they seem to all have the same helmet design; however, it is only seen on female Mandalorians putting on a gendered look, which is utterly silly for this culture.

thanks for reading :3 this is just my view as i grew up with Karen traviss writing and work so seeing it destroyed just makes me sad so these are just my quick thoughts.

[mysticaltora8276]

Want a clone deserter done right? Howser, Rex, Cody and the Bad Batch are an excellent example of clone deserters done right. They choose what they wanted to do and quite a few of them fought against the Empire and then did what they liked…not indoctrination into a cult.

So in conclusion not the Nulls

[mysticaltora8276]

But Skirata exploits the Nulls mental illness for his own gain so yes it is ableism.

— Is “psycho” a slur? —

My easiest answer to this question: ASK IF A REAL PERSON IS OKAY TO BE CALLED A PSYCHO. If not, then you are not calling the person with ASPD, BPD, or any other PD a psycho.

Listen to the people with personality disorders, not the people who claim they are allys so they call everything ableist that can hurt our pretty sensitive disabled heart. There is a chance that someone is made the label their own. And someone is not okay with it. No, you don't make a fucking a poll where everyone can vote, and even the neighbours cat can puke on the reblog button. YOU TALK TO A REAL PERSON, YOU ASK. End of story.

Personality disorders and especially Antisocial Personality Disorder are often associated to “being a psycho”.

And you especially met with this term in RepComm while reading.

“EWWWW REPCOMM AND KAREN TRAVISS AND KAL SKIRATA IS FUCKIGN ABLEIST DON’T READ IT OR YOU’LL BECOME ABLEIST YOURSE-“

When I mention TODAY to someone that I have personality disorder, people are being like: okay and you are eating that with fork or spoon?

You call out ableism because you heard it somewhere that being called a psycho is ableist, and calling out ableism gives you browney points on tumblr.

“Psycho” is not a slur. Sometimes not even the self-diagnosed psyhopaths know about the existence of the term of ASPD (that's how personality disorders are not in every speech!!!), they just now that something is wrong, because they always hit walls around people. Psycho or sociopath was the closest that you could name this condition in the early 2000's.

Nulls being called a psycho is not Kal Skirata’s elaborate trick to enslave the nulls or whatever the fuck anti-kal people comes up with. People with pd-s are mostly self-aware. Being always fucking self-aware is why we know that we don’t fit in.

Someone with personality disorder is extremely important to be self-aware, that's why name-erasing, mental-health erasing cause more harm. You don't say shit like to a pd that "you are completely normal, there is nothing wrong with you, carry on" because the next time we actually do something mentally ill™, you will be the first to call us "fucking psychos".

(yeah. I know. so much we, and them, and us, like I'm one with ASPD too, I'm trying to figure if I have more personality disorder than BPD, and probably have.)

In this age where everything is within reach via internet, people truly forget that media is accessible written by different generations, and when I see younger people engaging with the Republic Commando series TODAY in 2024 with today’s tumblr sensitivity standards, I think: vod. Are you aware that the first book came out in 2004, TWENTY YEARS AGO? The accessibility to everything is great but it totally messes up the ability to see TIME CONTEXT. And this time blindness can truly mess up communication between different generations too, causing rifts and we end up invalidating other’s experiences if we are not careful.

“But there were more progressive books even before 2004” - Probably. Only we didn’t have an entire library of progressive labels of genders, sexuality, phobias and MENTAL ILLNESSES AND CONDITIONS.

Not in everyday speech. If no one talks about it, you won't know the concept. You don't know how to ask questions aside from "what's wrong with me?"

WATCH OUT! SLURS INCOMING!!!!

In the early 2000’s and before if your teachers hated you, your parents weren’t educated (or just didn’t care), or your parents themselves never got proper treatment for their neurodivergency, there is chance that YOU ALSO didn’t have a chance to get a proper diagnosis for different types of neurodivergency as a child.

children with dyscalculia were called lazy.

children with dyslexia were called retards who can't even read.

children who were fine playing alone were the weird ones.

autistic people? You mean rain man? Or those braindead retards shitting themselves and throwing fits and should have been euthanized if their parents had any love for them? Oh no you are not autistic, stop being oversensitive to noises and shit and people bullying you for your special interests is not bullying, they are just trying to involve you sweetheart.

ADHD? Problem children with behavior issues.

Antisocial Personality Disorder? Psychos. Problem children. HOOLIGANS. DEVIANTS.

Sounds familiar? No? Then I am truly happy for you.

People like to use this quote to prove that the Nulls didn’t have mental illnesses, it’s just Kal who spread the rumors about them, and the Nulls weren’t more than your ordinary bad behaving children. Because Vau is an outsider, therefore more reliable and objective narrator about the Nulls and because fuckkalskirataingeneral. Yeah. Sure. But we are talking about Walon Vau.

Walon “my father beat the living shit out of me as a child but I turned out fine” Vau.

These kind of abused people In real life with the exact same mentality tell you that you don’t have a problem, you are just oversensitive. You don’t need therapy, you just have to man up. Don’t take pills because pills are for pussies. YOU DON’T HAVE MENTAL ILLNESS, YOU ARE JUST A BAD CHILD. Generational trauma is fucking shit and affects everybody.

Walon Vau alone deserves a separate post about his non-existent mental health. And Sev, now that he was mentioned here. Sev is especially heartbreaking, seeing how Nulls as psychos are treated, and how Sev as a psycho is treated in the books.

This blurb is born from the thought that the Nulls are having Antisocial Personality Disorder and I’ve come to this conclusion because they are constantly called psychos, the most common label people used for this kind of behavior patterns they show throughout the series.

ASPD or Antisocial Personality Disorder and the usage of this name is encouraged in scientific circles because the symptoms and traits of psychopathy can’t be measured objectively anymore. Psychopathy is a neurological/hormonal condition, but no longer its own sickness, because other non-related disorders, diseases and illnesses can mimic the symptoms of psychopathy for eg.: DEMENTIA.

If you ever wonder how can a 80 years old person who never showed any sign of aggression before just go and brutally kill their neighbor for a sole treebranch hanging over the fence and littering the garden with leaves, there is a chance that something is not alright in the brain anymore.

Emotions developed healthy with healthy self-restraints and and self-control will not let you do socially unacceptable things like killing to solve problems, just because your brain tells you: BASH THEIR FUCKING SKULL WITH A ROCK.

Every emotional response are hormones and neurotransmitters in work. Brain is responsible to give the appropriate response to each situation we are facing. If you have hormonal problems, or neurological conditions, different brain structure than a neurotypical people, there is a chance, that these responses are not working as they are intended, you will have different or more extreme emotional responses to things, or not having at all.

So that is why we don’t use the terms of psychopath today as an individual sickness, because PSYCHOPATHY ITSELF IS A SYMPTOM of various conditions! People with psychopathy, the “psychos” are usually on the spectrum of ASPD.

So again, repeat after me like I'm Dora the explorer who put you on gunpoint:

ASK IF A REAL PERSON WITH ASPD IS OKAY WITH BEING CALLED A PSYCHO. IF NOT, YOU DON'T CALL THE PERSON PSYCHO. END OF STORY.

[lieutenant-teach]

Trying Karen Traviss 'Republic Commando' (critical)

I’ve read loads of criticism on Karen Traviss ‘Republic Commando’ books. Despite being weaponized with knowledge of her treatment of Jedi and Mandalorians, decided to read anyway, because clones! Though I’m in the camps of ‘anti-Mandoclones’ and ‘pro-jedi’, and from my previous reading experience I know my whole being protests when I see even an ounce of Jedi-criticism both in books and fics, I still thought – maybe, at least the plot will be interesting? And clones!

Well… I lasted about 10 pages (was reading from an e-book, so it’s hard to tell) of the first novel of the series, ‘Hard contact’.

I’d even ignore anti-Jedi stuff that starts from the very beginning – as if I would believe the Jedi would treat the clones as ‘created for war, so they must be used for war’.

First thing that started to turn me off – the treatment of common clones, ‘regs’. The main characters immediately began to smell disgustingly like The Bad Batch. They have special training, they see each other as ‘family’ – unlike these regular clones! They are even treated poorly by the ‘regs’, poor things! :(

The second – the language. A lot of Mando’a words that are referenced in the end of the book. Thanks to fics, I know several terms, but in next books I scrolled through – whole incomprehensible dialogues in Mando’a! Seriously?! 1st, technically uncomfortable, 2nd – disrespect to the readers.

And the main reason that made me delete all these books – it’s written boringly. Plain boringly. I guess it’s just her journalist-influenced style, but still – one more reason not to read her.

[roseaesynstylae]

Star Wars: Republic Commando: Triple Zero, Chapter 2

"'I think your sergeant should be leaving all that to Coruscant Security,' said Captain Maze, who clearly didn't understand the situation well enough.

Typical ordinary ARC. Typical stubborn ARC."

You are really one to talk about stubbornness. Not, to be honest, that Maze comes across as particularly stubborn in this situation.

Also, hi, Maze! You're one of the characters in this series that I like (that aren't problematic faves) and who isn't ruined.

"Maze squared up. 'Look, Null, I don't know who your sergeant thinks he is, but you obey a general when he --'

'I don't have time for this.' Ordo brought his fist up hard and without warning right under Maze's chin, knocking him against the wall. The man swore and didn't go down, so Ordo hit him again, this time in the nose -- always demoralizing enough to stop someone dead, but nothing seriously damaging, nothing to cause lasting pain. He would never harm a brother if he could help it. 'And I only take orders from Kal Skirata.'

Jusik and Ordo sprinted the rest of the way to the speeder to make up lost time.

'Ordo...'

'Yes?'

'Ordo, you just flattened an ARC trooper.'

'He was delaying us.'

'But you hit him. Twice.'

'Not permanent harm done,' Ordo said, lifting his kama to slide over the pillion seat behind Jusik. He sealed his helmet. 'You can't convince Alpha ARCs of anything by rational argument. They're every bit as obtuse and impulsive as Fett, believe me.'"

Okay. In order.

Maze immediately zoomed to the top of my RepComm characters' list. Who does Kal Skirata think he is?

Only taking orders from Kal Skirata is one of the Nulls' biggest flaws. This may be shocking, dear, but the man is not always right. In fact, as the series goes on, we will see that he is wrong about a lot of things.

"Can't convince Alpha ARCs of anything by rational argument?' I think that applies to you.

In conclusion, Ordo, prove yourself better than your father and learn to be quiet.

(I want to like Ordo. Like, a lot. But he isn't making a great first impression.)

"'General, do you remember being taken from your parents?'"

Before I say anything else, I will direct this to Ordo: SHUT UP. I AM TRYING TO LIKE YOU. YOU ARE NOT HELPING.

Okay, first, that is really insensitive. Even putting aside the Jedi-Bashing, you don't just say that to someone. It isn't a question that will make him come to terms with himself (although in this series...), it's a question that makes you look like an asshole.

"Taken?" Taken implies kidnapping. Taken implies stealing. I will be dissecting this in a future chapter (which also involves Ordo), but for now, I will just say this.

JEDI ARE NOT BABY-STEALERS.

I swear, I am going to tattoo this on Kal Skirata's forehead so he has to see it whenever he looks in the mirror.

Jedi-Bashing: 5

"'No, I remember being taken from my family. Just being taken. Not my family though.'

'And what makes you so attached to us?' Ordo chose his words carefully, knowing precisely what attachment meant to a Jedi. He knew the answer anyway. 'And doesn't that worry you?'

Jusik paused for a moment and then turned with an anxious smile. Jedi weren't supposed to feel powerful emotions like vengeance or love or hate. Ordo could now see that conflict on the boy's face daily."

*Deep, deep, deep breaths*

Okay.

Now that I've had my first proper rage, I will merely say a few edifying comments.

Attachment is not love.

Attachment in Star Wars is not a good thing.

There needs to be a flashing neon sign saying the above in every Star Wars writer's office.

I don't believe I need to say anything else.

Jedi-Bashing: 8

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal Ordo: 2

"'Save your sympathy for the troopers,' Ordo said. 'Nobody uses us.'"

No one uses them, either. Not the way you put it anyway. Go ahead, tell Rex or Cody or Wolffe they're being used.

I dare you.

"'I'll be cautious,' Jusik said, meshing his fingers in front of him to do that little Jedi bow that Ordo found fascinating. Sometimes Jusik was one of the boys, and sometimes he was ancient, wisely sober, another creature entirely."

Jedi-Bashing: 10

"'Fifteen dead.' Skirata clearly didn't care about civilian casualties, traffic disruption, or structural damage."

If it was anyone else, any other writer, any other book, I wouldn't be too bothered by this. But given Kal Skirata's track record...

Jedi-Bashing: 8

Mando-Shilling: 1

It's a Man's World: 1

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal: 2

Deltas, Move Out: 0

Mird, My Beloved: 0

Is This The Bad Batch?: 2

Main Post

This is the second chapter, people. Second chapter, and I've raged like the Hulk and wanted to strangle a character I literally just met (something that usually only happens with Kal Skirata). I'm trying to be fair and give everyone a fair shake, but this... Maybe it'll get better.

[blenderbender1811]

Fanfic: Did you ever hear of the Tragedy of Etain Tur-Mukan?

Me: No. Enlighten me.

Fanfic: She was a Jedi who fell in love with and married a clone, but she died in Order 66.

Me: Awww! That sounds sweet! And tragic! I'd like to see that. Was her husband forced to kill her or something?

Wookieepedia: She was killed when she jumped between some clones and some teenage/kid Padawans.

Me: Oh, cool, so she died a hero?

Wookieepedia: She did it to defend the clones.

Me: To....defend the CLONES? In ORDER 66? The time when clones were committing mass genocide??? Against HER CULTURE?

Wookieepedia: That'd be the ones!

Me: ....Okay, so, nothing of value was lost with her dying, got it. Who wrote this???

Me: Oh. I see. Her tragedy was being written by Karen Traviss. Fair enough, fandom, fair enough.

[mysticaltora8276]

“I didn’t realize they had names.” What the hell are you talking about kid? They had names because of the Jedi Order.

““they don’t know what life is like.” What the hell? Who the hell says that aside from mouthpieces that this author thinks is OK to express her opinions through.

“All they know is war so they’re probably perfectly happy.” no Jedi no matter the rank would be saying this. This is something an uninformed civilian would say or separatist.

“I’m glad they don’t suffer.” Again no Jedi order person talks like this. And I’m sorry everybody has to suffer through this and sufferably stupid quote.

Traviss! Get your grimy fingers out of these Padawans!

She writes every Jedi like this btw

[phoenixyfriend]

Is Karin Travis the reason I keep seeing people who think that the Clones had any attachment to Mandalorian culture?

Uhhh, possibly? I think most Mando'a comes from her Republic Commando books, at least.

[blackkatmagic]

I have a baseline level of annoyance directed at Karen Traviss that exists at all times, but I am so annoyed at her 3-4 million clones estimation and how it's just turned into the fandom's canon. Like, the gffa is massive! Does she have any concept of space/numbers??? Because there were 70 million soldiers fighting in WWII alone, and if you multiply that by multiple worlds and multiple fronts and whole sectors of space with dozens or hundred of planets, 3-4 million people fighting across all of that territory is laughable, even if they are all technically supersoldiers. And that doesn't even account for losses, when we know from canon that there were losses of over 30k soldiers in a single day.

Just. The lack of logic is infuriating. Traviss pulled that number out of her ass, and fandom just rolling with it makes no sense if you think about it for even a few seconds.

[mysticaltora8276]

I found a quote for the Republic commando series where Scout the Jedi youngling who is well-known getting the wrestling matches. Who wasn’t afraid to get her hands dirty is suddenly appalled that the Star Wars equivalent of soccer might have……female players….Traviss get OUT!

[mysticaltora8276]

Skirata they did ask. And in Legends some left the Order as Jedi as conscientious objectors and the Order respected that. Some left the Order all together and again that was respected. In canon they didn’t even get that chance to form a splinter group due to the freaking Senate. And what’s this about dissing freaking children?! Piss. Off. Skirata.

Star Wars: Republic Commando: Triple Zero, Chapter 4

"Mereel was on Kamino. If Zey was heard to mutter that the Nulls were Skirata's private army, he wasn't entirely wrong."

You say that like it's a good thing.

"'I never said good-bye to the lads who didn't come back, that's all. I lost nine out of my batch.'

'But the last time you saw them, you left them feeling confident, respected, and loved. That's enough for any buir to achieve.'"

*narrows eyes* *with a remarkable amount of spite* I fucking doubt that calling them "wet-droids" made them feel loved. Just because you're constantly licking daddy's boots doesn't mean everyone else does.

Okay, that was going a little far. But everyone talking about this asshole like he's the ideal parent makes me want to throw something across the room. Hard. And repeatedly.

"'Have you met Sergeant Kal yet?'

'No.' Kal was always there for Darman, somewhere, even at times like this when she wanted to say so much to him.'

'Darman beamed, clearly delighted. 'Oh, you'll like him, General. You'll really like him.'

Etain certainly hoped so. And if she didn't, then she'd try, for Darman's sake."

*beaming smile* I'll just list things off, shall I?

"Even at times like this when she wanted to say so much to him." Etain, I want to say so much to him as well. It isn't what you want to say, though. It's a bit more...profane.

"You'll really like him." I've been getting a look into this man's mind for the past few chapters. I don't fucking like him. I actually prefer Walon Vau, since he's at least open about the fact that he's an asshole.

"And if she didn't, then she'd try, for Darman's sake." I could not try. It would end in an attempted strangulation.

"Vau was settled in one of the deeply upholstered hide chairs with the strill draped across his lap on its back, all six of its legs flopping in an undignified sprawl while he scratched its belly. Its huge fanged mouth was slack, tongue lolling, and a long skein of drool hung almost to the floor. Its body was a meter long, lengthened by a whip of a tail covered in more loose skin.

The strill was still prettier than Vau, though. The man had a long square-jawed face that was all bone and frown lines, and graying hair cut brutally short. Faces rarely lied about the soul within."

MIRD!!

PRECIOUS BABY!!

Oh, yeah, and its human servant. Great to see him too.

Who is the most adorable little killing machine?! It's you~

Mird, My Beloved: 1

"'The Jedi Council is pretty adept at turning blind eyes,' Skirata said. 'For an organization that knew it was taking on an army with an assassination capability, you do send out conflicting signals to simple soldiers like me.'

Vau was watching like a man being mildly amused by a holovid. The strill yawned with a thin, high-pitched whine."

Mird, My Beloved: 2

*sourly* I'm glad someone is amused by this.

"'We didn't even know we had an army until a year ago.'

'Maybe, but the fact that you're sitting here now with a general's rank means you've accepted responsibility for it. You could have objected, collectively or individually. You could have asked questions. But no. You picked up the blaster you found on the floor and you just fired it to defend yourself. Expedience ambushes you in the end.'"

*in the most fake nice way imaginable* Fuck. You.

Lemme just break this down a little...

"You could have objected, collectively or individually."

They did.

"You could have asked questions."

They did.

The problem isn't that the Jedi didn't try to find a way to object or that they didn't try to investigate. The problem is that the Separatists were actively attacking, the Senate wanted a war, and Palpatine had manipulated everything so they had no other choice. They took the role of Generals and Commanders because they felt that it was the best way to prevent excessive casualties and lessen suffering.

But, no. It's all the Jedi's fault. It isn't that they're a group that was not and never has been intended for a military position who have just been forced into this role. It isn't that they're trying to keep to their principles in the middle of a situation they are not meant for. It isn't that the chaos of the war made it so that trying to object or figure out what the hell was going on impossible.

In conclusion...

WHY DON'T YOU ASK JEDI WHAT THEY FEEL ABOUT THE SITUATION AND WHAT THEY DID? THEY'D TALK TO YOU. THEY'RE NICE, REASONABLE PEOPLE. I"M SURE THAT YOU'D LEARN A LOT MORE IF YOU HAD AN ACTUAL CONVERSATION INSTEAD OF RANTING ABOUT A GROUP OF PEOPLE YOU BARELY KNOW.

Jedi-Bashing: 7

"'Oh no, I'm just a civilian now,' Vau said. The strill rumbled. Vau, apparently distracted, fondled its ghastly, stinking head, his slightly narrowed eyes revealing a doting affection that he never seemed to spare for any other living creature."

I'm going to make this clear right now: I like Vau considerably more than Skirata. 80% of that affection comes from Mird.

Mird, My Beloved: 3

"'How far is too far, Kal? Can you answer that? How far did you go?' Vau called after him. 'I made that boy a warrior. Without me, he wouldn't be alive today.'

With him, Ordo thought, Atin very nearly wasn't."

Vau's training methods are a discussion for another time.

(I still prefer him to Skirata. Like I said, Vau's open about the fact that he's a bastard, unlike some people.)

"It was delightful to see the mix of armor -- yellow-striped commanders and pilots, plain white troopers, and the motley mix of commando colors -- drawn together in one ancient Mandalorian ritual, every face the same.

Etain felt adrift, excluded.

She had never truly felt this degree of bond with her Jedi clan. The connection in the Force was there, yes, but....no, the real strength here was attachment, passion, identity, meaning."

Attachment is not love. Attachment is not a good thing. Passion is not a good thing for a Jedi. I am explaining this in small words for the author's benefit.

Also, nice shit you just took on the Jedi's Youngling Clans.

(Don't fucking insult the Jedi Younglings. They're adorable and have done nothing wrong, ever.)

Given the fixation on (relatively nuclear and standard by sci-fi standards) families in this series, this really feels like a jab at the "fact" that *extremely mocking voice* ThE JedI DOn'T HAve FaMilIEs.

Jedi-Bashing: 9

That's it. I'm exhausted by this series' bullshit and it's only been one chapter. Thankfully, I have a vacation coming up where I can ignore these books and concentrate on actually good Star Wars content. Once I'm done decompressing, I'll be ranting about this again.

Jedi-Bashing: 9

Mando-Shilling: 1

It's a Man's World: 1

Shut the Fuck Up, Kal: 1

Deltas, Move Out: 4

Mird, My Beloved: 3

Is This The Bad Batch?: 2

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[toaarcan]

Hi, hey there, did you know that the whole "Jedi can deflect blasters so Mandalorians used solid-shot weapons to kill them because blocking a bullet with a lightsaber just results in molten metal spraying the Jedi" meme is actually bullshit?

Like, first thing you have to know about that lore is that it was written by Karen Traviss. Traviss is fairly infamous for writing a shitton of military wank and really hating the Jedi, portraying them as cruel, cold, fascist idiots, who are much, much lamer than the cool Mandalorians, who are badass military types and definitely haven't carried out multiple genocides in the past (they have). She was also known for not exactly playing ball with other writers, and ultimately ragequit the franchise when TCW started to include Mandalorians and portrayed them differently. This was not a detail that basically any other writer in anything Star Wars ever actually backs up.

And like, here's the thing... this exists.

That's a Jedi using the Force to deflect bullets with her bare hand.

This is Tutaminis. And/or Force Deflection, it's not really clear whether they're the same thing or not. It's a pretty standard Force ability that a bunch of characters have demonstrated. Obi-Wan blocks both bullets and a flamethrower with it in the 03 Clone Wars microseries. It's how Yoda catches and redirects Force Lightning during his duels with Dooku in Attack of the Clones and Palpatine in Revenge of the Sith. It's how Vader absorbs Han's shots with his hand in The Empire Strikes Back.

It's also evident from the amount of times that the Mandalorians fight the Jedi with normal blasters instead of breaking out their "anti-Jedi" weapons for their ancient enemies. And the fact that the Mandalorians lost their wars against the Jedi.

If solid-shot guns/slugthrowers were the amazing anti-Jedi weapons that totally always worked against Jedi, then we'd see a lot more slugthrowers and a lot fewer Jedi. We see the CIS' Droid armies fight against the Jedi for three years, we see the Clones being designed from the get-go to kill the Jedi at the end of the war and being highly successful at it, we see the Empire hunting Jedi for the next 19 years and the rest of the Galactic Civil War after that, and y'know what they have in common? None of them use slugthrowers. They all just keep using blasters.

The answer to "How to kill a Jedi" equation has traditionally been depicted as "Use more blasters than they can actually physically deflect."

There's also the detail that Jedi are precognitive space wizards who can move with superhuman speed. If you're actually in range to shoot one with a gun, they'll sense you, evade or block with the Force, close the gap before you can chamber the next round, and revoke your Hand Privileges.

Even the "You'll kill them with a spray of molten metal from the melted bullet!" thing doesn't actually track with what we see on-screen. At the climax of Revenge of the Sith, we see Obi-Wan and Vader fight in the middle of an active volcano. They get splashed with showers of lava a couple of times, and at the end of the fight, both of their clothes are scorched and burned from the embers. Obi-Wan continues to wear his charred robes throughout the rest of the movie. And he's fine. No lava burns. Neither of them actually gets hurt by the lava until Obi-Wan cuts Vader's limbs off and he can no longer move or protect himself, and even then, Vader survives getting burned to a crisp by being really fucking mad about it.

So yeah, it's nonsense. A dumb "Hurr, Jedi are so lame and my unproblematic genocidal warrior race could totally kill them super-easy" take written by Star Wars' own version of Ken Penders.

[mysticaltora8276]

“Everyone knows that intel's about as reliable as a Weequay quay bail[?]. But that doesn't mean it doesn't have its uses. Sometimes it's the lies and myths that tell you everything you need to know”

OK, what is with Karen Traviss and making weekly some sort of a stand for Black people consider the only one she shows is a rapist? Seriously she seems to make them into a standard for Black people.

[starbeltconstellation]

No matter how I look at it, I get the feeling that Lesyle Headland is racist against Asians. Seeing all those characters portrayed by Asian people get mistreated horribly makes me very uncomfortable because I'm Asian myself, and I've been through that multiple times during my life. I'm not the only one who thinks that. I saw there are a couple of other people who think that Lesyle Headland is against Asians too. Kathleen Kennedy keeps pointing out the racism in the fandom, yet she ignores the racism that she HERSELF and her co-workers are doing, and that includes Lesyle Headland! Why did Star Wars now have to be in the hands of a Western company where they keep mistreating Asian characters and Asian people??? Now, with what happened in Sol in the finale, the SW fandom is going to be even more racist and spout more BS against Asians now. I'm tired af of all the hatred towards my people! Both Asians and the Jedi deserve better!!!

Hello, dear anon. ❤️

Firstly, I just want to DEEPLY apologize for the long wait in my response. 😅💔���� I try not to get behind on asks, but life has been crazy for me at the moment, and especially with longer asks like yours, I really want to take my time and give a good and in depth response.

And yesssss! 👏👏 Speak your truth, dear anon! 😖✊

I will be honest and say that my view—while I HEAVILY dislike LH’s writing morals and style (and just the whole concept of The Acolyte show in general being some ‘girl power fantasy’ for women when the Dark Side is anything but that and is nothing but weighted chains tying you to the ocean floor to drown)—was more charitable at first where I know in my SOUL if I ever met this woman that we probably would not be able to get along if we talked about SW fandom lore too much. And I can accept that! 😂

Not everyone will like or agree with each other. At least she’s not as bad as Karen Traviss, because dear GOD I have recently just learned about the petty hatred that woman has towards the Jedi (with a WORD FOR WORD line of a character in her books EXPLICITLY saying the Jedi Order deserved their genocide! 🤢), and I KNOWWW I would dislike that woman if I met her on the street. I can acknowledge the incredible feat she accomplished with developing Mando’a, while still maintaining that she seems like a very mean spirited person to be around), and it is literally nauseating in the most highly disgusting and disturbing way.

KT is basically a rapid and foaming at the mouth Jedi anti who believes they “got what was coming to them.🤢🥶” LH on the other hand (at least in HER head), views herself as Jedi CRITICAL. And while there is a little bit of a difference there, it’s not as stark a line as fans would try to convince us pro Jedi’s to believe.

There are plenty of fair criticisms about the Jedi that I can acknowledge: the Shimi thing, for one, which is I think just a bad symptom of GL’s writing being more “metaphorical” than literal. Shimi HAS to stay on Tatooine because Anakin eventually HAS to murder the Tuskens in cold blood so GL can tell the story he wants to tell of how Anakin can’t let go, and so the Jedi are never given the opportunity to do what I truly BELIEVE they would’ve done, which is go back and free her, at least for the peace of mind of one of their newest initiate. The plot literally physically bars them from doing so.

And even THIS is not without its flaws, because they would ONLY have wiggle room to free Shimi after the heat of TPM problems had died down where they had time to do so… while walking past/avoiding eye contact with all of Shimi’s slave neighbors, because as specified before—The Jedi have no jurisdiction in the Outer Rim, and you bet your ass if they freed all those slaves and started a war with the Hutts with their little 10,000 strong army, the Republic would take one look and go “Lol, good luck with that,” and not help them at all, which would be basically suicide for the Order to try and accomplish on abolishment of slavery on the Outer Rim all on their own in the TRILLIONS of people in the galaxy. They do not have the MAN POWER for that. Not without the Senate army/clones.

People want the Jedi to do something about it? Get on the Senate’s ass about it then—the REAL people who are responsible for all of the shit going wrong in the Outer Rim while they line their pockets and kiss up to clueless galactic citizens for votes come election time. THEY are the ones that should be responsible for the problems of an ENTIRE galaxy—not a small little minority group (which I’ve already come to realize that the Jedi are. They are a culture/religion/family, and 10,000 is but a drop in the ocean of the galaxy. They are so small in the grand scheme of things that it’s SCARY when considering how easy it was for Palpatine to lead them to almost total annihilation) that try and try and TRY as hard as they can, which is apparently somehow NEVER enough, for the galactic citizens AND the SW fandom itself.

And why is that? Why is it so HARD for SW fandom to relate to them? Why does LH (who I’m sure in her head BELIEVES she’s as progressive as they come) view the Jedi as some type of “space cops” who are “oppressing 🙄” the Sith as a representation of her religious trauma that she is clearly projecting onto them as something completely separate than what the Jedi Culture actually is? Why does she view them as “emotionally repressed” and “almost catholic-like”, and views the fucking SITH (literal SPACE NAZIS 😭🤦‍♀️) as a representation for her persecution as a gay woman?

It’s because—just like MOST SW fans in the US—she cannot fathom a culture outside of the lens of western philosophy. In her mind, the Jedi aren’t a “real 🙄🤢” family. In HER mind, the Jedi aren’t necessarily evil, but she still believes those “poor little culty Jedi 😔💔🙄” didn’t see they were ‘sewing their own destruction’. (Which is blaming them. It’s BLAMING the victims of genocide, and it’s to this day the most disgusting thing I will always remember about the show’s “your actions will cause the destruction of every Jedi in the galaxy” quote that made Twitter go wild with genocide apologia galore).

Some lovely examples! 😁🙃🙃

Disgusting Example 1:

Disgusting Example 2:

Disgusting Example 3:

Disgusting Example 4: REALLY YIKES. 🥶

Disgusting Example 5: Ahhh, would you look at that? We’ve made it into good ol’ ✨dehumanization✨. 🙃🙃🤢

ALL of those examples are not a small portion of the fandom. They are the MAJORITY. This is what the MAJORITY of the fandom truly deep in their hearts believe about the Jedi and their culture and way of life, even if they won’t word it as bluntly as those commenters did out loud.

THIS is what I believe LH’s beliefs regarding the Jedi’s non-western culture is like. She thinks she’s being “fair”, because hey! I made you like Jecki and Yord, didn’t I? 😘😘😘

… And then mere episodes later, she throws the rug out from under you in having Quimir (who she has ADMITTED in interviews is basically her mouthpiece for her own personal thoughts on SW) dehumanize not just Jecki and Yord by saying they were “incapable of going deeper to care about Osha like she deserves 🤢🙄🥶”, but also just by dehumanizing the Jedi in general. It becomes CLEAR in the final episodes that everything was meant to lead up to Osha and Quimir meeting (because they’re clearly Reylo 2.0, and this was LH’s way of getting to smash her Barbie dolls together), which basically gives a feeling of hollowness to the entire backdrop of the show—because the rest of the characters ARE a backdrop to them. She FAKES THE AUDIENCE OUT by pretending to humanize Sol as someone repentant, teasing the possibility of him and Osha being able to talk things out, before swiftly turning him into a one-dimensional caricature of himself who seems to have done a complete 180 on his remorse, only for the sheer purpose of him and Osha not being able to have a conversation. You may say, “Oh, but the show is an unreliable narrator! 🤪🤪🤪”

Except… no, it’s really not. 😭🤦‍♀️ Especially with the way LH spells out that she AGREES with Quimir’s philosophy, she AGREES with that asshole Senator treating the Jedi like shit who are “corrupt/emotionally repressed space monks”, she AGREES with Oshamir fans’s interpretations that the finale of turning to the Dark Side is a TRIUMPH for Osha instead of a heartbreaking moment that will lead to only ruin.

And it’s because—just like most western fans—she just doesn’t even WANT or CARE to understand the eastern philosophy of the Jedi’s culture, and instead projects her feelings from no doubt sympathetic trauma onto something that has no true basis for it. She views something that doesn’t have the “passion” of the Sith’s ‘love 🙄’ as lesser than. She doesn’t really view them as a family, because she only believes in a more standard family dynamic, and instead views them as an institution that “brought everything on themselves. 🥶”

And… honestly? I think you’re basically RIGHT, anon. I don’t think it’s truly this big CONSCIOUS thing. I don’t think she wrote out Sol’s death for the sheer purpose of “Muah-ha-ha”-ing over Asian fans losing some of the honestly most MEMORABLE and AMAZING representation they’ve had in YEARS in the very franchise that borrows from their own culture and philosophy. But I DO think she doesn’t view it as something worth considering. Oshamir is where her mind was at at the end of the day (because ROMANTIC love is something she clearly views as the most important and powerful thing, because OSHAMIR is who stand together at the end. Not Osha or her sister), and I think any other storyline factors became all but insignificant to her in the grand scheme of things. It was easy to kill all of the Jedi characters, because the “new fave” was here—the Sith. And to be fair, his hotness drew in a lot of buzz! But the cancellation and the renew the series petition signatures I think show the gap in how many people were truly interested going forward that weren’t reylo 2.0 fans. Yeah, a lot of people are into villains. But even MORE people want to root for their heros. The Jedi are supposed to be the heroes of SW, and such a show PURPOSELY and VINDICTIVELY portraying them in the worst way possible (the EMPATHETIC SPACE MONKS covered up a massacre? REALLY? 😭🤦‍♀️) throws more people off than LH would like to believe.

The way she killed Sol… it was brutal. And in interviews, she says some bullshit like Sol was “taking away Osha’s agency” by forgiving her and telling her it was okay. Because the portrayal of the Jedi in this show isn’t just “showing their flaws! 🤪🤪🤪” It is purposely writing them in a way that they’ve NEVER been shown to act on screen before—all to make the villain sympathetic, because LH clearly has adopted the thinking (much as radical Anakin fans have), that because someone has become a villain, then SOMEONE must’ve forced their hand. But that’s not how all true three dimensional characters WORK. Yes, there are tragic characters whose circumstances make things worse, but the idea that a villain is always “misunderstood” creates the narrative that the HERO is somehow in the wrong. LH does this because both Osha and Quimir are her new OCs. She makes the Jedi almost completely OOC and portrays them as oppressive to JUSTIFY Quimir and Osha’s actions. Because THIS is what The Acolyte was about: giving Reylo 2.0 a happy ending.

There has been criticism from fans that Jecki and Yord were killed too early which only gave fans an “awww ☹️💔” feeling, because they barely had the chance to even solidify into real characters to make the audience sob and cry at their loss. And I would argue this thinking is right. Because if you look CLOSELY at the background, you can see how it all was just a hollow backdrop for LH’s “dark romance” idea. And I’m not saying such an idea was BAD—I’m saying it wasn’t originally marketed that way. Sol is marketed as the main character (representing Asians in a fantastic way), and then she brutally kills him off, because he was never REALLY important to LH’s story. None of the Jedi were. She was always more interested in the Sith. And so, she tries to make the Sith the “oppressed 🙃🙄”. And I would argue she fails at this with the larger audience, even if loud fans of reylo are chanting about it on tumblr and twitter. The viewership is lower than expected for the show (and part of that is because of the horrible racism and campaign against it from SW dudebros). But honestly, I think a part of it is just… what’s left? Everyone except Osha and Quimir are dead. Sol was brutally murdered on his knees (one of the best Asian representation I’ve seen in a while in SW) like he was nothing but garbage. The Jedi lost, and apparently LH has also character assassinated Vernestra by what she does in the finale, if the character’s fans huffing on tumblr are anything to go by (which is TOTALLY within their right to feel disappointed and angry over an aroace character being treated by the narrative like she and the culture she believes in have ‘no emotion or empathy’ 🥶🤢. There’s that good ol’ ✨dehumanization✨ kicking in again, huh?)

THIS is what SW has apparently decayed into. Into being vindictive and petty and blaming victims for their own persecution and pain. It’s a sign of a self involved culture, which is what the USA/the west is, I’ll admit. Other countries are collectivist. We are individualists. (ie; “I got mine.”) People ENJOY these tales of flipping everything around to blame the heroes and not the villains, because they SEE themselves in villains like Anakin or Kylo Ren or Osha and Quimir. And look—there’s nothing wrong with seeing yourself in a villain and even with sympathizing with them! Anakin’s past as a slave no doubt makes him very much deserving of empathy in that regard.

But the problem is—since they SEE themselves in the villain—then they don’t want the villain to be in the wrong (ie; Anakin). Because if the VILLAIN is in the wrong, then they TOO can also be in the wrong, and a lot of people don’t like to grapple with that. I have seen a recent post going around from someone I was pretty disappointed with that switched sides from pro jedi into anti jedi territory so vindictively and quickly (do NOT attack this person if you know who I’m talking about. I am bringing this up for the sheer purpose of meta. Not to pettily call them out or something), who was responding to an ask where the asker was thanking this person in basically defending Anakin by excusing his actions. The anon said they related heavily to Anakin, and apparently hated recent posts going around which call Anakin out on his behavior, because the anon and this person both believe that the criticism is meant to be vindictive and cruel, when that is rarely the case.

This is where the “Anakin was bullied by The Council/Mace/Obi-Wan” excuses come in. Because Obi-Wan gently offers CONSTRUCTIVE criticism at times, he is somehow viewed as someone who never truly respected or understood Anakin as a person. Because the Council didn’t worship the ground Anakin walked on and didn’t just let him get away with things without a sometimes gentle/firm reprimand, they are somehow viewed as people who have been out to get Anakin and ‘didn’t trust him’ since he was a child. Because Mace butted heads with Anakin at times because they had different opinions on how to be a good Jedi and in their battle strategies on the war, Mace is somehow the most petty and worst man alive who has been “jealous” of Anakin his whole life.

All of these above excuses—in the most nicest way I can state possible—sound like the platitudes that children tell themselves against parents who they’re angry at. This is WHY Anakin went to Palpatine; because Palpatine always told him “Yes.”

And believe it or not?

Sometimes being told “no” isn’t the end of the world or means people hate you.

Sometimes you’re a good person who made a mistake, and just need to be called out to get back on the right track.

Accountability.

LH apparently believes in none of this for her characters. The backstory crafted for Osha and Quirmir clearly shows that. It’s meant to ABSOLVE them.

Funny how the JEDI (the ones based off of Asian inspired culture in certain areas) aren’t given the same courtesy, huh? 🙃🙃

This is why the pro jedi fanfic I’m writing is free therapy. Loooool. 😂❤️

In conclusion—yessss, I think you’re pretty on the mark in a certain type of way, anon, even if we both have a little bit of a charitable gap for LH between the two of us.

I apologize for the late reply again! 😭❤️❤️❤️❤️ I hope the wait was worth it!

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To any readers that stumble across this and are curious enough to check out my fic:

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