#anti jayvik shippers

[coye]

How hard is it to use the right damn tags? If you’re criticizing a ship or character, the least you can do is tag it under anti Sky or anti Skyvik so people know what they’re walking into. I read this as Skyvik and Sky hate, and I’m not the only one. Just because you mention Sky or Skyvik doesn’t mean your post comes across as neutral, let alone positive. Shippers and stans are obviously going to read it as negative. What’s so difficult about using anti tags? If I made a post calling Jayvik brothers and questioning how anyone could ship it, then tagged it as Jayvik, people would rightfully be annoyed. It’s the same thing.

[stromblessed]

jayvik shippers need to understand that non-jayvik shippers are annoyed with you not because of not shipping jayvik, but because there is no escaping you.

you clog every tag on every social media platform. want to look at caitvi? jayvik posts tagged as caitvi for some reason. want to look at viktor posts? jayvik. jayce posts? jayvik. want to look at mel posts? jayvik. anyone talking about mel and viktor in the same sentence is obviously secretly talking about jayvik. (and by the way here's why every mel scene is secretly about jayvik and every viktor scene is secretly about how all he thinks about is jayce and why mel is inferior and jayce was a good boy and was right all along). you dominate the discourse and don't give room for criticism of jayce or viktor's writing and don't tolerate other interpretations. every theme in the show was about jayvik all along.

on my main blog, i write fic and make arcane posts - not complaining, staying in my lane, making my own content for me and my friends - and my tags, comments, and replies are full of people talking about jayvik and asking about jayvik when the ship is not tagged or present in my posts or fics, and jayce usually isn't even tagged because i just don't have fun with him as a character right now, and all people want to talk about or comment on is him or jayvik. so here i am, venting on my sideblog

this is a curse i specifically bear and cannot escape because as a fan of the writing of these aforementioned characters SEPARATELY, any and every algorithm is gonna shovel piles of jayvik posts 10 feet deep right up against my front door, and everyone on tumblr is "tagging for visibility" or whatever so there's no escaping it here either. blocking and muting does not help because either jayvik isn't always tagged, or jayvik is tagged at random and i end up hiding swathes of posts i actually do want to see. and there is also the fact that i WOULD be into jayvik because i do think it's fun, i WOULD have more fun discussing jayce specifically as a character who i think is a very fun hot mess, if social media wasn't making me despise both with a burning passion right now, which sucks

the only haven is Ao3 because people are still slightly sane when tagging their fics - at least with the relationship tags. jayvik shippers you do need to stop tagging mel though along with any other character who doesn't affect the plot of your story and i am dead serious

this is a vent post but i am also declaring - the reason why people are frustrated and annoyed at jayvik at large, as a concept, even if you yourself are a chill shipper and you don't see why we all can't just get along, is because the collective has poisoned the well and it's not fun for other people to be in the same space as you right now. there are a lot of you - be glad of that and happy, not every fandom let alone ship gets this large and energetic a following - but don't be surprised that people like me are gonna be mad because. it is irritating. and you're everywhere. and unfortunately there's nothing that any one person can do about it. it is an environmental thing and you just. need to come to terms and be aware, idk

[k3n-dyll]

Y'know what, I really was trying to take a break from ranting about Arcane but shit keeps pissing me off and twitters format doesn't let a bitch rant like she wants to.

I'm sick and fucking tired of white queer people acting as if they're the only ones that are underrepresented in media. Like actually get a fucking grip on reality. I keep seeing people say that MelJay doesn't count as rep because "it's straight" as if that is not a direct representation of a dark skinned black woman being loved and cared for without needing to fight tooth and nail for it. As if that isn't an interracial couple that doesn't have a white person in it for fucking once. As if Jayce isn't a Latino coded man.

Straight white people have a fuck ton of representation, sure, but let's be fucking for real, out of all the people in the LGBTQ+ community that need more representation, white queer people are not at the top of the list. Y'all get most of it actually! Y'all have me on the internet fighting for my life about a straight ship because y'all can't stop for two fucking seconds to think about anyone that isn't fucking you!

"I think Mel is sapphic though!" - And a good chunk of the time the account has not shit about Mel on it. It's just a JayVik shipper using it as an excuse to completely shove her aside.

"She deserves better than a man"...they don't live in a patriarchy bookie. Jayce is not some misogynistic asshole from the real world, he's flawed for sure, but he's not treating Mel like she's inferior to him. He loves her and she does in fact deserve someone that loves her. If that person happens to be a man then so fucking be it. Not to mention...'she deserves better than a man' but you're ultimately using it as an excuse to...ship two men together? Oh okay...

EDIT: Real quick - I dont really wanna hear about how you 'just prefer gay ships' babe. I prefer sapphic ships. That doesn't take away from what I said. Actually, it just makes me feel like you're trying to deflect from the topic at hand rather than just listening and shutting the fuck up and I can't promise my reply to that is going to be particularly kind <3

[rosenr0tten]

“Mel doesn’t deserve the hate”

YES

“I mean without her we wouldn’t have Jayvik 🥰 She made Jayce realize his true feelings 🥺”

NO

[midnightcatharsis]

"JaYvIk sHipPers aRe tOxiC" - don't make me laugh. Reed (Ekko's VA) tweeted "canon" about jayvik and the members of the "totally not problematic, totally not toxic" (extremely toxic) meljay fandom started calling him slurs as well as calling him a "coon" and "corny attention whore". All these over liking not their ship. I bet if it was their ship instead they would love it. It shouldn't have surprised me, considering Toks (Mel's VA) was also insulted numerous times for liking the ship, and real people have been harassed by them for pointing out parallels between Mel and Viktor that btw were later reblogged and confirmed by an official lol account or for hoping there will be some jayce and viktor (not even jayvik :p) content in the future series. Apparently pointing out obvious parallels is hate and racism but insulting and harassing a POC for liking a ship is not.

Anyway below are some examples. Unfortunately, there are way more on the Internet 😞 I must say I especially "loved" that one person "reminding people to be respectful" while calling Reed a weak, embarrassing disappointment for liking a ship...

[sukibenders]

Some in the Arcane fandom think they are being helpful when, regarding Mel having romantic relationships, they say "She's a strong, independent woman who doesn't need a (in this case) man", but they really aren't. Even if they don't mean to, or were being genuine, the statement is still riddled with many undertones because the "Strong Black Woman" trope is often placed on so many black female characters to often deny them the opportunity of love and care and protection that they, in fiction and real life, are often not given or given right off the bat in comparison to their counterparts, to the point where they don't even get the choice either, as well as to push them aside.

It's not even a compliment because, oftentimes, when this term/trope is used, it doesn't even take into account the amount of stress it takes to be strong, let alone strong and alone. Another thing, which also makes it very backhanded, this trope really rears its head regarding Mel from a lot of JayVik fans, some who I will give benefit of doubt while others know exactly what they are doing. Using this term to brush off the fact that, whether you ship them or not, Mel and Jayce shared a bond with one another and she would obviously be saddened to hear of his demise (unless some of you are still running with the trope of her being heartless or just like Ambessa, and even that loses weight when you see Ambessa call Mel her literal weakness). Like, apply this to real life, why would you automatically assume that a black woman doesn't need love just because she's strong? Why do you think she doesn't need to be held or consoled? Why don't you think black girls and women want to see black female characters who are, not only, strong and have power, but also loved and cherished in the same breath?

To add on, there's this trend in fandom of labeling a female character as a "girlboss" or "queen" or just any of these terms, but not doing/adding anything else to her character besides "She's strong!" but will write 1000 word essays on the male characters within the same media. Do you see the problem here? This happens with Mel so much to the point where people don't even know who she is as a character. People (specifically toxic shippers) said that she's just like Ambessa, but the show went out of its way to show you again and again why she is not. Or did you just ignore it/watch with your eyes closed?

[thebloodredraven]

Not adding to whatever asinine Mel hate that exists, but I need to say that not liking her as a character or person because she's a classist, opportunistic, and manipulative Piltovian politician is a valid take.

(seriously, Elora being like "you're literally the richest person in all of piltover, and Mel being like "but I'm the POOREST medarda :(" like girl fuck off people are dying lmao)

Completely erasing, her canon relationship (romantic or friends with benefits, or whatever) with Jayce just because you ship JayVik -- or making her a third wheel ALL THE TIME -- is a choice rooted in something that probably needs to be unpacked.

A lot of y'all are falling into the rhetoric that allows the disposable Black girlfriend trope to exist and I wish she got the same grace and nuance that Jayce and Viktor are given.

[multifandomhellhole]

I rarely say my takes unprompted but I genuinely can't stand modern fandom and need to scream into the void over it to thug it out.

it genuinely feels like fandom is in its gen alpha age of regression. I've noticed this heavily with other fandoms, for me I've seen it most in resident evil but now I'm seeing it in arcane too of ship wars being taken WAAAAY to seriously and just everything in general being surrounded by weird purity culture. Not to mention someone always trying to find some deep controversial reason into why you don't like a popular character or treating it like it's a direct attack. That weird portion can be left in 2020 with kinnies and IRL character shit.

What really pisses me off is that people especially on twitter, scream for fandom culture to be back, but the slightest mary sue, terrible animatic, out of character x reader, large age gap, weird fanfic, horrible but fun take, insensitive joke about a well loved character, and/or rare pair art gets crucified there. And y'all wonder why fandom is dead. Genuinely who wants to provide any material for an ungrateful bible thumping community and a hostile one at that? Or one that's so obsessed with canon.

Fandom etiquette is absolutely dead on any other website minus this one and even then I'm seeing some popular tweets that erase the fun of it here on Tumblr for some reason. Since I'm focused on arcane right now I'll be using that as an example. So what if people want to think jinx and Jayce would be friends? That doesn't mean they didn't understand the show or are less superior watchers to you. That means they don't have a stick up their ass. Who cares If someone makes a Viktor coughing joke? He does in fact cough a lot and it's placement can be funny. You are not morally ascended cause you didn't laugh at pixels fictional lung cancer. In fact you are morally shity for telling someone to kill themselves for joking about it.

Who cares if someone ships cait and Maddie over vi or vi with maddie. Or cait with ambessa or Viktor with sky or Viktor with silco. Literally the world kept spinning. Genuinely who gives a fuck it's an animated show about league not a real time war documentary 💀 Creepypasta literally turned a bunch of murders into a found family let's not forget how being delusional makes fandom more fun.

Like I said, Unfortunately since Im in an arcane place of focus this post will be using arcane examples but this does apply to every fandom.

[dangerousdan-dan]

Do you ship Jayvik?????

Hi!

I really like the ship!!! And I 100% respect and understand the romantic interpretation of their relationship.

HOWEVER

As an aromantic person, I'll always be against the "there's not a platonic explanation for x behavior" (pls let's remember that platonic relationships can be just as deep and meaningful as any other!!!), and so I also really like the platonic soulmates interpretation of their relationship.

I find both interpretations beautiful and valid, and I enjoy both in their own way. To be completely honest, I think the fandom war between these different perspectives is stupid and annoying af.

Different interpretations of a single source can exist and make sense within the source material!

Proof of this is that we still do academic work of texts like Othello and Don Quixote (two texts that have been analyzed for YEARS from a hundred different angles and given all the interpretations imaginable), and yet we still find new and different things to say about them :)

[esp-resso]

and if i said im really starting to dislike jayvik due to their shippers? then what?

[moonsdancer]

This.

And I'm not gonna stand by and let people re-write fandom history. Some of us were out here in the streets, fighting for our lives, trying to get people to even SEE Mel as a character in her own right instead of just an obstacle to fanon yaoi. Most people in a certain corner of the fandom were baying for her blood all of last season and the intervening years. They were excited at the thought that she'd be dead and Jayce would forget about her and idk, go ride off into the sunset with his science bro.

Almost all the discourse about her was shallow at best, with people only willing to see her as an evil (but oh so pretty) manipulative bitch (a pretty one, don't forget because her looks are all that matters!) despite the show carefully threading her characterisation in each episode to show (amongst other things): her thoughtfulness, compassion, political acumen, her love of progress and supporting Jayce and Viktor's dreams of bringing magic to the masses, childhood trauma, mother angst, grief, desire to improve the lives of people in direct contrast to her family's colonising conquering ways, her sensuality, her sexuality, her desire for intimacy, her artistry, her openness to love again set in direct contrast to her mother in the first ep Ambessa appears, her magical superpowers (which were showcased most starkly in the final scene of season one although many people kept telling us that her armour tinkling and lighting up was just some random light reflecting on her back??????) and much MORE.

Mel was ALWAYS this complex and fascinating, the whole point of a STORY is to give it time to be told, and to peel away the layers. Viewers could do this for Silco or Singed or really any other character.

But Mel was not granted even this simple courtesy by a good chunk of the fandom. And there are reasons for that. One of them being misogynoir and the incapacity of some to appreciate and empathise with characters of a certain skin tone because they've been trained by real life and other media not to. And another being toxic yaoi fandom shipping especially when a Black woman is seen as an obstacle.

Either way, I will not forget the shit some people were saying on every platform. And that some are still saying. The North remembers.

Going into the tag and seeing people talk about how nice and compassionate Mel is this season, as opposed to last season when she was manipulative and hated Viktor like. You guys can just admit you were wrong about her. You guys can just recognize that she explicitly said she wanted to prevent war and help people and you all were already on another, more tired narrative so you ignored her. You guys can acknowledge how race and gender played into the fandom’s consensus about Mel and Viktor, even after Mel’s VA directly said Mel liked and respected him. You can do it. I believe in you.

[stromblessed]

What makes me crazy about Arcane season 2 is that, if you watch only the final episode of season 2, there is nothing wrong with this interpretation of the themes or of Viktor's character. It is, obviously, a beautiful - if simple - sentiment that we all love to see in stories. And Viktor shown as the unloved misunderstood villain next to Jayce's unquestionably heroic narrative and forgiving heart supports this statement, as well as feeding the fire of jay//vik shippers.

This is assuming that season 2, and the final act of season 2 in particular, was written as a proper continuation and conclusion to the whole of Arcane. Which it was not.

Season 1 Viktor is pursuing change and "evolution" at first because he loves science and wants to help the undercity, and then later, because he is dying. He doesn't want to die without leaving behind a legacy. He doesn't want to die, period. What does that have to do with him not feeling loved? Interpreting Viktor's attempts to survive and his desire for legacy and success as "wrong" or something he should not have done instead of seeking love in Jayce or Sky flattens his character and moves him away from the themes of tragedy, progress, technology, and the gray area that exists between heroism and villainy, and makes season 1 less coherent.

You can take the season 2 finale and retroactively apply "Viktor wasn't loved enough/didn't understand love" to season 1 and sort of season 2 acts 1 and 2, but this involves imagining scenes and dialogue to fill in what wasn't written in season 1. It is not present in the text.

What is present in the text in season 1 is the class struggle. How Viktor is shafted in Piltover compared to Jayce. And how Jayce does not understand how Viktor is being shafted, nor how Viktor feels about that or Jayce's involvement in that imbalance. Viktor's one solitary attempt to reach out to Jayce and tell him what he's up to is nipped in the bud by Viktor himself because of Jayce's prejudice and the threat he poses by wielding power he doesn't know how to use - a microcosm of the threat Piltover poses to the undercity on a daily basis. The rift between them grows throughout season 1 as a result, culminating in Jayce's frankly inadvisable and rushed efforts to make changes between Piltover and Zaun that are ultimately futile anyway, and result in all of Jayce's fears and prejudices against the undercity being tragically and unfortunately validated anyway. Which does not carry through to season 2 at all, but that's for another post.

What is present in the text in season 2 acts 1 and 2 is... not much, if we're being honest. Viktor leaves Piltover because Jayce crossed multiple lines. Probably including the fact that Hextech is being weaponized (frustrating how this is not in the script - Fortiche animators could only show this through hints in the scenery and later in a music montage). Viktor is in the commune in act 2, he's not acting like himself, and it's about evolution, magic, and Viktor's attempts to "help" the undercity being futile no matter what he does. Jayce gets a hamfisted "arc" of - somehow? - unlearning his prejudice or something without meaningfully interacting with anyone from the cast let alone anyone from the undercity, with a halfhearted attempt at making him look like a misunderstood crazy person who is really "right all along."

By the time we get to act 3, Viktor's sudden turn to black-and-white villainy, his focus on "perfection," let alone Jayce's sudden black-and-white heroism and suddenly being "in the right" while Viktor is "in the wrong" is completely incoherent with everything that came before. And season 2's oddly disconnected and simplistic writing is smoothed over with "love was the answer all along. and poor Viktor never understood that until the very end :("

[k3n-dyll]

Female character that people hate and purposefully mischaracterize simply because she 'gets in the way' of their favored mlm ship get behind me

[dawnstruck]

I swear to God, all those dumb fucking idiots who watched Arcane with their eyes closed and genuinely think that JayVik and/or Vanco are actual biological brothers and therefore shouldn't be shipped are giving me violent flashbacks to ye olden days of Voltron when people insisted Sheith were (adopted or biological) brothers with absolutely no canonical evidence to back up those claims.

Don't ship something if it's not your cup of tea. Write your AUs where they are related. But first please improve your media literacy because omg, people who are siblings do not say "He's like a brother to me."

And for the record: Let people ship their Wincest and Thorki and whatever, too. You don't have to like it. You don't have to approve of it. There are some pairings (many of them very popular) that absolutely want to make me claw my fucking eyes out. And you know what I do about that? I filter out said ships on AO3. I do not go into the tags. I don't leave inane "Aren't they brothers?1!?" comments on ship content.

There will always be things in fandom that go against your personal beliefs or preferences. But, to me, a lot of times, the whole "But they are brothers" protests read more like "But they are both guys". It's just a different flavor of homophobia/anti-slash rhetoric.

So fine, be bigoted and judgmental - but please do it in the privacy of your head or in personal conversations with friends who agree with you. Don't complain to shippers and content creators. And don't make incorrect claims about any blood relations just because you watched a show with your eyes closed and the tv on mute.

Rant over.

[srslylini]

no no I need to make this one thing a bigger point

as soon as I see the start of the "it's so cool that she is now independent and strong" or even the "she is so beautiful she needs no man" (etc. cause that one post that used "my lesbian brain now likes her more in season 2 because she is seperated from Jayce and finally has a story" ???????) bullshit they pull with her I open the accounts and ohhh it always hits me like a brick when I scroll and am hit by a wall of Jayvik

it doesn't. It doesn't hit me at all, I am never surprised. n e v e r

I can’t take criticism on Mel seriously because most of it is done by jayviks who say she’s pretty and call it a day then act like they love her😭. Like sorry, I’m not taking you seriously when your account is filled with only jayvik and you only talk about Mel to objectify her and seem like you don’t hate “the female character that gets in the way” that’s simply not enough. A lot of these hardcore “Mel is a manipulator” people are very obviously biased lmfao. “Jayce dumped her” except that never happened? They talked and then he left and fucking died lol, one important thing to remember is that these are CHARACTERS and there is writing behind them. What I’m saying is that they were handled poorly by the writers and they never actually “broke up” or should I say he never “dumped her🤓” they just.. had a thoughtful conversation and it was never brought up again. I feel like yall only say he “dumped her” so it fits the shitty narrative that Jayce dumped Mel for Viktor which is NOT true and literally never will be. You guys literally call her an “independent black woman who doesn’t need a man” except in different wording to make her seem unlovable. Yes, she doesn’t need a man but she WANTS a man. Stop acting like you actually want her to be independent, you just want to get her out of the way but also still seem like you’re an “”ally””.

[le-fruit-de-la-passion]

I keep seeing people worship Christian Linke for some shit he’s said and ignore the fact this man is antisemetic and heavily insensitive towards non white and straight characters HE IS NOT YOUR ALLY

I genuinely think people just don't know how much of a shitty person he is. Seriously, that dude was quite possibly the worst person to put in charge of a project like Arcane. Here are just some of things he's said that you should know of:

• Linke said the death of every character in Arcane was a direct result of their own actions : "Every single big beat in the end with our characters, whether it’s a death or not, is a consequence of their choices."

So, I'd like you to explain to me how Vander's death was his fault, because I don't quite remember him agreeing to becoming Warwick. Also, maybe having the three characters portrayed as suicidal in the show (Jinx, Viktor, and Jayce) all die, and go on to say it was just the consequences of their own actions... isn't a good message?

• Linke has declared Viktor as asexual on his own, with the sole purpose of discouraging JayVik shippers : "There is a love. I don't think it's romantic [...]. To me, Viktor was always asexual".

Now, the issue here isn't having an asexual character, its having chosen VIKTOR, one of the most important characters for disabled rep in animation and popular media, to be asexual. I've went on and on about how infantalizing that is to disabled/chronically ill fans, because we NEVER get to be perceived as sexual beings. Having a body that's visibly different from the norm, or limits on certain abilities, turns off people, makes them uncomfortable. That's why you just never see a sexually active or a sex positive disabled character on screen. That's why, in all his "sexy" skins in LoL, Viktor is given a six pack, has no visible marks of illness on his body (scars, fatigue lines), and has no medical brace or crutch.

Viktor was always intended to have a sexual swagger in season 1 ("this isnt my bedroom") and that was EXTREMELY important to a lot of us in the community. I've seen a very similar response from the asexual community as well, who feel like Linke is using their identity and experience as a shield from fan interractions he dislikes, and without actual care for what it means to the characters. Don't fall for rep that isn't actually meant to represent you.

• Linke has directly and openly compared the Zaun and Piltover conflict to the left and right in the United States, and put both sides on equal moral footing : "If you’re asking me whether we were inspired by two sides of one nation who are incapable of even talking to each other anymore at a certain point, yes."

So, I don't think I need to explain how bad this is. Remember that Piltover is the city of wealth and enforcers, and that they've gazed the district of Zaun, dumped chemicals around their water suplies, directed brutal and deadly repressions of civil uprising and protest, offered no financial support to the struggling communities of addicts, disabled people, and orphans, refused Zaun any implication or decisional seat in the city political life, AND THAT'S JUST ON TOP OF MY HEAD. Now, think about what that means with the USA politics comparison, and the idea that they should "just listen to each other". Yeah.

Now, if you know me a bit, you know I live in Canada, so maybe you think this doesn't affect me personally, or that it doesn't affect you because you live outside the US. To that, I want to tell you about a neighbour of mine, who lives on the street parallel to my house, and this truck he owns. The truck has a whole lot of fun stickers and flags on it: the quotes "TRUMP ARREST TRUDEAU" and "CANADIANS FOR TRUMP", the israeli flag, the confederate flag, christian crosses, the blue lives matter flag, and an anti BLM sticker. Now, I'm sure theres more cool things, I've just never gotten close enough to look at the smaller stickers and ornaments because, as a very openly bi arabic woman, I'm scared to death of that man. But maybe I should just hear him out, right?

Tldr, do not think that the state of american politics doesn’t affect the rest of the world.

• Linke has called the people of Zaun and specifically Silco "Svengali", which is an antisemitic name that implies Jewish people are crooks / dirty / thiefs / sexual degenerates. There's a great post on Tumblr that goes more into detail about this (https://www.tumblr.com/endearing-dalliance/769693230696677376/another-blow-against-arcane-anti-semitism?source=share). I'd just like to insist on how bad calling someone "svengali" is. His character was used in many pieces of propaganda in Nazi Germany to picture the "Evil Jew", and to dehumanize Jewish communities by portraying them as ressembling Satan (forked beard, can do unholy hypnosis, targets women...). Linke could have chosen ANY other term to talk about Zaunites, the oppressed community getting gazed by a police state, but he chose that one. That was not an unconscious decision.

I'm a firm believer that it is possible to separate art from artist/studio/company, and to appreciate something while still being aware the person behind it is not a great individual. However, if you're defending all the decisions made in season 2, these are things you HAVE to be aware of.