#and rich people tend to be rich because of pretty much the same reasons

[fipindustries]

️‍🔥 Social Class

i think poor people are evil because money is the one single measure of moral and ethical worth in a person.

[on-the-clear-blue]

Original idea coming from @the-witchhunter and then added on to by many others.

Dead Man's Diner

---

Danny was tired okay? It may very well be his own damn fault but he can't keep waking up during daylight hours, while yes, he can fully be up and sitting at a desk, the likelihood of him waking up getting shouted at by his boss for sleeping on the job was astounding.

So at 19 years old, freshly jobless, Danny said Fuck it and moved away from Amity Park, Valarie was more than willing to handle the few ghosts that still came through the portal since he became the King.

You might be wondering, why isn't Danny filthy rich and rolling in it as the ghost king? Two words, the Observants.

Those flouting eye bastards had moved in and said that unless he was the king full time, he was unable to access the vaults of the Infinite Realms.

So once again, 19, freshly jobless and wanting to get out of Gotham? Danny was very lucky to have friends that love him far to much, Sam and Tucker both pitched in to move him out to where they had chosen to do collage.

*Gotham* oh Sam was in love with the place, the architecture, the people, (and maybe a certain green supervillian that was determined to make the city better) and Tucker was obsessing over being in the same city as Wayne Enterprises, trying his best to get into their internship program by his own merit rather than just hacking himself into it.

And Danny? He was loving it for a slightly different reason.

While the death rate was unfortunately high in Gotham, that also meant that the amount of passive ectoplasim generated by the deaths was massive, it was almost as rich as back in Amity Park with the portal into the ghost zone!

(Oh and the many job opportunities but Danny was a little less worried about that.)

---

Letting out a sigh, Danny scrubbed at his eyes as he leaned back into his chair, another job he had to turn down due to it being shady as all get out.

4 hours and he was getting payed 200 bucks? Major criminal vibes from that...

Taking a moment to get himself balanced, Danny leaned back and looked to the clunky laptop that Tucker had given him, it was modified to hell and back, so it still ran quickly, but it sure as he'll wasn't pretty.

Clicking on yet another job listing, Danny paused as he felt a shiver run down his spine, and a blue mist pass through his lips, blinking, he twisted around to look at the spare room of Sam's apartment, Ghosts tend not to get close enough to him to trigger the ghost sense in Gotham...

Seeing nothing, Danny turned back to his laptop only to find a piece of paper stuck to the screen with tape, freezing at first, the dark haired man sighed deeply, peeling it off he held it close as he read it.

[Help wanted at Big C's Dinner! Looking for a night cook that knows their way around a kitchen!]

There was a few more lines that Danny's eyes skimmed over, picking up the location that it was at, it even had a decent pay, but he paid more attention to the scribbled on note at the bottom of it.

[Daniel, head to this place at 12 am tonight. While the Observants said that you may not touch a single coin in your vaults, they side nothing of your properties.]

---

So Danny knows how to handle himself, he has fought many, many people and still came out half alive, but even he felt a little on edge coming down to the railroad tracts in Gotham, because apparently that was were Big C's dinner was at...which he apparently owned? Clockwork works in mysterious ways that Danny was so done trying to figure out.

Stepping up to a bit of abandoned tract, he blinked a few times at the site of Big C's.

It was a decent sized Dinning Car, with a ramp that attached itself to a proper street, it had peeling green paint and dirty white accents with charming rusted steel connecting it to the tracts, the only thing new looking on it was a bit banner stretched across it, stating the name "BIG C'S ALL DAY EVERY DAY BREAKFAST CART! OPEN 24/7!"

The windows were close off by tinted yellow blinds, but he could still see light coming through them. Stepping up the ramp Danny felt the cart under him shudder and something inside of him fluttered, and by the time he was opening the door he could feel the reason why.

The very cart was *alive*, taking a quick breath, Danny could practically taste the energy from it, there was a buzzing undercurrent of excitement that rung through the whole cart.

A little unprepared for his, Danny just smiled warily, "Uhh, hey there? Anyone around?" In response to his words the cart shuddered, the blinds dancing up and down and he could hear the squeel of the wheels.

"O-okay then, um my name is Danny Fenton...Clockwork sent me?" There was another flapingnof the blinds, and the small wooden flap that let people into the back lifted up suddenly before clacking down loudly.

Taking a steadying breath, Danny slipped through the bar and into the back.

It was surprisingly clean and orderly, the stove and fryer looked over than his parents but well maintained, the flat top was perfectly scrubbed and was already heating up.

As Danny looked around, he felt a familiar shiver run down his spine, looking around once more, Danny fell into a fighting position as he spotted the figure of a familiar foe

"Lunch Lady? Aren't you a little far from home? What did your order of fist not come in?" The bright rings of light around Danny's waist swirled into life as he went into his ghost form.

He got a thrilling grin from the older apparition, but she only crossed her arms, "While we can tumble later little King, Lord Clockwork sent me personally, said you need a bit of help learning how to cook? And ain't nobody better slinging food than me, dead or alive!"

---

Down in the dripping depths of the cave system deep under Gotham, one Bruce Wayne, still in his Batsuit sat in front of the Bat Computer, eyes glaring at a map of Gotham.

He had been tracking a strange energy pattern that made its way through Gotham, he had first thought it was some sort of layline, but the more that he tracked it the more he realized it was closer to watching a person's walking patterns, sometimes following roads, and sometimes crisscrossing through streets and alleyways.

But tonight that power signal tripled in size, off-putting energy that Bruce hadn't seen it done before, tapping the com on his ear, he spoke clearly "Nightwing, take Red Robin and investigate the coordinates I am sending the both of you, observe it, I just got a massive spike in an energy at that location."

There was silence for a moment before the com crackled and his sons responded "Got it B! Me and RR needed a little time together huh Babybird?"

There was a quiet hum from Tim, before the teen spoke "On route Batman, after this I am heading in, we have a meeting with a suspect in the morning B, Vlad Masters has been poking around Gotham."

[artemis32]

Locksley

yandere Batfam x reader

yes, i do love them. yes, it is a problem. yes, i will make this my entire personality for the next two and a half months

also, necessary disclaimer, there’s a piece of dialogue in this that i took from a youtube asmr channel (bite me, they’re interesting and i’m starved of attention) - it’s jimち asmr, if you’re interested

word count - 4.8k

mbe masterlist

You wouldn’t call yourself a hero, not in any sense of the word. Likewise, you didn’t consider yourself a villain. You were something in between - you did bad things for good reasons, you did good things for bad reasons. 

Living in Gotham changed people. No matter how kind or well-intentioned, everyone ended up corrupt sooner or later. Some just fell further from grace than others. 

The people you helped would argue that you were a hero, someone who deserved recognition and respect for your actions. The people you stole from tended to disagree.

You didn’t care much about what you were. Heroes, villains… They were all the same in your eyes. They wrecked havoc and left people like you to deal with the aftermath - an ordinary citizen who had neither the means nor the aspirations to fix what they’d broken.

****

You started years ago, before you were even a teenager.

It was small things at first. Single fruits, a loaf of bread, a blanket, cough syrup. Things people wouldn’t usually notice. 

You realised pretty soon that you were good at stealing, good at getting away without people noticing. Very good.

Stealing felt justified in your young mind. You told yourself that it was okay. It was okay because you weren’t stealing for yourself. Never for yourself. Never committing a crime for personal benefit.

No, you stole to help others. You did what you could to help those that were too weak or scared to help themselves. 

In those early years, when you were still young and hopeful, you likened yourself to Robin Hood. Stealing from the rich to give to the poor.

Now, years later, the sentiment had faded. 

You still stole from the rich. You still gave everything you stole to the poor. 

Poverty in Gotham was a disease. The densely populated apartment blocks in the Narrows, where you lived, housed more people than it should have, and those people had become somewhat of a family to you. Or at least as close as you’d ever get. So you did what you could to keep them safe and alive. Stealing food to keep them fed, stealing clothes and blankets to keep them warm, stealing medicine to keep them healthy, stealing toys to keep the children hopeful.

That was your job, your purpose in life.

It made you feel as though you had a use. Seeing how people’s faces brightened, how happy they looked to see you when you bought a spare blanket or some extra food, or a toy a hopeful child had been eyeing for a while, it made you feel as though your life wasn’t completely meaningless.

Your life had a purpose. And that purpose was to help those who couldn’t help themselves. 

So you did.

And you never got caught. Not once. 

Until you did.

****

This uniform is so fucking uncomfortable. How do these people do this all day? You think, slipping your index finger beneath the buttoned collar of your shirt, tugging at it in a lacklustre attempt to catch a breath.

As much as recon was necessary, it was also an annoyance most of the time. It was times like these that you thanked the stars above that you weren’t born into a wealthy family. Stuffy galas and boring board meetings were never your thing.

The crowd of wealthy tycoons and aristocrats barely paid the waitstaff a second thought, primping and preening as they mingled amongst one another, trying to impress people who were too self centred to notice them. 

You would’ve rolled your eyes and gagged at the sight, had it not acted as the perfect cover for you. 

Stealing the name tag and uniform off of the service roster was simple enough, and sneaking in through the service entrance of the disgustingly lavish manor was a breeze. Now, as you flit through the crowd of supercilious pricks, you feel grateful for your own nondescript appearance.

Blending in with the average service worker was a blessing, one you took full advantage of as you scanned the large ballroom. There were several large windows, massive panes of glass bordered with ornately carved ebony wood frames. The doors were just as grand, two sets of double doors, and a smaller service door in the very corner of the room, all dark stained ebony to match the windows, were just as detailed and lavish.

It made you sick.

How could these people live so wastefully? How could they live so easily? Their biggest worry was keeping their faces youthful and their houses fancy. It didn’t make sense. Even now, after months, years of doing this, it still confused you - the fact that you lived such a jarringly different life, one that seemed so pathetic in comparison to the vapid crowd that surrounded you.

At the very least, it eased your conscience, and made your job easier. You felt no pity, no remorse for stealing from people like those gathered around you. Very few of them had actually worked for what they had in life. No, it was handed to them at birth. Life was funny like that. Those who work hard are left impoverished, and those who give in to gluttony and greed never have to work a day in their lives for what they have.

You discarded the now empty serving tray behind a potted plant, slipping out the large double doors and into the empty corridor beyond. The halls were silent and dark, moonlight casting large shadows over the walls.

The manor’s antiquated runner rug muffled the sound of your footsteps as you crept along the wall of the corridor, carefully taking note of each door, drawing up a mental map as you continued. 

Every corner you turned was more extravagant than the last. You could practically feel the wealth seeping out of the walls. It disgusted you. 

At least it was nice to look at.

Twenty minutes later, you’ve made it up to the East Wing, the furthest part of the manor from the ballroom. It seems to be the personal quarters of whoever the hell owns this abomination of a house. On the trek up several flights of stairs, you’d passed a collection of bedrooms, several smaller living rooms, and,to your great delight, a study. Though, ‘study’ feels like the wrong word to describe the room.

It looks more like a grotesque mix of a library and a maze, and if you were any more wet behind the ears, you might’ve been intimidated by the sheer size of it. In fact, if you’d stumbled upon a room like this a few years ago, you’d have been in awe. The value of a single item in this room would have you set for life. 

But you don’t allow yourself to be caught up in the moment, keeping steely focus as you move silently, swiftly between towering shelves. You don’t take anything. Not yet. The time for that would come later. Right now, you focus instead on gathering information. The layout of the manor, alarms, sensors, residents.

The last part was always the hardest, especially with people like the elite of Gotham city. People came and went as they pleased, and the odds of you running into someone was higher in extravagant homes like this, what with their abundance of butlers and maids. But you’d avoided them all up to this point, never once encountering anyone in more than a decade of prowling.

And this manor - the famous Wayne residence - never housed more than a dozen people on any given night. You knew the staff and groundskeepers all went home in the evening, leaving the property all but abandoned at night.

You reach the end of the room, pausing only to glance over at the large grandfather clock nestled between two shelves before you turn on your heel and stride back towards the door. You’d gotten what you came for. Now, it was time to take your leave, full mental map in tow. 

Getting out of the gala was a lot easier than getting in, and you took the time to register the smaller details of the manor. In this time, you confirmed one thing you knew for certain:

Wayne manor disgusted you in all its excessive wealth.

Bruce Wayne may have appeared as some kind of well meaning philanthropist or humanitarian, but you knew his pockets ran deep. Much of his wealth, generational and unearned, was hoarded while the rest of Gotham was left to rot in poverty. 

It was, in part, the reason that you didn’t feel bad about what you were doing. He, alongside the rest of Gotham’s elite, had done nothing to earn what they had. You were just levelling out the playing field, giving those in the Narrows a fair chance at life.

And if you had to dirty your hands to help them, then so be it.

****

The thick carpet muffles your landing, though you don’t really need it.

Over the years, you’d mastered your movements, learning how to move silently, without notice. It’d been born from necessity, rather than genuine desire. Growing up in the Narrows wasn’t good for much, but at least you learnt pretty quickly that it was easier to get by if you went unnoticed.

You gently close the window, pushing the polished wooden frame with your fingertips, wincing at the soft click of the lock. Any noise was too much.

The corridors are empty as you silently sweep through the manor, as expected. You aim for the lavish library you’d scoped out a week prior, mental checklist ready. 

Avoiding the cameras and alarms is easy enough, especially when the majority of them scoped the perimeter, rather than the interior. The lack of security, combined with the excessive luxury confirmed what you’d always thought.

Rich people were fucking dumb.

They really thought their money could protect them from everything. Well, there was one thing that no amount of money could save them from.

People like you. People with absolutely nothing to lose.

You had no family, no prized possessions, no desire or greed. And you sure as hell didn’t harbour any fear for people like them.

Eventually, you arrive in the East Wing, slowing your stride slightly. You strain your ears for any hint of movement, blending seamlessly into the shadows as you prowl the corridor. The ornately carved solid wood door opens with a silent swoosh, and you slip into the room a mere moment later.

Someone’s here.

You take note of it a moment too late, slipping between two towering shelves the instant you hear the soft murmurs of a conversation. The lighting is dim, shadows dancing across the room, sourced from the crackling fireplace at the back of the study.

Fuck.

It takes you a beat longer than usual to calm your now racing heart, and the instant you get it under control, you’re back to creeping along the shadows, hands darting out to grab at ornaments and books, shoving them silently into every pocket and gap in your suit and small backpack.

If you could, you’d have brought a bigger bag, but you needed to travel light - light enough to make a swift exit if needed. 

You manage to grab quite a few things without nearing the source of conversation, which you’ve now determined to be two men murmuring lowly near the fireplace. Relief settles heavy in your bones as you creep back towards the door, thankful for the numerous shelves hiding you from view.

Lady Luck was a fickle being, and it seemed she’d decided your time was up.

When you’re about ten steps away from the exit, senses on high alert, time seems to slow, the baroque handle dropping slowly as the door is pushed open. You’re back in the shadows before it fully opens, back pressed against the wall while you weigh your options.

The door is out of the question. There’s no way to slip out without being noticed. The window, maybe?

One glance at the tightly latched windows across the room dash that idea immediately.

Panic swirls up your spine, threatening to take over. If you got caught here, there’s no telling what would happen to you.

As you scramble to come up with a plan, the door swings open and a man steps into the room. He’s young, fresh-faced, perhaps a year or two younger than you. He’s handsome too, in the way aristocrats often were - light eyes, tanned skin, full lips. He was striking. 

And he turned to look right at you.

You’re up, on top of the nearest shelf seconds before his eyes slide towards you. You squeeze your eyes shut, sweat slicked palms pressed flat against the dusty wooden shelf underneath you.

Fuck.

He lingers for a moment, taking a step closer into the shadows, to the spot you’d stood in moments ago. 

There’s no way he knew. He couldn’t.

After several tense, painful seconds, his brow twitches and he turns on his heel, striding over to the other two men, his gait confident and swift. You let out a soft sigh, relaxing only a bit as you try to stop the nervous tremors in your hands.

Escape comes hours later, near three in the morning, when all three men eventually retire to their rooms. You couldn’t get out of that eerie, shadowed manor fast enough.

****

“You really should lock your door at night, especially in this area. You never know when some creep might think about inviting themselves in. Windows too, for that matter - or else B&E’s would just be… Well, E’s.” 

It was barely two in the morning. You’d crawled into bed, still fully clothed, less than an hour ago, exhausted from a long day of work in the hellscape that was hospitality. You hadn’t even had the energy to look over your next few potential hits, never mind take a shower or have dinner.

So it’s no surprise that you’re disoriented, thrown off guard when you wake up to a masked man leaning far too casually against your derelict old couch, slim katana resting comfortably in his hand while he twirls it around.

“Then again,” he continues, ignoring the wide eyed look you give him. You flinch back, the movement too slight to notice as he straightens and strides over to you. “You’ve made my job easier. So I should thank you.”

He stands, hovering over you, arms hanging casually at his sides beneath his cloak as he regards you. The mask he wears hides his eyes, and it feels as though you’re staring up into dark, never-ending pits rather than eyes.

“Hm. You look different than what I expected. Younger. How old are you?”

If you weren’t so terrified, you might’ve laughed. Here, in your cramped, dingy bedsit, stood someone who appeared more demon than man, and he was presumptuous enough to critique your appearance. Worse still is the fact that you might’ve answered him, had he not swiftly changed topics.

“It doesn’t matter. A criminal is a criminal. Blackgate has a cell with your name on it.”

The train rumbles by and shakes the thin walls of your apartment, casting an eerie half glow bright enough to just barely light up your apartment.

Your blood runs cold.

Robin.

You’re moving before he has time to register what’s happening, tossing your worn knit blanket at his head as you leap from your bed, the small single’s frame groaning beneath you at the abrupt movement. You’re across the room when he recovers, hand on the doorknob. Seconds later, a vaguely bird-shaped dagger embeds itself into the doorframe right beside your hand.

“Don’t move.”

For once, despite the alarm bells blaring in your head, you listen. You fight against your instincts and the burning in your limbs as he approaches, closer and closer with every taunting step until he’s right in front of you, another stupid bird-shaped dagger nicking the soft underside of your jaw.

“You’re coming with me. Peacefully.”

Your brow twitches in annoyance at his tone. It’s so condescending, as if he thinks he’s talking to a child. If this was anyone else, you might’ve fought back, but of the list of people you avoided, the Gotham vigilantes associated with Batman were top of the list. 

They were so irritatingly self-righteous, and you knew without a shadow of a doubt that they’d view you as a scum of the earth criminal, should they ever catch you. It was part of the reason you’d avoided them so religiously, and you’d done a great job of it up until this point. The only question on your mind right now, though, was-

“How?”

Robin tilts his head, mouth flat. “How what?”

You lift your chin a bit more as he raises his dagger, softly piercing the skin, as if in a warning.

“How did you find me?”

If you could see his eyes, you were sure they’d hold an incredulous look, as if to ask ‘are you stupid?’. But you weren’t. Not like this. You weren’t sloppy. And you sure as hell didn’t step on toes when you stole, especially not enough to gain the attention of a run of the mill vigilante. There was no reason for him to be standing here, in your apartment, all but pinning you to the door.

“How did you find me?” you insist, pushing forward despite the slight sting against your jaw. “What did you see?”

He sets his jaw, tilting his head down as he speaks through clenched teeth. 

“Stealing from Bruce Wayne of all people was a dumb move.”

Your blood chills in your veins.

So someone did see me then… That man. That boy. Fuck.

“It was especially dumb to stick around for four hours afterwards.”

At that moment, you weigh your options. 

If you go with him peacefully, all but turn yourself in, Blackgate would be the least of your worries. You stole from Bruce Wayne.

Wronging such an influential man would have its own set of unique consequences, and it wasn’t yourself you were worried about. Anyone you’d helped in the process would be incriminated. All those innocent people, the women and children, the elderly people who lived around you… 

No. You couldn’t go with him. 

Prison was one thing. Endangering those you swore to help was another entirely.

With your mind made up, everything else is easy.

You grab the wrought iron coat rack beside the door and swing it upwards, aiming for his head without a second thought. The moment he releases you and shoves you back, you’re out the door, sprinting down several flights of stairs.

Too slow. Faster. Move faster.

You hear him behind you, footsteps ringing out like a death knell. 

He wants you to hear him. You know he does. A vigilante like that, someone as skilled as him - you wouldn’t hear him unless he wanted you too.

Honestly, you were quite proud of yourself. You’d made it further than you’d expected. The uneven gravel stings against your bare feet as you sprint through the side alley, aiming for the main street.

It was pointless. You knew it was. Even if you could make it that far, it wouldn’t amount to anything. No one would help you. No one could help you.

Regardless, you still feel disappointed when he grabs you by the collar of your thin, old sleepshirt, yanking you back. The exit to the alley, a mere two metres away, seems to mock you.

In that moment, you think about what you’d done. You truly think, and realise that you didn’t regret a single thing. You didn’t care about what happened to you. Everything you’d taken had helped so many people, far more than it would have helped Bruce Wayne, gathering dust in his old study. 

Everyone had been so happy, so relieved at how much you’d managed to help them. The amount you’d received for the stolen goods had been enough to care for everyone in your building ten times over. 

So no, you didn’t regret your decision.

This time, Robin doesn’t waste any time with pleasantries, gripping the back of your neck tightly and knocking you out a moment later.

****

“Who is she?”

“Her name is-”

“I know what her damn name is. I mean, who is she?”

Tim pauses, eyeing Damian with a strange expression, clearing his throat and continuing after throwing a perplexed glance at Bruce.

“...well, uh, she lives in the Narrows, has for more than a decade. She went to Gotham public high school and received her high school diploma, with no further education. She’s… pretty unremarkable, to be honest. Works in a shitty diner in the East End, earns less than minimum wage...” he trails off for a moment and shrugs. “There’s not much else to say.”

Damian clenches his jaw, arms crossed tightly over his chest.

“Her address. What is it?”

Again, Tim throws Bruce a glance, sharper this time, choosing his words wisely.

“I… don’t think that’s necessary information. It’s not a big deal, she only took a few things. And it doesn’t seem like she kept any of it. Actually, I’m kind of impressed–”

He’s cut off in an instant, Damian’s glare sharp and filled with rage.

“It does matter. She stole from us. She–” 

The green-eyed youth sucks in a sharp breath, dropping his arms to his side, flexing his hands.

“...she was right there. She was inside the manor, ten steps away from me, and I didn’t fucking notice. It took us two weeks to notice she’d been here at all!”

His words are like venom, belying the real reason he’s so worked up, and Bruce watches him with a blank expression, stepping forward after he’s calmed down slightly, placing a heavy palm on his shoulder.

“I understand your frustrations, but you can’t allow them to cloud your judgement. Don’t allow your emotions to rule your actions. While I agree we should find her, I don’t think we need to be as… extreme as you’re suggesting. She’s just a civilian - albeit a very… efficient one. Take some time, calm down, and we’ll discuss what to do from there, okay?”

Damian shrugs the hand off his shoulder, stalking out of the Batcave with a few short, clipped words thrown over his shoulder.

“Yes, Father. Of course.”

****

A very frazzled looking man is the first thing you see when you come to, temple aching terribly where the angered Robin had decked you hours earlier. Presently, the man hovering over you sighs when he sees your eyes open, though it doesn’t seem to be a sound of relief. His mouth tugs down at the corners, brows pinching together.

“Don’t.”

He presses a palm to your shoulder, keeping you flat on your back when you try to sit up. His tone is stern, flat, accentuated by the dark bags under his eyes. His shoulders sag and he loosens his hold, fingers flexing against your shoulder.

“Just… stay there. Don’t move.”

The words seem more like a plea than a demand, but you listen regardless. Even if you wanted to move, the pain rippling through your skull makes you too dizzy to sit up, let alone stand.

“...do you remember anything?” he murmurs, bright blue eyes roaming your face worriedly.

Licking your dry, cracked lips, you avoid his gaze. Would it be better to lie, you wonder? Would he know? You had a feeling he might. And you had a feeling that somehow, being honest just this once would help you a lot more than lying ever could. 

You swallow thickly, glancing back at him before answering. 

“Yes.”

He rolls his eyes, head lolling forward as he mutters.

“Fan-fucking-tastic.”

Before he can ask you another question, before you can say anything else, there’s a flurry of movement at the entrance to the room, several people storming in. The racket makes your head throb, and you feel faint and woozy as you lean back against the admittedly plump pillows.

You wonder distantly why you weren’t in a prison cell or a hospital. If you’d been in a better headspace and perhaps not concussed, you might’ve been concerned, but it was effort enough to focus on staying conscious at the moment.

“No, Damian! I have had enough! You explicitly went against my instructions– You kidnapped a civilian!”

Chancing a small peek at the arguing duo, you catch sight of little more than two blob-like shapes, the taller of the two yelling animatedly while the shorter stands stoically, staring off to the side, towards–

Towards you.

“She’s awake.”

That has the taller man falling silent for a moment. He sighs heavily, murmuring. 

“We’ll discuss this later. For now, I have to deal with your mess.”

With that, he turns and strides over to you, placing his hand on the shoulder of the young man at your bedside, a silent dismissal. He remains standing while the other two leave, staring down at you expressionlessly.

Bruce Wayne.

Bruce fucking Wayne.

…I’m so dead.

You jolt up, wincing at the pounding in your head as you blurt out.

“Mr Wayne, I–” 

He holds up a palm, silencing you.

“I don’t want to hear it.”

There’s a pause, one in which he looks down at you before sitting down with a sigh, massaging the bridge of his nose for a moment.

“I don’t care that you stole from me. Usually, I'd just file a police report and go about my day, but my son… Well, you upset him.”

He leans back in his seat, unbuttoning his blazer.

“You see, he’s a prideful boy. It’s never caused problems before, at least, not like this. I mean, involving a civilian, that is. But you seem to have struck a nerve. He’s holding quite a bit of animosity towards you.”

Bruce leans forward again, elbows resting on his thighs as he regards you with a critical eye.

“And I’ll admit, you caught me too, to a degree. You broke into my home without my notice. You were right under my nose.” He huffs a disbelieving laugh, as if the very idea of you evading him was impossible. “It’s impressive, I won’t deny it.”

A strange flutter fills your chest, something that feels oddly akin to pride. Bruce Wayne of all people was complimenting you. Or, at least, it felt like a compliment. 

“Why is he so upset?” 

You regret the question the instant it leaves your mouth. His gaze, which had been slowly warming up, turns cold and flat at that.

“...because you slipped right by him. Do you understand what a feat that is? How much you’ve wounded his pride? For you, an untrained young woman from the slums of Gotham to have fooled him, a trained assassin. Robin. You understand, don’t you? He took it as a very personal offence.”

You feel the blood drain from your face. Was this some kind of twisted punishment for stealing? Did this man, Bruce Wayne, really expect you to believe that his son, the sweetheart of Gotham’s high society, was the Robin? And an assassin to boot?

He huffs a silent laugh, brows raising as he regards the expression on your face.

“Yes, yes, I know. It’s shocking. Damian Wayne, Robin? You’ll get used to it.”

Your hands are shaking now, sweaty and white knuckled as you clutch the bedsheets, and you feel your blood pressure rising. If you weren’t careful, you’d pass out soon. Swallowing thickly, you ask the question urgently gnawing at the forefront of your mind.

“If he’s Robin, then…?”

A small smile tugs at his lips. He was handsome, in an older gentleman kind of way - tall, strong, sturdy build. Even the wrinkles and lines marring his face looked attractive. No wonder women fell over themselves in an attempt to catch his attention.

“Yes. You catch on quickly, don’t you? Well, that’s to be expected from Gotham’s own do-good Robin Hood, I suppose. Yes, I am Batman.”

A choked noise dies out in your chest. 

Of course I’d steal from Batman. Of everyone in Gotham, this is who I choose? God, why is my luck so shitty?

His admission sows a seed of unease in the pit of your stomach, and your eyes dart around the room for the first time since you’d arrived. It was large, larger than what you were used to, though the only furniture was the bed, a vanity, and a small couch near the window. The window that was locked tight, covered with solid iron burglar bars. Bars you had the sinking feeling were put there to keep you in.

You turn to him, eyes wide and pleading.

“Why are you telling me all this?” 

He stands, posture straight and assertive as he eyes you callously. “Because, unfortunately, your actions, and my son’s impulsive decision have both pushed me to make a decision I have no choice in. It means that, until we decide what to do with you, you won’t be allowed to leave–”

Evidently, his admittance to essentially abducting you is what sends your blood pressure through the roof. You pass out before he finishes his sentence, praying with the last of your fading consciousness that this was all some twisted nightmare.

[thechekhov]

Dungeon Meshi Quick Reacts: CH45

Slumber party!

Fair, but consider: She deserves a little murder. As a treat.

Kabru be like "IS THAT MY BACKSTORY???"

That sure is....a ship. With no one on it.

Ah, shit the Americans are here.

Two things: Toshiro being tended to like a pretty pretty princess is hilarious.

And also, the fact that they think the elves can kill Falin......... hmmm.... Pressing X to doubt.

............... oh. Laios. 😂

But also like. How was he MEANT to keep it silent? Put a little something in it? I thought since it was a magic bell you could code it to only ring when it's shaken with INTENT?

Fancy ass house.

Also, Namari...........are you hitting that yet? Both of that?

Oh, it's backstory time.

Okay one: that's fucking tragic, it sounds like the Elves are just forcing the dungeons closed with no regard for how the ecosystem compensates and what people suffer by being in close proximity......

And another thing: Kabru. Kabru, isn't that what YOU'RE after? Having all the power?

Why is this so much like that one meme where the girls at the party are looking at you.

It's the same picture.

Kabru that's. That's maybe not the way to go about it. you're going to give them MORE reasons to go in.

Nevermind the governor not being into this 'good boy, now sign' talk, Toshiro's kinda right. Ya fucked up Kabru.

No matter how far Laios runs, he cannot escape other people trying to tell him how to live his life. Poor guy. But at the same time...

Is this real? Or a red herring?

Laios' father and mother seemed to be living relatively pious lives. They clearly had a good house, but it didn't seem like they were extremely rich. Then again, perhaps he's just a cousin of royalty? Is that why his parents wanted him to have children?

They want to.... halt the growth of the dungeon? Is this another part of the natural ecosystem of things? Dungeons growing seems to point even more towards the idea that it's a gigantic, fleshpit-like creature instead of simply a construct.

Then again, constructs CAN be creatures. Like the golems.

Elves not understanding how old humans are continues to be hilarious because like.

As humans, we HAVE this same concept of variant aging. Like. Dogs. We understand that dogs live less than us, and mature a lot slower. But this is.... COMMON KNOWLEDGE. Most people do not make it into adulthood without understanding that dogs mature within 1-2 years of their birth.

The fact that elves, a species with FAR more time on their hands, who have lived alongside other races for AGES....... have STILL not got the general concept of aging down....means their education is atrocious. Or they're all not paying attention.

.......this. THIS is the most fascinating concept in this chapter.

The fallen.... turned into MONSTERS.

We know that dying inside the dungeon doesn't mean permanent death. But dying above-ground does.

We know that dying in the dungeon doesn't mean your body turns into a monster (aside from ghosts and ghouls?) ..... but dying aboveground.... DOES......?

WHAT'S THE TRUTH.

👁👁

Hm.

If Kabru and Laios fused, they could almost make one functioning human being.

Senshi just beginning to speak in the middle of his own internal monologue is so real.

...... what's going on there with the expression, buddy?

Bread.......are they STILL carrying around flour with them?! How are they getting bread?!

Also, it's awesome that the eggs are canonically hard to crack, because it makes sense that they don't break during their many fighting events.

Izutsumi really said ◉_◉

Don't tell me Laios, who is sensitive to ghosts has ALSO been seeing things?

Not gonna lie, that's highkey terrifying.

Props to that ghost that's been following Laios around, not ever giving up hope that it can bother him into acknowledging it.

And also - hey, it already saved them once! that means it's probably not evil!

That, or it's the king of the bloody dungeon. Wouldn't that be something!

[klbmsw]

Superstar Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg goes viral for a knockout takedown of Donald Trump's collapsing presidential campaign.

This is one for the books…

"I think you were exactly right to describe it as distraction. The challenge of course is you have to say something if he attacks the service of military service members who earned the Medal of Honor," Buttigieg said to MSNBC's Joe Scarborough.

"If he, you know, goes to the National Associaton of Black Journalists and blurts out something racist, obviously you have to deal with that," said Buttigieg. "But you have to deal with that quickly and then come right back to our message."

"Because I do think this is a kind of strategy. You might ask why would a politician do things like that but you know going all the way back to the days of him denigrating the service of John McCain, it's very clear that he does this for a reason," he continued.

"It's a twofold reason," Buttigieg explained. "One, is he wants people talking about him. And then two, he wants people not talking about the difference between our agenda and his agenda especially when you look at Project 2025."

"It's an amazing thing that Project 2025 is kind of the scandal of the year for the Republicans, the thing that they have had to do the most damage control around," he went on.

"Because look at what Project 2025 is. It's just their policies. It's nothing but a write-up of what they plan to do and they really don't want the American people focused on how Trump is about tax cuts for the rich and we're trying to make sure we have a fairer tax code," said Buttigieg.

"Or Donald Trump demolished the right to choose in this country. Now, Kamala Harris will lead the work to restore that right to choose," he continued.

"Or any other issue from climate to gun safety to education. You name it. Where the American people strongly agree with us and strongly disagree with him," he went on. "They don't want us talking about that. They don't want us talking about his record, results that even if you go by the measures that conservatives tend to pay the most attention to — like crime rates — that was worse under Donald Trump."

"If you're one of those folks who thinks of the economy in terms of the stock market — you know there's a lot more to the economy than the stock market but to some people that's pretty much the same thing — the DOW and S&P were worse under Donald Trump than they were under Biden and Harris," said Buttigieg.

"Energy production! One of the things you hear Republicans talk the most about. Domestic energy production is higher under Biden and Harris than it was under Trump,” he continued. “He can't afford for us to be talking about that so every couple days he's going to blurt out something outrageous so that we're talking about that instead."

As usual, Buttigieg's analysis is incisive and spot-on. Trump has no popular policies to run on so he's resorting to cheap tricks and distractions.

Meanwhile, Kamala Harris and Tim Walz are offering a vision of a brighter future. Under their leadership, America will flourish and leave the fascist MAGA movement in

[genericpuff]

(disclaimer, this is coming from a heartstopper fan! i love heartstopper this is not hate!!)

i think at least part of the annoyance with heartstopper isn't just that isn't a light fluffy ya series, it's also that its another example of how the queer media that gets the most mainstream attention tends to be this kind of light fluffy ya stuff that focuses on two conventially attractive queer boys or men and it also tends to be written by people who aren't queer men on top of that, so not only can it feel very samey but it can feel like other queer people are relegated to side characters in the stories of cis gay men. and as someone who loves heartstopper i get that on some level.

btw by "written by people who aren't queer men" NOT saying that isn't not written by queer people. alice oseman is genderfluid and aroace, becky albertalli is bisexual, etc. and while i think the point is still valid there is a misogyny element in that a lot of the focus is put on things that are written by women or people they perceive as women while tumblr darlings like good omens and ofmd (written by presumably straight men) don't get the same treatment.

nah y'know what, that's fair, I can get how frustrating it can be for a lot of popular queer stories to feel samey, I've definitely gotten BL-fatigue in the past on platforms like WT and Tapas because many of them ARE the same and feel like they're just piggybacking off trends for the sake of clout (and this is a problem in the heterocis romance stories too, don't get me fucking started on how dark romance has turned into torture porn where vulnerable women are constantly being victimized by rich powerful men and we're just supposed to root for that ??), but it's one of those things where like, what might be seen as just more corny shit could very well be the revelation another person needs that they're gay / trans / etc. that the story helped them realize. there's just a point where i see these arguments against cheesy popular queer stories that teeter dangerously close to being queerphobic and, as you said, misogynist, simply because "it was written by someone who i perceive as a woman so that makes it BAD!"

and I didn't mention it in the original post because I didn't want to @ OP in any way but in the comment section they literally said "i dont think heartstopper itself is all that bad but it has pretty much aimed the direction of all mainstream gay comics towards wholesomeness instead of anything more interesting so i want to destroy heartstopper to destroy heartstopper clones" and that gives me massive ick because it implies their sole reasoning for including it was "chill and happy queer stories bad, if a character doesn't suffer enough then they're not interesting"?? why can't LGBTQ+ audiences have more 'vanilla' stories that aren't all sad and angsty all the time? are we not entitled to the same corny romcom vanilla shit that the heterocis are entitled to? why do LGBTQ+ characters - and by extension, people - have to suffer to qualify as being 'interesting'? You're already interesting, you're you! like i'm sorry, are we trying to scare people straight??? 😭 shit, that's even a plot point that's touched on in Heartstopper itself where Nick is questioning his sexuality and he starts googling shit and it's just ALL the terrifying news stories of queer kids being ostracized / bullied / murdered / etc. and as much as it's important to be aware of the ongoing issues so we can keep fighting for our rights, we ALSO need to find balance and remember to celebrate the stories that AREN'T that because we need something to be hopeful for, something we can find peace in. I don't think Heartstopper is some deeply profound piece of work, but it also doesn't seem like it's trying to be? It's a low stakes celebration of the LGBTQ+ experience that's very warm and comforting, especially for those who are the same ages as the main characters who are often being persuaded by the grown-ups around them that it's a death sentence to be gay / trans / etc.

and it's not like we HAVEN'T had popular pieces of queer representative media that explored things outside of cheesy BL, like are we forgetting about Nimona which explored both the gay and genderfluid experience in a very accessible and fun way while still being mature and not pandering to its audience over how society has made monsters out of queer people?

(and even then I'm sure there are folks who would argue "actually, here are the issues with Nimona" , and that's fine tbh, we can like media and appreciate what it brings to the table while also discussing what it lacks in, such as what we're doing now with Heartstopper! progress is a never-ending journey!!)

and also okay, not me trying to be argumentative in the slightest BUT I don't really get the argument that 'other queer people' are being sidelined for the main characters? unless there's something I'm missing here lol (I will apologize for that because it's admittedly been a while since I've re-read Heartstopper so I should probably go do that to refresh myself on it). like i say that in the sense that Heartstopper is clearly meant to be about two gay male teenagers. just like how Nimona is about a shapeshifter who is not a girl or a boy (they're Nimona!) and a gay man who are both trying to change the system that's other'd them for years for the better. that is the story Heartstopper is trying to tell and it achieves that. it also has a trans character plotline that I could see people arguing feels sidelined but I think there's a massive difference between 'sidelining' and just having a B plot ? my honest take with that is not every piece of representative media is going to be able to cover every single topic, it's just not doable for one piece of media to be a monolith for everything, the same as how one person can't be a monolith for an entire community of people. BUT that doesn't mean works like Heartstopper and Nimona can't inspire others to also lend their voices into the medium and create that representation that's needed. That's why we need ✨variety✨ and Heartstopper is part of that variety by offering a more vanilla cutesy story full of good vibes for people who want that sort of thing.

IDK, I think there's just a lot of nuance that's being missed in that poll, and in the difference between Heartstopper inspiring more people to write happy cozy BL stories vs. implying that it's had an actual negative influence on modern art and media in the same way that series like Homestuck and LO have to the point that people think it needs to be destroyed, like wtf LOL Like they're not even comparable IMO and a lot of the arguments I see people making about why it is just feel a little backwards, and those arguments obfuscate the real issue which is just "popular thing is popular and people like to piggyback off popular shit". That's a fact for basically any niche and genre, these trends come and go. Even if the whole cutesy BL trend passes one day (which it will) it'll be replaced by something else that people will also inevitably find samey and boring after a while. This is not a concept that's unique to LGBTQ+ media, it's universal.

Balance is important and I think finding that balance is as much a responsibility on the shoulders of the consumer as it is on the creator. And I don't think Heartstopper deserves to be put into the same camp as stories like LO which literally straightwashes its canonically queer characters and gives those queer identities to nothingburger characters who are easy to shoo out of the plot to make way for the heterocis ones (while still parading itself around like it's actually 'queer rep' which... it really isn't.) Like all three of the comics in that poll are vastly different, serving different audiences, with different goals and intentions. It's comparing apples to oranges to pineapples.

The worst Heartstopper has to offer is just a low stakes plot that might not appeal to everyone or feel 'samey' which yeah, valid, but in the grander sense of whether or not it's had a negative effect on queer media just for being... cheesy? And inspiring other people to write stories like it? I don't get the argument, it feels like it's severely missing the point of what we're fighting for here - to live happy little unbothered lives - but that's just me ╮(￣ω￣;)╭ I'm definitely not trying to be a dick about it in any way and I don't want anyone to think I'm not open to the opposing points here, I do agree with you on the oversaturation of samey BL stories, but it just rose some massive red flags to see Heartstopper next to frigging Homestuck and Lore Olympus LOL

[whetstonefires]

I think a part of the reason I feel so connected to JGY and XY is that I, too, think everyone is lying about what a good person they are. Sure, there may be a few genuinely good people, but those are in the minority and never claim the title.

I don't know about never; some people are pretty straightforward.

And in some ways the whole point of the concept of 'a good person' is that the feeling of losing the right to consider yourself one can impose instinctive recoil from doing wrong, in situations where you don't have the leisure of working your way through an ethics diagram and choosing the logically moral path before reacting to a situation. It has practical utility.

But that system can backfire pretty horribly too, in a lot of ways. It can be hijacked by definitions of 'good' that actually make you recoil from ethical acts because they're deviant. It can lead to disappearing up your own ass lmao.

And definitely the threshold for 'talking about how you're a good person' enough that it makes you suspect as either a) a liar or b) someone who values that self-image over objective reality and other people's wellbeing is. Not very high.

Jin Guangyao, ironically, is one of those people who's so performatively A Good Person in his public life that in retrospect it looks like a red flag. Which knowing this about himself in an ongoing fashion ofc just reinforces his own cynicism about everyone else lmao.

Even Lan Xichen, who I think he may see as a genuinely good person, he also sees as an easy mark who will reliably choose what is comfortable over what is 'right,' if you just structure the scenario to make that an easy choice that's easy for him to justify.

Xue Yang's bitterness is in many ways more exciting than Jin Guangyao's because he has a way more unusual relationship to reality, but it does share a lot of notes.

The role of deception in his psychology fascinates me because as far as I can tell he's as instinctively straightforward a person as Lan Wangji, albeit along quite different lines involving a total lack of impulse control, but has adopted 'deceit' as a weapon against the wicked world in the same way he has adopted 'murder.'

But when he feels someone is not merely lying but papering over bad behavior with principles they are not living up to he is livid.

People claiming to be better than him because they're 'good' when 'good' is a construct of privilege, is the underlying idea he's not equipped to articulate. Except he takes that and applies it to 'hitting me to interrupt my random murder of some guy who happened to be within arm's reach when I wanted to hurt someone.'

Which isn't like philosophically perfect, but the underlying problem he's actually reacting to is that he understands the social contract as a lie that has never protected him but seeks to control him, while protecting rich men it has no power to control.

Which it is fair to be mad about, but then his feeling is that since that's the nature of the world and all people, he is entitled to amass for himself the power to inflict hurt without consequences as much as he possibly can, and to use it against the vulnerable for fun, and no one is entitled to interfere.

Which brings him to a place where he is violently angry at anyone talking about trying to treat other people well as a value, because either they're a hypocrite and a liar or they threaten his entire system of rationalization for why he can be The Worst and still In The Right.

'Everyone is equally bad, actually' is like, an understandable take for anyone who's had cause to become embittered. Everyone is free to make whatever philosophical peace they can with the world and by and large there's no ethical weight to any such opinion, in itself.

But it's an ideological crutch people tend to wind up leaning on very heavily when they can't or don't want to take responsibility for their own behavior.

Which is an approach that Xue Yang, Jin Guangyao, and Su She all share, and which not only is shitty of them, it...traps them in a wheel of doubling down on their own worst impulses because rather than going 'that was bad and I shouldn't do it again' they've repeatedly invested all this energy into making what they did actually the correct thing, according to their interpretation of the context. Which means they're more likely to do it again.

(I think this is how Jin Guangyao became a serial killer, for example. He followed a doing-a-murder-impulse and then internally doubled down on how he had nothing to be ashamed of, so he was more likely to do it again, every time.

Wei Wuxian's strain of self-righteousness about his revenge was less...thorough than Jin Guangyao's, because he had the benefit of going after people on the opposite side of a war from him while Meng Yao's first known murder plot was against a shitty boss. But it probably didn't help him not try to solve army-shaped problems with mass murder, even after that stopped being allowed.)

If any of them had just like, zero moral sensibilities they would have created very different problems, and very possibly fewer of them. It's making a central goal of your operations 'self-vindication in your own internal narrative, created retroactively via reframing' rather than 'figuring out what I think I should do and trying to do that' that traps them in the self-reinforcing murder pissbaby vortex.

So if you look at it one way, these three villains are themselves perfect examples of how pursuit of the 'feeling of being good' (or at least 'not the bad guy') can make you worse.

Notably Wei Wuxian was also extremely sensitive to hypocrisy in his youth; it was the only part of Madam Yu's behavior he was ever shown objecting to. But he's sufficiently mellow and cynical from regret and burnout by the 'present' timespan after his resurrection to just get disgusted and alienated about it, rather than outraged.

He wasn't even all that mad at Xue Yang, though honestly that may be partly because he stopped entirely characterizing him as a person at some point during their interaction. Like, there's no point being angry at someone whose moral sensibilities operate exclusively on the plane of 'is this unfair to me' for manipulating and destroying people who were good to him, and then getting obsessed with his own self-pity about it. This is not a person who understands how not to be, metaphorically speaking, a cannibal.

And Wei Wuxian did know better and still got roughly the same result, so what business does he have getting angry?

Anyway yeah those two villains are both delightfully relatable if you sit down and put their perspectives together; they are clearly operating with the same basic suite of human needs and emotions as everybody else, without that being in itself particularly exculpatory, which is honestly refreshing. They've just got the most fantastically toxic interpersonal habits that knowing them counts as some level of Suffering A Curse.

Jin Guangyao and Xue Yang do both stand as scathing rebukes of the society that created them. But within the narrative, wherein they're people, the fact is that each of them had agency and one of the things they chose to do with it was develop rationales for why they were the most special little guy and everything was someone else's fault.

And their moral nihilisms, while also grounded in serious trauma, ping me as emotional masturbation of this variety.

[kick-a-long]

Hi I'm the previous anon and I have to say - everything you added was spot on!

I want to say something extra that has been bothering me for a long time.

I can't help but feel like there are specific (major) traits of antisemitism that always appear in every other form of bigotry. As a person of many different minority groups, I am not saying antisemitism is worst than all the other forms of hatred or downplaying the rest at all. But I see these traits that I feel like are inherently antisemitic appear everywhere else and I can't stop thinking "this shows bigotry starts and stops with jew hate"?

For example, I'm from country A (not saying where for personal reasons). In this country, (mainly) Arab Christians have moved here due to religious persecution. They are a very small group and have become wealthy due to 1) transferring of wealth or 2) they used their intelligence to make businesses. Due to assimilation into whiteness, they have become "white people" as well. As a result they are victims of the "they control the country and are behind everything bad" narrative. I would argue that "they control the world" is a uniquely antisemitic belief and it goes to show how people default to antisemitism to destroy any group. Additionally, I would argue antisemitism is truly people's map to the world and they use it to navigate. Moreover, Indians in Africa had also been accused of doing the same "controlling". Now there is a lot to be said about assimilation and doing anything for power and minorities being pit against each other for division but regardless of the nuance, these negative emotions (anger, frustration, sadness, etc) tend to lead back to antisemitism? Indians in Tanzania experienced random acts of mob violence in the 1920s/30s similar to pogroms (important to note: these were not common but their existence still highlights something).

Human beings love an easy, concrete group to hate and project onto hence the reason why the left loves nazis so much (they are their easy punching bags). As a result, the hatred stems from an antisemitic belief and morphs into anti- whatever the "nuisance" is, no matter how justifiable the hatred is.

Like when people hate immigrants and chant "they will not replace us and take our jobs", am I not supposed to think everything is a big antisemitic conspiracy?

!!!this this this^^^^ I agree so much!!!

antisemitism is older than racism, literally. it was around before the concepts of race or nationhood. it was around when feudalism and slave labor was the main economic system. jews were blamed for being poor and stupid just as often as for being smart and rich. jews have always been a convenient 'other' because we have always had to identify as a diasporic group from somewhere else with different customs based on living somewhere else.

antisemitism is in most other forms of bigotry imo because it's the prototype for it, since the roman empire and the destruction of the second temple. probably before.

I think it's pretty accurate to point to aspects of it in other bigotry because it's where hateful troupes were tested and popularized for thousands of years. what's wild is that people don't even realize what antisemitism does or how it's useful to maintain power structures. it's the most time tested way to scapegoat and distract from real problems and unite against real power structures that fuck up people's lives. you see antisemitism spike around economic crisis or huge cultural swings from liberal to traditional, but you never see the blame fall on changing the laws that caused the economy to crash or try to build bridges between liberal and traditional aspects of society. you just have the scapegoat of jews, or minority populations, or homosexuals, or X, or Y... but eventually the story is always explained with jews as architects of it.

conservative states could look at the successes of LGBTQ entertainers from those states and celebrate how their tradition bore that success (true or false) but instead they reject it. southern states could celebrate the black civil rights leaders from there and the parts of their culture that generated that rebelliousness (true or false) but they reject it. you can see it all over. jews are the only ones who are adopted as "from here" when they succeed and "jewish cabal" when the tide changes. it's the conditional oppression and conditional acceptance that alienates us from all other groups.

all bigotry is based on antisemitism but antisemitism is different than all other bigotry, imo.

[ateez-himari]

[240824] ETERNAL PROJECT

[NEW UPLOAD FROM TAEMIN]

태민 (TAEMIN) @/TAEMIN_BPM

[#태민] ETERNAL owes its success to the talented young producer at the head of this project, who spent time within hectic schedules creating this masterpiece. Himari has now been part of my team for four years and keeps surpassing previous works with every release, I truly would not have made it to this point without her creative vision.

From recording demo tracks in hotel rooms to putting together instrumental drafts in the car between events, she truly did put everything into this album. At only 22 years old her leadership has brought divided opinions together and her artistic soul made unique harmonies from unexpected styles. I can not properly express my gratitude towards this wonderful young woman, but know that without her this album would not have been what it is today.

The influence she has had on the industry at such a young age is truly something rare, and I can confidently say that her and ATEEZ's careers will see nothing but success. Turning everything she touches into gold no matter how nonsensical it may be, she truly is the second Hand of Midas. Please enjoy plenty of rest when these next schedules end and take care of your health, our Himari ❤️I will ETERNALLY be grateful for your presence

#TAEMIN #ETERNAL ##히마리 #애이티즈

Translated from Korean by Google

09:35pm · 24 Aug 24 · 4.3M Views 85K Reposts 859 Quotes 2.5M Likes

mikah @/himaswife Replying to @/TAEMIN_BPM I can't believe she went from thinking about leaving the group because of hate to leading huge projects for idols as successful as Taemin. It's kind of strange seeing her growing up this fast right in front of our eyes 🥹 The talent this girl has is really unbelievable especially considering how different his style is to ATEEZ

Hotteokie N.1 @/yunhosbuckethat Replying to @/TAEMIN_BPM we forget too quickly that she was given a FULL KOMCA MEMBERSHIP before 3Racha, who are an absolute production powerhouse and even won 'best creator' at the AAA last year (also with all those royalties this girl has to be secretly rich-)

GOTTA WORK GOTTA WORK @/lightuptiny Replying to @/yunhosbuckethat it's not even a secret anymore 😭some people noticed that she was using a black card in certain videos and are pretty sure it was pulled out of her wallet. Bang Chan and her are also standing at the same number of credits right now (193)

왔다 갔다 @/yeosangiecookie Replying to @/TAEMIN_BPM I love their synergy so much, every album is always somewhat experimental in the style it uses but even though it's risky the results are breath taking 🙌 sexy concepts are pretty common for Taemin or the industry in general but this really makes you feel the sensuality, it drags you in, I honestly can't get enough of this duo

Uyu @/bulleobulleooo Replying to @/TAEMIN_BPM I'd like to remind everyone that S-Coups himself wrote in an instagram story; 'There's something very special about this girl, it's almost like she was created to make music, she's almost music herself.' when he shared a screenshot of 'Shadow' playing on Spotify

sweethwa @/weonfirewihomhae Replying to @/TAEMIN_BPM J-Hope and Jungkook went to her for their solos for a reason and as much as people like to say it's because she's privileged to have known them for a long time, they've known other producers for a long time as well. she's so versatile in her own sound that she's able to work with almost anyone because she takes their creative vision on as her own. just look at behind the scenes where she talks with Hongjoong and Mingi, she's able to use everyone's ideas to create something that has one single voice. artists tend to gravitate towards her because she finds inspiration in the people themselves, in their souls, that's what makes her so special

[speedforce-zoomies]

Y’all know what I think would make an interesting AU?

If everyone in the 90’s Young Justice was a clone or a “clone”

Canonically we’ve already got two out of the main ten

Conner Kent/Superboy being a “clone” of Superman & Lex Luthor

& Slobo being a clone of Lobo

Two things to note 1) I think it’s kinda boring if all of them have the same backstory so I’ll still try to give them all a reason that they’ve left Cadmus early in life

And 2) If we’re looking at all the various DC works 1 to 1 clones usually have some major issues

For example the other attempts at cloning Superman didn’t work, the DNA was too unstable

And in the DCAU, the Supergirl 1 on 1 clone had the side effect of being mentally connected to Supergirl which made her mentally unstable and Waller purposely avoided going the 1 to 1 route with Terry implying that it was still not a smart route to go down decades later

Therefore every “clone” will still have two “parents”

Let’s start with the other members of the core four

Tim - obviously a clone of Bruce, could add in Selena’s DNA if the scientists want some extra kick or he could still be the son of Janet so that he’s raised in a similar manner (rich kid upbringing) to Bruce

Janet and Jack could be having fertility issues and are given an opportunity to have a child through Cadmus and they just ignore all the weird stuff like rich people tend to do. Maybe they know Tim is Bruce’s clone, maybe they don’t. 🤷🏼‍♀️

Cassie - Diana Prince & Steve Trevor - not only would this give them access to the Amazons/Themyscira but also to a member of military personnel who knows a lot of stuff he probably shouldn’t

If this pairing Helena Sandsmark could be chosen to adopt her specifically so that she has a higher chance of interacting with the Greek gods which activates her powers (I mean Helena is already canonically interacting with them - might not be hard for Cadmus to realize that)

Could also do Diana & Helena Sandsmark, she could be in the same boat as Janet in the earlier scenario and just rolls with all the weird stuff.

Bart - Barry and Iris. Could still have the aging problem and still raised in Virtual Reality just some centuries behind the usual route. Imagine him thinking up the twins names himself - I mean Dawn and Don as twin names SOUND like they came from a kid raised in VR lol. When Barry and Iris later have the twins, they just roll with the names because Bart said them so matter of fact and Cadmus acts like they aren’t surprised that Bart got it right about Iris’s pregnancy.

Maybe they send him to go find Wally through suggestions from the VR so that he can better learn his powers/can become the next Flash and then Wally sends him to Max like in canon.

Now for the others…

Cissie - super easy Bonnie & Ollie. Bonnie as an Olympic-level archer wants her daughter to be the best archer and a hero and so she seeks out Cadmus and asks just straight up asks them for a clone.

Greta - I’m sorry to say is a mystery. She was a failed clone but no one seems to know who her original DNA came from.

Anita - could be a clone of her mother Oshi if Agua killed Oshi before she had Anita. Cadmus could reach out and be like hey Donald Fite it’s not the same as having your wife back but um, we could clone her? Give you a kid? Maybe Agua pushes for it idk

La'gaan - I couldn’t find much about his history prior to him becoming an Atlantis citizen so I imagine Cadmus might have captured his “parents” or maybe it’s someone who works with Orm and wants to send in a spy and though a child would be easier to get in than an adult. When Aquaman makes him a citizen he decides not to betray his confidence.

Ray - cloned from the original Ray and his wife or another golden age hero. Again pretty simple. Cadmus just thought he was neat. They are obsessed with Sun based superheroes after all. Ray is one I could see being locked up in Cadmus until the formation of the team since he was already locked away from the Sun in his origin story.

So at some point I imagine Tim would probably start to unravel things which would lead to similar events to canon (regarding the formation of the team I mean) but I just think it would be interesting since cloning is so prevalent in the DC universe to have an entire team of clones or “clones”

Maybe after distributing the other clones Luthor gets the idea to actually raise Conner himself which is always a fun AU

Plus with all this cloning going on they could potentially have the tools to prevent Slobo’s body from degrading which is a nice bonus

What do y’all think?

[dross-the-fish]

First of all I just really want to say I absolutely LOVE your art and specially the way you draw Erik, Leroux-Erik my beloved 😭💕

Ok ANYWAY. I saw your posts discussing about Erik and how the Phandom portray him and Raou, and I really want to point out some of my views (in the healthiest and most polite way possible!!!)

I'm not trying to deny Erik's flaws nor that I have an obvious bias since he's my favorite character ever AAAND Raoul is a character I dislike a LOT for multiple reasons lol but, I want to adress that: Erik is a person that endured multiple ways of abuse and humiliation in his life, since he was a child. He has multiple scenes of trauma response and, as you pointed out your post, acts impulsively many times and also shows clear remorse for his actions. What I think separates him from Raoul is (aside from the obvious class diference and the fact that Erik has a whole history of trauma and evidences of mental illness) the fact that Erik learns something from his selfish, self-destructive behaviour. He *had* a chance to end up with Christine if he didn't so shitty with her, and this is very impactful in the end specially because Leroux didn't treat him as a villain who deserved punishment, but as a traumatized AND completely abandoned person who fucked up pretty bad

Obviously, despite my personal beef with Raoul, I don't think he's some sort of abusive devil or any shit like that. I just think Christine would be better at her own. Forgetting Erik's flaws for a minute — Raoul *is* very manipulative, childish and uncaring towards Christine. He, unlike Erik, doesn't learn from his mistakes and presents the same behavior until the end of the story. Idk my girl Christine could be better at her own, single, following her career. The fact that Raoul was born in a rich family in the 19th century and didn't face any of the poberty or struggles that lower-classed people like Daroga, Erik and Christine had also make his character waaaay more difficult to like in my point of view. I'm NOT SAYING THAT "being rich makes you evil" (duh) nor that Erik's actions are ok, just to be clear! It just bothers me how so many people treat Raoul like a saint little puppy and Erik as a monster, like COME ON

Now, back to Erik: I'm not saying you intended to mean that, but I have a huge problem with how part of the Phandom thinks Erik had malicious intentions when approaching Christine, or that his feelings for her are fake. The "Erik knew precisely what he was doing since the start" really makes sense considering how his redemption arc went in the novel. Obviously this changes a lot in many adaptations (for example he's clearly much more self-aware and manipulative in the musical). But Leroux-Erik *genuinely* believed he was doing the right thing. Maybe he had an idea of "uuuugh maybe this is pretty bad maybe i should stop" but the self-destructive-fear-of-abandoment-everything-is-fine voice spoke louder. Let's not forget that what turned Erik into having such a violent mental breakdown was not "Christine doesn't love me and I must punish her" bullshit, it was when he heard her speaking not so many cool things about him and his appearance at his back (NOT BLAMING OR HATING HER, I love Christine, I'm talking about Erik's pov). If Erik didn't love Christine, or if he was a monster, he wouldn't feel any guilty for his actions. The most impactful thing in the ending of POTO is that Erik realized he had treated the woman he loved like trash and even still she showed him the compassion he needed

Ok ending this long ass text, I just wanted to state that I agree with a lot of your points specially how the Phandom tends to summarize everything to black and white even though most of the characters are all morally grey. I wanted people to stop dehumanizing a mentally ill abuse survivor like Erik while also stop hating on a poor woman who never asked to be put into Raoul's or Erik's bullshit lol thanks for having the patience to read, I'm really curious to know what your thoughts about this are 💕💕💕

I appreciate your courtesy, I understand where you are coming from but there are a few points i'm not sure I fully agree with. While it is fair to depict Erik as traumatized or mentally ill, I feel these are ultimately reasons for his behavior, not justifications. I agree that he is a sympathetic character and his story is a tragic one, I also agree that Erik had a great capacity for good under better circumstances. Leroux says "he had a heart that could hold empires but had to content himself with a cellar," or something to that effect and I believe that's true. But some of Erik's behavior cannot be written off as impulse or trauma response. He was still an assassin who built torture chambers and even when no longer in Persia he still had a torture chamber in his home that he made use of. He has enough agency that he can still be held responsible for all of the death and destruction he caused even as we acknowledge that he doesn't enjoy killing and feels remorse. How he deals with his remorse in particular is a bit of a sticking point for me. Erik's consistent ability to willfully "forget" what he does or completely deny the severity of his crimes is very likely a product of guilt but the presence of guilt is not a sign of virtue and after awhile it starts to feel like he is first and foremost dodging accountability. He never feels guilty enough to stop and prefers instead to alleviate his internal discomfort by emotionally distance himself from his actions. I also think it's important to acknowledge that Erik is a villainous character and he is violent with Christine. He does try terrorize her and coerce her into marrying him by threatening to kill her and everyone else. To be honest that's why I like his redemption, because he actually NEEDS to be redeemed. You can't redeem a character that never fell from grace. If we can't hold him accountable for his choices and acknowledge the full harm he did then his redemption is hollow. On the subject of Raoul, Leroux tends to write him as being kind of young and stupid and most of his boorish behavior the product of youthful impulse and the older I get the more I'm inclined to agree. This doesn't make Raoul right or even necessarily likeable but if we're giving Erik grace based on the author's sentiments towards the character we should probably give some to Raoul as well. Ultimately I feel Raoul redeems himself by proving he's willing to die for Christine. He throws himself into mortal peril to save her because he does love her. Yes, he has a lot of privilege compared to other characters and it certainly contributes to him coming off spoiled and bratty at times but at the end of the day he and Christine do love each other and he is who she chose. I'll admit I sometimes feel compelled to defend Raoul even if he's not remotely close to my favorite character just because the fandom tends to over inflate his flaws and hold him to the worst faith interpretation while making every excuse under the sun for Erik. The phandom will go to great lengths to see nuance and humanity in Erik's behavior but not in Raoul's and, while I have my own character preferences and Erik is certainly my favorite by a long shot, I try to be fair and empathetic to ALL the characters in the story, whether I actually like them or not.

[metanarrates]

i have a lot of mixed feelings regarding trans headcanons in orv, or in general in fandom spaces because of how often its taking transmisogynistic jokes and bending them to actually have a cool and awesome meaning instead of just reading fiction with transgender characters. how do you feel about this as an everyone in orv is transfem poster (not accusatory tone i am genuinely wondering your take on this)

I think it's complicated because i Do agree that most trans headcanons in fandom are rooted in transphobic ideas, especially when it comes to transfem characters. I actually personally wouldn't trust most people who headcanon characters as trans unless they're able to point out when something in the text is transmisogynistic. and orv does have transmisogynistic stuff in it. the whole joke with nirvana and the entire scene with the pink kids is based around transfems being predators and men in disguise. I really don't want to hang around other orv fans unless they're able to point that out. (also, i would Definitely not trust anyone who refers to those characters as trans icons or whatever.)

I'll also fully admit that I don't remember the revolutionary arc all that well. at the time when I first read it, I just simply assumed that jang hayoung was meant to be a trans woman, and any issues kim dokja had with recognizing her gender was interesting because of how it tied into the metafictional elements about how characters can change beyond a reader's perception. from my recollection, and from the readings of other people in my life who have read the novel, it seemed canon that she was intentionally transfem. similarly, I felt like the plot point of "yoo joonghyuk has a female alter ego" was taken pretty seriously, rather than being a meanspirited joke. if I'm not remembering that right, though, please let me know.

orv in general has a problem in depictions of lgbt people. there's the abovementioned transmisogyny with nirvana and the pink kids, and there's also the undeniable fact that "kim dokja and yoo joonghyuk are gay but haha Not Actually" is leaned on a little bit too much as a joke. I have a similarly complicated relationship to the idea of shipping them for that reason - I think their relationship is meaningful and rich, but I really dislike that the fandom seems to just take that joke as an uncritical BL trope, rather than discussing how it's sometimes a bit homophobic. again, I don't trust joongdok shippers who aren't able to discuss this.

at the same time, though, I do think that if you're aware of the problems in the text, it's possible to construct a lot of rich meaning out of applying queer lenses to the text. there's a lot to dig into regarding how the story depicts gender, for example, and how it depicts transcendence and self-actualization. you can't credit the authors here - like I said, their writing has several issues with lgbt people. but as long as you aren't advertising the story as Queer Fiction, I find that it's extremely valuable to discuss how a trans reading might cast an interesting light onto a character. and on a more personal level, I think having these sorts of open discussions about both the problems and merits of trans readings, as well as the issues present in a text, do tend to make a lot of trans people feel more welcome in fan spaces. both are necessary for making a story and space that may be hostile towards them feel more welcoming.

yes, I do agree that it would probably be better to read fiction with better trans characters. those stories are out there! this is also why I am wary to praise singshong for jang hayoung's character - I don't think orv exactly Deserves a reputation as a trans inclusive story, especially when there's a lot more of those that are much better at it out there.

but at the end of the day, there are going to be trans people who do like orv, all the same. I'm one of them, though I will say upfront that I am tme and therefore much less affected by the story's problems. my fiancee is transfem and she likes it. a lot of my mutuals who like orv are trans. I don't think it's such a bad thing that we've constructed these community readings in a work we already liked for its other merits. we're going to be here anyway. as long as we do our best to be respectful and point out problems as they arise, I think it's a good thing that we're having these sorts of discussions.

[rainbowsky]

hi Rbs,

there is a conspiracy theory going around on twitter that GG is reported for tax evasion, is it true?

Actually, it's worse than that. 😔

Both GG and DD have been reported.

HOWEVER. The reports are clearly fishing expeditions, maliciously submitted by anti-fans. To be clear: There is no credible information that either GG or DD is involved in any wrongdoing.

The initial report was done against GG by a DD fan, and in retaliation, someone reported DD using the same methods.

The reports are general and vague, saying basically, "This guy has made so much money, he's got so many endorsements, surely somewhere along the way he's cheating on his taxes." In essence, they're calling on the government to audit GG and DD.

The way things work in China, anyone can make a report and the government encourages people to report each other. It's pretty toxic and awful, to be honest.

Reports done anonymously tend not to be taken as seriously as reports that are accompanied by the real name and ID of the person making the report. In the case of Song Zuer who was recently reported, she was reported by someone connected to her company, which lends more credibility to the allegations because it's possible that person was close enough to her operations to have potentially witnessed some wrongdoing.

The other reason that 'real name' reports are taken more seriously is that if someone makes a baseless report they can be sued for 'reputation damage' by the person or company that was reported. Therefore the thinking is, "No one would make a real name report unless they were sure there was wrongdoing."

In this case, both the reports against GG and DD were 'real name' reports, so theoretically GG and DD could sue the people who reported them if it turns out that the reports were false or malicious.

But now we get to the deeper issue - why the reports were made in the first place.

People make reports like this in hopes that the rumors, negative publicity and speculation will kill the target's career.

In China - especially with the economic struggles burdening ordinary people - any 'rich celebrity' thought to have been evading taxes is massively hated by the general public. Brands and backers will step away from that star in order to avoid risk.

And there doesn't have to be any clear evidence of wrongdoing for that backlash to happen. Song Zuer's case hasn't been concluded (and therefore nothing has been proved against her) yet she's already dealing with fallout from the report against her.

And that, in truth, is why it's safe for these assholes to make false, baseless reports against GG and DD. Because they know neither of them is likely to sue. Both GG and DD are going to want to avoid the negative publicity and speculation about them, so there are not likely to be any consequences for these antis. Not unless serious reputational damage occurs, in which case the damage will have already been done and the anti's mission will have already been accomplished.

Can this harm GG and DD?

Yes, it absolutely can. In a couple of different ways:

1] The rumors alone could seriously harm them

If the story starts gaining traction, even on the basis of these obviously false, ridiculous reports, any public buzz about GG and DD evading taxes could be enough to seriously damage and even destroy their careers.

This doesn't seem likely, though, because the reports are obvious bullshit. In the case of Song Zuer, the report involved detailed allegations from someone who had worked for/with her. In both GG and DD's reports, the information is vague and generalized, and the reports come from obvious antis.

The story hasn't been getting a lot of attention and will hopefully blow over.

2] An audit could put them at risk

Because they are 'real name' reports, the government might decide to take them seriously and audit GG and DD's business and financial dealings. And because of the likely volume of transactions, vendors, partners, contracts, etc. and because of the way business is done in China, it's possible an error or violation could be found.

If a thorough audit of every aspect of their dealings is conducted, they and everyone working for/with them will need to have had a totally immaculate record of every transaction and every receipt, the phrasing of every contract must be absolutely perfect, the math on every transaction will have to have been perfect, etc. in order for them to be in the clear.

Even if GG and DD and those closest to them are incredibly diligent and aboveboard on everything they do, it's possible that someone connected to them let something slide or failed to follow correct procedures somewhere along the way. If that happens, they could end up on the hook for something they were unaware of and didn't directly sign off on.

GG and DD and those they've worked with will need to have never made any mistakes or slacked off on anything ever in order for them to be totally safe. It might be impossible for that to be true for even the most upright and diligent of people.

And there is financial incentive for auditors to find even small errors, because that can mean huge fines - aka huge revenue - for a government that is currently strapped for cash.

Even a relatively minor violation or error of this sort could potentially seriously harm GG and DD's careers and reputations. The public isn't going to care that a transaction was incorrectly recorded or filed by accident or because of an error or misunderstanding. All they're going to hear is "So-and-so fined for 'irregular transactions'" or whatever, and they're going to assume the worst.

Brands and backers are increasingly risk-averse, and will step away from any artist who is involved in any type of scandal or is unpopular with the public.

Final thoughts

So yeah, this is really fucked up. This is yet another example of why fan wars are so fucked up - why fan culture is so fucked up. If you've heard me ranting about how much I hate fan culture and you've ever wondered why, look no further.

At this point I am not worried, nor do I think you should be. These are clearly malicious reports aimed at harming them, and we have to trust GG and DD and trust the system to sort it out.

Both GG and DD are in the government's good books right now, which they wouldn't be if they hadn't been thoroughly vetted by the powers that be. In my view, it's highly unlikely this will lead to any lasting harm.

I hope that the government will do something to change the way these reports are handled to make it less likely for them to be used in such frivolous, malicious ways. However, I won't be holding my breath on that. A core principle of reporting culture is to make it as easy and risk-free as possible for people to report others.

One thing we can be sure of is that GG and DD and their teams have put a lot of resources, preparation and thought into how to handle these types of situations, and will be bringing all their expertise to bear on it in the coming days and weeks.

So, Anon, let's just trust GG and DD's teams to handle things. I think it's all going to be fine.

[linkspooky]

You've written about Overhaul in the past. Any tips on writing him accurately?

Overhaul's actually one of the most complex villains in the story that's not a part of the league of villains, however since he's pretty unlikable and has mostly negative and unsavory character traits he's not discussed as often. However when it comes to writing him, there's a lot of rich material to mine here.

So my starting point whenever trying to write a character and make them as in-character as possible, is to figure out what the author intended for them in story. What role are they supposed to play? What function do they serve? In my opinion, Chisaki was an attempt by Horikoshi to twist a lot of traditional "good guy" traits into a villainous character that the audience would despise.

One of my biggest ways of doing this is to compare them to other characters, especially haracters who aren't given as much screentime because there are lots of cogs in a story and often the purpose of one character is to highlight a personality trait in another character because they share it.

Now I'm going to explain Chisaki's characterization by comparing them to another character, but here's the curveball here: I'm not going to use Shigaraki. Because I can explain it real quick with Shigaraki, the purpose of Chisaki is to show how Shigaraki's leadership differs from Chisaki because Shigaraki sees his allies as more than just pawns to be utilized. However, to come to understand why Chisaki wholeheartedly believes that everyone exists to be used thoroughly to further his own ends, we're going to look at a different character.

Hawks and Chisaki are both bird-themed. They are both orphans who were taken in by an organization at a young age, Chisaki by the Yakuza and Hawks by the hero commission. They are both also extremely fanatically loyal to that organization and do everything possible to ensure that organizations survival, in part because they feel they have to repay being taken in.

They are both characters who were introduced to the league of villains, trusted by Twice, only to turn around and kill a member of the league. For Hawks it was literally Twice himself he killed. They were also initially presented as cooperating with the league, but when they reveal their true colors it shows how they view people in stark contrast to how the league views and treats it's own members. Which like, Hawks does not come out looking pretty in the comparison.

Hawks doesn't actively abuse children so he has that over overhaul, but he does drag them onto battlefields that are basically an active warzone where the villains are fighting to kill. Which means that much like Overhaul, he tends to treat children the way he was treated: Ie, weaponizing them.

If you are familiar with Hawks mindset, "I am a pawn, so therefore everyone else is a pawn that I can maneuver around to obtain my objective" then it's easy to extrapolate the same onto Chisaki. Hawks talks about dirtying his hands, Chisaki is literally a germaphobe who has panic attacks if he gets blood on his hands (I'm exaggerating only slightly).

Chisaki is introduced with a deep psychological need to stay clean and avoid everything he considers filth, dirty, or diseased a rampant paranoia of his which spreads to his hatred of quirks. We never get the reason why Chisaki hates quirks, besides the fact that the advent of heroes threatened his home in the Yakuza, but if we're going to extrapolate here it's probably due to the grotesque nature of his own quirk. He literally targets Eri because their quirks are similiar and he finds hers to be incredibly disgusting, and justifies his abuse of her with that logic.

My pet theory is that he was either abandoned by his parents because of hsi quirk, or that he was taken in by AFO at some point and deliberately targeted by his quirk like Toya was (people have pointed out that the wallpaper here and the children playing int he background resemble the house that Toya was taken to).

So, what we get here is Chisaki hates quirks, and he likely hates his own quirk possibly because of how he was treated in childhood because of it. He was definitely exploited by the same man who took him in due to that quirk, considering the fact he's a yakuza enforcer and has probably been committing violent crime since childhood. Once again, a Hawks trait, to be born with a prodigious quirk and yet find that quirk incredibly filthy.

Hawks and Chisaki are a study in how characters can be painted to have "good guy" and "bad guy" traits, when really they're only being painted that way because of circumstances or surroudnings. Hawks in a lot of ways acts the same as Chisaki, he just happens to be manipulating people for the heroes, not to restore the Yakuza. Chisaki values no one, everyone including his childhood friend, the people he takes in off the streets, are pawns to be utilized by the best of their aiblity. He even tries to teach Shigaraki to play Shogi (Shigaraki not knowing how to play probably signifying how much he views people differently).

So, Chisaki's willing to utilize everyone around him in service of a goal, the worth they have is to how he can use them to benefit his larger goal in mind and he's got no qualms about it.

Villainous trait, villainous trait, you say but Hawks does the same thing basically maneuvering everyone on the battlefield in the first and second wars the way Chisaki does, he just does it for an entirely different goal. He's even willing to personally betray and mutilate someone who trusted him in order to achieve that goal. Chisaki's point of no return is him completely massacring Nemoto in order to fuse with him when the tables started to turn against him in his fight against the hero. Hawks stabs Twice in the back in order to prevent him from using his quirk to stop the raid. In both cases it's a personal betrayal of someone who was good to them and trusted them.

You could say Hawks did it for the greater good, but for CHisaki who only knows his Yakzua way of life he's doing it for the survival of the only life he knows. Which is why I say they're so similiar, Hawks isn't really protecting innocent people, he's protecting his role in the hero commission. He takes what he was raised to do to the extreme.

Which is another central character trait they share, Chisaki's biggest defect is that he never, ever gives up on anything ever. A traditionally heroic trait especially in the shonen manga where the character never gives up ever, but his determination is twisted into something hideous because he has no qualms about making sacrifices to get what he wants.

Since childhood Chisaki has done absolutely everything to protect the family's dignity, to the point where it was disturbing. He never changes his mind, never backs down, even when the man he's trying to repay goes against him, but it comes from the same source as Hawks.

He believes he owes the person who took him in, and does everything he does in service of that debt.

So the last part is Chisaki's germophobia himself. Now Chisaki is a man completely divorced from his own sense of guilt who doesn't really hesitate before making heinous actions, but I wouldn't say he feels nothing,the man's clearly not mentally well. If anything I'd say his own germophobia is a metaphor for the guilt and self-loathing he feels and chooses to ignore.

He usually has breakdowns shortly after using his quirk as well. He'll absolutely brutalize people and then have a breakdown about the blood that they've gotten on him. Which suggests he you know, probably does not enjoy bloodshed in any real way. You could even compare it to Shigaraki's statement that he always feels like there's a constant sickness no matter what he destroys, which is likely his repressed guilt that AFO played off as some kind of urge to destroy, or the way Shigarki carries his hands of his family on him so he'll never forget his own self-disgust at murdering them.

Chisaki is living completely divorced from his own sense of guilt, until he's not. Once you remove him from his position of power, when he's away from the mission and forced to sit in his prison cell in tartarus he's reduced to a shambling mess that just constantly apologizes over and over to his boss and begs for the chance to see him again.

Which means that Chisaki represses all of his emotions to perform a task, and when he si not performing a task or functioning in a role he falls to pieces, because he doesn't have any sort of life except for serving in the yakuza. He's even referred to as a "gangster without a heart" because he literally has nothing else and no identity.

Chisaki's gotta be a gangster and he'll even throw a coup and put his boss in a coma for fear of losing that place in the world, because what else is there for him?

He even hates being called by his real name, much like Hawks, so his central issue is really a lack of identity because he was raised in a fishbowl with no other place to belong in the real world. Except we saw Chisaki when he was taken out of his fishbowl, and all he did was flop around like a magikarp.

As for general guidelines on his voice:

The germaphobia is a constant thing with him. Don't put your shoes in my table. Don't breathe in my direction. Hey stop bleeding on me your blood is filthy.

He talks down to people in general. He's extremely condescending with Shigaraki right off the bat, and states to his face that the only worth that Shigaraki and the League will ever have is pawns to be used as a part of his plan.

He flips between being detached, and extreme anger. Basically he's able to act cold and detached when things are going his way, and when people resist his plans or manipulations he then switches to browbeating, bullying or just otherwise lashing out in anger. If the square peg won't fit in the round hole, then just hit it harder until it does. He's cold and calculating until his calculations fail then he just brute forces it.

He's generally pretty good at negging people, he's got Eri convinced that her quirk is disgusting and she's the source of the misfortune around her. He's also got a bunch of street rats incredibly loyal to him by convincing them they can literally do no better in life than being used as a part of his plan.

He also has a softer and more polite side that only comes out in front of the boss. This is his childish side too. When he's fighting Deku and has basically lost, he flashes back to his boss patting him on the head and thanking him for protecting the family's honor. He literally just craves validation from the closest thing he has to a father figure. He'll go to any lengths to get it.

In general Chisaki should be disturbingly inhuman too, not just in his actions, but in his rationale and how far he can go and how little he considers other people in the equation. Even his own childhood friend and fellow yakuza finds him to be offputting. His boss asks him point blank, "What are humans to you?"

Basically, he's creepy, weird, anti-social, uses everyone around him, and is also completely divorced from his own feelings and sense of guilt which lets him run roughshod over other people's feelings.

So, y'know. Hawks.

Except Hawks puts on a charming and likable personality, whereas Chisaki's personality is having no personality.

[jiangwanyinscatmom]

It’s funny that ‘tiger moms’ are viewed as such a default thing when they’re very much tied to the whole ‘China just came out of the century of humiliation, the civil war, the cultural revolution, life sucks but if you work hard you can get a better life’; it’s why it’s so common in diaspora/immigrant families. If you’re rich, chinese parents tend to be pretty lax as long as you’re not an absolute embarrassment.

Also the stuff people are complaining about in mxtx writing is funny because like most of that is just normal cn writing stuff. Truly people need to watch more cdramas than cql

It's so tiring to see this as some major default when it's very much a generational thing. And why die on this hill of normalizing fictional abusive adults with this take when the novel is reiterating the exact opposite

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

And as you said this is all very common material in cdramas or any other cmedia. There are entire warnings about CP materials and only featuring said canon CP's for such things because the fans do not pay to see side pairs they want the canon ones and what is expected. Just look at the mess of romance gatchas and the uproar if devs even hint of a side character with a main from a CP. As well as the reason as to why the Untamed got what it got and had been an out of the norm production the fans fought to get.

For all the complaints of tags, web novels have those in order for readers to find what they want and don't want for original publications. You get what you get upfront and if you want love triangles, side ships it will be upfront with that, if you bother to look yourself and I dunno... bother to navigate a novel site yourself for once?

But ahhhh so many rants with some of this and the supposed fandom etiquette that just is not the same as the western sphere and shouldn't have to be because it's not from that base to begin with and authors shouldn't have to cater to American fanbase expectations.

[bthump]

Ik what your stance is on liking Griffs character and I have nothing against it because Griffith's character is arguably one of the best written characters in Berserk, he's actually my guilty favorite.

But sometimes, I catch myself SILENTLY judging ppl who like characters that do morally incorrect things like Mori from Bungou Stray Dogs who's a straight up p*do or same with Hisoka or many other characters who tend to be p*dos and r*pists.

so i guess my question sorta fall in, when do you draw the line in liking a character?

I mean, Griffith did unfortunately rape casca (a horrible writing decision, really). anyways, I guess I sorta try to seek justification like "Oh but Miura wrote the rape scene in such a ridiculous way that I can't seem to really fully have the idea that Griff is a rapist in mind"

or sometimes i just yk, love the character design and how he was written (esp post eclipse god, he is awesome!!)

but sometimes...I see ppl who are justifably upset that I like a character that happens to SADLY have a stupidly written key point where he rapes a character.

And I don't blame ppl who hate Griff for raping her, bc theres been times where I also hate charcters for how they were pedos or also SA'd someone...so why is the line so blurry when it comes to liking Griffith and how can I ig put myself in a position where I don't feel bad for liking him?

tbh I don't have a line when it comes to fictional characters.

Or maybe more accurately, my line isn't which characters people like, but how they discuss them. I wouldn't judge someone (morally, I might judge their taste lol) for liking any character ever, no matter how awful, because I don't know what they like about them, what their lines are, what they feel comfortable ignoring or reasoning away or happily playing up because they like dark shit in fiction, etc. It's all fair game as far as I'm concerned. If they like a rapist I don't assume they love real rape, I assume they like dark fiction and consider them a really well-written villain, or they like other aspects of the character and the rape doesn't ruin it for them, or they like the character design and don't care that much about fictional crimes, or maybe they have a rape kink which is also perfectly fine, etc.

But yk, when people use harmful rhetoric to discuss a character they like, that's when I start judging. Eg I'm fine with people who love Guts. I'm not fine with people who say things like "Casca should forgive Guts for the assault because he stopped himself before going too far," eg. I'd be fine if they said "Casca should forgive Guts because it would make for a more satisfying story" though - I'd judge their taste in fiction and ability to analyze the story lol, but I don't think that opinion would make them a bad person. I'm fine with people who love Farnese, I'm fine with people who prefer her to Casca, but I'm not fine with anyone who might frame it like, Farnese is better than Casca because she's rich and white and from a respectable family. (I've never seen this take lol, but yk, as a hypothetical.)

Also in my personal experience I find that people who like characters due to their own offensive biases tend to have a hard time hiding it, so it's pretty easy to judge them by their own character, rather than their fictional preferences. And in my own experience the worst kinds of people tend to like heroic characters more than villains lol. If anything I find that liking characters who do "morally incorrect things" is often a sign that I'll get along with that person.

There's also something to be said here re: watsonian vs doylist perspectives. I think people who view media from a purely watsonian perspective, ie kind of buying into the fictional story as if it's real, attempting to understand the characters the way someone would understand a real person and relate to them on those terms, are going to have a harder time dealing with morally dark characters.

I tend to view media from a doylist perspective, which means I view the characters as constructions that help tell a story, and I generally judge them on what they bring to that story and how effectively they serve it. I wouldn't want to be friends with most of my faves, and I like a lot of characters who do terrible things, because those characters are fun to watch and read about. So disliking a character just because they did a bad thing doesn't really make sense to me on a personal level. I get why other people feel that way, but I don't care about fictional harm. I'll hate a character for being mildly annoying when they're on screen, but I generally won't hate a character for committing atrocities, unless they're depicted in a way that pisses me off lol. Like, I love Femto, I hate Isidro. Femto is cool even with the obnoxious rape scene, Isidro is annoying even though he's an innocent kid.

(Also I guess to be completely fair I'd judge someone for liking a character who exists solely as like, fascist political propaganda. But I do mean solely, like I'm talking shit like The Turner Diaries, not like the MCU or cop shows lol. Or like, if someone says they love the protag of Atlas Shrugged they'd better clarify that they disagree with the political messaging and they like him for xyz reasons, because it's such an infamously libertarian story that I'm gonna side-eye anyone who likes it by default, bc I feel like in this day and age very few people are reading Ayn Rand for the story lol. So I do technically have some lines in terms of judging fans of characters, but they're pretty uncommon lines.)

tl;dr I don't think you should feel bad for liking Griffith and idt you should even feel like you have to justify it by saying the rape scene was badly written. It was, and I think it's totally fair if that helps you like Griffith more, but even if the rape scene was super well-written and respectful to Casca and thematically significant etc etc Griffith would still be a fantastically written character imo.

And I don't know the other examples you gave personally, but as a general rule I think it's better to judge people for how they behave than for what kinds of fiction they enjoy. I do at least have friends who like Hisoka, presumably because he's a fun, entertaining character give or take the creepiness, and they're awesome people.

I don't think you should have to like those characters yourself ofc, rape/pedophilia/etc etc is a pretty understandable line to draw in terms of your own enjoyment of a fictional character, but other people have different lines and I think that's reasonable too.