#and not ace + aro as an afterthought

[contagious-watermelon]

i love the visibility and inclusion we aromantics get

[heartless-aro]

Reminder that just because a character isn’t explicitly referred to as aspec doesn’t mean that it isn’t harmful to the aspec community when the character is written in a way that implicitly ties their cruelty or their violence or their evil acts to their disinterest in romance, sex, or other forms of relationships. Dexter Morgan may have never been called aromantic or asexual in-text, but when I came out as aro ace to my family, I still got a reaction of “Oh, so like the main character from Dexter! He doesn’t have interest in those sort of relationships either, because he’s a serial killer.”

J.K. Rowling may have never called Voldemort aromantic, but she did directly tie his evil acts and his choice to be a genocidal monster to the fact that he cannot feel love. People have told me that this wasn’t arophobic of her at all, because “his inability to love is psychopathy, not aromanticism!” Ableism against people with personality disorders aside, this doesn’t actually change the fact that Rowling’s writing, specifically her characterization of Voldemort, is deeply arophobic. When I read the Harry Potter series as a kid, it made me feel broken and dirty, and I remember realizing abruptly that this writer whose work I had gotten so invested in would likely have seen a part of me—which I didn’t yet have the words to describe but which was a core part of my being—as something evil, immoral, and shameful.

Anyway, a character doesn’t have to identify as aromantic or as asexual to be written in a way that’s arophobic and/or acephobic. Discussions of aro coding and ace coding are often relegated to the realm of headcanons, and that can make it feel almost like we aren’t “allowed” to call out arophobia and acephobia in mainstream media. This character who kicks puppies and commits genocide every other Tuesday due to being incapable of love isn’t really aromantic, right? That’s just a headcanon.

But even without our words being used to describe these characters, we are still harmed by the existence of characters who are evil because they don’t love or who are just too evil and gross for the writers to feel comfortable imagining them in a sexual or romantic relationship (We don’t want to think about Dark Lord Puppy Kicker kissing someone or having SEX! Ew! He’s far too repulsive to be thought of in such a light. Let’s just imply he doesn’t care for such things.). This rant is a bit messy and disorganized because I’m very tired, but hopefully y’all get what I’m trying to say.

[sircarolyn]

asexuals (and aromantics) asexuality (and aromanticism) asexuals(/aromantics!) (and aros!) (aro)ace (aromanticism!!)

[nightvale359]

I would appreciate it if more aroace rep focused a little less on the ace part and a little more on the aro part

[moinsbienquekaworu]

The struggle between being happy that all kinds of aspecs are talking about aspec experiences more and barely being able to stand the way people talk about aspec experiences

[actual-corpse]

I wish I was allowed to be lgbt+

I wonder if I would be happier. Feel more fulfilled. Find love, not only external but also internal.

[pansexual-pied-piper]

Hate how some ppl seem to read aro as afterthought

[communitypoolswimlessons]

Aromantic/Aro-spec people deserve visibility. Asexual/Ace-spec people deserve visibility.

[our-arospec-experience]

The whole time I’ve identified as aromantic, I’ve also identified as ace, because I don’t feel sexual attraction. But the ace label has always made me uncomfortable, and feels wrong, I guess.

Figuring out I was Aro meant lots of things clicked, and I felt relieved to know it. It felt important and is the huge banner of my sexuality. The ace part however I was just kinda like yeah sure whatever, and it’s kinda an afterthought. Being aromantic means so much to me, and feels like my whole sexuality. I’m proud of it.

But with sexual attraction, honestly, I don’t really feel I’m ace-spec or allo. And I know that may sound weird but it’s just me. The ace label makes me uncomfortable if referring to me (no internalised acephobia, they’re lovely folks, some of my favourite people are ace - I’m just unhappy if it’s describing me).

I know this is an Aro blog, so it may be weird I brought up asexuality here, but I wanted to know if it’s possible that maybe I’m just an aro identity I don’t know about, because lately it feels like that.

If not thanks for reading anyway, it felt good to get out. To anyone reading this: you are valid and I hope you have an amazing day. You deserve it. -💚👾 (if that’s not taken <2)

thanks for sharing :) ! You can absolutely fit a label and yet not want to use it, you are still valid.

[sheyri]

My Triple A experience at Pride

I love going to Pride. Being among fellow queer people, loud music, blocking traffic with our demonstration, and just vibing. I try to attend as many as I can and travel for hours on full trains if necessary.

Big Prides are great, but I especially love smaller ones in rural areas. It's less of a party and more of a demonstration, as it should be. Unfortunately rural in my area means risking confrontations with nazis, but that's a different story.

But no matter how much I love being at Pride, there's always this underlying feeling of being excluded.

Even at smaller Prides, I'm usually not the only person with an ace flag. Occasionally you can find someone with an aro flag, sometimes even an aroace person. Rarely someone with an agender flag. Though there are more people with those as pins or other accessories. But hey, most people just have the rainbow flag and no one has to disclose their sexuality or gender. In short, the people in the demonstration are great!

But from the organisation side? It's almost like the A doesn't exist! Stage discussions? Nope, at most they name asexual when they go through the list of labels. Info material? I saw one flyer about grey asexuality. Stickers? Yeah, okay, those exist in the mix, but mostly ace.

On the other hand you see lesbian and gay, trans and bi everywhere. I love penis/I love vagina, love is love, love who you want, etc. Great to see that political parties don't look past the LGBT. Nice that discussions include non-binary people as an afterthought.

When talking about love all the time, is it too much to ask to mention there are different kinds of love? That love doesn't have to be romantic to be valid? That it can be whatever you want it to be? Mention the split attraction model in info material? Have info material about aromanticism at all? Some parties actually have an aromantic sticker, but those are even rarer than ace ones.

This year there's a lot of talk about legally changing your gender, because they finally changed the law in Germany to make it a lot easier. The stage discussions are all about how it used to be and how much easier it is now. I'm not sure if I heard mention of non-binary and intersex people in this regard. If, then it wasn't much. Would've been nice to hear them mention that "diverse" is an option for your legal gender, or that you can have it removed all together. And why and for whom that is important. Especially since some federal states banned gender sensitive language from schools and government places, to "protect the German language". (They criticised that and it's a whole different rant.) Come on, gender isn't a binary, some people exist somewhere in the middle, or outside of it, or don't have a gender at all. That's not new information and queer organisations like Pride should be well aware of that and speak about it! But I guess that topic is too risky and too uncomfortable for a stage in a public place.

TL,DR Pride is great, but as an aroace agender person I often feel excluded and unseen at least to some extent.

All that said, I have to end on something positive: my favourite Pride so far - CSD Göttingen 2023.

Organised by the community, for the community. No political parties were present, because they were not invited and not welcome. Instead we had queer organisations talking on stage and manning booths. Including the local asexual and aromantic network.

There were banners along the demonstration route, saying love is love. They were put up by the city, independently, without asking the organisers if those banners were wanted. They were not. (The organisers said that.)

Out of 15 Prides I went to so far, this one was the one where I felt most at home. Unfortunately it's quite far from where I live and this year it shares a date with another Pride I want to attend, so I can't go there again. Hopefully next year. And hopefully they can keep going like this. Independent from politicians.

[sarocasm]

Total aces: 55

Total aros: 36 1/2 (counting the Shadowhunters one as 1/2 due to the show un-aroing the character)

Confirmed aces: 41

Confirmed aros: 21 1/2

Aroaces: 35 1/2

Alloaros: 1

Alloaces (& possibly non-SAM aces): 19 1/2

List/ Collage with A-Spec Characters: canon confirmed, and popular headcanons

Colours:

Canon confirmed: blue

popular headcanon/ speculation: orange

Alastor, Hazbin Hotel: ace, aro

Senku Ishigami, Dr. Stone: ace, aro

Vi Moradi, Star Wars: ace, aro

Victor Vale, Vicious: ace, biromantic

Spongebob: ace

Kirby: ace, aro, non-binary

the Knight, Hollow Knight: agender, ace, aro

Todd Chavez, BoJack Horseman: ace

Georgia Warr, Loveless: ace, aro, aego?

Jughead Jones, Archie: ace

Doomguy/ Dooomslayer: ace

Seiji Maki, Bloom into you: ace, aro, aegoromantic?

Monkey D. Luffy, One Piece: ace, aro

Connor Hawke, DC Comics: ace, alloromantic

Perry the platypus: ace, aro

Kusuo Saiki, Disastrous life of Saiki K.: ace, aro

Yelena Belova, Marvel: ace, aro

Izaya Orihara, Durara: ace, aro

Daryl Dixon, the Walking Dead: ace

Keyleth, Critical Role: demisexual

Neil Josten, Foxhole Court: demisexual, demiromantic

Isaac Henderson, Heartstopper: ace, aro

Vernestra Rwoh, Star Wars: ace, aro

Light Yagami, Death Note: ace, aro

Caduceus Clay, Critical Role: ace, aro

Murderbot, Murderbot Diaries: ace, aro, genderless

Jonathan "Jon" Simms, Magnus Archives: ace, biromantic

Shouto Todoroki, Boku no Hero Academia: ace, aro

Lilith Clawthorne, Owl House: ace, aro

Bill Cypher, Gravity Falls: ace, aro, agender

Ezperanza "Spooner" Cruz, Legends of Tomorrow: ace

Nadia Van Dyne/ the Wasp, Marvel: ace, aro, quoiromantic

Peridot, Stephen Universe: ace, aro

Gwenpool, Marvel: ace, aro

Frieren: ace, aro/ aspec

Joffrey Baratheon, Game of Thrones: ace, aro

Sherlock Holmes, Arthur Conan Doyle: ace, aro

Lord Varys, Game of Thrones: ace, aro

Reyna Avila Ramirez-Arellano, Percy Jackson: ace, aro

Son Goku, Dragonball: ace

10th Doctor, Doctor Who (David Tennant): ace, panromantic

11th Doctor, Doctor Who (Matt Smith): ace

Sakuko Kodama, Koisenu Futari: ace, aro

Satoru Takahashi, Koisenu Futari: ace, aro

Felicity Montague, Lady's guide to petticoats and piracy: ace, aro

Jasnah Kholin, Stormlight Archive: ace, heteroromantic

Loth, Priory of the Orange Tree: grey-ace

Tané, Priory of the Orange Tree: ace, aro

Adèle, Baker Thief: demisexual, bi

Claire/ Claude, Baker Thief: aro (aroallo!), genderfluid

Sandry, Circle of Magic: ace

Ling Chan, the Diviners: ace, lesbian

Nancy Whitman, Every Heart a Doorway: ace, alloromantic

Kel, Protector of the Small: ace, aro

Natalie, Natural History of Dragons: ace, aro

Raphael Santiago, Shadowhunters: Cassandra Clare: ace, aro (In the show only ace)

Please note that I took most of my information from online, and I didn't personally read/ watch everything, so there may be some mistakes. Also, some of the not-canon characters are very likely aspec, but just not confirmed. And especially if they say/ do really obviously aro/ ace stuff, I wasn't sure if it's enough to put them in the "confirmed" category. (e.g. Saiki literally said he isn't attracted to anyone regardless of gender, and never wants to be in a relationship. But there are still people who doubt his aroace-ness. (And at this point I don't see how it could be anything but aphobia, to deny the mere possibility of him being aroace so vehemently lol.) ) Also: Sadly, I couldn't find good aro-allo characters except Claire/ Claude from "baker thief". There is tons of good a-spec representation in that book (also more side characters that I didn't mention here), but I couldn't really find any fan-art. So then I just slapped the entire book cover on the collage.

[theaceandaroadvocacyproject]

Hello everyone! We wanted to do a piece talking about the intersectionality of disabled and aspec identities and experiences - does this ring true to your experiences? What did we miss? Info on the images are written out below and included in alt text.

[Text reads: July is Disability Pride Month. Let's discuss Disability and Aspec Identity. While individuals may be both aspec and disabled, the two groups also have many similarities outside of people who exist in both. Ableism and aphobia, while both robust issues on their own, have intersecting pain points. Ace and aro people may be accused of being "sick" or "unnatural", and in need of a cure. Simple existence is conflated with suffering, and some people may be more invested in "fixing" aspec people rather than accepting them.

The idealized future - long life, independent living, marriage, children, etc - does not necessarily leave room for people in these groups. Disabled and aspec people can definitely have wonderful futures, without adhering to ableist and amatonormative notions of what a future should look like. Both groups are frequently treated as an afterthought in the realms of legislation/political advocacy and community care*. *A great time to remind y'all that we are still in a pandemic. Wear a mask.

People who are both disabled and aspec may deal with the added stress of stereotype threat*. Stereotype threat is the anxiety and stress that comes from possibly confirming a negative stereotype about the demographic one is apart of. Stereotype threat may arise due to the stereotype that disabled people are not suitable for romantic and/or sexual relationships, or due to the stereotype that asexuality and aromanticism are signs of illness or dysfunction. *Stereotype threat can occur to people of any minority demographic - age, race, gender, orientation, etc.]

[mathematical-cheese]

Bro...aroaces are literally the most represented everywhere. And you're still complaining. Go ask aroallos and aceallos about being recognised lol

The post wasn't even about representation, it's about the fact that even in aspec spaces there is a tendency to leave out the aro part of aroace and just viewing those people as asexual where being aro is an afterthought. Do you not see how that is also harmful for both aroallos and alloaces?

In the case of aroallos it's the fact that they're forgotten about because they aren't asexual and therefore their identity isn't even at the forefront of most people's minds when discussing aspec stuff. Their aroness is erased because it is not accompanied by asexuality.

In the case of alloaces there is the underlying assumption that romantic attraction isn't felt because there is still the assumption that aroace and asexual are the same thing. The fact they do feel romantic attraction is erased by the fact they're asexual.

The underlying issue here is that there isn't a great understanding of how different attractions interact with each other and the different labels we have to describe different experiences, even within the aspec community.

I made the post because an irl aspec group that I'm in were talking about the aroace character in the new series of Heartstopper and almost all of them referred to him as asexual. I have not watched Heartstopper (romance stuff doesn't interest me) but I was informed that there's actually a stronger focus on romantic attraction, i.e. the aro part in his aroace identity. As well as a consistent feeling that my aroness was erased when I identified as aroace and is ultimately one of the reasons I dropped the ace part of the label.

[uselessvaldemarsimp]

"less-cannon-accurate" annnnd there it is, thanks for letting us know that the author of that "route" treats Valdemar being aroace just as an inconvenient little detail to be discarded. what a shame

DISCLAIMER: i am not aroace! this is simply my opinion, take what i say with a grain of salt

here’s what i have to say:

is valdemar good aroace representation in the first place?

i dont think so! their orientation was announced in a, correct me if im wrong, comment section of an instagram post, and no where else! the fact that they and vulgora, villains, are the only nonbinary characters that use they/them exclusively, and the fact that valdemar, again, a villain, is the only aroace character in the entire game, is simply overall bad representation! a villain being aroace isn’t inherently bad representation, but all other things considered in this specific situation, the creators seem to view aroace people as inhumane freaks! yikes!

is this an excuse to erase said gender and sexuality?

not really, no!

is the valdemar dorian route by ronelle otieno good aroace representation despite this?

i think so! it’s done very well in my opinion, being an integral part of their character, not explicitly stated but shown through their actions and storytelling, it honestly makes valdemar seem a little more human, the way that their orientation is shown. i think ronelle otieno took something that was a poorly done afterthought and made it into good representation

can aroace people partake in sex and romance?

yes! this is a pretty obvious fact that most people are aware of by now

since that’s the case, is the inclusion of sex and/or romance when engaging with an aroace character an erasure of their sexuality?

not inherently! again, aroace people Can partake in these things, despite what some people may think!

HOWEVER, is deviating from canon with an aroace character who has been explicitly stated to not have an interest in sex and romance an erasure of their sexuality?

honestly, this is where things get tricky, but i think i have a way of thinking about it:

do actions = attraction?

i dont think so! i think people can kiss whoever they want, have sex with whoever they want, give flowers to whoever they want, without it being a direct show of their orientation. therefore, while it may be deviating from canon, it isn’t an inherent erasure of the characters sexuality. an erasure of aroace sexuality would be having that character specifically show or state that they are romantically and/or sexually attracted to someone. that’s where we begin having issues! if you have a problem with deviating from canon, that’s an entirely different thing, and i suggest you never interact with fandoms ever! for your own sanity.

people swap the sexualities of characters all the time, why is it such an issue when people do it with aroace characters, or queer characters in general?

lack of representation! if all these different flavors of queer were normalized, as they should be, people wouldn’t have so much of an issue with playing around with characters sexualities, but because representation is spare, people cling onto these aspects of these characters for dear life, even if the representation isn’t good representation

so what should people be fighting for?

more representation! instead of hanging onto characters who’s orientation is already a badly done, arguably acephobic afterthought, maybe the best course of action is to make an effort to create more aro and/or ace representation in general!

at the end of the day, is this all that big of a deal?

not really! you are the the captain of your own ship. you can choose to interact with things, or dont! wasting energy arguing over something that wont change is not worth your precious time. using that energy to create and promote Good representation is probably a better use of ones energy.

i highly encourage aroace people, especially those who have read the dorian route, to share their opinions. i dont intend to speak For or Over aroace people, im just a stranger on the internet who has thought a lot about things that dont really matter a whole lot in the grand scheme of things

[aro-who-reads]

As an aro reader, I was actually a bit disappointed by this glossary?

Describing "allosexual" but not "alloromantic", not explaining the difference between aro and ace, putting both demisexual and demiromantic under the "asexual umbrella"

It was an otherwise sweet MG story filled with queer characters, but I guess just an example of how even in very queer spaces aros are often an afterthought

[mightymelancholy]

Adding on to a previous post since I feel it's more appropriate to explain here. Warning it gets ranty

I feel a lot of people would miss these "this character is xyz" tweets and live streams. I mean Peridot having little to no sexual/romantic attraction didn't even cross my mind as a young kid or even when I got older. Her being aroace had to be pointed at to me by other YouTubers since I didn't have Twitter (not calling it "X") to see the tweet or the book alluding to her to be aroace. Also because her being aroace wouldn't automatically block off from fusion, since fusion represents varying relationships like toxic relationships, romantic, sexual, polyamorous, monogamous, platonic, and familial relationships. It seems weird to imply Peridot can't have strong platonic and familial fusions just because she's aroace. That's an unfortunate stereotype that the Crewniverse fell into.

Also I won't even get into how Alastor's asexual/aroace identity was vaguely referenced by a joke that was very easy to miss.

Go watch this good video by The Ace Couple

And Octavia hardly contributed to Helluva Boss due to her being overshadowed by her neglectful father that sexually coercived a person with a poor education and a daughter, employees, and himself to financially provide for. I'll keep bringing up how terrible of a character Stolas is any chance I get lol But again a character being ace and or aro is an afterthought even to queer creators, but characters like Angel Dust, Fizz, Blitzø, Ozzie, and Stolas can mention how gay they are. There's nothing inherently wrong with sexual humor it is just that the writers of Hazbin and Helluva think overusing it is funny.

Full Moon was so bad for this 😭 Like making fun of sex toys by having the Cherubs think there torture devices isn't that funny and since they're intentionally or not making fun of people who use them. Like making fun of sex toys and BDSM is hardly funny anymore and really wasn't before at least in the ways some people did it so childishly. The people that participate in those things already get stigmatized enough, why is the show using it as a punchline??

It's just weird and kinda fetishy that the writers depict the prominent gay male characters in the show as extremely sexual people, while asexuals and aromantics can't even mention their orientation. The show uses the word gay or other similar words a good amount of times but only says ace ONCE in Hazbin Hotel that could easily go over someone's head. If people have to go looking for evidence and confirmation outside the show proper then that's not what I'd call good representation. What if platforms get taken down or the posts get removed for whatever reason, then that PROOF of the characters sexuality is gone.

Point is add more characters that are explicitly or heavily implied to be ace and or aro. This shouldn't be hard to make diverse characters important that are also their own person while not ignoring their sexual and romantic orientation. If a character can say they're gay/lesbian/bisexual etc. and like sex with pride, then why can't an ace/aro character.