#also relationship meta ffs

[mitsuki91]

I saw a post that make me 🤦🏻‍♀️

Like, I mean, I know everyone has his ship, and if you prefer Haymitch/Maysilee to Haydove is totally fine. But complain because Haymitch thinks about his girlfriend so much?! Complain that she is "too important" to him, that their story feels rushed?!

For the Lord' sake, he is a 16yo boy in love, who is also loved by his girlfriend. He is obsessed and rightly so. Also there is the whole angst "we will never meet again" (because he is sure to die in the hunger games); of course in the arena he'll keep thinking about her again and again. Let alone what happens in the end and the guilt he'll feel all his whole life.

I have this impression that today personal relationship are devalued so much... It's a scary thing. "You can not trauma dump on your friend!" WRONG. Friendhisp is about sharing! Not only experiences together but also (and most important) you inner life. "If you are rejected you have to move on" yes of course, don't be a stalker or else, but you are allowed to feel bad. Even for days or months. You have to process. And it's better if you can share your grief with someone - with friends.

So where this whole bullshit "People are too obsessive with the one they love" came from?! Excuse me, I am 33yo married woman, and I am obsessed with my husband since day one. I am sad to have to go work and be away all day from him and I am happy when at the end of the day I can see him again. It's not at all a 'toxic' love, I just care. Caring is the center of love, I don't know where this twisted mentality of what is a toxic love came from. Can we just relate toxicity to actual abuse (physical, mental, financial, etc) and stay away from actual normal people who love and be loved and in doing so are happy with each other and happy to see each other and happy to share time with each other and happy to think about each other during the day?!

Where is our sense of community if we can not accept even the basic concept that people who love think and care about each other?

[avelera]

https://www.tumblr.com/stanlunter/769778186821222400/i-dont-get-the-mel-manipulated-jayce-and-jayce?source=share

I found this meta, which I thought was interesting to say the least and I wanna know you're opinion on it

Well, I skimmed it and didn't really feel like doing a close read to absorb all their points because I think they're fundamentally wrong. Maybe if I read more closely I'd see I agree but, eh... Their dictionary definitions about what counts as manipulation are using therapist-speak for a personal relationship, but the definition doesn't apply to politics or the political games depicting in Arcane.

Mel manipulated Jayce politically. Yes, that involved persuasion, and eventually a relationship, but giving someone absolute freedom to choose the only option left to them is not giving them a choice.

Mel in the opera house presented Jayce with a literal life or death scenario. She said he had painted a target on his back by going after the corruption on the Council. He had only her word for it and regardless of whether or not she told the full truth, whether or not she did it for his benefit, she said, "You have to play the corruption game too or these people will kill you." That's not giving someone a choice, ffs.

Mel is meant to be shown as a savvy political player too. Giving Hoskel a present on his birthday in 1.02 and then using that leverage to get him to vote her way during Jayce's trial is how the narrative sets up that she's good at making people owe her favors. She plays the game well. She's not mean or vicious about it, but she wields power like the virtuoso on the violin during the opera.

It's an absurd argument to say she didn't manipulate Jayce that boils down to silly semantics. Did she persuade or manipulate? Did she do it for his benefit as well as her own? Did she think she was doing the right thing too? Yes, but it was also all self serving towards her own ends and she was very good at it and he didn't know it was happening.

Him choosing to get power from her assistance when she offered power with her assistance is still doing what she wanted. Jayce didn't want to be a politician in the first place and once there, she led him by the nose to do what she wanted, until he became an independent agent in his own right, which often upset her plans her good intentions too, like raiding the Shimmer factory (which was due to Ambessa and Vi too) or locking down the bridge (which was due to Marcus also offering him one choice that Jayce was too overworked to notice was a bad move).

The tragedy of Mel's manipulations is that she eventually does grow to like Jayce, and maybe even love him, but it's too late, because once he realizes in 2.07 that she was manipulating him at the beginning and how easily she did it without him realizing, he dumps her (in 2.08).

That isn't conjecture, that is literally just the text of the show.

And for the record, I think all of that? Made Mel a super cool and interesting character. I'm not interested in seeing nice bland people who never hurt or mislead each other and who talk in therapist speak all the time being scrupulously perfect to one another, that's boring, the one unforgivable sin in fiction.

I would much rather see the story of a beautiful, fascinating, powerful woman running circles around this pretty boy inventor she dragged into politics and only realizing too late that by playing the game with him, she locked herself out of what could have one day been an actual beautiful relationship because actions have consequences in the world of Arcane.

[messiahzzz]

Grooming also doesn't have to involve sex. So even if people think his relationship with Mystra was appropriate, you still can't deny he wasn't groomed to be great. The guy caught Elminster's attention at eight years old ffs. There's no way around it.

that’s the thing. it doesn’t matter at what exact point their relationship became sexual, it doesn’t matter whether gale was of age at this point in time or not. grooming is a process, it’s pure manipulation that sets the groundwork to ensure that this person will be fully accessible (in whatever way the abuser desires, usually sexual) at a later point. children can be groomed, teenagers can be groomed and adults can be groomed as well - age is no factor in this regard. children are merely common victims due to being more impressionable. it’s essentially about creating a power imbalance that the abuser exploits for their own gratification.

the discussion about where to fit gale’s relationship with mystra in terms of her death & the overall timeline (while fun to theorize over) is redundant imo, since larian has been known to play pretty loose with the lore themselves. there are already so many inconsistencies.

so, the information we have regarding mystra’s relationship with gale are these snippets:

mystra first functioned as his mentor, then his muse, and later his lover.

gale’s relationship with her was indeed of a sexual nature, he has explicitly stated so several times.

elminster sought him out when he was but 8 years old, as stated in the epilogue letter.

during the ending where gale fails to ascend raphael states during the credits that tav has “rekindled gale’s ambitions after mystra had so cleverly put them to rest”

if you do want to consider d&d lore, it also tells us that mystra possesses a degree of foresight. (my friend @galedekarios already wrote a very thorough meta on the general subject.)

elminster’s letter pretty much confirms any suspicions we might have had earlier. after all, what reason is there for elminster, one of mystra’s chosen, to seek out gale specifically? how was he aware of gale in the first place? what personal incentive could he possibly have that isn’t tied to mystra in some way? why gale specifically when there are likely many young wizards with a potential for greatness that he could take under his wing? claiming that “it wasn’t mystra who sought him out, but elminster” feels like a rather naive and shortsighted read on the situation imo. we know that mystra was gale’s mentor and that she eventually made him her chosen. it isn’t hard to connect the dots.

summed up: we do know that mystra had her sight set on gale when he was an 8-year-old boy, possibly even earlier than that. the intention was already there and we know that their relationship underwent the transitions of teacher, muse, and then lover.

gale has been inevitably shaped by her grooming (just like any victim) to be devoted, to be compliant, to be loyal, to not question. many of his behaviors and beliefs are a direct result of said manipulation and abuse. gale himself is only starting to comprehend the possibility that he might actually be a victim once the tadpole crew comes into his life. and, like i said in my previous post, has barely scratched the surface of the damage that was done.

[malsperanza]

MXTX the unreliable narrator vs. her unreliable protagonists

One of the things MXTX does so well is to blur the line between narrator and internal monologue. Scum Villain is almost entirely written from SQQ's POV, and we know that he is a classic unreliable protagonist. But it's not 100% true that SVSSS is entirely from SQQ's POV. There are several places where the book goes head-hopping and we get other people's internal monologues. Since this isn't signaled or called out in any way, it leaves the reader without real clarity about what is narrator and what is POV. One example comes quite early on, when the young LBH fights a series of duels with the demons during their invasion of Cang Qiong Mountain. We briefly get the POV of his combatants. This may just be a sign of MXTX's imperfect command of her form (she wrote the book when she was in high school ffs), or it may be deliberate.

Either way, this squishiness means that the reader can't be sure that there is no omniscient narrator who is suppressing or providing info that SQQ might not have. In addition, we have the System's interference in the novel, which is not exactly omniscient narrator, and not POV character either. And then there's SQQ's own tendency to lie to himself. He is unreliable not only because he neglects to mention certain things, but also because he is so un-self-aware that he doesn't know some things even from inside his own POV.

[Later, in Heaven Official's Blessing, MXTX wields the tools of narrator omniscience and narrator omission much more smoothly. We get a narrator who seems to be confidently omniscient and honest. Yet we can see - only on reread - how much salient info is omitted at crucial points. Exactly what happened in the past. Exactly why Xie Lian ascended. Exactly who Hua Cheng is. And then we have the unreliable Xie Lian, in whose POV most of the book is given. XL isn't unreliable because he lies (he doesn't lie); nor because he's ignorant or unself-aware (he is neither); but because he prefers not to tell anyone - including us - more than he needs to. He's very private, and he plays his cards close to his chest. He has a wicked sense of humor, but enjoys himself entirely in private and alone.]

So in SVSSS the line isn't necessarily a clear one. Further, the confusion on the part of the reader may not be a mistake or misreading - it may be provoked deliberately by MXTX. That's because in the greater scheme of the book, MXTX is intentionally putting us in the same role with respect to SVSSS that SQQ has with respect to Proud Immortal Demon Way. That is: we have our preferences about the protagonists and antagonists and our opinions about the quality of the writing, the inclusion of episodes for reasons not required by the plot (starting with the introduction of the System as a character in the book, separate from The Narrator, and separate again from MXTX).

That said, some readers do misread or interpret in ways that the text doesn't really support. But they're allowed to do that because the book is so deliberately confusing, and because the theme of the book is Fandom and its quixotic relationship with the Text.

It's an incredibly layered and complicated setup.

One thing I've noticed about MXTX readers (and maybe Danmei readers in general) is that they fall in love with the version of the book they like and want, and then tend to read through that lens. This may mean taking info as "fact" when it's really just the opinion of the POV character, and not reliable.

Which of course is Shen Yuan's problem with respect to PIDW in the first place. MXTX is amazingly savvy about her readers and not shy about parodying us too.

EDIT: I realize that I need to credit @gaywatch 's reading streams on YT of MXTX books for the starting points for my various meta thoughts. So much insight stuck in the middle of hilarious and delightful deconstructed and subverted versions of audiobooks. https://www.youtube.com/@Gaywatch

[nalyra-dreaming]

Hi, I hope you are doing well. There is one thing I don't understand before getting into an argument. Basically, some people have made the show about race (which respectfully is their opinion). What I don't get is if the trial went the same even when Louis' character was white?!. If so, I don't get why people hate on others because they like Lestat and accuse them of being racist and supportive of domestic violence. THIS IS A SHOW ABOUT VAMPIRES WHO DON'T GIVE A SINGLE FVCK ABOUT RACE!!!!! Madaline was white, and she got the same fate as them, like make it make sense ffs. Also, it is not a moral show; it is about monsters who drain people for fun, so let people like who tf they want to!. Another point is that there is not one single healthy relationship in that show so what? Are we all supportive of domestic violence?!.

Let‘s just let Delainey answer that one:

They did not make it about that. But she can see how it could be construed.

@virginiaisforvampires made a very good post on all of this the other day, you can read it here:

Ultimately this is a show about vampires, and the meta level of addressing racism is definitely there, but they… make a show about vampires.

And the rest is fandom interpretation. And nothing more.

[narrative-of-it-all]

I love the show and the gems of meta analysis I found on twt and here so much, but I can't seem to warm up to some very popular opinions and reactions on here. or rather holding opinions that I will immediately get cancelled over when I engage in the fandom. Like you all scare me. But I have to get it out there.

One of those opinions is that people make Tommy out to be this supervillain, yet he's just some random guy who was unlikable at best in the past, who's there to further buck's plot (and fly a helicopter once in a blue moon). Apart from the racist and misogynistic past, what makes him so much worse than any of Buck's other love interests? I'm not brushing off how non-redeemed he is, the writers could have done a lot more. Just.. I don't really get the dogpiling and hate for the current Tommy. That's just a piece of cardboard, blank slate. But what makes me sick to my stomach is when people are calling the actor's appearance abhorrent and mean it, that's just bullying. Some reactions to Buck and Tommy making out could count as downright homophobic when taken out of context. I know y'all have been fighting with braindead bt shippers but why does that need to have an effect on how you view the show? The hate is not warranted imo, and I genuinely wonder how people would have reacted to a more likable man in a relationship with Buck (whose actors have more chemistry than ostark and lfjr lmao).

Which brings me to another point, I don't understand the purity culture in this fandom regarding Buck & Eddie sleeping with other people, especially men, as if that will somehow 'stain' them when they finally get together. This applies to both characters, let them continue their trail of exploration and mildly fucked up relationships, as they already have on the show. I am fully on team 'let-buck-fuck' and honestly would enjoy him exploring his queerness through sex. ffs, that's a man who enjoys sex a lot, why would you want him to go celibate for the guy who moved away for what looks like to be months, and especially when he can't even conceptualize fully what he feels for Eddie. Let that man date a little. And for Eddie, fuck yeah, let him explore all that stuff with his realization arc. Just because they realize their queerness doesn't have to mean they realize yet what they are to each other (and won't at the same time), and it's logical for their characterization to go out and date people. Especially Eddie, who has repressed stuff for so long. In Buck's words, you don't have to have feelings for everyone you sleep with. Sometimes you just want to fuck around and find out, experience some queer joy.

This also intersects with how people interact with bts and interviews before the episodes come out. Sometimes it feels almost as if this information weighs more than the actual episode itself. There's a lot of insecurity if Buddie is endgame, I wish I could take that feeling away for you somehow, but who will listen to the rookie who joined like 4 weeks ago anyways. It's just out of the question that they won't make it canon, of course they will. The show speaks for itself, trust it! There's no need to catastrophize because an actor or writer has said something that contradicts future Buddie. What are they supposed to say? Should they spoil their surprise? Of course Ryan Guzman will tell you his character is straight, because that's the current text of the show! Sometimes I get the feeling that people are more concerned with getting confirmations and affirmations instead of caring about what a character on screen goes through. I can't fully articulate it, but I trust that the writers love all their characters and want to give them a compelling storyline.

[co-mixed]

Mark Waid’s Fantastic Four

It’s rare that a writer perfectly fits the character but when it’s Mark Waid and Fantastic Four, this is exactly the case. This was the first time when I was genuinely excited to read every new issue, and this is the book that’s finally made me like the characters. Well, not too much because Reed is still there (ugh). But you know what I mean. 

Anyway, if you haven’t read it, I very much recommend that, and if you have and want to relive it, go ahead and read the rest! 

The new look

Waid’s run starts with a meta-story that quickly points out what we’d been getting wrong all these years about the Fantastic Four. They were never superheroes, they were adventurers. And suddenly, right there everything falls into place. ‘A group of adventurers’ becomes the leitmotif of the whole run. In a way, this definition is a culmination of everything that came before – journeys through space, time, and the Negative zone, occasionally interspersed with supervillain encounters. But this is also a way to refresh the book by letting us view it in a slightly altered manner. I’d say that’s something the book needed desperately. 

It’s also immediately obvious how the book mixes the classic lighthearted tone with a more mature one. It’s ready to explore serious issues, which isn’t new for the FF, but it wants to keep things bright and colorful. That’s where Wieringo’s art works perfectly in unison with Waid’s stories. And such stories we get! 

FF is for family 

During Claremont’s run, I said that FF started to feel like a family. But everything before still had them as Reed, Ben, and two supporting characters. Even when each of them faced their own stories, and they confronted them together, they never felt like people who had known each other their whole lives. Waid gives them small interactions that remind you how close they all truly are. And it’s not just banter between Johnny and Ben, it’s the way Sue interacts with Reed, admiring his genius and mocking his poor social skills and the way they both interact with their children. The children, by the way, they play a role too. They are very delicately written into the stories, even becoming their center, but never serving as a plot device. I’m gonna go back and talk a little more about Franklin later. 

Waid allows the characters to interact effortlessly, and naturally, so they don’t feel like strangers. 

Call for four

The main four people in this graphic play are of course Sue, Reed, Ben, and Johnny. Here, for the first time ever I can say that I got to know them all. It’s both ironic and sad that it took 41 years for them to finally be portrayed as people, who you kinda want to hang out with (even though you’ll always be an outsider because ‘family’) 

I very much liked Susan here. She is shown as a genuinely happy woman, a strong hero, a great adventurer, a caring mother, and a wife. I’m not saying “good wife” because her not having left Reed years ago makes her either a legend or someone who needs serious saving. A legend if we go off this run. She still gets her jealousy moments that are not entirely justified. Sue gets jealous of Alyssa, obviously because Reed neglected to disclose the nature of their past relationship to Sue. But similarly, she goes as far as purchasing a statue of Namor to make Reed jealous. This isn’t how a healthy marriage works, Susan. And it makes me feel bad for Namor. His arrogant ass doesn’t deserve this. 

But it’s great to see her happy and joking, and spending time with her family while still trying to raise her good-for-nothing brother. 

Speaking of Johnny, Waid probably felt just like we all did - Johnny hadn’t gone through much growth before that. Yes he’d been married, and he’d saved the world, but when it came to living in it, he wasn’t very well-adjusted. Waid changed that by putting him in charge of the FF company (say it with me: nepotism!). Not just that, but we got to see Johnny navigate the business world, and face pretty unfortunate obstacles. I have to say, I felt real bad for him when Sue went off and blamed him for the stolen sample of unstable molecules. But it all worked out in the end. This is how this run started, by reassuring you that the FF has everything under control. 

We’ll get to Reed (ugh!) and everything that went wrong later. 

Back to Johnny though, he has a tough time losing popularity, he even seeks the help of Spidey to learn how to be unpopular with the masses. It leads to a funny arc that honestly, leads me to believe that Johnny’s success with women is just it - his fame as a superhero because he has zero game otherwise. 

Again, not a secret - I never liked the lovable blue-eyed Thing. He’d been quite whiny and manipulative, and from everything I’d seen so far, it was really hard for me to relate to his issues. Waid changes that too, he lets us see why the others like and appreciate Ben, which is not because of him continuously reminding them that he’s lovable, and certainly not for his textbook heroic actions that again, to me often came off as ingenuine. 

He has a sense of humor here, when he bashes good-for-nothing Johnny, his jokes really stick the landing. When he connects to Franklin, he is being 100% transparent and helpful. In fact, I think he’s one of the characters that have the truest understanding of what the kid is going through, and he doesn’t waste a second in telling him that. He is also ready to sacrifice himself and not make it a big theatrical act. And after building up that side of his character, when he dies in Latveria, it… well, it doesn’t stick, this is still comics, but it certainly affects you as much as it does his family. Waid doesn’t let us sit with this emotion but he doesn’t rush through it, showing exactly how deeply it had touched everyone. Especially probably Johnny, who conjured an imaginary version of his friend. And here, Wieringo comes back after a short break and delivers a stunning difference between Johnny’s daydreaming and real life. 

I already mentioned that Franklin stops being a prop and becomes a character. Waid makes him face the good old older child problem - sibling rivalry. When all attention immediately goes to baby Valeria, Franklin misses his quality time with his parents, especially his dad. And that gets you to see him as a little human who is going through his own set of issues. That becomes even more obvious when he is sent to hell by Doom and is traumatized by the event so much, he can’t speak. Waid showed us the toll it took on Franklin’s psyche, and he did it through the adult characters around him, without trying to imagine how it would be, and without making the kid sound wise beyond his years.

Doom politics

I’m gonna get to Reed but first, we need to talk about Doom. Because if I had to pick, I’d say this is where you can truly see the nature and the cause of the Reed-Doom war. First of all, different writers view Doom differently, and while some attempt to justify and redeem him, others go out of their way to remind you how evil he is. Waid is not a Doom apologist. He immediately shows us how ruthless he can be when he kills the real Valeria to gain mystical power and then shows us that the prosperity in Latveria is a smoke screen that’s hiding a small guillotine-equipped human disposal system. So after all the debate, Doom is still a dictator who disappears his critics to silence them and forces people to trade freedom for stability. 

Waid also does to Doom the same thing he does to Lex Luthor in Superman: Birthright. Now they both lose potential friends over a misunderstanding. Only in Doom’s case, he thought Reed had messed with the controls on his machine, which ultimately resulted in him hiding behind a mask. It’s not his arrogance now, but the jealousy he thought Reed felt toward him, that drives Doom. 

This time though, In his evil endeavors, Doom goes further than ever before: he uses baby Valeria to get to the FF, then imprisons Franklin in hell, and tortures the rest of them. He likes Valeria though, that’s kinda sweet. 

Needless to say, when the team finally defeats Doom, and even temporarily sends him to hell (but not before he disfigures Reed’s face). 

Reed (Ugh!)

Here’s the thing, this run didn’t make me like Reed any more than before. Sure, he gets his redeeming qualities, plenty of them in fact, but he keeps messing up big. He even gets mixed up in international politics, which I gotta say was written very well. As soon as Doom disappears, multiple countries (including neighbors like Hungary and Serbia, as well as the US, Russia, and China) are preparing to make a move on Latveria. Meanwhile, in an attempt to deDoomify Latveria, Reed moves his whole family there and takes over the country. That’s a terrible decision on his side, and one that he’s tried to pull off before. My question is, when is Reed Richards going to realize that he’s not a politician or a monarch and stop trying to enforce his vision upon everyone? 

Essentially, there isn’t much difference between what he and Doom are doing. They are both consumed by their own vengeance, and both believe they are making peoples’ lives better out of the goodness of their hearts. Either way, it’s the Latverians who end up suffering. Reed didn’t even make any kind of address to them, before raising his shirt as a flag above Castle Doom and pretending everyone was now free. He needlessly endangered them to prove the FF wasn’t there to hurt them and then invited everyone to loot the castle. Happy 1917, I suppose? 

The visuals in this arc are a little darker. I don’t know the process behind the decision, but this is where we temporarily say goodbye to the larger-than-life bright art of Wieringo and say hello to Howard Porter’s more realistic approach. He especially focuses on Reed’s Two-Face appearance, highlighting the more fitting side for each one of his statements.

Just like the first time around, Reed can’t seem to take over Latveria without a shadow of Doom looming over him. The first time, he was possessed by the armor, the second, however, it was all Reed, only with a physical scar left by Doom. Everyone else (except for Franklin who was in hell, after all) shook it off. But Reed didn’t. He was hell-bent on destroying everything Doom had and built just to make sure he would never return. Ultimately, it led to him imprisoning Doom (and causing his escape because when does it ever work out?)

He also shoots (and kills) Doom-possessed Ben to save Johnny.

Yeah if anyone was hoping this run would make me like Reed, they were wrong. 

Reed reminds me of Buffy. Everything does but hear me out: as the leader of the FF he drags them into wild adventures and some of them inevitably end in disaster. Then it takes writer magic to make everything work out and pretend that all the issues and idiosyncrasies don’t really matter. But they do, everything he’d done up to the end, everything he said be it in service of a bigger goal or not, still matters. He keeps making mistakes that go unnoticed when he comes out on top. 

As a reader, you can like the team and hate the person. And this run has absolutely made me like the team.

Bag of tricks

Waid utilizes so many narrative tricks like the team meeting the Kirby-god to restore the status quo. Once again, ironic meta-stories allow to push the story forward. 

Another trick was kicking the FF out of their comfort zone of being rich and popular. And that is a great callback to the first issue, in which Reed confesses to Valeria that he worked relentlessly to make sure the FF is popular and beloved to compensate for the cosmic rays incident. Because… imagine them having to live like mutants (and blame Reed for that).

Waid forces Reed to come face to face with the one thing he can’t understand - magic.

The dysfunctional Frightful Four’s family dynamics are juxtaposed with those of the original FF, and we see why one works while another keeps failing.

As the herald of Galactus, Johnny encounters a world of sentient ants, making us look back at the first FF-Galactus encounter.

Then the team meets the person behind Galactus, someone who in all honesty, is nothing more than an unimpressed hater. So… nothing shocking about him going around eating worlds after all.

And there is a moment when the team loses powers only to get them back because they can’t imagine being without them now.

All that draws these characters, lets you see them for who they are, good and bad, and leaves you wanting more. 

Final thoughts

Waid’s run is enjoyable in every possible way. It’s very 00s in terms of visuals - cartoonish and bright, with just the right amount of nostalgia especially if that’s your introduction to the comics era. Narratively, it turned out to be deeper than I expected, all the while maintaining that connection to the original Lee/Kirby era. I’ve noticed that this is a trend with Waid’s books, he tries to at least partially return the characters to their starting point, make them recognizable, and rediscover their roots. For the Fantastic Four, it works incredibly well.

If we ever get a Disney Fantastic Four cartoon, I would like it to be based on this run since it’s done a marvelous job of flashing out each person behind the uniform. 

[eliotquillon]

if you wanted to write more meta, what do you think cameron's love life was like between in the decade between her first husband and chase?

GREAT QUESTION. with a one word answer: sparse!

not to reference early s2 again (my beloved) but i think a lot of those episodes make it pretty clear that cameron has been, consciously or not, denying herself that connection—she talks a lot about controlling actions, not feelings. there’s also lot of references made to the fact that she doesn’t exactly have a personal life, especially compared to the others (in needle in a haystack it’s explicitly pointed out by the patient that none of the fellows have rings on their fingers, but cameron is alone in not being seen dating or flirting with anyone but house—and we all know how that ended). even the s1 house fixation is i think proof of this; foreman really has to interrogate and tease cameron to get her to admit to having a crush on house, and she shows up to that date wearing her mother’s earrings ffs. she’s way out of practice.

and i think so much of this is rooted in cameron’s idolisation of marriage. it’s not that she’s not ready to move on—it’s more that i think she’s waiting for the perfect person to move on with, and nobody ever really comes along. the house crush is fascinating because she REALLY takes charge in that, but it appears she does this because she’s convinced that he absolutely feels the same way and is simply denying it. which: grade A cameron delusion, lol, but i wonder if she’d have been so forthright about it if she were any more uncertain about things. there’s also the fact that cameron’s particular neuroses mean that she is way more likely to gravitate towards people who she can ‘fix’ or who need her, and i think the list of people who fit the criteria of both ‘meeting cameron’s standards’ and ‘damaged enough for her to ‘fix’ is…very small. it’s kind of miraculous that chase kind of just falls into her lap lol.

she probably does go on a few first dates, maybe even progresses to the second or the third sometimes, but i don’t think there’s ever a major, serious relationship before chase. to both of their detriments, lol. i think maybe if both of them had a bit more experience then maybe things would’ve turned out a little better :/

[sir-adamus]

so the Rathalos is intentionally designed to work more like a Monster Hunter fight mechanically than an FFXIV fight, so you don't get the usual tells for specific attacks and have to rely on body language, that's the meta reasoning

in-universe though, the tells you get are a manifestation of the Echo, you're essentially reading the intent of the attack through the attacker's Aether (which we get to be on the other side of when Fordola gets her juiced up Resonance), so with the Rathalos, because it's from another world (though implications in dialogue and flavour text implies there's more than a few around and the Monster Hunter elements we see have been there long enough that Rathalos are recognisable and not even the Palico knows it's not supposed to be there), it's not naturally made of Aether, can't channel it and we can't read its intent because it's not integrated into the natural cycle yet

in the YoRHa raids, the machine lifeforms and androids don't fight any differently than anything else you've fought, with the usual Aetheric tells you normally get. now obviously on a meta level, this is because it's a raid series versus the Rathalos trial which can center around that gimmick. however, lore-wise, the NieR Automata canon establishes that the machines are constantly mining resources to build more of themselves and structures (hell the in-universe 'teleports' the androids use to get around aren't even actually teleports. it just deconstructs them to their base components at one station, stores the basic matter locally while transmitting the schematics and consciousness data to the receiving point and reconstructs using the locally stored matter at that point), meaning that when the machine lifeform rocket landed on the First, the network would've started using the local resources to start constructing the machines and androids that we see. and it's established that everything in the FFXIV is made of Aether, so the Echo is able to read their intent

(this also works as a way to disguise that it actually is a crossover and not like previous raids where it's a whole plot reference to another FF game with some details switched around set within the world of FFXIV - like how the Ivalice Raids play around with a lot of the details, allegiances and relationships of the Tactics and FFXII characters)

[thisisevenharderthannamingablog]

Episode 7 Gun Scene AKA Give Kinn a (little) Break Please

I've seen lots of meta on the bathroom scene but not much on the precursor.

At the end of 6/6.5 they've cleared the air, established that they're still attracted to one another and that there are Emotions All Up In This Bitch. Kinn having gotten shot puts things on hold. You don't want to try to start a relationship while one of you is recuperating from blood loss etc. So we get some plot for a while, and shenanigans from Vegas and emotional abuse from Korn and pep talks from friends, and then we get the gun scene.

First of all, that hanging-up fake-out was cute AF. Second, Kinn sneaking into the minor house to see him was arguably dumb when there's a whole thing going on tomorrow. Totally worth it, though.

I don't think it's escaped Porsche at this point that Kinn doesn't generally attach value to objects. He's been around the house for a while now, would have noticed that compared to the rest of the family, Kinn's rooms are almost empty of personal touches. (See also, Life in Korn's Panopticon.)

[Aside: Being completely uninterested in objects is one way to perform being Rich as Fuck; you can always buy another one of whatever it is so who cares. I find it interesting how the things he does have tend to underline Kinn's physicality; he's all about the scents and textures, and that's a trait maintained during the sex scenes. An interesting choice in a purely visual medium. Later on, when they're dating, it's about experiences, not things. It seems like that's how it was with Tawan, too, so that's a core characteristic for Kinn.]

Back to loaning Porsche the gun. This gesture is deeply unusual, lets Kinn remind him that he cares without getting all mushy about it (got to keep his head in the game here). Porsche has that shy look.

[Aside: LITERALLY NO ONE in however many years he spent street fighting has ever told Porsche to come back safe. Chay loves him, but Chay needs him in a way that means even if he said the words, it couldn't be just on account of Porsche's value as a person.]

Kinn takes a visible breath before this next bit, takes the plunge and makes the conversation about sex. Bearing in mind that Kinn's usual mode since Tawan has been ordering off the escort menu, this has a fascinating-to-me mix of delicacy (yes! I mean it!) and directness.

First there's the conversational placement; it comes after the concern for Porsche's safety. Second, it's a blunt but not serious way to broach the subject. There's loads of physical space here, and they're alone; Porsche can back away or laugh it off if he's uncomfortable. He doesn't do either one; he keeps it playful, but his body language is let us say "engaged." That tongue motion, FFS. Wave good-bye to Porsche's heterosexuality as it disappears over the horizon. He isn't nervous about the idea or still angry about last time, is 100% DTF after the mission is over. They're close enough to kiss, not going for it, but you can feel the anticipation.

Porsche did ask for some words of encouragement. Be careful tomorrow, come back, and then we're going to do this right (and have a really good time) is pretty encouraging. Kinn's expression gets serious again; they both just melt into the softest of soft looks, forehead touch is my forever weakness. Because this is not just about sex. This is them about to embark on a relationship.

Which they manage to do after a Vegas-induced hiccup that lasts all of a minute and a half.

I think all of that setup explains a lot of Kinn's initial reaction in the bathroom scene; the fact that it was Vegas of all people explains the rest. As far as Kinn can tell in those first few seconds, he let down his guard and just got knifed in the gut for it, and he's got an emotional whipsaw going through the whole scene as he realizes that he jumped to the wrong conclusion. Also explains the rapid shift into sexytimes. It's not just that Kinn prefers actions to words, although he definitely does that; bro has literally been thinking about doing this all damn day. I hope he didn't have to try to focus on any work.

Final note - I'm not sure Kinn actually does have as much of a possessive streak as seems to be a common interpretation? He doesn't act like that about anybody else we see. His jealous streak is mostly focused on Vegas, and that's had a lifetime to accumulate. He has a competitive streak a mile wide (thank you Korn, now there's a man who treats people like possessions), and that does show up consistently with other people.

[astudyintheburningofhearts]

FINALLY FINISHED GOOD OMENS- IT WAS SO GOOD WTF- ALSO ALSO ALSO I HAVE SO MANY THINGS TO SAY-

(spoilers under the cut) .

.

.

.

.

.

Bildad the Shuhite, love of my life.

BRO THE METATRON- FUCK HIM, HONESTLY, WHAT A DICK- (chanelling my inner comic!Nick Nelson, can you tell?)

The FUCKING "I FORGIVE YOU" AZIRAPHALEEEEE WHYYYYYYYYY (ALSO NEIL WHY. WHY. LITERALLY MY HEART-)

Couldn't cry because family was present + It'd been spoilt somewhat for me BUT NOTHING PREPARED ME FOR THE SCENES BEFORE THE KISS WHERE CROWLEY'S TRYING TO CONFESS AND AZIRAPHALE'S TRYING TO TELL HIM ABOUT THE POSITION HE JUST TOOK- UGHHHHHHHH

AND ALSO THE RESIGNED "DON'T BOTHER" OH. MY. GOSHHHHHH- CROWLEY :( MY HEART :(

also- the way the fucking way Crowley looked at Nina as if to say "I tried" and then at Maggie as if to say "I hope you do better/I hope it goes better for you" ffs

Also, again, FUCK METATRON- because this bitch walks in IMMEDIATELY after Crowley and then wastes absolutely NO time before bitching about him- literally "Always asked damn fool questions too"- not only is he manipulating Aziraphale into sort of believing Crowley would just fall again or he wouldn't do well by his side (DESPITE MANIPULATING HIM BY TELLING HIM THAT HE COULD MAKE HIM AN ANGEL AGAIN, MIND YOU) (imo, at least)

It truly is Aziraphale, Mr. I will make it better for you and Crowley, Mr. I never wanted you to make it better/ never wanted for it to be better, all I've ever wanted is you

The "Hear that? ... No Nightingales" literally broke my heart- cuz I remember reading some meta about it somewhere on here and when I was thinking about it to myself after watching, I could only think of how it sort of symbolised then end of their relationship and that broke me, ok? Especially when the Bentley played A Nightingale Sang In Berkely Square instead of its usual Queen- AND THEN HOW CROWLEY PAUSED FOR A MINUTE TO LISTEN TO IT? NO. LITERALLY STOP, OK. LIKE THE WAY IT SEEMS THAT HE'S ALREADY REMINISCING- HOW HE'S SO FUCKING DEJECTED AND FEELS LIKE HE NEEDS TO HOLD ONTO ANY PIECE OF THEM HE CAN BEFORE HE COMPLETELY GIVES UP- (AGAIN, IMO) BUT FUCK??????

On another note, however, how freaking adorable were Beelzebub and Gabriel??????????? They make me wanna 💢 🔪

No literally- Gabriel making only Everyday play on the jukebox???? Beelzebub recognising it????????? The FUCKING FLY MESSAGE ON THE BOX- shut up that's so cute, they're so stupidly in love- ALSO THE "MY HEAVEN IS WHERE BEELZEBUB IS" "AND MY HELL IS WHERE YOU ARE, MY SWEET"?????????????????????????????????? FUCKING SLAPPED- ME WHEN BRO. ME WHEN. GOD-

AND ALSO. THE. WAY. CROWLEY. AND. AZIRAPHALE. LOOK. AT. EACH. OTHER/ SHARE. A. LOOK. WHEN. CROWLEY. MENTIONS. APLHA. CENTAURI. LITERALLY ACTUALLY STFU OK? *SLAMS A DOOR IN NOBODY'S FACE IN PARTICULAR*

ALSO- CROWLEY TELLING AZIRAPHALE HOW HE PROBABLY UNDERSTANDS IT BETTER THAN AZIRAPHALE????? BECAUSE REMEMBER? IT USED TO BE THE OPPOSITE- ANGEL!CROWLEY WAS ALWAYS THE ULTIMATE OPTIMIST, THE ONE WHO BELIEVED HEAVEN WOULDN'T TRULY DAMN THOSE WHO ASKED QUESTIONS- AZIRAPHALE WAS THE ONE WHO WAS MORE CAUTIOUS- BUT NOW, IT'S AZIRAPHALE BLINDLY TRUSTING THE METATRON (IT'S BECAUSE HE LOVES CROWLEY SUPER FUCKING MUCH, BTW, FOLKS) AND CROWLEY'S THE ONE WHO'S LITERALLY DYING BECAUSE HE KNOWS. HE. KNOWS. AZIRAPHALE HAS NEVER BEEN NAIVE- NOT IN THE WAY CROWLEY HAD ONCE BEEN- BUT LOVE HAS BLINDED HIM-

oh, and i forgot to mention: THE FUCKING LIP TOUCH AZIRAPHALE DOES AFTERWARDS-

AND THE WAY HE PAUSES AND HESITATES AND THEN FAKES A SMILE SAYING HE DOESN'T NEED TO BRING ANYTHING WHEN WE ALL KNOW EXACTLY WHAT HE MEANS TO SAY

AND ALSO CROWLEY SAYING THAT HE NEEDED TO STAY AND TAKE CARE OF THE BOOKSHOP INSTEAD OF HIMSELF- AND NOW THAT I THINK ABOUT IT, WHEN METATRON SAYS MURIEL WILL TAKE CARE OF THE SHOP, HE MIGHT NOT REALISE IT HIMSELF, BUT MURIEL WILL ALSO PROBABLY TAKE CARE OF CROWLEY- IDK, MAYBE I'M JUST SPIRALLING OK-

god, if only they fucking talked-

Michael Sheen and David Tennant owe me oh so many things... someone pass it on to them, please, thanks.

[melpomeneprose]

🚢 glinda & elphaba ? ( or any other combos you are interested in! )

Shipping sheet / @storiesbreathed.

You are getting the exceptionally long answer with meta and canonical bisexuality and lesbianism to boot. But I will get the important stuff out of the way firstly…

1. I ship G.elphie and F.iyeraba, but not ours specifically yet. But it is merely a matter of time. I believe in bisexuality (canon), two hands and people who make more room to love in their hearts. Plus, 'M.aguire said both, so it is both.'

2. Always open to new rp partners (time permitting and permitting my social anxiety doesn't act up), so, yes.

3. Types of ship: friends to lovers, "enemies" to lovers, married (not legally but symbolically I feel like E.lphaba has a grudge against marriage and also - justifiably religion, and also poetry but specifically p.ropeganda but I digress, cause of her parents), plus F.iyero and Sarima exist so massive polycule-ism and to some (including E.lphie) that don''t exactly work with the unionist way of O.zian marriage, that said convention can go to hell. Exes to lovers. Fake relationship to lovers, forbidden love (canonical - not cause it is bi4lesbian but cause E.lphaba is an enemy of the state). Surprise pregnancy (as in G.elphie taking care of Liir cause I loathe book! F.iyero erasure / F.iyero erasure in general but especially re: the book), and forced proximity, oh and if book adjacent (my personal favourite) star crossed but then later reincarnation and making amends (cause Rain T.hropp).

4. Jump right in.

5. Write a starter or send memes or vice versa.

Now for the long meta part. Below the cut.

TLDR: W.icked is and always has been deeply p.olitical and E.lphaba is bisexual, if someone can't see that, I must say, congratulations on believing all sorts of things that aren't true and also... inability to read.

1. My most 'controversial' take is the book(s) are better and not just cause of explicit bisexuality and an intersex androgynous (ish) mc. I think M.aguire (it is his IP after all) knew better than everyone else what he was actually writing about. Whilst I enjoy the musical / movie as a separate work I hate how toned down it is. It makes E.lphaba (almost) generic to me, absolutely no hate to anyone who has ever played E.lphaba. It makes E.lphie's story about as friends of mine have said everything and nothing. E.Iphaba and L.estat are why I am not dead, that is why I am mad about it or at least loving but deeply critically.

2. E.lphaba (book) has no soulmate the closest in the novel she gets is the Arjiki Prince F.iyero who actually cares deeply about her and even challenges her intellectually and culturally. If E.lphaba (musical) had a soulmate it would be G.linda (because straightwashing is bad and I am petty and G.linda is a lesbian at least in the M.aguire and B.aum books). Also, regarding: E.lphaba and religion if someone insists that strongly they are a.theist and have no soul, I think they're right and should able to be as areligious as N.essarose the unionist is religious, cause freedom, and just ffs live and let live.

3. I personally (in the book) like F.iyeraba more than G.elphie though I like both. However Rain (E.lphie reincarnation and canonical overt bisexual as though E.lphaba wasn’t a raging a.theist bisexual enough), is another story entirely.

4. Mandatory thanks for sending!

5. if anyone else besides @storiesbreathed has read this far I want to say thanks for listening. El.phaba is my 'problematic' (subjective context matters I condone everything the green girl did in all universes ever, especially in the source material and 1939) "she is me, I am her" character. So, thanks for listening to me pull a 'I know more w.icked lore than I can be bullied or told off about' thing.

[beevean]

Baroryuu for the ship ask! ^-^

Heyyy my boys :D

• when or if I started shipping it.

Started to see something in G1-5 when Barok admitted to always pick cases that Ryuu would to "cross swords" with him. Got invested in their chemistry when Ryuu in G2-3 dropped everything he was doing to personally check on Barok in his own office after reading that he was attacked. Became OTP when Barok in G2-4 and 5 started praising Ryuu left and right and vocally expressing his gratitude at being saved <3

• my thoughts:

I LOVE THEIR ARC. Oh sure Barok is hard to stomach at the beginning, I won't deny it, but for two people with no relation to each other (and meta wise, this is clever because Barok had a relationship with Kazuma, but Ryuu replaced him!), the two grow to trust each other organically. Barok sees with his own eyes how dedicated to his mission and talented and most of all how righteous Ryuu is. Meanwhile Ryuu manages to see the good person behind Barok's horrible xenophobic attitude (in a setting where everyone is xenophobic to Ryuu), and that's why he trusts him despite all the walls Barok puts between them.

• What makes me happy about them:

The mutual unconditional respect <3 the banter <3 Ryuu bullying Barok <3

• What makes me sad about them:

Barok ffs can you tone down your xenophobic remarks. Oh, yeah, and the fact that they're not destined to be because Ryuu has to return to Japan, and they can only write each other letters and travel from time to time while Ryuu has to have a child with a woman. why didn't barok say goodbye at the end :(

• things done in art/fic that annoys me:

Ukeifying Ryuu, ofc. Less common in fanfics, but maybe I was lucky. Guys. Guys Ryuu isn't a blushing baby. He's an enemy of the state.

• things I look for in art/fic:

height difference

The slowburn of them growing closer together, Barok fully opening up to Ryuu, the two hugging, Barok using his riches to spoil Ryuu lol. They're so tender in fiction <3

• Who I’d be comfortable them ending up with, if not each other: 

I also ship Benbaro, so I don't mind the idea of Barok getting with Albert! Ryuu... ehhhh I don't ship Asoryuu because I just have to stand out lol. Maybe Susato, once she grows older :)

• My happily ever after for them:

Screw Phoenix' heritage, have Ryuu stay in England to continue his studies <3 and have a secret non-official marriage <3

• what is their favorite non-sexual activity?

I like to imagine Ryuu spending time in Barok's mansion and listening to him play the piano :) and Ryuu could also teach Barok some basic Japanese!

[tonydaddingham]

Dark grey anon again, greetings! I think, rather ironically considering the themes of this show, we might have misunderstood each other. You say I interpeted your comment on the shades of dark grey correctly, except when you then go into it more, that is in fact not what I meant 😂😂 For me, the dark grey comment read more like, if we take an alignment chart to help clarify, evil, whereas from your description I would personally go with the definition chaotic neutral.

I don't see why people* would interpret that as you not liking his character**... isn't fandom meant to love anti-heroes and morally grey characters? I promise this isn't going to stop Aziraphale*** from being in love with him or irrevocably ruin their relationship. Also, that vague post thing? I'l be honest, much as I love a lot of your other metas, I disagree with probably a good 90% of this one****, but ffs be decent about it!

Out of curiosity: you talk a bit about the character growth Crowley still has to experience. Would you consider his moral ambiguity, and becoming less ambiguous, as part of that, or is that simply part of his personality, and fine to stay the way it is, and it's just that it happens to run parallel when being analysed to the flaws that he does need to work on?

*I will admit my OCD wants a positive analysis for the sake of balance, however, this would be the same case in reverse with wanting a negative analysis to balance a bunch of positive ones. Unless you were to literally have an exact equal count of pros and cons there will always be something in my head going bingbingbingnotbalanced... what can you do? 🤦‍♀️🤷‍♀️

**Although, admittedly, English sucks, so that might partially be wording, and not just bad faith. Personally speaking, bad, for me, carries connotations of nasty/ill-intentioned/evil, and dark I arguably find worse, so some of it might simply be linguistic differences. At the very least, as a second language speaker, it's pretty easy to come away with the wrong impression, namely that you're suggesting he's actively villainous/malicious. In my native tongue, a bad or dark character would fall more under the category of commits murders for the sheer delight of human suffering.

***Potential hot take! I don't know, I'm not always overly in touch with fandom views, but Aziraphale is also more morally grey/morally ambiguous than some of the fandom would like to acknowledge.

****I do agree with some of the items on your list, but generally, I have a different or more lenient view on the points you mention and my conclusion is less mostly ambiguous character who can and will do good things semi-regularly and more mostly good character who can and will do ambiguous things semi-regularly.

hi anon, sorry i havent replied sooner✨

sorry, let me clear this up - when i said you interpreted my comment correctly, i was referring to this bit of your ask: "You say that Crowley's dark grey comment is one of the more honest and introspective things he says: that kinda comes across to me like you saying that Crowley's saying he's mostly bad with a capacity for good* and that's a fair assessment of him."

idk how to word the next bit, tbh - i don't necessarily see crowley as a bad character, certainly not outright (and definitely not an evil one). and idk if it was, perhaps, how shittily i worded it in the last ask (im not a writer, i regularly do not have The Right Words), but that's not what i was trying to get across. i just personally find it important that he asserts that he's not nice, he's not light, and imo the narrative has routinely supported this. he regularly shows tendencies of being someone that can be immoral. a little more specifically, maybe - sometimes insensitive, dishonest, distasteful, and acts occasionally without much conscience. yes, sometimes a little nasty, and sometimes a little ill-intentioned, but definitely not to the point where id consider him depraved, malicious, and completely absent of any redeemable quality - that's not what im saying at all. crowley is not a villain by any stretch.

a lot of people won't agree with that (that he's often a 'dark' or 'immoral' character), and in some part i agree with that contradiction, because he does have the capacity to be the abject opposite of those things, and has absolutely shown himself at times to be selfless, and kind, and compassionate - but i feel like those moments, those qualities, are all the more obvious and apparent because his character backdrop is typically the reverse, and because they are less frequent.

@maximumpenguinpuppy made the brilliant symbolic observation in their rb that kind of sums up my thoughts; the taijitu/yin-yang symbol is made of two parts, and one of those parts is a black field with a white dot - the 'good' within the 'bad'. it wouldn't be the symbol it is and have the meaning that it does, if the symbol were all white with two black dots. likewise, crowley and aziraphale wouldn't be the analogy for yin yang that they are, if they both were 'good' with small parts of 'bad'. it's this kind of balance that makes crowley being a mostly dark character, with capacity for good, not only make narrative and symbolic sense for me, but also makes him a more compelling character as a result.

and probably goes without saying, but it understandably wasn't something i explored in your last ask (and maybe should have) but aziraphale is the opposite. imo, his backdrop is mostly good, kind, selfless, and compassionate. it's then all the more obvious and startling when he doesn't act like that, because of the sheer contrast the story's portrayal of him has given us. so, exactly the same as crowley, his self-assessment of being "very light grey' also feels accurate, and again perhaps an accidental introspection that we as the audience ought to believe outright. (by the by, i feel like the audience does buy and accept this without much question - that aziraphale is a mostly good character whose questionable actions are perceived as all the more horrendous as a result - but seems to struggle with accepting the mirror of that where crowley's concerned) (as i see it anyway, this is only my interpretation of course).

as for where id personally like to see his character development go; i don't think it's a straightforward case of him starting to become more 'good' or 'light'. i think it would erase a lot of his personality and 'crowley-ness' for him to step completely away from being a bit of an occasional shit 😂 his darker qualities, i think in his case specifically, are likely to be a product of his experiences, and inner turmoil, and a good deal of bitterness and resentment, confusion and hurt. therefore, to erase his more immoral behaviours would be in part to erase what the narrative heavily suggests is the trauma and pain that he's been through; essentially, i wouldn't want to see what aziraphale is implied to want in the final fifteen, and restore him to 'good' when he's not that person anymore.

that being said, a crucial part of where i feel crowley is in the wrong a lot of the time is that he does tend to avoid blame or responsibility - and there have certainly been times where aziraphale has fallen afoul of that. i think perhaps (sheer speculation here) crowley's actions have crossed boundaries that aziraphale hasn't effectively communicated to crowley, and/or crowley has completely ignored. don't get me wrong; aziraphale has done the same to him too, and they both need to acknowledge this on their individual parts. they do need to make the relevant reparations for it, including genuine apologies, to respect those boundaries in the future, and make purposeful efforts to rebuild that trust. personally, i do think (or at least hope) that this is something that is going to be addressed, as being underlying sources of contention and upset for them both, in s3.

[ranbling]

Not sure if you are still looking for things to yap about, but I can’t help thinking about the production meta of it all:

(1) S7’s promo heavily focused on Buck and Eddie and (2) LFJr’s cameo shitstorm revealed that Tommy was meant for Eddie’s queer storyline, but was switched at some point around when production started, with Tim clarifying the switch-up was due to Natalia’s actress no longer being available – which, if it didn’t matter if Buck or Eddie came out first, then was buddie originally supposed to happen in 7b?

But then the show was renewed and they ended up making massive re-writes so Tim could shoehorn in his pet-Vertigo story (yikes) and thus possibly pushed other storylines (buddie) to S8…?

I don’t want to get into the way OS and RG talked about their characters’ storyline pre-renewal and post-renewal. But I also have Thoughts.

And don’t forget the Family Feud of it all! The team composition is literally the openly queer characters of 9-1-1… plus Eddie, which was supposedly set to air in July (and now pushed back to who knows when) – so was buddie already meant to be canon by then?

Have I connected the dots??? does this mean anything???

I am always looking for things to yap about!! This whole thing is gonna be a little bit all over the place, but I love your points

First of all, I don't think buddie was supposed to happen in s7b, but I do think they might have planned to actually start the mutual pinning or have feelings realisation scene for both of them and then do the actual getting together arc in s8. I do think it would have made sense if Eddie came out first (or instead of the Vertigo storyline).

Also, I think LFJ's cameos kinda put the show into a bad position. It's clear he was talking about anything he wanted without checking it with like Tim if that info can be public or not (the whole he was supposed to be Eddie's LI thing, or that he spoiled it will be a medal ceremony) and I don't think the show actually wanted to reveal that the queer storyline was originally supposed to be Eddie's. Now that people know about it, we expect it. It almost happened once, so it will have to happen again kinda thing. And if both Buck and Eddie are into men, Buddie is the only satisfying conclusion of their arcs

For me, it seems like after they got early renewal they decided to change everything. Tommy was originally supposed to be in like only 4 episodes, but instead they kept him the whole season (and did nothing to make him a loveable love interest, they actively made him a worse character), they brought in the Vertigo storyline (which was just a mess and I don't think more episodes could have made it better) and everything.

I'm really curious about the Family Feud episode too! I have no idea why it hasn't aired yet, but it's possible that they picked out who will represent the show before the rewrites started and it actually contains spoilers? (I'm not really familiar with FF)

So, yeah I agree with you, while I don't think we would have gotten an actual relationship between Buck and Eddie in s7, i'm kinda convinced the original plan was to have then both be out

[goldenworldsabound]

🌦️🛌👀 C L A Y M A N

THANK YOU tbh I'm gonna answer all of these for Clayman at some point hehe

🌦️: Would you be accompanied by mostly fluff or angst fanfics? Both? Explain why.

Both. There's so much angst to lean into - Clayman's death in the main timeline, and his grief in thinking he got Wendy killed when he wakes up in the REVENGE timeline. I think some folks would find the source material didn't cover this enough and would want to expand on it.

I think there would also fully be an equal faction that's like NO SADNESS NO DEATH ONLY HAPPY ENDINGS FFS and would write a lot of fluff to cope so fkdjsahfkjds

🛌: What tropes show up in fics involving your ship?

childhood friends to lovers is a must have for AUs because the ship is literally that

also forbidden love/secret relationship (hiding it from Kazalim)

and unbalanced power dynamics for sure

also battle couple

👀: How does your ship with your f/o influence both of your characterisations and the world? Would there be any interesting metas written about your dynamic?

It makes it even clearer from the beginning that Clayman is not his usual self in the beginning of the story. At the same time, it emphasizes that the loyalty Rimuru has from his subordinates repeats itself - Wendy is so loyal to Clayman, they don't hesitate to die for him, despite the evil things he's done, many of which they haven't agreed with.

My SI specifically also brings grief to the forefront. Rimuru experiences grief (though he manages to bring all his friends back to life so it's quite temporary), but my SI doesn't. They have to grapple with it. That's the difference between them and Rimuru - Rimuru is strong, and he can fix the bad situation he was given. My SI cannot, and cannot even seek revenge for it.

There's also Yuzu, and Yuzu being the reason SI decides to keep living. To find meaning in family - reemphasizing what seems to be a focus for the Moderate Jesters in general. Family is of the utmost importance - and in this case, family is what enables SI to move forward from grief.

And of course in Clayman's REVENGE they allow us to see the soft sweet loving side of Clayman. It's clear he cares about his family, but this would make it even clearer.

I think there could be a lot of interesting meta written about the processing of grief, as well the depths of loyalty Wendy has to Clayman.