#also connected to lilith in lore

[ya-kiri]

The Demon Haunt has given me a new appreciation for Lilim.😊

[astrow0rldx]

Dark Asteroids

TW Very Dark Themes of Human Experience & Nature.

Look at the house its in to show where it would show up, and its aspects to see how it influences different energies in your life.

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narcissus (37117) - narcissist. your side, or people in your life.

nessus (7066) - abuser, r@pist, predator. sexual abuse, obsession.

dejanaira (157) - ^ nessus victim. victim of these.

proserpina (26) - ruined innocence, abductions.

persephone (399) - ^ similar story. where time is not your own. held hostage, absence caused strife.

melete (56) - anxiety.

deprez (9795) - what makes us sad

pan (4450) - earthy carnal energy, lust, chase, desire.

maniac (228029) - inner maniac, where we do things other wouldn't, unexpected hobbies or passion.

lie (26955) - where you lie or manipulate, or get lied to about.

ate (111) - rushing to conclusions, delusional. respond to perceived, or real threats.

lucifer (1930) - where you are powerful. pride, egotistic. where you gain followers by manipulations. how you transform. why you look for revenge.

phaeton (3200) - dangerous behavior, people that got carried away, car crashes, accidents.

icarus (1566) - accidents, excessive risk.

nemesis (128) - enemies. vengeful self.

sado (118230) - sadistic dark sexual expression. borderline pain. thats that make us sad hard time expressing.

myrrha (381) - sexual relationships that go against natural law.

medusa (149) - your the prettiest, natural beauty can be corrupted by others. assault. punishment for something that isn't your fault.

karma (3811) - karmic connections, circumstances. fated.

tantalus (2102) - never getting what you want. always out of reach, temptation without satisfaction.

furia (194982) - our anger. what proves it. what attitudes bother us.

cassandra (114) - a gift & a curse. where your rejection ruined your life. where no one believes what you say

anubis (1912) - egyptian god of the dead.

grieve (4451) - grieve, grief, mourning, sorrow.

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for Nessus and pan to be in my 7th house i do attract those type of people. lustful, predatory men. but like in my actual relationships to.

furia is in my 4th house and i get really angry in the home, my mars is also there. narcissus is in my 4th house and and i have a narcissistic mother. my ancestors i work with seem to be very strong and aggressive to.

phaeton, dangerous behavior, accidents, and car crashes are prevalent in my dreams stuff like that and it's in my 12th house. also mania is there and spirituality, drugs, sleep/dreams, psychology could be where i have an unexpected hobby and passion others wouldn't.

icarus is another dangerous behavior, excessive risk. in my 5th house of parties, sex, creativity, entertainment etc. while deprez is there to that causes depression. as i read or write out celebrity chart analysis, everything puts together as lore, jhene aiko, jeffery dahmer, donald trump, etc. so as im writing mines out and its just mini asteroids, i love to see the depths, and art of my birth chart.

my lucifer is in the same house as my lilith the 3rd. also where my sun and venus is. and i do have really good mental manipulation skills, lying and using my words to scheme. but im only so aware because im not to much in my ego about it and never really liked to since a kid except when i needed to, but was always aware of that "power". nemesis is there and that is also my vengeful self. ate is also there in my 3rd house lol, rushing to conclusions, delusional. respond to perceived, or real threats. but these characters are very influnced in my school life also. im also a big trickster, love mind games, dark humor,etc.

tantalus in my 2nd house is frustrating. so as medusa in my 6th house of day to day activities & work environment. proserpina and persophone in my 10th and 2nd house is scary.

[gooperts-gunk]

post-qsmp q!bbh's story so far...

back to back we have had new q!bbh story pieces, on mythcraft with lilithluvsya and as mr. x on arkanis, so im going to write down all of my own notes of what we have learned so far + my crazed theory talk :) this will be long!!! note: this is from the perspective of someone who doesn't know mythcraft lore and the only arkanis lore i know is from what i pick up in passing lol. i will do my best!!

starting with the halloween special on mythcraft with lilith and rurus in which bbh helps lilith solve a puzzle that leads to her finding and adopting a new child, we get to see an actual bbh summoning!! im unsure if the treats are a necessary offering or just a kind gesture, but the soulfire-esque flames or wisps seem to be a very specific detail...

the chant lilith says is "hear these words, hear my cry, spirit from the other side! come to me, i summon thee, cross now the great divide!" implying that if he's summoned, chances are, he was in the underworld or somewhere else. later on during technical difficulties, lilith mentions that "i don't even know the state of his soul at the moment! because usually whenever i summon a chant through those words," she repeats it, "his soul just acted a bit... weird! he usually doesn't act like that whenever i summon him. usually, the magic feels a bit more smooth, and it was very choppy this time. his soul just felt different from the last time i saw him. i can't put my finger on it." it's hard to say what exactly this means, (i've seen some people think it's about how he died with a split soul, he never got the other half back from purgatory as far as we know...) as we've never seen him be summoned before, but in this case, he just showed up on the chest crying out a confused "HELLO...?" but later on says "i could sense something was off, that's why im here." with his trickster confidence. he also mentions he's "been around, doing my thing. im very busy," and no concrete answer is ever stated. another detail is that halloween is said by lilith to be "the veils between our world meet once a year," meaning as far as we know he can only be summoned on halloween.

when he accepts the treats and attempts to leave he says "im trying to get back home!" a place of residence for q!bbh is implied, whether or not it's one we know of or even if it's an actual house is uncertain. when bad comes across a haunted house he says "oh my gosh! i had a house like this once, only it was red." which might cross out the place of residence being on the island. might, considering the house was later changed because most people hated the red lol. when bad is downed from fall damage lilith comments "why are you so fragile?! you're not usually, like, this breakable." bbh says "oh, as soon as i die, i get to go back home, so..." since we know how !bbh deaths work, (he can only perma-die once from a unique death, e.g. the combination of soul vulture infection and nuke radiation slowly ate away until perma-killing that version of himself, which means it was an entirely unique instance of death. so it's safe to assume that ever since he had fallen, he would have perma-died from simple things like starvation, but then can no longer perma-die from it again, with a possible exception of if it's starvation along with something else at the same time) we know that him dying wouldn't be enough to bring him 'back home' if it's implied to be the underworld or the mind desert, therefore, it would mean that if he dies during a summoning that the connection is immediately broken and he's back to wherever he was at the time. he's sometimes even excited whenever he gets downed, even saying "take me! take me home!" either because 1. he just really wants to get home for some reason or 2. he just really doesn't want to work for lilith.

but, we know he doesn't HAVE to work for lilith, because lilith states at the end after he's left to fellow mythcraft member nex that, "you know how im a witch? ... WELL... a long, LONG time ago... i made a mistake with my magic and i MIGHT have summoned a greater demon who turned out to be a TRICKSTER demon instead and KINDA reversed the contract on me and NOW im stuck with him until i die and i have to do his bidding whenever he comes around, but only whenever i create the first kind of contract for him to flip around. and he kind of... is around, and changes rurus a lot, and i have to work to make sure that rurus can transform back into a human one day because they're stuck in their bunny form..." which is a LOT to digest and she said it all in like two breaths lol. so in reality lilith is stuck with bad, not bad being stuck with lilith, and bad could peace out whenever he wanted because it's trickster demon rules and on top of that he can also transform humans into bunnies??!!

going back to where my previous notes were, when they arrive at rurus' house and bad seeing a painting of himself with 5 cracked eggs around him, he exclaims, "what the fudge is that?! THAT'S CRAZY!! who's the monster who made this??" meanwhile lilith is oblivious to whatever this means. he also steals the painting. rurus shows up! (rurus says he smells like sulfur, which is definitely the 'demon smell' ak!bagi mentions once she has a moment to speak with him after the chaos) rurus mentions making the painting and it was likely a gag that bad wasn't supposed to see during the lore stream but it's there now LOL and bad repeats the same horror to them as they're oblivious too, "it's you blowing up the moon! all the moons that you've blown up?" "oh, yeah, im sure it's blowing up the moon!!" he says in angry sarcasm, and then sobs a little. "i had eggs once..." both lilith and rurus inquire, and lilith is the one to say "you became a father?" in myth!lilith's defense, the residents have a lot of adorable baby creatures they care for and might sooner assume the eggs in question are cute creatures LOL "well i just said i had eggs, so..." "oh, you hatched them?" "ohhh he HAD eggs- lawren, he- he hit menopause, he said something about that..." I HEEHEE'D. idc if it's just a goof and not entirely canon im keeping it in here.

later on, when the trio complete the puzzles and find a well-decorated baby ghost named willow inside a willow tree, bbh's behavior to willow is very endearing and also straight-forward, casually offering some steak that he stole from rurus' house. he finds the way out of the tree for them by hearing a raccoon's chitter, and lilith comments "you're really good at talking to raccoons for some reason..." and rurus pokes further with "did you have a special relationship with a raccoon?" "yeah i- i speak raccoon." this of course is brought up from the perspective of both of them knowing his lore out of character and wanting to poke fun, but it's also a fun coincidence that it was a raccoon, as raccoons are very special to pomme. it starts storming, and rurus tells bad to give willow his hood but alternatively gives willow his soul lantern instead since his hood is a "...non-removable item...".

when they bring willow back to lilith's house, he continues stealing like he has been since he was summoned, but this time he takes a cookie from a cookie jar and passes one to willow before taking one for himself. when willow thanks him and says she loves cookies, he gives her another and says "you can never have too many cookies!" which would immediately make you think of his kids and their cookies, dapper especially as they're a total cookie fiend. as willow settles in he teaches willow the first and only lesson he's given to her so far: "whenever someone invites you into their home, you get to take whatever you want!!" he goes upstairs and shows himself and willow around lilith's house, rurus mentions a gaming chair, of which was a toilet. bad takes it and says, "i know someone who would love this!" which of course would be richas' gaming set-up that had a toilet for a chair because of a prank, if i remember correctly.

bad asks where his room is, making an assumption that his summoning meant he was going to move in. when lilith says he could stay at rurus', REALLY not wanting him here, he says "i can't have a room at both??" like the greedy little man he is. <3 willow is then shown her own room, where bad then proceeds to place the furniture he stole from lilith into the room for her.

the birth certificate is revealed! willow is lilith's daughter, and bbh is her guardian demon. (many were unsure if he was a parent to willow but lilith clarified on twitter that he's a guardian demon that will show up from time to time) rurus inquires if HE scribbled his name there, and he says "no, no! that's crazy. that'd be ridiculous." in a bit of a liar voice.

when he accidentally picks up willow's sign, he courteously says "im sorry," and gives it back, prompting rurus to tell lilith she could just ask and he'd give her stuff back. when she does in a cutesy way, he dodges it entirely by saying "no hablo inglés" and when lilith demands for the furniture in spanish, he says "i don't speak spanish". i wouldn't call it entirely parental as willow's not his kid, but as you can tell bbh has shown far more care and respect to this child he just met than his contractors. the trickster has priorities!

they tuck willow into bed, and bbh falls asleep standing up, when lilith starts shoving him saying it's time to get him to bed, he wakes up suddenly, yelling "night terrors!! night terrors!!" we know he's gone long periods of time without sleeping, but he's having night terrors when he does...

bbh has technical issues, and during that time, rurus and lilith have a back and forth about him and their contract which is summarized in the bout with nex above. rurus says "you know, i used to be able to swear before i knew him, and now i can't." "huh! that's a weird incantation." this itself is likely a joke about their out of character friendship, but they come up with the idea that he might have a literal swear jar that he puts people's swears in, never to be said again lol.

lilith decides to keep the portal open as bad loses summoning connection to their world (aka technical difficulties) so he can visit whenever he likes to be a guardian demon for willow.

this wraps up the mythcraft section of new q!bbh pieces! onto arkanis!

a lot of people were unsure if mr. x would be q!bbh, but it becomes VERY clear based on how he acts with familiar faces, and some late night conversations...

not much to note when bad / mr. x greets fit, but there's a very silly familiarity when he says he'd like to take fit out to brunch right before talking about torturing him... yeah sure man why not O_O when fit asks if he's considered being GOOD and not murdering people, bad says "i considered it, but my therapist says i should embrace my hobbies. im trying to listen to my therapist more." so he at least had a therapist in recent times to tell him this, because on quesadilla island when asked about therapy, he mentioned something along the lines of that he tried therapy once, but he'd get chased out of town by people with pitchforks.

to briefly dissect the cutscene, from what i've learned, bad floating is a sign that he's powerful in valigma! only people with magic in valigma can float, examples being araldo when we get to see him later, and also bia raux who is also brought up to bad when telling him the current lore after the event. also. the manor. the banquet. i love you builders, it's so eggpire-coded. that man can't escape the aesthetic of red vines even if c!bbh tried LOL and another fun detail, he has ghosties/souls bursting around him! it's become integral to his character :)

when mr. x encounters the brazilians and his escaped captive fit, all the fantasminhas float around him! it's super cute that the grim reaper got little ghost sidekicks, and then doesn't even recognize that they're ghosts <3 he mostly called denix a gremlin or goblin, but that's because out of character he DEFINITELY knew who the admin was, that's why he bullied them so much and not the others lol.

even though he's having fun annoying everyone as mr x., bad still takes moments for the little ghosts, like spam crouching with amora when she creeps up to him, him and denix bonding by killing a penguin?? and playing songs on the flute and they all surround him and dance. :)

when the find the button room starts, and bad does his npc voice, bagi immediately starts yelling, knowing the "you got this! you can do it!" all too well, and bad keeps saying it in recognition. while it was already true that ak!bagi is a continuation of q!bagi, this interaction itself can be enough to assume that mr. x is q!bbh if he remembers it like she does. when it's revealed it's a find the button room, she's even MORE distressed, "are you responsible for this? please- please tell me you don't..." "i would never!" he says like a liar, and then maniacally laughs. bagi also frequently calls him "bad" and not mr. x unlike mostly everyone else, seeing through the silly alias.

one interesting detail is how hungry mr. x is for totems!! every once in a while he'll mention how he wants more totems popped, in the valigma cemetary / cemetario do valigma, he asks quel for how many totems they have, when they say a hundred, he says "passa tudo!" and drops mobs on them. he really wants totems for some reason!! does he absorb something from it or did he just really hate foolish that day? lol

once the event is over, bad and bagi get to talk! bad becomes uncle to amora, bagi's daughter. amora is immediately very sweet to bad! bagi catches bad up on what's going on in valigma, telling him about araldo and bia, and bagi thinks because he's a demon that he could help the specialists understand and handle the magic themselves, "you see those pink blocks glowing that way? they're like some of the magic powers that this land has, but we can't just touch it and start doing magic all the way through the town. so, basically, there's powers everywhere that we don't know how to use and those two entities fighting each other, they use different kinds of power. so maybe you, being a demon and stuff... maybe you can teach us how to handle this." which, upon mention of him being a demon, he deflects by admiring a streetlamp. bad didn't act this way with lilith and rurus because they were already aware he was a demon since they summoned him, but he never confirmed anything to bagi other than the vague vastness of his age and his immortality, if i remember correctly. which is more than he's confirmed to other people!

bad points out bagi's smoking, "you've taken up smoking, im guessing it's been really hard?" "yeah! yeah, no, that was because, the things i lived before, you know..." "yeah i understand..." "it caused me a lot of trouble." if im correct in assuming this is about the island and losing the kids... :( which bad then segues into asking if there's an ikea. LOL

when jvnq starts taking bad to pac's house to steal furniture, he says "oh wow! you guys are all nice and close together, i like this. yeah, i hate having to walk really far." knowing that q!bbh tried really hard to get people to live close by to him when he was dying so someone would take care of his kids recontextualizes this as living far away being a regret he still holds </3 (not to mention, cc!bad himself regrets building his bases so far away)

when pac says he'll give bad more muffins and furniture if he teaches him how to fly and such, bad deflects by saying "yeah! it's easy, you just got to... you got a- you got a nice view!" and looking at the black hole outside his house.

later on, when bad gets transported by araldo, they seem to get along nicely and araldo wants him to do MORE chaos at some point, which i believe is worrisome if it's true that araldo is the problem in the fight between araldo and bia raux... but also very fitting for him. meanwhile, sent back to his friends, he has only good things to say about him, and also inserted some of his silly lies. the entire interaction feels reminiscent of the times he'd talk about the 'eyeball guy with the snatched waist' aka the watcher, or even cucurucho to a certain degree LOL

when gabe takes bad to space, bad comments that it's a first for him! "the moon is just like i imagined it'd be..." congrats !bbh for having your first moon experience, at least, as far as you can remember!

meanwhile, transported to the mr. x manor, bad gives a dizzying tour to gabe, denix, and amora! he introduces the skeppy room when asked about his bedroom, mentioning he doesn't really need to sleep, and he instead meditates on top of the skeppy. (someone PLEASE feed this man dapper's special cake recipe) he also introduces his chair and i have no doubt that people have shown a comparison of his chair here vs. his chair in the hall of grim but i'll put it here anyways lol. he's also very consistent because the vod i went to to get a screenshot of his hall of grim chair is the near exact same "and this is my chair..." when he introduces it.

when bad, gabe, denix and amora are in the maze that the experts + fit went through to get to the cemetary, they stop at a corner to chat and gabe asks bad "changing the subject a little, if you had a son now what would his name be?" (possibly more gender neutral than the translator says, which is how bad interprets it,) this likely was on the mind because a bit earlier while exploring the manor, denix asked him to give him a second name or middle name and bad hadn't answered. bad stops to think about it, before prefacing "well, i- i've had kids over the years, a couple, but you're saying if i got a new kid, right? what would i name... him... probably... how do you say 'gremlin' in portuguese?" it's the same, but alternatively gabe offers "duende." meaning denix's second name is probably duende now LOL but more importantly, for the first time, at least directly tonight, q!bbh was reminded of his children. gabe contextualizes why he asked, "it's because in this city... anything can happen, you understand? one day you're single, and sad, and the next you have a family." "no, that's true... yeah. i- i understand what it's like, one day you just wake up and you got kids, i totally get it... and then everybody dies, and you're left alone." OOGH. EEYOWCH. we don't know for certain how long q!bbh has been living after escaping quesadilla island, or if even in the end cc!bad is planning that he escapes at all, he might still be bound to it. but however long it's been, he's been carrying onto the weight of everyone disappearing, with only strange creatures (the bunnies, the penguins, cucurucho...) to keep him company once everyone is gone. gabe inquires about if his family died, and he covers up with "oh, no, im just saying that's the inevitable. that's what happens, sorry." ...top 10 sentences that are more depressing when contextualized by an immortal demon with a heart too big for people to comprehend... :( something that bad misses here is denix asking if he wants to adopt amora, but this comes back around!

transported again, while gabe walks bad towards the boat the experts arrived on, he says "valigma keeps many mysteries and lots of trouble, right? fights, in this case many fights, problems, death, pain, suffering, and then we decide to have a child despite all these problems; how can this be, right? it's a weak point." bad says "yeah, love tends to lead to lots of problems..." which would be specifically commenting on taking care of children. and from the perspective of his current situation, being without them... yowch. :( then bad falls into a ravine, shoved by denix, and amora saves him. :) but when he fell he purposefully avoided landing in the water. :(

later on they go to the leaderboard! there amora offers that bad can adopt her for a while, since she's "kinda an orphan" based on the activity of her parents other than bagi, and he accepts :) though knowing he literally can't be active either lol. from then on, amora calls bad "dad" for the rest of the night, and "pai bad" the next day when talking with some of the experts :)

some more fun stops later, they pause in the gallery as gabe explains more of the araldo and bia beef, to which bad says once more to "wine and dine" araldo... if u want it done right, do it urself, geez... chat, beat this guy up for me... he has a weakness for guys with power... another moment in this stop to goof around, bad says "yeah, im really good at cooking... people. meals." which is normal q!bbh and the least surprising thing he's said or done all night.

the night slowly comes to a close, after running into guaxi for a small reunion, he says goodbye with a bang when denix kills him and he logs out. they then contain mr. x's corpse in a box of glass, preserved for memories <3

if this is what post-qsmp has been like for q!bbh so far, IM SO EXCITED FOR MORE!!! and yes i HAVE spent at least 5 hours writing notes as i vod review!!! q!bbh on arkanis felt a lot like a classic day on qsmp with his character plus some pain and suffering, and q!bbh on mythcraft gave us some extra lore bits to think about!!! very very fun, im sooo excited for whatever ending cc!bad has been wanting to make for q!bbh, because if it means he's still kicking it going around to other worlds, all of his pain in tow, IM SO READY!!! thank you if you went through everything here it was a doozy and mostly for yelling about with other people since i haven't been on tumblr for a while and i miss the screams from here. :)

[katagawajr]

BORDERLANDS 4- the lore so far

a post compiling all the tidbits from the trailers/descriptions, about everything we know about the story (so far).

wanted to make this post because i may be borderlands' biggest hater, but this new stuff looks really intriguing so far! call me optimistic but i'm definitely interested for now...

(speculation/theorizing involved here. i'm not actually 100% knowledgeable on all the lore but this is just what i'm gathering from it. if it turns out to be true then i called it here first <3)

so here's the timeline we know so far:

-> At the end of Borderlands 3, Elpis is crashing into Pandora. To save everyone (on both places), Lilith flies up and teleports Elpis away. Presumably, just like Sanctuary in BL2, she can't exactly control where it goes.

-> Where it happens to go is the planet of Kairos: a planet hidden in space- it's insinuated that the "protective barrier" surrounding the planet (made of glass?) turned it invisible. Or at least undetectable.

-> This "revealed" Kairos to the universe. Elpis presumably has been pulled in and is now orbiting Kairos.

-> Kairos is currently being controlled by "The Timekeeper." The Timekeeper is not a PERSON, but rather an Eridian Guardian. AKA... A Vault Monster.

-> This is explicitly stated in one of Nyriad's diary entries from BL3. She mentions the Timekeeper by name as an "Eridian Creation," in the likes of Graveward (BL3) and the Traveller (TFTBL). It's also obvious by the images above that it isn't Human- it has robotic limbs, floats, and seemingly harnesses/is connected to the Vault Gate behind it.

-> The Timekeeper is described as a dictator obsessed with Perfect Order, furthering the idea that this hidden planet was in a perfect state of "Order," with only the Timekeeper + its "synthetic" army. Remnants of whatever Eridian Society created it, and hid it away, for whatever reason.

-> Elpis crashing into Kairos, and breaking the barrier, has enraged the Timekeeper, who's planet is now visible to the galaxy. And a big hole in the ceiling of it's house. Damn.

-> It's confirmed there's a few years' time-skip between the crashing of Elpis and the start of the game. The SCAVS of Elpis (and bandits of Pandora most likely, however they hitched a ride) have now made their way to the surface of Kairos and are causing mayhem. They seem way more mechanical in nature than the last time we saw Elpis, but similar vibes. Very tech-y, robotic, etc. -> These bandits become their own faction known as "The Rippers," and their leader is a robot lady named Callis.

-> Queen Callis is shown in the trailer to ALSO be not human (robot? something else? Kairos's influence, or Elpis tech? who knows.) But apparently she also has the power to control the bandits, through their masks. She puts the masks on them and their eyes turn red, matching hers. So it's possible she's just mind controlling every bandit.

-> Anyways, it's a "robo-bandit" VS. "synthetic Eridian" civil war deal. The Timekeeper appears to be attempting to subjugate the entire planet again, especially based on all the "break free" wording of the teaser descriptions. Whether you're fighting WITH Callis's army or just as a third party, it appears the Vault Hunters are from Elpis (or, were on Elpis when it got yoinked at the very least). And they're trying to escape this planet. -> The last description does mention "cast of characters, new AND old," so it remains to be seen in what capacity old characters are involved. It IS a time-skip, so maybe Sanctuary finally tracked down Lilith's whereabouts and she's stranded on Elpis. Maybe Ava is an adult now and leading the Crimson Raiders. Maybe the whole "Timekeeper" business means there will be timeline fuckery- pulling alternate timeline versions of old characters, bringing back dead ones, who knows.

-> (I'M PERSONALLY INCLINED TO BELIEVE that Sasha and Fiona will also play a role in this game? Because New Tales called specific attention to Sasha being in a different part of the galaxy unable to be found (hidden planet? wink wink?), and Fiona's talk of Sasha's anahatium pocketwatch, with the etched phrase "TIME HEALS ALL WOUNDS.")

-> (Who knows if that is true, or what that really means. Just speculation here. I miss Sasha and Fiona, and they've been hyped up with BL3 Echoes, New Tales stuff, and even their own book. Give us the two best Borderlands characters back please.)

-> Last thing as an aside, it DOES show that we will be getting a Siren VH again. So she either needs to have Steele's unknown power, the Leech power, or some secret third thing. Maybe she isn't a real siren at all. The device on her arm could either be a way to REPLICATE a siren's power (like Anu, making her a "fake siren") or possibly as a way to enhance/contain the Leech power, like Tyreen alludes to in BL3. Interested to find out.

TLDR: we're finally getting the Eridian War plotline! They didn't forget guys! AND it directly involves Elpis, like the game where we first learned about the Eridian War!

Synthetic "Eridian" army led by a Vault Guardian/Monster, THE TIMEKEEPER, vs. the robotic bandit army, the Rippers, led by QUEEN CALLIS. Time-skip again (intrigued to see how long this time. It's canonically been at LEAST two years since BL3.) New + Old characters. New Eridian planet, like Nekrotafeyo. 4 New VH's, either FROM Elpis, or wayward travelers who accidentally crashed onto Kairos.

“Early 2025” gameplay reveal, unspecified 2025 release date.

[apoloadonisandnarcissus]

"Evil Takes Root": The Temptation and Fall of Galadriel

How many Christian references do you want in Sauron and Galadriel’s scene in 2x08? Yes! Because this is Tolkien, and Christian-Catholic message is the core of his legendarium.

“The Original sin” (or “The Fall") is central to Tolkien world-building: “The dislocation of sex-instinct is one of the chief symptoms of the Fall [of Adam and Eve]” (Tolkien Letter 43). Lust is the “original sin”, and the gateway to sin, and from where all other sins originate.  

St. Paul writes "cupiditas radix malorum": “the root of all evil is cupidity". “Cupidity” is greedy and lustful desire. This is motivated by the fact that Eve ate the forbidden fruit because "she saw it, was beautiful". This explains why Christians have such a bad view of sex, especially when it’s not restrained by marriage.

There is lust for the forbidden fruit (the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil that Adam and Eve were instructed not to eat in the Garden of Eden). This is when “sin” is first introduced into the world, leading to their banishment from paradise. The themes here are: disobedience to God, and succumbing to temptation (evil).

And it’s the serpent that inflames Eve's lust, and "Rings of Power" wasn't even being subtle here (even the OST for this scene is called "The Fall of Galadriel"): 

“Lust”, in its biblical/catholic sense, is the misuse of the body, sexually. The opposite of “lust” is “temperance” and “chastity”. “Lust” is disorderly sexual desire, and the subordinated enjoyment of sexual pleasure (against God’s law). It’s not just promiscuity, but extra-marital sex, as well.

In the Bible, “lust” is thematized by adultery (because marriage is a sacred sacrament, and acting against it, it’s breaking God’s laws, hence being a “deadly sin”). We also see this sin in connection with “idolatry” (one of Sauron’s crimes in Tolkien lore), when characters (such as Solomon) take foreign wives, symbolizing the forsaking of one’s partner for another.

Freudian symbolism: a crown (clitorical symbol) penetrating a sword (phallic symbol). That’s symbolic penetrative sex for you.

I’m not saying they are symbolically f*cking here, but they probably are.

And this serpent has a name, and a history of its own: his name is Samael (“poison of God”), the accuser or adversary, the seducer; and he’s mentioned in the Old Testament of the Bible, connected to Jewish tradition and early Christianity. Described as handsome and angelic, he’s one of the several angels who rebelled against God, and descend upon Earth to fornicate with women. He’s the prince of all demons, and a sorcerer. In the Jewish Kabbalah, he’s known as the “great serpent” who coils around creation and injects his venom into it. He’s associated with fire, and represents the Dark side of the Sun.

The devil is endlessly ingenious, and sex is his favorite subject. He is as good every bit at catching you through generous romantic or tender motives, as through baser or more animal ones. Tolkien Letter 43

Samael is associated with the Garden of Eden, and with Original sin myth; because he’s the planter of the tree (or vine) of knowledge, the one with the forbidden fruit Eve will eventually eat.

Are they not the seeds you planted?

He has a bride: Lilith: a raven-haired demon cursed by her sin of rebelliousness. She’s Adam’s first wife, who rebels against him and against God, and flees from the Garden of Eden. She’s known for her dark, uncontrollable and dangerous sexuality; she’s the mother of demons. God tries to get her back, but she has slept with Samael already. With him, she creates a host of demon children.

Now you know the meaning of the wine on *that* peak. And there you have it, folks: the queer couple of “Rings of Power” is Sauron and Adar, and this should surprise no one, really. Adar was obviously the spiteful ex-lover on a personal vendetta, and the show even went with the “bury your gays” trope with him. And Sauron is the queerest character to ever queer, so there’s that.

What this Uruk right here is saying is that he ate the “forbidden fruit”, too. Because he “saw it, it was beautiful”.

Back to Samael and the Garden of Eden; in some versions he’s the serpent itself, while in others he rides the serpent. Either way, he’s involved. He tempts Eve into eating the forbidden fruit, the original sin, lust. In one text, Samael actually had sex with Eve and impregnated her; he’s the father of Cain. God eventually castrated Samael to prevent him from filling the world with his demonic offspring.

Both of these demons are connected to another: Asmodeus (“wrath-demon”). The demon of lust (“original sin”), the king of demons, the prince of pleasures, the patron of passions, and the lord of luxury. He’s the Devil’s wingman, who’s known as a trickster, a shapeshifter, and a seducer who deceives people, causing them to stray from God’s path. He whispers into peoples’ ears, and inflames their passions and desires. He’s connected to power, seduction and testing of wills. While Lilith seduces men; Asmodeus seduces women. He’s known for being beautiful, charming and for his engaging nature.

In Lurianic Kabbalah, these three demons - Lilith, Samael, and Asmodeus - are connected, and interact with each other, in cooperation, to create a powerful force of evil to challenge God and humanity.

Which means, it’s possible to draw inspiration from these myths to create one single character. Which explains why Sauron has elements of both Samael (although I would argue this is more Morgoth coded), Asmodeus, and even Lilith when he was at Morgoth’s side and seduced Adar. Right now he’s on his “Asmodeus era”, so he seduces and wants women (Mirdania and Galadriel).

Evil takes root: Full-on penetration, followed by ejaculation (blood binding; the crown ejaculates Sauron’s blood into Galadriel’s chest).

But Eve wanted to eat the forbidden fruit. She wanted to bite into it, it was consensual. She was tempted, and she succumbed to temptation, to lust. Like Adar drank the red wine Sauron gave him. He drank it all.

So whatever is happening here is meant to be seen as consensual. No idea why they decided to make it look so brutal, then. However, and playing the Devil’s advocate here; why would Galadriel surrender her chest for stabbing, in the first place? Which leads me to next religious reference at play in this scene:

“Rings of Power” also went all the way with the The Ecstasy of Saint Teresa/Galadriel reference, by having her orgasm after getting stabbed in the chest by the spear of an angel of fire.

And Galadriel "ate the forbidden fruit", too. And she's about to join Sauron/the serpent.

But she snaps out of it (via Nenya), and jumps off the cliff. But it's too late, because evil already took root:

[nocreativityfornames]

Everything we know about Diavolo so far, lore wise.

WARNING: SPOILERS FOR ALL SEASONS

➤ He's the prince and future king of the Devildom, and the founder of RAD — the Royal Academy of Diavolo — taking the position of Student Council President. (swd: 1-1)

➤ He created the exchange program as a first step towards his goal of strengthening the relationships between the three realms and forming an allyship between angels, demons and humans. (swd: 1-1)

➤ He has the ability to discern the truth from the lie. (swd: 4-1)

➤ He was the one to step in and save MC from being attacked by Lucifer in the underground tomb. (swd: 6-6)

➤ He hasn't seen his father in several centuries now and only knows that the Demon King is somewhere in the bottom of the Devildom. (swd: 7-10)

➤ Unlike Lucifer, he saw MC's pacts with the brothers as a good thing from the very beginning. To him, MC's pacts were proof that demons and humans could put aside their differences and actually form bonds together. And that made him happy, considering it was all he wanted with the exchange program. (swd: 8-19)

➤ Before, citizens of the Devildom were allowed to travel to the Human World whenever they wished through passages spread through the kingdom, but Diavolo changed that after taking over the throne. Now, those passages are blocked and the only way demons can use them is by getting permission from Diavolo, Lucifer, or Barbatos - the only demons apart from his father who are allowed to use them freely. (swd: 11-4)

➤ He ordered Barbatos to imprison Belphegor in the castle and put Lucifer under house arrest for hiding the youngest from him even though he had planned treason. But later, he admitted to having known about it beforehand. "...Truth be told, I knew. I knew you were hiding Belphegor, and I knew why. Your loyalty to me forced you to deceive your brothers, and I knew that was a source of guilt. I saw how you struggled with it-how hard it was being pulled in two directions at once. And it made me sad.” (swd: 13-14 and 15-12)

➤ When the eight siblings were cast down to the Devildom and Lilith was in the verge of death from the battle, Lucifer begged Diavolo to save her and he did, having her reborn in the Human World with no memories of her previous life. This came with a cost, however, said cost being Lucifer's loyalty to the prince for the rest of time. (swd: 14-10 and 15-7)

➤ He refused to free Belphegor at first, but eventually made a deal with MC: to release him from prison if they went back in time with the help of Barbatos' powers and found out who had freed him in the first place. (swd: 15-14)

➤ He had Barbatos trace down MC's bloodline and found out that they were a descendant of Lilith because of it. (swd: 16-15)

➤ On his birthday he decided to not only celebrate himself but also MC, to give them a "late welcome party" and show appreciation for them after everything that had happened. (swd: 18-A)

➤ He was suspicious of Solomon for suddenly showing up in the Devildom with MC unannounced (swd: 21-4) but arranged things so they would be able to stay for a while. (swd: 22-19)

➤ When Lucifer and his siblings fell Diavolo found them in the colosseum, and every now and then he finds himself going there and pondering over his past decisions and wondering if they were the correct ones after all. (swd: 24-13)

➤ He was the first Solomon talked to about his suspicions that MC was connected to the natural disasters happening in ancient locations around the realms, and for a while only the two of them and Barbatos knew about it (swd: 37-4), since Diavolo decided to keep it a secret from everyone else until he had proof of MC's powers being harmful to the realms (swd: hard mode, 32-16).

➤ He had MC undergo the standard magic exams that demons students are given at RAD, and although he initially told MC it was to help them learn more about the powers demons possess and how to control them (swd: 29-5), it was actually a test to see if their magic was as powerful as Solomon suspected. The sorcerer was proven right when MC passed each of them. (swd: 37-4)

➤ His secrecy and unusual reliance on Solomon caused a strain on his relationship with Lucifer, as the eldest knew that Diavolo was hiding something but refused to tell him. They eventually had a conversation in the colosseum after RAD's exams week ended, where Lucifer directly enquired him about what was happening. Diavolo refused to tell him, saying it wasn't "the right time" for him to know yet, and when Lucifer asked if whatever secret he was keeping involved MC the prince replied that he wasn't certain yet, further concerning him. (swd: 28-C)

➤ He's "not fond" of Simeon because he finds him difficult to deal with and told this to the angel's face while speaking to him. When Simeon asked Diavolo why he found him difficult to deal with, he explained that it's because angels never divulge anything about themselves or the Celestial Realm but are constantly inserting themselves into Devildom business, and he's especially not fond of Simeon because he hides his true intentions better than any angel Diavolo has ever met. (swd: Hard Mode, 31-16) He's so unfond of Simeon that when he finally decided to make him aware of MC's powers being a threat to the three realms, he asked Solomon to break the news instead of doing it himself. (swd: Hard Mode, 32-16)

➤ He eventually decided to tell Lucifer about MC’s situation and through text apologized to the Avatar of Pride for leaving him in the dark for so long and asked him to meet him so he could finally let him in on what was happening (swd: hard mode, 36-16). Unfortunately that meeting never happened, since Lucifer ended up affected by MC’s powers and lost his memories before Diavolo could explain anything to him. (swd chat: the fantastic three, "untitled")

➤ Finally breaking the news to everyone, he and Solomon told the others everything, from the moment the sorcerer started growing suspicions about MC's powers to the moment that their powers struck Lucifer and he lost his memories. They also presented their only solution(s): to sever MC's pacts with the Night Dagger in order to break their magical connections to the brothers and make them an avarage human again. There was another solution: to stabilize MC's magic with the Ring of Light - the counterpart to the Ring of Wisdom that once belonged to Lucifer - but it was discarded right away as the ring had been lost in the Great Celestial War and no one knew its whereabouts. (swd: 37-9)

➤ Once everyone knew the whole story, he apologized to MC for not finding another way to prevent their magic from causing massive destruction to the realms, since he knew neither MC or the brothers wanted to sever their pacts with the each other. (swd: 37-9)

➤ When all things ended well and MC was able to get their powers under control without using the Night Dagger thanks to the Ring of Light that Simeon found just in time, Diavolo organized a party to honor MC and celebrate the victory. (swd: 39-1)

➤ He showed no surprise when MC expressed wanting to stay in the Devildom instead of going back to the Human World but still refused the request. Later, he explained why: "I don't want MC to be a demon...or an angel, for that matter. No, I want MC to be a human. A human who understands us, and who works together with Solomon to shepherd the human world toward a better future… Someday I'd like MC to work alongside me to bring harmony to the three worlds. Which is precisely why I won't allow you to be stuck here in the Devildom, MC. I want you to learn more about the three worlds and to understand each of them better... The human world, the Devildom, and the Celestial Realm.” (swd: 39-10 and 40-22)

➤ He couldn't accompany the brothers on their vacation to the Human World at first because of work and told MC he often found it hard to get things done with everything being so quiet since the others weren't in the Devildom with him. (swd: 42-18)

➤ When tasked with the over the kingdom in his father's absence, the first thing Diavolo did was to start conciliating with the Celestial Realm to end the conflict between the two realms. For this, he started having meetings with high-ranking angels to explain his plans and hopefully reach an agreement of peace between the realms. That was how he met Lucifer, when the angel came down the Devildom to hear what he had to say. (swd: 44-12, 44-15 and swd card: Lucifer, "Glory Days")

➤ He's a majority shareholder of the Three-Legged Crow Group otherwise called Yatagarasu, the largest company in the Devildom that's been expanding business in the Human World with their technology devices. (swd: 47-11)

➤ He has admitted to feeling jealous of the bond MC and the brothers share multiple times. On one hand, he's jealous of the brothers for being so close to MC, and on the other, he's jealous of MC for managing to become a part of their family so easily. “I wonder, when was it, exactly? When did you and your brothers become so very important to me? I thought I'd never be able to become ‘one of you.’ It seemed ridiculous to even try because it was just obvious that I couldn't. But then MC did just that... Effortlessly fitting in with the seven of you to become just another one of the gang. More than that, actually. MC is part of your family now. And when I saw that, it may have made me a little jealous. And while I haven't wanted to admit it to myself up to now...the truth is, I think I was lonely.” (swd: 48-12 and Hard Mode, 50-16)

➤ His mother died shortly after giving birth to him and he was raised by his father who was very strict and gave him a sheltered childhood, so much so he rarely ever left the castle. (swd: 56-18)

➤ He met Barbatos for the first time when he was still a child and the older demon was the first person he met from outside the castle. The older demon amazed him with stories of the outside world, and little Diavolo begged him to stay with him, getting to the point of threatening not to assume his position of king in the future if Barbatos left him. (swd: 56-18)

➤ When the brothers at the farewell party asked if they could make MC “officially part of the family” by marrying them, Diavolo explained that demons and humans aren't able to marry yet but that he'll do everything he can so one day that'll be possible. “MC, you aren't aware of this, but some bad blood still exists between our three worlds. No matter how much all of you may want this to happen, it's not something I have the power to do on my own. [...] However, my ultimate goal is to eliminate these barriers someday. And I will do everything in my power to make sure that happens.” (swd: 60-15)

➤ A while after MC left Diavolo sent them a magic letter and asked them to come to the Devildom for a third time because he had something important to discuss with them. (swd: 61-4) And that something turned out to be a request for MC to participate in the exchange program for a second time and an invitation for them to be a new member of the student council. (swd: 62-17)

➤ The intentions for this second try of the exchange program was mostly the same but now with a different approach, as Diavolo explained to everyone in the meeting then: “Our last exchange program was meant to provide an opportunity for cultural exchange among the inhabitants of all three worlds. But nothing more than that. Think of it as merely a starting point on the path to mutual understanding. But this time, the goal of the program is to make a stronger case for mutual understanding. Directed at everyone both inside and outside of the Devildom.” (swd: 62-17)

➤ He's known Mephistopheles ever since they were children. (nb: 13-11)

➤ Initially, his father was the main reason why he was determined to be a good king and why he even rescued the brothers in the first place. He craved the king's approval, wanted to live up to his name, show himself worthy of the throne, and eventually surpass him. He was forced to face this truth when he was younger during his last trial of the Kingsblood Crucible - a traditional ritual that demons of royalty have to go through before they take the throne. (nb: 14-7)

➤ After MC was officially appointed as the 9th member of the Student Council and the short-term exchange program ended, he gave them an “entry permit” so they could travel from the Human World to the Devildom whenever they wanted. (swd: 80-22)

[crooked-wasteland]

The court scene in hazbin leaks seemed empty .

Lute had no arguments, she was yelling in void, the seraphim and female stolas were just there waiting for plot to happen, Sera answer to anything lute saying was "shut up" literally, which isn't only unprofessional for a governor to do but also it helped at portraying lute as crazy hysterical woman no one respect without the presence of her man.

If hazbin hotel was really interested in discussing the concept of good and evil then here's the right moment, we could take this scene as opportunity to talk about the the justice, lute should represent the concept of the justice is inflexible only bound to the rules that kept people safe for decades . her arguments is that they are currently in war with hell and they can't let a sinner in might be dangerous he might attend some harm upon them or play the role of spy for the morningstars . Emily or stolas-evil-twin or anyone, will represent the concept that there's no justice without mercy and rules should have an exception for cases like this their argument is his sin didn't come from malicious place but rather from a genuine fear so is his act of redemption and therefore we have right to assume that his soul is inherently good and he attends no harm and we should welcome him in heaven .

And I remember a saying in writing goes like :"write an argument where everyone seems to win"(I forgot the actual quote) and I think this one of the scene where we should apply that in order for scene to have a depth

I agree, except on the account of Lute's argument being pointless. Unfortunately, you need the other leak of Seraph talking to Able and the one of Vox to grasp the points being made.

Major spoilers incoming!

The argument Lute makes in the courtroom is nonsensical because we were never given the information. At the start of the season, Charlie has a fairytale book of her parents and it mentions Lilith using music to rally demons against heaven. Vox says this explicitly in a reminder lore dump of 12 whopping seconds that Lilith was prepared to go to war with Heaven before vanishing.

So there's that aspect of the world we never had mentioned or hinted at in the main series. It would have actually helped a lot with incorporating Lilith's army waiting for her in Happy Day in Hell. It also could have been tied back to Rosie and her cannibals. Maybe hinting at the Rosie and Lilith connection more appropriately, or at least opening the idea that Lilith had an army waiting on her still.

Additionally, Seraph mentions how Hell will "want revenge". So even if Hell wasn't a threat before, her greenlighting a genocide is going to make peace a relative impossibility. It's inevitable for Hell to fight back, so now Heaven has to figure out if they will risk their own safety by ending the cullings, or continue and admit they are oppressors keeping Hell weak intentionally. It would make the suggestion of redemption unappealing, regardless of being possible.

But the issue the series will have to patch over is the idea that Sinners would want to be redeemed if it wasn't for Heaven's yearly census shaving. The conflict in the pilot was that Sinners wouldn't want to be redeemed. The exorcists were actually a believable motivation for why anyone would even consider redemption when you have the right to suffer and cause suffering forever in Hell. The issue of the Sinners' immortality questioning how the show is going to believably instill the idea that the discomfort of staying the same is going to outweigh the discomfort of change. And the exorcists seem, frankly, necessary to maintain the pressure on Hell to give Charlie a chance. Meanwhile, maintaining a genocide is going to turn away people who are probably good at their core. The pressure of being oppressed will leave them nowhere to go and without options that don't in some way contradict their own values.

So the story is actually focused on the major plot issue for once. However it isn't staying there. Then we have to remember the sneak peek Medrano shared of Baxter and how the concept of Redemption at all is what is being challenged. Not if Redemption is desirable. So that is where the two sides of the story lose cohesion. Honestly, the Heaven storyline will be far stronger than the story taking place amongst the actual main characters. And between the Baxter/Alastor/Lute reveals, I'm wondering what time there is left to even tell any story about the main character. Once again, we're looking at too many plot threads not being given enough time to expand.

[circeyoru]

collection of overlords??? I love it so muchh 😭💗💗. I have some questions for this, does reader have any connection to Lucifer? By that i mean are they close and does he visit them from time to time. Or does he just ignore them as long as they don't bring harm to his family and to most of the residents of the ring? I feel like for someone like reader that owns all of the overlords soul, Lucifer would at least be acquainted with them (all of your writings are so addicting, I've already read all of them twice by now)

Go to MASTERLIST for the works. This ask is for {Collection of Overlords}.

Thank you for liking this newest story!! And my writings!! I can't believe there are part 2 requests. Now there's ask!! AHHH!!

Anyways. Back to the topic at hand~ A bit of lore too

Simple answer yes. (ok end of this post, just kidding)

Okay, essentially, I see Reader/you with this background. You were the Ruler of Hell, before Lucifer and Lilith's arrival. Since Lucifer was a powerful angel then fell, you let him hold the title of King of Hell since you saw him to be the one with more power. And the fact that if he used holy magic on you, there wasn't much of a way you could counter it. However, Hellborns still see you as a royal of the highest rank, but they don't rebel against Lucifer or Lilith's reign so it's all okay.

You were the one to help Lucifer and Lilith rise to power once they arrived, nothing like what you did to the Overlords. You introduced them to the demon nobles and the sins of different Rings of Hell. Naturally, they were stationed in Pride where you were formerly. The Overlord system wasn't in effect yet, it only started when Lucifer and Lilith's reign became less public and their focus shifted. You suggested a new hierarchy ranking that was specific to Sinners since there were a vast number of them and they do aim to stand in power. There can't be a rebellion and the Hellborns were in line because of their respective Ring's Sin. What of Pride? Because either the King or Queen were taking their duties, you took the role of maintaining a balance.

Your relationship with Lucifer in the beginning was a mentor and mentee type, since you had more experience with ruling, you showed him the ropes. Then it turned to friends when he was in his Kingly position. While others may see you two as rivals with your 'army' of Overlords and Lucifer's angelic powers, you two respect each other on serious matters. Plus, Lucifer understands that you basically still hold authority over Hell like back in the old days, but you just don't show it. Your history as the Ruler of Hell was painted as a legend that the Hellborns passed on to their children from generation to generation.

You notice how there are eyes everywhere? I'll adapt it to you being everywhere and nowhere at the same time. That's how you keep an eye out for things and know when to act.

Fun fact: Lucifer makes you ducks too, it's basically like a private phone between you two. It's still a bit awkward when you hold up the ducky to your ear. You're also his unpaid therapist when it came to listening to him rant and whine about missing his daughter, Charlotte all the time.

[sparklingsora]

Hi. I would like to know many things about your roleswap au bc I love it very much but I have no idea what to ask I just want to know many things bc my brain has been consumed already

uhhhhh I guess can you lore dump a little bit on backstories? Idk I just wanna know everything about this au

I will be back in your ask box for this au several times most likely

-Spaghetti Brain Anon

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE ASK!!! i am SO glad that i could get this au to live in someone else's brain rent free too. all i could ever ask for in life tbh i guess i'll infodump about character backstories, dynamics, character arcs, all that juicy stuff putting it under cut because HO BOY THIS IS GONNA GET LONG

as a heads up, take the timeframes i give you with a grain of salt, because i still havent completely figured out the timeline so first of all, vox!! he's a sinner, died in the 1950s, as per canon. he's a businessman, but less stable than in canon. he's always jumping from job to job, business to business, which results in him having a lot of connections with various people around hell. soon after arriving in hell, he met and became friends with alastor. cut to, i'd say around 7-10 years before the events of the story? alastor disappears without a trace during an extermination and vox assumes him dead. having now been personally touched by the effects of the extermination, the idea to try and solve overpopulation another way is planted in his head, but wont come to fruition until much later. in the meantime he meets velvette - finds her bleeding out in an alleyway after getting too cocky and trying to fight back to an exorcist (bad idea). he nurses her back to health, they become friends and eventually start dating, yada yada yada. one day vox and velvette find a funky little cat (keekee). keekee takes a liking to them and leads them to the old ruins of a building up on the hill on the edge of pentagram city. they figure out that the cat turns into a keyblade that can be used to magically build shit (only the hotel though, as keekee is the spirit of the hotel or??? whatever the hell the canon lore is idk???) vox finally decides to realize his idea to try and solve overpopulation more humanely - through redeeming sinners! his reasoning is, if angels can fall (as proven by lute and charlie), then demons can surely ascend, right? though he's not as sure or idealistic about it as charlie is in canon. he simply thinks it has a chance of working, and opening up a hotel means a bigger sample size than if he were to just try and get into heaven himself or something like that. besides, he wouldnt wanna go to heaven, he likes it here. also, im not sure where this is situated in the timeline yet, but he was in a band with adam, lute and possibly eve at some point? the band is called brimstone eden, as mentioned in the comic i posted. im not sure yet whether he was in the band prior to eve's disappearance or after it (eve disappears 7 years before the story starts to mirror canon lilith). swap!vox, like his canon counterpart, is a very reactive person. he follows trends, he's extremely go-with-the-flow to a fault. he never really had any strong beliefs until the hotel - his character arc mainly involves him gaining something to believe in and learning to fight for that belief, 'ready for this' being more or less the culmination of his arc. jesus christ i cant believe i wrote that much JUST on vox. *slaps the top of his head* this boy can fit so much lore in him

now, velvette... she's how you'd expect her to be. same old brave, arrogant velvette. she's a fashion designer and seamstress and runs a moderately sized business which she promotes on sinstagram. she's mutuals with val there, which is how he finds out about the hotel. there's not much to write home about when it comes to val - it's insane how similar angel and him are. like literally barely anything changes when you swap them, it's very clean. he's a prn star, sold his soul to angel dust, yada yada. though a bit on his dynamic with vox - vox is very good at reading people, and doesn't like being lied to (he's a bit of a hypocrite in that regard - he puts on a facade all the time when in professional settings). he can clearly tell val isnt doing as good as he pretends he is, and wants to help him really badly, but val just sees it as vox pitying him and rejects his help (its what they fight about in ep 4, as a counterpart to the whole "charlie going to the studio" thing bc vox wouldnt do that) and now here's the fun part - ALASTOR! oh, alastor, you beautiful stuck up bitch! so turns out, he's not so dead after all! he ALMOST died in that fateful extermination, but husk found him and offered him a "give me your soul right now or bleed out in this alleyway" type deal. of course alastor chose the former, but boy he's not happy about it. he's extremely ashamed of how far he's fallen. so ashamed, in fact, that he hid from the world for those 7-10 years! yeah! he's only pulled out of hiding when husk summons him to be the bartender for the hotel. vox is of course, extremely bewildered and demands answers. alastor doesnt give them and avoids him instead. it takes a sincere conversation with valentino in ep 4 for alastor to finally talk to vox again and explain himself. alastor is basically in extremely deep denial of just how fucked his life is. he clings onto his radio demon persona like a lifeline bc its the last thing that can help him feel some semblance of control over his situation. his tension with valentino is twofold - first they butt heads because of opposing personalities, and second because they both see the other's bullshittery. it's a clusterfuck it eventually bubbles over in ep 4, they both admit how absolutely fucked they are and are friends now. wish i could say more on al & val bc i love them very much but it seems ive run out of eloquency for now. though i know i'll draw some comics of them eventually so maybe it'll come across better in comic form. anyway as mentioned above ive run out of eloquency and im honestly not sure how coherent this whole thing is so you'll have to come back for the other characters some other time, dear anon! until then, thank you so much for the ask once again, and have a nice day/night :)

[teeth-cable]

Why Lucifer being a good person is fucking stupid:

So in the show canon Lucifer and Lilith were kicked out because they were dreamers and gave Eve the fruit of knowledge. Based off the lore of Helluva Boss Lucifer 99% is the sin of Pride. In the show Lucifer is just a quirky theatre major who just wants to reconnect with his daughter...

Ok so lets analyze why this does not make sense in the worldbuilding. Lucifer is the King of Hell, a.k.a. a place full of homicidal maniacs and various other people. And since angelic weapons can harm angels (which is stupid btw) and sinners have been stealing weapons left behind by angels... Lucifer logistically cannot be a good person because these people could just decide to try to murder him if he was too weak. He needs the sinners and populace to fear him or respect him. Since Helluva takes place in the same setting Lucifer must have put in the social hierarchy of hell, approved it or doesn't do anything about it. Which means he plays some part in Stolas and Stella being forced to wed and the imps plus hellhounds being treated like garbage.

Then we get into story construction problems. Like if Charlie and Lucifer have a good relationship instantly then almost all the problems in the show can be solved at a snap of a finger because of Lucifer's power level. Its a similar problem with Alastor but worse because Lucifer is stronger. Like Alastor tho is implied to be weakened and forced to do this so there is intrigue storywise and limits on his personality and power. Lucifer is angel and can just like idk zap the Vees. Theres no threat, risk or anything now.

Also this Lucifer may have slept with Eve which either implies he cheated on Lilith or Adam was cheated on twice and Lucifer also agreed with genocide

And what wouldve been better is Lucifer being a shitty dad or person WHICH WE HAD IN THE PILOT. Like Lucifer being awful is actually better for the previous reasons and Charlie's own character. Like Charlie is supposed to be an underdog despite being princess and has an impossible task and if her father doesnt believe in her theres another personal level to then and maybe some of the audience could connect with her. And if Charlie's dad hates her or something you could easily write in and make Charlie struggle more by having him cut off her resources. Heck if her dad is awful then you can write in how Charlie feels about being so morally different. Then slowly build up to when we see Lucifer for the first time and actually have it feel special

This just makes me missed the pilot even more. While it did have it's own problems with the worldbuilding and characters, a majority of its ideas were still believable.

A better angle for Lucifer would be if he was a morally grey character. He can still be a decent father but a terrible ruler. Of course, that angle wouldn't work because everything in this show has to be black and white, where it literally tells you in a song, "Cause the rules are black and white" despite the same show critiquing its Heaven for the same black and white thinking.

I'm not against the idea of Lucifer being a decent father because there are still other ways the show can create conflict between him and Charlie. For example, he does get her the meeting into Heaven but it's at a cost. If she's unable to convinced Heaven, she has to abandon the hotel. Or maybe he is skeptical of Charlie's idea so he makes her overcome the hotel's problems, like the Vees, alone, to prove how strong and passionate she is. Of course, if they hurt Charlie, he can easily kill them, but it can serve as a great character moment for the both of them. Charlie learning Hell is brutal, Lucifer now hating the hotel because it will hurt Charlie, and create a new conflict where Charlie and Lucifer are against each other. Or the fact Lucifer was the one who allowed the exterminations to happened and Charlie has to undo her father's actions.

I'm only focusing on Lucifer being a "good" person through parenting because almost everything else, he's a bad guy. Not only was this the same man who allowed the yearly genocide of the sinners but also he created the classist, racist social hierarchy and system in Hell, and let the pride ring become so awful, the overlords, a group of powerful sinners, are taking advantage of regular sinners daily.

[justanotherblogger]

Random Rambles And Theories About Alastor Go!

Ok, so right now I am on a high with all the recent Alastor lore we've been blessed with in Hazbin Hotel, and this little murderer has been occupying my mind 24/7. I really need to get all my theories and rambles out that I don't see a lot of people talking about.

(BTW, before my ramble, I have seen many places say he was mixed race as a human, but if I am wrong, please let me know, because this delves deep into that with his human life.)

(Also be warned for a bit of gore/violence and that this thing is kind of long)

Now let's begin!

I'll start with the most talked about theory with Alastor: his connections with Lilith and why he reacted the way he did with Lucifer

The show has given us what many people think are hints to this with both of them gone for 7 years, the slight eye twitch in the pilot when he looked at liliths portrait, Alastor showing up right after Charlie finished voicmailing her mom also in the pilot, how he knew about Charlie's Daddy Issues before she seemed to have told anyone, the leash comment from Husker, and how Alastor reacted to Lucifer.

Now, all of these could be chalked up to Alastor having some sort of nice relations to Lilith, but some of these are a bit too far stretched to just be because he has interacted nicely with Lilith in my eyes.

I have seen many people talk about how Alastor must have gotten a bad impression of Lucifer because either him and Lilith are besties and talk crap about him after the split, or he listened to her complaints about him and got an impression off of that to dislike him this much right off the bat in episode 5.

But I don't think that's it. We see how badly Alastor reacted to the leash comment by Husker, which definitely isn't a good sign that he would even trust the words of whoever is holding that 'leash' against him. He seemed pushed over the edge, vulnerable enough to lash out, which is unlike himself. Whatever deal he made for his soul, was most likely under threat, a life or death choice.

This is why I think he despises (most likely) Lilith or whoever has that 'leash' on him. He lashes out, sensitive about the subject. After gaining so much power over the overlords, he suddenly gets toppled over again by someone of (most likely) higher status, being forced into an unwilling contract, now just another pawn that this demon(?) can use for their own desires, and he doesn't want to be that, he needs to make his own decisions. But he doesn't have any say in the matter.

So I think why he was mocking and teasing Lucifer so much was because of his connection with Lilith. Everyone knew how deeply in love they were (before they split) and how they are both the most powerful demons in hell. I think Alastor took a chance to use his pent up anger on Lucifer, trying to get him to hurt as much as he can because of what Lilith did, all the while Lucifer cant do anything too serious leat he upset Charlie. We know he is extremely petty, after all. (we can also see him (most likely) letting off some steam when devouring the loan sharks, with him getting unnecessarily big and just letting loose on a couple of low-tier goons)

I saw another person talk about how Alastor has no power over Lucifer/Lilith, no political power, and he can't beat them in games of wits either. But the one thing that he does have the upper hand on, is their daughter, and I completely agree with that.

Alastor has been there since the beginning, has helped Charlie out and talked with her more than her own Parents had in the last couple of years probably. He's seen how attached the parents are to Charlie, and decided to use that info in full force. Just look at the Lucifer/Alastor duet.

Now that we have my theories of the life and death contract with Lilith, let's go deep into what I think is Alastors character right now:

Alastor, a mixed child in the early 1900's most likely had it really rough. With being treated as less than from both sides for being to dark/light to the violence that he most likely had to endure during his childhood.

This could have been where his anger/obsessive resentment started to simmer up in sporadic bursts over the years and years of belittlement, abuse, and racism.

Like I said before, he was probably treated as less than human for his mixed skin, and Alastor most likely started to hate it. His skin, the people, everything seemed so wrong. Why should the people who beat him and his mother see them so vulnerable and weak. He decided he didn't like that anymore.

So the radio show started. I got this idea from when he said his face was only made for radio. Over the radio, no one ever knew what you looked like. Just your voice would be broadcasted, and no one would ever see who was really behind the microphone unless they stepped out. This seemed like a barrier to Alastor. Letting himself go with no worries about letting people see him vulnerable behind his broadcast. (Maybe that's why he hates TV and modern tech so much; people can see everything about you)

And when his radio show became a hit and people wanted pictures and news? What would protect him then? Simple: his unwavering smile. Reactions are what people want when they crush others. They want to see them wallow and beg cry from what they have done. But Alastor won't let anyone do that to him ever again.

He stands his guard, not letting any comments get to him, keeping charming smile and unwavering voice all throughout his career as a radio host. Keep the smile up, dont have your voice crack, never show weakness. If you stop, those that wait will sink their teeth in and never let go of you. That's what I think a part of his mentality is and is maybe a part of why his smile is stitched on in his demonic form.

Now onto why I think he's a serial killer/cannibal. Remember when I said he had lots of unchecked anger and obsessive resentment? All this now simmering even more while being pushed down by his persona?

This is when he'll break loose.

He usually goes for the ones with the least amount of defense: drunkards/ bar frequenters. I though of this when Mimzy said he used to always come to the bar she was performing at and how he could drink like a sailor.

He might've drank with people to let their guard down in addition to his non-threatening charm, and he probably built a tolerance to be at least a bit sober when the others are full out drunk so he can easily transport and kill them.

He probably enjoys killing/eating his victims because a) it shows how he has power now. How he isn't a helpless victim anymore and he's finally in control of his life or b) where he likes seeing privileged people beaten and bruised for once, the gratification of seeing someone taste their own medicine by his own hand, like revenge, even if that person hadn't been necessarily bad towards him.

His death ro me is the same that everyone else thinks, where he's burying some victims body and gets mistaken for a deer, then shot straight between the eyes. What I do think a bit differently is that he was chased by hunting dogs first, which alerted the hunter for him to get shot, which then led to his fear of dogs.

Then he was finally free to do anything. Hell had no limits, he didn't have to hide his carnage anymore. But now that smile he wore was engraved into his face, almost making it impossible to frown. But that didn't matter. Not right now. Alastor has so many emotions bubbling up that he just wanted blood to be on his hands.

And then he slaughtered the overlords and took their souls within weeks ( maybe months, idk how quick he killed them, but ima go with weeks), broadcasting it over the radio to show everyone what he's been up to.

Alastor had kept this routine for a couple of decades, occasionally getting a guest star on his broadcast by those who he seems fit.

But maybe he had become too cocky with this power high, as he had been attacked by holy weaponry right before the extermination he dealth with most of them, but a shot did make it into his shoulder, causing him to collapse in pain, unable to move. (a bit simple, but I imagine him getting badly hurt by angels/angelic weaponry to lethal levels and Lilith decides to save him)

He fought hard when the angels arrived, of course, but he could only go so far in being this injured. So when he was about to get stabbed in the chest by a holy spear, he was already tired and almost accepted his fate, before being pulled somewhere by Lilith herself.

This is where Lilith offers a beat and broken Alastor a one time deal: become her servant or she'll throw him back to the exterminators herself. And in a situation like this, there's usually only one option you can really take.

And so he was a ghost, leaving everything he had behind. His power, his respect, his freedom...

Now Alastor had become a pawn again. A tool useful for the right situations, and just a toy to be played with by Lilith. This is exactly what he didn't want from his human life. The humility, the disregard, treating him as some sort of street animal, no matter what he did.

And now she orders him to guard her daughters hotel, giving him back a piece of his power to protect the hotel.

Alastor had hated Charlie for how she misused her amazing power for something like redemption.

Alastor hated Lucifer, for having all that power, being the strongest demon in hell, yet taking it for granted while mocking him about his choices.

And Alastor hated Lilith, for trapping him again, and renewing his endless cycle of suffering.

So those are my thoughts about Alastor. I think you can tell he's my favorite. I just love his powers and lore.

[sepublic]

With this analysis of Luz having Belos, and King having the Collector, it does feel as if Eda herself is technically missing her own personal antagonist; Though tbf, she does parallel/foil Belos in a lot of ways too. So it could simply be interchangeable, esp when we have Luz and the Collector; But a part of me wonders if there would've been a third villain, for Eda?

Like, maybe the Archivists; They're out there, and their relationship with the Collector can be comparable to Eda and King's. It's just that Eda lied to King and was at times a neglectful parent, but nevertheless came around... And since I believe it was an Archivist and not the Collector who turned the Owl Beast into a scroll, there's a very personal connection for Eda there, given how much the curse really shaped her life and made her self-doubt in a way even the coven system didn't (Though you could argue she only got cursed because of Belos' cutthroat system pitting Lilith against her).

Maybe the Archivists would've recognized their magic on Eda, would've recognized the Owl Beast especially and we'd get more lore on it; Not that the Archivists needed it to be special to 'preserve' it, per their stated MO. Given the Owl Beast's reaction to the Collector, imagine how it would've responded to the actual Archivist who transformed it? And we could've gotten more collaboration between Eda and the Owl Beast, more understanding as the latter became more active as a character...

Who knows, maybe the six-legged form we see in the finale is a super-harpy form that the two could've achieved against the Archivists; Or the 'Owl Deity' mural within the Owl House's living room.

I also wonder if Eda's antagonist is Lilith; After all, we've seen in the storyboards that she was originally going to be much more antagonistic and mean-spirited. I wonder why the writers changed this. I suspect it's to make the twist of Lilith cursing Eda actually impactful, since a Lilith who clearly cares and is struggling to have it both ways feels like a genuine betrayal to Eda and the audience, as does her dangling Luz over a cliff (Which in the storyboards, happens but isn't as huge of a deal).

So Lilith is an occasional antagonist and rival, but never a malicious threat and even someone who teams up; Which makes the revelation and her crossing a line hit extra-hard. So she's basically a twist villain, revealed as the 'mastermind' behind the curse that Eda struggles with in S1, with S1 having the most emphasis on the curse as a conflict for the protagonists to navigate; And Lilith sharing that curse is the resolution, as it's no longer an active problem threatening Eda's existence. There's still more (like the aforementioned Owl Beast) to address in S2, but the curse itself is not worsening anymore.

With all that in mind, I guess this makes Lilith technically the villain of S1? Since Belos only really takes initiative in the last two episodes. She's more recurring, and her being less antagonistic kind of works with S1 being much more light-hearted. I've already suggested before that each season corresponds to one of our main trio; S1 for Eda, S2 for King, and S3 for Luz. Belos definitely plays a bigger role in S2 while the Collector is more S3, so it's not exactly one-to-one...

Still, we can see the progression as the villains get more powerful; But in the end, Lilith and the Collector were both manipulated by Belos, and are won over in the end. Lilith gets the most screen time as an ally due to when she turns around, and thus her time as a protagonist overshadows her time as an antagonist.

I also have to wonder if Eda isn't meant to have her own villain? Eda is unlike Luz and King in that she's already a full-grown adult who's seen and learned plenty; She's got more to learn as we see. But she's more certain of her place in life, whereas Luz and King are going through their coming-of-age, and thus they have their personal antagonists to represent that big character conflict.

For Eda, it's more confronting herself; Or maybe the Owl Beast is that antagonist, since she does blame it for ruining her life and all that. Maybe it's Raine and Gwen and Dell and Lilith; Less in an "Antagonist" sense, and more as people Eda needs to make resolution with, that she's in conflict with.

And as an adult, that conflict is less overt and more quiet, internally painful, and really about just talking things out. By contrast, Luz still had her Gildersnake moment coming up, set up in THE very first scene of the show, and King had his arc renouncing his destroyer status to be more mature with the concept of power.

Maybe it's because Eda's not one who operates on fantasy like Luz and King do, either; In the second episode, Eda delivers the lesson about 'being special' which tell us a bunch. It suggests she's already been there and done that, she's the mentor. Her antagonist is less of an overt face per adulthood, but maybe it represents how she's done most of her growth.

So Eda's arc isn't about her relationship with fantasy; King's is abandoning his in favor of a quieter, sustainable reality; Luz has a nuanced dynamic with her fiction (due to it being less inherently destructive than King's), where she healthily distinguishes when and when not to embrace it.

It could be that since Dana originally held hopes for a prequel series involving teen Eda, that we would've gotten a more overt antagonist for her that way; Maybe Principal Faust! With his rantings on kids as evil, being an insincere teacher while Eda becomes a genuine one and even a dean! And that conflict’s resolution leads to Bump taking his place. And/or it's Terra Snapdragon. Hell what if it was the previous Golden Guard, and Darius not yet realizing what his mentor did wrong (even if his mentor realized but never vocalized it to a kid who could get in trouble) contributed to him no longer being friends with Eda; Because she defeated the Golden Guard.

(This reminds me of my speculation on Eda and the Golden Guard, before we learned Hunter's name, being parallels and having connections. They're not exactly parallels... Well maybe in some ways they are with their lacking magic... But they definitely have that lost-to-time familial connection.)

I did notice that in S3, Eda didn't have as much focus compared to Luz and King; Again, for the reasons I listed above about her having done most of her arc already, and what she had left had already been resolved. So it makes sense to focus on Luz and King, who are still struggling. But also again; If we got that prequel series, we would've gotten a bunch of solo Eda development and screen time, but without any Luz and King alas.

So when evaluating all these factors, maybe Dana and the writers chose to focus on Luz and King, and let Eda take the backseat for this reason; They'd still have a whole show for Eda, or at least a mini-series, afterwards. But this was the last we'd see of Luz and King, so I think that priority worked. Even if we evidently aren't getting that prequel series, if Dana's acceptance of this is any indication... Plus, again: S3 being short means they can only fit in so much, meaning Eda could only get so much too; Esp with the set-up of Luz needing to make her way back to Eda and King, which means they only have 2/3 of S3 where they can appear.

[daybreakerangel]

Your discussion about leaks made me think many things.I feel like Lucifer is being dick to Al 'cus he's still holding grudge from the whole Drop beat dad.

I actually laughed how much Lute tried to paint herself as the victim. Probably thinks she's a victim. I hope we find out if she is heavenborn or not.

Adam disliking Abel makes me think that we're missing details. Most likely it's something to do with Cain. Or he just didn't like that Abel chose marching band.

Why Abel took Adam's position might be a pretty simple reason; to piss Lute off. I get a feeling that she's not that popular thanks to her personality. Maybe that's why Adam was so important to her, he liked her as a person and gave her purpose. And while Hazbin is full of misogyny, I feel like Lute not being the new leader is more to do with the fact that she's too unstable for the position. So it's also possible that Abel became a leader because there was no other choice.

I wonder if the rumor/leak/theory about Eve being Beach!Lilith is true. Would that give Adam's and Eve's relationship more depth? And probably mess up Lute's already fragile mental state. For example, she finds out and is furious at Eve (+ Lilith if they work together) for deveicing Adam, only to learn that he knew. That he (the brutally honest guy) actually lied to her. I don't know how much her simp heart would handle.

Sounds like a unnecessary trainwreck? This is hellaverse, every relationship is a trainwreck.

Seeing this ask made me put on my critical cap on. I do not want more Lu and Al “beef”, it is already uninteresting to me. Less of that more of him trying to fix his relationship with Charlie. Lucifer being a prideful but insecure is fine and dandy. I do not want him to be petty and bitchy. Al was minding his business and did not even said anything yet.

I hope this season clears up if Lute and the exorcists are Heaven made or born too. I hope we see some of exorcists react to Adam’s death. I am surprised there was some with Lute at Sir P’s trial to back her up. The other exorcists are just a hive mind I guess. Lute becoming obsessed about Adam is wild. It could have worked if she had a personality outside of him but that is clearly not the case. She did everything for that bastard and her whole character revolves around him. She even had a bracelet on her wrist that looked like his halo like GIRL. She wanted a piece of that fat man BADLY, definition of down bad. Cain is the first murderer, I do not how the show can due to “twist” of their story. The murder probably did not happen in the show because Adam was the first soul to get into Heaven. In biblical lore, Adam and Eve were alive when Abel was killed. Adam hating marching bands would be funny but also dumb on his part. Have you seen marching bands? That shit is cool. Or Abel took the marching band aesthetic to connect with Adam in some shape or form. I do like the idea of the first family having a band aesthetic. Adam is the rocker, Abel is the marching band, Cain can be death metal, and Eve can be gospel.

Lute is more off the rails than Adam was. He was even weirded out by her comment she made about Vaggie at the start of Ep 8. Abel seems to not hold any malicious towards her, calling her “miss”. Abel taking up the role of leader so fast is crazy. Like Adam was just murked and Heaven is like “Abel. You leader now.” Like what? Are they going to train him? They had a mask similar to Adam’s already made for him too. The higher ups were waiting for Adam to die, no one liked his fat ass.

Lute becoming unstable makes me wonder if mental health services do not exist in Heaven. There is clearly something wrong with her and everyone just brushes her off and not even try to comfort her.

I hate the Eve and Lilith theories. It is a high chance of the swap theory being canon but it is still stupid. What would be the need to switch places? Adam probably was keeping some secrets from Lute that he took to the grave. I fear that Adam and Eve’s relationship will be typical for the Hellaverse. Toxic or one-sided. Depth for these shows is like a kiddy pool. Which is an issue for some, I am mixed on it. It does give me more to work with as I create my AU.

Sorry about the rambles. I think about this show too much. I was excited to S2 as a whole but now, Abel is the only new aspect I am excited for. He is a cute little dude.

[emmys-grimoire]

The Nightbringer, how lesson 9-A tells us everything, and why it’s (probably) not Barb

I’m working on lesson 3 summary, but now that a good portion of the fanbase seems to have gotten through lesson 10, I feel it’s timely to get my thoughts out there ahead of covering lesson 10 because the story will likely continue before I’m done.

And I think a lot of you are ignoring some of the contextual clues.

Don’t read this if you don’t want lesson 8+ spoiled yet.

Ahead of the game releasing, most of the fanbase thought the prologue was a peek into how Barbatos met Solomon because it matched up with the lore in the OG game and Solomon was narrating. There were also other hints that Barb was behind things via promotional media and art. Pair that with his well-known time travel abilities, and it all seems very straightforward and obvious.

We learn in lesson 8, though, that the boy in the prologue video isn’t Solomon -- it’s Adam, and it’s heavily implied that he’s Lilith’s lover.

This fact alone doesn’t actually change much beyond the implied relationship between the Nightbringer and Solomon. It is relevant that Solomon is narrating, though, because they do have a significant relationship.

In lesson 9-A (and the node in lesson 10 that’s a continuation), which I have not gotten to myself yet, Solomon has a telling conversation with the Nightbringer after being confronted with illusions of Diavolo and Simeon meant to test his resolve. They’re squabbling over him, the obvious metaphor for humanity.

Solomon chooses neither, because he believes humanity doesn’t need either demons or angels guiding them. This is meant to mirror a choice he made in the past, as the self-appointed steward of humanity.

And furthermore, back then... the Nightbringer was likely one of the advocates of one of these sides. Furthermore, whatever this agreement he made with the Nightbringer is meant to ensure his “freedom”, even though...

The Nightbringer clearly wanted him to choose one of the presented sides, not neither. So which side was he on? He reveals his hand here, too, if you read into it far enough.

Why on earth would Solomon make this retort if the Nightbringer was actually a demon? If he was a demon, of course he’d be acting like one. It’d be no surprise, and certainly not considered an insult.

We got an angel who acts like a demon. This conversation doesn’t make any sense otherwise.

The Nightbringer is an angel? But that’s CRAZY!

Is it?

Is it really?

There’s one angel in particular who has a similar connection to Solomon as Barbatos, who has also had a significant role in his past: Michael.

We find out in the dream sequence flashback in S3 that Michael was eyeballing Solomon before the Great Celestial War. We know he’s the one who fished us out of that sequence, and warned us that the effect we had on the brothers past selves will carry on into the present (though admittedly this never manifests later). We find out he approached Solomon when he was lost and confused and we know he gave him his Ring of Wisdom, which grants the power to control demons. We find out in Nightbringer that Solomon waged war against the entire Devildom in an effort to leverage his newfound power to better humanity’s position. We learn that war was ultimately inconclusive. At numerous point in the story, Michael is referred to as a “demon in disguise” and a sadist like Lucifer.

We don’t know why Michael would give his very powerful ring to Solomon, but it likely was part of some agreement.

What doesn’t line up with this theory is a lack of motivation. I have no idea why Michael would want us to fling us back to this point of time, after the war. It sounds like he’d want to prevent the war entirely. Adam also meets the Nightbringer in the Devildom, and I can’t see the Devildom allowing Michael to just waltz in and meddle with things, particularly after the Great Celestial War. I’m not sure why they’d let any of them in, but I digress...

The other small details

There’s other small details strewn throughout the story that point to an angel, or at least someone that isn’t Barb.

Adam says he heard trumpets heralding the Nightbringer’s arrival. The king in the prologue also blows a trumpet.

You know what trumpets are associated with? Angels. According to this wikipedia article:

“In Christian Eschatology, all the first six trumpets are used to serve as a wake up call to the sinners on Earth and a call to repentance. Each trumpet blast brings with it a plague of a more disastrous nature than the one before it. The trumpet is used to build anticipation and tells the reader that an alert, announcement, or warning is about to take place. The seventh trumpet does not bring a plague with it. Rather, it is sounded so that glory is given to God and His kingdom is announced.”

There’s a bunch of other biblical associations, too. Barbatos has no trumpet symbolism in any point in the story. His callsign is portals.

Additionally, Barbatos interacts with time via doors.

The Nightbringer sees time as mud, which just might be the liquid swirling around in the Nightbringer trailer.

Who is the king?

The prologue implies that the Nightbringer is summoned via trumpets, and the trumpet is blown by a king. The Barbatos puppeteering art implies it’s a human king, but I’m not so sure.

Understanding who the king is may be instrumental in figuring out who the Nightbringer is. Is it a human king? Is it King Solomon? Is it the Demon King? Is it God? Is it someone completely different? It implies the Nightbringer acts at the behest of someone else, but so far it doesn’t sound like he is right now. And if he’s acting against Solomon, it would be quite problematic if he was tethered to him via a pact like Barbatos clearly is.

My conclusion

It’s either Michael and his motivations are simply more complex than I give him credit for, or it’s another angelic being that has gone rogue without falling somehow. I’m leaning towards the latter, honestly. I’d be really happy if we got a multi-season big bad.

It could still be an alternative timeline Barbatos if Barbatos was once an angel, and this is an angel Barb which has managed to avoid falling and doesn’t have the door motif thing going on. 

This is kind of why I hate time travel shenanigans. You have to account for so many damn possibilities that it gets tiresome having to sort through it all.

[gothamcitycentral]

Judging by everything we know, in Hazbin Hotel’s lore there was no War In Heaven started by Lucifer that resulted in his damnation. Makes sense, the fruit of knowledge is certainly more iconic and it fits the story and characters more for that event to be what sent Lucifer (and Lilith) to Hell.

But y’know that’s a pretty big thing that happened, and it makes me interested if there will be some equivalent in the show, even if not carried out by Lucifer.

With that idea, it’s interesting that there’s two characters currently with a lot of parallels with Lucifer sitting in Heaven

Emily being the ‘second Lucifer’ is pretty blatant with:

“If you start to question, you could end up like Lucifer.”

“Fallen.”

There’s also the idea that Emily is literally Lucifer’s replacement. That with his fall, Emily eventually came into being to fulfill his role in Heaven. Her explicit purpose is to “keep [Heaven’s people] happy and joyful,” an entertainer. Which is very much what Lucifer is, not only from his theatrics but his design being a clown that has dressed himself as the ringmaster. His introduction during his days in heaven even has him creating confetti and fireworks. This certainly explains why there’s this very young seraphim, who for all intents and purposes seems to be very close to Charlie’s age.

Meanwhile, Lucifer’s fall (the first fall) is directly connected to him taking the form of a snake. Then, Sir Pentious, the snake demon, is the first to rise. The show also emphasizes Sir Pentious out of all characters when Charlie and Lucifer are struggling to connect, showing him tearing up multiple times and commenting “that was sssweet” when they do accept each other (possibly due to his own implied desire for a family). They are also both creators, Lucifer having “fantastical ideas for creation” and being implied to have brought Keekee, Razzle, and Dazzle to life and Sir Pentious being a steampunk inventor who possibly created his own minions.

They also both have their own set up to be leaders. Emily is established to be very close to the people of Heaven, and therefore someone many of them would follow. The show also emphasizes just how darn similar Emily and Charlie are, so it’s not hard to imagine Emily having her own “Ready for This” moment. Meanwhile we’ve seen Sir Pentious grow into a capable leader with his role in the resistance against the Exorcists.

Additionally (while this is not a part of every reading of course) one of Lucifer’s reasons for rebellion was which souls were allowed into Heaven. That he would “redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost” (Moses 4:1), this being rejected because it would destroy the agency of mankind. What exactly redeeming all of mankind means is debated, but this concept is ripe for reinterpretation to be the cause of Emily or Sir Pentious starting the War in Heaven.

Frankly, I could see the show doing this with both of them. Emily starting the rebellion but this action being what causes her to fall, with Sir Pentious carrying on leading the rebellion following her departure. This is especially relevant given how in the war itself Lucifer takes on the form of a dragon, which fits in with Pentious’ own reptilian appearance (perhaps his ascension has come with a ‘higher form’ like Charlie has? One more draconic?).

[talonabraxas]

Lilith Talon Abraxas

Lilith, an ancient mythological figure and one of the oldest known female spirits in the world, has embodied various roles across cultures. In some sources she has been described as a demon, while in others she was revered as an icon who morphed to become one of the darkest deities of the pagans. While her roots can be found within the famous Epic of Gilgamesh, she was also described within both the Bible and the Talmud.

Within Jewish tradition, Lilith is regarded as the most notorious of demons, which in other sources she was portrayed as the first woman created on Earth. In fact, according to one legend, God formed Lilith as the first woman of the human race, employing the same method as he did with Adam. The only different was that in place of pure dust, he also used filth and residue to create woman.

Lilith's name, derived from ancient Semitic languages, carries profound symbolism. Signifying “the night,” it links her to the darkness and mysteries of the nocturnal realm. This association underscores her connection to primal instincts, including sensuality and freedom, while also evoking a sense of awe and fear, highlighting the complexity of her character across different cultural interpretations.

Lilith as the Ancient Demon of the Sumerians

Lilith’s name comes from the Sumerian word lilitu, which meant a wind spirit or a female demon. Lilith was mentioned in the Tablet XII of the Epic of Gilgamesh, a famous poem of ancient Mesopotamia dated back to not later than c. 2100 BC. Tablet XII was added to the original text much later, c. 600 BC, in its later Assyrian and Akkadian translations.

Within these ancient references, Lilith appears in a magical story, where she represents the branches of a tree. She is described along with other demons, but researchers still argue if she was a demon or a dark goddess.

Lilith's presence extends beyond Sumerian mythology; early Jewish texts also feature her prominently, complicating the quest to pinpoint her origin. Yet, from the outset, her association with Sumerian witchcraft is unmistakable.

Within the Babylonian Talmud, Lilith was described as a dark spirit with an uncontrollable and dangerous sexuality, said to have fertilized herself with male sperm to create demons. She was believed to be the mother of hundreds of demons.

Lilith was known in the culture of the Hittites, Egyptians, Greeks, Israelites and Romans as well. In later times, she migrated to the north of the Europe. Within various mythologies and folklore, Lilith represented chaos and sexuality with legends attributing her with casting spells. Additionally, her lore intertwines with early vampire narratives.

Lilith: Ancient Demon, Dark Deity or Sensual Goddess?