#also can anyone confirm how canon this storyline is?

[pizzazz-party]

me finishing the last issue of WhereWhen like, “where’s the rest of it. where’s the rest of it mr sakai.”

[azaharinflames]

Sorry I need to rant for a tiny, little bit, because...

You know what I find particularly funny?

Their version of Buddie simply does not exist.

And I am not talking about how it is not canon, that is a given. But their version of it. The things they've claimed they do, or feel about each other, or think of each other.

(Disclaimer: I have my own opinion of their friendship and I do believe there are way better friendships within the show, including for Buck. But I do acknowledge they do love each other as friends and deeply care about one another. And that Chris is important for Buck. That is not up to discussion here. Okay, we can go on)

They have this whole "Buckley-Diaz is a family" that consists of Buck spending 99% of his free time at the Diaz house, of them having weekly movie nights, and of Buck taking Chris to school almost as much as Eddie does. And this is simply not true.

We do see Buck spending time at the Diaz house, of course. When he's hanging out with the Diazes (something that, might I point out, has not really happened since Season 4, as the few scenes we got of them hanging out since have been at Buck's loft - correct me if I'm wrong), helping Eddie out, in a group setting, and hiding from his sister and her helicopter babysitting. Movie nights- when is it even mentioned this is something they do weekly? Not once. And please correct me if I am wrong. Buck does not take Chris to school almost daily, not because he did after Eddie's breakdown does it mean this is a normal and usual occurrence. It doesn't mean it isn't, to be fair, but nothing in canon tells us otherwise. I will give them the zoo, however, because in canon we do have Eddie saying Buck takes Chris there all of the time.

What we got, however, was scenes showing how Buck has his own independent life. He has lots of scenes in his loft, as much as Buddies hate it, as we have never gotten an off-handed comment on how little he's spending there because he's at the Diazes all the time. We've gotten scenes of Buck reaching out to people who are not Eddie for help. And oh, of course - we have gotten scenes of his family (whether you like the Buckleys or not) having a family dinner. And guess who was not invited? Oh, right.

(We have, also, gotten enough scenes with Tommy that we know post-going official, they spend most of their free time with each other. Thank you to Bobby for also confirming this. We love you, king)

With the Diazes, we got scenes that showed how Eddie and Chris exist on their own, without needing Buck there to complete their family. We got a whole ep where Eddie was dealing with Chris's new crush, and instead of making that be a Buckley-Diaz 'family' storyline, Carla was the one accompanying Eddie and being the other adult in the situation. We can say whatever we want about the dating debacle at the end of Season 6 (I also think it was a mess, but for the way they rushed it), but Eddie did not say: oh, Chris and I are fine, we have Buck. And he did not say it because it simply would not have made sense.

And oh, I could go on and on on how the Eddie they have in Fanon is also not the one we have, but this is way too long already. Do let me know if anyone wants to hear it though. Although I will probably write it down whenever I am bored enough.

Short story very long: Buck and Eddie are good friends. They respect each other and clearly enjoy each other's company. And the show has definitely played with the concept of family for them (looking directly at the elf from season 2 here), but never too serious. Never in canon. Outside of the 118 being a family (which I am not denying), at least for me, it has always been obvious how Eddie and Chris were very valued by Buck, but his close-knit family (nuclear family, if you will) is and has always been Maddie (now extended to Jee-Yun and Chim as well), and Bobby (something he's admitted in canon, before someone comes at me for this).

Now, thankfully, we have Tommy to join in in there as well ☺️

[lemotmo]

I am confused by people on the daily but sending it to you because I loved her response. She has to be exhausted by her inbox 😭. I don't know how you all handle this.

Q. I need a few things explained to me. I will say upfront I am camp Tommy. The article did not seem pro Tommy and Buck to me, but plenty of my Tommy peers were thrilled with it, but so were Buddie fans so there is a disconnect in someone's interpretation. It was unnecessary for Tim to have brought up Eddie there. They weren't talking about Eddie, it was inappropriate. It doesn't matter that Lou and Oliver never did a chemistry test, they're fine together. Why do people care? Lastly Oliver clearly has an agenda. It would not have killed him to hold that picture of Ryan for another day. He could have let us have our confirmation that Tommy is indeed back and maybe shared a pic of him instead of Ryan. Lou can have BTS stuff too.

A. The article speaks for itself. It doesn't require interpretation. Tim mentioned Eddie because they're all part of the same storyline. Period. People can choose to ignore that fact if they want but it won't change the storyline. Eddie is the point. Eddie has been the point. That theme is carrying over into this season. Buck's relationship with Tommy is going to play some part in whatever Eddie's self discovery is going to be. Tim wouldn't have mentioned Eddie in relation to the pair otherwise. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think TV shows do chemistry reads unless it's a long term thing. If it is just for a particular plot or storyline they will cast the actor that best fits the plot purpose. The chemistry is secondary to the overall plot so I'm not at all surprised that they didn't do a chemistry read. Their chemistry isn't the point. The storyline he was cast for is the point. In this case the plot purpose is Buck and Eddie. Eddie told Buck him being bi wouldn't change anything between the two of them when in reality everything is going to change. That is the point. Oliver's chemistry with Lou isn't relevant in any way.

I would not look too hard for him in any BTS. And I know you won't believe this but I think that is for your benefit. Why give you anything that may lead you to believe he's anything other than a plot point? They shouldn't include him. It's not realistic. And feeds into something that has already been taken way out of context. Lastly, Oliver does have an agenda. He always has. He always offers counter programming to the canon. It will not change unless the canon becomes Buddie. He has been this way from the beginning. And he doesn't owe anyone an apology for that.

Thank you so much Nonny. As always, much appreciated.

*sigh*

I really feel like everyone should just give Ali a break here. She has explained this over a 1000 times already. How many times does she need to repeat it?

I agree with all of this.

Also, that article was blunt and in your face. Tim brought up Eddie when talking about BT, which is something the show has done since day one by the way. Eddie has ALWAYS been involved in this storyline and he will continue to become even more important in this storyline, because the whole purpose of BT was always Buddie.

IMPORTANT! Please don't repost this ask and/or a link that leads straight to my Tumblr account on Twitter or any other social media. Thank you!

Heads up! For anyone who is giving me the shifty eyes for reposting Ali's updates instead of reblogging. Read this.

Remember, no hate in comments, reblogs or inboxes. Let's keep it civil and respectful. Thank you.

If you are interested in more of Ali’s posts, you can find all of her posts so far under the tag: anonymous blog I love.

[bbygirl-aemond]

In case anyone was curious about the supposed leaks for season 2 episodes 3 and 4, you can find a paraphrased summary of the main points below the cut. They aren't confirmed, it's just from screenshots of messages between two people, and the person who watched the episode doesn't seem very knowledgeable about canon (hasn't read the book/mixes up dragon names) so take with a hefty grain of salt. Feel free to discuss your thoughts in the replies to this post as well!

Episode 3:

Helaena is only in one brief scene with Alicent

Aegon embarrasses Aemond at the brothel (mocks him for going back to the first woman he ever slept with even as an adult)

Episode 4:

Alicent has a Maester bring her moon tea by saying it's for someone else and then drinks it herself in private

Aemond is supposed to go to Harrenhal but goes rogue and plots with Criston behind Aegon's back to show up at Rook's Rest instead

Aemond burns both Meleys/Rhaenys and Sunfyre/Aegon during the fight at Rook's Rest

Rhaenys has an opportunity to fly away after Aegon was downed, but for some reason loops back over the battlefield, leaving herself wide open for Vhagar who then takes her down

After Aegon is downed, Aemond dismounts Vhagar and is going after him with his sword drawn when Criston finds him; unclear whether Aemond was trying to attack Aegon or not

My thoughts:

I'm sad it seems like we aren't getting much of Helaena since I find her character by far one of the most interesting + Phia Saban is one of the stronger actors on the show

I like the parallel of Alicent and Rhaenyra taking moon tea after sleeping with Criston for its mirroring and also because how it's kinda funny how badly none of these women want his baby

Some people were thinking Helaena might get pregnant with Maelor later but I don't think they're planning to include him at all now; curious to see how this impacts Daeron's storyline since it kinda revolved around Maelor

Biggest point of departure from book canon is Aemond seemingly being the one responsible for Aegon getting burned and crippled and maybe even trying to finish him off in the closing scene. There's no mention of this in the books at all, and book Aemond never tried to claim himself to be king while ruling in Aegon's stead, so didn't seem very eager to usurp him

I'm reserving judgment for the airing of episode 4 itself but am curious to see how this might slot into Aemond's characterization

[supercalime]

No one asked but I have a take haha.

I have zero problem with buck and eddie being an item, the biggest problem I have is their stans acting the way they are now with the current storyline with tommy.

I mean, I hate to break it to the b*ddie st*ns but you can think your friends are hot and like, not want to pursue them, whether you realize you’re queer or not. The fans are undermining so much of the current storyline that it makes me sad.

Im as aroace as one can be, but also I have eyes lol. I see hot/attractive people, I of course can admit that they are hot/attractive. It doesn’t mean that I want to be with them specifically sexually or romantically.

Also, figuring out your sexuality is confusing and weird. I definitely thought I had a crush on a friend solely because they were a person I got along with and spent a lot of time with and thought that was what I was supposed to do (by the time I thought I was allo).

What I mean is that it’s not always black and white when it comes to what attraction is.

Another thing, and this is pure speculation on my part: the actors are VERY aware of b*ddie and know that it’s one of the biggest reasons people keep watching the show, so they might keep on stirring the pot a bit in the interviews because they know it can create enough buzz for the show to trend and make the network/producers/investors keep renewing it so they can keep their jobs for as long as possible.

Im not saying b*ddie fans are delusional or anything like that but I am really disappointed how many of them (or at least a loud minority) is treating the canon ship as if it’s a stepping stone for another that has yet to be fully confirmed on screen. Sure there are signs in retrospect, but like I said, you can think someone is attractive without wanting to be with them.

This whole thing of buck having always been in love with eddie irks me a bit as it falls in a trope I don’t personally like (someone sticking around because they are pining over their friend the whole time and the friendship is a stepping stone to romance). I mean, if b*ddie happens and it’s done well, I’m all for it. What I really don’t want to happen is the trope I mentioned above. If it’s meant to happen, the best way in my opinion is for the two guys to develop those feelings with time, not it being a realization that they were in love the whole time. Heck, there are dcoms that did friends to lovers quite decently in the past and it wasn’t a “it has always been youuu” situation.

In conclusion, the only thing we gotta take is what is confirmed on screen, in canon. If we are supposed to listen to anyone talking about ships and storyline is Tim Menear and the other writers. And what has been confirmed so far by Tim is that Buck was jealous of Eddie being with Tommy because he was attracted to Tommy without realizing it. In canon so far, that’s what is happening and you have to accept that. The story is about Buck coming to terms with his bisexuality and him and Tommy being in a romantic relationship.

[lbulldesigns]

A very far out there theory.

I've seen a few theories on who this little girl here could be.

Some have said that she's Powder and this is a flashback, which doesn't seem likely because she's wearing clothes similar to Jinx and has cloud tattoos drawn on her tiny arm, I've also seen theories that she's a random child that will die to further Jinx's plot (which I really hope isn't true), and even a theory that she's Marcus' daughter, but I think that's just a meme at this point.

Now I have a theory and it's really, really out there so bare with me a moment.

This girl is Seraphine. A.K.A The Songbird of Zaun.

Now hear me out. Riot has confirmed that Arcane is not Canon with the games and is its own story. Seraphine has gone through a few evolutions over the years in order to make her story interesting, considering the negative reviews on her original skin and storyline. So what if Riot decided to introduce her as a child first, she's younger than Jinx in Canon and also fangirls over her saying that she loves Jinx's rhythm and how unpredictable it is.

So it isn't too out there for her to mimic Jinx's look here. She's also all about unity, so what if she develops these beliefs by seeing how terrible war is with her own eyes.

There's also her hair in this screenshot.

When you look closely you can see flecks of pink, being a child she wouldn't be able to properly dye her hair so she coloured it with hair chalk or something but it wears off and you see her natural colour. It could be a trick of the light but with the direction it's coming from and the fact you can't see any light reflecting of the person (possibly Sevika) carrying her off makes me question if this is her actual hair colour coming through.

There's also how thick and wavy looking her hair is, Seraphine has long hair canalogically.

And as someone with thick hair herself, I can attest to how curly and wavy it looks when cut short.

Seraphine is also a mage and empath, so if anyone were to bond with Jinx instantly, it would be her. And the way her hand is outstretched here,

Kinda suggests, to me, that she's reaching out to help or trying to cast a spell; that sounds far-fetched I know, but her facial features look more like she's concentrating and less like she's in distress.

There's also this line in the trailer "The Arcane is waking." What better way to introduce that storyline than through one of Zaun's known mages, next to Zeri, that is.

There is also the fact that Jinx has had a few bird motifs throughout the series, such as the crows and ravens and the doves in her mural. She's also been referred to as Janna's Bluebird by the fandom, which again is interesting that Janna has bluebirds and there's a flighty little blue haired girl running amock that Janna (in game at least) seems to like.

And her new look here,

The teeth look like feathers when framing her face and making her look more like a bird from front view.

How adorable would it be if Jinx's number one fan here was the Songbird of Zaun.

It's highly unlikely that this theory is true, but if at any point Jinx turns around and calls this girl Songbird or she introduces herself to Jinx as Sera, then I will shit bricks.

[cambrioleur]

In the interest of making this blog a bit more intelligent and less of a collection of dumb memes, here's an actual "hot take" that I have...

Ben is likable but he's also jaw-droppingly underdeveloped in the official canon of the show. Basically he's what TV Tropes terms a Satellite Character, in that he's almost always shown in the context of his interactions with other characters, with these scenes being from their viewpoint and not his. He never gets a real arc or storyline of his own: Claire and Guédira are consistently the central POV figures of the assorted B and C plots, while Ben appears in the A plots but in an exclusively supporting role.

The show actually DOES have opportunities to expand on his character a bit more but for whatever reason it never takes advantage of them. You'd think that Ben getting sold out by Assane and tossed in prison would have been a perfect candidate for this, but he appears in like three scenes in the last few episodes of Part 3, with these once again being mainly from the perspectives of Guédira, Claire, and Assane (not to mention that the audience still doesn't know exactly how he sustained all those injuries).

An additional issue is that so far, Ben hasn't had any meaningful conflict in his relationship with Assane, which seems unrealistic given what an utter mess Assane is a lot of the time. Claire has the obvious conflict of desperately wanting to believe in Assane but being let down by him over and over again, and also having to deal with how his antics are negatively affecting their son. Guédira is an Assane Diop stan while also being a police officer who's supposed to be trying to jail him, which is a comedic conflict but it's a conflict nonetheless. We never get any of that with Assane and Ben; their friendship is fun but it's weirdly smooth-sailing. We don't know if they can survive the kind of turmoil that arises between Assane and Claire on a regular basis, because up until Ben gets thrown to the wolves at the gala, he's never been on the receiving end of Assane's dishonesty and erratic behavior. (This is why I actually think that the betrayal was a good narrative choice.)

So Ben's characterization is that he's the technically-competent friend who's also a loyal, solid dude...and that's it. We don't really know who he is in the same way that we know who Assane, Claire, and Guédira are. And the result is that the fans can project pretty much whatever they want onto him. If they want to say he's in love with Assane, fine, because there's nothing canonical that obviously confirms or refutes it. (In contrast I think it's fair to say that any notion of Assane reciprocating these potential affections is 100% fanon; the showrunners clearly view him as someone who can charm anyone he wants to while also being completely heterosexual, although one could argue that they're attempting to have their cake and eat it too.) The same is true if they want to say that Ben is in love with Claire, which is a theory that I've seen crop up a few times. My own opinion is that he's probably aroace or something along those lines, but at the same time I find the interpretation that he loves Assane to be plausible enough, although I have absolutely no emotional investment in it.

Anyway, bottom line...Ben's character should be developed more. Also I personally think he should turn on Assane. But that's just me.

[acourtofthought]

4 Books of Buildup is not something E/riels and E/riels alone get to claim.

Yes, there have been moments in ACOMAF through SF that put the idea of E/riel into your head. Feyre thinking on how "handsome" they'd be together (literally the most shallow reason in existence for someone pairing two people but I digress), Az helping Feyre rescue Elain in ACOWAR, him offering Elain TT, Az sitting with Elain and listening to her talk about her seeds in ACOFAS, their "charged" look in SF and depending on the day and argument about whether the BC counts, their near kiss.

Yet between every single one of those moments, there is another love for Elain or Az or both. Elain was in love with Graysen in ACOMAF through ACOFAS. Az was still hung up on Mor, even in SF. He was happy not to stay and guard Elain, later helped rescue Elain then went on to look at Mor with heat and yearning on Solstice. He gave Elain TT but only because Mor begged him to sit out of battle. He was relieved that he was not expected to get Elain a gift that first year.

In all of those 4 books though, Elain and Lucien are confirmed mates. Confirmed by the King, by Feyre, by Rhys, by Az, by Mor, by Elain, by Graysen, by Lucien, by Eris.

It is CANON that they are mates. The "4 books of E/riel moments" are canon too however it being love is heavily debated because neither Elain or Az have confirmed it to be that. There is NOTHING in canon that unequivocally states she wants a relationship with him, that she wishes he were her mate, that he is completely over Mor, that he would take Elain without a mating bond.

In comparison, there is CANON showing Elain and Lucien are mates. Lucien calls her his mate, Az confirms their bond can be scented, she makes sure Graysen knows Lucien's name when Graysen is referring to her mate, Lucien acknowledges the real thread between them and Elain confirms she felt it too.

Could SJM decide to pull a fast one over on us in the next book and reveal the mating bond as fake? Sure, because she can do whatever she wants as the author however at this point in time, Elucien being mates is more canon than E/riel actually being in love. And to those who claim Elucien's bond will turn out to be fake, that the 4 books of proof of an Elucien mating bond can easily be undone in the next ACOTAR, then can't we say the exact same of E/riel? That the 4 books of "open to interpretation" interactions of E/riel could also easily be undone (I think they kind of already were in the BC but that's another discussion).

If a storyline which was confirmed (once again) by Feyre, Rhys, Az, Cassian, Mor, the KoH, Eris, and the author herself in interviews can be magicked away after 4 books of Elain and Lucien's arcs being built around that narrative, that it could suddenly be proven as fake, then how is anyone arguing against how the unconfirmed love between E/riel (of which no characters are even aware of considering Nesta called Az Gwyn's new ribbon and Rhys told him to find a hooker instead) can be even more easily deconstructed?

If it's that easy to undo a confirmed mating bond then anything hinting at Elain and Az is a house of cards in comparison.

[alliepretends]

i could be wrong and this could be outdated information, but on the D20 wiki riz page, under trivia it says that riz is confirmed asexual, and implied to be aromantic but this is NOT confirmed, and i think this worries me a lot in the fandom. it was the same with adaine before the introduction of oisin, where she was still fluid in her sexuality because she is a teenager. i feel like (and don't get me wrong, this is a very valid feeling considering the lack of representation) that there is so much pressure on riz the character and murph the player right now from the fandom, and i worry that if there is ever any sort of romantic or qpr storyline for riz, there will be a huge amount of criticism as a result, because so many people have put their hopes of representation on this character. i don't really have a point to make, but in terms of the TTRPG show space, dimension 20 has done so much already, and i really, really fear the fandom turning against them for how they might choose to represent their characters.

I think that's a fair concern. I also think it's something we have to be able to have a balanced conversation on. Technically, Riz is neither confirmed to be asexual or aromantic. Brennan's word of god confirmation in an Adventuring Party for another season is something they could walk back. And they would be well within their rights as creators to do so. They would also be within their rights to make Riz canon ace only and not aro. However, the aromantic coding in Sophmore Year was pretty heavy, and although my understanding is that the Dropout cast steers away from the internet now, I don't believe they did after the release of Sophmore Year. And Dropout likely has some kind of PR team that is aware of the discussion of the aromantic coding. If they've backed themselves into a corner with a story they don't want to or don't feel comfortable telling, I would hope they find a way of communicating that to the audience that's respectful of the pre-existing aro coding. Because this is such an underrepresented community and we do deserve some respectful consideration. If they fail to do this, I don't think that makes them bad creators or bad performers. I don't think anyone should turn against them (although the internet being what it is I'm sure some will, that's just a sad reality of internet culture). That said, I think there's a difference between being respectful of creators as people, and shutting down valid criticism. I think it would be fair for aromantic people to be hurt and disappointed if this happened. And I think it would be fair for those people to voice that hurt and disappointment. You're right that there's a lot of pressure. And that can lead to dangerous situations for online celebrities. But I don't think we should ignore the heavy aromantic coding and pretend we're not eager for this representation just because the creators might shy away from the pressure of it at the last minute. Nor do I think we should avoid criticizing our favorite creators when they don't live up to our expectations, just because some people might take it too far. A no bummers fandom attitude can stifle thoughtful discussion just as much as an overly vitriolic one can.

Also, I think a canon qpr developing for Riz would be fine with almost everyone. What I'm talking about with fandom shipping culture is very different than that happening with real representation. If that's the direction they go in canon, that's still a valid aromantic story to tell. (Although, to be frank, if a canon qpr did happen for Riz, I think the chances of it being with Fabain are pretty low. The idea that they are the closest of the Bad Kids isn't really supported by canon, in my opinion, if you take your shipping goggles off.)

I hope this makes sense

[chevelleneech]

It’s weird you claim to know the mind of a 32 year old man doing his job. Based off social media? He can’t even keep the same photos on his feed for a month. He’s been liking buddie stuff for years now so he will continue to do it. Isn’t this the same ship that pushed him off Twitter?

Also he mentioned in several interviews he couldn’t wait to get know Lou on and off screen. So take that as will 🤷‍♂️

Anon, what are you here for, if not to prove yourself as the Lou/Tommy defense team captain? For no reason, at that, because I never said Oliver dislikes Lou or Tommy. I said I think my earlier assumption that he prefers/ships Buddie, was correct, and I stand by it.

Y’all can try as hard as you want to play the “You don’t know them!” or “He’s doing his jobs!” cards, but 1) the same applies to BuckTommy, and Lou making folks pay for headcanons, and 2) is intentionally dismissive.

Of course we don’t know Oliver. Anyone who thinks they do is crazy, but that doesn’t mean Oliver saying for years that he’s open to Buddie, saying this season he was prepared to play Buck as queer, and consistently liking or reposting Buddie fan art is all a lie. Oliver is allowed to have a preferred ship the same way Lou is, but I have yet to see a BT shipper say what’s he’s doing is weird.

Y’all need that validation because Oliver is not giving it, but is also not damning y’all in interviews. He doesn’t appear to be that kind of person, aka he is doing his job properly. He’s neutral or positive about the storylines he likes, and is seemingly neutral to silent on the ones he doesn’t. Pointing that out has nothing to do with Lou or Tommy, tbh. It’s about Oliver’s apparent preference.

Lastly, Buddie didn’t run him off Twitter, as he’s already said. It was people who shipped Buddie and wanted him to confirm them becoming canon, and would say he was queerbaiting if he posted Buddie despite Buck dating a woman in canon. Oliver literally said this year, he left Twitter because he wanted to discuss the ship and Buck’s queerness yet couldn’t. Now he can, because Buck is bi and the relationship is technically more possible. So what is your point in bringing this up, beyond trying to act like he dislikes the ship yet has to talk about it? He don’t talk about shit he don’t want to, as is established by his constant behavior.

I know y’all higher than thou types love to pretend celebrities aren’t actual people and can never be authentic without exposing their entire lives to social media, but it’s not true. Who knows how he really and truly feels about a single thing, but I mean… he’s been consistent for years. Oliver is famous and appeasing fans is part of his job, but that doesn’t make him a walking empty shell. If that’s how you prefer to see him, go ahead. If ignoring his posts and words unless they’re in praise to Lou and Tommy works best for you to continue shipping what you ship, go ahead. But slithering up your pedestal to talk down on Buddie shippers who do pay attention to his socials, is a waste of your time.

We all sipping from the same parasocial tea, you just don’t think your cup got cracks in it too.

[mazzystar24]

OMG i still feel like I'm in a fever dream. I keep refreshing tumblr just to make sure that it HAPPENED.

We've been waiting for this for so long, i can't believe that they made Buck Bi!! Also here is the thing i want Buddie to happen and I am a hundred percent sure that it's happening (i don't know why people are thinking that it's not like???) the way i could see this going down is buck and tommy exploring their relationship and Buck beginning to question more and more things such as his relationship with Eddie. I WANT and him and Tommy to be in a relationship for a while (because they're actually pretty cute) and eddie pining. tommy will be the catalyst for Buddie.

Also: Oliver stark literally said, Buck has a crush, gets the person (exactly what happened with tommy) and that he has to work for his relationship to work and ryan saying "closer than ever??"

I also hate the fact that so people are mad and hating on the actors , that it wasn't with Eddie. Like of course a Buddie conformation would've been great, but we all knew that that wasn't gonna happen in this episode? We got FUCKING BI BUCK !!! Let's just celebrate this and just watch this beautiful story unfold. I really love reading your prediction and your positivity, please continue with that !!!

What do you think is going to happen in the next episodes? Sorry for the long ask!!

Sameee like I keep trying to be normal then I REMEMBER I’m like wow I didnt hallucinate that??

Exactly like they flat out called Tommy a plot device, confirmed he’s here for a little bit and that it’s a fling, so enjoy it as much as you want to while it’s here but don’t lose hope for buddie people? like legit this is the biggest confirmation buddie is on the horizon

YES THE INTERVIEWS HAVE BEEN REALLY FEEDING INTO MY DELUSION

Like let’s not forget Ryan saying they’re trying to give the people what they want🫡and that they are closer than ever - like legit he has no reason to say this in the same season buck realises he’s bi unless something BIG is gonna happen for buddie (maybe not full canon but vibes???)

Anyone hating on the actors can legit fight me.

Oliver and Ryan have been such troopers for the fandom and Oliver now with this storyline you can tell how much he genuinely loves buck and like understands him as a character but also how to give this storyline what it deserves. Like Oliver has been endlessly respectful to the fandom too like he’s been making sure that he doesn’t get peoples hopes up while also trying to play buck in a way that is true to the character. Like did you guys see his message to the fans? Or his interview talking about how he was gonna actively play buck as bi this season as much as he can even before he got told abt the kiss. Like that man hasnt just been supportive of the fandom he’s been an advocate for us and for buck which is such a wonderful thing.

Also yeah it wasn’t Eddie but do people realise that it’s VERY hard to write an up to now presumed straight character’s self discovery in their 30s LET ALONE TWO?? Like Tim found the easiest way to set the scene for the new audience and the GA who won’t have picked up on early seasons undertone and the little things planted throughout and while I would’ve loved buddie without the middleman I completely understand why they did it this way and I’ll enjoy seeing it unfold

And YES EXACTLY BI BUCK like that alone is a MASSIVE win like we are getting such rare bi rep of not only a guy in a very “macho” job and a womaniser type character BUT ALSO a person figuring stuff out in their 30s not in a repressed full of sex shame and guilt way but in a they genuinely just never explored that side of them!! Like that’s so huge we can talk for hours about how many queer rep stories are just plain depressing but this one is so authentic while also being quite light and sweet

Also aww thanks I genuinely love these asks sm (me? In love with everyone who sends me an ask? More likely than you think🤭🤭🤭)

Also omg I’m sorry this is so long like I spent most of this talking about everything except your question😭😭

Okay so predictions:

So we know that Buck is gonna tell some people and some will be surprised some not so much and some will be like it’s about damn time, my bets are:

chimney- surprised but maybe not through insider info (Maddie)

Maddie- KNOWS HAS KNOWN but the only shocker for her is that it wasn’t Eddie like I can imagine the confused and so tired face rn, I think she probs has either thought he knew or knew he didn’t and just was giving him the time and dropping as many hints as she can in the meanwhile

Bobby- supportive father icon, KNOWS (and while he also I fully believe is the buddie captain as well he will play it a little closer to vest if you get what I mean- but inside he’s going insane and his eye is twitching because he poached Eddie for his dumb bi son only for them to ACT married for six seasons and go to him for dating advice abt other people constantly and now that his son is a man kisser it’s not the man Bobby was hoping for😔 pray for him y’all)

Hen- she’s the it’s about damn time response

Athena- also might be the it’s about damn time response

Ravi- in a permanent state of confusion- not about this he’s just confused always (also still fully convinced the poor guy thought buddie had been married cos that headcanon is endlessly amusing to me)

Now for actual plot I think that like the date is low-key a train wreck after the Eddie and Marisol interruption and that either we get a chenford-like double date or we just have a brief intereuption from Eddie and that’s a minor thing and like it’s buck admitting it’s his first date with a guy who hates throws a lot of questions in the air because Tommys reaction was a bit 👀 like I think it’s more or less confirmed that Tommy was repressed for a while when working with captain dickhead so maybe he’s like gonna be taking a step back cos he thinks buck needs more time to like explore this part of himself (but I hate that trope so hoping not) or maybe we get the buddie shipper daydream and Tommy is like more aware of buddie than buddie are and he either says that to buck as the reasoning but buck doesn’t tell Eddie that OR he says something cryptic about it to buck and buck doesn’t fully understand and he’s like you will eventually👀👀👀 (I need a lobotomy yes the delusions are a part of me now)

I hope that Marisol gets the fuck out right about now but I say that every episode 🫡 (edy’s face and voice make me wanna scream I hate her homophobic, transphobic ass sm)

Anyways I’m gonna shut up now bye love ya thank ya and sorry 🫡🫡

[matan4il]

ok first of all congrats on step 1 of your ship but second of all as someone who has never watched but wants to catch up with no time to watch seven seasons: best meta to read first? when exactly do both characters start appearing on the show? If it’s later than s1 I may be able to watch enough of it. But yea most importantly where to start with meta for the ship and has anyone done a primer for the ship I could read? No rush and sorry if this is too much work for you!

Hi Nonnie!

Thank you so much for the congrats! XD It's a delight to have been screaming, "Buck is bisexual!" since ep 107 and get to 704, and get it confirmed as canon. ^u^

Well, I guess the good news for you is that Eddie doesn't appear in s1, so if you're less interested in seeing the shown when it was only featuring Buck out of the ship, then go ahead and skip that. I do think it matters to see that season, to better understand Buck's journey, and also why Eddie was such an important and positive person in his life once they became friends (plus s1 is just 10 eps), but if you're more inclined to skipping, Eddie shows up in 201.

As for meta, I didn't sit down to write anything until the end of both s2 and the first half of s3, by which point I felt like I would explode if I didn't. So, that meta was more summarized than my weekly Buddie meta posts I started doing starting in the second part of s3. And you can probably just... skim through that first round of Buddie meta (it looks like it has a lot of parts, but some are quite short) and my other buddie meta posts (which you can find through my pinned post) to get a good idea of the Buddie r/s overall.

Honestly, the big moments that really cemented things, are the beginning of Buddie, in the first few eps of s2, ep 210 which gives us our first glimpse of Buck and Eddie being co-parents to Chris, 218 where you see how much they've come to mean to each other already, the start of s3, 309 and THE kitchen scene (don't ask, but it will be THE kitchen scene for you as well, once you've watched it), the end of s4 and the shooting storyline, s5's best Buddie moments were IMO in 504, 506, 513 and 514, s6 was a bit of a mess, but eps 610 to 612 or so are probably the vital ones. So if you're interested, you can check out the weekly meta posts for those specific eps.

I hope this helps, and that you enjoy Buddie a lot! xoxox

[leikeliscomet]

Let's Talk About Thasmin

Intro Chapter 1 - Not Something I Usually Do [TW: SA Mentions] Chapter 2 - I Haven't Even Told Anyone, Not Even Myself Chapter 3 & Conclusion - I Wish This Would Go On Forever

Intro

I didn’t know how to write about Thasmin because I didn’t understand what Thasmin was. 

I’m in a weird position with it. I watched the Chibnall era and barely thought about it. I knew about it in series 11, not minding if it became canon or if Ryasmin would instead. I thought Yaz’s attachment to Thirteen seemed stronger than Ryan and Graham’s in series 12 and it was interesting but not that exciting enough for me to go full thassie. I liked the Thasmin bits in series 13 like in Eve of the Daleks and Legend of the Sea Devils (even though I didn’t like the rest of it). But after my rewatch, several things started coming together. I started to see Thirteen and Yaz differently, even seeing parts of them in myself and essentially started looking at the Chibnall era a bit differently as a whole. It’s still not my fave era, but there’s things from it I can appreciate that I didn’t see before.

What interests me about Thasmin isn’t just the ship itself but how the fandom talks about it. Both praise and critiques. Thasmin is the first sapphic ship involving the Doctor, with one sapphic only realising her attraction to women recently, and the other essentially being one of the very few asexual sapphic characters in mainstream TV at the time. Thasmin was fresh with potential but as the essay goes on and from the fandom’s reaction, the potential didn’t fully blossom in the way a lot of fans wanted it to. Whilst I’ve stayed indifferent to it, this ship is somehow so controversial it’s torn the fandom in half, caused many YouTube videos, debates and articles (like this lol) and caused some of the wildest discourse I’ve ever seen throughout my time in the fandom. So this essay is basically an attempt at an asexual, lesbian and possibly bi interpretation of what Thasmin tried to be, how lesbophobia and compulsory sexuality shape the fandom’s ideas about queerness using Thasmin as an example and what Thasmin could've been if handled differently.

I need to make it clear this essay isn’t about proving whether or not Thasmin is queerbait. The discourse since 2022, to me, is unproductive, repetitive and only reinforces misinformation and ignorance towards other queer labels. Regardless of writing quality, Yasmin Khan and the Thirteenth Doctor have confirmed feelings for each other so in my personal opinion, I don’t consider the ship queerbait. I’m aware queerbait has expanded definitions like how the queer character’s storylines and how the queer relationship is carried out but to me, that isn’t proof either. Queerness is a large umbrella term of various identities that are outside of the norm, so not all forms of queerness depend on or can be ‘proven’ solely with a romantic/sexual relationship. These definitions to me exclude queer people whose queerness isn’t dependent on those things or doesn’t involve them at all. Lastly, I don’t believe the conclusion of bad queer representation is that it isn’t queer. It is. It just flopped. 

I’m not writing to prove Thirteen really loved Yaz because as far as I’m concerned, her feelings for Yaz are canon. I’m not writing to prove Thasmin is toxic or morally good because as far as I’m concerned, all ships involving the Doctor, a morally grey character, are all morally grey in their own ways and that would mean also critiquing the ethics of Thoschei, Tenrose, TwelveClara and DoctorRiver. I have no interest in doing this or singling out Thasmin as some unique evil because to me that’s performative. I’m not writing to prove that Yaz is ‘really gay’ or ‘gay enough’ because as far as I’m concerned she is a canon sapphic companion and I don’t believe in gold-star, lesbophobic or biphobic rhetoric to erase any sapphic character’s attraction to women. I’m not writing to prove Thirteen/The Doctor is ‘actually asexual’ because as far as I’m concerned they are, as confirmed by Tennant, Smith, Pertwee, other actors and the official account and I don't care for the validity or close-minded opinions of anti-asexual and ace exclusionist fans, the same way I don’t care for the approval or permission from homophobes, lesbophobes, biphobes, transphobes or any group of queerphobic people to exist.

If you’ve come to this essay for me to critique Thasmin specifically on the basis that the Thirteenth Doctor, Yasmin Khan and/or Thasmin the ship have failed to live up to some arbitrary measure of queerness and that they are un-queer, less queer, fake queer, queerbait or ‘cishet’ then basically… you’re in the wrong place.

With that out of the way, let’s talk Thasmin!

Chapter 1 ->

[ohmycale]

 On fanon, canon and details Dark Souls style

Hey, @mellowwater.

I’m sorry if this is late and I haven’t replied to this in my original post. In truth, I have tried to go back and actually answer this question. I made a few drafts but I opted for this instead. The most important thing is you pointed out is this- there is a lot of not confirmed details gets floated around and we don't know what's what. People latch on info that they feel is the truth.

Canon tells us that when Jour died, Deruth did distance himself from his son. We both know they are both grieving and Cale (in Ron's memories) was trying to reach out. Deruth in the same memories was painted as someone clinging to Cale at that event.

Personally, Deruth distancing due to his grief and is understandable in an adult's POV. But it is confusing for someone in Cale's age at that time. I am sure not many have heard it but there is a thing called childhood emotional neglect. This is what I interpret as what happened to kid!Og!Cale. I think it also happened when Violan and Basen came into the picture and when Lily was born because they now trying to be a blended family. It would be normal for og!Cale to be feeling left out or replaced in this new dynamic.

Realistically, we‘re trying to find nuance on very little information, much less confirmed/canon information. It doesn’t help that the topic of the said info are side characters who are, for the sake of writing, not the interest of the story/ TCF in whole.

And of course there is the fanfic side, whether everything is basically under the sun. In fanfic, things get more muddled because there is a lot of character/plot interpretation (and even reinterpretation (I’m looking at you, do-over/fix-it fics/characters react to the plot fics). They are also people in the fandom who have some personal experience about a certain experience with our biases and projection. Same goes for fans who don’t have the said experience being projected.

Talking about og!Cale or any side character is like playing any game from FromSoftware. If you are not familiar with the videogame company aka creator of Dark Souls (you died!), there is lore on the game but you will be hard pressed to find a coherent storyline. I think TCF is the same – the author gives a ton of interesting characters and details about them but it feels wanting since you guessed it- they are side characters and practically, they don’t have much details.

Back to the TCF – I think it is okay to not have full details on what is fanon or canon. For me, whether the info is fanon or canon, it generates discussion, conversation, ideas and things that we (as fans) can throw at each other. Realistically, we cannot press for more info – the author gave us a few details and that’s it. They chose not to do more details. And fans discussing things will stick to what they want to believe – whether it is canon or fanon. It’s up to them whether to believe them or not. A fan can have their own cannon (aka headcannon) and it’s up to them to change their minds from other that. Even if somebody does bring forth canon, how many people are actually gonna believe that if it messes up with their headcannon?

In previous posts, I was welcoming anyone to challenge whatever I posted with canon evidence to the contrary since details get muddy. So far, nothing. But there are posts who post information whether it’s canon or fanon. I just opted for reading and reacting to what people post, whether fanon or canon since not a lot of people are posting canon, especially on the relationship dynamics of characters. Maybe there is someone who is more industrious than me out there.

I know I didn’t actually answer your question. I also know I have some many unanswered questions that I don’t even know if the canon covered. Because of the really lack of info, I don’t see fanon as something really bad especially for topics that we don’t really have info on. We all want clarity, alas, there is not much we can find.

[wildsflag]

can't wait for when james lance is finally allowed to ramble on and on about how trent's fallen in love with ted and been crushing on him this whole time. boy's so desperate to tell ALL I just know it

also hilarious for jason to confirm they're doing that storyline by basically saying "oh btw you're dating that ted lookalike over there"

regardless of what happens in canon i will be waiting impatiently for james lance's post s3 tell-all interview when he can finally reveal all his personal trent crimm headcanons and confirm that he was playing trent as in love with ted the whole time

lmao right mustaches aren't that common they could have cast literally anyone else

[tommykinrd]

Serious question, no hate or anything but why are so many people convinced that Ryan and Oliver would love for buddie to happen? Because everything they said sounds quite like the opposite, especially from Ryan. He said the same thing since 2019, he wants to portray this vulnerable, close, platonic friendship/bromance without it turning romantic. He also said he doesn’t even see or play Eddie as gay. And Oliver also said he doesn’t even know if he would actually want it to happen. Which means he doesn’t even think about it actually happening. Sure they love the (non toxic) fans and their love for the characters but I really don’t think they’re dying for buddie to happen. They always say they’re open to it if that’s what Tim decides and if it doesn’t come off as fanservice. But they know exactly it could never be anything but fanservice if it happens. And even if they absolutely wouldn’t want it to happen, they couldn’t say it or else they get called homophobic. So what is it that makes people believe they want Buddie to be canon?

Okay so I'm gonna answer assuming this was sent in good faith, but I really don't like the putting of words in people's mouths and also this extremism re: :they never said that", "this will never happen", etc.

I can only speak for myself, not for anyone else in fandom and definitely not for Ryan or Oliver since I don't know these people personally and I can only assume that you don't either. And as much as we joke about them being unhinged and out of PR jail and whatever, we have to remember these people are professionals who have been in the industry a long time and know how to interact with journalists and press because it's their job. They're never going to outright confirm or deny anything, they can only speak to what material they're given in the moment. As of right now, buddie is a vulnerable, close, platonic friendship. Neither of them have any reason to suggest otherwise. Also please remember that they are actors, they don't write for the show, yes they can offer input into the storylines but they cannot definitively change the trajectory of the show. Sorry anon, but Ryan and Oliver saying that they don't know the future of buddie does not mean they "don't even think about it happening". You don't know what they think, I don't know what they think, so let's stop with these extreme assumptions.

Also "they're not dying for buddie to happen"? I never said that they were. I said that from everything I've seen, I can tell that Ryan and Oliver know their characters and love their characters better than anyone in this fandom ever could. And understanding and loving Eddie means knowing the full depth of how much he loves Buck, whether that be platonic or romantic or some secret third thing. Same goes for Buck. I think if it goes the romantic route, Ryan and Oliver would have a blast getting to explore and portray another aspect to the buddie dynamic. If it doesn't go there, I think they would still knock it out of the park with how they portray a very important relationship in these characters lives, and I think they would still have a blast with it, like they've been doing this whole time. But again, I don't know them and I could be wrong, I'm just going off of the bare minimum info I have.

As for "they know it could never be anything but fanservice", did they tell you that? I've seen time and time again how this show surpasses expectations, I for one did not want an Eddie cheating with Shannon's doppleganger arc when it was speculation, but the show surprised me with how much I liked the way they did it. Same goes for buddie, if you think it can only ever be fanservice, just give them a chance to maybe surprise you. Ryan and Oliver are gonna get shit on no matter what they say in interviews. If they talk about buddie too much and hint about it being romantic, they're going to get accused of queerbaiting. If they don't talk about buddie at all or keep emphasizing that buddie is platonic, they're going to be called homophobic. It's a lose lose situation.

And another thing? Interviews are not word of god. This fandom (and any fandom) needs to stop placing so much weight on them. They're a fun behind the scenes look into the conversations and decisions surrounding different scenes and storylines, but that's it. Personally, I don't care what Ryan or Oliver might feel about buddie. It's fun seeing them be supportive of it, sure, but they could outright say that it was never going to happen and I wouldn't care, because they're not the writers or showrunners, what they say in an interview has no impact on the show. A lot of people weren't there or have forgotten when Tim made comments about how much he loved Taylor Kelly and wanted to pursue more journalist storylines, or when he said Eddie would have no PTSD after the shooting. So even if Tim confirmed or denied buddie in an interview? It means nothing bc it didn't occur in the show. We'll all find out whether Ryan and Oliver wanted buddie to happen or not if/when it does happen, or when the show ends. Until then just stay along for the ride or hop off if you're not having a good time.