#adrien's confused

[wisteriasymphony]

plot bunny: What if Lila/Iris was a random person who found Ladybug dead and decided to impersonate her so that the city could still have their hero.

[zoe-oneesama]

Got some SL Kwami Swap/Merch Swaps looks thanks to my Patreon Requests (Except Adrien who's in Ladybug merch, don't get it twisted lol)

Ko-fi | Patreon

[strawberrinoz]

self indulgent art time

sometimes i wish the farmer can participate in emily's clothing therapy bc ik ruru would EAT. but i digress

[mummer]

just saw asteroid city last night, pls explain the proposed significance of the kiss!!

answering this publicly hope thats ok! cant do a readmore im on mobile *****asteroid city spoilers below beware*****

i dont remember anyones names so this is gonna sound partly unhinged. okay so the edward norton playwright and jason schwartzman actor (not character, in the black and white parts) are lovers right. tbh i thought this was kind of a gag and forgot about it. but later we find out that the playwright died 6 months into the production. i didnt make the connection that THAT’s why the actor-jason has to suddenly leave the stage and freaks out backstage about how he’s not sure he’s Doing it right. hes not talking about acting!! because he himself is literally grieving his lover while he’s playing a character who’s grieving his wife written by his lover so obviously it’s too much!!! actor-jason is trying to find meaning in his death through his writing but there isnt any meaning in death [gerris drinkwater voice] which is what the play is trying to say anyway. he doesnt think he’s performing grief right even in his own life!!! (and tbh it’s the 50s so he wouldnt be able to perform grief publicly anyway!!!!) the play starts with a car accident… anyone would search for some hidden meaning there, some sign…. so when he talks to margot robbie outside it’s not really about finding the CHARACTER’s motivations it’s about the actor himself being able to process the playwright’s death! and adrien brody director was probably also dealing with that too (him and norton seemed to be good buddies) so the whole “sleeping backstage” thing gets a bit sadder maybe? maybe everyone else got this in the theatre and im just stupid lol but crazy making stuff to me!!! the whole story is about sublimated gay grief that cannot be expressed?!?!

the tweet that caught me onto this was here which posits that the playwright’s death was a suicide but i think that’s pretty stupid and unnecessary because the whole thing about the play asteroid city is that death is random and meaningless. im pretty sure that’s what the alien represents— a shocking and absurd event that isnt outright evil or menacing, not something anyone can predict or make sense of, it’s just a thing that happens to you out of nowhere, it doesnt mean anything. he’s a little black figure, he’s death! giving and taking! aagh

[miraculosus]

And I can't tell you how it feels…

[valentinafoxr]

You know what the ‘leaked’ Chat Noir look on that poster reminds me of

This silly little guy here

[actually-factually-anonymous]

The unnecessary lack of personal stakes of Marinette Dupain-Cheng in the Agreste Arc

Inspired by a recent post by @starguardianniom, with half pinched again from my own reblog:

Marinette has zero personal stakes in the main conflict of her show, except that she happened to be the first girl who helped Fu across the road, and was thus chosen to wear the earrings. She doesn't even really seem to have any reason to be Ladybug aside from the basic "I can't sit back and do nothing" she stated in Origins. So a sense of responsibility conferred by being the bearer of the earrings, and an ostensible general desire to do good.

This would be fine, except that Adrien very much did have a reason to continue being Chat Noir. Plagg's Miraculous is the source of his freedom, and a new identity of his own making separate from the carefully curated child of Gabriel Agreste. Most importantly he had so much personal connection to the core plot that his narrative potential dwarfed Marinette's beyond compare.

His mere existence is the very axis of the plot, putting it in motion by the apparent desire for a designer child seeming being the very reason Gabriel and Emile sought the Miraculous all those years ago, and the consequences of his creation being the very reason that Gabriel devolves into magical terrorism. Hawkmoth being his father whom Adrien clearly cares for and whose goal of restoring his much mourned mother setup a truly impressive case for split loyalties for when Adrien (seemingly) inevitably learnt of his father's identity and true goal:

I made a comparison before between Avatar and Miraculous where Avatar won without question. Allow me to balance the scales here: the setup for Adrien potentially turning on Ladybug, or having to sacrifice his familial bonds for the sake of justice outweighed Zuko's own setup for choosing his ''honour"/loyalty to his family over his burgeoning sense of justice.

In potential at least. Rest assured that Zuko's character arc still far eclipses anything Adrien was ever allowed.

But the point I'm trying to make here is that in the very story that bears her name, Ladybug's only reason to be involved comes from the fact that she happens to have Tikki's Miraculous. She has no personal investment in the fate of Hawkmoth than other citizen of Paris, she certainly has no conflicting loyalties.

She doesn't even have a personal reason to continue being Ladybug. You can draw a parallel if you like with one of her ostensible inspirations Peter Parker, who learnt the price of personal inaction in a harsh and unforgiving manner that selflessly drives him to protect others. You can say that the Stoneheart incident fulfills a similar role.

But here's the thing: Peter Parker is Spiderman thanks to his radioactive blood. Ladybug is whoever wears Tikki's Miraculous. If Peter retires, he takes his powers away from the protection of New York. If Marinette gives up her Miraculous, a new Ladybug will arise in her place within a day. There's no need for her to be Ladybug, to take on that responsibility, and until the season three finale there's no personal stake for her to be the girl under the mask any more than any other Parisian citizen.

And that means that Marinette isn't the heart of her own story. In Avatar, it's Aang's quest to defeat the Fire Lord because it has to be him that restores balance. In Star Wars, it's Luke whose connection with Vader that has to restore Anakin's better nature. In just about any series there is a pressing need and personal stakes for the protagonist to be that The Protagonist of that story, that make that story their story.

But the setup here has all the pathos and personal stakes placed upon Adrien. Marinette is the centerpiece of the show, but Adrien's handed all of the narrative potential even as the writers let it go to waste.

It's like preparing a finely seasoned meal, then leaving it to rot as you serve plain vegetables. There's just no reason to have the vegetables when the fine meal is ready for consumption: and if that's a problem? If the plain vegetables were always meant to be the centrepiece? Then you should have seasoned the vegetables and made something delectable with them.

Because the saddest apart about Marinette having or actual ties or pathos to the Agreste Arc is that once upon a time that was not the case.

In previous Miraculous proposals, before the PV, Marinette Cheng was at least as part of the main story as Felix/Adrien was. There were various versions of how the story would go, with one echoing Cardcaptor's plot, and the later proposals looking more like what we got in the final product.

But all had Marinette having a personal stake in the story. In the Cardcaptor-esque plot, Marinette was Fu's granddaughter (or granddaughter figure), and Fu was the caretaker of the The Orb. A crystal that contained all the "fairies" (beings that served both the roles Kwamis and Akumas would later take). The story kicked off because Marinette brought her crush Felix into her Grandfather's store and accidentally broke The Orb, shattering it and allowing the Fairies to escape across Paris and empower countless people- heroes and villains both.

It was her mission to retrieve the Fairies, because she was the one who had released them. She was Fu's granddaughter and it was her responsibility to clean up her mess. It was her story, and Felix/Adrien was the one with less direct connection.

Later proposals ditched The Orb as the Kwamis were developed, but up until the most recent and final versions of the story Marinette retained Fu as either her blood Grandfather outright or at least a mentor so close from her childhood that she thought of him as a Grandfather. She also was usually being trained to be a Guardian or something like it herself from childhood.

She wasn't just a girl Fu found on the side of the road. She had as much connection to the Guardians and their world as Felix/Adrien did to Papillion. It even added a certain Montague-Capulet tragic element to the romance, since if Felix/Adrien and Marinette ever got together it would mean one having to choose between their partner and their family.

But for some reason, in the final product Marinette was stripped of all pre-series personal connections to the Miraculous.

The question is why? Was there really so great a need for Martinette to be "a girl like any other" that all of the plot relevance needed to be stripped out of her and added to Adrien, only to then completely ignore all that potential pathos by sidelining Adrien at every turn?

Because if you weren't going to do anything with Adrien, then all you've done is needlessly undermine Marinette's potential as a character.

Seriously, if you had given me the backstory of these two characters and asked which one was the main character: there would have been no chance I would have selected Marinette. Because all the writers have given her backstory is side-character material, whereas Adrien's very existence, as well as his relationship to his family and the Miraculous is at the heart of the story.

And I doubt there would be many others who would think otherwise.

[sanchesaas]

Marinette KNOWS she made the wrong decision. She is just trying to justify her action lying to herself that she made the right decision. But she doesn't believe in her own lies, so she tries confort in other people to say that she made something right. She wants them to say it was right, but they will never do it.

And she will never be satisfied with her decision.

[miraculouslbcnreactions]

Wait how is Adrien supposed to be Ken in Miraculous? There is to many things that should revolve around him because of his family, like him being a sentimonster, his dad being the main villain for example

I remember watching Barbie Life in The Dreamhouse 2012 and in the show there was an episode where Ken realize he really didn't have a life outside of being Barbie's boyfriend. So he tried other things or at least attempted to because everytime barbie called he was there. At the end of the episode he realizes he's fine with not having a life outside of barbie. Ken was Barbie's accessory and he was totally fine with that infact he took pride in that. And this works because he has nothing major going on. He doesn't have a parent that wants revenge and his friends are barbie's friends

Adrien has a life outside of Marinette. He does fencing, he models, he's a rich kid whose the face of his fathers brand and has to go to social functions. He's a sentimonster and she knows but he doesn't. There were no secrets that big between barbie and Ken. Honestly the show could focus on Adrien it would make sense and probably be a lot better or we could have episodes where he's the main character because those so much going on around him because of his family

Adrien can't be Ken because he has a life outside of Marinette and there are times where certain episodes should have him be the main character for that episode. Ken didn't have a life outside of barbie and there are zero times episodes should have been about him.

Hard disagree that the show would be better if Adrien replaced Marinette as the main character, but other than that, you're preaching to the choice, anon. That post was NOT me saying that Adrien has the narrative weight and setup of Ken. It was me highlighting the existence of a writing issue that I'd first brought up in a different post. Namely that the writers are acting as if Adrien is a character like Ken. In broader teams, he's often written like a classic girl-power male love interest whose only purpose is supporting, causing drama for, and being shipped with his designated girl.

There's nothing wrong with those kinds of characters, but if that's all that they wanted Adrien to be, then they did a horrible job of setting him up as you already pointed out. Adrien was not given the kind of backstory or narrative role that fit a classic girl-power male love interest. That doesn't change the fact that this how he's being written, which is why I brought up the Ken quote.

It wasn't me saying, "you're silly to expect Adrien to have a more active role in the narrative, he was never set up for that." It was me saying, "even though Adrien should have a more active role in the narrative, he isn't being written like he does and - at this point - I don't think that he ever will be. You really should set your expectations accordingly or else the show is just going to keep upsetting you because the issue that I'm pointing out isn't just a matter of opinion. It has strong textual backing and even seems to be a 100% intentional read unless the head writer is lying for some reason."

In other words, if you want stories that focus more on Adrien? Then give up on canon. Stick to fanon. It's ridiculous, but it's also reality.

[ladyofthenoodle]

marinette's friends while chloe is accusing her of theft

adrien:

rose:

juleka:

mylene:

[wisteriasymphony]

When trying to fix a Perfect Character, the only thing you can do is make them worse and this is rather beautiful i think. Where else can a damsel go but down

[zoe-oneesama]

Now pick a side Marinette!

Episode 43 Part 11

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Season 1, Season 2, Season 3, Season 4, Season 5

Ep 41, Ep 42, Ep 44, Ep 45, Ep 46, Ep 47

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[piromina]

HELLO MIRACULOUS FANDOM

if u are part of the miraculous fandom PLS DO NOT SCROLL PAST THIS.

I'll try to keep this message short enough, but if you don't want to be really confused in season 6, READ THIS. (and yes there will be pictures)

Do you remember the episode Representation? Of course you do. It was probably one of the best episodes imo. We got some feligami, adrien fighting his father (only to end up in solitary confinement afterwards but forget that), and, of course, confirmation to a very popular fan theory.

HOWEVER. that fan theory is something I need to talk about.

Don't worry, yes, I still do believe that adrien, félix and kagami are all sentis, that is not what the purpose of this message is. Please keep reading.

do you remember him? yes. this is félix. impersonating his shitty father, colt. in this scene , 'colt' is using the peacock miraculous to create a son.

in this scene, the amok is very clearly going into the ring félix has on at all times.

But what, in the entire representation play, has not been shown once?

Émelie using the peacock. Émelie putting the amok into Adrien's rings. Émelie creating a son.

This play is Félix's story, not Adrien's.

Yes, adrien is a sentimonster, but that was never shown here once. Yes, there were peacock feathers in the background of Émelie being pregnant, and yes, Gabriel called Adrien a miracle.

But those were just hints for the audience.

In this scene, here is what 'Gabriel' was saying.

After much study, I have discovered a solution for you and your wife.

This is making it sound like he has just now discovered the peacock miraculous. We as the audience, of course, know that he's lying.

But who was this play meant for, other than us as the all-knowing viewers?

Marinette Dupain-Cheng. The only in-universe audience member. And let's not forget that this is her very first exposure to the Agreste and Graham de Vanily family history and the senti lore. She doesn't know what we do.

Marinette, upon hearing Gabriel's lie, had no reason to believe he or émelie used the peacock to create Adrien. Marinette, upon hearing Gabriel's lie, had no reason to believe that after Colt created félix, he stole back the peacock miraculous. Marinette, upon watching this play, had no reason to believe that Adrien is a sentimonster, or that the Graham de Vanily rings are significant in any way.

"But then why did she give them back to Adrien?" It's what would have made him happy. It's what Gabriel wanted. It's the last thing she could find in there that Gabriel owned. It's the last known piece of the Agreste family.

Marinette Dupain-Cheng has no reason to believe that Émelie used the peacock. In fact, Émelie only appears in this play four times, once as the curious princess, once living a bohemian life with the tailor, once being pregnant, and once giving birth.

And the Graham de Vanily rings? Only when her parents attached them to her necklace, and then as she was getting married! Marinette thinks those are just simple wedding bands, like her parents'!

And now, to recap, this is what everyone knows:

Us, the viewers:

Adrien, Félix, and Kagami are sentimonsters. Gabriel found the miraculous while in Tibet, along with the butterfly. Then, he gave it to Émelie, and she used it to create Adrien, putting the amok in the wedding bands. Afterwards, Gabriel gave the miraculous to Colt, who made Félix, as shown in the play. And, somehow, the peacock found its way over to Kagami's family (possibly her father?) who used it to create her, and put the amok in the ring she wears.

Marinette:

Félix is a sentimonster. Gabriel found the miraculous somewhere (probably Tibet, as that's where it was lost, possibly along with the butterfly). Then, he gave it to Colt in an act of sympathy (strange, those must have been nicer times), but of course not without making a trade. Afterwards, Colt used the peacock to create Félix, and then somehow Gabriel got it back and used it to become Shadowmoth.

Marinette doesn't know that Adrien is a sentimonster.

Reblog to spread the word.

[majestysnowbird0]

toxigriffe moments

Shadybug appears in her Adrien’s window. They are older now. Her buns are back, and he still has his emo aesthetic going on. He's been sitting on his couch, studying a large book. He closes it as she crouches at the open window frame.  “Can I come in, Adrien?” She says, with a tiny sneer when she says his name, defensively covering a deeper earnestness in her question. “Yes,” he says. She jumps from the window straight to the couch, straddling him where he sits, sideways on the couch with his feet up. He clears his throat. “What do you need, Ladybug?” he asks softly. She’s still on top of him, her arms over each of his shoulders, hands braced on the side of the couch behind his back. “I’m… lonely," she says through gritted teeth. Her big eyes are shifty with nerves and defensiveness, but deep pools of sadness underneath. “I wondered if you could make me feel… less lonely,” she finishes in a rush. He raises an eyebrow and smiles slightly. “Yes, I can do that.” He puts the book down on the floor with exaggerated calm, then grabs her by the waist and pulls her closer for a long, hungry kiss, full of all the pent-up longing they have been holding for each other. She sinks from her slightly threatening, crouched position, to rest her body more fully on his, while raking her hands through his hair. He is kissing her as if he were dying of thirst.

...

Emonette is on her balcony, home from uni, watering flowers. Claw Noir jumps out of the night to crouch on her banister. She puts the water down and walks over to him, grabs his face and kisses him hungrily, as the night breezes and occasional nighttime city noise rush around them. He’s still balancing on the banister, leaning into their long kiss. The night is clear, and the stars are sparkling all around them.

[thetardisisnotourdivision]

I am unreasonably upset about the fact that I've been forced to accept that Gabriel was a Gerald.

For context, in An Inspector Calls, Gerald Croft is engaged to Sheila Birling when he meets a homeless, struggling Eva Smith in a bar, and essentially in return for a home and money he shows her affection (ahem), then gets rid of her once he no longer has a use for her. Now, obviously this isn't a direct translation, but the essentials are - a Gerald is a character who uses another character, in return for something they need, usually masking the fact that they're using them with affection and love.

And against my will I've had to accept that this is exactly what Gabriel does to Nathalie.

Did I want to think he had potential to be better? Did I think he genuinely cared for Nathalie?? Hell, did I just really really want somebody to care about Nathalie???

Probably all of the above but the point is: he's Gerald. And I cannot - I literally can't unsee it now. Their whole dynamic in S3 is like “oh boohoo I'm sorry I wish you didn't have to use the peacock Miraculous and kill yourself over it but uh I need to use your powers” “yeah no that's fine I'm all good”. Which, given the "Gerald" theorem, I'm assuming leads to the fact that what Nathalie needed, above all, was someone to care about her - and Gabriel came along, as Sheila Birling puts it, "like a fairytale prince", and was so caring and gentle and... Yeah. She fell for him. And. Yeah he genuinely did seem to care like twice. But so did Gerald. Gerald actually admits that he did care for Eva, just not the way that she cared for him, and, uh, not enough to not just dispose of her. So he discards her anyway when she stops being useful.

Leading me neatly to my point.

He starts using the peacock Miraculous the second it's fixed, the slimy bastard, HOWEVER. It runs way deeper than that. Assuming I'm right (which I almost DEFINITELY am), then Gabriel only needed Nathalie while she was useful. She didn't stop being useful in season three - she's still scheming for him, helping him with plan after plan. It's only partway through season 5 that she officially servers ties with him, and starts to actively hinder him.

Nathalie stops being useful when she fails as Safari. And I reckon that's when Gabriel and Tomoe decided she had to go.

(It's painfully, I-was-ugly-crying-over-it obvious in Conformation that Gabriel is fully prepared to let Nathalie die - in the original storyboard, her alliance was encouraging her to sleep, and he's very obviously prepared for this moment - I've made a separate post about it that I'll link if I can find it. However, onto the next bit)

With all of this, there's one thing that sticks out to me - Nathalie didn't see any of it until it was already too late. There could be many reasons for this. But you know who would have seen through it? Whose parents were all loving and perfect until she married the wrong man? Emilie. Emilie, who left behind those videos, which on the surface look innocent, but when you look deeper look like a (love confession???????) AHEM a warning. I reckon Emilie noticed what was going on and realised that Nathalie wouldn't see through Gabriel, so she left those videos addressed to Nathalie (not Gabriel, which surely they should have been - they were about him, after all - unless they were there...) as a warning. I don't think the videos were supposed to be about helping Gabriel, I think Emilie was warning Nathalie to get the fuck out of that house, and to take Adrien with her. Because Emilie knew it'd end like this.

Yes I'm still mad ok give me a break.