#SPOP Discourse

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

they're the same picture ☠️

[carto0ncritter]

People are so desperate for LGBT representation, (specifically gay and lesbian couples), that they're willing to accept literally any homosexual ship regardless of the concerning elements.

Let's see, we have ass ships like

1)Stolitz - Stolas is an abuser, a r*pist, a racist man who has so many powers yet is emotionally fragile, passive and wimpy, a man who victimizes himself over and over, a man who emotionally neglects the child who desperately needs him for his sexual fantasies with his victim, a man who is the creator's pet, a man whose actions aren't wrong according to the writers, a man who can just blame everyone else around him but himself with no consequences

2) Catradora - Catra is an abuser too, but was treated like a cute kitty cat in s5 despite having done atrocious things, she was instantly forgiven with no consequences, and she ended up dating her sister and the biggest victim of her abuse

3) Huskerdust - I haven't talked about this one so far, but Angel sexually harassed Husk and never apologized, Husk himself sang "Loser, Baby" and as a SA survivor I felt like he was trying to say this to Angel: "Oh, you've hit rock bottom because of SA? It's your fault lol, accept that you're a whiny bitch and a loser even tho the problem is extremely serious and out of your control and just suck it up, I'm a loser too despite not going through the same thing you have, you're not alone in being a loser BUT YOU ARE STILL A LOSER BABYYY A LOOOSER" Like, ik the message was supposed to be how we're not alone in our struggles and how there's always someone who will understand and make us feel less alone, but the way this was handled rubbed me the wrong way. Also, I'm not sure whether or not to mention this as well (screw it, I will), but Husk is described as "the old bartender," his voice sounds like it belongs to an old dude too, and he apparently died when he was like, 70, while Angel died in his 30's. I'm not gonna calculate their ages based on how it works in Hell because personally I feel like it doesn't matter. What matters is how old they were when they were alive. But however you decide to look at their ages, it's not just the implied enormous age gap that bothers me, no... it's more so the difference in maturity between Husk and Angel. Husk is described as a dude who has seen and experienced a lot of stuff. On the other hand, Angel is clearly immature and there is this weird... emotional imbalance between them? It's like a mentor dating his apprentice, at least that's how I see it. I'm not saying dating someone who's 40 years older than you is morally wrong (if you're both adults) but IT IS WEIRD imo, especially since Angel & Husk are not on the same page when it comes to life experience and maturity. Oh yeah, I also don't think Angel should be in any kind of romantic relationship... for his own good

[shyrgyrryn]

Me *moves on from She-Ra and disappointed that it was, watches Arcane because the new season seemed interesting*

*is disappointed in season 2 and watches in horror as the Arcane fandom becomes the She-Ra fandom 2.0 and fans are angry and dismissive over show criticism*

[66kenobi66]

Adora if she still had scars (By: @/bravestshera)

Broke my heart :(

This one especially gave me chills

[pan-catra]

one thing that this spop rewatch is really opening my eyes on is how hypocritical the Catra redemption discourse was back when the show was still airing. i could make a compilation of all the times Scorpia tries to murder someone in the Rebellion or Entrapta disregards basic morals to uphold her partnership with the Horde and yet they get passes in regards to their redemption while people complain about Catra not “deserving it”. and like, it’s literally only because Scorpia and Entrapta are nicer than Catra. if Catra wasn’t a huge bitch no one would be saying her redemption was rushed or undeserved. people care far more about personality than they do about actions.

[blackholezyy]

What I watched SPOP for:

What I loved by the end of the series:

[spopsalt]

What show's title is vs how it actually is

What the show's title is: She-Ra and The Princesses of Power

What the show actually is: Watch Adora get abused by Cata for 5 seasons straight then date her abuser, also FEEL BAD FOR CATRA

What the show's title is: Helluva Boss

What the show actually is: Watch a gay soap opera while the abuser gets victimized and while the victim gets demonized. Watch the victim form a trauma bond with his abuser. ALSO DON'T YOU FEEL SO BAD FOR STOLAS DONT YOU WANT HIM AND BLITZO TO DATE!?

What the show's title is: Hazbin Hotel

What the show actually is: Watch who is supposed to be the female main character get pushed to the side because men. Get introduced to a whole Lotta plotholes and rushed story telling as we stuff the plot into the last 2 episodes! Enjoy the boring/rushed/toxic romances as well!

[antispopausandstuff]

Adora's Underwritten Psyche

.

list of unexplored, underdeveloped opportunities granted that the writers didn't take for their main ( keyword - main ) protagonist:

being the next poster child of the Horde, desiring Shadow Weaver and Hordak's approval.

Shadow Weaver putting not only the responsibility, but the life of another child ( a volatile one, at that ) in her hands when Adora herself was, at most, 10 years old.

her promotion of Force Captain, which would mean she would be responsible for more lives, while she herself is still a child.

being different from her peers for unknown reasons, and being antagonized for it from a young age ( by Catra ).

constantly having to cater to Catra's person, often including her mood swings and sadism, to either avoid conflict or to make Catra happier.

not only her entire world being turned upside down, but having to fight the only people she knew as family.

being so incredibly sheltered and manipulated that she doesn't even know what an aunt or a party is, showing she was completely unable to have even a modicum of an actual childhood.

not knowing her own culture, home planet, people, biological family, if they ever wanted her, and being given away.

Mara. Mara.

Catra's repeated, increasingly violent betrayals, her hypocrisies, manipulations, etc. after abandoning Adora, while claiming she was the one who was abandoned.

likely feeling even more responsible for Glimmer, Bow, and Angella's lives, a part of it out of immense guilt.

being repeatedly harassed // stalked and assaulted by Catra.

being repeatedly harassed // stalked by Shadow Weaver.

Entrapta's "death". and her betrayal.

being drugged, kidnapped, and essentially nearly "leashed" by Catra.

the Portal. Corrupted Catra. everything.

Angella's sacrifice. with her Atlas complex, there's no way Adora should've been as stable as she was after seeing someone, quite literally, for all she knew, die for her.

Glimmer blaming her. i get it, but it felt like the show quickly made it so that Adora was more upset about not being enough for her than the fact that, y'know, she was the only one blamed for someone's, let alone Angella's, death.

the Heart of Etheria.

Horde Prime's invasion. you cannot convince me she wouldn't feel at least somewhat responsible for that.

Horde Prime telling her, to her face, that Eternia was gone.

Catra being back in her life.

Chipped Catra. no, not for shipping angst reasons.

Catra antagonizing her again, for literally no reason.

Melog being the last of their kind, Adora being the last of hers. maybe not psyche-related, but it certainly should've affected her way more than it did ( which was p much not at all ).

Shadow Weaver. oh, wait, sorry, i forgot that only Catra has trauma related to Shadow Weaver /s.

the Failsafe.

Catra antagonizing her for the umpteenth time, for no reason.

Catra abandoning her, for no reason.

the Failsafe.

but she's just a dumb jock lesbian who's in love with Catra, right? that's alllll that matters. /s.

[cookie-nom-nom]

I wasn’t going to say anything but the take was dismal so:

“””the she ra reboot is oversexualized, it’s wrong to sexualize and homoeroticize teenagers. They should have been adults in the show”””

-the reboot is oversexualizing teenagers

Hilarious given the right wing melt down over it too being woke and ugly for *checks notes* giving She Ra shorts to wear, having muscles, and not massive boobs. Did we seriously forget the entire controversy about them not being sexy enough. Y’all. They were seething and whining.

We can have a conversation about sexualizing teenagers! That is a problem that exists, and there’s a tricky nuance to enforcing beauty standards on teens, fetishizing youth in a predatory way, and acknowledging that teens may want to explore their own sexuality and its healthy to do so. Just, I’m not convinced sexualization is happening in SPOP but sure, later outfit designs do start to show more skin. When they’re literally growing up because hey, the show covers a few years and the main cast is in the 20-21 range by the end. And even then like

If that’s the epitome of sexualization you might be a puritan.

-It is wrong to homoeroticize teenagers

Loud incorrect buzzer sound! Rumor has it teenagers can and will be gay! If your problem is with shipping fictional teenagers, say that. I can’t imagine anyone who has ever been in a fandom will agree, but at least it wouldn’t be homophobic.

-The show should have been about adults.

It’s. It’s literally about child soldiers. That’s literally what the show is about. Would it be the same if Catra was an adult? No, because her story is about an abused and traumatized teenager desperate to have enough power she can’t be hurt anymore. She is young and inexperienced and rebelling and making horrible, selfish choices and it’s so deeply tied into her age because she’s just now growing up enough to be strong and clever enough to flip the tables. Would it be the same if Adora was an adult? No, because her story is about the horror of a teenager being turned into an idol, into a weapon of war. We literally watch how that shapes her as she steps into adulthood. Would it be the same if Glimmer was an adult? No, because her arc is going from a rebellious teenager demanding to be taken seriously and have more control, to her struggling when she gets shoved into adulthood and queenhood far too young as she looses her only present parent.

No, the story about teen soldiers crumpling under the war they’ve grown up in would not be better if it was about adults, because it would HAVE to be a different story with different themes. If you want to say they shouldn’t have been hot while doing so, fine whatever, but eviscerating the core premise in order to ‘fix’ it is a disservice to the story.

[aviaryartist1800]

Idk why the SPOP fandom thinks the dance scene is romantic

I don't see it as romantic or "sexual tension"(which, wth, they are teenagers)

In fact, it just reminds me of this entire musical number:

(Specifically the part where Drake forces Marina to dance with him)

I know Pebble and the Penguin kinda sucked, but my point still stands

[bitterlynsposts]

People never fail to impress me lol

"I really dont get the adora should have just stayed in the hoard argument" yeah absolutely! She really just should have kept unknowingly hurt inocent people and destroy again INOCENT ppls homes and kingdoms, all while thinking she was actualy doing the right thing just to please catra. Yeah... totally...

I thought we were all anti forcefully taking over the world and killing ppl but i guees not lmao

(Hopefully the original poster wont see this lmao but if they do im sorry but your comments just really...surprised me, but i mean no hate really. Just becuse we dont agree on opinions about a show. Dosen't mean i mean them any harm, hell maybe ill delete this becuse i really dont want to give them any hate but at the same time i really want to know other anticatradora ppls take on this) 😵‍💫😵‍💫

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

“catra is a complex poc” fuck that. here are some ACTUAL poc animated characters who are just as, if not more complex than catra.

grace monroe (infinity train) • black american

connie maheshwaran (steven universe) • indian-american

katara (avatar the last airbender) • inuk

wolf (kipo and the age of wonderbeasts) • black american

suhara/shadowsan (carmen sandiego) • japanese

korra (the legend of korra) • inuk

jesse cosay (infinity train) • indigenous (apache)

lars barriga (steven universe) • filipino

azula (avatar the last airbender) • japanese

ryan akagi (infinity train) • japanese-canadian

luz noceda (the owl house) • afro-dominican american

(there are a lot more, so i'll be making a part 2!)

[carto0ncritter]

I'm sorry but I genuinely can't understand how people can look at Stolitz and Catradora and think these ships are healthy in any way, shape or form.

Stolas r*ped Blitzø. No, consent given in a life-or-death situation doesn't count

Stolas is racist towards imps, and this didn't change even when he "fell in love" with Blitzø

Stolas doesn't appreciate or respect Moxxie and Millie in the slightest (and was disappointed that his "Prince Charming" wasn't the one to rescue him)

He looks down on Blitzø and calls him things like "impish little plaything" and "his big dicked Blitzy" and doesn't stop treating him like shit even when Blitzø says loud and clear that he hates being talked down on like this (DUH)

The only thing Stolas knows about Blitzø is that he hates books and the only thing Blitzø knows about Stolas is that he's a boring bookworm. Keep in mind, the two figured this out about each other while they were kids, 25 YEARS AGO, after Blitzø was bought so that he could be Stolas' "friend" for ONE DAY

Stolas doesn't love Blitzø for Blitzø. Stolas loves the *idea* of Blitzø. The bird man wants to live a romance that is just like the romances in his cheesy novels. He wants to ride into the sunset with his one true love. He wants grand romantic gestures. He wants his "Prince Charming". Except, Blitzø isn't the type of guy for such sappy displays of affection, he never was. Especially combined with his trauma. And as soon as that other imp guy asked him to dance, Stolas not only accepted the offer, but Blitzø was no longer on his mind. And no, I don't think being drunk is proof that Stolas didn't mean what he had told Blitzø. Drunk people find it easier to say what's really on their mind after all

Blitzø fell in love with his abuser. This makes sense, actually. The guy always pushed everyone away and never got to experience true love, and now that he has the chance to be "wanted," even if the "relationship" is toxic, he finds it hard to let it go

As for Catradora, the things I wanna say about this ship have already been said throughout the years, but it all boils down to these things:

Catra mentally, emotionally and physically abused Adora

Catra had no problem ending the whole entire universe if it meant she'd finally be better than Adora

Catra was a war criminal and a fascist

Catra was responsible for what happened to Glimmer's mom and never apologized, let alone faced consequences

Their relationship was toxic even when they were kids

They were both raised by Shadow Weaver and were the only ones in the Horde who saw her as a mother figure, thus making the ship straight up incest, with even the official source material calling them sisters (adoptive siblings ARE REAL SIBLINGS!!!)

Catra got exactly what she wanted in the end (the girl she's always been obsessed with and dependent on) and, once again, faced 0 consequences for her actions

The show (and C//A stans) fetishizes abuse. As a SA survivor, I felt physically sick during the final episode, where the abuser ends up with her victim/sister and they kiss

In short, these ships are disgusting and the lgbt community deserves better representation

[66kenobi66]

C//A stans: Omg, Adora is such a ditz! She didn't even know she was GAY before her and Catra kissed 😂

Literally Adora every other episode:

[anti-catradora-collection]

just leaving this here.

[blackholezyy]

Honestly, I don’t actively hate Scorfuma like I do certain ships like C//A. I just find it to be really, really boring. Let’s get into it:

I already don’t like Perfuma as a character. She’s hypocritical, annoying and ableist (like she put Entrapta on a leash). Not to mention, she’s just not a good written character. She’s boring, one dimensional and had no character arc outside of “nice flower girl preaching about peace.” I wouldn’t mind her had anyone called her out on her BS but no, it just doesn’t happen.

Perfuma also enforces toxic positivity.. which, if you don’t know, it’s basically an excessive harmful pressure to maintain a positive, happy attitude and in turn ignores or dismisses negative feelings like sadness, anger, grief, etc. I won’t go into detail too much so I might just make a separate post about this.

Moving on, Scorpia is probably one of the better characters from SPOP. She’s naive, energetic and deeply protective but also self conscious, deprived of love, and insecure. And throughout the show, she does go through character development (which got retconned in S5 but I digress). One of the most memorable things about Scorpia is her loyalty to Catra. As seen multiple times, she actively defended her even behind her back, is extremely defensive over her to the point where she hates Adora simply because she knows Catra is hurt by Adora leaving the Horde, stays by her side even if it gets her into danger, and is convinced that Catra is misunderstood.

Heck, I’ll even come out and say that Scopria strongest relationship is with Catra. It’s not exactly healthy per say (any relationship with Catra is unhealthy) but we could see that time and time again Scorpia deeply cares about Catra and Catra secretly deep down cares about Scorpia until S4.

The only grievance I have is that when they first met, Scorpia was immediately “ride or die” for Catra. I think it would make more sense and be narratively better had Scorpia grow to deeply care for Catra rather than her immediately caring right off the bat.

But what about Perfuma, you may ask? Well.. I have nothing to say about Scorpia’s relationship with Perfuma outside of aesthetics. It’s the same situation with Glimbow but at least with Glimbow, they were friends and had something. Granted, it was rushed, poor written and came out of nowhere, but at least it was something. With Scorfuma, it was nothing.

One of the biggest issues I have with Scorfuma is that Perfuma immediately liked and crushed on Scorpia the moment Scorpia arrived in Bright Moon. Excuse me for being pessimistic but that makes ZERO sense. You have been fighting for three seasons straight and have like no reason to trust Scorpia, who mind you was practically Catra’s right hand and helped the Horde with the Battle of Bright Moon, kidnapping Bow and Glimmer in the Princess Prom episode, etc.

This is why I say that this show just doesn’t portray war well because in the middle of a war, when an enemy deflects, they would be greeted with suspicion and a bunch of background checks and reasonably so. In war, the enemy could easily plant spies or use someone to gain the other side’s trust and use that to their advantage.

For the rest of the show, it was just.. boring. Perfuma and Scorpia had no meaningful conversations, no real connection, nothing. It’s hilarious that Scorpia seemed closer with Sea Hawk due to their similar insecurities than Perfuma. Which is a shame because I feel like if written well, these two could’ve had a good relationship, both platonically and romantically.

One of the things I do like about Scorfuma though is that in S5, when Scorpia was chipped, Perfuma was heavily devoted to save her and because of that devotion, Scorpia managed to resist Horde Prime, even briefly. Scorpia being chipped had a clear effect on Perfuma and I like how Scorpia sacrificed herself. But that’s where my praises end. Because this would’ve been way more impactful had their relationship had time to actually develop.

Overall, I don’t hate Scorfuma. I actually think it’s arguably one of the more better ships to come out of SPOP. But again, the poor writing and lack of development just drags this ship down for me.