#Pro Ben Solo

[vintageseawitch]

"omg i didn't know this book was based off a REYLO fanfic waaaah i don't like that 😭😭"

[midgardianqueenreturns]

Over the last couple months I’ve seen antis say stuff like “The Reylo/Kylo fandom is mostly dead”, “Nobody cares about Kylo anymore”, and “Everyone dislikes Reylo now”. The past few days sure proved them wrong, especially since Kylo Ren wasn’t even mentioned in the movie announcement yet you have so, so many Kylo fans and/or Reylo shippers begging for his return. So much for a dead fandom lol.

[mysticaltora8276]

Also, I will end this particular note in saying this. Ben Solo, however flawed his execution might be in some areas is a way better person who’s turned into the dark side and Jacen Solo is. Jacen is one of those characters that is portrayed as “compassionate“ and all knowing, but he comes across as a self righteous jerk. When I first read about him in young Jedi order, he was OK if somewhat unmemorable but what they turn them into I wanted to jump through the pages and start smacking him repeatedly. I have a thing against self-righteous jerks because I’ve dealt with people like that in real life and let me tell you something. It’s not fun.

Ben comes as someone who is trying to define himself and gets groomed into the wrong idea and way.

[octobers-veryown]

REYLO 🦋

Your honor I am obsessed with them lately.

[darklinaforever]

Frankly, those who think a happy ending to Star Wars 9 would have been inappropriate are the ones who least understand Star Wars at its core. George Lucas himself described Star Wars as a fairy tale. And yes, he meant it in its current most childish and clichéd aspect, that is to say with the happy ending. Not to mention his opinion on romance... So no, Having Ben Solo die at the end of Star Wars 9 and depriving Reylo of a happy ending was literally the worst thing to do, both story-wise and marketing-wise. Because, like George say himself :

[theshipdiaries]

I can't go through losing another ship. I just can't. All I do is lose and honestly? It hurts me like someone I personally knew and loved died. I don't know why it hurts me this deeply. But it's crazy. I cried more when Klaus Mikaelson died than when my grandfather who I loved deeply died. To be fair he was 96 he WANTED TO DIE and literally stopped eating on purpose so he would die because he was bored out of his mind and all his friends had died and felt like he had no purpose anymore. It's not like you can have long term goals at his age. So we all saw it coming and I knew he wanted it and was happy so It brought me comfort.

BUT KLAUS MIKAELSON'S DEATH? Totally unexpected, felt like a huge betrayal. And it just sent me into a deep spiral and I'm still mourning him. Cried for 3 days locked in my room. Every once in a while I still cry. It's been 6 years AND I HATE IT. Because it's so stupid. HE IS NOT REAL. Just ink on a script and fake everything. And yet it hurts. It hurts so much. Losing Klaroline was like losing a part of myself. Something I had loved for so long, something I had invested so much time in, been obsessed with for so long.

And then sometimes karamel makes me cry. They were the representation of true love for me. True soft good love. What everyone deserves. And I cry at their loss. And the injustice of Kara ending up alone and sad. The message that if you are a woman you have to choose to either be strong and independent or be in love. And it was made explicitly clear that Kara wanted to get married and have a family. SHE LONGED FOR IT. But they didn't let her. They punished her for it. The same writers who forced the character to want it. But all the other male superheroes? They were applauded for it.

Most other ships don't make me cry but anger me deeply. Like bellarke and barchie and Hyde and Jackie. REYLO.

And now? I'm terrified for Kastle. I can't lose them too. I thought I was safe. The show was cancelled and there was never a resolution but it ended in both literally confessing their love. Karen begging him to choose her and telling him there is nothing he could do to change her feelings for him. That she would risk it all and run away with him. Him confessing that he doesn't want to feel this. He is not ready to feel this. Who is he without his war? He doesn't know. But he knows he loves her. She means everything to him. I was fine with that ending. Even with him REJECTING HER. Because it was made obvious that he loved her. But his arc wasn't over. He needed more time. And the writers had respect for the ship. Understood it.

But now? I have no idea what they might do. They might pretend they were never anything to each other. They might kill her off. They might betray all of us and destroy the characters completely. Just like with bellarke just like with Hyde and Jackie. Ignore everything stablished and stab us fans in the back. Treat us like we are stupid and undeserving of respect.

I CANT GO THROUGH THAT PAIN AGAIN. I know what it's like and it destroys something in me EACH TIME. Again, it's like someone I loved very deeply died. I don't know why. But it hurts. And I just don't know if I have it in me. I'm so scared. Terrified. More than for my future or for anything.

[sleepingapparition]

‘Their eyes locked as their fingertips touched. Ben granted himself an indulgence and stepped to the side, allowing the dying sun behind him to bathe her in gold.

Like Icarus, drawn irresistibly toward the sun, he felt the pull to move closer to her- consequences be damned. Let her scorch his skin and light a flame in his heart.

He noticed the quick rise and fall of her chest and his own hammering heartbeat.

Standing before her with his back to the window, he cast a silhouette in the fiery glow. An eclipse to her sun.

It hid the burning in his gaze as she stood before him.

Defiant, irritated, and utterly radiant in the fading light of the day.’

_______

Finished!

[unleashthegoats]

EPISODE 13: JAKE SKYWALKER: THE WORST JEDI

Welcome to the second episode in our Fixing the Sequels series! This time we’re focusing on that controversy of all controversies, Jake Skywalker. Some people liked him, others felt like he was an insult to everything Star Wars had ever stood for before this, but we had some ideas on what we would’ve liked to have seen happen for the character in the Sequels. 

[emilyredekerart]

I am very late to this art meme but whatever :)

---

Commissions are open! Info here, message me if interested!

Credit me if you repost.

Please be respectful in the comments.

Do not involve my artwork in fandom arguments.

Bonus version with Kylo/Ben angry crying:

[whennoonecares]

Calling Kylo Ren "Ben" feels like deadnaming him

Here me out: Ben was feeling fundamentally altered after his traumatic experience with Luke Skywalker, and as part of separating himself from it, he chose a new name.

So referring to him as "Ben" feels like denoting who he was before, and "Kylo" for who he is afterward.

In that way, I feel like Rey insisting on calling him "Ben" after she learns that name is sort of disrespectful of his decision to distance himself from his family.

Though, I acknowledge him distancing himself through his name does ring a bit hollow when you remember his near-constant comparisons of himself to Darth Vader, BUT I would argue that that was implanted by Palpatine.

Because fundamentally Palpatine didn't care to acknowledge that his Grand Plan was just fuckin wrong, yet he's trying so hard to hold on to all that work he'd done.

But he's just a stubborn, vain man, and it would've been baller to see a Kylo that chose that name for himself.

ALSO!! Wouldn't it be baller if he chose the name "Kylo", no last name? Wouldn't that coincide so very well with "Rey", no last name?? The dichotomy of someone with no family because his family was slowly killing him, vs someone with no family who was only staying alive for the hope they'd be there for her?

And while we're on the topic of Rey, I can respect her taking on the last name "Skywalker" IF Luke had shown that he, y'know,, liked her at all? He seemed pretty begrudging about the whole thing to me.

Wouldn't it have been cool for her to adopt the name "Palpatine" as a way to reclaim power from that horrible man?

[reylogirlie]

“That’s abusive”

“That’s manipulation”

I’m gonna explain why it’s not in this context:

Now, is this how you should address your love interest irl? Definitely not. Is Ben Solo truly back to the light at this point? No. Is Kylo’s mindset still twisted? Yes. However, some don’t seem to understand what Kylo/Ben meant.

“You’re nothing.” Kylo/Ben didn’t mean Rey was actually nothing. Hell, he legit tells her she’s anything but that. “Nothing” , in his terms, means she’s seen as worthless by the people who are supposed to love her.(I know Rey’s parents are actually good people, I’ll get into that) means that they saw her as someone- something, honestly, to get rid of.

This is what Ben thought Leia and Han saw in him; that he was worthless and they needed Luke to off him. That nobody loved him. At least, that’s what he felt before he met Rey. He knows Rey grew up thinking no one loved her, and thought that she possessed nothing of value.

At this point, Ben hasn’t fully come back. He still feels like he was a victim to the light (when he was actually a victim to the dark) and he’s telling Rey “those people”- her parents, his parents, Luke, etc consider her nothing. “Real abusers brainwash victims into turning on their friends and family” Kylo/Ben doesn’t consider the resistance Rey’s friends. He thinks they’re just going to use and discard her the way he thought he was. He thinks he’s looking out for her. Real abusers typically know their victims loved ones care but wanna get rid of them so they can have said person all to themselves.

(And before you come at me like “actually a lot of abusers don’t get what they’re doing but it’s not an excuse” yea I got that, doesn’t apply here)

“But not to me”- This is Ben telling Rey that their view on her is wrong. That she’s not nothing. That’s she is, in fact, everything. To him especially. He’s not just saying this so she can be on the dark side, that’s not his main concern here even if he still is on the dark side. His main concern is what’s best for Rey, and he believes joining himself is what’s best for her.

His mind set isn’t “I’m gonna isolate her from her friends so I turn her evil and use her for my growth” it’s actually “Those people tried to kill me and use me for my power and they’ll do the same to her so I’m gonna protect her while I still can” he thinks he’s helping her. It’s pretty fucked, but he’s not trying to manipulate her.

“He lied about her parents” no he didn’t. Was Kylo/Ben wrong about Rey’s parents? Yes. But what you people fail to remember is YOU REALLY SHOULD NOT USE THE FORCE AS A FORTUNE TELLER. The future/ past visions are often vague and altered. He only saw parts of what happened. He had no clue that her parents were actually protecting her from evil, he saw them leaving and going to shady ass places and thought they were actually trading her for alcohol. That’s why when he found out the truth he told her!!! If he was manipulating her so he could have her all to himself, he would’ve never told her the truth. Notice how when she left at the end of TLJ he let her and didn’t form a plan to force her back or hurt her. He aggressively tried to persuade her, yes, but he never seriously threatened her. He even snitches on the dark side for Rey and offered to kill Palpatine instead of killing her to complete his mission.

So, bottom line- When Kylo/Ben called Rey nothing, he wasn’t saying she was actually worthless. He was saying that’s what her parents and the people who felt turned on him saw her as, but he considered her to be everything and the most important thing to him. You don’t have to like Reylo or agree with me, but I could go on about how Rey and Kylo/Ben don’t exactly fit the “toxic relationship” boat.

[midgardianqueenreturns]

Maybe this is an oversimplification, I don’t want to generalize, and I really dislike “people only dislike this character because x” type of takes, but I have to say, I don’t think it’s totally a coincidence Snape and Kylo Ren look so alike and inspire very similar levels of widespread vile hatred and moral outrage from their respective fandoms. Obviously it’s not a total overlap as I’ve seen plenty of Kylo stans who are anti Snape and vice-versa, but still. I can’t help but wonder if them having very similar appearances that aren’t conventionally handsome plays a role in why their antis are so excessively hostile and unhinged in their hatred for them. Again, this is probably an oversimplification and generalization (and I don’t want to suggest *everyone* who hates Snape and/or Kylo only does so beccause of their looks), but I can’t help but notice this connection.

[mysticaltora8276]

You know how there’s some people who complain about Ben Solo’s redemption and say that it’s unearned? I’ll give you someone whose redemption comes out of nowhere and it’s basically accepted by everyone even though it makes no sense…Jacen Solo… the person who becomes a Sith for the stupidest reasons and comes across as a massive moron and to be frank I just didn’t like his character. This was a guy who was OK with killing his aunt and killing his sister, but just because he sent a warning to his estranged wife and child I’m supposed to believe that he redeemed himself. Well, no, he didn’t because he didn’t repent of anything he did. It’s another product of redemption that people seem to forget is repentance just saying I’m sorry is not enough. You have to show contrition for what you’ve done and repent of your evil Saying I’m sorry becomes a bit trite when you don’t change your personality or behavior the fact I argue that Ben actually manages to accomplish with Jacen, didn’t.

OK for a bit of context in the old continuity of legends, it was indicated that to become a Sith Lord under the rule of Darth Bane you have to sacrifice someone that kept you level and away from the dark side… Jacen did it full steam ahead with Mara Jade, which pissed off quite a few fans of the characters, even me who immensely lamented of her later use being wasted, and doesn’t regret it in the slightest. Not to mention that he lies to his wife and his child and is OK with conducting a massacres across the galaxy which includes genocide Ben on the other hand immediately and immensely regrets killing his father and he’s torn every step of the way. I used to joke that he was a wannabe villain, but that’s kind of what his character is. He feels like he was forced to evil due to the legacy of his grandfather because in the canon continuity, spoiler alert, he feels isolated a little alone from his peers due to his power, and the fact that he knows that his parents, especially his father is afraid of him due to it. That said he doesn’t want to be deep in his core and that’s why he’s constantly conflicted with it and to be frank I like it. Yeah he could’ve gone fully, but then he would’ve just been a typical villain and his conflict of whether he wants to be good or not is actually pretty nice. It’s seen one of the things that the sequels did very well.

[short-wooloo]

@david-talks-sw recently made a post (https://www.tumblr.com/david-talks-sw/712987173655363584/luke-skywalker-in-the-last-jedi-22) about Luke in TLJ, specifically on how some ideas struggled to work due to the film being unable to delve into Luke as deeply as is ideal, and how this can be remedied through additional media

So in that spirit, here’s my Ideas for what can be done with a pre-sequels Luke and Ben series, expanding on Ben’s turn to the dark side and basing the relationship between him and Luke and the falling out off of Shifu and Tai Lung from Kung Fu Panda

(Originally this was from a reblog I made on @ensomniaa​ ‘s post on the Jedi and Oogway https://www.tumblr.com/ensomniaa/696816137236774912/the-jedi-and-master-oogway)

This would start 10 years before TFA/TLJ (thus 4 years before Ben’s turn which is 6 years before TFA/TLJ), and cover a period of time of 4 years, so the timeline is 24-28 ABY

Let’s start with Luke, in line with basing him off of Shifu, Luke has a great deal of love and pride for his nephew/student, unfortunately this is clouding his objectivity on the subject, that love and pride is becoming attachment, Luke is not seeing what his nephew is becoming/not taking the warning signs as seriously as he should, ironically Luke is attempting to learn from his past mistakes, in ESB he rushed into Bespin without thinking because of a vision, so here Luke is seeing visions of Ben falling, but he’s trying not to overreact to them and make the same mistake or worse cause what he sought to prevent, that’s good, but as I said, Luke’s attachment to Ben is clouding his judgement and he’s not taking it as seriously as he should, and of course over time these visions will become more frequent and Ben’s own behavior (we’ll get to him in a minute) will worsen, but Luke, somewhat arrogantly (ties into Rian Johnson’s commentary that Luke is conflating his own failures as failures of the Jedi as a whole, he was arrogant and it caused disaster so now he’s thinking of the Jedi as a whole as arrogant in bitterness) reassures himself that he saved Anakin so he can do the same again with Ben

Speaking of, for Ben Solo, his bloodline and abilities are a great source of pride to him, but that pride is turning to arrogance and entitlement, we would see him grow more aggressive and cocky (which Snoke/Palpatine would eagerly encourage), becoming more violent in fights and prone to un-Jedi like behaviors, while also believing himself to be the greatest by virtue of his bloodline, we also have the revelation of Anakin/Vader (this is largely taken from the eu stuff), like Luke before him, Ben idolized Anakin Skywalker and was not made aware of his identity as Darth Vader, and the reveal is crushing, again just like it was for Luke, but whereas Luke came to terms with it, Ben will not, and it makes things worse,

Now I want to take a break from Luke and Ben specifically to address some additional factors

during all of this Luke would have some outside factors making things worse (and not just Snoke/Palpatine prodding at Ben trying to make him turn), obviously we know that the correct way to go about Jedi training is one Master focusing all their efforts on one student

unfortunately, Luke can’t exactly do that

in addition to mentoring Ben, Luke is also trying to rebuild the Order, Lead it, recover artifacts, and train a few dozen other Jedi all at once

It’s the worst of both worlds, nobody/nothing is getting the proper attention needed

Now I want to be clear, this is not a criticism of Luke, this is just a fact of how things are, he’s one man with a ton to do (and also maybe this feeds into his later self loathing, Luke thinks himself responsible because he tried to do everything), ideally it should not be this way, but like with the Prequel Jedi, Luke is lacking in good options, and taking on all of that work at once is simply the least bad option

As I already said, we wouldn’t see this all at once, this would be a gradual process over the course of years, I kinda would approach this like a lot of prequel material does: that feeling of dread as we slowly approach disaster

And speaking of disaster, we set the stage, the point in time is just a few days (or hours even) before the flashback in TLJ (the year is 28 ABY, 6 years before TFA)

Luke and Ben have returned from a mission, while it was a success, Luke is concerned, his visions have gotten worse, and the reality is not much better, Ben was very aggressive and arrogant, and even killed the darksider (who maybe is another apprentice of Snoke’s and Kylo’s own predecessor in the First Order) they fought after that darksider had been defeated (why yes that is an allusion to Anakin killing Dooku), and the whole thing has Luke questioning if he’s been going about this the right way, and then Ben does it...

He is demanding to be made a Knight, and this is where we lock in Ben’s parallels with Tai Lung (and parallels to his grandfather), rather than awaiting the time as to when he is judged to be worthy of something (knighthood/the Dragon Scroll), Ben in his arrogance is demanding it of his teacher

and the rejection of it causes something to snap

In a blind rage Ben lashes out, igniting his saber and attacking Luke, the fight is brief but furious, with Luke winning soundly

(and yes, I did deliberately inject aspects of the Obi-Wan/Anakin relationship and decline into Luke and Ben’s, if Kylo Ren’s story is going to mirror Vader’s so to should his fall)

though this all seems like should be the end of it, in truth this is the beginning of the end, Luke orders Ben to return to his hut to meditate and think on his actions, in a combination of attachment to Ben and an attempt to not act rashly, Luke is not taking this situation as seriously as he should, he’s not seeing Ben as the person who gave into anger and attacked him, Luke is still seeing Ben as his nephew and student

ut now Luke is questioning everything, he fears he has made a mistake, his love for Ben is clouding his mind, and after a little while he heads for the hut Ben stays in hoping to try and resolve this

But what has happened with Ben since the fight?

Well he is mad, he’s stewing in rage, dark murderous thoughts flow freely, self control is out the window, he’s not over the edge quite yet, but its enough for Snoke/Palpatine to use to create a disaster, they cultivate these dark thoughts, amplify them, even in Ben’s dreams knowing it will just take one wrong person in the wrong place and wrong time to set everything off

And thus, as Luke enters the hut hoping to speak with Ben and resolve things, he’s hit by darkness in Ben’s mind (Snoke/Palpatine probably took care to make sure that Luke was able to see such), and those thoughts, in tandem with Ben’s growing violent behavior and the fight just a few hours earlier, Luke seriously considers the unthinkable...

And from this change in context, Luke contemplating killing his nephew as we seen in the TLJ flashback is less out of the blue and instead shows that this is the culmination of a low point in the relationship

Of course, all of this wouldn’t exactly fit in a single movie’s runtime, but it just goes to show what disney should be doing with the sequels, expanding on the context to help improve them

I had a few other ideas but they’re not really about the Luke/Ben relationship, more just ideas for “if this was a show”, stuff like ongoing plots, arcs, other characters, etc

[darklinaforever]

It kills me that the nostalgia that makes part of the Star Wars fandom idealize the Jedi and refuse to see them as flawed and corrupt in their system is so powerful. Just look at the critical receptions from some viewers to The Last Jedi, and now The Acolyte. It's amazing that these idiots didn't learn from their mistakes and reproduced the same pattern of criticism on the show. Idealization of past figures due to nostalgia, therefore refusing a more nuanced or even negative treatment which is objectively true (with Luke, therefore the Jedi and again the Jedi in The Acolyte), misogyny (against any female characters present / with It matters even more if the main protagonist is therefore a woman) racist (against any character who is not white, and even worse when it comes this time to the two main protagonists of the story) and anti romance (against Reylo and Oshamir, while Wtf Anakin and Padme, Han & Leia, Hera & Kanan, Jyn & Cassian or even Revan & Bastilla from the Legend extended universe ?) on the program !

[kylo-skywalkerr]

I know a lot of the SW comics aren't canon, Dark Empire especially since Boba's alive in a different way + many more details, but Kylo's backstory makes a lot more sense with this particular set of comics.

One thing I feel like the sequels didn't get right was that it didn't show enough about the corruption of Ben Solo. About why Leia and Luke sensed something awful within young Ben. You can't tell me Luke would look at a 6 year old boy and see him as irredeemable when Vader was in his perspective.

With comic context, it makes more sense. Here's the exchange between Leia and Palpatine when he tries to claim her as an apprentice due to her more upfront and occasionally aggressive way of handling things:

(Side note: The line about him being able to enter one of his clones additionally justifies Snoke's existence.)

With this context, it makes sense that Ben's family would sense something very wrong with him. Palpatine is an irredeemable evil, simply corrupt because he eroded himself until there was nothing left but that evil. Luke, in a moment of fear, was going to end Ben Solo's life to stop the growing evil that was within him. Another thing it explains is why he always heard Palpatine's voice in his head. It was Ben's mind, but he was not alone. Palpatine tormented another Skywalker boy until he had him running into his arms once more, this time using Snoke.

These comics were released in 1991. In fact, while researching this, I found out that this comic was potentially an inspiration for the sequels, which makes this even more disappointing. These comics were great. They set up a great potential, but they run into the issue of execution.

The sequels had great ideas and characters to explore, but expecting the audience to simply know where your story is coming from is a bit dumb. This is the meat they should have shown in TFA, not throwing us into the halfway point of a story where everyone's favorite characters are plucked off one by one.

Yet I still very much enjoy the flavor that this adds to the life of young Ben Solo, who never had a damn chance from the moment he was conceived. For the love of god, someone get this wretched old man away from this poor family.