#I don’t hate Kawoshin but its stans are a different story

[autistic-ben-tennyson]

After getting involved in some NGE shipping discourse, I think there needs to be a discussion about the difference between anime with yaoi or yuri in it vs western shows that are meant to have lgbtq rep like SU, TOH or She-Ra. NGE can certainly be read as queer but it’s not the only interpretation one can have and Kaworu was created as a shadow archetype, not because they wanted to make a gay show. It’s not necessarily queer erasure for one to prefer to ship Shinji with Asuka or Rei. There are homophobic dudebros who dismiss Kawoshin but a lot of fans who prefer m/f ships are queer too and it’s not self hating to dislike the popular yaoi ship.

Japan has different views on queerness than the west. There’s less religious opposition to it and there aren’t One Million Moms groups starting moral panics over something like PMMM or Utena having yuri in it. Much of the homophobia in Japan stems from their views on conformity, hence why they think it’s okay to show youth in a sapphic relationship in anime but believe they must grow out of it and have a traditional marriage. Gay marriage is still banned and the government is fairly conservative. Japan has a complicated view of homosexuality and anime having gay characters is not necessarily for the same reason as western cartoons doing so.

[autistic-ben-tennyson]

I barely like/reblog any posts tagged Kawoshin because the last time I did, one hardcore stan went on my Shinji/Rei posts to preach about incest and told me not to touch his posts when he didn’t have a DNI or any warnings on his post as well as claim Rei had no personality.

[autistic-ben-tennyson]

Ok, @enkxd99, I am going to pick apart every single one of your points. You guys who complain about people you disagree with liking even one of your post when you didn’t have a DNI, which most don’t even read, and I didn’t see your tags at first since your post popped up on my dash. If you don’t want Shinji/Rei shippers touching your posts, either make that clear or accept you’ll have to interact with people with different opinions.

First, “Rei has no personality” is one of the most shallow ways of looking at her character. Reading her that way is based solely off of how Ritsuko and Asuka see her. She’s a very subtle person but she’s not blank, she’s sad, pessimistic and straightforward. Viewing her as a blank doll ignores her whole arc about personhood. Here’s a long essay about Rei’s character and her personality who says it better than I ever could.

As for your other point, no their relationship is not “family-like”. Again, it comes down to Rei being a subtle character and it being easy to attach labels to her. I’m going to leave this quote from another pro Shinji/Rei fan here:

“Reishin is sort of a litmus test for how you perceive the intricacies of relationships. If you’re a literal person you might be caught up on the implied familial connection, to the exclusion of any other interpretation of her and Shinji’s dynamic.”

Just because the narrative foreshadows something doesn’t mean the characters think that way. Shinji didn’t tell her she looks like a mother because he thinks she’s Yui but because he’s trying to compliment her. I acknowledged that there was a bit of DNA relation but that does not make me an incest supporter and Reishin is not one of those “incest for incest” sakes ships. Their relationship isn’t built on family ties, they weren’t raised together and don’t have a brother-sister connection. Gendo may have planned to name a potential daughter Rei but she’s not his daughter. Liking problematic fiction isn’t proof of your real morals. The Jaws effect is fake. People hated Sharks for years before that movie, hunting and fearing them for centuries.

So again, you are the one who made a big deal after I liked one of your posts without reading the tags and chose to argue. Reishin is a ship that a lot of people like and if you can’t accept that, then you probably won’t get along with a lot of fans.

@novakaiser03 @aqours you are more knowledgeable about this than me, care to add anything else?

In Defense of Shinji/Rei

Out of all the pairings in the Evangelion fandom, Shinji/Rei is one of the most controversial and least popular, especially here on tumblr. It did have some popularity at one point but that has died down in favor of Kawoshin and Asurei. It’s a ship that I, and many others, feel is often mischaracterized and dismissed due to its more controversial elements but one that is honestly very emotional and deserves less hate in my opinion, as do it’s shippers who people also have a misguided view of. Fandom in general has become more moralistic and puritanical in recent years. It’s like no one learned a thing from the SU fandom discourse where people were bullied or called homophobic for liking a certain pairing over the other.

Argument 1: she’s his mother/sister

The most common criticism of the pairing is that it’s incest and that their relationship is that of a brother-sister or mother-son. First, Rei’s whole arc in the show is that she’s not just a clone or copy of Yui or Lilith. She’s her own person with her own desires which is why her loyalty to Gendo wanes as she becomes more of an individual. Her DNA also isn’t that similar to Shinji and only a small amount of Yui’s was used. The rest was affected by Lilith hence the differences in their appearance. So there is a little bit of blood relation but it’s not on the same level of say Bwen or Pinecest. Incest is terrible because it’s a betrayal of family trust and abuse but Shinji and Rei met as teens and were not raised as siblings, nor did he know of her origin until Ritsuko explained it.

I’ve also seen the argument that their bond is sibling-like or Shinji views her as a Madonna/mother figure. Anno has stated that he intended there to be a “love triangle” with the pilot trio and show’s proposal described Rei as having “learned about feelings when she fell in love”. While that info comes from Reddit and may not be reliable, it does challenge the idea that there was no intention for their dynamic to be romantic.

Next, antis really take that elevator scene out of context where Shinji was complimenting her on being like a mom while ignoring him telling her she’d make a good housewife. The rebuilds and manga make their connection more blatant but it was always there. Misato, Toji and Kensuke all tease Shinji about his crush and the two act as friends after warming up despite their icy first interactions. There may be some maternal aspects to it but it’s rather simplistic to dumb their bond down to a family connection. It seems antis argue that they’re siblings because the romantic implications are uncomfortable and antis don’t want to admit that they do have feelings for each other.

Argument 2: it’s misogynistic and queer erasure

Okay, this is a less common argument against it but one I’ve seen from popular Eva analysis writers that view Kawoshin as the only valid pairing for Shinji. I’ve seen it used against Asushin and Marishin too. This goes hand and hand with the idea that Shinji views Rei as a Madonna and is misogynistic. I have a lot of thoughts about the “Shinji is an incel misogynist and Asuka did nothing wrong” discourse but that’s for another day. He’s not a perfect uwu soft boy but fans seem to base his entire characterization off the hospital scene in rather single issue Eva analyses that cherry-pick certain scenes or dialogue.

The argument that it’s queer erasure is one I’m starting to despise. Yes, there are homophobic dudebro fans who hate Kawoshin but not everyone who prefers a “straight” pairing is anti gay. Shinji could still be bisexual and be in a m/f relationship. I’ve also seen some ship him in a polycule with Rei and Kaworu. Plus, not everyone has to interpret the show or character the same way. The writers made it so people can view Kawoshin as romantic and Shinji as queer, but never demanded that be the only possible interpretation.

This kind reminds me of something I’ve occasionally seen in the Ben 10 fandom too. A few fans, not all of them, treating the wholesome gay ship as the only good pairing because of the problematic elements in the m/f ships or because they view the male protagonist as a misogynist. The “male character is sexist or a bad boyfriend so let’s make him gay” is also a fandom trope that kind of irritates me. Not every ship has be gay or a girlboss romance either.

Argument 3: they’re kids and you can’t ship them

This is one of the least common criticisms but one that I’ve occasionally encountered. First, they’re 14 which is around the time a lot of teens start dating. Second, romance =/= sex and child/teen characters can have romantic feelings for each other. Yes, ship wars over fictional kids can escalate but there’s nothing wrong with just liking a pairing. This post about Chihiro and Haku’s bond from Spirited Away kind of applies here too.

My thoughts: why do I love this pairing?

I first fell in love with this ship because I watched the rebuilds first on Amazon Prime and didn’t know the series was on Netflix because my account, embarrassingly, still has parental controls on it. I know they’re not everyone’s cup of tea but I liked them. Shinji was a character I really connected to and so was Rei. Their relationship got me a bit emotional and the scene where Shinji attempts to save her had me on the edge of my seat, while the scene where Shinji accepts Rei Q got a tear out of me as did the apology scene in 3.0+1.0.

If I had to compare them to any other pairing, which I’ve done before, it would be Hodaka/Hina from Weathering with You which also is a bit divisive and a bit of a tearjerker. Ironically, EoE is one of Makoto Shinkai’s favorites and he considers Anno an inspiration. Everything from their bond to Hodaka’s character and Hina’s arc of a blue haired girl, blackish-blue in Hina’s case, that’s lived a difficult life and who’s only purpose is to be a sacrificial lamb, learning to pray for herself is a lot like Shinji/Rei, down the ending of WWY being a lot like that of 2.22. The scene where Hodaka gives Hina a promise ring is also a little like the “smile” moment from Episode 6/1.11.

Conclusion

In short, Shinji/Rei isn’t a bad pairing and is overhated and misrepresented by many in the fandom. It’s fine to dislike it or prefer another ship but one can do so without chomping at the bit to paint its shippers as homophobes, misogynists or people with incest fetishes or Oedipal complexes. Many of us like it because it’s one of the least toxic relationships in the series and is honestly a very powerful story. Are there some questionable elements in it? Sure, but you can like a ship even if it’s not up to golden moral standards and expecting every pairing to be unproblematic is ridiculous. Real life is much more grey than what moralistic fans claim.