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indecisivemuch · 9 months ago

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Cupids in Converses

Pairing: Luke Castellan x Reader

Summary: Valentine's was rolling up. You and Luke played Cupid on Percy and Annabeth. But what if playing matchmakers gave both you guys and your unspoken feelings the nudge that you guys have always needed? (Fluff, friends to lovers, happy ending)

Warning: sort of cliché, but it's Valentines so.

Note: Valentines got me in the mood of writing something rom-com-ish. Let's just assume Luke wears red converses that looks like Maia in the show. Also, I've been incredibly busy so I kinda rushed through this one to post it on time for Valentines.

Word count: 4.1k (whoops)

February has always filled the air with some sort of sugary chemical. Everything seemed sweeter like a pink filter had been put over the world. Some may dislike the upcoming February holiday, but it was perhaps one of your favorite times of the year.

Why? You were somehow blessed with the skills of getting people together and nudging them just enough to cross the line they needed to. So far, you have managed to help six couples get together. With Valentine’s right around the corner, the urge to play cupid grew to the point it was itching your hands.

“Well, compared to the Chimera on Monday, Medusa on Sunday, could have been a lot worse,” Percy was quickly interrupted by Annabeth.

“Medusa was Saturday.”

“I thought Sunday?”

“No monsters on Sunday. Monday, you died in a river.” You squint your eyes at the conversation that Percy and Annabeth were having. The familiar bells rang in your head; you could practically hear them roaring at you.

“Right, so Medusa on Saturday…”

“Woah, guys, what’s this?” Luke interrupted. “When did you turn into an old married couple?” Percy and Annabeth both grew slightly flustered at the Hermes counselor’s words. Muttering a few things here and there, the two kids quickly excused themselves and walked off from you and Luke just to avoid the topic in general. You slowly turned towards Luke and peered up at him.

“Surely…” you spoke cryptically.

“Surely what?”

“Them!” you gestured to the direction that Percy and Annabeth had headed off to. You kicked a small rock with your Converse and watched it tumble away. “Surely we can give a little nudge?” you trailed off, bumping into Luke’s shoulder.

“You’re not seriously gonna play Cupid on them, right?”

“No, I’m not…because we are,” Luke let out a loud breath, hands on his hips as he peered down at you. However, you could see a glimmer of amusement in his eyes.

“Sweet girl, I adore you, but why not let things run their course?” you hope he did not see the physical reaction over that nickname because, internally, your heart skipped a beat.

“Oh? And you’re telling me those six couples from before would have gotten together without me? You know I’m right about this kind of stuff. I can usually sense it. Besides, it’ll be fun, I promise.”

“What’s in it for me?”

“Uhm…you get to spend time with me?” you decided to answer, grinning up at Luke when he gave you a feigned unimpressed look. “Please, besides, you and Percy are close, so it would help a lot. I already have a plan and I need your help for it.”

One look into your eyes, and Luke knew he was doomed. For some reason, you just can make him do anything you ask. Luke could feel the hands on his hips slowly slipping as he looked into your eyes.

“Fine.”

Stage 1: Get Percy to realize his feelings cause he’s blind as hell

It was midnight and everybody else was asleep except for you and Luke. The two of you were in the kitchen, trying to be as quiet as possible.

The two of you were making some fortune cookies for your plan. However, there was a tiny twist to the treat you two were making. You had personally printed out a couple of prompts that you wrote yourself in hopes they would nudge Percy into realizing his feelings.

“Really?’“Romance is in the air. What you’re looking for is right in front of you’?” Luke read out the small piece of paper that you printed. You pulled the cookies out of the oven when they were ready.

“It’s cliche and sort of obvious, but hey! It’ll work because it’s Percy I’m working with,” you quickly pulled the paper out of his hand to put it in the fortune cookie before folding it into shape and letting it cool down.

“Mhm. He’s gonna realize you’re trying to play cupid.”

“Are we talking about the same person? I doubt Percy would realize. Annabeth would, hence why I’m not trying this on her.”

Luke helped you out with a couple of other spare fortune cookies that you two intended to keep for yourselves.

“Alright, finally done,” you muttered, washing your hands. However, you were caught off guard when Luke dipped his hand in the bag of flour on the counter and smeared some on your cheek. Your mouth hung slightly at this, and you looked up at him challengingly. You wiped your hands with a hand towel, “Oh? Is that how we’re playing it?”

“...No…” Luke sheepishly replied, a grin growing on his face when he saw the look of mischief creeping on your face.

“Game on, Castellan,” with that, you dipped both of your hands in flour and chased after the tall boy, who was sprinting around the counter. You caught up with Luke and compromised by smearing flour onto the back of his shirt first. At your attack, he turned around and smeared some more across your face from your other cheek to the top of your nose. You immediately did it back to him.

“Ok, ok, I surrender,” he coughed in between quiet waves of laughter after you smeared some from his cheek down his neck, marking your last attack.

For a moment, Luke and you stood in silence, but when you two let the state of one another sink in, laughs echoed throughout the room again. Luke was able to stop his laughter first, though he was still wearing a wide grin. He washed the flour off his face and dried it with kitchen tissues as you muttered: “Oh, I wish I had a camera. I could practically blackmail you with that photo.”

“I have no doubt you would have never let me live that down,” while replying, Luke also approached you and started wiping the flour off your nose before moving to your cheeks. Your laughter slowly faded as your cheeks heated at the feeling of his hand on your skin. He was looking at you so tentatively. Callous hands - a reflection of his remarkable title as best swordsman - delicately holding your face as if you were the rarest diamond to exist.

Something about this moment felt so domestic. Luke allowed himself to indulge in the fantasy that this is how it would feel like to be with you and share cute moments like these together. Luke unbeknownstly let out a breath he didn’t know he was keeping in as he made eye contact with you.

However, the moment was interrupted by another camper who yelped upon seeing you two in the kitchen. The presence of another person caused you two to spring apart. “I’m so sorry, I’ll leave,” the camper muttered, clearly abandoning their plan of stealing food and sweets in the middle of the night. Luke coughed to break the silence.

“So what’s the plan after giving it to Percy?” Luke asked, looking down at the fortune cookies before picking one up and munching on it.

“Hopefully, he’ll finally realize his feelings, and when he does…Percy will come to you, for sure.”

Stage 2: Romantic gesture

You were right, Percy came to Luke for dating advice. As you planned, Luke suggested that Percy make a flower crown for Annabeth. Hence, here the Hermes counselor was - with Percy as he picked out flowers for Annabeth.

"I'm gonna need you to guide me on this 'cause I've never made flower crowns before," Percy muttered as he picked out California Poppins, Annabeth's favorite. Luke grinned at this. He found it interesting how the young boy already knew. "Maybe you could make one for someone special too?" Percy said, his voice somewhat unsure.

At the young boy's words, Luke froze. The first person that seemed to pop into his mind when Percy said that was you.

"I mean, might as well, right? It's for Valentine's. Maybe you could give it to someone who means a lot to you and makes you happy?" Percy spoke, though there was something instigative about his tone.

Happy. The word bounced in between the walls of Luke's mind. Once again, the first thing that flashed in his head was you. Then, a surge of images came running from memories of you two. He almost could not remember happiness before you. A warm feeling embedded in his chest as he pictured your smile. Just seeing you happy seemed to do it for him, like you could spread happiness to him by just looking at him. You were like the first glimmer of daylight after a cold night. He subconsciously smiled at that thought.

You have always made him feel loved, even though he knew you were probably doing it platonically. However, he would gladly take any form of love that he could receive from you. Every day, waking up and knowing he had you in his life was good enough for him. Maybe he should try giving you more hints. Maybe you'll finally see it. Perhaps Percy was right with the flower crown idea.

“Uhm, sure,” with that, Luke decided to take some of your favorite flowers into his hand and went to a nearby table, where he started guiding Percy on how to make a flower crown. However, ever so often, his mind would trail to its own thoughts whenever he focused on making this flower crown for you.

Percy watched Luke as the older boy started intensely working on his own flower crown, crafting it with so much care as if it was an artwork intended for a national museum. If Percy didn’t know better, he would think Luke was a perfectionist.

Meanwhile, you were sitting with Annabeth near the ocean where she had previously pushed Percy into the waters, leading to Poseidon claiming him. You asked, “Any plans for Valentine’s Day?”

“No, you?”

“Nope.”

“Oh?” she replied, though you tilted your head at the tone of her voice. “I’m just surprised,” Annabeth explained as she looked out at the ocean instead of at you. “I mean…I thought you and Luke…”

“Huh?—”

“Well, I mean, you two are together all the time, and there seems to be something going on —”

“What do you mea—”

“It always seems like you two would gravitate to one another. I just assumed you two were together already—”

“We’re…just friends,” you settled on saying, though you could hear your heart beating loudly, seemingly echoing near your chest and neck. Of course, you knew you had feelings for Luke. However, you have always ruled it as a silly little crush.

“...You sure? You sound really unsure,” Annabeth challenged, making you sigh.

“I mean, he’s really sweet, and nice…”

“Uh-huh”

“And he makes me laugh all the time…”

“That’s good,” Annabeth’s words echoed as you sunk into silence and started reflecting on who Luke was to you. He has always made you feel cared for. Out of everybody at camp, perhaps he was the one you were most comfortable with, never having to be afraid of being yourself. Almost all of your favorite memories at camp included him in them.

You remember the night you told him about your minor fear of the darkness and how he promised to always protect you in it. In a way, since then, he has become your light. You always felt lit up when he made his way to you. Your eyes are always drawn to him like a moth to its flame. Then, it finally dawned on you how serious your feelings were. You realized how most of the time you seemed to be mindless about the existence of your heart until Luke was around because it was only then that your heart would tug or race to run you breathless. You gulped as your eyes darted around slightly.

“I mean…maybe…” you started but snapped out of your thoughts when you heard Luke’s voice. And there it was again, the silly familiar tug your heart was doing just from his voice. “Hey…” you greeted Luke and Percy before noticing Percy with a flower crown in his hand.

“Annabeth, can I speak to you privately?” Annabeth stood up and gestured for Percy to lead the way, presumably somewhere, so the young boy could give her the flower crown and ask her out on Valentine’s Day. You remained seated, still pondering at your feelings and wondering when they had exponentially grown that much.

“I actually have something for you as well,” you finally looked up at Luke when he said this. You noticed he had his hands behind his back. Something about the way he looked now seemed so shy and timid, which was unlike the outgoing and confident boy you always knew.

Your mouth fell agape when he pulled out a flower crown made of your favorite flower. “Luke…” you said his name and stood up when you saw the item.

However, because your eyes were on his gift, you didn’t notice the way Luke’s breath hitched at the sound of your voice calling out his name. He never thought it was anything special until November two years ago when you said his name while laughing at one of his jokes by the campfire. It was probably a moment you did not remember, but ever since then, he felt so sure that he was named so because the name sounded like it was born just for the sole purpose of being sounded from your lips.

“I made this for you,” he muttered, though it sounded almost like a whisper. His eyes shifted to both of your Converses instead of at you. Something about this made him so nervous as if he was handing you his heart instead of a simple gift. He almost scowled at himself for acting like a boy in kindergarten, confessing to his crush.

If only Luke was looking at you because you were looking at him and the item in awe. Your cheeks flushed from his gesture. Though, you were somewhat glad he was not looking at you because you were sure one look at you right now would tell Luke exactly everything about your feelings. You were a blushing mess. “Luke, thank you so much. This is beautiful. I can’t believe you made one for me.”

You touched Luke’s hand that was holding the crown, and he almost grew an even deeper shade of red. “Put it on my head,” you instructed, and he obliged just like everything else you would ask. He was sure he must have caught a sickness or something for wanting to follow you this blindly. But you were perhaps the only one with the power to get him to do absolutely anything. Just as the crown touched your hair, you peered up at him, and the sight alone made Luke swallow nervously.

You looked breathtaking.

And he meant this literally because Luke felt like he stopped breathing for a second. He could not look away. That was until you wrapped your arms around his waist and hugged him. His arms wrapped around your neck almost immediately to return the hug as if they existed to only hold you.

However, unlike the hundreds of hugs before, this one felt different. It was as if something had shifted and was bound to unfold.

Final Stage: Valentine’s Day

Annabeth had said yes.

You were ecstatic to learn that the young girl had agreed to go on a Valentine’s date with Percy. Even though you didn’t want to intrude, you and Luke decided to just have a peep to see what Percy had planned. You were not planning to stay long. It was just a sort of reward or a way to see your plan grow into fruition. You smiled when you spot the cute picnic date near the shore.

“See, I told you the plan was going to work,” you muttered as you tiptoed up in your converses to peer at the kids through the tall bushes nearby. You almost lost balance and step onto Luke's shoes that were similar to yours, except his was red.

The boy quickly steadied you with his hand on your waist. You muttered a quick thank you before turning back to the kids, trying to ignore the blush that was slowly decorating your cheeks. But you were quickly caught off guard at the sight of Percy and Annabeth pushing a small boat off the shore and hopping on it.

“Uhm…that is not what I expected. Where are they going?” Luke looked over your shoulder when you said that. Your eyes fluttered at his warm breath hitting your neck.

However, you noticed the two kids looking like they were in trouble and panicking as they quickly started rowing away. You turned your head towards Luke, forgetting he was very close to you. Your voice faltered as you were about to utter your next sentence. Noticing this, Luke turned to you, only causing the two of you to come face to face with little distance in between. You gulped and forced yourself not to glance down at his lips, “Do you think they’re okay? Should we follow them? I mean…what if they’re in trouble?”

Seeing the worried look on your face, Luke frowned. He deeply disliked anything that caused that kind of expression on your face. Hence, he decided to go over to the second boat there and started pushing it towards the water. “Come on,” you hopped onto the small boat with him and started rowing after Percy and Annabeth, hoping to help them from whatever trouble they were seeming to have.

After a few minutes of rowing behind them, you saw Percy and Annabeth rowing into a small tunnel. Luke and you quickly followed in, rowing your boat, only to be engulfed by darkness upon entering the tunnel.

The wind blew much harder in there, causing goosebumps on your arm as your hand gripped your oar tightly. To make matters worse, it was your most hated type of darkness - utter pitch black. Even with your eyes adjusted to the darkness, you could see nothing, not even Luke.

You were fine with darkness in familiar places like your cabin, where you knew at least there were other campers around and you were safe. You were also mostly fine with darkness where you could see as your eyes adjusted to it. But here, you were in a tunnel you’ve never been in, where there were possibly monsters that could attack you at any moment.

You were slightly startled by the hand that softly touched yours that, unbeknownst to you, was crushing the wooden oar. You immediately recognize it was Luke’s hand from the warmth and familiar touch. He soothingly ran his thumb across your hand. His actions were proven effective at calming you down when you could feel your grip loosen around the tool.

“Breathe, sweet girl,” his words somehow made you release the breath you were subconsciously holding.

A few seconds later, the lights were turned on. You were met with one of the most beautiful sights you’ve ever seen. Lights were decorating the path throughout the tunnel. There were also plants and trees with extended branches and leaves that softly brushed past the boat Luke and you were on.

Suddenly, you both heard a tune start playing quietly in the background, almost quiet enough to make you two think you were imagining it:

“There you see her, sitting there across the way.

She don’t got a lot to say, but there’s something about her”

His thumb hasn’t stopped rubbing over your knuckles even though the darkness was no longer casting over the both of you. His eyes were absorbing how you looked at that moment, embracing it. You were absolutely stunning and he was hopelessly infatuated with you.

“And you don’t know why, but you’re dying to try

You wanna kiss the girl.”

The lyrics made Luke subconsciously lick his lips as he pictured himself kissing you. Gods, he wondered if his heart would even survive doing so and whether anything would ever surpass getting to kiss you. Your eyes flickered to Luke's lips, and he noticed it. He also noticed how your cheeks flushed as you gulped at his actions.

“Luke.”

“Y/N,” you almost melted at the way Luke was saying your name as if it was an honor or privilege to do so. The tone he used was sweeter than any dessert you have ever had. Gods, it was as if your name was a sacred passage he lived by.

“Yes, you want her

Look at her, you know you do”

Indeed he was looking at you, and it felt almost like he was spellbound because he could not take his eyes off you. Right then, you could see it all - he was utterly smitten. He was giving you a soft smile. The lights decorating the tunnel shimmered in his eyes, illuminating just enough to display his pupils and how they almost completely overtook the usual dark brown color that you love. Before you knew it, he was leaning closer to you on the small boat and you mirrored his action.

“Possible she wants you too, there is one way to ask her…”

Just when Luke was inches from your face, he stopped. His eyes longingly stare at your lips like a long-awaited dream that was within his grasp but not quite within his grip yet. You noticed how he took a deep breath as if mustering all the drops of courage he had. His eyes fluttered shut for a second before he opened them again.

“Can I?” he uttered only two words, but somehow, his voice conveyed enough the yearning coursing through every inch of his body. Luke gulped as he restrained himself from closing the distance and waited for your consent.

You nodded wordlessly.

“It don’t take a word, not a single word

Go on and kiss the girl.”

Almost instantly, he caressed both sides of your face and sealed the deal.

All the glory Luke has gained throughout the years seemed trivial compared to kissing you. It almost convinced him that everything he had gone through to get here today was worth it. He hummed against your lips as you wrapped your arms around his neck, pulling him even closer. Kissing you felt like the best gift he had ever gotten in his entire life. Luke knew he was forever screwed from the way it felt. He could not fathom the idea of his lips ever touching anyone else’s. Maybe they were made for you, but his heart and mind do not seem to oppose that idea.

You slowly slid your arms down, allowing your hands to caress his jawline and the sides of his face. However, your hands slightly jolted at the pace of his heartbeat along the side of his neck. It was as if his heart was trying to break out of his body. Your own heart started replicating the same rhythm. It had you flustered that you had such an effect on him.

Luke broke away from the kiss breathlessly. For a second, he hated the idea of needing air to live because if he could, he would not have stopped showing you how much his lips belonged to you. His forehead leaned against yours while his hands rested on your hips. He looked at you endearingly as if he could not fathom that he just got to kiss you. You smiled at the sight of him.

“I know I’m a tad bit late, but will you be my Valentine?” he sweetly asked.

“Of course, Luke.” Luke grinned at your answer. He drew you in for another kiss as giggles escaped your lips and echoed through the tunnel that now marked an important memory for the two of you.

You truly must be Cupid because your plan not only worked for Percy and Annabeth, but somehow also indirectly gave Luke and you the nudge you both needed.

14th February marked the day when two Cupids wearing Converses got their happy ending.

Bonus:

“I told you that would work,” Annabeth whispered to Percy as the two hopped back onto their boat with a speaker in hand, rowing away hastily to be out of sight from the older couple.

Little did you know, Annabeth had orchestrated the whole thing, including the conversation between her and Percy about their mission in front of Luke and you. Annabeth’s plan of getting Luke and you together through playing cupid together had seemingly worked just like she had planned.

Who said you were the only cupid at Camp Half-Blood?

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theweirdoinurhouse · 7 months ago

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I genuinely have a strong hatred for people who romance Shane then divorce him due to his room. Hi, welcome to my Ted Talk.

It's also not just his room, but also people who say "I thought he got help!" or "It's clashing with my style!" or "I thought I could fix him!" and what not. Like yes, I know this is a video game character, but honestly peoples' reactions to Shane speaks about them as a person.

We don't get him help, he gets it himself. Harvey suggests it, and Shane decides he is. We just help him along the way. We don't "fix him", he fixes himself and we are there to be by his side. And even though he does go see a counselor, that isn't going to fix everything. Honestly those type of people don't know how addictions work make mad. I can't say I know 100%, but I do understand you aren't going to get fixed right away.

I saw this tiktok of someone assuming they were being cheated on by Shane, without seeing the full cut scene. It just shows the absolute mistrust people have in him. And yes, I know he's fictional, but still it speaks about people's true colors.

Stepping away from the alcoholic part, let's talk about the depression part. IT. IS. NOT. EASY. TO. BECOME. UNDEPRESSED! Shane literally tried/wants to kill himself, he isn't going to get out of that mental state easily! I myself struggle with some mild depression. And it isn't easy to just "be happy." OF COURSE his room isn't going to be absolutely 100% perfect! Depression is a serious thing, especially for Shane.

Don't get me started on people with the "His room doesn't match my vibe" mentality. Everyone has an unique room that fits to them. Everyone is complicated (maybe, I don't know much about some of the candidates). Shane is a very complicated person, and his room speaks to that. Sorry that his depression and struggles don't match your cutesy cabin in the woods aesthetic. (That's somewhat sarcastic).

One of my biggest problems is this: You went through ALL his heart events. You know what he's struggled with, and still is struggling with. You stayed with him till marriage. And you divorce him for his ROOM?! I may be overreacting, but people with these mentalites make me mad. If this is how they react to a fictional character with alcoholism and depression,how are they gonna react to someone they might like irl that has these problems?

Anyways I'm a Shane defender for life, fight me.

#sdv shane #stardew valley #shane stardew valley #shane sdv #i will defend him with my life

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linkspooky · 6 months ago

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DOOMED SIBLINGS: THE TODOROKIS VS. THE FIRE NATION ROYAL FAMILY

I received an ask in my inbox about how Zuko doesn't owe Azula any forgiveness. Truthfully I wasn't even going to respond because this isn't an avatar blog, but then I watched this video.

Not only do I disagree with the basically everything in this video, but I am going to make the argument that both Zuko' and Azula's arcs are both incomplete with the way the show left the two of them in the final showdown.

In order to make my argument I'm going to compare Azula and Zuko's relationship in avatar to Shoto and Toya's relationship in My Hero Academia and use the latter as a more positive example.

Unnecessary Redemption Arcs

The common fandom opinion I want to argue against is this idea that Azula's ending is a perfect tragedy, and therefore doesn't need to be expanded upon. There's also a sentiment that redeeming Azula would somehow ruin the impact of this perfect tragedy.

I'm about to argue against both of these points.

Azula's arc doesn't work as a tragedy.

Because of this her arc is unsatisfying and unfinished.

I'm going to address the first bullet point but before that let me add another disclaimer. The reason why I think Azula's arc isn't an effectively written tragedy isn't because I like Azula.

Before we even get into the My Hero Academia comparison let me bring up something completely different. I do like Azula, but I like Terra Markov from Teen Titans a lot more and I would not change a thing about her tragic end.

AZULA'S ARC IS NOT A WELL-WRITTEN TRAGEDY

Terra in the comics is what a lot of people accuse Azula of being. She is stated in the text and by her creators to be an unfeeling sociopath. She was also never intended by her creators to be redeemed.

[About Terra] The very first time we see her, she’s trying to blow up the Statue of Liberty. It’s just that all the fans assumed because we went out of our way to make her cute — but not too cute, with the buck teeth and everything — everyone would assume that she was gonna become good by the end and that was never the case. First thing, we made a promise that day that we would never renege on our view that she’d never become good. It’s sometimes hard to do that with characters you like. You want them to become good or something like that. But we never liked the character enough—because we knew what we were doing with her—we never allowed ourselves to fall for the character. Because that’s bad. That’s bad storytelling. You’re doing what you want as a fan at that particular point, not as the creators. T

Now let me clarify, both creators of New Teen Titans say some nasty things about Terra and don't recognize her sexual abuse, but here's the thing. You don't have to read a story 100% the way the author intended, sometimes the story says one thing and the text says something different.

I am going to use Judas Contract as an example of a story where the character from the start was never intended to be redeemed and why that's a positive in this case.

Terra is a teenage girl, the bastard daughter of the king of Markovia and a random American woman who presumably has had no stable home her entire life because she's working as a mercenary at fifteen. She teams up with a man that is in his mid fifties and even starts a sexual relationship with him (this is statutory rape she cannot consent) and Deathstroke uses her to infiltrate the Teen Titans and learn as much as possible.

Terra is sent to live with the team and spy on them for several months. The whole time she only ever engages with them in a fake spunky persona, and never shows her real cutthroat self. She leads Beast Boy on in a fake romance to make him trust her and secure her place on the team. The way you'd usually expect this arc to go is that Terra would grow fond of the team and be torn in her loyalties.

Yeah, that never happens.

Terra loathes the Titans. In fact she's developed a superiority complex about her meta human abilities and she doesn't understand why anyone would use their powers to help others. She despises the concept of superheroes in general, and because of that never bonds with any of the Titans. Her feelings never change from start to finish, because her creators intentionally wrote her as a character that can't be redeemed.

Terra is written to be a psychopath, but even with that intention in mind there are scene that shows a greater range of emotions. She has what could amount to a trauma flashback when Beast Boy too aggressively flirts with her and tries to kiss her and she reacts violently, trying to bury him under the earth.

Let's go ahead and interpret Terra as what is used as the fictional definition of a "sociopath" that is someone who feels no bonds with other people, someone with shallow emotions and someone devoid of guilt. Even if we interpret her that way, her story is still meant to be read as a tragedy.

Terra succeeds in her mission of infiltrating the Titans. Slade captures most of them, and the only remaining member Dick Grayson goes missing. Dick Grayson then unites with Slade's son Jericho, and the two of them team up in order to rescue the rest of their friends.

Even after all she's done the Titans try to make pleas to Terra during the final battle, which she not only rejects but responds to with violence. Which only confirms what I said above, Terra never grew to love them, she never regretted her actions, she only ever engaged with them with lies.

(Terra always lies, Terra always lies, Terra always lies).

Terra is declared by Raven to be devoid of emotions: "Her thinking is unlike ours. She feels no true love or hate. Her soul is corrupt. What she does is done without remorse."

Even after Raven declares this, however she still pleads with Terra to stop because she's going to hurt herself. Terra feels Slade betrayed her because he favored his son Jericho over her, so she decides to take both Slade and the Titans down. As the Titans fight her she begins to mentally fall apart ignoring their appeals to her and lashing out at everything around her. Eventually she makes one last attempt to everything around her, but the Titans escape and she only manages to bury herself.

At no point in the fight do the Titans give up on trying to reach her even as she's loudly screaming how much she hates them. Even after she's buried and it looks like she's dead, Gar and Donna both try desperately to dig her up on the slim hope she's still alive. When they find the body they even give her a funeral afterwards, even though they all think that Terra was beyond redemption.

Even the prose narration that accompanies her death is incredibly melancholy and bemoans her fate, at the same time as it calls her a outright sociopath.

There's no reasoning with her now. However slim, whatever sanity Tara Markov possessed is gone. Now there is only primal hatred! Hatred born, nurtured, and fanned. Hatred that festers and grows without care, without feeling, without plan. her pursed lips part and the sounds which echoes force are garbled and inhuman. Hot, boiling blood gushes wildly from the earth's open wounds, its skin fractures and cracks, and if a world could cry, it surely would. Her name is Tara Markov and she is little more than sxiteen years old, and due to the fault of no one but herself she is insane. No one taught her to hate, yet she hates without cause, without reason. No one taught her to destroy, yet she destroys with glee, with relish. Don't look for reasons which do not exist, plainly Tara Markov is what she is, and she has taken a great power and made it as corrupt as she. Hers was the power over the earth itself she could have brought life to deserts, hat to the frozen tundra, food to sraving millions. She could have damned raging rivers, and tunneled water to packed lands dry and dead. her powers were limited only by the mind which controlled them. A mind which sought not hope, not love, not life, but death.

If you go with the text that she is just a sociopath beyond redemption who hates and hates and hates for no reason, the narrative still mourns her because a sixteen year old with her whole life ahead of being consumed by hatred and then dying because of it is in fact sad.

If you read into the subtext then you can argue that the events of the story, contradicts what the narration is telling us. Terra is being sexually groomed and groomed as a child soldier by a man who is much older than her, even if she thinks he's a partner he clearly has all power in the relationship.

If you think about it that way then Terra is the ultimate bad victim. She doesn't cry and call for help as a victim of sexual abuse, instead she tries to claim power for herself, she manipulates, and she destroys any chance she had for a genuine relationship because she only sees all relationships as transactions she can gain or lose from.

Even if you only go with the first interpretation, the narrative still remains tragic because the Titans themselves did not want to give up on her, they did not want to watch this sixteen-year-old girl destroy herself. They never stop reaching out for her and it doesn't work, because there was no way out for Terra but death.

Here's the thing I don't think Terra's status as a sexual victim automatically means an ending where she dies is offensive. It reflects a reality that victims like Terra often go unseen because they don't present their victimhood in palatable ways, and by the time anyone notices it's far too late. Sometimes tragedies are meant to reflect a reality where many people do not get saved.

There's two reasons that Judas Contract works as a tragic story. Number one the creators planned Terra's ending right from the beginning. Which meant they never gave her any moment where she shows that she's redeemable. There's no genuine bond between her and the titans, no wrestling with the guilt of her actions, nothing.

Number two, Judas Contract is Terra's story from beginning to end. It begins with her betrayal of the Titans, and ends with her death. The death is also brought upon herself by her fatal flaw her hatred, which is what makes her the protagonist of a tragedy. Tragedies are stories where heroes are undone by their flaws. Terra also goes out on her own terms. She buries herself underneath her own rocks. Her death is a direct consequence of her inability to let go of her hatred. Terra's not fridged for anybody else's arc, she retains her agency until the exact moment of her death.

To simplify into bullet points, Judas Contract works because:

The creators thought out what they wanted to do with Terra.

Judas contract is Terra's story.

Now, getting to the part where we actually talk about Avatar, and I start complaining about that awful, awful video.

AZULA'S ARC IS NOT WELL THOUGHT OUT

I just went on a long tangent on how Terra, a character written to have no redeemable qualities can still be tragic. How the creators marked her as clearly doomed from the start, and how she brought about her end on herself, how there no redemption for Terra. How this girl had no real chance, and how regardless of the fact Terra is a lil baby sociopath her fall is still tragic because of how well structured the tragedy is surrounding her.

It's awful to kill off a sixteen year old victim of sexual abuse, but the ending just fits because Terra represents a certain type of bad, unsympathetic victim who doesn't get saved.

Azula's arc isn't as well structured. The ending does not fit. I'm going to start by refuting some points in the awful, awful video I did not like.

"Maybe it's okay if Azula's story ends where it does in the series we would separate how we would treat a real 14-year-old girl from a villain in a series, ad that's why any redemption arc isn't need i a story after all. A character needs of deserves a redemption arc when it becomes the most meaningful way to explore their character and place in the story, but a character deserving redemption usually comes before the story really needing it, and I don't think Azula's done anything to deserve it yet. They've got to exhibit some willingness and action to change..."

So the main reason I'm using Terra as my first example is because Terra is the kind of character that Hello Future Me is describing. Terra was written with the specific intention she'd never experience a change of heart, all of the friendships she makes with the Titans are fake, she very loudly experiences no remorse, or even self-reflection over what she is. Terra's pretty proudly a monster and she never experiences any kind of self-doubt or regret over what she's become.

I can disprove right away Hello Future Me's blanket statement (with no actual cited examples, just trust him guys) that Azula never did anything to hint she may deserve redemption. That suggests Azula is an entirely selfish character who uses, manipulates and thinks she's right and worst of all is comfortable being the way she is, and therefore incapable of doing the self-reflection necessary for change.

Azula does show the capacity to do selfless actions several times in the narrative, and even consider the feelings of others. There's the apology scene with Ty Lee and the way she interacts with her friends in general with the Beach where when she's not fighting in a war or trying to complete a mission for her father Azula 1) interacts with her friends in a normal way and 2) seems to express a desire to experience normal relationships not the hierarchical ones she's experienced all of her life.

However, that's not the example I'm going to use as her save the cat moment. I generally intend to interpret that as a sign that even though she treats Mai and Ty Lee as subordinates and that power she holds over them eventually leads to them leaving her, their friendship isn't just Azula abusing them and lording her authority over their heads 24/7.

No, Azula's save the cat moments all revolve around Zuko. Which is funny, because the entire fandom seems to regard Azula as Zuko's evil little sister who exists to do nothing but torment her.

The first and biggest is Azula deciding to bring Zuko home in Ba Sing Se, and telling a lie to her father that he was the one to slay the avatar.

Ozai: I am proud of you, Prince Zuko. I am proud because you and your sister conquered Ba Sing Se. I am proud because when your loyalty was tested by your treacherous uncle, you did the right thing and captured the traitor. And I am proudest of all of your most legendary accomplishment: you slayed the Avatar.

Zuko: [Shocked.] What did you hear? Ozai: Azula told me everything. She said she was amazed and impressed at your power and ferocity at the moment of truth. [Inspired partly by this post]

Now the show seems to regard this action as Azula being an evil temptress who is there to tempt Zuko back to her side with everything he thinks he ever wanted.

That's only if you regard it from Zuko's perspective.

Think for a moment from Azula's perspective. Number one, Azula is someone thoroughly indoctrinated into Fire Nation propaganda who measures her self-worth based on 1) military achievement and 2) her father's approval and assessment of her talents. In Azula's own logic (wrongheaded as it is) she's helping Zuko. She's bringing him back home with his place in the line of succession restored and his father's approval.

Azula doesn't benefit from this gesture at all, in fact if her father discovers the lie she has as much to lose as Zuko does.

Now Zuko insinuates that Azula only brought Zuko along and told her father that he was the one who killed the avatar so she could let him take the fall if the avatar turned out to be alive.

However, if you look at the actual order of events that doesn't make sense. Azula saw the avatar die, she didn't know about the spirit water, and therefore had no way of knowing Aang could come back. In fact, it's Zuko who 1) knew about the spirit water and 2) decides to keep the spirit water and the fact the avatar might have survived a secret that is throwing Azula under the bus. After all she has as much to lose as he did and instead of sharing that information with her he decides to keep it all to himself.

Now Azula does imply that if the avatar were to turn out to be alive all of Zuko's glory would dry up, but this is only after Zuko 1) throws accusations at her and 2) makes it's pretty clear he's lying to her putting her on the defensive.

This is also a scenario where Azula doesn't have much to gain by bringing Zuko back, if you look at it from her perspective. If Azula just lets Zuko rot in a ba sing se prison, then her claim to the throne is secure. With Zuko back he's restored in the line of succession. She also, when making the decision to invite Zuko to her side probably didn't need him for her plan to succeed.

There is a dramatic moment of Zuko choosing to side with Azula over Katara which turns the tide in Azula's favor, but Azula can't see into the future and therefore wouldn't be able to predict that happening. If you look at it from Azula's perspective she 1) successfully infiltrated the city, 2) already had the Dai Lee in her pocket. She likely already thought she had the city secure at this point so her decision to extend a hand out to Zuko is therefore likely motivated by selflessness instead of self-interest.

That's important because usually when Azula usually only gives her help to others if it also benefits her in some way. Azula might genuinely see her recruiting Mai and Ty Lee to her side as a member of the royal family extending her favor and giving them status and security in their positions but it has the underlying motivation of 1) she keeps them in a position to beneath her and therefore in her complete control.

Azula will interact with Mai and Ty Lee like friends on the surface, as long she maintains control over them, but if they do anything to something that displeases her she'll do anything to regain her control.

Mai: I thought you ran off and joined the circus. You said it was your calling. Ty Lee: Well, Azula called harder.

This is set up in Azula's very first interaction with Ty Lee. Azula greets her like an old friends, Ty Lee even seems happy to see her, but the second Ty Lee tries to say no to her Azula goes to extreme lengths to "persuade her". Azula's friendship with Mai and Ty Lee is an abusive friendship because there is a power differential and even if Azula feels genuine affection for them both it's clear they're not allowed to say no. Mai and Ty Lee are put into positions where it's in their best interest to please her, and live in fear of the consequences if they don't do just that.

Here's the thing, I'm not arguing that Azula didn't deserve any consequences for her actions. I'm arguing that the setup doesn't match her eventual ending. Azula is set up to have Mai and Ty Lee leave her from the very first scene that Azula interacts with Ty Lee. It's satisfying because the set up matches the pay off.

It's also tragic because it's Azula continuing the chain of abuse. The video isn't entirely wrong (which is why they came to the wrong conclusion frustrating).

Azula's fall is about how differenting parenting styles can a child. Ozai's affection is exchanged for being useful. Something Azula would go on to repeat with her friends, whereas Iroh's affection is something freely given with patience for imperfections and failures, something Zuko goes then on to repeat.

It's like... there it is it's so close. Here's the thing, Azula is set up for a tragic falling out with Mai and Ty Lee (and one she deserves) but the set up is different with Zuko. Azula's save the cat moment revolves around Zuko, and her genuine attempt to bring her brother home.

Yes, the first time Azula interacts with Zuko in season 2, she tries to take him home by force. However, by the ending of the season Azula's perspective on the matter has obviously changed because she begins by trying to bring him back as a prisoner, and by the end of the season invites him back as an equal.

There's no moment in Season 3 where Azula treats Zuko the way she does Mai and Ty Lee (unless Zuko provokes it first and puts her on the defensive) in fact most of her interactions are either them interacting normally (such as when Azula goes to find Zuko at their old beach house because she knows he'll be there and advises he leave instead of dwelling on their depressing memories) or Azula deliberately trying to look out for Zuko such as when she advises him not to go visiting with Uncle because it'll make others suspicious.

On the other hand, Zuko never at any point looks out for his sister the way Azula is demonstrated looking out for him. He doesn't say, try to tell her where he's going on the Day of Black Sun, or try to convince her the fire nation is wrong. There's a scene in the later part of Season 3 where Zuko is watching Azula fall to her death while sitting on a flying bison and not only sits there and does nothing about it, but sounds disappointed when she doesn't hit the ground and become an Azula Pancake.

That's pretty much the opposite of a save the cat moment. It's a "let the cat fall to their death" kind of moment.

Yes they were enemies at that point, but Zuko's the one who's supposed to learn that affection is something freely given with patience for imperfections and failures, something Zuko goes then on to repeat.

How exactly is he doing that in this scene?

The thing is... this setup doesn't have to be bad. Of course Zuko has trouble has trouble empathizing with Azula, he doesn't even think about sending a letter to Mai, Zuko's shown at this point to be like a healing abuse victim who's understandably focused on himself.

This in fact could be excellent set up with step 1) learning what genuine love and forgiveness is and 2) demonstrating those two things by applying it to others.

However, that's not where we got. We got Zuko watching his sister have a complete emotional breakdown, crying and screaming while chained to a grate and looking somewhat sad.

And once again to bring Terra into this, Terra is what Stay at Home and parts of fandom argue that Azula is. Terra screams at the top of her lungs how much she hates the Titans, how much she was always lying to them, and the Titans STILL try to reach Terra with words, try to de-escalate the conflict, when she's about to bring the rocks falling down on herself warn her she's going to hurt herself, and then when she's buried under rubble try to dig her out begging for her too still be alive.

Terra who's intentionally created by her writers to be as hatable as possible, is shown more compassion by the heroes in her ending than Zuko ever does to Azula. They also give Terra multiple opportunities to change until literally the very last minute, which Zuko doesn't do either.

What's set up is Azula has this save the cat moment with her brother, that Zuko is pretty much the only person she doesn't treat like a subordinate in the story (because she just like Zuko has a craving for familial love she tries to earn from her father). However, her ending with Zuko just taking her down doesn't fit that setup.

Azula's ending only fits if you consider her arc entirely from Zuko's perspective, which is the underlying issue. Azula's not the protagonist of her own tragedy, she's a plot object that's used to benefit Zuko's arc.

Azula's is written to have a downfall, the same way that Zuko loses everything at the ending of season 1 b/c of his inability to give up on the obsessive search for the avatar (and his father's love with it). Azula is written to be left by Mai and Ty Lee (this is the strongest point of writing when it comes to her since it comes from the beginning).

However, she's not written to be left completely alone and insane with the only empathy being shown is that her brother looks kinda sorta sad. That's only good if you view her as an object to further Zuko's arc, because isn't the ultimate culmination of Zuko beating his sister who has always been ahead of him at life? Azula needs to torn down completely without even some small glimpse of a hope of recovery so Zuko can be built up even moreor at least the writers of avatar seem to think so.

However, even Azula just existing for Zuko's growth and character development doesn't have to necessarily be a bad thing. This is where we get to MHA, which does the tragic siblings and the final Ag Ni Kai about 1000 times better with Shoto and Dabi.

THE GOOD

The comparisons between Shoto and Dabi to Zuko and Azula are made pretty often by the fandom. Shoto has a scar, Dabi has blue flames. Shoto has an arc about healing and learning what it means to be a hero, Dabi's arc is about self-destruction.

Dabi's not the center of his own story, he exists to foil Shoto and help Shoto reach the endpoint of his character development however that's not necessarily a bad thing. These are both two pairs of tragic siblings, the main difference is that MHA doesn't feel the need to tear down one sibling in order to build up the other. In fact, the final step to Shoto's arc is HELPING Dabi, not PUTTING HIM DOWN.

Not only that but the decision to help Dabi is a decision that Shoto makes on his own, and him going against the tide of a society that has already given up on Dabi and would much rather have Shoto shoot Dabi like a mad dog. Which makes the decision to do so even more powerful and emblematic of Shoto's growth.

Now you could say that Shoto and Zuko are too different to compare their arcs, Zuko has a redemption arc, and Shoto has what most people would probably term a healing arc. Shoto starts out the series as a hero.

However, this is what annoys me about the redemption arc debate. A redemption arc is really just a normal character arc. However, calling it redemption drags things like morality and forgiveness into the debate. if you take remove the discussion about moral philosophy both Zuko and Shoto have character arcs where they start the story defined entirely by their home situations and their father's abuse (hence why they have big obvious scars on their face), recover from their trauma, and go on to find an identity outside of their father and form healthy non-abusive connections with others.

In fact I'd see the theme of both arcs are the same, to literally find balance within themselves. Shoto is divided quite literally into right and left sides, fire and ice, and even seems to view himself as half of his father and half of his mother. Zuko is someone who's permanently marked and dishonored by the burn scar on his face. He suffers from an internal imbalance as well. Iroh says that Zuko is the descendant of both Roku and Sozin and therefore both pathways are open to him (but wouldn't that apply to Azula too). Zuko says to his father that the fire nation has destroyed the balance to the world and he's going to leave to assist the avatar in order to fix it.

Shoto's balance isn't just about fixing his internal trauma though, it's also about finding a balance between his family which has defined his entire life up until this point, and his desire to become his own hero not the hero his father groomed him into.

It's why the culmination of his arc is Shoto reaching out to save his family member Toya, because it's the ultimate balance in wanting to heal his family, and also the kind of hero he wants to be, someone who saves and brings peace to others instead of just violently putting down villains. He can bring peace to his family and become his own hero in one action.

However, let's go back to the beginning of Shoto's arc, because saving Toya as an endpoint to his arc is set up pretty early on.

Shoto's arc begins with Deku, a stranger breaking down Shoto's walls as an outsider in order to allow him to look past his own trauma and recall for the first time what he wanted outside of his resentment towards his father. This sets up the idea early on for Shoto that sometimes you need outside interference, help you didn't ask for, especially when you can't see outside of your own problems.

What Deku brings about ultimately is a change of perspective, Shoto's so hurt by the memory of his mother throwing boiling water in his face and everything that came after that he can't recall the memory of her telling him he could be who he wanted to be.

But, you want to be a hero right?

Shoto takes away two things from this arc, sometimes you need help even when you're not asking for it, and sometimes a change in respective is required in order to take the first step forward.

He goes to demonstrate these things multiple times, but here's two exaamples. The first Shoto demonstrates immediately after the tournament arc. When Iida is about to go down a dark path and commit a revenge killing on Stain. When, as a result of that IIDA is paralyzed and about to die in an alleyway, it's Shoto who both notices Midoriya and Iida are missing and shows up in the clutch. He's practicing the same thing that Deku taught him in the last arc: Giving help that's not asked for is what makes a true hero.

He even mentions the second idea, that a small change in perspective can be all it takes to save someone, and he wants to do for Iida hat Deku did for him. His words are the one who convinces Iida to stand back up again when he's paralyzed.

If you wanna stop this, then stand up. Because I've got one thing to say to you. Never forget who you want to become!

However Shoto's arc doesn't end here, because one of the major conflicts in MHA is that heroes don't pick and choose who to save and a true hero will give help even to those people who don't ask for it.

This is a point which further develops when Shoto's abusive father starts to show a change of heart at the end of the Pro Hero Arc. Shoto still holds his father accountable for what he did in the past, but he also acknowledges that if he had the capacity to change then so does Enji. This isn't about whether or not Enji is forgivable, this is an extension of what Shoto learned. Shoto originally believed he was controlled by the circumstances of his birth, that his fate was set in stone, but a change in perspective allows him to realize he can determine who he wants to be. So, Shoto is just applying what he's learned, Enji has the capacity to grow.

There's one final piece of setup that I want to cover before showing how these separate dies all culminate in saving Dabi. Shoto's not only someone who has to find balance between his family and his desire to be a hero.

The theme of balance is written into the quirk itself. Enji basically practiced eugenics to create Shoto as his masterpiece. He noticed a flaw in his own quirk where he could only make his flames so hot without overheating. So he arranged a quirk marriage with Rei who possessed an ice quirk to create a hybrid ice and fire quirk that he could use to cool himself off to prevent him from overheating.

Enji only ever cared about the fire half of Shoto's quirk. His ice quirk only exists for his flames to grow stronger. This is shown when Enji is trying to force Shoto to learn all of his signature moves, because he only cares about Shoto's flame quirk. Shoto was created to carry on his father's legacy, and surpass him with an even more powerful flame quirk. Part of his character development is him learning how to use his quirk in his own way.

This is a theme that continues in the class training arc where Enji is still repeating the behavior of trying to force Shoto to learn his signature moves instead of considering what he wants at all, because still Shoto only exists in Enji's mind to carry on his legacy.

This all culminates in Toya's decision to save his brother. The first is his action in choosing to identify with his brother. If Shoto believes in his own capacity to change, and even his father's, then why would he deny Toya that same chance to change?

The foiling between Shoto and Toya isn't supposed to reduce the two of them to "Shoto is the good one, and he's the bad one", but instead Shoto and Toya were both in a point where they were consumed by hatred and couldn't see any other path in life. Therefore if Shoto was able to change because someone gave him help when he didn't ask for it, then Toya not only has the capacity to change - but in order for Shoto to stick to his stated beliefs that the smallest of things can bring about a change in people he has to be the one to give his brother that chance to change.

It's not about whether Dabi is worthy or not, it's about the themes in Shoto's arc finally being paid off.

Shoto's identifying with Toya, and even parts where he tells Bakugo he'll make Toya sit down and make Toya tell him his favorite food indicate that from the beginning Shoto's intention was to find a way to stop Toya without killing him (which is what several of the adult heroes were encouraging him to do).

@stillness-in-green does a more succinct summary of this plan.

Just me?

Because, like, Shouto had a plan. He spent the time between the two war arcs specifically developing a brand-new combat technique that he planned to use to shut down Dabi's combat advantage without killing him. He convinced his dad not to change the plan like Endeavor was hesitantly sounding him out about[1]; he went out and talked and asked questions, and even if they weren't the right words every single time, he did his best and he did it with intention. If Dabi proves to be dead, it won't be because of anything Shouto did to him; it'll be because Dabi himself chose to stand back up, take a warp gate across the country, pick a fight with the guy who doesn't have the power set to shut him down without unduly hurting him, and trying to replicate an Ultimate Move specifically tailored for someone with a balanced power set Dabi doesn't have. And if Dabi lives, it's still going to be because Shouto booked it across the country and used that same technique to stop him again.

Shoto's decision to save Shoto is also a continuation of his decision to help save Iida from Stain. It's not enough for Shoto to experience a change of heart about his own life, he's got to take what he learned about people's capacity to change, and the importance of connections and then put that into practice and help others the way he was helped.

However, it also further develops the theme of giving help that's not ask for from Iida because Shoto's not saving a mostly heroic kid, he's saving Toya to help break a familial cycle of abuse (because murdering the abuse victim isn't how you end the cycle of abuse... actually).

Shoto's last lines to Dabi are also a refutation of this idea of destiny that he once thought he was ruled by. It's once again, Shoto teaching someone else the lesson he learned. Toya says a warped rail can never mingle with a straight and narrow one! In other words Shoto can never understand or get along with Dabi, because Dabi will forever be defined as the failure because of the circumstances of his brith, whereas Shoto will always be the success.

His final action is a decision to break the cycle they were born into: no, we're gonna mingle whether you like it or not.

Shoto's ultimate move Phosphor is not only a move he designed far in advance to take down Dabi non-lethally, it also is a rejection of his father's teaching method. Toya says he only ever taught me how to turn up the heat. Enji only valued both Shoto and Toya for their flame quirks. Developing his own quirk and breaking away from what his father wanted, specifically in order to save his brother. It's Shoto rejecting what his father created both of them for (a successor to his quirk) and finding his own path. By using that move to take down Dabi he's not only teaching Dabi their flame exists for more than just destruction, he's also by letting Dabi live giving Dabi a chance.

From a conversation with @class1akids

Dabi was the last push to unlock Shoto’s full power. Until then he was on the track of mastering flashfire like Endeavor planned for him (except for his own reasons) but realising the fighting Dabi with fire was gonna kill them both and also he’s simply no match fire only helped Shoto to fully take control of what his quirk is Like his quirk development goes parallel with how he faces each member of his family and finally meeting Toya is like the last piece of his puzzle to find his own full power and identity.

It's not just Shoto decides to save his brother because he's just that nice, his arc is literally incomplete without it. The act of creating phosphor a move specifically to save Dabi is both him unlocking the full power of his quirk (by balancing the fire and ice sides of his quirk) but also achieving balance between trying not to leave his family behind while at the same time becoming his own person and hero outside of his family circumstances.

Citing my conversation with class1akids again:

Toya is endangering everyone at Gunga. Endeavor has no means to stop him and when he tries to murder suicide Rei interrupts and his “hero way out” is taken. All he can do is watch helplessly as his family is about to burn to death with a bunch of strangers he tried to protect. But it would do Shoto dirty to use his heart technique to kill his family and the strangers so he comes in a clutch and I see that confrontation as the power trauma vs the power of healing in the family. With Shoto who is a true hero, they can put the fire out and save the family and strangertoo. Shoto become a balanced hero and bring relief and reassurance, Endeavor was completely helpless, and Toyas inner child got the attention he wanted, plus depending on how you read it, he may have become less suicidal.

Shoto also, and I want to point this out desires to stop his brother not to take him down but because he doesn't want him to hurt any more people. He's again finding a balance between two ideas 1) Shoto needs to stop his brother in order to stop him from creating more victims and 2) Shoto needs to find a way to stop him that's not just putting him down because Toya himself is a victim.

Shoto also, and I must point this out for the comparison between Zuko and Azula goes out of his way to engage Dabi in conversation, ask him why he didn't come home and what happened to him in the years after he died. This is especially poignant because unlike Zuko and Azula who grew up together, Shoto basically had no relationship with his brother (and the rest of his siblings really) before Toya died because Enji purposefully kept Shoto separate from all the "failures."

So yes, the act of saving Toya is more for the completion of Shoto's arc than any redemption arc for Toya but Toya's not just a plot object to move around for Shoto's arc, Toya has his own agency all throughout. In fact it's the fact that Toya resists being saved every step of the way that provides the challenge that Shoto needs to grow in order to be able to save him.

Toya's not just after revenge against his father that's the surface reason, Toya is also just blatantly suicidal. Toya's birth is marked as a failure, his death wasn't even acknowledged by his family and everything stayed the same in his absence, so he created Dabi while praying at his own shrine in order to mourn Toya. Dabi can't find any meaning in his life where he was born as a failure, so he'll use his death taking revenge against Endeavor for having been born in order to give his life meaning.

What makes Avatar look especially bad in its treatment of Azula in comparison to how MHA treats Dabi, is that Dabi is way, way less redeemable than Azula. For one Azula has clearly proven affection both her friends and her brother (and I don't think she even deserves Mai and Ty Lee's forgiveness they had every right to walk out on her and want nothing to do with her again.)

Dabi is probably the ugliest victim of the League of Villains. The rest of the league have far more moments in their bonds with each other. Toya is the outsider to the league even if there are some subtle hints to his affection (he tries to show up to save Twice, and also burns down Toga's family house to comfort her). The villains are mostly shown to be redeemable by their positive friendship with each other, and Dabi at several points denies the league's bond (he pulls a Terra and yells out loud at the top of his lungs none of the league matter to him). Unlike with Terra you can argue this is most likely Dabi trying to cover up his real feelings. However, the fact that he feels the need to hide his affection from the league shows he's purposefully distancing himself from any bonds whatsoever.

Unlike Azula who has gone out of her way to help her brother in one major way, and also shows hints in early season 3 of having that sibling bond with him Dabi just straight up wants to murk Toya. Azula also tries to murk Zuko, but that's only when Zuko leaves on the day of Black Sun (one without telling her, and two something that probably left her alone to deal with the consequences of lying to her father for his sake). Either way, Azula's behavior in early season 3 is setup for the fact that their sibling bond can be salvaged.

Dabi is way worse to Shoto in comparison. Dabi in the first part never saw Shoto as his own person, just a puppet of his father (puppets have no autonomy or personhood). His feelings towards Shoto only went so far as Shoto was someone who could kill in order to upset Enji. Dabi also doesn't particularly care for the rest of his family as well (only calling out Natsu's name when his brain is literally melting), they're either ways to hurt endeavor, or he wants to drag them in hell with him. Heck his last words after being saved is telling everyone to die and go to hell.

Dabi doesn't bother to make bonds with the league or have any lingering affection for his family because Dabi's determined to seslf destruct. He's given up on life the moment he saw that he died and nothing changed in that household, now all that's left is for him to create a meaningful death by dragging his family to hell with him.

Dabi is also even as a child made out to be an unpleasant victim. He attacks baby Shoto with his flames early on out of jealousy (even though he later admits that he was being unfair to Shoto). He makes the situation in the house worse by loudly screaming and demanding his father's attention. He screams at his mother and throws her complicity in Enji's abuse in her face.

This is in comparison to Shoto who in childhood flashbacks we are only ever seen either 1) crying, and 2) trying to comfort and protect his mother. Toya's even made out to be difficult to empathize with as a child - which like flew over half of the fandom's heads because he got accusations of somehow abusing his father and the rest of his family in that chapter at 10 years old. However, that in a way illustrates my point.

The fact that Dabi is so disliked by a certain portion of the fandom is because Horikoshi paints such an ugly portrait of Toya in the way he expresses his victimhood. It's done deliberately too, because number one Toya by resisting Shoto's attempts to save him and trying to self destruct instead retains agency as a character. He makes decisions even though they're bad self destructive ones, he's not just a prop. Number two, the fact that Toya is intentionally portrayed as such an ugly victim makes Shoto's decision to break the cycle of familial abuse by saving Toya and not leaving a single family member all the more poignant.

Toya is an uglier victim than Azula, actively trying to kill himself in a way that Azula isn't, and treats Shoto way worse than Azula ever treated Zuko and yet Azula isn't shown the sympathy or given the salvation that Toya is.

Because once again, the writers didn't think about the ending of Azula's arc or of Azula as her own character. Shoto defeating Toya is the culmination of his desire to break the cycle of abuse in his family. Zuko putting Azula down is just to make Zuko look better. It's in service of Zuko's character instead of both of their characters.

THE BAD

Avatar isn't setting up some gritty ending where the bad guys can't be stopped, they can only be killed. In fact it's pretty close in tone to MHA.

Season 3 especially is the season that really begins to hammer in on the themes that even the people on the enemy side are still human after all. The headband shows that Fire Nation children are indoctrinated into the war, but they are in the end still children. There's the story between Avatar Roku and Sozin, and once again Iroh saying that Zuko has both options becoming like Roku or becoming like Sozin available to him (but not Azula I guess). There's Zuko joining Team Avatar, even after he betrayed Katara in Ba Sing Se and should have burnt that bridge then and there. There's Zuko working to earn their trust again when no one on the team really owe it to him.

The main character of the show is a pacifist, who deliberately learns a way to stop Ozai without killing him before the final battle because he doesn't want to break the values taught to him by his culture.

If the entire theme of season 3 is redemption, healing and that the fire nation are not inherently evil then why does Zuko's sister and character foil end the last shot of the series screaming and crying with no one comforting or even attempting to sympathize with her. Why is this one character marked for tragedy in a show that is about redemption and healing and showing compassion to your enemies and very specifically not a tragedy.

Toya literally burns all of the flesh off of his body, and somehow he has a gentler ending than Azula, because at least Toya's arc ends with all the members of his family showing up to try to cool down his flames, and when he's on the ground burnt to a crisp his father finally apologizes to him. Toya is a skinless burnt chicken wing, my boy has no skin, and somehow he's better off than Azula.

I don't think the writers gave Azula such a cruel ending because they don't like her, but rather because they just didn't think about her ending outside of what it meant for Zuko. Which is why you get moments like Aang who is apparently a pacifist who doesn't want to kill the Firelord, watching his daughter fall to her death while sitting on a flying bison and doing absolutely nothing to save her. ALL LIFE IS PRECIOUS (except for Azula I guess).

It's not bad because a victim doesn't get saved, it's bad because it doesn't fit in with the rest of the story.

Not only is Zuko saving Azula a very natural conclusion to his arc, but there's far more setup for Zuko reaching out to his sister and saving her than there ever was for Toya and Shoto. Both Toya and Terra are screaming at the top of their lungs "I HATE EVERYONE, YOU SHOULD ALL JUST GO TO HELL." They're both making decisions and committing to their self destruction while Azula is a 14 year old girl having a mental breakdown.

Anyway, time to quote the bad bad video again.

"When does a villain deserve a redemption arc? When do we deserve a redemption arc? I know this is gonna hurt, but characters are not people. They are tools. They are represetations of people. They can be used to say other things. They can be symbolic representation of other ideas. Azula's story is not just about a fourteen year old defeated by her brother for the throne, Azula is Zuko's character foil, where she is ruthless and practical, Zuko is empathetic and emotional. Where Azula's a prodigy, Zuko has to work hard to earn eve a fraction of her power.

I specifically chose to cite MHA, because of how differently it decided to use Shoto and Toya's character foiling. Shoto recognizes himself in Toya, and how different their paths were in life. This is explicitly motivates him to save Toya. It's also the culmination of everything that Shoto has learned because Shoto is a hero who believes that actions speak louder than words. It's not enough for Shoto to resolve his own inner struggle, he also has to help Dabi with his because that's showing Shoto has grown rather than telling us.

I think that is where the major difference lies between Shoto and Zuko, we're told that Zuko has chosen the path of empathy and healing, that he's learned to give people love and patience like Iroh has but instead of showing that the culmination of his arc is having a fist fight with his sister in a denny's parkinglot.

Azula is Zuko's character foil, where she is ruthless and practical, Zuko is empathetic and emotional. Where Azula's a prodigy, Zuko has to work hard to earn eve a fraction of her power.

If Zuko is empathic and emotional and that is why he's gained friends while Azula is now alone after having lost her friends due to the way she treated them, then like... what a great opportunity for Zuko to SHOW that quality of empathy.

However, Zuko doesn't do anything that Shoto does in the final fight. He's not even here for Azula, Azula's just an obstacle for taking back the crown. He doesn't talk to Azula, engage her in any way, try to de-escalate and avoid the fight.

If you want to make the tragedy that Azula and Zuko have taken such different paths in life that that Zuko fighting with his sister is unavoidable you could um... at least show Zuko being sad over the prospect of fighting his sister or being reluctant in any way.

(Before you come in here with "Zuko doesn't owe Azula anything take" this isn't about whether or not Azula is a terrible sister to Zuko, this is about the story that avatar is attempting to tell. Shoto and Dabi's fight is tragic because Shoto doesn't want to fight Dabi, he wants Dabi to come home and for their family to be complete. Zuko never expresses anything like that so where does the tragedy come from?)

If it were 100% committed to a tragedy like Terra's death then I wouldn't mind. if it were 100% committed to a story of redemption like Shoto reaching out to Toya then I wouldn't mind. My issue arises from the fact they want to have their cake and eat it too.

They want to give this tragic end to Azula, and use it to illustrate how Zuko has grown as a character. However, you can't have both.

If Zuko's growth is about learning that his father's love based on achievement and 2) learning he needed to get lost in life in order to find himself then why doesn't any of Zuko's actions demonstrate this lesson Zuko has learned about love, and about how you can be your own person outside what your father expects from you.

If Zuko has grown as a character he should be able to show those actions. He does show his new understanding of love and friendship to Team Avatar, but as I said that's easy mode. That's Shoto's attempts to save Iida, it's a step in the right direction. It's also not really Zuko demonstrating a selfless love, because he's also at the same time trying to earn their trust and earn his way into the group.

It's also not Zuko breaking the cycle of abuse in their family in any way. Shoto is trying to break free from his role of his father's masterpiece, and at the same time helping Dabi break free from his view that he's the failure.

It's also such a natural ending for Zuko's arc, to take the lessons he learned from Iroh and give them to his sister who needs them so they can both break away from their father's parenting. As I said Zuko does solve the internal conflict within himself, but he doesn't really demonstrate that by helping someone else find their balance.

If you wanted the tragic end, then it would have to be about Zuko's failure to reach out to his sister, because he hasn't learned how to reach out to her. Or because he tries and is unable to. The writers don't seem to understand that though, they think the tragedy is about Azula bringing it all on herself, and not the inherent tragedy of a fourteen year old girl being unable to be saved.

The set up is right there too, because number one avatar is about balance. So, wouldn't the true ending be finding balance between the siblings, not having Zuko rise and Azula fall. Number two, Azula being alone and friendless because of her own actions is again a parallel to where Zuko was in early season 2 at his lowest point. Except Zuko can be the better person in this situation by reaching out to her.

Zuko doesn't break the golden child / scapegoat dynamic, he just flips it so now he's the success and Azula is the failure.

While Azula's fall comes from cruelty and rejection from friends and allies it is Zuko's humility and kindness and friendship that ultimately wins the day. Him sacrifcing herself for Katara and her bringing Azula down and then her healing him. Azula ending up imprisoned isn't something happening to a real person, it's a deliberative narrative choice by the author to say something about how people like this isolate themselves and end up alone. "

As I've stated above, I'm not saying Azula didn't deserve to take a fall. Her fall is actually set up from the first moment she met Ty lee. However, there's no set up for her fall being permanent.

Azula's given way more humanizing moments than characters like Terra or even Dabi. Which is why Azula being in an insane asylum for the rest of her life doesn't fit as an ending at all.

Azula is one link in the chain of abuse. Her father only gives out affection in regards to her usefulness. No matter what Azula is an asset first and a daughter second. Azula then repeats the cycle and treats her friends the same way. She has been shown through an improper model of parenting of using fear to dominate others with power and control and she replicates that in her other relationships.

Therefore, Ty lee and Mai leaving her is not only deserved, it's the perfect opportunity to pull the rug underneath Azula and to show her that her understanding of how relationships work is completely wrong.

This also mirrors Zuko's arc, because part of Zuko's arc is realizing just how wrong Ozai is for making both children earn his love, and that he doesn't need to measure his self-worth based upon his father's approval. He also learns about healthy expressions of trust and friendship from the gang.

Azula loses in part due to her own inability to form healthy relationships is losing people rapid fire, her brother leaves and joins the enemy side, Mai and Ty Lee betray her in favor of her brother, then her father in one action of leaving Azula behind and throws the title of Firelord to her after it's become completely meaningless reminds her of her place. Azula learns in about five episodes what Zuko had in 3.5 seasons to process that her father's love was always conditional and no matter what she did she would never truly "earn it."

People leaving Azula isn't exactly the problem, the problem is that Azula ends up alone permanently without being given the same chance that Zuko is. Terra, and Toya both get opportunities to turn back. They both refuse the hand that's reaching out to him. Mai and Ty Lee leaving is caused by Azula's own choices, but her ultimate end isn't. She's not even given the chance to turn away being saved like Terra and Toya do because Zuko doesn't even bother to try saving her. Her ending is not entirely brought about by her own choices, because the writers need her to take a fall to uplift Zuko.

Azula ending up imprisoned isn't something happening to a real person, it's a deliberative narrative choice by the author to say something about how people like this isolate themselves and end up alone.

I think once again it comes from the author's misunderstanding things because they don't want to look at the story from Azula's perspective, only Zuko's.

Stay at Home almost had it when he said the tragedy of Zuko and Azula was there to show how two different parenting styles affected these children.

The tragedy is that Zuko and Azula started in the same place, but Zuko had persistent guidance and someone who modeled for him a healthy kind of love. The difference is that Azula has never experienced any kind of healthy love or support on the level Zuko has, so she models all her relationships on the way her father treats her. It's not that Azula is offered some chance for change and rejects it, it's that Azula isn't even aware of the fact that there's another way because no one is there to show it to her.

Which is why I said once again, Zuko being the first one to show Azula the lessons he himself was shown by Iroh is such a natural place for his character to end.

Azula also even while completely alone and with no idea what healthy love is, knows that there is something wrong with her and is troubled by that fact in a way Dabi and Terra aren't.

Azula: I can sit here and complain about how our mom liked Zuko more than me. But I don't really care. My own mother... thoguht I was a monster... She was right of course, but it still hurt.

Then there's the famous mirror scene:

Ursa: I didn't want to miss my own daughter's coronation. Azula:Don't pretend to act proud. I know what you really think of me. You think I'm a monster. Ursa: think you're confused. All your life you used fear to control people, like your friends Mai and Ty Lee. Azula: Well what choice do I have?! Trust is for fools. Fear is the only reliable way. Even you fear me. Ursa: No. I love you, Azula. I do.

Both of these scenes indicate that Azula thinks of herself as a monster and is deeply uncomfortable with the idea. Considering Ursa is a voice in Azula's head and not a ghost, it also shows on some level Azula knew what she did to Mai and Ty Lee was wrong and feels conflicted over it.

Once again she's much more in conflict with herself than Toya and Terror ever are, and who's someone who's constantly warring with himself? Who's someone who could help resolve her inner conflict... Zuko (too bad the way the show's written he never does).

Azula doesn't choose to self-destruct the way that Terra and Toya did. Azula's ending isn't brought about by her choice not to change, because she's never given the chance to change in the first place. Her tragic ending would make sense if it was entirely of her own choices, but Azula doesn't retain her agency in the end it's literally taken away from her. She loses control of her mind, and her ending is being chained to a grate screaming and then thrown into an asylum.

I'm not arguing against Azula's ending because she's my favorite character and I don't want bad things to happen to her. It's because her tragedy isn't about her it's about Zuko, and her ending actively takes agency away from her where at least Toya and Terra both retain their agency up until the end. It's not good writing because the tragedy doesn't fit in with the rest of the story which is about balance and healing - and it's also ableist as hell.

THE UGLY

Azula's ending is unfitting to the tone of the story she's in, makes her and Zuko's arcs feel incomplete, and also is ableist as hell.

Here's yet more evidence that Azula's tragic ending is poorly thought out. Azula's mental breakdown doesn't exist in service of her character, but Zuko's.

Azula's issues pop up out of nowhere after episode 15, and take place over the last 6 episode of the series. The idea of Azula having a mental breakdown isn't necessarily a bad concept, but it's executed poorly.

The first way it's executed poorly is just how rushed it is. There's basically no hints of any mental instability beforehand. Of course people can have mental breakdowns spontaenously like that in real life, but this is a story and stories require foreshadowing. Azula spontaneously developing mental issues doesn't feel like it's planned as a part of an arc. First off, because the writers don't seem too sure about what Azula's symptoms even are. Hallucination, paranoia, manic laughter, but apparently she's still able to bend lightning just fine. Secondly, the writer's intentions for giving Azula a mental breakdown are pretty transparent.

The writer's room needed to come up with a believable reason why Zuko would suddenly be able to fight on equal terms with Azula, so boom sudden mental illness. The intent was not to create a sympathetic portrayal of a young girl struggling with both paranoia and delusions. The intent was to nerf Azula because they couldn't think of any other way this plot could end, other than Zuko and Azula fighting in a denny's parkinglot.

As I said they use mental illness as a plot device to take Azula's agency and choices away from her. It's not done with the intention of humanizing her, and in fact except for one small scene with her talking to her mother in the mirror it's a pretty negative and unsympathetic portrayal of mental illness. Not because the writers hate mentally ill people, but because they needed Azula to have a mental breakdown in order for a plot point to happen. Which is why they didn't think of the potential implciations of such a writing choice at all.

Now, people are going to argue about me so I'll use one final example. Azula's ending may be controversial but it's universally agreed upon that the Game of Thrones Ending was bad, right?

Game of Thrones uses mental illness as the exact same plot device, to explain why Daenerys Targaryen turns from a hero to villain in the last few episodes with absolutely no foreshadowing. In fact, the all of the show director's interviews about that choice are just blatantly ableist.

Rant from @hamliet

This quote is (likely unintentionally) gaslighting, ableist, terrible logically, and downright offensive.

First, ableism: why, why, why are we conflating madness with evil? She was driven to madness so she killed a bunch of people and had to be put down? And you think this is a great message in the year of our Lord 2019? [...] Additionally, while good writing is to an extent subjective, there are general consensuses on what make good writing--and Game of Thrones hit all the general consensuses for bad writing, from bad pacing to confusing character assassination. Critics are like, pretty united on this front. No one thought Dany’s turn made sense, even the ones who expect Mad Queen in the books. Maybe if people love a character who is meant to be evil you're not writing them correctly... or maybe they aren't meant to be evil.

Daenerys and Azula are incredibly similiar characters. They're both dragon themed, alligned with the element of fire, they're both colonizers they both represent the warrior princess archetype.

I'd say Daenerys is more of a tragic heroine though, because while Danerys is essentially doing the same thing as Azula, waging war in a foreign land and a culture that's not hers, for the purpose of then bringing back soldiers to her home continent so she can wage war again - while she is definitely a war mongerer she has good intentions. Daenerys for all of her faults, genuinely wants to break the chains and help out people.

I think Azula definitely sees herself as the hero for winning the war for the fire nation's sake, but she's completely uncritical of her own culture and she doesn't really have the good intentions that Dany has. She does it more out of a sense of duty, and her belief of divine right, not because she wants to break people free.

Daenerys's problem is that she doesn't understand the culture she's invading and the complicated world she lives in and despite all good intentions, is as I described above, invading a foreign power so she can go back and wage a war to reclaim the throne. Even if Daenerys would then proceed to go on to be the bestest queen ever that wouldn't change the fact her methods to get to the throne were incredibly violent, and she's sort of failing to break free from the cycle that led the Targeryen rule to fail in the first place.

Azula's problem is she sees herself as the hero and is therefore uncritical of fire nation values. She doesn't have any nobler intentions either other than service to her country, she just like Zuko is just trying to fulfill her duties as daughter and believe her birthright puts her above others. (I mean Dany does too but digressing).

Azula's more of a tragic villain who plays the antagonist role in the story, Danerys is one of the three heroes. However, she's more of a tragic villain in the sense that she's first season zuko pre character development just way more competent.

However, while Daenerys is a much more heroic character than Azula, here's the thing. I still think she's going to die. She is foreshadowed pretty heavily to die, and fail for her quest for the throne, because her entire story is a deconstruction of the warrior princess and the liberator archetype.

However, the story that GRRM is building throughout his books with Dany as an incredibly flawed heroine is different from what we got in the show, which was Daenerys going crazy and starting to murder people. That's because Daenerys turn to darkness wasn't about her character at all, it was just making her into a plot device to move their bad idea for a plot forward. That's why the turn is so unnatural and makes little sense with her character, that's why it's so rushed.

That's also why it's ableist, because it's using mental illness as a plot device to make a character unsympathetic and monstrous and give the other characters a reason to put them down.

The same for Azula, outside of one scene where he's talking to her mother, Azula's mental illness manifests in her screaming, maniacally laughing, looking like the joker did her makeup, and her instability also makes her violent and dangerous to be around. (Ignoring the fact that most people who experience delusions in real life are harmless, and more likely to be the victims of violence).

Her sudden mental illness isn't even used to make her more sympathetic in say Zuko's eyes and make him realize she's a victim, no it's just there to nerf her so she can be violently put down. The way she's drawn, the way she acts, it's to paint her as monstrous as possible. Her last action is like sobbing and screaming while being drawn as ugly as possible. She's not even given a small hope for recovery, because it just ends there. That's a pretty great message to send people that experience delusions, not only will you not recover or be shown sympathy, you'll also get sent to a mental asylum for the rest of your life. The choice for both Azula and Dany is not to portray any kind of mental illness in a respectful way, but to make a plot point happen.

As I said I expect Dany to die in the books, but there's a difference between dying as a tragic hero succumbing to your flaws but still having your good intentions acknowledged and just turning into a villain for no reason and being put down like a rabid dog.

(This is a quote I stole from a Shigaraki post but): "Why does she need to be put down in the first place, she has trauma, not rabies."

The problem isn't bad thing happened to my favorite character, the problem with the ending is it doesn't take Dany's setup into consideration.

Stealing from @hamliet again:

The thing about tragedies is that you have to manage expectations and clearly show that your tragic hero is doomed from the very early on–ie you have to show them making steadily worse and worse decisions (see: Eren Jaeger in SnK), if not directly tell your audience at the very beginning that this is a tragic story (ie see Greek choruses and Shakespeare, the prequels from Star Wars because everyone knows Anakin is Vader–plus I’d argue Anakin’s arc only works because we know he comes back to the light in the end. Audiences don’t like reversing on set up/undoing structure. To make Dany a tragic villain is to go against the structure of her arc in both show and book. That’s why people don’t like it, even if the books makes it seem more believable.

Kate then goes onto describe a character that's much more comparable to Azula's. Honestly Arianne is closer to Azula than Daenerys is.

You know who is set up as a tragic heroine destined to descend and die because of her flaws in the books, whose arc has almost certainly been combined with Dany’s in some sense in the show? Arianne Martell. (and another character known as f!Aegon) In the books, Arianne is incredibly ambitious, and especially resents her brother and his quest for power. Like Margaery (another tragic character), Arianne seeks power and is intelligent and manipulative in her quest for it. But Margaery’s fatal mistake is that in seeking power and prestige, she’s become more a pawn than anything else for a villain (Cersei). She chose to play with lions, and she’ll be torn apart; that’s not surprising. Arianne, as her chapters hint, is going to almost certainly marry f!Aegon, playing with fire, and die burning for it. Arianne’s grasping for her own power is never portrayed as cruel or stupid like the main human villain (Cersei); on the contrary, we empathize with a girl who truly cares about her people, but resents her father’s preferential treatment towards her brother. That’s the difference between Arianne and Cersei: Arianne cares. She is not cruel. But her pride is still going to get her killed.

There's a lot of game of throne females you could compare Azula to because GOT is full of queens, but like. Azula may be a tragic villain firmly on the side of the antagonists but she's not Cerseie. She's not queen, she doesn't wield the power that Cersei wields. In fact one of Azula's downfalls is finding out she doesn't have as much power as she thought she had, and ultimately was just a tool of her fathers.

She's not Rhaenyra or Alicent, because yes she may be grabbing for power but her character isn't affected by misogyny. Because once again, the writers simply didn't think about misogyny except for a really surface level "girls can be just as strong as boys" way so we really have no idea how women are seen in the fire nation. The show doesn't really explore if being a woman makes things harder, or makes people treat her differently than Zuko because the writers just didn't consider Azula's perspcetive on that matter.

Azula is alike to Danaerys in several ways, but as I said I think her ultimate end comes from Azula understimating her own importance in her father's eyes, and quickly realizing when her father is her only family left she never had his love or loyalty in the first place.

But Margaery’s fatal mistake is that in seeking power and prestige, she’s become more a pawn than anything else for a villain (Cersei). She chose to play with lions, and she’ll be torn apart; that’s not surprising.

Azula's most famous quote is about how Long Feng isn't even a player, only to find out her father considered her a pawn from the beginning and be broken by the revelation.

The difference being of course that Avatar is not Game of Thrones and it won't even kill the evil fascist dictator so it doesn't make a lot of sense to hand Azula the ending that Arianne got. They have the same fatal flaw.

Anyway, I made this big post but I can explain why Azula's tragic ending down't work in one sentence.

AVATAR THE LAST AIRBENDER IS NOT A TRAGEDY.

Maybe the reason Azula should get redeemed is because THE SHOW IS ABOUT F&%CKING REDEMPTION.

#bnha meta #mha meta #atla meta #azula meta #azula #princess azula #dabi #toya todoroki #shoto todoroki #azula redemption

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musicalmoritz · 2 months ago

Note

It’s canon Mitsuba’s gay?

I’m gonna use this as an excuse to yap because Mitsuba’s queercoding is either weirdly downplayed by fans or used solely for BL shipping purposes so I want to talk about it through the lens of what it means for his character, role in the story, and relationship with Kou

Yes, Mitsuba is canonically gay

Things don’t have to be explicitly stated in order to be canon, subtext is a major part of media analysis. This is something a lot of fans miss which leads to a misunderstanding of the source material. I do have some credentials for this, I’ve taken two undergrad college literature classes in which the subject of queercoding did come up multiple times. Meaning analyzing queercoding has literally gone towards my degree so I feel like my opinion holds some weight (not as much as that of an actual English major but yk I assume I’ve had more education on it than the general TBHK fandom)

There are multiple ways to queercode a character, sometimes it can be as simple as feminizing a man or masculinizing a woman. Though that method might be a bit outdated nowadays with gender roles becoming less strict, it’s still worth keeping in mind when analyzing queer characters. Another way is through romantically colored scenes with characters of the same sex, or by having them hint at disinterest in the opposite sex. Mitsuba checks off all three of these boxes and then some

First off, Mitsuba is attracted to men. This is made extremely obvious through his relationship with Kou but I’m gonna explain it anyways because unfortunately I’ve seen a lot of fans say they’re just platonic

Mitsuba and Kou went on a date. When this is brought up, fans typically jump to the excuse of “but Kou said it wasn’t a date,” which is where my American Lit class is going to come in handy. One of the major things we learned is that authors have to understand that everything they write has some sort of real world connotation. If you write a scene with a doctor, you have to understand that your readers already have preconceived notions of what doctors represent. You can choose to either lean into that or subvert it, but you have to be aware that as soon as a doctor enters the scene, readers have already made assumptions about that character

The word “date” is clearly being used in a romantic context here. When Kou texts his friends and brother about it, they all assume he’s talking about a romantic date. While in the actual context of the scene, Mitsuba and Kou aren’t quite ready to use such a strong label yet, the romantic wording here is still very intentional. AidaIro would not have labeled this moment as a date if they didn’t want readers to view it in a romantic light, because they understand that their readers are going to associate dates with romance. Japanese censorship is really strict, it’s hard to publish stories with explicitly queer characters unless the series is labeled as a BL or GL. And so Japanese manga writers often have to find roundabout ways to express that characters are gay without outright stating it- such as suggesting that they’re going on a date with a character of the same sex

In the printed volume for Vol.20, there’s an editor’s note that mentions that when Kou and Mitsuba are making plans to hang out at the school festival, it holds a romantic implication for the Japanese audience. Cultural differences are important to keep in mind, to western fans this scene might not raise any eyebrows but for its primary audience, it is confirmation that Mitsuba and Kou are romantic. I also find it interesting that the editor felt this context was important enough to warrant clarification

And frankly, their relationship doesn’t make a lot of sense if it’s solely platonic. Male friendship is something TBHK writes very realistically, the male characters aren’t as touchy-feely with their friends as they are with their female love interests. Yokoo and Satou don’t directly ask Kou how he’s feeling when they notice he’s upset, instead they give him a task to distract him- similar to how men in real life cheer their friends up through quality time rather than talking through their emotions like women do (not every man ofc but a good majority of them). When Teru is down, Akane doesn’t hold him and reassure him the way he does with Aoi. There are no grand declarations of ultimate “friendship” the way you see in fan servicy series like Haikyuu. Instead, he used his and Teru’s rivalry to indirectly motivate him to get his head back in the game. When Hanako is sad, Kou cheers him up by making donuts for him and then giving them to Nene so she can pretend she’s the one who made them. This is a very healthy portrayal of male friendship, and Mitsuba and Kou are nothing like this

Mitsuba and Kou both cry and vent to each other multiple times (the Mitsuba Arc, the Picture Perfect Arc, the Nightlife Arc), and instead of comforting each other indirectly they do things like offering to die for each other. You would never see Akane offer to die to make Teru feel better, nor would you Aoi and Nene or Kou and Hanako. It stands out so much from other friendships in the series, even Kou’s friendships with other characters. That is a conscious writing decision, AidaIro make a point to show Mitsuba as an exception for Kou. It’s worth noting that in the same chapter where Yokoo and Satou cheer Kou up indirectly, Mitsuba attempts to directly have him talk about his feelings

They’re also incredibly possessive over one another, in a way friends usually aren’t. When Kou was in the Red House, he was shown his greatest desires, and Mitsuba appeared in one of these. Kou said he knew Mitsuba would appear, which is interesting because at that point he had already picked up on the house showing him what he wanted. But what does he want? He wants Mitsuba to rely on him entirely, to be completely useless without him. He wants Mitsuba to be “no good without him,” to need him so badly that he begs him to die so they can be together. I’m not exaggerating, these are lines pulled straight from the chapter (paraphrased but still). Later on in the Nightlife arc, Kou breaks down when he discovers Mitsuba has been relying on Tsukasa for life-saving help. As for Mitsuba, he wants to die by Kou’s hands. He says it wouldn’t be satisfying if anyone else killed him, and that he would be happy if Kou were to be the last person he spent time with before he died. He tries to trap Kou in a picture perfect world just like Hanako does with Nene, because he wants to live a normal life with him. It’s also shown in one of the extras that Mitsuba cries when Kou ignores him

They’re also drawn very romantically, again we don’t see Teru and Akane this intimate with one another unless they’re fighting. We especially don’t see Kou this intimate with anyone other than Mitsuba, and while Mitsuba is sometimes clingy with Tsukasa we certainly never see him posed romantically with a woman. This comes back to authorial intent and real world connotations, AidaIro know that male friends aren’t typically this close, and therefore casual affection like this will be interpreted in a romantic light. We see them hold hands/wrists multiple times too, Kou gives Mitsuba a piggyback ride in one scene, and in ASHK they had a classic “pinned against the wall” page

I’ll also mention the AUs, because those indicate a lot about the characters as well. In Hanako-Kun of the Opera, Kou poisoned Mitsuba so he could take him away from the opera house and protect him from Tsukasa. He basically kidnapped him. He also stayed with Mitsuba at the opera house for a seemingly long period of time despite hating opera. Aaaaand they’re childhood best friends in this au and Kou took care of Mitsuba while he was sick

Then there’s the Ghost Hotel, where Kou is a werewolf who takes bites out of mummy Mitsuba during full moons. Despite this, the two appear to be friends and Mitsuba helps Kou out around the kitchen. Cannibalism is consistently tied to romance throughout TBHK, most notably with Hakubo and Sumire but other romantic pairings have cannibalistic moments or official arts. During the zombie mokke chapter, Nene panicked when Akane tries to eat her because she assumed it would put her in a love triangle with Aoi. So yeah, cannibalism in TBHK is directly tied to romance and we see that with Mitsukou both in canon and in this au. Speaking of which, I’m not even gonna get into the symbolism of Kou holding a heart out to Mitsuba. Connect the dots for yourselves

Now that we’ve got Mitsukou out of the way, let’s talk about Mitsuba’s disinterest in women

Remember how I said one of the ways queercoding is done is by having a character hint at disinterest in the opposite sex? Yeah, very rarely are we going to see a queercoded male character outright say “I have no attraction to women.” Instead they say they just never saw the appeal in dating, or that they never had time to settle down. In more obvious cases, we have scenes like Reiner from AOT joking that Ymir isn’t all that into guys

I couldn’t find the second scene but there are TWO extras where the subject of Mitsuba’s disinterest in women comes up. C’mon guys I’m trying not to be mean here but you have to be blind, oblivious, or in denial to not pick up on that. Whyyyyy would they mention Mitsuba not having a crush on any girls twice if it weren’t to suggest something about his preference?? Coupled with his appearance (which I’ll get to later) and relationship with Kou, these scenes carry a lot of weight. Even if those other aspects weren’t included, scenes like this would still indicate he has no interest in women (which would make him gay or aroace, though due to his relationship with Kou the aroace thing is kind of ruled out)

Compare this to a scene where Mitsuba thinks he’s being asked out by a man. He doesn’t say “hmmm nope no guys, I’m cuter than all of them~” he specifically says “I’m not interested in guys with lame earrings.” The way this is worded implies that Mitsuba is discussing a type, though it’s v much a comedic scene and we know from everything else that he absolutely does like guys with lame earrings, it’s still worded in a way that makes him appear queer. If he were straight, they would have had him say he’s not interested in guys at all (like Dazai from Bungou Stray Dogs, John Watson from BBC Sherlock, Finn Hudson from Glee, idk there are a lot of male characters that are explicit straight sorry for the crazy random list). Also note how he teases Kou about it, he knows that Kou is fond of him and doesn’t hesitate to use that against him (like when he was comforting him during the Nightlife arc)

They don’t go overboard with Mitsuba’s disinterest in women because, well, that’s not really necessary. Two scenes is already a lot, and he doesn’t have any romantic relationships with women in canon (even as a crush/a joke scene). It’s rare for TBHK characters to have absolutely no scenes expressing interest in the opposite sex, since the series is partially a romance. But Mitsuba consistently only ever shows interest in one man, and when girls are brought up he’s quick to brush it off. His mom did think Nene was his girlfriend when they met, but this was depicted as a very awkward and comedic scene. Because the premise of Mitsuba having a girlfriend is objectively hilarious

(Due to Sousuke’s young age it’s reasonable to assume he wasn’t out to his mom yet, he’s around the age where most kids are closeted. It’s even possible that Sousuke hadn’t come to terms with his sexuality yet, though it’s still a prevalent part of both his character and No.3’s)

Now let’s move onto appearances. I want to give a quick disclaimer, not all gay men are feminine and not all feminine men are gay. Androgyny is also very common in anime and doesn’t automatically mean a character is gay, but there are cases when it’s used for queercoding. Mitsuba is one of these cases

Mitsuba is a very feminine character, this is addressed as soon as he shows up in the manga. He was bullied for his appearance (and personality), but unlike his personality he never tried to change his feminine appearance. He kept his hair long, continues to wear scarves and cardigans and earrings. No.3 wears these things as well, and I would argue has a more feminine personality since he seems to be more open about his emotions and idk. I struggle to categorize feminine and masculine traits because imo that’s subjective but there are things society deems feminine vs. masculine. The problem is that I really dislike the whole “men are strong and women are emotional” thing but ehhhh I guess I have to talk about it for this. Hmph. But yeah although Mitsuba isn’t exactly the biggest sweetheart ever, he does act somewhat feminine compared to the other male characters (as I’ve said he’s p much the only man in the series who attempts to work through emotional conflicts directly)

Once again we circle back to intent, AidaIro know that a male character dressed in pink with pink eyes and long pink hair is going to raise some eyebrows. Even by androgynous anime standards, it’s a bit much. And good for him, although not all gay men are feminine, some are and that’s also fine. I can’t speak on how well he represents feminine gay men because I’m a lesbian but he does dress similar to some of the feminine gay men I’ve known irl (or slightly less feminine in some cases…I knew this one dude in high school who used to wear corsets to class and he was so badass I hope he’s doing well)

I could get into how Kou is a bit feminized too with the whole housework thing but this ain’t abt him. I will say that Kou is still a very masculine character but despite this his character is feminized in some ways compared to the other men. I’m not really here to discuss whether that’s good or bad, I’m just stating the evidence as it is, you can make your own conclusions as to how you feel about it

So how does being queer impact Mitsuba’s character arc?

When I get around to writing my analyses of all the TBHK characters I WILL be talking more in depth about the queer allegories with Mitsuba’s character but for now I’ll give ya’ll a quick summary. Supernatural characters have been used for years to represent queerness, the same could be said for villains and any character trope that represents a feeling of “otherness.” Sometimes it’s more broad like X-Men, where the superpowered characters are used to represent all types of minorities (though I believe X-Men is more closely tied to race, there are rampant queer themes as well). Then there’s books like Interview with the Vampire that get more specific with it, where Louis denying his “true nature” as a vampire is used as an allegory for him denying his queerness. Well I’m here to tell you that Mitsuba and Louis de Pointe du Lac are in the same boat

Mitsuba differs from the other supernaturals because he desperately tries to hold on to feelings of normalcy. He wants to be a normal human and live a normal human life. He doesn’t want to be othered, to be outcasted from society for something he can’t control. We don’t see Hanako, Tsuchigomori, Mei, or any of the other supernatural characters struggle with this. You could argue that Akane does but his situation is more related to learning to empathize with others than any internal battles within himself. Hanako may have moments of wishing him and Nene could have something more, but that’s more about romance than his identity.

This desire to be “normal” is unique to Mitsuba’s character, and it’s a very queer desire. Being an angsty teenager who hasn’t fully accepted themself yet and hasn’t realized that being queer is not only normal, but a beautiful experience. It’s also so interesting to me that as he’s trying so hard to be normal, it creates a push and pull between him and Kou. He wants to be normal for Kou but he also feels that he’s hurting Kou just by existing, that this could only end bad for him. Oh the inherent guilt of having your first gay crush and feeling like you're corrupting them hist for pining from afar

So, can you ship him with women? Technically you can do anything, shipping isn’t illegal and we all have free will. Should you ship him with women is more subjective, I personally think no!! Queerness is not just a sexuality, it’s an identity that deeply impacts who you are as a person. It shapes your experiences and your view of yourself, and in an allegorical way it has certainly done this for Mitsuba. Yes, bi people are queer as well and this is still true for them, but bisexuality is not Mitsuba’s experience. Mono-attraction exists and that specification is very important to gay men and lesbians. For some people sexuality is fluid and that’s beautiful, but it doesn’t work that way for everyone

Some queer fans don’t care if gay characters are shipped with members of the opposite sex, and they’re entitled to their own opinions. It makes me immensely uncomfortable tho, so please block me if you ship Mitsuba with women. That goes for any ships between canon gay/lesbian characters and the opposite sex. I respect people’s right to have opinions but that doesn’t mean I have to like the opinions themselves, and I don’t have to engage with anything that makes me uneasy. That goes for all of you btw, never let people convince you that you have to put up with shit you hate on the internet lmao, this is not real life babes. Block and move on

TL;DR

Mitsuba is too gay to function

#ask #ask me anything #tbhk #toilet bound hanako kun #jibaku shounen hanako kun #jshk #analysis #queer coding #mitsukou #sousuke mitsuba #kou minamoto #soukou #kousuke #queer analysis #gay #mlm

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felassan · 4 months ago

Text

Transcript of the DA:TV ‘Meet The Companions’ panel @ SDCC.

Update: this post has now been updated into a full transcript.

BioWare have said that they are going to share a recording of the panel at a later date. In the meantime, here is a transcript of it. When the recording is available, I will update this post further if required. This is a word-for-word transcript (in as far as it was possible to make one, it was quite a noisy room with lots of people in it), but a few bits were not clearly audible - these are marked as "[...]". listening to the original source in audio/video format, when it��s available, first-hand is of course always advisable, in case of any mis-hearings or missing things out etc on my part!! :>

there are other things from the panel here in this BioWare blogpost, collected in this compilation post, and also in this Tumblr post.

The panel was moderated/hosted by Lucy James. In attendance were creative director John Epler, creative performance director Ashley Barlow, and the actors of Lucanis, Neve, Emmrich, and Harding - Zach Mendez, Jessica Clark, Nick Boraine, and Ali Hillis respectively.

----

[panel begins]

Lucy: Goodness me, there are a lot of you. Hello everyone. Hello San Diego. But more importantly, hello Dragon Age fans! Give yourselves a cheer! Now welcome to a panel that I am so excited to be moderating today. A little bit of, what do you call it, a little bit of, I'm just gonna say it, we're doing Q&A at the end. There is a microphone right here. I will give a warning - housekeeping was the word I was searching for. We're gonna be doing Q&A at the end. I will give you a warning to come up and ask questions to this incredible panel of developers from BioWare and actors from the brand new Dragon Age game, The Veilguard. I'm Lucy James, I'm your moderator for today, but you're not here for me, you're here for these incredible people, so let's go down the line and see who we have on the panel today. We have creative director John Epler. Creative performance director Ashley Barlow. The poised and pragmatic assassin, playing the role of Lucanis, Zach Mendez. The necromancer Emmrich, we have Nick Boraine. Absolutely did not mean to skip, but we have different, different lineup over here. The voice behind the private detective Neve, Jessica Clark. And returning franchise favorite, you know her as Lace Harding, the lovable Scout, Ali Hillis. Now, we all love Dragon Age games for multiple reasons, whether it is the combat, the impactful decisions that we get to make, the romances - I know my [...], I know my - but the heart and soul of every game is always the companions, and so we are gonna be doing a deep dive into some of the new cast as well as, like I said, returning franchise favorite. So I'm gonna kick off with you, John.

John: Awesome.

Lucy: Can, you know, you've been at BioWare for a couple of years now.

John: Yeah, seventeen years as of this year, so.

Lucy: Wow. Can you tell us a little bit about your history with Dragon Age?

John: Absolutely. So as mentioned, I've been at BioWare for coming up on seventeen years now. I worked as a QA tester on Dragon Age: Origins, moved into cinematic design, did that [...] Dragon Age II, Dragon Age: Inquisition, and then became lead cinematic designer for Dragon Age: Inquisition - Trespasser, where I worked closely with Trick Weekes, building out that story. And then now as creative director on Dragon Age: The Veilguard, which has been just a fantastic project to be a part of.

Lucy: Now, I assume pretty much everyone in this room has gone frame-by-frame through the trailers and gameplay videos and every BioWare social post about Dragon Age, but just in case there's anyone in the room who is unfamiliar, give us the quick overview of Dragon Age: The Veilguard?

John: Absolutely. So Dragon Age: The Veilguard is the latest entry in the Dragon Age franchise. It takes place approximately ten years after the end of Inquisition. You start the game hunting for Solas. It's a game built on some core principles of: be who you want to be, in a world worth saving, and with characters who matter. So, again, companions always at the heart of Dragon Age, they're at the heart of this one as well.

Lucy: And so, I mean, why is this team coming together? You mentioned it a little bit there, and like, what's bringing this, kinda 'rogues' gallery' together?

John: I mean it's the end of the world, and each character that you bring into your party understands that the world's ending, that they need to stop that, and you're really building, what I would say is more of a found family. These are characters who may not start off liking each other, may not even start off liking you, but over time, they grow to understand the importance of what they're doing and just, how critical it is to stop the elven gods.

Lucy: Now we were chatting a little bit before the panel, and you kinda said, like, a bold statement which was that this is one of the best groups BioWare has ever written. I say 'bold', cause we all have our favorites. What makes you say that? What's going on with The Veilguard that makes them so special?

John: Yeah, I mean, I think that every Dragon Age game the companions we write and create for those games are the best companions for that one. And I think in this case, what's really fascinating and what I've really loved to see come out through the game, through its development is, the way these characters form relationships, not just with you but with each other, so, whereas, you know, sometimes characters maybe don't interact as much. Each one of these has a relationship that extends beyond Rook, the protagonist, but also some become friends, some become lovers, and some become rivals. And it's just, the way that they learn to get over their differences, or put them aside, has really been fun and exciting, because they all represent a different part of the world of Thedas.

Lucy: I am very excited to see how these family dynamics come together, avoiding my real life family for my virtual family. Ashley, you’ve been playing a huge role in helping bring these characters to life. Can you tell us a little bit about your role at BioWare?

Ashley: Yeah. I’m the creative performance director, so I get to cast all of these characters, with the team at BioWare, of course. And then work tirelessly in the booth with them, I mean, they just met like this weekend. I just silo them off, and they do their work, and they listen to each other, and, you know, 3000 hours later, and then they get them back around, and we can iterate on it, and they can say, ‘oh, oh that’s what everyone sounds like!’, now they get to play off of it. So, it’s a big road-trip in a VO booth. From my house.

Lucy: A big road trip. A big deal. A big game. Where do you even begin with a behemoth like this?

Ashley: We, we audition our companions. We have to make sure that our leads can play off of each other, that compliment each other, that juxtapose each other. Like John said, it’s kind of like a family, an un-chosen family, and so we need them to, you know, it’s, you need to create an ensemble, a diverse ensemble, so that the players get the choice of who they want to bring on this hero’s journey. And so, we brought them all in, you know, and they, we do motion capture, so we need to see how they move, and how they walk, and how they talk, and how they can act like heroes. And they all carry themselves so well. Now, it’s tripping me out, because they all look like their characters to me.

Lucy: Now, there are plenty of returning faces in The Veilguard, but there are new companions that we will get to know and love. Let’s start with Lucanis. John, can you give us a little quick overview of his background, and what’s his deal?

John: Absolutely. So Lucanis is the stylish assassin from the Antivan Crows, you know. But, not bloodthirsty, more, as he sees assassination as a job, one that he is extremely skilled at. Over the course of the story, you learn more about him, more about his character, more about his relationship, not just within The Veilguard, but also with the Crows and with other characters in the world. And I think, it’s fascinating to see how that grows over the course of the game.

Lucy: Now Zach, you are the voice. I mean, how do you approach this? Where did you […]?

Zach: Well, when I first found out I got the role, I read Tevinter Nights, which is the book, that came out [...] and you should read. And I read The Wigmaker Job, in which Lucanis is featured. I read it about three times, and after I closed the book I realized, ‘this might be the coolest guy I ever get to play’. I mean, not only is he a smooth assassin, not only is he determined - yes, he can kill you a thousand different ways, but what struck me was, his mind is as dangerous as his knives. I mean this is a guy who takes in the environment with all five senses. He’s constantly attuning himself to the kind of shifting terrain of every mission. And also, he’s kinda hilarious. I mean, if you look at his relationship with his cousin Illario, in The Wigmaker Job, they’re constantly giving each other crap. But there’s a lotta love there, so I got to pull, you know, from my relationship with my brother. Because we love each other dearly, but we can be ruthless with each other. And so, it was really easy to play in that way.

Lucy: I mean, yeah, you mentioned being a comedian there. Ashley, how was working with Zach?

Ashley: Yeah.

Lucy: Harnessing that and bringing it to the character.

Ashley: Zach’s one of the funniest people I know. And that’s a lot to live up to. But, you know, he came in as one of the most adaptable actors. And, you know, we did a lot of motion capture during 2020, 2021, 2022, even 2023, and so Zach stood in for like, Assan, and Varric, like all the characters [...] just mostly, most - [a scene plays on the screen behind the panel of the actors doing mo-cap. Zach as Assan hops along the ground like :D over to Davrin, Rook and another character. Davrin is happy to see him and scratches him under the chin. Davrin motions to Rook, who then bends down and hugs Assan] - I mean I’m pretty sure [...] a huge inspiration for the cinematics. Once you see this scene that this is, like - remember it, 'cause [...] -

Zach: Just know, when you’re hugging Assan, you’re hugging me. That means a lot.

Ashley: It’s true! But, yeah, but, for Lucanis, Zach was able to bring, I mean once you get in the game and you meet Lucanis, you’ll know that he’s, you know, a murdering Crow, and then, is a […], you know, there’s a darkness. [there is a rumbling noise in the background and the panelists look around confused]

[?]: I think it's just thundering.

Ashley: It’s thundering, let's, let's do a -

Zach: The darkness.

[...]

Ashley: But in the darkness -

Zach: Prepare yourselves. [background noise continues]

Ali[?]: It’s coming.

Zach: Seriously, what is that? What’s happening?

A person off to the side: Other rooms!

Zach: Okay, okay, okay, thank you.

Ashley: Okay, thank you. [...] think you were doing it. As you can tell, he brought like a, he brings a lightness to it, ‘cause you can’t always be that heavy. I don’t want to be scared or crying in the booth all the time. And thank God the writers, John included, and all of the writers of Lucanis really brought some fast, quick-witted writing. So he’s quick as a whip, he really lightened it up, and can’t wait til you guys get in and play it and romance this sucker! Sorry! Sorry not sorry!

Lucy: I was going to say, how does it also feel to play a romanceable character?

Zach: Oh, I’m quite excited about it. Ashley has promised to give me the stats of how many people romance me. I'm really looking forward to that.

Lucy: No pressure, gotta get those numbers up!

Zach: Yeah, I know. But, that’s the great thing about Lucanis, is that, you know, he’s extremely smooth, as an assassin, but, and, yes, he does have a heart, he does have a soft side, he’s not completely adept at always dealing with other people and interactions of that such, you know, he’s extremely stubborn and stuck in his ways, so it’s really hard for him to let people in sometimes, so I’m really excited for fans to get to meet him, and, you know, help him open up.

Lucy: And before we go to the rest of your illustrious cast members, what’s, what was, what’s been your highlight of working on The Veilguard? Is it, you know, this moment getting to see everyone in person? Was it a story from on set one day, or an interaction with one of the devs?

Zach: Well, you know, I did, before the first day of shooting, I did kinda get an idea about how passionate the fanbase was, which made me really excited. I don’t wanna say nervous, because I don’t say I’m nervous, I say I’m excited. And so before the first day of shoot, I was very excited. And luckily, you know, Ashley and them, didn’t have me do too much on the first day. I played a lot of darkspawn. I darkspawn-ed my ass off, though. I want you guys to know, I really –

Ashley: Oh he did, yeah.

Zach: – and when I got home, I thought to myself, you know, ‘Zach, did you darkspawn hard enough?’ I was just worried! You know, and within an hour I got a text from Jeff, who’s a part of this cast as well, and Jee, telling me what a great job I did. And then, I’ll never forget. I got a call from Ali Hillis down here. And I will remember that conversation, because for thirty minutes, she made me feel like I was welcome in the Dragon Age family, and it gave me so much confidence moving forward. So thank you Ali, so much, I still remember that, God bless you.

Lucy: That is lovely. See, the family stuff coming up already. I’m very excited.

Ashley: [...]

Lucy: Right, let’s move on. Coming to the private detective, Neve, who we actually got a glimpse of in the gameplay reveal from a few weeks ago. Let’s take a quick look. [a scene plays on the screen; the scene when Rook meets Neve in the prologue with Varric and Harding, that we saw in the gameplay reveal video] Now John, can you give us a quick overview of Neve?

John: Absolutely. So Neve, as you can see in the video, is one of the first companions that you encounter in Dragon Age: The Veilguard. She’s from Tevinter, Minrathous specifically. And anyone who’s played Dragon Age before knows that we’ve always talked about Minrathous, we’ve always talked about Tevinter, so we wanted to have a character who showed, not the parts of Tevinter that we’ve touched on before, you know, obviously slavery is a big part of it, it’s a mageocracy, but somebody who was pushing back, fighting back against that. And Neve’s shown up in the ancillary media as well, in the comics The Missing. And it’s just, she is that, you know, somewhat cynical detective with a bit of a heart of gold, bit of [a?] romantic, and just seeing her character evolve over the course of The Veilguard, over the course of the game, because again, she’s one of the first people you meet, is. Always fun seeing Neve’s character bounce off other the followers, banter has been super fun, just the way that she, what she brings to the table is always, it’s always so interesting to me.

Lucy: Jessica, I mean, what was it like getting that call to find out that you were gonna be in Dragon Age?

Jessica: It was slightly terrifying, and it was, I just felt really honored immediately, because I feel like, to be, I feel like they entrusted me with such, something with such significance and such importance to so many people, and so I just really wanted to honor that, and bring everything that I could to this fabulous character that I had been gifted. So yeah, that was.

Lucy: And I understand that you are kind’ve newer to the kind’ve voice acting, kind’ve realm. How was it different from more traditional roles?

Jessica: I am pretty new to it. I’ve barely done anything as significant, Dragon Age is enormous. It was very freeing honestly, I mean, like Ashley said, they auditioned and auditioned and auditioned and auditioned us. Like, every time I was brought in, I was like, ‘oh I didn’t get that’, you know what I mean? And then three months later there was another audition, and. But it was just so interesting and so freeing, because it really is sort’ve, it almost felt like play pretend, like when I was a little girl, you know? And it’s like what you dream up in your imagination. Because they, you know, they give you this character, and they give you some of the dialogue and then they really wanna see where you go with it and how you move and how you embody her and how you react to dragons that aren’t there because you’re in an audition room. You know, like all of that. So, and then, also, playing Neve, it really allowed me, and being a voice actor, it really allowed me to sort’ve step into my power a bit more, because, you know, I’m very tall, and things like that. And so, in a lot of my, sort’ve, more traditional television and film work, they kind’ve want you to be the girl, and I have to raise my voice, and be a little softer, and you know, kind’ve, not diminish myself, I don’t wanna say that, but just be very conscious of my physicality. And then Neve, it’s completely the opposite. You know, so Ashley had to work with me literally on dropping my register and things like that, and it was so confusing at the beginning, and then it was so amazing, to kind’ve have that opportunity, so I’m very grateful.

Lucy: Yeah. I mean, what drew you, what’s your favorite thing about Neve? – get that applause going, go on, let's go!

Jessica: I love her loyalty, I love her dedication, I love how much she loves Docktown and its people and how she really sees a different vision for Tevinter than, as John said, than what’s previously been depicted. And she’s really really fighting for those people, and she loves those people, and so yes she’s cynical, and yes she’s kinda tough and brusque and all these other things, but when they say there’s a heart of gold, there really, like to have that kind of a passion and dedicate your life to something like that, I think that, that’s my favorite part about her.

Lucy: And what were some of your highlights from, I mean, is it, is it kind of strange to record a video game, because I assume you’re doing things in different orders -

Ashley: Yeah.

Jessica: Oh yes.

Lucy: - working with some people some days and other people different days - tell me about that?

Jessica: I mean in terms of that, I just trusted Ashley and John, you know, and they know, and I was there to learn and embody and kind’ve grow into that. But I think my favorite thing, even though we were all separate disembodied voices a lot of the time, we kind’ve really all bonded in the way that we were intended to, you know? And that’s why we’ve been so excited all week and all weekend, because we can be like, ‘oh my god, you’re here, oh my god you’re here, you’re here, you’re here’, finally, you know? And you know, I know on a lot of projects, people are like ‘oh yeah, we’re all like, we love each other’, but we really do, we really really do. And it just evolved so organically. And there was something magical about it just being our voices in the beginning. You know, like sort’ve taking anything else out of the -

Zach: Equation.

Jessica: – you know what I’m saying. I’ve run out of words.

Ashley[?]: Yeah, it’s like an audible penpal. […] speaking to each other for so long.

Jessica: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Ashley: It's nice with Jess, [...] she hit it on the head, you know, voice acting, you know, I hate to say it, I don't wanna put Jess - Jessica’s obviously a beautiful woman, but in the booth, it doesn’t matter. We just, pulled out the power and the range that Neve has, and it’s limitless, and as a woman to see that kind of writing and that kind of performance ability is, I know for a lot of us in the room, probably, pretty badass.

Lucy: Jess, I wanna, I'm gonna come back to something, because you mentioned, like, you’ve been messaging, and that the cast, you know, really loves each other, is there a Veilguard groupchat?

Jessica: There are several.

Lucy: Hold up. Who sends the most memes, who is the person who only reacts with the thumbs-up emoji?

Jessica: I, I would say Jeff is the most active, who plays one of the Rooks, I would say, in that respect, and to bounce off what Zach said, just an incredibly generous actor. And then, Ali, like it’s so true, like I had that story too, like literally even being back there, I was like, [gasp], I was like, she’s like, ‘it’s gonna be okay’, she’s like, ‘it’s good, it’s like, you’re gonna love it, it’s gonna feel special’. She literally like held my hands and like looked into my eyes and was like [inhale, exhale], you know? [looks at Ali and reaches out to her] I love you.

Lucy: I was gonna say, if we’re doing an Ali love-in, she did that for me too. So.

[?]: She does that for everyone.

Lucy: She’s done it for everyone? Fantastic!

Ali: Guys, you’re making me cry!

Lucy: We didn’t expect, hang on, we did expect one of our companions to be - a stone cold gray fox. BioWare treating us well. Emmrich has been driving the internet wild. And so, John, can you give us a little bit of background there?

John: Absolutely.

Lucy: Where did Emmrich come from?

John: I mean honestly, I will say like, we expected a great reaction to Emmrich. Went beyond what we expected for sure. But it’s been fascinating to see, because again, Emmrich is this character, he’s more of the professorial, more, he brings a wisdom and kind of a calmness to the group, so even when things are at their worst, there’s that one person in the group who’s kind’ve like, ‘okay, you know, we’ve got, let’s figure it out, slow, take a deep breath’. And just his journey through his character arc and his interaction with the others, it’s been fantastic to see. Even just finding opportunities for him to bounce off the other characters, you know, the way he talks to Bellara, the way he talks to Neve, it’s all so different, but it’s all so just, again, based around this core of this warm, kind-hearted, professorial necromancer, which again is not something that you see a lot of in media, usually necromancers are depicted a very specific way. But it’s been, just awesome to see how Emmrich has grown and just, really one of the most, one of my favorite experiences has been just working with Emmrich’s writer and working with Emmrich as a character.

Lucy: And Nick, you are the voice behind Emmrich.

Nick: I am.

Lucy: How did you prepare for the role, you know, what were you told about him before you got into the booth for the first time?

Nick: I think I’ve been preparing for Emmrich all my life. I was very attracted to the role initially. And I was so, I was overjoyed when I got it because I think it was, the writing of Emmrich is really fascinating. It’s this, this man that is obsessed with death, on one hand, but on death as a comfort, death as a transition, death as something that is not scary, and that ability to enable people to transition, and the investment that he gives in that sphere, which we don’t give in our own lives. I was immediately attracted to that and I thought that that was – I’d never seen that before, and so to go in these two ways, to talk about death and to talk about it in a way that is kind and that the transition becomes a kind transition, that was fascinating to me, and I think, will be fascinating to you too, yeah.

Lucy: And I hear as well that Emmrich gets, I mean, you’re all gonna get some fantastic lines, but I hear that Emmrich has some quite spectacular ones. You, Nick, you and Ashley, I would love to hear about the process of, was it difficult to get like some of those tongue-twisters, and?

Ashley: Yeah, Sylvia the lead writer basically was like, ‘Ash, you’re gonna need a dictionary for all of the sessions with Emmrich’, it’s like, 'Okay!'. And we get there, you just nailed them all, like 'shduhfejdkjjdhdjdhfjehfjkhehe into the Fade'.

Nick: Well, I don’t know if I nailed them all, that’s very kind of you. But, there was some serious tongue-twisters there, and, but it’s great, it’s great to be in the booth, and to be given a challenge like that, and. Yeah, it’s fantastic, I mean that’s what I love to do, so it was great to be just gifted that.

Ashley: You’re such a natural nerdy scientist. […]

Nick: It's my inner self.

Ashley: It's your inner secret.

Nick: Yeah.

Lucy: Now I love that, and I think, I think the, I, I’m drawn towards with Emmrich is that like, he loves learning.

Ashley: Yeah!

Lucy: It’s very clear, like, it seems like you’ve really just thrown yourself into this role and the world of Dragon Age. You know, I asked Zach a similar question and it’s like, you’ve been working on this for so long, what’s it like now that people have caught a glimpse of your character, it is just a glimpse, but people are desperate to know more?

Nick: I mean it’s so interesting that this character has kind of caught fire a little because, when I did it I thought ‘okay, well everyone else is like so sexy and like, it’s just amazing, and I’ll just be this kind of professorial kinda guy chatting in the background, having fun, you know, dealing with death, and you know, on the side’, and suddenly it became this thing of like, no, this is actually really interesting. And I think people have found it interesting, and I love that! I love that you guys have also found it as interesting as I have as because, it’s, it's a fantastic character, he’s a fantastic character, honestly.

Lucy: I mean, Ashley, working with Nick, any other highlights to share about your time in the booth, or?

Ashley: Oh man, every, Nick is the most consistent person I’ve ever met in the booth – or in his garage.

Nick: Yeah.

Ashley: Recording booth, he’s really like [a hippy in art?], so I, so it’s kinda trippy, seeing you again in person and knowing what your character looks like.

Nick: Yeah.

Ashley: But yeah, you’ve just been so consistent with Emmrich and bringing this grounded-ness, and I’ve learned so much working with you, and. Yeah, now, you tell me, what, what good really looks like.

Nick: Oh wow, thank you, thank you. Appreciate that.

Lucy: I mean obviously, there’s Manfred too.

Nick: [gasp!]

Lucy: Played by Matt Mercer. What was it like kind’ve having another character to [...] bounce off of?

Nick: Oh man! I mean that is such a hard question because Matt and I have never met.

Ashley: Yeah.

Nick: And we worked completely separately, and. I mean I know that the rapport is really great, but it’s in the ether, I mean it is just, the magic that these guys create, telling us how to respond, how to do that, but it’s, I can’t wait to meet Matt.

Ashley: We recorded, basically before Manfred.

Nick: Right.

Ashley: All of before Manfred.

Nick: Right.

Ashley: And so Manfred got to play off of your straight delivery -

Nick: OH he did? I did not know that. Oh man!

Ashley: I know!

Nick: He got the easy part!

Ashley: Yeah, totally! So you set him up, just to knock it out of the park –

Nick: Right!

Lucy: Okay, so you got to set the tone. You get [...]

Ashley: Yeah, yeah […]

Nick: Right right right right. I set the tone!

Lucy: And, finally. Last but certainly not least, Ali Hillis returning as Scout Harding. Please [indicates for applause]. Now, I’m so excited because, she’s one of my favorite Dragon Age characters period and it looks like we’ll be seeing a lot more of her. But what has she been up to, John, between Inquisition and The Veilguard?

John: So I mean, if you’ve read the comics, you know that Scout Harding has been working with Varric to track down Solas. So she has been on his tail for quite some time. The game starts just as they finally - tracked him down, figured out where he is, but she’s been working with the remnants of the Inquisition, working with Varric, and then also working with Rook and Neve. Again, if you read the comics, you know that Harding has met Neve, they have a […] relationship before the events of the game. But yeah, she is dedicated to taking someone who used to be a friend, someone she considered, you know, even if they weren’t close, because Harding wasn’t part of the Inquisitor’s core companions, somebody she knew, somebody who treated her with some amount of respect, and knowing what he’s up to now, knowing she has to stop him, so.

Lucy: She was in the core Inquisitor’s, of my heart, so.

John: That’s right, well, I mean, she had the light romance, so.

Lucy: I tried to flirt with her every time. Never went anywhere. Ali, you are no stranger to playing beloved BioWare characters, obviously, Doctor Liara T’Soni.

Ali: [in her Liara voice] It is very nice to see you all today.

Lucy: What’s it like to be returning as Lace Harding?

Ali: First of all, it was a complete surprise. I don’t know if it was for you guys, but it was for me. So I was so excited when I got that call, because I had no idea it was coming. And after recording the last Dragon Age, and going to cons, much like this one, and having the line in front of me and all my pictures spread out, and every few people, someone would come up and say, well, ‘Where’s your Scout Harding photo?’ I was like, ‘oh, I didn’t bring one! Like. I didn’t realize! Okay!’ So I started getting more into the idea that this was a really beloved character, and I didn’t realize! And she was so much fun to create because BioWare gives us so much freedom as actors, it’s such a collaborative effort, both with Liara as well as Scout, I remember getting in the studio for the very first time to record these characters. I do a lot of voiceover, I do a lot of amazing games, I don’t always remember the very first day in the studio with a project, and I do for both of these projects. Because they were so poignant in my life, because it was, it was, a group of people coming together, they had already obviously conceptualized these characters. There was art, there was writing, brilliant writing that we are only so lucky to chew on in these voiceover sessions with such expert direction. The material that we are given to work with, only, just blasts us off this planet, in the acting world. But, just, knowing that when we went in to create Scout Harding to begin with, and one of the ideas I remember us talking about was, like, ‘well, I wonder if she’s kind of a character whom, when she talks, maybe she draws in the dirt with her toe?’ You know, coming up with these little tiny bits of yumminess to create a character and build it, the fact that they give us that honor to work with them on it, you know, is incredible. So when I heard that she was coming back, I was thrilled from the inside out, because I felt a part of this whole thing, so thank you, guys, for bringing her back. You! [to the audience] You! [to BioWare devs' direction] Thank you.

Lucy: I think I can speak for all of us when I say, we are thrilled.

Ashley: Yeah.

Lucy: You know, a lot has changed in the time since Dragon Age: Inquisition. I mean, what, how, for you has the experience of recording changed, like, technology-wise? Obviously, a little thing happened in 2020 we don’t have to talk about, but how has it changed for you?

Ali: Yeah, and speaking of that little thing that we’re not supposed to talk about, but the way that this company pivoted and, I mean, we were working on something, we had a project in the works, and somehow, every single person had to deal with this big thing in the world that we’re not talking about -

Lucy: We can talk about it.

Ali: - and somehow produce a game! So when you guys play this, just know that the amount of effort that went into this one, you know, maybe exceeds every game I’ve ever worked on because, we had to, everyone had to pivot, you know, suddenly we’re working from our garages – me too – and usually we’re wearing pants. And, and, you know, when I worked on past games with BioWare, everybody was in Edmonton, pretty much, and then everyone just kinda dispersed and I didn’t know where anybody was, and Ash was working out of her house all the time. It was incredible because we just did it, we pivoted, like all of you did, like all of us did, and we all came together and we made it happen and I was really really proud of that. Anyway, I know we weren’t supposed to talk about it, but it was magical, and powerful, and incredible. And I’m so sorry, back to the original question.

Lucy: No, I mean, how has the process changed for you?

Ali: The process has changed for me? I got to do p-cap! I got to be her! I got to physicalize, they gave me that, I got to physicalize her this time, which I didn’t get to do last time and I did not get to do in Mass Effect. And I really had a great time with it! Because, just like these guys have all talked about, we all come from different acting and theater backgrounds, I think Ash as well, and different types of performance, and it was cool to get on the volume - the p-cap stage -because, it’s like a theater.

Ashley: Yeah.

Ali: You have freedom! It’s better than a theater because you can turn around backwards and talk like this and everybody still knows what’s going on, so, it’s freedom in acting and we get to really bring the character to life outside of being behind the microphone and envisioning all of it, we actually get to perform. So that was one big difference for me in this game particularly. That, and the, doing it from my home sometimes in voiceover, or studio, it was, we kinda just, went with the flow.

Lucy: Is it easy to come back to a character that you kinda know inside out, or is it kind of like a mental block about it because you’re returning to something, or is it easier to come up with something new to […] What was it like getting back into the shoes of Harding?

Ali: That’s a really good question because it had been a minute. I mean, I’m so excited this game is releasing, how about you? Woo! You know what, with her, again, just kind of like Liara, because we came about this character so organically, I did ask, I remember asking to hear voice-bytes, I just wanna make sure we were in the same ballpark. But also, you know, there’s been an evolution.

Ashley: Yeah, you’ve seen some shit.

Ali: Yeah. We can’t really talk about it, you guys’ll have to find out for yourselves. But there’s been an evolution, so.

Ashley: Yeah.

Ali: So, yeah, it’s, it's, I can’t really say anything else about it without giving stuff away.

Ashley: She comes back with such, like, a veteran voice, y'know?

Lucy: Yeah, I kinda noticed that, like, she’s, she’s got a little bit more of an edge to her.

Ashley: Yeah.

Ali: Yes.

John: Well, she’s been chasing Solas for almost a decade, so.

Ali: And I love that, that is an amazing relationship that you guys created. And then I’ll stop talking about that. Damn!

John: No more!

Ali: I’m so excited!

John: I know!

Ali: I defer to these guys!

Lucy: I mean, question, kind’ve for all of you. We kind’ve touched on it a little bit, the challenges, and you know, the fact that the game is almost here, Fall 2024. I’d love to know, down the line, and just, you know, what’s been kind’ve your guiding light for all of you on this project?

John: I mean for me, it’s always been about, Dragon Age has always been about the people. I mean, the companions, the villains, the allies you make along the way. And for us, making sure that that stayed central, that that was still our guiding light. We really wanted to focus the game, the story, the gameplay, always around yourself as a character, but also the other characters in the world, not just, again, how they relate to you, but also, having these relationships, having this idea of this world that exists, with people that exist, not just as kind’ve a theme park for the player character to go through. But they have lives, and they have internality, like they’ve got an internal life of their own, that cause them to act in ways that may not always be predictable, but is always fascinating, and makes them feel real, even if you’re only getting a few dozen lines, they feel like real people.

Lucy[?]: Yeah.

Ashley: Yeah. I think that was my guiding light, like, I’m, have to find logic in these, you know, over hundred thousand lines in the story and over 700 unique characters you can meet. And I, in this fantasy world, I, we’re all still looking for the truth. What is the truth? How can we ground this? Do I believe it? Do you believe it? Are we in it? And that was always my North star. And, you know, often times I’m in the booth, and sometimes I’ll just, ‘I don’t buy it, I don’t buy it’, or, and, so, it was my job to be the gatekeeper, I felt, in the booth, to make sure, that I buy it, so you will all buy it.

Zach: I made the mistake, before we started shooting, of checking out the Reddit of Dragon Age. Not a good idea. It was a bad idea. But what I did, what struck me is that these people, these fans, have the same passion for this game that I have had for a hundred fantasy worlds. You know, places where I’ve gone into and discovered different parts of myself through. through, following these stories. And so I felt an, I felt so, it was so incumbent upon me to put as much effort as I could into this game. And I really do feel like the fans inspired me to pour my heart and soul into this, and I just cannot wait for you guys to play it, I really cannot.

Lucy: Jessica, what about you?

Jessica: I would say for me it was the dialogue, honestly. I loved the writing, Brianne was my writer, and Ashley, and John, and she’s right, like it’s, you gotta go deeper, and like we’re trying to find it, and we’re trying to find it together, and sometimes we’re not there, and sometimes we have to come back to it, you know, there was, I could tell there was such an evolution in my work, and part of that was because I just kind’ve gave it over to the writing. And whenever I did get to play off the other actors, you know, sometimes they’ll have, you can play in with their lines, and that was just such a joy, and I got to like discover other little parts of the game that I had no idea about, you know, because we’re doing it in isolation. So that was kind’ve the joy for me, and just honestly trusting, trusting the team and Ashley and John, so.

Lucy: Nick?

Nick: Yeah, I mean I’d have to say narrative as well, I think what the writers have done on this show, you don’t get in other games, you just don’t. You don’t get the level of, the depth of character. And character makes story. And that is what they focused on here. And I just kept coming back into that booth going, ‘I’ve never, I’ve never, experienced this before’. And just one last thing as well, I think the fact that we were separate, and I’m only just sort’ve putting this together now, the fact that we didn’t see each other, the fact that we didn’t know each other, has created a kind of magic that, I think is extraordinary. You can’t see somebody and you have to listen in the dark for cues and signals, and you have to put it together. That, that is magical. And I think, out of the chaos of 2020, 2021, 2022, which was exactly when we were recording and trying to figure this out, that’s when the magic came together, that’s, and I think we all feel that here, and I really hope you guys do too.

Lucy: Ali?

Ali: Well I feel like they’ve kinda covered it. I was gonna speak to kinda like what John said. One thing I really like about this game particularly, and I think you guys will find this as well, is you really find yourself in it.

Ashley: Yeah.

Ali: And the relationships, not only with the player and the people you bring along, but the team with each other, it’s just, it’s so well-written, the relationships are so conditioned that you really get lost in the moment. And I love when I’m at a con signing somewhere and someone comes to the table and says, you know, ‘this is a game that took me away from something I was dealing with in my real life, and I’m so grateful for it’, and I feel like, this is one of those games. This is gonna take you into a world that’s gonna blow your mind. And, I was just so honored to be a part of this group, again, again, I’m just gonna echo everything everybody said. But when I would hear their voices in my cans, in my headset, and I don’t get to see their faces, there is something so specific and so intimate about that experience, when you’re not seeing each other, and you’re just hearing, they have this amazing system where we get to hear each other. Whoever’s recorded first is played, if I’m having a conversation with these guys, if they’ve recorded first, I get to hear them and talk back. Acting is reacting. So it’s really nice that I actually get to react honestly off of these guys with expert guidance. So, I was really appreciative that we’ve conditioned these relationships in a fantasy land and also in real life, and I think you guys will feel that when you play.

Lucy: Now we do have time for Q&A. I'm gonna ask the panel another question, but if you wanna start lining up, we have, people are jumping to their feet already, this is great. We have a microphone right here. Before we go to Q&A, I suppose, what's the big, the biggest takeaway you want when people actually get to play later this year?

John: For me, honestly, it's just, how much this project has just been a team effort in a way that, everyone is working collaboratively with each other, everyone is bouncing off each other. Everyone was talking earlier about the writing, but I think what's fascinating for [...] has been so awesome to see is, the actors also shaping these characters as we built them. Seeing, like, how, Nick delivers a line, how Zach delivers a line, how Jessica delivers a line, how, and then, bouncing off that and then forming the character, shaping the character, so. We realize, okay, so, Ali has this, you know, has this, says things in a very specific way. Maybe we, let's re-write a few things, let's really lean into this, you know, what she brings to the character, and it's just. That's true across the entire team. It's not just the actor, it's not just the writer, but everybody who has worked on it, has a little piece of themselves in it. And to me there's just this excitement that that brings, and just this amazing passion that you can see in everything that's been built in this game.

Ali: It's so cool, I was gonna say, when we were recording, and I know we gotta get these questions, when we were recording during the pandemic and we were at home, I didn't realize sometimes that on the Zoom call I'd only see Ashley's face, or sometimes, you know, whatever, whatever she puts up. And then suddenly I'd have a question, 'hey, so in this line, this and this?', suddenly, like, John, or somebody else would just pop in, and talk about the line, so, we were always collaborating, it was just amazing, I was very grateful to have you guys ever-present.

John: Thank you.

Lucy: Alright. Shall we go to our first question? We all ready?

[?]: Yeah.

Lucy: Alright.

Audience member: Hello. [...] fan of Dragon Age since Origins. Oh, I must say, I am very disappointed with this panel. You've failed to mention a very important part of the game! The factions!

John: Mmm!

Audience member: So I would like to know, what can you tell me about them, and, can you join them, or do you just interact with them?

John: So, you start the game, you get to choose which background you go with. Each one is tied to one of the major factions. But one of our principles from the start was the concept of 'characters not causes'. So we didn't wanna just give you, 'here's the Grey Wardens, they're just kinda this group that exists in the world', we wanted to attach characters to them. So I can speak to the Grey Wardens in particular, anyone who's read comics and any of our short stories know Evka and Antoine, they kind've represent your connection to that faction. And you can work with them throughout the story, you can help them out. And decide how much you want to spend time with them. But each one of them [...] represents these important forces in the world that you need to get on your side if you're gonna stop the end of the world, so.

Audience member: Looks good.

Lucy: I was gonna say, Zach, you've done, you've done your research, so how exciting was it for you to kind've see and hear all these factions coming into play?

Zach: What, I'm sorry, can you repeat the question?

Lucy: You did all your research, so.

Zach: Oh, yeah.

Lucy: How exciting was it for you to hear about these factions and then hearing about how they'll come into play in the game?

Zach: Well, I don't think they kept my voice for Antoine, but I did my best French accent, I think it was pretty painful for everybody else on set, I really did. Oh yeah, the Grey Wardens are a barrel of laughs, those guys, they're absolutely wonderful. Well, yeah, so I had to play a bunch of characters, so I had to really steep myself in the understanding that, okay, the Grey Wardens go a lot, go through a lot, actually, doing what they do. They make a pretty intense bond in order to carry out exactly what they do. So, I tried to bring that as best I can to the physicality when I did do the motion capture and whatnot, but I cannot wait to see how it plays out in the game.

Lucy: Next question.

Audience member: Hello, I've also been a fan of Dragon Age since Origins. So, I've noticed in pretty much all of the games, there's a lot of influence from classical fantasy and mythology. So I was wondering, general question for the whole panel, what was your first exposure to fantasy or mythological storytelling, and do you use any of that in your voice-acting?

John: Hm. I can speak to mine but I can't speak to the voice-acting part, obviously. I mean I read Lord of the Rings at a very young age, and everything that you read that you, any piece of art that you enjoy, engage with, it's obviously gonna have an influence on yourself and also what you do.

Ashley: Yeah, there's a [depth?], in it, you know, to the fantasy world, that acting, it's kind of timeless, right? It can be anything, anywhere, and I feel like when we were doing the voices, we, you know, we didn't want it to be in 2020 or 2024 or whatever, so I think that's how I was most influenced, is, what's the most universal sound or a language, or a mixture of those, that can feel like nobody knows what it is?

Zach: I mean I was obsessed with, I think it's Theseus and the Minotaur, that story, when I was young. Did I just put my foot, I think it's Theseus, it could be Perseus, I can never remember okay?

Audience member: It's Theseus.

Zach: It's Theseus? My man! Thank you. I appreciate it. But I love the symbolism in those types of myths, right? Like, the Minotaur is this half-man, half-beast, who sits in the middle of the labyrinth, and the labyrinth is, of course, your mind, and you are also the Minotaur, and you are also Theseus. But so, getting to see the symbolism that's represented in Dragon Age, and how deep the meaning is, like that, those the stories I've always wanted to tell, ever since I was young, so I, it was a real honor to get to bring this to life.

Jessica: I also, my first, was Lord of the Rings, but I also was very interested in Greek mythology growing up. And, yeah, I think it's that, as Zach said, the symbolism, that you see, and like, I think you really see that in Dragon Age, and I know you know, right, you all, like, know the lore, and go looking for things, and that's really exciting to me. And then, just, yeah, the limitless possibility, right? You're not limited to what people look like, or whether you're human, I don't know, you know what I'm saying, like, that can really can take your mind and the world and the depth of the world anywhere and everywhere. And that's so exciting.

Nick: Yeah, I mean, for me it was The Hobbit, as well, my mom read me The Hobbit, and I would go, 'stop, stop!' And I would run to her closet and put on a pair of her boots, these shiny boots, and wear a cape, and I would go 'okay, okay, carry on' [...], you know, just, I would just, I would just be so in it. And then I'd go like, 'stop, stop, I'm gonna read that bit, I'm gonna read that bit'. And, you know, it was just, it absolutely informed why I'm sitting here today.

Ali: I wish I had better answers. Talking about, instead of yesteryear, talking about recently, I was travelling, and we were in Greece, and I feel like I saw Dragon Age everywhere. Just like an inspiration to travel and look back and, I'm now infatuated with castles. So, actually, it's brought me into this world, instead of me discovering it, you know, a long time ago, this has what's really brought me here.

[?]: Thank you very much.

[?]: Thank you.

Lucy: Thank you for your question.

Audience member: Hello, thank you for answering questions. For the new companions, if you could romance, from your companion's perspective, which older companion would you romance?

Ali: This could get embarrassing!

Zach: I kinda have a thing for The Iron Bull. Yeah, I saw him for the first time when I was looking up some answer to some question I had when I was reading the books, and I was like, 'oh, that awakened something inside of me! Huh! Look at that!' - You guys are gonna leave me hanging after I said that I want to have sex with The Iron Bull?

Jessica: [...] Um, I, I, don't know, honestly, I'm overwhelmed by that question, so [...]

Nick: I guess I'm a little overwhelmed by that question too. I have a particular fondness for Manfred, but, you know that's, that's a very particular relationship. I would say, like, I think what you've done with Solas is really sexy [...]

Zach: Dorian is really cute too. Yeah. [...] the mustache. Dig that guy.

Ali: Well, he's sitting right next to me, so this is a little embarrassing, but every time I heard Emmrich in my cans. Just, woooo. I might be on-board with all of the fans out there for Emmrich. If you'll have me, if you'll have me.

[?]: Thank you.

Panel: Thank you.

Audience member: So, the first game I played was Inquisition, and, this is not a knock, but, because, my reference would be Mass Effect, and I love that series. For Mass Effect 1 to Mass Effect 3, it seems the games was more streamlined. I'm getting the same feel from Inquisition to this one. Does that, what you can expect from gameplay-wise?

John: I mean, I don't think there's any, I don't think it's streamlined, it's. Again, each Dragon Age has been fundamentally different in its gameplay. We've tried things, seeing what works, seeing what didn't. In the case of The Veilguard, just like the other games, you wanna keep that tactical, strategic complexity and make that the centerpiece. And each one we focused on a little bit differently. In the case of this one, I think our skills in particular are some of the best we've done. There's some exciting combinations you do there, so.

Audience member: Thank you so much.

John: No worries.

[?]: Okay. There we are, okay.

Audience member: I was wondering what your favorite aspect was of the character you voiced?

Lucy: Ali, should we start with you this time?

Ali: I mean, so many layers, man, we're talking BioWare characters here! I think some of my favorite things about Lace Harding are the little things. Like, she loves her mom, you know, she loves to write letters home, she's always talking about her mama's soup and stuff like that. I love that relationship. She likes plants, and raising plants, which is inspirational, since I kill them. But just the texture they add to the characters, that's, in general, but for me, yeah, it's those little things that really kinda give me a bunch of stuff to work with in my brain, for bringing these characters to life.

Zach: I love the fact that Lucanis is a good cook. I just imagine him finishing a job and then going home, and, you know, cooking him a meal to kind've calm himself down, but with like the same knife he just used to murder somebody. He cleaned it of course, he cleaned it, but at the same time [...] -

Ali: I recommend my mama's soup.

Jessica: I really enjoyed, we sort've worked to bring, like, a noir element to Neve, and her being a private investigator, and so I really enjoyed leaning into that. And then she's just so dry, you know, like, things really mean a lot to her, but she's not necessarily gonna let you know that, you know what I mean? You have to kind've, like, discover that underneath. And, so I, I related to that, and I love that about her.

Ali: I was gonna say, 'I don't know anyone like that'.

Nick: I loved the, the fact that the writers just took Emmrich and explored the whole idea of death. The whole idea of necromancing, and, I really responded to that, I got into that, and bringing kindness into it, I know that sounds crazy, but it's to not have this idea that death is vulgar or kind've to be, something to be terrified about, but something to actually engage with on so many levels. I just thought the fact that the writers had the courage to do that in a game like this, I thought, it just blew my mind.

[?]: Thank you for the question.

Lucy: I think we have time for a couple more quick ones.

Audience member: Hi, okay, so first of all. Okay, hi, again. So, first of all, my dad just died, so [...]

[?]: Oh, I'm sorry.

Audience member: [...] Thank you. [...] So, [...] what you said about your take on Emmrich, really, really, I appreciated that. So, my question, to, I guess, John, would be, so, lore-wise, mechanically, not like story-telling-wise for the lore, how do you decide what lore goes in what games? Like, just, okay, so like, what decides what goes in Dragon Age 3, what goes in Dragon Age 4, what goes in Dragon Age 90-bajillion? Not from like a story perspective, right, but from, like a, what do we want to do, right?

John: Mhm. I mean it really does come down to, each one, as we build, it's, it's hard to say it as [...] something that we come [...], it's like, 'okay, we're gonna do it this way, this way, this way', mechanically, but, we kind've, we always know the base lore of the franchise, of the IP, and as we start to build the story, we start to see these opportunities to again, [...] speaking mechanically, bring certain elements in that make the most sense with the characters we're building and the story we're telling. We try not to overwhelm by saying a bunch, having a bunch of lore included that's not necessarily critical to the understanding of the story, but we always wanna expand the universe, and expand the IP, so.

Audience member: Thank you.

John: You're welcome.

Ali: And, can we please have a Dragon Age 90-bajillion?

John: I'd like that.

Ali[?]: That'd be amazing.

Audience member: Hi, I'm Matt. I've been a fan of Dragon Age since, actually, The Stolen Throne book, before I even knew there was like a game. And my question was, for the voice actors, one of my favorite things is the party banter. Was there any, like, lines of party banter that you recorded that you can say that just made you just, like, laugh, 'cause some of the party banter is pretty hilarious. Like, is there a certain thing that just sticks in your mind, whether you can say what it is, or just who it was with, like, so I can be on the lookout for it?

Ashley: I have one, it's so not appropriate. Do I have permission to say it?

Ali: That's what I was gonna say.

Zach: Yeah, say it.

Ashley: Listen for "hand-to-bone combat".

Lucy: I mean, do we end it there?

Ali[?]: And, scene.

Lucy: Well thank you so much everyone for coming to the panel. Thank you [...] Fall 2024.

[panel ends]

[source: DA:TV ‘Meet The Companions’ panel @ SDCC. BioWare have said that they are going to share the recording of the panel at a later date].

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