#you couldn’t get mad at me for defending a historical woman’s femaleness. but saying something like this will make the prof hostile to me

[cats-in-the-clouds]

successfully dropped the women’s and gender history class

[alecthemovieguy]

Being Nicole

‘Supergirl’ star Nicole Maines’ passion for transgender rights makes her super in real life, too

Transgender activist and actor Nicole Maines knew she was a girl around the age of 3 or 4. 

“My case is kind of unique because I have a twin brother (Jonas),” she told Ellen Degeneres during an appearance on “Ellen” in 2018. “So, growing up with him, he was identifying with all these male things and feeling very comfortable in his body, and I wasn’t.” 

Maines, the subject of the Mount Washington Valley’s One Book One Valley community read “Becoming Nicole,” slowing began publicly transitioning in the first grade, and officially presented herself as female in the fifth grade, when she changed her name from Wyatt to Nicole. 

Maines, who is turning 22 on Oct. 7, became the center of the precedent-setting Maine Supreme Judicial Court case Doe v. Regional School Unit 26 regarding gender identity and bathroom use in schools. Maines had been barred from using the female bathroom after a complaint, but the court ruled that denying a transgender student access to the bathroom consistent with their gender identity is unlawful. 

In 2018, Maines debuted as Nia Nal/Dreamer, television’s first transgender superhero, on “Supergirl.” She is returning as a series regular for season five which premieres Sunday, Oct. 6, at 9 p.m. on The CW. 

One Book One Valley has a series of events throughout October culminating in an evening with “Becoming Nicole” author Amy Ellis Nutt on Thursday, Oct. 24, at 7 p.m. at Loynd Auditorium at Kennett High School in North Conway, N.H. In addition to Nutt, the plan is to have the Maines family be part of the discussion through a Skype connection.

I recently talked with Maines about growing up transgender, activism, privilege and the upcoming season of “Supergirl.”

“Becoming Nicole” is beautifully written, but it is very journalistic and academic in its approach. Is there anything you would’ve done differently or included in telling that story?

I don’t know. I think, of course, Amy did a phenomenal job, and I am so happy with how the book came out because I think it really does have something for everyone, whether or not you’re just starting to learn about transitioning and you’re looking for something new. But there was so much that had to be cut out in the final editing process and, unfortunately, a lot of what did get cut out was original writing from Jonas’ perspective. I don’t know if it was something I would’ve done differently, I think it is more of a shame that it couldn’t make it into the final cut. It was just so long before it was cut. So, I do hope at some point people do get to see that because it is really, really beautiful.

In “Becoming Nicole,” a therapist told your parents that you weren’t transgender because you were peeing standing up. What are some other examples you’ve encountered of misinformation about what transgender is?

Where do I even begin? So many people think that it is one of those things that you can kind of slap a label on and say, “This is what this is,” and with something as expansive as gender it is really impossible to paint it as very black and white. So many people have tried to say “Oh, all trans people look like this. This is how you spot a trans person.” And that’s 1) offensive, and 2) not true or realistic. 

I think a lot of that has to do with how historically we are represented in the media: men in dresses and this and that. It is so much more expansive than that. No one group of people looks a certain way, and it is dangerous to try to categorize people like that. So, I think besides the peeing standing up, which is ridiculous, what is equally ridiculous is the idea that some people think that they can spot a trans person, and that’s sort of the whole basis of their argument. 

You know how sometimes you read certain blogs or you read certain Twitter accounts just to make yourself mad? I stumbled across one, it was a really popular TERF account — which stands for trans-exclusionary radical feminists, which is pretty much feminists who believe trans women aren’t women, and they use recycled rhetoric from the ’70s saying that trans women are just men trying to invade women’s spaces and stupid shit like that. It was this person going on and on about, like, “Oh, none of you pass. None of you look like women. Yada yada yada.” And I was like, 1) no room to talk because her haircut was atrocious, and 2) come say it to my face. It really made me mad. It is atrocious that people think they can spot something like that. It is ridiculous. 

It is kind of like the back-handed compliment that I receive a lot, that is “Oh, you don’t look trans,” or “Oh, never really would’ve guessed.” A lot of the time, I try not to jump on people for that because I know it is coming from a place where they’re trying to give me a compliment, but what does trans look like? What did you think I was going to look like? 

And, of course, everyone thinks that we are supposed to look like men in dresses, which —  even if we did — is rude as hell to say something like that because, not only is that stupid, but it is also reinforcing negative beauty standards among women, not just trans women, but women. Because you hear about the bathroom bills and they are like, “Oh, we are going to enforce no trans people in bathrooms.” Well, how are you going to enforce that? And then you get cases of cis women getting kicked out of the bathrooms because they look more masculine than others. Even for cisgender women that is not a black and white line. People look different, and it is totally unfair and unreasonable to say just because someone has harder features than somebody else that this is what is going on in your pants. That feels like a wild, crazy assumption to me. 

So, obviously your father always loved you, but he struggled with your identity. Was there a specific moment when you finally felt truly seen by him?

I know a lot of moments where he really started having light bulb moments. I think for me, one of the first moments where I felt like I started being seen was when I started wearing girl’s clothes to school. My transition started going there slowly, but between second and third grade I had gone from wearing longer hair to wearing girl’s clothes all the time. I don’t know if it was even just my father, but by everyone, but that is when I started feeling like I was being seen. Then in fifth grade was when I had fully transitioned. I was allowed to pierce my ears and I was allowed to wear skirts and dresses. That really felt like I am seen. And then, of course, when my father finally started fighting for me. Because I knew, at that point, he still didn’t fully understand, but when he started defending me and defending my transition and my using the girl’s bathroom, I felt like I had him on my side. 

I love last season of “Supergirl.” One of my favorite moments was when Nia Nal/Dreamer publicly announced herself as both an alien and a transgender woman because it put a positive face on a group who were being demonized in the show. How important do you think it is to give a face to marginalized people?

It is incredibly important. The best way to fight against marginalization and the most effective way that we fight back against people who are trying to erase us is with visibility. When you have an administration who, for incidents in a crazy hypothetical, removed me from the 2020 census, then the best way to combat that is to be more visible than ever. By saying, OK, you’re trying to make people think that we are not valid, you’re trying to make people think we don’t exist and that we are not solid and valid in our identities and our existence. Well, then we are going to show you that we are. We are going to show you: no, you cannot ignore us because we are here and it doesn’t really matter what you believe. It doesn’t really matter if you say, “Well, I don’t really believe in transgender.” Well, it isn’t really something for you to believe in because whether you like it or not, we are here. We exist and that’s not a matter of opinion. You do not get to choose whether or not my identity is valid because I am not doing it for you and we are not going to let you erase that. So, I think visibility is the number one method of defense against erasure. 

Based on the trailer, the new season of “Supergirl” partially deals with the betrayal and anger Lena Luthor feels toward Carol Danvers hiding her identity of Supergirl from her. This seems like an apt metaphor for the similar sense of betrayal, hurt and confusion some people feel when a loved one comes out as trans or gay. Do you think that is intentional?

I don’t know if it was intentional. I think because there are so many different layers with Carol and Lena’s relationship, and especially with the Kryptonian-Luthor relationship. I think it is hard to boil it down to just that, because I get why Lena is upset and I get why those feelings are floating around, but personally, I’m kind of like nobody owes any facet of their identity to anybody but themselves. If they did not feel that they wanted to share a part of their identity with you, you don’t get to be mad about that. That is something that belongs entirely to them and if they did not choose, for whatever reason to disclose that part of themselves, that’s not because you necessarily did anything wrong, that’s because they had a choice and that’s not necessarily on them either. But, like I said, it is different between being trans and being a superhero. It is hard because, at the same time, it is like, “Oh, you were treating me like Lex, and I’m not Lex. You can trust me.” So, there’s a whole bunch of other stuff floating around, but I don’t know if it was a 100 percent intentional, but there are definitely connections. 

That’s the great thing about sci-fi is that it can always be used as a metaphor for exploring social issues. 

Absolutely. 

How will Nia Nal be challenged in the new season?

The theme of this season is communication, and so something Nia is struggling with the first chunk of the season is communicating with how she feels with Brainiac because they’ve been dating and they have been having communication issues. Neither of them are the best at relationships, and so this is kind of a new area for her and she’s trying to work out, “How do I express how I feel without hurting you?” And that’s something she struggles with a lot. It is being open and honest with how she’s feeling and trying not to bottle up what she is feeling for the sake of other people. 

What I also really love about Nia Nal is when she puts herself out there — kind of going off the whole thing of passing — she does pass as both a human and a woman, and so she doesn’t need to put herself out there, but by doing so she empowers others. Do you also try to lead by example in your own life?

Absolutely, I recognize 100 percent as Nia and as Nicole that I have an insane amount of privilege. I’m white and, like you said, I pass and I’m on TV. And I mention that I am on TV because when we look at issues like HB2 and we look at bathroom bills and stuff like that, that is not necessarily going to affect me as someone who passes and as someone who is in Vancouver. I’m working in Vancouver, HB2 will not affect me. I am not there. But I recognize that there are issues that are affecting members of my community who don’t have the same significant platform that I do. And so it is my responsibility as a member of that community, as someone with that platform, to lift them up and to start to shine a light on issues that are affecting members of my community, even if I personally will not feel the impact of that harmful legislation. 

It is important and that’s what we talk about in feminist circles. We are always talking about how can people with privilege use that privilege to lift others up, to better the situation of others who don’t have those some privileges. We ask that of men, we ask that of white people, we ask that of abled-body people, of trans women who pass. We ask that people use their privilege responsibly. And so that is what I try to do and I hope that I am succeeding. I just try to use my platform and use my voice to talk about issues that I feel matter. 

Going back to “Becoming Nicole,” the book discusses “The Little Mermaid” as a metaphor for being transgender because Ariel doesn’t feel she belongs in the ocean and everyone tells her you have to be with your own people blah, blah, blah. Ariel was one of your favorite characters growing up, do you feel even at a young age you were drawn to this character because your struggle paralleled her struggle?

I guess subconsciously, yes, but on a surface level, I liked mermaids. I don’t know why I liked it so much and that’s why I say subconsciously I was drawn to it. I remember loving that more than anything else. I loved everything about her. I remember I was like, “That is what I want for myself.” I was like, “She is so beautiful, and she is so graceful,” which is not a trait that I’ve been able to replicate in my own life. I remember being so drawn to her, and I was like “Mom, Dad, that is what we are going for. That is the look.” Between her and, I’ve said it before, Storm from the X-Men. I remember watching “X-Men: The Animated Series” as as kid and she had that hair and the cape and was like “Oh, that’s drama. I love it.” 

And now you have your own cape. 

Well, metaphorically speaking. I don’t have a superhero cape. I feel a little cheated. 

Well, maybe you can get one. 

No, I have the best supersuit. It is shiny and holographic. It is awesome. 

One part I really liked in “Becoming Nicole,” I think it was before you were going to enter fifth grade, you were asked what kind of story you’d tell and you said it would be this mystery/comedy/fantasy with a sassy character and a sidekick who was even sassier. If you were to write that story now what do you think it would look like?

Oh my God. Well, it would definitely have the sassy character and the sassier sidekick, because I remember growing up I was always the biggest fan of the sassy comic relief characters, which is why I tried to play that role in my own regular life, which took some getting used to. I remember in middle school people didn’t exactly get the whole me trying-to-be-funny and I think it just came across as annoying. If I was going to write that story now, I think it would absolutely be about murder that would be the mystery. The comedy that would manifest itself in probably macabre, offbeat humor about murder. And then the fantasy ... they are all vampires. I’m just describing “Bit.”

I haven’t been able to find anyway to watch “Bit” (which stars Maines as a transgender teen who falls in with four queer feminist vampires, who try to rid Los Angeles' streets of predatory men), but I am very interested in that film. What was it like making that?

It was so amazing and I hope you’ll be able to watch soon. Right now, it is making its festival rounds, and hoping someone will choose to distribute it, and we’re like, “Pay us, please!” It was so incredible. Everyone on set was amazing and our writer/director Brad Michael Elmore is the coolest dude on the planet. I was talking about using our privilege to tell stories that matter and to raise up minority voices, and that’s absolutely what he did in this situation. I know a lot of the festivals we have gone to have been feminist festivals and gay festivals, and we’ve had a significant amount of people kind of be like, “Oh, you were written by a straight cis white guy,” and we’re like,“Yeah, and he’s doing exactly what we want him to be doing, which is using his privilege to create this super awesome movie featuring queer and interracial talent, this intersectional group of feminists.” We had a female DP which how awesome is that? We had this super awesome kaleidoscope of different identities in this film and I feel like some folks are very quick to write it off because it was written by a straight cis white guy. 1) I don’t feel that is fair to Brad, and 2) I don’t think that is fair to the movie. The movie is so cool and the movie deals with such cool issues and it approaches them all in such a fucking awesome way. To write it off because of who our director is feels very shortsighted. 

And obviously you wouldn’t say or do anything that felt disingenuous to your own experience. 

Yes, absolutely. I was like, “Ye of little faith.” 

When you were 13 years old you went to the Maine statehouse and spoke to dozens of representatives to convince them to vote against a bill that would make it legal to discriminate against trans people. Do you have any interest in getting into politics either working for a campaign or as a candidate yourself?

I think I would be willing to support someone else’s campaign. Politics are not for me. I do not have the stomach for that. I do not have the patience for that. I know where my lane is and it is absolutely not going for an elected position. I am more the person who shows up when the politicians are not doing what they are supposed to be doing. That’s when I get involved. 

The big thing I took away from “Becoming Nicole” was that prejudice and hate is something that is taught, because the boy who started harassing you the most was told by his grandfather that you were wrong and that he should go after you. And so I guess the question is, what do you do to undo these wrongheaded lessons that are passed down by parents or grandparents?

I think the first step comes from within. You cannot make anybody do anything. You cannot make somebody unlearn hate and prejudice. That journey has to start with themselves. With my father — and, of course, he was never outwardly hateful or anything, I always knew he loved me — but his journey to acceptance started with him deciding to pick up Jennifer Finney Boylan’s book (about being a transgender woman) and read it. He had to ask himself what he was so afraid of if his son was his daughter. He had to ask himself what about that terrified him so much. And that’s what every person has to do. 

Every person has to be aware of their own prejudices and their own biases. We all have them. We have to be aware of them. We have to actively work to undo them because it is something we are taught, not even just by our parents or caretakers, but through television and society. We are pumped full of biases and prejudices that we are not even aware of, and so we have to pay extra care and extra caution to do undo those. And when we catch ourselves, we have to recognize, “No, that’s not right” and go from there.

It has to be a conscious choice, and so that is hard. It is a hard thing to do. It is a really gross feeling to try to unlearn stuff like that, and so a lot of people won’t do that because a lot of people are more comfortable being like, “No, I don’t get it, that’s gross, I don’t like it and I’m going to hate it.” That is much easier and much more comfortable then asking yourself what you are afraid of. As socially responsible participants in the community, we have a responsibility to ask that question anyway. All of us have to ask that question and not just about trans issues, because if we don’t do that, if we are looking for what is easy and what is comfortable at the expense of other people, then stay inside. 

And I feel like the biggest thing is if you’re afraid of a gay person or trans person or black, Hispanic, whatever social issue, if you actually talk to these people that you are afraid of, that you’d see that they are just human beings.

That is the number one thing. It is so much easier to marginalize a group of people when you are not putting names to faces, when we are not putting faces to groups, when you are dehumanizing them. It is so much easier to sweep their plights under the rug and be like, “Oh, they don’t matter,” because you are not talking to them, you’re not seeing them as people. That’s why I always say, “Come say it to my face.” It is so much harder to be an asshole to someone’s face because you have to look them in the eye and tell them their rights don’t matter.

[gweniala]

Quantum Uncertainty

After re-reading Dake of the Past by shinakazami1, I was so violently inspired that I spent the whole afternoon, evening and morning writing. This is the 9-page result. I am proud of my muse.

If you’re not familiar with my five Guardians, have a look at NH: The Guardians at my dA page. That should do for an introduction so that you’re not confused who is who.

Important note: Several parts of this fanfiction, mostly the “flashbacks”, were taken from shina’s Dake of the Past and adapted so that they’d fit with my writing style a little more. I don’t claim ownership of those pieces. In fact, this entire thing is heavily based on Dake of the Past, it’s basically a retelling from another angle and... making it cannon. Go shina, your ideas are strange and awesome.

***

„Adah!“

The scream woke Ruze up like a knife stab. He shot up and looked around wildly. He heard a thump in the darkness… and when he finally made light, he saw Dake lying on the floor next to his bed.

“…What?” Gome asked sleepily.

“Dake?” Ruze growled. The Guardian of Fire groaned.

“I think I was having a nightmare…”

Ruze snorted, half annoyed, half relieved. “Don’t scare me like that. You almost gave me a heart attack.”

“Sorry…” Dake muttered, picking himself up from the floor. “Good night,” he said, lying down again.

“What was the nightmare about?” Gome asked curiously. He was shushed by three of his brothers, but Dake answered in spite of that. “I don’t rememeber anymore…”

“Lame,” Gome yawned.

Before Ruze went back to sleep, he saw Dake light a scented candle beside his bed. He usually kept one alight throughout the night, said it helped him sleep. Did he forget to light it in the evening? Ruze couldn’t remember.

They all fell back asleep one by one.

***

“Tell me only once more ‘I love you’… and I will never go away again.”

***

“Look at that beauty,” Dake said and nudged Kamzik in the rib cage. The Hoodian jerked and spilled dynamite powder on his lap.

“What?”

Dake pointed. Caline and Krevel were walking across the Arena toward the Explosive Shack. They were chatting amicably.

“May I remind you that she’s married?” Kamzik pulled one brow up and returned to stuffing his dynamite stick.

“Yeah but… do you see those huge… stems?” Dake grinned shamelessly, gesturing in front of his chest.

Kamzik rolled his eyes. “Why won’t you just leave her alone?”

“Because she’s one of the very few girls here!” Dake retorted, his gaze never leaving Caline’s body. “I can’t waste this opportunity.”

“It’s always girls, girls, girls with you,” Kamzik looked at the Guardian angrily. “What’s your problem? There aren’t any girls on the Neverhood. The only ones we’ve got is Tao who’s weird and Klaya who’s your mother! Why do you keep going on about them? Aren’t guys enough friends for you?”

“Ah-ah,” Dake wagged his finger. “You have to learn to appreciate beauty, my friend. The curves of a female body are the most refreshing gaze one can… Hello, madame,” he took off his non-existent hat and bowed to Caline, who had just entered the Shack. “May I interest you in some fireworks tonight?”

“No flirting, we’re just passing through,” Krevel told him sternly and pushed Caline through the Shack.

“They will start at eight in the Arena if you take a fancy!” Dake called after them with a wide smile. “Anyway, as I was saying,” he turned back to Kamzik. He paused when he saw what the Hoodian was doing with the dynamite stick. “That is going to explode in your hands, you know,” he said dryly.

“No, it’s not,” Kamzik defended his craft, covering the stick end and inspecting the finished product.

“Uh-huh,” Dake nodded, unimpressed. He took the dynamite stick from Kamzik’s hand (“Hey!”) and walked out into the Arena (“What’s your problem?”). “Watch and learn,” he told his discontented friend. He snapped his fingers and the fuse caught on fire. He barely had time to extend his hand before the dynamite exploded.

“For Quater’s sake, you madman!” Kamzik cried out, running out of the Shack toward his friend. When the smoke cleared, he saw that Dake was covered in soot and completely unharmed. “You’re crazy!”

“And you can’t stuff a dynamite stick,” Dake replied swiftly. “Come on, I’ll show you how it’s done so that you don’t lose a limb or two the next time.”

***

“Dake, why are you sleeping on the ground?”

It was Loopid, one of the youngest Hoodians. Dake groaned. He found Loopid terribly annoying. Whenever Dake approached a lady, this guy would appear out of nowhere and spoil his plans.

“What do you want, Loop?” Dake growled as he picked himself up from the ground. “I’m not bothering anyone right now. Is there a problem?”

Loopid didn’t answer. He was looking at his feet, rocking from side to side gently. Then he smiled, waved at Dake and walked away.

What is up with this guy? One moment he hates me, the next he’s all smiles.

But he wouldn’t waste any more time on him. He needed to see Klem, one of the Neverhood medics. Surely she would give him her time of the day.

***

Arig was tending to a gramophone flower sapling when he heard the inarticulate cry. He looked around quickly, recalling whom he had recently seen in the Garden. When he couldn’t see anyone, he felt out. Immediately he noticed a Hoodian lying under the five-leaved ivy. He rushed over. It was Dake, lying on his side and twitching.

“You said to her… live for… three more years, and…“ he was mumbling.

„Dake,“ Arig called out to his brother. Dake didn’t react.

“Without any memories about me…”

“Dake, wake up,” Arig nudged him gently.

Suddenly Dake’s eyes sprang open. “You BASTARD!” he bellowed and swung his arm, sending a fan of blazing fire out. Arig leaped backward. The heat singed his face and chest, leaving behind nasty burns.

“D-D-Dake?!” he stuttered, wide-eyed and terrified. He felt his face; the wounds were regenerating.

Dake blinked and sat up. He looked at his hand. “What?” he uttered, disoriented. Then he looked at Arig and his eyes widened. “By mother, bro, I’m so sorry,” he got to his feet and went to hug Arig, but the Hoodian scooted away. Dake stopped, looking regretful and ashamed. “I must have been having a nightmare.”

Arig nodded, taking deep breaths to calm himself down. He had not seen that coming at all. It had been harmless, all in all, but for a Guardian to use his powers against his brother… “I know. You… you realise that they keep coming back, right? Are you doing anything about them?”

Dake shrugged helplessly. “Candles help. I didn’t want to fall asleep here… Arig, I’m sorry man…”

Arig waved his hand. “I’m fine, you just scared me. Come on, let’s sit down. Do you remember what the nightmares are about? You keep calling someone called Adah…”

“Adah…” Dake repeated thoughtfully. “Doesn’t ring a bell. Maybe Hoborg knows something about them.” He rubbed his hands gleefully. “I hope it’s a girl! Then I could have one at least in my sleep.”

***

“Adah,” Bobuslaw set down a large dusty book, “was a historical figure. She was a wife to Nuri and the sole survivor of the burning of Lides. She lived on a world created by Arven a long time ago. Her name survived to this day because the village’s gruesome end attracted much attention, including that of historians.”

“What happened?” Krevel asked, sipping at his cup of tea.

“Bad business,” Bobuslaw shook his head sadly. “The village shaman, Majeer Shanem, went mad. He murdered everyone in the village except for Adah and then set his house on fire. The fire blazed so high that it could be seen hundreds of miles away. Adah was found scrambling through the ruins, half insane with pain from the burns. She was trying to find the corpse of her husband, Nuri, among the corpses of the villagers, but they were all burned beyond recognition… She died on the same day, but not before she told everyone what had happened. That’s how she made it into historic records.”

“Why did the shaman spare her?” Krevel asked.

Bobuslaw shrugged. “I don’t know. Maybe he liked her?”

Krevel made a small sceptical smile. “Thank you, Bobuslaw. You’ve been a great help. Your library’s really the best. We couldn’t find a mention of Adah in the entire Castle or in the Hall of Records.”

Bobuslaw blushed and chuckled from the praise. “Do you want to borrow the book? Perhaps you’ll find more interesting things in there.”

“I would like to,” Krevel nodded curtly. “Ottoborg?” he called upstairs. “I’m done here. Would you mind coming down and giving me a ride back to the Brokenhood?”

***

“Nuri was a Guardian of Fire,” Ruze muttered darkly, flipping through the pages. “The shaman didn’t burn his house down, it was Nuri who came in there and fought him with fire. Dake shouldn’t be remembering this. He’s not supposed to recall any of this.”

“But he doesn’t, does he?” Gome piped up. “He has no idea who Nuri or Adah are. He doesn’t remember that previous life when he’s awake.”

“He’s not supposed to remember it at all!” Ruze raised his voice. “Sorry. Fuck.” He ran his hand across his face. “This is really bad. I don’t know what’s happening, but it’s really bad.”

“How can you tell?” Arig asked carefully.

Ruze hesitated. “I don’t know. Gut feeling. I’m just getting the feeling that remembering your previous incarnation is really, really not supposed to happen. I’m worried that the hothead might be interdimensionally sick.”

“Interdimensionally sick,” Gome repeated in admiration. “Psyche… I wanna be interdimensionally sick.”

“No, you don’t,” Ruze snapped, but he couldn’t help smiling.

***

“Higher, higher! Nuri, I want to go higher.”

“Hush love, any more and the fire might hurt you. I can’t let that happen.”

Adah just laughed and told Nuri to give her a break. After their hot-air balloon touched down, she made dinner for them, and like every day, they ate it together in the garden.

When they were just about finished, Adah disregarded table manners and began to sing:

“Something so unfair,

a woman kills a man.

Why did we not beware

and why did you say it, Shanem?

We will die anyway,

but what will it be for

if we have to start up everything

right from the beginning once more?”

She stopped and smiled at Nuri. He knew that his wife’s health was getting worse. He needed to go alone to Majeer Shanem and ask him some questions. And one of those questions was…

***

“We don’t think this is a good idea,” Ottimo shook his head.

“Please,” Ruze stepped forward. “You and Tuborg are the only ones who can help us. Hoborg has rejected us twice now, and Ottoborg doesn’t want anything to do with it.”

“Have you considered that they might have a reason for that?” Tuborg asked snidely. “I’m not saying a machine that can read dreams is impossible…”

“…but it’s really immoral,” Ottimo finished for him. “I like my privacy when I dream.”

“You share half of your dreams with me,” Tuborg narrowed his eyes as his twin.

“You don’t count,” Ottimo shrugged.

“Then it’s possible,” Ruze latched onto the only important thing he had heard. “You can get inside someone’s head and see their dreams.”

The twins looked at each other. Ottimo pinched the bridge of his nose. “Let me get this straight. You’re worried that your brother is ripping through reality when he sleeps, which is why he gets dreams about his past life.”

Ruze nodded. Ottimo stared at him in exasperation.

“Don’t you think that it could be a coincidence? Maybe he just have heard the name Adah somewhere. Dreams are weird.”

“And repetitive,” Tuborg added. “Sometimes you’ll have the same dream for years.”

“On top of that, your brother is a womaniser who can’t keep it in his pants for shit,” Ottimo continued.

“He’s been constantly hitting both on our mother and our sister, who are both happily married,” Tuborg elaborated.

“Why would we want to help you get inside his head when we don’t like him very much already?” Ottimo finished.

Ruze bit his lip. “I can offer a favour.”

Ottimo waved his hand, dismissing that option. “Favours are a Neverhoodian thing. Raise the bid.”

“You want money?” Ruze stared at them in surprise.

“What? No!” Ottimo recoiled.

“Best klay would be nice, though,” Tuborg interjected thoughtfully.

“Brother dear, don’t get distracted,” Ottimo told his twin. Tuborg shrugged and smiled.

Ruze huffed. “Fine. Then what about information?”

“Ooh,” the twins said in unison and leaned forward.

“Now you’re talking,” Tuborg said.

“What kind of information?” Ottimo asked, grinning. “A new robot drive?”

Ruze turned his palms up, shrugging. “I may come up with something. Let me into your workshop and I’ll figure something out.”

Tuborg caught Ottimo’s eye. “Are we really going to sell out like this?” he asked, a little concerned.

“Depends on what miracle of technology he comes up with,” Ottimo shrugged and smirked. “Think of dad’s reaction when he sees it. It has to be real good if we’re constructing a dream reader in return.”

***

“And I’m supposed to sleep with this thing on my head?” Dake asked sceptically, turning the dark grey helmet in his hands. “Won’t it explode and tear my head off?”

“It won’t, I checked,” Ruze assured him.

“Right.” Dake rubbed his lips. “I’m still not totally cool with this, just so you know. I’m not wrong it the head. A dude’s allowed to dream.”

“Just put it on,” Usha rolled his eyes and prodded his brother. “We’re all curious about Adah.”

“One more thing,” Dake said as he was putting the helmet on his head. “You’re the only ones who’ll see this, right? Bros before hoes. You’ll tell no one.”

“We promise,” Ruze knocked on the grey helmet affectionately. “Now go to sleep. I hope you’re not too nervous to fall asleep.”

“I’ll keep you all awake for hours,” Dake laughed sinisterly.

He was out within ten minutes.

***

“It’s nice to have such a good patient,” Klem smiled at Dake, wiping her hands clean on a white peace of cloth. “But next time, please, don’t visit ill ladies again. You might not wake up again. Capishe?”

“Of course, Klem,” Dake smiled back, appreciating the view of her curving body. “I don’t understand what happened either. I wanted to find you because I didn’t feel so good, and then I don’t remember anything.”

“Not even what you did in the waiting room?” Klem asked, raising a brow.

“Eh heheh, you know me…” Dake laughed it off. “I’ll see you.”

“Take care,” Klem said, catching and holding his eye as he walked out of the infirmary.

***

“Wow, it’s his dream girl! Did you see that look? That’s what I can flirting!”

“Hush, Gome. You’ll wake the loverboy up.”

***

On his way home, Dake found something completely unexpected.

“Hello girl!” he whistled. “Do you come down here often?” Finally, a new face! He had never seen this Hoodian, and she didn’t look like she knew this place either.

“Yes, quite often,” she smiled at him and batted her eyelashes. She made his blood boil just by that little gesture. “Tell me, darling, where can I find Hoborg?” Her voice was so familiar. But, as he looked at her chest, that wasn’t the only familiar thing about her. That chest didn't belong to the girl from his dreams. No, it was…

“Of course,” he heard himself say. “But first, won’t you tell me your name?” It couldn't be. That chest was the same as Loopid’s. The shape of it was different, of course, but the threaded markings definitely looked similar to his.

”This is my problem,” the girl sighed. “I need to find the king so that he gives me a name. My brother already has one, but I don't.”

“Who’s your brother? You know, most of us can be siblings and lovers at the same time.” He smiled at her, as bright as the sun, while his stomach was turning like a restless otter. He felt like he knew her.

“Well, his name is Loopid…” she told him intimately.

He remembered Loopid's birth. He was born with three brothers, no sisters. But let's play this game of yours, he thought. “Really? Where is your brother now?”

“Oh Nuri,” the girl purred, coming even closer to him. “He is here.”

Dake’s eyes widened. “What did you call me?” Nuri. That name… it belonged to him. How? He felt like something was tearing… “What is this game?” he grabbed the girl by her shoulders. “Who are you? How do you know-” Unwelcome images flashed in his mind: a great fire, a crouching shaman covered in red… a great despair.

Her smile vanished. She looked down and said: “You said that one day I would be the one to forget you. And yet I see you here, chasing other women, not remembering me… Loop is doing a good job.” She sounded close to tears. She looked him in the eye hopefully. “Don’t you remember someone named Adah?”

It was her. The one he had been longing for. Wordless, he hugged her. He was happy that only she could see him cry. Corrupted memories were flooding in.

Then he heard a male voice.

“Welp, I see this session is over. I thought she said she could be here a little here longer.”

***

Dake yelped and jerked awake. Arig went to calm him down, helping him take the grey helmet off. The Guardian of Fire squinted at the static-filled screen.

“Well? Did you see something?”

His brothers responded with silence.

“What? I don’t remember anything. Was it scary? Was it rad? I think I woke up with terror, but I can’t really remember what it was about…”

Finally Ruze broke the silence. “This is really bad.”

“What?” Dake bristled. “Why? You guys – what did you see?”

“It was another Neverhood,” Gome said with wonder. “Different from this one. There were different buildings and different people… I hardly recognised some of the places. But it was definitely the Neverhood.”

“Oh,” Dake perked up. “Were there girls?”

“You talked to two of them, but I saw a lot more,” Gome nodded. “I thought you said the image would be hazy and blurred?” he turned to Ruze. “But I could see everything in detail. And were we supposed to hear Dake’s thoughts, too? By mother, I’d never looked at someone’s chest with that much intensity.”

“We weren’t,” Ruze growled from where he was leaning against the wall, arms crossed. “That’s the point. This wasn’t a dream.”

“What about a very vivid dream?” Usha suggested.

“No!” Ruze barked, making Usha jump. Then hid his face in his palms and groaned. “Why are you doing this to me, Dake…”

“I’m not doing anything, you’re the one who insisted that you take a peek at my dreams,” Dake protested. “Not my fault you didn’t like what you see. I don’t remember any of it!”

“Do you really not remember a single dream?” Arig asked. “Not ever?”

“Not ever,” Dake confirmed. “I’ve always been jealous of people who remembered their dreams. I know that I have dreams, but I forget them the moment I wake up.”

“Ruze?” Gome said. “Do you mind telling us why you’re so upset over this?”

Ruze let his hands down and glared at his well-meaning brother. “Sure,” he said in the end. “What Dake’s having aren’t dreams. He’s tapping into another reality. That’s why the image is so clean. His brain isn’t making it up as it goes. It’s genuinely happening, somewhere very far away, and our lover boy switches between bodies and realities as he goes.”

“Ahem,” Usha cleared his throat, breaking the still that followed. “Not to be a spoil-sport, but are you sure that you’ve been getting enough sleep? You sound half delirious right now. I’m pretty sure that other realities don’t exist.”

“I’m-” Ruze began to snap back, but then he noticed the others nodding. “…You really think so? That I’m making this up?”

“I’m just saying that you’re reading a lot into it,” Usha shrugged apologetically. “How would you convince us that what you’re saying is true? Do you have anything beside your gut feeling?”

Ruze hesitated. Then he sighed, defeated, and leaned back against the wall.

“It would explain one thing, though,” Arig spoke up in a musing tone. “Didn’t you find it weird that Dake always chased after girls, even though there weren’t any? Maybe he does it because he remembers them from his dreams. After all, there were a lot of girls there.”

“I don’t remember anything from my dreams, I’ve just told you,” Dake pouted. “Don’t make me out to be deranged.”

“No,” Arig shook his head, “I’m not saying anything like that. It wouldn’t be the first time someone I knew switched back and forth between an alterego and didn’t remember anything.” He paused, looking at his brothers expectantly. Confused stares was all he got. “Really? No one’s told you The Perfect Stone yet?” He shook his head in disbelief. “I’ll have to get Nike to tell it to you once he comes back again. It was Krevel. For reasons I can’t begin to speculate about, he put Hoborg’s crown on many years ago. He turned evil and forgot everything he was before.”

“Holy water,” Gome interrupted. “Krevel put on Hoborg’s crown? And they just let him walk around the Hood after that? He’s a security risk!”

Arig shrugged uneasily. “I… don’t think he is? Anyway, that’s beside the point. What I want to say is, after Krevel turned into Leverk, he didn’t remember anything about being Krevel. And after he turned back, he didn’t recall anything about being Leverk either. But Nike and Nehmen insist that it was still the same person, with the same background, opinions and insights. He just didn’t keep any conscious memories. It was all in the subconsciousness.” He tapped his temple. “The same thing could go for Dake. He doesn’t remember any girls in particular, but he knows that there are supposed to be girls.”

“Are you serious?” Dake frowned at him. “Your theories are even more unhinged than Ruze’s. Don’t tell me you actually believe the guy.”

Arig made a defensive gesture, sitting back on his bed. “Don’t shoot the messenger. I’m just pointing out that there’s a precedent.”

“I don’t have an evil alter ego!” Dake cried out. “Seriously, I think this entire business with dream reading is a load of bullshit. I don’t know why I agreed to it in the first place.”

“Your previous incarnation apparently burned his shaman’s house down to the ground,” Ruze growled.

“He was very obviously upset that his entire village had been killed!” Dake threw his arms out.

“Yes, my point exactly,” Ruze bared his teeth, rising up from the wall. “He let his fury get the better of him. As far as we know, both he and the shaman burned to their deaths in that house.”

“Don’t compare me to some lunatic!” Dake hissed, getting up from his bed as well. “Should I dig up some historic records of your previous lives, see how you fared in the big cruel world?”

“Guys,” Gome said unhappily.

“Go ahead and try,” Ruze hissed back. “Whenever we find references of previous Guardians, it’s always the Guardian of Fire. Who was the first one we learned about, huh? The Warrior of Fire, Gerard. Very moving story, tells how you got your cool sword. Begins with how you burned your house down and our parents with it.”

“Burn in hell!” Dake shouted, stomping his foot. Sparks came out from under it. “You don’t get to order me around like this! My past selves are long gone, and my dreams are mine alone!”

“Funny thing that,” Ruze snarled. “Cause it seems to me like you’re breaking the fabric of the universe in your dreams. You always did what you wanted, chaos. As thoughtless as ever.”

Dake placed his palm over his chest and bright red light seeped from between his fingers. “You will NOT-”

There was a loud crash followed by a splash. Dake yelped and jumped back as rivulets of water ran across the floor. They converged in Gome’s hands as one bobbing blob of water.

“Alright you hotheads – I have a bucketful of water and I’m not afraid to use it!” the Guardian shouted, taking a battle stance. “The first one to smite the other will get wet from head to toe! Seriously though,” he added in a tone much less aggressive and more pleading, “quit it, please. You look like you’re gonna murder each other. Can’t you just take a break and talk it out? Ruze, you don’t gotta rub Dake’s previous lives in his face, you know that’s a low blow…”

Ruze seemed to deflate at that. He slumped his shoulders and said quietly: “I see. That’s how it is, then. None of you believe me.” And he turned to leave. He ignored when several voices called out “wait”. When someone grabbed his hand to stop him, he tried to yank it out. But the grip was stronger than he had expected. He turned around to glare at whoever was stopping him from leaving. He hesitated when he found that it was Arig.

“You…”

“Don’t run away,” the Guardian of Earth said quietly, covering his brother’s hand with his other palm. “We’re here, we’re with you. If something is wrong, we need to know.”

Ruze wavered. Arig pressed his hand and pulled him back gently. “Come. You need to explain where you’re coming from. Otherwise we’ll never understand you.”

Ruze took a deep breath and released it in a sigh. “Fine,” he murmured. He plopped down on his bed and hid his face in his hands. Gome gave Dake a threatening look and wobbled the water bubble in his hands.

“Put that away,” Dake muttered nervously.

“No playing with swords in the bedroom,” Gome reminded him. “Um, Arig? Would you make me a bucket? I don’t have anywhere to put this.”

Dake lit a scented candle it the meantime. It filled the room with the fragrance of chamomile.

“Alright,” Ruze raised his head when they were all settled down. “So… you know that I’m the Guardian of Order, right?”

“Order?” Usha echoed. “You’re the Guardian of Invisible Forces, aren’t you?”

Ruze nodded. “I thought you might not know. Yeah, that’s what they call me. Earth, Water, Air and Fire… and Invisible Forces. Didn’t that seem odd to you? That the fifth element is kinda… redundant?”

“I thought they didn’t know what to call you, so they just came up with something,” Dake shrugged.

Ruze smirked. “I’d think you were trying to be a smart arse, if that wasn’t exactly how it is. Thing is, we didn’t start out as the Guardians of Earth, Water and so on. We started out as three Guardians of the real world and two Guardians of the meta world. The real world, obviously, falls onto you three,” he gestured to Arig, Gome and Usha. “You don’t have elements per se, you command the three states of matter: solid klay, liquid klay and gaseous klay. Earth, water and air just happen to be their most prevalent examples.”

“Oh yeah,” Gome lit up. “I found out I could control molten metal the other day. Cool, right?”

Ruze nodded. “Arig goes a little out of this context because of his second contract, but his flower power is just a wild mix of empathy and regular solid klay skills.”

“Don’t call it flower power,” Arig protested weakly.

“And then,” Ruze paid him no mind, “you’ve got me and Dake. Anyone take a guess what our ‘real elements’ might be?”

“You said you were the Guardian of Order,” Gome said in an unsure tone.

“Congrats, you have an attention span longer than a fish,” Ruze smirked. “And Dake?”

“You called me chaos before,” the Guardian of Fire muttered reluctantly.

“Yep,” Ruze stared at his brother. “You’re the Guardian of Chaos. You could also be called Energy, or Entropy, or Change. Either way, Quater’s original intent was that three of his Guardians represent matter, and two Guardians the antagonistic forces that shape matter. I get to make the rules. You get to break them.” Ruze rubbed his eyes with his palm. “I can’t imagine what the world looks like to you, guys. I suppose you’re ‘one’ with your element. You can feel it, you can move it, it feels like a second nature to you.”

“Something along those lines,” Usha commented.

“To me, the world is a set of rules,” Ruze continued. “I feel the tick of time. I know the structure of things and how they fall one into the other. I get the most basic of forces, gravity, electricity and magnetism, because everything else is too complex for me to fully understand. I get a few cool tricks, but they’re not terribly useful in real life.” He sighed and glared at Dake. “And then there’s you. Who’s able to break my rules without any conscious effort. Who apparently travels in space and time and between alternate realities in your sleep, just because you can.”

Dake shrugged, and seemed somehow pleased with himself.

“Your ‘element’ is phoney, just like mine,” Ruze frowned at the self-satisfied expression. “Fire is a chemical reaction, not a real thing like the air or the earth. Your original power lies in disregarding rules and making your own reality.” He sighed and ran his hand over his face again. He seemed tired all of the sudden. “And that’s why I have such a bad feeling about your dreams. I can’t prove that something is wrong with you. After all, you’ve been having these dreams since we were born and I didn’t feel any tears in the fabric of reality yet. It’s possible that your jumping between timelines is completely safe. But it’s not the way it’s supposed to be. You’re not supposed to recall your previous lives. You’re not supposed to know about another Neverhood where girls are plentiful and chasing skirts is normal. I’m sorry for freaking out on you, but… by mother, it just gives me such bad vibes…”

“Is that all?” Dake asked curiously. “You went this far on a feeling?”

“Sod off,” Ruze mumbled and turned away, flustered.

“And here I thought Gome was my eternal rival!” Dake laughed. “I didn’t know I should hate you in particular.”

“You shouldn’t hate him or Gome,” Usha frowned. “That’s like saying that I should hate Arig just because our elements are so different. You should work together and let your powers complement one another.”

“Hear hear,” Ruze smirked sarcastically. “There’s something about what you say, though. I noticed that not only is the Guardian of Fire the most popular one in literature. He’s also the one who brings the most disasters. Neither Gerard’s nor Nuri’s story ends well. I think Quater might have tweaked your powers a little so that another Guardian could keep you in check. Hence the Guardian of Water.”

“You think so?” Gome asked excitedly. “Then is it alright if I splash him a little from time to time?”

“I will smite you,” Dake began to hiss. Ruze waved his hand quickly to stop them both.

“You don’t splash anyone unless they’re making trouble. But, uh… the bucket was actually good thinking on your part.”

“Hee,” the Guardian of Water smiled.

***

“You won't escape, Majeer. I will find you.”

***

Dake woke up in cold sweat. He unclenched his stiff fists and kicked the blanket off. His brothers were still sleeping. His candle had gone out.

He rubbed his fingers against each other to light it again.

In the bed across the room, Ruze stirred. “Dake?” he mumbled, rising up to one elbow.

The Guardian of Fire waved for him to go back to sleep. Ruze grunted and lay back down.

Dake stared at the ceiling for a long time. He didn’t remember a thing from his dream. Not even the feeling. Was it loving? Had he been with his wife? Had he been fighting the mad shaman? Had he flirted with a pretty girl? He didn’t know. He had no way of knowing.

He closed his eyes and tried to fall asleep again.

At the threshold between waking and dreams, he thought: Adah, my love… I’m coming.

[modernlifehistorian]

Timeless “Mrs.Sherlock Holmes” Lucy/Wyatt/Lyatt Reactions

Okay so I knew if I had put my Lyatt reactions on the other post then it would be too long for any sane person to read, so I’m going to put these thoughts onto a different post to save us all a little time. 

Buckle in clockblockers, cause this one is going to be a doozy. (please don’t be daunted by the length! I worked really hard on this so I want people to read it lol)

Lucy “Maybe I Will/Someone Has To Do Something Now” Preston

First off, Lucy Preston is the most brilliantly written female heroine on TV in the history of anything ever.

She is not having any of Flynn and Wyatt’s bickering. They are all there to do a job, and she’s not going to let this petty squabbling get in the way of that. This is too important.

Her heart eyes for history get me every single time. She’s been to so many points in time, yet every trip there is something that brings back that childlike wonderment in her eyes. This is the biggest sign of resilience that a character can show. It’s one thing to just not let tough times turn you cold, but it’s a completely different level of strength to not only fight the desire to turned cold and calloused, but instead to remain bright-eyed and excited about the things you love even when the rest of your life kind of sucks. This is a different kind of strength.

“What I do and who I do it with is none of your business.”

She tells Wyatt that he has no business criticizing her for who she spends her time with, and she’s darn right. He made his choices, now she gets to make hers.

“So please stop acting like you’re the one who got screwed.”

FINALLY. Finally Lucy tells him what’s on her heart. He hurt her. He pulled the rug out from under her. Also I love how honest she is about her pain. A lot of women on TV would never come clean for fear that it would make them look weak or emotional, but Lucy isn’t like that. She knows her feelings are justified and her right to feel them fully is justified, but what makes her strong is she is not going to let the feelings dissuade her from doing the job. And he has to realize how hard this is for her, but they have a job to do, and she’ll be damned if anything stops her from doing it.

“Then get the hell out of the way.”

Lucy Preston isn’t an overly outspoken person especially in the context of their time-traveling adventures. Keep a low profile, get the job done seems to be more her style except you know Hollywoodland, but like the NASA guy who needed to be put in his place, she just cannot help herself here. Because when the chips are down, when the fate of who knows how many people are on the line, she will not be silent. The future of women hangs in the balance, and Lucy will not let anyone, not a historical hero, not Wyatt, prevent that from happening. I love her passion.

And then her humility, when Grace gets up and gives the speech Lucy intended to give, she doesn’t remember that it was indirectly her doing, that without Lucy there to smack some sense into her that she wouldn’t be standing up there. But Wyatt is there to remind her. Just like he always is.

Also Lucy fighting the sleeper for the gun like THAT’S MY GIRL. 

“I’m not going to be that woman. That’s not who I am.” 

PRAISE LUCY PRESTON. Again, here is the writers doing this love triangle thing right. She will not be the other woman. She will not even put herself in a position to make it possible. She has too much integrity and too much heart to cause anyone that kind of pain. Even if it causes her even more pain.

“Same place as always. Kicking ass and saving the world.” 

Okay do you realize what she implies with this scene??!!?! It might seem innocent and funny, but it’s so much more than that. She’s giving Wyatt the hope that they are still Lucy and Wyatt. They are still Logan and Preston. It would be easy for her to shrug off his question here or even say something that might cause him more guilt or pain, but she doesn’t do that. She is implying hope for them moving forward, and that again shows such strength on her part. An normal person would feel that they couldn’t carry on as they did before things like Hollywoodland and undead wives happened, but Lucy is bigger than that, she won’t let this ruin what she and Wyatt had. 

Wyatt “I Think You Did It” Logan

This guy, are there even words? Yes there are, and I’m going to share them right now.

“I’m warning you.”

I said it in my other post and I’ll say it again THIS SCENE IS NOT ALL ABOUT JEALOUSY. In Wyatt’s Delta Force eyes, Flynn is a terrorist who is in Wyatt’s home, with Wyatt’s family, getting closer to the person Wyatt loves. He has every right to be concerned. Flynn has done little to prove to Wyatt that he’s any less of the mad man he was in season 1. So don’t go raging about how Wyatt’s just a jealous rage monster because he’s concerned for everyone’s safety. 

*Casual wave to wife*

Okay, but for real, man, you’re significantly failing to hide your disinterest, For all you know she could be dead again when you get back. But let’s be real all that’s on Wyatt’s mind is Lucy and the fact that Flynn is getting into the Lifeboat with his team. 

“That is not what I meant.”

I haven’t witnessed it yet, but I get the feeling Wyatt will take quite a bit of heat for this scene, but can we take a second to look at his face while he’s talking to Lucy here? His brows aren’t furrowed, his eyes are wide, his nose isn’t scrunched. Anyone with two eyes can see that he isn’t coming from a place of anger, but of sincere concern. Yes, he doesn’t deliver it in the best way, but I mean this is they guy who thought “not hideous” was the best thing to say to Lucy to explain how beautiful she was. The guy isn’t the best with words. But he’s scared in this scene, scared of Lucy getting hurt. But Lucy is still correct, it’s not any of his business anymore.

ALSO can we take note of how Wyatt literally takes Lucy’s lead in almost all circumstances. He literally waits for her to move and he follows because of how much he respects her and trusts her. As the soldier it would make perfect sense that he leads in case of danger, but instead he trusts Lucy to lead them in the right direction. Love aside, this is such a beautiful partnership I don’t even know how to deal. And on top of that in the scene where they go deliver the news to the suffragettes about Alice, when he gives her the little head nod of encouragement, telling her “you’ve got this.” “tell them what needs to happen”

“Doesn’t mean you should quit.” 

Wyatt is Lucy’s number #1 supporter and this is only a small example of it. He lets her take the lead and then steps in when she needs a little back up. And also we know that here he’s talking about the men he lost in that fateful mission. The ones that at the Alamo sent him into PTSD induced flashbacks that Lucy pulled him out of. If it hadn’t been for Lucy, I doubt he would’ve had the stability to talk about his loss and pain so openly, but he does it for her and because of her.

“I’m not going to let you get hurt.”

The look of heartbreak in Wyatt’s eyes in this scene almost brought me to tears. He finally understands the gravity of their situation because Lucy finally came clean about what she was feeling. And yet I will say that he has a right to be hurt as well. He’s in an impossible situation: in love with one woman while married to another that was supposed to be dead and was dead when he fell in love with the other woman and then undead suddenly when he finally got together with the other woman. Pretty damn complicated. And he’s also the one who has to live with knowing how much he hurt the woman he loves. He might have gained something from all this although not really but he lost a lot too.

Protector vs. Overbearing body guard

This is possibly one of my favorite things about Lucy and Wyatt’s partner dynamic. Wyatt’s original purpose on these missions was to take out Flynn while also protecting Lucy and Rufus. But he doesn’t do it like a lot of other men might. His method of protecting Lucy is defensive more than offensive. His method of protecting her doesn’t involve keeping her out of any harm’s way, but instead being ready to step in when the danger arrives. He worries for her safety, yes, so any man in love does, but he also knows Lucy, and knows her stubbornness, and knows the best he’ll be able to manage is being ready to defend her when it becomes essential for him to do so.

Also I love the unspoken communication between them when Lucy steps into the march, their eye contact, and Wyatt’s constant looking back to make sure he can still see Lucy, and it’s only when Rufus and Flynn demand his attention away from Lucy that Lucy gets taken. 

*Let me make heartbreaking eye contact with Lucy when Jessica throws herself into my arms*

Okay, but seriously, Wyatt, just cut if off already. Everyone and their dog can see where your heart is and it’s not with the woman who flung herself at you. This scene is so full of emotion for being so short. Like Wyatt could easily have his focus on his wife get caught up in the thrill of having here there, alive, but nope his thoughts go straight to Lucy. He hardly takes a second before he opens his eyes to  meet hers. He has no interest in showing his wife that he’s happy to see her too. 

Lyatt Lyatt Lyatt Lyatt.

Where to begin? 

With Alamo Parallels... or at least with Alamo-related development.

Let’s take a look at some dialogue from The Alamo, shall we?

Wyatt: It’s just a letter.

Lucy: It’s not just a letter. It’s the letter that created Texas; no pressure or anything.

Wyatt: You’re in your own head just write something, anything.

Lucy: Oh I can just say whatever I want like you did with Bowie?

Wyatt: Yes. You say what’s in your heart. Quit pretending. All the middle school drama like we’re from San Felipe.

Lucy: That’s the job. That’s my job.

Wyatt: No the job is Flynn.

K, are we sure these are the same two characters we just saw in 1919? Yep. In the Alamo, Lucy is so uncertain of her ability to change the world through words, and Wyatt’s main focus is eliminating Flynn. In 1919, Lucy doesn’t hesitate a second before deciding she’ll give the speech without hardly a hint of self-doubt, and Wyatt’s main focus is Lucy’s safety. They’ve grown so much from each other that it’s nuts. 

“Our one night relationship?”

I love how she can’t bring herself to call it a one night stand or a hook up or something that plays it to be less than what it was for her or for him. They really did begin something that night, and it meant a whole hell of a lot more than some casual fling. 

“She did it!” “I think you did it.”

No one else is there quite like Wyatt Logan to remind Lucy how amazing she is. How invaluable she is. And I think in this moment they both kinda forget about Jessica because she’s so receptive to his touch and he’s so eager to find her with his arms to make sure she’s safe. And the look they share. Good grief was I the only one who yelled “Just kiss already!!!” because that look was so full of love. Like I can’t even... I need a minute.

“There’s something strange about you.”

IS IT THE INSANE AMOUNT OF LOVE THEIR IN BECAUSE THAT’S PRETTY STRANGE. But seriously all the sly side looks, good grief, you two, you’re doing a pretty sucky job at not being in love. 

THE ENTIRETY OF THAT LAST FREAKING SCENE. 

Okay, but first off, they get back, change out of their clothes and Wyatt goes straight to find Lucy, to make sure she’s okay. Like, sorry Jessica, Wyatt has more pressing concerns. And the first thing he does is try to remind Lucy of her success, that because of Lucy’s influence Grace went onto change the world for the better, and when he realizes that it isn’t about the success, that it was about the one woman who doesn’t get credit, doesn’t get remembered, doesn’t get the recognition she deserves, and when Lucy says that she’s the only one who will ever remember, Wyatt tries to remind her that she’s not alone. He’ll keep Alice’s memory alive with her.

And then his attempt at physical comfort *excuse me while I go cry* I love the look on his face before he reaches out for her. It’s so full of love and concern and a desperation to ease her mind. It’s exactly what he would’ve done before this whole Jessica thing, and it would’ve helped then, so he’s hoping it’ll work now. 

They’re whole relationship has been very tactile, from buckling seat belts, to covering each other while under fire, to finally the most intimate physical interaction of any, and now because of that last one, Lucy, specifically, cannot go back to the smaller gestures of touch. Because even the most innocent of touches transport her back to when all she could feel was Wyatt and the sheets of Hedy’s guest house, and, even for how strong she is, she can’t continue being constantly reminded of the time where she almost had everything. 

“Lucy, I still care about you. I can’t make that disappear.”

Basically the gentle way of saying he loves her. But seriously think about it. Back at the Alamo, he says “Jessica. Everyone I care about it gone.” At that point the only person in his life really had been Jessica and he doesn’t say he loves her, no, he says “care” because even with Jessica love was tough for him. It was so hard for him to give his heart away. But with Lucy, she stole his heart before he had a chance to fight for it, so in this scene while “care” might seem like an innocent word, any simpler man would’ve said “love.”

“Wyatt, you are married. You are happily married. To a woman you love.”

Anyone else take notice of the only one saying Wyatt loves Jessica is Lucy? She says it here and back in 2x04 when they’re on the phone. “She’s your wife and you love her.” I’m waiting for the moment where Wyatt says anything of the sort, but I don’t think we’ll see it because we all know that Wyatt Logan isn’t a liar, and he cannot tell a woman he doesn’t love that he loves her.

“I have to accept that, and you have to accept that.”

Yeah, for all those out there who think Lucy’s totally moved on from Wyatt LOL cause no, she’s just as in love as she was in Hollywood. Sorry not sorry ‘bout ya. And I love that she adds that he also had to accept that, like she sees through the facade he’s putting on. Even though she keeps telling him that he’s married in love with someone who isn’t her. I think in doing that she’s trying to convince both of them of that.

“We can’t keep living in the past.” *cue shared smirks because thats all they do*

OKAY BUT THESE TWO DORKS I CANNOT DEAL WITH THEM. Even in the middle of this heartbreaking conversation, they cannot help but be their goofy selves. His little smirk and eyebrow raise saying “you do realize what you just said, right” and her little smirk and head scratch, saying “yeah I probably should’ve thought that one through a little more” THEIR UNSPOKEN COMMUNICATION IS ONE FOR THE AGES. This is the stuff love is made out of. 

“Okay, but Flynn?”

She smiles while he gets all riled up here, and you know I think she was thinking here? “There’s my hothead.” Because it’s so him to blow something so small out of proportion. Something that wasn’t actually anything. And this whole interaction is just as precious as can be. With the whole “Cool...” *skeptical look from Lucy* “I mean thank god.” These two couldn’t be more in love if there wasn’t an undead wife standing in between them.

“No one understands what we’re going through.”

THANK YOU FOR FINALLY SAYING IT. Everyone on tumblr being all self-righteous like you would know exactly how to handle this situation can now shut their traps because this is just an incomprehensible situation. And they are the only ones they can relate to now.

“You getting a second chance with Jessica is the closest thing to a miracle I have seen.”

Alright, people, there is a reason that when Lucy says this, they focus on Wyatt’s face. No happiness, no sense of agreement, he just kinda has this blank expression because he doesn’t know if he really agrees with her. Throwing Jessica in the mix has torn a hole in the life Wyatt built without her, and he’s not sure if having Jessica is making him better. Hint: it’s not

"I’m no Alice Paul.” “No, you’re Lucy Freaking Preston. That’s pretty damn good.” 

SO MANY FEELINGS. First, Lucy doesn’t understand how amazing she is and like while they were in the crowd in 1919, Wyatt is there to remind her. And the words might sound eh, but it’s the voice that he says it with that scream IRONIC UNDERSTATEMENT. When he says pretty damn good, he actually means that no woman they’ve met or will meet could compare the the woman standing before him. She’s everything. More courageous than any soldier. More intelligent than any physicist. More than what her family wants her to be. More than what she believes she is or ever could be, and only one person sees that. And it’s the man standing in front of her. And he knows her better than anyone because of the very fact that he knows that he will never be able to fully comprehend  her. She’s the sun. Something you can’t look directly, something you have to look at through a filter or by shading your eyes because alone she is too powerful for any one to comprehend.

The necessity of breaking eye contact

When I’ve talked about unspoken communication, I’ve never talked about when it’s too much. When too much is said without a word being shared. That’s what happens here. They’re looking at each other with every emotion on display, and they have to look away because too much has been said through just looks. Too much truth has been revealed, so they have to look away and have to change the subject.

“So where does that leave us?

Wyatt desperately needs some hope to cling onto when it comes to his relationship with Lucy because like always he’s following her lead. Wherever she wants them to be for now, that’s where he’ll start. But he wants something. He needs something. And she gives him the hope that maybe they can continue as Lucy and Wyatt, as Logan and Preston. 

So where is Lyatt left as of right now?

With so much still unsaid. You see it in that final moment. When Wyatt takes forever to turn away because he wants to say more. You see it in his hesitation, in the grit of his teeth. I almost see that as him calling himself a coward. A coward for not being able to say it. Tell her what she really is to him. And then as he turns away, she opens her mouth, ready to call him back because she’s not ready for him to leave again. Because as much as she’s hurting, she also wants her best friend back. 

These two are not finished coming clean about feelings or intentions or thoughts or whatever. They have so much to tell each other, and if the writers have any mercy we’ll see it by the end of season 2, but I have never been more certain of Lucy and Wyatt being endgame then I am now. Anyone who can’t see it by now is in denial of the obvious. 

Thoughts from anyone who made it all the way through?

@chasethesun18 @enchanted-keys @timelessbae12 @dopemixtape @chloeswans @wyatttoldme @bestshipcaptainswan @thebracingbibliophile @simply-anya @thedanceneverends @amazalina

[reconditarmonia]

Dear Yuletide Writer

Hello, lovely writer!

I’m reconditarmonia here and on AO3 (and have been since LJ days, but my LJ is locked down and I only have a DW to see locked things).

General likes:

-- Relationships that aren’t built on romance or attraction. They can be romantic or sexual as well, but my favorite ships are all ones where it would still be interesting or compelling if the romantic component never materialized.

-- Loyalty kink, whether commander-subordinate or comrades-in-arms, and the trust associated with it. Sometimes-but-not-always relatedly, idealism. I guess the two combined might be, in general, the idea of nobility of character and what that means.

-- Heists, or other stories where there’s a lot of planning and then we see how the plan goes.

-- Femslash, complicated or intense relationships between women, and female-centric gen. Women doing “male” stuff.

-- Stories whose emotional climax or resolution isn’t the sex scene, if there is one.

-- Uniforms/costumes/clothing.

-- Stories, history, and performance. What gets told and how, what doesn’t get told or written down, behavior in a society where everyone’s consuming media and aware of its tropes, how people create their personas and script their own lines.

-- Eucatastrophe.

General DNW: rape/dubcon, torture, other creative gore; Christmas/Christian themes; unrequested AUs, including “same setting, different rules” AUs such as soulmates/soulbonds; PWP; food sex.

Fandom: Dòu Máah Dáan | Peking Opera Blues (1986) 

Characters: Tsao Wan

This film is so much MORE than I ever dreamed. More hilarious, more shippy, more dramatic. I think what I want most from this fandom is something on a similar emotional scale - not necessarily something where the plot itself has a national or international scope, but something that has room for opera slapstick, corpse puppetry, and torture; material concerns, and high aspirations; saving each other’s lives, and having sleepovers. Thematically, I’m really interested in the way the film shows friendship and familial love sometimes dovetailing with ethics and ideological goals and sometimes conflicting with them, and in the various ways women can find, or seek, their own independence.

Tsao Wan is the only character I’ve put in my request. I was fully expecting to come out of the film with femslash ships, and instead I have a big OT5 and a huge crush on Brigitte Lin (okay, that part I could see coming), so I’d be happy with any combination of the main five, including the two men, who were not nominated, as long as Tsao Wan is there. Some combination possibilities: how do any of them meet up again after the events of the film, whether by chance - do Bai Niu and/or Sheung Hung happen to be making a tour stop somewhere Tsao Wan has a mission? does Tsao Wan and Ling’s work take them near Tung’s village farm? - or intentionally - how would a new opera about Tsao Wan and Ling’s exciting adventures be created by Bai Niu and/or Sheung Hung, in terms of research and role creation? Or maybe Tsao Wan needs Bai Niu’s skills for a mission. In fact, maybe she needs everyone’s skills for a mission. Recruitment road trip! Some solo possibilities: what was Tsao Wan’s time in Europe like? Was she involved in any political activity there? What does she do post-film as History continues? In anything set post-film, I’d like to know that all five characters are important to each other, even if they’re not actually in the fic and/or sexually involved.

If you want to get really plotty, I love heist and con stuff like Leverage, Ocean’s Eleven (remake), and The Italian Job (original), where there’s a Plan with steps and roles, and then it plays out. If straight-up casefic isn’t your style, it could be fun to throw some shippy tropes at this canon (fake marriage where Tsao Wan is pretending to be the husband? hurt/comfort or sickfic? hell, I’d read accidental baby acquisition), but tropey stuff is not necessary - I’m just trying to throw out some ideas to get things moving. Ideally there’d be at least a figleaf of plot in the background, even if it’s not casefic.

Fandom-specific DNW: Explicit references to torture are still a hard DNW (I covered my eyes during the scene in question when watching the film), but I recognize it’s part of canon and consequently might be part of the world of the fic. If someone is tortured or creatively executed in your story, it’s fine to mention it but I do not want to know how.

---

Fandom: Far from the Madding Crowd - Thomas Hardy

Characters: Bathsheba Everdene

I didn’t nominate this and it didn’t occur to me that it would be in the tagset, but I couldn’t stop thinking about it! One thing that always sticks in my mind about this novel is the way Hardy calls Bathsheba “the young farmer” just as he refers to the men as farmers - which, just saying, is more than most people writing about this story can do - and so, that being the case, what I’m most interested in is something about Bathsheba as farmer. One day in the life or four seasons in the life or five plantings/harvests in the life, or pseudo-academic fic about a case study of a woman farmer in the Victorian era, or a conflict between the farm and nature that Bathsheba has to decide how to solve.

Feel free to bring in the other nominated characters or other major characters if it suits what you’re trying to do, but what I’m really looking for is a focus on Bathsheba’s work, determination, and process of learning. I’d also love to read something like a merchant ship AU (as the first alternate setting that came to mind where it would be not exactly the done thing for her to captain her inherited ship and make commercial decisions herself - although I do have to point out that contrary to popular belief, there were a lot of women on shipboard in the age of sail, may this be useful - but also where nature and luck/fate are as influential as they are in the original setting), or something in which the land, superstition, and ritual were more overtly magical.

---

Fandom: 月刊少女野崎くん | Gekkan Shoujo Nozaki-kun

Characters: Kashima Yuu, Nozaki Umetarou

Pick a trope. Have them fuck it up.

That’s one of the things that makes me love this canon - the simultaneous send-up of and indulgence in tropes, in a very good-natured way. (Another way I’ve described its genre: “nothing happens, but very dramatically.” Everything is shocking or devastating or the pinnacle of bliss.) Kashima and Nozaki are two of the characters whose propensity to do this is most likely to set a story in motion, due to Nozaki’s experimentation/observation for his manga and Kashima’s princely self-fashioning and going 120% on everything; I also love Kashima’s bifauxnen-ness, acting talent, and earnest failboating, and the way that Nozaki could have been written as a tall-dark-handsome-stoic cipher guy and instead is just as quirky as anyone else. That said, this is an OR request, not an AND, and I’d also be happy to read stories about pretty much anyone from the nominated tagset (except Mikoshiba or Mayu; I don’t know Mayu very well because I originally got into this through the anime, and Mikoshiba just isn’t my fave, although I have no objection to his appearing in the story).

There are all sorts of lists out there of common shoujo(/romcom/fanfic) tropes if you’re not sure where to start. And, because Nozaki is all about subverting gendered characterization and role-boxing, and also about people trying to make their lives conform to narrative, go ahead and apply those tropes to whichever characters you feel would be the most interesting or fun. Feel free to pick non-high-school-setting ones, too, if there's magical/historical/high-society shoujo you want to see them tackle, or to take a play that Kashima (and whoever else) is involved in as a jumping-off point.

As you may have gathered, I love the way the canon plays with romance tropes, but I would prefer no overt Shipfic. If you’d like to include a ship, whether slash/femslash or het, I’d like for it to be handled without much seriousness, and for friendship with characters who aren’t part of the ship to be a significant part of the fic, as per canon. I do really like the show’s variety of friendships between characters of different temperaments, interests, and sexes.

If you’re really getting a “why don’t you just rewatch/reread the canon, reconditarmonia” vibe off this, which I’m kind of giving myself, you could try sex comedy future fic? Give them magical powers? What I’m most interested in, wherever you go with this, is the playing-with-tropes thing.

Fandom-specific DNW: I love Hori and Kashima’s relationship, but I’d strongly prefer that her feelings for him not be written as overtly romantic. High levels of ambiguity/intensity/tropey-ness are fine and great.

---

Fandom: Monstrous Regiment - Terry Pratchett

Characters: Any (Alice “Wazzer” Goom, Jack Jackrum, Magda “Tonker” Halter, Maladict, Polly “Ozzer” Perks, Tilda “Lofty” Tewt)

Give me all the loyalty kink for this fandom. Characters rescuing each other from peril, risking their reputation or position or ethics to defend each other, accomplishing the impossible or sacrificing things without even thinking twice because one trusts the other’s orders or judgment. Or A not going off the leash or into danger to defend B because B said not to, to protect A’s conscience or life or reputation. Can be romantic or platonic - I ship Polly/Mal and Tonker/Lofty, but I would also be delighted with Polly&Jackrum, Wazzer&Polly, or other non-romantic twosomes or moresomes in situations of loyalty and trust. Maybe Polly sends Mal on a dangerous mission, or Tonker is captured after she and Lofty burn down another place where women and girls are being abused, or Polly protects Jackrum’s secret/s from someone who could reveal them, or Wazzer ends up in the field again with the general’s retinue and Polly and Mal rescue her from danger (or vice versa!!). What strengths or sacrifices do they have at their disposal for each other?

Pratchett-esque voices would be great. He’s really, really good at sucker-punching the reader with sincerity in an overall satiric mode, and I think that style lends itself well to this sort of thing.

I’m not going to lie, Polly is my fave. I like that this could have been a generic coming-of-age or women-in-war story, where the protagonist learns that she’s brave or worthwhile and then the crisis is past, but instead Polly learns that she’s a cunning bastard and a hell of a sergeant, and being a one-off hero in a country that’s at peace and making slow social progress isn’t good enough for her. That said, just because I’m better able to articulate what I like about Polly doesn’t mean I’d be less excited for fic about anyone else! I think that’s something I’d want to explore for any of the characters who enlist in the course of the story - what are these women good at? What lets them fulfill their potential? What do they want when their hand isn’t being forced? Or for Jackrum, who’s already gone through that whole process by the time the story begins, any more backstory would be fabulous.

If you’re going the Polly/Mal route, I also love ludicrous levels of sexual tension in a military context (I think it’s the unavoidable proximity + the presence of others making it hard to act on it).

Fandom-specific DNW: vampire romance tropes (such as turning and/or immortality) as focus; non-female pronouns/headcanons.

--

Fandom: Simoun (Anime)

Characters: Any (Aaeru, Dominuura, Halconf, Mamiina, Neviril, Paraietta, Plumbish Priestesses, Rodoreamon)

Simoun somehow ended up being a really weirdly meaningful show to me. I loved how all these women got to be flawed and fucked-up, noble and loyal. How, in the mold of all my favorite epic shoujo anime, it starts off beautiful and fine and then Shit Gets Very Real and that’s actually one of the themes of the show - we had a little debate a few weeks ago on FFA as to whether or not Simoun was a military canon, and the fact that circumstances have remade a team of priestesses in fancy quarters and magic flying machines who are there to pray to God, put off their choice of sex, use their talents, maintain or claw their way into a social position, into a military force involved in a war - that’s an idea that the characters themselves struggle with in the show. (Neviril’s scene in the hearing is one of my favorites.) How everyone gets character development, in the sense of learning and changing, and even what seem like annoying mandatory straight subplots actually end up serving that thematic or character development, to say nothing of the more focal relationships between the leads (not just Neviril and Aeru, but also Mamiina and Rodoreamon, Neviril and Paraietta...)

I’d really like to read a fic where an individual character’s development or two characters’ relationship is similarly tied in to plot developments; it doesn’t have to be a plotty fic as such, but I was very interested in the way the developments of the war and the pilots/priestesses’ actions in it precipitated changes in their relationships. So how might Neviril and Aeru’s relationship develop in the other world (what are they doing?), or Mamiina and Rodoreamon’s on the Messis when they’re not the narrative focus before Mamiina’s last mission and the braid thing? (Or if this is more your speed, dig into that and see how a character grows or the relationship between characters develops when that’s not being moved along by outside events in the same way, especially if they’re aware of that being an issue. When Neviril and Aeru are outside the normal flow of time, or Paraietta and Rodoreamon are civilians, for example.) I’m also interested in all the permutations of loyalty we see in the show - like loyalty to a position over loyalty to a side (as with the Plumbish priestesses’ siding with our Sibyllae), loyalty that develops before liking or friendship, the devoted loyalty to Neviril. I like the show’s military themes despite its magical-girl visuals. I think this is also a canon where it would make sense for sexual first times to be part of a fic - what does that mean for the characters you choose?

I should also say that due to all the magic and timespace warping in the show, I am more than okay with post-canon fic that gets characters back together who were separated by canon, if that’s what you want. You can resurrect Mamiina, or have Neviril and Aeru visit the main reality/timeline again. Or play with timespace even more - time loop fic? (Edit: This didn’t even occur to me until I found out about the IF post, but this fandom might lend itself to interactive fiction, too.)

[reign-of-the-wolves]

THEM:

Hi Reading one of your recent comments on Soo It seems to be that you actually don't like her as a character not just the way she was written I think, it's just my assumption consider her as weak and a bit stupid Maybe I'm wrong

ME: It's both how she was written as a character and the character herself. Lol I've watched this series over 6 times now (partly to enjoy it with friends but also to analyze the story and characters for my own writing.) It may be the editing departments fault too with how they edited the final video

THEM: I think that the writing has a couple of flaws as every script has and it's ok but I put all blame on director and editor team.

Also, I think you really underestimate her and putting definition of a strong female lead in a very classic dimension when it comes to judging Soo, idk about others.

She was pretty much silly in the first eps and I didn't like her either. But there so much development that made me grow to like her more and more.

After all, of it wasn't her nothing would have happened. Even Eun's death supposed to happen because she meant to be there to story that we know in modern days could happen.

She's not even a bit weak. Just out yourself a modern day girl into her condition. Time travel, deaths of people that important to you and not most of them aren't natural. Tortures, a year of hard work of a water maid, ruined health, always aching knees and problem with heart. Const fear of hurting and affecting somebody's life, holding back with a person you falling in love with, then watching how his marrying other woman and suffering because of it, then leaving him not because you don't love him but because you have to and there's no other choice.

She's relatable in so many aspects even in Goryeo era. She's not super smart or strong or anything else, that what makes her so human. But she is so compassionate, hardworking.

ME: But it's not just my opinion 4 other of my friends (one of them having never seen Kdramas before) kinda of the same opinion. Her early eps were basically what kinda killed it.

Honestly my biggest thing is that there was no excuse for her behavior in the early episodes. (I didn't mind her too much after Court Lady Oh's death, but everything before that point she just didn't make sense to me... she would've realistically been executed) Even her being from another time can be a valid reason up to a point... before it becomes a writers scapegoat.

To me, if I had to pick a character from that show that was the most relateable and believably written, It would be Court Lady oh.

ME: it's just there's things that are common sense and common knowledge that anyone of any social class (modern or ancient) would know, and she somehow... didn't?? how to speak to royalty, and not get in a fight with them being for starters LOL

ME: the other things I can kinda loosely overlook as pure modern ignorance but there are some things that are just painfully jarring that make 0 sense for anyone in Korea or SE-Asia

ME: the more I watch and try to find reasons to sympathize with her or justify her behavior the more I can't-- especially when my friends are also asking me questions about why she's behaving a certain way. LOL I do try... I genuinelly do try (especially cause I want me friends to love this show as much as me) but I can't. xD I can't even objectively try to defend her character until after Court Lady Oh's death. and by that point when it comes to hr and wang So's relationship I can feel even less empathy for it aside from his character... XD

ME: I love wang So very very much, extremely deeply but their pairing made so little sense to me... that I couldn't even try to explain it to my friends xD Maybe the original book was different, but, this show didn't make work... this could be the fault of the editors and writers of the show

ME: 5 other friends of mine (my miscount I forgot how many I have seen this series with) Today at 10:06 AM

THEM: She was fearless and didn't want to let people humiliate her. Don't forget that she was a part of powerful Wook's household and people tear her as she is a mere child so I doubt that something would have happened to her. The only stupid thing that she did back then was beating Eun. She just couldn't stand his pervertism and decided to teach him a lesson.

I doubt that you know how to speak to medieval royalty as I have no clue how to speak to royalty from medieval Rus. Everything what I know is based on history books and tv series. I'm pretty sure it's far from accurate Also, Ha Jin's history knowledge was awfully poor. She couldn't even figure out that Gwangjong wasn't the second Goryeo king nor she didn't know that he actually didn't killed all his brothers. Her history knowledge was on a level of girl just appearing in history class auditorium without paying much attention.

For example? (What doesn't make sense for people in Kore and Asia)

Girl in original book is absolutely different just as 4th prince, they just took some main plot lines, everything else is different.

Their relationship was built on friendship, complete understanding of each other, they could see real nature of each other. Also, they're both idealistic and fight for truth, they're romantic and cherish freedom. They're really similar and I already told you about it.

ME: you sound mad? O-o are you mad at me or something? cause again this is just my own view point. LOL

THEM: Ahahah, no 😄

ME: okay LOL

ME: good XD

THEM: Sorry if I offend you

ME: nah you didn't I was worried of the reverse

THEM: I'm just giving you my point of view

ME: ^_^ ok

THEM: Because I'm just upset that you would rather erase Hae Soo from the story when she's basically the core of this narration

ME: LOL If I had to have a time traveling character beign the narration I'd persoanlly prefer a different character in her place. or even just have the narration from So's POV entirely or the original Hae Soo. :/  Sorry if I upset you it's just my oppinion and I'm not trying to like force it on ya LOL Today at 12:47 PM

THEM: But was hwarang female lead brilliantly written and was their romance developed? Like just to compare historical dramas that you watched.

It's not just So's story, initially it is a girls story, Koreans decided to share the focus with male lead as well.

It's fine, I get it. And you wouldn't be able to do it anyway 😄

ME: I liked the girl in the very very first episode. But after that first episode. THE VERY INSTANT SHE MET THE MALE LEAD... I ended up disliking her too the romance in Hwarang was just as bad as SHR

THEM: I'm afraid that you end up disliking all female leads in sageuk

ME: after that point TBH I kinda realized maybe it was Korean's media where they're so focused on shoehorning and shoving poorly developed romance down people's throats.... yeahhhh probably

THEM: But SoSoo wasn't poorly developed Can't agree with you It one of the most amazingly developed relationship in kdrama world In fiction I've run into And I love romance but only a good believable romance

ME: if that's the case then I am absolutely mortified to see other shows in Korea if that was considered the best in Kdrama world

THEM: Have you thought that it's a western mindset that makes you think that Soo and other female leads are weak

ME: my friend found the way he acted after she said she understood him absolutely jarring today ROFL

THEM: Ofc there are some one dimensional poorly written characters But I honestly saw many great girls

ME: Honestly I hate how a lot of media writes women in the West too I do think it could be a culture thing for me too, that maybe Korea and Japan idiolize these meek weak kinda "dense and quirky" women that NEED a man to function or at least the trope of it

THEM: Why it's so understandable

ME: in SE-Asian media

THEM: There's a parallel between his conversation with mother and this moment with Soo

ME: I know these countries are very sexist and women don't get a lot of respect over there.

THEM: Actually I feel like less sexist in historical way that Europe In Japan there were women samurais

ME: Oh I know in history it was fine till we came and shoved our noses in it

THEM: And I'm Goryeo women could divorce without damaging their honor

ME: or with confusnism

THEM: And all the property still belonged to them

ME: I'm not completely naive about Japan XD I did do research on the Samurai and the Minamoto family I also know in the Three Kingdoms era women were of equal

THEM: Japanese are more severe

ME: in fact one of them ruled err wait three of the women ruled Silla

THEM: Not completely equal but almost yeah

ME: What I'm saying is the roles of women changed roughly around the Joseon Dynasty and into the era where Christians started butting in well yeah not perfect but closer

ME: then it all turned to shit

THEM: Agree

ME: And yes maybe my Western upbringing has a lot to do with how I see it, but then again, I loved characters like Court lady Oh, Queen Hwangbo, (Hell I would even say- despite her corruption and being written as a bitch/antagonist-) I enjoyed Yeon Hwa's character and felt she was wonderfully developed. (no I do NOT ship Yeon hwa with WAng So) But I loved ALL these characters way more then I liked Soo because I felt they were better written and developed over all. Or WOo Hee for that mater I adored Woo hee and felt she was incredibly brace and strong

THEM: Ok but all these woman were ready to kill I like only Woo Hee from these three

ME: Court Lady Oh wasn't willing to kill. Also Lady Hae herself was another powerful and strong woman in her own right and she wasn't gunna kill anyone

THEM: But you say you liked these three

ME: both these women would've died (and one of them did) to protect the people they loved I forgot the other two xD well I mentioned Court Lady Oh XD but yeah basically any other woman in that show I found more engaging and compelling

THEM: Even Chae ryung? 😄 But Yeon Hwa was snake as well

ME: Soon Deok, Lady Oh, Lady Hae, Yeon Hwa, (hell even Yoo for being a horrible antagnosist and terible mother) Woo Hee.... all of these girls in my mind were better written and developed. yes even Chae Ryung I felt more emotion to all of these other women

THEM: But she was an evil traitor and liar

ME: in different ways yes but I felt SOMETHING I didn't nessicarily mean positive

THEM: Ok then I can say one thing

ME: or liking the character's decisions XD

THEM: You don't like Hae Soo in general Bc it's impossible to the same writers to write all these women and So itself To be poorly wrote Hae Soo in which I disagree ofc

THEM: You just don't like her for her character Like you found interesting everyone in this show except Hae Soo

ME: XD No I don't her character or how she was written...I felt 0 empathy for her on any level as a viewer, and I felt over all she made no sense as a character and was too unrealistic as a believeable character. I felt and could relate to the other characters in different ways. Yeon hwa for all her treachery I could see she was blindly pursuing her goals to protect her family (even though it was wrong). Lady Oh and Lady Hae and Woo Hee all were amazing and brave women yeah basically XD I did

THEM: Yeon Hwa wasn't protecting her family Like never

ME: It's not that I don't BLINDLY dislike her I have stated many times why I don't like or agree with her. ehh true XD she was just poisoned with greed but even she was interesting as a character

THEM: She just wanted power And So was for her just a beast to be tamed When Soo saw in him a kind hearted human and friend

ME: Well yeah XD I never liked YH and So together either

THEM: You didn't feel any empathy bc you didn't like her as a person, you felt no connection bc maybe you share only few traits with her. Most of the time when I watch dramas and movies, I feel no connection with characters. Especially western ones. I can say same things about beloved by many characters but I know that there are people who are like this particular heroine and they feel connection. Why she's not believable? She was betrayed many time, she fell for the wrong person, right person was always by her side and it took sonmuxh time to realize. She was to kind and to idealistic to realize many things earlier. I think it happened to many people. I felt her extremely relatable bc I would act same in many situations. Who am I kidding I would gone crazy after few days. But she had strength to not give up and accept the reality and live. She was acting so carelessly because she was allowed to, she felt love and protection from all the princes. She relaxed as if she was at home, in friendly atmosphere but after Lady Oh's death she realized that she can't and don't have right to live and behave like that anymore. It was a call that she's in medieval kingdom after all. I'm just saying that you don't feel empathy bc you don't like her as a person. And I feel like you belittle her and her strength

THEM: And I'm saying all of that considering how many times I was extremely mad at her and wanted to shout at her

Still I can't hate her or accuse in anything

She was in huge stress. She managed to survive for 10 in a toxic and suffocating atmosphere where she didn't belong.

ME: Yeah. XD Honestly I've stated many points on why I didn't like how she was written or her character as a character/person XD My friend who watched this series with me kinda pointed out to me too that she felt Hae Soo was "literally there to further the drama and development of the princes and she's a badly done character that was done injustice by baaaaaaaad writing." And my friend is in honors classes full scholarship majoring in developmental psychology. She likes a LOT of fiction, TV and admits she loves almost all types of characters and in her own words "has no standards for writing" xD IDK maybe we just see things differently My friend LOVED Wang so and the royal family and the story as a whole

ME: she just didn't like Soo either

ME: Maybe we should avoid the topic of Hae Soo when it comes to this show and stick to Wang So and the other Princes XD XD Cause yeah we'll never see eye to eye on it. might be safer that way ahahah ^_^;; I don't want to offend ya since you love her so much.

THEM: I don't even love her so much I really like her and I relate to her

ME: Ah Ok LOL xD Well either way I just really don't wanna step on toes XD

THEM: I just don't really get how you skip her in this story

THEM: It's unfair To the whole story and So itself Because neither of it happened without her She's a base of this story

THEM: Like if there's poorly written character - Jung Or he's just eternally stupid

ME: I loved So's development as HIM I just wished Hae Soo's character was different then I might support it more.

THEM: But she was a part of his development He wouldn't have became king without her

ME: I just didn't like him and Soo as a couple nor did I like how she was written nor her character itself.

I think he could've developed that same way were she a different person.

ME: Eh it's kinda like friend said, she was a plot device in that respect. xD

THEM: Fe She wasn't a plot device, she was a center of this story

ME: LOL Like I said, it's probably safer we don't bring up Hae Soo xD I could go on and on about Wang So and the rest of the family with positive praise. LOL

THEM: Ok give me an example of what kind of different female lead should have been there

ME: and deep love... but her... ehhhh character type?

THEM: I'm not the one who avoids uncomfortable topics Yes You also think she's unworthy of this love, right? Because she never showed it so openly as he did?

ME: (strictly character personality types, not ethnicity) Woo Hee, Lady Oh, Rose Tyler, Arwen, I could hoenstly go on

THEM: That's actually really funny that you mentioned lady oh Bc it's an older version of Hae Soo

ME: I mean after Lady Oh got wise to the world yes older and wiser much older and wiser matured

THEM: But nobody gets as older and wiser in such young age Without tough experience

THEM: You get wisdom from experience Fans you compare Woo Hee and Hae Soo/Ha Jin when they were raised ina different atmosphere It's same as people were comparing Wook and So

ME: I'm looking at personality types... not characters and backstory the**

THEM: But their character traits came from their experience

ME: I'm talking technical Like the character breakdown in writing

THEM: Oh, I see

THEM: Idk neither Arwen or Rose I can't see this kind of character in this kind of story

ME: not the characters themselves or their history.

Well no one is an elf from another world of fiction the other is a 21st century girl from London. XD But their character traits and personality/flaws are what I'm talking about. Not who they are or where they're from

THEM: Also, about Woo Hee. Her and Baek Ah and SoSoo are mirroring each other Showing that this type of people have light inside of them but life made them tondo some things that were corrupting them from the inside

ME: ehhhhhh they're different people maybe

THEM: They need someone with the light to help them to return to their natural state To soften their thorns That they forced themselves to grow in order to survive

THEM: Both of them didn't to chose to be who they are, the had to do it The other thing that showing is a Soo and Baek Ah talk in ep 19 Soo talks with Baek Ah possibly having her and So in mind Saying that Woo Hee wasn't selfish enough, she's the one who left and she's a bad guy

ME: hahahahahha yeahhh mental illnesss doesn't work that way... honestly that little comment really ticked me off.

THEM: Possibly referring to herself, fully recognizing that she and So weren't selfish and she's the bad guy, she hurts him badly by leaving him But as Woo Hee (here a woman sacrifice parallel) she leaves to protect So and their baby Which comment?

ME: the whole Woo Hee was the bad guy for killing herself kinda thing

ME: the context and situation was just bad for that cosnidering she committed suicide

THEM: She was more talking about herself

THEM: But she committed suicide not bc of mental illness She did that for Baek Ah and her people

ME: LOL Woo hee and soo are nothing alike... especially in that respect.

THEM: They both sacrificed their happiness for their beloved Soo just didn't die

ME: Woo Hee was unhappy from the start

THEM: Bc she was already severely ill and she had to deliver a healthy child

ME: even Baek Ah noticed that

THEM: Ofc she was She was a princess of fallen kingdom And had to become a kisaeng

ME: She probably suffered from depression and that was partially what drove her to suicide.

THEM: I think every single person in this story suffered from depression

ME: Well yeah.... xD in some ways But she was an extreme case

THEM: The other thing that her existence itself gave hope to Baekje people that their kingdom will be restored And So?

ME: So is a whole other can of worms with mental illness probably PTSD just to start

THEM: Let's be honest As a physical illnesses There's no completely mentally healthy person in this world And Soo? You think she wasn't traumatized? She had, in my opinion, the least stable situation

ME: she probably was and should've been...

ME: but the thing is

THEM: Because the huge contracts of upbringing and the reality she was put in The weight of responsibility and fear Fear that consumes

ME: that's even more of a reason why I felt she and So shouldn't have ever gotten together... and that their relationship (on top of the country) was toxic and unhealthy and should have never happened. and probably wouldn't have in reality

THEM: I just really familiar with this feeling when fear just blocks your rationality bc you just don't want to mess up Toxic and unhealthy?

THEM: There weren't any attachment, obsessions Jealousy And other stuff

ME: jealousy lies, possessiveness. For both of them it was an emotionally abusive relationship

THEM: Lies happens in all relationship Jealousy when? Emotional pain was cause not by them but by the circumstances they were put in

ME: she got sulky when he got married to Mu's kid (WHO WAS LIKE 12) she got jealous of YH,

THEM: If they lived in a hut in that village they would have grow old together with a  lot of children It wasn't jealousy

THEM: She thought he might be after throne And it's his ambition When she got jealous of Yeon Hwa?

ME: when she mentioned getting married to him... it wasn't outward but she refused to let go and see that she was not good for him as Queen. it was only when Ji Mong finally shut her down and told her how it is that it finally sunk in anyway this is just going in circles it's perspective and opinion. there's not enough content in the show to properly psycho analyze the characters sadly

ME: sadly**

THEM: Omg She wasn't jealous She simply didn't want the love of her lie to get married to other woman

ME: So was jealous of her though... and possessive

THEM: Bc she knew he didn't want it too He loves her

ME: I love him and I could justify it rationally

THEM: And proposed to her

ME: honestly it shouldve ended after Eun's death if not before then.

THEM: Relationship you're talking about is a complete utopia No lies, no jealousy

ME: LOOOL nah

THEM: Lies that told each other was motivated to protect each other for good Lame motive but still

ME: well yeahhhh it's called an honest and healthy one XD I'm not saying their aren't struggles but you don't lie to the person you claim to love.

THEM: In toxic relationship lies is motivated to manipulate your partner into doing what you want

ME: Lame motive and toxic in reality

THEM: Ofc you don't But you're measuring everyone from a modern mindset not considering that there's a whole empire on a stake besides them

THEM: That's the conflict of a whole story You can't have both a throne and love There's only one thing you can hold It not toxic It's problematic Toxic a strong word

ME: I'm very tempted to actually ask a psychologist this very thing someone who is certified to say what is toxic relationship and not given that period just to see if it's promlematic or genuinely a toxic circumstance

THEM: And when you say emotional pain. Well, in toxic relationship, emotional abuses is an intentional thing, right? They never did that, they never did something to each other to hurt and make them feel worse or unworthy, they did say something things to push each other bc they thought it would be better for them and will keep them safe.

THEM: I saw many discussions on tumblr on that matter Even from a psychologist

ME: uhhh unfortuantely tumblr is an echochamber of biasness

THEM: People who said it's toxic mainly aimed it on So

ME: and nah it's not always intentional

THEM: Other people said it's not And toxic relationship Soo nactually had with Wook

ME: you can be abusive and not realize it

THEM: But it's a natural thing We grow like that

THEM: It makes us stronger and wiser Then Baek Ah and Woo Hee is toxic Seon Deok and Wang Eun is toxic Ten and Rose is toxic Everything single relationship on tv and books is a toxic things

ME: Well asking my friend (who's taking psych) whether Soo and So were toxic... she didn't think so but she did think they weren't good for each other

THEM: Toxic is when relationship brings more pain and discomfort that joy and happiness but you can't quit due to development attachment and feelings

When it destroys your heart and soul

Am I right?

But SoSoo weren't destroyed by their love. They were destroyed by life and time, love was the only thing that brighten their days and kept them alive

ME: I wanted her imput because I feel she'd be more relatlly qualified and I DO sometimes misuse words

THEM: Now tell me, please, what are you favourite romances in fictional world that you think are healthy and perfect. So I could wholly understand your pov.

ME: There aren't any "perfect ones" but offhand Arwen and Aragorn... no not perfect but it was real Beren and Luthien, my friend said : A Court of Thorns and Roses Sarah J Mass Rhys/Freyre

also IMHO Keeping someone "safe" through lying takes away their agency and makes it seem like they're not competent to handle the situation Also jack/Ianto were great. 10/Rose Tyler were great they weren't perfect...

I don't read a lot of fiction I mostly watch TV shows and movies

ME: also katara and Anng from that TV series Avatar aang* PiperxLeo from Charmed

ME: Phoebe/Cupe from Charmed as well

ME: Peggy Carterx Steve Rogers

THEM: But Hae Soo actually couldn't handle the situation, like she couldn't stop the bloodshed in Wang family, only So could.

And when she was leaving him, she actually knew that he can hadnlaw the situation and marry her but it lead to clans rebellion, more blood and it will put him in huge danger

It wasn't a modern word, it's not that simple

Come on, like Ten didn't lie to Rose and didn't hurt her? Can't comment others not familiar

Piper and Leo - jealousy, lies, emotional hurting check check check, they even divorced

I'm mentioning things that you said about SoSoo, that's why I'm so repetitive

Phoebe and Cupe were unrealistically ideal and sugary and plane in my opinion

ME: I have read the comics too

THEM: Peggy and Steve they didn't even have a relationship Even a proper date Oh well

THEM: I'm judging by the movies It's just what you're mentioning appearing everywhere, in my opinion, it's just a context That makes it's toxic or not

ME: it's been years since I saw Charmed so  I'd have to rewatch it the show again.

THEM: Sometimes this checklists with definitions don't work I was obsessed so I remember some things