#yet the narrative tells us time and time again that it is JON who is the true king….

[jonsnowunemploymentera]

For a significant period of his life, Rhaegar lived knowing that he was the prophesied prince.

Until one day Prince Rhaegar found something in his scrolls that changed him. No one knows what it might have been, only that the boy suddenly appeared early one morning in the yard as the knights were donning their steel. He walked up to Ser Willem Darry, the master-at-arms, and said, ‘I will require sword and armor. It seems I must be a warrior.’ (Dany I, ASoS)

Most (if not all) of the written lore we have depicts Azor Ahai as being a warrior who wielded a magic sword. So it’s not unreasonable to assume that Rhaegar’s decision to become a warrior came because he read about Azor Ahai and his Lightbringer. And Rhaegar did become a warrior, one primarily characterized with his House’s main colors: black and red.

Many years later, Rhaegar’s last surviving son also reads about Azor Ahai and his Lightbringer — in a book Rhaegar left behind, no less. Now Jon doesn’t dwell too much on it, but a few chapters later he dreams of this:

Burning shafts hissed upward, trailing tongues of fire. Scarecrow brothers tumbled down, black cloaks ablaze. “Snow,” an eagle cried, as foemen scuttled up the ice like spiders. Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist. (Jon XII, ADWD)

This one line holds visual imagery that speaks a thousand words. Jon is a warrior in black armor, as his father once was. The visual contrast of black and red also calls back to the house of dragons; which is a great touch given that Jon’s ADWD arc is marked by Melisandre’s dreams of waking a dragon. Plus Jon has a glowing red sword — THE sword of heroes, Lightbringer.

There’s an interesting contrast between Jon and Rhaegar here. Rhaegar, defined by his inheritance, was directly primed to be the hero. But he couldn’t be because he died. On the other hand, Jon is defined by his lack of inheritance; being bastard born and all. Yet it’s Jon who actually lives to realize the hero’s ideal. Jon is the one who actually wields Lightbringer; well, he will in due time. Despite his bastardy, Jon is already achieving things Rhaegar never did. Which raises an interesting question: Rhaegar was the heir, but he never sat the throne, nor did he fulfill prophecy. Bastard as he is, Jon is already fulfilling prophecy….so will he do what his father never did and rule as well?

[ai-manre]

Following the Roses: A Meta

Having remerged into the fandom now after a long break, I was surprised to see all the currently prevailing ideas on a lot of things. It looks like the longer we go without the books, the more cycles and counter-cycles of convictions we have as a fandom, as our echo-chamber gets more intense and the contexts that much matter so much in canon fade. It was interesting to see all the different ideas and head-canons of people regarding R+L now in particular (with many now stalwartly characterizing Rhaegar as a prophecy-obsessed lunatic who impregnated Lyanna, with or without her will, and that Lyanna later grew to hate him). That made me curious into delving back to see what the books tell us and try to see where the narrative is leading us. Or maybe, more specifically, it's the roses I want to follow. The winter roses.

**The Introduction**

GRRM does a beautiful misdirection in the first book. Having Ned associate Lyanna again and again with the winter roses in his thoughts, by the time the origin of the winter roses is shown in Ned's last chapter, we have already associated Lyanna singularly with the roses. Rather than feeling the full impact of them being associated with her. So I'd like to go through the winter roses chronologically instead, according to the timeline.

**What is the narrative telling us?**

>Yet when the jousting began, the day belonged to Rhaegar Targaryen. The crown prince wore the armor he would die in: gleaming black plate with the three-headed dragon of his House wrought in rubies on the breast. A plume of scarlet silk streamed behind him when he rode, and it seemed no lance could touch him. Brandon fell to him, and Bronze Yohn Royce, and even the splendid Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning.

>Robert had been jesting with Jon and old Lord Hunter as the prince circled the field after unhorsing Ser Barristan in the final tilt to claim the champion's crown. Ned remembered the moment when all the smiles died, when*Prince Rhaegar Targaryen urged his horse past his own wife, the Dornish princess Elia Martell, to lay the queen of beauty's laurel in Lyanna's lap. He could see it still: a crown of winter roses, blue as frost*.

>*Ned Stark reached out his hand to grasp the flowery crown, but beneath the pale blue petals the thorns lay hidden. He felt them clawing at his skin, sharp and cruel, saw the slow trickle of blood run down his fingers, and woke, trembling, in the dark.*

>*Promise me, Ned, his sister had whispered from her bed of blood. She had loved the scent of winter roses. "Gods save me," Ned wept. "I am going mad."

This is the origin of the winter roses according to the timeline. We do not get mentions of Lyanna with the winter roses before Rhaegar crowned her with them. When Bran looks back in time and sees Lyanna, she's not seen around those roses. When the Northmen discuss her in her childhood, they don't mention her roses, only her horse-riding skills. In Howland's story of the wolf maid, she is not associated with them. Winter roses start featuring prominently around Lyanna Stark only after Rhaegar crowns her with them. Considering this to be the origin of the roses, I would find it safe to interpret that the roses don't solely symbolize Lyanna, but rather *the bond that grew between Rhaegar and Lyanna*. This way, the roses also work as a great narrative device for Ned to covertly think of R+L without directly giving it away to the readers.

This interpretation fits in very well with the next words, where Ned reaches out to touch the flower crown and feels the thorns underneath that claw at him. The beauty of the petals was hiding the "sharp and cruel" thorns underneath which could draw blood. Just like R+L's love which likely seemed a thing of great beauty to them, but resulted in pain and suffering for both of them and all around them. If, as some other interpretations go, the roses were meant to symbolize only Lyanna as a Stark maiden or represent her connection to Winterfell, it would make no sense for the sharp and cruel thorns to appear underneath.

In the words after, Ned describes her words from bed of blood and again, seemingly out of nowhere mentions how she had loved the scent of winter roses. Why was this sentence put here? In the middle of a seemingly irrelevant of her death? Following the narrative flow of where the roses began a few sentences ago, the meaning is clear. Lyanna had loved the scent of winter roses, loved the beauty of her bond with Rhaegar, maybe ignorant or uncaring of the thorns underneath.

>"And now it begins," said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light. "No," Ned said with sadness in his voice. "Now it ends." As they came together in a rush of steel and shadow, he could hear Lyanna screaming. "Eddard!" she called. *A storm of **rose** petals blew across a blood-streaked sky, as **blue** as the eyes of death.*

This is our next memory of Lyanna after the crowning at Harrenhal. Ned clashes with the Kingsguard trying to get to Lyanna, Ned's subconscious and the narrative associates this clash against a background of *storm of rose petals as blue as the eyes of death*. Again, the rose petals are associated with things like pain and blood and death. The blood-streaked sky is the background of the war, the war sparked by R+L's actions, the beautiful petals are still blowing, though they are "death". Rhaegar who is dead and Lyanna who is dying, their love that has started the fire that killed them both and many more including all the kingsguard and many northmen here here. (Though the situation was far more nuanced than just R+L being responsible for all the bloodshed that happened).

> "I was with her when she died," Ned reminded the king. "She wanted to come home, to rest beside Brandon and Father." He could hear her still at times. *Promise me, she had cried, in a room that smelled of blood and roses.* Promise me, Ned. The fever had taken her strength and her voice had been faint as a whisper, but when he gave her his word, the fear had gone out of his sister's eyes. *Ned remembered the way she had smiled then, how tightly her fingers had clutched his as she gave up her hold on life, the **rose** petals spilling from her palm, dead and black.* After that he remembered nothing. They had found him still holding her body, silent with grief. The little crannogman, Howland Reed, had taken her hand from his. Ned could recall none of it. "I bring her flowers when I can," he said. *"Lyanna was … fond of flowers."*

Now we come to her death. Ned remembers her room which had smelled of blood and roses. More importantly, he recalls the rose petals spilling from her palm as she died, implying that she had been holding on to them until the point of the death. The fact that her room smelled of roses itself implies that she had been making an effort to keep the roses around her, nothing was forcing her to have them around considering Rhaegar had left her months ago and died as well. (Unless anyone thinks evil Rhaegar ordered his Kingsguard to keep bringing roses to her against Lyanna's will? Or that the Kingsguard wanted to force her to continue having the roses around her? Imo that's ridiculous). It seems clear if we follow the narrative that the only roses these can be are the winter roses which connects her with Rhaegar. The fact that she took the effort to keep surrounding herself with roses, that she held onto the roses *until the moment of her death*, seems pretty irrefutable proof that she loved Rhaegar till the very end.

I have seen interpretations before that she was holding onto the roses as they symbolized her connection with Winterfell and her home. Apart from the reasons I had already mentioned above regarding why the roses clearly don't represent Winterfell, there is also the fact that if Lyanna wanted a connection to her home, her brother Ned Stark should be a much clearer option to cling onto rather than the roses connected heavily with Rhaegar (who according to this interpretation, she must have grown to hate). If it was only about her desire for home, we would have only gotten mentions of how hard she clung to Ned, there was no reason to mention the roses. But they were mentioned. And she did. She clung onto the roses as hard as she'd clung on to Ned, until death forced her to let go. This is capital R romanticism, Rhaegar died with Lyanna's name on his lips, Lyanna died with his roses (the last remnant of their love) in her palm. They died thinking of each other. And the roses, the roses are now "dead and black" just as both of them are.

After remembering that moment, Ned tells Robert that he brings her flowers. That Lyanna had loved flowers (note the ellipses). Lyanna had loved the scent of winter roses, even as they'd brought her death. She had loved Rhaegar, even as that brought her so much pain.

> Her eyes burned, green fire in the dusk, like the lioness that was her sigil. "The night of our wedding feast, the first time we shared a bed, he called me by your sister's name. He was on top of me, in me, stinking of wine, and he whispered Lyanna." *Ned Stark thought of pale blue roses, and for a moment he wanted to weep.* "I do not know which of you I pity most."The queen seemed amused by that. "Save your pity for yourself, Lord Stark. I want none of it."

Next, Ned thinks of the roses when he speaks with Cersei. And this, I love this!! Ned having to confront Robert's love for his sister and all that had cost him (not getting into Robert's vices here), knowing that Lyanna had loved Rhaegar. To see his friend cost himself a life and the love of Cersei by not getting over Lyanna, unknowing that Lyanna had never loved him! What Ned doesn't know but the narrative enriches is "I do not know which of you I pity the most" because Cersei had wanted Rhaegar as much as Robert had wanted Lyanna. Both were defeated so thoroughly by R+L's love for eachother.

>He was walking through the crypts beneath Winterfell, as he had walked a thousand times before. The Kings of Winter watched him pass with eyes of ice, and the direwolves at their feet turned their great stone heads and snarled. Last of all, he came to the tomb where his father slept, with Brandon and Lyanna beside him. "Promise me, Ned," Lyanna's statue whispered. *She wore a garland of pale blue roses, and her eyes wept blood.* Eddard Stark jerked upright, his heart racing, the blankets tangled around him. The room was black as pitch, and someone was hammering on the door. "Lord Eddard," a voice called loudly.

Nothing much here, just Lyanna again with her garland of roses (aka R+L) reminding Ned of his promise to protect their only son. This is a covert reference to R+L=J. With this, we end Ned's POV and move on to the next references of winter roses.

>She smiled again, a flash of white teeth. *"And she never sung you the song o' the winter rose?" "I never knew my mother. Or any such song."*

The next time the mentions of winter roses crop up again is in Jon's story, where Ygritte asks him if his mother had never sung the song of winter rose to him. To which he responds that he'd never known his mother or such a song, unknowing that this song was the hint to his mother, that this song represented her life.

>North or south, singers always find a ready welcome, so Bael ate at Lord Stark's own table, and played for the lord in his high seat until half the night was gone. The old songs he played, and new ones he'd made himself, and he played and sang so well that when he was done, the lord offered to let him name his own reward. 'All I ask is a flower,' Bael answered, 'the fairest flower that blooms in the gardens o' Winterfell.'"

>*"Now as it happened the winter roses had only then come into bloom, and no flower is so rare nor precious. So the Stark sent to his glass gardens and commanded that the most beautiful o' the winter roses be plucked for the singer's payment. And so it was done. But when morning come, the singer had vanished . . . and so had Lord Brandon's maiden daughter. Her bed they found empty, but for the pale blue rose that Bael had left on the pillow where her head had lain." Jon had never heard this tale before.*

A singer and a Stark maiden. The Stark girl who loved Bael so much that she'd given him a son (just as Jon himself was born) and who later threw herself off a tower when her son brought her Bael's head. Quite a few narrative resonances here, death of the Stark maid in a tower, a relative who had a hand in the death of her love. "No flower so rare nor precious". Is there anything so rare and precious as true, unconditional love? As Maester Aemon says, "We are only human after all, and the gods have fashioned us for love. That is our great glory and our great tragedy."

> But there were others with faces he had never known in life, faces he had seen only in stone. *The slim, sad girl who wore a crown of pale blue roses and a white gown spattered with gore could only be Lyanna.* - Theon V, ACOK

The next mention is, oddly enough, in Theon's prophetic dreams. Again, Lyanna is associated with the crown of roses Rhaegar gave her and death. The white gown might represent marriage as it is an interesting detail to have mentioned (instead of just calling it a gown) but I don't have strong opinions on it either way.

The next mention is the most interesting to me, as for the first time, the roses lead to the future rather than the past.

>Then phantoms shivered through the murk, images in indigo. Viserys screamed as the molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman's name. . . . mother of dragons, daughter of death . . . Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire. . . . mother of dragons, slayer of lies . . . Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness. . . . mother of dragons, bride of fire . . . - Dany IV, ACOK

>"Perhaps," she said reluctantly. "Yet the things I saw . . .""A dead man in the prow of a ship, a blue rose, a banquet of blood . . . what does any of it mean, Khaleesi? A mummer's dragon, you said. What is a mummer's dragon, pray?" - Dany V, ACOK

And what a lovely image it is. Jon, the sole child of Rhaegar and Lyanna, the only remnant of their love, growing at the Wall. For once, the imagery is overwhelmingly positive. The beautiful blue rose, against all odds, flourishes in the harshest of environments and what's more, it "fills the air with sweetness". Rhaegar and Lyanna might have died, but the child that resulted from their bond is making the world better.

The Conclusion

What's more, even in the latest calendar illustration GRRM had [commissioned](https://www.reddit.com/r/ImaginaryWesteros/comments/1093bgk/2024_calendar_cover_art_by_justin_sweet/), we know instinctively that it is Rhaegar and Lyanna thanks to the winter roses. Rhaegar who crowned Lyanna with these roses. Lyanna who died clutching them till the last moment. Their son who fights to protect the realms of men, doing the duty of a King without even knowing that he is one, that he is the King of the narrative. The blue rose who continues to bloom in the harshest of places.

The significance that in the text, it's Jon and only **JON** who is connected with/represented as the blue winter rose is important. Neither of the Stark maidens, Sansa or Arya, are ever connected with the blue rose in the text itself despite both having love for flowers. No other Stark has this motif in their story. The motif belongs solely to Bael and his Lady Stark, to Rhaegar and Lyanna, to Jon himself. It's the motif of love. Prince Rhaegar had loved his Lady Lyanna and thousands died for it. Lady Lyanna had loved her Prince Rhaegar and their child is saving the realms of men.

The roses that bloomed for them and between them. That showed how beautiful their love was and how painful. The world is cruel, the world is beautiful.

[throwawayasoiafaccount]

i am reminded once again that people are so weird about rhaegar.

it’s interesting but nauseating to see the shift about him on the anti-rhaegar side of the fandom as it’s clear that people are still wildly and crazily deep in their fanon versions of him, but have decided he’s somewhat useful to them as the fandom becomes less accepting of the ‘targaryens are bad and all mad’ narrative that was floating around for years, so some of the antis have slightly changed their tunes.

i should clarify that the shift does seem subtle right now, so maybe it’s not going to affect the way the antis discuss rhaegar that much, but i find it interesting and a bit annoying so im gonna discuss it.

the shift is basically starting from ‘rhaegar was a moron and killed his family by fucking his whore so he deserved death’ and seems to be heading to ‘rhaegar was secretly really cunning and cruel and actually loved elia but she was iffy/neutral of him and he only got with lyanna to have a baby and left her to die cause he was always gonna go back to elia.’

both of these are crazy interpretations imo, but the second one is even worse than the first. the first interpretation is at least a tad bit understandable, but the second is completely based on fanon land nonsense.

because… how is rhaegar seen as cunningly cruel when he’s only been paralleled with dany and jon, two incredibly kind characters? one of the first times dany is directly paralleled to rhaegar is when dany was protecting others! while we do learn a lot about rhaegar through these parallels, there’s also an on page interaction that completely contradicts the ‘rhaegar is cruel and callous’ interpretation. it starts when jamie is recalling rhaegar’s departure to the trident, he remembers when jon darry snapped at him, telling him to obey and stay with aerys; then rhaegar takes the time to console a teenage jamie and ease his worries before he leaves. we have all this and yet people interpret this character as cunningly cruel and willing to use others for his own ends?

like bsffr… this is a character who prefers writing songs and singing them instead of violence and the song of swords. that says a lot about rhaegar, and it’s all good things.

speaking of good things said about rhaegar: barristan as whitebeard, when he was still sussing out dany, calls rhaegar able, determined, deliberate, dutiful, and single-minded. these are all positive descriptions. barristan also later says that there’s a lot of good to be said about rhaegar, more than any of dany’s other relatives. this is not the description of someone hiding a nasty personality behind a perfect facade, it’s a deliberate set up preparing us readers for the big rhaelya reveal and to contradict roberts anti rhaegar propaganda.

i also want to mention the other side of rhaegar. he was described as melancholy and was said to have sad eyes, and according to cersei he looked wounded. it seems like he suffered from depression. and based on the parallels between aerys and viserys, i think it’s safe to assume that aerys was likely abusive to rhaegar like viserys was to dany. what’s written in a world of ice and fire supports my case and shows that things were always very very tense between rhaegar and aerys. things were so tense in fact that aerys even brought varys in as spymaster partly because he mistrusted rhaegar. that is a very terrible environment for someone to grow up in, and yet rhaegar still pulled through so much so that characters still sing his praises years after his death. that’s impressive and shows how good of an impression he left on so many characters.

now, i also want to discuss the rhaegar x elia ship as it’s getting more popular as the tides keep shifting. one quote that these shippers use to support their ship is the “rhaegar was fond of elia” remark made by barristan, but the context of that conversation is specifically left out by these shippers. basically the conversation began when dany is telling barristan that she’ll do her duty and marry hizdahr, so she asks barristan if rhaegar wed for duty or love. barristan hesitates and tells her that rhaegar was fond of elia but says nothing about love. context is key here. and while it’s not surprising that these shippers need to strip away the context as they have to go up against rhaelya, which has a lot of textual support, it is deceitful and proves that their case is weak in compassion to the build up of rhaelya.

anyways… yeah… this shifting tide is weird af and seems like a huge backwards dive into fanon land, and while i can’t control anyone i think i’ve done my best to stay true to canon by mentioning what we know about rhaegar and trying to keep my interpretations grounded.

tbh… i don’t even like this character that much, but i think his impact on the fandom is so cool. cause it’s like… here is rhaegar, a sad boy, and yet so many people treat him like he’s satan incarnate responsible for everything bad. it’s like so wild and so far from what little we know of him. so, basically, because of this fandom discourse, i became interested in this character and am now one of his defenders. yeahhhhh….

also, because so many people liked to basically shit on rhaegar for ‘doing nothing’ and ‘just letting war break out’ i found it kinda fun to theorize about what he may have actually been doing at the time of the rebellion. as of now, i’m pretty set in my belief that he specifically went to dorne to conspire with house martell and potential allies in order to overthrow aerys. my theory is based on what we know of his personality, and i think his last words to jamie clearly hint that he had some sort of plan in place; and since he was last in dorne, it’s only logical to conclude that there was something going on.

that’s all

[littlemisssquiggles]

Did you see the RWBY volume 9 epilogue?

I'm happy there was more to it than what we got from last year and that we actually got to see characters like Nora Oscar and Ren featured as important characters

I'm especially Happy Oscar actually got to be in it because to be honest he gets excluded so much I was actually shocked he had a part and we actually got to focus on him for once

This also gives me hope that they'll do something similar like they did with cinder ,with Oscar because I believe it was possibly said in a q&a or in a live stream

that originally they wanted to do cinders backstory and volume 4-5 when we thought she got killed off again but they kept having to push it back along with other things they wanted to do for certain characters

and since many think Oscar is possibly not going to make it through his merge and it will be just ozpin/Oz

when it's done maybe we'll actually get to see his past and maybe because Oscar is merging with Ozpin that means his memories are catching up with Oz's memories and will maybe get to see Oz's past too because that's something we've all wondered about as well

and maybe we'll get a hint at where the final relic is because I don't believe the writers are just going to wait tell the last minute to show us were it is I think they're going to hint at it

I don't Oscar part sense he my favorite along side ozpin

what do you think 🤔

Hiya Autumn o/ Thank you so much for your inbox and pardon the late reply.

To answer your first question, yes, I did see the full V9 Epilogue Animatic. TWICE and I plan on rewatching it many, many times because I haven’t recovered from it yet.

I know I’ve been relatively silent these days especially when it comes to this newly dropped animatic. But that’s mostly because I haven’t fully gathered my thoughts on it yet to form a consisive essay.

My head is still reeling from all that was revealed in that short space of animatic frames, particularly the bits about Oscar and what he’s currently going through. As a Pinehead, you just know that part got to me the most because BOI! WAS IT GOOD! Oscar-worthy, as I might say,

So if I may, and if you don’t mind m’fam, I am going to piggyback off of your inboxed message and use this as opportunity to get some of my main thoughts about Oscar’s side of the Epilogue off of my chest. So here I go.

According to the RWBY V9 full Epilogue Animatic…

Oscar’s story with the Merge with Oz has officially started with him isolating himself from his friends while he goes through it on his own, practically dooming him (and essentially Oz as well) to suffer in silence.

But while that’s how things seem to be starting, if it doesn’t end with a scene where Oscar is going through the Merge but this time he’s surrounded by all of his friends all vowing to stay by side through it all and cherish him for who he is---Oscar---no matter who he becomes after the Merge.

If it doesn’t end with all of Oscar’s friends being there for him during the Merge (ESPECIALLY Ruby) then, like Jon Snow , I don't want it.

I don’t know how Oscar’s story will end.

The way I perceive it, Oscar’s story can end in many possible different ways.

In one way, Oscar’s story could end the way it was originally intended to, according to the natural progression of the narrative.---with Salem being defeated, Ozma finally moving on and Oscar being allowed to live the rest of his days as himself, Merge completely avoided.

Or like a Shamalan movie, it can end with a twist. Maybe Oscar isn’t so lucky and doesn’t avoid the Merge like his predecessors and is changed forever.

Maybe Oscar gets attack by Tyrian and “dies” forcing the Merge to happen as a way to save his life.

Maybe Oscar is taken to the Tree and gets to meet the Blacksmith who decides his final fate in the Merge.

Or who knows? Maybe the CRWBY Writers saw the recent 60th anniversary Doctor Who special and have the brilliance to put a new spin on the whole Ozma cycle where instead of Oscar merging with Oz, the two split apart with either wizards retaining their memories and single identities.

Instead of Oscar of losing himself to the Merge, he is set free leaving Ozma to carry on his mission to the Gods as himself. So no more pairing him up with like-minded souls. Like Oscar, Ozma is now his own person with his own agency. So even if he died again, similar to Salem, Ozma was still immortal only now he would simply come back in his original body as opposed to the former latter of playing hot potato with his soul inhabiting another poor innocent man or young boy’s body. All this with the extra added bonus that now we have two great and powerful wizards for the price of one. Both Oscar and the newly reincarnated Ozma (who gets back his original form---the one that was married to Salem and equally as powerful as her) retained his combat-ready muscle memory and shared ability to use magic. So Ozma, naturally fights with his trademark Long Memory, while Oscar uses magic freehand without the need for the cane.

That last one’s a big stretch but like all of my past Pinehead headcanons that I’ve tossed aimlessly into the ether of the FNDM community, I’m keeping it on the table of possibilities since it’d make a sick Oscar the Sorceror’s Apprentice Pinehead headcanon AU. Definitely adding that one to the list.

---

Anyways, getting back on track. Through everything that Oscar has been put through in the story so far, the most I want from this whole Merge storyline is that he doesn’t have to go through it on his own and I don’t mean, he’s going through it with just Oz as his main company.

What I mean for that is, I don’t think the implications of what the Merge means has truly sunk in for the rest of the hero team. A part of me wishes to assume that part of the reason why the rest of the hero team seems so nonchalant about Oscar’s whole merge with Oz is because Oscar has never truly been honest with them about how he really feels about the merge.

The last time Oscar spoke about the Merge with the team was back in V6 when he basically did it in such a “no biggie; don’t worry about me” sort of way that it came off as if he just said it to sound brave in the moment for the sake of the team and for the sake of keeping his own emotions in check.

I say this because as we’ve seen from the events of V7 through V8, Oscar is very anxious about the Merge. He doesn’t want it to happen which is why he and Oz are now fighting to keep it from happening even though it’s already long begun.

Bottom-line, I don’t think Oscar has been completely honest with anyone else outside of Oz about how he truly feels concerning the Merge. And now that it’s happening, he’s basically resolved himself to go through it alone. I don’t even think anyone else in the current group; not Nora, not Emerald, not even Ren (who literally has the ability to read someone’s thoughts and feelings through their emotions) knows about what he’s going through.

I wonder if Oscar puts on a brave face whenever he’s with the others and anytime he feels another “Merger episode” coming along, he quickly excuses himself (probably claiming that he needs to get back to his research in the Archives of Solitude) so the others don’t have to see him going through it.

Ren, in particular, because I’m sure if Ren saw Oscar’s pain from the Merge, he would blurt it out. Ren has now become the unsung singing canary of the hero team after his whole semblance upgrade.

Just like how he blurted out that Ozpin was back during the tunnel walk back in V8 following the rescue mission and escape from Monstro, Ren would definitely reveal that Oscar is going through the Merge if he knew he was going through it and having a painful grand ole time too.

Ren’s inability to remain discrete when revealing another’s true emotions could probably explain why Oscar has been avoiding alone time with him.

If you look at it, Ren is on his own probably stretching himself between helping everyone. It’s also interesting to me that Oscar hasn’t asked anyone else to help look for stuff in the Shade Archives.

Even if Oscar is technically two people in one, that is still a big ass library of books and archives to sift through for even two people. And yet, as we saw from the epilogue, Oscar is ALONE most of the time and I highly doubt no one else offered to help him in the libraries.

I know the Atlesian refugees are a priority but, when you look closely, everyone else is basically sharing the work; helping each other out with something. Nora is supporting folks like SSSN and CVFY.

Same for Ren. Em as well (even though she’s mostly mentioned in notes in the scene in the animatic).

 But when you look to Oscar. He is ALL BY HIMSELF.

Yes, he has Oz with him. But, that doesn’t count. Why hasn’t anyone else volunteered to help Oscar in the archives?

My assumption is because Oscar probably convinced the others to leave the archives to him (and Oz) and prioritize the refugees as a way of ensuring that he’s by himself at all times so no one would have to glimpse his pain from the Merge.

Again, each time a merger episode was highlighted in the epilogue animatic, Oscar was by himself. So my money is that no one knows what Oscar’s really going through.

No one else knows of his mental struggle or pain.

And why I find this interesting is because it kind of parallels Ruby’s whole detachment period from the others in the Ever After before she went to the Tree and what happened at the Mad Tea Party.

Not saying Oscar will share a similar experience as Ruby. I’m just saying, he’s clearly removed himself from the others and acting alone.

As Ren pointed out, he’s not himself. He’s there but…not there at the same time.

This brings me back to my point. Personally, I do want Oscar pulling himself from the team to hide the fact that he’s going through the Merge to be proven canon.

And I want it to be canon so that the first person to pick up that something is clearly off about Oscar’s behaviour to be Ruby.

Maybe Ruby realizes that Oscar is acting weird and when she brings it up, Ren is probably definitely the first person to reveal that he’s been sensing something off for a while but after everything that’s happened, similar to how he’s currently giving Nora space to work things out on her own, Ren has been doing the same with Oscar.

He’s been giving the little prince space when if anyone were to look closely at Ren’s expressions, they could probably see his frustration in being the one to know fully well that his friends aren’t entirely ok and despite wanting to help, he still feels helpless because Ren can’t force his friends to accept his help; no matter how much he offers, y’know what I mean?

I feel like some of RWBYJ’s struggles in the After Ever and how they rose to triumph over them could be mirrored in what NOR is going through now back in Vacuo.

Overall, the point I’m trying to make here is that I just want a moment where Oscar is having another merger episode and he tries to go through it alone, believing that he has to, only to get the reassurance and support he needs from his friends.

I saw someone compare Oscar’s merger episodes to Penny’s battle with Watts’ virus back in V8.

And while I didn’t enjoy the forced heavy focus on Penny during that season, I did sort of like how it culminated in everyone coming together to show their support of Penny and reminding her that she is a part of their team.

That is a type of a moment I want for Oscar. Because unlike Penny, feeling like a part of the team as himself and not just a placeholder for Oz is something Oscar desires.

I want Oscar to push his friends away, believing that he needed to go through this Merge on his own, only to be reminded by his friends in the end that they have his back no matter what.

That he is still a part of their team. That he is still Oscar to them no matter who he becomes in the Merge.

I want a scene where Oscar loses it, possibly even abusing his magic to force walls between himself and his friends only for those said friends to break down those walls and be there for him.

(Maybe even have a moment where Oscar loses control of his magic while trying to fight the Merge and it ends up looking like a moment where everyone thinks it's another Grimm attack when it's actually Oscar whose feelings of the merge have manifested into some kind of monstrous form that Oscar practically cocooned himself inside of).

Y’know that moment in Steven Universe Future where Steven loses control and all of his friends---all the major people he has helped throughout the seasons---come together to help him for once.

I want a moment where the whole team---Ruby, Nora, Ren, Jaune, Blake, Yang, Weiss and Emerald---all of Oscar’s people are there at his side showing him full support as he goes through the Merge; ensuring him that he doesn’t have to be scared of the Merge anymore because no matter who he becomes in the Merge, he will always be Oscar to them.

He’s not Ozpin. He’s not Ozma. He’s sure as hell ain’t Salem’s Ozma. He’s Oscar. Their Oscar

The small, cute farm boy from Mistral who showed up on their doorstep one random night in Mistral and has now cemented himself as one of the most important members of their little team that they will not stand to lose; not even to himself.

I want Oscar to be reminded by his friends that he will be cherished and supported no matter who he becomes in Merge.

Even if Oscar forgot his “old self” due to the Merge, they---his friends, will be there to remind him of who he was because they, as his friends, will never forgot Oscar because to them, he never left.

I just want a moment where everybody group hugs Oscar while he cries about SIX SEASONS worth of repressed tears after all the sh** he's been put through plot-wise. I want it dagnabbit!

Who knows? Maybe Oscar has another painful merger episode and it’s the worse one he’s had since it started and the love and support of his friends surrounding him is what helps to ease him out of it and back to his old farm boy Oscar self.

Just give me one scene like that. That’s all I want.

Don’t know if it will ever come to fruition given the current state of RT and the fate of RWBY as a whole. But hey, still wanted to get that off of my chest.

---

On the subject of the CRWBY Writers possibly showing more of Oscar's past in V10 as he's going through the Merge:

Honestly, at this point, m'fam, it's either now or never.

Now, as in during the events of V10, is the perfect time to give the audience more insight into Oscar's past and who he is. It is practically mandatory at this point that they show it as he is going into a storyline where he's being forced to lose that part of himself. They just have to do it!

Just as how V8 could pretty much be pretty much summed up as another Cinder-centric season similar to V4-V5, V10 could potentially be more Oscar-focused as he's going through the Merge. Like I said, it's the right time for them to do it.

And while I'm unsure of them telling Ozpin's story, maybe that too can be done and do something similar to what they did with Ren and Nora's backstory back in V4.

We got Ren and Nora's whole history in Kunoyuri in an episode that jumped back and forth between the past and the present.

Perhaps Oscar could have a potential episode in V10 where he's having another Merge episode and, as I theorized, he loses control of his magic while a) fighting the Merge again and b) running away/hiding from his friends so that they would've have to see him suffer through it.

So it's an episode that ping pongs between the present day where Oscar's friends are trying to get through to him while he's suffering through yet another painful Merger episode and the past which reveals more of Oscar's backstory leading up to the moment he met Oz and possibly showing other Oscar-centric moments that we, as the audience, never got to see like what happened with Oscar in Argus after his fall out with Jaune (remember we never got to see his side of things and it's something that still bothers me to this day)

Perhaps Ozpin's past is mixed in with it as well as you mentioned and the location of the final relic is actually revealed in Ozpin's memories in a flashback where he entrusted the location to someone. Maybe that person was Summer Rose. Since V9 revealed there is more to Summer Rose's story and that Raven actually knows more about that; perhaps Summer Rose's disappearance is connected to the final Relic or at least the final vault?

I dunno.

Overall, I definitely do like the idea of a potential episode of V10 fully dedicated to sharing bits of both Oscar's past as well as Ozpin's; specifically during his time as headmaster of Beacon when Team STRQ were still students since it could potentially reveal more on where Oz hid the location of the Vault of the Fall Maiden and the Relic of Choice. And if that episode is then followed up by an episode that shows the hero team---all of Oscar's friends actually helping him through an episode of the Merge then even better.

I think that would be pretty amazing. Hope that helps answer your questions m'fam. Let me know.

~ LMS (2024)

[esther-dot]

You know sometimes fans forget that Dany was raised by Viserys and he fed Targ exceptionalism and blood purity to her. He taught her that Targs have right to Westeros. Plus she is surrounded by toxic people who generally feeds her Targ propaganda. At many times she started emaluting like her toxic family. Yet they think that Dany an underdog shouldn't be punished by narrative. That her becoming like her evil family is reductive story.

I understand the discomfort fans have with some of Martin’s choices here, but he said that the Targaryens were inspired by the Ptolemy dynasty, which imo indicates he always intended to tell the story of the end of house Targaryen. I really don’t think he expected fans to believe Dany would be victorious and restore House Targaryen, simply because, it isn’t a good thing for people to liken themselves to gods or believe in blood purity. The fact that the fandom has ostracized those who point to such things as bad is…interesting.

At the same time, I do have a lot of sympathy for those who feel that it is offensive to write an abuse victim turning into an abuser. But, we can have objections to things Martin has written without denying what he’s done. I think that’s an essential aspect of engaging with this series, actually. Viserys is such an abusive, horrible force in Dany’s life, and I do think she could have been different / had a different end if she wasn’t so influenced by him/the Targ beliefs. She still has good instincts, the desire to do good, but it isn’t enough for her to reject all the Targ ideas he inculcated in her at such a young age.

I think it’s gonna get so much worse because the fear that “waking the dragon” inspires in Dany (and us!) because of Viserys’ abuse makes that an especially worrisome phrase, and while it features a lot in AGOT, we understandably start to see it far less as the series goes on until it pops up again from Dany’s own lips in ADWD. To me, that must be a deliberate choice on the author’s part to indicate where this is heading. I suppose the frustration is that it feels like Dany is doomed by her blood because we know she has better instincts. We know she doesn’t *want* to be evil, but Martin has talked about being the hero in one’s own story, the villain being the hero of the other side, and no other character has the potential to carry that the way Dany does. We either have people who are recognized as villains by everyone, heroes, and then those who are clearly doing bad things but people deny it means anything. The interest in having a psychological reason for why someone makes the choices they do (Cersei has them, Tyrion, the Hound, even LF…) means that we can relate and see them as humans, which is a worthy goal artistically, even though for some people, the abused to abuser take is too much.

I suppose what saves the story from being reductive is how many characters we have? As in, Jon is a Targ, and we know he will not give into the worst Targaryen impulses—this isn’t about blood. Sam was raised in a toxic/abusive environment, and he is kind and good — this isn’t a story in which your fate is written by your abusers. Bran was driven from his home and starved in the North but will ultimately have some hand in saving Westeros— this isn’t a story in which all those who are wronged are forever exiled / doomed to failure.

I know we all pick our favs and think “of this happens to X, the story is saying Y,” but it isn’t quite that simple, and Dany is only part of a much more complex whole.

[lycanlovingvampyre]

MAG 155 Relisten

Activity on my first listen: sitting in my hammock chair on the balcony

So after MAG 154 has been such a banger I couldn't stop and wanted to listen to yet another episode! So I grabbed my phone and went upstairs and outside on the balcony to listen to this one. It's one of my favorite statements, it’s so good on a very complicated level! (Plus that conversation with Basira at the beginning!) ... (It’s gonna be a long post...)

BASIRA: "Hmm. London’s what, 600 square miles?" JON: "607." I don't even think this is the Beholding, I think Jon just knows that xD Just like I know the exact meters of sea level of my hometown XD

JON: "I mean… I don’t know how much she can predict or manipulate the future, but I think she’s proven she can at least avoid us finding her." BASIRA: "Yeah, well, it makes me feel better." Oh yeah, one of the most horrible things... Knowing that there is a spider, but not knowing where...

BASIRA: "Why did you call her and not me?" JON: "Honestly, I panicked. Her name came up first on my phone." We needed it to be Daisy for the narrative, but also I like to think that Jon trusts Daisy more than Basira. And having Daisy come up first on his phone also just shows, that he's talking more often to Daisy on his phone than to Basira.

BASIRA: "I’m trying to convince her to go after them. To, uh… Hunt them." JON: "Why?" BASIRA: "Because I’m not going to lose her." JON: "She goes hunting again, you might anyway." BASIRA: "And if she doesn’t, she might die." JON: "Something you’re fine with in certain other cases, and something she’s made peace with." Ah yes, now the real hypocrisy starts... Jon sounds so angry here when he's calling her out on it. I mean, yeah, I get the emotional side of it, Basira has been with Daisy for a long time and you tend to have a lot more patience for people you love than for people you do not care that much about. But it must still feel horrible on Jon's side.

BASIRA: "Because of the guilt she feels over the stuff the Hunt made her do. It’s not her fault." Oh, just because you feel guilty everything's okay? That's not how it works. It might be an important step to stop doing it, self recognition, but it's still a long way from there. Jon says he wanted to get those live statements, that they felt good. It doesn't mean that he can't feel guilty about it. Isn't that a theme with addiction? (I don't know, I don't think I've ever been addicted to something, at least not in the conventional sense. But I damn sure know what it feels like doing something because you wanted it so badly in that moment and afterwards you see it different -> mundane example of eating that damn piece of pie and regretting it afterwards xDD) Also interesting topic there, "the stuff the Hunt made her do". It might not be a shock to hear that police here in Austria is also pretty right-winged. What is it, that makes police like this. I know only one police officer, she's leftist and of course has a really, reaaally hard time with her colleagues. Gotta ask her someday if it's just that kind of people who chose to become police (it would make sense, that promise of power does attract these kind of people. A phenomenon you can also see in management positions), or if there's in fact a considerable amount of people on the fence, who then get brain-washed into that bullshit.  

JON: "Earlier, when she was still out of it, I… I saw some of the things she was talking about, some of the things she did while she was police. I’m not convinced I disagree with her assessment. Do you want me to tell you?" BASIRA: "No. No I don’t." JON: "You knew, didn’t you? You knew the sort of things she did, and you let her." BASIRA: "No. Not exactly. I thought… It’s not that simple." JON: "It never is. But that doesn’t make it okay." Denial might be natural, but not one of the steps to make things better...

JON: "No. I suppose not. In many ways it’s simpler now isn’t it? At least now our demons have names." OMG yes... Even though none of my "problems" have resolved themselves, being able to put names to them makes it so much easier. And some of those things actually stopped being a problem as soon as I understood them. Now they're just a part of who I am and I won't beat myself up about them anymore.

Conversations like these are so important. Not just in-story for character growth, but also for us to understand them better, maybe even to understand ourselves better.

"I know most people have plenty to live for, but what I mean is that my life does good. I put a lot into the world. Did you read about that homelessness initiative that got 8,000 people into shelters? That was me. I’ve financed drug projects, organized inner city violence initiatives. I’ve always been so aware of the position I’m in, and keen to use that power to actually help people." Ahhh, I love/hate the fact that THIS is the person who tries to justify their behavior....

"My existence does a lot of good, and that’s only gotten more true since all this started. I’ve given more, spent more time on charitable stuff, and helped more people." Yeah, figures, trying to compensate the guilt.

"Sorry, I’m just… aware of how this story makes me look and I don’t want you to think I’m some selfish monster grinding people up just to extend my own ghoulish life. I’m trying to do good." Ahhh, this statement is so extremely difficult and I love it!!!

"So when I had an epileptic seizure, the first one of my entire life, the month before my wedding… that wasn’t fair. I mean, even if I had to have epilepsy – which I could live with – having my first attack at the top of a staircase, five weeks before the happiest day of my life, that’s just not fair!" That’s life. Life doesn't have a manual with an warranty. Vis major doesn't have any fairness. It just is.

"But more likely I thought it would be nothing. No heaven or hell, no thought or sensation, just… Nothing. You wouldn’t even notice you were gone." Oh yeah, I think of this sometimes and it makes my head feel fuzzy. It's not possible to comprehend, this nothingness.

"But it wasn’t like that at all. I don’t know if I have words for it. How can you describe being aware of the absence of everything? Life. Light. Warmth." At least there is a mind to describe it. The nothingness doesn't even have this... Oh course, if it ends in nothingness, I won’t care about this...

"It was very dark, and very cold. It dawned on me that this might be my existence forever. There, beyond time, and I tried so desperately to scream, but I had no lungs or throat in that dreadful place." Literally “And I Must Scream” xD The trope of a fate worse than death and the statement giver tries to scream^^

"And then I felt something. I felt myself reach into his chest, held the strong steady beat of his heart. Calm. Calm while I was lying dead on the table. There was a sudden moment of rage and hate that flowed out of me down at his torso" Yeah yeah, we needed that for the story to progress. But I think this is also why the Jigsaw Killer in Saw imprisoned that doctor? At least I remember that I first began to think about this when watching Saw - the first one I mean, from 2004. This is something that always makes me a bit mad. What do you think makes you so special that the doctor should beat themself up over your fate? Do people not realize that doctors and nurses see this every week? Do people think medicals would be able to continue their jobs if every tragic case gets to them? This is something you have to understand, when you work in medical. You can't let these things get to you. It'll eat you alive and then you'll be less than ever able to help people. Yes, getting a devastating diagnosis is an exceptional state and I know this leads to all kinds of emotional outbursts. But it won't change a thing if the medical staff feels sorry for you or not (provided they're not complete assholes about it of course!). And I say this having been on both sides.

"I had to live, I couldn’t die, not then. We were on the verge of closing a deal that would provide fresh water to impoverished communities in a dozen developing countries. Without me, it would fall through." Ahhh, this statement! This is already something like the dilemma of MAG 199. Hypothetical impact on other people. Morally/logically (?) you would have to say every life is equal. So when you have to kill again and again and again then several lives would pay for your single life. But then we get the hypothetical component of the survival of this single person might save hundreds, thousands more! Suddenly that scale dips the other way. But you won't know if without that one person the project would actually fail or work just fine.

"If only I could have explained it to her, I’m sure she would have understood. She might even have agreed." OMG, holy hell, wtf, no! Why would that person want to live any less than you do?

"Perhaps it was life itself that I was taking, and the old woman that had hardly any left in her, and it had run out too fast." It does sound plausible at least?... Isn't that vaguely how Death Note works for the Shinigami? I can't remember, it's been so long since I read the manga and I never watched the anime...

"This time I sought out a homeless man. Young and strong, though his life was clearly over as he tried to destroy himself through drinking." Aaaah, so now we had an old person and a homeless alcoholic... It seems those are the people less valued in our society... Thanks, I hate it!

I love how the music picks up when the statement giver has a car accident only 3 months after the homeless guy. Cause it's the moment when this turns into absolute madness, seemingly having to take more and more lives!

"I took a newborn. It’s strange, the maths you do of it all. A full life ahead of it, but aside from the devastated parents, no real harm to the world as a whole. No good works left unfinished." I... know that this is where a lot of people get absolutely mad at the statement giver, but I think that's missing the point of the statement. The cost of living... or more the cost of a life. Its value. By what criteria is the value calculated? There is a tendency of society putting an awful lot of value on children's lives. Rather save the kid than the adult... But adults want to live too... This discussion has become even more complicated with the pandemic. Cause then we tried to protect people with pre-existing illnesses and old folks the most. At the cost of mental health of so many. I remember very clearly when young folks suddenly began to become angry when elders immediately went outside after lockdowns to sit in cafes. Like they said, we stayed home for you to protect you and now you immediately throw that away by putting yourself so much at risk? Then again, I remember a.. politician (I think?) also saying something absolutely mad like "Old folks should die for the freedom of the youths"... Holy fuck... Well, long story short, I find this topic just highly interesting...

"It was about connection. About joy. The more friends, family, loved ones the person has, the further out the terror of sudden death spreads from me. The longer it keeps me alive." Ahhh, that it such an interesting concept! The more impact on the surrounding world, the more "saturating" is that life. And Fear Entity-wise that makes sense. It feeds off of that negative emotions. And this actually ties in with the Desolation and not just the End. Causing pain through loss.

"I’m 40 now, and I have taken the life of beloved mothers, respected professionals, pillars of the community. But I have done so much good with my life, I’ve reached further helped more people than they ever could have." Hahaha, have you? Cause in the end, you'll never know...

"I’m not saying how I live is right, or good, but it is the position I have been put in, and a decision I have to make. I never wanted to weigh up the value of a life, to set it on the scales against my own, but that’s a choice that I am forced into. And it is one I will continue to make." Just boil it down to this: The desire to survive is stronger than the guilt of taking lives' of others. Period. No excuses of doing good.

JON: "I’ve saved the world, the whole world. Does that give me the right to take what I need to survive?" Aaaah, such a good question!

MELANIE: "It’s – it’s the rest of you I’m worried about." Seriously, Melanie really made me angry at times. But I think that was all during her Slaughter bullet time. She not an easy person, but seems to care a lot. And when she's not hurting she can be really sweet.

Also again the parallel of the statement and the conversations being held in that same episode. All of them are about a certain price. Losing yourself and hurting others to survive, losing your eyesight to be free... Melanie says it, she okay to pay the price.

JON: "How are you planning on doing it?" MELANIE: "Got, uh, got one of those awls from the book repair suppliers, up in the library? (shakily) If it can punch through books it can punch through, uh… Well it – it should do the trick. No reason to try and make it too complicated." Of course Jon had to ask, urgh... But TMA is horror genre, wouldn't make sense to miss out on that sweet body horror...

MELANIE: "But if you, um… If you could…In five minutes, I would appreciate it if you could call me an ambulance." Ah fuck...

@a-mag-a-day

[agentnico]

Unfrosted (2024) review

This film gave me Movie 43 vibes. Believe me that is not a good comparison to have.

Plot: Michigan, 1963. Kellogg's and Post, sworn cereal rivals, race to create a pastry that will change the face of breakfast forever. A tale of ambition, betrayal, sugar, and menacing milkmen.

Hollywood has recently been really into telling backstories of famous commercial products, from BlackBerry’s to the legal battle behind the Tetris game, to Air Jordans. That’s right, we had a movie about Nike shoes - actually wasn’t a bad movie but seems strange thinking I spent two hours of my life learning about a shoe creation. Arguably the best of these recent product movies was The Founder, that told the story of McDonalds and how it was bastardized by Ray Crock (played by an energetic Michael Keaton), who transformed it into the soulless conglomerate it is today. I wouldn't call it a glowing endorsement of the modern day restaurant, but it really made for a solid and engaging cinematic narrative. Now cometh Netflix’s Unfrosted, a tale of how the popular Pop-Tart snack came to be, however here’s the catch - it’s made by Jerry Seinfeld.

As such, rather than being a cohesive unravelling of real life events, this primarily is a comedy. So much so that the story itself is so thin, and instead Seinfeld takes us from one skit to the other in hopes of getting a chuckle or two. Look, I’m not going to sugarcoat it, this movie ain’t worth eating for breakfast. It feels like a bunch of poor Saturday Night Live jokes thrown together, with 90% of it being unfunny. It’s a shame really as everyone involved seems to be having a wonderful time, but it doesn’t translate well as a whole package.

The one moment I actually got a kick out of was the Mad Men reunion. It was a totally unexpected cameo, and though I found it amusing, I’m very aware it’s going to piss of die-hard fans of the show, who may accuse this to be a cheap nostalgia gimmick that disrespects the show’s legacy. But honestly, I’ve seen a couple of seasons of Mad Men myself, and though it’s a very well written piece of TV drama, Jon Hamm’s character is not so sacred that it can’t be used in comedy. And yes his and John Slattery’s appearance in Unfrosted was absolutely out of left-field, but this random surprise really got me. It was silly yet at the same time utterly delightful.

What’s really crazy is how many famous faces agreed to be in this movie. A lot of the comedians have walked in straight from SNL, so their presence makes sense, and Melissa McCarthy, well, it’s Melissa McCarthy. Sort of expect this from her by now. However there are some genuinely talented people here from the likes of Christian Slater to Dean Norris to Hugh Grant, which makes you wonder what Seinfeld had on them to get them to agree to be in this. Must say though I did get slight entertainment from noticing every time another famous face showed up.

Overall Unfrosted is a mess. There’s high Cat in the Hat level colourful energy to its stupidity, with so much randomness thrown at you, but in no way is this a good movie. Can hardly even call it a movie to be honest. Then again after experiencing Jerry Seinfeld’s beestiality in Bee Movie don’t really know what else I expected.

Overall score: 2/10

[whateverthedragonswant]

This!

There is way too much that has been placed in Eddie's complete arc in the show that has been too suggestive within the format that Tim and these writers write.

Let's also not forget that any serious love interest Eddie has been given in the show has been dismantled without allowing the relationship to grow or even time to breathe. We have never gotten to see him happily settle in with a romantic partner.

You know else we haven't gotten to see that with before a certain firefighter came along this season? Buck. While his relationships with women were given a little more breathing room, he's also been one of the main characters since season 1. Eddie was not. Either way, Buck's relationships have not worked out (pre-Tommy) while Bathena's, Henren's, and Madney's all have stayed strong despite being tested time and time again.

Also, please let's not forget that Buck and Eddie have been heavily paralleled for a while now. While I haven't seen this new episode yet, I have seen some posts going on about it and what Eddie did. You know who else cheated after he started getting serious with his girlfriend? Buck. Even though it was just a kiss (and cheating is never okay obviously), it was still cheating. Their arcs have been dancing around one another now for quite some time, in a way that fills the other's gaps. Unlike say the Jon and Daenerys parallels from Game of Thrones where they were two sides of the same coin which led to...well, where it led to. The parallels Buck and Eddie have are the good ones, trust me. Just rewatch Lena Bosko's/Evan Buckley arc again in season 3 (an stand-in for Buck) and Lucy Donato's/Eddie Diaz arc again in season 5 (an obvious stand-in for Eddie) and then take a look at the beginning of Tommy and Buck's relationship. I'm not saying Tommy is a stand-in for Eddie, for Buck or in the narrative, but the characters are way too alike and that's made beyond clear by everything we saw and heard in that episode. That's why Eddie and Tommy get along so well. And that should tell us something.

And last but not least, have we all not learned to listen to these interviews from the writers by now? Let the story unfold in front of you as it's meant to unfold: organically. Just enjoy the ride. That's another thing we should have learned by now, seeing what the story is actually telling us when we watch the show and knowing that if there are any possibilities in the background being discussed by Tim, Ryan, Oliver, and the show, we're not going to know about it until the moment it happens.

Like the tweets pictured above said, breathe and just let them cook.

[welcometomy20s]

March 8, 2023

Back when I was a baby, my mom would carry me through a climb up a mountain in my neighborhood, and both my mom and I have loved climbing ever since.

Once on a climb, my mom talked about her philosophy regarding climbing. She said that every step on a climb is a commitment to make that same step back down home.

Everytime I open my ‘third’ eye and start to head down the abyss of thoughts, I would have to remind myself that nothing useful would be done unless I head back out. I guess the same is true for drugs, taking the stuff is fine but you need to get back to the trailhead.

There is a story published in n+1 magazine called The Feminist by Tony Tulahimutte that basically describes a descent into the far right by supposed feminist, and it’s kind of a mystery trying to figure why someone would fall down that path, and the answer is pervasive, but it only glimpses in the forefront - it’s very beautifully constructed. 

My glimpse to the answer comes with the protagonist’s interaction with his QPOC agender friend from his college co-op… which from his description tells us that he only thinks of them as a series of labels and not as an… person. His scenes with them always reminds me of those Daily Show routines, which have Jon, the everyman, interact with a correspondent of some ridiculous pursuit. It’s a gentle rib at the whole situation, but oddly perpetuates them.

Once you know the answer, the behavior pops right at you at the first paragraph. Someone had a crush on the protagonist and he rejected her because it wasn’t ‘his type’, not because she wasn’t compatible, or had no interest in common, but because of her body figure.

Right there, the predators are going ‘that’s the mark’. One of the fascinating things about the group I just mentioned is their fascination with aesthetics. They care what they come off as, rather than who they really are. Another thing, which the protagonist exhibits plenty and something I am preyed on far too often, is how he focuses heavily on his sensational experiences but rarely on others’. It’s as if, as with many things about these people including myself, I can’t stop thinking about myself… There is a new derogatory term called NPC, but I think a significant advantage of neurotypicals is that they can imagine themselves as NPC, as a non-player character in someone else’s story and somehow maneuver themselves around that. 

In part, I understand his persuasions. My head lies in physics and mathematics after all and Leibinz’s law is strong there, the objects are defined by their properties, but real things can’t be defined that way simply because these properties change all the time. People grow, they adopt new styles and attitudes, and yet they are still one. People are narratives, which are unconstrained by rigid properties… In fact, narratives only exist in hindsight in reality.

Reading that story again makes me downright uncomfortable, and also deeply more relatable, which adds to the horrifying feeling. I feel like I am being comfortable in my loneliness… and I notice people leaving me behind, but most importantly there is a rekindling of the deep fear that I have, my lack of empathy… but it’s not really empathy, but something more than that.

So why? Can we save him? The story deliberately starts out in high school, where he is already far too gone. You might notice a rise in autism in the recent decades, and there have been very bad explanations about this, but in actuality there is a social cause. We think complexly to understand ourselves and our place in the world, but starting in the late 70’s, there was a thought in leading institutions that we had solved everything and therefore introspection and outro-spection was not necessarily, the goal was efficiency not finding the goal.

As Thatcher said, there are no alternatives. This was the solution, and any attempt to think otherwise would be a waste of time. Humans need not apply, but not the reason it was originally said. We still needed Homo Sapiens, AI was still in infancy and there are many challenges that still need to be overcome and some that can’t, but they didn’t need to be humans.

So humans were made… lean. They still processed like humans, they could empathize, they were intelligent, but they were left off of thinking complexly, trying to understand his place in the world, so they were easy to manipulate into tools of the state, or go rogue in some cases.

[jonsnowunemploymentera]

I understand that there is a sizable amount of Jon stans whose delusions can be aggravating. Trust me, I’ve come across my fair share of people who think that the sun rises only for Jon Snow and no one else. But, it’s really annoying when certain sections of this fandom act like reading Jon as Azor Ahai is a result of Jon fans making shit up. No, we’re not. We’re literally reading what the text is telling us. We’re not reading into it, we’re reading it straight up. Mel’s singular ADWD chapter is literally just: hey Mel pay attention to Jon Snow, also there’s random stuff happening all over Westeros, and also pay extra attention to Jon Snow.

Mel’s visions are absolutely correct. What’s not correct is how she interprets them to fit an agenda/make herself appear more credible to others (Jon, Stannis). We already know exactly what this looks like when she sees towers being submerged in water, says it’s Eastwatch by the Sea when asked, even though in her head she’s like “oh it can’t be Eastwatch because that place doesn’t look like that”.

ADWD shows us that Mel looks into her fires searching for Azor Ahai and sees “only Snow”. There’s no other way of reading that other than “oh yeah if Mel is specifically looking for Azor Ahai and is seeing Jon Snow, then Jon is the Azor Ahai she’s looking for”. And the gag with this is Mel’s entire purpose, her existence, is to find Azor Ahai. But she completely misidentifies him so when she encounters the real deal, she’s in far too deep to make the obvious and necessary pivot. And it’s even funnier (and I think that’s what GRRM is going for) when there’s nothing special about Mel’s chosen hero Stannis, but there’s a lot that is special about the one she’s ignoring: Jon. Mel literally tells Jon “you’re a super special magic boy let’s make babies because of how super special you are, and these babies will be even more powerful than the ones I made with Stannis” but at the same time being like “yeah mr not-that-special Stannis is totally the guy I’m looking for”.

Plus, Mel’s “only Snow” is quite literally reaffirmed in Jon XII when he dreams himself atop the wall, armored in ice, and wielding LIGHTBRINGER. This isn’t some ordinary flaming sword. This sword burns “red in his fist”, which literally equates it to “the red sword of heroes” - Azor Ahai’s sword. Not only that but Mel’s ptwp is definitely going to be reborn. She has visions about a grey girl on a dying horse WHICH IS TRUE!! What’s not true is this girl being Arya. It’s Alys Karstark. She then has visions about daggers in the dark, which again happens!! Read the last few pages of Jon XIII ADWD. The one that hasn’t come yet but will (based on Jon XIII) is a “promised prince born amidst salt and smoke”. There’s a reason why GRRM included these things in the narrative. And there’s a reason why they happen sequentially. So unless Winds comes out and GRRM is like sike forget that ever happened, it’s pretty safe to assume that Jon is Azor Ahai.

[the-king-andthe-lionheart]

So this is definitely in response to that certain dark section of our fandom (you know exactly who you are) who are throwing a fit about the Arya and Daenerys fandoms enjoying the possibility of a canon Daenarya friendship in the future.  So let’s look at all the quotes that possibly foreshadow a future Arya and Dany friendship and put it into context.

It was very dark right now, she realized. She hugged her bare knees tight against her chest and shivered. She would wait quietly and count to ten thousand. By then it would be safe for her to come creeping back out and find her way home.

By the time she had reached eighty-seven, the room had begun to lighten as her eyes adjusted to the blackness. Slowly the shapes around her took on form. Huge empty eyes stared at her hungrily through the gloom, and dimly she saw the jagged shadows of long teeth. She had lost the count. She closed her eyes and bit her lip and sent the fear away. When she looked again, the monsters would be gone. Would never have been. She pretended that Syrio was beside her in the dark, whispering in her ear. Calm as still water, she told herself. Strong as a bear. Fierce as a wolverine. She opened her eyes again.

The monsters were still there, but the fear was gone.

Arya got to her feet, moving warily. The heads were all around her. She touched one, curious, wondering if it was real. Her fingertips brushed a massive jaw. It felt real enough. The bone was smooth beneath her hand, cold and hard to the touch. She ran her fingers down a tooth, black and sharp, a dagger made of darkness. It made her shiver.

"It's dead," she said aloud. "It's just a skull, it can't hurt me." Yet somehow the monster seemed to know she was there. She could feel its empty eyes watching her through the gloom, and there was something in that dim, cavernous room that did not love her. She edged away from the skull and backed into a second, larger than the first. For an instant she could feel its teeth digging into her shoulder, as if it wanted a bite of her flesh. Arya whirled, felt leather catch and tear as a huge fang nipped at her jerkin, and then she was running. Another skull loomed ahead, the biggest monster of all, but Arya did not even slow. She leapt over a ridge of black teeth as tall as swords, dashed through hungry jaws, and threw herself against the door. - Arya III AGOT

Here is the initial passage that has to do with dragons in Arya’s story.  She comes across the dragon skulls in the dark and feels afraid of them.  She feels as if the eyes of the skulls were watching her and did not like her. She also doesn’t recognize them for what they are.  She initially refers to them as monsters, but later she comes to realize they are dragons: 

This time the monsters did not frighten her. They seemed almost old friends. Arya held the candle over her head. With each step she took, the shadows moved against the walls, as if they were turning to watch her pass. "Dragons," she whispered. She slid Needle out from under her cloak. The slender blade seemed very small and the dragons very big, yet somehow Arya felt better with steel in her hand. - Arya IV AGOT

Now admittedly the first quote does sound like the foreshadowing could suggest antagonism between Arya and Dany, but the second quote doesn’t suggest this.  Arya thinks of them as if they are old friends.  That is the most notable sentence of the paragraph, not the fact that she slid Needle out.  But when you actually look at this paragraph you actually see a duality here.  The monsters did not frighten her.  They seemed almost old friends.  Yet she slides her blade out and feels better?  So for me this quote just seems to foreshadow that Dany will be Arya’s friend, yet Arya will remain wary of her dragons like anyone naturally would be.

So putting these two quotes into context, it tells us that if Arya and Dany will meet they will initially be antagonistic and wary of each other (most Daenarya fans I’ve seen acknowledge this will likely be the case).  However it also suggests that this wariness will eventually fade and they will become friends.  Arya doesn’t need to think she is wholly safe from the dragons to have a friendship with Dany.  EVERYONE is wary about the dragons, just like most people would be unsure and most likely afraid if they were in the same room as a large cat or a bear. 

But this isn’t Arya’s only dragon connections in the narrative.  Arya’s closest relationship is with Jon, who is half Targaryen.  In Braavos Arya is fascinated by the courtesans and the Black Pearl in particular:

"The Black Pearl," she told them. Merry claimed the Black Pearl was the most famous courtesan of all. "She's descended from the dragons, that one," the woman had told Cat. "The first Black Pearl was a pirate queen. A Westerosi prince took her for a lover and got a daughter on her, who grew up to be a courtesan. Her own daughter followed her, and her daughter after her, until you get to this one [...] - Cat of the Canals AFFC

The woman with him could not have been more than a third his age. She was so lovely that the lamps seemed to burn brighter when she passed. She had dressed in a low-cut gown of pale yellow silk, startling against the light brown of her skin. Her black hair was bound up in a net of spun gold, and a jet-and-gold necklace brushed against the top of her full breasts. As they watched, she leaned close to the envoy and whispered something in his ear that made him laugh. "They should call her the Brown Pearl," Mercy said to Daena. "She's more brown than black."

"The first Black Pearl was black as a pot of ink," said Daena. "She was a pirate queen, fathered by a Sealord's son on a princess from the Summer Isles. A dragon king from Westeros took her for his lover."

"I would like to see a dragon," Mercy said wistfully. - Mercy TWOW

There is even foreshadowing that Arya will form a closer relationship with the Black Pearl in the future by becoming an apprentice for her so Arya can refine her highborn manners so it’s easier for the FM to place her into highborn society to do their work, because why not utilize a highborn girl in this way?

But also notice that Arya/Mercy is friends with a girl named “Daena” which is ridiculously close to the name Daenerys.  And in the same conversation with Daena (Daenerys) Arya/Mercy also said she wished to see a dragon.  And no this isn’t “Mercy’s” wish, this is Arya’s wish:

As Arya crossed the yard to the bathhouse, she spied a raven circling down toward the rookery, and wondered where it had come from and what message it carried. Might be it's from Robb, come to say it wasn't true about Bran and Rickon. She chewed on her lip, hoping. If I had wings I could fly back to Winterfell and see for myself. And if it was true, I'd just fly away, fly up past the moon and the shining stars, and see all the things in Old Nan's stories, dragons and sea monsters and the Titan of Braavos, and maybe I wouldn't ever fly back unless I wanted to. - Arya X ACOK

Doesn’t really sound like Arya hates dragons or have any issues regarding them.  She wants to see them irregardless of any fear they may inspire within her that everyone would naturally have upon seeing a dragon.

Arya also expresses a wish to fly throughout her narrative and she also has wing symbolism in her arc:

If I was a crow I could fly down and peck off his stupid fat pouty lips. - Arya X ACOK

If I had wings I could fly back to Winterfell and see for myself.  And if it was true, I'd just fly away, fly up past the moon and the shining stars, and see all the things in Old Nan's stories, dragons and sea monsters and the Titan of Braavos, and maybe I wouldn't ever fly back unless I wanted to. - Arya X ACOK

I wish I could change into a wolf and grow wings and fly away. - Arya XIII ASOS

She might be bald and skinny, but Mercy had a pretty smile, and a certain grace. Even Izembaro agreed that she was graceful. She was not far from the Gate as the crows flies, but for girls with feet instead of wings the way was longer. - Mercy TWOW

Also lets not forget how similar Arya and Dany are to each other and how many parallels they share.  They are both lost princesses exiled and sent to Essos, specifically Braavos, after their father's deaths at the hands of Lannister's.  They each know what it's like to be bought and sold and to be enslaved – Dany as a child bride and Arya as a child soldier.  And they both have pretenders trying to take their claims.  Both have been forced into becoming smallfolk, living in poverty and starved.  And they both know what it's like to be hunted and scared.  They adapt exceedingly well into other environments and cultures, and their morality and sense of justice are very attuned, as they seek to protect those that can not protect themselves.  Very protective, they are both empathetic and maternal and care for the sick, ailing, and dying.  Both of them are survivors and have both suffered abuse and sexual assault (more so for Dany, but it's still there).  They are both clever and know how to manipulate people.  They are both polyglots and both of their deepest desires are for home and family/pack.  They both try to live up to the image of their older siblings (ie Sansa and Rhaegar).  Arya is said to look and act like Lyanna and Daenerys is compared to Rhaegar by the people that knew him.   They are both very close to their house sigils and even dream about them and the mystical beasts they both own.  They both love horseback riding and they both have encountered mystical prophets.  Wanted/considered becoming sailors and they both have fantastic people skills.  Not to mention that it was Arya who said that the slaves should have killed the masters, while Dany is leading a slave uprising to overthrow and yes, execute the masters.

Dany is also not some “mad queen” and she does listen to the people who knew her father and Rhaegar.  She is learning the truth about the monster her father was and learning to accept that.  So there is no reason why Dany should continue to feel antagonistic towards the next generation of Stark’s for something they didn’t do.  

I’ve also seen comments about how the fire devastation that is within Arya’s story must clearly mean “Dark Dany” and that Arya and Dany will be antagonistic towards each other in canon when they meet.  I’m assuming these people are referring to the burning barn scene:

"You take her!" she yelled. "You get her out! You do it!" The fire beat at her back with hot red wings as she fled the burning barn. It felt blessedly cool outside, but men were dying all around her. She saw Koss throw down his blade to yield, and she saw them kill him where he stood. Smoke was everywhere. There was no sign of Yoren, but the axe was where Gendry had left it, by the woodpile outside the haven. As she wrenched it free, a mailed hand grabbed her arm. Spinning, Arya drove the head of the axe hard between his legs. She never saw his face, only the dark blood seeping between the links of his hauberk. Going back into that barn was the hardest thing she ever did. Smoke was pouring out the open door like a writhing black snake, and she could hear the screams of the poor animals inside, donkeys and horses and men. She chewed her lip, and darted through the doors, crouched low where the smoke wasn't quite so thick.

A donkey was caught in a ring of fire, shrieking in terror and pain. She could smell the stench of burning hair. The roof was gone up too, and things were falling down, pieces of flaming wood and bits of straw and hay. Arya put a hand over her mouth and nose. She couldn't see the wagon for the smoke, but she could still hear Biter screaming. She crawled toward the sound. - Arya IV ACOK

Arya rolled headfirst into the tunnel and dropped five feet. She got dirt in her mouth but she didn't care, the taste was fine, the taste was mud and water and worms and life. Under the earth the air was cool and dark. Above was nothing but blood and roaring red and choking smoke and the screams of dying horses. She moved her belt around so Needle would not be in her way, and began to crawl. A dozen feet down the tunnel she heard the sound, like the roar of some monstrous beast, and a cloud of hot smoke and black dust came billowing up behind her, smelling of hell. Arya held her breath and kissed the mud on the floor of the tunnel and cried. For whom, she could not say. - Arya IV ACOK

This chapter does not mean that Dany is going to go “evil” or “mad” and start burning stuff to the ground.  You guys do remember that Dany has three dragons right?  And that Dany is only the dragonrider to Drogon?  That leaves two other possible dragons that could be stolen from Dany.  We have Euron/Victarion who has the dragon binder horn and then we have Aegon who may or may not be able to claim one of those dragons for himself.  There is also the possibility that Euron dies or Aegon dies and someone else will take their places as dragonriders via Targaryen blood or use of that horn.  So besides Dany we have Aegon, Jon, Euron, and Tyrion who may all ride dragons within the story as they all have the proper set-up and foreshadowing for it to be a possibility.  So why is it the automatic assumption that it will be Dany burning shit down?   

Not to mention, wildfire has the same types of language used as the two quotes above:

And then some vast beast had let out a roar, and green flames were all around them: wildfire, pyromancer's piss, the jade demon [...] From bank to bank there was nothing but burning ships and wildfire. The sight of it seemed to stop his heart for a moment, and he could still remember the sound of it, the crackle of flames, the hiss of steam, the shrieks of dying men, and the beat of that terrible heat against his face as the current swept him down toward hell. - Davos I ASOS

So considering there not only is there a ton of foreshadowing that it will be Cersei who destroys King’s Landing with wildfire, but also there is foreshadowing that Jon Connington will do something incredibly drastic to win and keep the Iron Throne for Aegon.  And may I remind the audience that the fires Arya went through and experienced in the Riverlands had zero to do with Dany.  They were the direct result of the Lannisters.

So if Arya IV ACOK is foreshadowing a future fire she is stuck in, there is no evidence that the fire will be caused by Dany nor that the fire is dragonfire.  And if you are going to point out the show as evidence, let me tell you something, go to the youtuber The Dragon Demands and watch his videos dissecting everything about the scene of Dany burning King’s Landing by using the script, listening to BtS content, looking at the storyboards, actually noting that a scene of Cersei looking out the window, depicting her watching people put barrels of wildfire on the battlements, etc.  Because the compilation he makes proves that Dany burning KL the way that she did in 8x05 was a last minute change.  It was supposed to be an accidental wildfire explosion before they changed it so they could justify Jon killing her.  But I’m sure even with the evidence you’ll still cling to the idea of Dark!Dany because you are incredibly insecure about your fictitious ship and your blatant mischaracterization of your favorite “pure as the driven snow /s” character, because there is literally nothing in the books that foreshadows Dany going “mad” or “dark”.  So why don’t you take your jealousies about Daenerys and Arya and the very possible Daenarya friendship somewhere else.

[thelustybraavosimaid]

Unrelated, kind of, but your post reminded me of something that I'd like to take the time to tack on here.

Jonsas often use this passage...

"The heart is all that matters. Do not despair, Lord Snow. Despair is a weapon of the enemy, whose name may not be spoken. Your sister is not lost to you."

"I have no sister." The words were knives. What do you know of my heart, priestess? What do you know of my sister?

...as a reason for Jonsa — you know, despite the fact that this is the chapter where Jon learns that Arya is not only alive, but is to be married to Ramsay Snow-Bolton. Apparently the next few lines in this same snippet is also Jonsa proof too I fucken guess

Melisandre seemed amused. "What is her name, this little sister that you do not have?"

"Arya." His voice was hoarse. "My half-sister, truly…"

"…for you are bastard born. I had not forgotten. I have seen your sister in my fires, fleeing from this marriage they have made for her. Coming here, to you. A girl in grey on a dying horse, I have seen it plain as day. It has not happened yet, but it will." (Jon VI, ADwD)

They claim that Jon's omission of Sansa here is proof that Jon was thinking subconsciously about her, even though he has always been consistently clear and straightforward about who he is thinking of and why he is thinking of them/mentioning them in his own narrative.

They even claim that Melisandre was subconsciously predicting Sansa's arrival at the Wall, despite the fact that the girl who showed up to Castle Black looked so northern that she was mistaken for Arya herself.

She does look a bit like Arya, Jon thought. Starved and skinny, but her hair's the same color, and her eyes. (Jon IX, ADwD)

I mean, the mYsTeRy of who the girl in grey is has already been solved for fuck's sake.

"You are seeing cinders dancing in the updraft."

"I am seeing skulls. And you. I see your face every time I look into the flames. The danger that I warned you of grows very close now."

"Daggers in the dark. I know. You will forgive my doubts, my lady. A grey girl on a dying horse, fleeing from a marriage, that was what you said."

"I was not wrong."

"You were not right. Alys is not Arya."

"The vision was a true one. It was my reading that was false. I am as mortal as you, Jon Snow. All mortals err." (Jon X, ADwD)

So much subconscious activity!

So, hmm. I guess this means that Jon was subconsciously thinking about Sansa here:

"You have not asked about your sister," Melisandre said, as they climbed the spiral steps of the King's Tower.

"I told you. I have no sister. We put aside our kin when we say our words. I cannot help Arya, much as I—" (Melisandre I, ADwD)

And here:

"Your fires have been known to lie."

"I have made mistakes, I have admitted as much, but—"

"A grey girl on a dying horse. Daggers in the dark. A promised prince, born in smoke and salt. It seems to me that you make nothing but mistakes, my lady. Where is Stannis? What of Rattleshirt and his spearwives? Where is my sister?"

"All your questions shall be answered. Look to the skies, Lord Snow. And when you have your answers, send to me. Winter is almost upon us now. I am your only hope."

"A fool's hope." Jon turned and left her. (Jon XIII, ADwD)

We see Jon agonise for over half of his ADwD chapters over rescuing Arya and despises the thought of her getting married to the point where he wanted to Crush Ramsay's Throat™️ like it was a Sheet of Parchment, but Jonsas want us to believe that he's subconsciously referring to Sansa as his heart? That she is secretly the one he's been thinking about the whole time? Really?

But what is funniest to me is the claim itself. Again, Jon is a very straightforward and ambitious character. Not speaking of Sansa is not the author telling us that "he feels he's not good enough" for her, it is a pointed show that Jon is largely indifferent to her. He always wanted to grow up like The Young Dragon for gods' sake! Why would he suddenly turn shy and unambitious in regards to Sansa? Because he felt some sort of perceived inadequacy? Bullshit! He felt like he was deserved the role of ranger but somehow he feels inadequate when it comes to a sister's affection? And one that he was never close to? This bleeds into the horseshit "pRe-cAnOn cRuSh" nonsense they came up with, all because Jon called Sansa radiant.

And I am so tired of it.

Regarding Jon and Sansa's relationship, a redditor, perhaps surprisingly, put it best:

Reading posts about how marrying Sansa is going to be a reward for Jon Snow...

If these shippers had actually read the Jon and Sansa POV chapters in the books they would realize just how incompatible these two characters are. Reading fanfiction and made up headcanons disguised as 'meta' does not equate to the actual story and characters of the books.

Jon Snow would consider it a punishment to marry Sansa and vice versa. A Jon/Sansa marriage would basically be another Stannis/Selyse marriage.

Sansa was matchmaking Mya Stone with a much older, low born, 'not handsome' (in Sansa's opinion) freerider like Lothor Brune because, as a bastard, that's all Mya qualifies for in Sansa's eyes. As of the most recent book, Sansa would be shocked and disgusted if anyone tries to marry her off to a bastard. Over 5 books she hasn't shown the slightest bit of class consciousness. She would never mingle with Jon's friends at the Wall - Crows and Freefolk included - the way someone like Arya or Dany would.

Jon Snow in turn would treat her opinions with the same disdain he showed Selyse's ideas of decorum and his deputies' bigotry. He already has no patience for and scoffs at the songs and stories about valiant knights rescuing damsels in distress.

And by the way, do Jonsa shippers understand that Sansa is a distant last when it comes to Jon's affection and love for the Starks in the books?

After calling Arya his heart and his home, breaking his sworn oaths and dying to save her from a forced marriage in the most recent book - one of his last dying thoughts being of Arya - do Jonsa shippers really think that Sansa is going to suddenly and randomly supersede Jon's unconditional love and care for Arya in book 6?

What is it it about Sansa that is supposedly different now and which is going to change Jon's entire character, personality, relationships and motives - consistent over 5 books - to randomly be like - 'Oh I love Sansa now! She's the love of my life! Arya who?'

I am going to therefore assume that Jonsa shippers wanting Jon and Sansa to marry are okay with Arya always being number one in Jon's heart and affections when it comes to the Starks. Because that's how it is in the books and it's so very clear to anyone who has read the books.

[radiosandrecordings]

Something I really like in the interpersonal dynamics of TMA is the portrayal of ex’s. There are a few mentions scattered throughout the statements but I wanna talk specifically about Jon and Georgie, and Tim and Sasha.

Jon and Georgie. Oh boy, where do I even start here. I have so many feelings about their relationship in general so it’s kind of difficult to untangle how I feel about them as a whole and the role they serve within the whole show’s examination of dynamics from their actual former romantic relationship. But, along with TimSasha, I think the thing I like about it is how little it’s brought up? I think it’s possibly only mentioned once, in 106, with Melanie telling Basira about it. At that stage we’d known Georgie for 26 episodes, and had Jon living with her, and they never mention it. I mean, we only get glimpses of their conversation on tape, maybe they did, but we don’t know for certain. The important thing is our experience as an audience and how they’re portrayed to us. 

They have this extremely fraught and complicated dynamic and it’s my favourite in the whole show, because each believes themselves to be right in the actions they’re taking, because they each are very stubborn and have these deep-seated mindsets, plus Georgie is working with imperfect information about what exactly is happening in Jon’s life. And it would be so easy, expected even for a lesser show, to have this culminate in a conflict where one of them yells “This is exactly why we broke up!” or “This is just like you, you’ve always been like this” or “This is just like (x y z time)!”. 

But that never happens! I don’t think we ever get any references to what they were like as a couple. We just have to take their dynamic as it is, because whatever they were like in the past is something they’ve put behind them. It ended on bad terms, but for regular Young Adult Break-Up reasons. They’re adults now, they have new problems like Being Framed For Murder, and The Apocalypse. And it’s just really refreshing to see them deal with new problems and not stale ones from the past that they’ve buried. 

This extends to how Martin interacts with Georgie as well. When they first meet, Georgie is aware that Jon is in love with him, and Martin clearly knows they were staying together, if not that they used to be together from him calling her “Jon’s Georgie”. And yet they conflict for how the other treats Jon, not because of any dating based tension, especially surprising considering Martin has a whole list of people he’s been jealous of in regards to Jon. Which means it’s allowed to become a trait which, while not good, never leads to any actual conflict. I really like that because that would just feel out of place in the narrative, to have all this massive complicated web of dynamics and grievances going on and then have “You dated the guy I like 10ish years ago, and that’s why I hate you” as one of them. It would feel a little immature in a story about people closing in on 30 if it was allowed to grow beyond something brought up in minor scenes as flavour text and become a  whole dynamic definer, especially in a show where each dynamic is supposed to be a specific type of exploration of relationships.  

The same could be said of Jon and Melanie. The two famously don’t get on, finding any reason really to go for each other’s throats a lot of the time, even when it can be taken more literally as ‘scalpel to the shoulder’. I’ve made jokes about this scenario’s hilarity before, but in actual fact I’m glad that there’s never anything made of “The girl who hates me stole my girlfriend”. Because Georgie doesn’t belong to either of them, she’s not a pawn in any of their fights. She’s a woman who can make her own decisions and form opinions independent from who she’s dating. 

And then there’s Tim and Sasha. Something they were so chill about, we, the audience, didn’t know about it for 162 episodes. It’s a lovely little scene really, it tells us so little but also so much. They have an “Ill-advised hook-up” and Tim is convinced something more will come of it. Sasha laughs and tells him that she doesn’t agree. And then the conversation continues on. He doesn’t push her on it, doesn’t even ask her why, just lets it go. From Sasha referencing that she’s “pretty sure we already established it’s a ‘wont they” it might hint that this is a conversation they’d had before, but honestly from the light tone I want to give Tim the benefit of the doubt and say Sasha is just referencing the general fallout of their fling that made it, to Tim’s own description, ‘ill-advised’. And unlike Jongeorgie, after this breakup, Tim and Sasha remain close friends and co-workers. Tim continues to care about Sasha even when it’s clear she doesn’t have any romantic interest in him and no longer any sexual interest, because he genuinely cares about her as his friend. He jokes around with her and curses out both Jon and Elias and they’re just good to each other. They platonically care so much that Sasha is literally willing to risk her life to save Tim when he doesn’t notice Prentiss in episode 39. 

And again, jealousy never comes into play. When the Not!Sasha starts going out with ‘Tom’ - Literally one letter away from his own name! - It would be so easy to have some of Tim’s anger in season two manifest in jealousy about that. About wondering what this guy has that he clearly doesn’t when Sasha has moved on to someone else. But that never happens, at least as it’s presented to the audience, because Tim is genuinely a nice guy and respects her decisions (Aside from the fact that isn’t Sasha but y’know. He thinks it is). 

Overall it’s just very, very good to see a show where characters are allowed to have (had) romantic/sexual relationships but these not define their dynamics or for this to extend to how other character’s perceive them. A lot of media will often introduce the ‘evil ex’ because for some reason I feel like people tend to forget sometimes that whatever happens later, we date people because in the first place there was something there that we liked? And not every breakup has to ruin our ability to see that. It’s also maybe a little reflective of the fact that every relationship I analysed there involved at least one queer person? (Well, every person I mentioned is queer except canon Sasha. Sorry love) Because just from my experience and my friend groups that’s how it can often be. It’s just another way in which TMA has my favourite character dynamic writing and really knows how to give it’s characters complex connections without letting them fall into stereotypes. 

[iheartbookbran]

Ok so actually my biggest problem with the whole “Daenerys will burn KL” theory—not even the Mad Queen Dany theory, which is of course very sexist for obvious reasons, but just like, the idea that Dany will ~accidentally~ ignite the wildfire in the city, burning it all to the ground. That, at first, doesn’t sound that bad, but the longer I think about it the more I hate it because tbh it doesn’t do anything for her character? And also… that fate for her is just down right cruel.

Like, the most frequent argument I see on why this would be at all satisfactory for Dany’s arc is basically that it would be a sort of lesson for her about the dangers of unchecked power and the real threat the Dragons can pose on humans and that she shouldn’t use them to fight against other people. And that’s all well and good, excellent message… except that’s not something Dany’s ever really needed to learn? Not anymore that her fellow rulers, which I will touch on more detail later, but in general Dany has seen what the abuse of power can do. Starting with her conflicting feelings regarding Viserys and how she recognizes that even though he was her brother and she loved him, he also abused his power over her as her older brother, her only family and her king; she feels guilt about the atrocities Drogo committed to the lhazarene and tries to help them; she feels so much guilt about not handling things correctly in Astapor that she decides to throw away all her plans to go to Westeros and instead stays in Meereen.

And about not knowing the true danger that her dragons can pose? I mean, this is the same girl that literally agonizes across several of her ADWD chapters because Drogon killed a child, and then takes the extreme measure of caging Rhaegal and Viserion to prevent that from ever happening again. I think she’s at least a little bit aware that the dragons can be dangerous, thank you very much.

Ok so this got long...

Anyways, the only time Dany legit uses Drogon to harm someone and not just as bluff was at the house of the Undying, where she was being attacked, and in Astapor… and like, lmao, that asshole Kraznys mo Nakloz and the rest of his slaver buddies deserved it. Don’t at me. Also, Dany’s hardly the only one with a big magical and deadly beast at her disposal, why didn’t Robb had to go through some horrifying traumatic incident to learn he shouldn’t use Grey Wind in battle to tear his enemies’ throats. Bran will be learning about the dangers of abusing power, but that’s linked to his magic powers and an actual reprehensible thing he’s doing, not the use of his glorified prehistoric dog to kill, which he’s done, just like Robb. By all means let the narrative hold Dany accountable for her mistakes… but her actual mistakes and not shit she has no control over, because she doesn’t have much control over Drogon or the other dragons even though she’s trying to, and that’s very obvious in her last ADWD chapter where she’s delirious and Drogon could kill her at any moment, and she knows that.

The other big argument people make for Dany burning KL (even if it’s by accident!) is that it will teach her about the price of war, that someone as young as her shouldn’t be leading armies and conquering kingdoms, and that fighting for the Iron Throne is not a worthy cause, and I feel like that misses the actual point of her story by a mile. First of all because a) Dany is hardly the only teenage ruler in the story and b) this is a fantasy medieval story, a lot of the characters shouldn’t be doing the things they do, aaaand yet. Also speaking of other teenage rulers with far more power that they should have—Robb and Jon, being the biggest examples.

Granted, Robb and Jon aren’t exactly successful during their time as rulers, they’re literally betrayed and killed by their own men (even if Jon will technically come back for round 2 of bullshit he’s too tired for). But the moral of their stories is not that they lost because theirs was an unworthy cause and they were stupid kids wholly unprepared for their roles. And I actually partially agree! They are just kids, including Dany, and they shouldn’t be responsible for looking after so many others and going to battle, but their cause is still just and worthy, even with all the mistakes they make along the way. Robb didn’t loose because he was wrong in demanding justice for his family or trying to protect the riverlands from the Lannisters and their minions, he lost because Tywin Lannister was a giant coward who couldn’t take him out in a fair fight.

Likewise, it isn’t wrong of Jon to try to incorporate refugees from beyond the Wall into Westeros. He’s not too stupid and honorable to do politics like his father (how I hate when people insult Jon and Ned like that), and while he did some very obvious mistakes that inevitably ended in a coup and in him dying, this is more connected to his inability to let go of his ties with his family (mainly Arya or who he believes to be her), and in isolating himself from his friends and the people he could actually trust.

I’ve always thought that Dany and Jon share a parallel narrative within the story, so while Jon is struggling with that Dany is faced with similar problems. She cages her dragons, that to her represent the only family she has left, and she tries to compromise with the slavers, marry a man she doesn’t love, pretend she’s ok with reopening the fighting pit. While she tries her best to rule wisely in Meereen, it all comes at the cost of betraying herself and her beliefs, so it’s no surprise when it all crashes around her and she’s betrayed and nearly killed. Ironically, it is Drogon who comes to rescue her.

If they are monsters, so am I.—Daenerys II, ADWD.

This is hands down one of my favorite Dany quotes from the whole series, and I hate that it’s been given such a negative connotation in the fandom, when for me it represents Dany’s humanity and compassion at the fullest.

GRRM has a knack for humanizing the ‘monsters’ of his story, for showing the good in the outcasts and the ugly and the scary. He embraces their ‘otherness’ and makes them the heroes of his stories; Arya, Bran, Brienne, Dany, Tyrion, Jon, Theon and many others are all compared to monsters or beasts at one point or another in the books.

Dany sees herself in her dragons, literal monsters in every sense of the word. Later on she faces Drogon inside the pit, and in that moment you could say that she accepts that ‘monstrous’ part of her, and in doing so she’s saved from her fate of dying at the hands of the men who would crucify innocent children and gleefully profit off of the suffering of their fellow human beings while watching them fight each other to the death for their own amusement. Now tell me who’s the real monster in this situation.

But shortly before that happens, Dany is able to see the humanity in Tyrion, an outcast who has been branded as monstrous and unlovable due to his disability all his life, a man who has come to believe in his abusers’ rhetoric about him so strongly that he’s started to act cruel and detached. She saves his life. She sees value in his life when few others would, because she cares.

I’ve always find it funny that the “dragons plant no trees” is—another—example fans use to argue in favor of Dany’s descent into Darkness™ because the actual scene goes like this:

You are a queen, her bear said. In Westeros.

"It is such a long way," she complained. "I was tired, Jorah. I was weary of war. I wanted to rest, to laugh, to plant trees and see them grow. I am only a young girl."

No. You are the blood of the dragon. The whispering was growing fainter, as if Ser Jorah were falling farther behind. Dragons plant no trees. Remember that. Remember who you are, what you were made to be. Remember your words.—Daenerys X, ADWD.

Now am I the only one who finds it at least a bit relevant that it’s freaking Jorah Mormont aka Jorah the Enslaver whom Dany’s subconscious, at her literal lowest moment, utilizes to represent this particular thought, which btw I’ve always interpreted as Dany’s own self-loathing manifesting in her, and this is something she’s actually always struggled with—the idea that she’s not enough and she’s failing. Because above all things, even Westeros or the Iron Throne, what Dany wants is peace, she wants to plant trees.

When Dany made her descent, Reznak and Skahaz dropped to their knees. "Your Worship shines so brightly, you will blind every man who dares to look upon you," said Reznak. […] This match will save our city, you will see."

"So we pray. I want to plant my olive trees and see them fruit." Does it matter that Hizdahr's kisses do not please me? Peace will please me. Am I a queen or just a woman?—Daenerys VII, ADWD.

But of course the world doesn’t work like that, and so long as there’s Jorahs and Tywins and Eurons out there, men who would take the freedom of humans and submit them to their will, Dany can’t have the luxury of peace, just like Jon can’t have the luxury of belonging and family so long as there’s people still beyond the Wall who need his protection.

And I think that’s fine. It’s fine that Dany failed, it will help her develop as a character and realize that there’s no room to compromise with slavers, the metaphorical monsters of the story who do far more harm than the other more literal ‘monsters’ of the story. So that when she has to face down Euron Greyjoy—who btw, there’s a high chance he will end up stealing one of Dany’s dragons via Victarion using Dragonbinder… y’know, as in enslaving one of her children and using said dragon to inflict god knows what horrors, yet not many people ever consider this for some reason?—she will know. When she has to face down the Others, the magical ice fairies with no regard for human life, she will know.

That’s why I believe that it would make absolutely no sense for Dany to have to go through such a tragic and traumatic experience like burning a whole city even by pure accident, over something that’s either never been a problem with her character or she’s well into her way of learning anyways, so it would just feel repetitive. As I have pointed out, she’s already reached one of the lowest moments of her arc. Not saying there will be no other blows for her, and probably the destruction of KL will be one of them, and knowing Dany she will feel responsibility over it no matter what, but that doesn’t mean she has to be the culprit, intentional or otherwise.

[hchollym]

So you don't think Brandon was the father of Ashara's baby?!

No, I don't. I'm not completely against it, so if it ends up being canon, then so be it, but I personally think Ned was the father.

Let's look at what we know about Ashara's relationship and the baby:

The crannogman saw a maid with laughing purple eyes dance with a white sword, a red snake, and the lord of griffins, and lastly with the quiet wolf . . . but only after the wild wolf spoke to her on behalf of a brother too shy to leave his bench.

We see her dancing with Ned, because Brandon asked for him, but it doesn't make any mention of Ashara dancing with Brandon.

He looked at her uncomfortably. "My aunt Allyria says Lady Ashara and your father fell in love at Harrenhal—"

Allyria Dayne - Ashara's sister - thinks that Ned was the one that Ashara fell for. Edric doesn't say anything about Brandon, which implies that Allyria didn't talk about him, but if Brandon was the father of Ashara's child, then don't you think Allyria would have at least mentioned him? And if she did, then it seems strange that Edric wouldn't at least comment on the fact that Ashara loved Arya's father but was pregnant by Arya's uncle (with a baby that would have been Arya's cousin), if that were actually the case.

"Aye, he told me. Lady Ashara Dayne. It's an old tale, that one. I heard it once at Winterfell, when I was no older than you are now."

The story about Ashara and Ned is one that plenty of people have heard about.

Is it possible that Ned used Ashara as a possible red herring for Jon's mother? Unlikely, given this situation:

That was the only time in all their years that Ned had ever frightened her. "Never ask me about Jon," he said, cold as ice. "He is my blood, and that is all you need to know. And now I will learn where you heard that name, my lady." She had pledged to obey; she told him; and from that day on, the whispering had stopped, and Ashara Dayne's name was never heard in Winterfell again.

That doesn't seem like a man that's encouraging rumors for the sake of throwing people off Jon's trail. Which means the rumors didn't start from him, and chances are, there was at least some truth to them. It seems to be the general consensus, even by Ashara's family, that there were feelings involved on both sides.

So could Brandon have slept with Ashara despite Ned's feelings for her? Yes, but I doubt it. Brandon was reckless and promiscuous, but he was also very family-oriented. I don't think people give him enough credit and recognize his loyalty to his family, but I have a hard time believing that he would betray his brother like that.

It seems to me like we see a lot of evidence for Ashara & Ned (not Ashara & Brandon), yet I usually see three arguments for why people don't believe Ned was the father:

1. Ned wouldn't dishonor someone.

"I doubt there's any truth to it. But if there is, what of it? When Ned met this Dornish lady, his brother Brandon was still alive, and it was him betrothed to Lady Catelyn, so there's no stain on your father's honor. There's nought like a tourney to make the blood run hot, so maybe some words were whispered in a tent of a night, who can say? Words or kisses, maybe more, but where's the harm in that? Spring had come, or so they thought, and neither one of them was pledged."

We also don't know that Ned didn't intend to marry Ashara eventually. Neither one was betrothed yet, so it was a definite possibility. And Edric Dayne implies that Ashara's heartbreak had something to do with her love for Ned, so it's very possible that she was as blindsided (and upset) by Ned's marriage to Catelyn.

2. Ned doesn't think about her in canon.

First of all, Ned has a tendency to push unpleasant thoughts away (we see Sansa do something similar), because it's too difficult for him to deal with. We don't see him think about his father or mother either, but that doesn't mean that he didn't love them.

Plus, there's only two times that someone brings up Ashara to Ned. The first time (with Catelyn), we don't see his own inner thoughts, so we can't say for certain what was going through his mind at the time, but we do know that he gets angry about the rumor.

The second time, this is what the conversation looks like:

"Honor," she spat. "How dare you play the noble lord with me! What do you take me for? You've a bastard of your own, I've seen him. Who was the mother, I wonder? Some Dornish peasant you raped while her holdfast burned? A whore? Or was it the grieving sister, the Lady Ashara? She threw herself into the sea, I'm told. Why was that? For the brother you slew, or the child you stole? Tell me, my honorable Lord Eddard, how are you any different from Robert, or me, or Jaime?"

"For a start," said Ned, "I do not kill children. You would do well to listen, my lady. I shall say this only once. When the king returns from his hunt, I intend to lay the truth before him. You must be gone by then. You and your children, all three, and not to Casterly Rock. If I were you, I should take ship for the Free Cities, or even farther, to the Summer Isles or the Port of Ibben. As far as the winds blow."

We don't see any inner thoughts from Ned at that moment, and it's obvious that he's focused on this very crucial situation happening at the present time, so I don't think his lack of reaction to Ashara's name here means anything.

3. Barristan Selmy only refers to Ashara's lover as "Stark."

But Ashara's daughter had been stillborn, and his fair lady had thrown herself from a tower soon after, mad with grief for the child she had lost, and perhaps for the man who had dishonored her at Harrenhal as well. She died never knowing that Ser Barristan had loved her. How could she? He was a knight of the Kingsguard, sworn to celibacy. No good could have come from telling her his feelings. No good came from silence either. If I had unhorsed Rhaegar and crowned Ashara queen of love and beauty, might she have looked to me instead of Stark?

I don't know; this seems like a weak argument to me. Barristan obviously sees this "Stark" as his rival for Ashara's affections, so I don't think it's all that important that he's thinking about him by his last name, which is less personal and can be attributed to his jealousy.

My last thought is that I don't see any narrative purpose for Brandon being the father of Ashara's baby. I don't like the idea of Young Griff as being their child who is just being passed off as Aegon (for a lot of reasons), so what other good would it be for this detail to be revealed in later books? To be fair, there isn't really any narrative purpose for Ned to be the father either, but there is more evidence so far pointing to him, and I tend to doubt that we are going to see anything new in future books about this. I think this is one of those topics that is just going to be left open-ended.

To summarize, this is all just my opinion (so take it with a grain of salt), but I think Ned was the father of Ashara's baby, and I don't think that diminishes or undermines his love for Catelyn in any way. Ultimately, I don't think this topic will be revisited or confirmed either way in future books, so I guess it's just left up to the readers to decide what we believe 🤷‍♂️

Thanks for the ask!

[kaypeace21]

Analyzing the 5 plays in this drama club poster .From the bts pics of stranger things 4.

So... some of ya’ll know I'm going through the st s4 films given to us by the official st twitter + the films reffed in the show itself or mentioned by the Duffers in interviews .

So I decided to look at the plays mentioned here. Because even if we don't see the monologues in the show directly - the Duffers wouldn't name drop anything unless it inspired them in some way. Similar to films name dropped in the show. Tw : for some dark themes .

This is just a quick little analysis I decided to do since we probably won't get any new st content today (3/22). Nothing too deep. Just mentioning things that caught my interest especially cause these plays have a lot of narrative connections to the st s4 movies I've been watching.

Invitation to a march (Authur laurents)

Reminds me of the stancy/jancy love triangle. "A young woman is having second thoughts about doing the right thing and marrying a respectable , rich, kind, young man with good prospects.By way of a prewedding diversion, this woman becomes interested in the passionate but poor and entirely unsuitable son of a local landlord.Basically, the plot concerns the efforts of Norma Brown to choose between a conventional fiance who "puts her to sleep" but is wealthy (like what her own mother did) or go for this new-poor guy. The play is principally interested in how this youthful love triangle affects the three mothers involved (whether the kids like it or not)

12th night (Shakespeare)

 - viola (el) wrongly assumes a family member (hopper) is dead. She dresses up as a man named 'cesario'. A girl named Olivia falls for 'cesario' (violet dressed as a man). "Finally, when 'Cesario' and Sebastian (violet's twin brother: assumed to have drowned - Will) appear in the presence of Olivia there is more wonder and confusion at their physical similarity. Taking Sebastian for 'Cesario', Olivia asks him to marry her, and they are secretly married in a church. Cough if Olivia is 'straight' cause she fell for Viola (as a doppleganger dressed like her twin brother).Mike being into el who multiple characters in s1 said looked like a boy and specifically like Will is...suspish and a hint he's not straight lol. just like Olivia they're both into guys . plus, this play just has a butt load of love triangles (ugh i hated that aspect). There was also romantically coded letters (which was in the s4 films) . One character is also thrown into an insane asylum and framed as 'insane'.'Pretending that Malvolio is insane, they lock him up in a dark chamber. Feste visits him to mock his insanity'. We all know the psych hospital will be narratively important- talked about it more here.

The seagull (Anton Chekhov-russian)

similar to how I believed s4 will show m*#even already broken up since the months between s3-4 : act 3 (s3) ends with Nina begging for one last chance to be with Trigorin before he leaves/moves away. They kiss and make plans to meet again in Moscow.And in act 4 there's a timeskip where it shows they've been broken up for a long time between acts- and its established they never actually loved eachother. Do i even have to spell out why this parallels the m*#even ending in s3? There is also a play within the play (this is common in a lot of the st films- they have plays- or a story within a story- which illustrate certain themes or emotions of the characters within said film : blackswan, children of paradise, highschool musical, Rushmore, book of Henry, welcome to marwen, never ending story, romancing the stone, wet hot American summer, etc).The play is Konstantin's latest attempt at creating a dense symbolist work. There is also alot of love triangles in the seagull. TW!: for se#ual ab*se/su*cidal thoughts/ inc*st (here and in other play segments). The seagull motif reminds me a lot of Jonathan's rabbit story.Konstantin romantically into Nina shows up to give her a gull that he has shot. Nina is confused and horrified . Trigorin sees the gull that Konstantin has shot and muses to Nina on how he could use it as a subject for a short story: "The plot for the short story: a young girl lives all her life on the shore of a lake. She loves the lake, like a gull, and she's happy and free, like a gull. But a man arrives by chance, and when he sees her, he destroys her, out of sheer boredom. Like this gull."  This immediately reminded me of jon's rabbit story and some of the movies on the s4 list . Like in forrest gump- Jenny (who is poor) was se*ually ab*sed as a very young girl by her father. As a child she runs away into a field-away from her alcoholic father yelling at her -there she prays that she can "be a bird so I can fly far far away" .

Jenny as an adult struggles with this unresolved trauma- being with ab*sive partners, doing dr*gs, and having su*cidal thoughts . She as an adult when contemplating su*icide, jokes 'you think i can fly like a bird ?' while looking down at a bridge.God-i'm worried about jonathan (Jenny was also a musician sort of like jon). In another s4 movie example ' mystic river ' :(in the 80s) a preteen baseball playing boy is r*ped by men in the woods. He later says he wishes he could become an undead monster to not feel the pain of that experience - cause quote " if I'm not human anymore maybe the pain will stop" (Will) . slightly off topic but he also has another personality, imagines a alternate word that dissappears when he turns his head. And as a less direct animal parallel to the play - the boy from the film also imagined his perpetrators as monsters and wolves to cope.In 'getout' the photographer character sees a dead deer in the woods and it represents a parent/his own childhood tra*ma relating to his past. similarly in 'prince of tides' the 2 siblings as kids were ra*ed by men. The older brother remembered it and the younger sibling developed DID (so didn't remember but she would draw wolves- as the perpetrators/villains in her picture stories she created . In the film they also had an ab*sive dad and were very poor. She also tried k*ling herself multiple times-but started to get better after remembering the source of her pain and trauma.  There is also the theme of multiple attempted su*cides in the play- and the play ends with yet another attempt- and the audience is left unaware of the artist's fate at the end of the play.

The tempest (Shakespeare)

Prospereo - (the perceived antagonist) is a wizard with monstrous looks, storm powers , and ability to create monster-dogs

He wants revenge on a man who tried ra*ing his family member & revenge on his other family member who wronged him years ago. I mean... pretty much my did theory.But in the end.Prospero decides to show his enemies the mercy that they did not show him twelve years earlier. He tells Ariel to bring the men to him, he will restore their sanity and then renounce magic forever.Prospero breaks the spell that the men are under .

Diary of a scoundrel (Alexander Ostrovsky-Russian)

-  I suppose this could loosely relate to Jonathan? Glumov, is a young man from an impoverished family lacking status seeking entrance into society's pampered class. A 19th-century Russian scoundrel must scheme his way out of his meager life in a small apartment -whatever it takes.He has a quick mind and some talent for seeing through the hypocrisies of people around him ( Jonathan does make a lot of social critiques about society). That gives him some advantages. A tale of one man's mission to finagle his way into upper-class society and find a cushy job. Set in 1874, this social comedy follows Glumov, a Russian youth who begins his ambitious ascent to social esteem. He progresses by wit, guile and rhetoric. Pitting one stupid person against another, he soon gains his ends. To reach these goals, Glumov will lie, flatter, and cater to the vanities of the wealthy. Unable to contain his disgust with his victims, Glumov decides to relieve his unvoiced satirical comments by recording his schemes in a diary. But he is tripped up by his uncle's wife, to whom he has made passionate love on his way to success. At the end of the play, his diary is stolen and his duplicity exposed, but he can nevertheless suceeds. The author is much more critical about the high society itself than about the main character, so the play keeps attracting generations of directors by opening possibilities for political criticism while also avoiding naming names of the current rulers.The play's aim was to overthrow bourgeois tradition and establish a class-conscious art called eccentricism giving a deliberately comic portrayal of reality.

I suppose I notice some possible commonalities-  besides s3 critiquing the wealthy/capitalism in comedic ways . jonathan since s1 has worried about his family's finances / had some resentment toward the rich . In some of the s4 movies ‘orphan’ & ‘ girl interrupted’ someone reads their diary out loud to get at them (in girl interrupted the winona character’s diary even had critiques of her new friends).  Alot of movies also have someone (usually a teen/young adult) making a documentary about their life -which could narratively replace said diary? A few movies have a poor guy adjusting to snobby rich social circles (or being poor and then getting money)- titanic, kingsmen, karate kid, the craft , godfather,  wardogs,into the spiderverse,flashdance, and many others . And movies like wardogs has a poor-young-character do shady things to finacially support his family . There’s also that whole uncle’s wife thing- which makes me uncomfortable for obvious reasons (but I’m just thinking of Lonnie’s creepy gf who was into him). A few movies had the guy’s step mom innappropriately hit on him- orange county & you got mail. And him trying to avoid her advances. Or...not to mention ... it may be a problematic coincidence /trope. But in enter the void -the guy who needs to finacially support his sibling/ does dr*gs -hooks up with his dr*g dealing friend’s married mom (who would give him money).  Or in gilbert grape- the poor teen-who has to finacially support his siblings/single mom-has his endgame relationship be a girl his own age. But before that he h*oked up with a married woman -who would give him money. Don’s plum -young film guy-propositioned by older female film director (for dream job). Not even mentioning the other films that have the guy hooking up with toxic older women (like ‘the graduate’). Or analyze this-where the therapist accuses him of having an Oedipus complex (not touching that one... but the guy in ‘enter the void’ a 100% had one). It’s possible those movies were just- inspo for s3?  A coincidence? Or s3 was foreshadowing for this in s4- but unlike s3 it will accurately be played as wrong  and a sign of Jonathan recreating past tra*ma caused by Lonnie (cough like the photos) /being desperate for money. And not played ‘comedically’ like how it mostly was in s3. But shown as self destructive  (for Jon) and immoral on the Woman’s end. Like... Billy and Jon are character foils. Both are older siblings into rock music, with ab*sive dads who shoved them into walls. Both lose it (and beat steve to a pulp when Steve accidentally triggers their daddy issues). In s3 it’s established womanizer Billy has mommy issues, than he tries ho*king up with someone his mom’s age, and the characters ref ‘back to the future ‘ and Steve incorrectly says it’s about “alex p keaton trying to bang his mom.” This could illustrate his subconscious issues with parental figures/adults cause of Lonnie’s  possible past se*ual ab*se . One film the friend even says to the guy “you don’t have friends!” guy b: i have friends! him:  no you have acquaintances! ADMIT IT! YOU’RE AFRAID OF MEN!I mean-Jonathan liked Nancy- but he initially hooked up with her cause he wanted to prove he didn’t have ‘trust issues’ from his dad. Also it’s prob a bit of a reach (and maybe a coincidence)- but the fact Murray in the same breath compares Steve (Nancy’s then bf) and Lonnie  ... uh... if you think too long about it ... it’s very sinister .  Especially because in s3: muray tells Joyce  that despite her wanting to be with a nice guy, she’s curious about “the brute” Hopper despite him reminding her of a past “bad relationship”(aka Lonnie). Like- yeah connect some dots.  Quite a few films (other than forrest gump) also have the character who (as a kid) was  r*ped by their dad/parent-  begin to do dr*gs/be pr*miscuous as adults since they never learned to properly cope with their trauma (’girl with the dragon tattoo’,  ‘black swan’, and ‘magnolia’). Unfortunately the whole relative doing such things to kid-relatives is in at least 30+ movies. 

Personally, i would be MUCH happier if Jon had a age appropriate romance- and had not a single creepy adult near him. A few movies actually imply Lonnie gets yet another ‘new model’  replacing his gf in her 20s with a new gf- who is ‘barely l*gal” and just turned 18. so there’s that possibility as well- that she’s jonathan’s age.I just want Jonathan-happy &safe. GOD. IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?