#yes I know taika is involved

[scarlettblack24]

The Creator (yeah I said it)🧛🏼‍♂️🧛🏻‍♀️🤓

[uniiiquehecrt]

I'm thinking in terms of actual real life experiences I've had when I say this, but I'd imagine part of what makes being a Thor enjoyer so frustrating in 2024/MCU's phase 4+ era is that... you're effectively not allowed to enjoy your favorite superhero.

I once had a conversation with a close friend of mine during a casual outing, and without going into very many details, this particular person is an enjoyer of Ragnarok, and enjoys Tailka's work overall. Now, I should say right off the bat: there is nothing wrong with these opinions. Everyone is entitled to like what they like and enjoy the work of creators just the same as other people are allowed to dislike them. For this particular post, I'm not here to get into fandom wars or "reasons why taika waititi is a terrible director" beef. I have other posts in line for that. But what I will say is that I already knew this about my friend, so it never surprised me when the topic of Thor came up that it would be a point of disagreement.

The issue I've found that continues to circle in the general space of "being a Thor fan" came when I expressed that I don't like Ragnarok, I do think Thor was funnier (and just better overall) before Ragnarok and therefore Taika's involvement, and quite frankly Taika had very little business taking on the mantle of director of a superhero franchise he has never liked or understood in his life just because he had mouths to feed. (There are other opportunities to fulfill that. And filmmakers know going into this industry that it's all gig-based and - if they're smart anyways - work around that.) I hadn't even gotten a chance to go through all of the reasons WHY I feel that way, of which I have had before compiled an organized list of about 16 talking points off the top of my head, so as far as that particular discussion goes... it didn't go anywhere. We were busy at the time.

But namely what I want to talk about is this:

The response I was given, in summary, was something along the lines of "well I think Thor was boring, and he wasn't my cup of tea, so I'm glad he changed."

But, you see, there's just ONE small issue with that: Thor isn't meant for everyone.

In fact, no character is meant for everyone. So why is it that Thor needs to change to be "for everyone" and be the MCU normies' "cup of tea" when no other character has to? Why does he need to lose his core identity (both as a character, as a franchise, you name it, it's been done) just because people like my friend don't understand him as well as Tony Stark or Spider-Man? And why should Thor fans have tow watch their favorite superhero get stripped down and turned into something completely divorced from the character, world and cast we were first involved with from the beginning?

Nobody at any point has been able to answer me that besides "well just because I didn't like Thor personally."

Iron Man won't appeal to everyone. Neither does Captain America, neither does Spider-Man, beloved as even Spidey is. They have their own quirks, their own villains, their own storylines... Every superhero has a core to them that their stories revolve around. He's from DC, but Superman, for instance, has the core of: love, justice and the American Way. Therefore, his stories revolve around challenging that core, and making Superman prove it. Steve Rogers/Captain America has a similar core. Justice, freedom and the American Way, is what I'd mostly boil his core down to. Thor's is "love" all around. I've written about that '(here)' in my post about his 2011 themes. Maybe it's different for other fans, but for me personally? I adore that about Thor. It's one of the many reasons I'm drawn to him over any other marvel Super besides Spider-Man. (not you tom holland ... yes you andrew garfield...)

So when I go to Thor for entertainment, I'm going to him above the other superheros because I want a story that revolves around HIS core and how Thor goes about reckoning with his challenges. I also go to MCU Thor specifically for his quiet, kind, regal nature. I come to him for his gravitas, his passion, his relationships with his cast of companions.

I go to him for high-sci-fi action/adventure, or for the "what if we took norse mythology and made it an alien superhero" route they took him in for the MCU. I go to Thor because he IS different from the rest of the Avengers... and that's the point.

So when someone says to me: "Well Thor wasn't for me so I'm glad he changed", or "Well I really liked Ragnarok because Thor kind of become more in line with the other Avengers"... they're fundamentally missing the point of why Thor has a fanbase at all.

[summerlinenss]

I no longer believe the actor who claims abuse on the Time Bandits set. Please read this all. I did my best to explain my reasons. I apologize for any rambling.

Paramount has issues with safety on their sets. They have issues with their HR and resolution departments. That is proven fact and has happened more than once recently, even resulting in lawsuits. I don't deny they were injured as they have record of that and Paramount has stated they paid their worker's comp claim, but I would take everything else they claim with a Rock of Gibraltar sized grain of salt.

Especially since they're just now trotting out that damned letter Taika signed as "proof" he and the entire cast, crew, and production companies are all white supremacist, pro-genocide zionists.

"Taika who signed that Biden letter" is a direct quote from the actor in a comment. They shared a post from an Instagram called "Zionists in Film" that purports to "out" supposed celebrity zionists. That post is Taika with falsehoods about the letter he signed plastered all over it. I don't know about all the celebrities listed, but there are several I know are anything but zionists and are listed there for doing literally nothing wrong.

The actor said nothing about the set being packed full of zionists until six days ago, starting with a post about Apple firing pro-Palestinian workers (I don't know if that's true, but either way it's not about Apple TV). The post from Zionists in Film about Taika went up five days ago. Everything else about the incident had been up and untouched since May. There is no other "evidence" that I've seen, be it quotes from the actor or anecdotes from anyone on that set that points to anyone being a zionist. Obviously I don't know each actor and crew member's stance personally, but when all a person who was on set with them can say is that Taika signed a letter, it doesn't look very convincing.

Also, the biggest and most obvious strike against their claim that the place was chock full of zionists? They were only on set when filming began in 2022 and filming wrapped entirely in early 2023! I/P has been a conflict for decades, I know, but your average joe did not care about "zionists" or even the conflict as a whole (regretfully) until after Oct 7th. So why, after all these months and two years after they left the set, do they suddenly start claiming it was a den of genocidal zionists?

I also don't believe every single one of the hundreds of people on the TB set was out to get them specifically. The entire cast, crew, and all the production companies involved are made up of misogynistic white supremacist queerphobes who only hated them just because they're Asian and nonbinary? What about the black guys in the cast? Or the little people? Or the women? Or any of the countless other minorities working on the show in any capacity, such as the no doubt large Maori presence? It was somehow just them who was despised by everyone, including those other minorities?

So yes, the actor deserves proper compensation for their injury, assuming their claim that Paramount didn't pay enough to cover their bills is true. But every other thing they said? I don't believe a word of it anymore. I was listening and accepting until they started screaming zionist. Now they come across as nothing more than a person with a bone to pick because they didn't get all the money they wanted. They just shot their credibility in the foot.

(I'm sending this essay to you because while I don't have a twitter account and can't get one, I have still seen idiots using this actor's "proof" to hate Taika, his fans, and Time Bandits as a whole. I just needed to put some fact checking and discussion somewhere.)

i want to just start with a disclaimer that, as anon said, i’m aware of the actual claims that have been made and read through the statements both from the actor and the paramount reps and it’s clear that they experienced some form of physical/emotional distress on set. no one is denying that. so i’m in no way attempting to diminish or disregard their experience.

that being said, i’m going to be 100% honest and say this as carefully as i can, but i’ve had an extremely off feeling about this since i first read about it. not in the sense of “well they would never allow that to happen so you’re obviously lying,” but there’s just something i really can’t put my finger on about this actor’s intentions that genuinely feel rooted in something vindictive rather than actually seeking personal justice.

just for comparison for anyone who hasn’t read the statements, i’m going to leave a link and screenshots of those here:

at first i honestly tried to take everything they were saying in good faith, but it’s at the point where it feels like they’re just making accusations of every controversial thing possible and waiting to see what sticks so they can get a pay-out to keep them quiet. it was originally a costar physically/psychologically abusing them and no one on set caring or believing them. now it’s escalated to:

- alleging the set was full of open and vocal zionists spewing a “pro-genocide” agenda

- claiming in advance that paramount is going to use AI to dub over their scenes

- apparently being both mad that they were “forced to leave” the show and mad that they’re going to still be in the show at all

- claiming they were gaslit and threatened by producers to the point of becoming suicidal

- calling them all “colonizers” (which if they are referring to taika and jemaine i think that is highly inappropriate and tone deaf)

- claiming they were digitally erased from stills because the producers are too scared to show their character and address what happened

- claiming they were originally in all 10 episodes and had their part reduced out of spite

- sharing headlines alleging all little people roles were cut from the show (which they weren’t) and alleging the cast was full of only white men (from the trailer alone the majority of the cast is literally bipoc and afab people)

- implied they were specifically discriminated against for being queer/non-binary and asian (although they are seemingly nowhere near the only lgbtq+ or AAPI cast/crew member so i don’t even understand what they’re talking about)

i’d also like to point out that i noticed one of the cast members is a queer and disabled rights activist (who seems like a lovely person btw) who has expressed nothing but total positivity and gratitude towards the show and absolutely everyone involved. and yes, of course, everyone can have different experiences, but i sincerely doubt someone who dedicates their spare time to fighting discrimination would stand by and not speak up if a costar was being abused or mistreated.

like you mentioned, the zionist stuff is all pure bullshit. and people who cry “zionism” to win their own personal conflicts typically don’t have a grasp on what it actually means. i don’t know how many times i’ve said by now that taika has literally been openly opposing the israeli military’s occupation of palestine on social media for the past six years minimum. i’m gonna be blunt and say any arguments people are still trying to make that he’s secretly an evil zionist because he (or probably his publicist) signed a letter that he likely didn’t even read and just assumed said “hey let’s keep freeing hostages and stop the violence” are just rooted in antisemitism at this point. i’m not sure about everyone else, but i do know that many people working on the show have been openly and vocally pro-palestine and even signed ceasefire letters, including jemaine and rachel house (i believe madeleine sami may have a cameo as well). and as you mentioned, anon, most of the general public (including i might assume this actor in question) didn’t become aware of or actively start speaking out against the occupation of palestine until this past october, which in no way coincided with the show’s filming. so i don’t get what they’re trying to prove besides the fact that they know buzzwords, honestly.

i’m also aware that this isn’t the first time this individual has done this kind of thing. they literally have a whole subcategory of their wikipedia page dedicated to allegations and accusations of abuse and discrimination they’ve made against others. and granted, some of the claims they’ve made are valid and i hope they got some sort of retribution. but a lot are also pretty big reaches and feel much more like attempts to “cancel” people they don’t like or had a hard time working with (e.g. they went on a bit of a smear campaign calling seth rogen an abuse apologist because he’d been friends with and “enabled” james franco in the past and deserved to never work in the industry again).

i’m not gonna be that person and say “well i know them and they’re good people and would never do these things,” because frankly, we don’t know anyone and incidents do happen. however i find it extremely questionable that this is literally the first time in about a decade of following their work that i have ever heard a single person have a remotely negative experience working with taika and/or jemaine, especially when all anyone else has ever said is specifically how safe and inviting and comfortable they make their sets for everyone. it also seems really bizarre and downright out-of-character to me that either one of them would not only refuse to help a cast member in distress, but that they’d go out of their way to mock and threaten them, all for the sake of protecting some B/C-list actor on an apple tv series of all things. i know for a fact taika has fired and recast abusers/people with allegations before for bigger projects, i don’t see why he wouldn’t do it again if necessary. and as the “insider source” in that article mentioned, i understand why they said they waited so long, but it still seems awfully convenient that they didn’t make any of this public until nearly a year and a half post-filming (and just a couple of months before the show was set to be released), despite apparently being in such life-altering turmoil.

i seriously do feel awful saying it, because again i don’t doubt there was an injury and emotional distress/discomfort being on set (or that HR was probably a goddamn pain to deal with), but it truly just doesn’t feel sincere or like they actually want to find a resolution. it really feels to me like either paramount didn’t fulfill their obligations of required support/compensation (which yes is obviously fucked up) or the actor in question didn’t get what they thought they deserved in support/compensation, and now they have a vendetta against everyone involved in the production and are determined to establish martyrdom to get them all “cancelled.”

[jaskierx]

the most deranged thing I've seen tbh was someone tagging rachel house oh her "thank you bb ❤️" (or something similar) comment on taika's post about the mountain with a tirade BEGGING her to speak to taika about Palestine and like. if not one of his friends has cut ties with him maybe it's time to just admit you're just a rando on the internet and they know he's not the evil warmonger they like to paint him as lol. like David posted about wck and con liked the post. and the problem is just that, admitting defeat now would mean also admitting the whole g*z situation was just a conspiracy by an antisemite that he himself blocked lmao

ah yes, guzgate. truly one of my least favourite conspiracies. the person who started it is Interesting and that's all i'll say on that x

people need to sort themselves out and realise that people who have previously interacted with taika waititi should be allowed to exist and post on their instagram in peace without being bombarded with a load of comments like 'when will you get him to say [the exact sequence of performative bullshit that would satisfy me for 1 second before i started whinging that he hadn't said it sooner]'

and some of the racism on those posts that's getting perpetuated in the name of 'helping palestinians' is truly vile. almost as if everyone involved is a shitty little bully who hops from bandwagon to bandwagon so they can justify their harassment of others by calling it social justice

[obufalo]

obufalo 📌

this blog is essentially a mess, but i feel like i can make it easier to newcomers to understand what goes on here.

so, hi!

about me:

millennial

brazilian

she/her

i reblog fandom stuff (including nsfw) 90% of the time. 5% is yapping of my own (mostly about fandom) and the other 5% are memes, politics or art that are not related to fandom

i write fanfic! i'm herkind on AO3

main fandoms/obsessions:

our flag means death pretty much my fav show of all time. i'm an ed kinnie, love gentlebeard and am probably izzy's biggest hater.

x-men mainly morph and morpherine as of late, also love cherik and romy. i'm a morph kinnie, of course. not in love with other ships involving morph or wolverine (apart from deadpool/wolverine, not really in a romantic way though more in a hatefuck way. particularly dislike logan with jean or scott or both, even if i see where the appeal comes from), but i love most of the characters from x-men, anyway. nightcrawler can be considered a little side obsession.

what we do in the shadows (movie & tv) movie: one of my favs ever, love vianton. tv: i'm a nadjacoded laszlogirl. main ships are sean/laszlo and nadja/jenna (yea i know i'm the only one in the latter). don't hate nandermo, just don't feel that strongly about it. same for guidja.

amc's interview with the vampire i'm a louis kinnie. so, gotta give it to loustat. don't really like armand but am super invested in devil's minion.

house of the dragon rhaenicent. that's it.

supernatural i'm never breaking free from the chokehold this shitshow has on me. dean kinnie, destiel shipper, wincest hater - you know, the basics. the non-basic thing is that i also ship samifer (yes it's problematic and toxic: i like to acknowledge nuance and don't think shipping should always be morally correct).

the walking dead caryl is everything to me. also love richonne.

the good the bad and the ugly blonco (i actually love some westerns and have other ships of the sort, but blonco's the main one).

rpf i'm not proud of shipping real people but sometimes it's inevitable and i indulge in it 'cause this is the website for Indulging In It. you'll mostly see me reblogging/talking about jenmish aka cockles (and/or jenmisheel), rhys darby/taika waititi, emma d'arcy/olivia cooke and joey/frankie from the basement yard.

basically, i'm on tumblr to be a full-time fangirl. i'll be extremely happy to talk about any of these silly little things, so if anyone wants to be friends, just hit the ask box or the chat :)

oh, and i'll be doing a masterpost for my fics soon!

[melvisik]

OFMD - What hurts the most (right now) is the sudden good bye and the lack of closure...

My first post concerning the bad news was on giving the cast and crew their well-deserved thank you, because although many of us want to keep fighting, I realized I didn't want to 'miss the chance to say how much I care.' So, going to get sentimental from being in the depression period of grief, but still trying to process what others are saying and my own thoughts on why this one hurts so much more than some others. I mean, yes, because this show won't get it's conclusion but... I suppose that's just it. The word 'won't' right now. These wonderful performers and creators who were so confident that the show was getting renewed are now sending out 'it's been fun' messages that are so final. Like despite all the hope from before there is absolutely no way that Our Flag Means Death is going to continue in any way, shape, or form, even though we as the fans are working towards somehow changing the tides. There must have been some last minute decision that just ultimately went...

...and then it (initially) seems like it's just gone, swallowed by a black hole never to be seen again, the memory of it all doomed to fade into obscurity little by little as Max and other streaming platforms shit out season after season of other mindless dribble. And we didn't have time to bid farewell with all the confidence of a return going around, it just suddenly switched to 'bye bye.' Good bye. Because this seems like not only does that mean no more episodes, but no more content. Not a hint if we'll ever get any more stories, canon, BTS, or otherwise. No more speculation and hope to see if it will be confirmed. And will there be no more revisiting these characters even just for fun? That's what clenches my heart the most I think, if the actors can ever bring anything of these characters to life again in any capacity. Does Max own these characters to the extent that the actors might not even be able to bring them out, just dick around with on social media platforms or at cons? Can Max or WB forbid them from slipping into their characters or mentioning them just for shits and giggles? I mean, that's why some are extremely upset, because no more OFMD means more than likely no more of this Stede and/or Blackbeard, and certainly no more of their romantic dynamic. It doesn't seem like Rhys and/or Taika's style to revisit old projects from what I've seen (Unless I missed something? Taika I really haven't seen enough of, but Rhys not so sure. Maybe Rhys at least.) But there are other members of this cast who've been incredibly involved in interacting with the fanbase and being such a positive force in the fandom. Season three was supposed to be the final season, no questions asked, and they (and Rhys and Taika) deserved proper send offs. They and we are currently lacking closure with these words of finality, not just for the OFMD plot but the experience too, and it's hard to do that now because many of us are still willing to fight for it! Well, before pissing off and having another good cry, I want to again call out to the cast that they at least need to know they will ALWAYS be the OGs of their characters. They are the Mark Hamills of this beautiful queer pirate show, and while I hope their careers bring them the most wonderful projects and take them to immeasurable heights, I also hope that they will never forget they are THE pirate crew of OFMD and they always will be ❤️ I encourage them keep going to cons, I hope they'll never be afraid to step back into their character (if they can), and I wish, just as they keep advising aspiring actors, for them to keep that that thick skin and for great things to be coming their way. Most of all, I want them to know they will always be our stars 👍

And thanks again so much to the cast, crew, and creators who've honored us with such beauty 🌈

Y'all were done dirty, and EVERYONE knows it.

Even though we're gonna keep fighting. But just in case.

[appleteeth]

The number of tags on that poll that were sending abuse at Taika specifically (I literally saw one after the poll ended saying they were gonna kill him on live TV. YES I know that sort of thing is not a serious threat but those aren't funny jokes to make!!)... like I know part of it is just that he's the biggest name people not in the fandom know who's attached to it but ngl it felt pretty racist. (Also I never saw an ofmd fan even mention the names of the actors for stucky, just agreeing that the Russos fucked up their story)

Honestly, the whole thing has been a complete shit show for the sake of a silly poll. Stucky fans have shown themselves to be immature and downright nasty just because their fandom was losing, and then eventually lost (by a whisker!) to another fandom.

I find any jokey-jokes about threatening people's lives or the casual use of 'kys' pretty upsetting. And like you, I've seen some fucking awful and downright racist responses, which seems to be par the course when Taika is involved in any discussion. It's fucking hideous. I was starting to go through the tags to pull out the most buckwild comments for the lols, but the more I read the more I realised it was the sort of immature fandom I try to stay clear of.

[nerdgirlriot]

so I got a free one month trial of Audible and I cashed in my free credit on the audio version of Burn it Down, which is a new book by television critic Maureen Ryan. It focuses on Hollywood and the systemic abuse of power which exists behind the scenes of many fan-favorite movies and shows. Not just in the wake of the #metoo movement, but of all power imbalances, involving members of marginalized communities and the ones in charge, who are still mostly cis hetero white dudes. Is it a disappointing read? In many ways, yes.

There's account after account of awfulness, assistants being overworked and getting things thrown at them (and nothing happening because, well, that's just HoW ThINGs aRe), to racist remarks in the writers' room, to sidelining characters of color in Lost (which you can read about here in this excerpt). There are chapters focused on SNL and Sleepy Hollow, and I think the Sleepy Hollow details are only seeing light for the first time in this book. There's even a chapter on the Muppets series that ABC did, and the showrunner hated Miss Piggy as a character and shut down a writer who spoke up about how Piggy was being written and also SHUT DOWN THE MUPPETEERS WHO COMPLAINED THAT THEIR LINES WERE OUT OF CHARACTER

I've reached the section of the book devoted to discussing Star Wars and Marvel and how risk-averse studios are to making new and original media when they can just adapt IP from somewhere else that has a built in audience. Current Star Wars (the TV shows on Disney+) are being run by Jon Favreau and Dave Feloni (two white dudes) while the Cathy Jenkins project Rogue Squadron got canned and Taika Waititi's SW joint has been off the radar for forever, it seems. Marvel shows don't have showrunners, only head writers, and there's very little wiggle room for creativity when everything is overseen by a production committee. I think the book gives a lot of background on why the WGA is striking.

It's a disappointing and depressing book but I'm one of those weirdos who really wants to know about this sort of stuff so it's indispensable. I highly recommend it but many of the accounts of abuse are harrowing so tread carefully if you need to.

[paleoleigh]

hello, what would you say to someone who very much thinks about stepping away from the renewal movement bc our fandom keeps being associated with slavery, racism and zionism? and people just take it at word value and feel morally better that they don't consume that media taika did while probably watching 1665 tv shows from disney and mcu. i do not care to be associated with zionists and racists and be told i ship slave owners, but everyone outside of fandom seems to have made up their mids and i don't need my tweet in supoort of a silly tv show i love to be used in some ofmd guys are dicks bullying campaign

Oh boy. I don't typically delve into this because I'm cautious about saying the right/wrong thing and being misconstrued. But I'll do my best*. Let's break this down:

Slavery - I understand people are uncomfortable with the show depicting characters based on real life pirates who were connected to slavery in the 1700s, and that is incredibly valid. If someone doesn't want to interact with the show because of that, that's fine! It's great! However, the show basically takes the idea of these pirates and makes them into entirely new characters which never themselves touch on the idea of slavery. The show depicts itself as pretty anti-slavery given the immediate violence that occurs against people who are racist to the non-white characters (Officer Whatever getting knifed after calling Frenchie slave, Abshir and the servants helping burn down the French ship and leaving happily with money after one of them called them "my Africans", which, yes EW, but was very pointedly saying he was wrong). I will also say to the slavery point that kids play pirates/love pirate stuff, people don't tell them not to because the real Blackbeard was involved in that? Idk, please take my opinion here with a grain of salt (and I'm very willing to be wrong on this) but it seems a bit...reactionary to say the show is pro-slavery.

Same goes for racism - MOST of the actors and characters are not white in this show, and that I think is portrayed very well through many different backgrounds. And as I just mentioned, every time a character is racist, they almost immediately get their comeuppance. Stede never treats any of his crew in any way which is racist, and the one time he and Pete are racist towards the Indigenous tribe, they're called out on it explicitly and never do that again.

Zionism....sigh. This is unfortunately a loaded argument these days. Yes, Taika signed a letter that said "give the hostages back". Taika is also half-Jewish and describes himself as a Jewish Polynesian man. At the time the letter was making the rounds, October 7th had just happened, and a very real, terrible kidnapping/murder of roughly 1,000 people happened, which is shocking and terrible to see as a Jewish person. It was the deadliest day for Jews since the Holocaust. Of course that does not excuse the >20,000 Palestinians who have been killed. Absolutely not.

Taika also gets a lot of unnecessary shit because people just don't like him and want to find some moral high ground to stand on and berate fans of his work with. I'm Taika neutral, but the more hate he gets the more I'm willing to back him because it's waaaaay disproportionate to anything he actually says. Plus, many, MANY actors on the show are openly pro-Palestine, and those people are close with Taika (see: Vico), so I'm very against the idea that OFMD is zionist? At least, I don't see how it can be any worse than any other piece of media those screaming about hating OFMD watch.

So, ending my ramble....I say do it anyway. You can't please everyone. People on the internet are mean. You don't know them, and they don't know you. They probably haven't seen the show and are dogpiling, because that's what people on the internet do. In addition, the renew as a crew movement has raised money for Palestine and for other charities close to the shows themes - LGBTQ+ youth and rights and amputees come to mind from what I've seen over the past few days. All extra money from the renewal campaign is going to charity. Everyone I know who donated and emails Zaslav and Co are also active in the campaign for a ceasefire, calling reps and MPs, being loud on other sources.

I'm sorry if this didn't make much sense and if anything I said was wrong. Again, very willing to listen and dialouge on any of it. As always, my DMs are open.

*Please note that I am a white American who lives in Canada and was raised Catholic (although in a very Jewish area with many Jewish friends so I do have a lot of background on Judaism, but again am not Jewish so), therefore I don't want to speak over anyone more qualified on any of these matters.

[loveisamountain]

SPOILER SEASON 2 FINALE OFMD

Hey, i know, i know. My heart is broken and i cried like a baby when he died.

but i Love, I LOVE, that this show, showed us the angriest, meaniest, sometimes abusive man who was CHANGED because of love, and specially the Love from the crew, who he could proudly call family.

A men that could had been easily written as Just a one dimencional villain. But no, he is a human being, and he is lonely, that’s why he was so bitter.

He got the chance to feel loved so much, so so much, and Love BROKE the cicle of violence.

this is what the show is about, Love changes us, Love heals us, Love is tender medicine and bravery.

Yes, i also get it, the show SHOULD have been 10 episodes, and because of greedy capitalism we only got 8 and that afected everything and is NOT the fault of David or Taika or anyone involved. We could have had more time for all the crew, specially Ed could have grief properly. BUT! The fact that Ed and Stede chose to start their inn so near Izzy says A LOT. Izzy is with them, and they are with Izzy.

All the people involved in this show are telling us: You, who has being bullied, cast aside, discriminated, You queer, neurodivergent beautiful and complex human, you who has light and dark in the same being, you who were thaught you did Not deserved love, guess what, YOU DO DESERVE TO BE LOVED, even when you are broken and WE LOVE YOU.

please guys (gender neutral) let’s see the Love that this show gives us and let ourselves feel it!

also the Love from other people NEVER is perfect But is genuine, i know we are hurting for Izzy, But that doesn’t erase everything else, not always we are loved in exactly the way we want to, and that’s okey, because it’s imposible, we are only human, so, let’s learn to receive and treasure the Love as it comes.

[freyalorelei]

Okay. Wow. Where do I start.

(HERE THERE BE SPOILERS:)

THEY MADE MERSTEDE HAPPEN. Now we KNOW that the crew reads fic, because that was pure fanservice. When he materialized and swam up to Ed, I couldn't stop giggling. My husband asked what was so funny, and when I refused to reply, he asked if it was a fan fic thing. Why, yes. Yes, it is.

(Also MerStede is a good look and yes it's camp and cheesy and cringefail or whatever the kids say these days, but honestly I can't blame Ed 'cause yeah, I'd go there. Also congrats to Rhys for living out his cryptid dreams. :D)

Not loving where the Olu/Jim relationship is heading. Seeing Archie intrude on their space was uncomfortable. And I don't like that they made Olu incompetent (he's been a pirate for how long and he doesn't recognize a battle map?). Zheng Yi Sao is amazing, though. "Girl, how are you?" 11/10, chef's kiss, you're doing great sweetie, etc.

I'm shocked that Lucius immediately pivoted to blaming STEDE for his misfortune instead of, you know, THE GUY WHO PUSHED HIM. Everyone seemed a little too on board with pointing fingers at Stede, and no one mentioned Chauncey or the effort Stede went through to fix his mistakes. He even admitted to Lucius to his face that he's aware he's a flawed individual who has hurt many people.

Apparently Stede's vision of their reunion involves a full-bearded Ed, even though the last time they saw one another Ed was clean-shaven. I get that they couldn't make Taika grow a short beard within days, but it's an odd choice for the character. I guess he's remembering Ed as he was when they fell in love? Also I was originally anti-Steard, but that opening scene gave me pause. Damn but that's a good look for Rhys.

Alas, poor Ivan, we hardly knew ye. And for Ed to barely twitch at his death? That's cold, man. They need him to atone HARD for his actions this seasons, because so far he's become very unsympathetic.

Ricky idolizes Stede the same way that Izzy idolized Ed, and it's going to end just as badly for him. Also now I want to try a gin Rick(e)y. Watch this become the new signature fandom drink (with orange juice in place of lime, of course). Lavender-eucalyptus scents will surge in popularity as well.

"You smoke now?" babe he just endured a cavalcade of horrors incomprehensible to the human mind, you're lucky he isn't strung out 24/7. Also smoking was probably considered medicinal.

Speaking of hard drugs, apparently Ed's been snorting rhino horn, which is an aphrodisiac. Is he just giving himself constant blue balls over Stede as self-punishment? No wonder his brain finally was like, fine, if you're not gonna get a therapist I guess I'll just have to make one myself. And Ed repaid this with a Looney Tunes sequence of repeatedly killing his hallucination.

Which leads me to ask...how did he get in that state, anyway? Auntie said that a man had his head bashed in, but the cannonball that Jim dropped would have caved in Ed's face, no takesy-backsies. Izzy's failed suicide attempt I get; 17th century pistols were notoriously unreliable and misfired all the time. You can't just lightly bounce a cannonball off someone's head.

ETA: You know what, I'll accept Ed surviving a cannonball to the face the same way that the show itself shrugs off all the various major character stabbings, hangings, and drownings in an era when the most effective medical care was catgut, laudanum, and hope. If Stede can survive being gut-stabbed AND hanged at the same time, not to mention Izzy getting shot minutes after losing a leg, sure Ed can deflect a fatal head wound. Why not.

Is it me or were there a LOT of suicide attempts, particularly on Ed's part? Like, I get that he's long past spiraled into insanity, but it's unnerving to watch someone repeatedly hold a gun barrel under their chin. I knew a guy (not well) who did kill himself this way, and in front of his kid no less. She was 18 months old and has no memory of it, thank god, but it was horribly traumatic for his wife and older sons, who were in the next room. So yeah. A trigger warning specifically for suicide attempts would have been nice.

They seem to be leaning hard into Buttons's mysticism. Now he can not only talk to birds, but he's being treated as some sort of sea god who can maybe turn into a bird? I hope they don't veer too far into fantasy; I like that it's more grounded with just a hint of theatricality.

Ed puts 'orgasms' as a priority on his list of three reasons to live. Oooooh, they gonna fuck nasty this season.

...they never did explain exactly how Stede got the crew off that island in a dinghy. Did he row them to land one by one? There's no way he piled them all in...the boat wouldn't support their combined weight.

[summerlinenss]

I don't know, maybe it's just me but Taika's fans (not just Ed's fans) seems like practically left OFMD fandom. The fandom only supports Darby out of all the actors. Any appearance of him on the red carpet and people go crazy. Any poll - again he gets the biggest support. Taika's not noticed or deliberately ignored. No one cares about his new projects or appearances on the red carpet in this fandom. Almost no one in the fandom even congratulated him on his birthday... He appears in the thread for their discussion only when they want to judge him (for the cancellation of the third season for example). Taika Waititi in this fandom exists ONLY in connection with Darby. He OUGHT to make We Are Wolves because their beloved Rhys needs it. TBH I can't even look at their joint photos anymore because of it. Again Taika appears on my TL only when Rhys is around. I won't even mention Con! Rhys is the only one who needs support in this fandom, who is pitied and loved. Taika apparently doesn't deserve it because he always wears the mask of a confident guy. In any case, I hope Taika just continues to quietly pursue new projects. Yes, Ed will probably remain his brightest and best role and we are unlikely to see him in leading roles (only small cameos) in the near future but we need to move on. Although of course he gets hate here much less than in Marvel fandom. Some ppl here even love him. Thanks for that, I suppose.

…i hope assume this is bait but regardless, yes, i think it is just you, anon. i don’t think any of what you’re saying is fair or accurate, and it’s actually pretty rude and disrespectful.

i can tell this is prompted by the photos from the red carpet of his new film today, but claiming rhys is the only cast member to get (and need) any support from the fandom is a massive exaggeration and blatantly untrue. one of the best things about this fandom is that everyone supports the cast & crew’s other projects, from samba’s new film to nathan’s play to rachel’s directorial debut (and they all support each other, as well).

going off that, this is the first time rhys has ever played the lead role in a tv series, and that was mostly because of taika. no one is demanding for we’re wolves to be made because rhys “needs it,” they’re hoping for a sequel they’ve been anticipating for years to finally be made (and yes, rhys getting another leading role will be nice). rhys deserves love and praise just as much as taika does. they’re our co-leads. and i hate to break it to you but they’re best friends + collaborators going on 30 (?) years now, so he’s not going anywhere from taika’s life or work any time soon.

frankly, the real reason most fans don’t explicitly talk about taika as much anymore is because they’re afraid of literally being harassed. it has nothing to do with not caring about him, but it gets exhausting when you can’t even write his name in a post without people sending you awful false accusations and graphic death threats towards him. but many people initially took interest in ofmd because they love taika’s work and heard of his involvement (i’m one of them). and many of us still vocally love and stick up for him.

i feel like this is an issue of needing to curate your tl better, honestly. find and engage with the people who post what you want to see, block and mute those who post what you don’t. and if it bothers you that other people talk so much about the leading man of their favourite show, i don’t really know how to help you with that.

[jaskierx]

really frustrating to see some ofmd fans feeling like they have to make posts that are like “just clarifying that just because i enjoy the show doesn’t mean i agree with the opinions or actions of the zionists involved”

obviously vagueing about the conspiracy theory that taika is a zionist. it drives me especially insane when people in the fandom spread this shit. they’re acting like there is definitive proof of taika’s opinions when there literally isn’t.

but like, the hate will die down eventually right? like there’s no way it’ll be like this in a couple months hopefully. I just wanna go back to being able to post positively about him without getting harassed in the replies

yep. don't let them gaslight you! don't let them make you believe that those kind of posts are necessary! nobody involved in making ofmd is a zionist and even if they all were, it still wouldn't make you a zionist just because you enjoy the show

you don't need to answer their bullshit allegations. you don't need to give them the time of day. you don't need to shut up bc you're scared that they'll come after you and paint you as a terrible person

turn anon off. block liberally. ignore people. (i know i have anons on and regularly do not ignore people but shh i'm built different) you don't have to sit down and be quiet because the bullies on this website have decided the thing you like is their latest target

and yes it will die down, hopefully very soon, bc it's just a bandwagon. ofmd will stop being the trendy thing to hate. palestine will stop trending. there will be a new combination of [humanitarian crisis] and [entirely unrelated popular thing] and people will be acting as if you could never possibly care about both at once. same shit different day

sending love to you anon 💕

[pjharvey-moved]

i don’t say this to imply that taika waititi is like, a war hawk lol. but yes i DO think when there is also at the same time an open letter among celebrities of the same ilk advocating a ceasefire that has also gotten hundreds of signatures going around, that a letter saying “get back hostages by any means necessary” and extensively congratulating joe biden who is notably anti ceasefire on his involvement, with no further notes, nothing adjacent to any criticism or suggestions, IS essentially anti ceasefire. and a letter that only acknowledges palestinian suffering in the most recent conflict by saying that hamas has been terrorizing them for the past 15 years, along with israel who of course is mentioned first, clearly does not care about the deaths of palestinian citizens caused by israel. also the word “savage” is used to refer to the massacre carried out by hamas, and yes that word can be used in a non racist context, but it is clearly racially loaded in most others, and in this one it is in reference to a group of people that netanyahu and co have openly referred to as “human animals”. so you know. not a great letter

i’m not necessarily “boycotting” it because i had very little interest in watching it anyway, but i did lose interest completely in season 2 of our flag means death when i saw that taika waititi signed an open letter congratulating joe biden for his support of israel and essentially advocating AGAINST a ceasefire. i don’t understand!!! how can you oppose saving civilian lives and preventing the mass murder of children!!! almost everyone dying are civilians and half the population of gaza is children, that isn’t war, that isn’t self defense

[knowlesian]

okay: so whether this is what ed and stede’s literal first time seeing each other in s2 is like, in terms of the first moment of emotional breakthrough here’s what i’d most want.

stede’s s1 arc has approx 272289 moving parts, but one of the deep ironies is the way his liminal space ship allowed everybody willing to take the chance room to emotionally grow and crack open their shells, but stede almost never takes advantage of the same chance in a way that involves him offering up emotional disclosures about himself.

(and when he does, they’re prompted by someone else going first or literally being forced, ohhhh stede. oh buddy. i love you: you’re a lot. you’re family, kiddo, but you gotta learn we can’t blame people for not knowing we want them to walk through doors we keep firmly closed and sometimes lock against them.)

and given stede’s upbringing on about... every level, it makes sense he’s this locked down. putting himself out there verbally and being vulnerable in that way, performing love that way: that’s gonna be hard for him. it’s also going to be one of the things that helps him keep growing, instead of clinging to the damage of his past and calling it Just How It Is.

beyond that, we can be fairly sure ed’s going to still be pissed off. if i had to guess, when this starts ed’s position is he does not want to hear it: he’s walled back up, he’s the kraken and he DOES NOT WANT TO HEAR IT STEDE

and then i don’t know, stede can apologize because he’s going to have to be inconsiderate once again: he really does need to say it, because maybe knowing why might help. not make it right: not take it back. just... help.

and then stede can explain he left because yes: it was late and he was scared and chauncey is a reeeeeal jerk who made stede an accidental murderer in an even more ridiculous way, and nobody makes great choices in those kind of situations.

but more than that: stede left because he thought he ruined ed, like he ruined his family. ed didn’t want to become a privateer, and he didn’t want to run away to china: he was doing those things because he thought he wanted to be with stede. what would happen, the day ed woke up and realized he’d been wrong and stede was nothing like ed had thought and he had been ruined. what would happen? he would hate stede, and he would leave.

at least this way, stede was doing something right. he was going back and being a husband and a father, but then mary helped him realize: he was a husband, and he is a father��� well, was on both maybe! legally he’s dead, you see, there was this fantastic fuckery ed, you would have loved it. obtained a jaguar and all!!! and ed is like ...i hate how much i want all those details, you mad fucker i’m so mad at you but i can’t seem to quit the other stuff i feel about you, too— but the way he could do right by them was to leave again, and go back to ed. the kids say hi, by the way! very excited to hear about all our adventures. mary, too, some of this was all thanks to her.

oh! like how she’s the one who showed me that i love you, he should probably add as a cheerful afterthought while ed is dealing with all that insanity at once.

and because ed deserves a little fuck you room to breathe, he could say: well fuck that. you left. taika would do something with his eyes i’ll yell about until i die, the works. maybe even go for the ‘yeah, well? i HATE YOU now’ gut.

and stede can say: i did. and i love you, even if it’s too late. even if you hate me! even if you threw away all my things, even if you marooned most of our kids. (though you will probably have to have THAT discussion with them, edward really i don’t suppose i have much standing here but really. not even leaving them some lunch???? an appetizer or two? you know how buttons gets about this, & etc) i love all of you, & etc.

and then honestly? i want ed to start the process of letting him back in. not just: well okay then. we don’t need to deal with it, because that was one of the mistakes that tripped them up after their breakthrough in the bathtub confessional: they never circled back and actually talked much more about it. if they had, maybe stede could have asked more, and ed could have done the same. instead, they wandered around with half-filled in images of each other, some based on what they learned by being around each other, but still holding onto their own individual baggage about why they assume the other has it made and doesn’t feel downright worthless sometimes.

part of the thing i find most interesting about where we leave stede at the end of s1 is that he’s faaaar from finished with his journey; he's just ready to start figuring out who the fuck he actually is, now. ed’s had a setback thanks to mister izzy ‘what’s emotional literacy? is that some gay shit? is it about FINDING JOY???? you KNOW how i feel about finding joy and gay shit’ hands, but he was actually on the start of a similar road before shit went sideways.

 so: because i’m a big sap but a realist, i don’t know that ed needs to say it back RIGHT then. i... wouldn’t hate it, because i think love is saying: sure, okay. come on in, kiddo, i got cake for us all, but dramatic tension is also a love language.

either way, i want stede to open the fuck up in a clear way, apologize, and profess love to any fucking version of ed alive, because ed doesn’t need to be making stede happy for stede to love him, and stede wouldn’t dream of demanding ed say it back. hope, dream? want? oh yeah. we all want that shit.

...honestly, here's what my soul really wants: what i think ed probably wanted, when he left that afternoon with jack. the romance movie moment, the big declaration. the moment when somebody takes the risk and says: wait. i need you: don’t go.

if stede goes to leave and ed calls him back, open to trying again even if he’s not fully ready to trust again, that seems right to me. heal the mistakes of their past, do it right this time.

once more, self-aware and with feeling!!!!

[three--rings]

You know, Our Flag Means Death has reawakened my internal conversation about whether canon needs to be "good" to inspire fanworks and shipping and intense fan experiences or whether it's actually better if canon is kinda...questionable in quality.

Now, before I get strung up, let me explain. If you ask me, "Is OFMD good?" I'll automatically say, "Yes, omg, I love it so much!" And I do.

But also...when I rewatch the eps...there's jank, you know? There's something...decidedly janky and imperfect about this show. And like, that's not necessary a BAD THING, is my point. It's a show clearly made with a limited budget, run by people with limited experience (despite Taika's involvement lbr without him it probably wouldn't have gotten made). And the show improves a LOT as the season goes on. Like I feel like I need to warn people of that when I rec the show. There's big signs of learning as they go, as well as possibly saving budget for later eps.

But it's also clearly made with SO MUCH LOVE by people who really care. It's to a pretty great and obvious extent made by outcasts about outcasts, to rephrase that one post by Taika.

And like so many other shows that have inspired love (Star Trek TOS, Old Doctor Who) there's just this heart and strong characters that shine through.

Notwithstanding that they set out to tell a story that hasn't really been told much in Western media, an actual explicit queer romance (I mean many of them but of course the focus of the plot is Stede and Ed.) And on so many levels it was executed well.

But on a level of pure, objective "quality" is it comparable to say, Black Sails (which I consider one of the highest quality shows ever made)? No, of course not. It's not the same genre, it's not the same prestige, it's nowhere near the same budget, and it's not trying to do the same thing. (Except for when it IS, cough ep 10)

But do those two shows rhyme? Yes. Do I have way more desire to consume and create fanworks for Our Flag Means Death than I do for Black Sails? YES.

And yeah, I think it's partly because yanno OFMD was designed with fandom in mind. It references fanfiction IN THE TEXT. And partly because there is jank in there. Imperfect places to fit in fix-its and jam in headcanons. It says "hey we did a whole episode on treasure hunting with a few palms, some sand, and a rubber snake, you can also do whatever you want."

It's not slick and overproduced hollywood nonsense. It's just some people making art in a messy way and being overexcited while they do it. And that's beautiful.