#translation comparison

[robbery-bankruptcy-fraud-plunder]

-1 translation point to Tapas

[quailfence]

[Image description taken from alt: Screenshot from the Ace Attorney Investigations Collection. Simeon Saint covers his mouth while Edgeworth points at him. Saint says: Y-yes. Some kid named "DeWinner" or something? End description.]

[transcriptioncity]

Back Translation Services and Using a Back Translation Company

The Art and Science of Back Translation Services Translation is the process of converting text from one language to another. This practice ensures that information is accessible and comprehensible to people who speak different languages. Among the various methods of translation, back translation stands out as a particularly rigorous and insightful technique. The Importance of��

[yrsonpurpose]

RED, WHITE & ROYAL BLUE (2023) book → screen (x)

[mxtxfanatic]

While flipping through mdzs to verify some stray thoughts of mine, I happened to fall into a translation discrepancy that I feel really, really emphasizes how important it is to have a proper grasp on the language you are translating before translating for a public audience.

Now before we get too deep into this, I want to reiterate that I am someone who does not understand Mandarin in any form but has been reading translations (both by humans and machines) for a few years now. However, because I have been reading translations that tend to follow the Mandarin more closely in grammar and because I haven't shied away from reading machine-made or bad human translations, I have noticed some places where mistranslations from Mandarin to English are common: pronouns, verb-subject matching, negatives, prepositions, and conjunctions. For this post, we will be focusing on the latter two.

In the lead-up to the Wen invasion of Lotus Pier, we are given a scene where Madam Yu whips Wei Wuxian, and in this scene, we are given a glimpse as to Madam Yu's average punishments towards the young ward.

While Madam Yu always pelted him with hostile words, she’d never really hit him hard before—two or three lashes at most, or being made to kneel or confined indoors, and it never took Jiang Fengmian long to release him from that.

—Vol. 3, Chapt. 12: Sandu: The Three Poisons, 7seas

In the past, although Madam Yu had always come at him with harsh words, she had never truly been cruel to him. The most that he’d been through were two or three strikes and being grounded. He’d also be let out by Jiang FengMian soon later.

—Chapt. 57: Poisons, exr

Reading these back-to-back, it should be very clear that though the same section is being translated from the same exact source, these translations do not say the same thing. The official stresses that Madam Yu had never hit Wei Wuxian "that hard" before, as well as saying that his punishments were a few lashes OR being made to kneel OR being confined, three separate punishments never taken together according to this diction. The exr translation, however, states that Madam Yu had "never truly been cruel to him" (emphasis mine) and that him being whipped was in addition to being confined. The emphasis on the strength of her lashings is absent, but an emphasis on the intent behind her actions—that she never meant to be honestly cruel to her ward—is established in its stead. (While this section as translated by exr does not mention kneeling, later scenes reflecting on Wei Wuxian's childhood in Lotus Pier do.)

Both of these translations... are wrong.

If we give exr the benefit of the doubt by virtue of being the original completed English translation of mdzs, then the official 7seas release should automatically raise red flags for the ways it seems to directly contradict the narrative that has existed for a few years before the novel was licensed. It doesn't help that the official has been riddled with many mistranslations and omissions from the very first volume, lowering any credibility it would otherwise have to stand on. But if we were to examine the rest of the exr translation, then the emphasis on Madam Yu's intent also rings false given the fact that we are told over and over again in this same translation that 1) Madam Yu is, in fact, unnecessarily, illogically, and erratically mean-spirited and cruel, and 2) Wei Wuxian knows this even at this time in his life (shoutout to the Lotus Pod Seeds extra) and understands her actions as targeted cruelty. What does the actual text say, then?

Although Madam Yu always spoke ill of him before, her hand had never been this viciously cruel. At most, she whipped him two or three times and ordered him to kneel down and be confined to his room, and he would be released by Jiang Fengmian sometime later.

—@jiangwanyinscatmom (emphasis mine)

Madam Yu has never been "as cruel" as in that moment when whipping Wei Wuxian, because normally she only whips him 2-3 times. She would whip him a few times and send him to the ancestral hall to kneel and be in confinement, which matches up to the memories that Wei Wuxian reflects on in other parts of the novel. This translation gets rid of the character inconsistencies that the other two translations create. So how did we get here? Remember how I pointed out those common Mandarin-to-English translation mistakes? Well, both the exr and 7seas translations fall into the trap of confusing conjunctions and prepositions. That's how we get a list of punishments rather than an order of events for a singular punishment type. That's how we get "not truly cruel" instead of "not as cruel." That's how we get these sections contradicting what we know about Madam Yu's personality and behavior from the rest of the novel through those two translations. Unfortunately, both translation teams just happened to flub in the same area in slightly different ways, and while I'm willing to give a multi-lingual grade-school student translating in their spare time the benefit of the doubt, a paid translator with a translation team hired by a professional publishing house should have better quality control than a spare-time hobbyist.

Also, just in case anyone wants more proof on what mxtx meant for us to take away about Madam Yu's treatment of Wei Wuxian from this scene, it was also apparently so important to mxtx for readers to know that Madam Yu was truly cruel to Wei Wuxian during his childhood that the act of her routinely whipping him whenever he was in her presence was something that was added into the revised mdzs. It was not in the original unedited version of the novel.

In the past, although Lady Yu always insulted or patronized him, she never laid a hand on him. At worst, she’d make him kneel for prolonged periods of time, but he’d always get bailed out by Jiang FengMian after a while.

—Chapt. 57. Act 12: Sandu/Three Poisons, Part 2, qinghe-nie

[quailfence]

[Image description: two screencaps of the same scene from Ace attorney Investigations 2. The first is from the fan translation. Miles Edgeworth says, "The sight of that man still shines brilliantly in my eyes..." The second is from the official translation. Miles says, "That man's image will be forever burned into my memory."

[hanhwrites]

sometimes i sit here and think 'yeah i'm a pretty normal person'. and then i remember that i am fully preparing myself to write a 20-ish page academic paper on how enjolras and grantaire directly relate to achilles and patroclus and that love and passion conquers fear and cynicism

[sukimas]

unfortunately i don't like the "you darn fool" translation of sannyo's little dialogue bubble. it becomes a little too measured when おろかものめが isn't really measured at all. [Fool]+[scorn indicator]+[scorn indicator]

[pikhachu]

[terracegardenphoenix]

This is amazing! (swallowing my fear of looking like a demanding unappreciative a-hole: does anyone have an idea of how to download a copy of this? It's hard to use when it's a read-only Google doc. If you know how, I'd be super grateful! I also promise it's just for my own personal use; you obviously have no way of knowing if I'm telling the truth, but if it helps I swear on my beloved cat's life?)

A wonderful soul here on Tumblr who has asked to remain anonymous just sent me this INCREDIBLE resource — side-by-side comparisons of the subtitles and translations for each episode of The Untamed! (and across each platform!)

Free to share, amazing resource for fics too! 

[kimasousparky]

i post one (1) little luiasy doodle and suddenly im like "WAIT i've seen a lot of people drawing mario giving fire flowers to peach. what if luigi gave superball flowers to daisy???" djfbjfngk

[qilingxiong]

“整个《莲花楼》大家只是在一个悬疑探案的，这样一个故事情节的大的框架里面，但更多地写的就是这些角色身上的爱恨情仇。我觉得这些是更重要的一点。因为现在的现实世界，没有更多能够感受得到武侠里面的那些情感。但我们反而可以从影视作品中，我们可以从故事里面，从角色身上体会到这种感觉。”

"In Mysterious Lotus Casebook, everyone is wrapped up in this overarching plot of suspense and mystery, but it's also about these characters and the love, hate, and sentiments they bear. I think all of that is a little more important. Because in today's real world, we don't have as many opportunities to feel the emotions we find within wuxia. But instead, we can experience them through film and television, through stories, through putting ourselves in the places of these characters." — Xiao Shunyao

“每个时代的侠都是不一样的，每个人都可以成为侠者。你包括出去，看到有一个老奶奶突然过马路，你去扶她一下，这都是侠。怎么说，就是江湖虽远，侠义永存。这个点我就觉得你自己只要相信有，那肯定就会有。”

"What a xia looks like is different in every era, and everyone has the potential to become a xia. Including, [for example], if you went out and saw an old lady suddenly trying to cross the street, and went to support her. That too, is xia. How do I put it? Although the jianghu is distant, xiayi is eternal. When it comes to this, I think that as long as you believe that it exists, then it will." — Cheng Yi

I adore the contrast in how CY and XSY view xiayi and the jianghu, and their roles acting as a part of it. For XSY, xiayi is experienced through the huge, sweeping emotions of these wuxia stories, while for CY it's about the mundane actions that still stem from a sense of chivalry and righteousness, however small. As well, to XSY wuxia media is a path for one to escape into the jianghu and live vicariously for a while, but for CY it's a way to bring part of the jianghu into one's own everyday life. It's interesting to see how their views differ, and how those understandings of wuxia translated to/shaped their characters (because if you look at DFS and LLH, they absolutely did). These two are such dedicated actors. I could listen to them talk forever about things like this.

[lost-technology]

Trigun Maximum - What the Gender???!!! Okay, so I'm sitting here doing a re-read of Trigun Maximum Vol. 5 and I get to the last chapter. I am reading the print edition from Dark Horse - Japanese publication in 2001, English language translation publication in 2005 according to the back of the book. Anyway, I got a little confused by something I hadn't remembered that is apparently there: The page where Elendira is dumped out onto the ground from the Ark (and wants to gut the helmsman) Meryl says: "A transvestite?! (He has a nicer figure than I do...)" I had forgotten that because I believe that most people tend to refer to the Trigun Manga Overhaul fan-translation for that, which is here for that chapter: https://www.trigunoverhaul.com/TVol5Ch06.html and has Meryl saying: "A trans-woman?! (But she has a better figure than I do...)" One is official (comic-licensed), one is fan-translated (but is said to be very accurate, done as dedicated fans rather than people just paid for a task). I am wondering which is more accurate? Specifically, I am wondering if the latter one "cleaned things up" for the sake of modern sensitivities or if it really does carry more of the gist of the original. I mean, I found myself with a bit of confusion at that chapter when skimming Overhall and seeing Legato say "She saved me," when my Dark Horse book has "He saved me" which had led me to believe that Legato had been referring to Knives (Knives chose to spare him, by order) - while "She saved me" (referring to Elendira) completely changes the meaning. Legato *does* have one of his "fanatical" facial expressions there, thus leaving me confused as to whether he is surprised that Elendira the ("he" in DH or "she" in Overhaul) saved him or if it might have been "he" referring to Knives ordering him spared? I am not asking for people to cancel Nightow... (ugh, please don't). I don't even know if pronouns work the same in Japanese as they do in English (I heard that they do not). Having been alive in 2005 and having read the volume back around then (either that or I got it in 2006 or so, anyway, I was alive back then AND old enough to read a very bloody, adult-oriented manga), well, I seem to remember "transvestite" being a more common term then / the basic common before "transgender" "transwoman" and "transman" came into common usage. Not being a part of the trans community, I do not know if it was more "the accepted common term" then or if it was always a slur and I thought it used to be the common term before new terms were created? If my recall is accurate, "transgender" / trans - man/woman was coming into play then and "transvestite" was fading out as it was more often used in a derogatory fashion than as a descriptor. (I honestly do not know very much about the culture of the words, so forgive me if I am getting things wrong).* *There was a similar process that I saw in real time regarding what is now known as the R-word for certain disabilities. I was alive (a child) back in the 1980s when the word was actually a medical descriptor but was ALSO a slur and by about the 1990s other medical terms were used and "R" had become exclusively insulting. - It is one of those things that one must be mindful of when encountering old media. (I watched a Twilight Zone 1985 episode I hunted up having vaguely remembered it from my childhood on Youtube some time ago that treated the condition and a character that had it with sensitivity, but had his parents and medical staff using the term and it felt like a shock / I had to remind myself "that was the term back then"). I'm just left wondering about the bias DH translators might have had back in the day having been jumpscared by that when most of today's manga-readers are obviously reading Overhaul.

[blossoms-phan]

im so soft for amazingphil hiatus era videos where dan is silently filming him behind the camera but you can tell it’s him bc of the movements and the way phil keeps looking up into his eyes when laughing at something it’s especially noticeable in the tour of my plants video

[yazzydream]

Jujutsu Kaisen Ch 2 // Ch 230

My own translation to reflect that Gojo used the same wording both times.

[chaika-jpeg-shitpost]

ancient magus' bride season 2: anime vs manga comparison

According to the fan and the official English translations, Elias never called Chise a child in the manga (here's a good post from blue-inspiration-blog about that too).

Was the line changed to compensate for this panel that didn't fit in the anime? Or did the creators actually want Elias to call Chise a child?

(this is ch 66, wanted to find it in Japanese but it's no longer available on comicgrowl. If any of you read the chapter in Japanese or official translation to any other language, please tell us how it was translated there!)